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00:15:30 *** Supercheese is now known as Guest5868 00:15:36 *** Supercheese [~Superchee@cpe-76-178-136-186.natnow.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 00:20:35 *** Guest5868 [~Superchee@cpe-76-178-136-186.natnow.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:41:38 *** Supercheese [~Superchee@cpe-76-178-136-186.natnow.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:52:28 *** luaduck_ [~luaduck@host165-120-85-59.range165-120.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 00:53:02 *** luaduck [~luaduck@0001c465.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:53:02 *** luaduck_ is now known as luaduck 01:14:13 *** Supercheese [~Superchee@cpe-76-178-136-186.natnow.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 01:34:19 *** Myhorta[1] [~Myhorta@10.87.37.188.rev.vodafone.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:50:29 <supermop> yo` 02:02:13 *** Pereba [~UserNick@186.212.248.31] has quit [Quit: AdiIRC: triple your pleasure, triple your fun! [www.adiirc.com]] 02:05:43 *** glx [~glx@000128ec.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Bye] 02:10:43 *** Flygon [~Flygon@ppp118-209-51-52.lns20.mel4.internode.on.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:15:31 *** Biolunar_ [Biolunar@x4d0247bc.dyn.telefonica.de] has joined #openttd 02:22:28 *** Biolunar [Biolunar@x4d08f307.dyn.telefonica.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:29:36 *** Flygon [~Flygon@ppp118-209-51-52.lns20.mel4.internode.on.net] has joined #openttd 02:38:39 *** Ketsuban [~ketsuban@2.221.246.223] has joined #openttd 03:41:33 *** Netsplit resistance.oftc.net <-> synthon.oftc.net quits: funnel, jinks_, Cursarion, Sylf, Vadtec, __ln__, xQR, Supercheese, DDR, @peter1138, (+18 more, use /NETSPLIT to show all of them) 03:43:21 *** Netsplit over, joins: Prof_Frink, @peter1138, Biolunar_, Supercheese, DDR, +tokai|noir, strohalm, Speedy, Vadtec, __ln__ (+18 more) 03:50:53 *** Netsplit resistance.oftc.net <-> synthon.oftc.net quits: funnel, strohalm, Cursarion, Sylf, Vadtec, __ln__, xQR, DDR, Prof_Frink, @peter1138, (+18 more, use /NETSPLIT to show all of them) 03:54:53 *** Netsplit over, joins: @peter1138, Prof_Frink, jinks_, lastmikoi, tyteen4a03, xQR, Cursarion, TinoDidriksen, nikow, ccfreak2k (+18 more) 04:09:03 *** liq3 [liq3@CPE-120-147-178-81.gdfw1.lon.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 04:15:34 *** kamnet [~kamnet@cpe-76-177-66-219.natcky.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 04:27:41 *** solatis [~user@49.156.41.254] has joined #openttd 04:33:52 <solatis> is the performance impact of CargoDist something I should be worrying about? will it scale with large networks on my moderate laptop? 04:49:53 <kamnet> I've never had a problem with CargoDist, been playing it for years. 04:50:44 <solatis> ok great to hear 04:51:49 <kamnet> I think the main issue people run into is not quite knowing how to handle the passenger and mail generation. They're so used to being able to shift it wherever they want and have trouble adapting to the idea that your networks are now going to be more greaetly shaped by where the cargo wants to go. 04:56:01 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p5DC67EF8.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [] 04:56:16 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p5DC66C2E.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 05:01:32 *** roidal [~roland@62-46-143-58.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #openttd 05:10:49 <Flygon> kamnet: It's also a nightmare for eGTVRS Tram/Buses before 1950 :P 05:11:18 <kamnet> In what way? I didn't have a problem with them in my "Birth of an Empire" scenario. 05:11:27 * Supercheese gets some more playtime in 05:11:35 * Supercheese starts thinking of cool new newgrf features 05:11:47 * Supercheese ends up spending more time developing them 05:11:55 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 05:12:05 <Supercheese> there's a fellow who knows how I feel 05:16:18 <solatis> kamnet: thats only with the sync setting eh, async doesn't behave like that ? 05:18:03 <kamnet> I'm with you there Supercheese. I've got a half-dozen projects in various states because I keep getting distracted. I've not played a good round in months now! 05:19:06 <kamnet> solatis: I don't know, I've never ran pax/mail on asynchronous. 05:19:29 <solatis> yeah it doesn't really make sense to run them async 05:20:40 <solatis> ok, this might sound like a silly question, but i'm a little bit new about the terminology that is being used wrt openttd 05:20:52 <solatis> https://wiki.openttd.org/FIRS#Production_Rates 05:20:57 <solatis> that talks about "supply order" 05:21:22 <solatis> what is a supply order, an order that brings from mine/farm to feeder station ? 05:26:38 <Flygon> kamnet: Different playstyles? 