Log for #openttd on 14th March 2007:
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01:02:05  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r9156 /branches/noai/ (10 files in 6 dirs): [NoAI] -Fix: set svn:eol-style and svn:keywords.
01:06:49  <Smoovious> svn keywords?
01:06:52  * Smoovious wonders.
01:07:04  <glx> $Id$ mainly
01:07:38  <Smoovious> just to keep things consistent I suppose?
01:12:51  <glx> yes all source files start with /* $Id$ */ and setting svn:keywords enables the translation into /* $Id: ai.cpp 9151 2007-03-13 21:55:22Z truelight $ */
01:15:56  <Smoovious> okee
01:16:20  * Smoovious climbs up another millimeter on the huge learning curve ahead of him.
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01:34:49  <Digitalfox> Lol
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01:41:30  <Smoovious>
01:42:33  <Digitalfox> lol
01:43:20  <Smoovious> :)
01:43:38  <Eddi|zuHause2> that's disgusting...
01:44:00  <Eddi|zuHause2> (both of them)
01:44:21  <Digitalfox> Eddi|zuHause2: ??
01:46:05  <Digitalfox> "The Chinese government has given Intel permission to build a .5 billion chip-manufacturing plant in Dalian" I'm going to ask Intel 1 milion, since money is something they don't care..
01:46:37  <Digitalfox> Maybe i'll get a milion for a refund on my old P4 ;)
01:50:47  <Smoovious>
01:53:48  <Belugas> i'm amazed to see how much animation data is required for toyland industries, compared to all 3 other climates combined...
01:53:53  <Belugas> absolutely amazed
01:54:14  <Smoovious> well, they had to figure out some reason to get people to wanna play the damned thing
01:57:13  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r9157 /branches/noai/src/ai/core/object/commands.cpp: [NoAI] -Fix: wrong function was chosen (scoping issue).
01:57:15  <Digitalfox> belugas, why? I don't play toyland, but do they have more animation than temperate, like when producing goods etc.. ?
01:58:07  <Smoovious> they got a lot of animation... I played toyland quite a bit for a month or two years ago... but the sounds eventually just annoyed me too much
01:58:38  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r9158 /branches/noai/src/ai/core/base/random.cpp: [NoAI] -Fix: a 1 in 2 chance wasn't a 1 in two, but a 1 in 2 * 65536...
01:59:28  <Belugas> well.. i'm doing stuff in table/industry_land.h and... well..
01:59:48  <Belugas> after a big cleanup, almost all that is left are arrays devoted to toyland animation
02:00:00  <Belugas> sometimes, really big arrays
02:01:11  <Digitalfox> belugas i see :)
02:01:27  <Smoovious> well, nice to know... in case someone wants to try to do another toyland replacement
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02:04:31  <Digitalfox> Does patch work with TTO or only with Deluxe?
02:06:28  <Smoovious> only with TTD official
02:08:09  <Digitalfox> ok
02:14:18  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: truelight * r9159 /branches/noai/src/ai/core/ai_controller.hpp: [NoAI] -Change: moved 'tick' from public to private. Use GetTick() to get its value.
02:15:19  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: truelight * r9160 /branches/noai/ (3 files in 2 dirs): [NoAI] -Add: added AIController for Squirrel; all AIs, C++ or Squirrel, should extend this class
02:17:21  <Smoovious> I wonder if it would be possible to set up the new AI to allow for different AI routines... so the different AI companies play with different characteristics... like one preferring road vehicles, another preferring to do passenger service, another likes to do aircraft more, etc
02:17:30  <Smoovious> yet another doing nothing but subsidy-chasing
02:18:12  * Smoovious is thinking of some VGAP computer players that had different strategies
02:21:03  <Digitalfox> !seen darkvater
02:21:05  <_42_> Digitalfox, Darkvater ( was last seen quitting #openttd 4 days 1 hour 47 minutes ago (10.03. 00:33) stating "Quit: leaving" after spending 6 seconds there.
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02:29:32  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r9161 /branches/noai/ (11 files in 6 dirs): [NoAI] -Add: functions to get/set company related information: loan, bank balance, company value and company name.
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02:34:29  <Eddi|zuHause3> !openttd commit
02:34:32  <_42_> Commit by rubidium :: r9161 /branches/noai/ (13 files in 6 dirs) (2007-03-14 02:29:26 UTC)
02:34:34  <_42_> [NoAI] -Add: functions to get/set company related information: loan, bank balance, company value and company name.
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02:52:52  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: belugas * r9162 /trunk/src/ (4 files in 2 dirs):
02:52:52  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Codechange: Cleanup of industry_cmd (Step-8). Gather tile animation data into IndustryTileSpec array
02:52:52  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: Added a few documentation on remaining animation arrays (mostly ToyLand ones)
02:53:28  <Belugas> heheh conflicting my own stuff :D
02:54:49  <Smoovious> yeah, hate when that happens
02:55:17  <Belugas> no, not really :)
02:55:29  <Belugas> it just means i have less stuff on that repo to commit :D
02:56:58  <Eddi|zuHause3> hm, there's an advantage to insane city growth... i can do actual suburban trains on a big scale
02:58:05  <Smoovious> I made a scenario of totally flat land... 2048x2048... and kept hitting the random town generation button... its too bad I can't see the count of how many towns are in the game... would be interesting to see how far I got up to
02:58:28  <Smoovious> was thinking of just letting it run with all computer players... let them go to town making vehicles all over the place
02:58:57  <Smoovious> well... once I fixed the lack of mail subsidies that is...
02:59:06  <Belugas> time to lay down
02:59:09  <Belugas> night all
02:59:16  * Smoovious wonders who he can coax into another look at my last diff
02:59:18  <Smoovious> wave
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05:30:47  <Smoovious> anyone know off-hand where the base cargo amounts are listed? like, to get an idea of how many passengers is equivalent to how many mail? or as far as cargo is concerned, are they equivalent to each other... (like, for refit purposes)
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05:38:57  <Smoovious> nvm... found it
05:42:47  <Smoovious> huess not
05:42:50  <Smoovious> -h+g
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07:26:37  <Smoovious> ugh
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07:37:45  * Smoovious gives up for tonight and goes to bed.
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09:30:25  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: truelight * r9163 /branches/noai/src/ai/squirrel/ (squirrel.cpp squirrel.hpp): [NoAI] -Codechange: put AddMethod in his own function, so calling often is easier
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09:53:26  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r9164 /branches/noai/src/ai/ (NoAI/NoAI.cpp core/ai_company.hpp core/company/money.cpp): [NoAI] -Add: function to get the value of LOAN_INTERVAL in the AIs.
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10:00:58  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: celestar * r9165 /branches/gamebalance/src/ (economy_new.cpp town.h town_cmd.cpp): [gamebalance] -Add: Towns now have different levels of wealth. Alas, it doesn't have any influence either up to now
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10:26:15  <Patrick> cool, a branch making the game more balanced
10:30:37  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: truelight * r9166 /branches/noai/ (3 files in 2 dirs):
10:30:37  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: [NoAI] -Add: added destructor code, so we can do things there in the future
10:30:37  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Add: store the instance-pointer of the squirrel class
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10:39:48  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: truelight * r9167 /branches/noai/src/ai/squirrel/squirrel.cpp:
10:39:48  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: [NoAI] -Fix: store the 'this' pointer in a nicer way (KUDr)
10:39:48  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Fix: don't allow multiple instances of AIController inside one script
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10:57:25  <HMage> was the mouse scroll wheel fixed?
