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00:05:41 *** tokai|noir has quit IRC 00:17:11 *** Flygon has joined #openttd 00:42:19 *** iSoSyS has joined #openttd 00:59:57 *** gelignite has quit IRC 01:14:46 <milek7> TrueBrain: bananas websocket is not yet running, right? 01:31:11 <milek7> https://milek7.pl/openttd-wasm-lite/ 02:01:59 *** rptr_ has joined #openttd 02:02:30 <milek7> it should have some ability to connect with 1.10.3 servers 02:21:40 <milek7> oh, and c++17 changes broke building on stretch 02:58:50 *** iSoSyS has quit IRC 03:24:14 *** heffer has quit IRC 03:24:29 *** heffer has joined #openttd 03:30:29 *** glx has quit IRC 03:41:48 *** D-HUND has joined #openttd 03:45:13 *** debdog has quit IRC 05:21:48 *** rptr_ has quit IRC 05:56:01 *** rptr_ has joined #openttd 05:58:20 *** ekangmonyet has joined #openttd 06:00:57 <ekangmonyet> Hi! Just came across openTTD and decided to try. The audio doesn't work with my pulseaudio, it seems like an old problem but I can't find any solution around. 06:01:50 <ekangmonyet> It keeps complaining: ALSA lib ....(snd_pcm_dmix_open) unable to open slave. Even though I tried specifying SDL_AUDIODRIVER=pulseaudio / having pulseaudio-alsa installed 06:32:57 *** gregdek has joined #openttd 07:12:47 *** DasPoseidon has joined #openttd 07:27:49 <gregdek> Does anyone have any information on running a NoAI tournament server? 07:29:22 *** Smedles has quit IRC 07:30:46 *** Smedles has joined #openttd 07:56:41 <LordAro> ekangmonyet: usually the issue is a missing midi player (fluidsynth/timidity), rather than any issue with pulseaudio/alsa 07:57:08 <LordAro> make sure a music/sound set is actually selected, too 07:57:17 <LordAro> won't play anything otherwise ;) 08:00:08 <ekangmonyet> i have both timidity and fluidsynth installed, I tried using the openmsx package from AUR too 08:01:00 <LordAro> make sure it's actually selected in game 08:01:07 <LordAro> (game options) 08:05:46 <LordAro> (you only need 1 of the midi players, fluidsynth is generally preferred these days) 08:07:09 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 08:08:19 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 08:10:59 <ekangmonyet> Ah I see, I totally missed that one out 08:11:07 <ekangmonyet> but the music is still not playing 08:11:25 <ekangmonyet> the player keeps going through the whole playlist 08:12:43 <ekangmonyet> i fed the midi file to mpv it worked fine 08:16:44 <ekangmonyet> ah I saw this on github issue, let me try debugging 08:17:50 <LordAro> going through the whole playlist implies missing midi support 08:18:27 <LordAro> presumably the package has actually been compiled with support for it 08:20:18 <TrueBrain> Freepats installed? Or what as the package with midi synths 08:23:29 <ekangmonyet> yep got it working after i specified the path to the soundfonts file 08:23:48 <ekangmonyet> thank you all =D 08:23:57 <ekangmonyet> im gonna explore this for a while heh 08:24:49 <LordAro> getting midi working is such a common problem, we could probably add more warning windows for these scenarios 08:26:08 <ekangmonyet> i am interested to help too 08:26:37 <ekangmonyet> maybe a health-check and warnings in STDERR at the minimum 08:30:00 <TrueBrain> If you can find a way to streamline the midi experience, yes please 08:30:42 <andythenorth> so when we replace the vehicle modding framework 08:30:48 <andythenorth> can we call it grftoo? 08:30:59 <andythenorth> or grfTooOh 08:32:51 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 08:33:44 <Xaroth> you could call it hsg, which is grf but all the letters moved by one. 08:35:44 <andythenorth> hsgtoo 08:36:03 <andythenorth> the main thing is the names 08:36:10 <ekangmonyet> TrueBrain: sure, i can give it a try 08:39:07 <andythenorth> I would like to see grf replaced before I die 08:39:32 <andythenorth> let's say I am about 40 ish, and most of my family live to 80-90 08:39:45 <andythenorth> so if I am lucky, we have about 30 years or so to do it 08:45:01 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 08:45:15 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 08:51:57 <TrueBrain> "let's say I am about 40 ish" ... lol :D 08:52:19 <TrueBrain> LordAro: did that review deal include a follow-up review, or what can I do for you to earn that? :D :D :D 08:52:55 <LordAro> TrueBrain: yeah, i'll have another look soon :p 08:53:07 <TrueBrain> :D 08:53:15 <TrueBrain> too many PRs require a preview before merging :P 08:56:31 <TrueBrain> I cannot believe CodeQL things "await res" is a noop 08:56:38 <TrueBrain> it cannot possibly be a noop, in no context 08:56:52 <TrueBrain> I hadn't seen a real false positive from it :) 08:58:42 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain merged pull request #8352: Change: set the default setting for autorenew to on for new games https://git.io/JIscu 09:08:30 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/website] TrueBrain created new tag: 1.4.6 https://git.io/JLmwg 09:11:42 <andythenorth> I mean, if I die before we replace grf 09:11:50 <andythenorth> I'm not going to care that much 09:12:00 <andythenorth> I can live with it 09:12:09 <TrueBrain> I am scared to death that you hunt us from the afterlife, I have to admit 09:12:19 <andythenorth> I could make a longevity bot 09:12:31 *** ekangmonyet has quit IRC 09:12:35 <andythenorth> hmm, maybe we just invented a form of immortality here 09:12:49 <andythenorth> if you can't live, but you can continue having the same effect on the world...? 09:13:06 <TrueBrain> that would be short of horrible 09:13:07 <TrueBrain> not you 09:13:12 <TrueBrain> but .. like .. so many people 09:13:34 <TrueBrain> to go into extremes: take a Hitler 09:13:35 <TrueBrain> :P 09:13:48 <Xaroth> This conversation is really going places 09:14:09 <TrueBrain> well, you joined, what did you expect? 09:14:29 <Xaroth> I joined many a moon ago, pretty sure this.. whatever it is.. cannot be attributed to me! :P 09:14:44 <andythenorth> grf 2 though 09:15:03 <andythenorth> maybe we could call it 'new' ...something 09:17:16 <TrueBrain> yes, let's start with the name :) And work from there :P 09:17:23 <LordAro> newandy 09:17:52 <andythenorth> names beginning with A are often more successful 09:19:14 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #8307: Feature: Show group name as part of the default vehicle name. https://git.io/JLmo0 09:19:29 <TrueBrain> I need opinions ^^ :) 09:19:52 <andythenorth> is that not merged yet? 09:20:06 <andythenorth> # is not universally understand as 'member of a list' 09:20:09 <andythenorth> around the world 09:20:16 <andythenorth> I'd just drop it, and merge 09:20:19 <andythenorth> it's a nice feature 09:20:32 <TrueBrain> for Buoys we already do # 09:20:42 <andythenorth> consistency is a hobgoblin :P 09:20:47 <TrueBrain> and yes, the game is inconsistent :D 09:20:52 <andythenorth> and stations we do # 09:20:57 <TrueBrain> Waypoints too 09:21:06 <TrueBrain> a lovely mixed bag :) 09:21:08 <TrueBrain> Depots ... 09:21:09 <TrueBrain> haha 09:21:20 <TrueBrain> so basically, on most places BUT vehicles that are ungrouped :D 09:21:32 <TrueBrain> default name of a group is "Group 0" 09:21:35 <TrueBrain> so doing "Group 0 0" 09:21:37 <TrueBrain> that is silly 09:21:51 <andythenorth> yes 09:22:00 <TrueBrain> "Group 0 #0" is slightly better, still silly :D 09:22:02 <andythenorth> ok nice chat, include the # everywhere, move on 09:22:14 <TrueBrain> you are not getting out of this THAT easy :P 09:22:27 <FLHerne> TrueBrain: Yes please, with hash 09:22:28 <andythenorth> I'm here all day 09:22:39 <TrueBrain> FLHerne: but should it also be Train #1, in that case? 09:22:46 <FLHerne> Possibly yes 09:22:49 <andythenorth> THAT WOULD BE A SEPARATE COMMIT 09:22:50 <andythenorth> or something 09:22:52 <FLHerne> ^ 09:22:56 <TrueBrain> for sure :) 09:23:00 <andythenorth> I dunno, I used to get yelled at for not separating concerns 09:23:04 <andythenorth> then those people left 09:23:26 <TrueBrain> let the past be the past ;) 09:23:57 <andythenorth> Ungrouped #2? 09:24:00 <TrueBrain> but is # really not universally seen as "part of a group"? 09:24:17 <TrueBrain> guess if you code too long .. you forget silly things in cultures :) 09:24:21 <andythenorth> I am not aware of any GH issues mentioning it 09:24:50 <TrueBrain> good point, even GH uses # :P 09:25:01 <andythenorth> I made the point, you proved we already have the precedent... 09:25:14 <andythenorth> All trains are in a group anyway 09:25:22 <andythenorth> Even if that group is 'Ungrouped' 09:25:32 <andythenorth> So 'Ungrouped #99' for names 09:26:13 <TrueBrain> only works if you ever made a single group 09:26:21 <TrueBrain> I wonder how many people use groups 09:26:24 <TrueBrain> we need telemetry :D 09:28:03 <andythenorth> I make groups 09:28:06 <andythenorth> telemetry count: 1 09:28:10 <TrueBrain> :D 09:28:16 <andythenorth> do a survey 09:29:20 <andythenorth> I just tried changing it in game to # for ungrouped vehicles 09:29:31 <andythenorth> 1) that name button is really really hard to find 09:29:34 <andythenorth> 2) # is fine 09:29:46 <TrueBrain> cheers 09:30:08 <TrueBrain> now for the patch itself ... it is a bit wonky :) 09:30:49 <andythenorth> there are some good studies in UI design about how things like ':' on field names don't really matter 09:31:01 <andythenorth> and even consistency doesn't really matter, beyond being consistent in each page 09:31:02 <FLHerne> TrueBrain: We could switch to № :p 09:31:26 <TrueBrain> FLHerne: don't tempt me :P 09:31:34 <andythenorth> Just emoji everything 09:31:37 <FLHerne> Is the '#' localisable currently, or just hardcoded? 09:31:38 <TrueBrain> I really do not like # in the OpenGFX font :P 09:31:42 <andythenorth> Or put the numbles in a bubble 09:31:45 <TrueBrain> localisable 09:31:55 <andythenorth> TrueBrain the obvious solution there is to replace that font :P 09:31:59 <FLHerne> Well, ok, definitely # everywhere then 09:32:10 <FLHerne> If someone's language doesn't do # they can use something else 09:32:23 <TrueBrain> FLHerne: good point, tnx :) Was looking for something like that :D 09:32:33 <FLHerne> (presumably "" is a valid something else) 09:32:45 <TrueBrain> :{GROUP} #{COMMA} 09:32:50 <TrueBrain> so .. lot of room :) 09:32:54 * andythenorth wonders what a numble is? 09:33:16 <andythenorth> I think a numble is one of those bubbles with a number in, as used on notification counts etc 09:34:01 <andythenorth> oh, no it's other things https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Numble 09:34:02 <FLHerne> I don't think using that for an ID number would be semantically right 09:34:30 <andythenorth> Urban Dictionary, surprisingly SFW today 09:34:46 <FLHerne> Those definitely imply that it's a count of things, particularly of things needing attention 09:35:57 <andythenorth> maybe I could get Bootstrap UI to accept a patch renaming the bubbles as numbles 09:36:01 <andythenorth> then I WIN 09:36:07 <andythenorth> is it 2021 yet? 09:38:20 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain updated pull request #8307: Feature: Show group name as part of the default vehicle name. https://git.io/JU4lR 09:38:24 <TrueBrain> so something like this then? 09:38:37 <TrueBrain> (don't worry, they are 2 commits) 09:39:27 <andythenorth> \o/ 09:39:33 <andythenorth> so Group #88 also? :P 09:39:34 <andythenorth> oof 09:39:46 <andythenorth> Group #88 #2 09:40:31 <FLHerne> Agh 09:40:39 <andythenorth> Group 88 #2 09:40:39 <FLHerne> That's the obvious conclusion, but looks terrible 09:40:44 <andythenorth> Group #88 - #2 09:41:17 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain updated pull request #8307: Feature: Show group name as part of the default vehicle name. https://git.io/JU4lR 09:41:19 <andythenorth> All UI design is picking the least crap of the crap options :) 09:41:31 <TrueBrain> lucky, creating groups shows the edit dialog 09:41:37 <TrueBrain> so it is less likely someone uses "Group 0" :) 09:42:20 <FLHerne> Creating trains should show the edit dialog 09:42:26 <andythenorth> Oof 09:42:28 <FLHerne> There's no way this would annoy everyone 09:42:42 <andythenorth> That 'rename group' dialog doesn't confuse me every time 09:42:49 <andythenorth> Anyway, merge it 09:42:50 <FLHerne> Oh, that 09:43:07 <FLHerne> So should groups have a #? Does anyone care? 09:43:12 <andythenorth> No they shouldn't 09:43:20 <andythenorth> because we can add them later if we're wrong now 09:43:29 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #8307: Feature: Show group name as part of the default vehicle name. https://git.io/JLmPj 09:43:38 <andythenorth> Take today's improvement, nothing else go worse 09:43:40 <andythenorth> got * 09:43:46 <andythenorth> Tomorrow is another day, etc 09:43:50 <andythenorth> I should make T-Shirts 09:43:57 <TrueBrain> so many .. you would be rich :) 09:43:59 <andythenorth> Typo-Shirts 09:44:13 <andythenorth> I meant so say something meaningful butI can't type 09:44:14 <TrueBrain> but indeed, "Group 0" is fine, as it is very unlikely you are going to keep that name 09:44:23 <TrueBrain> "Train #1" looks better, as you are unlikely to name it :) 09:44:29 <TrueBrain> btw .. why the FUCK do groups start with 0? 09:44:35 <andythenorth> because Engineers 09:44:36 <TrueBrain> that is idiotic :D 09:44:40 <TrueBrain> I should stop finding bugs :P 09:45:17 <andythenorth> Pls, don't look into groups 09:45:17 <FLHerne> I guess for consistency, it should be "Company #{COMMA}" too... 09:45:29 <TrueBrain> there are more of those honestly FLHerne 09:45:31 <andythenorth> I have group 8, and then the next group I make will be group 12 09:45:34 <FLHerne> Just merge it 09:45:36 <TrueBrain> if you feel up to it, a PR would be welcome :) 09:45:36 <andythenorth> this is super lolz 09:45:37 <andythenorth> merge it 09:45:46 <TrueBrain> CI is failing, oh-oh ... 