Times are UTC Toggle Colours
00:01:58 *** Wormnest has quit IRC 00:02:04 *** tokai|noir has joined #openttd 00:02:04 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai|noir 00:08:57 *** tokai has quit IRC 00:17:35 *** threesixty has quit IRC 00:23:43 *** threesixty has joined #openttd 00:36:04 <Wolf01> 'night 00:36:06 *** Wolf01 has quit IRC 00:39:21 *** Biolunar has quit IRC 00:47:30 *** FLHerne_ has quit IRC 00:47:48 *** FLHerne_ has joined #openttd 01:17:01 *** Supercheese has joined #openttd 01:42:03 *** FLHerne_ has quit IRC 01:51:48 *** maciozo has quit IRC 03:24:47 *** Fatmice has joined #openttd 04:00:57 *** glx has quit IRC 04:55:21 *** tokai has joined #openttd 04:55:21 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai 05:02:31 *** tokai|noir has quit IRC 05:51:34 *** Pinkypie has joined #openttd 05:57:08 *** Pinkypie has quit IRC 06:08:06 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 06:35:07 *** chomwitt2 has quit IRC 07:44:33 *** BluesInTheNet has joined #openttd 07:59:58 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 08:36:11 *** Alberth has joined #openttd 08:36:11 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Alberth 08:42:14 *** DDR has joined #openttd 08:43:49 *** Fatmice has quit IRC 09:18:58 *** Cals has joined #openttd 09:21:00 *** tokai|noir has joined #openttd 09:21:00 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai|noir 09:26:16 *** Biolunar has joined #openttd 09:26:18 *** tokai has quit IRC 09:37:40 <peter1139> that thing then a nuget package targets .net 4.5.2 and you're using .net 4.5 09:37:47 <peter1139> latest and greatest idiots :S 09:42:07 <peter1139> that thing when you look at the source and it is because they are doing $"{nameof(bytes)}" 09:42:25 <peter1139> which effectively results in the same thing as "bytes" 09:47:05 *** chomwitt2 has joined #openttd 10:09:07 <Alberth> :p 10:13:11 *** Progman has joined #openttd 10:19:58 *** tokai has joined #openttd 10:19:58 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai 10:23:14 *** BluesInTheNet has quit IRC 10:26:16 *** tokai|noir has quit IRC 10:26:23 *** Wolf01 has joined #openttd 10:26:41 <Wolf01> Moin 10:28:16 <peter1139> also turns out they're using classes not in my version of mono, so after fixing that shit it didn't work anyway :p 10:28:19 <peter1139> fecking debian 10:28:32 <Wolf01> Peter aged up again? 10:33:18 *** Supercheese has left #openttd 10:33:57 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 10:35:11 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 10:38:30 <andythenorth> o/ 10:54:48 <Wolf01> o/ 11:04:33 <Wolf01> http://img-9gag-fun.9cache.com/photo/aprYo65_460s.jpg andy :D 11:06:05 *** Wormnest has joined #openttd 11:12:06 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 11:13:50 <andythenorth> Wolf01: one for ‘where is cat' 11:16:46 <Wolf01> So far I believe that we did not find a simple, fun and fair solution. Ideas include: large power-up times(annoying and also weakens base defense); simply not allowing turrets to be build near biter bases (makes the player feel cheated); underground anti-turret worms (sugar-coated version of the previous idea). <- V453000, just introduce Dune's worms... so you'll even need to pavement your 11:16:46 <Wolf01> whole base to stay safe XD 11:18:43 <Wolf01> "I believe there is almost always an option to destroy bases without being forced to use turret-creep", yes, there is one very reliable, the ion cannon mod 11:27:23 <Alberth> o/ 11:28:38 <Alberth> allow tunneling, with plating to prevent that from being useful :) 11:29:26 <Wolf01> Remembers me about Brotherhood of Nod engineers attack 11:30:15 <Wolf01> Fill up 3-4 underground apcs with engineers and send them in the middle of the enemy base 11:31:02 <Wolf01> That's why I always pavemented my base and make walled traps in the middle of the base for those fuckers :P 11:34:08 <Alberth> para=trooping from the air could work too, hard