Log for #openttd on 26th December 2006:
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00:00:18  <Eddi|zuHause2> rather say east and west germany
00:00:27  <Eddi|zuHause2> then really everyone should know what is meant
00:00:41  <Bjarni> _MVV_: so what do you say about the quote about fleeing from east to west and not the other way?
00:01:27  <MeusH> _MVV_ they tend to blame Chechnya
00:01:30  <MeusH> for many things
00:01:31  <MeusH> IIRC
00:01:44  <MeusH> to cover their business
00:01:53  <MeusH> a typical soviet "integration"
00:02:07  *** KritiK [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
00:02:38  <Bjarni> _MVV_: are you still here?
00:02:57  <MeusH> the easiest way to unite (dumb - but you're not dumb as you have some outlook) society is to find an enemy
00:03:22  *** MVV [54321@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
00:03:23  <MeusH> do you remember raid on Moscow theater?
00:03:24  <MeusH> hmm
00:03:27  <MeusH> he's not here
00:03:50  <Eddi|zuHause2> _MVV_ is still here
00:03:55  <Bjarni> KGB detected our conversation and disabled his connection
00:04:00  <Bjarni> he will time out
00:06:06  <MeusH> pretty credible
00:06:17  *** qweqwe [sfdsfdf@] has joined #openttd
00:06:23  <qweqwe> Meush there are no repressions like 70 year ago :)
00:06:38  <qweqwe> oh f%cking connection ....
00:06:47  <MeusH> and who are you queqwe? MVV?
00:06:51  <Eddi|zuHause2> it's really the KGB ;)
00:06:53  <Bjarni> I think so
00:06:58  <Bjarni> he got the same IP
00:06:59  <HMage> there's no KGB.
00:07:03  <HMage> it's called FSB now
00:07:07  <Bjarni> on the other hand, KGB took over
00:07:11  <MeusH> it's MVV in disguise!
00:07:18  <qweqwe> ^)
00:07:23  <Bjarni> yeah, but MeusH reacts more funny to reading KGB
00:07:43  <Bjarni> I once gave him a shock by writing KGB :P
00:08:05  <Vikthor> There is still KGB, but only in Belarus
00:08:13  <Bjarni> besides new name... same people, same work and same means of operation
00:08:17  *** _MVV_ [~54321@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
00:10:34  *** _MVV_ [sfdsfdf@] has joined #openttd
00:10:59  *** GoneWacko [] has joined #openttd
00:11:11  <Bjarni> Belarus is an odd country regarding the red politicians here. They are really red, but they went to Belarus to protest
00:11:31  <Bjarni> if I recall correctly, some of them got arrested
00:12:03  <SpComb> Logs:
00:12:03  <Bjarni> !logs
00:12:17  <Bjarni> _MVV_: you should really keep up to date with what is written in here
00:12:24  <Bjarni> that's why we got the log thing
00:12:53  *** MVV [~a@] has joined #openttd
00:13:02  <Bjarni> MVV: are you here this time?
00:13:12  <MVV> i hope
00:13:16  <SpComb> Logs:
00:13:16  <Bjarni> !logs
00:13:19  <Bjarni> read up
00:13:45  <Eddi|zuHause2> so... how do i mount this thing properly?
00:13:58  <MVV> some problems with modem i suppose ...
00:14:14  <Biff> Eddi|zuHause2: mount what?
00:14:15  <Bjarni> you place a saddle on a house and place it on top of that saddle
00:14:21  <Bjarni> then it's mounted correctly
00:14:27  <Eddi|zuHause2> my rescued HD copy
00:14:31  <MeusH> Bjarni: noone protests in Belarus... or, if someone does, gets jailed
00:14:48  <Biff> did you dd the whole partition?
00:14:48  <Bjarni> it was during the unrest there
00:14:57  <Bjarni> and as I said, I think they got arrested
00:15:01  <Eddi|zuHause2> i dd'ed the whole HD
00:15:05  <Eddi|zuHause2> including partition table
00:15:15  <Eddi|zuHause2> which might be a problem
00:15:19  <Biff> ah
00:15:36  <Biff> i was thinking about that earlier today, how one could mount it
00:15:50  <Biff> only way i know is dd back to another disk
00:16:02  *** qweqwe [sfdsfdf@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
00:17:24  *** _MVV_ [sfdsfdf@] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
00:17:37  <Eddi|zuHause2> there's something about loop devices
00:17:49  <Biff> ah, true
00:18:06  <Biff> yep, thats correct
00:18:09  * Sacro_ gives Bjarni a chrismas kiss
00:18:24  *** Aracirion [] has joined #openttd
00:18:33  <Biff> Eddi|zuHause2:
00:18:34  *** ChrisM87 [] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
00:19:51  <Eddi|zuHause2> yeah, i think i'm onto it ;)
00:21:07  <MeusH> :o
00:22:07  <MeusH> we're talking about KGB and they kiss and dance eachother on #tycoon
00:22:28  <MVV> wow MeusH chchnya's criminals DO terracts and they confirm it; do you remember few years ago they have captured a school on the 1st of September? i saw video from that school; chechen's idiots not only got few thousands of children, they recorded it on video and at the end they exploded few hundred of children and their parents in that school; and that was not the only terract; or you want to say that russian government places bombs in supermarkets to blame innoc
00:22:30  <MVV> ent chechya's criminals?
00:23:59  <MeusH> These were chechnyans
00:24:11  <MeusH> at least I haven't heard anyone telling the opposite
00:24:25  <Bjarni> <MeusH>	we're talking about KGB and they kiss and dance eachother on #tycoon <-- well, they enjoy life now and we might uncover plots and prevent disasters from happening in the future.... who is spending their time best when you see it in the long run?
00:24:26  <MeusH> and what they did was horrible
00:24:28  <Bjarni> me
00:24:40  <Bjarni> reason: I'm multitasking and making something else as well
00:24:51  *** Sacro_ was kicked from #openttd by Bjarni [die you homosexual pig]
00:24:58  <MeusH> :D
00:25:18  <MVV> how many terracts do Irak or Iran in USA ? much more chechnya does in Russia; every month they explode some people in markets, cinemas; they even captures building in Moskow
00:25:28  <MeusH> MVV, maybye you're the one who knows, was there only one terrorist who survived?
00:25:29  *** Sacro_ [Ben@adsl-83-100-195-194.karoo.KCOM.COM] has joined #openttd
00:25:35  <Sacro_> hmm... i appeared to leave the channel
00:26:18  <ln-> MVV: and russia attacked chechnya because of those terrorist acts?
00:26:52  <MeusH> yeah RVV, how do you think, why there are wars?
00:27:06  <Bjarni> or did they retaliate with terrorist attacks after they were attacked by Russia?
00:27:36  <MeusH> but to be honest, Russian's rescue mission was awful, as always. They could have killed terrorists without that loss of children
00:27:55  <MeusH> but in Moscow theater, it was definately Russian fault
00:28:04  <MeusH> they used poisonous gas instead of tearing gas
00:28:06  <MeusH> or whatever
00:28:12  *** Aracirion is now known as Muhammad
00:28:17  <Muhammad> so its politics now?
00:28:22  <MeusH> they killed everyone, both terrorists and hostages, instead of just terrorists
00:28:29  <MeusH> yeah Muhammad :)
00:28:43  *** pecisk [] has quit [Quit: J?iet prom]
00:28:44  <Muhammad> Godless people always maake war
00:28:54  <Wolf01> 'night
00:28:56  *** Wolf01 [] has quit []
00:29:04  <MeusH> goodight Wolf01
00:29:05  <MeusH> hmm
00:30:00  <Bjarni> they actually had a serious problem. They new that the building were full of bombs. A theory is that the tape holding a bomb failed due to high temperature and it fell and exploded. The sound made all the children run because they thought that they were going to kill all of them at that time and the terrorists started shooting at the children because they lost their hostages and didn't want them to run away and the Russians had to s
00:30:01  <Bjarni> tart shooting because there was fired upon the children
00:30:10  <Bjarni> we will never know if that were the true events though
00:30:22  *** _MVV_ [~a@] has joined #openttd
00:30:27  <_MVV_> russia never just attacked chechnya! they do their missions of neutralize specific criminals and criminal groups; they just do planned acts and don't 'attack' chechnya for pleasure
00:30:28  <Naksu> mushrooms
00:30:30  <MeusH> ln- AFAIK they wanted to control Kaukas, and Chechnya was on their way
00:30:51  *** MVV [~a@] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
00:31:08  <Bjarni> _MVV_: is this the usual stability of your connection?
00:32:32  <Bjarni> we lost him again
00:32:48  <MeusH> _MVV_, allright, russians say they neutralize enemies of the Motherland. But let's go back to the roots, I'd like to know how do you think it started
00:32:54  <_MVV_> do you russian  'mission mistakes' was planned? why? for what? for you speaking about it ?
00:33:00  <Bjarni> no we didn't
00:33:07  <Bjarni> he just didn't answer me
00:33:15  <Naksu> actually russia attacked chechnya since they didnt see chechnya having a "right" to secede from the soviet union as it had not been an independent state before becoming a part of the soviet union :)
00:33:16  <_MVV_> no this disconnections are very strange i never had such
00:33:23  <CIA-1> rubidium * r7559 /trunk/order_cmd.c:
00:33:23  <CIA-1> -Fix (FS#456): clicking the 'Full Load' button when the 'current' order is
00:33:23  <CIA-1> selected in the Order GUI and one has instructed the train to go to the depot,
00:33:23  <CIA-1> via the button in the Train View GUI, changed the depot order by switching from
00:33:23  <CIA-1> 'service at depot' to 'stop at depot' and vice versa.
00:33:42  <MeusH> you see, there are no Danes attacking Germans or vice-versa - why would two countries attack eachother?
00:34:10  <Eddi|zuHause2> germans and danes have a long history of fighting each other
00:34:16  <Bjarni> Hitler attacked us in 1939... and you stole land from us in 1864
00:34:22  <MeusH> I don't think Chechnyans attacked Russia, because they know Chechnya is a small country and Russia has hundreds of nukes
00:34:51  <_MVV_> because chechnya is musulman country and  musulmans always do harm to us - that is truth and it has no explanation
00:35:11  <Eddi|zuHause2> yeah, prussia fighting against denmark in 1864 was a provocation against austria, to drive them out of the german federation
00:35:25  <_MVV_> chechnya's didn't attacked !!!! and russia didn't !!!! read what i write !!!
00:35:28  <Vikthor> Eddi|zuHause2: Well probably any nation has long history fughting the others
00:35:32  *** Jango [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
00:35:33  <MeusH> well, I meant small fights in current times
00:35:35  <Eddi|zuHause2> it was a step to form a united germany
00:35:43  <_MVV_> chechnya do teracts and russia killl specified criminals !
00:36:04  <Bjarni> we got some of the land back in 1920, but the Slevig-Holstein is lost forever :(
00:36:09  <_MVV_> there are no 'attacks' ! there is no war !
00:36:10  <Eddi|zuHause2> and austria could not be part of a united germany without loosing it's rule over hungria and half the balkan
00:36:14  <Bjarni> you guys stole our first railroad and our channel
00:36:26  <Vikthor> _MVV_: Criminals? Like the whole Grozny?
00:37:00  <Eddi|zuHause2> so attacking denmark was a trick of Bismarck to force austria into a war
00:37:08  *** Laukei [] has joined #openttd
00:37:16  <Eddi|zuHause2> (especially to make austria declare the war)
00:37:30  <Eddi|zuHause2> he later did something similar with france
00:37:43  <_MVV_> all the innocent people was evacuated from groznii and all people passed personality verification and criminals stayed and
00:37:43  <Bjarni> that's all the more reason to give us back our land. It appears you didn't even want it :P
00:37:44  <MeusH> _MVV_, I don't want to make enemies, or make OpenTTD loose a player, but when Russia finishes with Chechnya, they'll "neutralize targets" in Georgia, then Belarus, Ukraine... Poland?
00:38:11  <_MVV_> and those guys had a loooot of weapon; too lot for innocent people
00:38:12  <Eddi|zuHause2> err, i think you got some of the land back after WW!
00:38:21  <Eddi|zuHause2> WW1
00:38:49  <Bjarni> 1920, but look at a map. Kiel used to be in Denmark
00:38:59  <Bjarni> right until 1864
00:39:24  <Bjarni> in fact Hamburg was pretty close to the border
00:40:08  <_MVV_> MeusH you don't want to see facts ! you only can say some generalized and mooked things wihtout any provementss
00:40:15  <MeusH> when Tsars were expanding borders of Russia, they incorporated Georgia, Chechnya and other regions into Russia. But citizens of these places found their nationality and didn't want to be in Russia
00:40:24  <Eddi|zuHause2> imagine what the world would look like if germany did not unite in 1871
00:40:26  <MeusH> okay, is what I said ^ a fact?
00:40:46  <MeusH> yes _MVV_ they have weapons indeed
00:41:17  <_MVV_> NeusH you overwinds facts
00:41:18  <Bjarni> Eddi|zuHause2: impossible because then Hitler would not have gained power
00:41:39  <MeusH> _MVV_ please tell me the facts
00:41:57  <Eddi|zuHause2> i think we'd have seen another Napoleon instead
00:42:13  <_MVV_> NeusH i just explained situation in Groznii but you and such as you see my words and tomorrow you'll forget it
00:42:27  <_MVV_> you know only what you want to know
00:42:53  <Bjarni> <-- map of Denmark before Prussia stole the land in 1864
00:43:35  <Bjarni> now the boarder is just north of Flensburg
00:43:40  <_MVV_> i tell you facts all the discussion and you tell nothing but ' fine words'
00:44:14  <MeusH> can I compare WWII Poland to Chechnya?  There were lots of weapons Warsaw, too. We didn't want to be ruled either by Germans or Soviets. So we did the killing. The soviet army waited for germans to kill Poles, and then they moved to Warsaw saying they liberated the city. Motherfuckers. This is why Poles hate Ruskies, too. Soviet army was welcomed to Warsaw, we could kill nazis with help of Red Army easily!
00:44:21  <Eddi|zuHause2> yeah, flensburg is the most northern city of germany now
00:44:42  <Eddi|zuHause2> it is "famous" because it holds the index of traffic-violators
00:44:55  *** Jango [] has joined #openttd
00:45:24  <Bjarni> well, you can see that the old boarder is nowhere near Flensburg
00:45:29  <MeusH> okay _MVV_, so you said that: innocent people were evacuated from Georgia and terrorists stayed. You also said that they have lots of weapons. They are muslims and they do harm to Russia
00:45:32  <MeusH> is that what you said?
00:45:50  <MeusH> and I hope I will remember this conversation. I'm intrested in history
00:45:59  <_MVV_> waited ??? you just let german pass through you country
00:46:46  <Bjarni> I fail to see how you can evacuate a population without evacuating terrorists
00:47:00  <MeusH> _MVV_ their power was unstoppable
00:47:08  <Bjarni> terrorists prefer to hide in populations as defence. You can't shoot what you can't find
00:47:09  <MeusH> I'm talking about Warsaw Uprising in 1942
00:47:16  <Eddi|zuHause2> <- map of "Germany" at that time
00:47:18  <_MVV_> Germans occupied your country and Russia is guilty of it ?
00:47:24  <MeusH> Nazis controlled the city for three years, since 1939
00:47:28  <MeusH> no
00:47:30  <MeusH> no MVV
00:47:40  <MeusH> maybye I said too little about it
00:47:53  <MeusH> I was talking about the uprising
00:47:54  <_MVV_> ok explain your words
00:48:19  <MeusH> we wanted to get rid of Germans who stationed in Warsaw
00:48:33  <MeusH> Russia also wanted to get rid of Germans
00:48:40  <Eddi|zuHause2> actually, Germany and Russia mutually agreed to splitting up Poland between them in a secret contract
00:48:56  <MeusH> yeah Eddi
00:49:06  <Eddi|zuHause2> at the line that is now the eastern border of poland
00:49:13  <MeusH> There was a ghetto in Warsaw
00:49:26  <MeusH> many uprisers came from ghetto
00:49:39  <Bjarni> it was a really poor one
00:49:42  <_MVV_> what was going before "Great Patriotic War" was not our problem because that was your problems and Germany has signed pact of unattaqking of USSR
00:49:46  <Bjarni> even before the Germans arrived
00:49:51  <MeusH> anyway, we've been collecting and creating weapons, preparing to kill german stationing in Warsaw
00:50:05  <MeusH> fights have started and lasted many days
00:50:28  <_MVV_> tell me for what Warshava was important for Russia ?
00:50:45  <MeusH> we could have won if Russian army came to the city and fight with uprisers
00:50:46  <Vikthor> To rule the Poland perhaps?
00:51:01  <MeusH> but now I'll tell you what happened
00:51:32  <MeusH> Germans put end to the uprising
00:51:54  <MeusH> they either killed or sent to death camps (=killed) citizens
00:52:14  <MeusH> when the city was empty (because everyone was either removed to death camp or killed)
00:52:22  <MeusH> The red army came to the city
00:52:25  <_MVV_> why we have to help your country? Germany lied us that it will not attack us, our country was not prepared for war
00:52:27  <MeusH> and "liberated" it
00:52:47  <Eddi|zuHause2> Bjarni: as you might notice, the "Herzogtum Holstein" already belonged to the german federation, it just was ruled by the same person that was king of denmark
00:52:49  <MeusH> as Eddi|zuHause2 said, Russians and Germans had a secret plans of doing so
00:52:57  <_MVV_> I don't say about 'liberating'
00:52:59  <MeusH> and taking control over Poland
00:53:03  *** Nigel [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
00:54:00  <MeusH> why we have to help your country? < Germans were your enemies
00:54:10  <Athorium> hey MeusH I finished the Renfe 446, and I maked one angle of Renfe 450... post your suggestion please ^^
00:54:17  <MeusH> Their army suffered vast damages from the uprising
00:54:28  <_MVV_> Germany pffered us a territory - why we must refuse?
00:54:29  <MeusH> it was a great chance to get rid of Germans
00:54:52  <MeusH> Athorium, will do soon
00:54:57  <Bjarni> Eddi|zuHause2: noticed the years. The map shows borders from 1815 to 1866, which is 2 years after the land was stolen, so it was not Danish all the time
00:55:02  <Athorium> ^^
00:55:08  <_MVV_> will you refuse if russia says, for example, that it gives you half of occupied Ukraine? :)
00:55:41  <Eddi|zuHause2> that border was there since 1815 ;)
00:55:46  <MeusH> yes. Even if I was a ruler, I wouldn't do so
00:55:52  <_MVV_> GERMANY WAS NOT ENEMY !!!! we had 'non-aggression pacts'
00:55:53  <Eddi|zuHause2> this is not an argument
00:55:55  <MeusH> because only bastards do so
00:56:07  <MeusH> MVV these were secret pacts
00:56:12  <MeusH> officially you were enemies
00:56:27  <MeusH> and by the way, who killed Polish officers in Katy??
00:56:28  <Eddi|zuHause2> no, ukraine was "affiliated" with germany
00:57:07  <_MVV_> maybe officialy we were enemies but did we promised you help with war against Germany ?
00:57:12  <Vikthor> _MVV_: The point is that Poland wasnt occupied at that time, USSR attacked Poland before it capitulated to Germans
00:57:21  <MeusH> _MVV_ sorry, but only bastards take over a country, remove it's culture, instead of living in peace
00:57:45  <MeusH> MVV: it's sure that one would attack an enemy, especially if had a chance
00:58:00  <MeusH> but believe me, Russian tanks were on the outskirts of Warsaw
00:58:01  <_MVV_> woooow Eddi|zuHause2 and Vikthor - write fiction-books !!!
00:58:06  <MeusH> you could kill all germans
00:58:15  <MeusH> and have Poland for yourself
00:58:21  <MeusH> but you had a non-agression pact
00:58:27  <MeusH> you waited for nazis to kill poles
00:58:34  <MeusH> and then you came to an empty city
00:58:53  <_MVV_> did we kill polidsh people?
00:58:59  <MeusH> no
00:59:05  <_MVV_> in such amounts as German forces
00:59:20  <Vikthor> MeusH: During Warszav uprising the non-agression pact was long dead
00:59:28  <MeusH> Eddi|zuHause2, ukraine was forced to be with germany. Anyway, both germans and russians killed many ukrainians. Ukranie was the country that suffered much, and noone spoke about that
00:59:52  <Eddi|zuHause2> there's a reason why i put it in ""
01:00:00  <Born_Acorn> #openttd has been Godwinised!
01:00:00  <MeusH> oh, yes
01:00:01  <Born_Acorn> Noooooooooo
01:00:08  <_MVV_> MeusH you say toooo strange things about Ukraine
01:00:19  <Born_Acorn> Ukraine has a U in it!
01:00:19  <_MVV_> I can very surprise you but sorry not now
01:00:28  <Born_Acorn> U is a strange and rarely seen letter!
01:00:28  <MeusH> _MVV_: The point is, you did nothing. Instead of killing Nazis and winding Red Flags in western Poland, you waited for Warsaw to become a ghost city
01:00:45  <_MVV_> i must learn how to solve integrals :)
01:01:18  <MeusH> _MVV_ I think out conversation would only spark more tensions
01:01:22  <_MVV_> MeusH I agree but i don't see in t nothing so awful
01:01:27  <_MVV_> :)
01:01:31  <MeusH> our political views seem to be highly opposite
01:01:54  <Bjarni> is now the time to say "see you in battle"?
01:02:09  <_MVV_> yeah I 'll tell you few words about Ukraine in WW3 but not now
01:02:12  <MeusH> my grandfathers and parents were taught the same, believe me
01:02:16  <_MVV_> :)
01:02:22  <MeusH> russians = good, germans = bad
01:02:29  <_MVV_> WW@ :)))
01:02:31  <MeusH> they were told lies about war
01:02:43  <_MVV_> i wanted to say WW2
01:03:17  <MeusH> and they were forced to have outlooks similiar to your - if there's a chance, crush the country, kill citizens, steal everything possible
01:03:30  <MeusH> and I'm sorry to everyone supressed by communism
01:03:34  <_MVV_> MeusH please let stop discussing and move it on the next 'evening' :) i'm very busy
01:03:42  <MeusH> ok :)
01:03:55  <Vikthor> OK, gentlemen, I wish you good night
01:04:01  <MeusH> goodnight Vikthor
01:04:13  <_MVV_> let give people opportunity to speak about OTTD :)
01:04:19  *** Vikthor [] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
01:04:20  <_MVV_> goodnight :)
01:04:37  <Bjarni> _MVV_: did you ever answer my question... why did people flee from East Germany to West Germany and not the other way?
01:04:37  <Eddi|zuHause2> Bjarni: after WW1 there was an election in schleswig, wether to go to denmark or germany, in northern schleswig (north of the current german border) there was a majority for denmark, and in southern schleswig (between the current german border, and the border to holstein (the red line on that map) was a majority for germany
01:04:48  <_MVV_> besides my name is also Victor :)
01:05:17  <_MVV_> Bjarni i've stopped discussion for now
01:05:32  <Bjarni> but you didn't answer me before :(
01:05:59  <_MVV_> sorry, but i don't know anything about splitting of Germany
01:06:35  <MeusH> goodnight _MVV_ :)
01:06:37  <Eddi|zuHause2> i think in southern schleswig there is still a group of danish heritage, that has special political rights (like a party that is not subject to the 5% rule for the "Landtag" [parliament] of schleswig-holstein")
01:06:39  <Bjarni> the point is: why did people free from USSR into the west and not the other way?