09:45:58 <TrueBrain> regression, oops :D 09:46:06 <FLHerne> We need that guy who was trying to make a totally consistent style guide back 09:46:14 <FLHerne> I think I might have upset him :-( 09:46:33 <LordAro> FLHerne: was hardly only you 09:46:33 <TrueBrain> I asked him if he could rebase :) 09:46:35 * FLHerne seems to be good at that 09:46:41 <LordAro> we all disagreed with him quite a lot 09:46:52 <TrueBrain> was about to say .. that thread was ... opinionated :D 09:46:57 <FLHerne> tbf, it's an impossible task 09:47:03 <andythenorth> how could it be opinionated? 09:47:06 <TrueBrain> what he said: there has to be some trust 09:47:07 <andythenorth> I stayed out of it 09:47:15 <TrueBrain> we do the same with translators 09:47:27 <TrueBrain> but if I was around, I would also have joined the disagreements :P 09:47:31 <TrueBrain> so yeah .. easy to say for me :D 09:47:32 <FLHerne> andythenorth: Astonishingly, other people also have opinions ;-) 09:47:39 <LordAro> rigid style guidelines are great for programming languages 09:47:47 <LordAro> not so great for real life languages 09:47:55 <LordAro> especially English 09:47:56 <andythenorth> FLHerne what are these 'other people' you speak of? 09:48:24 * andythenorth narcissism lolz 09:49:18 <TrueBrain> I do not understand CMake yet .. sometimes it starts recompiling everything when I change certain files 09:49:23 <TrueBrain> not always what I intend :) 09:50:31 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain updated pull request #8307: Feature: Show group name as part of the default vehicle name. https://git.io/JU4lR 09:51:06 <TrueBrain> now .. can I approve my own work .. well, I can, as it is not my PR, but .. hmmmm :P 09:51:29 <TrueBrain> https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/8307/commits/d1e328bf345e40c6a4c8b02cfcfa41bb1abbd80e <- I mean, it is not that it can be wrong 09:51:32 <TrueBrain> :D 09:52:04 * andythenorth has controversial ideas 09:52:14 <andythenorth> oh dear 09:54:20 <TrueBrain> I really love that PR .. that would make me use Groups 09:54:33 <TrueBrain> (I absolute hate naming individual trains) 09:54:37 <andythenorth> As if group liveries weren't enough already? :P 09:54:51 <TrueBrain> group liveries? 09:55:16 <andythenorth> sometimes a 30s livestream would be the answer 09:55:27 <andythenorth> at work now, there's so much ad-hoc screensharing 09:55:32 <TrueBrain> or a preview! :P 09:55:35 <andythenorth> it really is much more fluid 09:55:52 <TrueBrain> it is a security nightmare I can tell you :) 09:55:53 <andythenorth> we should just make the game self-cast :P 09:56:01 <TrueBrain> we should do a livestream :) 09:56:24 <TrueBrain> pretty sure we can learn each other about a lot of things 09:56:38 <TrueBrain> "owh, you play this game like THAT?! " :D 09:56:51 <TrueBrain> "you doing WHAT NOW in your GRF?" :P 09:57:51 <andythenorth> I replied in the image-sharing channel 09:57:53 <TrueBrain> demos, that is what we need .. preview + prerecorded actions :) 09:58:06 <andythenorth> tutorial! 09:58:22 <TrueBrain> you can setup colour schemes per group? Cool 09:58:22 <andythenorth> the tank game can record battles, and replay 09:58:42 <TrueBrain> but what is "Group Livery" in this context? 09:58:47 <andythenorth> colour scheme 09:59:05 <andythenorth> words are interchangeable here 09:59:12 <TrueBrain> gotcha 09:59:13 <andythenorth> this is nothing to do with newgrf liveries :P 09:59:23 <andythenorth> which are very confusing 09:59:23 <TrueBrain> which is? 09:59:25 <andythenorth> no 09:59:27 <TrueBrain> okay, nevermind 09:59:30 <TrueBrain> I TAKE BACK THAT QUESTION 09:59:30 <andythenorth> we are being productive 09:59:47 <TrueBrain> I have to admit, I thought "liveries" had to do with cattle etc :P 09:59:57 <andythenorth> oh, like livery stable? 09:59:59 <andythenorth> or liver? 10:00:07 <TrueBrain> no clue why :) But wrong it is :P 10:00:23 <andythenorth> I want to call them colourways 10:00:26 <andythenorth> like shoes have 10:00:39 <TrueBrain> I am happy it is "colour schemes" in the title :) 10:00:49 <TrueBrain> liveries .. somehow I connected it to deliveries 10:00:53 <TrueBrain> well, learn something new :) 10:02:28 <TrueBrain> hmm .. still wondering about that self-approving 10:02:33 <TrueBrain> we used to do that all the time with subversion 10:02:45 <TrueBrain> user send in a patch, dev picked it up, cleaned it, and submitted it 10:03:07 <TrueBrain> I always had this issue at work too .. having someone else ALSO review it, is such a colossal waste of time 10:03:51 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain approved pull request #8307: Feature: Show group name as part of the default vehicle name. https://git.io/JLmy5 10:04:19 <andythenorth> lots of projects did fine with self-approval 10:04:28 <andythenorth> we're not writing kernel code here 10:04:56 <andythenorth> but it requires a lot of trust and judgement 10:06:08 <TrueBrain> andythenorth is not going to like me, but I kinda agree with https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/8268 :D 10:06:24 <TrueBrain> I could never use this window, and now I understand why :D 10:06:46 <andythenorth> no I re-read it at the weekend, I think it might be valid 10:06:55 <andythenorth> I took a break because the wall of text pissed me off 10:07:03 <andythenorth> and being pissed off is usually a bad sign 10:07:14 <andythenorth> it 'just' needs a 'sort by' on the key 10:07:27 <TrueBrain> more options is what the UI needs :D :D 10:07:33 <TrueBrain> it is funny, this is a big-data problem 10:07:37 <TrueBrain> and the world has been solving it 10:07:45 <TrueBrain> like, AWS allows you to click a line 10:07:52 <TrueBrain> and it hightlights throughout the interface what that line is 10:08:00 <TrueBrain> making it really easy to see what that line belongs to 10:08:18 <TrueBrain> (for openttd.org, we have 30+ services running .. spotting which one is using that large amount of CPU would otherwise be impossible) 10:08:28 <TrueBrain> but .. those kind of interactions might be a bit far-fetches for OpenTTD :D 10:08:28 <andythenorth> focus highlights 10:09:51 <TrueBrain> the patch only, oef 10:09:53 <TrueBrain> that is a lot of code 10:10:37 <andythenorth> trying to distill my objection 10:10:52 <andythenorth> the patch assumes that the correct way to play the game is to pick the highest paying cargo 10:11:07 <andythenorth> instead of finding the highest producing industry, then seeing if the cargos pay well 10:11:21 <andythenorth> this is pretty common in 'scratch my itch' PRs 10:11:25 <TrueBrain> different playstyles, yup 10:11:43 <TrueBrain> I have been watching playthroughs of OpenTTD 10:11:53 <TrueBrain> most people suggest using this graph to start with your first route 10:12:22 <andythenorth> yes 10:12:29 <TrueBrain> but absolutely, sort key is the proper short-term solution 10:12:43 <andythenorth> the feature requests for sorting the industry list by production suggest another cohort exists 10:13:03 <TrueBrain> which is normal for a game :) 10:13:12 <TrueBrain> the reason most games have "advanced" settings etc 10:16:57 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #8268: Change: Sort cargo payment rates legend in order of (initial) cost instead of alphabetically https://git.io/JLmHb 10:18:58 <TrueBrain> I think that sums it up nicely, not? :) 10:19:56 <andythenorth> +1 10:20:59 <andythenorth> I have never seen a UI get worse by adding filter, sort (and sometimes group) 10:21:15 <andythenorth> as long as they're designed and not just added 10:21:32 <TrueBrain> it also fits here, to have a dropdown with sort keys 10:21:35 <TrueBrain> it is just .. a lot of work to add 10:22:06 <andythenorth> a little work scares people? :P 10:22:27 <andythenorth> Iron Horse is like 5k commits 10:22:35 <andythenorth> and that's just trains 10:23:42 <andythenorth> oof I should do some work, making the internet 10:24:11 <TrueBrain> yes, you do that :) 10:24:16 <TrueBrain> I am going to pick another random PR :) 10:24:43 *** manu has joined #openttd 10:25:35 *** DasPoseidon has quit IRC 10:28:37 <TrueBrain> https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/7938 <- I so want to rename that setting to groundhog_year 10:30:45 <andythenorth> 'freeze time' button 10:30:53 <andythenorth> 'stop progression', 'start progression' 10:31:00 <andythenorth> then give GS the option to do it 10:31:15 <andythenorth> "No progression for you until you fulfill my arbitrary level-up goals" 10:32:14 <TrueBrain> haha, evil 10:32:22 <TrueBrain> and that would be a fine follow-up PR :) 10:33:57 * andythenorth looks in PRs 10:34:02 <FLHerne> TrueBrain: I don't think we need a sorting key 10:34:05 <FLHerne> Just merge it 10:34:33 <FLHerne> andythenorth: People choosing an industry don't really care about that graph at all, I think ;-) 10:34:37 <TrueBrain> FLHerne: the code is not in a state it can be accepted :) 10:35:03 <TrueBrain> and a sorting key would solve most of the reasons the code is not acceptable atm :) 10:35:11 <TrueBrain> it is a double-edged sword ;) 10:35:15 <FLHerne> andythenorth: If you care about industry chains and so on, it's not particularly useful 10:35:50 <andythenorth> there is a 3rd cohort 10:35:52 <andythenorth> newgrf authors 10:36:10 <FLHerne> Ok, but who cares about *those*? 10:36:12 <andythenorth> if we make it unnecessarily hard for content authors, we get less content 10:36:28 <andythenorth> and a sort key meets more needs 10:36:37 <FLHerne> How does sorting the list differently hurt content authors? 10:36:56 <andythenorth> because it's much harder to work with 10:37:04 <andythenorth> that's why it was alphabetised 10:37:20 <andythenorth> it wasn't an accident 10:37:25 <FLHerne> 'harder to work with'? 10:37:34 <TrueBrain> <FLHerne> Ok, but who cares about *those*? <- think you forgot a /s or a smiley there :) 10:37:49 <andythenorth> I imply smilies all the time in my head 10:37:55 <andythenorth> it makes for a better internet 10:37:58 <andythenorth> better people evn 10:38:01 <FLHerne> TrueBrain: No, I deliberately omitted one because sarcasm markers defeat the point 10:38:14 <TrueBrain> you would be surprised how poorly sarcasm travels over the internet :D 10:38:17 <andythenorth> I invented a thing once which would project emojis on a bubble above people's heads 10:38:20 <andythenorth> IRL 10:38:36 * andythenorth has automated the cargo payment rates anyway 10:38:45 <andythenorth> because it turns out that the gameplay effect is minimal 10:38:56 <andythenorth> and it's more important to prevent the chart lines overlapping visually 10:39:05 <FLHerne> TrueBrain: If we commit to not using /s, we can just imagine one for all statements we disagree with, and everything will be better 10:39:17 <_dp_> hm, I think I know what 8307 woundn't work well with.... that train racing thing I made 10:39:29 <_dp_> it sets both group name and vehicle name to a player name 10:39:31 <andythenorth> Train Whack Races! 10:39:41 <andythenorth> The Great Train Race! 10:39:44 <andythenorth> Train Off! 10:40:03 <_dp_> and both kinda make sense - group to make it easier to find in the list and vehicle to show in vehicle window: https://i.imgur.com/m2ryLeX.png 10:40:34 <FLHerne> _dp_: It doesn't show the group name if there's a custom vehicle name 10:40:41 <andythenorth> where is the PR to add high scores to Train Whack? 10:40:46 <_dp_> FLHerne, ah, ok, nvm then 10:40:50 <andythenorth> we can handle them in an edge lambda thing 10:40:50 <TrueBrain> :D 10:40:54 <TrueBrain> it is even in the commit message :P 10:40:55 <andythenorth> and store them on a queue 10:41:00 <andythenorth> we only need 30 days or so 10:41:05 <TrueBrain> but .. what is this game you made?! :D 10:42:00 <_dp_> TrueBrain, you mean racing thingie? you can check it on citymania test server ;) 10:42:06 <TrueBrain> owh boy .. 10:42:09 <TrueBrain> I might some day :P 10:42:23 <TrueBrain> I am afraid I won't see the light for a few days if I do :D 10:42:37 <_dp_> nah, it's pretty simple right now 10:43:00 <_dp_> needs a good map to make it more interesting but I'm too lazy to make it :p 10:43:55 <TrueBrain> https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/7938 <- so tempted to merge it, as "it just makes it a setting", but there is so much below the surface there :) 10:45:13 <TrueBrain> the code kinda assumes your game runs for 170 years before it loops back 10:45:30 <TrueBrain> after that time, this setting is not going to hurt anyone (as nothing changes, really) 10:45:36 <TrueBrain> before that time .. there are some nasty things that happen 10:46:11 <_dp_> where did 170 years come from? or do you mean if inflation is enabled? 10:46:21 <andythenorth> livestream! 10:46:25 <andythenorth> bleeding edge previews! 10:46:39 <TrueBrain> inflation runs for 170 years in OpenTTD 10:47:36 <_dp_> oh, so does groundhog make it infinite? 10:47:40 <TrueBrain> yup 10:48:11 <_dp_> fun 10:48:15 <TrueBrain> yeah .... no :) 10:48:24 <TrueBrain> most likely not what the intended goal is of a groundhog year :) 10:48:26 <_dp_> remove inflation? :p 10:48:41 <TrueBrain> yeah, but my issue is: do I know all those places that do stuff like this :) 10:48:43 <andythenorth> there are probably as many goals for groundhog year as players 10:48:56 <andythenorth> but the most common seems to be 'keep these trains around for longer' 10:49:02 <andythenorth> if we can do that, gravy 10:49:10 <TrueBrain> yeah, pretty sure nobody expects an infinite inflation ;) 10:49:24 * LordAro looks at the world 10:49:34 <TrueBrain> you live in a groundhog year? 10:49:37 * andythenorth looks at property prices 10:49:37 <TrueBrain> well, yeah, kinda 10:49:38 <TrueBrain> :P 10:49:40 <TrueBrain> fair point LordAro :D 10:49:42 <andythenorth> and the banking system 10:49:43 <_dp_> TrueBrain, just merge it and fix if someone complains? xD 10:49:51 <andythenorth> bleeding edge 10:49:52 <TrueBrain> yeah, that is too easy 10:50:09 <andythenorth> has anyone tested it in game yet? 10:50:26 <andythenorth> like, does it actually meet a goal, or is it just a candidate prototype 10:50:33 <_dp_> I kinda feel like nobody expects inflation period 10:50:41 <andythenorth> spanish inquisition 10:50:46 <TrueBrain> that is fair, but it is part of the game, so I have to deal with it :) 10:50:49 <TrueBrain> that or remove it :P 10:50:55 <andythenorth> 'Fix: groundhog year; delete inflation' 10:51:12 <TrueBrain> there are the default issues with a patch like this andythenorth , as I tested it, like the finance window overwriting the current year over and over 10:51:15 <_dp_> oh, I want it nice and hard ... why does it always bankrupt in 100 years reeee 10:51:45 <TrueBrain> but otherwise, it meets the goal, yes :) 10:52:13 <TrueBrain> engine aging is the other one frosch123 mentions 10:53:07 <andythenorth> so this would be a setting in settings? 