Log for #openttd on 22nd September 2007:
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00:00:03  <Bjarni> and I spoiled his cover :P
00:00:11  <SmatZ> :-)
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00:10:01  <mcbane> night
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00:12:09  <Eddi|zuHause3> maybe i'm slow in getting things today, but in which way does going to bed improve the amount of coding done?
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00:15:24  <SmatZ> Eddi|zuHause3: tired programmer -> bad programmer :-p
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00:50:53  <Belugas> Eddi|zuHause3, i can;t see the difference.  is there a difference?
00:51:18  <Eddi|zuHause3> the dirt is drawn over every 2nd wagon
00:51:31  <Eddi|zuHause3> (makes them look darker)
00:52:38  <Eddi|zuHause3> in the "after" picture
00:53:09  <Belugas> oh...
00:53:11  <Belugas> yeah...
00:53:16  <Belugas> like rusty wagons
00:53:56  <glx> like fix one glitch, it creates a new one
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00:59:14  <SmatZ> all sprites are made for the old sprite sorter, no matter how bad it can be...
00:59:34  <SmatZ> so many upgrades will make old sprites rendered bad :-/
00:59:40  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: belugas * r11137 /trunk/src/ (industry.h industry_cmd.cpp): -Feature: [NewGRF] Add support for bit 17 of property 1A for Industries. This bit enables the protection of the last instance of an industry type once raise.
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01:04:21  <Phazorx> ouch
01:04:29  <Phazorx> ottd suddenly is pegging CPU
01:04:34  <Phazorx> any way to find out why?
01:04:40  <Phazorx> talkign about coop server
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01:18:27  <Eddi|zuHause3> hm, i got a stuck loading indicator...
01:18:49  <Eddi|zuHause3> and it doesn't go away if i turn the setting off and on again
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02:28:17  <Debolaz> Hoy.
02:33:59  <Debolaz> Hrmm.. I see the licensing situation still haven't changed. :-/
02:34:19  <ln-> the what?
02:36:28  <Debolaz> Well, last time I was looking at OpenTTD development, it turned out that the project was bound to GPLv2 which seemed to have been chosen rather arbitrarily. GPLv2 only is generally a bad choice for a project which does not have central copyright ownership over its code (Ie, here the contributors owns their own code).
02:38:41  <ln-> Changing the license would require just about every contributor's approval, right?
02:39:34  <Debolaz> Yes, hence why it's an extremely bad idea to chose GPLv2 only, and the longer it goes the more difficult it becomes to resolve.
02:42:10  <ln-> One could also argue that there _is_ one central copyright owner, who has not given permission for releasing under any license.
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03:06:57  <Eddi|zuHause2> and i don't see a reason to change the license
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03:10:17  <Eddi|zuHause2> dbg: [misc] [utf8] unknown string command character 57368 <- what does that mean?
03:10:45  <Eddi|zuHause2> i get tons of those suddenly
03:12:06  <Eddi|zuHause2> but the cargo names are magically fixed now...
03:12:07  <glx> it means this character is not printable, and is not a special OTTD char either
03:18:17  <Eddi|zuHause2> hm, but i can't find where this character appears now...
03:21:07  *** gfldex_ is now known as gfldex
03:26:27  <Eddi|zuHause2> it's somewhere in the freight overview of my ore trains, but not of my passenger trains
03:26:54  <glx> newgrf?
03:27:04  <Eddi|zuHause2> lots :p
03:27:28  <glx> maybe some of them define strings to draw
03:27:29  <Eddi|zuHause2> alpinew.grf most notably
03:27:58  <Eddi|zuHause2> yeah, but those strings are also drawn elsewhere
03:28:33  <glx> and OTTD maybe doesn't handle some TTDP special chars
03:29:45  <glx> anyway it's late
03:29:52  * glx goes to sleep
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06:57:03  <gfldex> is there a upper limit of orders for a train?
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07:05:08  <mcbane> 50 i think
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07:42:14  <Rubidium> gfldex: don't think it's very useful to show examples of how somebody might be able to do something in quite a few years.
07:43:01  <Rubidium> furthermore: is boost supported on *all* platforms that OTTD supports?
07:43:23  <Rubidium> I could not find a place where they said what they support and what they do not support
07:43:24  <gfldex> halve the part of boost are pure header files
07:43:33  <gfldex> and at least those are supported
07:43:51  <gfldex> the only thing i know of you have to be carefull with are the signals they use
07:44:17  <Rubidium> well, I would say it's quite likely it doesn't work as expected with GCC 2.95
07:45:17  <gfldex> go to, and ctrl-f for supported
07:45:48  <Rubidium> ok... that makes the decision easy
07:45:53  <Rubidium> boost CANNOT be used for OTTD
07:45:57  <gfldex> and somebody will have to start with proper refactoring, why not him?
07:46:07  <gfldex> where does it fail?
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07:46:31  <Rubidium> gfldex: refactoring the WHOLE string subsystem for a few changes to the news subsystem is not quite in the scope
07:46:56  <Rubidium> gfldex: on gcc 2.95 as that's not supported
07:47:57  <gfldex> what platform is using that version (beside some embedded OS stuff)
07:47:59  <gfldex> ?
07:48:05  <Rubidium> MorphOS
07:50:44  <Rubidium> and AmigaOS
07:50:45  <gfldex> isnt morphos development stopped?
07:51:02  <Rubidium> tokai: ^^^
07:53:01  <dihedral> morning
07:53:09  <Rubidium> if I remember it correctly it hasn't stopped, but I'm not sure, though tokai will be sure about it
07:53:29  <gfldex> are there ppl that use openttd on morphos and amigaos?
07:53:37  <gfldex> i just want to know
07:53:48  <Rubidium> MorphOS for sure
07:54:05  <Rubidium> there is even a MorphOS nightly
07:57:29  <gfldex> would be mean to take it away from them. could be the only new game they get to see :)
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07:58:42  <Rubidium> maybe they'll, one day, go for gcc 4.x ;)
07:59:45  <gfldex> template support wasnt all that bad in 2.95 tho
08:01:34  <gfldex> do you test patches with the nightly build befor they go into trunk?
08:03:46  <Rubidium> no
08:03:57  <Rubidium> primarily because nightly builds are snapshots of trunk
08:05:43  <gfldex> how are the guidelines for using STL then? not sure what works with 2.95 when it comes to STL.
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08:14:41  <Rubidium> gfldex: neither am I, but you can find out fairly simple by installing gcc 2.95
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08:57:53  <dihedral> anybody got a shorter word for 'performance' ?
09:02:39  <gfldex> in what context?
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09:07:39  <gfldex> i can't compile gcc-2.95.3 under sid :-/
09:07:52  <dihedral> gfldex: performance rating in the game
09:08:27  <gfldex> dihedral: score maybe?
09:08:42  <dihedral> yeah...
09:08:54  <dihedral> performance is just way to long for a 3 digit number :-D
09:08:56  <gfldex> feat would be the shortest but that's most prob. a bit to heavy
09:09:24  <dihedral> perf. does not even look good ;-P
09:13:49  <gfldex> anybody got any idea where i have a chance to get binaries for gcc-2.95 for a modern linux from?
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09:18:53  <Doke> Hi all!
09:19:03  <Doke> New bug reported :D ->
09:32:47  <dihedral> nice
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09:46:58  <dihedral> hello SmatZ
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09:59:35  <Tefad> dunno, but in gentoo it's possible to emerge one, after some coaxing
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10:03:02  <TrueBrain> Tefad: emerging gcc-2.95 under Gentoo isn't going to work
10:03:06  <TrueBrain> everything below 3.3.4 is a pain
10:03:15  <TrueBrain> but 2.95 failed so far on all the attempts done by me and a few friends
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10:13:30  <SmatZ> hello dihedral
10:13:34  <SmatZ> morning all :)
10:13:39  <TrueBrain> howdie
10:14:05  <SmatZ> nice, the weather is great, it is going to be a nice weekend
10:14:07  <SmatZ> and you?
10:14:17  <TrueBrain> packing for my holiday :)
10:14:20  * dihedral waves hello to TrueBrain
10:14:33  <dihedral> again? you just had one :-D
10:14:39  <SmatZ> :-)
10:14:44  <TrueBrain> yup :)
10:14:55  <dihedral> flippin' heck
10:15:04  <dihedral> you lazy so 'n so :-D
10:15:12  * dihedral grins
10:29:52  <TrueBrain> @base 10 16 541
10:29:52  <DorpsGek> TrueBrain: 21D
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11:33:56  <dihedral> @seen chris82
11:33:56  <DorpsGek> dihedral: chris82 was last seen in #openttd 6 days, 3 hours, 6 minutes, and 1 second ago: <Chris82> good morning
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12:02:05  <Nickman> hi all
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12:10:53  <TrueBrain> Nickman!!
12:12:36  <Nickman> :)
12:12:39  <Nickman> you missed me? :)
12:12:50  <TrueBrain> of course we did! :)
12:12:52  <Nickman> :)
12:13:03  <Nickman> I did some vacation work the last tree weeks
12:13:03  <TrueBrain> I think
12:13:05  <Nickman> so...