01:07:04  <_MVV_> I'll discuss with my father - he may nkow something about that/// but I willnot just repeating his words ! I tell only facts
01:07:11  <MeusH> okay
01:07:20  <MeusH> see you next night :)
01:07:28  <MeusH> I hope we can talk more
01:07:28  <Bjarni> Eddi|zuHause2: yeah, I know about the minority (they tend to be leftist for some reason) and the election
01:07:29  <_MVV_> seeyou
01:07:30  <MeusH> calmly
01:07:35  <_MVV_> :)
01:08:09  <Bjarni> also that before the election, people were moved from Germany into Holstein to vote for Germany
01:08:11  <_MVV_> i must have a rest - my eyes almost don't see text ...
01:08:21  <MeusH> have a good sleep
01:08:24  *** _MVV_ is now known as MVV_away
01:08:46  <Eddi|zuHause2> but like i said, holstein already belonged to the german federation before that war
01:08:53  <MeusH> poor guy :( Simply, noone was stupid enough to go to USSR. Was it ever possible? People were running away as far from USSR as possible
01:09:04  <Eddi|zuHause2> it was just under rule of the danish king
01:09:39  <Eddi|zuHause2> it was not a rare event that german countries were ruled by people from outside of germany
01:09:47  <Eddi|zuHause2> like hannover was under the rule of the english king
01:10:04  <Eddi|zuHause2> (or actually, the english king was from hannover)
01:10:31  <MeusH> yeah :) I'm wondering how many brites know something about roots of their queen?
01:10:47  <Bjarni> not that many
01:10:55  * MVV_away will stay on this channel to log it in local file and analyze it ... debates of peoeple from different European countries seem to be very interesting for everybody
01:11:04  <Bjarni> it's rare to know about even your own origin
01:11:05  <MeusH> :o
01:11:08  * MVV_away is far away ...
01:11:42  <MeusH> but I mean, I think most of the world besides Britain knows that their royal family are germans
01:11:46  <Bjarni> he is not an FSB spy... because then he would not have told us
01:11:53  <Bjarni> yet FSB might access his HD
01:12:04  <Muhammad> bah, those who disbelieve and die while they are disbelievers, on them shall be the curse of Allah and of the angels and of men all together.
01:12:24  <Bjarni> Muhammad: ???
01:12:26  *** tokai [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
01:12:54  <Muhammad>  the case of those who disbelieve is like the case of one who shouts to that which hears naught but a call and a cry. They are deaf dumb and blind - so they do not understand.
01:13:13  <Muhammad> Those who disbelieve - their possessions and their children shall not avail them at all against Allah; and it is they that are the fuel of the Fire.
01:13:44  <Muhammad> as for those who disbelieve, I will punish them with a severe punishment in this world and in the next, and they shall have no helpers;
01:14:19  <Bjarni> hmm
01:14:34  <Bjarni> either we got a religious guy here or we got a troll
01:14:47  *** tokai [] has joined #openttd
01:14:50  *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai] by ChanServ
01:15:09  <Muhammad> a troll?
01:15:13  <Eddi|zuHause2> but like i said, the main result of the german-danish war was that schleswig fell under prussian rule, and holstein under austrian rule, which made it stick between prussian territories, far away from austria, and the conflict resulted in the prussian-austrian war in 1866
01:15:42  <Bjarni> a guy, who says stuff to see the reaction of other people
01:16:28  <Bjarni> trolls never tells what they believe themselves so there is no point in asking them questions
01:16:37  <Eddi|zuHause2>
01:16:51  <Bjarni> bad URL
01:16:53  <Eddi|zuHause2> grr... it has gone
01:17:10  <Eddi|zuHause2> well, then not ;)
01:17:42  <Bjarni> Muhammad: so why did you say all what you just said?
01:17:46  <Muhammad> um I will tell u my opinion if you ask :) but actually I apologise for interrupting .. I just couldnt say anything relevant as I was occupied elsewhere but I still wanted to say something :P
01:18:16  *** MVV [~a@] has joined #openttd
01:18:41  <Bjarni> you could have decided on something a bit more diplomatic to say
01:18:47  <Muhammad> well, what I said were all quotations from the quran ... so much for muslim and tolerance
01:18:55  <Bjarni> like "hi"
01:19:00  <Muhammad> its just what comes to my mind about politics
01:19:04  <Muhammad> sorry :P
01:19:10  <Muhammad> hi
01:19:50  <Eddi|zuHause2> well, the keys are like right next to each other ;)
01:20:01  <Bjarni> starting to quote the Kuran may not be the wisest move after talking about terrorists acting in the name of Allah (at least that's their claim)
01:20:12  <Bjarni> you don't see us quoting the bible
01:20:19  <Muhammad> um
01:20:31  <Muhammad> why?
01:20:44  <Muhammad> The bible has a lot of garbage init as well
01:20:54  <Bjarni> because quoting the bible would make little sense in this case
01:21:04  <Muhammad> I didnt intend to make sense
01:21:16  <Muhammad> actually I was being very autistic
01:21:36  <Muhammad> or maybe so childish, just to attract attention
01:21:45  <Laukei> [02:15:42] [@Bjarni] a guy, who says stuff to see the reaction of other people
01:21:46  <Muhammad> and by that I destroyed your conversation ... sorry ...
01:22:09  <Eddi|zuHause2> Bible quote: 1 Kings 7:23 - And he made a molten sea, ten cubits from the one brim to the other: it was round all about, and his height was five cubits: and a line of thirty cubits did compass it round about.
01:22:20  <Muhammad> yeah maybe, although what I sayd is the result of a firm political conviction, not just to see reaction
01:22:25  <Eddi|zuHause2> (aka PI = 3.0)
01:22:26  <Bjarni> you can't destroy a conversation after it ended because people left
01:22:40  <Muhammad> oh ok
01:22:42  <Muhammad> didnt notice
01:22:46  <Muhammad> cause i didnt read it
01:22:57  <Muhammad> so i dont have to feel bad?
01:23:12  <Muhammad> a molten see?
01:23:17  <MeusH> Muhammad, what do you think about USA vs Iran confilcy?
01:23:33  <Sacro_> Conflict?
01:23:43  <Laukei> Conflict, of course
01:23:44  <Muhammad> I think no religious nutters should be invested with a lot of power
01:23:45  <Laukei> Words
01:23:56  <Muhammad> unfortunately this is a vain wish
01:23:58  <Laukei> (Hello everyone, by the way)
01:24:05  <Bjarni> I still find it a bit odd to come out of nowhere and without greeting or anything starting to quote a religious book (and this got nothing to do with what religion)
01:24:26  <Muhammad> yeah
01:24:28  <Muhammad> i said
01:24:42  *** MVV_away [~a@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
01:24:49  <MeusH> hey Laukei
01:24:55  <Muhammad> it was autistic
01:25:04  <glx> will be hard for MVV to read logs :)
01:25:15  <Muhammad> just because everyone was talking about politics
01:25:35  <Laukei> I originally came here to engage in discussion about OpenTTD, but I stumbled upon something much more serious so just sat and lurked for a bit.
01:25:44  <Muhammad> :)
01:25:50  <Muhammad> what did u want to talk about
01:25:51  <Muhammad> ?
01:25:59  <Muhammad> I think planes suck and we need passenger destinations
01:26:03  <MeusH> Muhammad, you believe in Allah, I... believe in God, but anyway, it's the same God. What do you think about that?
01:26:18  <MeusH> am I disbeliever, too?
01:26:30  <Laukei> Muhammad: Nothing in particular, just see what the channel was like really and if it was active, and go from there.
01:26:32  <MeusH> am I a potential victim in a Jihad?
01:26:37  <Laukei> :o
01:27:00  <Eddi|zuHause2> hm... first you guys complain about the lack of bible quotes, and when i bring one up, you simply ignore it...
01:27:01  <Muhammad> everyone is a victim of jihad I'd say
01:27:08  <Muhammad> haha
01:27:14  <Muhammad> I didnt understand
01:27:16  <Muhammad> molten sea?
01:27:25  <Laukei> It was a pretty smart quote.
01:27:26  <Bjarni> <Muhammad>	everyone is a victim of jihad I'd say <-- I was about to say that
01:27:28  <Muhammad> I though water was molten ice, so how can it melt again?
01:27:31  <Bjarni> even Muslims
01:27:41  * MVV feels shame of that his second days on new server and channel absolutely changed it's topic from game to politics ...
01:27:55  <MVV> *day
01:27:57  <Bjarni> don't read the bible too literately
01:27:59  <Muhammad> muslims are victims yeah
01:28:15  <Muhammad> but they also propagate it again
01:28:23  <Laukei> Heh
01:28:32  <Bjarni> I think reading the message rather than the words is the way to go
01:28:34  <ln-> now, now, islam is the religion of peace.
01:28:43  *** BJH2_ [] has joined #openttd
01:28:44  <Bjarni> the?
01:28:50  <Eddi|zuHause2> Muhammad: it's about how a round object with a diameter of 10 has a surround of 30, combined with the formula of a surround of a circle, that evaluates to pi=3
01:28:52  <Bjarni> are you claiming that there are only one?
01:28:56  <Laukei> It's similar to saying that someone that gets a computer virus that gives it to you by an unsolicited email is responsible for your PC getting virused... very stretched analogy though
01:29:02  <Bjarni> so buddism is a violent one?
01:29:44  <Laukei> I mean... it could be anyone comitting a terrorist act
01:29:56  <Muhammad> at any moment, you can view a person entirely as the product of genes and environment, so there is no space for personal agency and blame
01:30:03  <Eddi|zuHause2> (i think it's about how salomon built some kind of ancient version of a swimming pool or something)
01:30:03  <MeusH> satanism is violent
01:30:11  <MeusH> lol
01:30:30  <Laukei> Unless they choose to do it willingly and aren't taught it's what you should do (which would make them mentally ill in western countries) then I'd not put blame on them
01:30:41  <Bjarni> Gestapo did so. They blew up trains in Denmark to kill passengers and blamed the resistance to get people to turn against the resistance movement... didn't really work though
01:30:42  <Laukei> Satanism's not violent really...
01:30:55  <Muhammad> well, what is will, if you believe in an immaterial form of free will then I don't understand you
01:30:56  <Laukei> It's just backwards Christianity as I understand it
01:31:04  <Muhammad> if not, then wil is shaped by genes and environment
01:31:05  <Laukei> Whereby you desire to be God.
01:31:20  *** BJH2 [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
01:31:59  <Bjarni> is the channel usually like this at night?
01:32:07  <Bjarni> talking about religion and politics?
01:32:11  <Eddi|zuHause2> the real problem with the "world religions" is, that their original reason of existance disappeared in the hundreds or thousands of years
01:32:16  <Laukei> I'd rather talk about OpenTTD... :D
01:32:19  <Muhammad> its just the second time im in the channel :D
01:32:25  <Bjarni> during the day, people tend to talk about a computer game
01:32:34  <Muhammad> haha
01:32:42  <Laukei> Bit rude to just change topic though in a relatively busy channel
01:32:44  <Muhammad> the original reason  being?
01:32:53  <Eddi|zuHause2> so they have to do something different to define themself, and that is often far from reality
01:33:13  <Eddi|zuHause2> that affects both christian religion as well as islam
01:33:55  <Eddi|zuHause2> example: in the early years of islam, it was a huge improvement to rights and freedom of women
01:34:25  <Laukei> So... how about that OpenTTD then...
01:34:25  <Eddi|zuHause2> that aspect of islam has pretty much completely turned into the opposite
01:34:31  <Muhammad> hm, may I propose a working definition for religion, bein something in the line of stubbornness to hold on to tradition after it has become technically and epistemologically obsolete?
01:34:32  * Laukei whistles anonymously
01:35:18  <MeusH> Laukei, killing cats is not only violent, but also sick, and should be sentenced capital penatly. This is why I think satanism is violent
01:35:31  <Muhammad> bah killing cows is better?
01:35:31  <Eddi|zuHause2> Muhammad: that pretty much describes the "established" religions of the modern days, but it does not apply to the originals
01:35:32  <Bjarni> originally women were allowed to be priests, but then the church decided against it and it was not until very recently that we got women priests again
01:35:44  <MeusH> oh course not Muhammad
01:35:49  <Muhammad> but the originals neednt be called relgions
01:35:53  <MeusH> I don't like religions that involve killing
01:36:03  <Laukei> MeusH
01:36:06  <MeusH> yes?
01:36:09  <Laukei> Why do they kill cats?
01:36:11  <Laukei> I've never heard this.
01:36:19  <MeusH> whoa
01:36:20  <MeusH> sec
01:36:22  <Laukei> :/
01:36:25  <Bjarni> who?
01:36:25  <Eddi|zuHause2> MeusH: what do you think the steaks in the supermarket come from?
01:36:34  <Bjarni> satanism or ?
01:36:38  <Muhammad> haha
01:37:03  <Bjarni> Eddi|zuHause2: that depends on what country you are in
01:37:10  <Muhammad> McDonald's new burger McSatan, with ritually killed beef
01:37:32  <Bjarni> here it's 20 year old cattle with added toxic flavours to hide that fact
01:37:34  <MeusH> It's been not long ago when some guys went to the cementary, destroyed some graves, killed black cats, then they were doing something with blood... that's sick. They call it "black services"
01:37:44  <Bjarni> in china, it could be cats
01:37:49  <MVV> I have a friend; he is good guy; but few weks ago he told me that he tested his will-power by throttle two cats ... I thnk it's awful ...
01:38:00  <Laukei> Hmmm
01:38:09  <Laukei> I don't know about that being actually satanism
01:38:14  <Tuzlo> hows that testing your will power?
01:38:14  <Laukei> :/
01:38:20  <MeusH> that's awful indeed
01:38:24  <Tuzlo> more like testing yuore weaknesses
01:38:28  <Muhammad> Tuzlo, you kill cats every day?
01:38:48  <MeusH> it's testing stupidity and receptivity for sick things like satanism or drugs
01:38:56  <Tuzlo> I dont kill cats, even though I hate them
01:38:58  <Muhammad> drugs are cool
01:38:58  <Laukei> MeusH
01:38:59  <Laukei>
01:39:19  <Laukei> Worth a quick scan. Obviously being Wikipedia you can't take its word as ... dare I say it, gospel :D but it's an insight.
01:39:49  <MVV> i want to taste LSD but I don't know where to get it :(
01:39:54  <Laukei> (You could also follow the link to Satanism from there if you were feeling adventerous)
01:40:08  <Bjarni> MVV: don't
01:40:17  <Bjarni> one time can be one time too many
01:40:29  <Bjarni> they are really dangerous
01:40:33  <Muhammad> Lsd is ok I think, but be sure to have someone with you who is experienced
01:40:36  <MeusH> MVV one intake will doom you
01:40:37  <MVV> Bjarni i know that LSD is NOT NARKOTIC !
01:40:39  <Muhammad> lsd doesnt make you addicted
01:40:47  <MeusH> people think they are strong, that one intake is nothing bad
01:40:53  <Laukei> I've always wanted to try it, but have gone on the basis that only if I was pronounced terminally ill would I.
01:40:55  <MVV> Muhammad tell truth
01:41:01  <MVV> *tells
01:41:06  <MeusH> and they end up beggin for a fagend
01:41:19  <Laukei> LSD is the only cure for the common cold.
01:41:23  <Muhammad> you have to be psychologically ok though
01:41:25  <Laukei> Bit of interesting trivia there.
01:41:32  <Eddi|zuHause2> LSD is a natural substance, you can make it from certain plants
01:41:33  <Muhammad> LSD is ok, even the british military used it :P
01:41:39  <MVV> LSD is not a narcotic but it has veeery interesting effect - so z I want to taste it
01:41:39  <Laukei> :D
01:41:48  <Laukei> The British military used it so it's safe?
01:41:49  <Bjarni> people get paranoid and stuff
01:41:52  <Laukei> What world do you live on? :D
01:41:56  <MeusH> Laukei, I don't know much about official satanism, but I've heard and seen some about people killing cats and destroying places considered as sacred
01:42:12  <Laukei> MeusH: I'd put that down more to people being dicks than it being Satanism
01:42:20  <Laukei> You could say Muslims = Terrorists 'cause you saw 9/11
01:42:22  <Laukei> I don't
01:42:22  <Muhammad>
01:42:26  <Laukei> Most people don't... I hope :/
01:42:36  <MeusH> 9/11 was a stupid lie for stupid americans
01:42:42  <Laukei> By the way... I'm not a satanist :D
01:42:45  <Laukei> Just to clear that up.
01:42:52  <Bjarni> The NaZi army invented ecstasy, so I assume that it's safe. It only reduce your need to sleep and eat
01:42:55  <Laukei> Atheism all the way baby.
01:42:55  <Bjarni> oh wait
01:43:05  <Laukei> :D
01:43:10  <MVV> I had never tasting any narcotic and I even don't smooke cigarettes and I suppose i can fully control myself - that's why i don't afraid to taste it
01:43:18  <Muhammad> mdma can make you grind your teeth
01:43:34  <MeusH> I'm sorry but people who say that mariujana or lsd is not a drug or is not addicting are poor liars IMO. I've been told many times "you won't get addicted", "this is a soft drug", "take it, it's cool"
01:43:36  <Muhammad> that can have pretty bad effects
01:43:40  <MeusH> they just want to make easy money on people
01:43:52  <Muhammad> lsd isnt addictive
01:43:57  <MeusH> ...
01:44:00  <Bjarni> <MVV>	I had never tasting any narcotic and I even don't smooke cigarettes and I suppose i can fully control myself - that's why i don't afraid to taste it <-- so if you haven't been shot yet, you aren't afraid to be shot?
01:44:02  <MeusH> I will never believe this
01:44:14  <Bjarni> LSD is really dangerous
01:44:17  <Laukei> It's not physically addictive, but it's mentally addictive, as is anything that is enjoyable
01:44:24  <Bjarni> you know, there is a reason why it's illegal
01:44:38  <MVV> MeusH they taste marihuanna for company but I i want to taste for single anonymous experiment
01:44:51  <MVV> maybe with friend if he'll agree
01:44:52  <Eddi|zuHause2> <Laukei> It's not physically addictive, but it's mentally addictive, as is anything that is enjoyable <- you mean like IRC?
01:44:54  <Laukei> MVV
01:44:58  <Laukei> Eddi|zuHause2: Yes
01:45:02  <Laukei> Exactly like that
01:45:03  <Laukei> :D
01:45:12  <Laukei> MVV: If you do try it, try it in company.
01:45:22  <Laukei> I've heard from friends that are users that if you have a bad trip
01:45:24  <Laukei> And are alone
01:45:32  <Laukei> It's absolutely hell
01:45:41  <Laukei> *absolute
01:45:52  <Muhammad> I would say that ttd is about as dangerous as lsd
01:45:59  <MVV> hmmm i'll think about it
01:46:14  <MVV> OTTD is more dangerous :)
01:46:28  <Bjarni> fine. Go ahead.... you aren't ruining my life by doing so
01:46:40  *** Alltaken [] has joined #openttd
01:46:42  <Bjarni> but I thought you valued your own life more than this
01:46:45  <Muhammad> I meant about mental dependece
01:46:45  <MeusH> seconded that
01:46:52  <MeusH> Bjarni says good words
01:46:55  <MeusH> hey Alltaken
01:47:11  <Laukei> MeusH, are you working on that Tropical train station still?
01:47:25  <MeusH> yes
01:47:33  <Laukei> I'm just trawling the forums really and it looks über.
01:47:35  <MeusH> I'm making siloes right now :)
01:47:39  <Bjarni> "An LSD trip can have long lasting or even permanent psychoemotional effects"
01:47:39  <MeusH> thanks
01:47:43  <MeusH> I'll post more tommorow
01:47:45  <Bjarni>
01:47:53  <Laukei> Hehe
01:48:20  <Naksu> mushrooms
01:48:29  <Laukei> So is there any way to help with OpenTTD if you're not good at coding and have little experience with pixel graphics?
01:48:31  <MVV> Bjarni, I always hold my life under my control, I try to never risk
01:48:52  <MVV> i don't suppose LSD to be riskable
01:49:00  <MeusH> Laukei, yes
01:49:01  <Alltaken> hey MeusH
01:49:21  <MeusH> Alltaken, how's your fridge?
01:49:27  <MeusH> I remember filling up a survey about it :)
01:49:43  <Muhammad> Laukei: how about 3d grafix?
01:49:49  <Bjarni> Alltaken made a survey about his fridge???
01:49:50  <MeusH> Laukei, you can create various graphics so that both TTDPatch and OpenTTD players may benefit
01:50:11  <MeusH> there are also some jobs to create graphics for new buttons
01:50:22  <MeusH> yes Bjarni :)
01:50:23  <Laukei> Hmm
01:50:30  <MeusH> It had pictures \o/
01:50:32  <Laukei> What tools do you use for graphics?
01:50:35  <Alltaken> ah yes MeusH lets see
01:50:36  <Laukei> Just photoshop and whatnot?
01:50:40  <MeusH> Adobe Photoshop
01:50:48  <Alltaken> MeusH:  you on my MSN?
01:50:52  <MeusH> no
01:50:58  <MeusH> I'm sorry but I'm not using MSN
01:51:29  <Alltaken> ok
01:51:30  <MeusH> Laukei, it's just a matter of turning off the antialiasing whereever possible, using dissolve blending instad of normal blending and using pencil instad of brush
01:51:44  <Laukei> Humm
01:52:02  <MeusH> I can send you a palette file so that you can create something in full colour then convert to TTD palette
01:52:20  <MeusH> this is helpful when you need to use some effect like blurring or changing colour shade
01:53:02  <Laukei> So you just do your usual stuff in Photoshop, then change the palette, and save as a png or whatever?
01:53:14  <ln-> i see some on-topic discussion going on
01:53:21  <Muhammad>
01:53:30  <Muhammad> read the section on problems
01:53:36  <Laukei> And some off-topic discussion.
01:53:38  <Laukei> :/
01:54:26  <Alltaken>
01:54:30  <MVV> ggi i'm reading russian wiki about LSD - i suppose composition of InfectedMushroom"DropOut" is about LSD
01:54:32  <Alltaken> a photo of my exhibition
01:54:43  <MeusH> yes, save as png
01:54:49  <MeusH> later you will need pcx
01:54:51  <MVV> and InfectedMushroom's genre is Phsycodelic
01:54:58  <Laukei> Hmm
01:55:15  <MeusH> you can take a look at my thread to see how do I post finished work
01:55:23  <MeusH> as pictures broken down to sprites
01:55:36  <Laukei> Can you send me something to play with to see if I can achieve the results required, or is there some tutorial somewhere I've missed?
01:55:37  <MeusH> I use layers and directories for everything
01:55:41  <Muhammad> I was just listening to infected mushrom
01:55:44  <MVV> MeusH how old are you?
01:56:08  <MeusH> if I need to hide sprite's foreground - roof and front wall - I do it via one click. I save it as png and have a background of a tile
01:56:29  <MeusH> for a foreground, I click two times to show the foreground and hide the background and it's ready
01:56:31  <MeusH> MVV: 17
01:56:33  <MeusH> and you?
01:56:33  <Bjarni> MeusH: FSB wants to know your age
01:56:50  <MeusH> FSB knows even The Stig!
01:57:03  <MeusH> Laukei, sure, I'll send you some files
01:57:12  <MVV> heh, I suppose 17-19 :)
01:57:15  <MVV> i'm am 19
01:57:27  <MeusH> Alltaken, is it a fridge?
01:57:28  <Laukei> Woo. Cheers. IRC, email, or other, MeusH?
01:57:38  <Alltaken> MeusH:  its an in-bench vege crisper
01:57:40  <MeusH> I mean, is only that bluish part a fridge?
01:57:44  <ln-> MVV: have you served in the army yet?
01:57:55  <Alltaken> yes its small
01:58:00  <MeusH> Laukei, IRC, email and forum
01:58:07  <MVV> MeusH are you coding something for OTTD ?
