Log for #openttd on 4th May 2007:
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00:03:24  <Eddi|zuHause3> it's kind of an in-joke :)
00:06:50  <Sacro> PBIMTTD?
00:08:00  <Belugas_Gone> Eddi|zuHause3 is right ;)
00:08:11  <Belugas_Gone> and Sacro is strange ^_^
00:08:16  <Eddi|zuHause3> well, i am in :)
00:08:25  <Belugas_Gone> lol
00:10:21  <Belugas_Gone> btw, it's fun when the forums are quiet, i cna concentrate on stuff to do :D
00:11:50  <HMage> heheh
00:15:11  <elmex> i wonder whether this junction would be any good
00:16:16  <Eddi|zuHause3> the inner circle could be a little larger
00:16:22  <elmex> yes
00:16:37  <Eddi|zuHause3> and again joins before splits
00:16:40  <elmex> and then trains that want to go straight wouldn't block them
00:17:11  <elmex> ah, no
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00:18:00  <Eddi|zuHause3> there are a few unnecessary connections
00:18:08  <Eddi|zuHause3> you have two ways to turn right
00:18:22  <elmex> thats right
00:18:40  <Eddi|zuHause3> and some lines cannot turn left
00:21:04  <Eddi|zuHause3> Patrick: btw. a bridge length of 4 tiles means a signal every 5 tiles, not 6
00:21:58  <elmex> maybe this works
00:22:32  <Eddi|zuHause3> this will be blocking horribly :p
00:23:11  <elmex> yes
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00:25:07  <elmex> damn
00:27:36  <elmex> hm
00:27:43  <elmex> i don't understand the 'joins before splits' thing you mean
00:37:42  <Eddi|zuHause3> it basically means you have two unrelated paths that cross each other
00:38:01  <Eddi|zuHause3> which is an avoidable bottleneck
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00:52:37  <elmex> ok, next try:
00:52:40  <elmex>
00:52:45  <elmex> this one should be a bit better
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00:55:58  <elmex> but thats already doable with tunnels
01:00:05  <elmex> ah, no, not in that space
01:05:04  <elmex> unfortunately it slows down the main lines for trains that go straight
01:05:30  <elmex> the cloverleaf doesn't do that for at least one line when no train wants to change lines
01:05:51  <elmex> but maybe my junction plays better when it gets crowded
01:22:12  <elmex> well, gn8
01:24:46  <elmex> well, with one could still priorize one line by not building those yellow bridges
01:25:13  <elmex> and instead use the blue bridges for the direct path
01:26:47  <elmex> whatevr, gn8
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06:58:23  <elmex> re
06:58:38  <elmex> Eddi|zuHause2: did you see my last try at the bridge?
06:58:46  <elmex> err.. junction
07:04:53  <elmex> and could someone tell me why the layout in the wiki is completly broken?
07:05:30  <elmex>
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07:08:49  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: peter1138 * r9775 /trunk/src/newgrf.cpp: -Fix: Remove arbitrary limit on length of NewGRF strings.
07:10:49  <peter1138> it's not broken, it's... advanced
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07:13:11  <elmex> lol??
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07:22:17  <elmex> somehow building bridges on diagonals doesn't look very realistic ;-/
07:22:18  <elmex>
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07:26:02  <elmex> i don't like that junction, it makes trains that go right fast and trains that go straight slow
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07:41:04  <Wolf01> hello
07:41:22  <Patrick> well, tune your junctions for which way is the most importan
07:41:55  <Patrick> and it's a junction, so the main line will get periodically interrupted anyway
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08:00:49  <peter1138> pompiedom
08:01:13  <Rubidium> lalala
08:01:58  <peter1138> i was looking back through pre-r1000 newgrf stuff
08:02:01  <peter1138> it's... funny
08:02:30  <peter1138> blatantly trying to get a couple of sets working rather than following the spec...
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08:22:14  <Ashley> I give up, there seems to be something wrong with the grfs in the openttcoop grf pack. I've downloaded and installed them but I'm still getting four grf mismatches, any ideas on how to fix it?
08:22:59  <Ammller> Ashley: for what are you using this pack?
08:23:17  <peter1138> it worked for me
08:23:23  <Ashley> Trying to join the Sandbox server
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08:23:47  <peter1138> did you restart ottd after installing them?
08:24:03  <Ashley> Several times, the same four keep complaining
08:25:37  <Ammller> I can't believe, that its still possible to join with wrong grf's.
08:27:01  <Ammller> Ashley: when did you download the pack?
08:27:15  <Ashley> About half an hour ago
08:28:02  <Ammller> from here: ?
08:28:24  <Ashley> Yes
08:28:46  <Ashley> Perhaps I downloaded the wrong one?
08:29:09  <Ammller> there is no wrong one, not that I know of
08:29:18  <Ammller> which one did you take
08:30:27  <Ashley> Hmm, we may be on to something here. The first one ending in .exe
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08:31:31  <Ammller> btw, join #openttdcoop
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08:45:11  <elmex> hm
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08:47:46  <elmex> peter1138: hm, are you a main developer?
08:48:23  <TrueBrain> elmex: you do know there is a very pretty website which defines who is what inside OpenTTD developers blabla
08:48:24  <TrueBrain> ?
08:48:33  <elmex> nope
08:48:45  <TrueBrain> try
08:48:47  <TrueBrain> you might like it
08:49:05  <elmex> i know that website, but does that contain a mapping of irc-nicks to developers?
08:49:26  <TrueBrain> if you just would have looked around....
08:50:09  <peter1138> why bother looking when you can ask :)
08:50:31  <elmex> TrueBrain: i'm sorry, i've never looked in the 'Contact' section
08:50:36  <TrueBrain> peter1138: in that case, I have many questions for you..... :p
08:50:39  <TrueBrain> elmex: :)
08:50:42  <peter1138> by some rare coincidence, i do happen to be the same peter1138 as listed in the credits...