12:13:52  <TrueBrain> real work
12:13:54  <TrueBrain> for real pussies
12:16:17  <Nickman> lol
12:19:38  * SpComb bought for two years
12:20:03  <ln-> took long
12:20:24  <TrueBrain> lol @ SpComb :)
12:20:33  <Nickman> so, I've seen that an autoslope patch has found it's way into the game? :)
12:21:01  <SpComb>  isn't very much money, and I wanted to experiment with buying domain names
12:27:52  <TrueBrain> so what is going to be on it?
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12:29:09  <SpComb> TrueBrain: MyOTTD, of course
12:29:19  <SpComb> I can stick into the server name
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12:31:51  <dihedral> TrueBrain: did you not pick up on MyOTTD yet?
12:32:03  <TrueBrain> dihedral: doubtful :p But that SpComb doesn't have to know ;)
12:32:41  <dihedral> it's a nice webinterface and deamon combination, so one can controll openttd games
12:33:09  <TrueBrain> Sounds like it fits in the rental draft I made a while back :p
12:33:32  <dihedral> you should have a look at it, it's really nice
12:33:33  <TrueBrain> (we were planning to allow people to rent OpenTTD Servers, so they could play, of course for a small amount of money)
12:33:40  <TrueBrain> so, give me an URL :P
12:33:50  <dihedral> SpComb: URL?
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12:34:23  <dihedral> TrueBrain: the deamon and the webinterface are on separate servers if i picket that up correctly, if not, i guess SpComb  will correct me in a jiffy
12:34:50  <SpComb> they're on the same server, trac's on a different one
12:34:54  <SpComb>
12:35:23  <dihedral> oh right
12:35:26  <dihedral> shame :-D
12:35:57  <dihedral> otherwise that could be way cool too :-)
12:36:03  <dihedral> and way too much work :-P
12:36:14  <dihedral> TrueBrain: got newgrf support working in OpenTTDLib :-)
12:36:19  <TrueBrain> concratz :)
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12:36:52  <TrueBrain> SpComb: no nightlies? :)
12:37:15  <TrueBrain> Error 500
12:37:16  <TrueBrain> Internal Server Error
12:37:17  <TrueBrain> whoho :p
12:37:44  <TrueBrain> Server needs to be started once before you can do things :p
12:38:03  <TrueBrain> hmm, server_lang needs extension
12:38:37  <TrueBrain> SpComb: the config thingy of patch thingies is very nice :)
12:39:01  <TrueBrain> it just misses a save button
12:39:05  <dihedral> SpComb has dome some really sweet work there
12:39:20  <dihedral> it parses the c code
12:40:18  <Sacro> dihedral: daemon
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12:41:05  <mcbane_oktoberfest> laters im off =)
12:41:53  <dihedral> TrueBrain: check this :-)
12:42:30  <TrueBrain> ugly webdesign :p :p :p
12:42:32  <TrueBrain> mwhahahahaha :)
12:43:03  <dihedral> yeah
12:43:51  <dihedral> but the webdesign is a minor thing
12:44:40  <dihedral> feel free to make it prettier TrueBrain  :-D
12:44:51  <Rubidium> TrueBrain: just disable stylesheets ;)
12:44:57  <dihedral> LOL
12:45:41  <dihedral> now that just makes it worse
12:46:18  <Ammler> TrueBrain: you implemented TAR support for newgrf, can the TAR be compressed, else what is the advantage of that?
12:46:26  <TrueBrain> Ammler: compression: no
12:46:33  <TrueBrain> advantage: less files, easier distrubution
12:46:40  <Rubidium> compression of images usually sucks anyway
12:46:47  <dihedral> lol
12:47:05  <Ammler> ah, ok your 32bpp
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12:48:50  <hylje> the fancy tar loader stuff could really use compression support: upon finding a compressed package, uncompress it and cache the uncompressed thing for actual use
12:49:37  * dihedral grees hylje
12:50:18  <hylje> :>
12:50:20  <Ammler> but we still have the problem, that people needs to read the readmes in the folders
12:50:54  <hylje> solution: readme reader in ottd, read-through on first load
12:51:17  <Ammler> then a start for a coop game takes 2 mins
12:51:58  <hylje> they need to at least acknowledge the readmes anyway
12:52:05  <hylje> and it should be just one-time
12:52:29  <dihedral> "i have read and understand the newgrf package readme" <yes> <no> <cancel>
12:52:55  <hylje> nah. just scrollable text and disabled "next" button until end of text is reached
12:53:02  <hylje> or continue
12:53:04  <Ammler> dihedral, not our readme, the readme of each grf
12:53:27  <Ammler> about 10 GRFs has one
12:54:20  <dihedral> i was more wanting to make fun of ms with the yes no cancel
12:54:29  <hylje> cancel or allow?
12:55:10  <hylje>
12:55:13  <Rubidium> it's up to the distributors to comply with the NewGRF license, not OTTD
12:55:49  <Ammler> Rubidium: sure, I just thinking, about, if we can use the new TAR support
12:55:53  <hylje> if ottd doesnt support stuff the licence imposes..
12:57:43  <Rubidium> yes, then maybe your file browser, archiver and web browser must show you the license of the GRFs too
12:57:53  <Rubidium> because you might be doing something that isn't allowed by the license
12:58:03  <Rubidium> and grfcodec too
12:59:01  <Rubidium> and does TTDP show the NewGRF's licenses once you load a savegame with NewGRFs you haven't used before?
13:04:15  * Ammler is wondering, if there will ever be a common REPO for OpenTTD and TTDPatch, where all this licence stuff is solved...
13:05:05  <hylje> no, because grf makers do not like it
13:05:11  <hylje> most particularly dalestan
13:06:34  <hylje> that mentality also prevents us from having all kinds of convenience
13:06:40  <hylje> such as automagically synchronising grfs
13:07:26  <Ammler> the only problem is only because OpenTTD is "illegal" and some "patcher" don't like to support it official, but as long as nobody earns money with OpenTTD, this problem won't be cleared
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13:12:51  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r11138 /trunk/ (9 files in 3 dirs): -Codechange: prepare some subsystems for persistent storage for NewGRFs.
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13:34:08  <skidd13> hi
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13:52:30  <dihedral> hello skidd13
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13:57:18  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r11139 /trunk/src/ (9 files): -Codechange: add support for persistent storage for NewGRFs.
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14:06:12  <SpComb> there,
14:06:47  <SpComb> if I had been smart enough to store my WLAN AP's password somewhere other than my desktop, which is now offline, I would be able to configure a port forward on port 80
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14:09:41  <skidd13> Rubidium: Thanks for review of FS1090
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14:22:24  <SpComb> grr, this is annoying
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14:32:21  <UnderBuilder> heh, I managed to run openttd on a p1 with 32mb ram
14:32:37  <UnderBuilder> which is the machine I am using right now
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14:37:22  <Maedhros> really? i wasn't sure it would still run on machines with specs that low :)
14:37:39  <UnderBuilder> I tested a 64x64 map only
14:37:44  <SpComb> so now I have to call the server " - terom's test" instead of " - terom's test"
14:38:15  <UnderBuilder> the title screen map ran nicely
14:40:09  <UnderBuilder> btw, I talked in the opencity channel about an idea of an online game where some players can create a city while others create the structures (houses, parks, *transport infrastructure*, etc.)
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15:00:23  <StarLite> I've got a weird problem atm..
15:00:47  <StarLite> My fruit trains are seemingly randomly partly unloading, some are totally unloading, some are leaving full
15:00:54  <StarLite> station IS accepting fruit
15:01:29  <StarLite> its just that some trains aren't making any ptofit while some are..
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15:03:14  <StarLite> A fruit plantage appeared next to my station, so I removed some tracks to make sure the plant is NOT in the stations coverage..
15:03:34  <StarLite> but the problems exist :(
15:03:44  <StarLite> j #openttdcoop
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15:30:58  <gfldex> StarLite: you have to remove the station and wait until the grey station name disapears
15:31:18  <gfldex> and if you are on it, activate cheat and remove the *deep*ing farm :)
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16:10:38  <Sacro> so, porting OpenTTD to S40
16:10:42  <Sacro> and Solaris 2.6
16:10:45  <Sacro> should be fun
16:10:49  <Sacro> or maybe even Next
16:11:13  *** dihedral|afk is now known as dihedral
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16:14:33  <SpComb> is there some way to assicate patch names with wiki pages?
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16:18:41  <Tommy> hi
16:20:13  <Tommy> why traditional chinese not work? it just showing all question mark
16:20:32  <ln-> you no have no font.
16:20:34  <Sacro> Tommy: rtfm
16:20:57  <Tommy> whats rtfm?
16:21:05  <Sacro> read the ... manual
16:21:09  <Sacro> or readme in this case
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16:48:43  <Txus> Hello
16:49:04  <Txus> I'm searching for some info about building OTTD
16:49:24  <Txus> is there a list of things you need to?
16:50:32  <svippy> Compile it.
16:51:00  <skidd13>
16:51:40  <skidd13> to be exact
16:51:51  <Txus> :)
16:51:57  <Txus> thank you very much
16:52:28  <skidd13> you're welcome
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16:54:29  <skidd13> Rubidium: You read FS1090, do you nitced someting (excluding the roadbit counting and the coding style)?
