Log for #openttd on 18th October 2007:
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00:08:00  <Ailure> hmm
00:08:17  <Ailure> are bricks usually transported by air?
00:08:19  <Ailure> :)
00:08:35  <Ailure> I'm so considering to transport goods by air, expect the goods is from a brickworks
00:08:36  <Ailure> hmm
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00:11:34  <SmatZ> aircrafts have very low cargo capacity :-/
00:12:55  <Ailure> not with goods :P
00:13:07  <Ailure> they usually have a somewhat decent capacity with goods
00:13:50  <SmatZ> aha
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01:24:32  <DaleStan> <Rubidium> DaleStan: can we rename NewGRF to XGRF? Just so it is more generic? <-- My sarcasm detector is failing to register. Please tell me you just broke it, and a new one is on its way.
01:25:14  <DaleStan> <Belugas> problem, though, is that i want to add variable ... A1, but... <-- What new information are you trying to provide?
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02:16:56  <Nia-Teppelin> So uh, Sorry for just bustinin here and asking a question..
02:17:04  <Nia-Teppelin> Is there a way to bring AI into multiplay games?
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02:19:55  <Belugas_Gone> 04:25:14 < DaleStan> <Belugas> problem, though, is that i want to add variable ... A1, but... <-- What new information are you trying to provide?
02:20:06  <Belugas_Gone> Dalestan : the version of OTTD
02:20:25  <DaleStan> Is it possible to do that in a single flat number?
02:20:47  <DaleStan> Or are you just doing "version" and not "revision"?
02:21:25  <Belugas_Gone> sorry...
02:21:29  <Belugas_Gone> yes, revision too
02:21:41  <Belugas_Gone> i have the scheme somewhere...
02:21:44  <Belugas_Gone> give me a minute
02:23:54  <Belugas_Gone> ok got it
02:23:54  <Belugas_Gone> The NewGRF revision of OTTD:
02:23:54  <Belugas_Gone> bits  meaning.
02:23:54  <Belugas_Gone>  28-31 major version
02:23:54  <Belugas_Gone>  24-27 minor version
02:23:55  <Belugas_Gone>  20-23 build
02:23:55  <Belugas_Gone>     19 1 if it is a release, 0 if it is not.
02:23:57  <Belugas_Gone>   0-18 revision number; 0 for releases and when the revision is unknown.
02:24:33  <Belugas_Gone> on our side, it willbe something like
02:24:40  <Belugas_Gone> _openttd_newgrf_version = 0 << 28 | 6 << 24 | 0 << 20 | 0 << 19 | @@REVISION@@ & ((1 << 19) - 1);
02:25:26  <Belugas_Gone> it is in fact the specs Rubidium wrote, but it has not yet been implemented
02:26:40  <Belugas_Gone> the pendant of var 8B, in fact
02:27:35  <DaleStan> How do you determine whether you're looking at a build of newgrf_ports, which supports Newairports, or trunk, which does not?
02:29:40  <DaleStan> Or is that the job of some other test?
02:29:44  <Belugas_Gone> i'm not totally convinced branches should be taken into account regarding that
02:30:01  <Belugas_Gone> no other test planned, from what i recall
02:30:30  <Belugas_Gone> anyway, the idea of a branch is to be merged to trunk one day or the other
02:32:37  <Belugas_Gone> but i guess 1 or 2 of the 19 bits of revision number could be used to indicate a branch, if ever it is required, which is not a bad idea, after thoughs
02:32:52  <Belugas_Gone> as to indicate which branch...
02:43:12  <DaleStan> As I see it, the version number is only useful if it can be used to determine the support for the vast majority of @FEATURES, and preferably all. If newairports and trunk use the same range, then this becomes rather difficult, unless some other test is available. Of course, Patch would probably always report either 0 or -1 for A1.
02:44:14  <DaleStan> So the exact implementation in Open is more a matter of making it useful to GRF coders, not Patch coders.
02:46:20  <Belugas_Gone> indeed.  Unless a new feature that Ottd brough up (not the case already, but it might be) would be implemented in Patch, as it is the case right now (but the other way around)
02:46:34  <Belugas_Gone> so this is why i was checking for a free variable spot,
02:46:55  <Belugas_Gone> and got a bit... mixed up :)
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02:51:12  <Belugas_Gone> got to sleep
02:51:14  <Belugas_Gone> good night
02:51:20  <Belugas_Gone> and until tomorrow
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02:52:17  <DaleStan> Belugas: A1/21 is indeed free.
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07:33:32  <dihedral|away> thanks TrueBrain
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08:27:06  <dihedral|work> does squirrel thread?
08:28:12  <TrueBrain> now that is a clear english sentence indeed
08:28:14  <TrueBrain> I guess: yes
08:28:17  <TrueBrain> But maybe: no
08:28:21  <TrueBrain> depends on what you ask :)
08:29:06  <dihedral|work> would it be possible to let squirrel do what autopilot does?
08:29:31  <TrueBrain> depends on what you think autopilot does
08:29:36  <TrueBrain> really, you questions couldn't be more vague
08:34:38  <dihedral|work> ok
08:34:46  <dihedral|work> let me be as specific as possible
08:34:54  <dihedral|work> as to what i am thinking :-)
08:35:13  <dihedral|work> autopilot has the ability to act as some sort of irc bot
08:35:25  <dihedral|work> or more like a bridge to irc
08:35:35  <dihedral|work> if squirrel threads
08:35:50  <dihedral|work> one thread could connect to irc and keep that connection live
08:36:07  <dihedral|work> if squirrel has the ability to perform such actions that is
08:36:31  <TrueBrain> okay, so you want to know if Squirrel can make its own parallel threads. No, it can not.
08:36:32  <dihedral|work> it could be used to maintain a black / white list based on other data
08:36:40  <dihedral|work> :-)
08:36:51  <TrueBrain> nevertheless, it doesn't need to, to do what you want
08:36:57  <TrueBrain> but that is all in the future anyway
08:37:07  <dihedral|work> so squirrel processing time is actually openttd processing time
08:37:20  <TrueBrain> of course, as it is part of OpenTTD
08:37:32  <dihedral|work> that is why i asked about the threads :-)
08:38:02  <TrueBrain> but AIs run in threads, but they are serial threads, not parallel
08:38:11  <dihedral|work> right
08:38:33  <dihedral|work> that means, as long as the nut script is running, openttd cannot?