08:50:54  <elmex> ah :-)
08:50:56  <peter1138> TrueBrain: the answer is yes, no, and maybe.
08:51:11  <TrueBrain> yes, you do own me money, no, you are not giving it back, and maybe you want to die for it
08:51:12  <TrueBrain> hmm
08:51:13  <TrueBrain> okay :p
08:51:17  <TrueBrain> own = owe
08:51:24  <peter1138> no, i own your money
08:51:31  <peter1138> mwahaha
08:51:34  <TrueBrain> :'(
08:51:38  <TrueBrain> See, there things go wrong
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08:57:39  <elmex> uh, extending the gui isn't a trivial task
08:58:55  <elmex> i would love to implement a 'estimated income' thingie in the train detail
08:58:55  <elmex> s
09:01:53  <elmex> i guess i will do it when i have more concentration ;/
09:02:30  <TrueBrain> I doubt you can make an estimated income value that is ever reached for real
09:02:50  <elmex> yes, but it is still useful imo
09:03:20  <TrueBrain> and then I mean that I doubt it will be even near the value estimated :)
09:04:21  <elmex> well, i think more of a 'estimated income at next stop' thingie
09:04:40  <TrueBrain> without breakdowns, you can estimate that, sort of
09:04:49  <elmex> yes
09:05:18  <elmex> its woudl just be an estimation of course after all :-)
09:06:13  <Rubidium> elmex: the estimated income thingy is useless, because you really cannot estimate at the moment you leave
09:06:28  <elmex> estimation is always possible
09:06:42  <elmex> even the constant 0 would be an estimation :-)
09:06:52  <TrueBrain> let's talk about an estimate that is no more wrong then 3% of the real value
09:06:58  <Rubidium> that is an useless estimation
09:07:10  <Rubidium> (about elmex' 0)
09:07:15  <elmex> yes
09:08:02  <elmex> but an estimation that becomes better as the vehicle gets nearer to the station would be possible
09:08:32  <elmex> or ok. lets not call it estimated income but 'cargo value'
09:09:26  <elmex> you could calc the current theoretical income with the distance you have from the station of the cargo and the current time
09:09:28  <Rubidium> elmex: the only thing you can do is give the cargo value at the travelled distance/time since departure. No more, no less, because all other estimates are going to be totally crap
09:09:38  <elmex> yes
09:09:41  <elmex> ok
09:10:59  <Rubidium> ofcourse for transfered cargo that's going to be pretty tricky
09:11:36  <elmex> why?
09:12:38  <Rubidium> because you need to calculate multiple travelled distance/times and apply some math to get the correct cargo value
09:13:19  <elmex> hmm
09:13:28  <elmex> damn, i've too few time ;-/
09:15:51  <elmex> i just would love to have more help with finding out how much of the income of a train is decimated by the time
09:16:41  <TrueBrain> I can understand that you do, it is just a bit tricky in current model :)
09:17:42  <elmex> :)
09:19:08  <elmex> hm, the fixed pixel guil layout sometimes breaks with translation in german
09:19:16  <elmex> s/guil/gui/
09:20:44  <elmex> lol, i've just found this on a server:
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09:25:16  <elmex> hm it's really painful when you build a network all day and then you have to leave the server
09:25:26  <elmex> at least it's possible to do a savegame
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10:05:31  <waroffice> lo
10:05:53  <waroffice> im stuck with developing
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10:08:00  <Patrick> give us time
10:11:51  <elmex> :)
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10:25:41  <elmex> this heightmap thingie is really scary: :-)
10:26:21  <Rubidium> ;)
10:27:02  <Rubidium> I'd bulldoze your head, so you get rid of the water ;)
10:30:45  <Patrick> hahaha, that's hilarious
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10:36:48  <elmex> hm
10:37:00  <elmex> i would love a heightmap of germany, so one could do a scenario for it ;/
10:44:24  <Patrick> yes, freight trains full of passengers in germany
10:44:28  <Patrick> because that always ends well
10:45:42  <peter1138> who what?
10:46:28  <Patrick> design a custom industry to turn passengers into luggage and gold teeth
10:50:19  <elmex> ?
10:50:24  <elmex> lol
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11:06:53  <Osai^zZz> hi all
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11:26:30  <elmex> i geuss this would be another possibility with a 4 way junction:
11:26:58  <elmex> onfortunately one line is slowed down by a long bridge where the other is slowed down by bridge+tunnel
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11:27:58  <Progman> this junction looks cool anyway ;)
11:28:41  <elmex> i havent tested it yet
11:28:47  <elmex> but it doesn't consume much space
11:28:58  <elmex> and isn't that hard to build i guess
11:29:22  <elmex> compare it to:
11:29:39  <elmex> that one is more symmetric, which means: each line has the same slowdown
11:30:04  <elmex> the junction8 als has no 90degree turns
11:30:35  <elmex> (the junction10 could be extended to prevent 90 degree turns of course)
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11:34:32  <neli> elmex: but it has no signalling
11:35:07  <elmex> i guess the signalling can be added in an actual application :)
11:35:38  <neli> but there are splits+bridges
11:35:46  <neli> that do not allow signal after split
11:36:31  <elmex> you mean at the end of the yellow ones?