16:54:36  *** lolman [~lolman@adsl-87-102-80-216.karoo.KCOM.COM] has joined #openttd
16:54:44  <skidd13> :%s /nitced/noticed/g
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17:13:07  <mcbane_oktoberfest> o.o
17:14:08  *** Mucht_ [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
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17:23:30  <Sacro> thats better
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17:46:43  <mcbane_oktoberfest> ?
17:47:05  *** mcbane_oktoberfest is now known as mcbane
17:48:56  <Bjarni> ...
17:49:04  <Bjarni> is the oktoberfest already over?
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17:50:07  <mcbane> no
17:50:12  <mcbane> it started today
17:50:23  <Bjarni> I know
17:50:26  <mcbane> i retunred some while ago.
17:50:44  <Bjarni> but I wondered if it were already over for you
17:50:51  <mcbane> *returned
17:51:03  <Bjarni> like if you were too active in the Biergarten :P
17:51:23  <mcbane> yea too much beer =)
17:51:53  <mcbane> its the crazy australians / new zelanders fault ...
17:52:19  <Bjarni> why?
17:52:38  <mcbane> much beer = not healthy...
17:53:01  <mcbane> i didnt vomit .. =P
17:53:09  <Bjarni> I don't see how it's related to Australia though
17:53:30  <mcbane> well i went there and i partied with some of em =)
17:54:06  <mcbane> im quite ok ..  they will have a very heavy headache ={
17:54:23  <Bjarni> :P
17:55:17  <mcbane> well when i arrives i already saw ppls going down.
17:55:30  <Bjarni> *arrived
17:55:33  <mcbane> we have a small hill (valled the tourist hill)
17:55:38  <mcbane> *called
17:55:48  <Bjarni> looks like you had a bit to drink... you can't figure out how to spell or grammar anymore :P
17:55:49  <mcbane> which was quite filled =P
17:56:19  <mcbane> ive never been good at grammar =)
17:56:39  <Bjarni> you always act drunk?
17:56:56  <mcbane> nope. <--- bad english.
17:57:16  <Bjarni> you know... you shouldn't give in to urges like that and there are professionals to help you with such issues
17:57:17  <mcbane> 2 lines. =)
17:57:37  <Bjarni> 2 lines?
17:57:51  <Bjarni> one thing is for sure: you are drunk right now
17:58:10  <Bjarni> it would make more sense to speak to even Sacro o_O
17:58:19  <mcbane> quite ... i still can stand , walk and talk quite normal.
17:58:19  <Sacro> eh?
17:58:34  <Bjarni> mcbane: at least YOU think so
17:58:50  <mcbane> just writing/typing non german is a lil bit difficult.
17:59:21  <Sacro> ja...
17:59:44  <mcbane> genau.
18:00:12  <Sacro> wie gehts?
18:00:22  <Bjarni> mcbane: you shouldn't tell Sacro what you know German. He will send you a Czech readme to translate because the languages look the same to him :P
18:00:22  *** MUcht [] has joined #openttd
18:00:38  <mcbane> heh
18:00:50  <mcbane> czech != german
18:00:52  <Sacro> Bjarni: you know both dutch and danish and netherlandian and possibly even swiss
18:01:29  <mcbane> hollÀnder *hides*
18:01:41  <Bjarni> but I have never been to Dutchovia :s
18:02:53  <Bjarni> but Sacro got a point (which is rare)... I seem to know languages
18:02:58  <Sacro> yes
18:02:59  <Bjarni> even those I don't know :P
18:03:05  <Sacro> i can just about do english, french, german, spanish
18:03:28  <Bjarni> ...
18:03:47  <Bjarni> Sacro: this is a decent channel. Don't talk about what you order at the local whores :P
18:04:08  *** Mucht_ [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
18:04:08  <Sacro> actually
18:04:24  <Sacro> i was told the other day that there is a brothel over the road from here
18:04:41  <Sacro> well... it's actually a "massage parlour" but... meh
18:05:18  <Bjarni> and you wondered about it ever since and now you have to go see for yourself to figure out if you should trust that rumour, right?
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18:28:04  <Bjarni> Sacro isn't answering... maybe he went to investigate right now
18:32:11  <Sacro> naaah
18:33:05  <Bjarni> btw Sacro: did you improve your MSTS skills?
18:33:15  <Bjarni> I remember you talked about missing a platform :P
18:34:25  <Sacro> can't say i've been on it recently
18:34:30  <Sacro> i'm waiting for KRS
18:34:37  <Bjarni> KRS?
18:34:46  <Sacro> Kuju Rail Sim
18:35:45  <Bjarni> looks nice
18:36:49  <Bjarni> I wonder how life like it will be
18:38:02  <Bjarni> somehow I fear that it will not be life like enough for me
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18:51:07  <Sacro> Bjarni: you drive trains irl
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18:55:29  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: miham * r11140 /trunk/src/lang/ (13 files): (log message trimmed)
18:55:29  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Update: WebTranslator2 update to 2007-09-22 20:52:32
18:55:29  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: american - 21 fixed by WhiteRabbit (21)
18:55:29  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: brazilian_portuguese - 1 fixed by tucalipe (1)
18:55:29  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: catalan - 1 fixed by arnaullv (1)
18:55:30  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: croatian - 1 fixed by knovak (1)
18:55:30  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: czech - 7 fixed, 1 changed by Hadez (8)
18:55:43  *** Mucht_ is now known as Mucht
18:56:45  <MrBrrr> Quick question, is there a good spot *URL* where I can get the skinny on creating a new train for OpenTTD?
18:58:30  <Maedhros> do you mean creating a newgrf file?
18:58:45  <MrBrrr> I have no idea. Could be I guess.
18:59:18  <MrBrrr> I wanted to add a few trains that VIA Rail uses.
18:59:55  <Maedhros> the docs are here:
19:00:07  <Maedhros> but it's not an easy job, i'm afraid
19:01:26  <MrBrrr> What do ye mean? Putting it all together into a neat .grf file?
19:03:25  <Maedhros> no, that's the easy part. understanding the specs and using them to write meaningful nfo files is the hard bit ;)
19:04:10  <MrBrrr> lol
19:04:25  <MrBrrr> Understanding has never been one of my weak points.
19:04:36  <MrBrrr> So long as it's not yet another exciting law class lecture it'll be fine.
19:04:47  <MrBrrr> -class
19:04:55  <MrBrrr> or not, not sure anymore
19:12:59  <Bjarni> <Sacro> Bjarni: you drive trains irl <-- I know ;)
19:13:29  <Bjarni> and because of that, whenever somebody does something wrong in a train sim, I can say "just do as I do" :P
19:17:24  <Sacro> Bjarni: like this?
19:18:29  <Bjarni> I DIDN'T DO IT
19:20:14  <Bjarni> however I know something like this happened in Denmark and two diesel engines (black at the time) had to be repainted right away (corrosion protection). Since they decided to change the design, they were painted in the most likely design to be selected as the next one. Later (before repainting any other locomotives) they decided on a completely different design
19:20:47  <Bjarni> so for a while we went "there is a red one... that's one of those two from the incident"
19:20:56  <Sacro> Bjarni: and this?
19:21:03  <Ammler> hmm, where can I see the client ID to ban someone?
19:21:53  <Bjarni> <-- here one of them is in the design that was never decided on and "never used" :P
19:22:11  <Bjarni> ...
19:22:34  <Bjarni> I think it's a really bad idea to fuck up switches like that, specially if you aren't using bogie cars :P
19:23:15  *** esco is now known as escopena
19:24:07  <Maedhros> Ammler: "clients" in the console, iirc
19:24:28  <Bjarni> Sacro: are you implying that I can't drive properly?
19:24:39  <Sacro> Bjarni: yes
19:25:00  <Bjarni> why?
19:25:57  <Ammler> Maedhros: thats only an alias for the IP then?
19:26:15  <Ammler> so, if someone change his IP, he can rejoin
19:26:33  <Bjarni> Ammler: how would you make the ban then?
19:26:49  <Bjarni> the name can easily be changed. There is no central server with names
19:27:27  <Bjarni> Ammler: are you asking for the ability to ban ISPs and countries and stuff like that?
19:28:21  <Bjarni> tell what you want to do and we will tell you if it's possible
19:28:35  <Bjarni> I mean how the ban should work
19:28:36  <Ammler> I thought, there is also an ID on the client self...
19:28:39  * Sacro sets mode +b *.dk
19:29:02  <Bjarni> Sacro: I'm op and you are not :P
19:29:25  * Bjarni sets mode +b *!*@*KCOM.COM
19:29:31  <Bjarni> :P
19:29:34  <Sacro> :(
19:29:46  <Eddi|zuHause> i can do that, too
19:30:02  * Eddi|zuHause sets mode -b *!*@*KCOM.COM
19:30:14  <Eddi|zuHause> see?
19:30:28  <Ammler> so, changing ISP doesn't affect the ban
19:30:45  *** glx|away is now known as glx
19:31:21  <Ammler> something like Windows for his activation
19:31:27  <Eddi|zuHause> Ammler: any criterium other than the IP is even easier to change
19:31:45  <Eddi|zuHause> ... or conflicts with the GPL
19:31:47  <Phazorx> Ammler: nick+mask would be good
19:32:27  <Phazorx> in particular case X.X.X.* would do just fine
19:33:13  <Eddi|zuHause> Ammler: so you want to create a central registration platform for online play, and who should host/moderate it?
