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00:00:21 <andythenorth> needs a designer... 00:00:26 <Timberwolf> supermop_Home_: A lot of them are expanding, I think Wildcard just went from having a brewery and taproom on the Ravenswood estate to having a big brewery in Blackhorse Road and using their old site just as a bar. 00:00:34 <andythenorth> supermop_Home_ you always wanted to do some fashion design right? :P 00:00:39 <supermop_Home_> andythenorth in 2017 one of those aforementioned vanity project firms did lead me to do a site visit for potential renovation of an apartment at 725 5th avenue... 00:00:46 <Timberwolf> They've done quite well out of the early lockdown, Wildcard were selling more than they could brew. 00:00:55 <supermop_Home_> I was able to convince my boss to refuse the project 00:01:04 <andythenorth> sad days 00:01:11 <andythenorth> don't you like working with gold everywhere? 00:01:59 <supermop_Home_> andythenorth i have some fashion things slow cooking for 2022. buddy of mine is trying to launch a natural fibers and dyes Techwear line atm 00:02:02 <Timberwolf> Beavertown have a big unit the other side of the River Lea, they have supermarket deals and all sorts now. 00:02:10 <andythenorth> OpenTTD hats or go home 00:02:27 <supermop_Home_> beavertown figures too large in my life these days... but Oregon 00:02:31 <andythenorth> also now Timberwolf has voxels, we can do custom 3D prints of trains 00:02:36 <andythenorth> fund the AWS bills 00:02:56 <supermop_Home_> andythenorth i thought about selling prints of the base set vehicles a few years ago 00:02:57 <andythenorth> then we can laser scan them 00:03:07 <andythenorth> then we can turn them into models for the game 00:03:19 <Timberwolf> I don't know much of Oregon outside of American Truck Simulator and the Decemberists :) 00:03:19 <supermop_Home_> nah scan the images Mortal Kombat style 00:04:01 <andythenorth> I was thinking voxel model -> 3D print -> scan -> CGI model -> blue screen render of each angle -> 8bpp pixels 00:04:09 <supermop_Home_> Timberwolf Beavertown OR is where a certain footwear brand can make more from dropping one shoe than a decent action movie box office take 00:04:20 <_dp_> I wanted to 3d print some vehicles but I quickly realized the problem with them being 2d xD 00:04:37 <andythenorth> its a limiting factor 00:04:51 <supermop_Home_> andythenorth doing something for capsule tower's 50th is my plan 00:05:32 <supermop_Home_> Timberwolf last i was there i thing Camden was about all i was drinking there 00:06:27 <Timberwolf> Camden are still about, they're all over the place now. You can buy Hells in most supermarkets. 00:06:42 <supermop_Home_> you can get it here sometimes 00:06:43 <Timberwolf> And it's the standard lager in a lot of pubs. 00:06:50 <supermop_Home_> and in melb when i was living there 00:07:43 <supermop_Home_> NYC beers have been on a good tear lately, after 5 long years of IPA dick-measuring contests 00:08:06 <supermop_Home_> back to making interesting and tasty things, offering delivery 00:10:15 <andythenorth> hmm is bedtime? 00:10:17 <andythenorth> again? 00:10:47 <Timberwolf> One of our dogs has already done the very obvious and loud Climbing Of The Stairs. 00:11:36 <supermop_Home_> i'd better get dinner then 00:12:12 <andythenorth> it's like literally every day, 00:12:15 <andythenorth> "bedtime" 00:12:17 <andythenorth> so dull 00:12:30 <andythenorth> I've tried avoiding it, but it always seems to find me 00:20:16 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/nml] glx22 opened pull request #179: Fix: optimising switches could change variable scope https://git.io/JLXED 00:21:04 <andythenorth> \o/ 00:21:10 <andythenorth> oh FML this is sleeping time 00:21:17 <andythenorth> marriage = waking up by 6am 00:23:12 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 00:30:15 *** grossing has quit IRC 00:37:25 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 commented on issue #8423: Can't build on Mac https://git.io/JLXBh 00:44:27 *** gelignite has quit IRC 00:48:50 *** grossing has joined #openttd 01:10:52 *** nielsm has quit IRC 01:49:59 *** Flygon has joined #openttd 02:17:10 *** Progman has quit IRC 02:19:25 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SJang1 commented on issue #8423: Can't build on Mac https://git.io/JLXBh 02:28:02 *** b1nda[m] has joined #openttd 03:28:58 *** glx has quit IRC 03:31:28 *** debdog has joined #openttd 03:34:48 *** D-HUND has quit IRC 03:43:32 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 03:45:42 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 04:03:22 *** grossing has quit IRC 04:12:21 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC 05:09:51 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] BarryJRowe opened issue #8424: Trains can crash through depots https://git.io/JLXif 05:44:48 *** grossing has joined #openttd 06:01:15 *** y2kboy23_ is now known as y2kboy23 07:14:56 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 07:17:07 *** gregdek has quit IRC 07:17:13 *** reldred has quit IRC 07:18:30 *** gregdek has joined #openttd 07:18:30 *** reldred has joined #openttd 07:56:00 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 07:57:26 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] btzy opened pull request #8425: Feature: Contextual actions for vehicles grouped by shared orders https://git.io/JLXyG 07:57:43 <andythenorth> hmm 31s compile, 7s is spent on drawing images 07:57:52 * andythenorth in optimisation hole again 07:58:05 *** nielsm has joined #openttd 07:58:14 <andythenorth> nielsm :) \o/ 08:00:33 *** Circuited has joined #openttd 08:01:48 *** Circuited has quit IRC 08:31:40 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: that's like weightloss obsession. any nonzero number can trigger it, and it can get very unhealthy 08:34:41 <andythenorth> ok let's talk about horse names instead 08:39:05 <andythenorth> I need a name for euro Horse 08:39:13 <andythenorth> probably a type of horse 08:39:56 <andythenorth> Baroque? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baroque_horse 08:39:59 *** b1nda[m] has left #openttd 08:40:03 <andythenorth> Courser? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Courser_(horse) 08:40:11 <andythenorth> Friesian? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friesian_horse 08:54:59 <planetmaker> Merry Christmas everyone :) 09:00:50 *** reldred has quit IRC 09:03:24 *** reldred has joined #openttd 09:09:27 <Eddi|zuHause> happy holidays to you, too, planetmaker 09:15:27 *** Progman has joined #openttd 09:36:58 <Timberwolf> Eisenpferd? 09:42:38 <andythenorth> Cheval du Fer? 09:44:06 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 09:44:19 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 10:00:54 *** TrueBrain has quit IRC 10:01:29 *** TrueBrain has joined #openttd 10:12:51 <LordAro> that depot bug is a good'un 10:17:39 *** dihedral has quit IRC 10:30:52 <andythenorth> it's quite retro no? 10:31:18 <Timberwolf> Yes, very original! 