05:26:39 <Flygon> In the end 05:26:45 <Flygon> I found it easier to just use railcars as Trams xD 05:32:32 <andythenorth> o/ 05:32:35 <kamnet> solatis: supplies are production amplifiers to industries. If you only bring base cargoes to an industry (for example, livestock to the stock yard) you will get so much cargo in return. If you also supply manufacturing supplies, then it will increase the cargo production as long as you keep supplying at least a certain amount of supplies. 05:32:47 <andythenorth> urgh, that wiki page 05:32:54 <andythenorth> one day, someone will fix it 05:32:58 <andythenorth> maybe even me :( 05:33:42 <andythenorth> FIRS was created to be fun 05:33:46 <andythenorth> but somehow it failed 05:33:47 <andythenorth> badly 05:33:55 <kamnet> I have fun with FIRS. 05:34:00 <solatis> kamnet: right, but in this context 'supply order' means something to describe a mechanism that spreads the delivery 05:34:09 <solatis> ECS doesn't seem to work properly for me 05:34:23 <solatis> i don't have any place that accepts Food for some reason 05:34:39 <solatis> it's supposed to be houses, but no city accepts food 05:34:52 <solatis> i think i have some conflicting plugins or something.. 05:35:03 <solatis> anyway, i'm having fun with FIRS 05:36:00 <andythenorth> are you playing the âFull FIRSâ economy? 05:36:02 <kamnet> solatis: That's a case where the page is badly out of date. As Andy has explained before, the supply chain works differently now and nobody's updated the OpenTTD wiki to update it. You can still set up a distribution chain if you wish, but really if you're playing with CargoDist on then it's not going to matter much. You deliver whatever cargo to wherever it needs to go. 05:36:31 <solatis> yeah that's exactly the reason i was looking into CargoDist 05:36:33 <andythenorth> well kind of 05:36:42 <andythenorth> CargoDist has no idea where the cargo needs to go 05:36:47 <andythenorth> it goes wherever you deliver it 05:37:09 <andythenorth> and it can stumble with supplies 05:37:10 <solatis> you still need to set up delivery destinations, CargoDist just distributes it correctly ? 05:37:48 <andythenorth> âmostly correctlyâ would be more accurate :) 05:37:55 <solatis> :) 05:37:57 <solatis> got it 05:38:18 <solatis> what do you mean with 'Full FIRS' economy btw? are there any additional plugins i'm unaware of? 05:38:31 <andythenorth> itâs a parameter option when you add the newgrf at game start 05:38:54 <andythenorth> http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/firs/releases/LATEST/docs/html/economies.html 05:39:19 <solatis> i'm playing with Economy: FIRS 05:39:44 <andythenorth> yeah thatâs the big one 05:41:21 <solatis> yeah, and map size 2048x2048 and a lot of spare time :) 05:41:31 * kamnet is distraccted by eurovision replay 05:42:47 <andythenorth> kamnet: you could improve that FIRS wiki page o_O 05:42:53 <andythenorth> select-al 05:42:55 <andythenorth> all * 05:42:57 <andythenorth> delete 05:42:59 <andythenorth> :P 05:43:11 <kamnet> Someody would be mad at me for defacement 05:47:06 <andythenorth> removing bad information is defacement? 05:47:15 <andythenorth> we should apply wikipedia rules 05:47:20 <andythenorth> everything must be cited 05:47:25 <kamnet> Without replacing it with better information, yes. 05:48:52 <kamnet> Well hell then noobody would update the wiki and it would be useless altogether 05:49:20 <andythenorth> cargo flow for 0.5.3 :P 05:49:42 <andythenorth> those were the days :P 05:50:29 <V453000> FIRS Is Royally Screwed 05:50:30 <V453000> ?:P 05:50:36 <andythenorth> moin V453000 05:50:39 <V453000> hy 05:50:40 <andythenorth> also greetings 05:50:54 <V453000> is it dying? 05:51:25 <kamnet> FIRS Industries Really Suck. 05:51:36 <V453000> :D much better 05:52:02 * andythenorth has an unprintable de-acronym 05:52:13 <V453000> print it =D 05:52:47 <andythenorth> better if you imagine it 05:56:42 *** solatis [~user@49.156.41.254] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:05:26 *** wicope [~wicope@0001fd8a.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 06:18:21 * kamnet imagines FIRS as one gaping, seeping hole one must fill time and time again. 06:22:45 <Flygon> FIRS can go yiff in hell? :B 06:33:03 <kamnet> So I went 7/10 in my Eurovision picks. Not bad for my rookie go, I'd say. 06:33:24 <Flygon> Not bad 06:43:04 <andythenorth> Pikka bob o/ 06:43:19 <Pikka> si 06:43:27 <andythenorth> it is the hour of day when I speak to Brisbane 06:43:37 <Pikka> lucky you 06:43:44 <andythenorth> it is odd that of all the places in all the world 06:43:52 <Pikka> be sure to remark on how foggy it was this morning 06:44:04 <andythenorth> Brisbane is the one where I might be talking to 2 or 3 different people 06:44:10 <andythenorth> none of who know each other 06:44:33 <andythenorth> also first 4 letters are same as Bristol 06:44:41 * andythenorth numerological 06:44:52 * andythenorth rambling 06:45:18 <andythenorth> Pikka how are you going to use 128 industries then? o_O 06:45:46 <Pikka> I'm going to make 100 different coal mine industries, probably. 