Times are UTC Toggle Colours
00:00:17 *** glx [~glx@000128ec.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Bye] 00:50:29 *** JezK_ [~jez@2407:7800:400:107f:3db5:daca:8457:e66a] has joined #openttd 00:53:20 *** JezK_ [~jez@2407:7800:400:107f:3db5:daca:8457:e66a] has quit [] 00:53:38 *** JezK [~jez@2407:7800:400:107f:3db5:daca:8457:e66a] has joined #openttd 00:56:34 *** FLHerne [~flh@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:56:39 *** Nathan1852_ [~Nathan185@p5DC11402.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 00:59:04 <Sylf> You can decode NewGRF to nfo. There may be nfo to NML converter/translator, but that won't still produce very readable code than nfo itself, as far as I know. 01:03:05 *** FLHerne [~flh@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has joined #openttd 01:03:14 *** FLHerne [~flh@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has quit [] 01:04:01 *** Nathan1852 [~Nathan185@p5DC11402.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:40:14 *** Nathan1852__ [~Nathan185@p5DC11855.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 01:47:44 *** Nathan1852_ [~Nathan185@p5DC11402.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:56:04 *** Nathan1852__ [~Nathan185@p5DC11855.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:52:59 *** DDR_ [~David@S0106001f16aa47bc.vc.shawcable.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:53:54 *** DDR [~David@S0106001f16aa47bc.vc.shawcable.net] has joined #openttd 02:54:00 *** DDR [~David@S0106001f16aa47bc.vc.shawcable.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:19:18 *** smoke_fumus [~smoke_fum@188.35.176.90] has quit [Quit: KVIrc 4.2.0 Equilibrium http://www.kvirc.net/] 03:30:24 <ade> I can't find "sprites/png/gui/introletters.png" in zbase-8fc57f008040 04:36:56 *** liq3 [liq3@CPE-120-147-178-81.gdfw1.lon.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 04:39:24 *** Supercheese [~Superchee@cpe-76-178-136-186.natnow.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Valete omnes] 04:55:37 *** liq3 [liq3@CPE-120-147-178-81.gdfw1.lon.bigpond.net.au] has quit [] 04:56:02 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p57BD4C06.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [] 04:56:16 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p57BD4783.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 04:57:33 *** liq3 [liq3@CPE-120-147-178-81.gdfw1.lon.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 05:43:30 *** Supercheese [~Superchee@cpe-76-178-136-186.natnow.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 06:11:48 *** sla_ro|master [slamaster@95.76.27.245] has joined #openttd 06:47:06 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 06:47:26 <andythenorth> o/ 06:51:19 <Supercheese> ahoy 06:59:22 <andythenorth> @seen pikka 06:59:22 <DorpsGek> andythenorth: pikka was last seen in #openttd 1 day, 23 hours, 35 minutes, and 50 seconds ago: <Pikka> flakey andynet? 07:06:15 <Supercheese> @seen Pokka 07:06:15 <DorpsGek> Supercheese: Pokka was last seen in #openttd 1 week, 2 days, 23 hours, 25 minutes, and 45 seconds ago: <Pokka> tilt to you too 07:37:02 <planetmaker> moin 07:38:22 *** Biolunar [Biolunar@x4d025332.dyn.telefonica.de] has joined #openttd 07:49:22 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 08:05:03 *** Hiddenfunstuff [~Geth@a392.ip16.netikka.fi] has joined #openttd 08:20:49 *** wicope [~wicope@0001fd8a.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 09:10:31 *** Pikka [~Octomom@124-170-107-114.dyn.iinet.net.au] has joined #openttd 09:34:46 *** Nathan1852__ [~Nathan185@p5DC11855.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 09:43:53 *** JacobD88 [~Thunderbi@cpc20-stap11-2-0-cust13.12-2.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 10:02:48 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 10:14:15 *** FLHerne [~flh@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has joined #openttd 10:15:06 <Pikka> isn't it 10:15:18 <Eddi|zuHause> no, definitely not. 10:15:29 <andythenorth> probably 10:15:34 <andythenorth> what is it? 10:15:48 <Pikka> hard to say really 10:15:55 <andythenorth> I canât tell 10:16:17 <andythenorth> but eh 10:16:24 <andythenorth> I now have 87 vehicles in Road Hog 10:16:27 <andythenorth> did I win yet? 10:16:38 <Eddi|zuHause> no. 10:16:39 <Pikka> depends. do you feel like a winner? 10:16:44 <andythenorth> not yet 10:16:51 <andythenorth> Iâm hoping that I add what I think is right 10:16:51 <Pikka> must need more then 10:17:01 <andythenorth> with the result being 99 10:17:03 <Eddi|zuHause> you win when you release. 10:17:14 <andythenorth> sometimes you lose when release :( 10:17:27 <Eddi|zuHause> tel aviv. 10:18:13 <Eddi|zuHause> [that's a pun on "c'est la vie"] 10:19:43 *** tokai [~tokai@00012860.