08:38:41  <TrueBrain> exactly
08:39:25  <dihedral|work> hmmm...
08:39:39  <dihedral|work> so if one builds some hungy nut script... openttd will lag?
08:39:55  <TrueBrain> yes
08:40:00  <TrueBrain> for AIs for sure
08:40:15  <dihedral|work> so an ai needs to run in it's own openttd instance?
08:40:33  <TrueBrain> not instance
08:41:10  <dihedral|work> but i could not play 'with' the ai in one game
08:41:35  <TrueBrain> ?
08:41:53  <dihedral|work> say i start openttd, load a nut script so i have a specific ai
08:42:06  <dihedral|work> could i play in that same game?
08:42:15  <TrueBrain> of course you can
08:42:24  <dihedral|work> or, as the nut script is threaded serially and not parallel
08:42:28  <TrueBrain> you can even start up to 7 AIs at the same time
08:42:39  * dihedral|work is confused
08:42:46  <dihedral|work> i dont get it
08:42:55  <dihedral|work> if it's serial threading
08:43:02  <TrueBrain> why would you think a serial thread would block till the end of execution of a thing as a script
08:43:10  <dihedral|work> then i would have to wait for the ai to do it's 'thing'
08:43:16  <TrueBrain> you think it would be useful to put something in a thread, that keeps running till the end of its live from the start?
08:43:23  <TrueBrain> sounds like a good waste of serial thrading :)
08:44:00  <TrueBrain> now consider the simple solution, where the serial thread gives back its control every time a command is issued outside the thread
08:44:17  <TrueBrain> basicly, every DoCommand 'pauses' the serial thread for a moment
08:44:28  <TrueBrain> giving back control to the main thread
08:44:43  <dihedral|work> but that could have influence on the length of a tick, no?
08:44:48  <TrueBrain> so unless you make long long for loops calculating things, openttd won't lag
08:45:02  <dihedral|work> ah
08:45:24  <TrueBrain> the only way to increase the length of a tick, is to make scripts work longer than.. say on an average game the gamelogic takes 10ms, you have say 7 AIs, so that is:
08:45:27  <TrueBrain> @calc 23 / 7
08:45:28  <DorpsGek> TrueBrain: 3.28571428571
08:45:34  <TrueBrain> They have to work longer than 3.2ms
08:45:37  <dihedral|work> would it be spossible to 'also' give squirrel the ability to do parallel threading?
08:46:02  <TrueBrain> technicly, of course, but it won't be done for OpenTTD in the longest time I hope
08:46:20  <dihedral|work> i mean - support both, for 2 different purposes
08:46:31  <TrueBrain> not going to happen, is my best guess
08:46:39  <dihedral|work> shame :-)
08:46:57  <TrueBrain> well, simple reason: parallel threads will be limited to.. what... 1 API function
08:46:59  <TrueBrain> which would be.. STOP
08:47:09  <dihedral|work> ...
08:47:13  <dihedral|work> let me rephrase that
08:47:33  <dihedral|work> the 2 different purposes being, ai and console :-)
08:47:48  <dihedral|work> so when at some point squirrel becomes the console language
08:48:01  <dihedral|work> when writing a nut script, choose wether parallel or serial
08:48:09  <dihedral|work> (for the console that would be)
08:48:19  <TrueBrain> what I said above goes for any SQ piece where-ever and when-ever in the code
08:48:31  <dihedral|work> k
08:48:35  <TrueBrain> parallel threading won't happen in OpenTTD any time soon
08:48:46  <TrueBrain> even the TGP status thingy isn't parallel
08:48:52  * dihedral|work was not thinking of "soon" :-P
08:48:59  <dihedral|work> TGP?
08:49:06  <TrueBrain> if I say any time soon, I mean like in the next 3 years :p
08:49:10  <TrueBrain> landscape generator
08:49:13  <dihedral|work> lol
08:50:38  <TrueBrain> dihedral|work: OpenTTD is NOT thread-safe, in any way
08:50:46  <dihedral|work> ok
08:50:47  <TrueBrain> therefor, you can't have 2 things doing things in the game at the same time
08:50:52  <TrueBrain> console does things in the game
08:50:56  <dihedral|work> right
08:50:57  <dihedral|work> yes
08:50:58  <TrueBrain> cases race-conditions
08:50:59  <TrueBrain> bad
08:51:04  <TrueBrain> so: won't happen
08:51:07  <dihedral|work> :-P
08:51:12  * dihedral|work understands that
08:51:15  <TrueBrain> the only way to make OpenTTD thread safe, is a long long long long long long long long
08:51:20  <TrueBrain> did I say: long long already?
08:51:21  <TrueBrain> road
08:51:36  <dihedral|work> you forgot to mention how long it would be...
08:51:39  <dihedral|work> :-P
08:51:58  <TrueBrain> best way of approach would be microthreads, but that requires making classes of all code, and no class can write directly into an other class
08:52:11  <TrueBrain> (so 1 class would be: _map, with tons of accessors (which we in fact already have))
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09:17:45  <gfldex> i was looking for a game that is challenging, fun to play in a team and doesnt take more then one hour per day
09:18:10  <TrueBrain> you found it! :)
09:18:14  <gfldex> all i came up with was VGAPlanets, what we used to play about 15 years ago over BBS
09:18:21  <gfldex> i feel old :(
09:18:27  <TrueBrain> bzflags!!! :)
09:18:45  <Ammler> worms
09:18:51  <TrueBrain> OpenTTD!
09:19:00  <gfldex> takes more then 1 hour per day
09:19:08  <gfldex> and you cant really play it in a team yet
09:19:13  <TrueBrain> depends.. if you puase after an hour :)
09:19:20  <TrueBrain> sure you can!
09:19:34  <gfldex> can you share money and stuff?
09:19:41  <TrueBrain> you can join 1 company
09:19:54  <Ammler> we do that all the time at #openttdcoop
09:20:10  <gfldex> and do you stop after 1 hour?
09:20:19  <TrueBrain> you can pause and continue later, sure, why not
09:20:27  <Ammler> sometimes after half an hour
09:20:52  <Ammler> but others might play forward then...