06:45:51 <andythenorth> anthracite 06:45:54 <andythenorth> open pit 06:45:57 <andythenorth> deep mine 06:45:58 <andythenorth> drift 06:46:08 <andythenorth> cooperative 06:46:25 <andythenorth> red 06:46:26 <andythenorth> pink 06:46:27 <andythenorth> blue 06:46:29 <Pikka> voxel 06:46:36 <andythenorth> winner 06:46:46 <andythenorth> frosch might be considering increasing cargo limit also 06:46:57 <andythenorth> then you can have more GEAR cargos 06:47:01 <andythenorth> 1st gear 06:47:03 <andythenorth> 2nd gear 06:47:15 <andythenorth> 3rd gear 06:47:18 <andythenorth> dunno after that 06:49:41 <kamnet> Top gear? No, that's a scratch now, huh? 06:55:45 *** solatis [~user@49.156.41.254] has joined #openttd 07:04:15 * Supercheese is watching Top Gear right now 07:17:13 <V453000> https://bugs.openttd.org/task/6303 =( 07:17:19 <V453000> halp 07:34:40 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has left #openttd [] 07:45:15 <supermop> hows it goin 07:51:29 <kamnet> It goes okay Supermop. How about yourself? 07:51:39 <supermop> chilly 07:53:31 <supermop> went walking around town, found an NZ shop selling neoprene hooded sweatshirts 07:53:44 *** Celestar [~Celestar@fire3.tngtech.com] has left #openttd [] 07:53:45 <supermop> gould go for one of those about now 07:53:59 *** Celestar [~Celestar@fire3.tngtech.com] has joined #openttd 08:26:01 *** Supercheese is now known as Guest5894 08:26:05 *** Supercheese [~Superchee@cpe-76-178-136-186.natnow.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 08:26:57 *** Guest5894 [~Superchee@cpe-76-178-136-186.natnow.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 08:42:44 <kamnet> I've never been high on hoodies. 09:07:53 *** Smedles [~quassel@58.160.136.199] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 09:09:56 *** Smedles [~quassel@58.160.136.199] has joined #openttd 09:12:34 *** wtfBonjour [~wtfBonjou@ec2-54-82-68-99.compute-1.amazonaws.com] has joined #openttd 09:27:36 <Eddi|zuHause> i 09:27:45 <Eddi|zuHause> 've never been high on anything 09:27:48 <Eddi|zuHause> don't do drugs. 09:27:58 *** CompuDesktop [~quassel@2604:6000:120a:a013:a5a9:30d:3e3b:7915] has joined #openttd 09:31:39 *** DDR [~david@S010600254bbe4e1c.vc.shawcable.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:32:01 *** DDR [~david@S010600254bbe4e1c.vc.shawcable.net] has joined #openttd 09:35:05 *** Compu [~quassel@cpe-67-241-224-121.stny.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:00:31 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 10:15:04 *** JacobD88 [~Thunderbi@cpc20-stap11-2-0-cust392.12-2.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 10:18:16 *** wtfBonjour [~wtfBonjou@ec2-54-82-68-99.compute-1.amazonaws.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:24:24 *** CompuDesktop is now known as Compu 10:24:29 *** Compu [~quassel@2604:6000:120a:a013:a5a9:30d:3e3b:7915] has quit [Quit: http://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.] 10:24:45 *** Compu [~quassel@2604:6000:120a:a013:a5a9:30d:3e3b:7915] has joined #openttd 10:34:47 *** DDR [~david@S010600254bbe4e1c.vc.shawcable.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:52:40 <kamnet> I was high on pot once 10:53:05 <kamnet> I had to change the lightbulb in the bathroom and didn't have a ladder. 10:53:26 *** smoke_fumus [~smoke_fum@188.35.176.90] has quit [Quit: KVIrc 4.2.0 Equilibrium http://www.kvirc.net/] 10:57:13 *** DorpsGek is now known as Guest5912 10:57:15 *** DorpsGek [~dorpsgek@000128f9.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 10:57:18 *** mode/#openttd [+o DorpsGek] by ChanServ 10:58:26 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-66-31.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 10:58:39 *** tokai|noir [~tokai@00012860.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:59:28 *** andythenorth [~Andy@194.168.185.226] has joined #openttd 10:59:29 <andythenorth> eh 10:59:39 <andythenorth> anyone understand industry animation? 10:59:44 * andythenorth has questions 10:59:49 *** Guest5912 [~dorpsgek@000128f9.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:02:05 *** JacobD88 [~Thunderbi@cpc20-stap11-2-0-cust392.12-2.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:03:17 *** Klanticus [~quassel@179.234.179.109] has joined #openttd 11:08:02 *** Ketsuban [~ketsuban@2.221.246.223] has quit [Quit: To robbery, slaughter, plunder they give the lying name of empire; they make a desert and call it peace.] 11:09:08 *** Ketsuban [~ketsuban@2.221.246.223] has joined #openttd 11:12:24 <solatis> hmm 11:12:45 <solatis> CargoDist can be used to automagically transport supply cargo to mines from a feeder station ? 11:13:50 <solatis> as in, i have several coal mines next to each other, feeding a station using several trucks 11:15:06 <solatis> if i add a few trucks to load engineering supplies from this feeder station and travel via the coal mines, will CargoDist automatically transfer some ES to this eeder station ? 11:16:06 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, if you have also a vehicle that brings supplies there 11:16:18 *** Pikka [~Octomom@203-206-161-219.perm.iinet.net.au] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 11:16:37 <solatis> do i have to manually set a vehicle to 'transfer' there ? 