to defend against 11:34:13 <Alberth> s/=/-/ 11:35:09 <Wolf01> You don't para-troop engineers usually, also there are SAM sites or AA guns, underground enemies can't be targeted instead 11:35:29 <Alberth> 1st WW trench warfare in France involved lots of explosives :p 11:35:51 <Alberth> and tunneling 11:39:24 *** deetwelve has quit IRC 11:52:42 *** Progman has quit IRC 11:53:36 *** deetwelve has joined #openttd 11:59:30 *** frosch123 has joined #openttd 12:05:13 <Wolf01> Quak 12:05:47 *** Cals has quit IRC 12:07:24 <frosch123> moin 12:19:34 *** tokai|noir has joined #openttd 12:19:34 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai|noir 12:25:51 *** tokai has quit IRC 12:51:30 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 13:07:57 *** Cals has joined #openttd 13:10:06 *** Cals has quit IRC 13:30:31 *** Biolunar has quit IRC 13:50:27 *** JohnnyWing has joined #openttd 13:52:41 *** roidal has joined #openttd 13:55:23 <JohnnyWing> Hello. So I'm a longtime player that's just been looking into contributing dev work...Am I right that there's no automated testing (unit tests) setup for the source? 13:55:39 <frosch123> there is somewhat 13:56:00 <JohnnyWing> OK. I come from a java background, the C's easy enough to pick up. What should I be looking at to see this? 13:56:04 <frosch123> you can run "make regression" and it will start ottd, and run same game and ai scripts, which run stuff, and it compares the output 13:56:40 <Wolf01> Which is functional testing and not unit testing 13:56:43 <JohnnyWing> OK. anything that runs at buildtime? 13:56:51 <Wolf01> I tried with unit tests but headers are a total mess 13:56:59 <JohnnyWing> ahh 13:57:10 <JohnnyWing> too much of a mess to mess with, or just a lot of work? 13:57:26 <JohnnyWing> I ask because im a Testing SME with whatI do, and I'm interested in a challenge 13:57:57 <Wolf01> If you want to give it a look, I preferred to avoid it 13:58:21 <JohnnyWing> OK awesome. I'll look into the regression and go from there 13:59:15 <peter1139> yeah it's not very... unitized 14:00:46 <JohnnyWing> If....big if....If someone wanted to make the effort, it sounds like there would likely be refactoring to make it work. Maybe quite a bit from the sounds of it. Is such an effort something that the core team would be interested in having done and supporting? 14:01:33 <JohnnyWing> I know that some projects dont care much about testing... and my goal would be to implement easy testing to enable changes to be made with confidence that they wont break the build 14:01:44 <JohnnyWing> or would that just be too much? 14:01:53 <Alberth> you know the source is > 300K lines? 14:02:16 <Alberth> unit tests are likely to be bigger, I think? 14:02:23 <JohnnyWing> Not much of a concern? Start small? again - would need analysis, unless it's already done 14:02:47 <JohnnyWing> no no, unit breaks them into units, testing the smallest set of logic possible, in isolation from other things 14:03:01 <Alberth> core is very much optimized, not very unit-testable, I think 14:03:29 <JohnnyWing> optimized for... performance, you mean, right? 14:03:36 <Alberth> yes, performance 14:03:52 <peter1139> performance and memory use 14:04:19 <peter1139> it's c++ written by c coders 14:05:00 <Wolf01> In my case it's C++ written by VB/C# coder :P 14:05:16 <JohnnyWing> Lol, I'm sure it's interesting then 14:06:16 <peter1139> have a look 14:06:30 <JohnnyWing> OK. I'm still curious to learn more so I'll do some looking around and see if there's any opportunities that make sense 14:06:33 <peter1139> biggest issue is lots of stuff is intertwined and interdependent 14:06:50 <Alberth> muchos global variables :) 14:06:59 <JohnnyWing> right and that's what I figured and where the refactoring that I mentioned was targeted at. 14:07:38 <JohnnyWing> So, in a nutshell, I take existing legacy enterprise applications that are rather large and refactor them to enable automated testing and