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00:06:21 <coopserver> <John> Anyone here? 00:08:41 <coopserver> <John> I need a peer review on my MSH 00:10:32 <Sylf> 1 sec 00:10:42 <Sylf> !password 00:10:42 <coopserver> Sylf: inland 00:10:46 <coopserver> *** Game paused (connecting clients) 00:10:49 <coopserver> *** Sylf has joined 00:10:50 <coopserver> *** Game unpaused (connecting clients) 00:10:57 <coopserver> *** Sylf has joined company #1 00:11:31 <coopserver> <Sylf> I'm going to rename this BBH because of the distance to the main station 00:11:43 <coopserver> <Sylf> someone will probably build a sideline hub there 00:12:05 <coopserver> <Sylf> and when you sign a hub, place a space in front of the sign 00:13:17 <coopserver> <John> yeah, I forgot about the space 00:13:35 <coopserver> <Sylf> anyway. 00:13:41 <coopserver> <Sylf> some actual hub stuff 00:15:57 <coopserver> <Sylf> ok, where shall we start 00:16:13 <coopserver> <John> Let me ask some stuff 00:16:17 <coopserver> <Sylf> yup 00:16:28 <coopserver> <John> Anything can be improved by PBS? 00:16:37 <coopserver> <Sylf> nope. 00:16:40 <coopserver> <John> like the blocking part 00:17:08 <coopserver> <Sylf> that blocking part shouldn't have any cross over at that point 00:17:27 <coopserver> <Sylf> what's needed is a balancer when it merges with the other 2 lines 00:17:54 <coopserver> <Sylf> when the balancer is so far away from the merges, the trains' path finders will probably not look so far ahead 00:18:08 <coopserver> <Sylf> so a balancer works better when it's closer to the merges 00:18:46 <coopserver> <John> what's the actual PF look-ahead? 00:19:34 <coopserver> <John> I get what's the problem.. but the terrain there is kind of restrictive 00:20:10 <coopserver> <Sylf> when there are multiple possible paths available from the train's current position to its next destination, it starts to do comparison of what the best path is 00:20:45 <coopserver> <Sylf> part of that calculation includes number of red signals in some of its most immediate tiles 00:21:00 <coopserver> <Sylf> so that's the lookahead 00:21:21 <coopserver> <Sylf> let's see what can be done around that area 00:21:28 <coopserver> <Sylf> we can tackle one area at a time 00:22:32 <coopserver> <John> 8 bridges? 00:23:08 <coopserver> <Sylf> yeah, that should work 00:24:54 <coopserver> <Sylf> those bridges now occupy less space 00:25:06 <coopserver> <Sylf> so, just north of there, we have more space to do other stuff 00:25:40 <coopserver> <Sylf> here's one trick... 00:25:47 <coopserver> <o11c> isn't the pair of bridges just northwest of those bad 00:25:57 <coopserver> <o11c> because the split/join is both the same way 00:26:09 <coopserver> <Sylf> if we separate the two lines, the mergers gets easier 00:27:14 <coopserver> <Sylf> see 00:27:21 <coopserver> <John> yup 00:27:28 <coopserver> <Sylf> the double bridges now turned into a balancer 00:28:27 <coopserver> <John> hold on.. that's.. . 00:28:56 <coopserver> <Sylf> question about something? 00:29:32 <coopserver> <John> oh I see what you did there 00:30:00 <coopserver> <Sylf> we're good so far? 00:30:01 <coopserver> <John> you took the double bridges 00:30:11 <coopserver> <John> and didn't join them 00:30:19 <coopserver> <Sylf> right 00:30:20 <coopserver> <John> like right after, 00:30:33 <coopserver> <John> you joined them into the output 00:30:57 <coopserver> <John> yeah, clever 00:31:02 <coopserver> <Sylf> for both Join A and Join B, they have inputs from both lines 00:31:09 <coopserver> <Sylf> so that's the line balancing 00:31:37 <coopserver> <Sylf> we can use the same trick else where as well 00:31:55 <coopserver> <Sylf> we can move on to the part just north of those 2 joins 00:32:22 <coopserver> <Sylf> so, I'm going to use the double bridge there 00:32:37 <LMBproninja> Sylf, thanks I got into the Welcome server 00:32:59 <coopserver> <Sylf> let's see if we can mix the lines like that 00:33:00 <LMBproninja> Total noob at coop so I didn't want to disturb the Public game 00:33:13 <coopserver> <Sylf> now we need to start counting tiles to give each lines enough waiting spaces 00:33:25 <LMBproninja> First time multiplayer ottd, it's very cool 00:33:50 <coopserver> <John> This CL != TL needs getting used to 00:34:10 <coopserver> <Sylf> multiplayer is the only way to go ;) 00:34:16 <coopserver> <John> I'm still quite confused how that works 00:34:19 <LMBproninja> My eyes are open 00:34:39 <LMBproninja> But my brain is overloading lo 00:34:41 <LMBproninja> lol 00:35:04 <coopserver> <Sylf> hrm 00:36:28 <coopserver> <Sylf> so... 00:36:36 <coopserver> <Sylf> here's one thing about TL4 CL2 00:36:46 <coopserver> <Sylf> see the !SLOW part 00:36:48 <coopserver> <John> Oh 00:36:50 <coopserver> <John> yeah 00:36:58 <coopserver> <Sylf> normally, that would be ok, especially with TL3 00:37:14 <coopserver> <Sylf> but that alas, we're playing TL 4 00:37:18 <coopserver> <John> that should be OK with any TL 00:37:25 <coopserver> <John> right??? 00:38:29 <coopserver> <Sylf> hrm 00:38:36 <coopserver> <Sylf> oh wait 00:38:49 <coopserver> <Sylf> that line will be a duplicate 00:38:56 <coopserver> <o11c> /me has long since lost track of what's supposed to connect to what, and is glad he's not playing yet 00:38:57 <coopserver> <John> see !Hypocrysy 00:39:13 <coopserver> <Sylf> actually, that's not slow 00:39:23 <coopserver> <Sylf> only when you do that, it's slow 00:39:36 <coopserver> <Sylf> that's and you're not slow again 00:41:51 <coopserver> <Sylf> crap 00:43:31 <coopserver> <John> About that prio 00:43:44 <coopserver> <Sylf> and just like that, that part is simpler than before 00:44:19 <coopserver> <Sylf> yes? 00:44:54 <coopserver> <John> do we really need like 6-7 tiles of priority for 4-tile trains? 00:45:10 <coopserver> <Sylf> why do you think so? 00:46:10 <coopserver> <John> ^ right? 00:46:13 <coopserver> <Sylf> yes 00:47:05 <coopserver> <Sylf> you think the prio should be bigger? 00:47:18 <coopserver> <Sylf> or smaller? 00:47:21 <coopserver> <John> I think it should be smaller 00:48:11 <coopserver> <Sylf> maybe. we'll see 00:48:25 <coopserver> <John> okay :) 00:48:42 <coopserver> <Sylf> now, we have 2 more sections 00:49:02 <coopserver> <Sylf> first, we'll work on the merger going north 00:49:03 <coopserver> <John> what do you mean by signal gap 00:49:11 <coopserver> <Sylf> which one? 00:49:23 <coopserver> <Sylf> add ! or signalgap2 or something so I'll know 00:50:13 <coopserver> <Sylf> ok, so 00:50:14 <coopserver> <John> ywah 00:50:21 <coopserver> <John> I know it's ugly 00:50:30 <coopserver> <Sylf> a train that's taking that red path 00:50:45 <coopserver> <Sylf> there is that one section in the middle of the cross that has 2 tiles without a signal 00:50:50 <coopserver> <Sylf> that's the signal gap 00:51:15 <coopserver> <Sylf> so, any time you cross lines like that, it's a no-no 00:51:36 <coopserver> <John> CL? 00:51:53 <coopserver> <o11c> that makes a double left turn with the one right before the bridge, right? 00:51:54 <coopserver> <Sylf> yes, we'll need to be careful with CL with config like that 00:52:09 <coopserver> <John> esp. here when its really just for double bridges 00:52:27 <coopserver> <Sylf> but actually, to make the whole hub smaller, we're going to move the merger further south 00:52:51 <coopserver> <John> sooo much terraforming :) 00:53:03 <coopserver> <Sylf> and when you start to see how it can be done, the whole lot of magic happens 00:55:31 <coopserver> <Sylf> there, that wasn't so terrible 00:55:39 <coopserver> <Sylf> :) 00:55:59 <coopserver> <o11c> that S bend just before is silly 00:56:11 <coopserver> <Sylf> that? 00:56:13 <coopserver> <o11c> yeah 00:56:14 <coopserver> <Sylf> yeah 00:56:15 <coopserver> <Sylf> it was 00:56:20 <coopserver> <John> :) 00:56:31 <coopserver> <o11c> afk, but it's nice watching 00:58:16 <coopserver> <John> wow that's starting to look like a nice hub 00:58:21 <coopserver> <Sylf> it's not the prettiest, but that'll work 00:58:38 <coopserver> <Sylf> :) it's just being able to picture what fits where 00:58:46 <coopserver> <Sylf> now comes the painful part 00:58:48 <coopserver> <John> I'm out of practice really 00:58:55 <coopserver> <John> painful, what? 00:59:02 <coopserver> <Sylf> destroying the whole lot we built a while ago, spending so much time 00:59:18 <coopserver> <John> noooooooooooooooo............................... 00:59:24 <coopserver> <John> :) 00:59:47 <coopserver> *** BallC has joined company #1 00:59:52 <coopserver> <Sylf> and all of sudden, we're left with a split that's so far away from the rest :D 00:59:54 <coopserver> <BallC> back 01:01:58 <coopserver> <Sylf> just like that, we have 01:02:04 <coopserver> <Sylf> a pretty handsome hub 01:02:06 <coopserver> <John> A diagonal curve of 1.5 is CL2, always? 01:02:12 <coopserver> <Sylf> yup. 01:02:21 <coopserver> <John> good 01:02:44 <coopserver> <BallC> Q on that CL1 sign 01:02:50 <coopserver> <Sylf> all of sudden, the BBH sign is not in synch with the placement of the hub itself :P 01:02:51 <coopserver> <BallC> I thought back and forth it was fine? 01:03:40 <coopserver> <Sylf> ok, on that SLOW? thing I just changed 01:03:47 <coopserver> <Sylf> do you think it'll be slow? 01:04:05 <coopserver> <John> depends 01:04:12 <coopserver> <BallC> I thought it was only two turns in the same direction 01:04:26 <coopserver> <John> depends on the train 01:04:47 <coopserver> <Sylf> this is the train 01:04:51 <coopserver> <Sylf> it has the CL of 2 01:05:09 <coopserver> <John> the wagons are .5? 01:05:15 <coopserver> <Sylf> yup. 01:05:44 <coopserver> <Sylf> wagons of 0.25 can have different characteristics :P 01:06:08 <coopserver> <John> see blue 01:06:09 <coopserver> <Sylf> 0.25 are like the maglev wagons, chameleon wagons and such 01:06:14 <coopserver> <John> thats the problem 01:06:24 <coopserver> <John> perhaps 01:06:28 <coopserver> <John> idk 01:06:29 <coopserver> <Sylf> but we have 2 tiles in the middle 01:06:41 <coopserver> <Sylf> so isn't that CL2? 01:06:50 <coopserver> <John> dude.. I have no idea 01:06:55 <coopserver> <Sylf> ok, the big answer is , yes, it is slow 01:06:56 <coopserver> <BallC> it is CL2 01:07:00 <coopserver> <Sylf> but not because of that part 01:07:14 <coopserver> <Sylf> but it's the 1 tile jog that's causing the slow down 01:07:43 <coopserver> <Sylf> ..... 