11:16:45 <Eddi|zuHause> mind you, that the distribution of supplies might not be very even 11:16:52 <solatis> that's ok 11:16:53 <Eddi|zuHause> no, you don't have to use "transfer" 11:16:57 <solatis> awesome 11:17:00 <solatis> that answers my question 11:17:52 <solatis> i guess it can take a while before the graph with all the links is built 11:18:01 <Eddi|zuHause> yes 11:18:01 <andythenorth> solatis: at the drop-off stations, always set âunload and leave emptyâ 11:18:12 <andythenorth> otherwise you can accidentally bridge linkgraphs 11:18:33 <andythenorth> also cdist copes very badly if you try to distribute to more than about 4 destinations from one supply source 11:20:14 * andythenorth wonders if cdist in trunk tries to measure capacity or not 11:20:26 <andythenorth> canât remember where fonso got to with some patches 11:22:14 <Eddi|zuHause> afaik, cargodist drops station rating at the source station, if cargo piles up at intermediate stations 11:22:36 <Eddi|zuHause> otherwise, i'm not sure what you mean when saying "capacity" 11:28:29 <andythenorth> (iirc) fonso had a set of patches that attempted to measure actual capacity (throughput) empirically 11:28:50 <andythenorth> and assign cargo in proportion to that 11:28:56 <andythenorth> unless thatâs just vanilla cdist 11:29:35 * andythenorth doesnât understand the implementation 11:32:26 *** Supercheese is now known as Guest5916 11:32:31 *** Supercheese [~Superchee@cpe-76-178-136-186.natnow.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 11:36:00 *** JacobD88 [~Thunderbi@cpc20-stap11-2-0-cust392.12-2.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 11:36:57 *** Guest5916 [~Superchee@cpe-76-178-136-186.natnow.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:42:39 <Eddi|zuHause> afair such concepts never quite worked out 11:50:22 <andythenorth> the patches I tested âworkedâ, but didnât make much difference to gameplay 11:50:29 <andythenorth> fonso didnât merge them 11:51:16 <andythenorth> in recent games, I find cdist can distribute FIRS supplies ok from one source node directly to 3 or 4 destination nodes 11:51:44 <andythenorth> beyond that the behaviour degrades rapidly 11:52:13 <Eddi|zuHause> i'd suggest making 2 stations at the source, one for close by destinations, and one for far away destinations 11:52:32 <andythenorth> plausible solution 11:52:48 <andythenorth> pre-split 11:52:49 <supermop> thats what i do 11:52:51 <Eddi|zuHause> and make sure that the two networks never connect 11:53:30 <Eddi|zuHause> that way, you reduce the impact of distance on demand 11:53:49 <andythenorth> I tend to have that turned down anyway 11:54:12 <Eddi|zuHause> the problem with that setting is that it's global for all cargos 11:54:20 <andythenorth> yes 11:54:24 <Eddi|zuHause> where you might want to have different settings for passengers, mail and goods 11:54:29 <andythenorth> we have previously discussed options for âsolvingâ that 11:54:37 <andythenorth> dunno if we agreed what we were solving yet :) 11:55:04 <Eddi|zuHause> i think we only ever agreed that it's impossible to have one setting per cargo :p 11:55:13 *** JacobD88 [~Thunderbi@cpc20-stap11-2-0-cust392.12-2.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: JacobD88] 11:59:18 <andythenorth> and there was some reason we didnât want to delegate it to newgrf? (frosch iirc suggested that) 11:59:53 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:03:54 *** roidal_ [~roland@193-154-139-153.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #openttd 12:07:00 <solatis> andythenorth: when you say "from one supply source to multiple others", you mean, for example, one source of engineering supplies to 4 end destinations, or do you mean 4 'hubs' (that might in fact distribute the cargo to multiple smaller destinations, by truck for example) 12:08:16 <solatis> i assume that you mean that cdist isn't able to distribute evenly amongst a lot of destinations ? 12:08:33 *** roidal [~roland@62-46-143-58.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:09:32 <solatis> (as in, it isn't as smooth as one would hope for) 12:10:42 <andythenorth> I find that one source to > 4 end destinations works poorly 12:11:00 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 12:14:07 <Eddi|zuHause> solatis: it's meant as 4 industries that accept the cargo, not hub stations. 