10:36:55 *** dihedral has joined #openttd 10:37:26 *** Samu has joined #openttd 10:46:45 <andythenorth> lol I just got smacked by the most subtle and silly templating bug 10:47:00 <andythenorth> the templater strips newlines in certain conditions 10:47:11 <andythenorth> and the last line of one template was a comment 10:47:40 <andythenorth> the first line of the next template was a switch (it used to be an outdated comment, which I removed) 10:47:44 <andythenorth> so nml barfed 10:47:47 <andythenorth> took ages to see why 11:01:21 *** gelignite has joined #openttd 11:04:36 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 11:11:32 *** TrueBrain has quit IRC 11:54:29 *** gelignite has quit IRC 12:02:02 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 has joined #openttd 12:08:08 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC 12:20:39 * LordAro going through the gitlog for 1.11.0-beta1 purposes 12:22:32 <andythenorth> \o/ 12:23:19 <LordAro> it's surprisingly long 12:23:32 *** frosch123 has joined #openttd 12:26:03 <LordAro> (that's what she said, etc) 12:26:09 <andythenorth> game is innovating etc 12:28:36 <LordAro> wasn't it dying? 12:28:39 <frosch123> i wondered. should ottd keep the "one stable branch per year, and maintainance relase"? 12:28:51 <frosch123> i got the impression noone likes the backports 12:29:39 <LordAro> there was a point where we were going to speed up the release cycle 12:29:40 <frosch123> an alternative would be a monthly, which is just the nightly of the first wednesday of each month or so 12:29:42 <LordAro> then it didn't happen 12:29:46 <andythenorth> I forgot we had the backports :P 12:30:05 <frosch123> LordAro: my point is more like: what is a release 12:30:17 <LordAro> aye 12:30:18 <frosch123> do we maintain them manually, or would we rather do automated snapshots 12:31:18 <frosch123> dp complains all day long that a year is too long. but apparently nightly is too fast 12:31:40 <_dp_> ;) 12:31:45 <frosch123> doing a real release with minor versions is impossible to do more than once per year 12:32:08 <LordAro> would probably mean the thing is (slightly) less stable 12:32:12 <frosch123> so the alternative would be a monthly or quaterly, which would just be an entitled nightly 12:32:14 *** Wolf01 has joined #openttd 12:33:09 <_dp_> imo quarterly would be perfect 12:33:53 <_dp_> too short to be annoying, not to long to feel like eternity 12:35:23 <_dp_> don't have to be on a strict schedule, but at least release smth every 3-4 month when it's logically most appropriate 12:35:34 <_dp_> with like 1 month feature freeze prior 12:35:47 <frosch123> _dp_: that won't work 12:36:01 <frosch123> you can have one manual release per year, or an automated more often 12:36:07 <frosch123> you cannot pick "just work more" 12:36:57 <andythenorth> what new things go wrong if we release from master? 12:37:20 * andythenorth has pre-loaded this question [spoiler: feature flags] 12:37:23 <andythenorth> oof :P 12:37:31 <Wolf01> Lol 12:37:32 <LordAro> not sure i like the idea of (fully) automated releases 12:37:51 <Wolf01> Especially "release what?" 12:37:53 <andythenorth> oof why do I use PARENT for var[0x8A, 0, 0xF] 12:38:02 <andythenorth> not now andythenorth we're talking 12:38:03 <frosch123> LordAro: yeah, you can't call it "releases" anymore :) 12:38:15 <_dp_> just how much more work is release anyway? if you can automate it you sure can add a button ;) 12:38:24 <frosch123> it's just a fake release, a nightly that is called "release", so people think it is good 12:38:48 <andythenorth> I feature flag unused grf stuff FWIW 12:38:59 <andythenorth> and turn the flags off before a release 12:39:02 <andythenorth> except when I forget 12:39:11 <frosch123> _dp_: the work comes from the branching 12:39:28 <frosch123> you have to change N files so ottd nows whether it is a reelase branch, or a real one 12:39:30 <Wolf01> Make fast branch, slow branch, lts branch? Too much microsoft? 12:39:40 <_dp_> frosch123, you do branching anyway 12:39:53 <frosch123> a quartely would not branch, just a tag from master 12:39:59 <frosch123> same as nightly 12:40:20 <frosch123> hmm, though, maybe i am lieing to myself there 12:40:29 <frosch123> maybe there is also savegame bumping and more 12:41:23 <frosch123> so, maybe automated release is more like: no manual changelog, no manual newspost, no dicussion when to branch, just a fixed date 12:41:35 <frosch123> every second is broken, but then people can play the previous :p 12:41:42 <LordAro> in which case why have nightlies? might as well just have weekly releases 12:42:03 <andythenorth> IMHO we need infrequent 'stable' releases, maybe once a year 12:42:05 <andythenorth> because MP 12:42:05 <frosch123> nightlies is an extensive ci at this point, noone plays them 12:42:36 <frosch123> and the point was that multiplayer people want releases not too often, so it's more likely they all have the same version 12:42:38 *** gelignite has joined #openttd 12:42:40 <andythenorth> yup 12:42:55 <andythenorth> unless we push to forced auto-updating 12:43:00 <andythenorth> which is..unwanted for us I think 12:43:28 <andythenorth> Blitz forces updates, outdated = no login 12:43:37 <andythenorth> also means if the mac client broke in say 5.2 12:43:50 <andythenorth> you ain't playing until they fix it, no matter how much you pay for subscription 12:43:54 <Wolf01> Master server accepts any version anyway 12:44:36 <Wolf01> It's up to clients to use the same version of the server they want to join 12:44:58 <Wolf01> It's not a mmo-openttd :P 12:45:14 <andythenorth> it's just so faffy 12:45:25 <andythenorth> open binary, browse servers, get a different binary 12:46:17 <andythenorth> anyway tag master with a numbered version annually, profit 12:46:51 <LordAro> tagging master every quarter wouldn't be the worst thing, imo 12:47:23 <LordAro> we do a release every quarter at work 12:47:59 <LordAro> though we still have release branches there (releases/X.Y irritatingly), because actual number of people working on things :) 12:48:57 <andythenorth> we have candidate branch for a build 12:49:06 <andythenorth> if it passes QA -> merge master, tag 12:49:16 <andythenorth> nothing else goes to master except README fixes 12:49:35 <andythenorth> but eh, that's not here 12:52:04 <frosch123> random interjection: last night i noticed i should have renamed "mail" to "eels", so i could refit the hovercraft on stream 12:52:23 <Wolf01> :D 12:54:39 <andythenorth> more eels 12:56:15 <andythenorth> https://youtu.be/p0BjGQ0ZTRM?t=43 12:58:57 *** Lejving has quit IRC 13:17:42 <andythenorth> oof today is the day for esoteric bugs 13:18:03 <andythenorth> I have an articulated wagon with mail + pax capacity 13:18:18 <andythenorth> I couldn't figure out why mail section wasn't showing opening doors 13:18:34 <andythenorth> test station doesn't accept mail :P 13:19:20 <Wolf01> So, not a bug 13:21:42 <andythenorth> took 20 minutes to find it :P 13:23:04 <Wolf01> Exactly like the bug I was asked to address today... not a bug :P Changed the description of one selector to better understand what the automations based on its activation do 13:26:47 *** Circuited has joined #openttd 13:26:56 <Circuited> he;lo==/ 13:27:13 *** Circuited has quit IRC 13:27:43 <LordAro> #youtried 13:29:31 *** Circuited has joined #openttd 13:31:02 <Circuited> Hello 13:37:29 <frosch123> there are 171 zombies here 14:01:29 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 14:06:10 <FLHerne> But some of use are only part-time zombies 14:06:26 <Wolf01> Others fake it... shit 14:10:59 *** TrueBrain has joined #openttd 14:24:18 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #8422: Change: Add some style to GameScript question windows depending on the type https://git.io/JLXFj 14:24:41 <andythenorth> hmm could we implement Ticket To Ride type mechanics? w 14:24:45 <andythenorth> without getting sued? 14:24:57 * andythenorth thinking of route tickets drawn at game start 14:26:41 <TrueBrain> michi_cc: https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/8416 <- was there any reason you did not approve it besides your initial comment? It looks good to me, but .. thought I better check with you first to make sure you didn't have a reason for not approving it yet :D 14:34:47 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #7745: Feature: setting for more flexible town spacing https://git.io/JLXbc 14:35:08 <TrueBrain> frosch123 / LordAro / who-ever, if you disagree with my comment in ^^ let me know, otherwise I close that PR in a few days 14:38:15 *** Flygon has quit IRC 14:38:16 <andythenorth> so...Towns. Or go complete Yolo and have arbitrary overlapping Regions? 