01:07:44 <coopserver> <BallC> no slow down 01:07:48 <coopserver> <John> wait, that was full speed 01:07:49 <coopserver> <Sylf> and it proves me wrong 01:08:00 <coopserver> <BallC> slowed to 200 01:08:06 <coopserver> <John> and that's obviously no CL2 01:08:10 <coopserver> <BallC> as soon as it hit the second turn 01:08:34 <coopserver> <Sylf> so, what I'm curious about is... 01:09:15 <coopserver> <BallC> full speed 01:09:44 <coopserver> <BallC> 200 as soon as it hit the 2nd turn 01:10:23 <coopserver> <BallC> so point taken -- no 1 tile "jogs" 01:11:20 <coopserver> <John> I'm confused 01:11:26 <coopserver> <John> how is CL calculated? 01:11:52 <coopserver> <BallC> there's a wiki article with pictures 01:12:43 <coopserver> <Sylf> http://wiki.openttd.org/Game_Mechanics#Trains 01:12:49 <coopserver> <Sylf> that's where I go to 01:13:12 <coopserver> <Sylf> from that chart, we read ... we're playing with monorail (read the monorail column) 01:13:28 <coopserver> <Sylf> and the train has tilt, so gets 20% speed bonus on curves 01:13:51 <coopserver> <Sylf> CL2 is 3 half tiles, so... 01:14:11 <coopserver> <Sylf> 198km/h (monorail) * 120% = something around 236km/h 01:14:50 <coopserver> <BallC> John: I just made a CL2 loop near the network plan 01:15:43 <coopserver> <John> I get it, sylf 01:16:21 <coopserver> <John> wait, BALLC 01:16:28 <coopserver> <BallC> ? 01:16:32 <coopserver> <John> that is kind of obvious :) 01:16:57 <coopserver> <John> I meant how do you calculate CL 01:17:05 <coopserver> <John> from train you use 01:18:40 <coopserver> <John> it just seems like an arbitrary number, you know 01:19:39 <coopserver> <John> but yeah, thanks :) 01:20:06 <coopserver> <John> and, while you guys are here... 01:20:27 <coopserver> <John> What evil kind of magic is SRNW? 01:20:35 <coopserver> <Sylf> one word 01:20:47 <coopserver> <Sylf> rail_firstred_twoway_eol 01:21:02 <coopserver> <Sylf> :P some kind of abracadabra magic word 01:21:05 <coopserver> <BallC> thats one word? :P 01:22:20 <coopserver> <Sylf> We can categorise SRNW into 3 different types 01:23:12 <coopserver> <Sylf> standard SRNW, where there is one shared order for all trains on the network (or one shared order per cargo type), and it hits the stations/waypoints that's in the order 01:23:18 <coopserver> <John> so using two-way signals you make trains without orders go where they need to? 01:24:15 <coopserver> <Sylf> unreacheable target SRNW - a mechanism where trains are given order to go to a station or waypoint that's unreacheable from the network (using it as path finder trap to force certain behavior) 01:24:18 <coopserver> <John> (ignore my snarky comments :)) 01:24:20 <coopserver> <Sylf> or trains without orders. 01:24:43 <coopserver> <Sylf> the first 2 types are actually pretty similar 01:25:05 <coopserver> <Sylf> basically, you give them a possible path to that whatever target station 01:25:27 <coopserver> <Sylf> the trains enter that path, but on its path is a station where the trains can pick up cargo 01:25:44 <coopserver> <John> so they implicitly stop and pick up the cargo... 01:25:59 <coopserver> <Sylf> then, all we need is some kind of mechanism, so the trains from the ML wait in front of a station until there is enough to fill that train 01:26:39 <coopserver> <Sylf> trains without orders is not much different, except for the fact that the trains have no target whatsoever 01:26:55 <coopserver> <Sylf> so we need to use pathfinder penalties to force trains to those station branches 01:27:35 <coopserver> <Sylf> then, we exploit that magic word setting 01:27:50 <coopserver> <John> how do you discriminate between cargo types? 01:28:15 <coopserver> <Sylf> when a train comes across a two-way signal that's red, that signal has such a high penalty point that the trains consider that line a dead-end 01:28:32 <coopserver> <Sylf> if you play with different cargoes, you set up unique way points for each cargo 01:28:56 <coopserver> <Sylf> or in a simpler set-up, you sed up completely separate network for each cargo type 01:29:07 <coopserver> <John> all right 01:29:48 <coopserver> <Sylf> http://wiki.openttdcoop.org/PublicServer:Archive_-_Games_171_-_180#gameid_172 01:29:57 <coopserver> <Sylf> that's the game that got me really fascinated with SRNW 01:30:20 <coopserver> <Sylf> 4 separate networks of SRNW 01:31:33 <coopserver> <John> will look at it, thanks 01:32:35 <coopserver> <Sylf> we don't play srnw often though 01:32:45 <coopserver> <Sylf> srnw game 01:33:05 <coopserver> <Sylf> peolpe use it as a part of SBahn or feeder network as a part of larger game 01:33:26 <coopserver> <John> It's an interesting concept, though 01:34:20 <coopserver> <John> what do you play? 01:34:22 <coopserver> <Sylf> it took me a while to understand how it works 01:34:38 <coopserver> <Sylf> me personally, or us the coop? 01:35:07 <coopserver> <John> I mean't the coop 01:35:25 <coopserver> <Sylf> a standard cargo game like this is common 01:35:31 <coopserver> <Sylf> no frills 01:35:33 <coopserver> <John> It seems quite dead here, or is it just the date 01:35:37 <coopserver> <Sylf> just try to fill the map as much as possible 01:37:57 <coopserver> <John> I get that this new trainset is developed by you? 01:38:14 <coopserver> <John> (and by you I mean someone from #openttdcoop) 01:38:17 <coopserver> <Sylf> you mean NUTS? 01:38:20 <coopserver> <John> yup 01:38:42 <coopserver> <Sylf> it's actually mostly one man's job 01:38:47 <coopserver> <Sylf> V435000 01:39:16 <coopserver> <John> He also made the new industry set, right? 01:39:24 <coopserver> <Sylf> now that we have that, which is made with coop style playing in mind, that's the train set we use the most 01:39:28 <coopserver> <Sylf> yes 01:39:52 <coopserver> <Sylf> but in the past, coop members have created other stuff as well 01:40:29 <coopserver> <John> such as? 01:41:15 <coopserver> <Sylf> I think, like german town names, swiss town names at least? 01:41:29 <coopserver> <Sylf> the logic engine comes from here too 01:41:43 <coopserver> <Sylf> I made my own japanese city names 01:41:58 <coopserver> <Sylf> someone here also made the base cost mod 01:42:01 <coopserver> <Sylf> I think 01:42:33 <coopserver> <Sylf> then there are some members who have contributed to the core of openttd code in the past 01:42:40 <LMBproninja> You guys rock 01:42:43 <coopserver> <John> How long are you playing coop? 01:42:44 <coopserver> <Sylf> and probably still do today 01:43:12 <coopserver> <Sylf> coop started probably 8-9 years ago 01:44:20 <coopserver> <John> and been playing ever since? 01:44:36 <coopserver> <Sylf> I believe so. 01:44:50 <coopserver> <John> Oh, wait.. I mean you you :) 01:45:05 <coopserver> <Sylf> me personally, joined here 4 years ago 01:46:05 <coopserver> <John> So... What's new in the community? 01:46:24 <coopserver> <John> I used to play here at# openttdcoop 01:46:30 <coopserver> <John> like 7 years ago 01:46:40 <coopserver> <Sylf> hmm well 01:47:00 <coopserver> <Sylf> a whole lot of new GRFs since 7 years ago 01:47:04 <coopserver> <Sylf> we like some of them 01:47:41 <coopserver> <Sylf> those concepts like SRNW probably wasn't around 7 years ago 01:47:50 <coopserver> <Sylf> but it wasn't exactly new by the time I started playing 01:47:54 <coopserver> <John> Nope, that's why I asked 01:48:05 <coopserver> <John> Actually, not even PBS were around 01:48:31 <coopserver> <Sylf> playing with trains that's longer than CL has been around since some time ago 01:49:15 <coopserver> <John> I've browsed the wiki 01:49:28 <coopserver> <John> lots'a new stuff there 01:49:46 <coopserver> <John> I like the bananas 01:50:35 <coopserver> <John> but, personally, I'm kind of sad there's no more moneymaker 01:50:40 <coopserver> <John> at game start 01:50:42 <coopserver> <Sylf> craaap 01:51:00 <coopserver> <John> what? 01:51:10 <coopserver> <Sylf> I just bombed my station 01:52:37 <coopserver> <John> that's quite awful 01:53:43 <coopserver> <John> do you use the logic-trains and circuits much? 01:53:57 <coopserver> <Sylf> not often 01:54:22 <coopserver> <Sylf> they have limited usefulness 01:55:25 <coopserver> <Sylf> I'm gonna be focusing on this eyecandy for a while... 01:55:39 <coopserver> <Sylf> I was thinking about dinner just a minute ago ;_; 01:55:44 <coopserver> <Sylf> dinner can wait 01:55:50 <coopserver> <Sylf> station can too, but station gets the prio 01:56:11 *** Hazzard has joined #openttdcoop 01:56:57 <coopserver> <John> :) Dinner? 01:57:25 <coopserver> <John> What TZ? It's like 4 AM here 01:57:49 <coopserver> <BallC> 10PM here (Florida) 01:58:10 <coopserver> <o11c> 19:00 here (Washington State) 01:58:26 <coopserver> <Sylf> 9PM 01:59:12 <coopserver> <John> Good evening to all America's there, then 02:03:09 <coopserver> <John> So, rubber factory station, how big should I start with? 02:03:54 <coopserver> <Sylf> see the food stations in the north and south 02:04:09 <coopserver> <Sylf> they shoud be good guides for the size 02:04:38 <coopserver> <Sylf> misus the eyecandies 02:05:07 <LMBproninja> Midday downunder 02:05:08 <Hazzard> !password 02:05:08 <coopserver> Hazzard: regexp 02:05:32 <coopserver> <Sylf> that's the timezone I used to live long long time ago 02:05:43 <coopserver> *** Game paused (connecting clients) 02:05:47 <coopserver> *** Hazzard has joined 02:05:48 <coopserver> *** Game unpaused (connecting clients) 02:05:54 <coopserver> <John> Wait, isn't rubber a primary? 02:06:16 <coopserver> <John> why does it need a huge f'n station? 02:06:45 <coopserver> <Sylf> the RUBBER spot is for a factory drop 02:06:48 <coopserver> <Sylf> dedicated to rubber 02:06:57 <coopserver> <Sylf> call it a condom factory if you want 02:07:09 <coopserver> <John> right, euphemisms 02:09:03 <coopserver> *** o11c has left the game (general timeout) 02:10:41 <coopserver> <Sylf> oh well, this is good enough 02:12:50 <coopserver> *** Hazzard has left the game (Leaving) 02:13:13 <LMBproninja> lol 02:19:12 <LMBproninja> I don't know if you have hotels in that game, but you could make a killing delivering there 02:30:23 <coopserver> <John> What's up with the PZ server? 