01:58:07  <MeusH>
01:58:16  <MeusH> just please don't give it to KGB :)
01:58:21  <Laukei> :D
01:58:28  <MeusH> MVV, currently not, however, I did
01:58:35  <MeusH> the big ones - tile measurement tool
01:58:37  <MVV> I'm ln- I'm ineligibile
01:58:40  <Laukei> So from your discussion earlier you are Polish?
01:58:45  <MeusH> yes
01:58:51  <Bjarni> I remember when I was 19. I thought I was a grown up, understanding stuff. Now I know that being 19 is actually a tricky time since you are still somewhat of a big child. Within the next 5 years or so, politics will be something completely different
01:59:03  <Laukei> My grandfather's from Katowice
01:59:13  <Bjarni> unless you screw yourself up with LSD and other bad stuff
01:59:31  <MVV> MeusH cool how long are programming on c ?
01:59:31  <Bjarni> goodnight
01:59:31  <Eddi|zuHause2> in east germany we had a saying: "every 5th person is in the Stasi" [Stasi being derived from STaatsSIcherheit = state security]
01:59:50  <Bjarni> sounds about right
02:00:00  <MeusH> MVV: Since I discovered OpenTTD, I think
02:00:06  <Eddi|zuHause2> so whenever you said something in a room of at least 5 persons, they would get to know about it
02:00:07  <MeusH> It would be two years
02:00:11  <Laukei> :/
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02:00:15  <MeusH> coding a few hours per month...
02:00:24  <Laukei> People like you MeusH make me feel so wasted :/
02:00:33  <MeusH> I've known Delphi since I was little
02:00:36  <MVV> Bjarni people are all different and somebody grows faster and somebody slower
02:00:37  <Laukei> I should have started playing around with programming languages at like 15-16
02:00:40  <MeusH> why Laukei?
02:00:46  <Laukei> I'm now 19 and can manage mIRC script and that's about it
02:00:46  <MeusH> lol I did when I was 7
02:00:55  <MeusH> and I can't make mIRC scripts :D
02:00:58  <Laukei> Although my mIRC script it must be said is pretty damn l33t
02:00:59  <Laukei> :D
02:01:00  <Eddi|zuHause2> i was around 9 when i started programming
02:01:09  <Laukei> I did a bit of BASIC
02:01:14  <Laukei> Well... quite a lot of BASIC :/
02:01:25  <Laukei> And started fiddling with C
02:01:36  <Eddi|zuHause2> i started with DBase
02:01:41  <Laukei> But I could never get my head around the Borland C++ compiler, and it never worked, so I never got anywhere... :/
02:01:47  <Eddi|zuHause2> later in school we had Pascal
02:02:01  <glx> Turbo Pascal 6 ?
02:02:16  <Eddi|zuHause2> no, Borland Pascal 7
02:02:18  <MVV> i programmed from 7 till 10 but my ZX was broken :( and I continued programming only when I was 17
02:02:47  <glx> MVV: spectrum zx81?
02:02:55  <MeusH> I didn't have any programming in school :(
02:02:58  <MVV> zx80
02:03:02  <MeusH> well, html isn't real programming
02:03:07  <Laukei> I didn't have programming either
02:03:12  <Laukei> HTML is pants :D
02:03:16  * ln- qbasic at 13, C at 15, C++ at 16, Java at 20
02:03:32  <Eddi|zuHause2> well, the Pascal thing was more like an after-school activity
02:03:35  <Laukei> <html><head><title>Pwnage!</title><body><p>I am l33t c0d3r!!!111!1one</p></body></html> :/
02:03:41  <MVV> i spent few years without computer it is very pity .... :( ... whom could I be now? ....
02:04:01  <Laukei> qbasic <3
02:04:05  <Laukei> I still have Qbasic
02:04:06  <Laukei> I think...
02:04:25  <Laukei> Yep
02:04:27  <Laukei> 200kb
02:04:29  <Laukei> :D
02:04:39  <Eddi|zuHause2> i tried QBasic for a while, did not get much beyond drawing some lines on the screen ;)
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02:05:22  <Eddi|zuHause2> coincidently, i was trying to program kind of a railroad simulation ;)
02:06:31  <MeusH> MVV, I've almost forgot, I've been making a mod for Jedi Academy, QIII engine based game
02:06:32  <MVV> I was studied in Sebastopol and could become a programmer (we had to learn 9 programming languages) but i was sent down and now i'm studing on not so perspective specialization
02:06:33  <MeusH> it was in C
02:06:36  <MeusH> then I found OpenTTD
02:06:52  <MeusH> one year ago I started making a java game for my mobile
02:06:57  <MeusH> and I'm like stuck :(
02:07:52  <Naksu> make a roguelike imo
02:07:53  <MVV> now i'm in Melitopol and i miss on Sebastopol hostel :(
02:08:11  <Laukei> MeusH, I emailed you.
02:08:33  <MVV> hostel with 1000 computers connected in LAN is the best place to study
02:09:49  *** MHMD_praying is now known as Idiot
02:10:13  <MVV> oh no ! 4:11 ! I have 2 ours to make a report  and solve a couple of integrals ...
02:10:29  <Idiot> 4:11? where are you?
02:10:35  *** MVV is now known as MVV_away
02:10:47  <MVV_away> Ukraine, idiot :)
02:10:58  <Idiot> haha
02:10:58  <Laukei> Wow
02:11:17  <Laukei> Never spoken to anyone in Ukraine I don't think.
02:11:18  <MeusH> 03:11... too late
02:11:20  <MeusH> even Bjarni sleeps
02:11:31  <MeusH> where are you from Laukei?
02:11:31  <Laukei> Poland is GMT+1?
02:11:39  <Laukei> I'm from England but am living in Spain.
02:11:41  <MeusH> dunno, I don't like DST
02:11:46  <MeusH> It's either +1 or +2
02:11:47  <Laukei> Although I go to University in England :/
02:11:58  <Idiot> sounds good
02:12:37  <Laukei> I jump around a lot really.. :)
02:12:49  <Laukei> Tonight I am in Spain.
02:13:53  <Idiot> I want to go to uni in England too
02:14:27  <Laukei> to study what?
02:15:40  <Idiot> Neuropsychology
02:15:52  <Laukei> :/
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02:16:07  <Idiot> what?
02:16:08  <MeusH> lol
02:16:09  <MeusH> :D
02:16:28  <glx> Idiot: why do you underline all your sentences ?
02:16:30  <Idiot> well, maybe also quran , who knows
02:16:35  <MeusH> your nick + Neuropsychology = rotfl
02:16:36  <Laukei> I was thinking that
02:16:41  <Laukei> ahaha
02:16:42  <Idiot> its not me its my stupid irc app
02:16:43  <Laukei> :D
02:16:56  <Laukei> Well turn it off, it's quite nasty
02:17:01  <Laukei> Please? :(
02:17:08  <Idiot> is it off now?
02:17:14  <Idiot> I dont see it here
02:17:17  <Laukei> It's off now.
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02:17:42  *** Idiot is now known as TLE-Nutter
02:17:48  <TLE-Nutter> so
02:17:55  <TLE-Nutter> what do you study then?
02:18:00  <Laukei> Physics
02:18:05  <TLE-Nutter> cool
02:18:07  <Laukei> It is
02:18:09  <Laukei> :D
02:18:22  <TLE-Nutter> how many years?
02:18:26  <Laukei> I'm in my first year.
02:19:02  <TLE-Nutter> oh good
02:19:07  <TLE-Nutter> and you stay with physics?
02:19:14  <Laukei> Stay with it?
02:19:15  <Laukei> How so?
02:19:27  <TLE-Nutter> I once started studying mechanical engineering but  didnt like it so i changed
02:19:33  <Laukei> Aaah
02:19:38  <Laukei> Yah I want to stay with it.
02:19:43  <Laukei> One of my friends really wants to study Mech Eng.
02:19:44  <TLE-Nutter> I didnt want to do algebra for the rest of my life
02:19:48  <Laukei> Haaha
02:19:49  <Laukei> Yeah
02:19:51  <Laukei> I hate maths :/
02:19:54  <Laukei> Shame really
02:19:54  <Eddi|zuHause2> yay, i got the thing mounted ;)
02:19:56  <Laukei> I love physics
02:19:59  <Laukei> Just not maths.. :D
02:20:04  <TLE-Nutter> :)
02:20:30  <Tuzlo> is it me or the latest release of open ttd
02:20:30  <Laukei> Does anyone play OpenTTD online much here?
02:20:41  <ln-> physics IS maths.
02:20:43  <Gonozal_VIII> <--
02:20:44  <ln-> eventually.
02:20:46  <TLE-Nutter> I tried yesteerday on brianetta server
02:20:51  <ln-> ultimately.
02:20:57  <TLE-Nutter> I just made a huge airline
02:21:05  <Laukei> There's a lot of it, but the underlying principles are physical and can be expressed in words
02:21:14  <Laukei> Such as "Every action has an equal and opposite reaction"
02:21:17  <TLE-Nutter> and once more I decided that its not really cool to play with planes and that passenger destinasyions are depserately neede
02:21:17  <TLE-Nutter> d
02:21:34  <Laukei> I played recently with a friend
02:21:41  <Laukei> We played a 1024x1024 map
02:21:47  <Tuzlo> I have 3 stations on the same rail line train goes from a to b and picks up passangers and uloads. then from b to c and does the same next it goes from C to A and unloads (or so I told it) on the return trip it stops at B and unloads and isnt programmed to
02:21:50  <Tuzlo> ???????????
02:21:53  <Laukei> And it was quite jerky on my PC after a while
02:21:57  <Laukei> Now this PC isn't great
02:22:03  <Laukei> But I wouldn't have thought TTD was *that* demanding
02:22:16  <Laukei> Or is a 1024*1024 map actually quite painful? :/
02:22:25  <Gonozal_VIII> turn on ttdpatch compatible nonstop handling tuzlo
02:22:29  <Tuzlo> try a 2048x2048
02:22:32  <glx> standard map is 256*256
02:22:35  <Tuzlo> okie
02:22:39  <Tuzlo> lemme check
02:23:08  <Laukei> I mean...
02:23:08  <Tuzlo> that on the vehicles tab?
02:23:09  <Laukei> (CPU1) AMD Athlon™ XP 2200+ @ 1800MHz (ASUSTeK Computer INC. A7V880 mainboard) (RAM) 1GB, 647.11MB free (VGA1) NVIDIA GeForce 6600 GT (128MB), 1280x1024x32, 60Hz
02:23:32  <Gonozal_VIII> stations i think
02:23:37  <Laukei> Should a 1024*1024 map with ~500 vehicles kill that map?
02:23:40  <Laukei> *PC
02:23:43  <Tuzlo> nm, found it
02:23:45  <Tuzlo> thanks
02:23:49  <Gonozal_VIII> np
02:24:59  <Gonozal_VIII> check the cpu usage
02:25:31  <Tuzlo> 100 %
02:25:33  <Laukei> CPU usage was maxed out
02:25:55  <Laukei> RAM usage was pitifully low
02:25:58  <Laukei> ~20mb I think
02:25:59  <Gonozal_VIII> hmm only does that on fast forward here
02:26:06  *** TLE-Nutter is now known as Eye-Jack
02:26:30  <Eye-Jack> gotta sleep
02:26:33  <Eye-Jack> night everybody
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02:28:07  <Gonozal_VIII> as far as i know the fast forward setting is as fast as the cpu can handle, so if the cpu can't handle the normal speed, it should work slower but without problems when you turn on the fast forward thing... maybe
02:28:25  <Laukei> :D
02:28:32  <Laukei> It works slower at normal speed ;)
02:28:49  <Laukei> The server admin was fiddling with settings
02:28:54  <Laukei> And found some frame buffer thing
02:28:58  <Laukei> That showed how much visual lag I had
02:29:21  <Laukei> He could fiddle with settings that meant that mine lag was more playable
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02:31:19  <Eddi|zuHause3> NPF is usually the biggest CPU user, and can easily kill a 2GHz CPU with 500 vehicles
02:31:39  <Eddi|zuHause3> so switch either to YAPF or NTP
02:31:49  <MeusH> 03:31 on my clock
02:31:53  <MeusH> and KGB is hunting me
02:32:14  <MeusH> goodnight
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02:33:50  <Laukei> NPF?
02:33:56  <Laukei> Normal Pathfinding?
02:34:00  <Gonozal_VIII> new pathfinder
02:34:02  <Laukei> Aaah
02:34:14  <Laukei> YAPF is Yet Another Path Finder, right?
02:34:20  <Gonozal_VIII> yes
02:34:30  <Laukei> There's hope for me yet.
02:34:31  <Laukei> :D
02:36:40  <Gonozal_VIII> my online games with yapf tend to desync if there are trains stuck in a jam.. don't know why and it's not really predictable or reproducable
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02:38:32  <Eddi|zuHause3> you ought to report that
02:39:12  <Gonozal_VIII> wanted to but as i said i can't be much more specific on how and when it happens
02:39:57  <Eddi|zuHause3> yeah, but first people have to know that there is actually a problem, before they can investigate it
02:40:46  <Eddi|zuHause3> and "trains stuck in jams" pretty much reduce the number of possible locations where the error might be
02:41:23  <Gonozal_VIII> problem is, that it's not only then... also seems to happen without any visible reason
02:41:50  <Eddi|zuHause3> the problem is, if you do not report it, it will never be fixed
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02:44:35  <Eddi|zuHause3> hm... it's probably a bad time to ask how to create a bootable NTFS partition in linux ;)
02:44:42  <Gonozal_VIII> some month ago i was told to make a savegame with it but that didn't work as it's not reproducable, sometimes it happens again after loading, sometimes not
02:44:48  <Sacro_> Eddi|zuHause3: bootable ntfs?
02:44:56  <Sacro_> use cfdisk
02:45:10  <Sacro_> create partition with file type as ntfs, and then set it bootable
02:45:14  <Eddi|zuHause3> i have this rescued disk, which contains WINXP
02:45:27  <Eddi|zuHause3> and i have an unused partition, that is smaller than the rescued image
02:45:47  <Eddi|zuHause3> and i want to copy most of the data from the image to that partition, preferably that i can boot from it
02:46:48  <Sacro_> hmmm
02:46:49  <Gonozal_VIII> copy it there and use the repair function from the xp installation cd?
02:46:56  <Sacro_> yeah
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02:47:07  <huha> hello!
02:47:12  <Gonozal_VIII> hi
02:47:27  <Eddi|zuHause3> if i had the XP installation cd, i'd not go through all that trouble
02:47:31  <huha> where can I find the autoreplace feature in openttd 0.5.0 rc1?
02:47:47  <Gonozal_VIII> manage list
02:47:50  <Eddi|zuHause3> huha: in the train list, click on "manage list"
02:48:13  <huha> ahh
02:48:15  <huha> thanks
02:48:30  <huha> I tried to find where it is for about 15 minutes
02:49:01  <Gonozal_VIII> didn't find myself at first
02:49:01  <Eddi|zuHause3> you ought not start playing OTTD at 3:30 AM
02:49:11  <Gonozal_VIII> +it
02:50:10  <huha> erm.
02:50:16  <huha> oh, is it already that late?
02:50:18  <huha> interesting!
02:58:26  <Eddi|zuHause3> i have slight doubts that this is gonna work
02:59:24  <Eddi|zuHause3> i should rather create a partition of the same size
02:59:42  <Eddi|zuHause3> but i have to free some space first
03:00:47  <Eddi|zuHause3> hm... are there linux tools to shrink an existing NTFS partition?
03:01:42  <Sacro_> ntfsresize?
03:04:54  <Eddi|zuHause3> "we strongly recommend to have a backup of your data. You have anyway, haven't you?"
03:04:57  <Eddi|zuHause3> ;)
03:09:44  <Eddi|zuHause3> hm, that doesn't appear to be able to understand the disk image
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05:08:17  <Eddi|zuHause3> ungodly hours at christmas? blasphemy! ;)
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06:25:12  <Smoky555> morning :)
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06:57:54  <mattt_> breakdowns are rediculous.. at normal setting i was servicing every 30 days and still getting at least 1 bd between services >_<
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07:10:44  <Eddi|zuHause3> that's why all sane people play with breakdowns off
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09:01:40  <Azio> lol yeah ive found that too mattt_ ;\
09:01:50  <Azio> dunno if its as realistic as its "meant" to be
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09:27:08  <MeusH> hello
09:27:18  <MeusH> !seen MiHaMi*
09:27:19  <_42_> MeusH, I found one match to your query: MiHaMiX. MiHaMiX ( was last seen rejoining #openttd from a netsplit 4 days 22 hours 16 minutes ago (21.12. 11:11) MiHaMiX is still there.
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10:56:07  <Celestar> morning
10:56:34  <Rubidium> morning Celestar
10:56:45  <Celestar> hows things?
10:57:09  <Rubidium> it is very quiet in here
10:59:14  <Celestar> true
10:59:19  <Prof_Frink> GORDON'S ALIVE!
10:59:21  <Celestar> !seen Darkvater
10:59:22  <_42_> Celestar, please look a bit closer at the memberlist of this channel.
10:59:29  <Prof_Frink> </blessed>
10:59:30  * Celestar punches _42_
10:59:42  <Rubidium> 05:48  * Darkvater hmms something at this ungodly hour and goes back to sleep
10:59:52  <Rubidium> so he might not be awake
11:00:01  <Celestar> ^^
11:01:39  <Prof_Frink> He /is/ set away
11:02:24  <Celestar> who cares about da away flag?
11:05:10  <blathijs> orning
11:05:24  <blathijs> hmm, let's jam an M in front of that, shall we?
11:05:35  * blathijs jams an M in front of his first line
11:05:41  <blathijs> There.
11:07:11  <MeusH> hey blathijs, hi Celestar, hello Rubidium :p
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11:20:12  <Celestar> hi all
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11:24:47  <Darkvater> morning
11:25:35  <Celestar> hi Darkvater
11:25:41  <Darkvater> lord Celestar, have they summoned me?
11:25:42  <Celestar> hows stuff?
11:25:50  <Celestar> yeah
11:26:13  <Darkvater> probably bridges, right?
11:26:13  <Celestar> I'll be merging bridges tomorrow morning, if that is ok with ya?
11:26:26  * Darkvater checks out
11:26:27  <Darkvater> hmm
11:26:31  <Darkvater> do you have a win32 binary?
11:26:34  <Celestar> no
11:26:39  <Celestar> but I can try to make one tomorrow
11:26:48  <Darkvater> he, that's of no use ;p
11:26:56  <Celestar> I have no windows here
11:27:15  <Darkvater> nvm, I'm checking it out
11:27:38  <Celestar> do it, but the changes you requested are local on my HDD @ work
11:28:13  <Darkvater> it's only comsetic though, so doesn't matter
11:29:23  <Darkvater>
11:29:33  <Darkvater> does anyon see any difference between these two images?
11:29:59  <Rubidium> look at the color of the statue
11:30:09  <Darkvater> ok, besides the statue
11:30:33  <Rubidium> there is no difference, and there shouldn't be any other difference
11:30:43  <Darkvater> Rubidium: the TGP window can set years between 0 and 5million. Don't know if that's intentional?
11:30:59  <Rubidium> it is
11:31:23  <Darkvater> it is then inconsistent with the patches setting which is limited to 1920-2050 or something
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11:32:13  <Rubidium> true, but the problem with patches settings is the fact that it scales the interval to (max-min)/50
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11:33:04  <Darkvater> Celestar: has bridge building criteria with regards to slop been changed in branch/bridges?
11:33:40  <Darkvater> hmm, apparently not
11:35:45  <Darkvater> Celestar: how is this bridge-over-bridge building criteria calculated?
11:36:39  <Rubidium> Darkvater, something a little different: you cannot create a new company if 8 or more clients are connected to a server. fixes that, though I would like to know why you placed IsValidPlayer there (in r2300)
11:36:47  <Darkvater> Rubidium: why is that a problem? If it's possible there, why not in tgp?
11:37:31  <MeusH> hey Alltaken
11:37:44  <Alltaken> hi
11:37:45  <MeusH> Darkvater, what is the estimated date of releasing 0.5.0?
11:37:46  <Rubidium> What the problem is: clicking the < or > skips over 100000 years if min = 0 and max = 5000000
11:38:50  <MeusH> apparently, there are no trains for year 2512853 :s
11:39:06  <Darkvater> Rubidium: look at the function comments. If p1 is 0 then the new player is in p2 (PlayerID)
11:40:04  <Rubidium> that comment is wrong, the ID is the ClientID, the index in _network_client_info
11:40:04  <Darkvater> but I think the comments are wrong and it should be clientID
11:40:09  <Alltaken> MeusH:  i really hope someone designs some good futuristic vehicles, and even some new track types
11:40:10  <Darkvater> as the function says elsewhere
11:40:55  <MeusH> Alltaken, have you thought about 32bpp effects for OpenTTD, like particles?
11:40:57  <Darkvater> Rubidium:the fix is good, but use cid and not p2
11:41:10  <Alltaken> MeusH:  yep, like smoke
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11:41:41  <MeusH> Alltaken, do you have some more details?
11:41:50  <Alltaken> do it the same as now?
11:41:50  <MeusH> have you coded something? or collected some links?
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11:42:16  <Darkvater> Rubidium: donnu why I put the comment there just above the isvalidplayer, better remove it
11:42:17  <Alltaken> some images of smoke getting bigger, and then fading away, but with 32bpp :P
11:42:27  <MeusH> you mean making them vehicles that change sprite from first to fifth, representing small and big smoke puff?
11:42:38  <Alltaken> yes
11:42:40  <Darkvater> ah already did ;p
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11:43:14  <Rubidium> ok, changed p2 -> cid
11:43:19  <MeusH> Alltaken: I was thinking about giving each effect a formula to calculate it's coordintates, size and let's say alpha
11:43:30  <Alltaken> i'd suggest graphics accelerating a particle layer over the top of everything (and ocean waves), but i doubt that will get done...
11:43:38  <MeusH> so a smoke puff goes higher, gets bigger and more transparent with each tick
11:43:49  <MeusH> :)
11:44:06  <Alltaken> MeusH:  yeah, so more of a vector system....  smoke could potentially be generated on the fly.  but i almost fear that would take a bit to computer on the cpu
11:44:15  <MeusH> Bjarni said something about moving display part of OpenTTD to GPU
11:44:41  <Alltaken> well if it could be switched to GPU then a lot more possibilities are opened
11:44:57  <MeusH> Alltaken, playing games like Quake or Unreal, I see thousands of particles drawn each frame
11:44:59  <MeusH> with 60fps
11:45:03  <Alltaken> yeah
11:45:04  <MeusH> and middle class computer
11:45:09  <MeusH> nowdays probably a poor computer
11:45:18  <Alltaken> thats my point, also they have particle physics and stuff
11:45:36  <Alltaken> i think all sprites could be moved to GPU pretty easily
11:45:41  <Alltaken> like Diablo2
11:45:48  <Alltaken> still 2d game though
11:46:02  <MeusH> mhm, yeah
11:46:02  <MeusH> I hope I could help with particles when things get moved to GPU and 32bpp gets integrated with trunk
11:46:06  <MeusH> brb
11:46:41  <Alltaken> well someone please email me when OTTD goes 32bpp officially, i'd love to know about it
11:47:34  <CIA-1> rubidium * r7560 /trunk/players.c:
11:47:34  <CIA-1> -Fix (r2300): p2 is not a PlayerID when creating a new company, but the ClientID
11:47:34  <CIA-1> (index in _network_client_info). Therefore it was not possible to create a new
11:47:34  <CIA-1> company if 8 or more clients were connected. Thanks to FlashFF for noticing this
11:47:34  <CIA-1> bug.
11:50:55  * Darkvater too
11:50:58  <MeusH> do you have e-mail option in your profile on tt-forums?
11:51:31  <Darkvater> what happened to celestar?