12:14:54 <Eddi|zuHause> solatis: but i'd say that you can have safely more destinations, when the destinations are all about the same distance from the source 12:16:07 <Eddi|zuHause> the larger the difference of these distances, the more uneven the distribution gets 12:18:35 <solatis> i understand 12:18:55 <solatis> so it's better to keep the graphs separated 12:19:11 <solatis> e.g. when you have mulitple sources, build multiple graphs with source / endpoints 12:19:25 <solatis> (one source and mulitple destinations) 12:19:48 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:20:31 <Eddi|zuHause> yes 12:20:42 <Eddi|zuHause> one industry can have up to two separate source stations 12:21:28 <Eddi|zuHause> that was meant to be you and a competitor, but you can also have two stations by yourself 12:25:54 <solatis> ah that is good to know 12:26:27 <Eddi|zuHause> if you have 3 stations, the 3rd one (ordered by station rating) will get no cargo at all 12:26:31 <solatis> so multiple source <-> destination graphs can even share the same tracks, as long as they don't share stations 12:26:40 <Eddi|zuHause> yes 12:26:51 <solatis> interesting hack :) 12:35:22 *** solatis [~user@49.156.41.254] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:42:34 *** Mek_ [~quassel@marijnalexwedding.com] has joined #openttd 12:45:09 *** Netsplit magnet.oftc.net <-> helix.oftc.net quits: luaduck, liq3, SmatZ, JGR, dihedral, CosmicRay, Celestar, @Terkhen, efess, Kurimus, (+2 more, use /NETSPLIT to show all of them) 12:45:27 *** Netsplit over, joins: SmatZ 12:45:27 *** avdg_ [~avdg@188.cimarosa.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 12:45:28 *** avdg_ is now known as avdg 12:46:16 *** Netsplit over, joins: JGR, Celestar, liq3, luaduck, efess, CosmicRay, Kurimus, @Terkhen, dihedral 12:46:30 *** Ferrum [~oftc-webi@adsl-234.185.3.222.tellas.gr] has joined #openttd 12:46:42 *** Ferrum [~oftc-webi@adsl-234.185.3.222.tellas.gr] has left #openttd [] 12:50:42 *** TheDude [~Thed@37.157.192.64] has joined #openttd 13:19:46 <andythenorth> if FIRS uses spriteset(animation_frame) everywhere 13:20:31 <andythenorth> that would explain why my attempts at animation control fail 13:37:25 *** shirish [~quassel@117.222.7.193] has joined #openttd 13:51:06 *** Biolunar_ [Biolunar@x4d0247bc.dyn.telefonica.de] has quit [Quit: Yo.] 13:57:30 *** solatis [~user@49.156.41.254] has joined #openttd 15:31:47 *** supermop [~supermop@d210-49-171-146.sun801.vic.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:32:44 *** Alberth [~alberth@a82-95-140-173.adsl.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 15:32:47 *** mode/#openttd [+o Alberth] by ChanServ 15:37:01 <Alberth> moin 15:37:55 <andythenorth> lo Alberth 15:40:30 <Alberth> time to look for dinner 15:45:02 *** glx [~glx@000128ec.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 15:45:05 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 15:57:15 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~flex@88.130.173.15] has joined #openttd 16:12:24 *** shirish [~quassel@0001358e.user.oftc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:13:03 *** Celestar [~Celestar@fire3.tngtech.com] has left #openttd [] 16:22:34 *** shirish [~quassel@117.222.7.193] has joined #openttd 16:26:53 *** sla_ro|master [slamaster@95.76.27.245] has joined #openttd 16:48:24 *** Progman [~progman@p57A19780.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 16:50:01 *** Bhoren [~quassel@LAubervilliers-656-1-270-96.w193-248.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #openttd 16:55:34 *** jinks [~jinks@172.245.35.67] has joined #openttd 17:01:48 *** solatis [~user@49.156.41.254] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:15:19 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 17:24:42 *** frosch123 [~frosch@x4d0096f0.dyn.telefonica.de] has joined #openttd 17:28:18 <andythenorth> quak 17:28:19 *** andythenorth [~Andy@194.168.185.226] has left #openttd [] 17:29:59 <frosch123> :p 17:41:00 *** Plaete [~moffi@x4d0a72b7.dyn.telefonica.de] has joined #openttd 17:54:14 *** Plaete [~moffi@x4d0a72b7.dyn.telefonica.de] has quit [Quit: Nettalk6 - www.ntalk.de] 17:56:17 <frosch123> lolwut 17:56:36 <frosch123> ah, nvm 17:57:03 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 17:57:06 <andythenorth> o/ 17:57:26 <frosch123> i found a reason to not support more than 32 cargos :) 17:57:35 <frosch123> it prevents a full full firs 18:00:41 <Eddi|zuHause> :p 18:01:01 <Eddi|zuHause> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rxUm-2x-2dM 18:01:22 <andythenorth> frosch123: I am +1 18:01:35 <andythenorth> although I still like the idea of 32 per newgrf :P 18:02:22 <peter1138> I think I had a patch for more than 32... 18:02:29 <peter1138> Who knows though... 18:03:22 <andythenorth> :) 18:05:14 * andythenorth boggles at animation 18:05:14 <frosch123> anyone changed anything wrt. engine previews lately? 18:07:02 *** OsteHovel [~OsteHovel@140.90-149-87.nextgentel.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:07:30 *** smoke_fumus [~smoke_fum@188.35.176.90] has joined #openttd 18:07:39 <andythenorth> when using sprite numbers I can do things like this 18:07:40 <andythenorth> 2174 + (((animation_frame % 11) < 6) ? (animation_frame % 11) : 10 - (animation_frame % 11)) 18:07:45 <andythenorth> but with spritesets, not so much 18:07:55 <andythenorth> afaict 18:08:43 *** OsteHovel [~OsteHovel@140.90-149-87.nextgentel.com] has joined #openttd 18:09:25 *** TheDude [~Thed@37.157.192.64] has quit [Quit: bye] 18:10:08 <frosch123> you can do that with sprites within a spriteset 18:10:38 *** TheDude [~Thed@new.novapolis.net] has joined #openttd 18:10:55 <andythenorth> yair 18:11:55 <andythenorth> so currently, for ~every spriteset, FIRS has something like 18:11:56 <andythenorth> sprite: coal_mine_spriteset_1a_0(1* animation_frame); 18:12:02 <andythenorth> where 1 might vary 18:12:06 <andythenorth> this is templated 18:12:32 * andythenorth needs to change that 18:13:34 * andythenorth doesnât really understand animation 18:13:49 <andythenorth> if I stop the animation with anim_control cb, the animation_frame stops incrementing? 