10:59:14  <peter1138> ages ago
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11:00:46  <HMage> ah, yes, I see it. It defaulted to 'scroll map' on me for some reason.
11:01:27  <HMage> ah, btw, I think I've found a bug - if the town's road expands into player's electric rail tile, it gets converted to nonelectrified one
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11:14:28  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r9168 /branches/noai/src/ai/core/ (ai_map.hpp map/ map/conversion.cpp map/query.cpp): [NoAI] -Add: AI wrapper functions for some map related queries.
11:14:59  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r9169 /branches/noai/ (6 files in 4 dirs): [NoAI] -Add: some wrapper functions for town related queries.
11:16:00  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: celestar * r9170 /branches/gamebalance/src/ (lang/english.txt town.h town_gui.cpp): [gamebalance] -Feature: Show the economic status of the town in the view window
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11:20:59  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: truelight * r9171 /branches/noai/ (3 files in 2 dirs): [NoAI] -Fix: call GameLoop() of the instance directly
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11:25:27  <SpComb> very pi
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11:28:31  <Nigel> pity it was off by 0.00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000004
11:28:43  <Nigel> :P
11:42:24  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r9172 /branches/noai/src/settings_gui.cpp: [NoAI] -Fix: the new AI patch setting was removed, but not from the patch settings gui.
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11:51:28  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r9173 /branches/noai/src/ai/core/ai.cpp: [NoAI] -Codechange: start both AIs when the game starts more than one.
11:52:26  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r9174 /branches/noai/src/ai/NoAI/ (NoAI.cpp NoAI.hpp): [NoAI] -Codechange: call all functions that are provided by the AI wrappers, so it can later be used for regression testing.
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12:12:50  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: maedhros * r9175 /branches/newhouses/src/newgrf_house.cpp: [NewHouses] -Fix: The house id specified as a parameter to house variable 0x61 is local to the current GRF file.
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12:13:40  <peter1138> woo
12:13:48  <peter1138> it's not on hold ;p
12:16:39  <antichaos> i've been playing with the newhouses branch with ttrs3 and it works great
12:17:12  <Maedhros> yeah, apart from cargos it's pretty much finished
12:17:21  <antichaos> I've seen a bit of weirdness with bridges though - not sure where to report it
12:18:08  <Maedhros> what sort of weirdness?
12:18:59  <antichaos> the biridge flickers when a vehicle goes over and under it at the same time
12:19:12  <antichaos> also it vanishes completely when a dock is built underneath
12:19:53  <Maedhros> i'm not even sure the game should allow you to build docks underneath bridges...
12:19:55  <antichaos> the sprite - not the whole bridge
12:20:12  <Maedhros> for exactly this reason ;)
12:20:57  <antichaos> fun to see road vehicles flying though the air though
12:21:35  <antichaos> it was an AI built bridge, if that helps
12:21:55  <Maedhros> did you build the dock, or did the ai?
12:22:01  <antichaos> I did
12:23:05  <Maedhros> hmm
12:23:12  <antichaos> lemme see if I can find the samegame
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12:24:52  <antichaos> oh yeah, this is the one that crashes with an invalid string too
12:24:55  <Frostregen> hmm, planes need movement/position interpolation
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12:25:42  <Maedhros> antichaos: yeah, that's definitely a bug. you shouldn't be able to build docks under bridges
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12:35:28  <antichaos> well, you definitely can, in newhouses and in trunk too.  also works under your own bridge
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12:36:56  <antichaos> can't build a bridge over a dock though
12:40:11  <Maedhros> i know, that's the bug - the code for building docks doesn't check if there's a bridge overhead
12:41:49  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: truelight * r9176 /branches/noai/ (3 files in 2 dirs):
12:41:49  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: [NoAI] -Add: added a RegisterAI() proc, that makes the AI known to the
12:41:49  <CIA-1> OpenTTD:  system. It is initialized automaticly when needed. Creating the class
12:41:49  <CIA-1> OpenTTD:  yourself results in an error.
12:42:25  <Progman> yeah, this looks funny ;)
12:42:38  <Maedhros> grr, you can build buoys under bridges too, with the same consequences
12:42:40  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: truelight * r9177 /branches/noai/ (3 files in 2 dirs): [NoAI] -Fix: squirrel scripts should end with .nut, not .sq
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12:47:35  <Progman> its even in trunk, i'll write a bug-report
12:50:26  <Maedhros> i'm attempting to fix it now
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12:51:34  <Progman> let me finish the bug-report so you can reference to it ;)
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12:53:52  <Progman>
12:56:11  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: maedhros * r9178 /trunk/src/station_cmd.cpp: -Fix (r7573) [FS#679]: Don't allow building docks or buoys under bridges.
12:57:13  <Maedhros> there, fixed :)
12:59:54  <Patrick> awwwwwwwww
13:00:05  <Patrick> or does it just make a crash
13:00:17  <Maedhros> it crashes if you try to remove the bridge afterwards
13:00:30  <Patrick> oh, dur, I just loaded 679
13:01:28  <Patrick> nice turnaround time ...
13:01:52  <Patrick> although really, buoys ought to be placeable under bridges but it's probably spritariffic
13:02:05  <Progman> 3mins to fix a bug? UNACCEPTABLE! ;)
13:02:21  <Maedhros> buoys are classified as stations, which means they use the same bits in the map array as bridges do
13:03:38  <Patrick> ah, fair enough
13:04:01  <peter1138> hmm
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13:48:41  <Belugas> hello
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13:59:36  <smithj> hello
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14:44:24  <Digitalfox> 14:12:50 < CIA-1> OpenTTD: maedhros * r9175 /branches/newhouses/src/newgrf_house.cpp: [NewHouses] -Fix: The house id specified as a parameter to house variable 0x61 is local to the current GRF file.
14:44:26  <Digitalfox> 14:12:52 -!- TinoM| [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
14:44:27  <Digitalfox> 14:13:40 <@peter1138> woo
14:44:29  <Digitalfox> 14:13:48 <@peter1138> it's not on hold ;p
14:44:30  <Digitalfox> /me hides
14:44:49  <Digitalfox> ops..
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14:46:45  <peter1138> i was mocking you :p
14:55:15  <hylje> when a oversized train is flipped around while loading, the game crashes as of r8979
14:57:24  <Maedhros> got any more information for us? ;)
14:57:25  <hylje>
14:57:31  <hylje> flip the train around
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14:58:57  <peter1138> it's that assert again
14:59:10  <hylje> is the bug already filed?
14:59:30  <Digitalfox> peter1138: I know and i deserve :)
15:03:14  <peter1138> hylje, dunno, but some accessors were added with asserts
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15:18:34  <imaginner> hi
15:21:32  <hylje> hey
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16:23:26  <imaginner> why is _network_unique_id 32-bit?
16:23:39  <imaginner> it's generated from a 16-bit md5 hash
16:23:49  <imaginner> so it should be 16-bit, right?
16:24:45  <Progman> md5 hash is 128bit wide
16:26:16  <TheMask96> 128bit == 16 byte...
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16:32:07  <Frostregen> 128bit displayed as hex string (=4bit per "hex-literal(0-F)") == 32 hex-literals
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16:34:37  <imaginner> I see
16:34:57  <imaginner> so each of 16 bytes is displayed as a 2-char hex string, right?