09:20:55  <TrueBrain> but okay, there are more ideal games for team-to-team :p
09:20:58  <TrueBrain> Quake!
09:20:59  <TrueBrain> DOOM!
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09:21:04  <Ammler> omg
09:21:05  <gfldex> takes all to long
09:21:20  <TrueBrain> Quake? Long? Lol :p
09:21:27  <TrueBrain> my average match length if 10 minutes :p
09:22:01  <TrueBrain> and in my case also: EVE: Online
09:22:06  <TrueBrain> can't play that game for more than an hour
09:22:08  <TrueBrain> makes my eyes pop
09:22:18  <TrueBrain> (because of the boring factor)
09:22:20  <gfldex> i used to play 16 hours in one go at lan parties
09:22:34  <TrueBrain> sure, if you like you can play as long as you want
09:22:35  <gfldex> quake does for sure take more then one hour
09:22:42  <TrueBrain> but then all games don't fit your description
09:22:48  <gfldex> the point is that i want to force myself to play less
09:22:52  <TrueBrain> as you can always play them for a long long time
09:23:00  <TrueBrain> set a power-interupter on your PC
09:23:10  <Ammler> gfldex: then you should look for worst game
09:23:16  <gfldex> and VGAPlanets got a tern every 2nd day so there was simply no reason to play more :)
09:23:21  <Ammler> you are wrong here then...
09:23:25  <gfldex> :(
09:23:35  <TrueBrain> go play chess via email
09:24:06  <dihedral|work> nice idea
09:24:55  * dihedral|work sends A2 => C3 to TrueBrain
09:25:04  <hylje> chess over irc
09:25:13  <gfldex> i got so depressed that i started to reimplement VGAPlanets
09:25:37  <gfldex> now i code 10 hours a day and still waste a lot time
09:25:39  * dihedral|work might have confused where numbers and chars are located on a chess board
09:25:45  <dihedral|work>
09:26:15  * dihedral|work corrects is last statement, to b1 => c3
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09:26:21  <Ailure> bah stupid IRC client
09:26:30  <Ailure> and oh yeah, just wanted to mention something funny before going to bed
09:26:59  <Ailure> Gotta love how the same keyboard command can differ alot between games
09:27:04  <TrueBrain> d7=>d6
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09:27:18  <Ailure> Ctrl+S is screenshot in openTTD
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09:27:23  <Ailure> but save game in Simcity4
09:27:34  <Ailure> I nearly ruined a Simcity4 savegame that way
09:27:35  <Ailure> D:
09:27:36  <gfldex> you got a lot screenshots, right?
09:27:42  <Ailure> no
09:27:44  <Ailure> the other way around
09:27:50  <Ailure> I saved when I thought I was taking a screenshot
09:27:51  <TrueBrain> Ailure: don't play simcity, problem solved :)
09:28:06  <Ailure> but Simcity 4: Rush hour is addicting
09:28:11  <TrueBrain> or ask simcity if they can give a warning when an OpenTTD users plays SimCity, on CTRL+S keypress
09:28:24  <dihedral|work> desync when giving Kommer's train 9 a goto order
09:28:26  <gfldex> so you wanted to keep nice pics of that fat disaster?
09:28:59  <dihedral|work> fixes when selling loc and rebuying it
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09:32:43  <Brandinger> hi
09:33:01  <TrueBrain> hi Brandinger
09:33:14  <Brandinger> i've got a little question
09:33:20  <TrueBrain> oh-oh
09:33:23  <Brandinger> :)
09:33:48  <Brandinger> ...considering the funtionality of the transfer-button when giving orders to vehicels
09:35:47  <Brandinger> i connected 2 cities for passernger transfer. when i just gave normal goto-orders without any load/unload/transfer he took as much people from one destination and the other way. i got the money and the people walked away.
09:36:48  <Brandinger> then i changed the order to transfer (german "Umladen und beladen"). he throuh everybody out of the train, i got the money but the people stayed at the station
09:37:31  <Brandinger> after some time i got 3000 people waiting at the station because they did not wanted to finish their journey :)
09:37:45  <TrueBrain> transfer in general does that exactly that: move things from one station to the other, but do not unload them
09:37:52  <TrueBrain> useful if you want to bring them even futher
09:38:13  <Brandinger> but i got the money for the transportation
09:38:21  <TrueBrain> then don't transfer them
09:38:25  <TrueBrain> see the wiki-page
09:38:42  <Brandinger> yeah thats what i did not understood ^^
09:39:06  <Eddi|zuHause2> Brandinger: if you use transfer, you do not get any money, just an estimation how much money you would get if you unloaded them there
09:39:09  <TrueBrain> transfer means: pick up at A, bring to B but don't get money (transfer). Someone else picks up at B, brings them to C (non-transfer), and everyone gets money
09:39:30  <Eddi|zuHause2> that's why the money is not green
09:39:44  <Brandinger> ah ok
09:40:34  <dihedral|work> Bandinger "umladen" != "ausladen"
09:41:10  <Brandinger> k :)
09:43:00  <Brandinger> one more question :) how did the trick work to make two different stations one with space in between?
09:44:01  <Brandinger> to make one station with train and airport that are not touching directly
09:44:09  <Brandinger> for example
09:44:13  <gfldex> you make one big station with a connection
09:44:27  <gfldex> and then remove the connection with the bulldoze icon thingy
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09:44:48  <gfldex> like you would remove a signal without touching the track
09:46:14  <Brandinger> ok, thanks alot :)
09:46:23  <Brandinger> i think that will help
09:47:14  <Eddi|zuHause2> pay attention, bulldozing a train station tile removes the entire station
09:47:31  <Eddi|zuHause2> actually, that's the dynamite
09:47:49  <Brandinger> yep so i would use bus-stations for build the connection, right?
09:47:53  <Eddi|zuHause2> early morning...
09:48:02  <gfldex> you can but you dont have to
09:48:21  <gfldex> if you use the single tile paint thingy to drag stations across your screen
09:48:27  <gfldex> you can just start to paint away
09:48:35  <gfldex> and then remove the bits you dont like
09:48:46  <Eddi|zuHause2> you can do that, but hitting the "build station" button, and then the "bulldozer" button on the right (like you do with rails) should also work
09:49:08  <gfldex> isnt there a wiki page with screenshots and all?