14:38:27 <andythenorth> and towns are subjugated to region 14:39:12 <Wolf01> <andythenorth> hmm could we implement Ticket To Ride type mechanics? <- which are? (I have it, never played) 14:39:28 <andythenorth> it's a board game, building train routes 14:39:31 <andythenorth> nothing like TTD 14:39:39 <michi_cc> TrueBrain: I've not tested it. But I don't have any principal objections. 14:39:43 <andythenorth> but at the beginning you're given certain routes you must achieve for points 14:39:49 <Wolf01> Oh, I thought something like mashinky 14:39:52 <andythenorth> 'connect X to Y' 14:40:27 <TrueBrain> michi_cc: cool, will test it soon if nobody beats me to it :D 14:40:28 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 14:40:55 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 14:41:49 *** Circuited has quit IRC 14:42:01 * andythenorth wonders if nielsm is reading the channel 14:43:51 <andythenorth> unrelated, this for Christmas? https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=32&t=88073 14:44:00 <andythenorth> it only requires computing to offer bytes with 32 values 14:44:04 <andythenorth> that's ok, right? 14:44:43 <andythenorth> 64 not 32 :P 14:44:47 <andythenorth> silly 14:47:40 <Samu> One year ago, I reported this as a bug: https://i.imgur.com/hAbTMv4.png 14:48:03 <Samu> made a PR, got rejected 14:48:09 <Samu> still looks odd 14:49:30 <nielsm> andythenorth: no I'm not 14:49:40 <andythenorth> you are now :) 14:49:45 <andythenorth> found a new game to play 14:49:46 <andythenorth> ? 14:50:06 *** glx has joined #openttd 14:50:06 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v glx 14:51:46 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] ldpl commented on pull request #8422: Change: Add some style to GameScript question windows depending on the type https://git.io/JLXby 14:54:44 <TrueBrain> _dp_: I was not expecting you to do so, but boy, it stands out :P 14:55:28 <TrueBrain> what I would like GitHub to add, is a way where people can vote on a PR .. but not any user .. like .. "Members only" or something 14:55:34 <TrueBrain> so much easier if that was possible 14:56:32 <TrueBrain> LordAro: https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/8422 <- is there a way to change colors after the fact that is code-wise less ugly, or is this really the way we have to do it? (sorry, I know nothing about the current window system :P) 14:58:25 <Samu> there are 16 farms in this map, they're all in that cluster https://i.imgur.com/vuffxsU.png 15:03:09 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #7981: Feature #7735: Implement protocol handling https://git.io/JLXNk 15:03:29 <TrueBrain> milek7: we are getting some good feedback on the Discussion, that is pretty nice :) 15:04:14 <TrueBrain> seems it is not only RCON that needs "server admin" role, but people would also enjoy it in a broader context 15:04:28 <TrueBrain> not sure if that should be done all at once btw; Phase 3 can also be 3+ PRs for all I care 15:04:32 <TrueBrain> just to be clear about that ;) 15:16:02 <glx> TrueBrain: as there is NWID *GetWidget(uint widnum) inside windows, I think it's possible to change colors, but nobody wrote code to to that easily 15:17:05 <andythenorth> anyone doing the CSS for that? 15:33:53 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 15:35:46 <andythenorth> one day I will figure out a good industry closure mechanic 15:36:20 <andythenorth> I have half an idea about industries being 'lucky' (safe from closure, production increases) or 'unlucky' (can close) 15:42:34 <TrueBrain> glx: okay, so in that case I agree that copying is better; or do you disagree? 15:43:20 <glx> until we have an easy way to change background color it's better to copy yes 15:43:35 <TrueBrain> cheers 15:43:52 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain approved pull request #8422: Change: Add some style to GameScript question windows depending on the type https://git.io/JLXhJ 15:45:09 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain requested changes for pull request #8422: Change: Add some style to GameScript question windows depending on the type https://git.io/JLXhm 15:45:10 <TrueBrain> changed my mind :P 15:45:46 <glx> happens 15:46:04 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #8422: Change: Add some style to GameScript question windows depending on the type https://git.io/JLXhG 15:46:10 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick updated pull request #7918: Fix 3c047b1: AIGroup.GetProfitLastYear could get values different than those displayed in gui https://git.io/Jvek6 15:49:35 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] ldpl updated pull request #8422: Change: Add some style to GameScript question windows depending on the type https://git.io/JLXGQ 15:51:25 <TrueBrain> frosch123: fun fact, I found out that you can stalk people on Steam too if you have been in a game with them .. :P 15:51:38 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain approved pull request #8422: Change: Add some style to GameScript question windows depending on the type https://git.io/JLXhh 15:52:08 <andythenorth> CSS in #8422 looked good 👍 15:52:10 * andythenorth approves 15:54:53 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 15:55:02 <frosch123> TrueBrain: changed your mind :p 15:55:46 <TrueBrain> only using the email is interesting .. it does need a bit more work 15:55:56 <TrueBrain> as the secret key is AES encrypted before it is send to the cloud 15:56:00 <TrueBrain> it needs something to encrypt with 15:56:53 <TrueBrain> (I was planning to use the password for that, but .. I like your idea more of only using email) 15:57:36 <TrueBrain> but if we want that people can forget their password and still be able to recover their account, we need to generate that password anyway server-side 15:57:42 <TrueBrain> so we can secure-exchange it to the client 15:57:43 <TrueBrain> hmmm 15:59:50 <frosch123> it's funny to see the emojis vanish and reappear. they have a noticeable color, so register as "movement" in the corner of your eye :p 16:00:09 <TrueBrain> and GitHub is laggy as fuck for me :P 16:00:10 <TrueBrain> which is funny too 16:00:45 <frosch123> i like the progress bar in windows explorer for network shares 16:01:16 <frosch123> they don't know how long it takes, they just make a progressbar that gets slower the longer it takes, and would never reach 100% 16:01:25 <frosch123> when it is done, it just animated quickly the rest of the way 16:01:35 <frosch123> it's totally a troll feature :) 16:01:44 <TrueBrain> but it helps keeping people calm :P 16:01:45 <frosch123> placebo progress 16:03:55 <TrueBrain> okay, the cloud storage is going to be a bit complicated, but I think that is possible without password indeed 16:04:03 <TrueBrain> we just have to setup encryption between cloud and client 16:05:00 <frosch123> the old "how to get a certificate store in ottd" problem :) 16:05:15 <TrueBrain> well, no, take this library for example, it can also setup a shared key 16:05:18 <TrueBrain> to use with encryption 16:05:20 <TrueBrain> (DH) 16:05:26 <TrueBrain> so it is pretty easy implementation wise 16:05:36 <TrueBrain> you just .. have to trust you are talking to the correct remote 16:05:41 <TrueBrain> (no CA, indeed) 16:05:44 <frosch123> exactly 16:06:23 <TrueBrain> we can fix that by changing the email flow to have a webpage in between 16:06:29 <TrueBrain> which is https to openttd.org :) 16:06:43 <TrueBrain> delegate trust to webbrowser :D 16:07:15 <frosch123> oh, we can use that oauth2 workflow for embedded devices 16:07:42 <frosch123> ottd starts browser and already adds a session key to the login 16:07:51 <frosch123> which is used to generate/validate the invite code 16:08:00 <TrueBrain> can we open the browser on all OSes? 16:08:13 <frosch123> noone complained that it does not work 16:08:22 <TrueBrain> it is already in there? :o 16:08:33 <frosch123> bananas urls, newgrf urls, ai/gs urls 16:08:37 <TrueBrain> look at that 16:08:38 <TrueBrain> lol 16:08:39 <TrueBrain> nice 16:08:39 <frosch123> in ottd for > 10 years 16:08:52 <TrueBrain> so that would be even better, yes 16:09:12 <TrueBrain> I like this password-less world, honestly :P 16:10:15 <TrueBrain> but okay, lets first get P1 and P3 in, after that we can see how to do this :) 16:11:16 <frosch123> ah, found it. it's called "oauth2 device authorization flow" 16:11:22 <TrueBrain> PKCE 16:11:37 <TrueBrain> bananas-frontend-cli uses it, I think :P 16:11:40 <frosch123> https://auth0.com/docs/flows/device-authorization-flow 16:12:21 <frosch123> with that ottd does not need to validate the openttd.org authenticiy 16:12:33 <TrueBrain> the user can, indeed 16:12:40 <TrueBrain> well, the browser :P 16:13:15 <TrueBrain> owh, the device authorization flow is different from PKCE flow 16:13:20 <TrueBrain> OAuth has too many flows :P 16:14:10 <TrueBrain> ah, this does not require a local webserver, so that is good :) 16:14:15 <frosch123> well, the point is. ottd tells the browser with which server it can talk to. and the brwoser-login-process validates whether ottd actually talked to the right server 16:14:52 <TrueBrain> MITM can still happen, and a person can be direct to scamopenttd.org :P But I hope a user would spot that :D 16:15:39 <TrueBrain> direct = redirected, english hard 16:15:47 <frosch123> no, openttd would only open opentd.org, it would not just open any url 16:16:02 <TrueBrain> owh, you want to hardcode there the correct URL 16:16:11 <frosch123> yes, as we do for bananas 16:16:11 <TrueBrain> so not depend on the OAuth0 Tenant, as in that picture, to give the correct one 16:16:23 <TrueBrain> that works :) 16:16:34 <frosch123> 1. ottd connects to server (which it thinks is legit) and exchanges session key 16:16:49 <frosch123> 2. ottd starts browser and let openttd.org validate the session key 16:17:03 <frosch123> 3. user copies invite code from browser into ottd 16:17:06 <frosch123> 4. profit 16:17:23 <TrueBrain> yeah, but the Device Auth flow you shows, the Tenant returns the URL to open for validation :) 16:17:26 <TrueBrain> you want to hard-code that 16:17:29 <TrueBrain> which is perfectly fine 16:17:40 <TrueBrain> (just a deviation :D) 16:17:50 <frosch123> oh, did not notice that :) but yes, i want that 16:17:56 <Wolf01> andythenorth, 2 words: adjacency bonus. Kindly suggested by a youtube video. 16:18:13 <TrueBrain> can still be MITM'd btw, but honestly .. that is not what we are trying to protect here :P 16:18:56 <frosch123> the verification_uri is validated by the ottd client, to match the hard-coded format 16:18:57 <TrueBrain> well, a simple IP check for both channel will do fine 16:19:06 <frosch123> it still contains some temporary keys 16:19:13 <TrueBrain> browser session needs to be of same IP as the ottd session 16:19:47 <frosch123> that breaks for proxies 16:19:58 <TrueBrain> where ottd is not proxied and browsers are? 16:20:16 <frosch123> people proxy browsers to watch illegal music or so 16:21:26 <TrueBrain> I think the device auth workflow kinda assumes everything happens over https :D 16:21:33 <andythenorth> Wolf01 pls start discussion thread, adjacency bonus 16:21:38 <andythenorth> time for ideas 16:21:56 <andythenorth> https://civilization.fandom.com/wiki/Adjacency_bonus_(Civ6) 16:22:33 <TrueBrain> frosch123: I guess the browser session should return something to enter in the client directly 16:22:36 <TrueBrain> as that would prevent a MITM attack 16:22:56 <frosch123> yeah, ok, so no device workflow 16:23:02 <frosch123> something else :) 16:23:10 <TrueBrain> it is a solid base, honestly 16:23:45 <TrueBrain> https://auth0.com/docs/flows/authorization-code-flow-with-proof-key-for-code-exchange-pkce 16:23:49 <TrueBrain> PKCE is not much different 16:24:56 <TrueBrain> I like device auth flow more; more what we want to do. We just have to find a way to promote the trust of the browser to ingame :) 16:25:16 <Wolf01> andythenorth: bonus is calculated between industries, stations (and station types), cities, landmarks? 16:25:20 <frosch123> yes, we need some mixture of device flow and pkce 16:25:26 <TrueBrain> I would almost suggest: put the access token in the browser-session too 16:25:35 <TrueBrain> copy/paste that back 16:25:44 <frosch123> ottd needs to create a session first. then the browser needs to validate that the session is valid 16:26:17 <TrueBrain> yeah, basically: ottd needs to start the browser with some verify-code, and the browser-session (or email, or what-ever) needs to return a challenge to put back in ottd 16:26:26 <TrueBrain> I think that is the only way to promote the trust from browser to ottd 16:26:53 <frosch123> yep 16:27:50 <frosch123> hmm, some body parts demand food 16:28:02 <TrueBrain> yeah, time to make xmas dinner 1 of 4 for me :) 16:28:54 <andythenorth> Wolf01 bonus stored per city, or for specific industries / other things being adjacent? 16:31:27 <Wolf01> andythenorth also which kind of bonuses? Load/unload speed and payment should be mandatory, industry stockpile could work for grfs which support it, also production rates 16:32:51 <Wolf01> We already have statues 16:33:54 <Wolf01> We could do station addons which could be built once which affect the station properties or the served industry properties 16:34:49 <Wolf01> Also, something which gives a bonus to X may give a malus to Y 16:35:07 <Wolf01> Adding some strategy 16:35:36 <andythenorth> station beautification bonuses 16:36:13 <Wolf01> Yup, nicer station than competitor attracts more goods 16:36:19 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] JMcKiern commented on pull request #7981: Feature #7735: Implement protocol handling https://git.io/JL1v7 16:39:22 <Wolf01> Roads near farms reduce production? Maybe even a roadtype... dirt roads reduce less, highways reduce more. Roadtypes need a pollution score 16:40:23 <LordAro> https://gist.github.com/LordAro/1701f5a7d4ee5e2e0f6d036aea0bd9f6 made a changelog 16:40:32 <LordAro> comments etc welcome 16:40:51 <andythenorth> Wolf01 start a discussion :) 16:41:01 <andythenorth> the exact ideas are less interesting than what spec would achieve them 16:41:05 <andythenorth> like...who controls what 16:41:18 <andythenorth> LordAro nearly 50 items 16:41:38 <LordAro> it was nearly 200 before i removed all the backported things 16:41:59 <LordAro> 392 total commits since 1.10 branch 16:42:17 <andythenorth> 8288 wat? 16:42:21 <andythenorth> that's nice 16:42:32 <andythenorth> I stopped reading notifications earlier this year, got a bit ragey 16:42:34 <andythenorth> I missed all this 16:45:16 <LordAro> 1.10.0-beta1 was 43 items, for reference 16:55:12 <TrueBrain> LordAro: nice! :D 16:55:44 <TrueBrain> let's hope we can add a few more before we create a beta :D 16:56:07 <TrueBrain> (I have like 2 or 3 open PRs in mind, feature-wise :P) 16:56:09 <_dp_> yeah, so far amount of new features looks kinda disapointing :/ 16:56:27 <TrueBrain> _dp_: might be from your perspective, but given the amount of activity, I am surprised it is this long :D 16:56:35 <LordAro> TrueBrain: as in, in the next 24 hours? :p 16:56:40 * andythenorth is opposite of disappointed 16:56:41 <TrueBrain> LordAro: no 16:56:52 <TrueBrain> LordAro: and I hope we are not going to release beta1 in the next 24 hours :) 16:57:04 <LordAro> i was planning to (try to)... 