16:34:58  <Progman> but none of these informations explained the size of 32-bit or 16-bit ;)
16:35:22  <imaginner> displayed = sent over net
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16:35:44  <Frostregen_> _network_unique_id is a char array anyway ;)
16:36:00  <imaginner> I see
16:37:01  *** tokai [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:38:00  <Frostregen_> and yes, two 4 bit chars represent one 8bit byte
16:39:29  *** tokai [] has joined #openttd
16:39:29  *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai] by ChanServ
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16:43:58  <imaginner> aren't the chars are 8 bit?
16:45:45  <Frostregen> sorry for confusing
16:46:17  *** Tron [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:46:19  <Frostregen> "chars" was meant to be "hex character" 0-F
16:47:23  <Smoovious> I wonder if they're taking applications -->
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16:52:09  <Smoovious>
16:56:34  *** Rens2Sea [~Rens2Sea@] has joined #openttd
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17:02:57  <imaginner> Frostregen: ah, I see
17:03:04  <imaginner> Frostregen: thanks
17:03:40  <Frostregen> np
17:06:29  *** nfc [] has quit [Quit: leaving]
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17:12:24  <Smoovious> ewww -->
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17:24:03  *** Rens2Sea is now known as Rens2Eat
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17:30:15  <Bjarni> <-- somebody make a reply to this one....
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17:31:34  <Bjarni> preferable something polite
17:31:54  <Bjarni> he ask for us to code something like autoreplace (without using the actual word)
17:34:32  * Smoovious takes a look.
17:34:42  <Smoovious> oh wait... nevermind, you said something polite...
17:35:06  *** Osai is now known as Osai^Kendo
17:35:20  <Bjarni> I can't prevent you from writing something inpolite
17:35:47  <Smoovious> damned right you can't. :D >j/k<
17:35:56  <Smoovious> I'll take a look...
17:36:26  <Bjarni> I thought of several replies but discarded all of them because none of them were polite enough for an admin >_<
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17:37:21  <Bjarni> like "you fucking moron... I already coded that in 2005"
17:37:25  * Smoovious grins.
17:37:41  <Smoovious> yeah, at some point, you just gotta give in to the beast...
17:38:01  <Smoovious> I figure, I give them 3 chances to get what I'm putting down... after that, they deserve it
17:40:36  <Smoovious> huh... wierd... ya know that little button in the vehicle orders window, for bringing up a list of vehicles sharing the orders? it is staying greyed out until I actually have an order
17:40:46  <Smoovious> even tho it knows the orders are shared
17:40:49  * Smoovious shrugs.
17:43:46  <Bjarni> hmm
17:43:58  <Bjarni> the changelog lacks info about when autoreplace was added
17:44:11  <Bjarni> but it was not in 0.3.3 and 0.3.6 contains a bugfix for it
17:44:24  <Bjarni> maybe somebody should tell this guy to update :P
17:46:07  *** Wolf01 [] has joined #openttd
17:46:15  <Wolf01> hello
17:46:37  <Bjarni> 	<Smoovious>	huh... wierd... ya know that little button in the vehicle orders window, for bringing up a list of vehicles sharing the orders? it is staying greyed out until I actually have an order <-- I made it like that by design. I didn't want to, but the order system storage needs a complete redesign to avoid this issue
17:46:45  <Bjarni> hi Wolf01
17:47:00  <Bjarni> and redesigning the order system could take a while
17:47:17  * peter1138 redesigns bjarni
17:47:18  <Bjarni> so I would call it "known issue" ;)
17:47:32  <Bjarni> peter1138: we already talked about this
17:48:13  <Smoovious> ok... I wasn't 100% polite
17:48:16  <Smoovious> but close enuf
17:48:20  <Bjarni> can't you remember?
17:49:00  <peter1138> Bjarni: you don't think the flower pot in the corner suits you?
17:49:14  <Bjarni> ???
17:49:36  <Bjarni> are you on some sort of medication?
17:49:40  <hylje> mushrooms
17:50:42  <Smoovious> wait... 0.3.3?
17:50:55  <Bjarni> that's ancient
17:51:05  <Smoovious> where did 0.3.3 come up?
17:52:10  <Bjarni> hmm
17:52:39  <Bjarni> looking at the dates, it looks like autoreplace was added in 0.3.6 (2005-1-25)
17:52:44  <Smoovious> welp, anyways... I got the instructions posted to the dude... I let my patience go for the last line. :)
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17:52:47  <HMage> r
17:52:51  <Bjarni> I wonder why the changelog calls it a fix, not a feature
17:53:25  <Bjarni> I think I would have mentioned 0.3.6.... and maybe the date for it :P
17:56:50  <Bjarni> odd
17:57:19  <Bjarni> autoreplace is mentioned for 0.3.6, but the changelog also mentions bugfixes for autoreplace in the same release
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18:09:05  <dihedral> i just had a chat with kirk prindle
18:09:20  <dihedral> who is the director of atari
18:09:30  <Smoovious>
18:09:54  <Bjarni> dihedral: go on
18:09:55  <Smoovious> lemme guess... he doesn't know who owns the rights to TTDofficial either?
18:10:13  <Bjarni> Smoovious: you could be interrupting something important with your devil talk :P
18:10:18  <dihedral> he want me to send him an email and he will take care of it
18:10:29  <Maedhros> take care of what?
18:10:32  * Smoovious grins at Bjarni, "at least I know you read it. :D"
18:11:00  <Bjarni> 	<Maedhros>	take care of what? <-- yeah
18:11:17  <Bjarni> giving the source free or suing us?
18:11:21  <Bjarni> or something 3rd?
18:11:40  <Sacro> dihedral: how did you manage that?
18:11:42  <dihedral> checking which part of atari owns the copyright
18:11:56  <dihedral> i called atari
18:12:02  <Smoovious> once ya find out, what then?