CI integration, so that enterprises dont have to be scared to change that legacy code any more. 14:08:00 <JohnnyWing> This sounds like a very similar situation, hence the interest 14:08:13 <JohnnyWing> and I've been playing ttd for 20 yrs, so it just seemed like a good match atm 14:08:14 <JohnnyWing> :) 14:08:51 <Alberth> refactor would be nice, if possible with a new feature :) 14:09:25 <Alberth> as refactor for refactor sake doesn't do much, and takes a lot of time, imho 14:10:05 <JohnnyWing> right...and that's kinda my root question: 14:10:37 <JohnnyWing> is a refactor to enable testing, by (this guy), one of those things that the team thinks is worth it? (again, if this guy does most/all the work) 14:11:11 <Alberth> I don't see the value of unit testing tbh, but that's just me 14:11:21 <Alberth> I do not speak for "the team" 14:11:31 <Alberth> in fact, "the team" doesn't exist 14:12:08 <Alberth> but have a look first 14:14:24 <Alberth> it's fine if you do something else than regular work :) 14:14:46 <JohnnyWing> OK. and that's completely valid opinion. Most of my efforts are spent doing the work so I can show devs the value it provides. That's the fun part. 14:15:42 <Wolf01> You could do some refactoring to better place some functions which are now spread over multiple files or in wrong places, I would start with that 14:15:55 <JohnnyWing> when you say the team doesn't exist....that makes me want to ask for a synopsis of the project? It sounds not very active? 14:16:20 <JohnnyWing> I looked at the roadmap and flyspray and found nothing. No roadmap, very informal, user contribution-based, likely? 14:17:23 <JohnnyWing> @Wolf I'll look in that direction 14:18:01 <peter1139> hmm, did we ever get multistop for docks? 14:18:37 <Wolf01> The cat guy asked me to get into docks after nrt 14:18:51 <peter1139> well i have a partial patch for it already 14:19:49 <Wolf01> Missing the movement part? 14:20:17 <peter1139> iirc it was mostly working 14:20:35 <peter1139> hmm, resizing the ottd window is buggy 14:20:49 <Wolf01> I would like to get into the vehicle movement code to provide some more features in that branch 14:21:06 *** roidal has quit IRC 14:21:18 <peter1139> how can window resize be buggy? :S 14:21:19 <Wolf01> Roundabouts and ramps for roads, realistic locks, real grf airports 14:21:35 <Wolf01> Bigger road stops 14:21:51 <JohnnyWing> sounds fun 14:22:26 <frosch123> JohnnyWing: development is mostly stalled. main issue seems to be that there are many kind of conflicting features in existence, and every new feature has to account for serval corner cases. but since noone uses all of the conflicting features, noone is interested in caring for the corner cases 14:23:18 <JohnnyWing> ouch. So...scope creep finally took over and is winning...damn 14:23:53 <JohnnyWing> Has there been any efforts to develop a plan to overcome it and make decisions on those things needed to get out of this situation? 14:24:17 <JohnnyWing> sounds like no, its just kinda stopped. 14:24:19 <frosch123> the main effort is to fork and make those features work which you use :) 14:24:34 <JohnnyWing> oi 14:24:35 <JohnnyWing> lol 14:24:55 <JohnnyWing> that kinda makes me sad for the game tho :/ 14:25:04 <JohnnyWing> but I get it, dont get me wrong 14:25:05 <frosch123> the main branch is now mostly about extending the add-on format 14:26:24 <JohnnyWing> OK. so really then, theres the engine, then a bunch of mods that plugin to it. Core dev ensures that the mod system works and nothing else break? 14:26:40 <Wolf01> Almost like that 14:26:54 <JohnnyWing> but it sounds like the module that should be like the core logic and such (or default logic), is kinda embedded withint he engine and not yet extracted to a mod style component? 