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Log for #openttd on 11th September 2018:
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00:05:22  <Samu> as for the other questions
00:06:19  <Samu> the cost grow per number of pieces of road / rail
00:06:29  <Samu> it's not the same as airport
00:07:19  <Samu> getting the cost of a road piece or a road tunnel or so will not be a fixed value, it depends on the amount of infrastructure count :(
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00:10:55  <Samu> isn't it?
00:11:01  <Samu> let me confirm
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00:18:35  <Samu> yep, the more you have the more it costs per piece
00:19:02  <Samu> just confirmed, so it's pointless to do it for road and rail,
00:19:09  <Samu> airports are different
00:19:21  <Samu> cost doesn't grow
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07:43:47  <andythenorth> o/
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09:38:38  <Samu> hey i made a comment
09:38:41  <Samu> https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/6897#discussion_r216606151
09:38:44  <Samu> LordAro:
09:40:47  <Samu> sorry about the url, i'm terrible
09:45:24  <Samu> andythenorth:
09:45:44  <Samu> how do i quote multiple lines in a url
09:47:40  <Samu> i don't want to quote only /**
09:47:41  <Samu> lel
09:57:06  <LordAro> what do you think it wrong with the url?
09:58:18  <LordAro> Samu: can you not use something like TestMode to work out the costs?
09:58:26  <LordAro> it's awkward to use, i know, but..
09:59:02  <Samu> that's the construction cost, not the maintenance cost
09:59:03  <LordAro> maybe a better solution would be to add a getcost function
09:59:19  <LordAro> then you can write your own maintenance cost function
10:00:24  <Samu> I wanted to quote lines 550 to 567
10:00:28  <Samu> only line 550 was quoted
10:01:45  <LordAro> ah right
10:02:11  <LordAro> fixed :p
10:05:56  <Samu> write my own maintenance cost in openttd code or in the ai code?
10:06:18  <LordAro> ai code
10:06:53  <andythenorth> snail_UES_: drawn any wagons yet?
10:06:57  <andythenorth> o_O
10:07:16  <Samu> thx for fixing quote
10:07:22  <snail_UES_> andythenorth: my wagons are finished already...
10:07:30  <andythenorth> got any covered hoppers?
10:07:37  <snail_UES_> unless you came up with yet any new cargoes :D
10:07:42  <snail_UES_> I have silo wagons...
10:07:48  <snail_UES_> or open hoppers
10:07:51  <andythenorth> I am trying to figure out liveries for silo wagons
10:07:58  <andythenorth> whether I show the cargo somehow
10:08:23  <snail_UES_> mine are simple grey silos, with a colored stripe around their maximum radius (they’re vertical silos)
10:08:35  <snail_UES_> I change the color of the stripe according to the cargo type
10:08:39  <Samu> well, in the AI side, i would have to predict the exact number of road/rail/canal pieces in a route
10:08:59  <andythenorth> snail_UES_: how many different cargo colours have you got?
10:09:08  <snail_UES_> only three I believe…
10:09:11  <Samu> road is complicated, because i don't think it's possible to retrieve the number of bit pieces with the AI
10:09:15  <snail_UES_> let me check the code (I’ve got it handy)
10:09:17  <Samu> on a tile
10:10:20  <Samu> haven't really looked through, but ...
10:11:03  <Samu> i know beforehand that predicting number of pieces would be too tough to do right
10:11:10  <snail_UES_> oh, nope that was my original idea
10:11:25  <snail_UES_> I eventually coded them in the same color to simplify stuff :p
10:11:30  <Samu> predicting it for airports is just straigth forward
10:11:47  <Samu> just need to know which airport type I wanna predict it for
10:11:54  <snail_UES_> but my idea would have been something like, yellow for grain, orange for food, grey for everything else
10:12:50  <andythenorth> yeah I'm thinking I do them all same colour
10:12:59  <andythenorth> I've tried colours per cargo, but somehow it doesn't work
10:13:09  <andythenorth> it does work for tank wagons though
10:13:21  <andythenorth> ok thanks
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10:14:36  <snail_UES_> maybe I’ll change it back to my original idea :p shouldn’t be too hard
10:14:54  <snail_UES_> for tank wagons I’ve also got different colors for different cargoes
10:15:09  <snail_UES_> with random kind-of-realistic color schemas for petrol...