18:12:08  <Bjarni> I don't think Atari could gain anything from suing
18:12:08  <dihedral> asked for omeone to talk to a copyright question
18:12:21  <dihedral> that is the point
18:12:27  <dihedral> there would be no gain
18:12:33  <dihedral> and there is no interest
18:12:45  <dihedral> in taking ottd to court
18:12:51  <Smoovious> tho... if someone could possibly get permission from them to distribute the GRF files, then won't have to dink around with people finding the official anymore
18:12:51  <Bjarni> they would a: gain no money, b: gain poor publicity
18:13:03  <dihedral> but he said he could not comment and needed to ask the board
18:13:04  <Bjarni> c: might not win at all
18:13:27  <Sacro> d) might get told to cease and desist, and have to disband the whole idea
18:13:52  <dihedral> but they could want money for it
18:14:00  <dihedral> big nasty downside
18:14:04  <Smoovious> kinda hard to enforce tho since jurisdiction is limited
18:14:26  <Sacro> dihedral: depends how much money
18:14:33  <Smoovious> they'd have to be able to show damages, for a product they don't even market
18:14:33  <Sacro> tt-f is quite a big community
18:14:38  <Bjarni> they would have to sue ludde under Swedish law if anything and ludde made sure not to break any Swedish laws
18:14:42  <dihedral> big big company = big big eyes
18:14:59  <dihedral> it is pretty hard to break swedish laws
18:15:04  <Bjarni> I don't think they would want  millions for it
18:15:16  <dihedral> but remember - there are patents that could be worldwide
18:15:20  <dihedral> no
18:15:36  <dihedral> not millions
18:15:42  <Bjarni> not in such an old game
18:15:50  <Maedhros> there are no world-wide patents
18:15:51  <Bjarni> patents runs out long before copyright
18:16:00  <dihedral> aye
18:16:02  <Smoovious> there's always somewhere that doesn't honor the patents
18:16:08  <Bjarni> yeah
18:16:09  <Maedhros> the uk, for example
18:16:12  <dihedral> hehe
18:16:16  <Smoovious> and when it comes to software patents, those are the ones that are on the ball
18:16:39  <dihedral> well - anyhow - i have his email address and his cell phone number :-P
18:17:01  <dihedral> and his office number
18:17:05  <Sacro> MAIL BOMB
18:17:09  <Smoovious> well... all in all... its a lot further than anyone else got... definite progress
18:17:14  <Bjarni> Germany didn't give a damn about copyright in the 17xx and early 18xx because they had a booming industry by copying patented products. Then they invented stuff on their own and started to enforce the patent system by law (hard)
18:17:43  <Smoovious> ^5's dihedral
18:17:47  <Bjarni> <Sacro>	MAIL BOMB <-- keep those info away from Sacro
18:17:50  <dihedral> talking of germany - calling a us cell phone aint cheep
18:17:54  <Bjarni> he would abuse them
18:17:59  <dihedral> but hey - take it as a donation :-D
18:18:08  <Bjarni> :)
18:18:10  <Sacro> Bjarni: s/those/that/
18:18:27  <Bjarni> those
18:18:29  <dihedral> mail bomb a person with a lot of money and you will never get a chance to do it again :-P
18:18:37  <Bjarni> it's info in plural... there are two of them
18:19:04  <Bjarni> now Sacro just showed that I'm better at his language than he is :P
18:19:09  <dihedral> there are 2 sides to atari
18:19:18  <dihedral> and one of them holds copyrights to all old games
18:19:40  <dihedral> and he was not sure if they even bothered in holding copyright for ttd
18:20:05  <Bjarni> I can imagine
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18:20:14  <dihedral> Bjarni: information is plural
18:20:20  <dihedral> there is no singular for that word
18:20:26  <Bjarni> right
18:20:29  <Bjarni> I knew that :p
18:20:36  <dihedral> me too :-P
18:20:48  <dihedral> i am making a lot of sence
18:20:49  <Bjarni> still there are two of them and Sacro tried to make it singular... making it even worse
18:20:58  <dihedral> nej
18:21:20  <dihedral> that
18:21:32  <Bjarni> in plural?
18:21:35  <dihedral> yup
18:21:42  <Bjarni> anyway let's talk about atari
18:21:50  <Bjarni> it's more interesting than grammar :D
18:21:54  <dihedral> lol
18:22:00  <dihedral> true
18:22:13  <dihedral> so - i would appreciate the devs sending me some questions
18:22:35  <Bjarni> like what questions?
18:22:52  <dihedral> write down what i should send to kirk prindle
18:23:06  <Sacro> GIEF US PERMISSIONS
18:23:19  <dihedral> GIEF
18:23:21  <dihedral> or GRF
18:23:24  <hylje>  GIEF LOOT
18:23:35  <dihedral> grf us permission sounds funnier
18:24:00  <Mortomesleeping> phat lewt
18:24:04  *** Mortomesleeping is now known as Mortomes
18:24:32  <peter1138> how about "please, don't sue us?"
18:24:41  <dihedral> good start
18:24:49  <Smoovious> "My Combat cartridge doesn't work any more... are replacements still available for purchase?"
18:25:08  <dihedral> not helpful
18:25:11  <dihedral> :-)
18:25:17  * Smoovious grins.
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18:25:41  <moe> ouch
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18:25:54  <Bjarni> actually I think it would be something more like: give the copyright free so it can freely be modified and distributed even without prove of everybody buying the game (since it's sold out)
18:26:13  <peter1138> i wouldn't listen to bjarni
18:26:23  <dihedral> it is a good direction
18:26:25  <peter1138> his vague concept of english grammar makes everything sound like demands
18:26:31  <dihedral> but we need to get their attention
18:26:39  <peter1138> not really :p
18:26:47  <dihedral> make kirk think we are taking the mick out of him and that was it
18:26:52  <peter1138> let me retire and remove all references to me first ;p
18:27:02  <Bjarni> I didn't mean like writing that as a quote, more like what would we want them to do. Then we can figure out how to write it
18:27:05  <dihedral> i did not mention openttd
18:27:23  <Smoovious> need to praise a little bit... let them know how much the game is still loved for its playability and has maintained a pretty solid following of people who have been putting a lot of work trying to keep it updated, and we'd like to continue etc etc etc
18:27:28  *** TronBSD is now known as Tron
18:28:05  <Smoovious> oh
18:28:24  <Smoovious> just out of curiosity, why didn't you, dihedral
18:28:40  <dihedral> so they cannot sue before i mail them :-)
18:28:55  * Smoovious grins.
18:29:08  <dihedral> i said that there was a community working on a ttd version
18:29:20  <dihedral> and that this was being developed by people world wied
18:29:25  <dihedral> wide
18:29:35  <peter1138> ttdpatch :D
18:29:39  <dihedral> nej
18:29:54  <dihedral> i dont have to say who it is
18:29:56  <Smoovious> well, if records are kept, and they decided to sue later, the records could demonstrate a good faith effort to try to establish who holds the copyright so things could be covered... and that the hold-up was on their end...
18:29:59  <dihedral> just need to get their attention
18:31:20  <dihedral> the last step of it all would be to in any way get permission and that in writing
18:31:21  <Smoovious> should be interesting however it turns out tho
18:31:28  <dihedral> yup
18:31:48  * Smoovious grins.
18:32:06  <Bjarni> <dihedral>	nej <-- it's spelled "no" in English ;)
18:32:16  <dihedral> i know
18:32:18  <Smoovious> how did you run into the dude anyways?
18:32:34  <Bjarni> he already told us
18:32:36  <Bjarni> he called him
18:32:43  <dihedral> atari first
18:32:45  <peter1138> run over him in his car
18:32:52  <Bjarni> called atari asking for somebody regarding copyright and he was forwarded
18:32:54  <Smoovious> ahh... must have missed that line
18:33:14  <dihedral> and the person i was forwarded to only had an answeringmachine
18:33:22  <dihedral> and that gave me his cellphone number :-)
18:33:27  <Bjarni> <peter1138>	run over him in his car <-- I don't think that would be the right start, but finding his lost cat would be a good start though
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18:33:30  <Smoovious> peter1138... well, that'd certainly be a solid attention-getter...
18:33:55  <dihedral> Bjarni: not a good start - but could be usefull depending on how it ends :-)
18:34:17  <Bjarni> yeah, it would have to be returned safely
18:34:29  <Bjarni> running it over would not help
18:34:38  <antichaos> release the copyright or we kill your cat!
18:34:56  <dihedral> basically we only need a letter saying they would not sue us
18:34:57  <Bjarni> that would likely be the wrong thing to say
18:35:01  <blathijs> dihedral: but, you called atari, and they forwarded you directly to the atari director?
18:35:13  <dihedral> i called a few times
18:35:29  <dihedral> and i told of the guy who answered the phone the first time
18:35:50  <dihedral> kicking someones rear end is fun
18:35:54  <hylje> :p
18:36:07  <blathijs> I don't think we need a letter that they won't sue us, but we need permission to use and distribute openttd material
18:36:18  <blathijs> the sueing part won't happen anyways
18:36:37  <dihedral> would not say that too loud
18:36:58  <dihedral> but they could not sue a paticular person
18:37:32  <Smoovious> just kinda highlight somehow that the TTD material is no longer a part of their revenue stream anyways, and they'd have nothing to lose by extending the rights to the project
18:37:57  <dihedral> it never was - it belonged to micropros which was bought in 2001
18:38:36  <Bjarni> how about adding that we can't use it commercially?