09:51:50  * Brandinger found this
09:53:11  <Brandinger> alright, thx again and byebye :)
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10:06:39  <dihedral|work> TrueBrain: would there be any outlook on the possiblility tcp or udp rcon patckets that will not require one to be a client to the game?
10:12:05  <TrueBrain> depends if someone programs it :p
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10:21:20  <dihedral|work> well - just adding packet types for udp should be simple enough
10:21:38  <TrueBrain> use tcp
10:21:51  <dihedral|work> do i not need a handshake for tcp?
10:22:28  <TrueBrain> tcp handshakes the OS takes care of for you :p
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10:22:37  <dihedral|work> uh - good
10:22:50  <TrueBrain> but it should be telnet alike
10:22:56  <TrueBrain> udp is too insecure for something like this
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10:26:00  <dihedral|work> k
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10:26:07  <dihedral|work> i'll see what i can do ;-)
10:27:17  <gfldex> if you leave your lan and enter the wild ocean that is the internet you will have to deal with 3% packet loss all the time
10:27:36  <gfldex> if you got asymetric lines with load it can get a lot higher
10:28:48  <dihedral|work> yes, aint all that nice :-)
10:29:00  <dihedral|work> i hate lost packets
10:32:18  <gfldex> i finally found a font i like :)
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10:38:41  <dihedral|work> hello
10:42:42  <dihedral|work> clients on my nightly are desyncing a lot when giving train orders to new trains...
10:43:06  <dihedral|work> 'a lot' meaning when train orders are being given it may occure :-)
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10:52:21  <dihedral|work> TrueBrain: would that rcon tcp connection need to be to another port?
10:52:34  <dihedral|work> or would a 'packet type' be sufficient to dertermin that
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10:52:59  <dihedral|work> just in time :-P
10:57:09  <TrueBrain> dihedral|work: other port, of course
10:57:27  <TrueBrain> rcon should be text-based
10:57:28  <TrueBrain> not binary
10:58:39  <dihedral|work> k
10:59:28  <dihedral|work> another question, just to help me understand...
10:59:39  <dihedral|work> other games tend to use udp for their rcon protocol
10:59:54  <dihedral|work> why then use tcp - i mean - there must be a reason why they use udp...
10:59:59  <TrueBrain> lol!
11:00:04  <TrueBrain> I know zero games who do
11:00:08  <dihedral|work> hl2
11:00:10  <dihedral|work> hl
11:00:11  <TrueBrain> uses TCP
11:00:29  <dihedral|work> and why on earth do you find _UDP_ web interfaces to the rcon
11:00:43  <dihedral|work> q3 uses udp also
11:00:46  <TrueBrain> hl uses udp for gaming
11:00:48  <TrueBrain> for querying
11:00:52  <TrueBrain> but server control is tcp
11:01:20  <TrueBrain> (as you can do it via telnet too)
11:01:59  <dihedral|work> k
11:03:32  <dihedral|work> thanks TrueBrain
11:04:55  <TrueBrain> dihedral|work: you use UDP if it doesn't matter if the other end receives your packet
11:04:58  <TrueBrain> you use TCP when it does matter
11:05:01  <TrueBrain> Rcon -> does matter
11:05:06  <TrueBrain> OpenTTD Game Logic -> does matter
11:05:12  <TrueBrain> HL Game Logic -> doesn't matter
11:05:31  <TrueBrain> (in HL you don't care if you miss 1 update package of a persons position)
11:06:09  <dihedral|work> k
11:06:15  <dihedral|work> yes - does make sense :-)
11:12:19  <gfldex> q3 handles the packet lost "by hand"
11:12:36  <gfldex> so they reimplement the handshake/resend semantics of tcp
11:23:53  <dihedral|work> ah
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11:30:13  <Kilinich> hi, is here someone who try write OpenTTD AI ?
11:30:25  <TrueBrain> search wiki for NoAI
11:30:37  <Kilinich> already did -)
11:30:41  <dihedral|work> :
11:31:13  <Kilinich> and realize that no AIRail clall in framework
11:31:20  <Kilinich> class
11:31:30  <TrueBrain> dihedral|work: didn't I told you? :)
11:31:40  <dihedral|work> tell me what?
11:31:46  <TrueBrain> Kilinich: first try to make a good AI in Road, then come back to us about Rail
11:31:53  <dihedral|work> :-)
11:32:47  <dihedral|work> true
11:32:56  <dihedral|work> dont start with the most complicated :-P
11:32:59  <Kilinich> what isn't related things. ok.
11:33:18  <dihedral|work> ?
11:33:51  <Kilinich> imagine that I did it. and then come back... -) so...
11:34:07  <Kilinich> let's talk about rail
11:34:20  <TrueBrain> someone still needs to code it
11:34:46  <TrueBrain> but because there is little enthoisasme in building roadAIs for example, my spirit of doing so is a bit low lately ;)
11:35:18  <dihedral|work> TrueBrain: is there AI API stuff for ships?
11:35:27  <TrueBrain> yes
11:35:29  <TrueBrain> ai_marine
11:35:32  <Kilinich> what is the problem with class AIRail ? why AIRoad done and it isn't?
11:35:39  <TrueBrain> road was easier
11:35:43  <dihedral|work> :-)
11:36:00  <dihedral|work> for ships, can i find out if a ship can atall get from dock A to dock B?
11:36:01  <TrueBrain> so show me a good RoadAI, and I make Rails for you :)
11:36:09  <TrueBrain> dihedral|work: no
11:36:17  <TrueBrain> no pathfinding in API yet, for any class
11:36:25  <dihedral|work> ok
11:36:38  <dihedral|work> would that be a lot of work to implement?
11:36:44  <Kilinich> I don't ask for pathfinding i wan builr rails -)
11:36:52  <TrueBrain> base already is there for PFs, so no
11:36:57  <dihedral|work> Kilinich: I am asking about ships
11:36:59  <TrueBrain> Kilinich: I was tlaking to dihedral|work :)
11:37:18  <TrueBrain> Anyway, Kilinich, make me a good RoadAI, I make you Rail support, and I am pretty serious :)
11:37:45  <dihedral|work> that means, post the road ai somewhere so it can be tested :-)
11:38:13  <dihedral|work> perhaps start a new thread in tt-forums to get others more enthusiastic about it too
11:40:00  <dihedral|work> are there some sort of 'nightly' builds for the noai branch?