11:54:34  <Rubidium> revenge of the Christmas Turkey?
11:54:47  <Darkvater> hehe
11:55:17  <Darkvater> it completely eludes me why I had 8 as client-id max there though
11:55:41  <Darkvater> but in my defence cmdplayerctrl was a huge mess and I had to work really hard to make all functions input-proof
11:57:04  <Rubidium> ah, well it is solved now and apparently wasn't a big issue as I've never heard someone complaining about it
11:57:29  <Darkvater> ah nice
11:57:34  <Darkvater> 20 orso 0.5.0RC1 servers
11:57:43  <Rubidium> ok, now something that (hopefully) fixes Bjarni's core<->GUI desync with respect to autorenew
11:57:47  <Rubidium>
11:58:18  <Rubidium> the idea: if the local_player is going to be changed, update the _patches.autorenew* to reflect that change.
11:58:27  <Darkvater> only 2 are using newgrfs ;)
11:58:28  <FlashFF> ...
11:58:44  <Darkvater> when can this happen?
11:58:57  <FlashFF> morning laddos
11:59:10  <Rubidium> when loading games, joining companies, ...
11:59:36  <Darkvater> how would loading games affect this?
11:59:40  <MeusH> hey FlashFF
12:00:09  <Rubidium> because _patches.autorenew* did not get set when the game was loaded
12:00:57  <Darkvater> Rubidium: in cmdplayerctrlt that docommandp in line 856 already does this
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12:01:36  <Darkvater> (players.c0
12:01:37  <Darkvater> )
12:01:38  <Rubidium> so if I have them enabled in game A save that, start a new game and disable it, then load game A, the settings are still on disabled in the GUI.
12:02:04  <Rubidium> Darkvater: it does it for new companies
12:02:57  <Rubidium> and maybe when you join a company in network games, but not when two companies are merged
12:03:01  <Darkvater> yes, so you would probably need some changes there as well
12:04:05  <Darkvater> cause that function only sets _autoreplace thingies for the joining player
12:04:12  <Darkvater> at least if I understood the bjarni-code correctly
12:04:25  <Darkvater> and more likely from what he told me
12:04:28  <Darkvater> you can't trust his code
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12:05:33  <Rubidium> when you are in the company that is joined/new, _patches.autorenew* are updated with the CMD_AUTOREPLACE_MODIFY command
12:05:45  <Rubidium> (CMD_SET_AUTOREPLACE)
12:05:52  <Darkvater> yes, but your setlocalplayer does that as well
12:07:46  <Rubidium> true, but if it isn't sent over the network, the new client might be out-of-sync with another client for the same company
12:08:04  <Darkvater> who said anything about not sending over the network?
12:08:10  <Rubidium> (yes, the joining client overwrites the autorenew settings as far as I can see)
12:08:45  <Darkvater> you do need to keep the command as it sets the p-> renew values
12:09:06  <Rubidium> oh, you're concerned with that it is doing work double?
12:09:52  <Darkvater> hmm
12:09:58  <Darkvater> I wanted it beautyfied
12:10:15  <Darkvater> but it might be unfeasable, since in cmdsetautoreplace one doesn't set the local player
12:10:23  <Rubidium> exactly
12:10:29  <Darkvater> it's just that function is so fking ublyg
12:10:31  <Darkvater> ugly
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12:11:00  <Rubidium> true
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12:15:00  <Darkvater> but it seems the control flow is different so it can't be done
12:15:19  <Darkvater> and even if done, settinglocalplayer to same local player just to get the corrent renew settings is just as ugly
12:16:41  <Rubidium> yup. Ideally there would be some be some per-company configuration screen, but that is way more intrusive than this is (and even then we need the SetLocalPlayer function)
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12:19:17  <Darkvater> for the next release ;)
12:19:24  <Darkvater> we can put it in the company information window
12:19:53  <Rubidium> exactly
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12:23:05  <qball> hi all, good with with 0.5
12:23:11  <qball> but I got a crasher
12:23:15  <qball> dbg: [NET] Trying to execute a packet in the past!
12:23:15  <qball> openttd: network.c:1197: NetworkHandleLocalQueue: Assertion `0' failed.
12:23:37  <FlashFF> Rubidium... the patch you posted above, does that work with 0.4.8?
12:23:55  <Rubidium> maybe
12:24:18  <FlashFF> lol  maybe ill manually enter it just to be sure
12:24:33  * Darkvater wonders why people would want to go back to 0.4.8...
12:24:55  <FlashFF> my server runs the lateset standard release version
12:25:18  <Darkvater> qball: interesting...sadly of no use :(
12:25:24  <Darkvater> FlashFF: point taken ;)
12:25:30  <FlashFF> when 0.5.0 makes it to the stable release section of the site ill pupgrade lol
12:25:42  <FlashFF> with 1 less P!
12:25:45  <qball> Darkvater: looking for the stupid core file
12:25:54  <qball> Darkvater: it dumped it... but I kinda cant find it
12:26:33  <qball> it's a problem also in 0.4.* it happens when there is one client in queue before you
12:26:39  <Darkvater> Rubidium: in your patch setting _patches; I would exclude mode GM_MENU no?
12:26:49  <Darkvater> qball: it is reproducable?
12:27:00  <qball> Darkvater: just described the steps
12:27:07  <qball> Darkvater: on X86_64 linux
12:27:19  <qball> connect to a server with one client in queu before you
12:27:29  <Darkvater> only x64?
12:27:42  <qball> no other machine I've tested it on
12:28:02  <Darkvater> hmm, how to get a client in queue before me...
12:28:29  <Rubidium> make a really large map, then you've got time to change GUI etc
12:28:40  <Rubidium> also ask peter1138 to host the game on his home computer ;)
12:28:47  <Darkvater> ;p
12:29:26  <Darkvater> really large map doesn't really help... locally it doesnloads just as fast...almost instant
12:29:35  <Darkvater> but I'll breakpoint the client as itjoins ;p
12:29:45  <Rubidium> but what did you mean with exclude GM_MENU? Not updating _patches.aut* when in GM_MENU?
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12:29:52  <qball> Darkvater: it happens after the map downloads
12:30:14  <Darkvater> Rubidium: yes; you don't want the (default) settings from the intro game as value
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12:33:48  <Rubidium> ok, done that too
12:34:34  <FlashFF> *boom*
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12:35:16  <Rubidium> FlashFF: what did you blow up?
12:35:24  <FlashFF> my head lol
12:36:00  <FlashFF> seems a lot has been changed since 0.4.8 lol
12:36:34  <FlashFF> 0.4.8 has this:   if (!(flags & DC_EXEC) || pid >= MAX_PLAYERS) return 0;
12:38:07  <FlashFF> so would I be right in recknoning it needs to be:   if (!(flags & DC_EXEC) || pid >= MAX_CLIENT_INFO) return 0;
12:38:16  <Rubidium> FlashFF: you know that _all_ clients connected to your server need that patch applied, otherwise any client not having applied this patch when there are 8+ clients and a new company is added will desync.
12:38:25  <FlashFF> lol
12:38:27  <FlashFF> damn them
12:38:28  <FlashFF> lol
12:39:06  <Rubidium> by the way, you reckoned right
12:39:10  <FlashFF> so when a player registers a company...
12:39:17  <FlashFF> it need to register with every client?
12:39:23  <hylje> yes
12:39:27  <FlashFF> thats insane
12:39:32  <hylje> ottd is fairly redundant in netplay
12:39:38  <hylje> thats why you get very little traffic
12:39:47  <Rubidium> that is why OTTD uses only a few kB of traffic
12:39:52  <FlashFF> why wouldnt it just register with the server then have the server update all other clients on company #'s info
12:40:35  <hylje> because server just keeps the state of the game saved, all changes are done identically in every client
12:40:37  <Rubidium> it sends the command to create a company to the server and the server sends that to all clients
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12:41:37  <erikv> guys, congrats with 5.0rc, downloading it atm
12:41:50  <Rubidium> then if the server adds the client to it's own version of the game and other clients do not, the clients will (eventually) desync as their state differs
12:41:59  <FlashFF> hmmm
12:42:13  <FlashFF> thats a pain
12:42:22  <FlashFF> whens 0.5.0 being released as stable? lol
12:42:40  <hylje> feel free to implement a different way of netplay
12:42:58  <Rubidium> when the known bugs in the release candidate(s) have been fixed
12:43:03  <FlashFF> lol  im not that crazy
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12:43:29  <hylje> i'd believe an optimised-for-performance netcode could have its uses
12:43:40  <hylje> as opposed to optimised-for-traffic
12:44:00  <FlashFF> i wouldnt have thought the traffic would be the issue though
12:44:28  * Rubidium wonders how you would optimise for performance
12:44:51  <FlashFF> if the client just took what the server said as final word,  so if the server accepts the company registration, the clients would be told "this is the way it is, and you better like it"
12:44:55  <hylje> Rubidium: dunno, but i was after a server-side calculated stuff
12:45:15  <FlashFF> if he client then had a desync, it's data must have been wrong to start with
12:45:23  <hylje> Rubidium: so a really beefy server could do large games without need for processing power for clients
12:45:25  <Rubidium> hylje: sending the new position/speed etc. of a 1000 trains?
12:45:40  <hylje> yes, or just the approximate area the user is situated
12:46:45  <Rubidium> that would cost so much more bandwidth than the current situation, that I reckon you wouldn't be able to host a 2kx2k game on your basic DSL connection
12:46:58  <hylje> yes, that's teh downside
12:47:04  <hylje> its all compromises
12:47:53  <Rubidium> FlashFF: the server has the final word; it checks all commands, but the client has to assume that the server can send bad information, so it has to check it itself too
12:48:14  <FlashFF> Rubidium
12:48:20  <Rubidium> otherwise you could easily exploit someone elses computer by running a compromised server.
12:48:21  <FlashFF> in CmdPlayerCtrl
12:48:41  <FlashFF> is p1 the id of the client the new client is connecting to...
12:48:43  <FlashFF> ?
12:49:47  <Rubidium> p1 is the the 'command', what is must exactly do (create a new company, merge companies, delete a company)
12:50:06  <FlashFF> k
12:50:28  <FlashFF> gg me @ reading comments lol
12:50:35  <Rubidium> p2 is the ID of the new client, which every client needs to know, otherwise you wouldn't be able to chat to that person (one-to-one, instead of one-to-all)
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12:53:28  <Darkvater> hmm
12:53:40  <FlashFF> ok people.  Off for a boxing day dinner
12:53:45  <FlashFF> i get beef!
12:53:53  <FlashFF> cya in like  6 hours
12:54:03  <Darkvater> my linux client crashes on RC1 when clicking on 'newgrf settings'...
12:54:40  <Darkvater> Rubidium: you did some fix in that area, no?
12:54:52  <Rubidium> yes
12:55:13  <Darkvater> then it's probably that
12:56:18  <Darkvater> hmm is authorizing after or bgefore downloading map?
12:56:51  <CIA-1> rubidium * r7561 /trunk/ (7 files): -Fix (FS#431): core and (patches) GUI were not in-sync with respect to autorenew settings. This is only a temporary fix, as the definite fix needs to move the autorenew settings to a per-company settings window.
12:57:12  <Rubidium> before I believe
12:57:37  <Darkvater> hmm, it is pretty hard doing a manual break just after map download
12:58:02  <Rubidium> there is one specific last-map-download packet
12:58:20  <Darkvater> yeah, I'll just set a breakpoint
12:58:23  <Rubidium> line 488 of network_client.c
13:00:37  <Darkvater> hmm I've got a client stuck at map_done but a new client doesn't get a crash
13:02:53  <Darkvater> ok '1 client in front of you'
13:03:07  <Biff> whats the point with the water canals?
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13:05:56  <DarkSSH> !openttd logs
13:06:03  <DarkSSH> qball: so when is this crash supposed to happen?
13:06:09  <SpComb> Logs:
13:06:09  <DarkSSH> !logs
13:06:26  <Azio> gheh
13:06:31  <Azio> then maybe it something to do with the client?:P
13:06:34  <qball> DarkSSH: when you connect to a server, wind up in a queue, and then the game data loads.
13:06:40  <qball> after it's loaded
13:06:43  <qball> I get a crash
13:06:44  <Azio> no version mismatch
13:06:52  <DarkSSH> not here
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13:06:58  <qball> it does here...
13:06:59  <Azio> no reproducable results on other clients
13:07:02  <Azio> so it cant be the server
13:07:07  <qball> 0.4.5 and 0.5.0
13:07:10  <Rubidium_> stupid surfnet :(
13:07:13  <qball> Azio: what are you rambling
13:07:15  <DarkSSH> eg I had '1 client waiting in front of you'..waiting, then connected and it just worked
13:07:20  <Azio> i run an isp
13:07:24  <Azio> i know how servers work
13:07:41  <qball> DarkSSH: it's on amd64 (ubuntu)
13:07:50  <qball> DarkSSH: I'll see I get a coredump next time
13:07:59  <qball> Azio: no, you think you know how servers work.
13:08:03  <Azio> no
13:08:05  <Azio> your just an asshole
13:08:07  <Azio> its christmas
13:08:08  <DarkSSH> is the server on pause when the client joins?
13:08:09  <Azio> calm the fuck down
13:08:11  <DarkSSH> Azio: what's the problem?
13:08:12  <Azio> i was only trying to help
13:08:19  <qball> DarkSSH: I think it is..
13:08:29  <Azio> DarkSSH: oh qball making assumptions about other ppl thats all
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13:09:49  <Rubidium> ah, surfnet is back
13:09:56  *** Rubidium_ [] has quit []
13:10:25  <DarkSSH> qball: nop, no crash :(
13:10:36  <qball> DarkSSH: :( to bad.
13:11:09  <DarkSSH> qball: let me ge this 100%. A client joins and is busy downloading a map. In the meantime someone else joins and is waiting. First client finishes, then I finish (I was waiting) and after that the server unpauses the game and I crash?
13:11:39  <qball> DarkSSH: that is what it looks like yes..  the game is also created on the server.. and I can rejoin it
13:12:04  <DarkSSH> so random game, and you can rejoin if nobody is waiting in front of you?
13:12:23  <qball> I can join any game, it just goes wrong when somebody is in front of me
13:12:35  <DarkSSH> qball: please check this thing in the case the server is paused while everyone joins and is unpaused when everybody is done
13:12:46  <hylje> this is the crash-after-queue bug?
13:12:51  <qball> DarkSSH: hmm bit hard not having a server.
13:13:02  <DarkSSH> run your own to test
13:13:14  <qball> I will later
13:14:07  <Rubidium> sounds like qball receives CommandPackets from before the savegame he got from the server
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13:14:24  <DarkSSH> qball: but I'm afraid it's a x64 specific crash if I can't reproduce it iwth the same steps
13:14:36  <qball> yeah..
13:14:44  <qball> thatswhy I am so pissed I can't find the
13:14:45  <qball> core
13:14:46  <DarkSSH> in whcih case you have two opetions
13:14:56  <DarkSSH> 1. fix it yourself, or try to find the cause
13:14:56  <DarkSSH> or
13:15:02  <DarkSSH> 2. donate a x64 machine to me ;)
13:15:22  <Biff> hmm, transfer system is still calculating negative profits
13:15:24  <qball> I am used running openttd with crasher bugs
13:16:32  <DarkSSH> nop, no crash here either with server paused or unpaused
13:16:37  <DarkSSH> blathijs: ping
13:16:57  <qball> I think I had a crasher (the 0 width crash) for almost 1.5 years
13:17:07  <qball> but it's fixed now (I heard)
13:17:11  <DarkSSH> yes, that's fixed
13:17:34  <qball> I reported it like 1000 times, and all you said was don't use newgrf, and I saying I didn't have any
13:17:56  <DarkSSH> mind you; that crash was almost unreproducable
13:18:01  <DarkSSH> except in your case :)
13:18:42  <qball> yeah.
13:18:46  <qball> sorry still gets me pissed
13:18:56  <qball> being treated like an idiot many times.
13:19:12  <qball> I know I am, but don't let me know
13:19:12  <DarkSSH> all users are idiots unless proven otherwise
13:19:26  <DarkSSH> ^^
13:21:00  <Rubidium> I suspect this might fix it:
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13:22:00  <hylje> hm
13:22:21  <DarkSSH> Rubidium: so why can't I reproduce?
13:22:45  <Rubidium> because you haven't got a third company issueing commands?
13:23:03  <DarkSSH> :O
13:23:05  <DarkSSH> good point
13:23:51  <DarkSSH> hmm but shouldn't I get the commands queued from MAP_WAIT?
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13:25:16  <Rubidium> I don't think so, as after MAP_WAIT you'll go to MAP_AUTH (which is MAP_WAIT - 1). Then the client requests the map, the server saves the map and then sends it to the client.
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13:25:55  <Rubidium> anything that is sent when in MAP_WAIT, has already happened on the map you will be receiving from the server
13:26:01  <DarkSSH> after map_wait you go to status_map (eg download map)
13:26:07  <DarkSSH> auth is done before you are put on hold
13:26:22  <Rubidium> after MAP_WAIT you'll go ba to MAP_AUTH
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13:26:39  <Rubidium> (network_server.c:340)
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13:27:03  <DarkSSH> nice control flow :s
13:27:29  <Rubidium> oh, the client doesn't request the map, the server just starts sending it :)
13:30:02  <MVV> hi all
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13:30:52  <CIA-1> Darkvater * r7562 /trunk/video/win32_v.c:
13:30:52  <CIA-1> -Fix (r7060, 5874): It seems windows doesn't have the same functionality for
13:30:52  <CIA-1> CreateWindow when starting a program from the console or from the GUI. Because
13:30:52  <CIA-1> of this starting OpenTTD from the desktop wouldn't maximize the window, even if
13:30:52  <CIA-1> the config file said so. So work around this...
13:30:56  <DarkSSH> hmm; cake
13:32:40  * Rubidium thinks that that is really stupid issue in the windows API
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13:35:15  <Athorium> Purno: U here?
13:37:09  <Tuzlo> listen to this. I have a train that when it goes for servicing will not leave the depot nutil you destroy the track in front of it then rebuild it, every time it goes into the depot it does this and it doesnt matter where the depot is
13:39:55  <Purno> Athorium , I am now
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13:40:02  <Rubidium> sounds like unwanted behaviour. Which version are you using and can you post a savegame somewhere?
13:41:32  <Tuzlo> o.5.o rc1
13:41:52  <Tuzlo> I could probably do that, know where>?
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13:54:40  <Tuzlo> I have what I think is a bug on the game I was playing. Train #3 for will not exit the depot after entering it, I have to destroy the track and rebuild it as its exiting. The rest of the trains are fine. I may have done something wrong, but for the life of me I cant figure it out......
13:54:40  <DarkSSH> Rubidium: tell me :(
13:54:53  <tokai> DarkSSH: did u commited my mos diffs already? didnt saw it in the mail outs.
13:55:02  <DarkSSH> oh shit forgot tokai
13:55:06  <DarkSSH> got link?
13:55:19  <tokai> wait.
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13:55:56  <DarkSSH> tokai: if you do a 'make install' on morphos does the executable get an openttd icon?
13:56:07  <Rubidium> DarkSSH: what do I have to tell you?
13:56:08  <tokai|noir> DarkSSH:
13:56:17  <DarkSSH> Rubidium: did qball try the network-crash thingie?
13:56:24  <DarkSSH> Rubidium: the win32 API thing
13:56:50  <DarkSSH> wait
13:56:51  <tokai|noir> DarkSSH: no idea.. i never used make install. you can't use that really on morphos anyway. there are no 'defined' app paths. But it gets an icon in the archive when i do "make release" :)
13:56:53  <DarkSSH> tokai|noir: I committed it
13:57:12  <DarkSSH> r7548
13:57:35  <Rubidium> as far as I know qball didn't test it yet, and the Win32API is just stupid in that area
13:58:02  <tokai|noir> ah.. interesting.. missing the mailouts from 7519 up to 7556
14:00:27  <tokai|noir> DarkSSH: ah.. makefiles says "make install is not supported on morphos" anyway. :)  its fine that way.
14:00:38  <DarkSSH> hehe
14:00:38  <DarkSSH> k
14:01:27  <tokai|noir> actually it could work, but then the game would end in the depths of devenv (SDK) paths which emulate quite a few of the unix env ( /bin /usr etc.)
14:02:07  <Rubidium> Tuzlo: it isn't a bug. The depot has an implicit signal, so when there is a train in the block (which there always is, due to the fact that you try to run two trains in the same signal block), the train in the depot cannot leave
14:02:56  <Rubidium> Tuzlo: placing a few signals around Flundingstone Valley should resolve your issue.
14:03:56  <Tuzlo> Rubidium: okie, sorry for bothering you
14:04:44  <Tuzlo> im not good with signals at all
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14:08:31  <Wolf01> ello
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14:58:04  <MeusH> hey Wolf01
14:58:18  <Wolf01> 'lo MeusH
14:58:48  <MeusH> how are you and your patches?
15:00:15  <MeusH> brb
15:00:52  <Wolf01> i'm fine, my patches not so good, thanks
15:02:46  <Frostregen> not ?
15:03:23  <Wolf01> my ideas are different from my patches ;)
15:03:47  <Wolf01> my patches are only the daylength and transparency options
15:04:09  <Frostregen> but they do work
15:04:22  <Wolf01> yeah
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15:05:21  <Wolf01> how is the eyecandy development?
15:05:50  <Athorium> Wolf01 I know you?
15:05:58  <Wolf01> maybe
15:06:02  <Frostregen> the custom ground sprite was the last thing
15:06:11  <Frostregen> looks much better now (town buildings)
15:06:14  <Athorium> your nick results me familiar... but now I don't know because...
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15:06:49  <Wolf01> ok, now the last thing is the grf support
15:06:56  <Frostregen> exactly
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15:07:36  <Athorium> ahhhh the eyecandy development
15:07:39  <Frostregen> tonight i drove 600km to hamburg. so i just woke up. maybe tonight i have some time for this
15:07:48  <Wolf01> :)
15:08:23  <Wolf01> maybe somebody who knows the code should help, instead of say "the manual is there"
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15:08:57  <Athorium> now I'm learning to make graphics
15:09:12  <Wolf01> a concrete example is better than a bunch of rules
15:10:07  <Frostregen> hmm, i do not think for this case exist examples
15:11:34  <Athorium> one question, can add trams more larger than normal trams?
15:11:53  <Athorium> or multiple trams in the same tram
15:12:01  <Frostregen> we should do it the same way ttdp will do it. but their coding does not seem to be very advanced
15:12:01  <Wolf01> you should ask this on #tycoon on the other server
15:12:14  <Athorium> what server?
15:12:29  <Wolf01> open the forum and then click to "chat"
15:12:39  <Athorium> ok ^^
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15:12:54  <Wolf01> it may be quakenet but i don't remember
15:13:16  <Athorium> oh. I and quakenet... enemies
15:13:17  <Athorium> xDD
15:13:42  <Athorium> the fu***** preventive port 113
15:13:44  <Athorium> -_-
15:14:25  <Athorium> Wolf01 u can give me your opinion about my new Barcelona 'TRAM'?
15:14:28  <MeusH> back
15:14:34  <Sacro> #tycoon on
15:14:36  <Athorium> hey  MeusH ^^
15:15:04  <Sacro> Hej MeusH
15:15:09  <MeusH> witaj Sacro :)
15:15:12  <MeusH> hey Athorium
15:15:15  <Athorium>
15:15:37  <Athorium> this is my new tried creation ^^
15:15:37  <Wolf01> mmm i think is really short
15:15:37  <MeusH> hello egladil
15:15:46  <Athorium> short?