18:38:37  <Smoovious> I know... Microprose's revenue stream became theirs in the process...
18:39:17  <dihedral> cannot be used commercially anyway - GPL
18:39:25  <Bjarni> I know
18:39:28  <Smoovious> <idea>... maybe make it useful to highlight that it would help us out on an educational level? as a learning project for programming? somehow?
18:39:40  <Maedhros> there's nothing in the gpl that prevents making money
18:39:56  <dihedral> hmmm
18:40:14  <Bjarni> but if the TTD stuff adds a special permission telling that it can't be sold to generate profit
18:40:15  <dihedral> but allows modifying and does not allow closed source
18:40:33  <Smoovious> a lot of the software companies like donating to projects... long term, they might turn out to be programmers they'd want to hire later on or something
18:40:44  <Maedhros> Bjarni: then it will become GPL incompatible, and you'd need the permission of all the copyright holders anyway
18:40:53  <Bjarni> right
18:41:03  <Bjarni> but the point is to make atari aware of this fact
18:41:17  <dihedral> them stating they were not interested could suffice
18:41:19  <Smoovious> dihedral... how much time do we have?
18:41:35  <Bjarni> and if they "release" their stuff, they would have an easier time doing so if they write that it can't be for commercial usage
18:41:46  <dihedral> i would say - get that email to kirky asap
18:41:54  * Smoovious nods.
18:42:19  <Smoovious> think the educational purpose is the way to go
18:42:27  <Smoovious> in part
18:42:31  <dihedral> Bjarni: they could give us permission but requrie ottd became closed source
18:42:52  <blathijs> dihedral: No, they can't
18:42:59  <Smoovious> dunno about the rest of you, but for me, it is having a very positive educational benefit for me
18:43:02  <dihedral> just a guess :-D
18:43:05  <Bjarni> they could, but we can't accept it
18:43:16  <blathijs> dihedral: We don't have enough people left to change away from GPL
18:43:20  <Bjarni> and they should know that
18:43:31  <dihedral> of course not
18:43:36  <blathijs> as in, we don't own copyright to all openttd code
18:43:48  <Maedhros> at which point they could say "our way, or not at all"
18:44:18  <Smoovious> are you looking for permission for all of the code, or just to be allowed to use the GRF's?
18:44:22  <dihedral> but then enemy territory was made opensource
18:44:28  <Sacro> dihedral: might wanna ask some of the people in #tycoon on
18:44:29  <dihedral> and that uses the q3 engine
18:44:38  <Sacro> TTDPatch people might want input
18:44:58  <Smoovious> um...
18:45:00  <hylje> dihedral: q3 is opensource itself
18:45:29  <dihedral> q3 was never open source
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18:45:35  <Smoovious> dunno if I remember correctly... but didn't I see someone comment somewhere, that there was more... ah... hostile?... feelings towards the patch people, than there was to the openttd people?
18:45:42  <peter1138> it is
18:45:48  <dihedral> damn it
18:46:02  <dihedral> appologies for the word "it"
18:47:43  <hylje> dihedral: fyi
18:48:39  <dihedral> ok - my latest stand was before 2005
18:48:46  <dihedral> :-)
18:51:03  <dihedral> where is Brianetta when you need him?
18:51:49  <dihedral> he always has some pretty good ideas
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19:02:22  <Brianetta> do I?
19:02:41  <dihedral> confident...
19:02:50  <dihedral> perhaps just whishfull thinking :-)
19:03:39  *** Digitalfox [] has joined #openttd
19:03:57  <Brianetta> Assume that I just got in this second, and that reading up the last 40 lines of conversation fills me with dread
19:04:21  <dihedral> why is that
19:04:23  <Maedhros> it could be worse... your name could be in the openttd source code...
19:04:31  <Maedhros> which i realise is deliberate
19:04:37  <Brianetta> It cuold be
19:04:51  <Brianetta> // Screw that Brianetta dude, he never helps
19:04:54  <Brianetta> etc
19:04:57  <Maedhros> hehe
19:05:04  <dihedral> :-)
19:05:24  <dihedral> that would explain the size
19:05:29  <dihedral> of the source files
19:06:05  <Brianetta> It's really just 100 lines of code, and several megs of vented spleen, rants and insult.
19:06:17  <Eddi|zuHause3> !openttd commit 6800
19:06:18  <Brianetta> Actually, that *is* part of the Linux kernel.
19:06:19  <_42_> Commit by KUDr :: r6800 /trunk/ (8 files in 2 dirs) (2006-10-17 16:16:19 UTC)
19:06:21  <_42_> -Feature change: [train is lost] message is now generated immediately when pathfinder can't find the path. (thanks MeusH, peter1138 and Brianetta for ideas and help).
19:06:28  <dihedral> the insults have been splitted into the header files :-D
19:06:47  <dihedral> branches only condemn other devs :-)
19:08:17  *** BJH2 [] has joined #openttd
19:08:25  <Eddi|zuHause3> (that's the only occurence of "Brianetta" i could find)
19:09:13  *** KritiK [] has joined #openttd
19:16:34  *** mikk36_ [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
19:16:50  *** mikk36 [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
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19:25:13  <peter1138> you bothered looking?
19:26:50  <dihedral> grep
19:29:43  <Brianetta> Don't forget to grep for Oevnarggn
19:30:02  *** Rens2SupCom is now known as Rens2Sea
19:32:44  * peter1138 attempts to find energy saving GU10s...
19:33:04  *** nfc [] has joined #openttd
19:33:27  <peter1138> hmm, £49 for 10* 7W
19:34:16  *** Osai^Kendo [] has joined #openttd
19:35:03  <peter1138> hmm, dimmable energy saver
19:35:45  <peter1138> how do they work then...
19:38:34  *** mikk36_ [] has joined #openttd
19:38:56  *** mikk36 [] has joined #openttd
19:40:15  <Smoovious> they dim?
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19:44:50  <Smoovious> any reason why subsidy routes have to be a distance of <=70? any objections to allowing some slightly longer routes? like a max of 100? or something in between?
19:46:39  <Smoovious> nvm... will just make it configurable for now.
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19:53:17  <Progman> maybe its for balancing in MP
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20:13:12  <Belugas> i agree with Progman on that, longer routes for subsidy should be a matter of game re-balancing
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20:22:11  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: truelight * r9179 /branches/noai/ (13 files in 5 dirs):
20:22:11  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: [NoAI] -Add: added templates that makes adding classes to squirrel very easy
20:22:11  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Update: SQNoAI does now exactly what NoAI does
20:25:45  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: truelight * r9180 /branches/noai/src/ai/ (7 files in 3 dirs): [NoAI] -Fix: copy/pasting can be nasty: wrong @file headers
20:25:54  <Smoovious> Belugas... well, I'll make the distance a static, so it can be changed in one location instead of hunting down all of the locations... for the big sparse maps I like, they'd really need to be longer... maybe make it console configurable, but not in the patches menu
20:27:14  <Maedhros> maybe making it scale with the map would be sensible
20:28:30  <Belugas> a lot more then that should be in scale with the map, actually...