11:40:07  <TrueBrain> of course
11:40:14  <TrueBrain>
11:40:17  <TrueBrain> see NoAI thread
11:40:32  <dihedral|work> i just dont have the options to build on windows
11:40:42  <dihedral|work> and - dont like the thought of it either
11:41:07  <Kilinich> i start my IA already, trying some stuff, i think week-two and i can show it.
11:41:09  <TrueBrain> for all our branches we always supply binaries
11:41:17  <Kilinich> IA -AI -)
11:41:18  <TrueBrain> Kilinich: would be awesome :)
11:41:35  <Rubidium> Kilinich: there were also a lot of people who said they were going to make a road AI when it would be possible. As far as I remember there are still no road AIs, which made us a little hesistant to add more effort for something that nobody was going to use.
11:41:43  <Kilinich> joking yea -)
11:42:40  <dihedral|work> the only thing i could think of would be to use the ai on a multiplayer from my client...
11:42:42  <Kilinich> i know
11:42:53  <dihedral|work> to start the company making some cash before i then take over :-P
11:42:55  <TrueBrain> dihedral|work: it is possible to battle AIs against eachother :)
11:43:01  <dihedral|work> nice
11:43:17  <dihedral|work> is the ai aware of patch settings/
11:43:18  <dihedral|work> ?
11:43:27  <TrueBrain> net yet
11:43:39  <dihedral|work> that might be a good thing too
11:43:45  <TrueBrain> yup
11:43:49  <TrueBrain> create it :)
11:43:55  <dihedral|work> :-P
11:43:59  <dihedral|work> add it to the todo list
11:44:00  <dihedral|work> :-D
11:44:07  <Eddi|zuHause2> rewrite the difficulty settings if you're at it ;)
11:44:14  <dihedral|work> nope
11:44:16  <dihedral|work> 2 different things
11:45:11  <Kilinich> TrueBrain: that criteria of good Road ai? is there example of what is done?
11:45:15  <dihedral|work> but making the ai aware of intrest rates, subsity multiplyer, breakdowns, 90degree turns for trains, etc could be very important
11:45:29  <TrueBrain> Kilinich: nope
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11:46:11  <Kilinich> making some profit easy, hard to do something compare to people
11:46:34  <Eddi|zuHause2> dihedral|work: yeah, but so is "allow turning in stations"
11:46:38  <TrueBrain> Kilinich: let's say, it can survive for 10 years :)
11:46:46  <Kilinich> lanscaping is free am i right?
11:46:54  <TrueBrain> you are wrong
11:46:55  <TrueBrain> that is OldAI
11:46:57  <Eddi|zuHause2> and accessing difficlty settings is probably difficult
11:46:58  <TrueBrain> NoAI is a fair AI
11:46:59  <TrueBrain> no cheats
11:47:05  <TrueBrain> it can only do what real players do
11:47:15  <Eddi|zuHause2> i mean more difficult than patch settings
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11:47:58  <Kilinich> TrueBrain, have you ICQ?
11:48:09  <TrueBrain> nope, but I do have IRC!
11:48:19  <Eddi|zuHause2> really?
11:48:24  * SpComb has bitlbee
11:48:24  <Eddi|zuHause2> can i have that, too?
11:48:30  <Kilinich> and you are always here?
11:48:39  <TrueBrain> always.. hmm.. yes :p
11:48:53  <Kilinich> sorry -0)
11:49:18  <TrueBrain> nothing to be sorry about :p
11:49:38  <SpComb> I don't have an ICQ account, but I'm on MSN whenever my IRC client is up, which it has been for 173 days now
11:50:43  <Kilinich> TrueBrain: what common advice for road AI you have?
11:50:51  <TrueBrain> make it good :)
11:50:58  <Kilinich> 10x
11:51:04  <TrueBrain> read some good AI documentation
11:51:22  <Kilinich> wiki?
11:51:33  <TrueBrain> I myself am pretty bad in AIs :p
11:52:08  <Kilinich> I myself a good AI -)
11:52:33  <Kilinich> so I just clone it
11:52:59  <Kilinich> and translate to squirrel
11:54:08  <TrueBrain> squirrel is almost equal to C++, so if you know that, you should be fone
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12:08:20  <dihedral|work>
12:09:53  <dihedral|work> TrueBrain: can you pin the wwottdgd thread in the OpenTTD General Forum
12:10:19  <Eddi|zuHause2> i finally think i got this station entrance right:,%2020.%20Okt%201947.png
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12:18:26  <Ammler> Eddi|zuHause2: diagonal foundations needed :P
12:18:45  <Eddi|zuHause2> Ammler: yeah, that would be nice sometimes
12:19:30  <Eddi|zuHause2> also, diagonal bridges and CBR, because those tunnels are unrealistic
12:19:38  <Ammler> it also looks like typical PBS
12:20:05  <Ammler> CBR?
12:20:50  <Eddi|zuHause2> Custom Bridge Heads
12:20:50  <Ammler> Eddi|zuHause2: try BKTunnels, would look better, I think...
12:21:29  <Eddi|zuHause2> to place signals or crossings on bridge heads
12:21:39  <Eddi|zuHause2> not just a straigt rail
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12:22:17  <Eddi|zuHause2> the previous attempt was stopped, because the signal part was not possible with the current system
12:23:23  <Eddi|zuHause2> well, PBS would be nice, but it works without
12:23:41  <Eddi|zuHause2> i'd only have half the problems with PBS
12:24:40  <Ammler> Eddi|zuHause2:
12:26:03  <Eddi|zuHause2> Ammler: i don't really like those
12:26:13  <Ammler> tunnels?
12:26:20  <Ammler> thats not BK
12:26:39  <Ammler> those aren't allowed to use in OTTD
12:26:43  <Eddi|zuHause2> i know
12:26:55  <Eddi|zuHause2> but also they lack a drawing of the rail basement
12:28:16  <Eddi|zuHause2> hm, something is wrong with the freight overview of trains...