18:19:37 <V453000> help help :( https://bugs.openttd.org/task/6303 18:20:03 <V453000> it happens all the time to all clients :( 18:20:40 <V453000> quite honestly I am also very curious wtf is the cause :D 18:21:50 <frosch123> ah, found my mistake 18:22:34 <andythenorth> \o/ 18:22:56 <frosch123> i have to rediscover desync log replaying every time :) 18:23:13 <V453000> :) 18:23:54 <frosch123> i failed to inject the commands, so i compared the saved replay with one noone playing :) 18:24:29 <V453000> (: 18:26:46 <frosch123> ah, i even compared it with a paused one 18:26:54 <frosch123> i always wondered why replay was wo fast :p 18:27:54 <V453000> what is replay? a series of savegames? 18:28:40 <frosch123> you gave me a start-savegame and a log of player actions 18:28:44 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@0001288e.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 18:28:48 <Wolf01> o/ 18:28:50 <frosch123> you also gave me a series of savegames from the original server 18:28:58 <V453000> :> 18:29:07 <V453000> idk what the files include :P 18:29:14 <frosch123> i replay the player actions on the start-savegame, and check whether it result sin the same as the original savegames 18:29:21 <frosch123> V453000: all the chat :p 18:29:33 <V453000> :D 18:31:37 <V453000> do you have any clues where could it be coming from? 18:31:56 <V453000> the desync not stupid shit I say :Pš 18:32:20 <frosch123> i first have to make sure that i am debugging it correctly :p 18:32:30 <V453000> :) 18:32:34 <V453000> good idea 18:40:51 <andythenorth> Epic WIN videos on YT are so much better than Epic FAIL :P 18:41:47 <V453000> havent ever seen such a thing 18:41:53 <V453000> who want to see someone succeed! 18:42:15 <frosch123> succeed with super hexagon? 18:42:26 <V453000> succeed with anything 18:42:32 <V453000> we humans want to see others fail 18:42:46 <frosch123> yup, that's why we add desyncs 18:43:00 <V453000> :D 18:43:17 <andythenorth> V453000: you are humans? :o 18:43:24 <andythenorth> news to andythenorth 18:43:27 <andythenorth> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=53YFLgRmG4Y 18:43:28 <V453000> xd 18:43:46 <andythenorth> my compile is FAIL :( 18:43:52 <andythenorth> but I didnât notice, busy watching YT 18:43:56 * andythenorth should get two screens 18:44:38 <V453000> laym 18:47:59 <frosch123> yay, triggered 18:49:38 <frosch123> industry builder data differs 18:49:49 <frosch123> likely something i broke with more industries :) 18:50:06 <V453000> I thought that could have caused some wtf :D 18:50:09 <Eddi|zuHause> did it pop out a stick with a flag that says "bang!" when triggered? 18:50:28 <V453000> can we blame andythenorth for that? 18:50:48 <V453000> err, s/can/will 18:51:05 <andythenorth> you will 18:51:08 <andythenorth> but you can't 18:51:11 <frosch123> Eddi|zuHause: killing does not create core dumps 18:51:15 <frosch123> you need to abort stuff 18:51:56 <Eddi|zuHause> how is a dead body not a cor(ps)e dump? 18:51:59 <frosch123> ah, i misread albert's code 18:55:18 *** FLHerne [~flh@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has joined #openttd 18:55:25 <frosch123> V453000: fixed :) 18:56:12 <V453000> no way =D 18:56:18 <V453000> awesome :) I love you 18:59:15 <DorpsGek> Commit by frosch :: r27291 trunk/src/saveload/industry_sl.cpp (2015-05-21 20:59:11 +0200 ) 18:59:16 <DorpsGek> -Fix (r27278) [FS#6303]: Some savegame data was discarded again during loading. 19:00:03 <V453000> =D 19:00:13 <V453000> I assume it will be available tomorrow evening? 19:00:34 <frosch123> if tb does not break the farm till then :) 19:00:44 <V453000> :DDDD 19:01:02 *** shirish [~quassel@0001358e.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:01:06 <V453000> TrueBrain: please do not break the farm till then :P 19:02:56 <andythenorth> the tile animation control, is it actually designed? 19:03:00 <andythenorth> or did it just grow? o_O 19:03:08 * andythenorth is unclear how it is intended to be used 19:03:22 <frosch123> why? 19:03:42 <frosch123> it's just a decision what frame to display next 19:03:56 <frosch123> either triggered periodically or by some event 19:04:01 <andythenorth> are start and stop just convenience methods? 19:04:24 <frosch123> they save cpu time 19:04:36 <frosch123> i start/stop the periodic trigger 19:04:47 <frosch123> *they 19:04:53 <frosch123> not me 19:05:11 <andythenorth> so e.g. FIRS coal mine has 3 sprites which loop 19:05:17 <andythenorth> for the winding wheel animation 19:05:34 <andythenorth> it needs to last n frames, then stop, then restart 19:05:44 <frosch123> what causes it to restart? 