02:57:14 <coopserver> *** Sylf has left the game (Leaving) 03:11:03 *** KWKdesign has quit IRC 03:11:16 *** KWKdesign has joined #openttdcoop 03:30:58 *** KWKdesign has quit IRC 03:31:02 *** KWKdesign has joined #openttdcoop 04:02:37 <o11c> !password 04:02:37 <coopserver> o11c: ludvig 04:03:13 <o11c> !password 04:03:13 <coopserver> o11c: rubber 04:03:18 <coopserver> *** Game paused (connecting clients) 04:03:20 <coopserver> *** o11c has joined 04:03:21 <coopserver> *** Game unpaused (connecting clients) 04:11:01 *** Hazzard_ has joined #openttdcoop 04:12:20 <coopserver> <o11c> is anything being built right now or is time just passing? 04:12:31 <coopserver> <BallC> i'm working on my BBH 04:14:54 <Sylf> back to BBH 01? 04:15:05 *** Hazzard has quit IRC 04:15:08 <coopserver> <BallC> yeah, doing some review/cleanup 04:15:47 <coopserver> <BallC> trying to simplify some of the merges 04:16:27 <Djanxy> !password 04:16:27 <coopserver> Djanxy: rubber 04:16:44 <coopserver> *** Game paused (connecting clients) 04:16:46 <coopserver> *** Djanxy has joined 04:16:47 <coopserver> *** Game unpaused (connecting clients) 04:16:56 <coopserver> <Djanxy> hola 04:17:06 <coopserver> <BallC> howdy 04:17:40 <Sylf> this is turning out to be the weirdest day of my coop years 04:17:50 <coopserver> <Djanxy> what's up 04:17:52 <coopserver> <BallC> why is that 04:18:01 <Sylf> I see more people in this time zone than European evening 04:18:06 <Sylf> that NEVER happens 04:18:17 <Sylf> or, NEVER until today 04:18:30 <coopserver> <Djanxy> european morning represent :) 04:18:46 <coopserver> <Djanxy> or, very late night for me rather 04:18:52 <Sylf> :P 04:19:09 <coopserver> <Djanxy> just thought I'd have a lurk before bed 04:19:34 <Sylf> oh, you're just teasing us with your presence 04:19:43 <coopserver> <Djanxy> as always 04:24:23 <coopserver> *** Djanxy has joined company #1 04:25:27 <coopserver> *** Djanxy has joined spectators 04:33:26 <coopserver> <Djanxy> John, you are missing a piece of track in your hub ;) 05:23:36 <coopserver> *** Djanxy has joined company #1 06:00:35 <coopserver> *** Djanxy has left the game (Leaving) 06:07:52 *** Djanxy has quit IRC 06:17:29 <coopserver> *** John has left the game (Leaving) 06:38:45 <coopserver> *** o11c has left the game (general timeout) 06:56:44 *** LMBproninja has quit IRC 07:07:13 *** Progman has joined #openttdcoop 07:12:47 *** Progman_ has joined #openttdcoop 07:17:34 <coopserver> *** BallC has joined spectators 07:17:35 <coopserver> *** Game paused (number of players) 07:17:57 <coopserver> *** BallC has left the game (Leaving) 07:18:32 *** Progman has quit IRC 07:18:35 *** Progman_ is now known as Progman 08:16:05 *** LMBproninja has joined #openttdcoop 09:16:23 *** Brumi has joined #openttdcoop 10:14:36 *** LMBproninja has quit IRC 10:57:47 *** LadyHawk has quit IRC 11:03:05 *** LadyHawk has joined #openttdcoop 11:21:53 *** JohnK has quit IRC 11:26:10 *** LMBproninja has joined #openttdcoop 11:43:11 *** Djanxy has joined #openttdcoop 11:59:36 *** KWKdesign has quit IRC 11:59:46 *** KWKdesign has joined #openttdcoop 12:11:00 *** Brumi has quit IRC 12:27:36 *** Brumi has joined #openttdcoop 13:28:51 <Djanxy> !password 13:28:51 <coopserver> Djanxy: unpack 13:29:00 <coopserver> *** Game still paused (connecting clients, number of players) 13:29:02 <coopserver> *** Djanxy has joined 13:29:03 <coopserver> *** Game still paused (number of players) 13:37:56 *** LSky` has joined #openttdcoop 13:44:53 <Djanxy> !ip 13:44:53 <coopserver> Djanxy: publicserver-new.openttdcoop.org:3983 13:52:49 *** sykop5am has joined #openttdcoop 13:54:39 *** Hazzard has joined #openttdcoop 14:01:25 *** Hazzard_ has quit IRC 14:53:45 <LMBproninja> G'night all, enjoy! 14:54:00 *** LMBproninja has quit IRC 14:55:27 *** Maraxus has joined #openttdcoop 14:55:27 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Maraxus 15:13:19 <Maraxus> !password 15:13:19 <coopserver> Maraxus: cleans 15:13:33 <coopserver> *** Game still paused (connecting clients, number of players) 15:13:35 <coopserver> *** Maraxus has joined 15:13:36 <coopserver> *** Game still paused (number of players) 15:25:39 *** RTM has joined #openttdcoop 15:25:56 <RTM> !passwoard 15:26:33 <RTM> !help 15:26:33 <coopserver> RTM: http://wiki.openttdcoop.org/Soap 15:27:54 *** RTM_ has joined #openttdcoop 15:28:09 <RTM_> !password 15:28:09 <coopserver> RTM_: access 15:29:23 <RTM_> hi lo 15:31:21 *** RTM_ has quit IRC 15:31:40 *** RTM_ has joined #openttdcoop 15:32:38 <RTM_> !password 15:32:38 <coopserver> RTM_: access 15:33:39 <RTM_> !password 15:33:39 <coopserver> RTM_: marker 15:33:53 <coopserver> *** Game still paused (connecting clients, number of players) 15:34:05 <coopserver> *** RTM has joined 15:34:06 <coopserver> *** Game still paused (number of players) 15:34:13 <coopserver> <RTM> hi Djanxy 15:34:17 <coopserver> <RTM> hi Maraxus 15:34:34 *** RTM has quit IRC 15:37:36 <coopserver> *** RTM has joined company #1 15:37:37 <coopserver> *** Game unpaused (number of players) 15:37:42 <coopserver> *** RTM has joined spectators 15:37:43 <coopserver> *** Game paused (number of players) 15:39:52 <coopserver> *** RTM has left the game (Leaving) 15:45:43 *** sykop5am has quit IRC 15:45:48 *** RTM_ has quit IRC 15:55:06 <coopserver> *** Maraxus has left the game (Leaving) 15:55:08 *** Maraxus has quit IRC 16:30:01 <Jam35> !password 16:30:01 <coopserver> Jam35: forest 16:30:07 <coopserver> *** Game still paused (connecting clients, number of players) 16:30:12 <coopserver> *** Jam35 has joined 16:30:13 <coopserver> *** Game still paused (number of players) 16:31:27 <coopserver> *** Jam35 has joined company #1 16:31:28 <coopserver> *** Game unpaused (number of players) 16:34:26 <coopserver> <Djanxy> hey Ja, 16:34:32 <coopserver> <Djanxy> Jam rather 16:34:39 <coopserver> <Djanxy> you cheater 16:34:50 <coopserver> <Jam35> eh? 16:34:57 <coopserver> *** Djanxy has joined company #1 16:35:04 <coopserver> <Djanxy> singleplayer :) 16:35:10 <coopserver> <Jam35> no 16:35:16 <coopserver> <Jam35> I did not set that 16:35:18 <coopserver> <Djanxy> oh 16:35:30 <coopserver> <Jam35> due to lack of interest I believe :) 16:35:36 <coopserver> <Djanxy> guess it was left off, didn' even bother to check 16:38:17 <coopserver> <Djanxy> think i might have went overboard on the town drop capacity when i was tired and bored (and a bit stoned) late last night 16:38:46 <coopserver> <Jam35> yeah, looks like it was made by someone on drugs :P 16:38:50 <coopserver> <Djanxy> lol 16:38:59 <coopserver> <Jam35> it's fine :) 16:39:24 <coopserver> <Djanxy> it's a shameless copy/paste with a few modifications, but I like the layout, it's kinda fun and different 16:40:15 <coopserver> <Djanxy> guess some eyecandy would be in order 16:40:31 <coopserver> <Jam35> I don't recognise it but it's quite compact 16:41:29 <coopserver> <Djanxy> something i saw when i was getting back into ottd (when i started playing here) - was reading a lot of wiki and examples etc 16:41:54 <coopserver> <Djanxy> dont think it was on openttdcoop though 16:46:21 *** dxtr has quit IRC 16:48:13 <coopserver> <Jam35> my MSH looks hard to expand 16:48:57 <coopserver> <Djanxy> in my eyes they always look hard to expand :) 16:49:19 <coopserver> <Jam35> :) I can see a way to make it easier but not doing it now 16:50:29 *** Brumi has quit IRC 16:50:43 <coopserver> *** Game paused (connecting clients) 16:50:45 <coopserver> *** Sylf has joined 16:50:46 <coopserver> *** Game unpaused (connecting clients) 16:51:07 <coopserver> <Sylf> awww 16:51:16 <coopserver> <Sylf> the poor chopper is lost 16:51:23 <coopserver> *** Sylf has joined company #1 16:52:20 <coopserver> <Jam35> I have no sympathy for it 16:52:21 <coopserver> <Djanxy> oh :) 16:52:35 <coopserver> <Sylf> it's my toy 16:52:39 <coopserver> <Djanxy> nah, just landed 16:52:52 <coopserver> <Sylf> I gave it new orders 16:52:55 <coopserver> <Djanxy> aha 16:53:31 <coopserver> <Jam35> steel mill looks challenging :) 16:53:41 <coopserver> <Djanxy> noticed that too 16:53:54 <coopserver> <Sylf> I think it'll be fun 16:54:13 <coopserver> <Jam35> more fun if the copper would die 16:54:14 <coopserver> <Sylf> I see pickup between anio montes and the network plan 16:54:24 <coopserver> <Sylf> and drop between the town and the mine 16:54:38 <coopserver> <Sylf> the line up to the pickup would gou around the town 16:54:45 <coopserver> <Sylf> so it'll need some additional land 16:55:45 <coopserver> <Jam35> I might have a look soon, just about to eat 16:55:55 <coopserver> <Jam35> or maybe do something else :) 16:56:20 <coopserver> <Jam35> in here I mean :P 16:56:26 <coopserver> <Djanxy> :P 16:57:59 <coopserver> <Jam35> bbh01 has a few slight issues 16:58:18 <coopserver> <Jam35> mainly choice/bay length related 16:58:33 <coopserver> <Sylf> yeah 16:58:38 <coopserver> <Jam35> but easy to fix 16:58:44 *** dxtr has joined #openttdcoop 16:59:19 <coopserver> <Djanxy> how about the track that ends very abruptly 16:59:25 <coopserver> <Jam35> not touching it yet 16:59:29 <coopserver> <Jam35> where ? 16:59:41 <coopserver> <Djanxy> at the west end 17:00:01 <coopserver> <Sylf> XD 17:00:02 <coopserver> <Djanxy> !here 17:00:09 <coopserver> <Jam35> oh that :) 17:00:20 <coopserver> <Jam35> guess it's wip 17:00:27 <coopserver> <Sylf> the merger around there can be much smaller, really 17:00:54 <coopserver> <Sylf> and perhaps kill some CL issues at the same time 17:01:11 <coopserver> <Jam35> also 2 bridges that act as one 17:01:24 <coopserver> <Jam35> well let him return 17:01:31 <coopserver> <Sylf> yeah 17:01:34 <coopserver> <Jam35> it's ok for 1st go 17:01:43 <coopserver> <Sylf> I won't touch it without his presence 17:01:56 <coopserver> <Sylf> if it's fixed, he should see how it's done 17:02:08 <coopserver> <Jam35> sure 17:02:20 <coopserver> <Jam35> right semi-afk 17:02:22 <coopserver> *** Jam35 has joined spectators 17:15:17 <coopserver> <Djanxy> Oh man, the profit graph. Heli doing work 17:15:25 <coopserver> <Sylf> :P 17:17:29 <coopserver> <Djanxy> never really comprehended how to use that gap command - like how long does bridges need to be before 3 is needed etc. 17:17:57 <coopserver> <Sylf> let's try with an example 17:18:01 <coopserver> <Sylf> @@gap 4 17:18:02 <Webster> coopserver: (gap <trainlength> [<split>]) -- Returns minimum and maximum signal gap sizes for 2,3 and 4 linesplits with <trainlength>. If <spilt> is given it will return the gap sizes for <split> (+/-) 1. 17:18:04 <coopserver> <Djanxy> what i hope :) 17:18:23 <coopserver> <Djanxy> hoped* 17:18:26 <coopserver> <Sylf> @@(gap 4) 17:18:27 <Webster> coopserver: For Trainlength of 4: <= 10 needs 2, 11 - 16 needs 3, 17 - 22 needs 4. 