11:37:10  <elmex> ah
11:41:38  <elmex> neli: - i guesss this one should do
11:42:38  <Patrick> wherever possible, you should land the longer bridges, put signals there, then do another bridge
11:42:45  <Patrick> the junction gets bigger but throughput goes up
11:42:55  <elmex> yes, thats right
11:43:09  <neli> elmex: ah I see the bridges were too long anyway
11:43:14  <elmex> neli: yea
11:43:39  <elmex> Patrick: in the end it all depends on the space you have
11:43:59  <neli> elmex: wait, you're missing a signal on the topright gray bridge
11:44:07  <elmex> neli: oh, damn, i knew it :)
11:44:07  <elmex> well
11:45:03  <neli> it has space for it though
11:45:39  <Patrick>
11:45:45  <elmex> a cloverleaf would be smaller
11:45:46  <Patrick> that's what I came up with
11:45:52  <Patrick> the template, so it's got no signals
11:46:01  <elmex> yep
11:46:04  <Patrick> join up the middle with bridges whichever way you want
11:46:19  <elmex> it even fits into the same space
11:46:35  <Patrick> grow it bigger if you want 10-car trains to turn fast with realistic acceleration
11:46:50  <Patrick> remember, 7 angled bits for 8-car, 9 angled bits for 10-car
11:47:00  <Patrick> the distance tool gets it right
11:47:09  <elmex> distnace tool?
11:47:23  <Patrick> some option shows you the distance on every drag-drop rail laying
11:47:32  <elmex> ah
11:48:12  <Patrick> see also
11:48:16  <Patrick> for a three-way
11:48:29  <Patrick> I also have designs where some of the branches are at angles
11:48:37  <elmex> ah, yes
11:49:02  <elmex> damn, why didn't i come up with ;-/
11:49:05  <elmex> it's way more simple
11:49:30  <peter1138> but... the middle!
11:49:42  <Patrick> like I said, hook it up how you want
11:49:44  <elmex> the middle needs bridges :)
11:49:46  <Patrick> that was one I just played with
11:49:53  <Patrick> bridge it whichever way has less traffic
11:49:59  <Patrick> although technically that doesn't matter
11:50:20  <Patrick> the best junction, ideally, is one where you can specify one route that's high-capacity and that one doesn't get its signal spacing interrupted
11:50:22  <peter1138> or use cheating tunnels, heh
11:50:29  <Patrick> and in this respect I've failed
11:50:46  <elmex> well, i've failed too :)
11:50:59  <neli> Patrick: how to go from bottom to right ?
11:51:26  <Patrick> which junction?
11:51:52  <Patrick> it should work
11:52:00  <Patrick> there are hardly any signals, sorry
11:52:12  <Patrick> I do left-hand drive but that won't make a difference
11:53:12  <peter1138> hmm, i still need to fix that up/down bug
11:53:18  <Patrick> --> le shop
11:56:49  <RobertGrammig> the calculation of passenger or good value is done based on the closest distance of one station complex to the other one, right?
11:57:15  <elmex> it's the manhattan distance between the stations, yes
11:57:27  <Patrick> but where is the station position taken from
11:57:35  <elmex> Patrick: well, could be build with tunnels too
11:57:36  <Patrick> I always thought it was the position of the station's sign
11:57:43  <Patrick> elmex: ugly though
11:57:53  <Patrick> and take up too much space unlessyou use build on slope
11:57:59  <Patrick> and slop building is ugly so I turn it off
11:58:03  <antichaos> Patrick I think it is from the tile you clicked on when you placed the station
11:58:14  <Patrick> yes.
11:58:17  <elmex> Patrick: oh, ok, it's on per default, so i take it as granted :)
11:58:23  <Patrick> and then you can "ladder" the station around
11:58:49  <RobertGrammig> manhattan distance?
11:59:01  <Patrick> X + y
11:59:24  <Patrick> not pythagorean distance, (x**2 + y**2) ** 0.5
11:59:35  <Patrick> means that diagonal runs are root2 more profitable
11:59:46  <RobertGrammig> ok I see that is fai
11:59:48  <elmex> :)
11:59:48  <RobertGrammig> fair
11:59:58  <Patrick> it's not, it's exploitable :/
11:59:59  <Patrick> anyway
12:00:45  <RobertGrammig> Its a bit stupid that you dont take the nearest station tiles though
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12:01:28  <RobertGrammig> that way you can really easily shorten the actual track the train has to run
12:01:42  <antichaos> That would take alot of extra time to calculate
12:05:33  <RobertGrammig> but wouldnt it be possible to make the payoff propotional to the distance between the place where the train did unload the goods and the station tile that is used to calculate the distance?
12:06:03  <RobertGrammig> and you should be able to set the relevant tile as well, of course
12:07:29  <RobertGrammig> for example payoff will be decreased by 5% for each tile that the arrival tile of the train is away from the central tile of the station complex
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12:09:00  <elmex> ??
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12:13:42  <RobertGrammig> I can found, for example, a station A and a station B with both being 50 X tiles and 10 Y tiles apart. Now I build additional station blocks to reduce the actual track distance the train has to cover is 48 X tiles and 0 Y tiles, but I still get the 50+10= 60 tile difference payout, right?
12:17:55  <elmex> hm, will the copy/paste patch ever get into openttd?
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13:01:29  <Belugas> hello
13:01:41  <Wolf01> hi
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14:11:07  <Touqen> Give me your soul!
14:11:11  <Touqen> cough...
14:13:03  <hylje> no
14:13:43  <Belugas> only my wife and my boss give me orders
14:13:49  <Belugas> so, no
14:14:16  <Touqen> Darn...
14:14:23  * Touqen will try again in a week
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14:19:21  <Touqen> So...How's PBS coming along?
14:21:16  <Belugas> nowhere
14:21:21  <Belugas> or so i think,
14:21:30  <Belugas> unless someone is working on it secretly
14:21:49  <Touqen> Boo.
14:22:09  <peter1138> y7eah
14:22:10  <Touqen> I know that it was to be implemented on YAPF and YAPF seems to have gotten quite far since the last forum post regarding PBS.