16:57:07 <LordAro> we usually do 16:57:07 <TrueBrain> why? 16:57:18 <TrueBrain> well, I guess this year should be less usual honestly :D 16:57:29 <LordAro> no great effort to push it to new years, i suppose :p 16:57:48 <TrueBrain> personally, I would prefer if we hold off a bit, till we went through the current PR list 16:58:18 <TrueBrain> (not that they all have to be closed :P But I have like 10 not done, and a few that can be merged with some effort) 16:58:26 <LordAro> is fine, there's no real rush 16:58:27 <TrueBrain> of course we can do that after beta1 too, but .. meh :) 16:58:39 <LordAro> mm, beta1 isn't a freeze 16:58:45 <TrueBrain> yeah, it usually isn't 16:58:48 <TrueBrain> but I always find that odd :P 16:59:00 <TrueBrain> it is some weird soft line in the sand :) 16:59:04 <LordAro> naming scheme long predates me :p 16:59:22 <TrueBrain> but I kinda agree that the release cycle could have some attention 17:00:46 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #7981: Feature #7735: Implement protocol handling https://git.io/JL1f7 17:00:52 <TrueBrain> which aligns more with my comment in ^^ :D 17:01:38 <TrueBrain> personally, I would love to have an "unstable" and "stable" stream, and that we push a new unstable every time we have a big new feature, and stable less often 17:01:44 <TrueBrain> a bit in line with what frosch123 says, I guess 17:01:54 <TrueBrain> and with a standalone launcher, we can also add streams for JGRPP etc 17:02:16 <TrueBrain> and yes, I like the view while sitting on this unicorn .. it looks really pretty :) 17:04:21 <TrueBrain> LordAro: I now see that for years we didn't even do betas :) 17:05:06 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] JMcKiern commented on pull request #7981: Feature #7735: Implement protocol handling https://git.io/JL1JT 17:05:11 <TrueBrain> we once even did an RC1 10 days before release .. lol 17:05:31 <Wolf01> https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=88257 <- andythenorth 17:05:42 <andythenorth> oog the FIRS backlog I keep here is kind of depressing 17:05:47 <andythenorth> I need to have a word with myself 17:06:08 <andythenorth> vehicle grfs never have the same problem 17:06:34 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #7981: Feature #7735: Implement protocol handling https://git.io/JL1JI 17:06:39 <andythenorth> 'fix layouts so they can be built' 17:06:45 <andythenorth> 'fix closure behaviour' 17:06:49 <andythenorth> 'fix opening behaviour' 17:07:09 <andythenorth> 'fix incompatible industry checks' 17:07:22 <andythenorth> 'fix road detection for industries that need to be built in towns' 17:07:39 <andythenorth> 'fix probability 17:07:46 <TrueBrain> LordAro: so with 1.0.0 we started this beta1 on the 24th. This went on for 6 years, up till 1.5.0. Then we didn't do any betas for 3 years. Then we did betas on the weirdest dates :P 17:07:52 <TrueBrain> seems we no longer have a "release cycle" in that sense :D 17:08:12 <andythenorth> it's almost like industries are kind of forced into some old clunky structure :P 17:08:23 <andythenorth> where vehicles have almost complete freedom in the spec 17:08:25 <Wolf01> We don't even have a roadmap, or I might be blind 17:08:28 * andythenorth BIAB 17:22:53 <frosch123> TrueBrain: LordAro: beta was added when the amount of backports after RC1 became too much. it's just a trick to add more testers 17:22:55 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] JMcKiern commented on pull request #7981: Feature #7735: Implement protocol handling https://git.io/JL1Jx 17:23:36 <frosch123> so, we could also have automated betas every 3 months 17:41:01 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/nml] LordAro approved pull request #178: Doc: remove credits section from README https://git.io/JL1Ui 17:41:36 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/nml] LordAro merged pull request #178: Doc: remove credits section from README https://git.io/JLPSu 17:42:57 <andythenorth> ta 17:43:49 <LordAro> (i fixed the commit message too) 17:45:35 <TrueBrain> How dare you :p :D 17:46:48 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 17:50:03 *** gnu_jj_ has joined #openttd 17:53:33 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 17:54:24 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 17:55:35 <andythenorth> deliver building materials to town, town will choose different buildings? 17:55:39 * andythenorth such ideas 17:56:06 <andythenorth> it's really hard to think up economy mechanics that don't require acres of text in a window to explain them 17:57:18 *** gnu_jj has quit IRC 18:04:29 <Samu> Group by shared orders complicated the rebase of my Lifetime profit feature 18:09:45 *** jback has quit IRC 18:10:31 * andythenorth opinions about making content authoring easier? 18:10:47 *** jback has joined #openttd 18:11:06 <andythenorth> some things like 'build industry near a road tile' or 'get a property of a neighbouring train vehicle' are pretty tricky in nml 18:11:18 <andythenorth> options I though of to sanitise that 18:11:32 <andythenorth> * suck it up, every author writes their own nml 18:11:49 *** Wormnest has joined #openttd 18:12:04 <andythenorth> * increase the range of vars OpenTTD offers 18:12:32 <andythenorth> * bake stored procedures into the toolchain, so nml can just simulate providing extra vars 18:12:57 <andythenorth> * again the tool chain, but macros for actual nml not stored procedures (I dislike this but added it for completeness) 18:13:32 <andythenorth> * develop a helper library and ship it as some kind of module that authors can use 18:13:53 <andythenorth> I have example code for some of these to show cases and solutions, because words are very wordy 18:19:55 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] DorpsGek pushed 1 commits to master https://git.io/JL1T5 18:19:56 <DorpsGek> - Update: Translations from eints (by translators) 18:21:58 <Heiki> oh, sorry about that one 18:22:43 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 18:23:01 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] frosch123 opened pull request #8426: Simplify GUI to search server on internet or LAN https://git.io/JL1TA 18:24:07 <LordAro> oohi 18:24:09 <LordAro> -i 18:24:55 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 18:25:11 <Samu> unfinished language strings aren't being updated or checked for consistency with strgen 18:25:14 <Samu> is that intended? 