15:15:50  <Athorium> is a tram, not a train
15:15:58  <egladil> hello
15:16:07  <Wolf01> the cars seem compressed
15:16:24  <Athorium> yeah, look real tram, cars are compressed hahahah
15:16:25  <Wolf01> maybe 2 or 3 px more longer
15:16:43  <Athorium> uhmm on each wagon?
15:16:48  <Wolf01> yeah
15:17:08  <Athorium> and the head/back?
15:17:12  <Wolf01> only wagons, not the heads
15:17:17  <Rubidium> DarkSSH/Darkvater: in the scenario editor the monthly loop for the subsidies is ran, this caused FS#468, where there exists a subsidy for a removed town. What do you think of: i.e. adding a function to remove the subsidies for a town. Removing the subsidies monthly loop would not resolve the issue, as you can load savegames in the scenario editor.
15:17:23  <MeusH> egladil, how's the 32bpp branch?
15:17:31  <MeusH> do you have a IRC channel?
15:18:50  <egladil> progress has been almost nonexistant for a while due to me having friends and school, and being lazy
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15:19:05  <egladil> no irc channel
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15:19:13  <Aracirion> hi
15:19:31  <Aracirion> -h-i-
15:19:32  <Athorium> ok Wolf01 I try it now
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15:20:08  <egladil> i was planning on getting back to work on now during the winter break from school
15:20:33  <MeusH> egladil, are you the only one coding 32bpp branch?
15:21:33  <egladil> unfortunately yeah
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15:22:12  <egladil> which means when i can't code for some reason progress drops to zero
15:23:23  <DarkSSH> Rubidium: does the same happen with industries?
15:23:39  <DarkSSH> +s
15:23:50  <Rubidium> no, as the same thing is already done for industries
15:24:10  <DarkSSH> well, yeah, that's what I meant :)
15:24:41  <Rubidium> it is basically a copy of the industry function with a few other cases in the for loop
15:24:42  <MeusH> egladil: I'm not that skilled but I have a will to help :)
15:25:12  <egladil> :)
15:25:25  <DarkSSH> looks good
15:26:03  <MeusH> egladil, are 32bpp pngs packed into a grf and then loaded like other sprites?
15:26:23  <egladil> currently they are packed in a tar file
15:28:02  <MeusH> how about their specifications?
15:28:08  <MeusH> are they in .nfo?
15:28:12  <MeusH> or some other format?
15:28:17  <CIA-1> rubidium * r7563 /trunk/ (economy.c economy.h town_cmd.c): -Fix (FS#468): removing towns in the scenario editor could leave subsidies with that town as source/destination, resulting in an assertion when displaying the Subsidies Window.
15:29:28  <Athorium> Wolf01 did it, I enlarged 3px each wagon
15:30:00  <egladil> MeusH: the specification is something similar to nfo
15:30:25  <MeusH> is it a human-readable format? ;)
15:30:48  <egladil> the intention is that it should be when it's done :)
15:30:50  <MeusH> I mean, with more letters than usual nfo?
15:30:53  <MeusH> okies
15:31:09  <MeusH> what's left to be done?
15:31:25  <Wolf01> mmmm how i can create an online repository on my site?
15:31:53  <egladil> a lot of search and replace of the sprite drawing calls
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15:32:02  <egladil> and adding new zoom levels
15:32:03  <Athorium> Wolf01 look now
15:32:06  <MeusH> what do you mean Wolf01?
15:32:34  <Wolf01> i have some custom builds on my disk, which take a lot of space
15:32:40  <MeusH> egladil: what's with sprite drawing calls? What do you need to replace?
15:33:02  <Rubidium> 12:31 <@Darkvater> it is then inconsistent with the patches setting which is limited to 1920-2050 or something <- that is a lie :) They are both limited to (MIN|MAX)_YEAR.
15:33:17  <Wolf01> so i wanted to put all in my server and then use the tortoise to update them like i do for the trunk
15:33:19  <MeusH> and you want to put all the files online and have a file list as index page?
15:33:36  <MeusH> this would be like svn or cvs
15:33:48  <MeusH> I don't know but try looking for info on setting up svn server
15:33:52  <DarkSSH> he
15:34:14  <MeusH> and of course your server must be able to have svn protocol enabled
15:34:17  <Wolf01> Athorium, is better now
15:34:23  <Athorium> ^^
15:34:34  <Athorium> now I continue making the Renfe 450 double decker
15:34:34  <egladil> MeusH: they need to tell the draw engine a few things for company colors and such to work in 32bpp mode
15:35:35  <MeusH> so it isn't that hard, it just takes way too much time to find it, analyze and eventually replace?
15:35:59  <egladil> most of all it's quite boring work...
15:36:37  <Athorium> arggg I need one town build no roads!
15:36:52  <MeusH> kill citizens!
15:36:54  <Athorium> fu*** towns...
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15:37:52  <MeusH> so if you need help you can bug me sometime :)
15:37:56  <Athorium> I think that towns would not be able to build on your own roads..
15:38:05  <MeusH> now I'll be going back to tropical stations
15:38:33  <Sacro> Wolf01: you sound like you need an svn server
15:38:39  <Athorium> very nice your tropical stations ^^
15:39:56  <peter1138> good morning
15:40:07  <MeusH> hello peter1138
15:40:11  <DarkSSH> morning'
15:40:16  <Wolf01> hello peter
15:41:15  <MeusH> peter1138, what do you think about merging small.bdf into OpenTTD as this is a very good (and the only one?) small font?
15:41:19  <Athorium> I go to try making a bus
15:41:22  <MeusH> thanks Athorium
15:41:27  <MeusH> have fun :)
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15:42:15  <DarkSSH> MeusH: why, does small.bdf contain all unicode characters?
15:42:50  <peter1138> quite a lot
15:43:00  <MeusH> I'm not sure about all characters, but it contains polish characters. If something contains polish stuff, it certainly contains the other things, too :)
15:43:17  <peter1138> i can't remember what it contains precisely
15:43:40  <Athorium> hehe, I try to make bus of my town, are this:
15:43:46  <peter1138> most of the latin-based characters, and cyrillic
15:43:49  <Athorium> I think, that can be so hard...
15:43:59  <peter1138> hmm, forums slow?
15:44:08  <MeusH> no, I don't think so
15:44:20  <MeusH> Athorium, have fun. These are nice busses, we've got many similiar busses
15:44:35  <Athorium> I go to try it... hahah
15:45:02  <MeusH> peter1138, if just a font name is given, does OpenTTD search for fonts also in its data folder, or only in windows\fonts\?
15:45:18  <Athorium> uhmm
15:45:30  <Athorium>  MeusH buses have same dimensions that trains?
15:45:55  <MeusH> no, trains are more tight and tall
15:46:09  <Athorium> what "base" dimensions have the buses?
15:46:22  <peter1138> MeusH: it tries opening the font name as a file first, then it looks using the system font method
15:46:39  <peter1138> so if you put "Arial" and had a file called "Arial" in the current directory, it would try using that
15:46:53  <peter1138> (and if it's not a font file should ignore it, but who knows)
15:47:02  <peter1138> "The server at is taking too long to respond."
15:47:03  <peter1138> o_O
15:47:17  <Athorium> forums go slow
15:47:24  <glx> works here
15:47:31  <Wolf01> oh so is not my connection
15:47:48  <DarkSSH> like a snail here :/
15:47:52  <peter1138> "as i was disgusted about miniin discontinuation"
15:47:53  <peter1138> heh
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15:48:26  <MeusH> peter1138, seems it wouldn't be a problem to add small.bdf and make it a default font in openttd.cfg. This is just my suggestion, but I'm afraid >95% of players won't find a font that looks good in OpenTTD in small size
15:50:01  <MeusH> Athorium, try
15:50:28  <MeusH> there you have a typical city bus and articulated bus sizes, I think
15:50:39  <MeusH> I hope they do have english version
15:50:41  <MeusH> !stats
15:50:42  <_42_> MeusH:
15:50:56  <Athorium> yeah, lol the yellow bus is very similar, include we have the same model.
15:51:12  <Athorium> Solaris Urbino III, I try to make this ^^
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15:55:44  <Athorium> how can i add 2cc in my creation?
15:57:11  <Born_Acorn> Thats done by code
15:57:34  <peter1138> only a tiny bit of code. most of it's in the graphic ;p
15:57:48  <Born_Acorn> peter1138, but it still needs code!
15:57:55  <Born_Acorn> Or it'll just be two normal colours! :p
15:58:02  <peter1138> no!
15:58:11  <peter1138> it'll be company colour and the rest'll stay green :D
15:58:23  <peter1138> Athorium:
15:58:59  <Athorium> o_O
15:59:18  <Athorium> my palette is different... :S
16:00:09  <Born_Acorn> Thats split up to make it easier to describe
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16:00:26  <Athorium> yeah but... I don't know if my palette have the 2cc :S
16:00:45  <peter1138> Darkvater: did you get a chance to look at that diff?
16:00:50  <peter1138> Athorium: are you using the DOS palette then?
16:01:01  <peter1138> (although that bit should be a same, iirc)
16:01:02  <Athorium> I using Purno's tutorial palette
16:02:06  <DarkSSH> which one?
16:02:09  <glx> MeusH: tahoma bold in size 7 is not too bad for me
16:02:12  <DarkSSH> sprite-limit?
16:02:31  <peter1138> yeah
16:02:35  <DarkSSH> well if you paste it again I'll have a look. Went straight to bed yesterday
16:02:37  <Athorium> I don't know... wait
16:02:54  <peter1138> out of idly curiosity, not any impending stuff
16:03:01  <peter1138>
16:03:03  <Athorium>
16:03:07  <Athorium> this palette I using
16:04:45  <Athorium> lol, I tried to stop a train in a roadcross and game crashed :S
16:05:21  <Wolf01> there is nothing to laugh, poor game :(
16:05:32  <MeusH> glx: does 's and ,s overlap onto higher/lower lines, for example on minimap legend?
16:05:44  <DarkSSH> peter1138: what does sprite-image contain now? Just flags about SPRITE_MODIFIER_USE_OFFSET and PALETTE_MODIFIER_COLOR ?
16:05:47  <Athorium> is only my game, or is a OpenTTD problem? :S
16:05:56  <MeusH> small.bdf is allright, but there's too small spacing and 's and ,s blend with other letters
16:06:08  <Wolf01> mmm i never tried
16:06:16  <peter1138> MeusH: you try doing better with a 3x5 pixel font
16:06:24  <Born_Acorn> You do have the 2cc green... it's just the normal green
16:06:58  <Wolf01> no, it doesn't crashes
16:07:01  <peter1138> DarkSSH: just three bits, and two of them are dealt with before drawing
16:07:03  <DarkSSH> peter1138: I wonder though for example DrawGroundSprite(image, image & PALETTE_MODIFIER_COLOR ? palette : PAL_NONE); image still contains the palette-bit, why not pass palette unconditionally and figure out whether to use it or not inside the function?
16:07:04  <MeusH> peter1138, but it can be only opaque(black)/transparent, with no grays?
16:07:20  <Athorium> allright
16:07:32  <peter1138> DarkSSH: lots of places there is a palette but no PALETTE_MODIFIER_COLOR
16:07:43  <peter1138> hmm
16:07:52  <peter1138> probably some things are wrong, somewhere
16:08:02  <peter1138> MeusH: correct
16:08:32  <peter1138> MeusH: what we need is that fully scalable gui with larger fonts :)
16:08:40  <MeusH> oh yes :)
16:09:24  <DarkSSH> MeusH: go write it
16:09:44  <DarkSSH> peter1138: if there's no palette modifier, than image won't have that bit set
16:10:23  <MeusH> DarkSSH: I'll do a small test and see what can I do
16:10:27  <DarkSSH> lol
16:10:43  <MeusH> I'm worried, however, about MiHaMiX's absence
16:10:47  <DarkSSH> but if most of the time it's done seperately that's probably better
16:10:59  <peter1138> for example, when drawing vehicles
16:11:03  <peter1138> they don't have that bit set
16:11:07  <peter1138> but they should be coloured...
16:11:18  <peter1138> it definitely needs fine trawling
16:11:25  <peter1138> and it's probably too massive anyway
16:11:29  <peter1138> although some bits could go in
16:11:32  <peter1138> int -> SpriteID etc
16:11:40  <Wolf01> eeeeeeek i miss diagonal railcrossings :(
16:12:17  <DarkSSH> yeah
16:12:18  <peter1138> Wolf01: if the original patch has been kept up to date, you never know...
16:12:32  <peter1138> miniin stopping is funny, though
16:13:01  <Wolf01> and i miss transparency options too... add it add it!
16:13:51  <DarkSSH> that diff really is big
16:14:17  <peter1138> very
16:14:21  <DarkSSH> some things do look a bit strange
16:14:21  <DarkSSH> like
16:14:33  <DarkSSH> -			if (_display_opt & DO_TRANS_BUILDINGS) MAKE_TRANSPARENT(image);
16:14:33  <DarkSSH> +			if (_display_opt & DO_TRANS_BUILDINGS) {
16:14:33  <DarkSSH> +				image |= PALETTE_MODIFIER_TRANSPARENT;
16:14:33  <DarkSSH> +				pal = PALETTE_TO_TRANSPARENT;
16:14:33  <DarkSSH> +			} else {
16:14:35  <DarkSSH> +				pal = psid->pal;
16:14:46  <DarkSSH> but that's what you get for splitting them I guess
16:14:46  <peter1138> shit happens when you're stuck at home with no internet connection ;p
16:15:04  <DarkSSH> should probably functionize it
16:15:13  <peter1138> p'raps
16:15:28  <peter1138> problem is PALETTE_TO_TRANSPARENT on its own isn't enough
16:15:41  <DarkSSH> ye, you need pal set as wel
16:15:41  <DarkSSH> l
16:15:43  <peter1138> otoh, it's possible to be transparent with other palettes (afaik)
16:15:56  <peter1138> (like MB's glass station, which uses a green transparent effect)
16:16:30  <DarkSSH> what's OFFSET_BIT?
16:16:37  <peter1138> newgrf related
16:17:08  <peter1138> means... something
16:17:12  <DarkSSH> lol
16:17:14  <peter1138> i can't remember what exactly
16:17:40  <peter1138> something to do with railtypes
16:17:47  <DarkSSH> excuse me for not looking through the tables ;p
16:17:57  <peter1138> i wouldn't bother
16:18:00  <peter1138> very long
16:18:25  <peter1138> that does remind me though
16:18:42  <peter1138> in the bridge tables there is extra data after the sprites, in some of the tables, but not all of them
16:18:57  <peter1138> so i can't see how the extra data is used safely, if at all
16:19:12  <DarkSSH> newgrf bridge tables or internal?
16:19:15  <peter1138> internal
16:19:26  <peter1138> they should contain 32 values
16:19:46  <peter1138> some have a few more, but they're not sprite ids
16:20:07  *** Tobin [] has quit [Quit: Tobin]
16:20:18  <DarkSSH> where is that?
16:21:40  <peter1138> bridge_land.h
16:21:44  <peter1138> seems to be pillar related
16:22:38  <DarkSSH> well the newgrf spec does have magic for bridge pillars
16:22:44  <DarkSSH> as did Oskar's bridge
16:22:51  <peter1138> not in the tables
16:23:01  <peter1138> that's only a bit in a flag
16:23:19  <peter1138> the weird thing is the length
16:23:23  <peter1138> they're not all the same
16:23:34  <peter1138> _bridge_sprite_table_5_2 is 33 entries
16:23:46  <peter1138> _bridge_sprite_table_5_4 is 37
16:28:33  <DarkSSH> well it is the pillars
16:29:00  <DarkSSH> cause you have back/floor, front and pillars
16:29:10  <DarkSSH> and pillars can differ depending if the bridge has pillars or not
16:29:58  <hylje> pylons
16:30:20  <DarkSSH> I think though all tables should have the same size, it only got 'optimized' away for some reason as ingame logics dont' make use of it anyways
16:30:50  * DarkSSH ponders committing DEBUG rewrite
16:33:33  *** DarkSSH [] has quit [Quit: leaving]
16:33:45  <peter1138> or not?
16:34:21  <Darkvater> no, still am
16:34:58  <Wolf01>
16:34:58  <Wolf01> daylength+transparency options+semaphores date, who wants to try?
16:35:09  <Wolf01> (i also have separate patches)
16:35:19  <peter1138> Wolf01: your semaphore patch is too primitive, iirc
16:35:30  <Wolf01> but works, and well
16:35:42  <peter1138> it's fine for placing signals, but changes the behaviour of changing signal type
16:35:51  <Athorium> Wolf01 what add this .diff?
16:35:53  <peter1138> because that also depends on the ctrl key
16:36:09  <Wolf01> uhm
16:36:19  <Athorium> not exist any .diff that increases the sprite limit?
16:36:27  <Athorium> or anything
16:36:29  <Darkvater> ttdp specs clearly say each bridge has the same size
16:36:44  <peter1138> they do in newgrf, yeah
16:37:11  <Darkvater> I think our internal ones, just left them off for size-reasons ;p
16:37:37  <Athorium> but now the limit is too low... I can't add trainset + 4LV set...
16:37:56  <Darkvater> semaphore-before year would make sense if it did sem before year, and signal after; CTRL+ would always flip and with patch off it's always signals
16:38:20  <Darkvater> hmm or is that what you did?
16:38:38  <Wolf01> is what i did
16:38:44  <peter1138> Darkvater: yeah, but changing signal direction / pre-signal type is also controlled by CTRL
16:38:59  <peter1138> so it needs to be done differently
16:39:19  <Darkvater> however, once a signal exists, its type cannot change
16:40:59  <Wolf01> but why? it only should change the sprite... in miniIN worked
16:41:02  <MeusH> peter1138, that's known issue that doesn't concern Wolf01's patch I think
16:41:15  <MeusH> and changing direction doesn't require CTRL
16:42:05  <Wolf01> meush, switching the signals with semaphores also switched the direction with presignal
16:42:06  <peter1138> . . .
16:42:25  <MeusH> o_O
16:42:31  <peter1138> yes
16:42:33  <Wolf01> DoCommandP(tile, i + ((_ctrl_pressed ^ (_cur_year < _patches.semaphores_date)) ? 8 : 0),
16:42:36  <peter1138> at least Wolf01 understands me :)
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16:43:15  <MeusH> Wolf01, you mean that ctrl+clicking a semaphore change some direction?
16:43:21  <Wolf01> yeah
16:43:44  <peter1138> MeusH: with that patch, ctrl-clicking before the cut-off date does the opposite action to after the cut-off date
16:43:59  <MeusH> and... that's good, isn't it?
16:44:13  * Wolf01 hides
16:44:16  <MeusH> no
16:44:17  <MeusH> allright
16:44:19  <MeusH> I get you
16:44:25  <MeusH> it's wrong
16:44:31  * MeusH hides, too
16:44:39  * MeusH hides more than Wolf01
16:44:51  * Sacro wants semaphores before a set year
16:45:03  <Wolf01> fix my patch then!
16:46:36  <Tuzlo> made a random map towns are no more than 400 pl ni each one, how do you make a profit on transporting the little amount of passengers you do get?
16:47:04  <Wolf01> 2 buses per route until cities grow up
16:47:18  <peter1138> Wolf01: fwiw, i hit that problem when i tried it ;)
16:47:29  <peter1138> didn't bother investigating further
16:47:47  <Tuzlo> they dont seem to be growing at all
16:47:56  <Gonozal_VIII> they do
16:48:17  *** MVV [~a@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:49:12  <Tuzlo> takes a long time
16:49:14  <glx> Tuzlo: which climate?
16:49:26  <Gonozal_VIII> the bigger they get the faster they grow... and they always build exactly where you wanted to build something all the time ;-)
16:49:49  <Tuzlo> haha
16:50:06  <Tuzlo> yeah, and if you buy the land before its built upon, it costs you in maintenance
16:51:04  <Gonozal_VIII> or your rating goes down and they won't allow you to build a station until you cover the whole area in trees
16:51:13  <Wolf01> mmm i still can't figure out why the transparency options patch do this
16:51:54  <peter1138> 11 or ll?
16:51:56  <peter1138> hmm
16:51:58  <peter1138> stupid font :/
16:52:13  <peter1138> 11, heh
16:52:15  <glx> 11 as the number
16:52:19  <Wolf01> eleven
16:52:20  <Sacro> eleven
16:52:49  <hylje> eleven
16:52:55  <Gonozal_VIII> eleven
16:52:58  <Athorium> one question. In the color palette on ttdpatch wiki, show some special colors used for example: Red cycle, fire, block cycles, water cycles, etc... I can use those colors normally for my graphics?
16:52:58  <MeusH> eleven
16:53:05  <peter1138> no
16:53:06  <MeusH> Athorium, you broke it :(
16:53:15  <Wolf01> the line is correct
16:53:19  <Athorium> what?
16:53:22  <MeusH> ohh that's eleven errors in one line!
16:53:31  <peter1138> Athorium: they're used for palette animations
16:53:39  <peter1138> Athorium: so you can use them, if you want those animations
16:53:50  <peter1138> (most likely you don't)
16:53:53  <MeusH> what are block cycles used besides cola in toyland?
16:53:58  <MeusH> where*
16:54:02  <Athorium> uhmm... shit
16:54:10  <MeusH> and besides shit? :D
16:54:17  <Athorium> I think that I need to copy the palette that appears on wiki...
16:54:25  <Gonozal_VIII> you can transport shit in toyland?
16:54:27  <Athorium> because in my palette I don't know what colors are for everything
16:54:34  <Athorium> sure
16:54:34  <Athorium> xDD
16:54:37  <Gonozal_VIII> another reason to never play that^^
16:54:40  <peter1138> heh, magicbuzz is great
16:54:51  <peter1138> "Note: Some patch should be released soon to help getting a more realistic town growing system, as the current is... crapy."
16:54:59  <Athorium> I can use this palette?
16:54:59  <hylje> creepy
16:55:06  <Athorium> for my models?
16:59:37  <Tuzlo> wish the towns would hold onto ppl longer than they do
16:59:53  <Gonozal_VIII> what?
17:00:31  <Tuzlo> the bus stations, dont seem to hold onto all the ppl for long
17:00:40  <hylje> the population growth should be simulated better
17:00:56  <Gonozal_VIII> ah... that's with everything you transport
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17:01:14  <Gonozal_VIII> you should visit the station more frequent
17:01:22  <Tuzlo> no, I just watched the population of the bus station decrease before a bus got there
17:01:48  <Tuzlo> Can only visit  so often, no profit in goin more often really
17:02:00  <Tuzlo> towns population is too small atm
17:02:04  <hylje> you have to keep a fine rating
17:02:17  <Gonozal_VIII> they leave after a while when there is no vehicle
17:02:22  <Tuzlo> yeah
17:03:01  <Tuzlo> cant see sending a bus out that holds 31 pass to pick up 3
17:03:10  <peter1138> stations don't have popultion
17:03:19  <peter1138> only people/cargo waiting
17:03:29  <peter1138> keep your ratings above... er.. some percentage
17:03:42  <MeusH> is it between 65 and 75%?
17:03:50  <Tuzlo> thats hard to do
17:04:12  <Tuzlo> but the lowest id 60%
17:04:15  <Gonozal_VIII> and let the buses wait at the station to load
17:04:21  <Tuzlo> full load?
17:04:23  <MeusH> and why, oh why, it isn't good to have higher rating? Let's say around 80-90%?
17:04:41  <hylje> because you're overtransporting
17:04:43  <Tuzlo> no, im just sayin it's hard to get there
17:04:56  <Gonozal_VIII> full load and set max waiting time in the station options...
17:05:06  <Tuzlo> why max waiting time?
17:05:10  *** ufoun [~opera@] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
17:05:24  <Gonozal_VIII> or leave when another one arrives...
17:05:51  <Tuzlo> Gonozal_VIII: doesnt that get a little hard to control with a lot of towns?
17:05:56  <Tuzlo> or is there a setting?