12:28:38  <Eddi|zuHause2> "-0 Tonnen Getreide (252 Getreide) (x4)"
12:29:16  <Ammler> I asked Osakar to use them in OTTD too, he told, BK Tunnels looks much better, I should use them
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12:57:09  <dihedral|work> anybody here that does grf stuff?
12:57:13  <dihedral|work> *who
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12:59:12  <dihedral|work> or some sprite stuff?
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13:02:21  <dihedral|work> we are looking for a grf for #wwottdgd
13:02:31  <dihedral|work> it will also be included in the #openttdcoop grf pack
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13:23:56  <dihedral|work>
13:28:02  <dihedral|work> TrueBrain: can you pin some threads for me?
13:28:11  <dihedral|work> s/me/us/
13:28:15  <dihedral|work> us as in #wwottdgd
13:43:49  <Purno> anyone here who knows some stuff about cpanel coincidentally?
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14:24:42  <dihedral|work> @seen Wolf01
14:24:42  <DorpsGek> dihedral|work: Wolf01 was last seen in #openttd 16 hours, 44 minutes, and 4 seconds ago: <Wolf01> 'night
14:24:59  <dihedral|work> anybody up to
14:26:59  <Sacro> dihedral|work: i'll spam it in #tycoon
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14:27:13  <dihedral|work> promisse?
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15:37:14  <PIP> hello
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15:37:26  <PIP> just a quick question 8love the game though)
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15:37:36  <PIP> is it possible to destroy a city owned crossroad?
15:37:36  *** Eddi|zuHause [] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
15:37:41  <PIP> it's basicly a roundabout
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15:38:08  <dihedral|work> yes
15:38:16  <dihedral|work> you need the coorect rating in that town
15:38:34  <dihedral|work> there is also a patch setting
15:38:39  <PIP> doesn't help even if i have outstanding
15:38:44  <dihedral|work> remove more town owned blah
15:38:52  <dihedral|work> what does it say
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15:39:23  <dihedral|work> you get a message if something does not work what you are trying to do
15:40:19  <Greyscale> going home now. BYe
15:40:21  <PIP> um
15:40:22  *** Greyscale [~Greyscale@] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
15:40:41  <PIP> Can't clear this Area. local Authoroty refuses to allow this.
15:41:29  <PIP>
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15:42:58  <dihedral|work> patch setting
15:43:09  <dihedral|work> remove more towned owned something
15:43:23  <PIP> yeah
15:43:25  <PIP> tried it
15:43:26  <PIP> works
15:43:29  <PIP> thanks a lot :)
15:43:32  <PIP> cya
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15:43:45  <SmatZ> hello
15:47:14  <dihedral|work> hi
15:52:05  * dihedral|work needs a gfx'er
15:58:44  *** _42_ [truelight@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:59:00  <dihedral|work> uh
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16:20:27  <Ammler> Problems with webpage / SVN Server ?
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16:44:44  <Wolf01> hello
16:45:03  <SmatZ> hi
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16:48:02  <dihedral> desyncs while someone is 'generating' faces for his company profile??
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16:49:38  <SmatZ> hmm great, is out of order for commiting bugs
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16:53:05  <SmatZ> dihedral yeah
16:53:14  <SmatZ> it should use interactive_random
16:53:21  <Ammller> Rubidium: same assert now on an other server, if you like to take a look :)
16:54:17  <SmatZ> Ammller: yes
16:54:33  <SmatZ> I have problems too :-(
16:54:45  * dihedral is still looking for someone to do some grf work for #wwottdgd
16:54:52  <Ammller> omg
16:55:23  <Ammller> your are all so poor guys.
16:55:28  <Ammller> brb
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16:58:14  <Ammler> something is broken with dns, isn't?
16:59:10  <dihedral> it's there for me
16:59:30  <dihedral> where on earth is TB?
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17:00:06  <dihedral> :-)
17:00:11  <dihedral> at least that is a start
17:00:13  <Ammler> hmm, now, seems ok
17:02:11  * dihedral is waiting for TrueBrain to follow _42_
17:02:28  <SmatZ> yesyesyes works now
17:02:30  <SmatZ> at last
17:02:39  <SmatZ> amd64 bin # ./openttd
17:02:43  <SmatZ> is not working for me :-/
17:02:52  <SmatZ> somwthing wrong at my side...
17:03:13  <SmatZ> maybe the hdd is on its last trip today
17:03:27  <dihedral> put it in the freezer
17:03:31  <Ammler> Rubidium: bt of
17:03:33  <dihedral> preserve it
17:04:35  <SmatZ> dihedral hopefully I do not have any important data there... maybe I will just do dd if=/dev/hda1 of=/backup bs=512 ...
17:04:57  <SmatZ> it is a small partition with system
17:05:32  <dihedral> heh
17:05:39  <dihedral> i have had trouble with dd in the past
17:05:48  <dihedral> esp when dd'ing back from the image
17:05:56  <dihedral> to a hdd that did not have the same geomety
17:05:57  <SmatZ> yes
17:06:06  <SmatZ> dd skips bad sectors
17:06:23  <dihedral> what else should it do...
17:06:23  <SmatZ> so... the backup is useless
17:06:43  <SmatZ> I expected it to write some data instead of skipping the block
17:07:09  <SmatZ> because that way, the sector numbers won't match those before backup
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17:09:33  <ln-> he was running openttd as root and no one said anything?
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17:10:21  <Ammler> dihedral: what does ResetGRFConfig(false) do in your patch?
17:14:07  <dihedral> let me look at that for a sec
17:14:28  <dihedral> ln-: who was?
17:16:03  <ln-> SmatZ
17:16:13  <dihedral> ouch
17:16:20  <dihedral> that is a very clever thing to do...
17:16:36  <Maedhros> Ammler: that backtrace is next to useless...
17:16:58  <Ammler> ok,
17:17:10  <Ammler> its just meant be a 1. look
17:17:28  <Ammler> Rubidum did take a longer look yesterday on that
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17:18:14  <Maedhros> ok
17:18:44  <Ammler> Maedhros: not sure, do you know something about that?
17:18:51  <Ammler> do you like to habe a look on it?
17:19:02  <dihedral> Ammler: makes sure the grf config is loaded
17:19:13  <Ammler> !s/habe/have/
17:19:43  <Ammler> dihedral, would that open possibility to load new GRF during a game?