14:26:58 <JohnnyWing> pretty much? 14:28:10 <peter1139> everything is core logic 14:28:32 <SpComb> just forget about OpenTTD and re-implement all of the game logic as a Cities: Skylines mod 14:29:02 <frosch123> SpComb: you mean as a factorio mod 14:29:08 <Wolf01> :D 14:29:12 <JohnnyWing> would be cool to see both 14:30:14 <Eddi|zuHause> just make a factorio mod that runs cities skylines (or vice versa) 14:30:21 <peter1139> to allow multiple docks per station, i need to touch pathfinding, station and ship handling code. 14:30:26 <JohnnyWing> what do you mean that everything is core logic? There should be engine code and business logic separated. They're currently intertwined, yes? Is that what you're saying? 14:31:48 <JohnnyWing> Also, I'm not sure that I saw anything to the effect, but methinks that some post on/near the front page of the dev wiki regarding the current state of developement and the project would be super helpful. A lot of what I'm hearing now conflicts with the impression I got from the wiki 14:31:52 <Eddi|zuHause> separating them only makes sense if they're also developed separately 14:32:55 <Eddi|zuHause> otherwise you're just adding development overhead for no benefit 14:34:04 <peter1139> cool 2 year old patch applies with minimal fixing 14:34:19 <JohnnyWing> separation of concerns and such? 14:34:24 <JohnnyWing> easier changes? 14:34:29 <Wolf01> The problem is that noone knows the entire thing to be the "right one" to write such article, a group of people can do it, but those should be the "core" devs, and I think they don't have enough time or will to do even that work 14:34:52 <JohnnyWing> Wolf - helpful. thanks 14:35:11 <JohnnyWing> but makes me a little more sad 14:35:20 <JohnnyWing> However, I thank all you guys for the work thus far. 14:35:31 <peter1139> tbh i support it 14:35:42 <peter1139> but i don't know where you'd start, what you'd do, what you'd achieve 14:36:08 <Wolf01> As you notice, we aren't so organized, and the project has blown up in these years so it's really big to be handled right now, we do what we can 14:36:09 <JohnnyWing> I played back when it had just started....i've taken 2-5 years off several times but always come back to it. It's amazing to see those years' features come in big chunks like that :) 14:36:23 <JohnnyWing> Understood. 14:36:34 <peter1139> and it is a game. within the core logic there is less of a concept of "this should do exactly this" 14:36:37 <Wolf01> I'd support it too, because refactoring for unit test would mean also more readable code 14:37:02 <Wolf01> *readable = understandable 14:37:29 <JohnnyWing> aye, readable/understandable/maintanable/testable/scalable/etc. 14:37:49 <JohnnyWing> Sounds like the "architect" role has been missing for a while and now it's just big and....big. 14:38:12 <Wolf01> Read it as "crooked house" 14:39:37 <SpComb> JohnnyWing: you also have to know that the source code was originally reverse-engineered from a 1990s game engine written by a single guy in assembler 14:39:46 <Wolf01> For example frosch123 has shown me some things, like we have a function which asserts when there are certain conditions and the same function which shouldn't assert on the same contitions but return false/invalid, as asserts are our current way to intercept weirdness whyle using a functionality 14:39:59 <SpComb> well, I haven't looked at the code for ages, but I would guess that you still see a lot of that in there :) 14:40:40 <Wolf01> One example is "GetRoadBits" which asserts if there is no road, "GetAnyRoadBits" instead returns ROADBITS_NONE 14:40:50 <Wolf01> But they do the same 14:40:57 <JohnnyWing> Sp - yea...I remember that. I always wanted to get involved, but never was smart enough yet. 14:41:11 <JohnnyWing> Gotcha. tons of technical debt & inconsistencies 14:41:17 <Wolf01> I find that really confusing :P 14:41:39 <JohnnyWing> my problem is that when I run into inconsistencies like that, I've got to fix them. 14:41:48 <JohnnyWing> It tends to make my projects pretty big efforts :/ 14:41:58 <Wolf01> You should fix them later 14:42:04 <JohnnyWing> but im OCD like that...therefore I'm a code quality guy 14:42:07 <JohnnyWing> lol. yep 14:43:15 <Wolf01> I'm the same type too, I start from changing a light bulb and find myself repairing the car's engine 14:43:21 <JohnnyWing> EXACTLY! 