17:06:09  *** ufoun [~opera@] has joined #openttd
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17:06:47  <Gonozal_VIII> you won't need it anymore when the towns get a bit bigger, it's just for the start
17:08:25  <Gonozal_VIII> otherwise it could happen that all busses wait at the same station and the rating of the other station goes down and passengers leave
17:11:12  *** _MVV_ [~a@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:11:18  <SpComb> Logs:
17:11:18  <Bjarni> !logs
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17:13:36  <Tuzlo> do advertising campaign's really work?
17:14:09  <Gonozal_VIII> statues do work
17:14:34  <Gonozal_VIII> increase rating by 10% iirc
17:15:00  <Bjarni> Tuzlo: yeah, but they could be more effective. It cost a fortune to be allowed to build when you aren't allowed
17:15:20  <Gonozal_VIII> that's what trees are for :-)
17:15:31  <Bjarni> yeah
17:15:45  <Bjarni> trees are the cheapest way to increase rating
17:16:06  <Tuzlo> trees
17:16:08  <Tuzlo> really
17:16:24  <Gonozal_VIII> i think statues increase the station ratings
17:16:32  <Bjarni> go figure. People wants to use your busses more if you plant trees than if you spend the same amount of money on commercials
17:16:42  *** MVVMVV [~a@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:16:47  <Tuzlo> haha
17:16:57  <Tuzlo> my problems town size atm, not popularity
17:17:21  <Gonozal_VIII> but if you remove all the trees around the town and rebuild half of them, your rating is better than before^^
17:18:11  <MeusH> Bjarni: really? I thought that trees affect only local authority, not only rating on surrounding stations
17:18:59  <Bjarni> trees affect local authority and thought that the rating, right?
17:19:00  <Tuzlo> heh, only one town wants to increase in size, opther 2 dont
17:19:06  <Bjarni> or do I recall incorrectly?
17:21:36  <Gonozal_VIII> the station rating calculation is not very good in my opinion...
17:21:44  <Wolf01> what is the probability of some miniIN patches being merged into trunk now that there is 0.5.0?
17:21:48  <Bjarni> it sucks big time
17:22:00  <Gonozal_VIII> it's impossible to reach 100%
17:22:39  <Bjarni> Wolf01: well, 0.5.0 or no 0.5.0, I got no time to read diff files for the next month or so
17:22:42  <Bjarni> or more
17:22:52  <CIA-1> Darkvater * r7564 /trunk/newgrf.c:
17:22:52  <CIA-1> -Codechange: Some newgrf changes. FFIR/EVAW endian-swapping, functionalize
17:22:52  <CIA-1>  check_length, don't print copyright message for grfinfo (it is shown in newgrf
17:22:52  <CIA-1>  window), have action 0x0B print out the messages with severity 0.
17:23:08  <Gonozal_VIII> things like age of the last vehicle... a 3 year old train counts as ancient... not very good
17:23:29  <peter1138> Darkvater: multiple changes in one commit? tut tut ;)
17:23:51  <Darkvater> i'ts cistmjlsakdfjas
17:23:51  <Darkvater> dfkj
17:24:03  <peter1138> :D
17:24:15  <Bjarni> did you guys notice what happened last night?
17:24:38  <Bjarni> people started to talk about politics and after that some guy showed up and started to quote the Koran
17:24:45  <Bjarni> it was indeed an unusual night
17:24:55  <Darkvater> fucking tortoisesvn
17:25:07  <Darkvater> it keeps stealing my focus everytime it starts applying a patch
17:25:37  <Darkvater> peter1138: eh yeah; it's christmas ;)
17:36:02  <Darkvater> pomopom
17:36:12  <Tuzlo> random games dont have subsidized routes?
17:36:23  <CIA-1> Darkvater * r7565 /trunk/ (63 files in 5 dirs):
17:36:23  <CIA-1> -Codechange: Rework DEBUG functionality. Look for appropiate debugging levels to
17:36:23  <CIA-1>  use in debug.h. grfmsg() is now used as a specific debug-function for grf.
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17:38:10  <MeusH> Bjarni: we've got to repeat this
17:38:19  <MeusH> MVV is here, but Muhamad is still missing
17:38:25  <MeusH> !seen Muhamad
17:38:26  <_42_> MeusH, I don't remember seeing Muhamad.
17:38:30  <Born_Acorn> hmm
17:38:31  <MeusH> !seen Muhammad
17:38:32  <_42_> MeusH, I found 6 matches to your query. These are the 5 most recent ones: Aracirion, Eye-Jack, TLE-Nutter, Idiot, MHMD_praying. Aracirion ( was last seen parting #openttd 2 hours 18 minutes ago (26.12. 15:20), after spending 58 seconds there.
17:38:39  <Born_Acorn> I'm missing several SVN Digests! D:
17:38:42  <MeusH> cheater!
17:39:05  <Athorium> wow, I looking one screen that have day/night cycles and train have lights... Is for OpenTTD?
17:40:02  <peter1138> probably a mock up ;p
17:40:13  <peter1138> or the night conversion, which is night time only
17:40:54  <MVV> MeusH i don't heve time for debates now :)
17:41:09  <MeusH> okay :)
17:41:59  <Athorium> mock up = fake?
17:42:58  *** Purno [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:43:32  <hylje> not playable in this case
17:43:44  <Athorium> wow this mock up, can be a real add?
17:43:59  <peter1138> unlikely
17:44:00  <peter1138> very unlikely
17:44:17  <hylje> we need to load ottd graphics to gpu to allow for that kind of stuff
17:44:21  <Athorium> but, realist
17:45:05  <Athorium> wow  MeusH your mock up about train collision with truck is incredible
17:45:21  <MeusH> thanks :)
17:45:22  <peter1138>
17:45:36  <MeusH> well, it may be possible in OpenTTD... in three years maybye? :)
17:45:42  <peter1138> i.e. nothing at all like 'realistic'
17:45:47  <peter1138> which is what you probably meant
17:46:40  <Athorium> peter1138 sorry, i no speak very nice english
17:46:42  <Athorium> ^^
17:47:28  <Tuzlo> whatas that about crashes MeusH?
17:48:09  <MeusH> yeah, when graphics get moved to GPU, OpenTTD goes 32bpp and we have particles
17:48:22  <MeusH> the most difficult thing would be lighting
17:48:28  <MeusH> and casting shadows
17:48:30  <Athorium> hmm
17:48:37  <Athorium> but, when OpenTTD go to 32bpp?
17:48:57  <MeusH> who knows?
17:49:21  <MeusH> I'm wondering when will someone say "when it's done"
17:49:21  <Athorium> this is the question ^^
17:49:21  <Rubidium> MeusH: you should not forget cross-platform compatability, that ain't easy either
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17:49:34  <Athorium> uhmmm
17:49:54  <Athorium> is possible to make in railroads... uhmm I don't know how it say in english...
17:49:59  <MeusH> yeah, probably PocketPCs and other minor platforms will suffer
17:50:23  <hylje> maybe separate the logic of ottd and the presentation? :P
17:50:49  <Rubidium> so will I, as I'm not going to install binary drivers 'just' to have OpenGL support
17:51:27  <MeusH> who said there's going to be some OpenGL?
17:51:44  <Rubidium> well, what is the other solution?
17:51:46  <MeusH> we can handle it just like today's effects
17:51:46  <hylje> directx? yay
17:51:59  <peter1138> i somehow doubt that we'll ever offload anything to a GPU
17:52:03  <MeusH> well, smoke puffs won't be vehicles but effects, they will change size and loose transparency
17:52:22  <Rubidium> MeusH: you cannot offload to GPU without OpenGL
17:52:34  <Rubidium> (or maybe DirectX under Windows)
17:52:44  <peter1138> well, 2D acceleration exists, or used to
17:52:50  <MeusH> okay, I didn't know that, excuse me then
17:52:56  <peter1138> accelerated blitting 'n the like
17:53:01  <MeusH> anyway, Doom2 has nice effects
17:53:05  <MeusH> done with sprites
17:53:06  <stillunknown> you mean Xrender stuff?
17:53:07  <Athorium> argg I don't know how it says in english...
17:53:30  <Rubidium> Athorium: what about fetching a dictionary?
17:53:43  <Athorium> spanish-english?
17:53:52  <Athorium> in spanish I don't know the exactly name
17:54:05  <Athorium> I trying to find a screen o photo
17:54:31  <Rubidium> oh, so you do not know the word in any language
17:55:17  <Athorium> nop
17:55:36  <Athorium> or yes, wait
17:55:51  <peter1138> MeusH: not really
17:56:00  <peter1138> MeusH: only comparable to our train smoke...
17:56:24  <MeusH> it would be nicer anyway
17:56:32  <MeusH> it would be possible to create more sophisticated effects
17:56:36  <MeusH> for more things
17:56:56  *** Wolf01 is now known as Wolf01|AWAY
17:58:08  <stillunknown> have variable running costs ever been considered
17:58:30  <Athorium> this is exact the thing i would say
17:58:36  <peter1138> MeusH: with what?
17:58:40  <Tuzlo> when making signals, I made a circle (basically with 2 stations)which set of signals do you want to use to run multiple trains on the tracks (in a circle)
17:58:40  <peter1138> with the doom2 engine? (lol)
17:58:41  <Athorium> the rail unions..
17:58:47  <Athorium> turnouts?
17:58:53  <MeusH> hmm with scripts?
17:59:28  <peter1138> ah
17:59:31  <peter1138> so you want a scripting engine?
17:59:39  <peter1138> which is really nothing at all to do with a graphics engine
17:59:43  <MeusH> we already have inis implemented
18:00:16  <Athorium> uhmm... is possible to increase the TTD scale and make a more detailed vehicles?
18:00:46  <Bjarni> yeah
18:00:47  <MeusH> only ctrl+D in windows/windowed mode/dunno
18:00:55  <Bjarni> but it would take a while to code
18:01:03  <MeusH> but gui doesn't like ctrl+d
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18:06:40  <Tuzlo> can anyone gimme hints on how to make siganls on a track directional
18:06:58  <Rubidium> click multiple times
18:08:10  <mattt_> lol
18:08:30  <mattt_> diesel trains annihilate trucks, eh?
18:08:39  <Tuzlo> yeah, that helps, pwonder what each one is
18:10:53  *** GoneWacko [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
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18:17:21  <Rubidium> Tuzlo: read the wiki for that
18:24:28  <Tuzlo> Rubidium: I am, it confuses me easily
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18:24:43  <DarkSSHClone> hm
18:24:46  *** DarkSSHClone [] has quit []
18:24:54  <hylje> evil clones
18:25:21  <Darkvater> ah phew
18:25:27  <Darkvater> I backgrounded irssi ;p
18:27:44  <CIA-1> rubidium * r7566 /trunk/network_server.c:
18:27:44  <CIA-1> -Fix: only send commands to the new client from the map, that is going to be
18:27:44  <CIA-1> transfered to the new client, is saved on the server and not while waiting for
18:27:44  <CIA-1> the 'map download slot' as that will add commands for already passed frames in
18:27:44  <CIA-1> the command queue of the new client.
18:27:48  <guru3> gott hate that ctrl z
18:28:13  <Darkvater> Rubidium: that commit log makes no sense ;p
18:28:30  <Darkvater> message
18:29:36  <Rubidium> hmm, now I see
18:31:23  <Rubidium> what about: "only send commands from the moment the map, that is going to be transfered to the new client, is saved on the server ..."
18:31:43  <Born_Acorn> I seem to be missing a tonne of SVN Digests, so, did the Bridge branch get merged yet, or hasn't it occurred yet?
18:32:12  <glx> not done yet
18:32:25  <Born_Acorn> aww.
18:32:47  <Rubidium> Darkvater: that commit fixes the bug qball came with earlier today
18:32:53  <Born_Acorn> <-- I was bored. :p
18:33:49  <guru3> snazzy
18:33:53  <guru3> so what am i looking at?
18:34:01  <Born_Acorn> Buffers.
18:34:15  <guru3> ohhh i see
18:34:17  <guru3> nice
18:34:19  <peter1138> Born_Acorn: it's no longer generic!
18:34:31  <Born_Acorn> What isn't? D:
18:34:47  <peter1138> Darkvater: gonna say, i thought it was a bjarni commit for a moment...
18:34:52  <peter1138> the buffer!
18:35:11  <Born_Acorn> Relax, exists for that
18:35:11  <Born_Acorn> Lo
18:35:14  <Born_Acorn> *:p
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18:37:18  <Rubidium> anyway, what are the current outstanding bugs that need to be fixed for a 0.5.0(-rc2)? Only one I can think of is the issue with duplicates due to newgrf_static.
18:37:20  <izhirahider> Born_Acorn, do you know if I can find that roadset where cars are supposed to drive on the right?
18:37:37  <Born_Acorn> izhirahider, the sprites are awaiting to be coded. :p
18:38:23  <Born_Acorn> So not yet.
18:38:28  <Born_Acorn> But soon, hopefullt
18:38:31  <izhirahider> Born_Acorn, could you point me to a good tutorial on that?
18:38:31  <Born_Acorn> *hopefully
18:39:18  <Born_Acorn> is practically everything about NFO coding.
18:41:09  <izhirahider> thank you
18:44:55  <Bjarni> <peter1138>	Darkvater: gonna say, i thought it was a bjarni commit for a moment... <--- o_O
18:45:08  <Bjarni> I'm too busy doing real life stuff to commit
18:45:28  <Bjarni> get used to it. It will be like that for at least a month
18:46:43  <peter1138> ah we're safe for a while then
18:47:07  <mikk36> hey :)
18:47:30  <mikk36> who here had a nice nifty program to automatically set priority of a process ?
18:47:31  <mikk36> in win
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19:06:59  <Athorium> someone can help me with the TortoiseSVN?
19:07:10  <MeusH> mikk36, ctrl+alt+del
19:07:20  <MeusH> you can right-click on processes and give priority
19:07:23  <mikk36> MeusH
19:07:25  <MeusH> Athorium, what's wrong?
19:07:27  <mikk36> this is temporarily
19:07:35  <Athorium> in PM or here?
19:07:37  <mikk36> but i want it to be set every time the process runs
19:07:44  <MeusH> oh, I don't know the other way around
19:07:50  <MeusH> Athorium, who cares? here :)
19:07:52  <FlashFF> mikk36
19:07:54  <mikk36> someone here had the lil' prog
19:07:57  <Athorium> ok well
19:07:57  <FlashFF> which windows version?
19:08:02  <mikk36> xp
19:08:03  <FlashFF> ok
19:08:09  <FlashFF> say u wanted to run notepad in high
19:08:12  <Athorium> I trying to install a .diff
19:08:22  <FlashFF> you'd type     start/wait/high notepad.exe
19:08:31  <mikk36> i know that
19:08:34  <FlashFF> so set a shortcut to that
19:08:43  <mikk36> but i need it to be set for a service-started process
19:08:55  <Athorium> for example, now patching english.txt, when I see the files, the "new" have one line that my english.txt no are
19:09:05  <Athorium> how can I add it to my english.txt?
19:09:38  <FlashFF> hmmmm
19:10:04  <FlashFF> dunno then.  the parent process would need to know to set it.
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19:13:47  <peter1138> bye
19:14:02  <MeusH> bye
19:14:21  <MeusH> what do you mean?
19:14:26  <MeusH> you want to update your file?
19:14:34  <MeusH> so you have the freshest revision?
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19:15:46  <Athorium> uhmmmm
19:15:48  <Athorium> i'm not sure
19:16:01  <Athorium> my version is old, because I using Quark's patch
19:16:20  <Athorium> but for example I seen a townbuildnoroads for OpenTTD and I would install it to my OpenTTD
19:16:41  <Athorium> I apply patch but now how can I add it to my file?
19:19:56  <Athorium>  MeusH
19:20:19  <MeusH> right-click on the directory
19:20:23  <MeusH> and click "apply patch"
19:20:48  <Athorium> yes..
19:20:49  <MeusH> by the way it would be better to update to newest revision
19:21:03  <MeusH> and you have a window divided into two colums, don't you?
19:21:32  <Athorium> 2 columns and other in down
19:22:05  <Athorium> Theirs (my file I think), Mine (patch file), Merged (2 files merged I think)
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19:25:57  <MeusH> right-click on a small white window with file names and click "patch all"
19:26:08  <MeusH> sorry for delay I've been away for a moment
19:26:28  <MeusH> when all text labels are grayed, you're finished
19:26:36  <MeusH> you can close this window and compile
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19:27:24  <Athorium> compile?
19:27:25  <Tuzlo> finally I understand directional signals
19:27:38  <Athorium> and if one file have conflicts?
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19:28:47  <MeusH> well, tortoise's tool sucks
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19:29:19  <MeusH> because you can only "put higher than x" "put lower than x" "ignore x" and "ignore y"
19:29:24  *** kdr [] has joined #openttd
19:29:27  <MeusH> sometimes you need to actually merge two lines
19:29:35  <MeusH> do it in your text editor
19:29:53  <Athorium> well, I maked all you say, patched all and closed, and now?
19:30:03  <MeusH> modify one file, then tell tortoise to ignore lines from the other file
19:30:12  <MeusH> $ make
19:31:03  <Athorium> I no understand this
19:32:04  <Athorium> I patched all but I no see the new "feature"
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19:42:45  <Tuzlo> is there any way to get a distance between towns?
19:43:10  <Wolf01> distance_manhattan()
19:43:17  <Wolf01> or something similar
19:43:50  <Athorium> arggg I can't add a feature installing .diff patch! why no appear!!!!
19:44:07  <Wolf01> what feature?
19:44:50  <Athorium> townscanbuildroads
19:45:22  <Wolf01> towns already can build roads
19:45:33  <Athorium> is an option to enable or disable it
19:45:43  <Athorium> same as townsbuildnoroads in TTDP
19:46:03  <Wolf01> yes ok, link me the diff
19:47:31  <Athorium>
19:48:18  <Wolf01> and you can't see the toggle button in configure patches?
19:48:24  <Athorium> exact
19:51:33  <Wolf01> i think is under "construction"
19:52:26  <Wolf01> mmm no, is a really old patch, are you sure you merged it successfully?
19:52:33  <Athorium> I think yes...
19:52:46  <Athorium> I no finded any conflict
19:52:51  <Athorium> and patched all correctly
19:52:58  <glx> and compiled?
19:53:01  <Athorium> if I see files I see the new lines addeds
19:53:04  <Athorium> compiled? :S
19:53:09  <Wolf01> lol
19:53:21  <Athorium> i'm noob!
19:53:23  <Athorium> how I compile?
19:54:28  <Wolf01> ok... you need this:
19:54:59  <Athorium> but, for what needs compile
19:55:00  <Athorium> ?
19:55:45  <Wolf01> since you can't run the sources directly you need to MAKE an executable, by compiling the sources you patched
19:56:02  <Athorium> omg...
19:56:17  <Athorium> what section I need to see?
19:56:50  <Wolf01> mmm what you use to code?
19:57:10  <Athorium> :? I no code... :S
19:57:13  <Athorium> I'm noob!
19:57:35  <Wolf01> i personally use notepad++ and i compile with msys+mingw
19:57:50  <Athorium> what's more easy?
19:57:55  <Wolf01> cygwin is also a good method
19:58:19  <Athorium> but I need to "program" something?
19:59:02  <Athorium> I downloading Cygwin
19:59:39  <Wolf01> follow the instructions, and maybe you can compile it
20:00:25  <Wolf01> i took at least a week to set up in the correct manner the environment
20:00:45  <Athorium> o_O
20:01:01  <Athorium> I install all options in "devel"?
20:01:04  <Athorium> only devel?
20:01:45  <Wolf01>
20:02:14  <Athorium> I looking it
20:02:21  <Athorium> but, bin or source options?
20:04:36  <Wolf01> bin, so you don't need to compile the compiler
20:08:34  <Athorium> installing...
20:09:24  <Athorium> uhmm how can I merge my version with new openTTD version to make a compile? ^^
20:09:53  *** pecisk [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
20:10:03  <Athorium> wordpad and add strings? xDD
20:10:18  <Wolf01> no, tortoiseSVN
20:10:38  <Wolf01> or notepad but no wordpad, it will break anything
20:11:12  <Athorium> uhmmm
20:11:14  <Athorium> ok
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20:42:19  <Athorium> Wolf01
20:42:27  <Wolf01> yes?
20:42:33  <Athorium> I need help to compile
20:42:34  <Athorium> xDD
20:42:46  <Wolf01> mmm
20:43:10  <Athorium> I need a step by step to configure this :S
20:43:42  <Athorium> I installed the program... and now?
20:43:54  <Wolf01> if you read the wiki you should have the environment set successfully
20:44:05  <Athorium> I readed it, but not works
20:44:08  <Athorium> :(
20:44:57  <Wolf01> what errors you get?
20:45:14  <Athorium> I don't know how to compile it
20:45:26  <Athorium> i'm lost in step 9
20:45:48  <Wolf01> ok
20:46:39  <Athorium> I write "svn checkout svn://"
20:46:43  <Athorium> but nothing occurs
20:46:43  <Athorium> :S
20:47:08  <glx> you need svn from
20:47:21  <Athorium> omg...
20:47:34  <Athorium> well, I have my OpenTTD Source code with all installed
20:47:47  <Athorium> how I need to do to cygwin load it
20:48:02  <glx> where is your ottd source?
20:48:29  <Athorium> C:\Archivos de programa\OpenTTD Source Code
20:48:32  <Wolf01> put the source code into the c:/cygwin/home/openttd/folder/ folder
20:49:01  <glx> type cd /c/Archivos\ de\ programa/OpenTTD\ Source\ Code
20:50:01  <Athorium> no such file or directory :S
20:50:09  <Biff> windows sure is easy
20:50:10  <Biff> ;)
20:50:33  <Wolf01> follow me, put the code in an easy directory
20:50:41  <Athorium> ok wait
20:50:47  <Athorium> C:\OpenTTD
20:51:08  <Wolf01> ok
20:51:25  <Wolf01> now write cd /c/openttd
20:51:30  <glx> cd /c/OpenTTD
20:51:45  <Athorium> no such file or directory :S
20:51:51  <Athorium> oh shit
20:51:52  <glx> cygwin cares about case IIRC
20:51:54  <Athorium> wait
20:51:54  <Athorium> wait
20:52:08  <Sacro> cd /cygdrive/c/openttd
20:52:08  <Athorium> i'm on /usr/src
20:52:30  <Athorium> ready
20:52:31  <Athorium> ^^
20:52:33  <Wolf01> yeah, sacro is right
20:52:39  <Athorium> yes, with cygdrive
20:52:40  <Athorium> ;)
20:52:43  <Athorium> and now
20:52:54  <Sacro> Wolf01: yes, im neither stupid nor italian ;)
20:53:23  <FlashFF> hey devvos!
20:53:26  <Athorium> well and now what i need?
20:53:31  <glx> make
20:53:46  <Athorium> wow errors
20:54:51  <Athorium> especialy one /cc/sh: cc: command not found
20:55:00  <Athorium> ops
20:55:08  <Athorium> bin/sh: cc: command not found
20:55:26  <Athorium> expr: expression error
20:55:34  <Athorium> make: cc: command not found
20:55:34  <Athorium> :S
20:55:56  <Wolf01> mmmm
20:56:00  <glx> try gcc --version
20:56:14  <Athorium> bash: gcc: command not found
20:56:17  <FlashFF> cc is the c compiler with gcc and it deffo wont compile without that
20:56:34  <glx> ok gcc is not installed :)
20:56:37  <FlashFF> lol
20:56:38  <Wolf01> you forgot about it
20:56:39  <Athorium> lol
20:56:48  <Athorium> I installed all wiki says... :S
20:56:51  <Wolf01> run again the cygwin installer
20:56:52  <Athorium> I go to reinstall it
20:57:12  <Wolf01> and look for gcc under the devel section
20:57:27  <FlashFF> i think that anyone planning to compile the code should be aware that they'll need a compiler lol
20:58:46  <Wolf01> if you installed the mingw it should have selected automatically the other packets, but there is one which you need to select by hand
20:59:19  <CIA-1> egladil * r7567 /branches/32bpp/ (69 files in 8 dirs): [32bpp] -Sync r7000:7100 from trunk.
