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00:08:44 *** FLHerne has quit IRC 00:09:32 <Wolf01> 'night 00:09:34 *** Wolf01 has quit IRC 00:21:58 *** ricus has quit IRC 00:27:36 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 has quit IRC 01:00:33 *** markasoftware has joined #openttd 01:02:46 *** iSoSyS has joined #openttd 01:32:51 *** iSoSyS has quit IRC 01:38:01 *** supermop_home has joined #openttd 02:12:05 <supermop_home> for some reason it's taking me like 30 min to download nrt road hog from the forums 02:12:23 <supermop_home> everything else for any other site is no problem 02:37:37 *** chomwitt1 has joined #openttd 02:43:30 *** chomwitt has quit IRC 03:22:40 *** glx has quit IRC 03:35:37 *** Biolunar has joined #openttd 03:42:39 *** Biolunar_ has quit IRC 04:02:58 *** supermop_home has quit IRC 04:18:30 *** chomwitt1 has quit IRC 05:12:18 *** markasoftware has quit IRC 05:13:16 *** supermop_home has joined #openttd 05:30:18 *** supermop_home has quit IRC 05:35:15 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 06:42:37 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 07:55:42 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 07:55:49 <andythenorth> integer maths :| 08:00:50 <andythenorth> there must be a way to consolidate this sum? 08:00:51 <andythenorth> 100 / 8 * 6 / 8 * 4 08:01:07 <andythenorth> where 100, 6 and 4 are vars, and the 8s are constant 08:02:27 *** Sova has joined #openttd 08:03:05 *** maciozo has joined #openttd 08:07:52 <__ln__> a mathematician would argue it's not a sum 08:08:20 <__ln__> @calc 100/8*6/8*4 08:08:20 <DorpsGek> __ln__: 37.5 08:08:32 <__ln__> @calc 100*6*4/(8*8) 08:08:32 <DorpsGek> __ln__: 37.5 08:11:23 <andythenorth> ha neat 08:11:36 <andythenorth> @ calc 100 * 6 * 4 / 64 08:11:36 <DorpsGek> andythenorth: 37.5 08:12:31 <andythenorth> thanks 08:45:11 <V453000> never do meth andythenorth 08:57:04 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 10:12:05 *** tycoondemon has quit IRC 10:32:16 *** tycoondemon has joined #openttd 10:32:55 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 10:35:55 *** Wolf01 has joined #openttd 10:36:42 *** skapazzo has joined #openttd 10:36:57 <Wolf01> Moin 10:38:04 <andythenorth> lo 10:41:29 *** tycoondemon has quit IRC 10:43:55 * Wolf01 requires more know-how and assistance to make that "CanBuildInfrastructureOnSteroids" function :( 10:47:58 <peter1138> multitile docks? 10:48:13 <Wolf01> No, fix ScenarioEditor for NRT 10:48:17 <crem> multititile 10:49:11 *** tycoondemon has joined #openttd 10:49:36 <Wolf01> Is actually impossible to build trams in SE 10:50:07 <Wolf01> Also the current function doesn't work well with road/railtypes 10:51:55 <Wolf01> I looked at what do I need to make a function as frosch suggested, but I'm not satisfied with the format 10:52:46 <Wolf01> Too many arguments, might need new support structures 10:53:38 <Wolf01> I would make 4 distinct functions, one for each one of the 3 use cases and a common one which does the actual check 10:57:13 <andythenorth> this is for checking availability of [xxx]type? 10:57:16 *** tycoondemon has quit IRC 10:57:48 <Wolf01> Yes 10:58:06 <Wolf01> To be used in GUI, SE, GameScripts 10:58:37 <Wolf01> And in commands too 11:01:58 <peter1138> i guess the SE was designed to plonk scenery, industries and towns down 11:02:02 <peter1138> not build infrastructure 11:02:48 <Wolf01> It can build roads 11:03:01 <Wolf01> But it inherited the build tram limitation from normal game 11:04:07 <Wolf01> If I remove that, you can build tramways also if there are no vehicles available for that 11:21:41 <andythenorth> SE mess :) 11:22:38 <andythenorth> can SE build railways? 11:22:49 <Wolf01> No 11:22:57 <andythenorth> ok, so it can’t build tramways 11:23:06 <Wolf01> They are company exclusive, while tramways not 11:23:12 <andythenorth> it shouldn’t build canals either 11:23:26 <andythenorth> roads are a special case, because they’re a dependency for towns 11:23:34 <Wolf01> You should be able anything which supports "owner none" 11:23:45 <andythenorth> that is a valid argument yes 11:23:56 <Wolf01> *able to build 11:23:58 <andythenorth> but I think it’s easier to prevent building infrastructure except default ROAD 11:24:03 <andythenorth> complexity is bad 11:24:16 <andythenorth> it’s hard to solve, hard to test, and makes code harder to work on 11:24:21 <andythenorth> also it’s demotivating usually :) 11:24:57 <andythenorth> imho canals should be removed from SE also 11:24:57 <Wolf01> Nah, it