19:06:04 <andythenorth> havenât decided yet 19:06:18 <andythenorth> either a trigger, or it just gets to the end of the loop 19:06:28 <andythenorth> not sure what is best 19:06:57 <andythenorth> probably just gets to the end of the loop 19:07:03 <frosch123> well, if it stops then animation control triggers STOP at frame N 19:07:20 <frosch123> if it never stops then animation control continues with frame 0 after frame N 19:07:47 <frosch123> if it stops, and some event start it, that event trigger checks whether it is already running, and if not, starts it from frame 0 19:08:01 *** FLHerne [~flh@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has quit [Quit: There's a real world out here!] 19:09:05 <andythenorth> and in all cases I need a switch to choose which actual sprite to play from the spriteset 19:09:16 <andythenorth> no 19:09:23 * andythenorth thinking out loud, sorry :P 19:09:57 <andythenorth> how do I loop over 3 frames for say, 250 frames? 19:10:00 <andythenorth> canât 19:10:20 <andythenorth> could use permanent register I suppose 19:10:44 <andythenorth> increment a counter 19:10:48 <frosch123> you likely want to make it devideable by 3 :p 19:10:59 <frosch123> *divideable 19:11:12 <frosch123> 249 frames :) 19:11:14 <andythenorth> easier 19:11:48 <andythenorth> but when I tried this, I get 3 frames of sprite, then a question mark 19:11:57 <andythenorth> I know why it didnât work 19:12:03 <andythenorth> I just donât know which is the intended route 19:12:08 <andythenorth> I suspect there isnât one 19:12:40 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: LOAD(blah)%3 for 3-loops 19:12:57 <andythenorth> the spriteset has 3 sprites 19:13:20 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: this cycles the numbers 0,1,2 19:13:38 <Eddi|zuHause> as long as blah increases by 1 in each step 19:13:55 <andythenorth> so the correct route is to do that in a switch 19:15:04 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: how would that stop animating after n frames? 19:15:12 <andythenorth> the animation for coal mine is intermittent 19:15:37 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: you stop when you stop incrementing blah 19:16:07 <frosch123> just call "blah" "animation_frame" 19:16:15 <andythenorth> yes 19:16:20 *** liq3 [liq3@CPE-120-147-178-81.gdfw1.lon.bigpond.net.au] has quit [] 19:16:37 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: the code that reads blah doesn't need to know whether blah is currently in stopped or incrementing mode 19:16:55 <Eddi|zuHause> it works either way 19:17:27 <andythenorth> so for an intermittent animation with a regular cycle, start / stop is irrelevant 19:17:35 <andythenorth> just control which sprite to show per frame 19:19:01 <andythenorth> simple eh? 19:21:47 <Eddi|zuHause> you start/stop in a different piece of code 19:22:54 <andythenorth> yup 19:22:54 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:22:55 *** Bhoren [~quassel@LAubervilliers-656-1-270-96.w193-248.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:22:56 *** Bhoren [~quassel@LAubervilliers-656-1-270-96.w193-248.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #openttd 19:23:42 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 19:31:08 <andythenorth> ok, so with max length 253, I see the point of start / stop :P 19:34:57 <andythenorth> ha ha thereâs âanim_next_frameâ as well 19:35:01 <andythenorth> thatâs what confuses me :D 19:35:09 <andythenorth> multiple ways to achieve same result 19:35:15 <andythenorth> thatâs relatively uncommon for newgrf spec 19:37:21 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: i think anim_next_frame is for when you want to do weird loops like "loop 3-9 this month, loop 10-30 next month" 19:37:39 <frosch123> it's the periodic trigger 19:37:39 <andythenorth> yes 19:37:52 <andythenorth> nah anim_control is the periodic trigger isnât it? 19:37:56 <frosch123> you use it to stop the animation after 246 frames 19:38:02 <frosch123> instead of making it loop 19:38:05 <andythenorth> anim_next_frame is the âevery frameâ check 19:38:39 <andythenorth> anim_next_frame seems nearly totally redundant to me 19:38:41 <andythenorth> but eh 19:38:53 <andythenorth> I guess it saves CPU time 19:39:09 <frosch123> it's the most important one for you 3 frames animation :p 19:39:16 <andythenorth> I donât use it 19:39:18 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, so for a 3-9 loop you do "if n==9: n=3; else: n=n+1" 19:39:37 <andythenorth> thatâs silly :) 19:39:44 <andythenorth> just do it in the graphics chain 19:39:45 <Eddi|zuHause> and to stop the animation you do "n=n" 19:40:17 <Eddi|zuHause> or "n=3" 19:40:38 <andythenorth> STORE_TEMP((animation_frame > 63 ? 1 : (animation_frame % 3)) 19:40:41 <Eddi|zuHause> or whatever 19:40:54 <andythenorth> ^^ just do that in the graphics block 19:41:08 <andythenorth> or do I miss something? 19:41:32 <frosch123> you are wasting 3/4 cpu time :) nothing else 19:41:52 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: yes. this makes an animation for 64 ticks, then stops for 196 ticks, then animates for 64 ticks, ... 