21:00:09  <glx> you need gcc-core and gcc-c++ (I don't know how they are called in cygwin)
21:00:58  <Athorium> installing...
21:01:20  <Athorium> now of gcc i have:
21:01:26  <glx> while you're at it don't forget win32api :)
21:01:37  <Athorium> gcc-mingw-core
21:01:50  <Athorium> gcc-mingw-g++
21:02:00  <Athorium> those two I have
21:02:09  <glx> that's ok
21:02:11  <Athorium> oh and
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21:02:22  <Wolf01> you should have all the packets the wiki says
21:02:23  <Athorium> gcc-core , gcc-g++ and gcc
21:02:28  <Athorium> yes
21:03:49  <Wolf01> ok, try gcc --version
21:04:23  <Athorium> command not found
21:04:29  <Athorium> -_-
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21:04:38  <FlashFF> you need binutils
21:04:48  <Athorium> i have it
21:04:56  <FlashFF> and gcc-mingw-core
21:05:00  <Athorium> i have
21:05:03  <FlashFF> and gcc-mingw-g++
21:05:07  <Athorium> I have all files that wiki says
21:05:39  <Athorium> humm in installation
21:05:44  <Athorium> says default text type
21:05:51  <Athorium> unix / binary not?
21:06:36  <Athorium> I need the "source"? or only bin?
21:06:59  <Sacro> bin
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21:07:51  <Athorium> ok, in list appears all selected :(
21:07:58  <Athorium> I try to reinstall it...
21:08:48  <Wolf01> i think you simply forgot something
21:09:00  <Wolf01> maybe to run cygwin
21:09:37  <Wolf01> (you are trying to compile throught the windows "run"?)
21:10:07  <Wolf01> ((i know because the first time i done so))
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21:12:46  <Athorium> what?
21:12:48  <Athorium> what u mean
21:12:52  <FlashFF> i dont think its that wolf
21:13:00  <FlashFF> otherwise it wouldnt say bash:
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21:13:26  <Athorium> bash...
21:13:28  <Wolf01> yes, true
21:13:31  <Athorium> one time appeared bash
21:13:50  <Tuzlo> when you do a multiplayer game you have the listing ofthe servers.... SERVER NAME 2/10 8/8     what do the 2/10 and 8/8 mean?
21:14:13  <FlashFF> 2/10 is the clients/max clients   8/8 is companies/max companies
21:14:19  <Tuzlo> ah
21:14:48  <Athorium> first number 'registered' company, 2 number max companies
21:14:51  <FlashFF> you should go on Riggers Realm!  *hint hint*
21:15:17  <Tuzlo> I dont see it
21:15:19  <Tuzlo> ip?
21:15:28  <Tuzlo> and is it 0.5.0 rc1?
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21:16:05  <FlashFF> no its 0.4.8 :(
21:16:07  <FlashFF> lol
21:16:11  <Tuzlo> nm
21:17:43  <Tuzlo> majority of the damn 0.5.0 servers I cant get a listing on them
21:17:52  <FlashFF> lol
21:17:52  <peter1138> hay guys i'm back!!
21:18:04  <FlashFF> its cos its a filty dev version! lol
21:18:07  <FlashFF> hey pete!
21:18:10  <Rubidium> Darkvater: looks like your debug patch interfered a little on some OSes
21:18:40  <Rubidium> or you didn't transform all cases
21:19:12  <Athorium> wow
21:19:15  <Athorium> I no have gcc-core
21:19:34  <Wolf01> eheh
21:19:44  <FlashFF> lol
21:20:16  <Athorium> I selected it but no installed :S
21:21:03  <FlashFF> lies!
21:21:04  <FlashFF> lol
21:22:06  <Tuzlo> anyone seen any decent premade maps other than the ones in the game>?
21:22:10  <Rubidium> Darkvater: I've got fixes for OSX, but I think the current MorphOS compiler doesn't know macros with '...'.
21:22:44  <glx> hehe variadic macros :)
21:22:45  <peter1138> silly morphos
21:22:52  <MeusH> back
21:22:56  <MeusH> sorry Athorium
21:22:59  <Rubidium> it is a 2.x compiler, so that might be it
21:23:17  <Athorium> hey  MeusH
21:23:18  <Athorium> ^^
21:23:25  <Athorium> I learning how to compile
21:23:26  <MeusH> does it work now?
21:23:26  <Athorium> hahaah
21:23:31  <Athorium> I installing
21:23:36  <Athorium> reinstalling cygwin
21:25:51  <Rubidium> ok, it isn't 2.95 that doesn't support variadic macros (at least my debian 2.95 gcc compiles it without errors)
21:26:44  <Rubidium> tokai: does the latest trunk compile for you?
21:26:59  <Darkvater> Rubidium: gcc has supported variadic macros for ages
21:27:27  <Rubidium> well, the morpos nightlies have failed
21:27:36  <Rubidium> for no apparent reasons (to me)
21:27:45  <Wolf01> mmm i would like to write a bash script which get the nightly from the site and then unzip it in the openttd folder
21:27:47  <Darkvater>  #define debug(format, args...) fprintf (stderr, format, args)
21:27:50  <Rubidium> the OSX nightlies have failed because they were not converted
21:27:51  <Darkvater> we could try this
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21:28:21  <Rubidium> <- that should solve the OSX failure
21:28:28  <Athorium> uhmm
21:28:34  <Athorium> now loading a lot, I think that works
21:28:34  <Athorium> ^^
21:28:59  <Athorium> compiling :D
21:29:13  <Darkvater> Rubidium: QZ_Gameloop is that run for every gameloop?
21:29:28  <Rubidium> I presume it does
21:29:35  <Darkvater> hmm it seems so
21:29:58  <Athorium> noooooooo
21:29:59  <peter1138> hmmz, my savegame segfaults now
21:30:00  <Athorium> errors!!!
21:30:11  <Darkvater> up it to lvl 5 at least
21:30:15  <Rubidium> or, it is the other way around
21:30:22  <Rubidium> QZ_GameLoop calls GameLoop
21:30:22  <Darkvater> why is there a debug there anyways?
21:30:33  <Athorium> Wolf01
21:30:44  <Athorium> errors when he tries to compile yapf... :S
21:31:00  <Wolf01> ok, at least it start
21:31:04  <Darkvater> jezus
21:31:04  <Rubidium> he hasn't installed g++ I guess
21:31:12  <glx> though the same :)
21:31:14  <Darkvater> Rubidium: just remove the debug for QZ_GameLoop there
21:31:21  <Darkvater> it's totally stupid
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21:31:58  <Darkvater> tokai: ping
21:32:05  <Rubidium> you meant the one around line 665?
21:32:05  <Athorium> Wolf01 all goes ok, but now appeared this: yapf/../variables.h:104: error: expected unqualified-id before '<<' token
21:32:14  <Darkvater> yes
21:32:15  *** Gonozal_VIII [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
21:32:17  <Athorium> and some more similar errors
21:32:28  <Rubidium> Athorium: have you installed the win32 api?
21:32:34  <Athorium> :?
21:32:48  <Wolf01> -_-'''
21:32:49  <FlashFF> the package  w32api
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21:32:57  <FlashFF> in libs
21:32:59  <Athorium> I think... yes, wait
21:33:24  <glx> be sure to install all packages listed in wiki
21:33:31  <Athorium> yes
21:33:38  <Athorium> yes I have it
21:34:16  <FlashFF> where did you get your version of the sourcecode?
21:34:17  <glx> cygwin shell was open when you installed packages?
21:34:24  <Athorium> nop
21:34:32  *** Frostregen [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
21:34:36  <FlashFF> using 'svn co svn://'
21:34:36  <KUDr> Athorium: '<<' token in variables.h looks like svn conflict
21:34:50  <Athorium> is possible to be svn problems
21:34:53  <KUDr> look there and paste the line 104
21:34:53  <glx> KUDr is right
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21:35:05  <Athorium> ok wait
21:35:09  <KUDr> no svn problem
21:35:13  <KUDr> user problem
21:35:32  <Athorium> uhmm is marked with !
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21:35:49  <Darkvater> these debug messages for videostart/videostop
21:35:51  <KUDr> yes, do clean checkout
21:35:57  <Darkvater> I don't even know what function they have :s
21:35:59  <glx> Athorium: means conflict
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21:36:46  <Rubidium> probably telling Bjarni that the function entered a specific function, so it warrants him to 'optimize' it?
21:37:09  <Athorium> wow
21:37:11  <peter1138> heh
21:37:15  <Rubidium> or just 'random' development debugging DEBUGs
21:37:16  <Athorium> <<<<<<< .mine
21:37:20  <Athorium> this is the line 104
21:37:20  <Athorium> :S
21:37:23  <Darkvater> donnu... I say remove those
21:37:35  <Darkvater> and make the 'failed..' thingies lvl0
21:37:42  <glx> Athorium: it's a conflict
21:38:01  <Athorium> I have a lot of conflicts... because cygwin "gived" a lot of errors
21:38:06  <Athorium> :(
21:38:09  <Athorium> how can I solve it?
21:38:13  <peter1138> Darkvater: you've b0rked grfmsg
21:38:19  <Darkvater> :O
21:38:20  <Darkvater> I did?
21:38:23  <KUDr> Athorium: do clean checkout
21:38:36  <Wolf01> Athorium, if you have the tortoiseSVN do right click on the folder -> revert and then again right click -> update, if you can't see the options they are in the tortoise submenu
21:38:42  <Darkvater> peter1138: you liked it the last time I showed it
21:39:02  <Born_Acorn> You'e killed peter1138's months of moderate work!
21:39:09  <hylje> :>
21:39:14  <Rubidium> Darkvater: is the diff better?
21:39:16  <peter1138> sorry, not grfmsg
21:39:20  <peter1138> GRFError
21:39:37  *** MVV [~a@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
21:39:37  <peter1138> is buf[4] the same as buf+4?
21:39:42  <Athorium> wait, I reinstall OpenTTD to version 0.5.0
21:39:54  <Darkvater> peter1138: why wouldn't it be?
21:40:00  *** |Jeroen| [] has quit [Quit: Whoopsy]
21:40:01  <Athorium> and try to make a compile up-to-date...
21:40:09  <peter1138> buf[4] == *(buf+4)
21:40:21  <PandaMojo> peter1138: yes (for that last one)
21:40:34  <PandaMojo> a[b] is defined in terms of a+b
21:40:40  <PandaMojo> this means 4[buf] works too <_<
21:40:46  <hylje> what
21:40:48  <hylje> .
21:40:51  <PandaMojo> (or is that a C++ quirk I'm getting confused in too?)
21:40:52  <Darkvater> you take a char* from buf+4
21:41:06  <peter1138> yeah, buf[4] is a char, though
21:41:30  <Darkvater> it's the same. You pick the address offset at 4 from the address of buf
21:41:36  <Darkvater> is something not working?
21:42:00  <Athorium> oh one question, if I find one .diff/.patch very old, I can add to my game? merging with Tortoise?
21:42:16  <peter1138> Darkvater: no, else i wouldn't mention it :)
21:42:22  <Wolf01> yes, but you'll get conflicts
21:42:23  <peter1138> buf[4] gives you the char at buf+4
21:42:53  <glx> Athorium: better update to rev of diff, patch then update to current rev
21:43:06  <PandaMojo> buf[4] == *(buf+4) == 4[buf] == *(4+buf)
21:43:25  <Darkvater> peter1138: which grf is it?
21:43:29  <peter1138> any
21:43:47  <Athorium> but, for example, I have one .diff for r7542, I have OpenTTD 0.5.0 RC1, I can add in to my game or not?
21:43:57  <peter1138> PandaMojo: right
21:44:13  <peter1138> PandaMojo: we had just "buf+4" before :)
21:44:16  <glx> you can but you need to resolve conflicts
21:44:30  <PandaMojo> Ahh, gotchya.
21:44:46  <peter1138> in which case &buf[4] is equivalent
21:44:51  <PandaMojo> Right.
21:44:53  <Athorium> ok
21:45:06  <peter1138> Darkvater: i'd fix it but i've got a ton of other changes in there, heh
21:45:10  <Darkvater> hmm...
21:45:20  <Darkvater> I think I did something..cause it did work
21:45:22  <Darkvater> but now it just crashes
21:46:48  * Darkvater hides in shame
21:46:57  * peter1138 ponders this tractive effort patch
21:47:06  * FlashFF rubs his belly
21:48:14  <Born_Acorn> peter1138, with extra Build Vehicle window bits?
21:48:18  <CIA-1> Darkvater * r7568 /trunk/newgrf.c: -Fix [r7564]: buf+4 is the same as &buf[4], not buf[4] for a char*.
21:48:26  *** Rubidium [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
21:48:29  <FlashFF> Athorium  did your sompile with a new svn checkout
21:48:38  <FlashFF> i just installed cywin and did it all fine
21:48:45  <FlashFF> it didnt run, ut it compiled lol
21:48:47  <Athorium> I downloaded a new OpenTTD, now using 0.5.0 RC1
21:48:56  <peter1138> Born_Acorn: only the extra line
21:49:05  <Born_Acorn> woo
21:49:13  *** Rubidium_ [] has joined #openttd
21:49:23  <peter1138> hmm, BR 195, max te 355kN
21:49:37  <Athorium> well I compiled it
21:49:41  * peter1138 wonders
21:49:58  <Wolf01> yeah
21:50:00  <Darkvater> Rubidium_: that OSX diff is good
21:50:04  <Athorium> but, when I run exe say, cannot open file
21:50:08  <peter1138> i think it should be half that
21:50:11  <Darkvater> Rubidium_: wait
21:50:23  <Darkvater> Rubidium_: in the 'failed with..' put in front what failed
21:50:26  <Wolf01> you need the data files
21:50:37  <peter1138> why does MB tease us so with his 'latest additions' that are not downloadable?
21:50:45  <Darkvater> eg changeres failed with message...
21:50:56  <Wolf01> copy them where the compiler created the executable
21:51:03  <qball> qball@NotToTrust:~/Games/openttd-0.5.0-RC1$ ./openttd
21:51:03  <qball> Segmentation fault (core dumped)
21:51:05  <qball> cool
21:51:05  <Darkvater> peter1138: I know; he is soo evil. Website is full of stuff that have been there for almost a year, and yet no download
21:51:14  <Athorium> Wolf01 the exe are maked
21:51:19  <Darkvater> newgrf_config.c: In function 'IsGoodGRFConfigList':
21:51:20  <Darkvater> newgrf_config.c:157: warning: format '%08X' expects type 'unsigned int', but argument 4 has type 'long unsigned int'
21:51:24  <Darkvater> he
21:51:33  <Athorium> but I no see any :S
21:51:33  <PandaMojo> Yes, that evil message.
21:51:34  <peter1138> OS X bug :p
21:51:37  <qball> ok.. backtrace is pointless
21:51:37  <Darkvater> OSX doesn't like Endian_Swap :P
21:51:46  <peter1138> OS X's endian_swap is 64bit
21:51:48  <Wolf01> Athorium, you need all the data files to be able to run ottd
21:51:53  <peter1138> for 32 bit values
21:51:57  <peter1138> i have no ieda why
21:52:02  <Athorium> Wolf01 and where can I find it?
21:52:05  <qball> Darkvater: I can get you a coredump but I am afraid it's pointless
21:52:08  <PandaMojo> Wait, what?  Dosn't it use uin32?
21:52:10  <Darkvater> peter1138: it's bjarnized
21:52:11  <PandaMojo> *uint32
21:52:12  <Athorium> oh, my other game
21:52:13  <Athorium> :P
21:52:35  <qball> Darkvater: how do I make a debug build?
21:52:36  <PandaMojo> I tried tracking it down, but I was under the impression that it was an OS X header that typedefed uint32?
21:52:38  <Darkvater> qball: run a server and 2 clients to reproduce the problem. Then apply Rubidium's patch and try again
21:52:44  <Darkvater> qball: ./configure --debug=3
21:52:45  <qball> Darkvater: other problem this is
21:52:46  <peter1138> Darkvater: i have no idea why it even needs a system specific version...
21:52:51  <qball> eeuh yoda me talk
21:52:51  <peter1138> apparently i't s faster or something
21:52:57  <Darkvater> look in stdafx.h
21:53:07  <qball> qball@NotToTrust:~/Games/openttd-0.5.0-RC1$ ./configure --debug=3
21:53:07  <qball> ./configure: 6: Syntax error: "(" unexpected
21:53:10  <qball> HA HA
21:53:22  <PandaMojo> >_<
21:53:25  <Darkvater>  // make endian swapping use Apple's macros to increase speed
21:53:44  <qball> Darkvater: configure is a bash script, not a sh script
21:53:57  <qball> so first line should be #!/bin/bash
21:54:08  <Darkvater> hey, I didn't write it
21:54:10  <Athorium> exist any patch to increase the max sprites ?
21:54:13  <qball> Darkvater: so?
21:54:27  <Darkvater> don't blame me
21:54:34  <qball> Darkvater: give me svn access I fix it myself
21:54:43  <qball> Darkvater: but you wont
21:54:51  <Darkvater> why won't I?
21:54:56  <qball> give me svn..
21:55:06  <qball> well I wouldn't trust myself :P
21:55:10  <glx> qball: run bash configure then :)
21:55:19  <peter1138> how strange
21:55:22  <qball> just reporting the bug
21:55:23  <qball> that's all
21:55:32  <peter1138> some of the power / max_te values in the DBSetXL don't match with the documentation
21:55:37  <qball> I didn't blame anybody
21:55:51  <PandaMojo> Hmm... wouldn't just casting to uint16/32 work there?
21:56:03  *** turi [] has joined #openttd
21:56:20  <peter1138> yes
21:56:25  <peter1138> but casts are usually wrong, as you know
21:56:31  *** turi is now known as mosfet
21:58:26  <Biff> is this integrated in trunk?
21:59:02  <Darkvater> hmm, so if it's a bash script, how come it works for me?
21:59:07  <Darkvater> even when my shell is not bash?
21:59:26  <Rubidium_> because sh is symlinked to bash?
21:59:35  <Biff> not in ubuntu
21:59:37  <peter1138> it;s a "not-sh" script
21:59:37  <Darkvater> no idea
21:59:53  <peter1138> or that, heh
21:59:58  <Biff> so all scripts where sh is used and bash is actually written will mostly fail
22:00:05  <Rubidium_> Darkvater: <- new version of the diff (I hate it that I cannot reach my normal server)
22:00:07  <Darkvater> and as my bash-powers are far below optimum I will not commit changes to configure
22:00:26  <Darkvater> so qball, you're right ;)
22:00:36  <Rubidium_> Darkvater: the change would be adding 'ba' before 'sh' on the first line of configure
22:00:41  <peter1138> i think ubuntu did that just to annoy us ;)
22:00:54  <Born_Acorn> [21:59:16] <Biff> is this integrated in trunk? <-- Ooh, that looks really good. And peter1138 even says theres not much wrong with it!
22:01:09  <Darkvater> Rubidium_: much better
22:01:42  <Rubidium_> and now a commit message :)
22:01:52  <Biff> Born_Acorn: it seems to be pretty easy, it only removes code to check if a conversion is sane (same type rail it seems)
22:02:43  <Darkvater> well someone fix configure if they think it's wrong cause I'm not touching it...totally not my thing..brrr
22:04:50  <Born_Acorn> Bjarni is the autoreplace dood. Lets show it to him!
22:04:58  <CIA-1> rubidium * r7569 /trunk/ (sound/cocoa_s.c video/cocoa_v.m):
22:04:58  <CIA-1> -Fix (r7565): cocoa files were (somehow) forgotten.
22:04:58  <CIA-1> -Change: messages about failures is cocoa should be debug level 0 and show what went wrong. " failed with message X" isn't really descriptive.
22:04:58  <CIA-1> -Change: remove unneeded level 1 debug messages for entering some cocoa functions.
22:05:10  <Born_Acorn> autoreplace : possibly the best feature ever?
22:05:19  <Born_Acorn> especially wagon replace.
22:05:42  *** MVV [a@] has joined #openttd
22:05:53  <Biff> Born_Acorn: "As for the idea in this patch. I talked about doing this, but it was turned down in the channel by the other developers (mainly Darkvater) because we can't have trains of the wrong type in depots. Actually I agree, so I found another solution. Build two depots next to each other and when a train is sold, a new one is bought in the other"
22:05:58  <Biff> thats a good point
22:06:17  <Biff> it should convert the trains when you hit the convert button on a depot
22:06:35  <Born_Acorn> :O
22:06:48  <Born_Acorn> That was my idea, and I called it Multidepot!
22:07:02  <Biff> oh, did you make it?
22:07:11  <Born_Acorn> No, but I had the idea. :p
22:07:41  <Darkvater> Rubidium_: (somehow) :p
22:08:32  *** _MVV_ [~a@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
22:08:51  <Born_Acorn> <-- See!
22:10:14  <Biff> Born_Acorn: well, that means you will have to build alot of depots
22:10:17  <Born_Acorn> <-- Even earlier! :p
22:13:43  <Born_Acorn> Biff, only at some
22:14:42  <Biff> the way it should work is you send all trains to depot and convert all rail to monorail/maglev with the convert thingy
22:17:09  <Born_Acorn> hmm, interesting
22:17:26  <Born_Acorn> When you do it on a depot, it should bring up an autoreplace window
22:17:44  <Born_Acorn> So you can replace the different trains in there
22:18:31  <Biff> that will be a problem if you do it on like 50 depots
22:18:35  <Biff> 50 windows
22:18:37  <Biff> ouch :/
22:19:44  <Born_Acorn> yeah, well, there must be some degree of control.
22:20:40  <Athorium> someone know how to increase sprite limit?
22:20:43  *** tokai [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
22:20:53  <Born_Acorn> otherwise people would find their coal trains engines carry passengers
22:23:57  <FlashFF> anyone know how to tell the openttd log to flush?
22:24:02  *** tokai [] has joined #openttd
22:24:03  *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai] by ChanServ
22:24:13  <FlashFF> as in tell it to write what its been storing all day lol
22:24:15  <Darkvater> ey tokai
22:24:29  <Darkvater> tokai: seems morphos from trunk/ doesn't compile, can you check it for me?
22:24:45  <Biff> Born_Acorn: true
22:25:29  <Biff> but the reason i want it is to avoid having to manually convert 200+ trains for example
22:25:42  <SpComb> Logs:
22:25:42  <Tuzlo> !logs
22:26:14  <Born_Acorn> I'd rather build fifty depots than replace 200 trains manually
22:26:14  *** Progman [] has joined #openttd
22:27:14  *** Rens2Sea [~Rens2Sea@] has quit []
22:27:59  <Biff> Born_Acorn: i think thats about the same amount of work
22:28:08  <Born_Acorn> not really
22:28:16  <Biff> build depot next to each depot where there are trains you need to convert
22:28:33  <Biff> then for each of those depots you need to select the trains and convert them?
22:28:54  <Born_Acorn> Nah, it could be done via the main autoreplace window
22:28:56  <Born_Acorn> in one go
22:29:00  <Biff> ok
22:29:33  <Born_Acorn> replace goods trains with goods maglevs and passenger ones with passenger maglevs
22:29:44  <Biff> ok
22:30:24  <Biff> but couldnt you allow for conversion of depots without converting the trains, then letting the autoreplace do the rest like you suggested
22:31:11  <Born_Acorn> Wouldn't that come under "we can't have trains of the wrong type in depots."