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 10:19:46 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai] by ChanServ 10:26:30 *** tokai|noir [~tokai@00012860.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:32:04 *** Nathan1852_ [~Nathan185@p5DC11855.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 10:34:49 *** sla_ro|master [slamaster@95.76.27.245] has quit [] 10:35:16 <andythenorth> Pikka: tried to stop your thread getting derailed into needless shit, failed sorry :) 10:35:38 <andythenorth> are you getting any traction from redditters? 10:35:46 * andythenorth has no idea about reddit, itâs for young people 10:36:15 <Pikka> a little, I'm not sure where most of the response is coming from though. Don't recognise the names. 10:36:36 <Pikka> I'm getting some through from the other language communities, the czechs and russians, which is nice. 10:37:11 <andythenorth> nice 10:37:34 <andythenorth> not sure how to help promote it 10:37:53 <andythenorth> forums are only OTTD place I really use 10:38:15 <Pikka> I don't know. I put out a few feelers to sites which have done articles on (Open)TTD before, I might possibly get something out of that 10:38:36 <planetmaker> from our google+ account a line was posted as well 10:39:16 *** Nathan1852__ [~Nathan185@p5DC11855.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:46:35 *** Alberth [~alberth@2001:981:c6c5:1:be5f:f4ff:feac:e11] has joined #openttd 10:46:38 *** mode/#openttd [+o Alberth] by ChanServ 10:54:30 *** glevans2 [~glevans2@71.12.36.79] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:56:37 *** glevans2 [~glevans2@71.12.36.79] has joined #openttd 11:08:24 <andythenorth> lo Alberth 11:08:37 <Alberth> moin 11:18:56 <andythenorth> eh 11:19:06 <andythenorth> pax and mail tram progression 11:20:14 <andythenorth> cargo trams are easy, 50t, 25mph-> 80t, 35mph, -> 110t, 45mph 11:20:31 <andythenorth> all about the same length, or new one is shorter than old, so more trams fit in a tile 11:20:36 <andythenorth> player wins every time 11:21:17 <Eddi|zuHause> you don't want more than one tram per tile, it doesn't mix well with the drive through stops 11:21:20 <andythenorth> pax trams get bigger and faster, but also double-deck -> multiple unit single deck 11:21:33 <andythenorth> this is bad for capacity per tile :( 11:21:56 <Eddi|zuHause> then don't make double decker trams 11:22:02 <andythenorth> yeah 11:22:09 <andythenorth> not very british though :) 11:22:33 <Alberth> non-britsh tram roster :) 11:22:52 <andythenorth> the grain tram is norwegian :P 11:22:58 <andythenorth> the dump tram is USA :P 11:23:05 <andythenorth> the beer tram is made up 11:23:18 <Alberth> international tram roster 11:23:50 <andythenorth> I should have matched rosters to FIRS economies or TTD climates 11:23:56 <andythenorth> not countries :P 11:25:24 <Alberth> s/british/temperate/ and done :) 11:26:05 <andythenorth> for Iron Horse, we also included Ireland and âpretend things that people made up but never got built really' 11:26:09 <andythenorth> which helps :) 11:32:30 *** Supercheese [~Superchee@cpe-76-178-136-186.natnow.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:33:06 *** Supercheese [~Superchee@cpe-76-178-136-186.natnow.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 11:33:53 <andythenorth> double deck tram http://11even.net/2010/05/stockholm-city-autonomous-tram-by-vanessa-sattele-patrik-pettersson-fredrik-nilsson/kreativ/ 11:35:47 <__ln__> photoshopped 11:37:02 <andythenorth> mockup 11:37:25 <Alberth> looks nice 11:37:50 *** wicope [~wicope@0001fd8a.user.oftc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:40:23 <Pikka> goodnight all, uni in the morning :) 11:40:25 *** Pikka [~Octomom@124-170-107-114.dyn.iinet.net.au] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 11:41:55 <andythenorth> looks steep for a tram http://www.railpage.org.au/tram/images/syd-d.jpg 11:43:08 <Alberth> you can see the gradient from that? :) 11:43:14 <Alberth> maybe it goes down-hill :) 11:43:30 <andythenorth> Iâm assuming the posts are vertical :) 11:47:26 <andythenorth> chibi https://i0.wp.com/www.papercraftsquare.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/Japanese-Train-and-Wagon-Papercrafts.jpg 11:50:36 *** TheMask96 [martijn@sloth.vhost.ne2000.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:50:57 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: photos are unreliable for determining grades, as the lenses distort everything 11:51:24 <andythenorth> yeah I know :) 11:51:58 <andythenorth> the rocks on the right hand side suggest a rising grade though 11:52:00 <andythenorth> amongst other things 11:52:15 <andythenorth> there are probably plenty of examples online of visual illusions proving this is a fallacy 11:53:53 *** Nathan1852__ [~Nathan185@p5DC11855.