should be consistent with the game, the problem are the current functions which do checks on company and remove the feature from SE with hardcoded "if (game_mode == GM_EDITOR) go f**k yourself" 11:25:16 *** Sova has quit IRC 11:26:03 <Wolf01> Meybe in future we could be able to generate big cities with a tramway ring, which could be used by the players 11:26:10 <Wolf01> *Maybe 11:27:42 * andythenorth is maybe the wrong audience 11:27:52 <andythenorth> I have almost never used a scenario 11:28:08 <Wolf01> I made some scenarios in the past 11:30:31 <andythenorth> I think trams in SE is marginal value, compared to say….improved water features :) 11:30:41 <andythenorth> or fixing the station window :P 11:33:53 * andythenorth fixes FIRS :) 11:35:35 <andythenorth> eh, failing station refit is failing :( 11:47:15 *** Sova has joined #openttd 11:59:03 *** chomwitt1 has joined #openttd 11:59:44 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o orudge 12:31:44 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 12:33:41 *** ZirconiumX has joined #openttd 12:49:39 <andythenorth> ach modulus (%) 12:49:53 *** tycoondemon has joined #openttd 13:00:46 *** matt11235 has joined #openttd 13:51:55 <V453000> iz slug? 13:52:36 <Wolf01> Not yet 13:55:23 * andythenorth hating maths today 13:55:28 <andythenorth> normally maths is ‘fine' 13:55:53 <andythenorth> it’s like 3 hours so far, just trying to refactor current code 13:56:55 *** Sova has quit IRC 14:00:20 *** TrueBrain-Bot has quit IRC 14:00:46 <andythenorth> this is code to remove the remainder in the production cb 14:00:47 <andythenorth> STORE_PERM(LOAD_PERM(var_leftover_cargo_1) % (MAX_SUM_PROD_RATIO / LOAD_TEMP(num_output_cargos)), var_leftover_cargo_1) 14:01:00 <andythenorth> I know why it’s there, but I don’t know why it works 14:01:10 <andythenorth> which makes refactoring it impossible :| 14:01:27 <andythenorth> MAX_SUM_PROD_RATIO is 8 14:01:40 *** TrueBrain has quit IRC 14:01:45 <andythenorth> but I don’t know why it would need to % 8 or % 4 depending on number of output cargos 14:02:05 <andythenorth> the whole thing is here http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/firs/repository/revisions/88656c250c13/entry/src/templates/produce_secondary.pypnml 14:02:13 * andythenorth didn’t write this code 14:02:52 <Wolf01> FIRS? 14:04:52 <Wolf01> I think is to not output an insane amount of cargo, like 10t iron -> 10t steel + 10t slag but 5t steel and 5t slag 14:05:39 <andythenorth> the modulus part is to deal with integer maths stuff 14:05:47 <andythenorth> can’t output 33.75t for example 14:06:01 <andythenorth> which can lead to input being ‘wasted' 14:06:15 <andythenorth> a player noticed it and filed a bug report, so we patched it :) 14:07:03 <Wolf01> That's because everyone expects a 1:1 or 2:1:1 14:07:13 <andythenorth> yes 14:07:28 <andythenorth> but why % 4 if there are two cargos? 14:07:31 <andythenorth> why not just % 8? 14:08:05 <Wolf01> Heh, math is not my friend 14:08:17 <andythenorth> me neither today 14:08:24 <andythenorth> specifically integer maths I struggle with 14:09:30 <andythenorth> it’s not accurate anyway, it will leave too much cargo behind 14:09:46 <andythenorth> this needs Eddi :( 14:17:41 <andythenorth> also the maths doesn’t work 14:17:59 <andythenorth> @calc 72 * 8 * 2 / 64 14:17:59 <DorpsGek> andythenorth: 18 14:18:03 <andythenorth> game gives me 21 14:24:03 <andythenorth> @calc 75 * 8 * 2 / 64 14:24:03 <DorpsGek> andythenorth: 18.75 14:24:27 <andythenorth> @calc 72 % 8 14:24:27 <DorpsGek> andythenorth: 0 14:29:05 <andythenorth> what’s the minimum amount that can be produced? o_O 14:41:29 <andythenorth> @calc 144 * 2 * 8 / 64 14:41:29 <DorpsGek> andythenorth: 36 14:41:37 <andythenorth> I get 32 or 38 :P 14:42:08 <supermop> yo 14:42:31 <andythenorth> lo supermop 14:43:50 <supermop> im with wolf 14:44:00 <supermop> because tram isn't always going to be tram 14:44:29 <supermop> there could be various non-ROAD road or tram types that might be valuable to scenario editor 14:44:58 <supermop> my bridge sprites are wrong 14:49:47 <andythenorth> I have new maths that should resolve the same as the old maths 14:49:51 <andythenorth> but it doesn’t :x 14:51:41 <supermop> why is bridge showing the regular underlays in the correct position, instead of the bridge surface sprites? 14:52:22 <andythenorth> mismatched template? 