10:53:13 <andythenorth> I should really just pull the patch eh 10:53:13 <TrueBrain> yup 10:53:23 <andythenorth> so a later PR could add a button next to in-game date? 10:53:37 <TrueBrain> a "loop this year button"? 10:53:41 <andythenorth> yes 10:53:44 <TrueBrain> sure, it is a game setting 10:53:45 <andythenorth> like looping a music playlist 10:53:50 <_dp_> no :p 10:53:53 <TrueBrain> well, no 10:53:54 <andythenorth> and that would disable on servers 10:53:58 <TrueBrain> it currently is a game_creation setting 10:54:31 <TrueBrain> owh, yes, that does work 10:54:33 <TrueBrain> name is silly 10:54:33 <TrueBrain> nevermind 10:55:34 <andythenorth> do we have a loop icon anywhere? 10:55:36 * andythenorth looks 10:56:09 <andythenorth> can't see one 10:56:21 <_dp_> groundhog icon :p 10:57:02 <andythenorth> Hog! 10:58:25 <andythenorth> http://bbcmicro.co.uk/game.php?id=1395 10:58:36 <andythenorth> the hog is the red blob at the bottom 10:58:49 <andythenorth> I learnt a lot about sprites from my 1980s childhood :P 11:03:54 *** rptr_ has quit IRC 11:04:44 *** virtualrandomnumber has joined #openttd 11:05:00 *** virtualrandomnumber has quit IRC 11:07:31 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #7938: Feature: Setting for a year that repeats forever https://git.io/JLmj2 11:07:50 <TrueBrain> owh, Eddit doesn't allow me pushing in his branches 11:08:19 <TrueBrain> Eddit? lol 11:10:59 <TrueBrain> @seen Eddi|zuHause 11:11:00 <DorpsGek> TrueBrain: Eddi|zuHause was last seen in #openttd 18 hours, 54 minutes, and 38 seconds ago: <Eddi|zuHause> that's a case of "this is technically a proper phrase, but it has a meaning you did not intend" 11:11:14 <TrueBrain> Eddi|zuHause: would you mind opening up your branch for me to push into? :D 11:11:30 <TrueBrain> (or rebase yourself, but I did the work already :P) 11:13:23 <TrueBrain> (it is the checkbox at the bottom of the list on the right) 11:17:13 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/bananas-server] LordAro approved pull request #39: Add: support client connections over WebSocket / HTTP https://git.io/JLYfI 11:20:27 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/bananas-server] TrueBrain merged pull request #39: Add: support client connections over WebSocket / HTTP https://git.io/JIzaz 11:20:41 <TrueBrain> now to wire this into the infra .. euhm ... I had to do something for that I believe .. 11:21:15 <TrueBrain> owh, yes, this was pointing to the NLB .. hmm 11:21:32 <TrueBrain> I need another DNS name :D 11:23:05 <TrueBrain> or I can wire the NLB to the ALB for 443 .. hmm 11:24:20 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro commented on pull request #8355: Add: support for emscripten (play-OpenTTD-in-the-browser) https://git.io/JLYJw 11:25:54 <TrueBrain> LordAro: I am going to tell you something about Emscripten you are going to be amazed about.. but first I will have lunch :) 11:27:22 <andythenorth> coffee is lunch, right? 11:44:27 *** manu has quit IRC 11:53:18 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #8355: Add: support for emscripten (play-OpenTTD-in-the-browser) https://git.io/JLYqF 11:58:36 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain updated pull request #8355: Add: support for emscripten (play-OpenTTD-in-the-browser) https://git.io/JIn4l 12:17:17 *** ekangmonyet has joined #openttd 12:21:23 <TrueBrain> I am going to provision a new version of the NLB, which is always a bit terrifying, as it can put the masterserver and contentservice offline :D 12:21:28 <TrueBrain> we will see how good I was in testing this :D 12:34:32 <TrueBrain> okay .. "it seems to work" :P 12:41:34 <TrueBrain> is that good enough? I like to think so :D 12:54:15 * andythenorth wonders what python will do with -0 12:54:44 <andythenorth> hmm 0 12:54:45 <andythenorth> nvm 13:05:42 <FLHerne> O? 13:05:55 <FLHerne> ISTR it didn't make much/any difference 13:15:07 <andythenorth> it makes a difference when I evaluate -ve numbers in the tech tree 13:15:15 <andythenorth> and I didn't leave room to insert a branch :P 13:15:50 <FLHerne> Oh, right 13:16:12 <FLHerne> I thought you meant the -O 'optimize' command-line flag 13:16:22 <FLHerne> -0 is just 0 in Python, yes 13:16:40 <andythenorth> and in maths 13:17:36 <_dp_> ~0 != 0 :p 13:18:07 <TrueBrain> 10 != 0 either! 13:19:08 <_dp_> btw it's kind of interesting how binary not (~) works in python considering numbers are technically infinite 13:20:02 <FLHerne> andythenorth: But not for floating-point values 13:20:37 <andythenorth> FLHerne :o 13:20:38 <andythenorth> wow 13:20:40 <FLHerne> I think some really old/weird architectures allowed signed integer zeros too 13:20:43 <andythenorth> I just tried that 13:21:29 <andythenorth> what's the sqrt of -0.0? o_O 13:21:31 <FLHerne> But 2's-complement is universal now and only has one possible 0 representation, so you won't get signed integer 0s in anything sane 13:21:46 *** glx has joined #openttd 13:21:46 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v glx 13:23:14 *** manu has joined #openttd 13:23:20 <manu> hi 13:23:25 <TrueBrain> hello 13:23:26 <FLHerne> -0.0, apparently 13:35:32 <TrueBrain> YES!!! It works :D 13:35:40 <TrueBrain> WebSocket for content-service is up and running on staging now :D 13:35:44 <TrueBrain> okay, that makes me really happy :) 13:35:59 <TrueBrain> took a bit of fiddling to route it in a correct way through the infra 13:36:01 <TrueBrain> but \o/ 13:36:31 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/bananas-server] TrueBrain created new tag: 1.1.0 https://git.io/JLY1S 13:36:32 <TrueBrain> time to get it on production too :D 13:45:43 <TrueBrain> okay ... with Emscripten, you can now download content from the content-service without issue :D :D :D Okay, that is just cool :) 13:48:35 <andythenorth> this is...big 13:48:53 <andythenorth> next, bananas for unreleased grfs :P 13:49:29 <TrueBrain> well, I can rebrand BaNaNaS if you like .. pretty sure most GRFs consider themself unreleased :P 13:49:31 <TrueBrain> hihi :) 13:51:04 <andythenorth> just do on the fly compilation from my github repo into the wasm client 13:51:07 <andythenorth> 'probably fine' 13:51:26 <TrueBrain> well, you can indeed use the preview to showcase GRFs too 13:51:29 <andythenorth> oh, a lambda edge that compiles the grf on the fly from a commit? o_O 13:51:41 <TrueBrain> you could load a game for example which showcases it 13:54:06 <TrueBrain> funny how google still hasn't updated the wiki properly :P 13:55:25 <milek7> https://milek7.pl/openttd-wasm-lite/ 13:55:28 <milek7> it works :) 13:55:35 <milek7> now, server discovery needs to be fixed :P 13:56:52 <TrueBrain> yeah ... so far I have: add SSL to the gameserver, add WebSocket server to the gameserver, extend master-server protocol to indicate if you also support WebSocket, add code for updater to validate WebSocket is reachable too, update master-server protocol discovery packet to request WebSocket only servers ... and THEN we can add it to the client :) 14:00:10 *** Samu has joined #openttd 14:07:05 <milek7> stretch needs to be removed from release builds, it was broken by c++17 changes 14:07:30 <TrueBrain> 16.04 does work? 14:09:04 <TrueBrain> my CDK is still deploying the infra ... taking forever ... 14:12:22 <milek7> it looks 16.04 have gcc5, so it won't work 14:12:47 <TrueBrain> I will do a full run in a bit, see what breaks :) 14:13:49 <TrueBrain> but first the deployment has to finish .... ugh .... 14:14:45 <milek7> seems my franken-1.10.3 build works :D 14:16:36 <TrueBrain> https://github.com/TrueBrain/OpenTTD/actions/runs/423369687 <- let's see what breaks :) 14:17:12 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/grfcodec] glx22 commented on pull request #9: Fix various issues with MinGW build https://git.io/JLYx8 14:17:38 <glx> and by looking at this PR I noticed missing stuff in cmake 14:17:44 <TrueBrain> :D 14:17:52 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 14:17:56 <glx> like fmemopen detection 14:18:26 <glx> need to start the VM to check 14:18:34 *** manu has quit IRC 14:25:46 <TrueBrain> Stretch and 16.04 fail, the rest succeed 14:25:52 <TrueBrain> so .. that is an easy fix :) 14:26:02 <LordAro> :( 14:26:21 <TrueBrain> sorry LordAro ... I tried to postpone it till after 1.11 14:26:23 <TrueBrain> but no dice 14:26:31 <TrueBrain> we can use backport gcc if you really like :) 14:26:31 <glx> are they still officially supported 14:27:10 <LordAro> stretch definitely has gcc6.3 14:27:14 <LordAro> is that too old? 14:27:18 <milek7> yes 14:27:22 <TrueBrain> https://github.com/TrueBrain/OpenTTD/runs/1557561450?check_suite_focus=true 14:27:25 <milek7> <optional> is missing 14:27:41 <TrueBrain> CMake flat-out refuses :) 14:27:47 <planetmaker> Ubuntu 16.04 LTS release Apr 2016 EOL Apr 2021 14:27:51 <TrueBrain> owh, stretch no longer has backport :( 14:27:57 <milek7> https://godbolt.org/z/1fasM7 14:29:39 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain updated pull request #8371: Add: [Actions] release workflow for both releases and nightlies https://git.io/JIiDr 14:30:17 <LordAro> hmm, clang 3.8 too 14:30:40 <TrueBrain> sorry LordAro :( 14:30:43 <LordAro> could build newer gcc? :p 14:30:50 <TrueBrain> we accept PRs :) :D 14:31:24 <TrueBrain> I like that even Debian no longer lists their stretch backports :P 14:31:33 <TrueBrain> guess they try to say something there :D 14:31:34 <LordAro> yes it does? 14:31:42 <LordAro> https://packages.debian.org/search?suite=stretch-backports&arch=amd64&searchon=names&keywords=clang 14:31:45 <LordAro> e.g. 14:31:54 <TrueBrain> https://packages.debian.org/stretch/gcc <- no backports in the top right 14:32:12 <LordAro> it's never done that there? 14:32:25 <TrueBrain> owh fuck yes :) 14:32:30 <TrueBrain> https://packages.debian.org/stretch/gcc-doc 14:32:33 <TrueBrain> just a random example :) 14:32:49 <LordAro> oh, probably because there aren't any gcc backports 14:32:53 <LordAro> because core package and all that 14:33:08 <TrueBrain> laaammmeeee 14:33:16 <LordAro> clang 5 might work :p 14:33:32 <TrueBrain> you are spending time on a 0.00001% of our userbase :D 14:33:44 <TrueBrain> pretty sure that 1 user survives fine compile it himself :D 14:34:11 <LordAro> eh, we'd need to use libc++ anyway 14:34:24 *** nielsm has joined #openttd 14:34:30 <TrueBrain> we can skip it with OpenTTD for stretch 14:34:36 <TrueBrain> we need a format for that ..... 14:34:43 <TrueBrain> snap? AppImage? flatpack? :D :P 14:34:44 <TrueBrain> trolls 14:34:46 <TrueBrain> sorry :) 14:34:50 <TrueBrain> skip = ship 14:35:57 <TrueBrain> this is something nielsm knows: is all of freepats needed to have music ingame? Or does it really only need 1 or 2 files? I ask, because AppImages and Snaps are HUGE just because of freepats :P 14:36:18 <TrueBrain> doesn't feel .. balanced :D 14:36:35 <LordAro> midi is the music equivalent of bmp, aiui 14:36:41 <LordAro> isn't very compressed 14:36:52 <TrueBrain> milek7: which reminds me, adding sound with emscripten is a bit easier now, as freepats doesn't have to be embedded; it can, like OpenGFX, just be downloaded once 14:37:36 <TrueBrain> sound/music, what-ever :P 14:38:27 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 14:39:00 <TrueBrain> LordAro: lol, it is as old, so yeah :P 14:43:51 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro approved pull request #8355: Add: support for emscripten (play-OpenTTD-in-the-browser) https://git.io/JLOTz 14:45:04 <TrueBrain> \o/ \o/ \o/ 14:45:24 <nielsm> TrueBrain, I'm sure you could do with a much simpler patchset for it 14:45:36 <nielsm> I can't remember which patches the music actually uses 14:46:06 <TrueBrain> so something to dive into :) Gotcha :) 14:46:12 <TrueBrain> I really know nothing about midi :P Except that it is old 14:46:43 <nielsm> but also, if you begin diving into all the various free music packs, you lose all ways of making assumptions 14:46:47 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain merged pull request #8355: Add: support for emscripten (play-OpenTTD-in-the-browser) https://git.io/JIn4l 14:47:04 <TrueBrain> and you never return? :D 14:47:08 <milek7> I used old freepats from 2006, 33MiB, but that had some samples missing 14:47:25 <TrueBrain> it is just annoying, that a game of 10MB is 40+ with sound :) 14:47:33 <nielsm> MIDI is just a sequence of instructions to a synthesizer, which notes to play and stop playing, and controllers to adjust, at which times, and how it sounds depends on the patchset and synth technology used 14:47:39 <TrueBrain> but I guess it comes back to: make them oggs :P 14:48:05 <TrueBrain> so one could argue no 2 people will have the same experience 14:48:09 <nielsm> like, the Roland SC-55 which the original TT soundtrack was composed for primarily has a pretty small sample bank actually 14:48:11 <TrueBrain> depending on their OS, driver, etc 14:48:38 <nielsm> yes a sampled music player would be simpler to handle 14:48:53 <nielsm> or just nothing and tell players to bring their own music 14:49:26 <TrueBrain> can our music play vorbis or what-ever? 14:49:44 <nielsm> not as-is 14:49:55 <nielsm> there is some framework for playing sampled music 14:50:03 <nielsm> but the music playing code still all assumed MIDI 14:50:14 <TrueBrain> k; so it needs work :) 14:50:16 <TrueBrain> tnx! 14:50:31 <LordAro> just put a music player on in the background 14:50:34 <LordAro> :p 14:50:43 <nielsm> just the audio mixer has a way to mix in a music stream along the sound effects, that's used for one of the midi drivers 14:50:51 <TrueBrain> a game should