14:27:44  <peter1138> but not pbs though
14:47:30  <Touqen> hmmm...
14:56:38  <RobertGrammig> does my reputation in a town have an impact on the number of passengers I get?
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15:08:00  <Sionide> RobertGrammig, no.. only on the councils leaniency in letting you build round their town
15:08:19  <Sionide> RobertGrammig, if you want more passengers, fund an advertising campaign (by clicking the name of the town)
15:22:43  <Cipri> Is there any newGRF that contains bridges the Cimaera can take at full speed(643kph)? Max tube bridge has a 611kph speed limit.
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15:57:52  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: truelight * r9776 /branches/noai/ (5 files in 3 dirs): [NoAI] -Add: added AITileListSlope as valuator to see if tiles are flat or not
15:58:01  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: truelight * r9777 /branches/noai/ (5 files in 3 dirs): [NoAI] -Fix: renamed AITileListFlat to AITileListSlope and returnt he slope value
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16:02:46  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: truelight * r9778 /branches/noai/bin/ai/regression/regression.txt: [NoAI] -Fix r9776: forgot to update regression output (tnx glx)
16:03:51  <SpComb> but did you remember to submit a regression test for this omission?
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16:27:25  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: belugas * r9779 /trunk/src/ (9 files in 2 dirs): (log message trimmed)
16:27:25  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Feature: Add the possiblity to choose different road patterns for towns to use.
16:27:25  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: Possible patterns are :
16:27:25  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: No Road (not available in scenario editor)
16:27:25  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: Original (for the nostalgics)
16:27:27  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: Better Roads (same as original, but based on distance of 2 tiles instead of one)
16:27:29  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: 2x2 grids
16:29:00  <hylje> what about 2-tile-wide town roads?
16:29:29  <Eddi|zuHause> go code them? :)
16:29:40  <hylje> wut no
16:29:45  <hylje> maybe someday
16:30:03  <peter1138> woo :D
16:30:15  <hylje> 2-wide roads could make big towns seem really big
16:30:29  <peter1138> 2-wide roads are a job for the scenario editor, and SAC :D
16:30:44  <hylje> sac=?
16:30:50  <peter1138> SAC!
16:30:54  <hylje> omg sac
16:34:31  <hylje> hm
16:34:42  <hylje> does SDL get massive boost from architecture optimization?
16:34:57  <hylje> on my gentoo install ottd was snappy and all, on ubuntu it seems just sluggish
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16:38:56  <Belugas> mmmh
16:39:00  <Belugas> following :
16:39:00  <Belugas> 3x3 grids
16:39:00  <Belugas> Patch by skiddl13
16:39:30  <hylje> :D
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16:41:14  <antichaos> Belugas I've got the shared delivery patch ready.
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16:42:00  <Belugas> nice :)
16:42:06  <Belugas> send it, please
16:45:58  <antichaos> just putting some details in an email
16:50:01  <hylje> r we getting patches to trunk?
16:52:42  <Eddi|zuHause> no, patches never ever go to trunk
16:53:37  <hylje> thats why i'm most astonished
16:54:51  <Belugas> we've been paid
16:55:30  <Belugas> antichaos: got it, thanks
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17:03:17  <Belugas> antichaos, function comment starts with /** and should end with <NEWLINE><SPACE>*/
17:03:27  <Belugas> just starting reading...
17:04:09  <Belugas> on the second line of a if (), add another indent
17:04:28  <Belugas> very nice and descriptive comments :)
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17:11:38  <Belugas> antichaos: looks pretty nice
17:11:40  <antichaos> where's the bad if?
17:11:58  <Belugas> on ShareGoodsToIndustry
17:12:39  <Belugas> so, ind->accepts_cargo[1] = +1 tab
17:12:44  <Belugas> same for 2
17:13:02  <Belugas> and "total_tiles += (*iter)..." + -1 tab
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17:13:12  <Belugas> and "total_tiles += (*iter)..." = -1 tab
17:13:14  <Belugas> sorry
17:13:25  <Belugas> same for iter++
17:13:28  <antichaos> ah ok
17:13:45  <Belugas> code style, really...
17:13:58  <Belugas> i need to check it at home tonigh, for the rest
17:15:55  <Belugas> are you sure "te->params_2 = GetDParam(4);"  is a bug, by the way?
17:16:00  <Belugas> waht's the implications?
17:16:07  <Belugas> if ever it gets called?
17:16:29  <antichaos> GetDparam(4) could be junk
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17:17:38  <antichaos> since they aren't cleared after use.
17:18:08  <antichaos> obviously you could work around it by calling SetDParam(4) for your second argument
17:18:45  <Belugas> ok
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17:21:26  <Belugas> about the DeliverGoodsToIndustry, since it is standard behaviour, i think it should still be available,
17:21:33  <Belugas> but this is open to discussion
17:22:36  <antichaos> I'll put in a setting to switch between them, then we can compare performance and behaviour.
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17:25:15  <Belugas> indeed
17:25:32  <Belugas> but for now, let's just resume work@work
17:25:35  <Belugas> and thanks again
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17:45:38  <peter1138> hmm, yes
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18:38:04  <dihedral> hello there
18:38:32  <TrueBrain> hi dihedral
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18:58:12  <peter1138> well i never
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19:24:24  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: peter1138 * r9780 /trunk/src/train_cmd.cpp: -Codechange: [NewGRF] Add support for variable vehicle weight for trains (callback 36, property 16)
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19:28:16  <Ammler> peter1138: did you fix the grf problem?