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 11:54:08 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: even if you can say it's a rising grade, the steepness is still unreliable 11:54:28 <Eddi|zuHause> anyway, i've seen trams climb some pretty steep grades 11:56:39 *** TheMask96 [martijn@lust.vhost.ne2000.nl] has joined #openttd 12:00:10 <andythenorth> so Road Hog has double-deck buses (slow, high capacity) 12:00:19 <andythenorth> and single-deck coaches, fast, high capacity 12:00:41 <andythenorth> but coaches are not as high as the buses 12:01:01 <andythenorth> but all are 8/8 or less 12:01:12 <andythenorth> this doesnât work for trams 12:01:14 *** Nathan1852_ [~Nathan185@p5DC11855.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:01:15 * andythenorth puzzling 12:01:52 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: pax trams need to be very high capacity per tile yes? 12:02:55 <Eddi|zuHause> i'd say 1 tram (1 tile) should be able to replace 3 single deck busses (1/2 tile) 12:03:31 <andythenorth> yeah thatâs fine 12:03:36 <Eddi|zuHause> assuming double deck busses have 50% more capacity than single deck, then that would make those equal 12:04:07 <andythenorth> trying to figure out if there are 2 types of tram or 1 12:04:22 <Eddi|zuHause> one type should suffice 12:04:33 <andythenorth> IRL isnât actually a problem here 12:04:50 <andythenorth> single-deck trams have high standing capacity, whereas double-deck donât 12:04:57 <andythenorth> so they net out about the same 12:05:14 <Eddi|zuHause> that's what i said, right? 12:05:19 <andythenorth> yeah 12:05:37 <andythenorth> decision is whether to have double-deck trams (for variety and realism) or not 12:05:57 <andythenorth> cost is that trams suddenly get much longer around 1960 12:06:39 <Eddi|zuHause> well, trams did get much longer around 1960... 12:06:48 <andythenorth> is that bad for gameplay? 12:06:58 <andythenorth> auto-replace: block all stations 12:07:08 <andythenorth> tedious? 12:07:15 <Eddi|zuHause> it's a challenge, not necessarily terrible 12:07:35 <andythenorth> current roster is mutable 12:07:54 <andythenorth> steam tram (engine + double deck trailer), 2 units 12:08:04 <andythenorth> 2 models of single unit double deck 12:08:13 <andythenorth> then 2 models of multiple unit single deck 12:10:30 <andythenorth> hmm, the multiple unit single deck could be a new option from 1960 12:10:47 <andythenorth> requiring stations to be adjusted 12:10:51 <andythenorth> dunno, probably overthinking 12:13:26 <Eddi|zuHause> GermanRV has a problem that in the 1990s, trams go from 1.2 tiles to 2 tiles, without properly increasing capacity. that actually is terrible 12:14:03 <andythenorth> seems pointless :) 12:14:28 <Eddi|zuHause> GermanRV has an inconsisty with mapping real length to game length 12:14:59 <Eddi|zuHause> but i never quite could convince Uwe to fix it 12:16:49 * andythenorth wonders whether to approach trams more radically 12:16:55 <andythenorth> and keep a fixed length for all time 12:17:03 <andythenorth> that is how Iron Horse does metro 12:28:32 *** JezK [~jez@2407:7800:400:107f:3db5:daca:8457:e66a] has quit [Quit: :q!] 12:34:18 *** zeknurn [~sup@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:41:11 *** zeknurn [~sup@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has joined #openttd 12:47:27 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: you ever move mail in your games? 12:51:28 <Hiddenfunstuff> isnt mail quite worthless and uesless? 12:51:47 <Hiddenfunstuff> and usually low quantities so its not even worth putting trains for it 12:51:51 <planetmaker> I value the mail I get - except when it's bills :) 12:52:03 <Hiddenfunstuff> aka once in year? 12:52:09 <planetmaker> :D 12:52:31 <andythenorth> mail between cities is easy, just add mail wagons to a train 12:52:38 <andythenorth> but within cities with trucks or trams? 12:52:40 * andythenorth doesnât bother 12:52:45 <andythenorth> ever 12:52:54 <Hiddenfunstuff> bill, bill, bill, complaint, bill, bill, speeding ticket, bill, bill, complaint, bill ... 