17:19:45  *** MarkSlap [] has joined #openttd
17:20:03  <Ammler> so you don't have to do it local?
17:20:24  <dihedral> hmmm
17:21:05  *** Markkisen [] has joined #openttd
17:26:33  *** Belugas [belugas@] has joined #openttd
17:26:44  * dihedral greets Belugas
17:26:48  *** mode/#openttd [+o Belugas] by ChanServ
17:26:56  * Belugas waves
17:27:00  <Wolf01> hello Belugas :D
17:27:07  <dihedral> Wolf01:
17:27:26  <dihedral> <--- intereste??
17:27:52  <Belugas> hello Wolf01 :)
17:28:40  *** Purno_ [] has joined #openttd
17:29:12  <Rubidium> Ammler: you're not talking about the server I had a ssh connection to yesterday, right?
17:29:45  <Ammler> no, its one from coop
17:30:08  <Rubidium> so not a server I've "played" with
17:30:10  *** Greyscale [] has joined #openttd
17:30:14  <Ammler> but I could add you key there too, if if would help...
17:30:21  <Ammler> nope :)
17:30:27  <Ammler> that server still runs
17:31:18  <Wolf01> dihedral: eh... i'll never draw it in time :P i'm taking soo long to draw a stupid road, and it's easy to do, think about celebration things like banners or something else
17:32:20  <Rubidium> Ammler: nah, I think I know what caused the assert
17:32:30  <Wolf01> you might want something like this :P
17:32:50  <dihedral> no... that is too mucyh
17:33:03  <dihedral> just need a little color
17:33:52  <Wolf01> i was thinking about drawing a band on the road which replaces the roadworks
17:34:10  <Ammler> Rubidium: you mean you have fixed "my" server, that why it doesn't assert anymore?
17:34:34  <Rubidium> it at least looks like it
17:35:24  <Ammler> is that already in trunk?
17:35:32  <Rubidium> no
17:35:38  *** Purno [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:35:41  <Ammler> or should I make a patch and make it in dev server too?
17:35:48  *** SmatZ [] has joined #openttd
17:38:55  *** Greyscale [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:40:36  <Ammler> hmm, you "just" changed the assert...
17:41:33  *** Fluidicspace [] has joined #openttd
17:41:49  *** TinoM| [] has joined #openttd
17:42:43  <ln-> SmatZ: why are you running openttd as root?
17:43:11  *** Grey [] has joined #openttd
17:43:13  <Ammler> wow, thats brave
17:43:18  <Ammler> (or stupid?)
17:43:22  <SmatZ> ln-: why do you think so?
17:43:23  *** mode/#openttd [+v _42_] by Belugas
17:43:38  <ln-> 20:02 < SmatZ> amd64 bin # ./openttd
17:44:14  <SmatZ> well, you may customize your shell, too...
17:44:33  <ln-> ... but that's not the case here, is it.
17:45:19  *** Wolf01 is now known as Wolf01|AWAY
17:45:24  <CIA-5> OpenTTD: rubidium * r11290 /trunk/src/network/core/packet.cpp: -Fix: obiwan in the assertion that checked for overflows when writing a packet, causing still correctly sized packets to cause assertions.
17:45:45  <SmatZ> well, I couldn't run it, and I couldn't run it even as a root
17:46:33  <SmatZ> !openttd commit 11289
17:46:38  <SmatZ> !help
17:46:41  <_42_> Commit by truelight :: r11289 /branches/noai/ (5 files in 2 dirs) (2007-10-17 23:45:22 UTC)
17:46:43  <_42_> [NoAI] -Add [FS#1346]: added AIVehicle::Is(Stopped)InDepot() (dihedral)
17:46:53  *** TinoM [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:47:14  <dihedral> Wolf01|AWAY: if you feel like doing the work for us, we would much appreciate it
17:48:11  <SmatZ> hmm seems I polluted FS with 1347-1349 while it was offline... if anyone can delete 1347,1348, do so
17:49:45  * Belugas likes removing FS entries
17:50:33  <glx> done
17:50:55  <SmatZ> thanks
17:50:59  <Belugas> lol
17:51:07  <Belugas> I lost the race :D
17:51:14  <Belugas> glx was faster
17:51:20  <SmatZ> I thought about actual removing, not just closing, but ok :)
17:51:28  <Ammler> does delete equal fixing?
17:52:34  *** Phazorx [] has joined #openttd
17:53:24  <Belugas> Ammler, not always, it depends on each case
17:53:39  <Ammler> :)
17:54:19  *** Sriikki [] has quit []
17:55:29  <Phazorx> brr... my tcp driver just went awol...
17:55:51  <Phazorx> Ammler: invite me to where ever i am supposed to be plz
17:56:26  <Ammler> hmm?
17:56:45  <Phazorx> channel i mean
17:56:59  *** FlowaPowa [] has joined #openttd
17:57:03  *** FlowaPowa [] has left #openttd []
17:57:38  <Ammler> #wwottdgd?
17:57:53  <Phazorx> since i was missing i dont know if it has been asked here yet - is it possible to stop random tree planting with grf, or has to be a code change?
17:57:57  <Phazorx> Ammler: the other one
17:58:47  <Ammler> #wwottdgd.admin
17:59:33  <Belugas> Phazorx, i REALLY doubt you can stop random tree planting with grf right now
17:59:45  <Belugas> unless you write it ;)
18:00:07  <Phazorx> Belugas: so a patch would be nice
18:00:21  <Phazorx> err... not nice - the only option
18:02:05  <SmatZ> it would be nice if you were so fast with commiting patches from FS, as you were with closing FS#1347,1348 :-x
18:02:35  *** Progman [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
18:06:13  *** Wolf01|AWAY is now known as Wolf01
18:07:17  <Eddi|zuHause> stopping tree growth is probably a matter of adding an if() to a function call
18:07:54  <Eddi|zuHause> and adding a patch setting is not more than a few lines either
18:10:07  *** Wezz6400 [] has joined #openttd
18:11:36  <huma> damn, this city is growing too fast :)
18:11:52  <huma> 11243
18:12:05  <SmatZ> what city?