19:33:24  * Sacro goes to demonoid
19:33:51  <Bjarni> Ammler: since it's open source, jerks will be able to fake more or less everything except their IP and stuff related to their IP (domain and such)
19:35:05  <Rubidium> and then people start using some of those network anomisers
19:35:33  <Bjarni> network anomisers?
19:35:39  <Bjarni> you mean some sort of gateways?
19:35:51  <Sacro> anonymisers
19:36:12  <valhallasw> proxy servers
19:36:14  <Sacro> you people have terrible english
19:36:14  <Eddi|zuHause> tor
19:36:16  <Rubidium>
19:38:05  <Bjarni> well, if people really try to do stuff like that, then they will be really hard to perm ban
19:38:10  *** SmatZ [] has joined #openttd
19:38:39  <Bjarni> new name, new IP and new country DNS... hard to tell that it's the same guy
19:39:39  <SmatZ> evening
19:39:44  <Bjarni> hi SmatZ
19:39:51  <Bjarni> or whoever you really are :P
19:39:57  <SmatZ> hello Bjarni
19:40:20  <Bjarni> for all we know, you could be faking your IP and have stolen our good friend SmatZ's online identity :P
19:40:37  <SmatZ> :-)
19:40:44  <SmatZ> maybe I did
19:41:17  <Sacro> Bjarni: actually its a conspiracy
19:41:19  <hylje> 1. chat and game searching with registered accounts 2. highly magical karma system between accounts and servers 3. ??? 4. profit!!
19:41:22  <SmatZ> I could make some authorisation at this server
19:41:24  <Sacro> all the other people in the channel are run by me :D
19:42:49  <Ammler> Bjarni: if you reach the ability to change code and compile, you won't be a "jerk", will you?
19:43:14  <hylje> he already can
19:43:17  <hylje> to some extent
19:44:33  <Bjarni> <Sacro> all the other people in the channel are run by me :D
19:44:34  <Bjarni> <Sacro> you people have terrible english
19:44:34  <Bjarni> this one backfired on you :P
19:44:47  <Sacro> oh pants
19:46:10  <Bjarni> Ammler: that's a fairly stupid question as I'm not a jerk at all.... however certain people spend ages coding some sort of mean virus for the sole purpose of doing bad stuff for other people
19:46:34  <Bjarni> so to be able to compile is not the same as being wise enough to treat other people nice
19:46:40  <Bjarni> I wish it was :(
19:47:17  <Ammler> yeah, but then login on a ottd server and make stupid things would be to less challenge for me
19:47:18  *** Mucht_ [] has joined #openttd
19:47:32  <Sacro> [20:46] <Bjarni> Ammler: that's a fairly stupid question as I'm not a jerk at all <-- some would disagree
19:47:50  <Bjarni> right
19:47:51  *** Eddi|zuHause [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
19:47:57  <Bjarni> it's an extremely stupid question :P
19:48:06  <Ammler> sorry
19:48:17  <Bjarni> or maybe a rhetorical question
19:49:20  <hylje> ha ha, busted
19:49:46  *** exe [] has joined #openttd
19:49:47  *** Progman [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
19:50:37  <Bjarni> anyway we are still sort of a decent "game breaking player detector and banner" :(
19:51:02  *** Mucht [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
19:51:20  <hylje> short
19:51:32  <Bjarni> typo
19:51:40  <Bjarni> sorry
19:51:41  <TrueBrain> k, time for some holiday :)
19:51:45  <TrueBrain> Bye all :) See you in 8 days ;)
19:51:46  <TrueBrain> or more :p
19:51:48  <TrueBrain> MWHAHAHA :)
19:51:50  <Bjarni> it is?
19:51:52  <hylje> good riddance
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19:52:27  <Bjarni> <TrueBrain> or more :p <-- you plan on meeting us in hell or something?
19:52:45  <TrueBrain> well, where I am going it is hot
19:52:48  <TrueBrain> but not that hot :)
19:52:51  <TrueBrain> Anyway, byebye :)
19:52:57  <Bjarni> I feel sorry for you
19:52:59  <TrueBrain> have fun, and make some patches :)
19:53:07  <Ammler> nice recovery from ttd
19:53:14  <TrueBrain> @kick Bjarni you could also wish me a good holiday, but okay...
19:53:15  *** Bjarni was kicked from #openttd by DorpsGek [you could also wish me a good holiday, but okay...]
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19:53:18  *** mode/#openttd [+o Bjarni] by ChanServ
19:53:23  <TrueBrain> Ah, that makes me feel good before going :) whoho :)
19:53:26  <TrueBrain> Ammler: yeah.. :s
19:53:29  <TrueBrain> anyway: bye
19:53:41  <Bjarni> TrueBrain: I'm sure you will bring a notebook so you can code while you are away
19:53:47  <Bjarni> hg is great for stuff like that :D
19:53:50  <TrueBrain> no freaking way!
19:53:55  * Bjarni hides
19:53:59  <Bjarni> :P
19:54:11  <hylje> so you guys picked up hg meanwhile?
19:54:14  <Ammler> has someone here a kick protection?
19:54:17  <hylje> this is very silly
19:54:48  <Bjarni> hylje: as a test, yes
19:54:55  <Bjarni> why is it silly?
19:55:01  <Bjarni> we still rely on svn
19:56:31  <TrueBrain> hylje: we added hg next to git, yes :) hg is better btw, in my opinion
19:56:32  <TrueBrain> minor details
19:56:34  <hylje> well, you already got git, which is obviously superior..
19:56:35  <TrueBrain> I really should be going ;)
19:57:20  <Bjarni> we still have git
19:57:28  <Bjarni> as a test as well
19:59:18  <Bjarni> basically what we want to see is how they behave on the different platforms
20:00:05  <Bjarni> I was told something about poor git support on windows
20:01:16  <Ammler> so funny, the guy who sabotage our server is telling thats a virus
20:01:49  <Bjarni> what?
20:02:01  <Bjarni> a virus made him send sabotaging packages?
20:02:24  <hylje> lol, what
20:02:24  <Ammler> [22:02] <publicserver> Banana: a virus or spyware that controls open ttd
20:02:27  <Bjarni> nasty virus.... sending valid game packages to block railroads and terraforming
20:02:59  <Bjarni> Ammler: now that sounds interesting
20:03:13  <Bjarni> what server and what version?
20:03:37  <Ammler> do you really believe that?
20:03:42  <Bjarni> no
20:03:46  <Ammler> #openttdcoop
20:03:55  <Bjarni> but now I want to have a bit of fun with him
20:04:30  <mcbane> wanna see that =P
20:05:42  <Bjarni> ohh... this will be good :D
20:06:08  <Ammler> cookie, lol
20:06:21  *** gfldex_ [] has joined #openttd
20:07:29  *** Wolf01 [] has joined #openttd
20:07:31  <mcbane> java cookie =P
20:07:36  <Wolf01> hello
20:07:37  <mcbane> virus
20:07:39  <Bjarni> java virus
20:07:42  <Ammler> he has fantasy
20:07:51  <Bjarni> he is creative.. I give him that
20:08:22  <Ammler> yeah
20:09:40  <mcbane> mmh
20:10:00  *** Tefad_ [] has joined #openttd
20:12:17  <Ammler> hmm, possible the AI of the virus is better then the ingame
20:13:03  *** gfldex [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
20:14:33  <Bjarni> valhallasw: your remark about a grf virus was shown in the game
20:14:44  <valhallasw> I know
20:14:55  <valhallasw> nice IRC<->game gateway, eh? ;)
20:15:01  <Bjarni> yeah
20:15:17  <Bjarni> so I didn't even have to join to talk to this guy
20:15:18  <Bjarni> hmm
20:15:24  *** Tefad [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
20:15:30  <Bjarni> but at least now I see the game
20:15:37  <Bjarni> looks impressive
20:16:16  <Bjarni> Ammler: what was the sabotage thingie?
20:16:36  <Ammler> oh, that was on an older save
20:16:47  <Bjarni> oh ok
20:16:50  <Ammler> he didn't start atm
20:16:55  <Bjarni> that's why it looks fine to me
20:17:06  <Ammler> he just joined and I asked if I have to ban him another time
20:17:19  <Bjarni> he asked to be banned?
20:17:20  *** zambba [] has joined #openttd
20:17:24  <Ammler> so he explained that it is a virus
20:17:39  <Ammler> I asked
20:18:06  <zambba> good evening. would someone guess what's wrong with me? my problem is I can't build any ttrakcs hwne I try to play scenarios with DBSetXL on
20:18:26  <hylje> you appear to be unable to spell, too
20:18:27  <Bjarni> <zambba> good evening. would someone guess what's wrong with me? <--- nice first sentence :P
20:18:29  <Ammler> Phazorx knows more about him
20:18:43  <Bjarni> and I will not try to imagine... you are on IRC
20:18:57  <Bjarni> it might not be healthy to try to imagine stuff like that
20:19:15  <Phazorx> it is a virus i guess... but it has nothing to do with computer i'd say
20:19:32  <Phazorx> but there are these that turn a kid into sadistic morron
20:19:43  <Bjarni> *moron
20:20:01  <Bjarni> wtf
20:20:10  <Bjarni> there is SALT in his caps lock???