12:53:08 <Hiddenfunstuff> Also spam 12:59:22 <V453000> I read add mail wagons to brain 13:00:30 <andythenorth> yeah 13:00:31 <Hiddenfunstuff> instructions unclear, mailed my brain 13:00:33 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: i rarely do mail, mostly because overabundance of passengers takes all my attention 13:00:37 <andythenorth> thatâs what I wrote V453000 13:01:32 <Eddi|zuHause> with a town production factor of 1/4 i might do mail properly 13:01:50 <Hiddenfunstuff> well tbh.. I rarely even bother with passengers either 13:03:55 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: anyway, whether i do or do not use mail, doesn't mean you can alter your obligation to provide proper mail transport :p 13:04:14 <andythenorth> more a question about whether you have valid opinion :) 13:04:31 <andythenorth> I am unsure about sizing of mail (also express freight) trams 13:04:31 <Eddi|zuHause> my opinion is that you should handle mail like any of your other cargo trams 13:05:11 <Eddi|zuHause> well, in CETS, mail capacity is probably larger than default. but i really have not spent much time on it 13:05:44 <andythenorth> the Road Hog trucks do 30 / 30 / 50 / 50 bags of mail 13:06:09 <andythenorth> dunno if that works yet 13:06:46 <Eddi|zuHause> i think the same ratio of 3 single-length trucks = 1 double-length tram should apply 13:06:54 <andythenorth> who builds mail trams, really? o_O 13:06:55 <Eddi|zuHause> but on the base value, i cannot give you any advise 13:06:56 <andythenorth> people do that? 13:07:04 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, mail trams existed 13:07:11 <andythenorth> irl I know 13:07:16 <Eddi|zuHause> London also has a mail-underground ;) 13:07:32 <andythenorth> but in game, there is usually no room for freight tram stops 13:07:35 <andythenorth> in town 13:07:47 <andythenorth> due to pax tram stops + queuing 13:11:44 <Alberth> with RV, I usually move the mail trucks to another street 13:12:28 <andythenorth> trams are trickier I think, due to turning loops 13:12:30 <andythenorth> might be wrong 13:13:06 <Eddi|zuHause> there are certainly many valid approaches to a mail network in parallel to a passenger network in a town 13:14:01 <Eddi|zuHause> anyway, if you have a grain tram and a beer tram, there's no reason to not have a mail tram 13:14:21 <V453000> everything is a beer tram in hiding 13:14:49 <Eddi|zuHause> if all you have is beer goggles, everything is a beer. 13:15:03 <V453000> yay 13:17:08 <Alberth> we'll just rename every cargo to "beer" :p 13:17:24 <andythenorth> simples 13:17:29 <andythenorth> accepts BEER 13:17:31 <andythenorth> produces BEER 13:17:57 <andythenorth> current pax tram generations + lengths: https://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/7407/pax_trams.png 13:17:58 <Alberth> stockpile: inifnite, until V arrived 13:18:13 <andythenorth> not convinced by the pax trams 13:18:52 <Alberth> bbl 13:18:55 *** Alberth [~alberth@2001:981:c6c5:1:be5f:f4ff:feac:e11] has left #openttd [] 13:19:41 <Eddi|zuHause> V453000: well, it's not like you have full control over an industry set to achueve this 13:19:51 <Eddi|zuHause> -u+i 13:20:31 <V453000> :) 13:20:34 <andythenorth> actually those pax trams are definitely suck 13:20:42 <andythenorth> the length progression just looks dumb 13:21:08 <V453000> I like it 13:21:11 <Eddi|zuHause> i'm somewhat indifferent 13:21:23 <andythenorth> no logic :P 13:22:54 <V453000> fuck logic 13:22:57 <V453000> go for beer solution 13:23:28 <andythenorth> beer solution is all one size 13:26:00 <Eddi|zuHause> beer is certainly not all one size. if you order one beer in cologne, you get 0,2l. if you order one beer in munich, you get 1l 13:27:21 <andythenorth> well when youâve tried all the beers, tell me how to fix pax and mail trams 13:27:37 <andythenorth> the cargo trams are now satisfactory, thanks to help from [random irc people] 13:27:39 <Eddi|zuHause> you never tried all the beers 13:28:18 <andythenorth> the pax and freight RVs are also satisfactory, for some value of satisfactory 13:28:24 <V453000> xd 13:28:26 <andythenorth> factoring in overtaking, station type etc :P 13:30:36 *** FLHerne [~flh@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:41:13 <V453000> doing some serious BRIX progress 13:41:20 <V453000> tracks being done now 13:42:20 <andythenorth> :) 13:44:12 *** zeknurn [~sup@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:47:40 * andythenorth wonders why openttd doesnât persist settings 13:47:44 <andythenorth> itâs a persistent irritation 13:48:02 <andythenorth> I have changed the build-while-paused settings maybe a hundred times now 13:49:23 *** zeknurn [~sup@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has joined #openttd 13:58:55 *** Belugas [~belugas@00011985.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:58:55 *** Belugas [~belugas@216.191.111.230] has joined #openttd 13:58:58 *** mode/#openttd [+o Belugas] by ChanServ 14:01:14 <Eddi|zuHause> it's not openttd, it's you. 14:01:42 <andythenorth> is there a save button? 