10:15:20  <snail_UES_> such as Shell, BP, Aral...
10:15:58  <andythenorth> I've tried the stripe in colours, and/or the hatches too http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/iron-horse/push/LATEST/docs/html/trains.html#covered_hopper_car_pony_gen_2A
10:16:06  <andythenorth> but most of the cargos for covered hopper are white or yellow :)
10:16:11  <andythenorth> so it doesn't really help player
10:18:56  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] andythenorth commented on issue #6894: destroy but keep land https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/issues/6894#issuecomment-420223197
10:20:29  <andythenorth> snail_UES_: so what colours might work? o_O
10:21:17  <snail_UES_> in my tank wagons, I'
10:21:20  <snail_UES_> I use two colors
10:21:40  <snail_UES_> one is main and the other one is a square-like symbol on one side (i.e. the petrol company logo)
10:21:49  <snail_UES_> let me double-check which colors I use...
10:22:16  <snail_UES_> I use main blue, white logo (Aral)
10:22:23  <snail_UES_> main blue, red logo (ELF)
10:22:31  <snail_UES_> main yellow, red logo (Shell)
10:22:42  <snail_UES_> and main green, white logo (BP_)
10:23:07  <snail_UES_> a train is uses each of these for all of the wagons, with 25% probability each
10:24:31  <snail_UES_> for other cargoes, I use dark grey (oil), light grey, brown or green (fertilizer), yellow (edible oil, chemical products), or white (water, milk)
10:25:59  <snail_UES_> but my tank wagons are smaller than yours, since they’re narrow gauge, so I have less real estate to play with :p
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11:07:52  <LordAro> andythenorth: thanks for elaborating :)
11:08:00  <andythenorth> np
11:49:28  <Samu> that sell land topic
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11:50:05  <Fantasp> Hello, what do you enjoy about openttd?
11:50:21  <andythenorth> the crack
11:50:33  <Samu> i think he wants to destroy an area of tiles without destroying the land-owned tiles
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12:29:22  <Samu> if (counter == stationTile == null ? 500 : 1)
12:29:29  <Samu> is this gonna work the way I think it works?
12:33:46  <LordAro> probably not
12:34:11  <LordAro> oh, hmm
12:34:19  <LordAro> maybe, but it's sorely lacking some parens
12:34:42  <LordAro> actually, definitely not
12:34:57  <LordAro> you'll end up with if (false == null ? 500 : 1)
13:00:44  <Samu> if (counter == (stationTile == null ? 500 : 1))
13:06:50  <Samu> if i am expanding a station, retry 1 time, else I am building a new station, retry 500 times
13:07:48  <Samu> i'm trying to speed up exanding station code, it takes too much time
13:08:52  <peter1138> max = (stationTile == null) ? 500 : 1;
13:08:58  <peter1138> if (counter == max)
13:10:25  <peter1138> Put the first line before your counter loop, else you'll be evaluating whether to count to 500 to 1 every time you loop.
13:11:10  <LordAro> peter1138: hardly the modt computationally expensive thing on the world
13:11:22  <LordAro> (though i do agree)
13:11:30  <LordAro> most*
13:12:01  <peter1138> Sure but don't scripts have execution limits?
13:12:31  <LordAro> possible
13:18:05  <Samu> it's still too slow t.t
13:18:14  <Samu> i have vehicles waiting 6 years in depots
13:18:27  <Samu> because of the expanding code :(
13:18:42  <Samu> trying to do it for the 83 routes
13:23:30  <Samu> function buildTownStation is a gigantic piece of code atm :(
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13:36:09  <Samu> i pintpointed the source of the slowdows
13:36:11  <Samu> if (Utils.AreOtherStationsNearby(tile, cargoClass, stationId)) {
13:36:14  <Samu> this thing is slow
13:37:38  <Samu> https://paste.openttdcoop.org/phtxvttpa
13:37:45  <Samu> what is slow in here?
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13:46:33  <Samu> the AI has is_friendly turned off
13:46:49  <Samu> so it's the part before the else
13:47:13  <Samu> or it could be the finalizing part after the if/else
13:47:15  <Samu> hmm
13:51:43  <LordAro> Samu: check the size of the rectangle
13:53:03  <Samu> it's 7x7 or 13x13 if im not mistaken
13:53:19  <Samu> in this case it's 7x7
13:53:24  <Samu> because it's expanding
13:53:25  <LordAro> are you sure of that?
13:54:16  <Samu> coverage of a bus station is 3
13:55:49  <Samu> if the tile is at 3,3 coordinates, the offset will have top tile at 0,0, bottom tile at 6,6
13:56:03  <Samu> that's 7x7
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14:00:45  <Samu> maybe the getValidOffsetTile could be improved
14:01:31  <Samu> https://paste.openttdcoop.org/p2xv8lx23
14:01:39  <Samu> my poor skills
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14:14:03  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Blauw67 opened issue #6898: Seeds above 32bit max int. https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/issues/6898
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14:19:53  <Samu> there is another rectangle
14:21:16  <Samu> 25*25 size
14:21:36  <Samu> sec
14:22:14  <Samu> https://paste.openttdcoop.org/pswaqpejg
14:23:00  <Samu> code that matters is between lines 27 - 42
14:23:25  <Samu> erm 27-44
14:23:39  <Samu> this is the function that is used to expand stations
14:23:47  <Samu> you see, it's biiiiig
14:24:02  <Samu> but the major slowdown is between 27-44
14:24:51  <Samu> 27-48, my bad
14:25:39  <Samu> @calc 25*25*7*7
14:25:39  <DorpsGek> Samu: 30625
14:25:45  <Samu> hmmm.... :P
14:25:48  <Samu> is that too much
14:27:20  <Samu> there are 85 routes
14:27:27  <Samu> @calc 30625 * 85
14:27:28  <DorpsGek> Samu: 2603125
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14:40:12  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] MrOriKlein opened issue #6899: An industry has went over a million production but isn't actually producing anything. https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/issues/6899
14:45:44  <Samu> gonna try a lower value
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14:47:19  <Samu> yep, much faster
14:47:35  <Samu> but then, it can barely expand :(
14:51:37  <planetmaker> hm... where is the OpenTTD code gone that's not the game code, like master server. osie etc?
14:52:05  <planetmaker> that is: where are the missing parts of the svn repo? :D
14:52:17  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] MrOriKlein commented on issue #6899: An industry has went over a million production but isn't actually producing anything. https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/issues/6899#issuecomment-420302404
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14:53:03  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] planetmaker commented on issue #6899: An industry has went over a million production but isn't actually producing anything. https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/issues/6899#issuecomment-420302651
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14:57:50  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] MrOriKlein commented on issue #6899: An industry has went over a million production but isn't actually producing anything. https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/issues/6899#issuecomment-420304429
14:57:55  <Alberth> hi hi
14:58:47  <planetmaker> o/
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15:00:54  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] MrOriKlein commented on issue #6899: An industry has went over a million production but isn't actually producing anything. https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/issues/6899#issuecomment-420305505
15:02:48  <Samu> cargodist and train renewed?
15:03:10  <Samu> i had that bug happen
15:03:19  <planetmaker> Alberth, do you know where I currently get / clone from the openttd extra stuff like osie and master server and such?
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15:04:33  <Alberth> only place I can think of is in another repo in the openttd organization
15:05:25  <Alberth> but no idea if it's actually there
15:05:27  <planetmaker> but hg.o.o and svn.o.o both direct to github
15:06:14  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] planetmaker commented on issue #6899: An industry has went over a million production but isn't actually producing anything. https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/issues/6899#issuecomment-420307404
15:06:17  <Alberth> yes, the GH openttd organization  https://github.com/OpenTTD
15:07:07  <Alberth> but I don't see it tbh
15:08:13  <planetmaker> hm, ok. Seems I'm at least not blind
15:09:15  <Samu> planetmaker: https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/issues/6647 i think this is the issue
15:09:29  <Alberth> you're not the only blind person, at least :)
15:09:44  <planetmaker> :D
15:11:32  <planetmaker> Samu, interesting... though I'm not sure it is because it seems the person *wants* the vehicles to load there
15:11:47  <Samu> that guy screenshots show the depot behind the station, seems to be the same symptom he's having
15:13:44  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] planetmaker commented on issue #6899: An industry has went over a million production but isn't actually producing anything. https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/issues/6899#issuecomment-420309953
15:16:08  <planetmaker> good point. Let's see what he replies
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15:19:35  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] MrOriKlein commented on issue #6899: An industry has went over a million production but isn't actually producing anything. https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/issues/6899#issuecomment-420312036
15:26:10  <LordAro> #6898 is a bit weird... everything i can find about the seed implies it's a uint32
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15:31:39  <Alberth> so the print routine would be wrong then?
15:31:52  <LordAro> aha, commandline parser is using atoi
15:32:05  <LordAro> out of range is apparently UB
15:33:02  <Alberth> :)
15:33:05  <LordAro> should probably be strtoul
15:33:19  <Eddi|zuHause> maybe we should be switching to a language that isn't filled with UB traps?
15:33:23  <LordAro> or even strtoull, with some bounds checking
15:33:45  * LordAro points Eddi|zuHause at https://www.joelonsoftware.com/2000/04/06/things-you-should-never-do-part-i/
15:33:57  <LordAro> oh hey, that article is old enough to drink now
15:34:40  <Eddi|zuHause> LordAro: so we need a language without UB that is also fully backwards compatible with C++? :p
15:35:07  <Alberth> good luck designing that :)
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15:35:46  <Eddi|zuHause> but seriously, range checking is basically a noop nowadays
15:36:07  <Eddi|zuHause> modern compilers can put them in places where the CPU otherwise would wait for memory access to return
15:36:14  <Alberth> hmm, simplest solution is to use a compiler implementation as the standard
15:36:33  <Alberth> not very compatible in time though
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15:37:33  <Eddi|zuHause> i think it's more a bureaucratic problem of eliminating some UB traps in the C++ standard
15:37:57  <LordAro> tbf, this is a C issue
15:37:57  <Eddi|zuHause> i hear microsoft is pushing a bit in that direction
15:37:59  <LordAro> not c++
15:38:02  <LordAro> we should upgrade to C++ first
15:38:32  <Alberth> not really, C++ is designed to be very flexible, so you won't get a C++ standard that defines everything
15:38:45  <planetmaker> eh, what is the actual issue with 6898? That the input is limited to MAX_INT?
15:38:46  <Eddi|zuHause> not everything, but some more things...
15:39:27  <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: eh, no, that the program does random things before it manages to check for MAX_INT
15:40:14  <LordAro> planetmaker: yeah, commandline input is limited to MAX_INT32, whereas it should be MAX_UINT32
15:40:18  <LordAro> or whatever the constant actually is
15:40:25  <planetmaker> uh
15:40:39  <Eddi|zuHause> Alberth: many of these UB traps are missing range checks in the library, not a compiler issue
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15:42:29  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro commented on issue #6898: Seeds above 32bit max int. https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/issues/6898#issuecomment-420319980
15:43:24  <Alberth> and library isn't updated for backwards compability :p
15:43:34  <Alberth> +ti
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16:25:32  <frosch123> planetmaker: migration of extra is in trello
16:25:38  <frosch123> currently you have to use svn-archive
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16:56:57  <Samu> damn, when pressing ctrl-s, the selection changes https://imgur.com/VObgN2H
16:57:13  <Samu> anyway, it was supposed to be a rectangle of size 25x25
16:58:47  <Samu> so, it's attempting to expand stations inside this rectangle, but the station spread value is 12
16:59:20  <Samu> it tries to expand from within the tile with the name
16:59:25  <Samu> station name*
16:59:45  <Samu> looks like the rectangle doesn't need to be that big
17:03:34  <Samu> half the value of station spread
17:03:37  <Samu> gonna try
17:04:44  <Samu> not really what I should do. It's a moving rectangle
17:04:51  <Samu> but meh, for now it suffices
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17:12:10  <andythenorth> o/
17:17:15  <frosch123> if you remove plastics you can add stuff like brass and pewter
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17:22:51  <Wolf01> o/
17:26:51  <andythenorth> that is the olde-worlde economy frosch123
17:26:54  <andythenorth> lead, wax, sisal
17:27:02  <andythenorth> jute, hemp, brass
17:27:08  <andythenorth> alchemical supplies
17:27:10  <andythenorth> dragon food
17:27:39  <frosch123> bone
17:29:58  <Samu> @calc 12/2
17:29:58  <DorpsGek> Samu: 6
17:30:14  <Samu> @calc 6+1+6
17:30:14  <DorpsGek> Samu: 13
17:30:44  <Samu>             local squareSize = AIGameSettings.GetValue("station_spread") / 2; 			if (AIGameSettings.GetValue("station_spread") % 2 == 0) { 			    squareSize = squareSize - 1; 			}
17:31:46  <Samu> @calc 5+1+5
17:31:46  <DorpsGek> Samu: 11
17:31:50  <Samu> boo
17:32:00  <Samu> i can never get 12
17:34:43  <andythenorth> night soil
17:34:51  <andythenorth> glue from horses
17:34:58  <andythenorth> urine for tanning leather
17:35:08  <andythenorth> corpse for medical research
17:38:41  <frosch123> that's noe olde worlde
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17:41:48  <Samu> retesting the ai in a 4k map again, should be managing expanding road stations faster
17:41:56  <Samu> zzz
17:43:57  <andythenorth> did we do prisoners and prison transport?
17:44:00  * andythenorth can't remember
17:44:33  <frosch123> ecs did
17:44:41  <frosch123> prisoners were consumed by mines iirc
17:45:10  <frosch123> anyway, i am watching old-stuff-restoration videos, and encounter unusual material vocabulary
17:45:26  <andythenorth> :)
17:46:08  <andythenorth> child #1 is learning about the linguistic paradoxes arising from special relativity where two observer frames are both in motion
17:46:09  <andythenorth> he's 8
17:46:53  <andythenorth> when I was 8, I just wanted to know the fastest train
17:47:08  <Wolf01> I thought he was learning about GHOTI
17:47:52  <frosch123> when i learned left/right, i thought they were geographical directions like west/east, and always tried to determine my orientation compared to the place where i learned left/right
17:48:18  <Wolf01> I don't remember what I did :(
17:49:16  <frosch123> andythenorth: what vocabulary does that involve?
17:49:52  <andythenorth> fastest train?
17:50:01  <andythenorth> :P
17:50:07  <frosch123> or is it about figureing out whether your train moves or the one you see through the window?
17:50:20  <andythenorth> it's that sort of thing
17:50:31  <andythenorth> and how time passes for each observer
17:50:45  <andythenorth> who gets younger relative to who etc
17:50:56  <frosch123> oh, that kind of relativity
17:51:29  <frosch123> well, fat people age slower, iirc
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17:58:16  <andythenorth> so can I do anything to help this along? https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/6867
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18:45:23  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] EgyLynx commented on issue #6899: An industry has went over a million production but isn't actually producing anything. https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/issues/6899#issuecomment-420379455
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20:14:43  <Eddi|zuHause> haha, "a million production" when it's just 1000, with a weird unit inflation
20:15:01  <Eddi|zuHause> probably has nothing to do with the problem
20:16:19  <LordAro> probably
20:16:24  <LordAro> someone should download the save and see :p
20:16:46  <Eddi|zuHause> uhm, that file was tagged as "contains a virus"
20:16:56  <LordAro> heh
20:21:52  <Eddi|zuHause> AI bought exclusive transport rights
20:22:31  <Eddi|zuHause> that's why no cargo
20:22:53  <LordAro> that'd do it
20:24:22  <LordAro> perhaps there should be a message in the station window
20:26:40  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro commented on issue #6899: An industry has went over a million production but isn't actually producing anything. https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/issues/6899#issuecomment-420413613
20:27:29  <LordAro> tada
20:34:28  <andythenorth> lol @ that
20:34:47  <Eddi|zuHause> there is, when you click on "transported"
20:35:00  <LordAro> well then.
20:35:10  <LordAro> someone else can close it :p
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21:00:07  <andythenorth> wonder if there's a var for 'vehicle is loading'
21:00:12  <andythenorth> specifically loading, not unloading
21:00:53  <andythenorth> probs not
21:01:00  <Eddi|zuHause> i remember that being tricky to distinguish even in the code
21:01:26  <Eddi|zuHause> closest would be the code that displays the up/down arrows next to the loading-%
21:04:41  <andythenorth> it's not essential
21:04:55  <andythenorth> I have closed hoppers which are loaded through roof doors
21:05:00  <Eddi|zuHause> none of newgrf spec is "essential"
21:05:12  <Eddi|zuHause> it would still be nice to have
21:05:20  <andythenorth> it will look weird to have open roof hatches when unloading
21:05:26  <andythenorth> although actually realistic in some cases
21:10:11  <LordAro> Eddi|zuHause: amusingly, chrome won't even let me download that file
21:13:07  <Eddi|zuHause> i don't know what signature it picked up on, though, there's only the sav file in there
21:13:12  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro commented on issue #6899: Not clear when an opponent has exclusive transport rights https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/issues/6899#issuecomment-420427457
21:13:12  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] MrOriKlein closed issue #6899: Not clear when an opponent has exclusive transport rights https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/issues/6899
21:13:20  <LordAro> zip file from a dodgy site, i think
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21:14:05  <Eddi|zuHause> possibly
21:14:44  <andythenorth> "Upload your file for zipping here, plus bonus malware"
21:21:02  <Samu> expanding stations seems faster, but not as fast as I would hope
21:21:19  <Samu> management is still rather slow
21:22:09  <Samu> gives the AI less air time for aircraft
21:23:34  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] bou6 commented on issue #6891: Question Building the project on Windows https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/issues/6891#issuecomment-420430382
21:23:41  <andythenorth> bed
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21:56:11  <LordAro> ooh
21:56:19  <LordAro> that's why my original music isn't working
21:56:41  <LordAro> it's looking for GM_TT00.GM, and my files are gm_tt00.gm
21:56:45  <LordAro> nielsm: fix :p
21:57:55  <LordAro> though hmm, that is how they're specified in the orig_win.obm
21:59:27  <nielsm> there are some annoyances with upper/lower case yes
21:59:54  <LordAro> did it look case insensitively before you made your changes, ooi?
21:59:59  <LordAro> because these files haven't changed in years
22:00:17  <nielsm> I think it did
22:00:59  <nielsm> there is some logic in one of the Fio* functions that tries the filename as specified, and then a lowercased version too
22:02:50  <nielsm> but imma sleep, gn
22:02:55  <LordAro> 'night
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22:05:38  <LordAro> ah, it also only searches baseset/
22:05:43  <LordAro> and my files are in gm/
22:05:46  <LordAro> because old
22:06:16  <LordAro> that's definitely an issue though, because it's picking up the .obm in the gm/ dir
22:07:36  <LordAro> yeah, that's the actual issue here, not the case issue
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22:25:52  <LordAro> and now that i've fixed my timidity setup, it's doing much better
22:27:28  <Samu> imgur is slow atm
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22:34:13  <Samu> https://ibb.co/nEwkZp
22:36:19  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro opened pull request #6900: Fix #6839: OLD_GM_DIR midi search path got lost https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/6900
22:36:31  <Samu> https://postimg.cc/image/erdtzgpbv/
22:36:39  <Samu> do any of the sites work? grr
22:36:44  <Samu> maybe it's my internet
22:41:07  <Samu> trying bus vs bus only
22:41:19  <Samu> and no station spread
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22:52:45  <Samu> AroAI plans faster
22:53:09  <Samu> LuDiAI AfterFix is a bit more cost conscious about the route
22:53:25  <LordAro> aroai hardly plans at all :p
22:53:46  <Samu> they're essentially tied the first 10 years
22:54:05  <LordAro> iirc, its process is 1) find city 2) build routes to all towns in a 250(?) tile radius around it
22:54:08  <LordAro> 3) done
22:54:29  <Samu> oh, 250
22:54:52  <Samu> i think LuDiAI has it set to 115? and then 115 * 1.2 if it couldn't find
22:55:01  <LordAro> actually, 250 seems way too big
22:55:04  <Samu> tries twice
22:55:13  <LordAro> probably no more than 100
22:55:54  <Samu> suddenly LuDiAI took off! 12 years into
22:55:58  <Samu> leading now
22:56:49  <Samu> strange that AroAI still has a better pathfinding success
22:56:52  <Samu> rate
22:56:54  <Samu> than mine
22:58:03  <Samu> ah, i see why aroai is doing bad after 12 years
22:58:06  <Samu> no autorenew
22:58:09  <Samu> breakdowns everywhere
22:58:36  <LordAro> hah
22:59:17  <Samu> wow, my AI crashed, wow that's unexpected lol
23:00:28  <Samu> fixed, that was because I was moving the order at which stuff was being managed
23:00:39  <Eddi|zuHause> i always wanted an AI that makes a voronoi partition of the map, and then builds all the cnnections
23:00:43  <Samu> some local variables weren't accounted for
23:01:31  <Samu> retrying with breakdowns disabled
23:01:31  <Eddi|zuHause> i think i managed to implement the partition, and list all neighbours of each city
23:02:07  <Eddi|zuHause> next step was "?"
23:02:13  <Eddi|zuHause> not sure why there's no profit yet
23:03:07  <Samu> @google voronoi partition
23:06:08  <Samu>  One of the early applications of Voronoi diagrams was implemented by John Snow
23:06:16  <Samu> you know nothing John Snow
23:09:02  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro opened pull request #6901: Add: Fluidsynth music driver support (jmak) https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/6901
23:24:32  <Samu> AroAI isn't cargodist aware, or is it?
23:24:41  <Samu> doesn't seem like it is
23:25:56  <LordAro> it predates cargodist :p
23:26:14  <LordAro> well, it predates cargodist being in trunk
23:26:29  <LordAro> cargodist as a patch has been around for many years
23:27:09  <Samu> i'm a bit confused what the plan is
23:27:21  <Samu> connect 1 big town to nearby small towns?
23:28:34  <Samu> damn, my ai builds ridiculously long bridges once he has the money, and aroai is taking full advantage of it :(
23:34:38  <Samu> retesting with cargodist disabled
23:41:13  <Samu> ah, aroai shines better with cargodist disabled, and in temperate
23:41:27  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro updated pull request #6901: Add: Fluidsynth music driver support (jmak) https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/6901
23:41:51  <LordAro> Samu: much fewer passengers in other environments
23:44:11  <Samu> aroai will win if it keeps this rate
23:44:56  <Samu> the main advantage of aro is really it's planning speed
23:45:13  <Samu> mine gets slower the more routes there are, management is slow
23:45:38  <Samu> and pathfinder takes more time and fails more often
23:45:45  <Samu> unsure why's that
23:48:29  <Samu> the end
23:48:50  <Samu> https://imgur.com/rQuXvwL
23:49:24  <Samu> 68 stations vs 158 stations
23:49:38  <Samu> it's more than twice as fast
23:53:02  <Samu> gonna try different settings for my ai
23:53:25  <LordAro> Samu: achieved nearly the same value with less than half the stations though
23:53:43  <LordAro> it's clearly more efficient
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23:54:47  <Samu> oh, i see lordaro expands stations, i thought it didn
23:55:41  <Samu> ok now mine expands stations, station spreads and is not friendly and not random
23:55:45  <Samu> let's see
23:59:09  <Samu> yeah, what a difference
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23:59:27  <Samu> these seem to be it's most competitive settings, it's doing much better

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