14:53:12 <supermop> http://imgur.com/a/25b7L 14:53:31 <supermop> grey bit is part of the bridge surface, but in wrong place 14:53:43 <supermop> but why is the cobble there at all 14:54:19 <andythenorth> paste your code? 14:54:24 <andythenorth> (or start a repo ;) ) 14:54:38 <supermop> https://paste.openttdcoop.org/pizkwjafy 14:55:34 <supermop> http://imgur.com/a/LnzxQ 14:55:42 <supermop> thats the spritesheet 14:55:54 *** sim-al2 has quit IRC 14:56:29 *** srhnsn has joined #openttd 14:56:47 <andythenorth> ground_tile( 10, 288)? 14:57:34 <andythenorth> hmm that looks ok 14:57:44 <supermop> should i call it something else? 14:57:55 <andythenorth> paste all your code? 14:58:40 <supermop> https://paste.openttdcoop.org/petgrpgoi 14:59:48 <supermop> ignore the truck at the bottom dont need it 14:59:57 <andythenorth> brb 15:01:24 <supermop> coffee 15:06:21 <andythenorth> supermop: whatever you’re doing, RH doesn’t do it :) 15:06:23 * andythenorth will look 15:08:20 <supermop> 'cobblestone pavement construction' or 'cobblestone driveway construction'? 15:09:28 <supermop> release docklands ->create steam tram harbor ->create quaint steam tram screenshots 15:09:30 <andythenorth> cobble road? o_O 15:10:02 <supermop> andythenorth: want to differentiate it from an actual cobblestone street or road 15:10:10 <andythenorth> not sure why RH works 15:10:19 <andythenorth> oh 15:10:33 <supermop> rh reuses regular sprites, not bridge sprites 15:10:38 <andythenorth> your underlay fills the whole tile? 15:10:45 <supermop> yep 15:10:57 <andythenorth> that’s why then 15:11:00 <supermop> but i dont want the underlay on the bridge at all 15:11:17 <andythenorth> RH copies from nml example, which reuses the underlay 15:11:26 <supermop> hmmm 15:11:49 <andythenorth> but you already split it :o 15:11:52 <andythenorth> hmm NFI then 15:13:49 <andythenorth> supermop: try removing ‘underlay’ from the graphics block and recompile 15:13:57 <andythenorth> just to test 15:14:13 <supermop> just for the bridge wording? 15:14:59 *** FR^2 has left #openttd 15:15:10 <andythenorth> line 85 or so in the paste 15:15:18 <andythenorth> underlay: cobble_road_underlay; 15:15:37 <andythenorth> I suspect that underlay is always drawn, and has to fit to standard bridge dimensions 15:18:59 <supermop> hmm 15:20:40 <supermop> tram is going to need that though 15:21:19 <supermop> unless tram can have two overlays 15:23:57 <supermop> commenting out underlay makes the roads all look like normal roads 15:25:03 <peter1138> hmm, what's a nice bug tracker with git integration? 15:26:37 <supermop> can i just disable bridges for a roadtype instead? 15:27:43 <supermop> tbh do not need these types to have bridges as they are just freight yard decoration 15:27:58 <andythenorth> peter1138: github? 15:28:01 <andythenorth> oh you said ‘nice' 15:28:15 <andythenorth> redmine is ‘ok' 15:28:36 <andythenorth> jira is paid for and divides opinion sharply 15:29:23 * andythenorth would likely just use github, cos, free and minimal set up 15:30:12 <peter1138> yeah this is for private internal projects though 15:30:45 <peter1138> redmine looks possible 15:30:48 <andythenorth> redmine is ok 15:30:51 <peter1138> i'm sure i used to have one 15:30:55 <andythenorth> better if someone else hosts it :P 15:31:01 <peter1138> must've lost it over the years 15:37:44 <supermop> lying awake last night pondering possible pro/cons/ways to make interesting trolley trucks in late game 15:40:30 <andythenorth> why does FIRS fuck around trying to calculate remainder cargos? :) 15:40:48 <andythenorth> @calc floor(100 * 6) / 8 15:40:48 <DorpsGek> andythenorth: 75 15:41:02 <andythenorth> @calc floor(100 * 3) / 8 15:41:02 <DorpsGek> andythenorth: 37.5 15:41:19 <andythenorth> @calc floor(100 * 3 / 8) 15:41:19 <DorpsGek> andythenorth: 37 15:41:32 <andythenorth> it’s 0.5t ‘wasted' 15:41:59 <andythenorth> @calc 8 * 3 / 8 15:41:59 <DorpsGek> andythenorth: 3 15:42:27 <andythenorth> iirc, for very small delivery amounts, nothing gets produced below a certain minimum 15:42:33 <andythenorth> but docs don’t tell me what the minimum is 15:43:08 <andythenorth> bloody integer division 15:51:41 <andythenorth> can’t see anything in IndustryProductionCallback that would require output >= 8 15:53:14 *** Alberth has joined #openttd 15:53:15 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Alberth 15:53:28 <Eddi|zuHause> <peter1138> i'm sure i used to have one <-- are you sure you didn't mean you had a patch for one? :p 15:57:21 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: can you discern what lines 45-48 are supposed to achieve