19:28:26  <peter1138> not yet
19:28:55  <Ammler> ok, thx anyway :)
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19:55:50  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: truelight * r9781 /branches/noai/ (10 files in 4 dirs):
19:55:50  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: [NoAI] -Add: added AIVehicleListProfit[This|Last]Year as valuator
19:55:50  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: [NoAI] -Add: added AIVehicleList(Max)Age(Left) (3 functions) valuators
19:55:50  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: [NoAI] -Add: added AIVehicleList and some valuators
19:55:50  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: [NoAI] -Add: added regression test for AIVehicleList
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20:11:33  <Wolf01> how much far is the development for noai?
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20:22:44  <Eddi|zuHause> i doubt it is anywhere close to finished...
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20:27:42  <TrueBrain> <- Wolf01: I just wrote a piece about it
20:28:51  <Wolf01> yeah, now stations, tomorrow the world!
20:30:54  <Eddi|zuHause> only together with TruePinky :)
20:36:26  <TrueBrain> Eddi|zuHause: I am still wondering when someone nicks itself like that :)
20:36:36  <TrueBrain> "What are we going to do today Brain?"
20:37:32  <Eddi|zuHause> i was actually wondering if i should, but i am too much of a brain myself to pose as pinky ;)
20:40:22  <TrueBrain> I love 'git' :)
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20:47:35  <Eddi|zuHause> hm, is that a word i should recognise?
20:48:20  <TrueBrain> if you do 'svn' and 'cvs', yes
20:48:29  <TrueBrain> if you do 'linux kernel development', yes
20:48:40  <TrueBrain> if you do 'wine development', yes
20:48:45  <TrueBrain> if you do 'vlc development', yes
20:48:45  <TrueBrain> :p
20:48:49  <Eddi|zuHause> i rarely do any of that :)
20:50:55  <Wolf01> that's all folks, for today, night
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21:10:58  <Zuu> I've made a scenario in the scenario editor to ensure the map is good. Then when I start a dedicated server with it using the -g flag an "unnamed" company is created. Is this a feature or a bug?
21:11:29  <glx> -D -g or -g -D ?
21:11:36  <Zuu> -D -g
21:12:03  <Zuu> So it should be in reverse order?
21:12:47  <Zuu> Tried -g -D, same problem.
21:13:06  <TrueBrain> and '-g' without a map behind it?
21:13:11  <TrueBrain> (so just: ./openttd -D -g)
21:13:31  <Zuu> I have a map behind -g, but I'll try w/o.
21:13:52  <TrueBrain> why I ask: the bug can be in two places, this rules out one :)
21:14:34  <Zuu> -g -D or -D -g  without a map gives no unnamed company.
21:15:10  <TrueBrain> so the problem is when loading the scenario :) Most likely it isn't dedicated-server aware :)
21:15:15  <TrueBrain> make a bug report :)
21:15:19  <Zuu> Shall I upload my openttd.cfg + scenario?
21:15:44  <Zuu> Okay, bugreport will be :)
21:18:07  *** boekabart [] has quit [Quit: Your eyes grow heavy.. you grow very sleepy..... zzzz...]
21:18:47  <Zuu> hmm, happens on default openttd.cfg.. but no worry, there will be a bugreport soon :)
21:26:55  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: truelight * r9782 /branches/noai/ (6 files in 2 dirs): [NoAI] -Add: add information functions to AIVehicle, like the valuators of AIVehicleList
21:29:33  <Zuu>
21:29:44  <TrueBrain> Zuu: I already noticed ;)
21:29:49  <Zuu> TrueBrain: Hehe :)
21:29:52  <TrueBrain> [23:29] <_42_> Flyspray: [FS#765] New Bug Report (sev: Low, prio: Normal): 'Unnamed company when starting dedicated server...', by Leif Linse -
21:29:53  <TrueBrain> :)
21:30:43  <Zuu> Is that from the top secret dev-channel? :p
21:31:05  <TrueBrain> haha, top secret it is not, but it is on a side-channel yes, as we don't want to spam that information in here (yet)
21:32:30  <Zuu> Well, the channel name is not sateted anywere I've been looking at least. But probably it is just to guess some names :)
21:33:27  <glx> Zuu: you can use your irc client to find it ;)
21:33:33  <TrueBrain> you won't 'guess' it, but there is also no need to be there :p Most people who have been there, run away VERY fast :)
21:33:56  <TrueBrain> all except XeryusTC, but oh well "onkruid vergaat niet" :p :p :p
21:33:58  * TrueBrain pets XeryusTC
21:34:08  <XeryusTC> huh?
21:34:13  <TrueBrain> hahahahaha :)
21:34:15  * XeryusTC slaps TrueBrain with -18°C
21:34:22  <TrueBrain> I went to the beach today :)
21:34:25  <TrueBrain> it was cold, but fun :)
21:34:49  <XeryusTC> i got "ingewerkt" in the freezer today :P
21:34:54  <XeryusTC> and i was sweating like a pig
21:34:56  <TrueBrain> lol :)
21:35:45  <XeryusTC> and that was with my jacket open
21:37:03  * Zuu was on a lecture about traffic modeling yesterday
21:37:15  <XeryusTC> i need to do some work on my AI once again
21:37:25  <XeryusTC> but then, i also need to do homework :P
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21:37:59  <Zuu> I reread the list of API-classes and it have grown a bit since last. :)
21:38:10  <XeryusTC> yeah
21:38:10  <TrueBrain> slowly, it is :)
21:38:16  <XeryusTC> well, it's time to use the TileList :P
21:38:25  <XeryusTC> so i can reincarnate my old AI somewhat
21:38:35  <TrueBrain>;a=blob;f=bin/ai/tb/main.nut;h=84b1fcab3a5dfa7d1fdaf23c386dda725f2bd1e8;hb=tb
21:38:37  <TrueBrain> my attempt so far :)
21:38:40  <XeryusTC> which was even more stupid than the default TT ai i must say
21:38:45  <Zuu> TrueBrain: Have you concidered to add some way to populate a TileList with tiles from a town?