17:18:58 <coopserver> <Sylf> so, we need 2 bridges if the signal gap is less than or equal to 10 17:19:16 <coopserver> <Djanxy> yeah thanks 17:19:21 <coopserver> <Jam35> my rule of thumb is gap 9 until I need 3 17:19:28 <coopserver> <Jam35> cos always play TL3 17:19:37 <coopserver> <Sylf> yup, pretty much 17:20:19 <coopserver> <Sylf> I wouldn't go more than 3 tunnels/bridges though 17:20:31 <coopserver> <Djanxy> @@(gap 3) 17:20:32 <Webster> coopserver: For Trainlength of 3: <= 9 needs 2, 10 - 14 needs 3, 15 - 19 needs 4. 17:20:37 <coopserver> <Sylf> unless you have some very unique design like... 17:20:43 <coopserver> <Sylf> @archive 17:20:58 <coopserver> <Sylf> @@archive 17:20:58 <Webster> http://www.openttdcoop.org/wiki/PublicServer:Archive | http://www.openttdcoop.org/wiki/MemberZone:Archive | http://www.openttdcoop.org/wiki/ProZone:Archive 17:21:03 <coopserver> <Djanxy> yeah, was just thinking how far 3 could take it 17:21:34 <coopserver> <Djanxy> will likely have a go at MSH rubber 17:24:22 <Sylf> http://wiki.openttdcoop.org/images/a/ac/PSG268.png 17:24:33 <Sylf> that hub had some awesomely long tunnels 17:25:05 <Djanxy> oh right, watched a lot of that evolving ;) 17:25:31 <Sylf> I couldn't keep up with it 17:25:45 <coopserver> <Jam35> who was building steel factory/sawmill MSH 17:26:06 <coopserver> <Sylf> I don't know, but my guess is camo 17:26:13 <Djanxy> signal gap 60 on some of those :D 17:26:35 <coopserver> <Jam35> it has some weird stuff too 17:26:53 <Sylf> weird connections weird everything 17:26:58 <coopserver> <Jam35> might be workable :) 17:27:04 <Sylf> I was going to wait if he was going to finish it 17:27:15 <Sylf> or see if it's actually a finished product 17:28:02 <coopserver> <Djanxy> tracks from south split twice from 1 track and not from the other 17:28:29 <coopserver> <Sylf> let's not start XD 17:28:45 <coopserver> <Djanxy> nah, there's lots of stuff - just what first caught my eye 17:29:20 <coopserver> <Sylf> He'll probably be able to see some errors if he signaled the hub as he built it 17:29:28 <coopserver> <Djanxy> mm 17:33:54 <BallC> ooo I hear you guys talking about BBH01 :) 17:34:03 <coopserver> <Sylf> yup, some 17:34:18 <BallC> !password 17:34:18 <coopserver> BallC: occurs 17:34:25 <coopserver> *** Game paused (connecting clients) 17:34:28 <coopserver> *** BallC has joined 17:34:29 <coopserver> *** Game unpaused (connecting clients) 17:34:31 <coopserver> <Sylf> now thinking about building steel mill stations... 17:34:39 <coopserver> <Djanxy> good luck :) 17:34:56 <coopserver> <Djanxy> if that ore mine wasnt in the middle of it all 17:35:23 <coopserver> <Sylf> The water source is actually bothering me more 17:35:28 <coopserver> <Djanxy> yeah, that too 17:36:07 <coopserver> <BallC> @gap 4 17:36:35 <coopserver> <Sylf> use double @@, and enclose the rest of the command with paranthesis 17:36:36 <coopserver> <BallC> @@gap 4 17:36:37 <Webster> coopserver: (gap <trainlength> [<split>]) -- Returns minimum and maximum signal gap sizes for 2,3 and 4 linesplits with <trainlength>. If <spilt> is given it will return the gap sizes for <split> (+/-) 1. 17:36:45 <coopserver> <BallC> @@(gap 4) 17:36:46 <Webster> coopserver: For Trainlength of 4: <= 10 needs 2, 11 - 16 needs 3, 17 - 22 needs 4. 17:37:09 <coopserver> <Sylf> hmm 17:37:22 <coopserver> <Sylf> I see extra question marks in game, which I don't see in IRC 17:37:42 <coopserver> <BallC> same 17:37:44 <coopserver> <Sylf> oh, they're the bold character markers 17:38:56 <coopserver> <BallC> ok, was just checking my MOAR BRIDGES marker -- i've got 8 tiles between the signals and each line splits to 3 bridges so i should be good. 17:39:22 <coopserver> <Sylf> you actually need only 2 bridges per line, actually 17:40:14 <coopserver> <BallC> alright, that should make it easier to handle this derpy 1-tile CL right before the bridges as well 17:40:57 <coopserver> <Djanxy> also, they are not synced the way they are now 17:41:43 <coopserver> <BallC> the paralleligram deal, right... 17:41:51 <coopserver> <Sylf> yup 17:41:54 <coopserver> <Djanxy> you can say that yes 17:42:12 <coopserver> <Djanxy> or just as long as all lines have the same amount of tiles totravel 17:42:20 <coopserver> <Djanxy> to travel* 17:43:06 <coopserver> <Sylf> you don't need to jog back 17:43:14 <coopserver> <Sylf> that next curve is CL3 right now 17:43:50 <coopserver> <BallC> sorry, which one are you talking about? 17:43:56 <coopserver> <BallC> what i was just fixing on the south side of the water? 17:43:57 <coopserver> <Sylf> that one you just fixed 17:43:59 <coopserver> <BallC> ok 17:44:51 <coopserver> <Sylf> I would have kept that bridge 17:45:07 <coopserver> <BallC> and chopped the top one? 17:45:13 <coopserver> <Sylf> and go that way 17:48:09 <coopserver> <Sylf> now, that mark of !CL still stands 17:48:24 <coopserver> <Jam35> neeg signals is the best sign :P 17:48:30 <coopserver> <BallC> lol 17:48:32 <coopserver> *** Jam35 has joined company #1 17:48:37 <coopserver> <Sylf> oooooh 17:48:39 <coopserver> <BallC> b/c it's a one tile jog 17:48:50 <coopserver> <Sylf> I knew something looked "off" on that sign! 17:49:09 <coopserver> <Jam35> It's better that way 17:49:47 <coopserver> <Sylf> my hint for that CL fix is a path signal 17:52:05 <coopserver> <BallC> you sure that CL still stands? 17:52:12 <coopserver> <BallC> I'm playing with the test track 17:52:14 <coopserver> <Sylf> yup 17:52:27 <coopserver> <Sylf> do you have a test track here? 17:52:35 <coopserver> <BallC> yeah, down where we had it before 17:53:00 <coopserver> <Sylf> that's closer to my cl issue 17:53:14 <coopserver> <Sylf> the train slows down to 200km/h 17:53:32 <coopserver> <BallC> i don't see two right turns at the CL sign though 17:54:20 <coopserver> <BallC> i see... 17:54:26 <coopserver> <BallC> there's a R-L-R 17:54:30 <coopserver> <Djanxy> that part 17:54:31 <o11c> !password 17:54:32 <coopserver> o11c: toobar 17:54:51 <coopserver> *** Game paused (connecting clients) 17:54:54 <coopserver> *** o11c has joined 17:54:55 <coopserver> *** Game unpaused (connecting clients) 17:54:56 <coopserver> <Sylf> that, and the problem is fixed 17:55:19 <coopserver> <BallC> ok let me see it how it is right now 17:55:36 <coopserver> <Sylf> yeah, with that knowledge, my hint about PBS should make sense 17:56:43 <coopserver> <BallC> ok so PBS over the bridge 17:56:52 <coopserver> <BallC> means i don't need the extra straight tile before 17:57:53 <coopserver> <Sylf> don't forget the signal there 17:58:02 <coopserver> <Sylf> and that spot is fixed 17:58:13 <coopserver> <BallC> hmmm 17:58:24 <coopserver> <BallC> so it might be a more advanced thing i'm not understanding 17:58:42 <coopserver> <Sylf> what's that? 17:58:43 <coopserver> <BallC> but I read that presignal is preferred over PBS on the wiki 17:58:48 <coopserver> <Sylf> it is 17:58:50 <coopserver> <BallC> due to pathfinder stuff maybe? 17:59:23 <coopserver> <Sylf> with presignals, we're always in control what path the trains will take in most cases 17:59:33 <coopserver> <Sylf> wth path signals, we have less control 18:00:19 <coopserver> <Sylf> sure, we can fix that PBS/presignal issue with 1 tile of teraforming, but... 18:00:30 <coopserver> <Sylf> meh, this works. 18:00:39 <coopserver> <BallC> little variety :) 18:00:43 <coopserver> <BallC> never hurts 18:00:59 <coopserver> <Sylf> the rest is up to you being not obsessive compulsive 18:01:01 <coopserver> <o11c> hm, there's no right turn from the southeast to the northeast 18:01:04 <coopserver> <Sylf> or subdue it 18:01:35 <coopserver> <o11c> near !short waiting bay 18:01:49 <coopserver> <BallC> got it thanks 18:01:55 <coopserver> <Sylf> yes and no 18:02:02 <coopserver> <Sylf> it does have right turn already 18:02:09 <coopserver> <Sylf> it just doesn't have choices 18:02:14 <coopserver> <o11c> 3 of 4, yeah 18:02:16 <coopserver> <Sylf> that's a smaler issue compared to others 18:02:54 <coopserver> <Sylf> I have some ideas about that need right turn spot for later 18:03:24 <coopserver> <o11c> so are the bigger issues in the left turn? 18:03:55 <coopserver> <Sylf> the bigger issues are the stuff I've noted with ! 18:04:29 <coopserver> <Sylf> the bottom !short waiting bays is easy to fix 18:04:43 <coopserver> <o11c> I can't see that one; I can see most of the other issues ... 18:04:59 <coopserver> <Sylf> just below your need right turn sign 18:05:09 <coopserver> <o11c> ah wait, do you mean short across the diagonal? 18:05:16 <coopserver> <o11c> no, I see the sign, just not the problem 18:05:35 <coopserver> <BallC> TL4 but 3 tile bays 18:05:40 <coopserver> <Sylf> those red rails are 3 tiles each 18:06:00 <coopserver> <o11c> oh right, the piece of track doesn't count because it has the signal 18:06:39 <coopserver> <Sylf> that's the fix 18:06:43 <coopserver> <Sylf> so that's easy 18:06:45 <coopserver> <BallC> yeah you beat me to it 18:06:46 <coopserver> <BallC> :P 18:06:55 <coopserver> <Sylf> you have 3 more to go ;) 18:07:33 <coopserver> <o11c> is the red color a separate rail type or something? like normal/electric/monorail/maglev in vanilla? 18:07:56 <coopserver> <Sylf> not separate like that 18:08:14 <coopserver> <Sylf> white, red, yellow, green and blue rails are all universal rails 18:08:24 <coopserver> <Sylf> any trains, monorails and maglevs can run on them 18:08:38 <coopserver> <o11c> so same mechanism, but accepts all trains on all rails 18:08:43 <coopserver> <Sylf> within NUTS set, there are trains that get different stats depending on the color of the rails 18:09:52 <coopserver> <Sylf> let's go back to !neeg signals 18:09:59 <coopserver> <Sylf> that sign someone silently fixed 18:10:27 <coopserver> <BallC> yeah so this was a bridge that i didn't do the extra tile on 18:10:43 <coopserver> <Sylf> let's see how we can fix that 18:11:02 <coopserver> <Sylf> ta-da 18:11:04 <coopserver> <Sylf> fixed 18:11:06 <coopserver> <o11c> why not move the bridged left and make the track under straighter? 18:11:09 <coopserver> <BallC> stagger them 18:11:27 <coopserver> <Sylf> yeah, we need to fix that track under them 18:11:52 <coopserver> <Sylf> there, no more CL issue there 18:12:14 <coopserver> <BallC> cool :) 18:12:24 <coopserver> <Sylf> hm, 18:12:33 <coopserver> <Sylf> I just saw that I didn't even need to do that 18:12:45 <coopserver> <Sylf> could've gon that way 18:12:55 <coopserver> <Sylf> oh well, it's all good 18:12:57 <coopserver> <BallC> doh i looked away for a second 18:13:16 <coopserver> <Sylf> that's the old path 18:13:23 <coopserver> <BallC> ahh i was turning left and then right then left again 18:13:28 <coopserver> <BallC> when it could have just been one left 18:14:01 <coopserver> <Sylf> ok, now to the !CL just above it 18:14:12 <coopserver> <BallC> yeah, this left here is where i had the most trouble 18:14:16 <coopserver> <o11c> no reason you can't turn immediately from the bridge 18:14:18 <coopserver> <BallC> i was working on this last night 18:14:25 <coopserver> <Sylf> see where !this goes? 18:14:32 <coopserver> <Sylf> it's not connected, so let's delete that line 18:14:45 <coopserver> <BallC> ok 18:14:46 <coopserver> <Sylf> ooh, already looks simpler 18:15:11 <coopserver> <Sylf> now, instead of waiting to that lake area to do the merge, let's mix and merge right here 18:15:17 <coopserver> <o11c> you're missing one left turn choice, from the right track to the left track 18:15:33 <coopserver> <o11c> or wait, what? 18:15:51 <coopserver> <BallC> you're right 011c, the very top track has no choice 18:16:27 <coopserver> <Sylf> now the lines are mixed and merged 18:16:39 <coopserver> <Sylf> pretty simple? 18:16:59 *** psde has joined #openttdcoop 18:17:05 <psde> !help 18:17:05 <coopserver> psde: http://wiki.openttdcoop.org/Soap 18:17:14 <coopserver> <BallC> yeah, can we do a three-way merge for the bottom set too 18:17:25 <psde> !password 18:17:25 <coopserver> psde: forced 18:17:27 <coopserver> <Sylf> yeah, we can do that too 18:17:38 <coopserver> <Sylf> like that 18:17:46 <coopserver> <o11c> you'll want a blank between tracks for the bridge split anyway 18:17:58 <coopserver> <o11c> ... or I guess you can avoid bridging at all 18:18:05 <coopserver> <BallC> lol 18:18:06 <coopserver> <Sylf> yup 18:18:27 <coopserver> <Sylf> kaboom! 18:19:00 <coopserver> <Sylf> no worries. you'll start seeing those possibilities in no time 18:19:02 <coopserver> <BallC> i don't know what i was thinking 18:19:03 <coopserver> <BallC> :D 18:19:09 <psde> !revison 18:19:21 <psde> !revision 18:19:21 <coopserver> psde: Game version is r26720. Use Download <os-version> to get a direct download link. 18:19:40 <psde> !download win64 18:19:40 <coopserver> psde: http://binaries.openttd.org/nightlies/trunk/r26720/openttd-trunk-r26720-windows-win64.zip 18:20:28 <coopserver> <Sylf> that double tunnel isn't needed, but it's not hurting anything right now 18:20:33 <coopserver> <Sylf> I'm gonna leave them alone 18:20:42 <coopserver> <o11c> yeah, I was thinking that earlier 18:20:59 <coopserver> <Sylf> let's go up to !check signal signs 18:21:03 <coopserver> <BallC> so on the south merge, i don't need double tunnels there 18:21:11 <coopserver> <BallC> because they're actually going to diff lines? 18:21:22 <coopserver> <Sylf> I think you had some other idea to cross some lines there 18:21:30 <coopserver> <Sylf> but turned out not needing it, but it was left there 18:21:51 <coopserver> <BallC> yeah, i'm talking about further south 18:21:56 <coopserver> <BallC> where we just fixed the bay length issues 18:22:15 <coopserver> <Sylf> we want those deliberate signal gaps there 18:22:25 <coopserver> <Sylf> the signal gaps are used to balance the lines 18:22:32 <coopserver> <Sylf> balance the line loads 18:22:45 <coopserver> <o11c> there are signal gaps on the non-tunnels too 18:22:50 <coopserver> <BallC> ahh otherwise, it'll take two trains to fill that choice 18:23:03 <coopserver> <BallC> ok that makes sense 18:23:18 <coopserver> <Jam35> get that shit done: trains are coming! :) 18:23:24 <coopserver> <BallC> LOL 18:23:25 <coopserver> <Djanxy> :o 18:23:27 <coopserver> <Sylf> :D 18:23:39 <coopserver> <BallC> ok check signal sign 18:23:54 <coopserver> <o11c> so !short waiting bay and !need right turn choice look easy 18:23:55 <coopserver> <BallC> the exit needs to be a two way i presume? 18:23:59 <coopserver> <Sylf> for prio, you want 1 two-way exit signal and 1 two-way combo signal 18:24:04 <coopserver> <o11c> I'm assuming the !check signal is something about precedence 18:24:31 <coopserver> <BallC> nah, i had a one-way there wrongly 18:24:35 <coopserver> <BallC> instead of a two way on the exit signal 18:24:51 <coopserver> <Sylf> ok, the last shit 18:25:08 <coopserver> <Sylf> we'll kill 2 shit with 1 fix 18:25:24 <coopserver> <Sylf> we have a double bridge here 18:25:29 <coopserver> <Sylf> we'll turn that into choices 18:25:50 <coopserver> <o11c> cl? 18:25:52 <psde> !password 18:25:52 <coopserver> psde: growth 18:25:59 <coopserver> <Sylf> no cl issues there 18:26:02 <coopserver> *** Game paused (connecting clients) 18:26:04 <coopserver> *** Player has joined 18:26:05 <coopserver> *** Game unpaused (connecting clients) 18:26:11 <coopserver> <o11c> at the merge at the north end? 18:26:12 <coopserver> <Sylf> but we still have the short waiting bay 18:26:21 <coopserver> <Sylf> hm, what to do there... 18:26:27 <coopserver> <Sylf> couldn't kill 2 shit with 1 fix 18:26:28 <coopserver> <Sylf> damn 18:26:54 <coopserver> <BallC> back the bridge up? 18:26:57 <coopserver> <Sylf> hm 18:27:08 <coopserver> <o11c> can't you just move the merge forward? 18:27:21 <coopserver> <Sylf> merge forward 18:27:22 <coopserver> <o11c> there's 3 straights before the next turn 18:27:27 <coopserver> <Sylf> yeah, that's what I was thinking yesterday 18:28:19 <coopserver> <o11c> you don't need that, do you? 18:28:22 <coopserver> <o11c> oh 18:28:53 <coopserver> <Jam35> awesome place to spawn a forest 18:29:00 <coopserver> <Sylf> start counting tiles 18:29:01 <coopserver> <Jam35> at rubber factory 18:29:05 <coopserver> <o11c> are those 1.5 turns not cl, really? 18:29:08 <coopserver> <Sylf> and make sure we have good waiting spaces 18:29:11 <coopserver> <Jam35> /unknown will be annoyed 18:29:20 <coopserver> <Sylf> yeah, 3 half tiles are all we need for CL 18:29:33 <coopserver> <o11c> /me takes notes 18:29:41 <coopserver> <o11c> /me is annoyed that /me isn't a thing 18:30:33 <coopserver> <Sylf> :D so that 1 fix did kill both problems 18:31:21 <coopserver> <Sylf> and fixed the issues without altering the overall design of the hub :) 18:31:40 <coopserver> <Sylf> one last minor !issue 18:31:42 <coopserver> <BallC> awesome 18:32:32 <coopserver> <Sylf> one, when you balance the signal gap, you don't want the signals between the exit signals and the bridges 18:32:56 <coopserver> <Sylf> two, because of the way the turn is made, two lines are not in synch 18:33:10 <coopserver> <Sylf> the lazy fix is to use PBS 18:33:46 <coopserver> <BallC> ok yeah, i was trying to do the presignal stuff instead 18:33:47 <coopserver> <Sylf> the not so lazy fix would have been to let that area take wider turn 18:33:56 <coopserver> *** Player has changed his/her name to psde 18:34:04 <coopserver> <Sylf> like that 18:34:10 <coopserver> <Sylf> it's your choice 18:34:42 <coopserver> <BallC> i like the not lazy choice 18:35:08 <coopserver> <psde> Hi guys. This is my first coop game, is there anything easy I can do without messing things up? 18:35:26 <coopserver> <o11c> psde: suggest you watch a lot like I am 18:35:27 <coopserver> <Sylf> hm 18:35:37 <coopserver> <Sylf> :D watching is good 18:35:39 <coopserver> <psde> Sure 18:35:40 <coopserver> <BallC> Hi psde -- this is my first coop game too :) 18:35:53 <coopserver> <Jam35> Is there anything you can do? :P 18:35:58 <coopserver> <Sylf> but you could take a plunge too and start building stuff as your guts allows 18:36:10 <coopserver> <BallC> INCOMING TRAIN to BBH01 18:36:18 <coopserver> <Sylf> bring it on! 18:36:45 <coopserver> <BallC> huzzah! 18:37:23 <coopserver> <Jam35> for a maiden voyage you'd think the train would be happy about it 18:37:39 <coopserver> <Sylf> :P 18:38:12 <coopserver> <Sylf> whoops, need the FPP funded 18:38:21 <coopserver> <Sylf> do us the honor, Jam 18:38:26 <coopserver> <Jam35> I remembered that 18:38:29 <coopserver> <Jam35> earlier 18:39:03 <coopserver> <Jam35> er.... 18:39:57 <coopserver> <Jam35> didn't fit there :/ 18:40:03 <coopserver> <Sylf> nope 18:40:17 <coopserver> <Djanxy> yeah, noticed that earlier 18:41:38 <coopserver> <BallC> Do we have a naming conv for trains? 18:42:16 <coopserver> <Sylf> oh those damn trains ignoring that one last platform 18:44:02 <coopserver> <Sylf> we haven't really named trains in the past 18:44:08 <coopserver> <Sylf> we just use groups... 18:44:18 <coopserver> <BallC> got it, i just opened the train list and saw the groups 18:44:48 <coopserver> <BallC> I was using a naming conv on the welcome server... makes it easy to see how many trains are going to a particular primary pickup 18:44:55 <coopserver> <BallC> but groups work too 18:45:12 <coopserver> <Sylf> for that, with primaries, we use the shared orders 18:45:23 <coopserver> <Sylf> after that, we can either see how many trains share the same order 18:45:30 <coopserver> <Sylf> or see how many trains use that primary station 18:46:25 <coopserver> <Sylf> or, since we can use sub groups, you can create one subgroup per primary station :P 18:47:13 <coopserver> <Jam35> that could be messy (imo) 18:47:16 <coopserver> <Jam35> many groups 18:47:30 <coopserver> <Jam35> but nice feature 18:48:04 <coopserver> <Jam35> if you have naming convention on primary stations too it makes more sense 18:48:17 <coopserver> <Jam35> otherwise it is a list of names 18:50:00 <coopserver> <o11c> that fruit plantation looks about to go out of business ... only 16 tons 18:51:10 <coopserver> <Jam35> I would take the other 18:51:20 <coopserver> <Jam35> but it blocks future expando 18:51:48 <coopserver> <Sylf> if someone built the refinery, we can service those oil wells near by :) 18:51:54 <coopserver> <Sylf> we're taking volunteers 18:52:00 <coopserver> <Jam35> subtle hint? :P 18:52:12 <coopserver> <Jam35> ok 18:52:16 <coopserver> <Jam35> I do it 18:52:28 <coopserver> <Sylf> how about new regulars? 18:52:37 <coopserver> <Sylf> you'd all be regulars, wont' you? 18:52:57 <coopserver> <o11c> dunno 18:53:32 <coopserver> <psde> I am still kinda confused by the silly trainset, tbh 18:53:44 <coopserver> <Djanxy> it's not silly 18:53:47 <coopserver> <Djanxy> it's NUTS 18:53:50 <coopserver> <Sylf> :P 18:54:05 <coopserver> <Sylf> about the only thing that matters is that the trains will be 4 tiles long 18:54:14 <coopserver> <Sylf> otherwise, it's building as usual 18:54:15 <coopserver> <Djanxy> and they melt brains 18:54:48 <coopserver> <Sylf> wewt, thet water well by the steel mill is gone 18:54:49 <coopserver> <o11c> is 9 stations a thing? 18:54:52 <coopserver> <Djanxy> yay 18:54:57 <coopserver> <Jam35> is now 18:55:26 <coopserver> <o11c> this is that technique where every other one is an in vs out ? 18:55:47 <coopserver> <Sylf> V's done that before 18:56:06 <coopserver> <Sylf> one of the FIRS game in about PSG 230-240 time frame? 18:56:45 <coopserver> <Jam35> 11 18:56:51 <coopserver> <Jam35> weirder 18:56:57 <coopserver> <Djanxy> good round number 18:57:12 <Sylf> http://wiki.openttdcoop.org/PublicServer:Archive_-_Games_221_-_230#gameid_222 18:57:17 <Sylf> that game, the top corner station 18:57:31 <Sylf> has 2 drop station, 2 pickup station, 2 drop station, etc 19:00:18 <coopserver> <BallC> so LL_RR must be easy mode compared to some of the crazier games with 4-5 lines per direction on the ML 19:01:00 <coopserver> <Sylf> we rarely start with more than LLL_RRR 19:01:05 <coopserver> <Jam35> we are only starting LL_RR 19:01:10 <coopserver> <Sylf> more games start with just LL_RR 19:01:15 <coopserver> <Jam35> will be expanded at least to 3 19:01:23 <coopserver> <Jam35> I reckon 19:02:06 *** fleet5 has joined #openttdcoop 19:02:09 <fleet5> !password 19:02:09 <coopserver> fleet5: double 19:03:00 *** fleet5 has quit IRC 19:03:12 *** fleet75 has joined #openttdcoop 19:03:17 <fleet75> !password 19:03:17 <coopserver> fleet75: almost 19:03:24 <coopserver> *** Game paused (connecting clients) 19:03:27 <coopserver> *** fleet75 has joined 19:03:28 <coopserver> *** Game unpaused (connecting clients) 19:03:49 <coopserver> <fleet75> hi 19:04:00 <coopserver> <Djanxy> hey 19:04:37 <coopserver> *** psde has left the game (Leaving) 19:05:24 <coopserver> <o11c> what are the tunnels for? 19:05:48 <coopserver> <Jam35> more platforms 19:05:49 <coopserver> <Sylf> who what where? 19:05:58 <coopserver> <Sylf> oh there :) 19:06:00 <coopserver> <o11c> I'm watching REFINERY 19:06:17 <coopserver> <Sylf> more crazy design 19:06:23 <coopserver> <BallC> high capacity terminus design 19:06:32 <coopserver> <Sylf> I have like the uber boring design 19:07:15 <coopserver> <o11c> destroyed station ... 19:07:26 <coopserver> <o11c> why do you keep clearing land? 19:07:41 <coopserver> <Jam35> trees 19:07:50 <coopserver> <o11c> ah, stupid local authority 19:08:41 <coopserver> <Djanxy> what's up 19:08:47 <coopserver> <BallC> not much 19:08:54 <coopserver> <BallC> just going to start the BBH right north of there 19:09:00 <coopserver> <Djanxy> aha :) 19:09:19 <coopserver> <fleet75> the trees look so strange 19:09:31 <coopserver> <fleet75> like big fat organic sausages 19:09:52 *** Vinnie has joined #openttdcoop 19:09:54 <Vinnie> !password 19:09:55 <coopserver> Vinnie: almost 19:10:02 <coopserver> *** Game paused (connecting clients) 19:10:04 <coopserver> *** Vinnie has joined 19:10:05 <coopserver> *** Game unpaused (connecting clients) 19:10:07 <coopserver> <Vinnie> Hi 19:10:24 <coopserver> <fleet75> hi 19:11:08 <coopserver> *** fleet75 has left the game (Leaving) 19:11:24 <coopserver> <Jam35> hi 19:11:42 <coopserver> <Vinnie> this looks amazing 19:11:55 <coopserver> <Djanxy> so do you ! 19:12:03 <coopserver> <Djanxy> or 19:12:06 <coopserver> <Djanxy> i guess 19:12:21 <coopserver> <Djanxy> i'm imagining you as a sparkling unicorn 19:12:22 <coopserver> <o11c> cl 19:12:37 <coopserver> <Vinnie> actually im more like a rainbow in springtime 19:12:44 <coopserver> <Djanxy> close call 19:12:48 <coopserver> <Vinnie> i know 19:13:23 <coopserver> <Vinnie> lot of new players :D 19:15:23 *** fleet75 has quit IRC 19:16:56 <coopserver> <o11c> you have enough space to merge all 3 before turning I think 19:17:04 <coopserver> *** Vinnie has joined company #1 19:20:55 <coopserver> <Sylf> hmm 19:21:07 <coopserver> <Sylf> no regard to future expandability whatsoever... 19:21:29 <coopserver> <Jam35> (mine I expect) 19:21:33 <coopserver> <Djanxy> or mine 19:21:34 <coopserver> <Sylf> mine 19:21:35 <coopserver> <BallC> lol mine 19:21:36 <coopserver> <Djanxy> oh lol 19:24:05 <coopserver> <BallC> @@(gap 4) 19:24:06 <Webster> coopserver: For Trainlength of 4: <= 10 needs 2, 11 - 16 needs 3, 17 - 22 needs 4. 19:27:31 <coopserver> <Djanxy> hmm, think I've made a mess 19:27:52 *** psde has left #openttdcoop 19:27:59 <coopserver> <Vinnie> looks nice 19:28:11 <coopserver> <Djanxy> be honest :) 19:28:20 <coopserver> <Sylf> I'm going all out TF :P whatever you're doing should be better than mine 19:28:22 <coopserver> <Vinnie> compact 19:28:40 <coopserver> <Djanxy> yeah, tried going for compact with the long tunnels 19:28:50 <coopserver> <Vinnie> merger ontop of tunnels is nice combo 19:29:18 <coopserver> <Djanxy> mostly satisfied, although the northern prios annoys me 19:29:39 <coopserver> <Vinnie> too short? 19:29:42 <coopserver> <Djanxy> ye 19:30:21 <coopserver> <Vinnie> i can give you one tile 19:30:22 <coopserver> <Djanxy> and general execution really :) 19:30:29 <coopserver> <Djanxy> go ahead 19:30:52 <coopserver> <Djanxy> CL though ? 19:31:03 <coopserver> <Vinnie> not sure 19:31:53 <coopserver> <Djanxy> guess the bridge cam be moved a tile 19:32:04 <coopserver> <Vinnie> or lower tunnels 1 tile 19:32:16 <coopserver> <Djanxy> true 19:32:24 <coopserver> <Djanxy> i'll have a look in a bit 19:33:47 <coopserver> *** o11c has left the game (Leaving) 19:34:42 *** zxbiohazardzx has joined #openttdcoop 19:35:16 <zxbiohazardzx> !players 19:35:16 <coopserver> zxbiohazardzx: There are currently 5 players and 0 spectators, making a total of 5 clients connected 19:35:18 <zxbiohazardzx> !password 19:35:18 <coopserver> zxbiohazardzx: resets 19:36:08 *** Maraxus has joined #openttdcoop 19:36:08 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Maraxus 19:36:13 <coopserver> <Sylf> hopefully I won't need an overflow here 19:36:23 <coopserver> <BallC> famous last words 19:36:25 <coopserver> <BallC> :P 19:36:34 <coopserver> <Vinnie> easy 19:36:48 <coopserver> <Vinnie> make a line straight into the sea and call it overflow 19:36:56 <coopserver> <Sylf> ah yes 19:37:06 <coopserver> <Sylf> /dev/null 19:37:15 <Maraxus> !password 19:37:15 <coopserver> Maraxus: resets 19:37:24 <coopserver> *** Game paused (connecting clients) 19:37:27 <coopserver> *** Maraxus has joined 19:37:28 <coopserver> *** Game unpaused (connecting clients) 19:37:47 <coopserver> *** Maraxus has joined company #1 19:37:53 <coopserver> <Maraxus> hi 19:37:56 <coopserver> <Sylf> hi 19:37:59 <coopserver> <Vinnie> hi 19:40:07 <coopserver> *** Game paused (connecting clients) 19:40:09 <coopserver> *** ZxBiohazardZx has joined 19:40:10 <coopserver> *** Game unpaused (connecting clients) 19:40:12 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> sup everyone 19:40:17 <coopserver> <Vinnie> dutchie 19:40:28 *** Born_Acorn has quit IRC 19:40:36 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> true 19:49:27 <coopserver> <Jam35> hi bio 19:49:45 <coopserver> <Jam35> was preoccupied 19:51:59 <coopserver> <Jam35> refinery done 19:52:21 <coopserver> <Vinnie> Beer done 20:02:33 *** Born_Acorn has joined #openttdcoop 20:09:51 <coopserver> *** Djanxy has joined spectators 20:09:59 <coopserver> <Djanxy> off for a while 20:10:09 <coopserver> <BallC> take care 20:10:30 <coopserver> <Vinnie> bye 20:12:12 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> wait its TL4 ? 20:12:16 <coopserver> <Sylf> yup 20:12:25 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> my bad, i thought it would fit, thx 20:15:45 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> who did that bad junction towards the northwest of 04? 20:16:07 <coopserver> <BallC> lol thought you were talking about mine 20:16:14 <coopserver> <BallC> had to double check where 04 was 20:16:20 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> nah your actually building 03 20:16:26 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> not commenting that till its done :) 20:16:47 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> Sylf can i nuke the bad stuff 20:17:25 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> its all bad, all red stuff just makes no sense 20:17:34 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> can i just nuke and rebuild it? 20:17:39 <coopserver> <Sylf> no 20:17:47 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> hmmz k 20:17:48 <coopserver> <Sylf> we already did that with the last game 20:17:54 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> hehe 20:17:57 <coopserver> <Sylf> we do that, and whoever was building will never learn 20:18:12 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> true,but its not signed, so hard to tell who made it 20:18:20 <coopserver> <Sylf> I have an idea 20:18:39 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> k 20:19:06 <coopserver> <Sylf> I'd love to connect my town drop otherwise :) 20:19:14 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> hmhm 20:19:32 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> Steel Factory & Sawmill still to do? 20:19:37 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> cause then ill build there 20:19:44 <coopserver> <Sylf> oh 20:19:51 <coopserver> <Sylf> I thought someone was building one earlier 20:19:59 <coopserver> <Vinnie> i gave up 20:20:00 <coopserver> <Sylf> probably vinnie or someone 20:20:08 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> k 20:20:22 <coopserver> <Sylf> had some crazy symmetry going on for a while 20:20:24 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> BallC whats your plan on 03 (globally 20:20:30 <coopserver> <Vinnie> yeah 20:20:35 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> where will you make the big swap 20:20:40 <coopserver> <Vinnie> didnt fit in with a merger tough 20:21:58 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> good plan BallC :) 20:22:13 <coopserver> <BallC> then i just have 2 right turns 20:22:14 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> just continue construction, ill just watch if you dont mind :) 20:22:28 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> yeah turns are the pain usually 20:23:31 <coopserver> <Vinnie> merge Wto S is on splitting location of hub 20:23:51 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> i think he ment on the lower tracks but yeah 20:24:26 <coopserver> <BallC> you're right... let me think about that a second 20:24:52 <coopserver> <Sylf> almost 3:30PM... lunch break 20:24:55 <coopserver> *** Sylf has joined spectators 20:24:57 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> use the red parts to your advantage 20:25:05 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> tunnels -> choices -> outputs 20:46:43 <coopserver> <Vinnie> sleepy time, cya 20:46:54 <coopserver> *** Vinnie has left the game (Leaving) 20:46:57 <coopserver> <Maraxus> cu 20:47:04 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> cya 20:47:05 <coopserver> <Jam35> bye 20:54:40 <coopserver> <BallC> smh 20:54:49 <coopserver> <BallC> working zoomed in and hooked up the wrong lines to my join 20:54:55 <coopserver> <BallC> hooked both directions of my mainline together 20:54:56 <coopserver> <BallC> lol 21:00:24 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> see suggestionairs 21:00:37 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> also you might have a hard time hooking the " other" connection like this 21:00:54 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> use the colors to your advantage when building 21:01:17 <coopserver> <BallC> what do you mean? 21:01:21 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> color green for To West, Yellow for To East, Blue for To south, Red for From south 21:01:27 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> so see ! example to your left 21:02:25 <coopserver> <BallC> gotcha 21:02:31 <coopserver> <BallC> to help keep track of lines 21:02:33 <coopserver> <BallC> while building 21:03:11 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> well simplified but you get my point 21:03:18 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> use colors to determine directions 21:05:30 <coopserver> <BallC> oh duh 21:05:36 <coopserver> <BallC> you're calling west south 21:05:37 <coopserver> <BallC> lol 21:05:45 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> im calling colorcode 21:06:47 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> anyway you get hte point 21:06:52 <coopserver> <BallC> yup 21:06:54 <coopserver> <BallC> good idea 21:06:55 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> colorcode and find a way to get all connect in 21:07:04 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> biggest pain is the two lefts 21:07:06 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> rest if fine 21:12:04 <coopserver> <Sylf> :D we have another crazy go at the steel factory 21:12:28 <coopserver> <Maraxus> indeed :) 21:14:17 <coopserver> *** Sylf has joined company #1 21:14:38 <coopserver> <Djanxy> i see a wild slug 21:14:44 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> lies 21:14:53 <coopserver> <Djanxy> the slug is a lie + 21:15:01 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> anyway i think the blue bend is useless and might create pathfind isue? 21:15:05 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> not sure 21:15:13 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> you can compact the design, but your getting there 21:15:30 <coopserver> <Jam35> Djanxy wins 21:15:45 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> you could make red chose and keep blue as was or just go half half (blue and red split, blue and red prio) 21:15:48 <coopserver> <Djanxy> what do I win ? 21:15:58 <coopserver> <Jam35> kudos 21:16:03 *** LSky` has quit IRC 21:16:08 <coopserver> <Djanxy> and what for ? :) 21:16:12 <coopserver> <Jam35> for good eyesight 21:16:28 <coopserver> <Djanxy> oh, the slug 21:17:07 <coopserver> <BallC> not sure i'm following what you're saying with the prio/choice/choice/prio signs 21:17:31 <coopserver> <BallC> so don't take the left blue all the way up, cut it in between the tunnels 21:19:20 <coopserver> *** Djanxy has joined company #1 21:20:29 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> that 21:20:53 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> see now? 21:21:57 <coopserver> <BallC> i think so 21:23:44 <coopserver> <BallC> its not balanced though 21:23:49 <coopserver> <BallC> or are you just omitting that in your example 21:24:26 *** Vinnie has quit IRC 21:26:48 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> its balanced 21:26:59 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> 2+2 -> 2 balanced (inner merge) 21:27:07 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> they have either choice or prio 21:28:20 <coopserver> <BallC> I'm not seeing how Right Blue gets to L Out 21:28:33 <coopserver> <Djanxy> it doesn't 21:28:35 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> right blue has prio 21:28:37 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> it doesnt 21:28:45 <coopserver> *** Jam35 has left the game (Leaving) 21:28:46 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> left blue gets to L out and R out 21:28:54 <Jam35> bbb 21:28:55 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> right red goes to L out and R out 21:29:06 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> and L Red and R Blue just go to L and R 21:29:30 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> it helps to keep stuff compact 21:30:24 <coopserver> <BallC> ok, i thought balanced was all-to-all 21:30:29 <coopserver> <BallC> any lane in can take any lane out 21:30:59 <coopserver> <Djanxy> full choice on merges aren't needed, since there should always be full choice on splits 21:31:10 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> you need to make sure traffic is balanced 21:31:25 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> Left + half+half = 2 21:31:30 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> Right + half + half = 2 21:31:31 <coopserver> <BallC> ahhh ok 21:31:35 <coopserver> <BallC> balanced is the hub as a whole 21:31:39 <coopserver> <BallC> not just the merge 21:31:40 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> as long as the sum fits it doesnt matter 21:31:47 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> sum needs to be 2 21:31:56 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> either half+half+half+half+half 21:32:00 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> or full+half+half 21:32:05 <coopserver> <BallC> which is any-to-any 21:32:12 <coopserver> <BallC> or inner merge like you've shown 21:32:14 <coopserver> <BallC> ok that makes sense 21:32:25 <coopserver> <BallC> sorry, this is my first coop game so i'm still learning this stuff :) 21:32:34 <coopserver> <Djanxy> can do it in a variety of ways 21:32:47 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> its fine 21:32:55 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> we are here to explain andhelp 21:33:03 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> we didnt learn it in 5 seconds either 21:33:07 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> just take a look and learn :) 21:33:33 <coopserver> <Djanxy> a lot of time can be spend staring at other people's work :D 21:33:40 <coopserver> <Djanxy> spent* 21:33:54 <coopserver> <Djanxy> i do my fair share at least 21:34:30 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> tunnels where good 21:34:40 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> the ones under farm 21:39:19 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> it fits 1 signal so its fine 21:42:17 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> CL=2? 21:42:21 <coopserver> <BallC> yup 21:42:25 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> then its good 21:43:40 <coopserver> <BallC> that's much better :) 21:43:41 <coopserver> <Djanxy> can be shortened if that farm dies :) 21:44:26 <coopserver> <Djanxy> unless some evil person is gonna keep it alive 21:44:36 <coopserver> <Djanxy> (that's vinnie) 21:44:38 <coopserver> <BallC> only 40 units of livestock 21:44:46 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> we dont care for the farm 21:44:53 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> tunnels allow choice so we /care for it 21:44:59 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> there is room for prios so 21:45:00 <coopserver> <Djanxy> :) 21:46:06 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> ok thats 1 side " done" 21:46:19 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> now just repeat that 2 more times and you have a BBH :) 21:46:31 <coopserver> <BallC> :) 21:46:34 <coopserver> <BallC> ok i'm going to give it a shot 21:48:09 <coopserver> <Sylf> I'm envious of the south town drop 21:48:49 <coopserver> <Djanxy> was bored :) 21:48:50 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> haha why? 21:49:13 <coopserver> <Sylf> it's getting traffic already, you know! 21:49:29 <coopserver> <Djanxy> hehe 21:49:55 <coopserver> <Djanxy> cant you just hack the connection to bbh 05 for now ? :D 21:50:03 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> he can 21:50:09 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> just connect it to 04 for now 21:50:58 <coopserver> <BallC> just put a bypass in until that junction gets built? 21:51:07 <coopserver> <Sylf> nah 21:51:30 <coopserver> <Sylf> bypass it now, and the steel factory will feel neglected next 21:53:33 <coopserver> <Djanxy> damn, now there's a watery slug as well 21:53:40 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> lies 21:54:15 <coopserver> <Djanxy> hmm, the canal cheat isn't that pretty on this landscape 21:54:42 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> true but i wanted to try it :P 21:54:49 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> better then land-bridge 21:54:50 <coopserver> <Djanxy> yaya :) 22:06:41 <coopserver> <Sylf> BallC et al, can I show you something there? 22:06:48 <coopserver> <BallC> sure 22:07:02 <coopserver> <Sylf> i hope it'll work 22:07:15 <coopserver> <Sylf> hm 22:08:06 <coopserver> <Sylf> ah, that should work 22:08:21 <coopserver> <Sylf> then we can avoid TFing that pond 22:08:26 <coopserver> <Sylf> or bridge all over it 22:09:35 <coopserver> <BallC> nice 22:12:23 <coopserver> <BallC> any problem leaving this BBH color coded? 22:12:54 <coopserver> <Sylf> not much 22:14:02 <coopserver> <BallC> ok, just think it's a lot easier looking at it and understanding it when it's color coded :) 22:14:16 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> sill 1 todo man 22:14:19 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> yellow to green 22:22:04 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> puzzle with help, enjoy 22:22:09 <coopserver> <BallC> lol 22:22:18 <coopserver> <BallC> thanks, i would have joined them and then split again 22:22:21 <coopserver> <BallC> :D 22:24:16 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> puzzle tip: dont bridge the prios 22:24:32 <coopserver> <BallC> oh yeah, b/c then i'd have to double them 22:28:28 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> tip on bottom 22:28:44 <coopserver> <Sylf> actually 22:28:49 <coopserver> <Sylf> we can use what we already have 22:29:00 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> yep 22:29:02 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> ofc 22:29:03 <coopserver> <Sylf> I'd connect like that 22:29:15 <coopserver> <BallC> ok so i keep getting confused about where i'm supposed to double bridge :P 22:29:32 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> just remember that you ALWAYS double bridge over something 22:29:37 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> unless you continue after a split 22:29:48 <coopserver> <BallC> ok, yeah, it's that second part 22:29:50 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> so A is double and B is single cause A has 1 per 22:30:20 <coopserver> <ZxBiohazardZx> so single after single is ok, but always double on first 22:30:34 <coopserver> <BallC> makes sense 22:31:03 <coopserver> <Sylf> basically we have that 22:31:22 <coopserver> <Sylf> but at the end, instead of merging back, we're connecting to 2 separate lines 22:31:42 <coopserver> <BallC> yup, understood 22:32:35 <coopserver> <Sylf> ok, I'll stop messing right there 22:34:13 <coopserver> <Maraxus> I'm off - gn 22:34:19 *** zxbiohazardzx has quit IRC 22:34:22 <coopserver> <Sylf> if you're looking for a clean 3-way merge... 22:34:24 <coopserver> *** ZxBiohazardZx has left the game (Leaving) 22:34:27 <coopserver> <BallC> yeah 22:34:29 <coopserver> *** Maraxus has left the game (Leaving) 22:34:41 <coopserver> <Sylf> that's what you're looking for 22:34:50 *** Maraxus has quit IRC 22:34:52 <coopserver> <BallC> ty 22:35:46 <coopserver> <Sylf> if you want another one there... 22:35:57 <coopserver> <Sylf> there's a trick we can use 22:36:18 <coopserver> <BallC> whats up 22:36:22 <coopserver> <BallC> err whats that 22:36:43 <coopserver> <Sylf> that 22:37:04 <coopserver> <BallC> you make it look easy :) 22:39:28 <coopserver> <Sylf> add prio, and you're almost done 22:39:36 <coopserver> <BallC> yup working on it now 22:40:38 <coopserver> <Sylf> that, sir, creates a signal gap 22:40:58 <coopserver> <Sylf> You can't repeat the combo signals 22:41:26 <coopserver> <BallC> ahh ok 22:41:27 <coopserver> <Sylf> or they'll all turn red and stay red until the trains exit the series of combo signals 22:41:58 <coopserver> <BallC> so you can only do 1 combo, 1 exit? 22:42:03 <coopserver> <Sylf> yup. 22:42:07 <coopserver> <BallC> otherwise, you gotta use the parallel track thingamajig 22:42:11 <coopserver> <Sylf> right 22:43:11 <coopserver> <Sylf> use the parallel track there 22:43:29 <coopserver> <Sylf> the smallest parallel track possible 22:43:55 <coopserver> <Sylf> then if you want, you can use that combo/exit signal combination again 22:44:10 <coopserver> <Sylf> if you want. 22:44:33 <coopserver> <BallC> i'm not sure how to figure out how long a priorty to make though 22:44:45 <coopserver> <Sylf> that only comes with experience 22:45:02 <coopserver> <Sylf> the easiest thing to do is see what other people are doing on each map 22:45:10 <coopserver> <Sylf> and copy their prio size 22:45:12 <coopserver> <BallC> but for TL4 with these trains, you're doing like 8 tiles? 22:45:41 <coopserver> <Sylf> these trains can accelerate okay most of the time, so they don't need to be so long 22:45:46 <coopserver> <Sylf> especially in BBHs 22:46:07 <coopserver> <Sylf> SLH prio can be longer than BBH prios 22:46:18 <coopserver> <Djanxy> speaking of prios 22:46:24 <coopserver> <Djanxy> BBH 02 doesn't have any ? 22:46:27 <coopserver> <Sylf> in BBH/MSH, all traffic going through are main line traffic 22:46:48 <coopserver> <Sylf> right, I omitted prio there 22:46:56 <coopserver> <Sylf> and created full all-to-all connections 22:47:11 <coopserver> <Djanxy> mm, excited to see how it does at load 22:47:26 <coopserver> <Sylf> yeah 22:47:44 <coopserver> <Sylf> my goal there was to create an all-to-all hub with an industry in the middle 22:47:56 <coopserver> <Djanxy> :) 22:48:19 <coopserver> <Sylf> the industry's dead already, but it's ok! 22:49:23 <coopserver> <Sylf> Mare Asopus is your SLH? 22:49:35 <coopserver> <Djanxy> oh ye, no sign 22:50:02 <coopserver> <Sylf> ah, time to have some fun 22:50:14 <coopserver> <Djanxy> knock yourself out 22:51:16 *** Progman has quit IRC 22:52:24 <coopserver> <Djanxy> doh 22:52:33 <coopserver> <Djanxy> the station im making doesnt have the drop yet 22:52:53 <coopserver> <Sylf> oh, rubber 22:52:55 <coopserver> <Sylf> right 22:53:10 <coopserver> <Djanxy> guess i can cheat 22:53:14 <coopserver> <Djanxy> til it's done 22:53:22 <coopserver> <Sylf> that rubber factory area is getting popular with primaries 22:53:47 <coopserver> <Sylf> how to complete this crazy stuff.. 22:53:50 <coopserver> <Djanxy> yup, noticed they tend to be there, and not so much where SLs are fitting :) 22:56:33 <coopserver> <Sylf> that crap is totally unneeded but 22:56:40 <coopserver> <Sylf> totally needed for added fun 22:56:56 <coopserver> <Djanxy> :P 22:57:01 <coopserver> <Djanxy> ofc 22:57:10 <coopserver> <Sylf> we need to fund the steel mill 23:03:48 <coopserver> <Sylf> going for those oil rigs? 23:04:29 <coopserver> <Djanxy> was thinking copper, but that too 23:04:48 <coopserver> <Sylf> for the oil, I was thinking of another SLH 23:04:53 <coopserver> <Djanxy> np 23:05:23 <coopserver> <Sylf> for copper, we probably don't need double bridges 23:05:45 <coopserver> <Sylf> you should make one set of bridges the return path 23:05:46 <coopserver> <Djanxy> nah 23:06:12 <coopserver> <Djanxy> actually, that was my plan at first - but i guess i just doubled them as force of habit :) 23:14:03 <coopserver> <Djanxy> soo 23:14:06 <coopserver> <Djanxy> the question is 23:14:11 <coopserver> <Djanxy> when is "tomorrow" 23:14:46 <coopserver> <Sylf> tomorrow doesn't expire for another few hours 23:14:54 <coopserver> <Sylf> since that construction started 23:14:58 <coopserver> <Djanxy> oki ;) 23:15:14 <coopserver> <Djanxy> pesky muricans 23:15:19 <coopserver> <BallC> hey now 23:15:23 <coopserver> <Djanxy> :DD 23:15:27 <coopserver> <Sylf> I'm safe there 23:15:37 <coopserver> <Djanxy> canada? 23:15:41 <coopserver> <Sylf> non 23:15:57 <coopserver> <Sylf> I only live in murica :P 23:16:03 <coopserver> <Djanxy> ;) 23:16:18 <coopserver> <Sylf> I grew up with shinkansen 23:16:54 <coopserver> <Djanxy> oh, Japan 23:17:05 <coopserver> <Sylf> jup 23:27:45 <coopserver> <Djanxy> hmm, is it time for 4 way SLH 23:28:09 <coopserver> <Sylf> I'll steer clear out of it 23:28:16 <coopserver> <Djanxy> heh 23:28:21 <coopserver> <Djanxy> perhaps i should as well 23:28:46 <coopserver> <Djanxy> seems fitting between BBH 03 and MSH 02 23:29:46 <coopserver> <Djanxy> what are you up to now BallC ? 23:37:26 <coopserver> <BallC> dinner :) 23:37:37 <coopserver> <Djanxy> not too shabby :) 23:37:41 <coopserver> <BallC> but back now 23:37:46 <coopserver> <BallC> just looking around a.t.m. 23:37:47 <coopserver> <Djanxy> i need dinner 23:37:51 <coopserver> <Djanxy> but it's soon 2 am 23:38:52 <coopserver> <Sylf> hm 23:38:54 <coopserver> <Sylf> too ugly 23:39:01 <coopserver> <BallC> I'm going to go read up on it but is this part of BBH01 an evil x? 23:39:33 <coopserver> <Sylf> it's not evil 23:39:41 <coopserver> <Djanxy> its cuddly 23:39:50 <coopserver> <BallC> lol 23:39:51 <coopserver> <Djanxy> how can you think that 23:40:15 <coopserver> <BallC> ok, i found it on the wiki, i remember the phrase, didn't remember the content 23:41:26 <coopserver> <Djanxy> i find it to be more of an issue when it's used to merge to lines, and the exit lanes goes to same destination 23:41:33 <coopserver> <Djanxy> to=two* 23:42:20 <coopserver> <Djanxy> then you can get the situation where they will cross all the time 23:42:23 <coopserver> <BallC> yeah, just popped out at me b/c i don't see that used in anyone else's hubs 23:42:29 <coopserver> <Djanxy> and stop each other 23:42:50 <coopserver> <Djanxy> there's soo many ways to do things 23:42:55 *** KWKdesign has quit IRC 23:43:16 *** KWKdesign has joined #openttdcoop 23:43:31 <coopserver> <Djanxy> it likely works just fine, and if it doesn't it will be modified 23:43:41 <coopserver> <Sylf> actually, you don't want PBS there 23:44:29 <coopserver> <Sylf> the alternative is 23:44:41 <coopserver> <Sylf> is that 23:44:54 <coopserver> <BallC> :) 23:44:56 <coopserver> <BallC> very nice 23:45:00 <coopserver> <Sylf> that or the earlier version don't make any difference 23:45:21 <coopserver> <Sylf> so I left with the version that splits sooner 23:45:23 <coopserver> <Djanxy> earlier version had room for a train infront of the entry signal 23:45:47 <coopserver> <BallC> Q for you... when double-bridging, use presignals or just regular block? 23:45:57 <coopserver> <Sylf> depends 23:45:59 <coopserver> <BallC> assuming you have the extra straight tile in front 23:46:22 <coopserver> <Djanxy> i tend to use block 23:46:26 <coopserver> <Sylf> go search the blog for "evil mode" 23:46:31 <coopserver> <Djanxy> yeah 23:47:00 <coopserver> <Djanxy> presignals can potentially cause that 23:47:07 <coopserver> <BallC> oooo 23:47:15 <coopserver> <BallC> I was looking at evil X 23:47:51 <coopserver> <Sylf> evil x and evil mode are 2 separate things 23:48:23 <coopserver> <Sylf> evil x is an X cross that creates a signal gap 23:48:48 <coopserver> <Sylf> evil mode is a double bridge/tunnel that leads to perpetual slow-down in ML traffic 23:52:14 <coopserver> <Sylf> any good idea for prio @ SLH 06 merge north? 23:53:36 <coopserver> <Djanxy> not really :) 23:56:56 <coopserver> <Sylf> 1 more 23:57:15 <coopserver> <Sylf> although it'll probably will never get used