14:01:56 <Eddi|zuHause> either you change settings from within the game, which doesn't persist on the next game you start 14:02:10 <Eddi|zuHause> or your openttd.cfg file (or the directory) is write protected 14:02:20 <andythenorth> itâs the former 14:02:29 <andythenorth> 100% explains it 14:02:50 <Eddi|zuHause> change it on the main menu, and it should persist 14:02:54 * andythenorth tests 14:03:31 <andythenorth> solved 14:03:54 <andythenorth> I have openttd open all the time 14:04:07 <andythenorth> but I never leave it on the main menu, due to sound effects 14:04:17 <andythenorth> I leave it in a game, then use ânewgameâ in console 14:04:43 <andythenorth> thus no persisting of settings 14:04:44 <Eddi|zuHause> you can use the "settings_newgame" [or similar] console command 14:05:03 <andythenorth> I did patch out the main menu sound effects once 14:05:08 <andythenorth> but patches die :P 14:08:11 <Eddi|zuHause> just replace opntitle.dat 14:08:25 <Eddi|zuHause> or delete it 14:11:31 <andythenorth> ta 14:15:13 *** Belugas [~belugas@00011985.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:15:13 *** Belugas [~belugas@216.191.111.230] has joined #openttd 14:15:16 *** mode/#openttd [+o Belugas] by ChanServ 14:30:59 *** Flygon [~Flygon@ppp118-209-106-83.lns20.mel4.internode.on.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:31:12 *** Flygon [~Flygon@ppp118-209-106-83.lns20.mel4.internode.on.net] has joined #openttd 14:32:43 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 14:41:50 *** JacobD88 [~Thunderbi@cpc20-stap11-2-0-cust13.12-2.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: JacobD88] 14:50:25 *** roidal [~roland@cm140-210.liwest.at] has joined #openttd 14:55:15 *** txtsd [~txtsd@103.20.64.208] has joined #openttd 14:55:19 <txtsd> hello 14:55:36 <txtsd> how can I make a 'very flat' world without 50% of it being water? 14:55:55 <txtsd> I set sea level to 1, but the map still generates with 50% water 14:56:17 <Eddi|zuHause> make a heightmap in your favourite image processing program 14:57:30 *** qwebirc56954 [~oftc-webi@221.3.134.142] has joined #openttd 14:57:50 <Eddi|zuHause> if you feel you have trouble coming up with suitible random shapes, try making a non-flat map, export it as heightmap, scale down the colours in the heightmap, and import that heightmap 14:58:24 *** Nathan1852__ [~Nathan185@p5DC11855.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:00:50 <txtsd> That sounds like a lot of work for a one-click feature 15:00:55 *** qwebirc56954 [~oftc-webi@221.3.134.142] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:01:06 <Eddi|zuHause> also, turn off variety distribution 15:01:25 <txtsd> oh I haven't tried fiddling with that option. Let me try it and get back. 15:01:57 <Eddi|zuHause> it runs an extra flattening step over the map, which might be too much for a map that already is flat 15:04:03 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~flex@i59F6D6E0.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 15:04:36 <txtsd> ok turning it off got me the kind of map I want 15:04:38 <txtsd> thanks :D 15:05:41 <txtsd> I've been watching OpenTTD lets play videos all day. I read about the game in a thread on the archlinux forums earlier today. I'm ready to play my own game now! 15:17:52 *** Alberth [~alberth@2001:981:c6c5:1:be5f:f4ff:feac:e11] has joined #openttd 15:17:55 *** mode/#openttd [+o Alberth] by ChanServ 15:18:45 <txtsd> Are there prerequisites for getting Oil Rigs on the map? I haven't seen a single one on the temperate maps I've been generating 15:18:55 <txtsd> The wiki doesn't mention anything special 15:19:11 <Alberth> after 1960, temperate climate 15:19:48 <Alberth> hmm, generating, not sure if they appear then 15:20:05 <txtsd> So they'll just appear as I play once I hit 1960? 15:20:09 <Alberth> generating and regular industry spawning during play are different things 15:20:35 <Alberth> it should happen gradually, but yep 15:20:42 <txtsd> Oh I see 15:21:09 <Alberth> there is probably also the requirement of having some water :p 15:21:35 <Alberth> default even demands water near the edge 15:21:38 <txtsd> I have water on all edges of my maps 15:22:46 <Alberth> and you need industry spawaning, ie no newgrfs that block industry creation or closure (to a lesser extent) 15:23:07 <Alberth> but if you play default, that should be fine 15:23:22 <txtsd> Gotcha. I only have Japanese town and city names for newgrfs. I don't want to stray too much. 15:24:12 <Alberth> you could check out the opengfx+ newgrfs, they are in the spirit of default game play, but just a little nicer 15:24:31 <Alberth> opengfx+industries however fails with toyland climate :( 15:24:50 <txtsd> Is it better than zbase? 15:24:57 <txtsd> zbase looks good enough for me 15:25:29 <Alberth> they only change behaviour, no need graphics (except opengfx+landscape I think) 15:26:02 <Alberth> zbase looks too flat and unfinished for me 15:26:25 <Alberth> so I play opengfx or even original base set 15:26:51 <Alberth> but I guess it's just what you're used to :) 15:27:10 <txtsd> Ok I'll download and try them out. Thanks for the suggestion! 