18:25:34 <LordAro> Samu: not particularly, but they're dead code really 18:25:41 <LordAro> they're not used at all 18:25:49 <LordAro> until someone picks them up again, they can be ignored 18:38:46 *** jback has quit IRC 18:45:31 * andythenorth should rewrite this to procedures https://github.com/andythenorth/firs/blob/master/src/templates/location_check_macros_tile.pynml 18:45:56 <andythenorth> currently it relies on building a stack of switches, and chaining 'next switch' 18:46:22 <andythenorth> if the checks all just returned 0 or 1 I could just AND them or OR them as needed, one line 18:49:59 *** Samu has quit IRC 18:52:57 <frosch123> be careful with that. the bigger the scope of a switch/procedure, the longer the va2 id remains blocked, the faster you run out of ids 18:54:29 <andythenorth> I ran into a similar issue with spritegroups last week 18:54:50 <frosch123> same thing 18:57:10 <andythenorth> it's quite interesting 18:57:43 <andythenorth> with a generator and procedures, it's really almost sane to write grfs 18:57:47 <andythenorth> until I hit the limits :P 18:58:39 <andythenorth> I do feel like I'm reinventing primitive computing here but eh 19:04:51 <_dp_> Am I missing something or has DC_NO_RAIL_OVERLAP been unused for ages? 19:06:55 <andythenorth> this brought Eddi|zuHause to mind https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oyx3xkdi4uw 19:10:01 <frosch123> _dp_: yes, it's oldai stuff :) 19:10:19 <frosch123> so, unused since 0.7 19:10:34 <frosch123> blame truebrain :p 19:12:15 <TrueBrain> Well, I am not sorry I removed the old AI so you can suck it :p 19:12:49 <TrueBrain> Funny how some remnants still appear :D 19:13:05 <TrueBrain> I mean .. 13 years later now? :) 19:20:21 <andythenorth> @seen borg 19:20:21 <DorpsGek> andythenorth: borg was last seen in #openttd 2 weeks, 2 days, 22 hours, 33 minutes, and 18 seconds ago: <Borg> if that would be an network game. you had to transfer 1GB? 19:21:57 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain approved pull request #8413: Fix: Don't lower tree density if spreading is not enabled https://git.io/JL1Lk 19:23:40 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain approved pull request #8415: Feature: Add an option to disable tree growth completely https://git.io/JL1Lq 19:24:44 <LordAro> adding options? :o 19:25:11 <TrueBrain> well, adding 1 option to an existing setting 19:25:12 <TrueBrain> so kinda 19:25:14 <TrueBrain> :) 19:25:40 <TrueBrain> (if you disagree btw, let me know, ofc :) ) 19:26:16 <TrueBrain> https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/8401 <- this test-save is AWESOME 19:26:29 <TrueBrain> seriously, wtf ... that is amazing 19:27:09 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #8401: Change: Towns don't build dead-end road bridges https://git.io/JL1Ll 19:27:17 <TrueBrain> added an image to understand why it is wow 19:29:59 <_dp_> hm, so, apparently, not all company settings are company settings :p https://i.imgur.com/mD3Zgl4.png 19:30:10 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain approved pull request #8401: Change: Towns don't build dead-end road bridges https://git.io/JL1LE 19:30:23 <TrueBrain> _dp_: don't be like this .... :P :P 19:30:23 <TrueBrain> :D 19:30:30 <TrueBrain> putting salt in deep wounds :P 19:31:50 <andythenorth> we should always remember 19:31:56 <andythenorth> former 'us' were fucking idiots 19:31:59 <andythenorth> and we should be kind 19:32:09 <_dp_> I tried to review a pr but so far only finding issues in openttd itself :p 19:32:10 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain requested changes for pull request #8426: Simplify GUI to search server on internet or LAN https://git.io/JL1LV 19:32:40 <TrueBrain> frosch123 is not going to like preview mode ... :P It made spotting this too easy :D 19:33:10 <_dp_> haha, I was waiting for a preview of that pr as well xD 19:33:35 <TrueBrain> and I love that I can paste images on GitHub 19:33:43 <TrueBrain> means I don't have random images all over my local disk :P 19:33:46 <andythenorth> Action 14 to communicate what town register numbers are used for what industry <-> towns (or go home) 19:33:56 * andythenorth talking to Tyler about economy stuff 19:34:13 <frosch123> it's weird you made a preview, when the buttons are disabled in emscripten 19:34:33 <TrueBrain> disabled doesn't mean invisible :) 19:35:21 <TrueBrain> (and I made the preview to validate they were disabled, I have to admit :P) 19:38:30 *** TooTallTyler has joined #openttd 19:39:47 <TrueBrain> TooTallTyler: your savegame is sick :P 19:40:10 <andythenorth> WASM or didn't happen 19:40:17 <andythenorth> I'm not compiling the patch :P 19:41:10 <TrueBrain> "that patch" 19:41:19 <TrueBrain> or "the", even worse :P 19:44:14 <TooTallTyler> It was helpful for trial-and-error testing and I figured I'd include it 19:50:27 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #8416: Change: [Linkgraph] Allow job threads to be aborted early when clearing schedule https://git.io/JL1Lj 19:51:24 <TrueBrain> frosch123: any idea what we should do with https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/7000 ? 19:52:23 <TrueBrain> that PR was created 2 years ago now, our oldest PR :D 19:52:34 <TrueBrain> well, in 5 days, 2 years 19:52:34 <TrueBrain> :D 19:52:40 <frosch123> it was already closed 19:52:57 <andythenorth> it could have stopped here https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/7000#issuecomment-450496709 19:53:08 <andythenorth> it's funny how things fall in holes 19:55:49 <frosch123> TrueBrain: that PR is dead. if someone needs something, they need to start from scratch 19:56:12 <andythenorth> I tend to agree 19:57:46 <TrueBrain> I did not properly read the comments, I see; my apologizes :D 20:00:14 * andythenorth posts this and sort of whistles innocently https://gist.githubusercontent.com/andythenorth/930e321dfec44029b59383eda85b08b1/raw/0b8b5377caf3728a61b73a131683414d3e005827/gistfile1.txt 20:00:22 <TrueBrain> will see if I can write a proper reply to that PR after xmas :D 20:01:41 <andythenorth> I do want the original var from 7000 20:01:48 <andythenorth> but not enough to do anything about it currently 20:02:08 <andythenorth> I 'solved' it for me because I only use one relevant set of railtypes 20:02:14 <andythenorth> so I never see the problem in my games 20:02:18 <andythenorth> but I get bug reports from players 20:03:52 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] frosch123 updated pull request #8426: Simplify GUI to search server on internet or LAN https://git.io/JL1TA 20:05:32 <frosch123> TrueBrain: basically, i am not interested in reviewing any newgrf feature, until there is a group of people who fix nrt 20:05:45 <frosch123> newgrf fixes are fine 20:06:17 <TrueBrain> I would like to know what is wrong with NRT (like, I honestly do not know), but it is xmas, and I promised you I will not bring up NRT :D 20:06:33 <TrueBrain> so lets keep that for another day :) 20:07:00 <TrueBrain> and about what you are saying: understood, will process PRs as such :) 20:08:45 *** Samu has joined #openttd 20:09:05 <milek7> https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/discussions/8420#discussioncomment-240202 20:09:20 <milek7> I don't understand what frosch wants to do here at all 20:10:20 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #7193: Fix #6468: Load correct version of AI as specified during the time of its save. https://git.io/JL1qt 20:10:21 <frosch123> it's an attempt so people can only follow/stalk you, if you agree 20:10:37 <milek7> but how? 20:11:00 <frosch123> server will not tell you who is online, unless you prove that you are their friend 20:12:17 <TrueBrain> jingle bells, jingle bells, jingle all the wayyyy 20:12:47 <milek7> frosch123: thanks, this one sentence is a lot more clear than what is in the comment :P 20:13:40 <frosch123> TrueBrain: i never use "request changes". for some reason gh does not invalidate them after push 20:13:50 <andythenorth> this is pretty cool https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=1239593#p1239593 20:13:52 <TrueBrain> frosch123: it is VERY annoying indeed 20:14:06 <TrueBrain> like .. that is not useful at all GitHub 20:14:19 <TrueBrain> you can click on it btw, and re-request review 20:14:26 <TrueBrain> I think that is how they intend their workflow 20:14:59 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain approved pull request #8426: Simplify GUI to search server on internet or LAN https://git.io/JL1q3 20:15:14 <frosch123> it was a weird window. i removed some code to get the sizing right 20:15:32 <andythenorth> I have not been talking about NRT, owing to some guily 20:15:35 <andythenorth> guily? 