20:20:27  *** Progman [] has joined #openttd
20:22:45  <valhallasw> Bjarni: I want to see what happens when he does add water :D
20:23:10  <Bjarni> I know
20:23:18  <Bjarni> salt water is a killing machine
20:23:24  <Bjarni> it really kills a lot of machinery
20:23:44  <valhallasw> salt water + oxygen, mainly :)
20:23:52  <valhallasw> redox \o/
20:24:02  <hylje> well, do we really miss his caps lock breaking?
20:25:10  <mcbane> its good for contacts in the keyboard =)
20:25:29  <Bjarni> ships can't use salt water for a lot of stuff... steamers needs freshwater for the boilers. Modern ships use fresh water to cool the engines (and then they move the heat to sea water from the fresh water)
20:25:37  <Bjarni> basically salt water is a killer
20:26:34  <Sacro> especially if you are a slug
20:27:10  <valhallasw> 'ini: trailing characters at end of setting advanced_vehicle_list' -> ?? should it be 1 instead of 'true'?
20:27:47  <valhallasw> I cannot find anything special in my openttd.cfg :|
20:28:14  <Rubidium> yup, the variable type has changed to accomodate 3 different settings instead of 2
20:28:28  <valhallasw> right
20:29:52  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r11141 /trunk/src/ (newgrf_spritegroup.cpp newgrf_spritegroup.h): -Codechange: add support for NewGRF's varaction2 operators 11, 12 and 13.
20:30:52  <Bjarni> I still wonder how he managed to get salt into his keyboard
20:31:00  *** Purno [] has quit [Quit: Always remember you're unique, just like everyone else.]
20:31:03  <Bjarni> my keyboard is clean of stuff like that
20:31:16  <Bjarni> hmm
20:31:22  <Bjarni> looks a bit dusty though
20:31:27  <valhallasw> I am getting BOFH'ish
20:31:28  <Bjarni> maybe I should clean it again
20:31:30  <valhallasw> I want to ban someone -_-
20:31:52  * Bjarni sets mode +b valhallasw
20:31:56  <valhallasw> ;(
20:31:58  <valhallasw> spinvis \o
20:31:59  <Bjarni> self defence
20:34:43  *** Masacru [~Masacru@] has joined #openttd
20:34:46  <Masacru> Hello
20:34:57  <Masacru> Can anyone please Help me :) ?
20:35:07  *** StarLite [] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20:35:20  <Masacru> :( ?
20:35:21  <mcbane> night ppls
20:35:31  *** mcbane is now known as nairan
20:35:42  <Masacru> is anyone here ?
20:35:55  <nairan> some are
20:35:59  *** ITSBTH [] has joined #openttd
20:36:02  <Masacru> i have a few questions
20:36:11  <valhallasw> don't ask to ask, ask
20:36:17  <Masacru> :D
20:36:20  <nairan> just ask someome will answer you.
20:36:31  <valhallasw> and if not, ask again in 12h or so :D
20:36:32  <Masacru> Openttd - is it a patch for Transport Tycoon ?>
20:36:33  *** SmatZ [] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
20:36:39  <valhallasw> no
20:36:44  <Masacru> Expansion ?
20:36:48  <Masacru> Mod ?
20:36:49  <Ammler> no
20:36:54  <Masacru> To be able to play online ?
20:36:54  <valhallasw> rtfm :)
20:37:00  <Masacru> ?
20:37:06  <valhallasw> it's a version that has been built from scratch
20:37:18  <Masacru> So it needs Transport Tycoon ?
20:37:20  <Masacru> Which is free ?
20:37:31  <valhallasw> it needs some data files from ttdlx
20:37:34  <valhallasw> ttdlx is not free
20:37:35  <valhallasw> openttd is
20:37:42  <Masacru> Openttd ohh ?
20:37:49  <Masacru> open tycoon  ?
20:37:49  <Masacru> or what
20:38:04  *** exe [] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20:38:07  <Masacru> :( ?
20:38:10  <valhallasw> open transport tycoon deluxe....
20:38:23  <Masacru> Open Transport Tycoon Deluxe is it free ?
20:38:27  <Masacru> ohhh
20:38:28  <Masacru> it's not
20:38:35  <Masacru> then the version from the forum :P ?
20:38:47  * valhallasw slaps Masacru
20:38:59  <valhallasw> *open* ttd is *open* and hence free as in beer
20:39:22  <Masacru> Open Transport Tycoon Deluxe is free , but TTD isn't ?
20:39:27  <valhallasw> yes
20:39:48  <Masacru> So you need OTTD and then the patch ?
20:40:03  <valhallasw> no
20:40:07  <Rubidium> by the way it's OpenTTD and Transport Tycoon Deluxe (their official names that is)
20:40:09  <valhallasw> the patch is a patch for the original TTD
20:40:33  <Rubidium> OpenTTD is not called Open Transport Tycoon Deluxe due to legal issues with the name and such
20:40:38  <Masacru> i saw on the forum OPENttd download
20:41:06  <Rubidium> that's free
20:41:07  <Masacru> i you get OpenTtd and then install the patch ? it works online ?
20:41:09  <Masacru> if
20:41:23  <Rubidium> "the patch" meaning TTDPatch?
20:41:33  <Masacru> 5.3
20:41:33  <Masacru> yeah
20:41:41  <valhallasw> there is 'Transport Tycoon Deluxe', 'TTDPatch' and 'OpenTTD'
20:41:42  <Rubidium> TTDPatch does not and will never ever work on OpenTTD
20:41:51  <valhallasw> which are basically three very different things
20:41:54  <Rubidium> TTDPatch only works on Transport Tycoon Deluxe
20:42:07  <valhallasw> TTDPatch are a lot of hacks to the executable of Transport Tycoon Deluxe
20:42:17  <Masacru> So you need Transport Tycoon Deluxe and then the TTD 5.3 patch ?
20:42:28  <valhallasw> OpenTTD is a complete rewrite and only needs the data files
20:42:47  <valhallasw> you can choose between TTD, TTD+TTDPatch and OpenTTD
20:43:01  <Masacru> I play Open TTD online
20:43:07  <Masacru> it writes there up Open
20:43:35  <valhallasw> so what do you want to know then...
20:43:42  <Masacru> Which version is played online ?
20:44:04  <Ammler> !servers
20:44:09  <Masacru> !servers
20:44:13  <Masacru> :D
20:44:15  <Masacru> :))
20:44:22  <Ammler>
20:44:27  <Masacru> i saw
20:46:41  <Masacru> SO you need
20:46:52  <Masacru> Transport Tycoon Deluxe and then the OPEN TTD 5.3 patch ?
20:46:55  <Masacru> and that's all ?
20:47:02  <Ammler> no patch
20:47:10  <Ammler> just OTTD 0.5.3
20:47:32  <Masacru> ohh OTTD 0.5.3 isn't a patch yerah :P
20:47:50  <Masacru> Transport Tycoon Deluxe and OTTD 0.5.3
20:47:51  *** TinoM [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
20:47:52  <Masacru> that's all
20:48:13  <Masacru> ?
20:48:13  <Ammler> yes
20:48:16  <Masacru> Okay :P
20:48:21  <Masacru> Who has xfire ?
20:48:37  <valhallasw> xfire? O_o
20:49:30  <Masacru> nvm
20:50:01  <Wolf01> <- xfire discussion
20:50:54  <Masacru> I'm trying to make xfire to support Transport Tycoon :D
20:51:44  *** Zr40 [] has quit [Quit: Zr40]
20:53:47  <Sionide> ohh nice
20:53:57  <Sionide> i don't use it myself but it's quite a neat system from what i've seen
20:55:30  <Wolf01> how does it works? i mean, how does it recognize a game, instead of spying all what is running your system?
20:55:38  <Masacru> Lol
20:55:39  <Masacru> It doesn'
20:55:44  <Masacru> it doesn't spy your system
20:55:57  <Masacru> It's easy to understand
20:56:11  <Wolf01> how i can be sure? ms is spying me constantly
20:56:16  <Masacru> Games get supported : And it detects the respective game , when you run the exe it shows on xfire
20:56:21  <Masacru> haha dude
20:56:26  <Masacru> There are some codes like
20:56:30  <Masacru> Detect Launcher : name
20:56:31  <Masacru> etc
20:56:37  <Masacru> it's not like gamespy or stuff
20:56:55  <Masacru> Do you want me to post a  game detection code ?
20:57:07  <Sionide> Wolf01, it *does* spy you though, that's the point of it....?
20:57:08  <Bjarni> <Masacru> I'm trying to make xfire to support Transport Tycoon :D <--- I haven't figured out what xfire can do that our server list can't do
20:57:17  <Bjarni> maybe you can enlighten me
20:57:23  <Sionide> Bjarni, IM between xfire users...?