21:39:01  <TrueBrain> Zuu: what exactly do you mean?
21:39:20  <XeryusTC> it isnt possible to populate a TL?
21:39:52  <Zuu> As it is now you can only get the town centre and guess the town radius to calculate a rectangle that you then add.
21:40:02  <Zuu> right?
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21:40:17  <TrueBrain> town radius is always guessing
21:40:24  <XeryusTC> TrueBrain:
21:40:25  <TrueBrain> you want to get all the tiles the town own or something?
21:40:48  <Zuu> With buildings or town road on.
21:40:57  <TrueBrain>;a=blob;f=bin/ai/tb/main.nut;hb=tb <- ha, even better :)
21:41:10  <TrueBrain> Zuu: town radius isn't predefined, so that is almost impossible
21:41:15  <TrueBrain> scanning the whole map is too expensive
21:41:33  <Zuu> Well, I will probably not use it in close future, so don't implement it because I said it now. :)
21:42:02  <TrueBrain> Zuu: such functions should be called with great care, so I rather not add them at all :p
21:42:14  <Zuu> :)
21:42:31  <TrueBrain> I just made a 14x14 rectangle around city-core
21:42:35  <Zuu> Just though that it is something that many AIs would like to do :)
21:42:37  <TrueBrain> but I agree that it is a bit of gambling :)
21:43:07  <TrueBrain> my AI makes 2k profit per bus, local city routes only
21:43:08  <TrueBrain> not bad :)
21:43:22  <Zuu> :)
21:43:35  <XeryusTC> nice :)
21:43:42  <TrueBrain> try to beat it ;)
21:43:48  <XeryusTC> my AI sets its name from a predefined list :P
21:44:01  <XeryusTC> oh, and one of the persons on that list died :'(
21:44:09  <TrueBrain> auch
21:44:15  <XeryusTC> actually, the person the AI is called after :P
21:44:29  <XeryusTC> TrueBrain: it is just an anime, although it rocks all other animes :P
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21:46:19  <Zuu> XeryusTC: Well, stop watching the anime and build her up again :p :)
21:46:42  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: truelight * r9783 /branches/noai/ (5 files in 3 dirs): [NoAI] -Fix: make naming more consistent between Valuators: don't add Get before them.
21:47:14  <XeryusTC> Zuu: i'll probably get special lenses in her honor :P
21:47:25  <XeryusTC> blood red :9
21:48:10  <XeryusTC> i should first get colorless lenses though :P
21:48:58  <Zuu> hehe, got glases now?
21:49:11  <XeryusTC> yes
21:49:14  <XeryusTC> until monday :P
21:49:19  <Zuu> hehe
21:54:39  <Zuu> I'm a lucky one, I got nither glases nor lenses. :)
21:54:48  <TrueBrain> me neither :)
21:54:58  <Zuu> But I got two DSPs :)
21:57:26  <TrueBrain> My AI is dying :)
21:58:05  <Zuu> More features in a DSP than in siple lenses :)
21:58:05  <TrueBrain> I really do need station managing
21:58:32  <Zuu> TrueBrain: as in amout of buses?
21:58:46  <TrueBrain> Zuu: no, -3k profit per year in total
21:58:49  <TrueBrain> mostly because of full loan
21:59:44  <Zuu> You could copy my ugly bank acount manager or write your own :)
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22:00:04  <Zuu> But that only helps as in not loaning to much in the begining. :)
22:01:41  <Zuu> It won't stop you from using up all your money or take a maximum loan.
22:02:13  <XeryusTC> Zuu: what's a DSP?
22:02:26  <Zuu> XeryusTC: Digital Sound Processor
22:02:32  <XeryusTC> oh
22:02:44  <XeryusTC> i've got 2 of those too :P
22:02:44  <Zuu> So, if you have not guessed yet, hearing aids :)
22:02:55  <XeryusTC> in my pc though :P
22:03:05  <XeryusTC> :o
22:06:19  <setrodox> Zuu, Signal, not Sound
22:06:31  <setrodox> atleast in the common definition of dsp
22:06:40  <Zuu> setrodox: Okay :)
22:06:49  <setrodox> sorry, didn't want to sound nit picky xD
22:06:59  <Zuu> setrodox: No problem..
22:07:03  <setrodox> :)
22:07:58  <Zuu> I read a course about signal and systems now, so if I open the english text book I might find the definition of "DSP" in it.
22:08:07  <Zuu> :)
22:08:40  <setrodox> oh :)
22:09:01  <TrueBrain> property maintaince sucks!
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22:10:22  <TrueBrain> bah, bankrupt
22:10:33  <Zuu> TrueBrain: Yea, Add a function to bring up the cheat window and get some extra cash ;) :p
22:10:38  <TrueBrain> repaying your loan all the time might not be the smartest :)
22:11:08  <XeryusTC> TrueBrain: cant you clone Igor's AI, or was that one too stupid for you?
22:11:23  <XeryusTC> and could you please get yourself ops, you're somewhat at the end of my tablist
22:11:59  <TrueBrain> XeryusTC: I dunno about igor's, I do know my own GPMI AI was pretty good. Just functions changed, ideas changed, so I am happily starting over :)
22:12:41  <XeryusTC> TrueBrain: wasnt the FastAI your AI? :P
22:12:54  <TrueBrain> also
22:12:59  <XeryusTC> seeing as it has the same level of intelligence as you :P
22:13:04  <TrueBrain> My AI beat Igor's in the end :)
22:13:45  <TrueBrain> +did
22:14:21  <XeryusTC> :o
22:14:31  <XeryusTC> lies
22:14:44  *** Tino|Home [] has joined #openttd
22:14:53  <TrueBrain> hmm, my current AI sucks in design :p
22:14:55  <TrueBrain> haha :)
22:14:59  <XeryusTC> hmm
22:15:01  <TrueBrain> but it doesn't matter, I just need it to test functions
22:15:09  <XeryusTC> my AI owns all of your AIs :P
22:15:11  <TrueBrain> and to show that it can be done :)
22:15:18  <TrueBrain> show me :)
22:15:26  <XeryusTC> isnt the regression to test functions too?