20:15:37 <andythenorth> guilt 20:15:38 <TrueBrain> preview looks good now :) 20:15:53 <andythenorth> but at some point I will do NRT Road Hog, and we might find some things out 20:15:58 <TrueBrain> andythenorth: we are not talking about NRT. 20:16:02 <andythenorth> oh yes! 20:16:11 <frosch123> andythenorth: wrap more presents for children? 20:16:16 <andythenorth> not started yet 20:16:30 <frosch123> don't you have to finish till tomorrow? 20:16:37 <andythenorth> not many this year 20:16:43 <andythenorth> it's kind of horribly ironic that I campaigned for NRT and haven't made a grf with it 20:16:47 <andythenorth> I am kind of aware :P 20:16:55 <Wolf01> Ahaha 20:17:07 <andythenorth> it's just so addictive making Horse :P 20:17:13 *** Lejving has joined #openttd 20:17:15 <andythenorth> the train spec is so complete and mostly easy to work with 20:17:22 <andythenorth> I have an idea...I do an idea 20:17:50 <TrueBrain> https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/7286 <- that PR can be cherry-picked for the good bits I think; having the command is nice :) 20:17:54 <TrueBrain> the PR grew a bit out of hand :P 20:19:40 * andythenorth makes plans 20:19:48 <andythenorth> release FIRS 4, do next thing 20:19:53 <andythenorth> what is next thing!? 20:19:58 <andythenorth> pls don't say CSS 20:20:00 <Wolf01> Play tanks 20:20:06 <frosch123> TrueBrain: what happened to your led project? 20:20:21 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] JGRennison commented on pull request #8416: Change: [Linkgraph] Allow job threads to be aborted early when clearing schedule https://git.io/JL1q0 20:20:42 <TrueBrain> frosch123: prioritized OpenTTD over it :( Mainly as they arrived REALLY late :( 20:21:12 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #7851: [WIP] Change: add support for next/previous railtype global hotkeys https://git.io/JL1qz 20:21:24 <frosch123> well, i know that andy is the xkcd author. but i wondered whether tb is this guy: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TvlpIojusBE 20:22:12 <andythenorth> oh that is very interesting 20:22:18 <andythenorth> it's like a product idea I have 20:22:20 <TrueBrain> I like it when people can defend their choices; makes reviewing so incredibly easy :D (refering to #8416) 20:22:22 * andythenorth says no more 20:22:42 <TrueBrain> frosch123: you literally have seen my face ... do I look like that? Like, really? 20:22:50 <TrueBrain> but yes, I could have done that :P 20:22:56 <TrueBrain> so I can understand that :D 20:23:04 <TrueBrain> that guy is (in a positive way) insane btw :P 20:24:02 <milek7> there is no snow this year, no motivation to setup lights :P 20:24:41 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] andythenorth commented on pull request #7851: [WIP] Change: add support for next/previous railtype global hotkeys https://git.io/JL1qP 20:25:09 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain approved pull request #8416: Change: [Linkgraph] Allow job threads to be aborted early when clearing schedule https://git.io/JL1qX 20:25:39 <TrueBrain> so many approvals tonight :P Sadly, small patches that were created recently ..... :P 20:26:06 <andythenorth> TooTallTyler so how do we think this cargos -> town idea would work? 20:26:21 <andythenorth> the town grows, but stays 'primitive' until certain cargos are delivered? 20:26:44 <TrueBrain> like water 20:26:45 <TrueBrain> and food 20:26:49 <TrueBrain> waiiiiitttt a minutteeeee 20:26:56 <andythenorth> but implemented differently 20:27:14 <andythenorth> it's a test of something, using existing spec 20:27:21 <Wolf01> I'm so bored that bad thoughts happen. I need to change my desk :| 20:27:32 <TooTallTyler> Yeah. Advanced buildings like skyscrapers only build when the town has received building supplies or whatever in the past month 20:27:38 <TrueBrain> milek7: from the discussions, is it a bit clear for you how to implement Phase 1 and Phase 3? Need any more info or help there? 20:27:42 <andythenorth> and that would limit the population? 20:28:08 <TooTallTyler> No, it would still grow basic houses which have no limitations 20:28:34 * andythenorth rephrases 20:28:43 <TooTallTyler> ITL limits the number of skyscrapers by house population. I think it's 1000 people per skyscraper but I'll have to check the code 20:29:30 <andythenorth> it would limit the population *density*? :) 20:30:43 <TooTallTyler> Actually, it might be good to have flats need building supplies too. They add 100 population each and spike the population as soon as they're invented in 1945. 20:32:02 <Samu> TrueBrain, https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/issues/6468 20:32:29 <Samu> Wormnest explains it best 20:33:37 <andythenorth> town growth is a bit of poisoned chalice 20:33:48 <andythenorth> I always grow a couple of towns to build a big pax network 20:33:49 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on issue #8423: Can't build on Mac https://git.io/JLXBh 20:33:57 <andythenorth> but growing too many, the map gets full 20:34:15 <andythenorth> but also I made FIRS Steeltown scrap production depend on town population 20:34:57 <TrueBrain> Samu: I am not interested in a treasure hunt for information :) We have plenty of stuff to do as it is, so if you want me to review your PR, make my life easier, and invest some time in your own PRs :) It would help greatly! Tnx :) 20:36:34 <TooTallTyler> Yeah, I'm all for forcing town growth to be intentional 20:39:24 <andythenorth> ok, so I get a FIRS 4 beta done, then I explore this town register idea 20:39:49 <andythenorth> it doesn't depend on actual cargos, it depends on the industries writing to a register to say 'happy' or not 20:39:58 <andythenorth> which I think simplifies a great deal of it 20:40:22 <TooTallTyler> Yes, and that would enable you to choose different growth cargos in different economies, and ITL won't care 20:40:33 <andythenorth> TooTallTyler is it boolean 0/1, or like 16 values, or 255 values or something? 20:40:44 <andythenorth> how granular is the choice you can make? 20:41:05 <TooTallTyler> I think boolean Happy/Not Happy would be sufficient 20:41:07 <TooTallTyler> Actually 20:41:31 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 20:41:44 <TooTallTyler> Maybe two levels of cargo could be interesting. Flats require one cargo, skyscrapers require two. 20:43:00 <TrueBrain> Samu: owh, and remember: it is not only important to know what the bug was (for which you can link that issue just fine), but also why you think this solution is the correct one to fix that problem. What is your reasoning, what was your intention with this fix, why you think this should be it 20:43:26 <TrueBrain> as just seeing code .. is not enough for that :) Nor is knowing what the bug is you think you are fixing :) Don't make us do all the work :) 20:46:06 <andythenorth> TooTallTyler I'll have a look at other economies 20:46:39 <andythenorth> current thinking is for Steeltown, where there is a builder's yard that accepts 3 different cargos, but would report 'happy or not' 20:46:51 <andythenorth> and a vehicle distributor, with one cargo, and similar 20:48:23 <andythenorth> oh...can we do negative values? :) 20:48:49 <andythenorth> does alcohol improve a town, or hold it back? :D https://grf.farm/firs/4.0.0-alpha-4/html/economies.html#temperate_basic 20:49:08 <TooTallTyler> Wouldn't that just be a 0 / Not Happy? 