here? http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/firs/repository/revisions/88656c250c13/entry/src/templates/produce_secondary.pypnml 15:57:57 <andythenorth> the intent is to compensate for ‘wasted’ input cargo due to integer division, but eh 15:59:45 <Eddi|zuHause> yeah, it stores the remainder for future use 16:00:52 <andythenorth> does the maths add up? 16:01:37 <andythenorth> I know what the grf code is doing, but I can’t follow the maths 16:01:41 <Eddi|zuHause> i'm not sure what the var_ratio_cargo_X do 16:01:54 <andythenorth> it would be, for example 8 16:01:56 <andythenorth> or 6 16:02:00 <andythenorth> or 3 16:02:20 <andythenorth> @calc 100 / 8 / 2 * 3 16:02:20 <DorpsGek> andythenorth: 18.75 16:02:29 <andythenorth> so the remainder would be 0.75 16:02:50 <andythenorth> @calc 100 % (8 * 2) 16:02:50 <DorpsGek> andythenorth: 4 16:03:28 <andythenorth> there seems to be no connection between the calculated remainder, and the actual remainder 16:03:31 <Eddi|zuHause> so the maths is roughly as follows: 100/8/2 is equal to 100/(8*2). in the lines above you take the whole part of that division 16:03:41 <Eddi|zuHause> in the lines below you take the remainder of that division 16:03:53 <Alberth> o/ 16:04:10 <Eddi|zuHause> i'm not sure what the *3 does 16:04:27 <andythenorth> the 2 is the number of produced cargos 16:04:47 <Eddi|zuHause> so you put 100/(8*2) into the production, and 100%(8*2) is the new leftover 16:05:07 <andythenorth> the 3 is the proportion of cargo supplied:delivered, as 8:3 16:05:30 <Alberth> b * (a/b) + (a%b) = a 16:06:07 <Alberth> where a/b rounds down 16:06:09 <Eddi|zuHause> @calc 100/(8*2) 16:06:09 <DorpsGek> Eddi|zuHause: 6.25 16:06:15 <Eddi|zuHause> @calc 100%(8*2) 16:06:15 <DorpsGek> Eddi|zuHause: 4 16:06:19 <Alberth> (or more likely, towards 0 16:06:27 <Eddi|zuHause> so the / rounds the 6.25 towards 6 16:06:36 <Eddi|zuHause> and the % is for not throwing away the .25 16:07:02 <Eddi|zuHause> and i'm no closer to understanding what the *3 does 16:07:02 <Alberth> 16 * 0.25 == 4 :) 16:08:29 <Eddi|zuHause> my best guess is that the 100/(8*2) is the amount of input cargo you use, and the *3 is just for the output cargo, so not relevant for storing the remainder 16:08:51 <andythenorth> @calc 100 / 8 * 2 16:08:51 <DorpsGek> andythenorth: 25 16:09:00 <andythenorth> @calc 100 / (8 * 2) 16:09:00 <DorpsGek> andythenorth: 6.25 16:09:25 <Eddi|zuHause> 100 divided by (8*2) is 6 with remainder 4 16:09:49 <Alberth> ratio sum? 16:09:52 <Eddi|zuHause> in the upper lines you process the 6, and in the lower lines you carry over the 4 16:10:05 <andythenorth> oh it’s like primary school maths? 16:10:07 <andythenorth> hah 16:10:21 <andythenorth> I never managed to do long division 16:10:26 <supermop> haha 16:10:35 <andythenorth> 30 years later, it shows up again 16:10:44 <andythenorth> I could never carry the remainder, makes no sense 16:10:50 <supermop> i got caught up on a GRE question about long division some how 16:11:10 <Eddi|zuHause> what's "long" about the division? 16:11:28 <supermop> there i was at like 24 years old looking at math i hadnt done since i was 10 16:11:29 *** Wormnest has joined #openttd 16:11:50 <supermop> Eddi|zuHause: the length of my lamentations upon being faced with it 16:11:54 * LordAro , the maths undergrad, looks pointedly at you all 16:12:17 <LordAro> that said, i miss actual numbers sometimes 16:12:22 <Eddi|zuHause> you can happily do a maths degree without ever having to do a division :p 16:12:45 <LordAro> i go through some lectures where the only numerical digit i see is the '1' at the bottom of a summation :p 16:13:14 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: how do you divide 100 by 16 without long division? 16:13:33 <andythenorth> https://www.mathsisfun.com/long_division.html 16:14:02 <supermop> i cant find an image macro of that particular simpsons line 16:14:12 <supermop> andythenorth: its 6 16:14:25 <supermop> 100/16 is 6 and vis versa 16:14:27 <Eddi|zuHause> x=100; y=0; while (x>0) { x-=16; y++; } 16:14:37 <andythenorth> yes, that is nicer 16:14:43 <supermop> was my rule of thumb for rmb while in china 16:14:44 <LordAro> Eddi|zuHause: lol 16:14:47 <Alberth> x >= 16 16:15:03 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: beware of obiwans 16:16:11 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: anyway, for doing the division you can ask the giant calculator in front of you. 16:16:26 <andythenorth> I do 16:16:30 <Eddi|zuHause> you don't need "long" division for that :p 16:16:31 <andythenorth> except in this case 16:16:46 <andythenorth> 1) I don’t understand the maths 16:17:02 <andythenorth> 2) OpenTTD doesn’t consistently produce the same output, so testing is hard 16:17:18 <andythenorth> deliver 72t, expecting 36t result 16:17:21 <andythenorth> sometimes I get 39t 16:17:25 <andythenorth> sometimes 32t 16:17:32 <andythenorth> I’ve re-run the same test from saves 16:17:51 <andythenorth> I’ve run it about 50 times today 16:18:06 <andythenorth> usually it’s 36 though 16:18:11 <Eddi|zuHause> so you get 32t until the remainder builds up, then you get 39t once, and have to wait for the remainder to build up again 16:18:32 <andythenorth> not when I’ve deleted the remainder code :P 16:18:52 <Eddi|zuHause> then i don't know what you do 16:19:05 <Eddi|zuHause> maybe some other variable changes? 16:19:14 <andythenorth> the only explanation I can think of is vehicles arriving as the month changes 16:19:28 <andythenorth> or deliveries coinciding with periodic processing in some other way 16:19:42 <andythenorth> maybe cargo gets double-counted for a tick or something 16:21:32 <supermop> andythenorth: http://krisdedecker.typepad.com/.a/6a00e0099229e88833011570f1437c970c-pi 16:22:06 <andythenorth> supermop: nice :) 16:22:17 <Eddi|zuHause> i feel like i've seen that picture before 16:23:12 <andythenorth> I guess I’ll just leave the remainder code in place, untouched 16:23:35 <andythenorth> the spurious looking results are likely just due to gradually increasing remainder 16:23:45 <andythenorth> at least this changes nothing from existing FIRS 16:29:05 <supermop> has anyone other than andy complained about the behavior? 16:29:45 <supermop> just say you are simulating shift changes at the factory between amateurs and experienced crews 16:33:09 *** TrueBrain has joined #openttd 16:33:38 <supermop> should there be any vehicles that can drive around on these pavements but not on regular roads and streets? 16:33:49 <supermop> like forklifts and container stackers? 16:34:35 *** TrueBrain-Bot has joined #openttd 16:36:29 *** supermop_ has joined #openttd 16:40:15 *** ZirconiumX has quit IRC 16:41:53 *** supermop has quit IRC 17:02:51 <Alberth> it's a matter of time before some vehicles can only drive on some of the available roads 17:03:21 <Alberth> otherwise NRT would be a whole lot simpler 17:04:20 <andythenorth> supermop_: the remainder code was in response to complaints :) 17:04:22 <andythenorth> not from me 17:04:28 <andythenorth> complaints / valid bug reports 17:04:46 <andythenorth> and yes, ‘industrial traffic’ should be a thing 17:04:53 <andythenorth> maybe you could do HEQS 2? 17:05:03 <supermop_> i will 17:05:09 <supermop_> if you want and its nml 17:05:34 <supermop_> im doing strings 17:06:33 <supermop_> and wondering if it should be 'new road vehicle' or 'new ... vehicle' 17:12:44 <andythenorth> RH has “New Heavy Haul Road Vehicles” 17:12:44 *** frosch123 has joined #openttd 17:13:00 <Alberth> hola 17:14:04 <supermop_> andythenorth: thats fine, but currently chips pavement roads are just non-public driveways for regular road vehicles 17:14:16 <andythenorth> supermop_: such is design :) 17:14:17 <andythenorth> dunno 17:14:25 <supermop_> so a cobblestone depot can build a regular bus 17:14:33 <andythenorth> “new road vehicle” then? o_O 17:14:40 <supermop_> thats what i have now 17:14:46 <andythenorth> combinatorial systems like this are notoriously hard to make sense with 17:14:55 <supermop_> but maybe it will be cool to change it 17:15:36 <supermop_> dual mode trucks - whats the interesting angle for late game ? 17:16:00 <supermop_> lower cost on wires? higher power? 17:16:24 <supermop_> mostly electric but can limp on diesel/battery? 17:16:35 <frosch123> moi 17:17:47 <supermop_> the 'real' reasons of better air-quality/less noise in populated areas aren't really workable in game 17:19:10 <supermop_> frosch123: i have a bridge surface problem 17:19:33 <frosch123> your car dropped into water? 