22:15:40  <TrueBrain> it just tests that it replies what we expect them
22:15:48  <TrueBrain> in my own AI I test them if they do what I expect them to
22:15:51  <XeryusTC> yes, but it tests ;)
22:16:02  <TrueBrain> so I noticed the loan system is kind of crappy :)
22:16:07  <XeryusTC> :P
22:16:10  *** DJ_Mirage [] has quit [Quit:]
22:16:21  <TrueBrain> so I noticed sending vehicles to a depot sucks
22:16:21  <XeryusTC> you just need a good way to repay the loans :P
22:16:45  <XeryusTC> like, repaying half of your loan when you hit some kind of number or something
22:16:56  <TrueBrain> best way is: repay loan as much as possible
22:17:01  <TrueBrain> when you want to build something, first estimate the value
22:17:07  <TrueBrain> borrow it, build it
22:17:09  <TrueBrain> repay as much as possible
22:17:42  <TrueBrain> in fact is kind of cheating, as the AI has a much better estimate then a human being will ever have :)
22:17:57  <XeryusTC> well, the AI has always cheated in TT
22:18:05  <TrueBrain> no excuse :)
22:18:14  <XeryusTC> well, you cant break with traditions ;)
22:18:45  <TrueBrain> the truth is that it will always cheat at some level :)
22:18:52  <TrueBrain> just it won't cheat on the level it did in TT :s
22:18:55  <TrueBrain> free terraforming
22:18:55  <TrueBrain> bah
22:19:01  <XeryusTC> :P
22:20:06  *** Sacro|Laptop [~Ben@] has joined #openttd
22:20:25  <XeryusTC> ah well, i wonder when i can get working on my AI again
22:20:49  <TrueBrain> how about... now?
22:20:50  <XeryusTC> fscking school
22:20:55  <XeryusTC> and other stuff
22:21:05  <XeryusTC> like TRoS and NFO
22:21:41  *** TinoM| [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
22:21:48  <XeryusTC> and work ofcourse
22:21:49  <TrueBrain> poor poor baby
22:21:53  <TrueBrain> want a cookie?
22:21:55  <XeryusTC> yes!
22:21:59  <XeryusTC> chocolate chip pls :P
22:22:06  <TrueBrain> well, in fact, I have some here
22:22:10  <TrueBrain> come and pick them up :)
22:22:19  <XeryusTC> hmm
22:22:25  <XeryusTC> no trains here anymore
22:22:34  <TrueBrain> I have no idea where you live, so that might be a bit tricky :p
22:22:41  <XeryusTC> so if you live within 15 mins cycling ill come over :P
22:23:10  <Rubidium> Sneek vs Leiden... you must be cycling *very* fast to do that in 15 minutes :)
22:23:16  <TrueBrain> Yup...
22:23:58  <glx> Zuu:
22:24:03  <TrueBrain> almost 2 hours with the car
22:24:07  <XeryusTC> well, give me a jet engine
22:24:23  <TrueBrain> which morron goes living in Friesland anyway...
22:24:29  <XeryusTC> my parents
22:24:36  <TrueBrain> poor choice :p
22:24:37  <XeryusTC> because my grandparents did
22:24:41  <TrueBrain> bad excuse
22:24:53  <XeryusTC> and the other people in my family wont even visit you if you dont live in the same street :/
22:25:06  <XeryusTC> really, they have problems driving 5km for a birthday :/
22:25:25  <TrueBrain> lol, I do that on my bike
22:25:33  <XeryusTC> yes
22:25:38  <XeryusTC> i do that for school every day
22:25:48  <TrueBrain> I did that for school every day :p
22:25:51  <TrueBrain> those days are long over
22:26:04  <TrueBrain> pff, the AI class-list is getting really big...
22:26:06  <Rubidium> yeah, 500m is max :)
22:26:44  <XeryusTC> Rubidium: you are like my family
22:27:01  <Rubidium> nah, 500m university<->home
22:27:10  <Zuu> Rubidium: Same here :)
22:27:17  <Zuu> glx: Will try.. :)
22:27:27  <TrueBrain> I have to bike like 10 minutes :p
22:27:28  <Rubidium> my university is like 3 hours by public transport from the rest of my family and I visit them fairly regular
22:27:38  <XeryusTC> :o
22:27:41  <Rubidium> *when I'm lucky
22:27:49  <XeryusTC> and it takes you 1.5 hour to get to uni? :P
22:27:51  <SpComb> depending on your definition of home, my school<->home is either 0km or somewhere around 1800km
22:28:03  <Touqen> Is your dorm really home?
22:28:12  <TrueBrain> Touqen: yes
22:28:17  <SpComb> it's my official address of residence
22:28:23  <Rubidium> SpComb: you sleep in the faculty?
22:28:30  <SpComb> boarding school
22:28:31  <TrueBrain> SpComb: hehe, 1800, nice :) For me between 2km and 200km :p
22:28:46  <SpComb> my parents live in germany, and I go to school in Finland
22:29:18  <TrueBrain> long way from home :)
22:29:47  <SpComb> I fly over there three/four times a year
22:29:50  <SpComb> takes me about 12h each way
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22:30:10  <Touqen> SpComb: Lots of layovers?