20:49:38 <andythenorth> probably :) 20:49:52 <andythenorth> I need some way to control industries writing to the register 20:50:03 <andythenorth> I have lots of registers, they can probably communicate :P 20:50:56 <andythenorth> peat -> powerplant = happy in arctic https://grf.farm/firs/4.0.0-alpha-4/html/economies.html#arctic_basic 20:51:11 <TooTallTyler> Agreed 20:51:11 <andythenorth> peat, the worst fuel to burn environmentally :| 20:51:34 <andythenorth> build a geothermal plant, supply ensp monthly, town is happy 20:51:39 <andythenorth> oh this could open up hydro as well :) 20:51:51 <andythenorth> we need industries that can flood areas :P 20:52:51 <andythenorth> innovation! 20:54:03 <TooTallTyler> Was it Warren Buffet who said the first trillionaire would make their fortune in green tech? 20:55:08 <andythenorth> I am pretty aware that Steeltown does not feature battery EV factory :P 20:55:13 <andythenorth> nor carbon capture facility 20:58:34 * andythenorth going to add a gas grid to FIRS :P 20:58:43 <milek7> TrueBrain: I'll just implement P1-P3 later and discuss then 20:58:43 <milek7> honestly these discussions are not useful, without some sort of dev board voting 20:58:43 <milek7> as everbody just dumps their idea, but that doesn't give information whether we actually want that or no 20:59:19 <TrueBrain> I would skip P2 for now honestly 20:59:23 <andythenorth> milek7 ^ that is pretty neat description of one of the unsolved problems :) 20:59:26 <andythenorth> Apache votes? o_O 20:59:28 <TrueBrain> and P3 comments show what people would like; that needs no voting really 20:59:34 <TrueBrain> it is just more: what is realistic to implement as first 20:59:41 <TrueBrain> and that is up to who-ever writes it, honestly 20:59:44 <TrueBrain> we have to start somewhere 20:59:49 <TrueBrain> but at least now you can keep in mind what the requests are 21:00:57 <TooTallTyler> andythenorth: You might try the waste production of my industry set paired with ITL. I think it would be a fun addition to FIRS :) 21:01:31 <TrueBrain> milek7: I think one of the things that became clear from the discussions that it would be nice if we can use a library that can also be used from Python etc 21:01:34 <TrueBrain> dunno what is possible there 21:01:58 <andythenorth> TooTallTyler what's the mechanic? :) 21:02:51 <TooTallTyler> Houses produce Waste which you can collect and ship to the Recycling Center for sorting 21:03:03 <TooTallTyler> Much like the Recycling Depot, but produced by houses directly 21:03:14 <TooTallTyler> I need to finish my garbage truck set 21:10:28 <TooTallTyler> Also workers at industries, but I'll make a video explaining those sometime 21:13:02 <andythenorth> I've considered industry workers, but it's not a direction I want to take 21:13:15 <andythenorth> it's easier for me to only have one 'supply' cargo 21:13:28 <TooTallTyler> They're not a supply cargo for me. Just another thing to transport 21:13:32 <TooTallTyler> For "immersion" 21:13:37 <andythenorth> interesting 21:13:47 <TooTallTyler> And they spice up passenger networks beyond simply connecting towns to each other 21:14:28 <TooTallTyler> I also have pretty strong rules putting industries in or near towns. Maybe too strong for a set with as many industries as FIRS but it's one of my favorite features 21:15:12 <TooTallTyler> I've been meaning to make videos explaining these features to players 21:22:31 <andythenorth> video is the new thing eh 21:22:34 <andythenorth> do a livestream :P 21:24:15 <TooTallTyler> Oh no, I need the power of editing 21:25:58 <Timberwolf> I never edit anything, which explains a lot really. 21:26:06 <Timberwolf> I claim it's a "stylistic choice" 21:28:28 <andythenorth> I edit later 21:28:32 <andythenorth> from a lot of material :| 21:29:03 <andythenorth> I had friends in school who could write 1000 words for a 1000 word essay then stop 21:29:15 <andythenorth> I wrote 4-5000 words and edited :| 21:31:59 <milek7> oh no, 1000 word essay 21:32:43 <milek7> I struggled with every sentence, but thankfully there was only requirement for 250 :P 21:35:10 <TooTallTyler> My first published work was 2500 words when I submitted it to the magazine for consideration, and they told me they'd publish if I edited it down to 250 words :P 21:35:27 <TooTallTyler> The photo was the size of a postage stamp 21:56:40 <Timberwolf> mmm, spaghetti. https://i.imgur.com/x7fG3Hk.png 21:57:38 <Timberwolf> I should make Tracks use the 64-sprite junction layout so it can have nice points like the Roads tram rails. 22:04:38 <TooTallTyler> That would be very pretty 22:06:28 <andythenorth> right FIRS 4 or bust now 22:06:37 <andythenorth> not today, but Beta by New Year 22:06:41 <andythenorth> or die trying 22:09:12 <TooTallTyler> Good luck! 22:09:56 <andythenorth> cheers 22:10:04 <andythenorth> if I die now, I will regret that comment 22:10:08 <andythenorth> jinx! 22:10:13 <andythenorth> I'll regret that too :) 22:11:07 <TooTallTyler> So no NewGRF competition for you? I'm going to give it a go. 22:12:14 <andythenorth> probs not 22:12:43 <andythenorth> good to see though 22:22:14 *** TooTallTyler has quit IRC 22:23:12 * andythenorth bed 22:23:13 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 22:32:58 *** frosch123 has quit IRC 22:38:20 *** Flygon has joined #openttd 23:12:15 *** Wolf01 has quit IRC 23:29:32 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick commented on pull request #7193: Fix #6468: Load correct version of AI as specified during the time of its save. https://git.io/JL1sX 23:29:57 <Samu> damn i should've been in bed already 23:30:01 <Samu> cyas good night 23:30:05 *** Samu has quit IRC 23:36:40 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] michicc merged pull request #8416: Change: [Linkgraph] Allow job threads to be aborted early when clearing schedule https://git.io/JLPtt 23:36:49 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] michicc merged pull request #8413: Fix: Don't lower tree density if spreading is not enabled https://git.io/JL6H9 23:36:58 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] michicc merged pull request #8415: Feature: Add an option to disable tree growth completely https://git.io/JLi5i 23:37:18 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] michicc merged pull request #8401: Change: Towns don't build dead-end road bridges https://git.io/JLzst 23:40:40 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] michicc merged pull request #8426: Simplify GUI to search server on internet or LAN https://git.io/JL1TA 23:41:14 *** Wormnest has quit IRC 23:41:27 <TrueBrain> Mmmmmmonsterspreeee 23:41:56 <michi_cc> Now I can at least feel usefull on christmas eve :) 23:43:25 <TrueBrain> Good start of the Xmas days :) 23:43:33 <TrueBrain> Ho ho ho 23:44:10 *** nielsm has quit IRC 23:47:40 <LordAro> nice :) 23:49:22 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] michicc updated pull request #7589: Change: Always apply inflation from 1920 to 2090, no matter the game start year. https://git.io/fjWc7 23:49:30 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] michicc commented on pull request #7589: Change: Always apply inflation from 1920 to 2090, no matter the game start year. https://git.io/JL1sh