17:20:43 <supermop_> http://imgur.com/a/25b7L 17:21:17 <supermop_> https://paste.openttdcoop.org/pizkwjafy 17:21:40 <supermop_> http://imgur.com/a/LnzxQ 17:22:31 <supermop_> i don't want the cobbles on there 17:22:45 <frosch123> i think you added your "ground" sprites as "overlay" sprites 17:24:02 <frosch123> for road you usually do not add any overlay sprites 17:24:39 <supermop_> https://paste.openttdcoop.org/petgrpgoi 17:24:50 <supermop_> thats the whole code if it helps 17:25:49 <frosch123> "track_overlay" is always drawn 17:25:51 <frosch123> on all tiles 17:26:30 <frosch123> so, remove "track_overlay" from all roadtypes 17:26:37 <supermop_> oooh 17:26:49 <frosch123> overlay is for small things like tram rails on top of other roadtypes 17:26:57 <frosch123> the overlay never includes the walkway 17:27:07 <supermop_> ok 17:38:20 *** roidal has joined #openttd 17:41:23 *** glx has joined #openttd 17:41:23 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v glx 17:42:52 <supermop_> ok fixed now except for one ramp offset 17:43:12 <supermop_> just need to fix level crossings then can ship 17:43:52 *** ConductorCat has quit IRC 17:44:10 *** ConductorCat has joined #openttd 17:46:49 <supermop_> now the southeast halftile is the drive in truckstop 17:49:16 <andythenorth> eh 17:49:27 <supermop_> thats odd 17:49:39 <andythenorth> mostly FIRS secondary industry outputs 4:4 (where there are 2 cargos) 17:49:55 <andythenorth> some Steeltown industries, this is inappropriate 17:50:25 <andythenorth> the rest of FIRS, ‘byproducts’ aren’t really a feature 17:50:30 <andythenorth> whereas Steeltown they are 17:50:40 <andythenorth> so Coke Oven: 6:2 Coke:Sulphur? 17:51:19 <andythenorth> realism would be about 7:1 or less 17:51:20 <andythenorth> but eh 17:54:02 <supermop_> lunch brb 17:54:54 <supermop_> or not 17:55:22 <Alberth> unless Sulphur is a sort of supplies, it becomes quite useless, I think 17:55:56 <andythenorth> there is a story behind that :P 17:56:06 <Alberth> maybe as multiplier in "if multiple cargos are delivered, production steps up" 17:56:11 <supermop_> i wonder why drive in stop suddenly showed up for just one of the half tiles, for only 3 of the roadtypes 17:56:35 <andythenorth> TL;DR sulphur was a nice hack to reduce dependence on chemicals for tyre plant 17:56:49 <Alberth> ok 17:57:38 <andythenorth> longer, amount of coke produced is same (6t per 8t coal), but the ‘waste’ (2t per 8t coal) is used to make tyres, replacing generic ‘chemicals’ 17:58:01 <Alberth> sounds fair enough :) 17:58:17 <andythenorth> it was a nice hack, but it means losing the neat 1:1 split that FIRS has always had where 2 cargos are produced at a secondary 17:58:23 * andythenorth did it anyway 17:58:49 <Alberth> you don't want to become too predictable :) 18:13:10 *** FR^2 has joined #openttd 18:17:00 *** chomwitt1 has quit IRC 18:31:29 <andythenorth> Alberth: how is your Steeltown game? o_O 18:31:34 <andythenorth> and do you want a new one? :P 18:32:19 *** Eddi|zuHause has quit IRC 18:32:20 *** Eddi|zuHause2 has joined #openttd 18:33:09 <Alberth> I was wondering about that :) 18:33:45 <andythenorth> I haven’t fixed any sprites, but I think the chains are good now 18:34:06 <andythenorth> more changes are probably just pissing around with diminishing returns 18:34:12 <andythenorth> but needs second or third opinions :) 18:36:33 *** Eddi|zuHause2 is now known as Eddi|zuHause 18:36:41 <Eddi|zuHause> somebody stole the internet again 18:36:49 <andythenorth> http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/firs/push/LATEST/ 18:36:54 <Eddi|zuHause> for like 5 minutes this time, not 5 hours 18:39:32 <Alberth> I was about to do something about 324t steel / month :p 18:39:48 <Alberth> also, chips are annoying at not showing cargo 18:41:43 <andythenorth> which cargos? 18:43:57 <Alberth> lots, at least slag 18:44:22 <andythenorth> I’ll fix them 18:45:33 <andythenorth> slag using fire cycle? :P 18:45:42 <DorpsGek> Commit by translators :: r27747 trunk/src/lang/korean.txt (2017-02-17 19:45:37 +0100 ) 18:45:43 <DorpsGek> -Update from Eints: 18:45:44 <DorpsGek> korean: 7 changes by telk5093 18:45:51 <andythenorth> http://c8.alamy.com/comp/EJX4M3/hot-iron-production-slag-being-poured-from-a-barrel-into-a-pit-in-EJX4M3.jpg 18:45:56 <andythenorth> probably not :) 18:48:47 *** Supercheese has joined #openttd 18:49:14 <Alberth> would be nice if that was possible, slowly becoming black :) 18:49:31 <andythenorth> I am putting in some fire pixels 18:49:36 <andythenorth> but animating them is beyond me :) 18:49:41 <andythenorth> CHIPS is quite special code 18:49:57 <Alberth> pig iron too, I think 18:52:28 *** srhnsn has quit IRC 18:53:38 <Alberth> quicklime too, just tested 18:55:16 <andythenorth> generic metal can probably serve for pig iron 18:57:18 <andythenorth> hmm pig iron does not come in coils 18:57:19 <andythenorth> nvm 18:57:21 *** FLHerne has joined #openttd 18:58:32 <Alberth> still need to touch about 1/3 of the map :) 19:01:40 <Alberth> let's try number 6275 :) 19:01:53 <andythenorth> quicklime seems to go in barrels 19:04:20 <andythenorth> Alberth: http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/chips/push/LATEST/ 19:04:45 * andythenorth will be shocked if that isn’t savegame safe 19:07:57 <Alberth> \o/ 19:08:07 <Alberth> game is less than 5 minutes old :p 19:08:44 <andythenorth> misses graphics for cement and soda ash cargos 19:09:04 <andythenorth> but those aren’t the main focus 19:10:45 <andythenorth> ha I should add explosives graphics :) 19:11:09 <Alberth> :) 19:12:01 <andythenorth> sadly just crates 19:12:45 <andythenorth> this won’t work at TTD scale http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net/ellathemoose/images/9/9f/Minecraft-tnt-block-packshot_size_410.jpeg/revision/latest?cb=20120802165820 19:14:20 *** chomwitt1 has joined #openttd 19:19:47 *** Biolunar has quit IRC 19:21:27 <Alberth> mega explosive packs :) 19:21:38 <Alberth> container full of them 19:21:56 <Alberth> ugh, loooong bridge @ 32km/h 19:24:50 *** Progman has joined #openttd 19:27:53 *** FLHerne_ has joined #openttd 19:35:15 *** FLHerne has quit IRC 19:45:49 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 19:48:32 *** gelignite has joined #openttd 19:56:44 *** supermop has joined #openttd 20:13:54 *** supermop has quit IRC 20:19:00 *** Supercheese has quit IRC 20:23:38 *** Gja has joined #openttd 20:54:11 <andythenorth> Alberth: pipe and explosives graphics added… http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/chips/push/LATEST/ 20:57:36 <andythenorth> sulphur next :) http://l7.alamy.com/zooms/df2f9bd221574acc84f5358741acd98b/sulfur-pile-at-north-vancouver-british-columbia-canada-b35dh5.jpg 20:59:57 *** sim-al2 has joined #openttd 21:01:14 <Alberth> looks like very good colour :) 21:01:31 <Alberth> or rather, unique colour :) 21:02:08 *** FLHerne_ has quit IRC 21:02:21 *** FLHerne_ has joined #openttd 21:07:17 <berndj> is "service all the things" an established game type? 21:10:14 <andythenorth> added Sulphur and Soda Ash cargos http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/chips/push/LATEST/ 21:11:57 <Alberth> berndj: sure 21:12:39 <berndj> i find i run out of cash and have to wait for some lines to make some money before i can build again, at an early-ish stage 21:12:44 <Alberth> thanks andy, will add it to the game tomorrow, not sure how much time I will have then 21:13:02 <berndj> later (assuming i don't go bankrupt) i can't keep up in click rate 21:13:14 <Alberth> yep, that's normal :) 21:13:49 <Alberth> you can use more expensive-to-run vehicles if you like to keep up clicking longer :) 21:15:21 <Alberth> some people aim for max money, personally, I lose interest in money as soon as I get more than I spend :) 21:15:27 <Alberth> nn andythenorth 21:15:37 <andythenorth> bye 21:15:46 *** Alberth has left #openttd 21:16:23 <andythenorth> anyone want to tell me how long ships should be, based on a ‘proper’ dimetric projection of a circle? 21:19:42 <andythenorth> http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/8355/ships-length.png 21:23:02 <andythenorth> http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/8356/ships-length-2.png 21:23:15 <andythenorth> the – view blatantly exceeds a projected circle 21:23:26 <andythenorth> but the ratio I’m using is same as for trains, RVs 21:25:50 *** Eddi|zuHause has quit IRC 21:27:34 *** Eddi|zuHause has joined #openttd 21:28:43 *** FLHerne_ has quit IRC 21:30:06 *** tokai has joined #openttd 21:30:06 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai 21:30:22 *** FLHerne has joined #openttd 21:37:04 *** tokai|noir has quit IRC 21:37:07 <andythenorth> https://i.ytimg.com/vi/aFg6F9mcV78/hqdefault.jpg 21:38:11 <Eddi|zuHause> Wolf01: so how accurate is this description? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NXUleq-Hd6c 21:44:38 <andythenorth> http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/8357/ships-length-3.png 21:44:49 <andythenorth> ship should be more like 86px 21:44:59 <andythenorth> which is about 1.33 * the 64 px length 21:45:17 <andythenorth> might be coincidence, might be trigonometry 21:48:53 <andythenorth> hmm trig says 74px 21:50:56 <andythenorth> @calc 2*(64/sqrt(3)) 21:50:56 <DorpsGek> andythenorth: 73.9008344563 21:54:25 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: in the – view you should cut every 4th pixel to have better rotational scale 21:55:13 <andythenorth> based on the original baseset train ratio? 