14:43:35 <JohnnyWing> damn that suspect looking wire... 14:45:10 <JohnnyWing> anyways. Does anyone know of a wiki page or category within flyspray or (whatever I need to know) that is a log of things like this technical debt that needs cleaned up? I'd much rather focus on that, even if it's futile, than feature dev/bug fixes. 14:45:24 <JohnnyWing> If there's nothing, I can whip something up and go from there 14:45:59 <Eddi|zuHause> a code quality guy has probably been missing here for a while (*cough*tron*cough*) but at the end, someone has to actually do the work of restructuring the code 14:46:14 <JohnnyWing> :) 14:46:54 <frosch123> JohnnyWing: it's mostly about removing global variables 14:47:08 <Eddi|zuHause> i don't think there's a comprehensive list of technical debt, but you probably quickly find some if you prod the right people or read the right forum threads 14:47:38 <Eddi|zuHause> but you'll quickly need to narrow down what area you want to touch 14:47:45 <JohnnyWing> Alrighty. Good info to work from. 14:47:57 <frosch123> JohnnyWing: last week we encountered a bug, where function parameters are passed via global variables, and are then messed up when the function recurses 14:48:07 <JohnnyWing> I'll be around. I'd rather not go off and work in a silo. 14:48:48 <frosch123> https://paste.openttdcoop.org/pbauyxjnc?/pbauyxjnc <- JohnnyWing: that is a work-around for the bug. the real fix would involve to remove Start/Stop/Rewind/Pause/Resume-TextRefStackUsage 14:49:18 <JohnnyWing> awesome. Is there an issue logged for it? 14:49:31 <frosch123> and to pass it directly to FormatString are calling functions 14:49:39 <JohnnyWing> which leads me to another question, Who's the webmaster(s)? 14:51:19 <Wolf01> Mmmh, I think that transport fever has some incompatibility with whatsapp web 14:51:42 <Wolf01> It starts to drop the framerate only when I open the whatsapp web page 14:51:58 <Wolf01> I could do anything else and works like a charm 14:56:34 <frosch123> JohnnyWing: http://devs.openttd.org/~frosch/firs_f9e2b83d5c2e.tar <- use that newgrf to start a game. http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/8227/generated_production_ratios_2.png <- the bug is that that 53250 should be a 8 14:56:56 <JohnnyWing> @frosch Fantastic. ty 14:58:07 <JohnnyWing> I've added a question to the Development FAQ asking what the state of the project is. I don't want to mix words, so I ask anyone willing to contribute to it to drop an update - https://wiki.openttd.org/FAQ_development 14:58:25 <frosch123> JohnnyWing: just in case, there are hg and git repositories for ottd, which you can clone 14:58:39 <frosch123> "svn" is not used for branch development 14:59:23 <JohnnyWing> Yea....I work in git....the svn thing is new to me (tho I know it's old). I came away from the wiki guides without a clear understanding of what source I should be using for what. 14:59:45 <JohnnyWing> so I pulled svn, but I'll go back to the others 15:01:24 <frosch123> clone from git://git.openttd.org/trunk.git or https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD.git 15:01:40 <JohnnyWing> ty ty 15:01:57 <JohnnyWing> is there a documented branching strategy? 