20:29:28  <Smoovious> Maedhros... maybe... but for now, will just make it configurable... not sure what an approriate scale would be yet... my main focus right now is to have mail subsidies again, as well as passenger subsidies with the oil rigs
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20:30:05  <dihedral> make it check the lowes amount of p->money64 and calculate a reasonable distance :-)
20:30:50  <Smoovious> hahaha... that's a little beyond what I'm comfortable doing right now :)
20:31:13  <Smoovious> besides... I'm doing this for trunk... maybe leave the balancing issues to the branch
20:32:18  <dihedral> of topic q: is there a branch for 050 development? just in case of bug fixes etc?
20:32:28  <glx> yes
20:32:33  <Maedhros> yes, /branches/0.5 :)
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20:33:08  <dihedral> hmm... could have actually guessed :-P thank you Maedhros
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20:34:27  <Smoovious> hey, that reminds me... should I be making patches for trunk or 0.5 branch?
20:34:32  <Maedhros> trunk
20:34:35  <Smoovious> ok
20:34:41  <Maedhros> unless it's a bug fix it will never be applied to 0.5
20:34:45  <Smoovious> what's the difference between them
20:34:55  <dihedral> c and c++ :-)
20:35:04  * Smoovious grins.
20:35:05  <Smoovious> ok
20:35:12  <dihedral> as a wild guess
20:35:29  <peter1138> indeed
20:35:33  <dihedral> dont take my word for it though
20:35:34  <dihedral> uh - wow
20:35:35  <peter1138> amongst other things
20:36:13  <dihedral> though if patches were made for trunk and not 05 - how will it be decided what goes out for 051?
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20:36:36  <dihedral> and who will have to do all the work?
20:36:47  <dihedral> or will 051 only ever be a bug fix?
20:36:55  <dihedral> if at all?
20:36:58  <Maedhros> as far as i know, yes
20:37:37  <Maedhros> new features and bug fixes go into trunk, if they're relevant, the fixes are backported to the 0.5 branch
20:37:55  <Maedhros> occasionally you get bug fixes that are only relevant to the 0.5 branch as well
20:38:00  <dihedral> that backporting could mean a lot of work
20:38:12  <Maedhros> yup
20:38:23  <dihedral> nice
20:40:01  <dihedral> i like working on the 050 dedicated server so i can apply patches to that and not have my players notice a thing...
20:40:03  <peter1138> yeah, 0.5.1 etc will only ever be bug fixes
20:40:27  <dihedral> and security updates?
20:40:58  <peter1138> they're bug fixes
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20:41:05  <dihedral> :-)
20:41:35  <peter1138> gah
20:41:39  <peter1138> affect or effect...
20:41:50  <peter1138> cargos have an affect/effect on towns
20:41:56  <dihedral> a
20:41:58  <peter1138> i never remember whcih :p
20:42:06  <peter1138> right
20:42:12  <peter1138> 1 vs 0 ;)
20:42:19  <dihedral> anybody else?
20:42:29  <Maedhros> they have an effect, by affecting the town ;)
20:42:45  <dihedral> now that is just rotten
20:42:57  <dihedral> why would you do such a thing
20:42:59  <dihedral> :-)
20:43:30  <peter1138> well, affect is good, because it means i did it right ;p
20:43:32  <dihedral> i guess that makes it 1 vs 1.5
20:44:08  <Bjarni> what was the conclusion on the atari stuff?
20:46:05  <Belugas> Bjarni : conclusion is find the right wording and the right questions to ask Kirk, send that to dihedral, and wait
20:47:01  <Smoovious> cargoes have an effect... cargoes affect
20:47:45  <dihedral> now about renaming
20:47:53  <dihedral> #openttd to #leaningenglish
20:48:02  <dihedral> :-D
20:48:40  <peter1138> hmm, now i'm not sure :/
20:49:15  <Smoovious> depends on if it is a noun or a verb
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20:49:33  <dihedral> whats that?
20:49:41  <dihedral> :-P
20:49:44  <Smoovious> [a|e]ffect
20:50:04  <peter1138> it's a variable name and enum ;p
20:50:14  <dihedral> good one
20:50:42  <dihedral> i never heard that before but that is so good
20:50:43  <peter1138> the effect of cargo types on towns
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20:52:58  <Smoovious> don't tell me the DistanceManhattan() function actually computes the distance from the XY of the town in the game, to Manhattan...!
20:53:24  <Smoovious> that'd be a neat trick... like, wow, how did it no my coordinates?
20:53:30  <Smoovious> no=know
20:54:11  <peter1138> smartarse
20:54:30  * Smoovious sets up a helicopter route, and suddenly 3 helicopters leap off the screen, rise in the air, and start flying eastward into the distance
20:55:28  <dihedral> how a bout an autobuy feature?
20:55:36  <Smoovious> autobuy?
20:55:38  <dihedral> build one train
20:56:02  <dihedral> tell the depot to keep feeding the station with new trains until the first train gets back
20:56:32  <dihedral> and only feed if at least one slot is empty
20:56:38  <Smoovious> hmm... maybe do it only if the station is empty
20:56:52  <Smoovious> or I forsee a lot of backed up traffic
20:57:27  <Belugas> 'night
20:57:34  <dihedral> night
20:57:38  <dihedral> and thx
20:57:42  <Smoovious> wave
20:58:56  <peter1138> well you can clone...
20:59:08  <dihedral> still requires your attention
20:59:12  <dihedral> also
20:59:14  <peter1138> awww
20:59:17  <dihedral> :-)
20:59:22  <peter1138> you want the game to play by itself?
20:59:44  <dihedral> long track where a steam engine will require over a year to return...
21:00:11  <Eddi|zuHause3> <Brianetta> Don't forget to grep for Oevnarggn <- what's that supposed to mean?
21:00:14  <Smoovious> why not... that's what people on an old MajorMUD game did... everyone buying scripts to play the game for them, and they pay to play the game...
21:00:34  <Smoovious> early days were better, we wrote our own scripts... each had a different personality...
21:01:09  <dihedral> anyway - another thought
21:01:18  <dihedral> talk xmlrpc
21:01:33  <dihedral> whenever the master server is contacted to update information
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21:01:54  <dihedral> openttd could send an xml file to an address the admin specifies
21:02:32  <Maedhros> gah, why do people like xml so much?
21:02:55  <dihedral> because it is more expandable
21:03:11  <dihedral> the actual system used does not matter
21:03:23  <Eddi|zuHause3> same reason why they like windows
21:03:35  <dihedral> the main thought would be adding another address to contact besids the master server
21:03:40  <dihedral> and just to point something out
21:03:42  <Eddi|zuHause3> because they have no clue how much better the alternatives are
21:03:45  <dihedral> i dont like windows
21:04:04  <dihedral> and i know what a pain xml is to code with
21:04:22  <Smoovious> contact all of the existing operating servers, and a player won't be approved to play until 60% of the servers have voted to allow the person to join a game
21:04:42  <dihedral> yeah - great
21:05:01  <dihedral> at some point players will feel a little overwhelmed
21:05:10  <dihedral> with message boxes popping up
21:05:15  <Smoovious> I only guarantee that I have ideas... my ideas come 'as is', buyer beware... no warranty provided on the quality of said ideas.