have background music, that is just what all games do :) 14:50:56 <nielsm> yeah I'd suggest just using an HTML5 <audio> player 14:51:07 <TrueBrain> haha, not a bad idea too :D 14:51:13 <TrueBrain> okay, so Sentry just gave me a bananas-server entry 14:51:20 <TrueBrain> which made me go like: owh boy, what did I fuck up with Websocket 14:51:25 <TrueBrain> but it is a totally different bug 14:51:31 <TrueBrain> like .. could have happened months ago too :D 14:51:31 <LordAro> \o/ 14:52:02 <milek7> that one had ogg music https://epicport.com/en/ttd 14:52:34 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 14:52:42 <TrueBrain> okay ..... now I am going to label something "preview" .... and I hope it works 14:52:44 <TrueBrain> it did with testing 14:52:50 <TrueBrain> but ... nothing like live-shit 14:53:14 <TrueBrain> fingers crossed 14:53:31 <TrueBrain> shit, it does need to be rebased before it works ofc :D Haha 14:54:24 <LordAro> clang5 & libc++ would work for c++17, incidentally 14:54:24 <milek7> oh, it does even have cloudsaves :P 14:54:32 <LordAro> but, bit of a pain to set up, i suppose 14:56:15 <Samu> I can't build OpenTTD with visual studio, missing openttd.manifest file? https://pastebin.com/raw/2Kjp8rwE 14:57:13 <glx> that's weird 14:57:42 <glx> nothing changed in this area 14:58:24 <TrueBrain> btw, tnx a bunch LordAro for review :) Really appreciated :D 14:58:57 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain updated pull request #7028: Feature: Option to group vehicle list by shared orders https://git.io/fhGxd 14:59:01 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain dismissed a review for pull request #7028: Feature: Option to group vehicle list by shared orders https://git.io/JU2XF 14:59:35 <TrueBrain> lets try it out on an already approved but not merged PR :D 15:00:36 <milek7> there is midi music available on bananas 15:00:50 <milek7> it would need to be somehow filtered out when using sampled music 15:01:19 <TrueBrain> I think that is the easier part to solve ... supporting sampled music is the hard part :D 15:02:25 <milek7> that's easy, it just need libsndfile (or something) and plug it into existing mixer 15:03:36 <TrueBrain> don't forget about support in a base-music, etc :) 15:03:50 <TrueBrain> but I think it wouldn't hurt if we move away from MIDI :D 15:11:05 <TrueBrain> okay, the screenshots of 7028 makes my OCD go BBBBBRRRRRRR 15:11:09 <TrueBrain> I wonder if that is fixed :D 15:12:26 <TrueBrain> preview works \o/ 15:12:29 <TrueBrain> owh, this is awesome :D 15:13:06 <andythenorth> those overlapping sprites 15:13:07 <andythenorth> oof 15:13:12 <andythenorth> probably a valid feature, but oof 15:14:06 <TrueBrain> no, the order of "sort" and "group" 15:14:09 <TrueBrain> sometimes it is sort/group 15:14:12 <TrueBrain> othertimes group/sort 15:14:19 <TrueBrain> how do you make shared orders again? :D 15:14:47 <TrueBrain> found it! 15:15:34 <andythenorth> just press ctrl for everything 15:15:36 <andythenorth> all the time 15:18:02 *** Flygon has quit IRC 15:22:07 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #7028: Feature: Option to group vehicle list by shared orders https://git.io/JLOc6 15:23:15 <TrueBrain> Docks have Sort -> Group, Hangers Group -> Sort 15:23:18 <TrueBrain> no, this is just wrong :P 15:24:59 <TrueBrain> can't believe LordAro didn't spot that :P :D <3 15:25:42 <LordAro> D: 15:26:09 <TrueBrain> windows do get crowded with such additions 15:26:17 <TrueBrain> I remember the game as simple windows with little stuff around it :P 15:26:25 <TrueBrain> now ... :D But most are useful, so it is okay :) 15:27:40 <andythenorth> it's survivable 15:27:44 <andythenorth> it's not pretty, but it works 15:30:43 <LordAro> TrueBrain: you haven't PR'd the nginx cache change yet 15:30:49 <LordAro> unless i missed it 15:31:29 <Samu> i found the openttd.manifest file, had to redownload it 15:31:47 <Samu> unsure how it got deleted on its own 15:32:18 <TrueBrain> LordAro: it was never a PR :) 15:32:29 <LordAro> aha 15:32:38 <TrueBrain> https://github.com/OpenTTD/aws-infra/commit/ec4cea79e9dca169cfe1a6a23be01b9b7bc80a38 15:35:55 <LordAro> :+1: 15:38:29 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 15:38:37 <TrueBrain> sorry LordAro , I should have PR'd it 15:38:42 <TrueBrain> but it was in the middle of other CDK stuff 15:38:49 <TrueBrain> which nobody wants to review :D Bad habbit :P 15:39:28 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain updated pull request #8234: Trees GUI improvements https://git.io/JfxU1 15:39:53 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #8234: Trees GUI improvements https://git.io/JLOR4 15:41:28 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/grfcodec] glx22 dismissed a review for pull request #10: Switch to CMake https://git.io/JLtWr 15:41:31 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/grfcodec] glx22 updated pull request #10: Switch to CMake https://git.io/JLLJ2 15:47:07 <Samu> I can build again! but the lzma, png and such are missing 15:47:24 <Samu> or were 15:48:48 <Samu> x64-Debug (Default) doesn't detect those libraries on its own 15:49:14 <LordAro> sounds like you need to start from scratch 15:50:04 <glx> they are provided by vcpkg, but you need to set VCPKG_TARGET_TRIPLET in cmake configuration 15:50:10 <Samu> I had to create a x64-Debug configuration and change the VCPKG_TARGET_TRIPLET from x64-windows to x64-windows-static 15:50:30 <glx> yes that's the solution 15:50:43 <glx> by default in doesn't use static version 15:50:44 <LordAro> is the wiki page up to date? :p 15:50:54 <LordAro> or whatever document is in docs/ 15:51:37 <glx> not detailled, but I think there's a mention about VCPKG_TARGET_TRIPLET 15:51:54 <TrueBrain> you expect us to maintain the docs too? Owh boy .. :D 15:52:59 <orudge> [15:03:52] <TrueBrain> but I think it wouldn't hurt if we move away from MIDI :D <-- yes, once we start getting multi-megabyte Ogg Opus music base sets on BaNaNaS, I'm sure you'll be delighted ;) 15:53:29 <orudge> I've still got my various ancient music patches 15:53:34 <orudge> Could be greatly simplified these days I suspect 15:54:02 <TrueBrain> we can always restrict upload-size :P 15:54:31 <orudge> We could just stream online radio stations in the background 15:54:37 <orudge> and run a TT Music 24/7 station 15:55:32 <Samu> I wanted to talk about this PR, now merged https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/8352 15:55:57 <Samu> seems now that AIs also start with the setting enabled 15:56:14 <Samu> that can be trouble for some AIs :( 15:56:43 <TrueBrain> orudge: haha, YES! 15:57:50 <Samu> will have to test it out 15:58:22 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/grfcodec] glx22 approved pull request #9: Fix various issues with MinGW build https://git.io/JLO25 16:00:22 <Samu> on the bright side, some of the AIs may benefit from it 16:00:38 <glx> Samu: yes it's on when AI start, as seen in regression test result update 16:00:38 <Samu> hmm i expect some won't, though 16:00:42 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain approved pull request #8234: Trees GUI improvements https://git.io/JLOay 16:01:00 <Samu> for example, I think Convoy will benefit from it 16:01:09 <glx> but AIs are supposed to manage their settings 16:01:18 <TrueBrain> ^^ :) 16:01:30 <TrueBrain> owh, I love the previews ... 16:01:33 <TrueBrain> it makes testing easier :D 16:02:04 <TrueBrain> sorry, drooling over my own feature, I know :) 16:02:17 <TrueBrain> but just look at it .. you can now see if you like #8324 yourself in 2 seconds :D 16:02:38 <andythenorth> when I have finished this html, I am going to look 16:02:41 <andythenorth> and be impressed 16:03:32 <LordAro> TrueBrain: hmm 16:03:38 <LordAro> with normal you can click & drag 16:03:42 <LordAro> with grove & forest you cannot 16:03:52 <TrueBrain> tooltip says you should be able :o 16:03:53 <TrueBrain> BUG 16:03:55 <LordAro> TrueBrain: but yes \o/ 16:05:31 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro commented on pull request #8234: Trees GUI improvements https://git.io/JLOwO 16:05:47 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain requested changes for pull request #8234: Trees GUI improvements https://git.io/JLOwZ 16:06:24 <glx> preview is a nice feature :) 16:06:44 *** Progman has joined #openttd 16:06:47 <LordAro> i'd suggest that the deployment message is unclear 16:06:51 <LordAro> but that's more of a GH ui issue 16:07:07 <TrueBrain> it is not perfect, no :) 16:07:13 <TrueBrain> but see how easily you found a bug :D 16:07:33 <LordAro> :D 16:07:52 <TrueBrain> I like that you point to a place that might be the issue .. let me see if that fixes it 16:11:12 <Samu> if I want a portable build of openttd.exe where do I look for 16:11:34 <Samu> D:\OpenTTD\OpenTTD GitHub\OpenTTD\out\build\x64-Release i find the .exe here but it's filled with temporary cmake stuff 16:11:58 <Samu> the old way was cleaner, it would go into a bin folder 16:12:16 <TrueBrain> LordAro: OnPlaceDrag is not called :( 16:12:43 <glx> Samu: you can install it 16:12:45 <LordAro> :/ 16:13:08 <glx> Samu: it will be in out/install/x64-Release 16:13:16 <TrueBrain> only seems to work in combination with VpStartPlacingSize :P 16:14:19 <Samu> ah! nice, thanks glx 16:14:31 <Samu> seems to be what I was looking for 16:17:06 <milek7> TrueBrain: it seems to redownload opengfx for each PR separately? 16:17:51 <TrueBrain> milek7: it does? Let me check .. 16:18:07 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] 2TallTyler commented on pull request #8234: Trees GUI improvements https://git.io/JLO63 16:18:18 <TrueBrain> it shouldn't; it is stored in preview.openttd.org 16:19:02 <milek7> ah, maybe not 16:19:49 <milek7> it just confused me 16:20:03 <TrueBrain> pfew .. was afraid it worked in some weird way :D 16:20:55 <milek7> progress could be displayed in MiB instead of bytes :P 16:20:56 <TrueBrain> LordAro: seems the best we can do that you can drag a line, as the tooltip suggests 16:21:04 <TrueBrain> milek7: PRs are welcome! :D 16:23:25 <LordAro> TrueBrain: i can't drag a line at all..? 16:23:30 <TrueBrain> no, I can enable that, ish 16:23:33 <TrueBrain> is what I meant, sorry :) 16:23:39 <LordAro> h, right 16:23:41 <LordAro> ah* 16:23:47 <TrueBrain> but .. this is above my paygrade currently 16:23:50 <TrueBrain> I can get the dragging to work 16:23:55 <TrueBrain> but I have no clue how to walk from start_tile to end_tile :D 16:26:10 <andythenorth> Samu ! 16:26:13 <andythenorth> is back :) 16:26:46 <Samu> yes, got some activity on my PRs 16:58:44 <FLHerne> andythenorth: How frequently do you make various kinds of small nml-source update? pixels-only vs property-values-only vs larger source changes? 16:58:54 <FLHerne> Offsets? 16:59:09 <supermop_Home> yay trees 16:59:21 <andythenorth> FLHerne 'often' 16:59:39 <andythenorth> pixels only is already covered by rendering to nfo 16:59:42 <andythenorth> and using grfcodec 17:00:33 <FLHerne> Well, relative to each other 17:00:37 <FLHerne> I forgot about that hack 17:03:34 <andythenorth> pixels and property changes will be about 80% of all compiles 17:04:10 <FLHerne> hm 17:04:31 * FLHerne plays with caching ideas 17:04:48 *** manu has joined #openttd 17:07:45 <supermop_Home> this looks possibly promising: https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/8342 17:08:43 <supermop_Home> I don't get how you make it mesh with other routes 17:09:58 <supermop_Home> i wonder for full load issue, if some kind of 'lay up' order would be nice 17:10:02 *** Cursarion has joined #openttd 17:10:46 *** gelignite has joined #openttd 17:11:08 <supermop_Home> like something to indicate to the autoseparation "try to wait approximately as long as the separation time" 17:11:47 <supermop_Home> seems easier than some kind of conditional order that explicitly says wait until the following train arrives and starts loading 17:12:07 <_dp_> it's suspiciously specific though, i wonder how well it works with anything more complex than just 1) full load 2) unload and leave empty 17:12:29 <supermop_Home> this is what i generally try to do with my timetables anyway 17:14:42 <supermop_Home> like, route takes 60 days and i need a train every 10 days... so i buy 7 trains and try to have the waiting time at the 'load' station, or end of line be 10 days 17:15:41 <supermop_Home> if i have the wiggle room ill make the layup time 12 days, so that the departing train waits til the following one has arrived and started loading 17:16:13 <supermop_Home> this helps with keeping the station junction clear and simple 17:17:17 <supermop_Home> _dp_ i don't know that it would work for complex cases, as it seems by design to simplify tedious but not overly complex situations 17:18:54 <supermop_Home> it also sounds like it already tries to maintain the separation by setting a certain station to wait longer at as a buffer? if you could just specify which station(s) you want that buffer to be, you might not need Full Load order in many cases 17:29:55 <andythenorth> I would say it's orthogonal to full load 17:30:08 <andythenorth> and should be disabled if full load orders are present 17:30:20 <andythenorth> we don't have enough modality in orders/timetables 17:30:24 <andythenorth> it's confusing 17:45:54 <_dp_> hm, found a funny bug... when you build tunnel it leaves miscolored pixel: https://i.imgur.com/aQfx1vy.png 17:46:08 <_dp_> sometimes it's red (from cost message I assume) 17:46:26 *** manu has quit IRC 17:49:19 *** manu has joined #openttd 17:51:32 <LordAro> ooh, nice 17:51:36 <LordAro> bug in ogfx, perhaps? 17:51:43 <LordAro> (transparent pixel, etc) 17:57:50 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] DorpsGek pushed 1 commits to master https://git.io/JL3fJ 17:57:51 <DorpsGek> - Update: Translations from eints (by translators) 17:58:28 *** arikover has joined #openttd 18:01:57 *** Wormnest has joined #openttd 18:13:42 *** Wolf01 has joined #openttd 18:13:49 <andythenorth> so I could learn to debug and profile newgrf vehicle sprite performance 18:13:51 <andythenorth> yeah right :) 18:13:58 <andythenorth> maybe jgr fixed that already though 18:14:19 <_dp_> I just realized you can have 2 stations with the same name in the same spot (sign)... 