15:02:33 <frosch123> no, in the end everything is put into svn, at which point the branch information is lost 15:02:42 <JohnnyWing> Sorry...i know I'm asking for a lot....but just want to get a clear picture 15:02:44 <JohnnyWing> ok 15:05:42 * peter1139 ponders dabbling with stupid size RSA keys 15:06:13 <Alberth> sounds like a good cargo to transport :) 15:06:43 <JohnnyWing> I see a stat on the wiki.... does anyone know when this happened? "Note: About 975 commits were lost when the old svn system crashed and was lost." 15:07:03 <Alberth> before rev 1 15:07:49 <Alberth> ie rev1 is what was salvaged :) 15:08:22 <frosch123> JohnnyWing: 2004/2005 15:08:31 <frosch123> @commit 1 15:08:32 <DorpsGek> frosch123: Commit by truelight :: r1 / (202 files in 13 dirs) (2004-08-09 19:04:08 +0200 ) 15:08:33 <DorpsGek> frosch123: Import of revision 975 of old (crashed) SVN 15:08:45 <JohnnyWing> nice 15:09:07 <frosch123> it started in march iirc, so about 5 months were lost 15:09:18 <JohnnyWing> :( 15:09:28 <frosch123> well, not the work, but the history :) 15:09:39 <JohnnyWing> oh ok 15:11:49 <peter1139> if only we had git back then 15:14:51 *** lucy has quit IRC 15:16:02 *** lucy has joined #openttd 15:18:54 <peter1139> takes a while to generate 8192 bit keys 15:19:35 <peter1139> starts getting slow to decrypt too 15:24:04 <JohnnyWing> Oh. I found the issue :P https://wiki.openttd.org/Objectives 15:25:08 * peter1139 tries 16384 now 15:27:11 <Wolf01> JohnnyWing, too many objectives? :P 15:27:48 <JohnnyWing> Aye. Hard to focus when you don't know what you're shooting for :) 15:28:02 <JohnnyWing> and that's a very very broad scope listed there right now haha 15:28:37 <peter1139> well 15:28:58 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 15:29:04 <peter1139> one persons stagnant and dead is another persons complete 15:29:31 <JohnnyWing> valid 15:35:39 <frosch123> JohnnyWing: there are at least three groups of interest wrt. game features: 1. micromanagement like conditonal orders, refitting and loading. 2. automated economy like cargodist. 3. model railway sandbox 15:35:59 <Wolf01> I'm for the last one :P 15:36:04 *** maciozo has joined #openttd 15:37:50 <JohnnyWing> so 3 game modes. Check 15:38:15 <frosch123> maybe competitive is a 4th, but i don't get those people 15:38:39 <JohnnyWing> lol 15:38:53 <JohnnyWing> to each their own, eh? 15:39:21 <frosch123> :) 15:39:22 <JohnnyWing> Does competitive, though, violate on of the 3 objectives? 15:39:23 <JohnnyWing> Provide a game that is free from war themes and conflict; hence suitable for all age groups 15:39:31 <JohnnyWing> conflict is arguable :) 15:39:46 <frosch123> 1. and 2. result in a lot of conflicting features 15:42:19 <frosch123> 3 and 4 add insane requests for very complicated stuff, which for me always sounds like "how stuff is supposed to be" instead of "fun" 15:42:50 <frosch123> i.e. 3. and 4. are socially complicated, and 1. and 2 are technically complicated :p 15:43:30 <frosch123> </salt> 15:45:19 *** BluesInTheNet has joined #openttd 15:51:04 <JohnnyWing> haha all of that makes sense. 15:51:31 <JohnnyWing> They really do sound like different game modes or different games entirely, where the features can be isolated from the others 16:01:43 <frosch123> except that different game modes or games would not offer the greyscale inbetween :) 16:02:26 <peter1139> you could have options for everything 16:02:39 <peter1139> and then offer another advanced settings window for all the options 16:03:01 <peter1139> and another option to hide certain options which are deemed more advanced 16:04:14 <frosch123> we have hidden options to show other hidden options 16:07:01 <JohnnyWing> lol. 16:07:12 <JohnnyWing> Yea. I could see it working out, but it'd have to be intentionally designed for such a scheme 16:16:16 *** Progman has joined #openttd 16:27:47 *** tokai has joined #openttd 16:27:48 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai 16:28:49 *** CompuDesktop has joined #openttd 16:29:08 *** [1]sim-al2 has joined #openttd 16:30:55 *** lorran78 has joined #openttd 16:31:06 <lorran78> hello ! 