15:30:07 *** jottyfan [~jottyfan@p54B47E53.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 15:39:28 *** TheMask96 [martijn@lust.vhost.ne2000.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:44:40 *** TheMask96 [martijn@pride.vhost.ne2000.nl] has joined #openttd 15:45:53 *** glx [~glx@000128ec.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 15:45:56 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 15:54:41 *** troilus [~troilus@117.136.63.16] has joined #openttd 16:02:46 *** troilus [~troilus@117.136.63.16] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:04:27 *** frosch123 [~frosch@x5f7443f0.dyn.telefonica.de] has joined #openttd 16:06:40 <Eddi|zuHause> whoever's responsible for the changelog, i think it should include all previous releases of a major version (so 1.5.1 changelog includes all changes for 1.5.0 as well) 16:07:44 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 16:10:00 <frosch123> just use the wiki 16:11:39 <Eddi|zuHause> not what i meant... 16:12:20 <andythenorth> hurgh 16:12:26 <andythenorth> silly tramses 16:12:40 <andythenorth> IRL, trams used to sometimes run in convoys 16:12:46 <andythenorth> not connected, but closely following :P 16:13:02 * andythenorth considers how that would look in the buy menu: âTram Convoy" 16:17:44 *** Belugas [~belugas@00011985.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:18:06 *** Belugas [~belugas@216.191.111.230] has joined #openttd 16:18:09 *** mode/#openttd [+o Belugas] by ChanServ 16:35:18 *** JacobD88 [~Thunderbi@cpc20-stap11-2-0-cust13.12-2.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 16:49:45 <andythenorth> this looks better for length progression https://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/7408/pax_trams_2.png 16:49:50 <andythenorth> probably bad for gameplay? 16:50:14 <andythenorth> biggest tram is 19/8 long 16:50:32 <andythenorth> shortest is 10/8 16:53:08 <Supercheese> looks better for lengths yeah 16:53:24 <Supercheese> the first longer then shorter progression was odd 16:54:23 <andythenorth> agreed 16:54:32 <andythenorth> if we want double deck trams, they can be separate 16:54:46 <andythenorth> hmm, the first steam one is double deck, but anyway :P 16:55:06 <andythenorth> Iâll wait for Eddiâs comments on lengths 16:55:48 <andythenorth> I ran a few tests last week, 18/8 seems to be an optimum length for station performance, but it wasnât very scientific 16:59:41 *** FLHerne [~flh@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has joined #openttd 16:59:45 <Alberth> pretty much all software runs by testing :p 17:02:16 <andythenorth> if it was scientific, I might have a hypothesis, instead of vague empiricism :P 17:05:06 <andythenorth> anyway, tramz :P 17:05:09 <andythenorth> are getting more done 17:06:32 *** luaduck_ [~luaduck@cream.duck.me.uk] has joined #openttd 17:06:55 *** luaduck is now known as luaduck_old 17:06:56 *** luaduck_ is now known as luaduck 17:07:03 *** Belugas [~belugas@00011985.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:07:24 <Alberth> the scientific approach takes too long, you'd have to compare each length with every other length 17:07:42 <andythenorth> I used a subset :P 17:07:51 *** Belugas [~belugas@216.191.111.230] has joined #openttd 17:07:52 *** mode/#openttd [+o Belugas] by ChanServ 17:07:52 <andythenorth> and no combinations of different lengths 17:08:02 <andythenorth> it was a monoculture of lengths 17:08:33 <Alberth> that can be good, see eg nuts :) 17:09:07 <V453000> wat 17:09:25 <V453000> ah andy with his length mess 17:09:57 <andythenorth> ideally all vehicles would be 8/8 17:09:57 <V453000> I would just make a total length the same for all vehicles, and make them consist of various lengths of articulated things 17:10:10 <V453000> makes it look fun and work fine 17:10:48 <andythenorth> shall I do that for the pax tramz? 17:10:50 <andythenorth> I wouldnât mind 17:10:57 <andythenorth> makes station building easy throughout the game 17:11:22 <V453000> idk :) 17:11:30 <V453000> for RVs I think various lengths are kind of nice 17:11:52 <V453000> I suppose it is good to keep them in half-tile multiplications, but it is fun to choose a longer/shorter vehicle 17:12:01 <andythenorth> contradicting your previous statement :P 17:12:10 <V453000> RVs though 17:12:24 <V453000> thought you mean trains 17:12:34 <andythenorth> nah 17:12:38 <andythenorth> tramzz 17:12:38 <V453000> if trains have odd lengths, it is bad because they combine one train 17:12:54 <V453000> RVs are one vehicle as a whole, so the length of the unit nicely matters 17:13:21 <andythenorth> length affects station performance⊠17:13:23 <V453000> of course it kind of applies to trains too but RVs can autoreplace from long to short and back without any losses etc 17:13:28 <V453000> sure, but also road performance 17:13:33 <V453000> road/tramtrack :) 17:13:35 *** Progman [~progman@p57A18548.