21:05:19  <dihedral> allow player x to play on server y
21:05:35  <dihedral> yes | no
21:05:43  <dihedral> on windows version
21:05:50  <dihedral> yes | no | cancle
21:05:58  <Mortomes> or allow
21:06:07  <Smoovious> and 'no' and 'cancel', will still count as a 'yes'
21:06:37  <dihedral> unless you tick the box "i accept"
21:07:01  <dihedral> then you are promted for you 200 char license key
21:07:02  <Smoovious> no... that just crashes the program in a state you have to use regedit to get it uninstalled
21:07:31  <dihedral> hehe write to the spare space in the mbr :-D
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21:09:46  <dihedral> hehe - that is an idea
21:10:03  <dihedral> why not store the client it in the mbr :-D
21:10:06  <dihedral> *id
21:10:41  <dihedral> ppc users would love it... *cough*
21:13:53  <Smoovious> why not just use the C partition's serial number? (or other filesystem's serial)
21:15:19  <dihedral> just had  a report that players on one of my servers wer not able to build anything
21:16:20  <dihedral> all players
21:16:43  <dihedral> they reconnected and it was fine
21:17:28  <peter1138> *sigh*
21:17:33  <peter1138> is this stupid thing A or E? :p
21:17:54  <Sacro> dihedral: you CANNOT use anything user side, it can all be spoofed
21:18:02  * Maedhros votes for 'e'
21:18:22  <Smoovious> E
21:19:12  <peter1138> ok
21:19:28  <Eddi|zuHause3> i vote for 'e', too
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21:33:24  <dihedral> night guys
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21:41:30  <Biff> do the amount of catchment area matter for how much cargo you can pick up there?
21:42:06  <Biff> eg. if you have to squares of a coal mine, can you pick up less then if you have the whole mine in the catchment area?
21:44:15  <Smoovious> Biff... I don't believe so
21:44:44  <Biff> i've always assumed it did
21:44:45  <Smoovious> tho might not be a bad idea.. but not all squares of an industry count
21:45:07  <Biff> but i dont know where i've gotten that idea
21:45:08  <Biff> :p
21:45:33  <Mortomes> Speaking of which, how many squares do you have to cover to be able to pick up something? Just 1? It only shows it for accepted materials :/
21:47:46  <Smoovious> Mortomes... I believe the squares are the same...
21:48:15  <Smoovious> you can use the ? cursor to see what squares produce what, I think
21:48:20  <Mortomes> ooh
21:48:27  <Mortomes> Hadn't noticed that yet.
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21:52:21  <Patrick> ooh
21:56:15  <Smoovious> ugh...
21:56:22  <Smoovious> this subsidy system is a headache
21:56:23  <peter1138> hmm?
21:57:40  <Smoovious> I'm trying to allow for passenger subsidies from oil rigs, and there are parts where I'd need to distinguish if the source is a town or industry, and it makes the distinction based solely on the cargo type
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21:59:37  * Smoovious grins.
21:59:47  <Smoovious> already gave up on the first attempt last night, and reverted
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22:00:26  <Wolf01> night
22:00:28  *** Wolf01 [] has quit []
22:00:40  <Smoovious> wave
22:04:09  *** Sacro_ is now known as Sacro
22:06:08  * Smoovious talks to himself some more, "maybe I could add in a boolean to the subsidy info and use that to determine if the relevant parameter refers to a town or industry
22:07:28  <Maedhros> anyone know of a fast weighted random number generator?
22:08:34  <Smoovious> for weighted, I usually figure in a tangent component to the result... it isn't perfect tho
22:09:31  <Maedhros> it doesn't really need to be perfect (as long as it gives the same results every time)
22:09:45  <peter1138> Smoovious: rather than the cargo type? heh
22:09:50  <Smoovious> welp... a tangent wold do it
22:10:53  <Smoovious> peter1138... yeah... cuz, passengers could be both town and industry... so using the cargo type to determine if the # in the index refers to a townID or an industryID just won't cut it if you wanna subsidize passengers from industries that generate them (oil rigs)
22:11:08  <Smoovious> (plus who know what other future industries when newcargoes is done)
22:11:43  <Smoovious> I suppose I could make the ID signed, instead of unsigned... positive #'s are towns, negative #'s are industries
22:11:48  <peter1138> no
22:11:51  <Maedhros> yuck
22:11:58  * Smoovious grins.
22:12:01  <peter1138> and wouldn't work
22:12:12  <Smoovious> why wouldn't it?
22:12:36  <peter1138> well, it would in practice
22:12:45  <peter1138> but if you had 40000 industries...
22:13:03  <peter1138> which reminds me
22:13:05  <Smoovious> if I had 40000 industries, I wouldn't be able to lay track for the subsidy anyways
22:13:25  <peter1138> yeah? you're forgetting the 32768x32768 mapsize!
22:13:38  <Smoovious> I can't forget something I haven't played yet. :)
22:13:40  <peter1138> hmm
22:13:44  <peter1138> 8.5GB for the map :D
22:13:56  <Smoovious> but if we ever get that high, we can just change it to int32 or int64
22:14:35  <Smoovious> but I know if we get that big, I'm gonna want to change the scaling factor for low/med/high towns and industries... they already make too many at 'low' for my taste as it is for 2048x2048
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22:17:29  <Smoovious> I could double the values of all of the towns/industries, and then add 1 to the industries, so all the towns are even numbers, and all the industries are odd numbers. :D
22:17:29  <Smoovious> j/k
22:18:09  <Smoovious> probably just go with the boolean... simpler
22:18:50  <Smoovious> er... can't be boolean...need at least 2 bits
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22:20:40  <Maedhros> 'night
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22:27:31  <peter1138> Smoovious: enum
22:28:13  * Smoovious nods.
22:28:31  <Smoovious> I'm taking a break from it right now... let the background process deal with it for a bit
22:32:02  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: glx * r9181 /branches/noai/src/ai/squirrel/squirrel.hpp: [NoAI] -Fix: allow compilation with MINGW and _UNICODE (squirrel has some problems with that)
22:42:24  <Smoovious> peter1138.. you had something in mind with 'enum'... but I'm just not catching what you were intending... (still reading help files)
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22:46:23  <Brianetta> Eddi|zuHause3: It's Brianetta, but Rot13
22:46:48  <Eddi|zuHause3> oh, right... i should have known that :p
22:55:59  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: truelight * r9182 /branches/noai/src/ai/ (NoAI/NoAI.cpp NoAI/NoAI.hpp core/ai.cpp core/ai_factory.hpp):
22:55:59  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: [NoAI] -Add: added AIFactory template which all AIs must define, as this
22:55:59  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: makes them select from the core. This gives information about author,
22:55:59  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: version, description, ...
22:55:59  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Add: make the AI selection random based on the entries in AIFactory
22:57:59  <Smoovious> AI selection? like... different AI's?
22:58:10  * Smoovious looks hopeful.
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22:58:25  <Bjarni> it is
22:58:27  <Bjarni> well
22:58:32  <Bjarni> it should be
22:58:35  <Bjarni> eventually
22:59:21  <Bjarni> but since it started yesterday or the day before, it's nowhere near usable and it has a timescale... a long one
22:59:37  <Bjarni> but it's a step in the right direction
23:00:10  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: truelight * r9183 /branches/noai/src/ai/core/ai_factory.hpp: [NoAI] -Fix: use 'instance' instead of 'this' in RegisterFactory
23:01:32  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: truelight * r9184 /branches/noai/src/ai/core/ai_factory.hpp:
23:01:32  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: [NoAI] -Revert r9183: now that was a bullshit commit
23:01:32  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Fix: remove instance-param as it is bullshit
23:01:57  <Bjarni> LOL
23:02:14  <Bjarni> one of the shortest lived commits ever in OTTD history
23:02:37  <mggrant> hehe
23:02:50  <Smoovious> yeah, but I'm glad to see it... :) multiple AI behaviors add so much more to a game... you don't have all the computer players basically playing the same way
23:03:22  <Bjarni> Smoovious: something completely different. You live near lake Erie, right?