20:57:34  <Masacru> Example
20:57:35  <Masacru> [5067]
20:57:47  <Masacru> LongName=Populous - The Beginning - Undiscovered Worlds
20:57:48  <Sionide> Bjarni, on xfire, you'd see sionide was on a ottd game and you'd just click and it'd launch and join in one click
20:57:54  <Masacru> ShortName=popu
20:58:02  <Masacru> LauncherDirKey=HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Bullfrog Productions Ltd\Populous: The Beginning\InstallPath
20:58:09  <Masacru> LauncherExe=populous_menu.exe
20:58:16  <Masacru> DetectExe[0]=D3DPopTBUW.exe
20:58:21  <Masacru> DetectExe[1]=popTBUW.exe
20:58:32  <Masacru> got it :P ?
20:58:44  <Masacru> With that code xfire Detects Populous
20:59:07  *** MUcht [] has joined #openttd
20:59:11  * Bjarni prefers populous on Amiga 500
20:59:26  <Masacru> Did you ever play Populous 3 The beginning ?
20:59:54  <Bjarni> not for as long as I played populous 1+2 on the amiga
20:59:54  <Masacru> Bjarni
20:59:59  <Masacru> :D
21:00:05  <Masacru> Pop 3 is better , it works online too
21:00:46  <Masacru> Will Transport Tycoon Deluxe ever be free ?
21:00:47  <Bjarni> I looked at the 3rd one... looked a bit closer and then ditched it
21:00:55  <Sionide> can you launch ottd from command line with arguments to join a specific online game straight away?
21:01:02  <Sionide> that's what xfire would need i assume?
21:01:06  <Masacru> yeah
21:01:08  <Masacru> You can
21:01:15  <Wolf01> the problem is, can you trust a software which detects any running software it wants on your system, because it can contain, hardcoded, some templates to detect the browser version, the system version, what are you playing on the media player...
21:01:17  <Masacru> If i play CSS , you can see the players on the server i am
21:01:31  <Masacru> Wolf , there's a readme GAmes_ini and there are those codes
21:01:38  <Masacru> and thanks to that it detects the respective game
21:01:44  <Masacru> i use xfire from Summer 2006
21:01:47  <Bjarni>  <Masacru> Will Transport Tycoon Deluxe ever be free ? <--- no, but there is a fair chance that OpenTTD will work without TTD grf files... eventually
21:02:04  <Masacru> I play OTTD online
21:02:27  <Masacru> I installed 0.5.3 OTTD (it neded to detect TTD )
21:02:44  <Sionide> Masacru, all it uses from the original TTD is the graphics files
21:02:52  *** Mucht_ [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
21:03:02  <Masacru> AHa
21:03:03  <Masacru> aha
21:03:04  <Masacru> cool
21:03:16  <Rubidium> Masacru: it didn't detect TTD, it only detected the data files (graphics/sounds/music)
21:03:26  <Rubidium> the executable is not checked whatsoever
21:03:30  <Masacru> I installed it last night when i heard about it , played it today from 11 AM - to 20-21 pm :)
21:03:40  <Bjarni> that's the windows installer... all other OSes and the win zip file has a readme telling the user to copy 6 specific files
21:03:46  <Sionide> Masacru, same as me when i found it, years ago now
21:04:07  <Bjarni> err 6 files+music, but it can do without music if needed
21:05:00  <Bjarni> when I found OpenTTD, I first had a battle with svn, then I spent like a week porting and then I could play :D
21:06:19  <MrBrrr> I miss the classic Adlib music with TT :(
21:06:58  <Masacru> I hate some people in online play , they join your compnay if you don't put pass and ruin you
21:07:11  <Masacru> as a dude did to me last night when i played the first time xD
21:07:32  *** Mucht_ [] has joined #openttd
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21:07:41  <Bjarni> send a power surge to his IP though the internet and then the problem is solved
21:07:46  <hylje> thats why one sets a pass
21:08:21  <Masacru> i set pass all the time
21:08:22  <Masacru> now
21:08:46  <Bjarni> actually ethernet used to have surge issues so they are kind of like the best protected part of a computer... you can make a surge in the ethernet and the computer will not care except it fails to read the package
21:09:03  <Bjarni> but if you want to test this, do it at your own risk :P
21:09:09  <Masacru> Bjarni
21:09:21  <Bjarni> Masacru
21:09:21  <Masacru> OTTD - are ppl still working on it ?
21:09:29  <Masacru> i saw that 5.3 went out on 17 september XD
21:09:31  <Bjarni> O_O
21:09:54  <Masacru> nvm
21:09:59  <Bjarni> do I even have to answer that one???
21:10:07  <Masacru> :P no
21:10:13  <Masacru> Bjarni
21:10:17  <Bjarni> Masacru
21:10:28  <Masacru> Will there be added a feature like : to be able to kick people who join your company if you want ?
21:10:44  <Bjarni> that was fun, but I don't want to play this naming game anymore
21:11:09  <Masacru> what
21:11:17  <Masacru> YOu don't play TTD onlinme ?
21:11:18  *** MUcht [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
21:11:36  <Bjarni> <Masacru> Will there be added a feature like : to be able to kick people who join your company if you want ? <-- if we add that with the current design, then the trespasser will be able to kick you, so no, at least not right away
21:11:56  <Masacru> Ohh :P
21:12:00  <Masacru> ^^
21:12:02  <ln-> would that be bad?
21:12:20  <Masacru> Bjarni
21:12:28  <Masacru> are you one of the OTTD creators ?
21:12:44  <Bjarni>  <Masacru> Bjarni <-- I meant this as the naming game... just say something instead of a single line with my name :P
21:13:07  <Masacru> OTTD - is like a big patch that allows people to play it over the internet  ,+ bugfixes , new features etc
21:13:07  <Masacru>  ?
21:13:36  <Bjarni>  <Masacru> are you one of the OTTD creators ? <-- well I didn't start coding this game, but I have been a developer on the game since 0.1.4
21:13:54  <Masacru> Awsome
21:14:09  <Bjarni> which makes me the developer, who have been active for the longest time (everybody who were active when I joined has retired by now)
21:14:28  <MrBrrr> retired?
21:14:30  <Masacru> meh
21:14:33  <MrBrrr> with benefits?
21:14:38  <Bjarni> well
21:14:48  <Masacru> can you explain me what OTTD is ? i mean i don't understand is it like an expansion ?
21:14:51  <Masacru> or how ?
21:15:13  <Bjarni> ludde went to make a bittorrent client instead... I think µtorrent turned out pretty well
21:15:58  <Masacru> Bjarni
21:15:58  <Masacru> Read up a bit please :P
21:16:00  <Progman> Masacru: ottd is a "standalone" game, but it needs the graphic files from the original transport tycoon deluxe
21:16:15  <Masacru> aha
21:16:32  <Bjarni> damn Progman beat me to it
21:16:32  <MrBrrr> It sure did Bjarni.
21:16:34  <Masacru> They don't add those graphic files to OTTD because that would be illegal ?
21:16:51  <Bjarni> basically we don't own them
21:16:55  <Masacru> ohh yeah
21:17:12  * Masacru prepares to snipes and steal the graphic files from the current owner
21:17:19  <Masacru> snipe*
21:17:40  <Bjarni> we can distribute what we make ourselves or what people give us, but nobody showed up and gave us permission to distribute TTD files
21:17:54  <Bjarni> heh
21:18:08  <Bjarni> first issue: who owns the TTD files today?
21:18:09  <Masacru> DId you ever talk with the creators of those graphic files ?
21:18:15  <MrBrrr> So that newgrf project is just what the doctor ordered?
21:18:38  <Masacru> Buf if you just use those files ? who will know >:)
21:18:54  <Bjarni>  <Masacru> DId you ever talk with the creators of those graphic files ? <-- it appears that nobody knows who the owner is, not even the owner
21:19:13  <Masacru> So if you use them ?
21:19:25  *** Vikthor [] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
21:19:31  <Masacru> Maybe the owner of them don't care about it no more
21:19:32  <Bjarni> we risk somebody shows up with proof of ownership and sues us
21:19:36  <Ammler> somone should make money with ottd
21:20:06  <Masacru> :(
21:20:21  <MrBrrr> I wonder how many millions he could make out of his TTD ownership.
21:21:05  <Bjarni> the TTD owner makes nothing out of the ownership. It looks like the ownership went into a big void when Microprose was no more
21:21:28  <Bjarni> surely it went somewhere else, but it looks like nobody knows for sure where it went
21:21:45  <MrBrrr> Well, I did say "could".
21:22:10  <Masacru> i read on the site this
21:22:59  <Masacru> Didn't this guy creat the graphics too Chris Sawyer.
21:23:16  <Bjarni> actually some guy did it for him (I think)
21:23:33  <Bjarni> but even though Chris coded the game, it's not the same as he owns it
21:23:39  <Bjarni> it depends on the contract
21:24:15  <Bjarni> Microprose could have bought a license to sell the game and they can have bought the game itself with all the rights
21:24:43  <Masacru> aha
21:24:49  *** Eddi|zuHause2 [] has joined #openttd
21:25:26  <Bjarni> so the artist might own them, Chris might own them and Microprose might own them
21:25:44  <Masacru> so Chris Sawyer. can't be contacted ?