22:31:50  <Biff> yes
22:32:07  <Biff> with one addition it would work
22:32:32  <Biff> allow conversion of the depot only if there is a autoreplacment for each type of train in the depot
22:32:50  <Biff> (and you have enough funds to convert all)
22:32:59  <Biff> then convert all trains, and convert the depot
22:33:47  <BFM> "Dolphin injures NZ woman in freak accident" Best news headline ever.
22:34:24  <BFM> HAHAHA An Auckland woman remains in a critical condition in hospital after a dolphin jumped into a boat and landed on her.
22:34:42  <BFM>
22:35:01  <Born_Acorn> Was the Dolphin okay?
22:35:06  <Bjarni> <Biff>	Born_Acorn: it seems to be pretty easy, it only removes code to check if a conversion is sane (same type rail it seems) <-- yeah, but I want autoreplace to me more complex :P
22:35:24  <Born_Acorn> Bjarni has arrived!
22:35:31  <Born_Acorn> The autoreplace masta.
22:35:32  <Bjarni> I got a long term plan to make it possible to build "replacement depots" (or whatever we should call them)
22:35:39  <Bjarni> using more than one tile
22:35:43  <Born_Acorn> next door neighbour depots
22:36:07  <Bjarni> so no vehicles will ever end up on incorrect track types
22:36:19  *** _MVV_ [~a@] has joined #openttd
22:36:27  <Bjarni> only... so far I haven't got around to code it yet
22:36:43  <Born_Acorn> lets send money to Bjarni via Paypal to fund his development costs!
22:36:51  <Biff> Bjarni: well, my last suggestion avoids incompatible trains and depots
22:36:51  <Bjarni> err
22:37:01  <Bjarni> that would be cool, but money got nothing to do with this right now
22:37:06  <Bjarni> I got a report to write for uni
22:37:25  <Born_Acorn> What on?
22:37:46  <Biff> and it provides the least amount of work for conversion
22:37:46  <Bjarni> technical stuff
22:38:12  <Born_Acorn> Lets send money to Bjarni via Paypal to fund his hiring of a technician to write it for him!
22:38:23  <Bjarni> haha
22:38:46  <Biff> lets send money to chris sawyer to write it
22:39:20  <Born_Acorn> Nah, he'd do it in ASM again. :p
22:40:06  <Bjarni> you know, I would rather code autoreplace than writing this report
22:40:09  <Biff> oh, he is busy writing train tycoon
22:40:21  <Bjarni> but I got little choice
22:40:32  <Bjarni> or rather: no choice
22:40:43  <Born_Acorn> He shouldn't have lost the name to Atari
22:40:48  <FlashFF> you could send me money!
22:40:55  <Biff> openttd should really run on cell phones aswell :p
22:40:58  <Born_Acorn> Then it could be Transport Tycoon Deluxe on mobile. :p
22:40:58  <Rubidium_> Bjarni, has it something to do with testing equipment for networks?
22:41:06  <Bjarni> FlashFF: yeah, but why should we do that?
22:41:13  <FlashFF> i dunno, it would be nice lol
22:41:26  <Bjarni> Rubidium_: why do you ask?
22:41:30  <MeusH> does anyone have info on Train Tycoon
22:41:39  <FlashFF> its bound to come back round and give you something nice one day
22:41:41  <MeusH> it was said to be released in autumn 2006
22:42:02  <Bjarni> Rubidium_: you got a network problem?
22:42:02  <MeusH> you know, the mobile Tycoon Chris Sawyer is working on
22:42:03  * Born_Acorn wonders if he should take screenshots of TT PSX for the TT wikipedia article
22:42:21  <Born_Acorn> I think had exclusive screenshots
22:42:25  <Rubidium_> as I found something with google and wanted to know whether it is you who is doing that, or someone else :)
22:42:26  <Born_Acorn> deep in their forums
22:42:32  *** MVV [a@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
22:42:38  <Born_Acorn> As they, like Redboss games are Czech
22:43:26  <Bjarni> ahh, that's logical.... you google something and presume that I do that :P
22:43:29  <Born_Acorn> <-- Looks like they died
22:43:43  <Bjarni> Rubidium_: URL?
22:44:01  <Rubidium_> in the open, or privately?
22:44:24  <Bjarni> PM
22:44:43  <Biff> Born_Acorn: no source code available? :o
22:45:22  <Born_Acorn> yeah, at the bottom of the download page
22:45:23  <Born_Acorn>
22:47:57  * Prof_Frink tries to get OZ bridging set up reliable enough to install openttd
22:48:59  <Biff> Born_Acorn: strange that he forked it tho, wouldnt it be possible to develop it alongside with the normal version?
22:53:21  <Prof_Frink> Huzzah, at least it now has screen
23:05:31  *** Aracirion [] has joined #openttd
23:05:43  *** Aracirion is now known as I
23:05:48  <I> I am stupid
23:06:01  <Wolf01> use /me
23:06:07  *** I is now known as I_AM_STUPID
23:06:24  * I_AM_STUPID is stupid
23:06:49  <I_AM_STUPID> thx\
23:06:54  <I_AM_STUPID> horhor
23:07:12  <Tuzlo> genius at work
23:07:27  <mattt_> hm, in OS X when i clear all the windows out with expose, my cursor gets lost behind where the OTTD window was ^_^
23:07:58  <Bjarni> I_AM_STUPID: finally somebody with an a name that clearly tells us about the person using it
23:07:59  <Bjarni> :P
23:08:24  <I_AM_STUPID> transparenssy is my slogan
23:08:48  <Bjarni> well, calling yourself stupid is somewhat different from what you did last night
23:08:54  <Tuzlo> not workin that well is it
23:09:01  <I_AM_STUPID> not a big differnce
23:09:30  *** I_AM_STUPID is now known as I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD
23:09:34  <I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD> better?
23:09:37  <Bjarni> so you are calling quoting the Koran stupid? I don't think that's what you said last night
23:11:23  <Born_Acorn> The Koran? Is that a race of aliens from Star Trek?
23:11:59  <Tuzlo> no, thats Bart SImpson
23:12:02  <Born_Acorn> Mr Spock! Koranian vessels off the port bow!
23:12:13  <Born_Acorn> Fire torpedos!
23:12:33  <Tuzlo> didnt anyone tell  mr spock that torpedos require water
23:12:43  <Prof_Frink> Born_Acorn: Why would Spock be firing topedoes?
23:12:45  <I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD> Verily, We have warned you of a punishment which is near at hand - a day when man will see what his hands have sent on before and the disbeliever will say, 'Would that I were mere dust!'
23:13:00  <Born_Acorn> hmm.
23:13:04  <Born_Acorn> So, the Borg now, is it?
23:13:08  *** [gen2]niki [] has quit [Quit: Verlassend]
23:13:19  <Eddi|zuHause3> Borg? sounds swedish ;)
23:13:32  <Tuzlo> someone put him out of his misery and boot him out of the channe;
23:14:03  <Born_Acorn> Prof_Frink, if in a pile of used pants, my Star Trek knowledge would amount to a cm of single thread from one pair.
23:14:39  <Prof_Frink> Born_Acorn: Likewise, but that's the bit that says that Spock wasn't weapons occifer
23:14:42  <Bjarni> I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD: I didn't ask you to start your requiting lines or whatever they are. I asked you a question that you even failed to answer
23:14:49  <I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD> Surely, those who have purchased disbelief at the price of faith cannot harm Allah at all; and they shall have a grievous punishment.
23:15:01  <Prof_Frink> Dunno what he was, or who was weapons occifer, but it wasn't Spock
23:15:04  *** Markavian [] has joined #openttd
23:15:07  <Markavian> hey!
23:15:17  <Born_Acorn> Prof_Frink, I knew he wasn't, but I don't know anyone else from that crew. :p
23:15:18  <I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD> fire torpedo at disbeliever
23:15:24  <Markavian> heres my talking on an empty FreeNode channel...
23:15:31  <I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD> burn, burn, burn !!!
23:15:43  <Markavian> Cargo transfer question: "Why does a goods truck that has a running cost of £567 per year, make a loss of £3000 a year when delivering transfered goods?"
23:16:01  *** Bjarni changed the topic of #openttd to: NO religious talk in here | 0.5.0-RC1 out! | Website: * (Translator: translator2, Gameservers: servers, Nightly-builds: nightly, WIKI: wiki, SVN mailinglist: maillist, Dev-docs: docs, Bug-reports: bugs)
23:16:06  <I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD> because of rising oil prices?
23:16:15  <Darkvater> Bjarni: please, be serious...
23:16:19  <Eddi|zuHause3> you mean we cannot discuss linux distributions here?
23:16:24  * Prof_Frink burnds Bjarni's embassies
23:16:30  <Prof_Frink> Eddi|zuHause3: Vim!
23:16:38  <Bjarni> damn, that backfired
23:16:41  *** Bjarni changed the topic of #openttd to: 0.5.0-RC1 out! | Website: * (Translator: translator2, Gameservers: servers, Nightly-builds: nightly, WIKI: wiki, SVN mailinglist: maillist, Dev-docs: docs, Bug-reports: bugs)
23:16:59  *** Prof_Frink was kicked from #openttd by Bjarni [you are violating international laws]
23:17:09  <I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD> I don't remember question my mind is so full of images and loud noises
23:17:10  <Tuzlo> what is a file with the extension .SC5
23:17:30  <Born_Acorn> Sim City 5 cities!
23:17:48  <Tuzlo> supposed to be a ttd file
23:18:10  *** Prof_Frink [] has joined #openttd
23:18:17  <Prof_Frink> :(
23:18:18  *** MeusH [] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
23:18:26  <Markavian> no one want to answer my question?
23:18:49  <Tuzlo> damnit howd that get on an openttd forum
23:19:35  <Tuzlo> Markavian: I believe it doesnt make a profir when transferring the goods. The vehicle that it transfers them to at the station makes all of the profit
23:19:36  <Eddi|zuHause3> maybe it's supposed to be an .sv? file
23:19:41  <Tuzlo> correct me if Im wrong
23:20:07  <Eddi|zuHause3> and somebody mistyped v with c?
23:20:28  <I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD> is that new?
23:20:35  <I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD> looks very useful
23:20:46  <Nigel> wow, 0.5.0-RC1? yippee
23:20:48  <Bjarni> Prof_Frink: burning embassies is something that violates the whole idea of embassies and not even countries at war does that
23:21:02  <Markavian> Tuzlo, infact its making a negative profit for each delivery. This doesn't look great on the stats sheets, and I think something is kinda wrong there
23:21:20  <Bjarni> but I can imagine it would be no fun to be the British ambassador in Berlin during WW2 or vice versa
23:22:05  <Tuzlo> Markavian: not sure, I didnt pay attention  last time I did that
23:22:05  <Born_Acorn> Bjarni, do you have any embassies to begin with? :p
23:22:17  <Bjarni> yes
23:22:32  <Born_Acorn> Where? I must visit my local one!
23:22:59  <Tuzlo> anyone got a decent repository for maps/scenarios?
23:23:02  <Prof_Frink> Born_Acorn: Need a light?
23:23:17  <Born_Acorn> I don't smoke!
23:23:22  <I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD> me neither
23:23:29  <Prof_Frink> That's not what I asked ;)
23:23:53  <Bjarni> Born_Acorn: I can't tell you. I just looked it up, but when I clicked UK, I got 404
23:23:56  <Bjarni> o_O
23:24:03  <I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD> O_o
23:24:05  <Markavian> is it worth someone making one Tuzlo?
23:24:12  <I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD> bababaababaabababa
23:24:24  <Prof_Frink> moo.
23:24:56  <I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD> "I have seen.. things ...... you wouldn't belive..."
23:25:17  <Born_Acorn> I once saw a mouse chase a cat.
23:25:43  <Born_Acorn> and it was trying to bite it as well!
23:25:56  <Tuzlo> Born_Acorn: you smokin dope?
23:26:07  <I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD> cool
23:26:10  <Born_Acorn> pfft no.
23:26:15  <I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD> I once saw a rat bite a dog in the nose
23:26:23  <Tuzlo> Markavian: well it would be good, then you can try other peoples creations
23:26:27  <Born_Acorn> It was a mouse from a cage, and a cat was trying to paw it!
23:26:30  <I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD> the dog was sniffing the cage
23:26:30  <Bjarni> elephants are scared of mice because elephant toes smells like mouse candy
23:26:38  <Born_Acorn> The mouse gave chase and the cat ran off
23:26:46  <Bjarni> if they elephants aren't careful, the mice will start to eat them
23:26:58  <I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD> thats fun
23:27:33  <Bjarni> but I would not like to be a mouse, that's being chased by an angry elephant
23:28:03  <Markavian> Tuzlo, I've got a shopping cart system for worms maps that zips downloads up. It could be modified for OpenTTD scenarios:
23:29:10  <I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD> Markavian: would be a good start
23:29:25  <I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD> there should be some way of categorizin
23:29:25  <I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD> g
23:29:53  <Markavian> what sort of categories?
23:30:04  <I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD> eg. desert/temperate
23:30:06  <Markavian> << made myself a website template a while back well
23:30:11  <I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD> and realistic/abstract
23:30:18  <Tuzlo> those maps are like the images are they?
23:30:36  <Tuzlo> well I'd lump them all into abstract
23:30:43  <Markavian> so map type, name, author, (realistic/abstract - sub category?), map file, date added..., submitted by
23:30:45  <I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD> :)
23:31:08  <Markavian> yes, Worms Armageddon uses .PNG files for maps, with modified headers for additional settings
23:31:11  *** Eddi|zuHause3 [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:31:49  *** MeusH [] has joined #openttd
23:31:50  <I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD> although maybe just making a small thumbnail would be more useful than scrolling around (although its a coll feature :) )
23:31:59  <MeusH> !stats
23:31:59  <_42_> MeusH:
23:32:01  <I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD> coll=cool
23:32:15  <Markavian> oh the scrolling around thing, yeah I'd drop that - its just a gizmo I was playing with
23:32:23  <SpComb> Logs:
23:32:23  <MeusH> !logs
23:32:52  *** MVVMVV [~a@] has joined #openttd
23:33:35  <Markavian> "Bjarni is either insane or just a fair op, kicking a total of 60 people! " lol
23:33:58  <MeusH> seems like discussion is going to start soon :)
23:34:24  <I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD> Hey, if there are free capacities by talented programmers, wouldn't anyone want to start working on passenger destinations?
23:34:59  *** DJ_Mirage [] has quit [Quit:]
23:35:13  <Rubidium_> it is really true that he is stupid :)
23:35:15  <Bjarni> <Markavian>	"Bjarni is either insane or just a fair op, kicking a total of 60 people! " lol <-- I noticed that earlier and also that I was one of the most kicked at that time and then I said in the channel "I better stop kicking myself"
23:35:18  <Tuzlo> haha
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23:36:00  <Markavian> so, who thinks a scenario repository is a good idea
23:36:10  <Markavian> or who knows of a decent one that already exists
23:36:18  *** ChrisM87 [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
23:36:22  <Rubidium_> as the latest passenger destination patch if for revision 7566, which is the revision of todays nightly
23:36:34  <Rubidium_> s/if/is/
23:36:45  <I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD> thats prissi's patch is it?
23:36:51  <Darkvater>
23:36:55  <Rubidium_> yes
23:37:18  <I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD> 1) theres no compiled mac version and I can't compile
23:37:37  <I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD> 2) I was thinking of something more advanced
23:37:38  <MeusH> 1) post a request on forum
23:37:43  <MeusH> 2) like what?
23:37:45  <I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD> I postd many times on forum
23:37:49  <I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD> but theres no response
23:37:54  <I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD> and ben said i better ask in irc :P
23:37:58  <Rubidium_> 1) learn how to compile yourself
23:38:04  <I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD> I dont have time
23:38:12  <I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD> if I learn to code i stop making gfx
23:38:14  <MeusH> change your nick to American_Patriot and you will get 44 replies
23:38:17  <I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD> and thats pontless
23:38:22  *** _MVV_ [~a@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:38:25  <Rubidium_> you do not need to learn to code to be able to compile
23:38:35  <I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD> but i dont want to waste more time
23:38:42  <mikk36> only 4 ops ???
23:38:43  *** I_AM_STUPID_MUHAMAD is now known as American_Patriot
23:38:44  <mikk36> :D
23:38:53  <American_Patriot> so?
23:39:00  <Bjarni> oh
23:39:06  <Bjarni> an American_Patriot
23:39:19  <Bjarni> should we be honoured?
23:39:25  <MeusH> now go and spread the faith
23:39:26  <American_Patriot> well in prissi's patch, passengers are generated as normal
23:39:32  <Rubidium_> so you're wasting time by making requests for compiles of a specific version, while you could have done it yourself in less time
23:39:33  <American_Patriot> and then they decide to go to one of YOUR stations
23:39:46  * Darkvater hates american patriots
23:40:01  <Rubidium_> mikk36: what is the problem of 'only' 4 ops?
23:40:04  <American_Patriot> what would be more interesting would be passengers that choose a route which can include different companies
23:40:08  <mikk36> none, Rubidium_ :)
23:40:19  <orudge> Hmm, scenario repository... I'm in theory going to be working on improving mine these next couple of weeks
23:40:21  <orudge> we will see how it goes
23:40:23  <American_Patriot> then finally people wouldn't keep saying "let my town alone"
23:40:33  <Markavian> Darkvater, I can't help but think that The ultimate tt game repository should have been updated a long long time ago
23:40:35  <American_Patriot> cause network building could be advantagous to both
23:40:50  <American_Patriot> and still competition on certain routes would be there
23:40:54  <orudge> In fact
23:41:02  * orudge may well go and have a play with it in a minute, after playing this game
23:41:05  <Darkvater> blame orudge :)
23:41:20  <Prof_Frink> orudge: You've been going to improve the repo for the last few years
23:41:31  <orudge> Yup
23:41:32  <orudge> well
23:41:36  <Darkvater> yeah; too much talk owen ;)
23:41:43  <orudge> I have the new codebase, which is half done
23:41:44  <orudge> the trouble is
23:41:48  <orudge> I got a bit ambitious with my features
23:41:51  *** ThePizzaKing [] has joined #openttd
23:41:53  * orudge has half of the ambitious features done
23:41:55  <orudge> but half of them not done
23:41:57  <American_Patriot> anyone interested or am I talking into an empty space?
23:42:00  <orudge> and then real life got a bit busy
23:42:24  <American_Patriot> My name change was useless, MeusH
23:42:33  <MeusH> I meant name change on forums
23:42:34  <MeusH> not here
23:42:34  *** American_Patriot is now known as STUPID_MUHAMAD
23:42:44  <MeusH> lol
23:42:45  <STUPID_MUHAMAD> why on forums?
23:42:47  <Tuzlo> is a .sv0 readable by openttd?
23:43:00  <Rubidium_> maybe
23:43:00  <Darkvater> yes
23:43:02  <MeusH> because you were asking requests there... didn't you?
23:43:08  <STUPID_MUHAMAD> yeah
23:43:10  <Darkvater> unless it's a recent ttdp game
23:43:14  <Darkvater> then it'd most probably crash
23:43:16  <Tuzlo> as a loaded game or scenario?
23:43:47  <Eddi|zuHause> i would assume both...
23:43:56  <STUPID_MUHAMAD> I also started adding ideas to a wiki page someone once made, but I got the impression that nobody was even noticing, so I stopped
23:43:56  <STUPID_MUHAMAD>
23:44:08  <STUPID_MUHAMAD> but people keep ignoring me ... :(
23:44:19  <STUPID_MUHAMAD> its the dilemma of any religious leader at the beginning
23:45:40  <Tuzlo> lol
23:45:55  <Tuzlo> anyway back to my question, as im not sure if anyone answered me
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23:45:59  <Tuzlo> is a .sv0 readable by openttd?
23:46:00  <Eddi|zuHause> grr... what use is it to have a wireless mouse if it constantly needs the power cable to recharge batteries
23:46:05  <Tuzlo> if so, as a loaded game or scenario?
23:46:11  <Bjarni> you see yourself as the new Muhammad or something?
23:46:18  <STUPID_MUHAMAD> bah
23:46:24  * qball is listening to Cash, Johnny - God's Gonna Cut You Down
23:46:29  <STUPID_MUHAMAD> I see dancing angels
23:46:42  <Tuzlo> Eddi|zuHause get one that requires batteries, or a new set of rechargables for yours
23:46:44  <Bjarni> I see my monitor
23:47:41  <STUPID_MUHAMAD> ok I think im just gunna read something
23:47:44  <Bjarni> hmm
23:47:49  * Eddi|zuHause is listening to Depeche Mode - Playing the Angel
23:47:52  <Bjarni> no railroad for more than 150 tiles?
23:47:52  *** KritiK [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:47:59  *** STUPID_MUHAMAD is now known as MUHAMAD_READING
23:48:16  * Bjarni is listening to ... nothing
23:48:46  *** Alltaken [] has quit []
23:48:52  <Bjarni> goodnight
23:48:56  <Eddi|zuHause> there was a time in germany, where no place was more than 10km away from the next station
23:49:10  <Bjarni> the good old days
23:49:31  <Bjarni> anyway I got plans for tomorrow, so I better get some sleep
23:49:36  *** Bjarni [] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
23:49:49  <qball> the netherlands changed there timetable after 36 years..
23:50:21  <Rubidium_> and that really sucks (for me at least)
23:50:30  <qball> ok for me
23:50:35  <qball> train every 15 minutes
23:50:37  <Eddi|zuHause> there are two huge problems with cables... 1) they are generally too short, and 2) you constantly trip over them
23:51:01  <MUHAMAD_READING> hey people I hate you
23:51:14  <qball> MUHAMAD_READING: it's mutual
23:51:17  <Eddi|zuHause> MUHAMAD_READING: i believe that is mutual
23:51:47  <MUHAMAD_READING> oooh
23:51:57  <MUHAMAD_READING> die! die in the fire!
23:52:15  <Rubidium_> total travel time +30 minutes going to the university and +15 minutes going back (on a trip that was 2 hours)
23:52:30  *** MUHAMAD_READING is now known as object_of_hate
23:53:10  *** object_of_hate was kicked from #openttd by Darkvater [get back when you grow up]
23:53:22  *** Rubidium_ is now known as Rubidium
23:54:02  <Rubidium> was about to do it myself :)
23:54:08  <Darkvater> :)
23:54:21  *** object_of_hate [] has joined #openttd
23:55:11  <Eddi|zuHause> impressive, i have not seen a kick without autorejoin in a long time
23:55:27  <qball> I don't have autorejoin on
23:56:32  <object_of_hate> /nick
23:56:38  <object_of_hate> now i cant change my nick
23:56:41  <object_of_hate> bah]
23:56:49  * object_of_hate is my real ientity then
23:57:08  <object_of_hate> stupid client
23:57:09  *** object_of_hate [] has left #openttd []
23:57:17  <Darkvater> lol
23:57:48  <Wolf01> 'night all
23:57:57  *** Wolf01 [] has quit []
23:58:05  *** Aracirion [] has joined #openttd
23:58:23  *** Aracirion is now known as Sick_Baby_Jerk
23:59:05  <Eddi|zuHause> wasn't mohammed the guy who married a 7 year old girl?
23:59:10  <Sick_Baby_Jerk> yeah
23:59:16  <Sick_Baby_Jerk> well, its legend
23:59:17  <MeusH> nice dude
23:59:30  <Prof_Frink> Eddi|zuHause: Half an hour is a long time now?
23:59:41  <MeusH> it's a common name anyway, it's like asking "was thomas the guy who entered the matrix?" :D
23:59:50  <MeusH> Time is money
23:59:59  <Eddi|zuHause> Prof_Frink: i have not noticed a kick half an hour ago

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