23:03:25  <Smoovious> if they're being based on scripts, it'll be possible to add more later? like, if I wanted to make an AI script ofm my own?
23:03:32  <Smoovious> Lk Michigan...
23:03:44  <Smoovious> <-- Grand Rapids vicinity
23:03:51  <Bjarni> near the great lakes anyway
23:03:59  <Smoovious> you could say that
23:04:04  *** Rexxars [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:04:17  <Smoovious> if I'm going to indiana, and I find myself running into water, I've gone the wrong way
23:06:18  <Bjarni> I learned that they are pretty polluted. Bird watchers noticed that an abnormal amount of birds didn't produce offspring and tend to turn homosexual. After some lab tests, they think it's a chemical called PCB (banned for years, but decays extremely slowly)
23:06:44  <Bjarni> when I realised that I came to think about your dad...
23:07:07  <Smoovious> ...
23:07:11  <Bjarni> could be random and it could be an indication of something really scary
23:07:23  <Smoovious> could just mean you're a prick.
23:07:26  * Smoovious goes afk.
23:07:31  <Bjarni> hey
23:08:05  <Bjarni> I think you read that in a way it wasn't intended
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23:09:40  <peter1138> mental-note: hole in oven glove == pain
23:09:49  <Mortomes> ouch
23:10:02  <Progman> the squirrel.h isn't in the NoAI branch, is it?
23:11:51  <Bjarni> peter1138: auch.... reminds me of the time when I nearly burned my hand though a glove (without holes). I turned around and put it in a bucket of water.... being outside in November with a wet glove was not a nice though
23:12:11  <Bjarni> -a
23:15:49  <mikk36> Bjarni, PCB -> smth like DDT ?
23:16:52  <mikk36> hmm
23:18:05  *** green-devil [] has quit []
23:18:26  <Bjarni> actually it's a non-flamable liquid electric isolator that was used for cooling electrical stuff, like engines and generators
23:19:38  <Bjarni> they tried it on grown up people and they didn't show any signs of poisoning, so they presumed that i was completely safe until it was found in the blood of everybody on the planet, even people in areas where it had never been used
23:19:42  <Bjarni> then they banned it
23:19:44  <mikk36> as much as i can find, it's a material used in PCB's (printed circuit boards), named Polychlorinated Biphenyl
23:19:49  <mikk36> hmm
23:19:51  <mikk36> yup
23:20:18  <mikk36> brings up cancer etc if exposed for a long time
23:20:27  <Bjarni> printed circuit boards <-- it's not that kind of PCB...
23:20:48  <mikk36> well, PCB is used currently in PCB's
23:21:06  <Bjarni> then there are 3 kinds of PCB
23:21:20  <Bjarni> because the banned one was banned like 50 years ago
23:21:44  <Bjarni> I think
23:21:44  <mikk36> Many chemical methods are available to destroy or reduce the toxicity of PCBs.
23:22:00  <mikk36> it's possible to make PCB safe to health
23:22:07  <mikk36> PCB as a material
23:22:12  <mikk36> not that board
23:23:05  <mikk36> The Schwartz reaction is the subject of much study, and has significant benefits over other routes. It is advantageous since it proceeds via a reductive process, and thus yields no dioxins through oxidation. The proposed reaction scheme involves the electron transfer from a titanium (III) organometallic species to form a radical anion on the PCB molecule which expels chlorine to eventually form the relatively non-toxic biphenyl.
23:23:52  <mikk36> they might have banned PCB for some use
23:24:07  <mikk36> but not entirely it's existance
23:25:11  <mikk36> also, PCB is contained inside transformers and capacitors
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23:28:26  <Bjarni> hmm
23:28:54  <mikk36> or
23:28:55  <mikk36> to be sure
23:29:03  <mikk36> could u name the full name of the PCB u're talking about ?
23:29:10  <mikk36> full chemical name
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23:29:39  <mikk36> my PCB is PolyChlorinated Biphenyl
23:29:46  <mikk36> PCB from capital letters
23:30:09  <Bjarni> I thought they banned it
23:30:09  <Bjarni> but I presume that they are not releasing it into the rivers on purpose anymore
23:30:31  <Bjarni> GM did that for years into the Hudson river and now there is a thick layer on the bottom and they don't know what to do about it
23:31:06  <Bjarni> the problem is that the PCB I mentioned... I lost the source now :(
23:31:22  <Bjarni> I recorded it from TV and it appears to have been deleted
23:32:21  <peter1138>
23:32:41  <mikk36> that's my nfo source :)
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23:36:17  <Bjarni> Concern over the toxicity and persistence (chemical stability) of PCBs in the environment led the United States Congress to ban their domestic production in 1977
23:36:27  <Bjarni> so not 50 years ago, but still a while ago
23:36:31  <Bjarni> I think this is the stuff
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23:37:34  <mikk36> omg sanchez the movie is sick :D
23:40:07  <Bjarni> Studies have shown that PCBs alter estrogen levels in the body and contribute to reproduction problems. In the womb, males can be feminized or the baby may be intersex, neither a male nor a female. Also, both sets of reproductive organs may develop. More instances of this are being reported.
23:40:36  <Bjarni> now that doesn't sound healthy
23:40:49  <Sacro> reproductive organs?
23:40:50  <mikk36> ofc
23:41:12  <mikk36> uncleaned (de-doxified) PCB is unhealthy :)
23:41:22  <mikk36> de-toxified*
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23:43:04  <Bjarni> the Hudson river and the great lakes are highly contaminated and for some reason, so are the polar areas
23:43:35  <Bjarni> the wiki page doesn't mention the gay birds...
23:43:56  <Bjarni> maybe it's not political correct to mention
23:45:37  <Bjarni> but being able to modify the physical gender of an animal/human makes the jump to modify the self-aware of a gender not to far out
23:53:43  <mikk36> well
23:53:58  <mikk36> register in wikipedia and u can make a change
23:55:08  <Bjarni> well
23:55:26  <Bjarni> if I still had the source so I could refer to it, then I would
23:55:34  <mikk36> :)
23:55:42  <Bjarni> but without a source, people will react like Smoovious
23:55:45  <Bjarni> and remove it
23:55:57  <Bjarni> it appears like he really left
23:56:02  <Smoovious> I reacted like that because you're full of shit about it, Bjarni
23:56:16  <Smoovious> you have NO clue whatever when you try to talk about sexuality
23:57:02  <Bjarni> ...
23:57:43  <Smoovious> a person's sexuality isn't something to be fixed... or to find whatever pollutants you can use to be the scapegoat of the year to try and dehumanize what people are
23:58:15  <Smoovious> next thing you know, someone somewhere is going to come up with some other crackpot theory to try to scapegoat another chemical to explain why some guys are into fat chicks
23:58:33  <Smoovious> people are attracted to who they're attracted to... it is that simple, and human nature, and that's all that it is
23:58:38  <Bjarni> sexual attraction and love are chemical processes. Researchers claim that it will take like 50 years to get the basic research to make a treatment to make people fall in love by command
23:59:04  <Bjarni> it's a fact that it's a chemical process in the brain
23:59:17  <Smoovious> life itself is a chemical process... your 'fact' is useless

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