18:14:46 <_dp_> https://i.imgur.com/wjQ695D.png 18:15:51 <andythenorth> we could rewrite vehicle grf 18:15:51 *** manu has joined #openttd 18:16:03 <andythenorth> so that all possible sprite results are pre-computed 18:16:09 <andythenorth> but NFI if it's actually a thing 18:16:22 *** manu is now known as manu1511 18:18:17 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] twpol updated pull request #8342: Feature #8095: Allow automatically separating vehicles in shared orders https://git.io/JklGO 18:19:13 *** manu1511 has quit IRC 18:20:33 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] twpol commented on pull request #8342: Feature #8095: Allow automatically separating vehicles in shared orders https://git.io/JL3Ik 18:21:37 *** jottyfan has joined #openttd 18:22:21 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] andythenorth commented on pull request #8342: Feature #8095: Allow automatically separating vehicles in shared orders https://git.io/JL3Iw 18:23:48 *** frosch123 has joined #openttd 18:24:08 <glx> <LordAro> (transparent pixel, etc) <-- just checked quickly, it's indeed an opengfx bug 18:24:32 <LordAro> :) 18:25:01 <glx> and all climates/rail type seems affectd 18:25:33 <LordAro> ...how has it been unnoticed this long? 18:28:14 *** arikover` has joined #openttd 18:29:13 <_dp_> it's even funnier that I noticed it on 4k 18:33:03 *** arikover has quit IRC 18:34:56 *** y2kboy23 has quit IRC 18:35:08 *** y2kboy23 has joined #openttd 18:36:01 <andythenorth> shall we merge some things! :) 18:36:14 *** fjodor[m] has left #openttd 18:37:44 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #8342: Feature #8095: Allow automatically separating vehicles in shared orders https://git.io/JL3qB 18:41:23 <TrueBrain> PR mostly looks okay; needs some minor coding style fixes, but nothing too bad :) I like easy PRs :) 18:41:57 <_dp_> next level - allow pr preview to save games and link them to pr as test cases 18:43:27 <_dp_> also mouse moves very slow in browser :( 18:49:33 <TrueBrain> mouse moves fine here? 18:49:38 <TrueBrain> and yeah, demo+savegame, would be great :D 18:50:29 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain requested changes for pull request #8342: Feature #8095: Allow automatically separating vehicles in shared orders https://git.io/JL3Oq 18:52:52 *** Samu has quit IRC 18:55:27 *** iSoSyS has joined #openttd 19:05:58 <_dp_> is MAX_MAX_LOAN an acceptable constant name? 19:06:33 <TrueBrain> no 19:06:36 <TrueBrain> :D 19:06:40 <TrueBrain> well, honestly, it is :P 19:06:54 <TrueBrain> MAX_LOAN_LIMIT ? Dunno :) 19:07:11 *** rptr_ has joined #openttd 19:07:26 <_dp_> cool, now to figure out wtf should its value be xD 19:07:43 <TrueBrain> a setting! 19:08:11 <_dp_> well, it's literally the max for max_loan variable, naming it differently would be quite confusing imo 19:10:15 <_dp_> can we just remove inflation, it eats 32 bits for no good reason :p 19:12:29 <TrueBrain> freeform_edges ... how to enable that ... I cannot find it in the code, hilarious :D 19:12:44 <TrueBrain> ah, in TGP only 19:14:16 <_dp_> well, you can probably set it via console 19:15:49 <_dp_> "170 years of 4% inflation result in a inflation of about 822, so 10 bits are actually enough" 19:16:01 <_dp_> nice comment before constant of type uint64 :/ 19:17:32 <_dp_> 10 bits are enough so let's set max_inflation to 2**31 in 64 bit var 19:18:16 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain requested changes for pull request #7883: Fix: Ensure a minimum gap of water upon generating terrain with original generator https://git.io/JL3nu 19:18:38 <_dp_> makes for a wonderful minigame "guess when this shit's gonna overflow" :p 19:19:41 <TrueBrain> hmm, no, code suggests freeform_edges can be on with original generator too 19:19:51 <TrueBrain> grepping the code for that is really not useful :D 19:28:49 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #7883: Fix: Ensure a minimum gap of water upon generating terrain with original generator https://git.io/JL3CR 19:29:19 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] frosch123 opened pull request #8382: Fix: [NewGRF] Action 7/9 conditions 0x0B to 0x12 failed, if 'param' was 0x85 or 0x88. https://git.io/JL3Cz 19:30:35 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] frosch123 commented on pull request #7823: Fix c02ef3e456: Special case of Var 0x88 was not handled for NRT Acti… https://git.io/JL3CX 19:30:38 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] frosch123 closed pull request #7823: Fix c02ef3e456: Special case of Var 0x88 was not handled for NRT Acti… https://git.io/Je2vL 19:31:14 <frosch123> do they get a cookie for most hex numbers in a commit message? 19:31:27 <frosch123> *I 19:31:31 <TrueBrain> well, you won, so yeah ... :P 19:32:09 <frosch123> hmm, how do i test it 19:33:45 <frosch123> firs still disables with pbi loaded, so i guess it is fine 19:35:15 <andythenorth> lol 19:35:25 <andythenorth> hard-coded disable all FIRS? o_O 19:35:27 <andythenorth> improved game 19:35:36 * andythenorth proposes that PR 19:36:01 <frosch123> save ottd, disable more grfs? 19:38:57 <TrueBrain> ah, only x=0 and y=0 is VOID in freeform_edges 19:38:59 <TrueBrain> found it :D 19:41:10 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain dismissed a review for pull request #7883: Fix: Ensure a minimum gap of water upon generating terrain with original generator https://git.io/JU2DQ 19:41:13 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain updated pull request #7883: Fix: Ensure a minimum gap of water upon generating terrain with original generator https://git.io/JeNQn 19:41:58 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #7883: Fix: Ensure a minimum gap of water upon generating terrain with original generator https://git.io/JL3lr 19:42:39 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain approved pull request #7883: Fix: Ensure a minimum gap of water upon generating terrain with original generator https://git.io/JL3lP 19:43:18 *** Samu has joined #openttd 19:43:49 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] frosch123 commented on pull request #7883: Fix: Ensure a minimum gap of water upon generating terrain with original generator https://git.io/JL3lA 19:45:44 <frosch123> TrueBrain: you changes the < to a <=? 19:46:01 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #7883: Fix: Ensure a minimum gap of water upon generating terrain with original generator https://git.io/JL38Y 19:46:12 <Eddi|zuHause> https://pastebin.com/F3umj8j0 <-- is this obsolete files? 19:46:18 <TrueBrain> frosch123: I am pretty sure I am capable of doing so; but why you ask? :D 19:46:37 <TrueBrain> owh, sorry, I read: can you 19:46:38 <LordAro> Eddi|zuHause: yes 19:46:40 <TrueBrain> ugh, I should read :P 19:47:03 <frosch123> maybe i am tried, but that PR is really difficult to read for me :) 19:47:09 <Eddi|zuHause> is there git magic to delete all unversioned files? 19:47:13 <TrueBrain> it is also really difficult to read the code frosch123 :) 19:47:15 <LordAro> git clean -fxd 19:47:15 *** tokai|noir has joined #openttd 19:47:15 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai|noir 19:47:30 <TrueBrain> but, with freeform_edges on, x=0 and y=0 are VOID tiles 19:47:40 <TrueBrain> for generation, it looks best if there is a border of water around the map 19:47:44 <frosch123> i redact my comment 19:47:45 <TrueBrain> so x=1 and y=1 should be water 19:47:52 <TrueBrain> no, I want to know if I am right :D 19:47:57 <frosch123> i though the PR would change behavior with non-freeform 19:48:15 <TrueBrain> ah, no, it is only during generation of the original generator 19:48:34 <TrueBrain> but I stared at this for 30 minutes now ... it is hard :( 19:48:40 <TrueBrain> I will add comment now :D 19:49:06 <frosch123> non-freeform => north border must be flat water => corners "x/y <= 1" must be at height 0 19:49:19 <Eddi|zuHause> LordAro: so from reading the description, i don't want -x 19:49:26 <TrueBrain> frosch123: yes 19:49:31 <frosch123> freeform => north border must till be flat water for original mapgen => corners "x/y <= 2" must be at height 0 19:49:32 <frosch123> right? 19:49:35 <TrueBrain> yes 19:49:39 <frosch123> should be fine then 19:49:41 <TrueBrain> \o/ 19:49:43 <TrueBrain> thank you :) 19:49:51 <TrueBrain> math hard 19:50:07 <TrueBrain> about your patch .... "it looks fine"? 19:50:11 <TrueBrain> "I assume you tested it"? :D 19:50:42 <LordAro> Eddi|zuHause: potentially, i always only remember that 19:50:47 <LordAro> TrueBrain: there's a reason i never merged it :p 19:51:24 <TrueBrain> LordAro: I cannot blame you :) 19:53:58 <frosch123> TrueBrain: i added NOT_REACHED to unwanted codepaths, and could not trigger them 19:54:11 *** tokai has quit IRC 19:54:40 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain approved pull request #8382: Fix: [NewGRF] Action 7/9 conditions 0x0B to 0x12 failed, if 'param' was 0x85 or 0x88. https://git.io/JL34y 19:54:46 <TrueBrain> these really are YOLO approvals 19:54:50 <TrueBrain> :P 19:55:10 <TrueBrain> I find it extremely weird that 85 is nowhere in that code snippet 19:55:12 <frosch123> lol, no 19:55:15 <TrueBrain> but I am pretty sure I do not want to ask :D 19:55:31 <frosch123> TrueBrain: it's in a comment, i added 19:55:44 <TrueBrain> that is why I don't want to ask :P 19:56:42 <frosch123> assembly is not structured programming :) 19:58:04 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain dismissed a review for pull request #7883: Fix: for original terrain generator, keep a single gap of water at the borders https://git.io/JL3lP 19:58:07 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain updated pull request #7883: Fix: for original terrain generator, keep a single gap of water at the borders https://git.io/JeNQn 19:58:08 <TrueBrain> fine, some comments in the commit message about what is going on .. helps the next person :P 19:58:20 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain approved pull request #7883: Fix: for original terrain generator, keep a single gap of water at the borders https://git.io/JL3BB 19:58:35 <TrueBrain> right, 3 ready for merge ... can we get it down to 60 today .. 19:59:58 *** Speeder_ has joined #openttd 20:00:41 <TrueBrain> frosch123: about the groundhog year, how big of a boom is it if we do not fix stuff like inflation in this PR? 20:02:35 <Eddi|zuHause> easy fix: inflation stops 1 year before the groundhog year. if groundhog year is lowered, inflation is not apllied backwards 20:02:55 <TrueBrain> there are many places that require such attention before 2090 20:03:03 <TrueBrain> well, I wrote in the ticket what my concern was :D 20:03:12 <TrueBrain> I just fail to estimate the impact 20:03:40 <Eddi|zuHause> i don't think i looked at the PR, but my intuition tells me: do this properly 20:03:54 <frosch123> TrueBrain: i consider it important that a feature has an intention. that PR adds something without stating the intention, so everyone expects something else from it. 20:04:07 <frosch123> you can either have the discussion before merge, or after merge 20:04:38 <frosch123> the PR does exactly what it says, but in a completely unhelpful manner for any player 20:04:46 *** Speeder has quit IRC 20:05:10 <Eddi|zuHause> i think the intention was "daylength is too complicated, let's do this instead", which is probably a bad reason to do it 20:05:42 <frosch123> TrueBrain: so, i vote for reject. unlikely that the author supports the patch :) 20:07:05 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #7938: Feature: Setting for a year that repeats forever https://git.io/JL30J 20:07:08 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain closed pull request #7938: Feature: Setting for a year that repeats forever https://git.io/JvU08 20:07:16 <TrueBrain> if even the author says: bad reason, yeah .... I am not going to keep it open :) 20:07:18 <TrueBrain> cheers both :) 20:08:25 <TrueBrain> 64 bottles of beer on the wall, 64 bottle of beer ... 20:08:26 <TrueBrain> :) 20:09:06 <TrueBrain> I did like the simplicity of that solution btw :) Just too bad OpenTTD has many .... hardwired assumptions :P 20:09:12 <TrueBrain> hardcoded :) 20:11:26 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #7895: Savegame regression testing https://git.io/JL309 20:12:17 <andythenorth> so rejected that way to do it, right? 20:12:22 <andythenorth> not the idea in principle? 20:13:22 <TrueBrain> we know there will be fallout, so better talk it over before, not after, yes :) 20:13:52 <TrueBrain> which is code for: someone needs to play with it, report the findings, and we need to address them ;) 20:14:06 <TrueBrain> I also wonder how NewGRFs react on the year staying the same for this long, for example 20:14:24 <TrueBrain> and answers don't have to be perfect, but currently we had "euuuuhhhh" as only answer ;) 20:14:27 <andythenorth> it's very pleasing to see PRs go away 20:14:45 <andythenorth> failed candidates doesn't mean there'll never be a good way to do it 20:14:56 <TrueBrain> by no means it is a rejection of the idea 20:15:37 <TrueBrain> funny enough, personally I prefer groundhog-year over a concept like daylength; but that is just 1 opinion :) 20:15:44 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] stormcone updated pull request #8304: Feature: Show the cargoes the vehicles can carry in the list window. https://git.io/JU3kc 20:15:51 <glx> yeah the idea is nice, but there's so many edgecase to check 20:16:51 <Eddi|zuHause> TrueBrain: i'm not sure there's many newgrf troubles. maybe industry newgrfs who overuse storage for weird stuff 20:17:18 <Eddi|zuHause> but those would be the same newgrfs that would have trouble with daylength 20:17:21 <TrueBrain> well, if you are up for it, it could use some testing and reporting back what broke and what worked :) 20:17:27 <Eddi|zuHause> i.e. ECS 20:17:35 <TrueBrain> owh, absolutely; and it doesn't have to be a problem 20:17:37 <TrueBrain> but we need to be informed :) 20:18:08 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain merged pull request #8307: Feature: Show group name as part of the default vehicle name. https://git.io/JU4lR 20:18:49 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #8304: Feature: Show the cargoes the vehicles can carry in the list window. https://git.io/JL3E5 20:19:46 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #8304: Feature: Show the cargoes the vehicles can carry in the list window. https://git.io/JL3EA 20:20:43 <TrueBrain> do we need a cargos vs cargoes discussion? 