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 17:13:45 <V453000> more density = more road capacity, same as stations 17:14:17 <andythenorth> I donât like that long tram 17:14:33 <V453000> k then :) 17:16:36 <andythenorth> I cba to test them against each other though 17:16:46 <andythenorth> also I havenât used them in a game :P 17:17:59 *** luaduck_old [~luaduck@0001c465.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: ZNC gives me a nerd boner.] 17:18:46 <V453000> WHY CARE ABOUT A GAME! :D 17:21:28 * andythenorth has no answer 17:21:36 <andythenorth> I will have to think about it :( 17:25:42 <andythenorth> tell me a number 17:27:00 *** Biolunar [Biolunar@x4d025332.dyn.telefonica.de] has quit [Quit: Yo.] 17:28:37 *** luaduck [~luaduck@0001c465.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: CHOO CHOO MOFOS] 17:28:42 *** luaduck [~luaduck@cream.duck.me.uk] has joined #openttd 17:30:17 *** roidal [~roland@cm140-210.liwest.at] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 1.2] 17:34:53 <Alberth> 4 17:35:08 <andythenorth> now I have to decide what that is for 17:35:34 *** JacobD88 [~Thunderbi@cpc20-stap11-2-0-cust13.12-2.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: JacobD88] 17:35:42 <andythenorth> really small mail trams? 17:36:45 <Alberth> that works with trains, normally, you never need many mail wagons with passenger trains 17:37:54 <andythenorth> 4 bags of mail? o_O 17:38:02 * andythenorth actually just uses Eddiâs suggestion :) 17:38:03 <andythenorth> easier 17:38:52 <Alberth> sounds like a fair interpretation of 4 :) 17:38:59 <andythenorth> you wonât be wanting trams in small towns :P 17:39:46 <Alberth> I don't want trams unless BB asks me to :p 17:40:03 <Alberth> trams are nice for short industrial cargo transport though 17:40:05 <V453000> haha 17:40:29 *** Belugas [~belugas@00011985.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:41:08 *** Belugas [~belugas@216.191.111.230] has joined #openttd 17:41:11 *** mode/#openttd [+o Belugas] by ChanServ 17:41:28 <Alberth> should we have goals like "build 5 trams"? :p 17:41:44 <Alberth> sounds more like "achievement unlocked!" 17:42:13 <andythenorth> :) 17:42:26 <andythenorth> might be interesting to vary the cargo goals 17:42:45 <andythenorth> dunno 17:42:51 <andythenorth> worried about overloading BB 17:42:54 <andythenorth> but 17:43:04 <andythenorth> âconstruct an industry supplying [cargo]â 17:43:15 <andythenorth> âsupply x tonnes every month to town zâ 17:43:34 <Alberth> SV ? 17:43:41 <andythenorth> âprovide a ferry service" 17:43:43 <andythenorth> dunno 17:44:01 *** liq3 [liq3@CPE-120-147-178-81.gdfw1.lon.bigpond.net.au] has quit [] 17:45:09 *** sla_ro|master [slamaster@95.76.27.245] has joined #openttd 17:45:38 *** wicope [~wicope@0001fd8a.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 17:50:44 *** FLHerne [~flh@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:02:28 <Supercheese> any actual hogs in Road Hog yet? 18:03:48 <andythenorth> nah :) 18:04:08 <andythenorth> eh, if the biggest trams canât keep stations clear in a 10k popn. city 18:04:12 <andythenorth> thereâs no point? 18:04:48 <Alberth> 10k? 18:05:02 <Alberth> I wouldn't try that with trams :p 18:05:14 <Supercheese> needs more 18:05:15 <andythenorth> what else would you do without station walking? 18:05:16 <Supercheese> like subways :P 18:05:36 <Alberth> regular train station 18:05:39 <Supercheese> or metro or whatever you have it 18:05:47 <Alberth> or don't care about waiting pax 18:08:16 <andythenorth> Iron Horse metro does 400 pax in 1 tile length @ 65mph 18:08:42 <andythenorth> the biggest Road Hog tram does 180 pax in 1.2 tile length @65 mph 18:08:52 * andythenorth considers rebalancing 18:09:59 <Alberth> why have hog trams at all, if they are in iron horse? 18:10:23 *** jottyfan [~jottyfan@p54B47E53.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 18:12:10 <Eddi|zuHause> why is setting double size gui disabled? 18:13:40 <andythenorth> o_O 18:13:46 <andythenorth> works for me :| 18:15:56 <Eddi|zuHause> apparently it's tied to the max zoom level 18:21:58 *** Belugas [~belugas@00011985.