21:26:02  <Bjarni> if this is really funny then the audio, the music and the graphics don't have the same owner
21:26:16  <Bjarni> in fact it could be 3 different people/companies
21:26:21  <Masacru> :D
21:26:33  <Masacru> Objective : Find out who designed the graphics
21:27:16  <Bjarni> it would most likely be easier to finish the 32 bit graphic engine and draw all sprites in 32 bit colours
21:27:31  <Bjarni> and the chance of success is likely greater
21:27:46  <Bjarni> I mean even if we find an owner, then what
21:27:49  <Masacru> so there's no chance in the future to add those files ?
21:28:21  <Bjarni> I say the odds are against it
21:28:38  <Bjarni> but I will not rule it out completely.. it's just highly unlikely
21:29:25  <Masacru> Aha
21:31:01  *** Eddi|zuHause [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
21:32:44  <Masacru> It's weird
21:33:09  <Masacru> Transport Tycoon Deluxe (Windows):
21:33:16  <Masacru> I downloaded it from the site
21:33:26  <Masacru> and then applied 5.3 and works online / single player
21:33:58  *** MUcht [] has joined #openttd
21:34:14  <Masacru> ?
21:34:19  <Masacru> slap
21:34:23  * Masacru slaps Bjarni
21:34:38  <Rubidium> kick him ;)
21:34:39  <Bjarni> what?
21:34:45  <glx> you are playing with fire Masacru
21:35:00  <Masacru> what :|
21:35:15  <Masacru> I downloaded Transport Tycoon Deluxe (Windows): This  from the Transport Tycoon forums
21:35:21  *** Masacru was kicked from #openttd by Bjarni [I just spent a great deal of time telling you stuff and this is how you repay me???]
21:35:41  *** Masacru [~Masacru@] has joined #openttd
21:35:44  <Masacru> sorry
21:35:59  <glx> that was what I meant
21:36:12  <Masacru> But why that can be founded on the forum then :\
21:36:23  <Bjarni> I didn't put it there
21:36:30  <Bjarni> the forum isn't our forum
21:36:42  <Masacru> Ohh
21:36:43  <Masacru> sorry
21:36:47  <Bjarni> we "borrow" 4 subforums, but the forum as a whole isn't our's
21:36:49  <Masacru> I thought it's the real forum
21:37:12  <glx> <@Bjarni> we "borrow" 4 subforums <-- 5 not 4
21:37:42  *** Mucht_ [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
21:39:33  <Masacru> sorry again :D
21:40:07  * Masacru is sorry
21:40:37  <Bjarni> oh right
21:40:44  <Bjarni> forgot the graphics forum :s
21:41:06  <Rubidium> technically those are subsubfora ;)
21:41:27  * glx always forget the suggestions forum ;)
21:41:41  <Bjarni> you don't miss much
21:42:28  <Rubidium> a lot of people making absurd suggestions ;)
21:42:41  <glx> like rename openttd :)
21:42:45  <Masacru> haha
21:42:51  <Bjarni> at one time I wanted to code something else and looked in the suggestions forum for ideas. After looking through the first 3 pages, I decided to look for inspiration somewhere else... nothing useful came out of reading the forum
21:43:14  <Eddi|zuHause2> did anyone there ever suggest implementing PBS?
21:43:15  <Bjarni> I like the renaming thread
21:43:28  <Bjarni> Eddi|zuHause2: not really... at least not on the forum
21:43:50  * Sacro slaps Bjarni
21:43:52  <glx> they often suggests things already done
21:43:56  <Sacro> no apostraphe in "ours"
21:43:59  <Bjarni> yeah, that too
21:44:18  <Eddi|zuHause2> you mean like building trains and signals?
21:44:29  <Masacru> Bjarni
21:44:34  <Masacru> Is it possible to add new vehicles ?
21:44:37  <Bjarni> you did it again!!!
21:44:37  <Masacru> in the next patch ?
21:44:48  <Bjarni> >_<
21:44:55  <glx> you can already use newgrf
21:45:04  <glx> and openttd is not a patch
21:45:10  <Eddi|zuHause2> or "a feature to build tunnels when the other player built rails on foundations"
21:45:20  <Eddi|zuHause2> :p
21:45:32  <Masacru> i meant patch for OTTD
21:45:33  <Masacru> :\
21:45:34  <Masacru> :|
21:46:09  <Sacro> openttdpatch?
21:46:30  <Bjarni> I like this one (from a few months ago). "we should be able to build signals in tunnels. Clearly this is an oversight which we should have corrected right away" (not quoted, but this was the idea)
21:46:35  <glx> that reminds me the trainer for openttd :)
21:47:01  <Rubidium> just build a debug binary and ALT-1 away ;)
21:47:15  <Bjarni> Masacru: you mean more than 255 different engine types?
21:47:26  <Masacru> I meant new buses and stuff
21:47:34  <Bjarni> use a newgrf then
21:47:37  * Rubidium wonders when the first bug report comes that says that ALT-0 crashes their debug library with a segmentation fault.
21:47:43  <Masacru> I mean to add it (to online play)
21:47:45  <Bjarni>
21:47:47  <Masacru> I play it online
21:47:47  <Rubidium> s/library/binary/
21:47:56  <Phazorx> ehh... anyone good with CIDR masks ?
21:48:09  <Masacru> I play OTDD Online
21:48:22  <Bjarni> Rubidium: I already closed that bug report years ago
21:48:27  <Phazorx> X.15.0.0 to X.16.255.255 is /15 ?
21:48:34  <Bjarni> oddly enough I think we only got it once
21:48:55  <Rubidium> Phazorx: probably not
21:49:03  <Masacru> Does TTD works online "?
21:49:11  <Masacru> or only OTTD works online *internet
21:49:14  <Phazorx>  /17 i meant
21:49:25  <Phazorx> 2 octets +1 bit
21:49:33  <glx> TTD should be able to work in LAN Masacru
21:49:35  <Rubidium> Phazorx: easiest way is to write the whole IP address as binary (begin and end) and then and them
21:49:41  <glx> but I never tried
21:49:42  <Rubidium> and then count the bits
21:50:00  <Masacru> Does TTD works online (internet) or only OTTD does ?
21:50:01  <Phazorx> that;s a liong way easiest would be asking who can do it in the ehad faster than i am and sure about the result :)
21:50:23  <Masacru> ?
21:50:47  <Rubidium> Phazorx: furthermore you start at 15 (0000111) and go to 16.something (00001000), so I guess it's /12 you need
21:51:05  <Phazorx> there you go that's how you do it thanks
21:51:11  <Eddi|zuHause2> <Masacru> I mean to add it (to online play) <- only the server admin can do that.
21:51:14  <Rubidium> s/then and them/then xor them/
21:51:32  <Rubidium> Phazorx: 14..15 would be /17 though
21:51:57  <Phazorx>  /12 in that case is what i need
21:52:09  <Phazorx>  58..59
21:52:19  <Masacru> Does TTD Works online ? Or Only OTTD does ?
21:52:31  <Progman> Masacru: TTD got a network feature, but this isn't stable. The one for OTTD works fine and there are a lot of servers to join
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21:52:35  <Bjarni> Masacru: you can't add grf files in midgame (odd stuff would happen if you tried). However if you lack a grf file that the server uses, then you can't join
21:53:50  <Masacru> aha
21:53:55  <Masacru> Bjarnio
21:53:59  <Masacru> do you have an xfire id ?
21:54:11  <Masacru> Cause i want you to repply in the supporting THread , you just repply SUPPORT
21:54:36  <Rubidium> then they first need to add OSX support I guess
21:55:08  <glx> and Linux, and OS2, and MorphOS, and ...
21:55:10  <glx> ;)
21:56:05  <Masacru> what ?
21:56:10  <Masacru> support to the game ? to OTTD
21:56:23  <glx> OTTD works on all this platforms
21:58:57  <Rubidium> and Bjarni works on OSX, so a Windows only application is not something he gets warm and fuzzy about
21:59:25  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: glx * r11142 /trunk/src/industry_cmd.cpp: -Codechange: prepare industry production change code for newgrf callbacks 29 and 35
21:59:50  <Bjarni> actually I couldn't care less for windows only online gaming tools
22:00:27  <Wolf01> 'night
22:00:30  *** Wolf01 [] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.]
22:02:01  <Masacru> OTTD ! IS THE BEST !
22:02:18  <Bjarni> we knew that
22:02:35  <Bjarni> even before you found it
22:03:02  <Masacru> haha :D
22:03:15  <Masacru> how can you put a QUIT MEssage ?
22:03:28  <Bjarni> that depends on your client
22:03:39  <Masacru> java
22:03:39  <Masacru>  ?
22:03:49  <Progman> type /quit and a input-box appears to enter the message
22:03:53  *** Masacru [~Masacru@] has quit [Quit: Masacru]
22:03:58  <Progman> *strike*
22:04:01  <Bjarni> :D
22:04:06  <glx> lol
22:04:07  <Bjarni> I waited for that to happen :D
22:04:53  <Bjarni> I wonder if he will return
22:04:58  *** Masacru [~Masacru@] has joined #openttd
22:05:01  <Masacru> meh
22:05:04  <Masacru> i typed /quit
22:05:07  <Masacru> and it left :p
22:05:11  <Bjarni> we noticed
22:05:17  <Masacru> :|
22:05:36  <Masacru> You put me to type it intentionality ?