20:21:35 <TrueBrain> we have 1 cargos vs 8 cargoes 20:21:49 <TrueBrain> sorry, 11 cargoes 20:22:36 <FLHerne> cargos 20:22:40 <frosch123> pretty sure rb made a cargo/cargoes spelling commit before 20:23:08 <frosch123> 3d88c74389ec978bb198415816364898963bb979 20:23:11 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #8304: Feature: Show the cargoes the vehicles can carry in the list window. https://git.io/JL3ug 20:23:30 <TrueBrain> a new one sneaked in 20:23:55 <frosch123> so the consensus was "cargoes". i prefer keeping it 20:24:21 <TrueBrain> if it is 11 vs 1, the 1 is losing :) 20:24:31 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain opened pull request #8383: Fix: a cargos sneaked in; should be cargoes for consistency https://git.io/JL3uy 20:24:31 <TrueBrain> and there he goes! 20:25:20 <andythenorth> I am +1 to the groundhog, and would test it 20:25:49 <andythenorth> my current play style involves setting the year back 5 years occasionally anyway 20:25:55 <andythenorth> poor-man's daylength 20:25:58 <TrueBrain> :D 20:26:33 <andythenorth> newgrfs that might break need to be updated 20:26:34 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] ldpl commented on pull request #7938: Feature: Setting for a year that repeats forever https://git.io/JL3zL 20:26:41 <andythenorth> newgrfs are for christmas, not for life 20:26:49 <frosch123> andythenorth: please make sure to also test with other settings, like "vehicles-never-expire=off" :) 20:27:15 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] frosch123 approved pull request #8383: Fix: a cargos sneaked in; should be cargoes for consistency https://git.io/JL3zs 20:27:44 <andythenorth> frosch123 there's another way to play? :P 20:28:25 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] stormcone updated pull request #8304: Feature: Show the cargoes the vehicles can carry in the list window. https://git.io/JU3kc 20:28:48 <frosch123> andythenorth: ok, i'll reword. when a pr needs testing, the answer is not "works for me", but "x works, y fails, z untested" 20:29:03 <TrueBrain> ^^ :) 20:29:18 <TrueBrain> I am tempted to open a Discussion for this on GitHub, just to see how that goes .. not sure that is the right form for it 20:30:56 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] stormcone commented on pull request #8304: Feature: Show the cargoes the vehicles can carry in the list window. https://git.io/JL3zp 20:31:09 <frosch123> try it :) but discussions looked pretty much the same as issues, and issues become unreadable with > 5 comments, so surprise me :p 20:31:27 <TrueBrain> yeah, I don't know either, if and how they work out 20:31:29 <TrueBrain> so sure, lets try it 20:31:48 <frosch123> want to tweet about it? 20:32:06 <frosch123> all experienced players i knew, no longer play :p 20:32:30 <andythenorth> at work we have a 'how to test' rule for PRs 20:32:46 <andythenorth> because we have separate QA roles 20:35:07 *** Samu has quit IRC 20:35:26 *** Samu has joined #openttd 20:35:29 <frosch123> what a weird feature... no idea what 8304 is useful for 20:35:37 <TrueBrain> https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/discussions/8384 20:35:46 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] stormcone commented on pull request #8304: Feature: Show the cargoes the vehicles can carry in the list window. https://git.io/JL3g1 20:36:07 <TrueBrain> frosch123: it is pretty much okay in my opinion. Clearly someone has an itch, and it seems more than one person :) 20:37:29 <frosch123> TrueBrain: well, it's again a PR that adds something without stating the intention. i guess for gui stuff it is okay to say "you can see the intention form the screenshot". but i can't :) 20:37:48 <andythenorth> I couldn't figure out how 8304 interacts with group name 20:37:56 <frosch123> my first thought was "what does this do with refit orders". the second was "maybe they do not know about vehicle cloning and forget to refit" 20:38:03 <andythenorth> it occupies the same screen space as group name 20:38:06 <andythenorth> I didn't pull it though 20:38:15 <TrueBrain> frosch123: I really do like the idea of starting to ask the intention more clear for each PR :) 20:38:19 <TrueBrain> instead of having assumption :) 20:38:23 <TrueBrain> we can fix that in the template etc :D 20:38:37 <TrueBrain> andythenorth: it is building a preview as we speak :) 20:38:43 <andythenorth> you see 20:38:44 <FLHerne> Yeah, I find it 8304 confusing too 20:38:46 <andythenorth> that is clever 20:38:49 *** rptr_ has quit IRC 20:39:22 <FLHerne> It doesn't really make sense in case of refitting 20:39:34 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain merged pull request #8383: Fix: a cargos sneaked in; should be cargoes for consistency https://git.io/JL3uy 20:39:45 <FLHerne> And in general, all cases I'd imagine using it for are better solved with groups 20:40:01 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #7938: Feature: Setting for a year that repeats forever https://git.io/JL320 20:40:08 <_dp_> TrueBrain, can you list all know issues in 8304 discussion? like inflation, company finances, what else? 20:40:29 <TrueBrain> 8384 you mean, and no. I rather have someone takes a real look at it, and report them :) 20:40:30 <FLHerne> _dp_: Do you mean 7938? 20:40:41 <frosch123> lol 20:40:46 * andythenorth wonders about per-window settings 20:40:47 <_dp_> i mean 8384 i guess xD 20:40:50 <frosch123> 3 random numbers :) 20:40:53 <andythenorth> it's a very Apple thing to do though :P 20:40:55 <_dp_> https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/discussions/8384 20:41:00 <TrueBrain> :D 20:42:00 <_dp_> I just feel it would be more useful to have a list in one place and update it as more are found 20:42:22 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] stormcone commented on pull request #8342: Feature #8095: Allow automatically separating vehicles in shared orders https://git.io/JL3ae 20:42:38 <TrueBrain> so please create that list :) 20:42:44 <TrueBrain> not sure why you are asking me to do all the work here :) 20:42:55 <FLHerne> TrueBrain: I don't understand why this isn't just on the PR 20:43:04 <TrueBrain> FLHerne: because we are trying something new 20:43:17 <FLHerne> something something intent :p 20:43:33 <TrueBrain> I wrote the intent pretty well in the discussion thread I hope 20:43:56 <_dp_> TrueBrain, well, you started it :p 20:44:14 <TrueBrain> so ........ you want me to review PRs? or spend time on doing stuff other people can do too? :) 20:44:17 * andythenorth does it 20:44:25 <TrueBrain> spread the workload! :D 20:44:42 <FLHerne> TrueBrain: The intent of what it's meant to be a discussion of, but not why you created a separate discussion thread from the PR one 20:45:04 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] stormcone commented on pull request #8307: Feature: Show group name as part of the default vehicle name. https://git.io/JL3aK 20:45:07 <FLHerne> It makes it pretty hard to find 20:45:24 <_dp_> let's open a discussion to discuss whether we should use discussions or just write in prs! :p 20:45:29 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #8342: Feature #8095: Allow automatically separating vehicles in shared orders https://git.io/JL3aD 20:45:33 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] frosch123 commented on pull request #8304: Feature: Show the cargoes the vehicles can carry in the list window. https://git.io/JL3ay 20:45:38 <FLHerne> (maybe it would be less hard to find if we used discussions more, so people actually considered looking at them...) 20:45:46 *** Wormnest has quit IRC 20:45:50 <TrueBrain> which .. only happens, if we start using it 20:45:54 <TrueBrain> so not sure where this discussion is going :) 20:45:58 <TrueBrain> either way, it is there now :) 20:46:14 <FLHerne> Recursively, I think 20:46:44 <TrueBrain> wow, the text above trains in 8304 is nearly unreadable (not because of the PR; it was already the case) .. dammmnnn 20:47:02 <TrueBrain> I just ... I can't. And I got glasses! 20:47:51 <frosch123> no freetype support yet? 20:48:38 <TrueBrain> https://pasteboard.co/JF5wA6q.png 20:48:42 <TrueBrain> I mean .. I just ... wuth? 20:49:10 <frosch123> TrueBrain: what is the "feature" category in discussions for? should your dicussion in that category? 20:49:20 <TrueBrain> I tried to do that 20:49:26 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 20:49:26 <TrueBrain> it is why I made the category :D 20:49:41 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 20:49:42 <TrueBrain> fixed :) 20:49:46 <TrueBrain> cheers 20:50:10 <frosch123> TrueBrain: well, with the text overlapping the vehicle roof, it is indeed hard :) 20:50:26 <TrueBrain> that is with OpenGFX fonts :) 20:50:45 <TrueBrain> we tried to stick too many things in a too darn small box :D 20:52:23 *** jottyfan has quit IRC 20:52:45 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain merged pull request #7883: Fix: for original terrain generator, keep a single gap of water at the borders https://git.io/JeNQn 20:54:01 <TrueBrain> I already see a feature they should add in Discussions .. threads inside the discussion, in some form :) 20:54:18 <frosch123> you mean a reddit tree? 20:54:53 <TrueBrain> I guess 20:55:06 <TrueBrain> owh, wait, you can 20:55:08 <TrueBrain> nevermind 20:55:21 <TrueBrain> did not see I had two reply-boxes :) 20:55:58 <TrueBrain> so I guess the next request is going to be: pinning of replies :) 20:55:59 <frosch123> andythenorth: can you split your comment into one comment per headline? then people can comment per headline? or does it not work like that? 20:56:08 <TrueBrain> it seems it does 20:56:09 <andythenorth> not sure, testing it 20:56:12 <TrueBrain> I wanted to ask the same thing :D 20:56:24 <andythenorth> we want something more like...a wiki? :P 20:56:32 <TrueBrain> no 20:56:36 <andythenorth> I have to wrap birthday presents shortly 20:56:45 <TrueBrain> sounds like that should have priority :D 20:56:55 <andythenorth> but yeah I only got about half the list so far, and I bet people point out what I missed 20:57:11 <TrueBrain> so 1 reply per item makes sense in that scenario 20:57:15 <TrueBrain> what you missed, they can fill in :) 20:57:22 <TrueBrain> let's try that out! \o/ :D 21:01:32 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #8322: Fix #8313: Correct capitalization on baseset filenames https://git.io/JL3rE 21:02:20 <TrueBrain> owh boy, now I need to remember where I left my original TT and TTD cd image .... eeeeuuuuhhhhhh 21:02:26 <TrueBrain> that will be interesting :D 21:04:41 <LordAro> i have my TTD cd on the shelf 21:04:59 <TrueBrain> if I remember correctly, TTD had everything lowercase, and TT had almost everything uppercase 21:05:14 <TrueBrain> either way, making GM.CAT uppercase doesn't hurt (it is now lowercase) 21:05:17 <TrueBrain> as we try both :) 21:05:43 <LordAro> that would follow, as TT was a dos game, and TTD was not 21:05:54 <LordAro> (ish) 21:06:37 <andythenorth> ok I did some more 21:06:44 <Eddi|zuHause> i remember the original TT was on CD, but it was essentially just 2 install diskettes mushed together 21:06:45 <andythenorth> I am happy to split it up later maybe 21:06:54 <TrueBrain> please do :) 21:07:04 <TrueBrain> I do not think the current format allows discussion ;) 21:07:09 <TrueBrain> but awesome start, cheers :) 21:07:20 <TrueBrain> I wish I could split if for you .. but then it is like I did all the work :D 21:07:25 <andythenorth> no I will do it 21:07:29 <TrueBrain> <3 21:07:31 <TrueBrain> you are the best! 21:07:31 <andythenorth> I don't mind grinding things out if it means progress 21:07:35 <andythenorth> send emoji 21:08:40 <Eddi|zuHause> also, i think it said "playable from CD ROM" on the package, which was a lie, because it was installable, not playable 21:09:09 <TrueBrain> wow, that is spammy andythenorth :D But it is okay :D 21:09:56 <andythenorth> I have notifications off :P 21:10:52 <TrueBrain> see, I could reply to something! 21:10:53 * andythenorth considers 'freeze time' for cheat menu 21:11:01 <andythenorth> where things break anyway 21:11:28 <andythenorth> oh we removed 'switch climate' :D 21:11:30 <andythenorth> nvm 21:12:14 <frosch123> TrueBrain: dos only had uppercase filenames 21:12:32 <TrueBrain> frosch123: true 21:12:44 <TrueBrain> okay, so that is the correct fix for this, good 21:12:45 <frosch123> windows considered that ugly, and added some hack to display all-uppercase filenames as all-lowercase 21:12:47 <TrueBrain> typetyp 21:12:54 <TrueBrain> type-y-type :) 21:12:57 <frosch123> no idea whether modern windows still does that 21:13:28 <glx> modern respect the case IIRC 21:14:56 <frosch123> TrueBrain: i guess unless you burn discussions within a week, we also want dorpsgek announcements for it? 21:16:09 *** Samu_ has joined #openttd 21:16:26 <TrueBrain> frosch123: sounds like a plan, yes 21:16:34 <TrueBrain> if you wouldn't mind making a PR for that? :D 21:16:48 <TrueBrain> I will give it a look this weekend earliest :) 21:18:08 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain opened pull request #8385: Fix #8313: use correct capitalization for TTO / DOS base-music https://git.io/JL36c 21:18:53 <andythenorth> hmm 'profit last year' for vehicles also 21:19:00 <andythenorth> and maybe servicing 21:19:02 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain closed pull request #8322: Fix #8313: Correct capitalization on baseset filenames https://git.io/JUPO4 21:19:05 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #8322: Fix #8313: Correct capitalization on baseset filenames https://git.io/JL36u 21:19:07 * andythenorth must to other things 21:19:08 *** Samu has quit IRC 21:19:59 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain updated pull request #8385: Fix #8313: use correct capitalization for TTO / DOS base-music https://git.io/JL36c 21:20:01 <TrueBrain> cannot believe I fucked ^^ up .. that is impressive .... I had one job ..... lolz 21:20:18 <TrueBrain> (I did all except ".cat" for "gm-tto.cat" ...) 