21:55:13 <andythenorth> or what? :) 21:55:42 <andythenorth> original base set ships are bonkers, they get shorter in – view :P 21:57:05 <andythenorth> original base set ships are bonkers, they get shorter in – view :P 21:57:48 <Eddi|zuHause> @calc sqrt(3)*16 21:57:48 <DorpsGek> Eddi|zuHause: 27.7128129211 21:58:18 <Eddi|zuHause> @calc sqrt(5)*16 21:58:18 <DorpsGek> Eddi|zuHause: 35.77708764 21:59:40 <Eddi|zuHause> @calc sqrt(5) 21:59:40 <DorpsGek> Eddi|zuHause: 2.2360679775 22:01:18 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: the "cutting every 4th pixel" is a result of making the diagonal of a square 1.5 times the side of the square (rounding from sqrt(2)) 22:01:45 * andythenorth needs a picture :) 22:02:09 <andythenorth> but I get the principle 22:02:59 <Eddi|zuHause> can't make pictures 22:03:04 <andythenorth> comes out at 86px I think 22:03:25 <andythenorth> for a vehicle that is 2 tiles (64px) 22:03:35 <andythenorth> 64px is measured along x axis though :P 22:03:47 <andythenorth> not longitudinally along the projection of the vehicle 22:05:04 <Eddi|zuHause> @calc sqrt(5)*1.5*32 22:05:04 <DorpsGek> Eddi|zuHause: 107.33126292 22:08:03 <Eddi|zuHause> @calc (445-275)/2 22:08:03 <DorpsGek> Eddi|zuHause: 85 22:11:31 <Eddi|zuHause> @calc (486-230)/2 22:11:31 <DorpsGek> Eddi|zuHause: 128 22:12:09 <Eddi|zuHause> @calc 128/sqrt(2) 22:12:09 <DorpsGek> Eddi|zuHause: 90.5096679919 22:12:20 <Eddi|zuHause> @calc 128/1.5 22:12:20 <DorpsGek> Eddi|zuHause: 85.3333333333 22:12:36 <Eddi|zuHause> i think that's the value you're going for 22:13:23 <andythenorth> it’s almost exactly what I got from drawing an ellipse in photoshop 22:13:41 <Eddi|zuHause> the diagonal of a square of length 2 is 128px, so length 2 is 90px (for "exact" sqrt(2)) or 85 (for "rounded" sqrt(2)) 22:13:58 * andythenorth can’t do long division, but paid attention in technical drawing geometry :P 22:14:39 <Eddi|zuHause> somewhere inbetween those two values you should probably try to get your ship 22:15:06 <andythenorth> to confirm, this is for the – view length, measured on x axis 22:15:08 <Wolf01> <Eddi|zuHause> Wolf01: so how accurate is this description? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NXUleq-Hd6c <- totally 22:15:09 <Eddi|zuHause> this also matches my "cut every 4th pixel" theorem 22:15:14 <andythenorth> [for avoidance of doubt] 22:15:21 <Eddi|zuHause> yes 22:15:39 <andythenorth> it fits an old rule I learnt for isometric triangles 22:15:54 <andythenorth> 1.33 22:15:57 <Wolf01> BTW, I live in the back garden of Venice :P 22:16:27 <Eddi|zuHause> Wolf01: well, nobody actually lives IN venice. it's all tourists... 22:16:40 <andythenorth> @calc 64 * 1.333 22:16:40 <DorpsGek> andythenorth: 85.312 22:17:00 <andythenorth> @calc 64 / 0.75 22:17:00 <DorpsGek> andythenorth: 85.3333333333 22:17:33 <andythenorth> it reduces to the same 22:17:37 <andythenorth> it’s all triangles 22:17:45 <andythenorth> ok, well that’s something 22:17:48 <Eddi|zuHause> illuminati confirmed! 22:18:10 <andythenorth> it means either ships are quite short in – view (86px instead of 128px, big reduction) 22:18:17 <andythenorth> or I make them > 2 tiles long 22:19:12 <andythenorth> @calc 128 * .75 22:19:12 <DorpsGek> andythenorth: 96 22:19:13 *** roidal has quit IRC 22:19:57 <andythenorth> or I distort the true scale, as per the rest of the base set :P 22:21:31 <andythenorth> or I distort the true scale, as per the rest of the base set :) 22:21:54 * andythenorth has flappy connection 22:23:01 <Eddi|zuHause> it's fine, means we can read everything twice :p 22:23:11 <andythenorth> such fun 22:24:02 <Wolf01> Oh, I thought it was my problem 22:26:55 <andythenorth> hmm 22:27:26 <andythenorth> so with the correct lengths, the \ / views are even longer than Squid :) 22:27:48 <andythenorth> and the purpose of a new set was to shorten those lengths, as they look wrong in game :) 22:27:58 * andythenorth has drawn the ship to the new lenght 22:28:20 <andythenorth> it’s quite obviously rotationally correct 22:33:49 * andythenorth will sleep on it 22:33:50 *** andythenorth has left #openttd 22:34:34 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 22:40:41 *** Bluelight has joined #openttd 22:43:06 *** Wormnest has quit IRC 22:45:37 *** Defaultti has quit IRC 22:47:03 *** Defaultti has joined #openttd 22:50:32 *** frosch123 has quit IRC 22:59:30 *** Eddi|zuHause has quit IRC 23:00:27 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC 23:01:41 *** Eddi|zuHause has joined #openttd 23:06:08 *** Bluelight has quit IRC 23:18:00 *** matt11235 has quit IRC 23:33:12 *** Progman has quit IRC 23:37:29 *** Gja has quit IRC