16:31:28 *** mikegrb_ has joined #openttd 16:31:33 *** Speedy` has joined #openttd 16:31:39 <lorran78> i am still searching for help to make new grf (actually i always make same grf with different pnml :/ 16:32:12 *** tokai|noir has quit IRC 16:32:12 *** deetwelve has quit IRC 16:32:12 *** DDR has quit IRC 16:32:12 *** sim-al2 has quit IRC 16:32:12 *** Compu has quit IRC 16:32:12 *** efess has quit IRC 16:32:12 *** mikegrb has quit IRC 16:32:13 *** Speedy has quit IRC 16:32:13 *** urdh has quit IRC 16:32:13 *** [1]sim-al2 is now known as sim-al2 16:32:13 *** Speedy` is now known as Speedy 16:32:40 *** urdh has joined #openttd 16:35:19 *** deetwelve has joined #openttd 16:42:46 *** DDR has joined #openttd 16:44:04 *** maciozo has quit IRC 16:49:07 *** maciozo has joined #openttd 16:58:22 *** gelignite has joined #openttd 17:06:17 *** crabster has joined #openttd 17:07:12 *** lobstar has joined #openttd 17:07:27 *** gelignite has quit IRC 17:12:24 *** Gja has joined #openttd 17:24:33 *** slaca has joined #openttd 17:27:40 <slaca> hi guys, I just realised on bundles.openttdcoop.org, that i have not the latest opengfx, i have 0.5.2. but i see there is 0.5.4. Why is that can't be seen in the content dowload? 17:30:51 <frosch123> likely because someone was busy and then forgot to publish it 17:32:17 <slaca> ok, so it should work with 1.6.1 openttd? 17:33:22 <frosch123> yes 17:34:44 <slaca> thx 18:01:42 *** glx has joined #openttd 18:01:42 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v glx 18:06:40 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 18:16:35 <Wolf01> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BPEBDk_w5hY&feature=youtu.be used a station to create a zig-zag 18:18:39 <Wolf01> andythenorth, bad news for lego, they will raise prices in UK from january :( 18:19:12 <frosch123> quick, stockpile! 18:19:33 <andythenorth> brexit means brexit eh 18:19:38 <andythenorth> at least I got my country back 18:20:04 <peter1139> red white & blue 18:20:05 <frosch123> roadtype compatibility works now btw. 18:20:18 <frosch123> i've also added npf and yapf 18:21:11 <Wolf01> :O 18:25:52 *** efess has joined #openttd 18:36:21 *** lobstar has quit IRC 18:36:24 *** crabster has quit IRC 18:45:25 * andythenorth pulls 18:45:42 <DorpsGek> Commit by translators :: r27697 /trunk/src/lang (spanish.txt unfinished/urdu.txt) (2016-12-17 19:45:36 +0100 ) 18:45:43 <DorpsGek> -Update from Eints: 18:45:44 <DorpsGek> urdu: 9 changes by siphr 18:45:45 <DorpsGek> spanish: 3 changes by SilverSurferZzZ 18:49:14 <andythenorth> frosch123: compatibilit works :D 18:50:02 <andythenorth> tried making some invalid orders and such 18:50:04 <andythenorth> all ok 18:51:08 <frosch123> it's all a bit crashy 18:51:32 <frosch123> when we fix the regression and the tram dropdown, we should make a test game or so 18:51:49 <frosch123> earlier a random starting ai showed me that you could no longer build rail bridges :p 18:52:55 <andythenorth> ha 18:53:11 <andythenorth> I should patch Road Hog and let players loose on it 18:53:19 <andythenorth> can’t today, child #2 birthday 18:53:28 <andythenorth> much parenting to do 18:56:40 *** lobstar has joined #openttd 18:56:57 *** crabster has joined #openttd 18:58:36 <JohnnyWing> I'm looking at gfx.cpp. The DrawString method and many others have comments stating to see "DoDrawString() for details". Does anyone know if this method still exists and where? I can't seem to find it. 19:00:11 <frosch123> i guess DrawLayoutLine is its predecessor 19:00:17 <frosch123> no, successor 19:01:12 <frosch123> no idea why that function should tell anything about colours though 19:02:27 <frosch123> anyway, DoDrawStrings was once in gfx.cpp 19:04:02 <frosch123> in r15000 DoDrawString refers to the comment which is now at the TextColour enum 19:04:40 <frosch123> so, i guess that DoDrawString reference can just be dropped :) 19:09:08 <frosch123> night 19:09:10 *** frosch123 has quit IRC 19:14:47 *** gelignite has joined #openttd 19:25:56 *** Ethereal_Whisper has joined #openttd 19:27:17 <andythenorth> eh so what road types shall I add? 19:27:26 <andythenorth> tram, electrified tram 19:27:29 <andythenorth> normal road 19:27:32 <andythenorth> and ??? 