19:42:52 <andythenorth> yes 19:43:16 <andythenorth> if I wanted âplay onceâ then anim_next_frame would be needed 19:43:28 <andythenorth> or I set no-loop on the animation 19:44:06 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: you probably want to fire a no-loop animation at random points 19:44:19 <andythenorth> periodic tile loop? 19:44:40 <andythenorth> seems most appropriate 19:44:57 <Eddi|zuHause> i would have expected there to be a random animation start callback 19:45:10 <andythenorth> can be done with the tile random bits 19:45:30 <frosch123> the animation callbacks all have random bits 19:45:51 <frosch123> you can randomise every frame :p 19:46:07 <Eddi|zuHause> like in extra_callback_info1? 19:46:23 <frosch123> yes 19:52:34 * andythenorth wonders if ternary op can be stacked 19:52:59 <andythenorth> condition1 ? result1 : (condition2 ? result2 : result3) 19:53:17 <Eddi|zuHause> yes 19:57:09 <andythenorth> ta 19:58:49 <andythenorth> ha ha 19:58:56 * andythenorth has made a boo-boo 19:59:08 <andythenorth> graphics chain is per industry currently, not per tile 19:59:13 <andythenorth> but animation rules are per tile 19:59:29 <andythenorth> doing it in the graphics chain is, in this case, a Terrible Idea 19:59:37 <andythenorth> specifically a FIRS issue :P 20:01:32 <Eddi|zuHause> i don't know what that means 20:03:41 <andythenorth> FIRS defines multiple tiles for some industries 20:03:48 <andythenorth> with different animation rules 20:04:15 <andythenorth> but the graphics chain has no way currently to provide a switch with per-tile rules 20:04:19 <andythenorth> because reasons :P 20:04:46 <frosch123> don't start animation for all tiles 20:04:52 <frosch123> that would be even more cpu waste 20:05:06 <andythenorth> oh FIRS did that ages ago I think :) 20:05:14 * andythenorth should check 20:05:21 <andythenorth> literally for years iirc 20:05:33 <frosch123> i should finnish that callback profiler :p 20:05:36 * andythenorth wonders about the carbon impact of FIRS 20:06:52 * andythenorth back to anim_next_frame then :P 20:09:09 *** Ketsuban [~ketsuban@2.221.246.223] has quit [Quit: To robbery, slaughter, plunder they give the lying name of empire; they make a desert and call it peace.] 20:09:37 *** Klanticus [~quassel@179.234.179.109] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:10:29 <andythenorth> ah 20:11:30 <andythenorth> yes every FIRS industry tile has animation_info set 20:11:56 <andythenorth> and in many cases the value is 1 :P 20:15:04 *** Alberth [~alberth@a82-95-140-173.adsl.xs4all.nl] has left #openttd [] 20:18:35 *** roidal_ [~roland@193-154-139-153.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 1.1.1] 20:28:45 <andythenorth> frosch123: you think animation makes much difference? o_O 20:29:48 <frosch123> problem is when it also causes work for unserviced industries 20:29:56 <frosch123> i.e. for douchebags playing on 4kx4k maps 20:30:14 <frosch123> thousands of animated tiles on an empty map 20:31:05 <frosch123> the tileloop only runs every 2.5 seconds 20:31:17 <frosch123> your animation runs every 0.1 seconds? 20:32:07 <andythenorth> probably :P 20:45:15 <frosch123> night 20:45:18 *** frosch123 [~frosch@x4d0096f0.dyn.telefonica.de] has quit [Quit: be yourself, except: if you have the opportunity to be a unicorn, then be a unicorn] 20:55:26 *** Progman [~progman@p57A19780.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:04:42 <andythenorth> this doesnât :D https://paste.openttdcoop.org/plp8ivr47 21:05:35 <andythenorth> never triggers 21:09:20 *** sla_ro|master [slamaster@95.76.27.245] has quit [] 21:22:50 *** wicope [~wicope@0001fd8a.user.oftc.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:27:26 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~flex@88.130.173.15] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:29:02 *** DarkenMoon [DarkenMoon@2602:100:6028:c90e:bdf6:92b9:da45:f13b] has joined #openttd 21:29:47 <Wolf01> 'night 21:29:54 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@0001288e.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 21:30:04 * andythenorth is such a bad programmer :P 22:00:35 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has left #openttd [] 22:22:14 <Eddi|zuHause> we know. 22:43:20 *** Bhoren [~quassel@LAubervilliers-656-1-270-96.w193-248.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:22:44 *** DDR [~david@S010600254bbe4e1c.vc.shawcable.net] has joined #openttd 23:24:53 *** tycoondemon [~ashnohoe@D97B8CD4.cm-3-4c.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:29:41 *** tycoondemon [~ashnohoe@D97B8CD4.cm-3-4c.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has joined #openttd 23:29:41 *** DDR [~david@S010600254bbe4e1c.vc.shawcable.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:39:47 *** tycoondemon [~ashnohoe@D97B8CD4.cm-3-4c.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:42:41 *** tycoondemon [~ashnohoe@D97B8CD4.cm-3-4c.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has joined #openttd 23:54:41 *** supermop [~supermop@d210-49-171-146.sun801.vic.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd