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00:59:05 *** Flygon has joined #openttd 01:08:33 *** acklen has quit IRC 01:21:39 *** acklen has joined #openttd 01:32:27 *** Progman has quit IRC 02:01:39 *** lugo has quit IRC 02:48:27 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC 02:53:07 *** glx has quit IRC 02:54:02 *** Wormnest has quit IRC 03:22:13 *** Thedarkb-T60 has quit IRC 03:51:16 *** Samu has quit IRC 05:55:59 *** Alberth has joined #openttd 05:55:59 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Alberth 05:56:07 <Alberth> moin 07:06:45 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 07:06:52 <andythenorth> early start Alberth? o_O 07:07:51 <Alberth> not quite, I got up about an hour earlier :) 07:08:21 <Alberth> that's normal for me 07:09:24 <Alberth> looked at some 2nd bananas, and apparently there is code for a db, and some code for reading file data 07:09:42 <Alberth> ie newgrf, savegames, etc 07:13:11 <andythenorth> I asked frosch if he wanted any help 07:13:20 <andythenorth> a few months ago 07:13:29 <Alberth> ah 07:13:37 <andythenorth> he said it was going ok and he didn't want to work with anyone else right now :) 07:14:19 <andythenorth> I have fixed the power display for multi-mode engines 07:14:21 <andythenorth> https://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/9228/double_trouble_fixed.png 07:14:27 <andythenorth> I used comic sans for emphasis of the change 07:15:04 <andythenorth> the diff for the newgrf part will be *really* big :P 07:15:35 <Alberth> makes sense 07:16:01 <andythenorth> the answer was right there already :P 07:16:08 <andythenorth> Max. Tractive Effort :P 07:16:37 <Alberth> don't know if openttd can detect cghanges, or it would need a flag to indicate this 07:17:36 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 07:17:42 <andythenorth> I would just change the string permanently 07:17:58 <Alberth> likely, neat solution andy! 07:18:19 <andythenorth> there's usually a way :P 07:18:49 <Alberth> finding the way is always the problem :) 07:19:00 <Alberth> especially when hidden in plain sight :p 07:20:23 <andythenorth> reminds me of this one https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/issues/3958 07:20:37 <andythenorth> I should finish the patch for that :P 07:20:57 <andythenorth> the simplest fix :P https://bugs.openttd.org/task/3958/getfile/10846/FS3958.png 07:21:46 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 07:23:05 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 07:29:29 <Alberth> not sure that exact speed is that interesting imho 07:30:46 <andythenorth> it's not, but it looked like such an easy fix :) 07:30:52 <andythenorth> just my C++ isn't very good :P 07:31:44 <Alberth> I somewhat expect something before the speed tbh 07:32:20 <Alberth> it's a bit weird to start with a number 07:32:58 <Alberth> maybe truncate the destination text instead? 07:33:18 <Alberth> Heading for New ..., 50mph 07:33:37 <andythenorth> oh we already use 'Max. Speed' also, in the vehicle info window :P 07:33:46 * andythenorth looking at strings for the other issue 07:34:00 <Alberth> and max reliability :) 07:41:47 * andythenorth trying to trigger an exclusive vehicle preview window 07:43:27 <Alberth> rig the code to only give previews to you :) 07:44:48 <andythenorth> currently running a game on ffwd :P 07:46:12 <andythenorth> oof I missed it 07:47:03 <andythenorth> got it 07:58:51 <andythenorth> oh 07:58:54 <andythenorth> git is broken :o 08:00:11 <peter1138> Herp derp. 08:00:22 <peter1138> Yeah, vehicle speed isn't really important? 08:00:47 <andythenorth> it is when debugging newgrfs :P 08:01:10 <andythenorth> so why is git broken now? 08:01:15 <andythenorth> I just wanted to commit 08:01:52 <andythenorth> Don't run this script from the command line. 08:01:53 <andythenorth> (if you want, you could supply GIT_DIR) 08:02:04 <andythenorth> some kind of hook to prevent commits? 08:03:07 *** nielsm has joined #openttd 08:06:41 <andythenorth> seems I have openttd_hooks in the expected location 08:06:49 <andythenorth> removing it solves the problem :P 08:07:52 *** tokai|noir has joined #openttd 08:07:52 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai|noir 08:14:47 *** tokai has quit IRC 08:17:39 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] andythenorth opened pull request #6997: Change: show 'Max. Power' for vehicles rather than 'Power' https://git.io/fhIMr 08:22:16 <andythenorth> who got 6996? :P 08:22:22 <andythenorth> I wanted that number :P 08:22:38 <andythenorth> oh it was TB 08:22:49 <Alberth> :) 08:22:58 <planetmaker> moin 08:23:51 <andythenorth> hi planetmaker 08:24:00 <nielsm> https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/issues/6032 -- is it really considered a bug when the savegame possibly has bad data in it? re. peter's comment on 2017-03-13 08:28:04 <andythenorth> I can't see it getting fixed 08:28:13 <andythenorth> it's not like we have 10s or 100s of these reports 08:28:16 <planetmaker> pro'ly difficult 08:28:22 <andythenorth> I would close it TBH 08:28:45 <planetmaker> edge case of backward bug-for-bug compatibility 08:29:22 <nielsm> https://0x0.st/sn_S.png 08:29:35 <nielsm> the tile in question renders right, it seems 08:29:50 <andythenorth> sunspots 08:29:59 <andythenorth> cosmic ray hit someone's RAM 08:30:04 <andythenorth> magnetic bees 08:30:18 <planetmaker> combination of both :) 08:31:05 <planetmaker> I think the best bug fix there would be to manually fix that savegame somehow and then close the bug 08:31:18 <planetmaker> the 2nd best is just closing the bug 08:33:59 <andythenorth> ooof 08:34:06 <andythenorth> I forgot about intro date randomisation 08:34:18 <andythenorth> so the high speed engine might be built, but no carriage for 17 years or so 08:34:21 <andythenorth> or vice versa 08:34:42 <planetmaker> it's only +-2 years? 08:35:10 <andythenorth> 511 days it seems 08:38:55 <peter1138> I probably have a patch for that. 08:39:05 <nielsm> okay trying to crash the involved train in that bug and see if it's the tile that's broken, or the train that's broken 08:39:08 <peter1138> (Sync intro dates) 08:41:52 <planetmaker> :) 08:47:23 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on issue #6032: Crash while loading savegame from 0.6 in 1.4 https://git.io/fhIDU 08:47:24 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh closed issue #6032: Crash while loading savegame from 0.6 in 1.4 https://git.io/fhIDT 08:50:47 <nielsm> hmm, maybe this could be a useful debugging tool, a "warp vehicle to depot" function? activate the tool from a depot window, click a vehicle in the world or another depot, and the vehicle is instanly moved 09:06:47 <andythenorth> where was that vehicle groups spec for purchase menu? :P 09:06:49 * andythenorth looks 09:09:18 <andythenorth> seems it wasn't 09:09:42 <andythenorth> proposal: vehicles gain a property 'group with [vehicle ID]' 09:10:08 <andythenorth> purchase menu then groups vehicles, under a disclosure widget (+/- thing) 09:10:18 <andythenorth> all vehicles in a group are introduced at same time 09:10:52 <andythenorth> use for liveries, wagons that match specific engine, variable properties (regearing) etc 09:12:17 <andythenorth> alternative proposal specific to intro dates: add a property to sync intro dates :P 09:12:46 <andythenorth> I really like the groups idea, but I think it will make a real headache out of sorting 09:12:56 <andythenorth> sorting on hidden things is always a disaster 09:15:42 *** Gabda has joined #openttd 09:25:04 <TrueBrain> sorry for stealing your number andythenorth .. I didn't know :'( 09:25:24 <andythenorth> sad times 09:25:30 <andythenorth> maybe I can get 9669 09:26:28 <TrueBrain> that .... takes a bit of time to get there :P 09:27:54 <andythenorth> patch faster :P 09:31:06 <TrueBrain> naaaahhhh 09:31:07 <TrueBrain> :D 09:32:32 <Gabda> hi everyone! 09:34:21 *** lugo has joined #openttd 09:34:23 <Gabda> can someone help me on how to make a pull request? 09:35:02 <nielsm> probably yes :) 09:35:08 <nielsm> Gabda how far are you? 09:36:28 <Gabda> can we "spam" this channel, or a PM would be better for this? 09:36:43 <nielsm> let's just keep it here 09:36:54 <nielsm> so others can help/learn from it too 09:37:24 <Gabda> ok, we can start from the point when I have a commit in my local repo 09:37:46 <Gabda> I am familiar with Git, but not with github, as I usually use other review system 09:38:08 <nielsm> do you have a fork of openttd on github? 09:38:31 <Gabda> not yet, should I make one? 09:38:34 <nielsm> yes 09:39:00 <nielsm> you add your fork as remote for your local repo, push your branch to your own fork (and set that as upstream for the branch) 09:39:13 <nielsm> then github's web interface should suggest you can create a PR from the fork 09:40:11 <TrueBrain> https://guides.github.com/activities/forking/ <- GitHub has awesome guides :) 09:40:33 <Gabda> ok, thank you 09:40:36 <TrueBrain> (feel free to ask questions btw; more meant to say that those guides spend a few more words on how to do stuff :) ) 09:41:29 <Gabda> the first guide I found was about PR without forking, and forking to a branch other than master 09:42:00 <Gabda> but as I saw the branches are not active in OpenTTD 09:42:03 <TrueBrain> yeah .. I noticed that too :D 09:42:28 <TrueBrain> and indeed; OpenTTD uses forks instead of branches 09:42:40 <TrueBrain> (like most projects on GitHub .. so that guide is a bit odd :D) 09:43:26 <nielsm> as a side note, most things in a PR can be changed after it has been created, and don't feel shy about force-pushing a massively rebased version of your branch to your own fork on github, it handles that correctly (by updating the PR) 09:44:04 <Gabda> that answers my next question :) 09:44:10 <andythenorth> oof 09:44:27 * andythenorth has become addicted to reset --hard HEAD~n 09:44:35 <andythenorth> because I can hide my mistakes 09:44:40 <andythenorth> if I do that at work, I'm dead :P 09:44:42 <TrueBrain> I dont want to know :P 09:44:43 <Gabda> if I can force push to my own branch at my fork, as it is not nice to amend published commits 09:45:19 <nielsm> github's even smart enough to provide diffs between force-pushed versions 09:45:28 <TrueBrain> nielsm: it does? Since when?! :D 09:45:34 <nielsm> although they don't always make sense 09:45:41 <nielsm> I first noticed it a month ago or so 09:45:48 <TrueBrain> that is awesome! 09:45:57 <nielsm> https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/6995 09:45:58 <TrueBrain> they was a thing that was lacking on GitHub 09:46:00 <nielsm> in that one for example 09:46:13 <TrueBrain> very cool 09:46:30 <TrueBrain> did notice it showed force-pushes now, but didnt spot that it was a link :) 09:46:39 <andythenorth> it's remarkable 09:46:40 <nielsm> (the change there was just commit message so the diff is empty) 09:47:01 <TrueBrain> gerrit solves that by making the commit message part of the diff :) 09:47:05 <TrueBrain> which is a nice way of doing that 09:47:36 <TrueBrain> okay ... I just noticed we are still running lighttpd on OpenTTD 09:47:39 <TrueBrain> that is ... old! 09:47:41 <TrueBrain> holy crap 09:48:11 <nielsm> lol 09:48:48 <Gabda> it is so much different than gerrit, I will need some time to get used to it 09:49:20 <TrueBrain> gerrit is a HUGE hack on git; so yeah .. the difference between gerrit and any other system is huge :D 09:49:45 <TrueBrain> no more 'refs/for' stuff :P 09:49:46 <Gabda> but at least now I know where can I get help, so thank you guys :) 10:01:33 <andythenorth> hmm 10:01:58 <andythenorth> planetmaker: so I'm using cb36 now to set power on specific wagons 10:02:21 <andythenorth> what's the condition? (1) Correct engine at the start of the consist? or (2) Correct engine anywhere in the consist? :P 10:02:41 <TrueBrain> bah; making sure the server listing is still served via the old method but not on www is more difficult than I would like 10:03:44 <nielsm> andythenorth, no way to walk the train to find the first engine in front of the wagon? 10:04:09 <andythenorth> not reliably 10:04:42 <andythenorth> I could use wagon_attach restrictions to reduce the problem 10:04:47 <andythenorth> I just don't like that approach :P 10:05:57 <andythenorth> only allowing the wagons to attach to specific engines avoids 'wrong engine' problem, but it's ugh 10:08:06 <nielsm> query for front engine imo 10:08:14 <andythenorth> makes the most sense 10:08:14 <TrueBrain> okay, new plan of attack: create two (temporary) new flask projects to serve servers.openttd.org and downloads.openttd.org .. ugh .. why is this so complex :D 10:08:26 <andythenorth> or just crudely use var 60 :P https://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/VariationalAction2/Vehicles#Count_Veh.ID_occurence_.2860.29 10:09:16 <nielsm> real world generally demands that all power or steering cars in a train use the same comms protocol as the front engine 10:09:32 <andythenorth> that would suggest wagon attach limits somewhere 10:09:43 <andythenorth> but what if player wants to do this? :P 10:09:44 <andythenorth> http://dieselimagegallery.com/gallery/65New/57307-3-N.jpg 10:10:27 <nielsm> the trainset might just not provide power in that situation? 10:10:48 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: the engine queries var 60 for any number of appropriate engines and any number of appropriate wagons, then divides (#wagons)/(#engines) to decide how much to increase his own power? 10:11:16 <andythenorth> good suggestion 10:11:46 *** Wacko1976 has joined #openttd 10:12:12 <Eddi|zuHause> the image above is fine, because the lone engine won't take part in additional-wagon-power, so it would be a don't-care in that formula 10:12:42 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Gabda87 opened pull request #6998: Feature #4115: default company colour setting https://git.io/fhIyD 10:13:37 <Gabda> it seems like the PR is in 10:13:45 <Gabda> thanks for the help 10:13:49 <TrueBrain> nice Gabda :) 10:14:00 <TrueBrain> hmm ... 'magic numbers' .. what is this 16, and where does it come from :D 10:14:13 <Gabda> yep, there is a magic number in it 10:14:21 <Eddi|zuHause> a fair dice roll, obviously? 10:14:49 <Eddi|zuHause> 1d20 10:15:25 <Gabda> I wanted to ask about it in the issue comments 10:15:52 <Gabda> as how likely is for the number of colours in the game to change 10:16:11 <TrueBrain> I would say ... between 0 and 1 :) 10:16:19 <Gabda> and if it is even possible to use that number in the settings ini files 10:16:38 * andythenorth waves at peter1138's group liveries patch :P 10:16:42 <andythenorth> as it recedes into history 10:17:08 <Eddi|zuHause> isn't there an enum for company colours, with a num_colours entry? 10:17:38 <LordAro> should the setting be saved? seems clientside only to me 10:18:04 <TrueBrain> havent touched the code in years, but we used to sync language entries with an enum (and mark the language entries as such) 10:18:21 <TrueBrain> that way who touches the enum knows there are language entries attached to it :) 10:18:49 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: it can join the 32bpp colours patch there? 10:19:34 <TrueBrain> but I leave this to people who actually know the code :D 10:20:23 <andythenorth> future civilisations will unearth peter1138's patch pile :P 10:20:31 <andythenorth> and write PhD theses about it 10:20:35 <andythenorth> or their AIs might 10:20:40 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #6998: Feature #4115: default company colour setting https://git.io/fhIyb 10:20:41 <Eddi|zuHause> i haven't looked at the code (or the PR) either, but these "default profile"-type settings need not be saved in the savegame, but somehow need to be transferred to the server on joining a game 10:20:43 <andythenorth> are AIs civilisation? 10:21:24 <TrueBrain> Azure Pipelines is a bit weird .. 10:21:31 <TrueBrain> it still hasnt triggered on this PR 10:21:34 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: "civilisation" is a term mainly used for "we are inside and they are outside" 10:21:44 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: it has no inherent meaning 10:22:01 <andythenorth> so it's a social construct? 10:22:06 <andythenorth> exists only in discourse? 10:22:14 * andythenorth can play post-modernism on demand 10:22:24 <TrueBrain> guess it is based on an old version 10:22:29 <andythenorth> ha ha 10:22:43 * andythenorth wonders if Sid Meier will make "Post-Modernism" 10:22:44 <LordAro> nielsm: last i checked "Feature" is a thing 10:22:50 <nielsm> it is? hmm 10:23:04 <TrueBrain> ah, yes, if you dont have azure-pipelines-ci.yml in your repo, it is just silently ignored 10:23:04 <TrueBrain> nasty 10:23:06 <nielsm> I don't remember it used then 10:23:41 <TrueBrain> not many new features :D 10:23:53 <Eddi|zuHause> TrueBrain: That wouldn't happen if ci-config would be something outside of the repo :p 10:23:57 <TrueBrain> https://wiki.openttd.org/Coding_style#Commit_message 10:24:35 <Eddi|zuHause> (but i suppose that problem only really exists in a transition period, once enough people have rebased, it'll disappear) 10:24:37 <TrueBrain> I like how even that page is confused about Add/Feature :D 10:24:43 *** Wolf01 has joined #openttd 10:24:52 <Wolf01> o/ 10:25:18 <Wolf01> Good, I reconfigured the entire LAN 10:25:31 <TrueBrain> you moved it to a known-bad state now? 10:25:35 <TrueBrain> so you are sure it doesnt work? :D 10:25:39 <Wolf01> Yes 10:25:47 <LordAro> generally "feature" if users are likely to notice it, right? 10:25:51 <andythenorth> "Add" is bollocks 10:26:14 <andythenorth> it's not even consistent with how I was told to do things with hg for coop devzone 10:26:21 <Wolf01> Put the private LAN behind my DDWRT, the modem could be anything and with any IP now 10:26:27 <andythenorth> I was told specifically to make "Add" commits to add new files 10:27:09 <Wolf01> The only downside is that now I have to physically move the eth cable to the modem to be able to change its config 10:27:32 <TrueBrain> I can connect to the internal IP of the modem despite not being on the same subnet :P 10:27:50 <Wolf01> Like... I forgot to set the DMZ towards DDWRT 10:28:00 <Eddi|zuHause> yeah, never had that kind of problem 10:28:06 *** Borg has joined #openttd 10:28:13 <Wolf01> Oh, nice, it works 10:28:29 <Wolf01> I can connect to the other subnet 10:29:16 <TrueBrain> because you now have your modem no longer in a bridge, I assume at least, the NAT is doing this for you :P 10:30:26 <Gabda> so Add would be better? 10:30:52 <TrueBrain> Gabda: I think we just agreed we didn't agree what it even means :D 10:30:59 <TrueBrain> Add .. Feature ... :D 10:31:14 <Wolf01> I had real problems trying to set the router wan mode on PPPoE, it couldn't get the IP, then I made it get the wan IP from DHCP 10:31:36 <Eddi|zuHause> i recently had a network where there were multiple modems, and each had the same 169.whatever default IP, it would randomly switch me between the two :p 10:31:54 <Wolf01> Ahah 10:32:14 <Wolf01> Also now I'm able to set static IPs from the router itself 10:32:29 <Wolf01> And leave the entire network on DHCP 10:32:43 <Gabda> TrueBrain: it is hard to follow the conversation :) 10:33:12 <TrueBrain> Gabda: it always id :D 10:33:16 <TrueBrain> s/id/is 10:33:57 <Eddi|zuHause> imho "feature" is better here 10:35:02 <Eddi|zuHause> anyway, the difference between "feature" and "add" should be how prominent it will be displayed in the changelog(.txt) 10:37:26 <Gabda> about the magic number: do you think there is a way to use the size of colour enum in the company_settings.ini? 10:37:55 <TrueBrain> I think the value in the ini is not a real issue, many magic values there. But the one in the if-statement is a bit unclear where it comes from 10:39:24 <Gabda> ok, then I will put random as first, as 0 is a better magic number :D 10:39:59 <TrueBrain> I dont know enough of the code (anymore) to give any sound advise on that :) 10:40:00 <Alberth> company_settings.ini is converted to code before compiling, so you should be able to use enum values 10:40:07 <Eddi|zuHause> Gabda: i think you can use constants in company_settings.ini 10:40:11 <Alberth> ie like all the string names 10:40:54 <Eddi|zuHause> for min/max/default 10:41:01 <Gabda> good point 10:44:02 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 10:44:08 <Eddi|zuHause> Gabda: if you put random at 0, you probably need a savegame conversion routine, to move existing savegames up by 1 10:44:18 <Eddi|zuHause> Gabda: better to add new entries at the end 10:44:21 <Eddi|zuHause> to avoid this 10:45:04 <Gabda> as none of the savegames contains this variable, it is not an issue yet 10:45:07 <Eddi|zuHause> anyway, on a more general scope, i think the real value in this setting is for people who often join multiplayer games, so you maybe should get that working 10:45:35 <Eddi|zuHause> Gabda: they don't contain this variable, but they contain company colours 10:46:13 <Eddi|zuHause> Gabda: you could have random as -1, though 10:46:47 <Gabda> -1 is a good idea 10:47:19 <nielsm> that's 255 if you use an unsigned by as storage :) 10:47:44 <nielsm> anyway, the default company color preference shouldn't need to be stored in savegames at all 10:47:50 <nielsm> since it's only relevant during game creation 10:48:21 <Gabda> I think the multiplayer part needs a separate commit, I want this part be nice first 10:48:22 <nielsm> really, it's a client preference and not a game setting 10:49:04 <Gabda> yes, I agree 10:50:44 <nielsm> move it to GUISettings 10:51:23 <andythenorth> oof 10:51:50 <andythenorth> bi-mode engines AND powered wagons? o_O 10:52:14 <andythenorth> the varaction 2 for those is *not* orthogonal :P 10:52:21 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: how is that a problem? 10:52:51 <andythenorth> it's not a problem, it's a design question 10:52:52 <Eddi|zuHause> ok, it might be if you don't think in tree-algorithms :p 10:53:10 <andythenorth> exactly, am I doing a tree 10:53:29 <andythenorth> or am I doing two separate conditional blocks, which cannot be combined? 10:53:54 <Gabda> nielsm: now I see that the GUISettings is for "other stuff" as well, so it is really a good place for it 10:54:40 <Eddi|zuHause> from the root (action3) i would do two layered branches (action2): the first one branches on railtype, and the second makes the calculation for additional power 10:54:56 <Eddi|zuHause> so you have a diesel calculation and an electric calculation action2 in parallel 10:55:39 <Eddi|zuHause> or alternatively, the first action2 pushes a value into temp register, and the second one reads that and multiplies it 10:55:41 <nielsm> well it might get funny if you want to handle the transition from electric to non-electric track such that cars on the elctric part provide more power 10:55:54 <nielsm> and not just based on whether the front engine is on electric track 10:56:06 <Eddi|zuHause> that second approach might make it reusable across multiple engines 10:56:23 <Eddi|zuHause> just change the base power in the temp register 10:57:26 <Eddi|zuHause> (just remember that in nfo/nml syntax, you reverse the order of action2) 10:57:50 *** Progman has joined #openttd 10:57:51 <Eddi|zuHause> (so what i call "first action2" is actually the last one in the code) 10:58:59 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Alberth289346 commented on issue #6966: GSTown.PerformTownAction crashes OpenTTD if called during world generation https://git.io/fhISz 10:59:51 <Gabda> I have to go now, thanks again for all the help. I will be back when the modifications are done :) 11:00:58 *** Gabda has quit IRC 11:03:42 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro commented on issue #6966: GSTown.PerformTownAction crashes OpenTTD if called during world generation https://git.io/fhISr 11:09:55 <andythenorth> oof 11:10:13 <andythenorth> given a time machine, I might travel back and split 'electrified' out from railtype :P 11:11:00 <nielsm> it's an accessory to the rail, not part of the track itself ;) 11:11:28 <andythenorth> it requires juggling skills :P 11:11:36 <andythenorth> sometimes ELRL vs RAIL is significant 11:11:42 <andythenorth> and sometimes they need to resolve to the same thing 11:11:50 <andythenorth> and that's before considering ELNG :P 11:12:02 <andythenorth> or possible compatible-types crap 11:12:20 <andythenorth> far too late to fix now :D 11:13:07 <nielsm> and then you maybe want to distinguish between catenary and third rail electrification 11:13:41 <Alberth> ugh :( 11:14:05 <andythenorth> people really shouldn't :P 11:42:30 <andythenorth> hmm 11:42:36 <andythenorth> how will varying power by railtype ever work? 11:42:38 <andythenorth> :| 11:42:44 <andythenorth> I don't know all the railtype labels 11:42:50 <andythenorth> so checking them is stupid, no? 11:43:03 <andythenorth> maybe I should disable Horse with railtype grfs 11:49:08 *** Thedarkb-T60 has joined #openttd 11:49:47 <andythenorth> yeah bi-mode engines fail with nutracks 11:50:10 <andythenorth> option 1) delete bi-mode 11:50:34 <andythenorth> option 2) keep a list of known railtype grfs, and disable Iron Horse if they're found 11:50:42 <andythenorth> option n) ? 11:50:53 <andythenorth> I fail to understand why we even have a railtype var, it's nonsense :P 11:53:49 <Alberth> use lowest hp for unknown track types? 11:54:20 <andythenorth> I was 11:54:32 <andythenorth> but that has a couple of unwanted results 11:54:47 <andythenorth> railtype grfs that define electrified rails, but my engine doesn't know about them 11:54:52 <nielsm> track type: standard/monorail below/monorail above/vactube; power type: none/AC catenary/DC catenary/DC 3rd rail/DC 4th rail/maglev 11:54:53 <andythenorth> because I can't know about every grf 11:55:16 <andythenorth> and also, for the Max. Power PR, I wanted to default to the maximum power, not min. :P 11:55:20 <nielsm> oh yeah and track gauge: standard/narrow/wide 11:55:39 <andythenorth> I figured out once why railtypes is such a total disaster 11:55:43 <andythenorth> but I always forget 11:56:03 <andythenorth> there is a rationale beyond 'we just got it wrong' 11:56:39 <Alberth> can't have a solution there I think, some one is going to argue electric rail type A != electric rail type B for seom weird RL reason 11:56:40 <nielsm> ttdpatch? 11:58:34 <nielsm> absolutely, within europe you have catenary with DC, 50 Hz AC, and 16.7 Hz AC 11:58:41 <nielsm> and various voltages of each 11:59:21 <Alberth> nice for modelers, disaster for transport tycoons 11:59:59 <andythenorth> I'm sure that the spec is carefully designed to allow railtype authors to take control from vehicle grf authors that they disagree with 12:00:06 <nielsm> you might be able to visually differentiate between AC and DC by the mast designs 12:00:14 <nielsm> but in TTD scale that's a few pixels at most 12:00:16 <andythenorth> I had an insight one day a few years ago 12:01:01 <Alberth> powered track is just powered track, only RL worries about voltages and stuff :) 12:01:10 <andythenorth> e.g. if you want to make two variants of RAIL 12:01:23 <andythenorth> you can't be relying on vehicle newgrfs to help you 12:01:31 <andythenorth> so you have to be able to control everything in the railtype grf 12:01:40 <andythenorth> otherwise you can't impose speed limits on trains 12:01:58 <andythenorth> I'm 99% certain it's designed to achieve letting railtype grf authors speed limit trains 12:02:06 <Alberth> be inocmpatible with all non-cooperating newgrfs :p 12:02:29 <andythenorth> we are where we are 12:02:45 <andythenorth> and where we might be next is 'deleting anything that checks var 4A (railtype) 12:03:04 <Alberth> speed limit is likely the only relevant differentiating notion between a pair of steel bars :p 12:03:16 <andythenorth> speed limits are the dumbest concept 12:03:21 <andythenorth> we already have speed limits on the vehicles 12:03:23 <Borg> guys 12:03:25 <Borg> great job btw 12:03:35 <Borg> OpenTTD 1.8.0 crashes WinXP hard.. very very hard.. blue screen 12:03:41 <Borg> it works correctly on Win2003 tho 12:04:15 * andythenorth might have a toys-out-of-pram moment 12:04:15 <Alberth> always nice if a user app can bring down the OS :p 12:04:23 <andythenorth> both the things I wanted to fix today are ~impossible :P 12:04:29 *** Gabda has joined #openttd 12:04:39 <Alberth> productive day andy :) 12:04:46 <andythenorth> I should go back to making industries 12:04:53 <andythenorth> which at least aren't broken 12:05:05 <andythenorth> 'oh but the station grf authors should be able to control cargos' 12:05:05 <Alberth> or simple train newgrfs :) 12:05:06 <andythenorth> GTFO 12:05:11 <andythenorth> :P 12:05:29 <andythenorth> ah simple grfs :) 12:05:53 <Alberth> he is, just be incompatible with what you don't know to be compatible 12:06:07 <Alberth> full control right there 12:07:27 <Alberth> oh, ship grfs are nice too of course :) 12:07:36 <Borg> can anyone tell me diffrence between win9x vs win32 OpenTTD build? 12:07:46 <Borg> size of .exe is significant smaller... 8MB vs 11MB 12:08:52 <nielsm> you mean 64 and 32 bit? 12:09:08 <Borg> no 12:09:29 <Borg> I mean win32 (build for WinXP SP3 and onward) vs win9x (build for Windows95/98/2000) 12:10:04 <nielsm> do they link all the same libraries? 12:10:16 <nielsm> there might be a difference in unicode support (maybe) 12:11:39 <Borg> dunno. whats the differences.. but WinXP SP2 crashes very hard.. 1.7.2 worked fine 12:11:59 <Borg> not a big deal.. of course, u can download win9x version.. but I wonder about differences 12:12:14 <Borg> and performance differences too? are they any? 12:12:16 <nielsm> maybe orudge knows something about it 12:12:39 <nielsm> but I doubt most people here really care about compatibility with 15 year old OS'es by now 12:13:24 <nielsm> are you talking about your own builds, or downloaded builds? 12:13:38 <Borg> downloaded builds 12:13:40 <nielsm> if it's your own builds, what compiler and environment are you using? what standard library are you targeting? 12:13:50 <nielsm> what dependency libraries are compiled in? 12:13:54 <Borg> it seems it might be a good time to build my own environment for OpenTTD building.. using mingw 12:16:23 <Eddi|zuHause> <Borg> dunno. whats the differences.. but WinXP SP2 crashes very hard.. 1.7.2 worked fine <-- i think there was a change where we only support WinXP SP3 with the regular windows build 12:17:20 <andythenorth> so do we have a list of all railtypes? 12:17:40 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: unlikely 12:18:03 <Borg> Eddi|zuHause: yeah.. its from 1.1.3 but so far... those win32 builds were working fine on WinXP SP2 too 12:18:12 <Eddi|zuHause> the "common railtype scheme" already has too many hypothetical railtypes to be unable to list them all 12:18:16 <andythenorth> oh god https://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/Standardized_Railtype_Scheme 12:18:25 <andythenorth> and then this https://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/RailtypeLabels 12:18:31 <andythenorth> this is bluntly moronic 12:18:37 <andythenorth> it's a tragedy of the commons 12:18:46 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: that's why we need a useful fallback mechanism 12:18:54 <Eddi|zuHause> so you can say "any ELRL-ish type" 12:18:58 <Eddi|zuHause> and be done with it 12:19:00 <andythenorth> I agree 12:19:04 <Eddi|zuHause> it will never work otherwise 12:19:08 <andythenorth> do you have any idea at all for how to do that? 12:19:18 <andythenorth> the current set up is prime idiocy 12:19:33 *** Progman has quit IRC 12:19:39 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: not in a way that would retain existing compatible/powered behaviour 12:19:49 <andythenorth> hmm 12:20:06 <andythenorth> my current inclination really is to just disable horse, and maintain a list of all railtype grfs on bananas 12:20:10 <andythenorth> seems a bit childish 12:21:06 * andythenorth explores 12:21:10 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: the alternative approach is to allow articulated vehicles of different railtypes, so you could have one part RAIL and another ELRL, and the ELRL part would only add its power depending on the existing powered mechanism 12:21:27 *** Wacko1976_ has joined #openttd 12:21:29 <Eddi|zuHause> avoiding all the callback mess 12:21:37 <andythenorth> it's tidy 12:21:40 <andythenorth> but would fail on other things 12:21:45 <andythenorth> articulated vehicles can't be flipped 12:21:52 <andythenorth> articulated vehicles can't be dual-headed 12:22:01 <andythenorth> and articulated vehicles put all the power on the lead unit 12:22:09 <Alberth> wouldn't you havce a callback on the rail and the elrail then? 12:22:20 <andythenorth> eddi is proposing doing it as a prop 12:22:22 <andythenorth> not cb 12:22:28 <andythenorth> AIUI 12:22:36 <Eddi|zuHause> Alberth: no, the game already handles that by itself 12:22:46 * andythenorth wonders if all installed railtypes can be inspected in a game 12:22:52 <Eddi|zuHause> Alberth: if you put a diesel and an electric engine in one train 12:22:53 <andythenorth> then disable Horse if unknown types are found 12:23:10 <Eddi|zuHause> Alberth: it'll have power of diesel on RAIL and power of diesel and electric on ELRL 12:23:14 <Alberth> andy, give up trying to be complete 12:23:30 <andythenorth> I am just testing whether the obvious conclusion can be avoided 12:23:39 <Alberth> Eddi|zuHause: zo somewhere you need to handle in the newgrf the amount of power right? 12:23:42 <andythenorth> the obvious conclusion is that the game is hostile to ideas like bi-mode 12:24:04 <andythenorth> which is at least easy to work with :) 12:24:32 <andythenorth> e.g. the multi-cargo articulated vehicles in Horse 1 are just impossible, so they are deleted from Horse 2, it's fine 12:24:52 <Alberth> andy, there are railtypes that you don't know. Use the lowest setting so it works, someone will complain, and you can adapt and release a new version 12:25:15 <andythenorth> that's possible yes 12:25:53 <andythenorth> I am in the rabbit hole of 'how was this supposed to work' 12:25:54 <Alberth> we should have versioning on features :p 12:26:24 *** Wacko1976 has quit IRC 12:26:26 <Eddi|zuHause> Alberth: how does that not explode in complexity hell? 12:26:49 <Alberth> likely by dropping old buggy crap :) 12:27:16 <Alberth> which is somewhat problematic under the current policies 12:27:25 <Eddi|zuHause> very 12:28:20 <Eddi|zuHause> i'm starting to hate commercial games because most of them go like "we have this minor update, but you need to start a new game" 12:28:56 <Alberth> if you have a choice when to update, that would be fine 12:29:42 <Eddi|zuHause> some games allow downgrading via steam's "beta" feature 12:30:08 <andythenorth> the thing that's bugging me with railtypes 12:30:24 <andythenorth> is that Eddi|zuHause doesn't have an alternative 'this is how it should have been done' option 12:30:30 <andythenorth> which is unusual 12:30:43 <Wolf01> <Eddi|zuHause> i'm starting to hate commercial games because most of them go like "we have this minor update, but you need to start a new game" <- I thought that was only on early access titles 12:31:01 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: i did have that, that's how the standardized scheme got developed 12:31:28 <Xaroth> wait, you found something that Eddi can't complain about? 12:31:40 <Xaroth> surely hell hasn't frozen over just yet? 12:31:47 <Eddi|zuHause> Xaroth: no, that's not what he said 12:31:52 <andythenorth> I was quite precise :P 12:32:01 <andythenorth> eddi often has an idea that leads to a solution 12:32:39 <andythenorth> but this specific problem seems immune to analysis 12:32:51 <Alberth> too complicated 12:32:57 <Eddi|zuHause> it's a bit complex 12:33:01 <andythenorth> and we're potentially replicating it for NRT, if the merge conflicts ever get resolved 12:33:40 <andythenorth> frosch proposed BGT to separate visual appearance from vehicle behaviour 12:33:41 <andythenorth> https://wiki.openttd.org/Frosch/ButGroundTypes 12:33:50 <andythenorth> but I'm not sure, it might just be even more complexity? 12:34:15 <andythenorth> there was an implication that BGT could be extended to rail, objects, station etc if it worked 12:34:24 <Eddi|zuHause> that is all nice, but it's only tangential to the current problem 12:34:44 <Eddi|zuHause> which is "how to solve dual power" 12:35:24 <Eddi|zuHause> "... without revamping everything, but just small sprinkles on top of the existing stuff" 12:39:42 *** Progman has joined #openttd 12:42:24 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Alberth289346 opened pull request #6999: Fix #6966: Only allow switching to a valid company. https://git.io/fhIHP 12:42:53 <andythenorth> option 1) deletee dual power 12:42:56 <andythenorth> -e 12:44:02 <Alberth> not much choice in options, is there 12:44:48 <andythenorth> so far no :D 12:44:53 <Eddi|zuHause> the other 289345 Alberth-s were already taken? 12:45:20 <Alberth> some were, didn't try all of them 12:46:43 <andythenorth> so what problem was I solving? 12:46:53 * andythenorth has lost track 12:47:23 <Alberth> tried several names, all taken, so I wanted to select a free name with a high probability. It worked :p 12:47:24 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: imho it's a valid option to skip dual power for now, most sets won't suffer from the lack of dual power vehicles 12:47:49 <andythenorth> it's quite late in the development to drop them :P 12:47:53 <andythenorth> usually I don't mind deleting 12:48:03 <andythenorth> but there's a lot of work in these, and I like the gameplay 12:48:33 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: in that case, i would just list as many known railtypes as possible, and wait for the complaints 12:48:46 <andythenorth> is there some kind of railtype table? 12:49:03 <Alberth> I think you listed them already? :p 12:49:03 <Eddi|zuHause> other than the two wiki pages? not that i know of 12:49:43 <andythenorth> I mean, is there any way to map railtypes to other railtypes? 12:49:52 <andythenorth> or do I just generate very big switches? 12:50:51 <Eddi|zuHause> just one very big switch that you reuse all over the place? 12:51:12 <Eddi|zuHause> nml still lacking procedure call mechanism i suppose 12:52:20 <andythenorth> what is this supposed to do? 12:52:21 <andythenorth> https://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/Action0/Global_Settings#Rail_type_translation_table_.2812.29 12:52:27 <Eddi|zuHause> last time i looked for a workaround for that the problem was you can't pass a switch id in var6x[] syntax 12:52:52 <Alberth> railtype is just a 32 bit number right? 12:53:17 <Alberth> so extract the right letter from the type 12:53:48 <Eddi|zuHause> Alberth: you don't have access to the label, you only get the index into the RTT 12:53:58 *** Wacko1976_ has quit IRC 12:54:24 <andythenorth> what is the RTT for? 12:54:33 <andythenorth> I cargo-culted the one in Horse 12:54:37 <andythenorth> NFI what it does 12:54:42 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: enumerating the known railtypes 12:54:51 <andythenorth> so does it remap labels? 12:54:55 <Alberth> yep 12:55:22 <andythenorth> so if I map ELRL to e.g. EMED 12:55:27 <andythenorth> I can ignore EMED? 12:55:30 <Alberth> so by carefully making a table, you can use the index to select a part? 12:55:37 <andythenorth> it will just appear as ELRL to my var 4A check? 12:55:52 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: if you define a vehicle, you tell it "this one is powered on railtype #1 and compatible on railtype #0" and the RTT says "railtype #0 is RAIL and #1 is ELRL" 12:55:53 <Alberth> no, it maps from label to a uniq index 12:56:06 <andythenorth> oof 12:56:18 <andythenorth> so I need to just keep a list of railtypes in python and write them all out? 12:56:41 <Eddi|zuHause> somewhat 12:56:42 <andythenorth> seems trivial 12:56:55 <andythenorth> can one railtype grf remove railtypes defined by another? 12:56:58 <andythenorth> remove / over-write? 12:57:03 <Alberth> you can't check the numeric index number? 12:57:14 <andythenorth> dunno :) 12:57:18 <andythenorth> it's all a mystery to me 12:57:33 <andythenorth> there's no proper domain 12:57:48 <andythenorth> I am trying to figure out if I can nerf Horse to just work with the railtypes it supplies 12:57:56 <Eddi|zuHause> Alberth: the problem with bi-mode is that you now need to fill the RTT with all known railtypes, which you didn't care about before 12:58:12 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: that is probably too limited 12:58:58 <andythenorth> I was getting away with it before, because only bi-mode engines checked railtype 12:59:01 <Alberth> you need to do that anyway if you ever want to interpret a random railtype 12:59:01 *** Wacko1976 has joined #openttd 12:59:11 <andythenorth> and they fell back to lowest value if railtype wasn't ELRL 12:59:26 <andythenorth> now I need to extend it so all engines are potentially checking railtype 12:59:36 <planetmaker> well... yes... RTT is a big "interesting" when it comes to supporting a hell lot of RTs 12:59:57 <Eddi|zuHause> Alberth: the main problem is, if your RTT only contains RAIL and ELRL, the callback variable will give you as results "RAIL, ELRL, unknown", and the "unknown" case is problematic, because you cannot distinguish "unknown, but ELRL is powered" and "unknown, but RAIL is powered" 12:59:59 <andythenorth> unrelated, I also need to swap the default power to 'max', not 'min', which also is a problem with the fallback if not ELRL 13:00:13 <Alberth> Eddi|zuHause: yep 13:00:32 <andythenorth> electrified should have been a flag :P 13:00:41 <Eddi|zuHause> so we nown need this clutch of a bloated RTT 13:00:51 <Alberth> coding meta-information in a label is a very bad idea 13:01:11 <andythenorth> we should have coded cargo class into the cargo labels 13:01:13 <andythenorth> :P 13:01:16 <andythenorth> would have gone well 13:01:32 <Alberth> clearly :) 13:01:46 <Eddi|zuHause> that's the "we should make it worse for someone else so we can feel better" approach 13:01:57 <Eddi|zuHause> which is all the rage nowadays 13:02:21 <andythenorth> anyway it's not changing now 13:02:27 <andythenorth> so really, I just need to accept the broken 13:02:37 <andythenorth> and pick my way through refactoring Horse 13:03:13 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: i would at least pick a few additional railtypes, so you have all the infrastructure in place to add some as the complaints come in 13:04:26 <andythenorth> "railtype grfs are not supported, except PIPE" 13:04:26 <Eddi|zuHause> it's pretty easy in nml, as you just add the labels at the end, don't need to give it an ID 13:04:30 <andythenorth> infrastructure in place :) 13:04:44 <andythenorth> PIPE, the only valid railtype grf :P 13:04:47 <planetmaker> RTT suggestion... https://kallithea.openttdcoop.org/ogfx-trains/files/21b821230b0e3f0802ad57e5039694023712104c/src/railtype_table.pnml 13:05:13 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: that's not enough 13:05:51 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: of the [] ones, only one is considered "active", the other ones will return "unknown" 13:06:11 <planetmaker> hm, yes 13:06:28 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: you really need to add all the single labels at the end 13:06:50 <andythenorth> Horse has this currently https://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/iron-horse/repository/entry/src/templates/railtype_table.pynml 13:06:53 <andythenorth> I don't know what it does 13:07:12 <andythenorth> I think it makes metro trains work on ELRL or something 13:07:34 <Eddi|zuHause> yes 13:07:44 <Eddi|zuHause> that is fine for defining vehicles 13:07:51 <Eddi|zuHause> but it is insufficient for bi-mode 13:08:36 <andythenorth> oof, I should avoid European narrow gauge https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electro-diesel_locomotive#Spain 13:08:43 <andythenorth> bi-mode, but default isn't RAIL :P 13:08:55 <Eddi|zuHause> yeah. 13:11:04 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: what could work is a 6x variant of var4A, that takes a RTT entry as parameter to use instead of the railtype that the vehicle is defined for 13:11:32 <andythenorth> so we map through types? 13:11:43 <andythenorth> and return true if in the list? 13:13:08 <Eddi|zuHause> var4A gives you "this vehicle [defined for ELRL] is currently powered", and this proposed 6x version would be "if this were vehicle defined for ELRL, it would be powered" 13:13:12 <nielsm> elsewhere on the internet, "a holiday themed toy train set look would be amazing" 13:13:23 <andythenorth> :P 13:14:00 <andythenorth> meanwhile https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/6997 13:16:16 <Eddi|zuHause> var 0x4A has this line: "return (HasPowerOnRail(Train::From(v)->railtype, rt) ? 0x100 : 0) | GetReverseRailTypeTranslation(rt, object->ro.grffile);" 13:16:30 <Eddi|zuHause> just replace v->railtype with the 6x-parameter 13:17:43 <Eddi|zuHause> (the parameter will be the RTT index, not the label, but nml should handle that intuitively correct) 13:19:37 *** Flygon has quit IRC 13:28:08 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Alberth289346 commented on issue #6605: Crash: loading savegame https://git.io/fhIQd 13:30:48 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Alberth289346 commented on issue #6966: GSTown.PerformTownAction crashes OpenTTD if called during world generation https://git.io/fhIQN 13:33:05 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: care to test https://paste.openttdcoop.org/po4jrn9sr ? 13:34:34 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: use it like "var[0x6a, 8, 0xFF, ELRL]" 13:34:49 *** andythenorth is now known as Guest1306 13:34:49 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 13:34:50 <andythenorth> oops I turned the microwave on :P 13:35:09 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: got my lines? 13:36:35 <andythenorth> https://paste.openttdcoop.org/po4jrn9sr 13:36:53 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: use it like "var[0x6a, 8, 0xFF, ELRL]" 13:36:58 <andythenorth> thx 13:37:21 <andythenorth> and then add some types to my RTT for ELRL? 13:37:32 <Eddi|zuHause> no need for that 13:38:15 <Eddi|zuHause> just use the var[] in the callback for bi-mode power 13:38:34 <Eddi|zuHause> no other changes 13:38:38 <andythenorth> oh you've magicked it I see 13:38:58 <Eddi|zuHause> then send the vehicle over some nutracks tracks or something 13:39:04 <Eddi|zuHause> to see what it's doing 13:40:03 <andythenorth> ok I'll test 13:40:07 <andythenorth> thx 13:40:48 <Eddi|zuHause> valid results are 0 (no) and 1 (yes) 13:41:29 *** Guest1306 has quit IRC 13:42:37 <Eddi|zuHause> also, concerning the microwave issue, is your device capable of 5GHz or only 2.4GHz? 13:43:14 *** Thedarkb-T60 has quit IRC 13:57:32 <andythenorth> I am uncertain :) 13:57:58 *** Thedarkb-T60 has joined #openttd 14:01:28 <Eddi|zuHause> it might be called "802.11b/g/n" or "802.11a+n" or something 14:01:39 <Eddi|zuHause> the letters being the important bit 14:02:36 <Eddi|zuHause> the point is, the microwave will probably only disturb one of the two bands 14:02:57 <Eddi|zuHause> 5GHz usually has higher bandwidth, but lower range 14:03:32 <andythenorth> oh the device is dual mode, and prefers 5GHz afaik 14:03:47 <andythenorth> but it's troubled by faraday cages 14:04:27 <Eddi|zuHause> you might want to force it to one of the two, then 14:05:07 <Eddi|zuHause> (or advanced: permanently open both connections with routing fallback) 14:05:44 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: so that patch works at least with RAIL / ELRL 14:05:50 <andythenorth> now I try some railtype grfs 14:07:03 <andythenorth> that's interesting 14:07:07 <andythenorth> it appears to work :) 14:07:58 <Eddi|zuHause> great 14:08:13 <Eddi|zuHause> now convince someone to include it :) 14:08:26 <andythenorth> needs a PR then ;) 14:09:45 <Eddi|zuHause> why did compiling change the *.ob? files? 14:09:54 <Wolf01> Ok, disabling the firewall on the modem worked for port forwarding 14:10:06 <andythenorth> because apparently we haven't set our local .gitignore :P 14:10:20 <andythenorth> I was told that the problem is my system, not our compile 14:10:40 <Eddi|zuHause> that sounds wrong 14:10:41 <andythenorth> until the first new contributor gets told off for pushing them in a PR by accident 14:11:01 <Eddi|zuHause> it's all translation changes 14:11:29 <andythenorth> it makes git add . very unwise :P 14:12:16 <Eddi|zuHause> so... this pr thing... how did i do that last time? 14:13:38 <andythenorth> fork, branch, push, github UI 14:15:41 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Eddi-z opened pull request #7000: Add: Var 6A, a clone of Var 4A for querying poweredness compared to a… https://git.io/fhI7h 14:16:01 <Eddi|zuHause> maybe that worked? 14:16:14 <Alberth> andy, maybe gitsu could be useful? 14:18:29 <Alberth> how to get the current number of towns? 14:21:37 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Eddi-z commented on pull request #7000: Add: Var 6A, a clone of Var 4A for querying poweredness compared to a… https://git.io/fhI5m 14:23:39 *** Wacko1976 has quit IRC 14:28:04 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] andythenorth commented on pull request #7000: Add: Var 6A, a clone of Var 4A for querying poweredness compared to a… https://git.io/fhI54 14:30:28 <andythenorth> I can't approve :P 14:30:33 <andythenorth> don't know what else I should check 14:37:45 <LordAro> Eddi|zuHause: grats on getting #7000 14:38:02 <LordAro> andythenorth: ...can you not? i can 14:38:07 <LordAro> i can't merge 14:50:47 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Alberth289346 commented on issue #6605: Crash: loading savegame https://git.io/fhI5d 14:52:28 <Alberth> next problem, how to find the spot where the town index becomes broken 14:52:47 *** Thedarkb-T60 has quit IRC 14:53:09 *** Thedarkb-T60 has joined #openttd 15:03:25 *** andythenorth is now known as Guest1309 15:03:25 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 15:06:29 <andythenorth> I'm going to approve my own PR 15:06:30 <andythenorth> https://github.com/OpenTTD/nml/pull/12 15:06:37 <andythenorth> life is too short for all this bureaucracy 15:07:03 *** Guest1309 has quit IRC 15:14:15 <andythenorth> hmm, without Eddi's patch I don't think I can build a power tree 15:14:36 <andythenorth> there has to be a default value, and that will cause vehicles to be powered on unknown types 15:14:43 <andythenorth> which is correct in some cases and wrong in others 15:15:05 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh approved pull request #6999: Fix #6966: Only allow switching to a valid company. https://git.io/fhIFT 15:15:47 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh merged pull request #6999: Fix #6966: Only allow switching to a valid company. https://git.io/fhIHP 15:15:51 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh closed issue #6966: GSTown.PerformTownAction crashes OpenTTD if called during world generation https://git.io/fpIIo 15:26:06 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: so var 6A would add a parameter to nml vehicle_is_powered var? 15:29:52 *** Progman has quit IRC 15:41:53 <andythenorth> what is vehicle_is_potentially_powered 15:42:44 <andythenorth> doesn't seem to correspond to var 4A 15:42:51 <andythenorth> https://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/VariationalAction2/Vehicles#Information_about_current_rail_type_for_trains_.284A.29 15:44:04 * andythenorth wonders how cb36 power interacts with railtype 'is powered' flag 15:44:40 <andythenorth> does an ELRL vehicle gain power on RAIL if I return > 0 in cb36? 15:46:36 <Eddi|zuHause> no 15:49:42 <andythenorth> I wonder if we need a diagram similar to https://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/VehicleRefitting 15:50:12 <andythenorth> it's very unclear what result is expected for any given combination of railtype grf, rtt, and vars that might be used in cb 36 15:50:19 <andythenorth> oh and vehicle track_type 15:50:26 *** Wormnest has joined #openttd 15:50:29 <nielsm> lol how does this ever work at all 15:50:30 <andythenorth> which, awesomely, is railtype 15:50:34 <nielsm> looking at those diagrams 15:50:46 <andythenorth> nielsm: well mostly one just doesn't worry about that crap 15:50:54 <andythenorth> I think frosch made it as satire 15:51:13 <andythenorth> the commentary is about as rude as frosch ever talks 15:51:16 <andythenorth> i.e. not 15:53:15 <planetmaker> he... indeed a supposedly simple thing as "vehicle refitting" is as complicated as that diagramme... could be much simpler :) 15:53:53 <andythenorth> given the 5 initial inputs, complexity is inevitable :P 15:54:37 <andythenorth> anyway I can't do this 'wagons add power' stuff with cb36 currently 15:54:44 <andythenorth> owing to failure to understand :P 15:56:34 <planetmaker> the complexity would already be much reduced, if it wouldn't differ by vehicle types :) 16:01:50 <andythenorth> :) 16:02:20 <andythenorth> even with the diagram I dont really understand :) 16:02:35 <andythenorth> I just set capacity with cb36, with specific handling of cargos like mail 16:03:02 <andythenorth> 'just' 16:04:35 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Gabda87 updated pull request #6998: Feature #4115: default company colour setting https://git.io/fhIyD 16:05:51 <Gabda> no more magic number :) 16:07:09 *** gelignite has joined #openttd 16:09:19 <Alberth> nice :) 16:11:33 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Gabda87 commented on pull request #6998: Feature #4115: default company colour setting https://git.io/fhINJ 16:24:35 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #6998: Feature #4115: default company colour setting https://git.io/fhINK 16:25:48 <planetmaker> nielsm, "Feature #xyz: bla bla" should actually be ok for our commit style 16:26:25 <planetmaker> whether Add: or Feature: is used is more a taste or style thing (Feature for big stuff, Add for small things) 16:28:03 <nielsm> I learned afterwards :) 16:28:42 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Gabda87 commented on pull request #6998: Feature #4115: default company colour setting https://git.io/fhINH 16:28:44 <planetmaker> :) 16:32:11 <Gabda> it is a good thing that there are Good first issue flags, it helps a lot get started 16:34:02 *** Progman has joined #openttd 16:43:41 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Gabda87 updated pull request #6998: Feature #4115: default company colour setting https://git.io/fhIyD 16:48:30 <andythenorth> oops 16:48:45 <andythenorth> what happens in python if functions call each other? :P 16:50:07 <andythenorth> def a(): assert(b); def b(): assert(a) 16:52:48 <Alberth> assert(b) is true, assert(b()) does a call :) 16:53:16 <Alberth> but infinite recursion until you hit the infinite recursion limit of 1000 calls 16:53:24 <andythenorth> yeah let's not :) 16:53:39 *** Flipp3rrr has joined #openttd 16:54:09 <Alberth> I've had longer stack traces :p 16:56:06 <Flipp3rrr> @logs 16:56:06 <DorpsGek> Flipp3rrr: https://webster.openttdcoop.org/index.php?channel=openttd 16:56:07 <Alberth> gabda: some looked more complicated then "good first issue" to me, but ymmv 16:56:19 <andythenorth> contributions are nice :) 16:56:36 <Alberth> always :) 16:58:36 *** Progman has quit IRC 16:58:37 <andythenorth> maybe we could approve some PRs :P 16:59:08 <Alberth> throw a die :) 16:59:41 <Alberth> eddi has a 1d20 which may come in handy 17:00:00 <andythenorth> we need 28 17:00:06 <Flipp3rrr> What is #openttd.notice ? 17:00:09 <andythenorth> but some are old, so we can ignore those 17:01:20 <Xaroth> closest I have is a D30 17:01:20 <andythenorth> I should try and fix NRT 17:01:23 <Xaroth> ... or a D100. 17:01:45 <andythenorth> NRT is a world of conflicts, and I can't fix them inside a rebase without making a mess 17:01:57 <Alberth> Flipp3rrr: no idea, probably safe to ignore 17:02:01 <andythenorth> can I do smaller incremental rebases? 17:02:25 <Alberth> git allows it if that's what you mean :) 17:02:33 <Flipp3rrr> Alberth, thanks! 17:02:43 <andythenorth> is it an acceptable tactic? 17:02:58 <andythenorth> there's some stuff I absolutely cannot resolve 17:03:09 <andythenorth> but I could maybe reduce the conflicts for someone else 17:03:16 <Alberth> should I have a go at it? 17:03:21 <andythenorth> it's pretty painful 17:03:24 <nielsm> it might work, but I think most of the conflicts arrive in just very few commits 17:03:31 <Alberth> yeah, conflicts always are 17:03:34 <andythenorth> it's not just choosing which side to take 17:04:43 <andythenorth> this is the most recent rebased fork https://github.com/PeterN/OpenTTD/tree/nrt-block-rebased 17:04:49 <andythenorth> there are about 9 conflicts with master 17:04:52 <Alberth> but basically, git checkout nrt; find a nice next rebase point between the current common ancestor and master, and git rebase <commit-hash> 17:04:53 <planetmaker> Flipp3rrr, it is - or probably used to be - an IRC channel which announces OpenTTD commits and issues 17:05:28 <andythenorth> there is a docs conflict where the last thinking was to simply throw away the NRT docs 17:05:39 <andythenorth> there is at least one openttd.grf sprite conflict 17:05:49 <andythenorth> which needs photoshop or gimp to resolve :P 17:05:54 <andythenorth> iirc 17:05:59 <Flipp3rrr> planetmaker, I looked at the logs but there's absolutely no activity... 17:06:27 <Alberth> how nice :p andy 17:06:42 <Alberth> andy, but tomorrow, ok? 17:06:49 <andythenorth> worth a try :) 17:08:19 *** gelignite has quit IRC 17:09:07 <planetmaker> Flipp3rrr, yeah, I recon as much. The bot activity there probably stopped with the move to git - and as such the change of both, bug tracker and CF 17:09:33 <Flipp3rrr> Ok, thanks! 17:09:36 *** Flipp3rrr has quit IRC 17:09:43 *** Thedarkb-T60 has quit IRC 17:10:21 <andythenorth> oof I should sleep more 17:10:42 <andythenorth> can't even figure out how to return count_veh_id(foo) * power_amount 17:10:50 <andythenorth> I really don't know much nml :P 17:11:43 <andythenorth> do I have to construct a range for each possible value? 17:12:30 <planetmaker> default: return expression 17:13:28 <andythenorth> let's see 17:13:51 * andythenorth often has to look up html and css too :P 17:14:12 <planetmaker> https://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/NML:Switch 17:14:37 <andythenorth> I read that :) 17:14:40 <planetmaker> the example there hopefully covers everything, so one doesn't need to look at anything else 17:14:54 <planetmaker> the rest is definitely tldr; ;) 17:14:58 <andythenorth> I just failed to read return (<expression>|<string>); 17:18:35 <andythenorth> "return [1200 + (count_veh_id(foo) * 1200)];" works 17:18:48 <andythenorth> now I just need to do things properly w.r.t the power 17:19:37 <planetmaker> I'm sure that power based on the number of vehicles is a good design :D 17:19:50 *** Thedarkb-T60 has joined #openttd 17:19:57 <andythenorth> for this specific type of very high speed train it's interesting 17:20:47 <andythenorth> ok that works now, and is much better than the previous 'drag engines to make the train' 17:20:53 <andythenorth> thanks all :) 17:21:18 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Alberth289346 commented on issue #6605: Crash: loading savegame https://git.io/fhIxg 17:28:47 <andythenorth> hmm, did "Coefficient of air drag" make it into nml? o_O 17:28:58 <andythenorth> so it did 17:29:43 * andythenorth wonders just how pointless it is 17:30:02 *** Samu has joined #openttd 17:31:40 <Alberth> I see no dots in that description 17:31:53 <planetmaker> I think there are few variables which didn't make it 17:31:55 <planetmaker> very few 17:32:16 <Alberth> hmm, wrong, 2 dots at the i-s 17:32:32 <Alberth> 3 even :p 17:32:47 <andythenorth> I suspect it's a very pointless prop :) 17:33:15 <Alberth> depends on how fast you travel :) 17:33:39 <andythenorth> in the case of the train I am testing, the default would be 8/140 17:33:44 <andythenorth> @calc 8/140 17:33:44 <DorpsGek> andythenorth: 0.0571428571429 17:34:02 <andythenorth> oh it's speed in km/h 17:34:13 <andythenorth> @calc 8/225 17:34:13 <DorpsGek> andythenorth: 0.0355555555556 17:34:20 <andythenorth> setting it to 0 makes no difference :) 17:34:24 <andythenorth> setting it to 1....does 17:35:40 <Alberth> useful for making a train grf for planets with only water at their surface 17:39:23 <Samu> hi 17:39:44 <Samu> is it intended that vehicles don't autorenew when breakdowns are disabled? 17:40:02 <Samu> I suppose it is, but it's just another headache for ais 17:41:20 <planetmaker> Samu, why would you need vehicles to autorenew when they cannot break down 17:42:15 <Samu> as a human, that's cool 17:42:56 <andythenorth> 'AI will take our jobs' 17:43:22 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Alberth289346 commented on issue #6605: Crash: loading savegame https://git.io/fhIp8 17:44:09 <Alberth> no idea how to proceed now 17:44:37 <andythenorth> in important news, this version of Horse will support this https://photos.smugmug.com/Digitalbackcatalogue/Up-North/i-Zj99gRk/0/7d226422/X2/RJW_2007_03_31_0433-X2.jpg 17:44:50 <andythenorth> almost exactly, except the fake engines are fake 17:45:33 <Alberth> I do hope you wash the pixels first, they are dirty at the picture 17:47:08 <andythenorth> also this https://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/9230/high_speed_pax_3.png 17:47:16 <andythenorth> although it's....unwise for gameplay :P 17:47:57 <Alberth> pax?! changing game play eh? 17:48:50 <Alberth> I played with maglev for a change, it's great, no worries about distance any more :) 17:53:03 <andythenorth> magnetic horse 17:53:07 <andythenorth> horselev 17:54:24 <Alberth> zoeeeefffffff-horse 17:55:38 <andythenorth> this works less well when wagons can add power :P 17:55:39 <andythenorth> https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/6997 17:55:47 <andythenorth> 'Max Power' is also then lies 17:56:54 <andythenorth> alternatives: showing a power range is meaningless if there's no upper bound 17:57:21 <andythenorth> option to hide 'power'? 17:57:37 <andythenorth> hmm, fails with sorting 17:59:10 <andythenorth> oof :) 17:59:14 <andythenorth> it's impossible :D 18:02:56 <Samu> god damn autorenew :( 18:03:09 <Samu> it switches vehicle indexes, it always breaks something in the ai 18:03:24 <Samu> t.t bah, i'm sad, seems i can't use autorenew 18:04:07 <peter1138> Well you get a new vehicle. 18:04:13 <Alberth> that's not bad, it also means you don't need to handle autorenew failures 18:04:31 <Samu> but i lose track of vehicles 18:04:51 * andythenorth has no idea what the problem is 18:04:52 <andythenorth> but 18:04:56 <andythenorth> wavey hands 18:04:58 <andythenorth> cattle not pets 18:05:18 <andythenorth> why would an AI ever be tracking individual vehicles? o_O 18:05:20 <Samu> it can get assigned to some other vehicles, the other day I had aircraft being sold in depots, while I was trying to sell road vehicles 18:06:14 <andythenorth> create hashes 18:06:23 <andythenorth> using other vehicle props? 18:06:43 <andythenorth> then check the hash before selling 18:06:44 <Alberth> can't you give a vehicle a name? 18:07:08 <andythenorth> don't they have numbers also? 18:07:34 <andythenorth> I'm sure I miss something, it just seems simple from this side of the fence :) 18:08:04 <Alberth> the number is what is being re-used I think :) 18:08:27 <andythenorth> autorenew changes the vehicle number? o_O 18:08:30 <andythenorth> that's a feature I missed 18:08:37 <Samu> it does 18:08:57 <andythenorth> sounds like a bug :) 18:09:07 * andythenorth has never read the AI spec :P 18:09:25 <Samu> i investigated autorenew code, what it does is build a new vehicle, this new vehicle has its own index 18:09:42 <Samu> then everything is copied over from the old vehicle to the new 18:09:51 <Samu> everything except the indexes 18:09:59 <Samu> that's what's breaking my lists on the ai 18:10:07 <Alberth> peter1138: I was digging in #6605, but don't know what to do next, any ideas? 18:10:09 <andythenorth> Samu: so vehicle_id is being changed? 18:10:25 <Samu> yes 18:10:27 <peter1138> What's #6605? Link? 18:10:37 <Alberth> https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/issues/6605 18:11:56 <andythenorth> Samu: if vehicle_id doesn't work then most of the vehicle NoAI spec is useless :) 18:12:02 <andythenorth> so you might want to give up :) 18:12:04 <andythenorth> but I doubt you will 18:12:25 <Samu> it does work when they remain the same 18:12:35 <Samu> which means, not using autorenew 18:12:36 <andythenorth> "Also note, that some IDs are static and never change, while others are allocated dynamically and might be reused for other objects once they are released. So be careful, which IDs you store for which purpose and whether they stay valid all the time." 18:12:38 <Samu> :( 18:13:16 <andythenorth> so give every vehicle a UUID as the name 18:13:25 <andythenorth> then iterate the vehicles, looking for that UUID 18:13:32 <andythenorth> then pull the vehicle ID off 18:13:58 *** gelignite has joined #openttd 18:14:13 <Samu> :( 18:14:17 <andythenorth> in systems with only one loop, it's usually safe to do UUIDs as simple numbers, starting at 0 and incrementing 18:15:04 <andythenorth> what's GetUnitNumber for? 18:15:15 <Alberth> you may want to check the name is actually copied (although that should be the case) 18:15:39 <andythenorth> can NoAI use vehicle groups? 18:15:42 <Samu> the name is copied over, probably 18:15:43 <Samu> yes 18:15:44 <andythenorth> just put vehicles in classes 18:15:47 <Samu> i'm trying to use groups 18:15:52 <andythenorth> 'just' 18:16:13 <andythenorth> this is more fun than solving my own problems :) 18:16:17 <andythenorth> armchair problem solving 18:16:19 <andythenorth> no skin in the game 18:16:28 <Alberth> :) 18:16:33 *** Flipp3rrr has joined #openttd 18:16:34 <peter1138> Alberth, I guess as you asked me, this is something I touched many years ago? 18:16:42 <andythenorth> a couple of years ago 18:16:43 <andythenorth> in FS 18:17:00 <Alberth> perhaps, but not that point where it ends 18:17:13 <Alberth> that was RB adding the m2 18:17:21 <andythenorth> oh nvm it's a different issue 18:17:59 *** Flipp3rrr has quit IRC 18:18:03 *** Flipp3rrr has joined #openttd 18:19:56 *** Wacko1976 has joined #openttd 18:21:01 *** Flipp3rrr has joined #openttd 18:21:17 <peter1138> Alberth, hmm, is d->xy wrong? 18:22:08 <peter1138> Is 37809 a depot? 18:22:18 <Alberth> I had a depot entry at that tile at some point 18:24:40 <peter1138> But it isn't now? 18:25:01 <Alberth> no idea, haven't seen the map 18:25:05 <peter1138> Hah 18:25:22 <andythenorth> Power: 950hp* 18:25:31 <andythenorth> where * is some extra text footnote 18:25:35 <andythenorth> or something :P 18:27:39 <Samu> trying to switch everything from AILists and {} and [] into AIGroups 18:28:06 <Samu> seems that groups are the future 18:28:09 <Samu> of my ai 18:28:34 <Alberth> at least it's unexplored territory :) 18:28:45 <andythenorth> \o/ 18:28:50 <andythenorth> cattle not pets 18:29:00 <andythenorth> manage things in classes, not individually 18:29:08 <andythenorth> GL when you need them to be in two groups at once :P 18:29:08 <Samu> performing savegame conversion 18:29:29 <Samu> oh, that actually happened 18:29:36 <andythenorth> oof, if I can't find a clever hack for this 'Power: xxx' problem, I have to delete all these vehicles :) 18:29:41 <andythenorth> that would be sad 18:30:07 <Alberth> "unknown" HP :) 18:30:14 <andythenorth> 'varies' 18:30:24 <andythenorth> and that gets kicked to the start or end of any sort list 18:30:29 <andythenorth> treat it like either infinite, or 0 18:30:47 <Samu> each route has 2 groups, one is the sent to depot group, which all routes use, the other is the route group 18:31:39 <Samu> i can still identify the vehicles being sent to depots as part of the same group 18:31:55 <andythenorth> who has more lines in this channel, me or Samu? o_O 18:32:20 <TrueBrain> lines that contribute to a conversation, or just "lines"? :P 18:32:43 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] andythenorth closed pull request #6997: Change: show 'Max. Power' for vehicles rather than 'Power' https://git.io/fhIMr 18:32:44 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] andythenorth commented on pull request #6997: Change: show 'Max. Power' for vehicles rather than 'Power' https://git.io/fhIjz 18:32:56 <andythenorth> TrueBrain: be interesting to see a plot of both 18:32:58 <Alberth> make #openttd.teddy-bear TB :) 18:33:15 <andythenorth> can I hack dorpsgek to be a bear? 18:33:21 <andythenorth> random encouraging responses 18:33:34 <Alberth> good work andy 18:33:34 <TrueBrain> be careful what you wish for :D 18:34:19 <andythenorth> ["have you googled that?", "are you sure this is necessary?", "did you check you're on the right branch?"] 18:34:22 <TrueBrain> for some reason, I am dreading setting up k8s for OpenTTD .. 18:34:23 <andythenorth> random.choice() 18:34:25 <TrueBrain> and I am not sure why .. 18:34:42 <andythenorth> TrueBrain: is there any reason you can't do it whilst drinking? 18:35:04 <TrueBrain> do I want to answer that question? :P 18:35:15 <andythenorth> well some people can't or don't drink :P 18:35:31 <andythenorth> but generally sysadmin seems to go better when drinking 18:35:51 <TrueBrain> until the next day; turns out they did burn the building after all 18:36:05 * andythenorth wonders if we'll see a frog soon 18:36:19 <TrueBrain> has been a while 18:36:22 <TrueBrain> xmas hit him hard, I guess 18:37:24 <andythenorth> very xmas 18:42:06 <Samu> when sending road vehicles to depots, sometimes it fails, especially if the vehicle is right in front of the depot :( 18:42:15 <Samu> or the depot is behind 18:42:36 <Samu> pathfinder doesn't reverse on loading trucks? 18:42:49 <Samu> yapf, that is 18:43:09 <Alberth> nope, with path signals it doesn't even change the path that has been reserved 18:43:23 *** andythenorth is now known as Guest1324 18:43:26 <Samu> i'm talking about road vehicles 18:43:33 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 18:43:38 <Alberth> oh, no idea 18:46:10 <Samu> yep, only happens with loading bays 18:46:18 <Samu> doesn't happen with drivethrough 18:46:28 *** Guest1324 has quit IRC 18:46:28 <Samu> peter1138: plz fix ! 18:46:37 <peter1138> What? 18:46:47 <Samu> pathfinder expert 18:47:28 <Samu> pathfinder doesn't reverse search on laoding bays 18:50:34 <Samu> let me test NPF 18:51:15 <Samu> on NPF it's working 18:51:20 <Samu> it's a YAPF only issue 18:52:36 <Samu> if it gets fixed, it will simplify code on my AI 18:52:58 <Samu> i won't have to insert an order to depot in the order list 18:53:10 <Samu> I really wanna avoid doing that 18:54:48 <Alberth> why insert? can't you just give the vehicle new orders? 18:58:21 <Samu> if the vehicle is unprofitable, i may want to send it to depot 18:58:53 <Samu> but if it can't find a depot, i'm forced to insert a go to depot order 18:58:56 <Samu> to stop in it 19:01:21 *** D-HUND has quit IRC 19:02:12 <andythenorth> why does peter get the benefit of a highlight? 19:02:13 <andythenorth> :P 19:02:31 <Samu> I remember he was familiar with yapf npf stuff 19:05:40 <Samu> peter1138: https://imgur.com/a/SCfZavE 19:05:41 <Samu> two images 19:05:50 <Samu> on NPF, it can find the depot 19:05:54 <Samu> on YAPF, it can' 19:05:55 <Samu> t 19:09:48 <Alberth> Samu: It's much more efficient to make a ticket for problems 19:11:32 <Samu> oh, right, good idea 19:14:37 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick opened issue #7001: YAPF can't find road depot, but NPF can https://git.io/fhLeQ 19:19:21 <andythenorth> child #1 says this train is no good http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/iron-horse/push/LATEST/docs/html/trains.html#shredder 19:19:28 <andythenorth> looks all wrong apparently 19:22:25 <andythenorth> RL edition :P https://www.peterboroughimages.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/6582-6577-1962.jpg 19:29:19 <Alberth> seems a bit more round in the horse 19:29:59 <Alberth> almost a tank wagon :p 19:31:05 <Alberth> what struck me was however the Hurly Burly, it looked like an upside down wagon at first sight :p 19:31:17 <Alberth> probably australian 19:31:22 <andythenorth> I like that one 19:31:28 <andythenorth> it's unusual 19:32:22 <Alberth> FlinderMouse has it a bit too, the black at the top misguides me :) 19:32:44 <andythenorth> I'm fine with some 'wtf' :) 19:33:13 <andythenorth> the RL thing doesn't make a good sprite without some weird touches https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a0/North_Eastern_Railway_electric_locomotive_No_13.jpg 19:35:09 <Alberth> about the shredder, from the photo, I expected more like the chinook, less high highlighted sides 19:37:25 <Alberth> No_13 looks much less massive at the top than the Hurly Burly 19:38:27 <andythenorth> oh the sides of the Shredder look like they bulge out? 19:38:36 <Alberth> yeah 19:38:45 <Alberth> especially the blue one 19:39:23 <andythenorth> I'll fix thanks 19:39:32 <Alberth> yw 19:53:02 <andythenorth> ha ha 19:53:14 <andythenorth> samu has found the bug I've been whining about for years :) https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/issues/7001 19:53:19 <andythenorth> YAPF can't find road depots 19:53:24 <andythenorth> which is why breakdowns have to be off 19:53:30 <andythenorth> which is why reliability is meaningless 19:53:33 <andythenorth> :D 19:58:55 *** Borg has quit IRC 20:00:06 *** acklen_ has joined #openttd 20:00:46 *** Wormnest_ has joined #openttd 20:00:51 *** Wolf03 has joined #openttd 20:02:52 <andythenorth> Wolf01 Wolf03 WolfN 20:02:59 <Wolf03> Wolf! 20:03:19 <Wolf03> Who is he? I didn't disconnect 20:03:22 *** wodencafe has joined #openttd 20:04:12 *** Wormnest has quit IRC 20:04:12 *** Wolf01 has quit IRC 20:04:12 *** acklen has quit IRC 20:04:12 *** cboyd_ has quit IRC 20:04:25 <Wolf03> Ah, netsplit 20:06:10 <Alberth> hai multi-wolf 20:06:26 *** Wolf03 is now known as Wolf01 20:06:44 <Wolf01> Back myself 20:06:49 <Alberth> and de-multiplexed again :) 20:11:16 <TrueBrain> brrr, demuxers .. they are the worst 20:11:32 <TrueBrain> do you know how difficult it is to implement a demuxer where entries have to synchronize? 20:11:41 <TrueBrain> it still haunts me in my sleep 20:11:43 <Wolf01> I know 20:12:21 <Wolf01> I had to design a setial to parallel to serial converter in high school 20:12:25 <Wolf01> *serial 20:12:47 <Samu> Your script made an error: attempt to call 'instance' 20:12:58 <Samu> sentToDepotList = sentToDepotList(1); 20:13:03 <Samu> it points me to this 20:13:35 <Samu> gonna try 20:13:37 <Samu> sentToDepotList = this.sentToDepotList(1); 20:14:45 <Samu> it solved it. I never understand when I have to use "this" and when I don't 20:21:01 <nielsm> presumably you need to when calling a method on an instance 20:22:01 <nielsm> this.sentToDepotList is a bound value including a reference to the object "this" refers to, while just sentToDepotList is unbound lacking the reference 20:25:27 *** Wormnest_ has quit IRC 20:26:25 <Alberth> Samu: you notice how the left side and the right side use the same name? 20:27:30 <Alberth> so while you may think the left side and right side use different things, they don't, as a name always points to the same thing no matter where you use it 20:28:42 <Alberth> the "this" reduces the scope from everything to just things inside the object, which means you now use two different things 21:20:45 <andythenorth> stupid amount of time tweaking this :P http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/iron-horse/push/LATEST/docs/html/trains.html#shredder 21:31:56 <Gabda> is it possible, that the IConsoleSetSetting function needs a whole game cycle to update the given value? 21:32:37 <Gabda> so that in the next program line if we ask for the value, we got the up-updated one? 21:34:38 <TrueBrain> okay, I think I have it working ... I can now bootstrap any random kubernetes cluster to run OpenTTD's infrastructure (well, the parts that are ported .. read: nothing yet) 21:34:43 <TrueBrain> which is pretty sweet :) 21:34:50 <TrueBrain> means people can even experiment with it at home :P 21:34:52 <TrueBrain> (read: me) 21:36:16 <andythenorth> yay 21:37:29 <TrueBrain> OpenTTD-IaC now automatically builds .. I really like Azure Pipelines 21:37:32 <TrueBrain> so much easier to work with 21:39:48 *** Wacko1976 has quit IRC 21:40:12 <Alberth> great 21:40:17 <Alberth> night 21:40:22 *** Gabda has quit IRC 21:40:33 *** Alberth has quit IRC 21:43:03 *** lugo has quit IRC 21:44:01 *** Thedarkb-T60 has quit IRC 21:44:27 *** Thedarkb-T60 has joined #openttd 21:57:39 *** Thedarkb-T60 has quit IRC 21:58:02 *** Thedarkb-T60 has joined #openttd 22:08:13 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 22:14:37 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] saxbophone commented on issue #6832: RetroAppX selling OpenTTD on Microsoft Store https://git.io/fhLIz 22:36:16 *** glx has joined #openttd 22:36:16 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v glx 23:14:21 *** Progman has joined #openttd 23:19:25 *** Wolf01 has quit IRC 23:33:39 *** Thedarkb-T60 has quit IRC 23:34:44 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 23:41:13 *** Thedarkb-T60 has joined #openttd 23:57:45 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] James103 commented on issue #7001: YAPF can't find road depot, but NPF can https://git.io/fhLqq