22:30:21  <Rubidium> ghehe of which at least 3 hours is waiting at the airport
22:31:00  <XeryusTC> SpComb: cant you drive that in less time
22:31:05  <SpComb> no, but with the train travel and whatnot to/from the airport that's how long it takes
22:31:19  <SpComb> XeryusTC: 18h to stockholm and then another 16h on the ferry, plus an hour or two in finland
22:31:31  <SpComb> or something along those lines
22:31:36  <Touqen> That's nuts.
22:31:41  <SpComb> takes the better part of two days to drive here
22:31:44  <XeryusTC> :|
22:31:55  <ln-> who spends 16h on a ferry?
22:32:07  <Touqen> What are you ferrying across?
22:32:08  <ln-> stockholm-turku is certainly less..
22:32:11  <SpComb> well, a passanger ferry... cabins with beds
22:32:21  <SpComb> well, 12h or something, it's a slow ferry
22:33:00  <SpComb> 9h in germany, 2h in denmark, 7h in sweden
22:33:22  <Touqen> Southern finland doesn't have an airport?
22:33:35  <SpComb> sure... I normally fly Helsinki <-> Munich
22:33:39  <yeti_> SpComb: if i may ask: so your parents are finnish but live in germany?
22:33:51  <glx> Zuu: patch is against trunk but shouldn't be hard for you to adapt it ;)
22:33:59  <Zuu> glx: Manually applied your patch on 0.5.1 and it solves the problem. Both with ./openttd -D -g scenario/test.scn and ./openttd -g scenario/test.scn -D.
22:35:43  <SpComb> yeti_: yes
22:44:12  <dihedral> Rubidium: remember talking about the smooth economy stuff a few days back?
22:44:44  <dihedral> Rubidium: check this out:
22:46:01  <Touqen> The farms grow/shrink in response to being serviced?
22:46:38  <dihedral> not to my knowledge
22:46:59  <dihedral> ah - sorry, yes
22:47:09  <dihedral> more than now at least
22:48:45  <dihedral> it would solve the issue of having low productions never getting an increase (1-4)
22:51:23  <dihedral> explanation in some detail (though not up to date)
22:52:50  * glx kicks CIA-1
22:52:51  <CIA-1> ow
22:54:59  <dihedral> well - i shall hit the rack
22:55:03  *** dihedral is now known as rack
22:55:09  <rack> *hits himself*
22:55:15  *** rack is now known as dihedral
22:55:19  <dihedral> :-)
22:55:53  <dihedral> good night
22:55:58  <glx> you should have use /me ;)
22:56:07  * dihedral ?
22:56:11  <dihedral> ah
22:56:23  <dihedral> should i do that again - just for the comedy?
22:56:59  *** dihedral is now known as rack
22:57:06  * rack hits himself
22:57:13  *** rack is now known as dihedral
22:57:28  <TrueBrain> and now you get kicked :p
22:57:31  <TrueBrain> that would be ironic :)
22:57:46  <dihedral> lol
22:57:47  <dihedral> yes
22:58:59  <dihedral> anyhow - it is late and i shall go to bed :-)
22:59:10  <TrueBrain> night dihedral :)
22:59:13  <dihedral> night
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23:00:11  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: truelight * r9786 /branches/noai/ (13 files in 4 dirs):
23:00:11  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: [NoAI] -Fix: NeighbourRoad -> NeighbourRoadCount
23:00:11  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: [NoAI] -Fix: move AITileListValuators self-defined checks to AITile so we can call it per tile (instead of only via AITileList)
23:00:12  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: glx * r9785 /trunk/src/openttd.cpp: -Fix (r942, FS#765): only non dedicated servers can't have 0 players
23:00:13  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r9784 /trunk/src/ (5 files): -Codechange: remove unused variable.
23:00:41  <Rubidium> hmm... that doesn't look in-order
23:00:43  <Touqen> yawn
23:01:23  <TrueBrain> hehe
23:04:02  <Touqen> It appears the CIA bot has some temporality bugs...
23:04:32  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: truelight * r9787 /branches/noai/bin/ai/regression/regression.txt: [NoAI] -Fix r9786: and again, forgot to update regression.txt..... (tnx glx)
23:04:38  *** yeti_ [] has quit [Quit: 'Why are you wearing that stupid man suit?']
23:04:39  <TrueBrain> I have CIA on ignore
23:04:51  <Touqen> Yea. It's a bit annoying
23:04:57  <Touqen> It must be torture for more active projects.
23:05:28  <glx> you should be in the channel in a pre release period ;)
23:07:54  <Touqen> heh
23:09:41  <Ailure> meh
23:09:45  <Ailure> you people are weak
23:10:01  <Ailure> bots that reports whenever soemone posts in a forum is lots worse than CIA is ;)
23:10:21  <TrueBrain> I hate those bots in public channels
23:10:36  <Sacro|Laptop> robobot does that in certain channels
23:10:38  <Ailure> I looove them
23:11:01  <Ailure> I notice when stuff hpapens
23:11:05  <Ailure> I have IRC on my other monitor
23:11:29  <TrueBrain> Ailure: it is nice for a side-channel, which people can join to follow those things
23:12:09  <Ailure> well truth is
23:12:15  <Ailure> none truly complains about that bot :p
23:12:27  <Ailure> and it's a rather medium sized community
23:14:07  * Touqen quietly passes up the opportunity for a your mom joke.
23:15:38  * Sacro|Laptop roffles
23:17:38  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: truelight * r9788 /branches/noai/src/ai/api/ai_tile.hpp: [NoAI] -Fix r9786: forgot to doxygen comment 1 param
23:19:29  <TrueBrain> k, night all
23:23:47  <Eddi|zuHause> actually, i enjoy the announcements of cia :)
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