21:24:06 <TrueBrain> subsidiaries .. that is a nice one andythenorth .. what would that do if you get one on December :D 21:24:33 <TrueBrain> amazing what you could think of this quick, nice :) 21:28:06 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] frosch123 commented on pull request #8385: Fix #8313: use correct capitalization for TTO / DOS base-music https://git.io/JL3iF 21:28:33 <frosch123> TrueBrain: not sure whether the DOS "hint" should be in the commit message 21:29:10 <frosch123> but it boils down to: DOS had no cases, different FS drivers interpret old DOS filename differently 21:29:54 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] bc-lee updated pull request #8337: Fix: Suppress unnecessary warnings introduced in Xcode 12 https://git.io/JTjNh 21:30:23 <TrueBrain> I am referring to the DOS base music set 21:30:29 <TrueBrain> orig_dos.obm 21:30:33 <TrueBrain> that DOS :) 21:32:17 <TrueBrain> I was otherwise not trying to hint to DOS the OS :P 21:32:24 <TrueBrain> suggestions to word that better are welcome! 21:34:48 <frosch123> the second paragraph of the commit message talks about filenames being lowercase (without mentioning the reason) and copying new (claiming that would be uppercase) 21:34:54 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] bc-lee commented on pull request #8337: Fix: Remove unnessary reference to suppress warning https://git.io/JL3P5 21:35:35 <TrueBrain> owh, you meant you do want it in the commit message? 21:35:38 <frosch123> suggestion: DOS did not have cases in filenames. Different OS interpret them as either all-lowercase or all-uppercase. So we try both. 21:35:48 <TrueBrain> sorry, ambiguous :D My bad :) 21:36:54 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro approved pull request #8337: Fix: Remove unnessary reference to suppress warning https://git.io/JL3XT 21:37:32 <TrueBrain> awesome, tnx frosch123 ; sorry, really misunderstood you there :P 21:37:34 <frosch123> yeah, your PRs show that github lacks the option to add review-comments to lines in commit messages :) 21:37:34 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain updated pull request #8385: Fix #8313: use correct capitalization for TTO / DOS base-music https://git.io/JL36c 21:37:40 <TrueBrain> did add an extra sentence to calm people's nerves :) 21:37:47 <TrueBrain> haha, yes :) 21:38:59 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] frosch123 approved pull request #8385: Fix #8313: use correct capitalization for TTO / DOS base-music https://git.io/JL3X4 21:39:09 <TrueBrain> one minor language fix :P 21:39:12 <TrueBrain> it annoyed me :D 21:39:13 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain dismissed a review for pull request #8385: Fix #8313: use correct capitalization for TTO / DOS base-music https://git.io/JL3X4 21:39:16 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain updated pull request #8385: Fix #8313: use correct capitalization for TTO / DOS base-music https://git.io/JL36c 21:39:42 <andythenorth> I didn't put too much spoiler on the discussion page, but I use date cheat a lot 21:39:47 <andythenorth> I don't break much 21:39:56 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain merged pull request #8337: Fix: Remove unnessary reference to suppress warning https://git.io/JTjNh 21:40:11 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #8337: Fix: Remove unnessary reference to suppress warning https://git.io/JL3X9 21:40:16 <frosch123> TrueBrain: yeah. same thing. you showed me how "force-pushed" gives a diff, but it does not diff the commit message :p 21:40:23 <TrueBrain> haha 21:40:23 <andythenorth> also someone gave me a guerilla daylength patch once, which set the year back once per year 21:40:30 <andythenorth> so game was half speed 21:40:32 <andythenorth> worked 'fine' 21:40:47 <TrueBrain> "and if opening that files fail" -> "and if opening fails" 21:40:51 <TrueBrain> that is what I changed :P 21:40:58 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] frosch123 approved pull request #8385: Fix #8313: use correct capitalization for TTO / DOS base-music https://git.io/JL3Xd 21:41:26 <TrueBrain> LordAro: lovely quick turnaround :D \o/ 21:41:37 <TrueBrain> I really was not sure that did the same in C++ ... I am so terrible at C++, it makes me laugh :D 21:41:57 <LordAro> i'm getting so many emails at the moment, it's basically hit and miss whether i see any of it 21:42:08 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] frosch123 merged pull request #8382: Fix: [NewGRF] Action 7/9 conditions 0x0B to 0x12 failed, if 'param' was 0x85 or 0x88. https://git.io/JL3Cz 21:42:48 <frosch123> LordAro: polling can be better than event queueing :) 21:43:00 <Samu_> #7918 has a "candidate: probably not" 21:43:02 <LordAro> ^^ 21:43:47 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/grfcodec] TrueBrain approved pull request #10: Switch to CMake https://git.io/JL31n 21:44:08 <TrueBrain> sorry not sorry LordAro :) 21:44:45 <TrueBrain> unexpected we are going to hit 59 today .. I was aiming for 60 :) 21:45:10 * andythenorth opens the list 21:45:22 <andythenorth> "where's my hammer" etc 21:45:36 <TrueBrain> there is little left to hammer .. the list was already pretty clean 21:46:07 <andythenorth> I am hammering for quality :P Or I try at least 21:46:16 <andythenorth> object if I ask stormcone for intents? 21:46:23 <andythenorth> e.g. https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/8308 I would not know until I build it 21:46:23 <TrueBrain> I absolutely love I can push in other people's branches .. makes the small things go a lot quicker 21:46:30 <TrueBrain> asking for a rebase and waiting for that, ugh ... 21:46:42 <TrueBrain> andythenorth: go for it 21:46:42 <andythenorth> I read the joker commits, but am not any wiser 21:47:32 <Samu_> if the group has vehicles that already made a profit, but they are below 2 years old, using AIGroup.GetProfitLastYear gives me a 0. I thought it was a quick fix 21:47:52 <Samu_> they should give their current profit, no matter the age 21:48:04 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain merged pull request #8385: Fix #8313: use correct capitalization for TTO / DOS base-music https://git.io/JL36c 21:48:05 <Samu_> their last year profit 21:48:07 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain closed issue #8313: OpenTTD does not find GM.CAT when named uppercase. https://git.io/JUudP 21:48:45 <TrueBrain> frosch123: https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/issues/8313 <- this is what annoys me about GitHub ... most of those commits are not in any active branch .. it should not show them 21:49:30 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] andythenorth commented on pull request #8308: Feature: Add cargo filter support to vehicle list. https://git.io/JL3MT 21:49:31 <TrueBrain> but I created feedback on Discussions on their Discussions page today :D 21:49:50 <andythenorth> GH use of emoji pisses me off somehow 21:49:56 <andythenorth> it's not one thing nor the other afaict 21:50:06 <TrueBrain> it doesn't support :) etc 21:50:07 * andythenorth just grumbling 21:50:08 <TrueBrain> so annoying 21:50:17 <andythenorth> it has 'proper' emoji support, but it's all weird 21:50:30 <TrueBrain> fuck proper 21:50:34 <TrueBrain> it can go screw itself :P 21:54:08 <Samu_> hmm, if I remember, I went to try to create a 2nd cache where it would store the last year profits no matter the age, but then I came accross some obstacle in the autoreplace code during the copy of variables, and gave up. 21:54:48 <Samu_> but it doesn't invalidate the PR, it's still valid 21:55:12 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] ldpl opened pull request #8386: Change: extend the allowed range for max loan setting https://git.io/JL3Mx 21:56:12 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 21:58:00 <andythenorth> hmm why do we have inflation? 21:58:10 <_dp_> to suffer 21:58:11 * andythenorth was reading https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/7589 21:58:18 <andythenorth> if we want cost inflation, do it in newgrf 21:58:40 <TrueBrain> "100000ll" <- I love random nes and zeroes 21:58:44 <TrueBrain> what shall it mean .... 21:59:02 <_dp_> it was there before me :p 21:59:03 <andythenorth> 7 21:59:05 <andythenorth> 99 21:59:12 <TrueBrain> I understand that, but ... what does it mean? 21:59:38 <TrueBrain> and why did you change it :D 21:59:44 <TrueBrain> there has to be some context around somewhere ... 21:59:51 <_dp_> it's initial balance of the company 22:00:01 <_dp_> when loan is less it becomes weird ;) 22:00:11 <TrueBrain> but your change there makes little sense to me :) 22:00:34 <TrueBrain> if the loan was part of that number, I expected that number to be changed too :P 22:00:51 <_dp_> yeah, it would be better to call it initial loan I guess 22:00:58 <_dp_> can't be > max loan 22:01:57 <TrueBrain> ah, okay, gotcha 22:02:12 <TrueBrain> still, that number, wtf :P 22:02:13 <andythenorth> oof my eyes glaze over on the PR list 22:02:16 <andythenorth> livestream! 22:02:28 <TrueBrain> frosch123: would you join our livestream? :D 22:03:10 <_dp_> don't ask me why it loaned 100k by default though 22:03:10 <_dp_> I'd gladly put it to max loan but a lot of people would object I guess 22:03:10 <_dp_> in fact, I think I set it to max loan automatically on citymania 22:03:11 *** jottyfan has joined #openttd 22:03:16 * andythenorth narrows the scope 22:03:22 <frosch123> i have neither mic nor cam, i can join in irc though :) 22:03:30 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause this would really scratch an itch I have, what does it take to get it done? https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/7745 22:03:39 <andythenorth> also use funds to send frosch a mic or cam 22:03:43 <andythenorth> just one though 22:03:51 <andythenorth> so either voice and no face, or face and random waving 22:03:54 <andythenorth> maybe the letter 22:03:59 <andythenorth> latter * 22:04:00 <TrueBrain> ooowwwwhhhh, it is ll, not 11 22:04:01 <TrueBrain> holy crap 22:04:06 <TrueBrain> font ... this is annoying 22:04:09 <frosch123> also, what livestream? just a party? or higher intentions? 22:04:10 <TrueBrain> okay, I understand now :) 22:04:26 <andythenorth> if "higher intentions" includes lolz, yes 22:04:33 <TrueBrain> frosch123: my current idea, put 5 of us or so on camera 22:04:35 <TrueBrain> open PR list 22:04:40 <TrueBrain> start talking about features 22:04:44 <TrueBrain> showcase what people have done 22:04:45 <TrueBrain> what works 22:04:47 <TrueBrain> what doesn't 22:04:49 <TrueBrain> have chat open 22:04:52 <TrueBrain> let people vote 22:04:58 <andythenorth> test them on stream 22:04:59 <TrueBrain> and by jury, get some ground covered 22:05:03 <andythenorth> can we MP in wasm yet? 22:05:08 <TrueBrain> but mostly: alcohol and giggles :P 22:05:08 <frosch123> ah, i guess i can use my phone then 22:05:14 <andythenorth> multiplayer coop was so good for advancing the game 22:05:18 <andythenorth> the nightly server etc 22:05:29 <TrueBrain> _dp _: sorry, totally misread that line, it is clear to me now :D 22:05:57 <frosch123> so its ages ago that i used skype on it. no idea whether it still works :) 22:06:19 <_dp_> TrueBrain, lol, I haven't even realised you read those as 1s xD 22:06:37 <TrueBrain> frosch123: it will be Discord in that case :) 22:06:57 <frosch123> discord hates me 22:07:04 <frosch123> they think i am a bot 22:07:20 <frosch123> but maybe when i use a different device, different email, they don't notice 22:07:23 *** Wormnest has joined #openttd 22:07:23 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain requested changes for pull request #8386: Change: extend the allowed range for max loan setting https://git.io/JL3y7 22:07:29 <TrueBrain> sorry _dp _ :) 22:07:32 <TrueBrain> it is REALLY nitpicking :) 22:08:00 <_dp_> np 22:08:19 <TrueBrain> I am trying to understand https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/7981/files .. but it seems they were trying to do something really complex 22:09:14 <TrueBrain> owh, I guess so you can join multiplayer servers directly with the correct version 22:10:39 *** Samu_ has quit IRC 22:11:06 <frosch123> extend it to also download the correct version :p 22:11:24 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 22:11:26 <TrueBrain> lolz, passwords in the protocol handler .. shall we not do that? Pretty please? :D 22:12:02 <TrueBrain> the SecOps in me is exploding; nothing to worry about :) 22:12:05 <milek7> password is useful 22:12:31 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 22:12:51 <frosch123> TrueBrain: it's on the same level as #coops !password 22:12:52 <TrueBrain> only if we rebrand it as "secret password phrase you have to say at the door of the nightclub" :) 22:13:05 <frosch123> everyone who knows the place to get the info can join, random people are kept out 22:13:17 <TrueBrain> until someone doesn't understand it :) 22:13:20 <milek7> eg. passworded server with link to it on private forum 22:13:25 <frosch123> company pw is unusual though 22:13:33 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] ldpl updated pull request #8386: Change: extend the allowed range for max loan setting https://git.io/JL3Mx 22:13:38 <TrueBrain> well, yes, that mostly triggered me :P 22:14:05 <TrueBrain> server password ... like coop, they understand what they are doing 22:14:17 <TrueBrain> for some reason I can see the bugreport: someone got in my server?!?!?! :P 22:14:41 <TrueBrain> but okay, password is all kind of wrong in OpenTTD to start with, so not sure this is worth any battle over :D 22:15:00 <TrueBrain> I just read it as "invite code", and I am good :) 22:15:50 <TrueBrain> should the installer register a client, or should the client be capable of registering itself .. hmm .. what is common .. 22:16:47 <_dp_> that query parser looks very rudimentary 22:16:57 <_dp_> can it handle & and % in password for example? 22:17:09 <TrueBrain> you can escape them :) 22:17:14 <TrueBrain> same for Browsers 22:17:22 <_dp_> ah, % is for escaping 22:17:25 <TrueBrain> :) 22:17:36 <TrueBrain> which is pretty neat; I wouldn't have done that :P 22:18:12 <_dp_> is it just urlencode? 22:18:36 *** Speedy` has joined #openttd 22:18:38 <_dp_> didn't quite realize it looking at the parser :p 22:18:55 <TrueBrain> your PR fails! :P 22:19:07 *** Speedyn has quit IRC 22:19:33 <_dp_> huh 22:19:34 <TrueBrain> I would put "min(INITIAL_LOAN, _economy.max_loan) " in a variable btw, just because that line is already LLOOONNNGGGG :P 22:19:38 <_dp_> and on linux weirdly 22:19:47 <milek7> passwords are annoying anyway 22:19:50 <TrueBrain> no, Mac too 22:19:52 <milek7> can we replace them with public-key auth? 22:19:59 <TrueBrain> tests are failing :) 22:20:08 <_dp_> TrueBrain, that whatever, but I use linux myself... 22:20:10 <TrueBrain> milek7: when is your SSL implementation PR coming? :D 22:20:17 <TrueBrain> did you run "make test"? :) 22:20:33 <TrueBrain> seems there is a boo-boo somewhere 22:20:42 <TrueBrain> or the test is weird 22:20:44 <TrueBrain> ah, no, test is weird 22:21:13 <_dp_> where do I even find tests? 22:21:19 <TrueBrain> "make test" :) 22:21:22 <TrueBrain> regression folder 22:21:43 <TrueBrain> regression/regression is the one that is failing 22:21:53 <TrueBrain> basically what it does, on a preset map it runs an AI which does all kinds of stuff 22:21:58 <TrueBrain> and the output is compared 22:22:51 *** jottyfan has quit IRC 22:24:06 <milek7> TrueBrain: this is not related to TLS 22:24:50 <TrueBrain> if we can do HTTPS, we can "solve" passwords pretty easily :) 22:25:31 <milek7> HTTPS talk was about content server, no? 22:25:38 <TrueBrain> well, we could over HTTP, but we need some crypt to setup trust .. so SSL, lol 22:26:03 <TrueBrain> the moments I talk about HTTPS it is mostly because I want a centralized authentication mechanism 22:26:11 <TrueBrain> (well, "centralized" .. you can pick which one you want to use) 22:26:17 <_dp_> where does this test takes config from? regression.cfg is almost empty and it should be 300k max loan by default 22:26:19 <TrueBrain> as that allows cloud saves 22:26:23 <TrueBrain> but also a lot of other shit :) 22:26:28 <TrueBrain> main.nut 22:26:57 <_dp_> I mean what openttd.cfg it runs with 22:27:06 <TrueBrain> regression.cfg 22:27:27 <milek7> I thought about: at first launch generate pubkey and store in .openttd directory 22:27:34 <_dp_> well, it's 300k there so neither 500k nor 2mm is right 22:27:35 <milek7> use that pubkey automatically when creating and accessing companies 22:27:51 <TrueBrain> milek7: generating pubkey requires an SSL library :D 22:27:59 <TrueBrain> but yeah, that is a method too, for sure :) 22:28:14 <milek7> nah, I don't want TLS for this 22:28:31 <TrueBrain> you keep saying TLS, I mean an SSL library :) One that can do RSA or what-ever :) 22:29:12 <TrueBrain> something that does a safe crypto 22:30:20 <frosch123> night 22:30:23 *** frosch123 has quit IRC 22:31:57 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] twpol commented on pull request #8342: Feature #8095: Allow automatically separating vehicles in shared orders https://git.io/JL3Q8 22:32:00 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] twpol updated pull request #8342: Feature #8095: Allow automatically separating vehicles in shared orders https://git.io/JklGO 22:32:10 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] twpol commented on pull request #8342: Feature #8095: Allow automatically separating vehicles in shared orders https://git.io/JL3Q0 22:32:14 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] twpol commented on pull request #8342: Feature #8095: Allow automatically separating vehicles in shared orders https://git.io/JL3QE 22:32:17 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] twpol commented on pull request #8342: Feature #8095: Allow automatically separating vehicles in shared orders https://git.io/JL3Qu 22:32:26 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] twpol commented on pull request #8342: Feature #8095: Allow automatically separating vehicles in shared orders https://git.io/JL3Q2 22:34:08 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] twpol commented on pull request #8342: Feature #8095: Allow automatically separating vehicles in shared orders https://git.io/JL3QX 22:34:34 <TrueBrain> milek7: libcurl is easiest, as it gives us HTTPS, but openssl / wolfSSL / bearSSL is most robust, as it gives us all kind of choices. If we do any of that, all these problems can easily be resolved 22:34:42 <TrueBrain> we could also hook into the crypto some OSes offer 22:34:53 <TrueBrain> but that just means we are doing it our self :D 22:35:35 <milek7> I would rather do that crypto-password-replacement and https-content as completely independent things 22:35:45 <TrueBrain> what https-content do you refer to? 22:35:51 <TrueBrain> owh, instead of the http 22:35:58 <TrueBrain> that is very low on my list of prios :) 22:36:15 <TrueBrain> anyway, if we plan on doing HTTPS, you can solve authentication a lot nicer 22:36:24 <TrueBrain> so doing any password replacement would be rather short-term 22:37:04 <_dp_> hmm, make test fails for me even on master https://i.imgur.com/xjYGwuq.png 22:37:09 <_dp_> and with no info why 22:37:22 <milek7> HTTPS is just secure transport, how it solves authentication? 22:37:23 <TrueBrain> you need that env variable to get output 22:37:24 <TrueBrain> euuhh 22:37:32 <TrueBrain> CTEST_OUTPUT_ON_FAILURE=1 22:37:40 <TrueBrain> milek7: certificates! 22:37:49 <TrueBrain> so no MITM 22:37:53 <milek7> I don't think you want client-side certs? :P 22:38:03 <_dp_> ah, ok, no graphics set, cool :/ 22:38:12 <TrueBrain> no; I want trust between client and a Centralized Authenticator :) 22:38:21 <TrueBrain> haha, yeah, that is always annoying 22:38:27 <TrueBrain> put OpenGFX in your ~/.openttd/baseset 22:38:30 <TrueBrain> and it will work :) 22:38:45 <milek7> ah, central authorization 22:38:50 <TrueBrain> milek7: I once wrote it all down, but we shut down the server it was one :D 22:39:12 <TrueBrain> but what we do for BaNaNaS for example 22:39:18 <TrueBrain> just a simple OAuth2 flow 22:39:33 <milek7> this feels bit icky, central authorization in oss game ;P 22:39:39 <_dp_> TrueBrain, magic %) 22:39:40 <TrueBrain> it is not centralized in that sense 22:39:43 <TrueBrain> anyone can run it 22:39:49 <TrueBrain> but it is like our content service 22:39:56 <TrueBrain> we offer a place too 22:40:15 <TrueBrain> in my plans I left room for a server to announce the CA it wants you to use 22:40:21 <TrueBrain> so server operators can pick 22:41:06 <TrueBrain> but, honestly, most people would use ours 22:41:16 <TrueBrain> but, freedom of choice; I personally wouldn't care :) 22:41:26 <TrueBrain> so it fits perfectly in an OSS game :) 22:41:45 <milek7> and anyway, it requires user to come up with password, create account, etc. 22:41:50 <TrueBrain> _dp _: it is possible the current regression was already broken 22:42:12 <TrueBrain> milek7: doesn't have to, honestly 22:42:22 <TrueBrain> so many possibilities :D 22:42:41 <TrueBrain> what does happen, however, is that you unique assign an ID to a user, in what-ever-way 22:42:51 <TrueBrain> (for that session) 22:43:27 <TrueBrain> for companies, this is most obvious: it means you can auto-lock a company to a player, and he can invite other players (that first join as spectator, for example) 22:43:33 <TrueBrain> never any password nothing 22:43:41 <TrueBrain> that would be smooth as silk :) 22:45:08 <_dp_> TrueBrain, well, it sure looks like but what should I do? "fix" the test? 22:45:23 <TrueBrain> I rather have you investigate why it breaks, but not sure you are up for that :D 22:45:40 <_dp_> well, I tried but no result so far 22:45:44 <TrueBrain> _economy.max_loan is really that big number 22:45:48 <_dp_> also it seems unrelated to my change 22:45:51 <TrueBrain> so it would need some debugging to figure out why that happens 22:46:07 <TrueBrain> sometimes one fix shows another problem, sadly 22:46:18 <_dp_> it seems regression somehow fucks up with config 22:46:44 <TrueBrain> it might be the savegame 22:46:54 <TrueBrain> and that there is a load-mechanism making it max 22:47:31 <_dp_> oh, it has savegame 22:47:43 <TrueBrain> I told you that, yes :D 22:47:54 <_dp_> I... missed it :] 22:47:55 <TrueBrain> it fully runs in a known-state 22:48:00 <TrueBrain> no worries, I am just teasing you :) 22:48:34 <milek7> isn't it just AI that tries to take maximum loan, so results are different now? 22:49:07 <TrueBrain> but why does the max-loan change? His patch only changes the setting what that max-loan value is 22:51:53 <_dp_> it something about that save it seems 22:52:02 <_dp_> doesn't change for my saves 22:52:19 <TrueBrain> most likely the savegame version in that case 22:52:26 <TrueBrain> one from before 97, I would guess 22:53:33 <TrueBrain> `dbg: [sl] Loading savegame version 104` 22:54:05 <TrueBrain> converted from an older savegame 22:54:12 <TrueBrain> 53 -> 98 -> 104 22:55:00 <TrueBrain> sadly, it does mean we have to find what is going on, as this can influence older savegames a lot :) 22:55:13 <TrueBrain> grepping on max_loan doesn't help me at all ... 22:55:24 <TrueBrain> the black magic around the settings system is ... "nice" I guess? :D 22:55:32 <_dp_> yeah, me too... 22:55:38 <_dp_> but I should be able to figure it out eventually 22:55:49 <_dp_> I'm kinda familiar with those parts xD 22:56:03 <TrueBrain> would be really great, and it most likely shows a bug we are like: how did we not notice this earlier?! 22:56:51 <TrueBrain> but loading that savegame manually shows a max-loan of 500k 22:57:30 <_dp_> it somehow sets it to max of that setting on load instead of default or whatever 22:57:42 <_dp_> so 500k without patch and 2mm with 22:57:53 *** nielsm has quit IRC 22:58:01 <TrueBrain> that is .... bad :P 22:59:29 <TrueBrain> with UINT32_MAX, it does cap off at 2B 22:59:38 <TrueBrain> so .... possibly 2B is in the savegame 22:59:42 <TrueBrain> and it was just clamped all this time :D 23:00:03 <_dp_> now that's an interesting theory... 23:00:15 <_dp_> I'll try to feed it to my python xD 23:00:34 <TrueBrain> change your max to like 2,500,000,000 23:00:36 <TrueBrain> :D 23:00:42 <TrueBrain> what a stupidity :D Holy crap :) 23:06:47 <TrueBrain> upperlimit always has been 500k 23:06:57 <TrueBrain> so that means someone did something evil :) 23:07:10 <TrueBrain> but please confirm that value is really in the savegame 23:07:10 <_dp_> my python doesn't eat OTTZ... sad python :( 23:07:27 <TrueBrain> and that also means you can just fix the result.txt with the new values :) 23:07:45 <TrueBrain> off to bed for me; good luck with this WTF IS THIS CRAP from 2008 or so :P 23:07:47 <TrueBrain> I wrote it :D 23:08:12 <_dp_> gn xD 23:08:29 <milek7> so, I could write sometime pubkey authorization, or you want to do your cloud thingy? 23:11:16 *** Wolf01 has quit IRC 23:14:59 <TrueBrain> Personally I would prefer someone puts time in getting an SSL library in board, but you should do what you enjoy :) And if that is toying with pubkey implementations, you should do so :D 23:15:05 <TrueBrain> Make a draft etc 23:15:25 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 23:16:04 <TrueBrain> Don't make it all polished before sharing, I would suggest :) 23:17:00 <TrueBrain> What I like about OpenTTD, there is a lot of room to do shit you enjoy :) 23:17:25 <TrueBrain> And if I am given the choice you doing nothing or doing pubkey, I take the pubkey :D 23:17:42 <TrueBrain> So dealers choice milek7 :) 23:19:02 <milek7> :) 23:19:09 <milek7> again, I think any library I would use there should be not related with eventual https support (which should use libcurl/winhttp/whatever depending on platform) 23:20:39 <TrueBrain> I agree, that is why I think openssl, WolfSSL is more likely 23:20:49 <TrueBrain> As libcurl does not offer https server, I believe 23:21:08 <TrueBrain> But .. someone has to explore this 23:21:24 <_dp_> ok, 2mm in save confirmed: https://pastebin.com/PtKVEW21 23:21:30 <TrueBrain> So pubkey is as good as a start as any ;) 23:21:53 <TrueBrain> Lollzzzz ... riggghhhttt .. :D 23:21:54 <_dp_> that's pure python so only original bugs xD 23:22:55 <_dp_> someone's been naughty this year for sure :p 23:23:01 <_dp_> well, some year I guess... 23:23:08 <TrueBrain> I blame Rb :) 23:24:17 <_dp_> tbh the way max loan is stored changed so much I'm not surprised it got borked 23:25:20 <_dp_> so, funnily enough, it will even be 100% correct with the new patch :p 23:25:33 <_dp_> as that value is now valid 23:29:21 <_dp_> that may or may not mean that afterload is not right for some old versions though... 23:30:10 <TrueBrain> But not a bug :D 23:34:00 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] ldpl updated pull request #8386: Change: extend the allowed range for max loan setting https://git.io/JL3Mx 23:35:51 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] ldpl commented on pull request #8386: Change: extend the allowed range for max loan setting https://git.io/JL3pE 23:39:53 <_dp_> hm... those settings... I wonder if that's the bug in my python or pf penalties are even more broken 23:41:57 <milek7> starting year -805306361? 23:43:33 <_dp_> yeah, looks like python oopsie 23:44:15 *** arikover` has quit IRC 23:44:16 <_dp_> well, at least it decoded what mattered :p 23:46:08 *** Progman has quit IRC