19:27:44 <Wolf01> Non-electrified tram 19:27:59 <Wolf01> Dirt road 19:51:42 <andythenorth> no trolleybus in this roster, but maybe in another 19:51:45 <andythenorth> also trolley trucks 19:57:35 <andythenorth> this steel mill is very TTD-ish http://c8.alamy.com/comp/BFH7CG/aerial-view-above-cleveland-steel-mill-cuyahoga-river-ohio-BFH7CG.jpg 19:58:38 <Wolf01> Nice 20:00:16 <V453000> because it's small? :D 20:02:09 <andythenorth> yup 20:02:19 <andythenorth> so this steel mill stuff, that’s dirt road too? http://www.phi-oil.com/uploads/tx_imagecarousel/IMG_2285_al_01.jpg 20:02:29 <andythenorth> I want to call it something like ‘heavy haul road’ 20:05:47 <Wolf01> But you can also run normal rvs on them, just make it with a low speed limit, 20kmh should be enough 20:06:21 <andythenorth> nah I’m making them exclusive :) 20:06:27 <andythenorth> the speed limit thing is weird 20:18:48 *** Alberth has left #openttd 20:20:06 <andythenorth> http://i61.tinypic.com/24vi9nm.jpg 20:44:30 <andythenorth> herp 20:44:45 <andythenorth> what’s the deal with compatibility between tram and road? 20:44:52 <andythenorth> any tram can be built over any road? 20:57:41 <lorran78> someone can tell me how to use make program? 21:00:31 <andythenorth> what’s your starting point? (which OS, and do you have gcc?) 21:03:28 *** slaca has quit IRC 21:13:35 *** Supercheese has joined #openttd 21:18:54 <lorran78> sorry i was afk 21:19:12 <lorran78> i change pnml file to add introduction_date for all trains 21:20:19 <lorran78> i dl nml program and used it using "nml opengfx+trains.nml" but i always compile the same grf without changes... 21:20:31 <andythenorth> so you have a shell? 21:20:43 * andythenorth assumes that because you can use nml 21:20:57 <lorran78> yes i have dos window :p 21:21:52 <andythenorth> do you have gcc? 21:22:44 <lorran78> yes i dl something like that wait a sec 21:23:04 <lorran78> i have mingw 21:23:11 <lorran78> someone advise me this prog 21:23:23 <lorran78> but i don't know how to use it 21:23:26 <andythenorth> ok :D I have no idea what’s next with mingw 21:23:35 <andythenorth> what happens if you type ‘make’ in the dos prompt? 21:23:43 <lorran78> i test wait 21:23:54 <lorran78> nothing 21:23:58 <andythenorth> any error? 21:23:59 <lorran78> not recognisez 21:24:02 <lorran78> not recognised 21:24:20 <lorran78> i can use gcc tell me where to find it 21:24:56 <andythenorth> ach no idea :) 21:25:05 <lorran78> shame:( 21:25:07 * andythenorth looking if someone documented this for newgrf 21:25:24 <lorran78> i want to play but i can't :(( 21:26:15 <andythenorth> https://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/home/wiki/Setting_up_a_Windows_compile_environment 21:26:42 <andythenorth> you pretty much need all of that, on windows, as far as I understand it 21:28:15 <lorran78> okay i am reading :p 21:29:15 * Wolf01 nods... 21:29:25 <Wolf01> 'night 21:29:33 *** Wolf01 has quit IRC 21:38:33 *** Supercheese has quit IRC 21:39:10 *** Supercheese has joined #openttd 21:40:49 <andythenorth> lorran78: those instructions might be outdated about python2.7 21:41:26 <andythenorth> I use python 3 for my newgrf stuff, nml was ported to python 3 some time ago 21:41:53 <andythenorth> not sure how it works for the windows nml though 21:51:39 <andythenorth> hmm maybe it’s just a specific script that uses it, nothing to do with nml perhaps 21:52:49 <andythenorth> oh FFS 21:52:53 <andythenorth> I broke my road-hog repo 21:53:11 <andythenorth> I need to stop using hg, I’m incompetent 21:53:13 * andythenorth -> bed 21:53:14 *** andythenorth has left #openttd 22:06:56 *** Lejving has quit IRC 22:07:39 *** Lejving has joined #openttd 22:23:01 *** Wormnest has quit IRC 22:24:56 *** BluesInTheNet has quit IRC 22:40:37 *** Gja has quit IRC 22:44:28 *** Biolunar has joined #openttd 23:18:30 *** Fatmice has joined #openttd 23:19:17 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 23:24:29 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 has quit IRC 23:58:50 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC