Log for #openttd on 14th October 2006:
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00:24:13  <MeusH> oh man
00:24:16  <MeusH> it's 2am
00:24:21  <MeusH> and I'm drawing sprites :o
00:24:26  <MeusH> I'm off
00:24:27  <MeusH> bye
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02:06:40  <zeth-> theres no music on my ottd (some recent nightly) any ideas? :p
02:06:49  <zeth-> effects are there
02:06:56  <glx> do you have gm dir?
02:07:08  <zeth-> ya, filled with .gm's
02:07:26  <glx> which OS?
02:07:36  <zeth-> win xp sp2
02:07:41  <zeth-> r6728
02:07:45  <zeth-> if it matters
02:08:06  <zeth-> oh fuck
02:08:16  <zeth-> i "fixed" it lol
02:08:27  <glx> you pressed paly ?
02:09:04  <zeth-> no, ive experienced problems with my soundcard lately, so i had muted most of the stuff in the soundsettings, including the MIDI thingie
02:09:15  <glx> lol :)
02:10:02  <zeth-> lets just say when its not muted my speakers makes some crackling sounds
02:10:07  <zeth-> i guess i have to mute it
02:13:11  <Triffid_Hunter> hehe just play your own music..'s goapsy stream works for me ;)
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07:20:29  <Wolf01> hi
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07:43:42  <Wolf01> Frostregen, here, now
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08:28:44  <Frostregen> hi wolf
08:28:48  <Frostregen> what is it? :)
08:29:46  * Frostregen slaps Wolf01 around a bit with a large trout
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09:11:38  <Wolf01>  viewport highlight mode (for highlighting tiles below cursor)
09:12:03  <Wolf01> and if i don't want to highlight tiles below cursor?
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09:35:57  <MeusH> hi
09:37:13  <peter1138> morning meush
09:37:22  <peter1138> don't include the ground tile
09:37:27  <peter1138> as that's already there
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09:39:06  <MeusH> okay
09:39:13  <MeusH> how about dividing the sprite?
09:39:40  <MeusH> I mean, things that are on the ground will be one sprite, and rest of things, like a building, should be on the second sprite?
09:39:54  <peter1138> yeah, that'll work
09:39:58  <peter1138> although
09:40:14  <peter1138> if you have stuff in front of the track, that needs to be a separate sprite from the stuff behind the track
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09:51:08  <CIA-1> Darkvater * r6769 /trunk/ (aircraft_cmd.c airport.c airport_movement.h):
09:51:08  <CIA-1> -Codechange: Minor syntax, const correctness, variable localization, coding
09:51:08  <CIA-1>  style changes to airport code, and cleanup of airport.c. Should not change
09:51:08  <CIA-1>  any functionality.
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09:53:33  <hylje> arrr
09:54:17  <MeusH> thanks peter1138
09:54:29  <MeusH> so it's the same for both waypoint and a station?
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10:03:52  <Tron> Darkvater: /* First element of depots array tells us how many depots there are (to know size of array)
10:03:59  <Tron> i guess that comment is stale
10:04:53  <Darkvater> indeed
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10:26:16  <CIA-1> Darkvater * r6770 /trunk/ (airport.c airport_movement.h):
10:26:16  <CIA-1> -Codechange: Make the airport checking a bit stricter...fix unnoticed errors:
10:26:16  <CIA-1>  Commuter (20): invalid use of terminal group designator; since all other options
10:26:16  <CIA-1>  goto position 2 and no additional blocks are checked, simplify state
10:26:16  <CIA-1>  Intercontinental (23, 30): no extra states are needed since all options go to
10:26:18  <CIA-1>  position 70 and 31 unconditionally
10:26:20  <CIA-1>  Intercontinental (31): invalid use of more-options-to-follow (255)
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11:26:56  <Darkvater> hmm
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11:27:19  <Darkvater> if we send chat messages, should the GUI (chat-window) reflect someway what kind of message we're sending?
11:27:26  <Darkvater> eg all/allies/pm?
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11:27:45  <Darkvater> differently coloured window?
11:27:51  <Darkvater> some small text before?
11:29:43  <ln-> pink heart figures?
11:29:52  * Darkvater slaps ln-
11:31:00  <Progman> like "[Private][User]: Hey, do that"?
11:31:20  <Darkvater> no, in the chat window, wher eyou type your message
11:33:23  <Progman> maybe some dropdown/dropup on the left
11:33:47  <Darkvater> so you think string-based?
11:33:48  <Progman> "[All [^]]: [Okay guys                  ][Send]"
11:34:27  <Progman> whatelse? icons?
11:34:36  <Darkvater> donnu, that's why I'm asking
11:34:44  <Darkvater> I have here a patch from someone that changes the widget colours
11:35:23  <Progman> I preferred strings
11:35:46  <Progman> "All, Team, Private, ..." localized of course
11:36:19  <Progman> ou, the tokens already exists ;)
11:39:15  <hylje> All: Private: Team:
11:39:19  <Bjarni> "Hello, I have version 0.4.8 and I have iMac intel 20" 64bit
11:39:19  <Bjarni> When I want have Screen resolution over 1280x800 I crash
11:39:19  <Bjarni> (1680x1050) with my older iMac 20" intel 32bit I don't haved this problem."
11:39:29  <Bjarni> and it looks like a NULL pointer issue
11:39:31  <Bjarni> any ideas?
11:39:43  <Bjarni> works on 64 bit PPC
11:40:24  <MeusH> Darkvater: how about shuffling widgets in a chat window?a window title?
11:40:32  <Darkvater> there's no window title
11:40:38  <MeusH> Make "send" and "cancel" buttons smaller
11:40:46  <Darkvater> I'm thinking of removing 'send'
11:40:50  <Darkvater> send is 'enter'
11:40:53  <MeusH> and put a text left to the text area
11:41:10  <MeusH> like "Say to all" or "Say to your company"
11:41:24  <MeusH> "Speak to all", "Speak to <user>", "Speak to company"
11:41:30  <Darkvater> yah, was thinking the same
11:41:45  <Darkvater> All / Team / Private
11:41:57  <MeusH> Yeah
11:46:40  <Bjarni> <-- any idea on how to figure out what piece of code is on that location?
11:46:49  <Bjarni> I presume video code, but...
11:47:28  <Darkvater> 0 org.ludde-ottd.ludde-ottd 0x00003df0 0x1000 + 11760
11:47:34  <Darkvater> wtf is that still doing there?
11:48:00  <Bjarni> I think I changed that in the trunk
11:48:04  <Bjarni> this is 0.4.8
11:48:50  <Bjarni> it was the logical thing to write in 0.2.1, but not anymore. Ludde is not mr. OpenTTD anymore
11:48:56  <Darkvater> hehe
11:49:08  * Darkvater has no idea about osx error reports
11:50:07  <Bjarni> also it looks really weird as how can a working pointer on 32 bit turn into a NULL pointer on 64 bit?
11:50:39  <Bjarni> specially since it should switch the CPU to 32 bit mode, which should then work just as a 32 bit CPU
11:52:09  <Bjarni> and... that pointer is not NULL for 1280x800 or smaller
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11:59:16  * Bjarni hates getting weird bug reports like this
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12:46:27  <MeusH> peter1138,
12:46:32  <MeusH> is that good?
13:02:25  <Eddi|zuHause3> do you honestly want to pretend you accept a "no" for an answer? ;)
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13:13:13  <MeusH> yes?
13:14:24  <Born_Acorn> ew those sheep are teh fugly
13:23:32  * peter1138 looks
13:25:32  <peter1138> MeusH: they rock
13:26:23  <MeusH> thanks
13:26:32  <MeusH> are they good from the NFO coder's point of view?
13:26:51  <Wolf01> somebody can help me and frost with tile highlighting?
13:27:07  <peter1138> yes
13:28:46  <Born_Acorn> MeusH, they'll be overlapped onto the railway track tiles
13:28:55  <Born_Acorn> So it should all fit.
13:29:26  <MeusH> okies, thanks
13:29:41  <MeusH> Wolf01, details details
13:30:01  <Wolf01> show catchement area
13:30:30  <Wolf01> for non uniform stations
13:30:45  <MeusH> have you done anything so far?
13:30:47  <MeusH> does it crash?
13:30:58  <MeusH> how have you done it? By a tile loop?
13:31:10  <Wolf01> some tries and a bag of crashes
13:32:50  <Wolf01> 1st try) the catchement area of all stations in the map follows the mouse
13:32:52  <Wolf01> 2nd try) the catchement area is not shown
13:32:52  <Wolf01> 3rd try) the map is filled with catchement area
13:33:00  <Wolf01> other tries the game crashes
13:35:42  <Wolf01> i thought about rewrite the _thd to accept a tile as argument (normally is passed the tile under the mouse) instead of use directly the mouse coords
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13:36:11  <Wolf01> but is a lot of code
13:37:37  <Wolf01> frost told me "if (tile is inside some catchment && showcatchment) do DrawSelectionSprite(PALETTE_SEL_TILE_BLUE | (SPR_SELECT_TILE + _tileh_to_sprite[ti->tileh]), ti);"
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13:55:02  <lolman> Afternoon :)
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13:57:19  <MeusH> hello lolman
13:57:37  <MeusH> Wolf01, how about using a tile-highlight code?
13:57:50  <MeusH> I don't know how does it work, but I think it does a tile loop
13:57:53  <MeusH> based on a tile mask
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13:58:18  <lolman> MeusH, ello :)
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14:12:14  * lolman legs it to play some Defcom
14:12:20  <lolman> s/m/n
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14:15:29  <MeusH> peter1138, Lakie said "You could just combine the ground sprite with the crossing for the waypoints.
14:15:29  <MeusH> Newstations allows a station to use it's own ground sprites." <- does it work in OpenTTD, too? This will be probably easier to code, but it won't look nice with alternate grass/desert sprites or other railway sprites? What would you do?
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14:17:08  <Steve14> how can i enable the music in openttd ??
14:17:35  <pumpkin0> iŽm searching for a example of working load-balancing for a RR_LL traintrack. Thanks.
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14:17:56  <peter1138> MeusH: don't bother with your own groundsprites
14:18:18  <peter1138> MeusH: your crossing can be overlayed over the normal rail tile
14:18:32  <peter1138> then it'll work with other peoples rail graphics
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14:20:03  <MeusH> okies, thanks
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14:22:00  <Steve14> other question: is there music in openttd ??
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14:22:12  <Zavior> I have
14:22:20  <Zavior> So I suppose you have it too
14:22:21  <Zavior> :o
14:22:22  <glx> Steve14: yes, you need gm dir from TTD
14:22:28  <pumpkin0> Steve14: yes, but you need the orginal music files from TTD
14:22:50  <Steve14> i own ttd
14:23:10  <Zavior> Just copy them over.
14:23:46  <Steve14> ?
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14:24:24  <glx> ho yo have DOS version of TTD, no way to have music in openttd then
14:24:58  <Steve14> :(
14:25:50  <MeusH> some are not sure whether it's legal, but you may download a windows version...
14:26:26  <Steve14> wait
14:26:46  <Steve14> i can remember me that my father has the win version somewhere too
14:30:57  <Steve14> where does i have to copy the gm folder ??
14:31:08  <glx> in openttd dir
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14:32:06  <Steve14> thx
14:34:41  <MeusH> does it work now?
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14:43:42  <jez> !seen Belugas
14:43:44  <_42_> jez, I found 4 matches to your query: Belugas_Gone, Belugas, Goofy, Bazooka. Belugas_Gone (~Jfranc@ was last seen joining #openttd.tgp 4 hours 30 minutes ago (14.10. 10:13). Belugas_Gone is still there.
14:44:37  <peter1138> hello
14:46:12  <jez> hi
14:46:23  <jez> Know whether Belugas has committed the new widget code yet?
14:47:36  <peter1138> yes
14:48:00  <jez> i need a primer in what to change with the GUI code
14:48:38  <peter1138> any use of disabled_state, hidden_state or click_state has an accessor to use
14:48:52  <jez> mmhmm
14:49:10  <peter1138> something like SetWidgetDisabledState(window, widgetindex, boolean)
14:50:06  <jez> and do you still use the same Widget arrays to define the window GUI, just using more than 32?
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14:55:39  <glx> yes
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15:02:13  <Darkvater> hmm what would we say to a split of the owner/player mess?
15:02:25  <Darkvater> eg OWNER_TOWN is also the player town
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15:16:01  <CIA-1> Darkvater * r6771 /trunk/ (12 files in 2 dirs):
15:16:01  <CIA-1> -Codechange: Replace two macros with functions. IS_HUMAN_PLAYER and
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15:43:41  <CIA-1> Darkvater * r6772 /trunk/ (map.h smallmap_gui.c):
15:43:41  <CIA-1> -Codechange: Do not abuse OWNER_SPECTATOR as the "owner" of the industry for
15:43:41  <CIA-1>  the minimap. This also saves us from having this huge _owner_colors table.
15:43:56  <Darkvater> god
15:44:30  <CIA-1> Darkvater * r6773 /trunk/smallmap_gui.c: -eh...I had to test it didn't i, just forgot to save
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15:48:18  <chu_> hiho
15:49:46  <CIA-1> Darkvater * r6774 /trunk/ (30 files in 3 dirs):
15:49:46  <CIA-1> -Codechange: Rename the badly named OWNER_SPECTATOR to PLAYER_SPECTATOR and
15:49:46  <CIA-1>  put it into player.h where it belongs (instead of map.h)
16:04:17  <MeusH> hi chu_
16:06:29  <hylje> so DV is fixing the huge WTFs in ottd
16:08:37  <Maedhros> he hasn't got to my favourite yet though - players.c:447 ;)
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16:12:34  <Steve14> need some help with installing OpenTTD
16:13:41  <Steve14> what does i have to write into INSTALL= ?
16:15:15  <wjarok> 5 dolla
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16:15:18  <Sacro> Steve14: which os?
16:15:29  <Steve14> Sacro: SUSE Linux
16:15:33  <Steve14> 10.1
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16:16:16  <Sacro> doesnt "make install" work?
16:16:56  <Steve14> Sacro: Makefile:872: *** make install is highly experimental at his state and not tested very much - use at your own risk - to use run \"make install INSTALL:=1\" - make sure Makefile.config is set correctly up - run \"make upgradeconf\".  Schluss.
16:17:24  <Maedhros> Steve14: personally, i find it easier to run it from the directory you built it in, and use a shell script to change to that directory and run it
16:17:28  <MeusH> Steve14, copy files from /lang/ and /data/ folder, along with openttd binary
16:17:42  <MeusH> to a desired game location
16:17:43  <Steve14> oki
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16:28:27  <Steve14> can i set an option that the game saves its settings into the homefolder of the current user ??
16:28:54  <Eddi|zuHause3> afaik that is a planned feature
16:30:00  <Steve14> oki ;)
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16:34:44  <Sacro> it has it
16:34:50  <Sacro> im sure it uses ~/.openttd.cfg
16:35:02  <Sacro> no, ~/openttd/openttd.cfg
16:38:24  <Steve14> Sacro: what version SVN ??
16:39:51  <Sacro> Steve14: i cant remember
16:40:13  <Steve14> Sacro: do you use any commandline options ?
16:40:54  <Sacro> just make
16:44:24  <Steve14> noo
16:44:34  <Steve14> Sacro: when you start the game ;)
16:44:40  <Eddi|zuHause3> of course, you can specify a config file with the commandline
16:44:44  <Sacro> Steve14: no, just click on it
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16:44:52  <Eddi|zuHause3> if you make a calling script
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16:47:06  <Steve14> Eddi|zuHause3: i only give my user writepermissions on the config, that should be enough at first
16:52:39  <chu_> wouln't it be nice to have a list of all old vehicles?
17:07:52  <Steve14> chu_: look at the wiki of OTTD
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17:29:12  <Sacro> lws1984!
17:29:31  <lws1984> Sacro!
17:34:27  <Steve14> how can i send messages in game ??
17:34:41  <Eddi|zuHause3> press enter?
17:34:46  <Steve14> oki
17:35:22  <Eddi|zuHause3> come on... it's not like this is not done the same way in all other multiplayer games...
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17:41:24  <Steve14> Eddi|zuHause3: I forgot it ;)
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18:07:34  <Sacro> heh, Bjarni is very popular
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18:18:19  <hylje> indeed
18:19:47  <Darkvater> peter1138: ping
18:20:03  <Sacro> :o
18:20:09  <peter1138> pong
18:21:16  <Darkvater> peter1138: < whaddaya think? I'm trying to seperate OWNER_TOWN and PLAYER_TOWN in a seperate commit, but this would be a bit preparatory work.
18:23:21  *** Wolf01|AWAY is now known as Wolf01
18:24:04  <Darkvater> or should I just leave the seperation of PLAYER_* OWNER_* as it is?
18:24:19  <Darkvater> it would be only a semantic change anyways, since the values would not change
18:24:34  <peter1138> return pi < MAX_PLAYERS
18:24:39  <peter1138> 3.141 players :D
18:24:47  <hylje> oh no
18:24:54  <Darkvater> hehe
18:24:56  <hylje> i wonder what the .1415... player is
18:25:16  <peter1138> i don't see why they are separate
18:26:08  <peter1138> Fetched 206MB in 5m11s (661kB/s)
18:26:12  <peter1138> tum te tum :D
18:26:28  <Darkvater> eg current_player is OWNER_TOWN for example in lots of cases
18:26:36  <Darkvater> but it should not be an owner but a PLAYER_
18:26:40  <Darkvater> eg PLAYER_TOWN
18:27:07  <Sacro> peter1138: thats ridiculous
18:27:35  <peter1138> it is?
18:27:55  <Sacro> yes :(
18:28:04  <Sacro> though i havent tried maxing mine out yet
18:28:22  <Sacro> i need something to do it with... like a remote /dev/random
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18:28:25  <peter1138> this'll go to 800+
18:28:34  <peter1138> think someone else is downloading
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18:29:48  <Sacro> hmmm, 128 here
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18:29:56  <Sacro> though ive been told it can go a lot higher
18:30:15  <Sacro> unless that was their end...
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18:30:50  <Cahata> hello
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18:32:22  <Sacro> hi Cahata
18:32:35  <Cahata> hello Sacro
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20:16:29  <jez> 		/* XXX - Draw the fake widgets-buttons. Can't add these to the widget-desc since
20:16:29  <jez> 		 * openttd currently can only handle 32 widgets. So hack it *g* */
20:16:33  <jez> That is in news_gui.c
20:16:43  <jez> Why is that still in there even with the new widgets code in?
20:18:02  <Born_Acorn> We're suckers for old times and nostalgia.
20:18:18  * Born_Acorn thinks back to the good happnin's
20:19:15  <hylje> and we like WTFs
20:21:33  *** Mucht|work [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
20:21:46  <lws1984> WTF? :p
20:22:24  <hylje> interesting stuff in code
20:22:30  <hylje> that is in essence useless and stupid
20:22:34  <hylje> or redundant
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20:35:54  <jez> sigh
20:36:02  <jez> my patch is now totally broken with the latest trunk :'-(
20:36:04  <Bjarni> jez: basically because nobody changed it
20:36:20  <glx> yet
20:36:24  <jez> somehow there's a mismatched #if/#endif pair
20:36:25  <hylje> jez: the bane of maintaining a patch
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20:38:03  <Bjarni> well, if you apply requested modifications to your patches in decent time, then the risk is much smaller for conflicts with the trunk
20:38:09  <Bjarni> the same thing is true for me
20:38:51  <jez> i dont recall anyone requesting particular modifications
20:38:51  <Bjarni> I got a patch that I have been writing on for a while. It have been affected by at least 3 commits and I started it this week
20:39:15  <jez> yeah well i think some onus should be on the people committing not to break stuff
20:39:24  <Bjarni> jez: well, I recall a request about not making huge functions
20:39:25  <jez> it is with most projects, APIs etc try to be kept stable
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20:40:21  <Bjarni> <jez>	yeah well i think some onus should be on the people committing not to break stuff <-- you mean if somebody decides to write a patch, then nobody should be allowed to commit anything that can affect it?
20:40:45  <jez> fatal error C1070: mismatched #if/#endif pair in file 'c:\openttd\trunk-latest\player_gui.c'
20:40:52  <jez> wow, that's useful
20:40:56  <jez> how the hell am i meant to debug that?
20:41:19  <Bjarni> nice in theory, but extremely hard, if not impossible to handle in the real world
20:41:52  <Bjarni> jez: well, look at where they start and end in that file
20:41:54  <Bjarni> and count
20:42:03  <Bjarni> doing it in your diff might make it easier
20:42:03  <jez> i dont get why my patch would've broken that
20:42:49  <Bjarni> well, it's always nice to have a clean checkout so if you get something you don't think you broke, then you can compare it against the clean checkout
20:42:51  <Maedhros> any rejections? does your patch add an #endif which doesn't correspond to an #if any more?
20:43:04  <Bjarni> that way you will quickly know if it's your patch of the trunk, that's broken
20:43:38  <Bjarni> <Sacro>	heh, Bjarni is very popular <-- that goes without saying
20:43:55  <Bjarni> but... why tell something everybody already know? :)
20:48:25  <jez> it's not fair that i should have to rewrite my gui code when there's loads of legacy stuff in there that hasn't been rewritten
20:48:26  <jez> #
20:48:31  <jez> like the message settings window
20:49:01  <Maedhros> huh? just because there's some crufty stuff remaining doesn't mean anyone should add any more...
20:51:45  <Born_Acorn> That's like asking why aren't we all using records because there's some left in use.
20:52:24  <jez> in what file are the new GUI-related functions implemented?
20:52:52  <Bjarni> jez: you are mixing up stuff. We are just got the new widget in the trunk and we are not done applying all the benefits from it yet. Your issue was not the widget limit, but the functions to handle the code
20:53:11  <Bjarni> window.c, I think
20:53:14  <jez> i believe one of your main objections was that i used fake widgets
20:53:27  <Bjarni> you did?
20:53:30  <jez> Belugas', anyway
20:53:48  <Bjarni> I forgot. Well, we are not ADDING fake widgets now that the goal is to remove all of them
20:56:10  <Bjarni> jez: think of this comparison: somebody got a road network designed for 2 meter wide vehicles and decides to use 3 meter wide vehicles. He then have to modify all roads to apply. While converting, any newly created roads will be for the 3 meter vehicles, not the 2 meter ones because then you will have to rebuild them right away to apply the new vehicles
20:56:36  <Bjarni> following this idea, we will not add fake widgets while we are working on removing all of them
20:56:55  * Bjarni fails to see the tricky part in that approach
20:57:16  <Born_Acorn> That analogy didn't help. ;p
20:57:21  <jez> a true openTTD analogy :-)
20:57:21  <hylje> ..
20:57:34  <hylje> its more like rail -> elrail
20:57:50  <jez> yeah i was just gonna say use rail -> maglev or something
20:57:51  <jez> :-P
20:58:40  <jez> however, that somebody decides to upgrade all his rails to maglevs except my part of the network
20:58:51  <jez> he does this without bothering to tell me too, which is bloody annoying
20:59:49  <hylje>
21:01:53  <Bjarni> <jez>	he does this without bothering to tell me <-- well, we should be able to make planned changes without sending an Email to everybody on the forum and ensuring that everybody in here knows it
21:02:51  <Bjarni> the svn logs states that some fake widgets was added not long ago and to solve this, the 32 widget limit will need to be solved, and work on solving it will start
21:03:28  <Bjarni> weeks later it's added and it comes as a surprise to you (ok, you could have missed it), but it was no secret
21:03:39  <jez> do you lot use a special definition to 'emphasize' a value's being a boolean?
21:03:53  <jez> for a 'boolean' argument?
21:03:53  <jez> (even though C doesnt use booleans)
21:04:15  <jez> in SetWindowWidgetsDisabledState()
21:04:22  <Bjarni> we got bool defined in stdafx.h, which is included in more or less all files
21:04:38  <jez> do i use 0 or FALSE for the 'disabled state' argument?
21:04:56  <Bjarni> we got a typedef and defined true as 1 and false as 0
21:05:16  <Bjarni> you should take a look inside that file as it contains really useful info
21:06:06  *** stavrosg_ [] has joined #openttd
21:06:49  <jez> erm
21:07:03  <jez> that only seems to apply if you're not using C++ or BEOS
21:07:11  <hylje> how am i supposed to view .wmvs on linux
21:07:12  <jez> otherwise they're undefined
21:07:21  <jez> hylje: mplayer?>
21:07:52  *** stavrosg [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
21:08:02  <Bjarni> C++ got it defined by default
21:08:14  <Bjarni> as for BeOS... well, maybe it's there by default as well
21:08:48  <Bjarni> anyway, whatever is in stdafx.h, it should be safe to use elsewhere
21:08:52  <Bjarni> it's well tested
21:09:18  <Bjarni> and if it fails on BeOS because somebody else screw up (I don't think so), then it's not your fault
21:09:28  <Bjarni> you can't ensure that it works on all platforms
21:09:57  *** jonty-comp [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
21:11:03  <jez> SetWindowWidgetsDisabledState(w, FALSE, 8, 20, 21, WIDGET_LIST_END);
21:11:03  <jez> SetWindowWidgetsDisabledState(w, 0, 8, 20, 21, WIDGET_LIST_END);
21:11:03  <jez> SetWindowWidgetsDisabledState(w, false, 8, 20, 21, WIDGET_LIST_END);
21:11:06  <jez> which to use?
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21:11:57  <Maedhros> false. FALSE is probably undefined, and while 0 will work, using false is clearer
21:12:19  <jez> no, interestingly FALSE is defined in windef.h :-)
21:12:53  <Bjarni> you should not code windows only code or we will really reject your patch
21:13:08  <hylje> FALSE = TRUE
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21:13:13  <glx> FALSE is define in winapi, but use false or 0 because those are used everywhere in openttd source
21:13:18  <Bjarni> also write it like:
21:13:19  <Bjarni> SetWindowWidgetsDisabledState(w, false,
21:13:21  <Bjarni> 8,
21:13:22  <Bjarni> 20,
21:13:25  <Bjarni> 21,
21:13:30  <Bjarni> WIDGET_LIST_END);
21:13:40  <jez> that's f*cking ugly, gjarni
21:13:44  <jez> it's only 3 widgets
21:13:45  <Bjarni> that way we can change one or add one without touching the other ones
21:13:55  <jez> what a waste of space
21:14:01  <Bjarni> look in depot_gui.c
21:14:14  <glx> and if you can add an enum for all your widgets (easier to read ;) )
21:14:17  <jez> yeah but you're not gonna likely need to change these ones
21:14:29  <jez> they're the 3 button widgets for one attribute
21:14:29  <Bjarni> line 310
21:14:32  <jez> you wont be adding/removing any
21:14:52  <Bjarni> yeah, add a widget name enum (also like in depot_gui.c)
21:15:05  <jez> I would also point you to main_gui.c, 1810
21:15:18  <jez> and 1812
21:16:03  <Bjarni> case WKC_SHIFT | WKC_F9: ShowBuildDocksToolbar(); break; <-- that one?
21:17:50  <jez> you're probably looking at an older revision
21:17:54  <jez> i just grabbed the latest one
21:18:05  <jez> it's the one with SetWindowWidgetsDisabledState :-)
21:18:15  *** ChrisM87____ is now known as ChrisM87
21:18:52  <ChrisM87> I'm playing MiniIn 6500 with smooth economy patch enabled. Should I keep station rating below 80% (for production to increase) or is this not important with smooth economy?
21:18:57  <Bjarni> ahh, yeah, now it's updated
21:22:03  *** Mucht|work is now known as Mucht
21:23:08  <Bjarni> jez: listen, we state how we want the code to be and instead of listening to what we say, you keep finding inconsistencies in the source instead, which is actually pretty tiresome to deal with. We can't get a consistent style if people like you keeps trying to add stuff we are working on removing from the source
21:23:15  <Belugas_Gone> [16:56] <jez> i believe one of your main objections was that i used fake widgets<--- never did anybody objected a thing about it
21:24:04  <Born_Acorn> Bjarni pwns! :p
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21:24:29  <Belugas_Gone> window.h contains all the declarations required to understand the new widget stuff, which is quite easy to undersand, in my point of view
21:24:54  <Belugas_Gone> [17:16] <jez> that's f*cking ugly, gjarni
21:24:55  <Belugas_Gone> [17:16] <jez> it's only 3 widgets
21:25:07  <Belugas_Gone> now it is, but it can be a lot more in the future
21:25:21  <jez> i explained, it's only disabling/enabling the 3 buttons for the one attribute
21:25:29  <jez> it's not like a button like you might add/remove to/from
21:25:41  <Bjarni> I hate being somebody, who have to act as "coding style police", but if nobody did that the code would be really buggy by now because it would be such a mess that nobody could find the bugs
21:25:44  <Belugas_Gone> yeah, we might ... who knows!
21:25:44  <jez> logically it is retarded to use several lines
21:25:59  <Belugas_Gone> retarded yourself
21:26:01  <jez> yeah and maybe every word in a string should be on a new line in case you want to insert a new one
21:26:03  <Belugas_Gone> it is readable
21:26:42  <jez> well if you take a look at it in the source i doubt you'll think it's sensible to place it over 4 lines
21:27:00  <Belugas_Gone> whatever
21:27:13  <Bjarni> <jez>	yeah and maybe every word in a string should be on a new line in case you want to insert a new one <-- poor comparison. Also we talked about this and decided on this solution as the benefits are greater than the "ugliness of more lines"
21:27:26  <jez> 		/* disable company list drop downs, if there are no companies */
21:27:26  <jez> 		SetWindowWidgetsDisabledState(w, ActivePlayerCount() == 0, 7, 8, 13, 14, 15, 16, WIDGET_LIST_END);
21:27:32  <jez> why is that on 1 line?
21:27:38  <hylje> its the perl way to do oneliners
21:27:41  <Belugas_Gone> maybe we should ask you to rewrite the whole ottd sources for it to be acceptablew to your standards
21:27:49  <glx> jez: it's my code :)
21:27:49  <jez> hylje: perl is my favourite language. :-)
21:28:12  <glx> this line would be on many lines if I had an enum
21:28:19  <hylje> !
21:28:26  <jez> i dont have an enum, so mine doesnt need to be on many lines
21:28:30  <jez> :-P
21:28:48  <Darkvater> I don't know what you guys are talking about but we almost never put each and ever argument on a new line
21:28:52  <Bjarni> <glx>	and if you can add an enum for all your widgets (easier to read ;) )
21:28:58  <Bjarni> <Bjarni>	yeah, add a widget name enum
21:29:10  <Bjarni> and I think we mentioned it earlier as well
21:29:11  <jez> why didn't glx do that for main_gui?
21:29:13  <glx> I didn't add the enum because I didn't want to cleanup the code at that time
21:29:32  <jez> god, you lot were complaining that i had too many defines
21:29:36  <glx> cleanup includes coding style for switches
21:29:37  <Belugas_Gone> yeah... we do evolve and find better ways to do stuff
21:29:45  <Bjarni> glx was modifying old code, which is differently compared to adding new code
21:29:53  <jez> you want an enum for every damn widget.  like, left_eyes_button,eyes_button,right_eyes_button
21:29:57  <jez> that's like 27 defines
21:30:04  <jez> just for the damn attribute buttons
21:30:11  <glx> it's automatic
21:30:12  <jez> massively verbose
21:30:13  <Bjarni> because he solved something regarding a window, he didn't have to add an enum for that window in the same commit
21:30:20  <Belugas_Gone> well... don't do it jez, do some perl instead...
21:30:34  <Bjarni> adding an enum for a window the patch adds/heavily modifies is highly recommended though
21:30:38  <Belugas_Gone> i'm out of thiis circus..
21:31:15  <Bjarni> jez: now you got two options:
21:31:21  <jez> i just think it's unnecessary.  it's obvious what the code does
21:31:23  <Bjarni> 1: listen to what we say
21:31:48  <Bjarni> 2: forget about this patch as it can't be added if the code goes against what we want
21:32:40  <jez> Bjarni, why dont you think about what you're asking me to do
21:32:49  <hylje> this is what splits open source projects :-)
21:33:22  <jez>
21:33:41  <jez> assign an identifier to EVERY widget on that face window
21:33:47  <jez> a long name
21:34:06  <jez> then use it EVERY time i do an operation on them
21:34:10  <Bjarni> it doesn't have to be very long
21:34:10  <jez> instead of a number
21:34:58  <Naksu> oo
21:34:58  <Naksu> drama
21:35:25  <Bjarni> the more widgets, the higher the need for that enum will be as it can take time to figure out what widget does what
21:35:54  <Bjarni> and we decided on adding the widgets for most/all windows for several reasons
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21:37:11  <jez> another point is that the way the list of widgets is specified is an array of Widget items, _select_player_face_widgets
21:37:27  <jez> the way they're numbered is just by incrementing because it's an array
21:38:00  <jez> you can define an enum with specific values to match each widget but if you add/remove a widget to/from that array it'll break
21:39:10  <Bjarni> jez: for the last time: we have coded on this game for more than 2 years now. We ran into a lot of issues and figured out how to solve them and now you show up and says "I don't care for your solutions", totally rejecting our experience and agreements. Well, I'm not going to discard that based on what you don't bother to do. It takes pretty good arguments to change this
21:39:36  <jez> that doesnt answer my point above
21:40:39  <Bjarni> you place the widget array and the enum next to each other and whenever you modify one of them, you modify the other one to keep them in sync
21:40:53  <Bjarni> unless you got a better idea on how to keep them in sync
21:40:55  <Maedhros> jez: and how will it not break if you're just using numbers and you add or remove something from that array
21:41:17  <jez> didnt say it wouldnt
21:42:06  <Bjarni> yeah, with an enum, you just have to apply it to the array and the enum and the rest of the file will do fine without modifications, making it a lot easier to handle future additions/removal of widgets
21:42:48  <Bjarni> and as a source constantly under development, we should never code anything to never be modified even though we can't imagine why it should be modified when we write it
21:42:48  <jez> i bet Windows programmes have policies like this
21:42:53  <jez> their code must be huuuuuuuge
21:43:05  <jez> *programmers
21:43:52  <Bjarni> actually MS got the problem of lack of policy. Why do you think the first version of longhorn was scrapped after 3 years?
21:44:13  <Bjarni> because nobody used any standard and it would never work when they put it together. It was faster and better to start over
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21:45:02  <Bjarni> here we have decided on a standard based on our experience and arguments and we have come to an agreement that we all support
21:45:17  <Bjarni> to ensure a certain quality of our code
21:45:48  <Bjarni> and you act like it will make the code worse, clearly showing that you didn't get the point in this
21:45:55  <jez> hmm
21:45:56  <Born_Acorn> First version of Longhorn was scrapped, new version is Win XP SP3.
21:45:57  <peter1138> yum yum
21:46:07  <jez> shame we cant make it so that you tag the widgets as part of the array
21:46:11  <peter1138> hello
21:46:13  <jez> instead of a separate enum
21:46:34  <Bjarni> jez: yeah, but if you can come up with an idea on how to do that, we will listen :)
21:46:43  <Bjarni> hi peter1138
21:48:17  <jez> use perl and put stuff in an associative array.  :-D
21:48:51  <Bjarni> ..
21:49:08  <jez> doesnt c++ have associative arrays?
21:49:18  <Bjarni> let be rephrase that: if you can come up with an idea on how to do that in C, we will listen
21:52:57  <Serriaromeo> question, can c and c++ coding work together in the same program?  i.e. using objects from c++ and leaving the rest of the code as is?
21:53:31  <jez> C is a subset of C++.
21:54:14  <Eddi|zuHause3> no, it is not
21:54:37  <Eddi|zuHause3> there are things in C that won't work in C++
21:54:57  <Bjarni> we already got C++ in the source
21:55:01  <Bjarni> YAPF is coded in C++
21:55:17  <jez> Eddi|zuHause3: like?
21:55:51  <Bjarni> but... we got files in C and files in C++, not mixed
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21:57:24  <Eddi|zuHause3> jez: i'm not a C coder, so i do not have those examples at hand... i only know they exist
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21:59:29  <Bjarni> C and C++ are related, but they can't interact 100%, you can't move stuff back and forth, at least not without knowing what you are doing
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22:22:52  <CIA-1> Darkvater * r6775 /trunk/ (8 files):
22:22:52  <CIA-1> -Codechange: Use some more proper types, especially Owner and PlayerID as
22:22:52  <CIA-1>  these are used intermixed often.
22:26:21  <Frostregen>
22:26:28  <Frostregen> known?
22:26:48  <glx> slow upload
22:27:03  <Frostregen> better?
22:27:26  <Darkvater> yes, station walking
22:27:54  <jez> Frostregen: that station looks too spread out
22:28:00  <jez> did you increase the 'spread out' value?
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22:28:12  <Frostregen> ah, thats the reason for 12
22:28:54  <Frostregen> yes its increased to 20
22:29:02  <Frostregen> but it should be possible with the default too
22:31:26  <CIA-1> Darkvater * r6776 /trunk/ (15 files in 2 dirs):
22:31:26  <CIA-1> -Codechange: Use IsValidPlayer() function to determine of a PlayerID is an
22:31:26  <CIA-1>  actual playable player (< MAX_PLAYERS) or not.
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22:38:52  <Frostregen>
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23:02:37  <Frostregen>
23:04:28  <Eddi|zuHause3> shouldn't bus stops only have 3?
23:04:43  <Frostregen> simple approximation ;)
23:04:59  <Frostregen> its a patch setting anyway
23:05:08  <Eddi|zuHause3> and airports have more, i think
23:05:16  <Frostregen> the smallest has 4 too
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23:15:24  <Eddi|zuHause3> oh, and if you manage to do it, make the actual station tiles white (like when you build the station)
23:15:54  <Frostregen> i won't continue
23:16:02  <Frostregen> due to the other pictures above
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23:37:20  <Wolf01> 'night all
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