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:21:58 *** Belugas [~belugas@216.191.111.230] has joined #openttd 18:22:01 *** mode/#openttd [+o Belugas] by ChanServ 18:31:03 <peter1138> Maximum zoom affects maximum zoom, how odd. 18:35:35 <Eddi|zuHause> well, yes, it is odd, because the two settings are in totally unrelated places 18:36:17 * andythenorth wishes there was a way to space out trams 18:36:33 <peter1138> Someone said the place where it is was going to go away, so I left it. 18:37:23 <Eddi|zuHause> the last time i spaced out trams, said way didn't even exist yet 18:38:29 <andythenorth> I tried timetables once, but they donât do anything 18:39:02 <peter1138> They're useful to have all your vehicles bunched up together while being flagged as late... 18:39:15 <andythenorth> yeah thatâs what happened 18:39:24 <andythenorth> and also to spend a lot of time clicking stuff 18:39:33 <andythenorth> and wonder why the interface gives no clues 18:39:40 <Eddi|zuHause> run timetable filling, reduce wait time at intermediate stations, increase wait time at end stations, make sure overtaking is possible at some place, and then use the vehicle spacing hidden feature 18:40:08 <Eddi|zuHause> overtaking preferably at those end stations 18:41:15 <Eddi|zuHause> even without setting all the start dates manually, that is still a tedious task 18:41:55 <andythenorth> anyway 240 pax trams that fit in 1.5 tiles 18:42:00 <andythenorth> seems to work for this big city 18:45:04 <Eddi|zuHause> that sounds reasonable 18:48:10 <andythenorth> Iâm clearing 2/3 of the pax with no blocking 18:48:16 <andythenorth> city keeps growing though :P 18:48:25 <andythenorth> inconvenient 19:00:52 <andythenorth> 40 pax per tram makes a huge difference to station clearance 19:01:50 *** Nathan1852__ [~Nathan185@p5DC11855.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 19:05:02 <Alberth> at 240 trams, sounds likely:) 19:07:17 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 19:10:14 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 19:19:13 *** frosch123 [~frosch@x5f7443f0.dyn.telefonica.de] has quit [Quit: be yourself, except: if you have the opportunity to be a unicorn, then be a unicorn] 19:21:33 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@0001288e.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 19:21:44 <Wolf01> o/ 19:24:34 <Alberth> o/ 19:30:09 <andythenorth> hmm 19:30:20 <andythenorth> so the terrain generation fixes now actuall make nice maps :D 19:30:23 <andythenorth> actually * 19:30:35 <peter1138> s/fixes/revert/ 19:30:49 <V453000> wa? (: 19:31:20 <V453000> nice 19:31:31 <andythenorth> mountainous isnât 19:31:36 <andythenorth> but we canât have everything :) 19:31:39 <V453000> amazing stuff 19:31:41 <andythenorth> alpinist seems to work 19:31:47 <andythenorth> mountainous is a synonym for âflat' 19:32:37 *** Wormnest [~Wormnest@s5596abd2.adsl.online.nl] has joined #openttd 20:14:21 *** sla_ro|master [slamaster@95.76.27.245] has quit [] 20:15:44 *** Wormnest [~Wormnest@s5596abd2.adsl.online.nl] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:19:11 <andythenorth> trams with heavy load :P http://villamosok.hu/nza/7052mosz.jpg 20:19:14 <andythenorth> Budapest 20:24:16 <Alberth> happens every now and then :p 20:24:26 <Alberth> gn 20:24:47 *** Alberth [~alberth@2001:981:c6c5:1:be5f:f4ff:feac:e11] has left #openttd [] 20:25:47 *** Biolunar [Biolunar@x4d025332.dyn.telefonica.de] has joined #openttd 20:32:08 *** Nathan1852__ is now known as Nathan1852 20:55:09 *** Belugas [~belugas@00011985.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:55:33 *** txtsd [~txtsd@103.20.64.208] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:55:48 *** Belugas [~belugas@216.191.111.230] has joined #openttd 20:55:51 *** mode/#openttd [+o Belugas] by ChanServ 21:02:11 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 21:20:45 *** Progman [~progman@p57A18548.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:26:08 *** FLHerne [~flh@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has joined #openttd 22:12:57 *** smoke_fumus [~smoke_fum@188.35.176.90] has joined #openttd 22:35:01 *** Biolunar [Biolunar@x4d025332.dyn.telefonica.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:42:05 *** wicope [~wicope@0001fd8a.user.oftc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:46:58 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~flex@i59F6D6E0.versanet.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 23:00:12 *** Hiddenfunstuff [~Geth@a392.ip16.netikka.fi] has quit [Quit: HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- Chicks dig it] 23:03:00 <Wolf01> 'night 23:03:02 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@0001288e.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 23:14:08 *** FLHerne [~flh@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has quit [Quit: There's a real world out here!] 23:55:06 *** supermop [~supermop@NYUFWA-GUESTS-01.NATPOOL.NYU.EDU] has joined #openttd