22:05:52  <Bjarni> I didn't do such a thing
22:06:00  <Masacru> k
22:06:33  <Bjarni> you asked how to set a quit message and somebody told you and then you start talking about mean intents
22:06:37  <Bjarni> shame on you
22:07:26  <Masacru> YOu told me to type /quit (i knew that it'll quit , but i never used java chat before)
22:07:28  <Masacru> so i tryed
22:07:40  <Masacru> tried*
22:08:30  <Rubidium> apparantly that input-box shows for Progman's java chat
22:08:37  <Masacru> w/e
22:08:39  <Rubidium> maybe you've got a different version that does not support that yet
22:08:51  <Masacru> I have the latest java version :|
22:09:20  <Masacru> maybe you type /quit (message)
22:09:20  <Rubidium> so, when you have the latest service packs installed you automatically have Windows Vista?
22:09:31  <Masacru> What :|
22:09:33  <Masacru> LOL
22:09:46  <Rubidium> Masacru: that's what you just said, only with different words
22:09:54  *** Farden [] has quit [Quit: ( :: NoNameScript 4.02 :: )]
22:10:15  <Masacru> Rubi
22:10:18  <Masacru> Very smart ;)
22:10:50  <Rubidium> that's what the psychologist said too
22:11:07  <Masacru> You mean the Pshyco doc ?
22:11:11  <Masacru> Anyway GG ;)
22:11:33  *** Greyscale [~Greyscale@] has joined #openttd
22:11:40  <Rubidium> GG?
22:11:45  <Masacru> yeah
22:11:56  <Masacru> Don't tell me you don't know what it means ?
22:11:56  <Rubidium> what does that acronym stand for?
22:12:04  <Masacru> Hahaha
22:12:08  <Masacru> You'r funny
22:12:37  <Bjarni> it's not that we don't know
22:13:00  <Bjarni> we just want to make sure that you don't use an acronym without knowing what it is
22:13:04  <Masacru> I bet both of you have spoken with eachother
22:13:05  <Masacru> to annoy me ?
22:13:16  <Bjarni> no
22:13:34  <Masacru> lol
22:13:39  <Bjarni> I didn't say anything to Rubidium about you or vice versa
22:13:45  <Rubidium> you mean Air Comores International?
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22:13:54  <Masacru> After you said : Shame on you
22:13:56  <Masacru> he said
22:13:57  <Masacru> <Rubidium> so, when you have the latest service packs installed you automatically have Windows Vista?
22:13:58  <Masacru> lol
22:14:28  <Bjarni> I didn't say anything about vista
22:14:33  <Masacru> Just leave me alone , as i see both of you are up to somthing ..and trying to fool me or however
22:14:42  <Bjarni> ...
22:15:12  <Bjarni> since I know this isn't the case, I would call you paranoid
22:15:47  <Rubidium> hmm, gg also stands for Guernsey
22:15:49  <Masacru> yeah i might be
22:15:55  <Masacru> GG means Good game :\
22:15:57  <Masacru> :|
22:16:15  <glx> for me GG == Game Gear (but I'm old ;) )
22:16:23  <Masacru> :D
22:16:38  <Masacru> where are you guys from ?
22:16:39  <Rubidium> though for Celestar GG would be Air Comores International ;)
22:16:47  <Bjarni> usually we say what we mean in here... skipping characters isn't a nice way of communicating
22:17:09  <skidd13> good night
22:17:11  <Bjarni> to me GG means something in Danish
22:17:24  <Masacru> Good night skidd13
22:17:30  *** skidd13 [] has left #openttd []
22:17:49  <Masacru> do you people play OTTD online ?
22:17:56  <Progman> sure
22:18:08  <Masacru> What comapny names do you usually wear ?
22:18:09  <Rubidium> not really
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22:19:04  <Bjarni> to be honest, I'm not a big fan of online games
22:19:42  <Masacru> IT was an honest mistake
22:22:01  *** Digitalfox [] has joined #openttd
22:22:07  <Masacru> i remember when i had a bad pc and no net i was playing Transport Tycoon :)
22:22:11  <Masacru> Everyday
22:22:14  <Masacru> non-stop :D
22:23:15  *** Greyscale [~Greyscale@] has joined #openttd
22:23:31  <Masacru> GOod NIGHT :D
22:23:42  <Bjarni> I remember when I invested in ethernet.. back in 1996
22:24:22  <svippy> :O
22:24:23  <Masacru> Good Night all
22:24:31  <svippy> There was ethernet in 1996?!
22:24:52  <Masacru> quit
22:25:02  <Bjarni> yeah
22:25:04  *** Masacru [~Masacru@] has quit [Quit: sleeeeeeeeepppiiinnnnnnnnnnggggggggggggggggg]
22:25:09  <Bjarni> 10 mbit half duplex
22:25:12  <Digitalfox> I just started openttd with command -b 32bpp-anim, and tried 32bpp grass tiles for use in the temperate climate ( no other newgrf ), but i noticed a lot of cpu demand, even slowing down my experience to the point of not being able to play ( P4 2.4 533BUS ). Is it the price we have to pay for support 32bpp or just the need for more optimizations on 32bpp code?
22:25:20  <Bjarni> and it was really expensive
22:25:41  <Rubidium> Digitalfox: increase the sprite cache in size, as you could've read in the 32bpp thread
22:26:05  <Rubidium> svippy: ethernet already existed in 1974
22:26:17  <svippy> I was making a joke.
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22:27:10  <Bjarni> people told me that it was a mistake to get 10base-T because BNC was cheaper.... now which one won :p
22:27:51  <glx> BNC was a pain
22:28:03  <Rubidium> UTP, but only because it's much better management-wise
22:28:08  <Rubidium> not because it's cheaper
22:28:24  <Rubidium> cheaper to buy that is
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22:28:32  <Rubidium> TCO will most likely be lower for UTP
22:28:57  <Rubidium> and UTP allows much more eloborate packet switching making the network much more efficient
22:29:00  <Digitalfox> Rubidium: I'm looking for the command to increase sprite cache size, but i'm not finding it :\
22:29:15  <Rubidium> openttd.cfg
22:29:28  <Rubidium> something with sprite cache and size in it (IIRC)
22:29:30  <Bjarni> the people, who invested in BNC almost always had problems while the people, who invested in twisted pair never had any problems
22:29:40  <Bjarni> hardware problems, that is
22:30:09  <Bjarni> issues of getting mac and windows to talk to each other and so on was common to both types of cables
22:31:26  <Bjarni> I remember a link party where we (as usual) used a 10-base-T <-> BNC bridge... one guy had to leave early and he took the whole BNC part down when he removed his computer. The 10-base-T section moved on without any problems
22:32:40  <Bjarni> the price for a 10-base-T hub was higher back then than a Gbit switch is today (with the same number of ports)
22:34:17  <Digitalfox> Rubidium: Thanks :) I have increaed it to 256 from 4 and it now runs quick :)
22:35:35  <glx> Bjarni: just remove the terminator and a BNC network is down ;)
22:35:59  <glx> same goes for an SCSI chain
22:36:29  *** Digitalfox [] has quit [Quit: Bye]
22:37:33  <Bjarni> <glx> same goes for an SCSI chain <-- not really... SCSI is odd when it comes to this. I once had a setup that worked just fine, but adding a terminator killed it
22:37:40  <Bjarni> I never figured out why
22:38:05  <glx> some SCSI devices had an internal terminator
22:38:11  <Bjarni> I know
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22:38:18  <Bjarni> and they were all off
22:38:33  <Bjarni> the same goes for them. If I enabled any of them, then the chain died
22:38:43  <Bjarni> so they were all off
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22:59:29  <Bjarni> goodnight
22:59:31  *** Bjarni [] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
23:06:53  *** Maedhros [] has quit [Quit: good night]
23:14:55  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r11143 /trunk/src/ (industry.h newgrf_industries.cpp): -Fix: the random bits were not set for the production callback when the NewGRF asked for it.
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23:40:48  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: glx * r11144 /trunk/src/ (industry_cmd.cpp newgrf.cpp newgrf_callbacks.h): -Codechange: add support for newgrf callbacks 29 and 35
23:47:01  <Eddi|zuHause2> i have a feeling something big is coming onto us...
23:47:03  *** Greyscale [~Greyscale@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:47:14  <glx> no not yet
23:48:31  <Eddi|zuHause2> does r11143 have a chance to fix the farms closing immediately?
23:49:06  <glx> and forests too (but you need Belugas' diff of course ;) )
23:50:09  <Eddi|zuHause2> i have not had forests closing
23:50:20  <Eddi|zuHause2> although i could only place them above snowline
23:50:44  <glx> in ECSWoods they were closing right after the game started
23:51:03  <Eddi|zuHause2> i am using alpine
23:51:42  <Eddi|zuHause2> and i am trying to update kernel, but i always get download timeout...
23:52:08  <glx> slap your ISP
23:52:27  <glx> or try another source
23:53:38  <Eddi|zuHause2> i am thinking it is trying to tell me i shouldn't do it :p
23:55:48  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r11145 /trunk/src/ (7 files in 2 dirs): -Codechange: add support for "decoding" TTDPs string codes wrt to registers 0x100 to 0x10F.
23:57:05  <Eddi|zuHause2> is that the issue i stumbled upon yesterday?
23:59:25  <Rubidium> what issue?

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