18:12:35  <huma> kollumenvorden :)
18:13:17  <huma> maybe funding new buildings and roads was a mistake :)
18:13:55  <SmatZ> maybe you are in a wrong channel
18:14:23  <Phazorx> Eddi|zuHause: yes, should nto be any hard if you know what you are doign :)
18:15:06  <dihedral> back
18:16:19  <dihedral> Wolf01: so... was that a yes or a not?
18:16:31  <Wolf01> i think is a no
18:16:34  *** Brianetta [] has joined #openttd
18:16:49  <dihedral> you dont have to answer right away :-P
18:17:02  * dihedral goes to hunt for another gfx'er
18:17:10  <dihedral> HELP....
18:17:19  <dihedral> :'(
18:17:30  <Belugas> [14:09] <Eddi|zuHause> stopping tree growth is probably a matter of adding an if() to a function call  <---nice :) another volunteer :D
18:18:08  <Wolf01> at least... if you want i might draw the sprites, but you must code them by yourself, because i really don't know how to make grfs :P
18:19:07  <Phazorx> Eddi|zuHause: feel like making a patch like that?
18:20:36  <dihedral> Wolf01: that already would be great
18:20:52  <Eddi|zuHause> no, i don't have that kind of time to spend right now
18:21:00  <dihedral> as Ammler said that if i made the sprites he could code the grf, and i really dont know how to do the sprites :-)
18:21:24  <dihedral> leaving aside the fact that i suck at design / images
18:21:45  <Wolf01> supply me the source images and i'll try what i can do, i'll tell you in a day or two if i can do it
18:23:31  <dihedral> i dont have a 'source image'...
18:24:09  <dihedral> but if you can get hold of the town lanterns (which must be somewhere) :-)
18:24:26  <Belugas> Phazorx, if you wan to do it by grf, yu might face a big problem : there is no spec (that i know of) who can control stuff like trees behaviour
18:24:36  <Belugas> you'll end up creating ne yourself :)
18:24:38  <Phazorx> Belugas: patch is much better
18:24:44  <Wolf01> ?
18:24:49  <Phazorx> this is for #wwottdgd we are gonna have own buuild anwyay
18:24:51  <Belugas> i hate adding patches :(
18:24:57  <Belugas> grf is so cool for that...
18:25:25  <dihedral> yes - Wolf01 - that is a lantern
18:28:31  <Ammler> no tree patch:
18:28:34  <Ammler> :)
18:29:27  <Eddi|zuHause> Ammler: i fear that will stop grass grow, too
18:30:18  *** skidd13 [] has joined #openttd
18:30:22  <skidd13> hi
18:30:26  <Phazorx> Eddi|zuHause: fine with that
18:30:53  <Eddi|zuHause> i'd rather try
18:32:10  <Eddi|zuHause> Phazorx: i wouldn't like to play on a map that is all dirty
18:32:28  *** Jezral [] has joined #openttd
18:32:55  <Phazorx> Eddi|zuHause: no one stops you from pretting it up
18:33:54  <huma> can i change one route order for all vehicles in depot?
18:34:25  *** Dephenom [~paul@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
18:34:58  <huma> like one station suddenly stopped accepting food and now i need to redirect them to another one
18:35:03  *** Dephenom [~paul@] has joined #openttd
18:35:38  <Eddi|zuHause> hm, my version does not affect tree planting
18:36:10  <huma> and this is happening in the downtown of 13 million city
18:36:20  <huma> apparently they've had enough
18:36:43  *** TinoDidriksen [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
18:37:09  <Eddi|zuHause> huma: office buildings don't accept food
18:37:15  <Eddi|zuHause> only living houses
18:38:18  <Eddi|zuHause> i suggest dropping off food at the main station (transfer), and distributing them by trucks to the suburbs
18:39:54  *** Bjarni [] has joined #openttd
18:39:55  *** mode/#openttd [+o Bjarni] by ChanServ
18:40:06  <ln-> a ...!
18:40:12  <Ammler> eddi, runned may patch now for 100 years, no trees, but grass growing
18:41:31  <Eddi|zuHause> Ammler: yeah, i think yours will work
18:41:45  <Eddi|zuHause> only don't play a tropic game :p
18:43:12  <Ammler> Rubidium: I'll update the dev server on coop now, should work with current nightly
18:47:18  <Bjarni> I see that Markkisen is back
18:47:23  <Markkisen> No
18:47:24  <Markkisen> :o
18:47:33  <Markkisen> It's an illusion
18:47:43  <Bjarni> Markkisen: do you know the story about a guy who joined this channel while he was high?
18:47:45  *** MarkSlap is now known as MarkMc
18:47:49  <Markkisen> Nope
18:47:53  *** Markkisen is now known as MarkSlap
18:49:18  <Bjarni> well... from his point of view he decided to try some drugs of some kind for the first time ever and the next thing he remembers is waking up the next day. Then he is contacted (by email or IRC... I don't know) asking if it's true that he said that (name of person contacting him) is a drug addict and party animal
18:49:23  <Bjarni> in this channel
18:49:43  <Bjarni> he couldn't remember ever being in this channel so he joined
18:50:05  <Bjarni> and everybody knew about his personal issues and problems with his sister and stuff
18:50:38  <Bjarni> and he went like "oh god, did I really tell about all of that to a bunch of strangers in a channel that I had never been in before?"
18:50:43  *** AntB [] has joined #openttd
18:50:46  <Bjarni> yes he did :P
18:50:49  <huma> Eddi|zuHause: thanks
18:51:24  <Bjarni> funny thing is that we have his real name and location so we can get to him if we like :P
18:51:37  <Eddi|zuHause> huma: problem with transfer, you need to time your trucks so food does not pile up at the station, it will kill your profit
18:51:39  <Bjarni> that is what drugs do to you
18:52:20  <huma> yes, i try to balance it
18:52:21  <MarkMc> What kind of drugs?
18:52:30  <Bjarni> like I would remember that
18:52:34  <MarkMc> :P
18:52:41  <Bjarni> if I really cared I could look it up
18:52:42  <dihedral> and why are you so interested
18:52:46  <MarkMc> Like cannabis would fuck you up that much
18:52:48  <Bjarni> but it's drugs... that's all that you need to know
18:52:50  <MarkMc> Nice
18:53:15  <MarkMc> Yes, it would be nice if you looked that up
18:53:15  <MarkMc> :)
18:54:01  <Bjarni> dihedral: I banned Markkisen last night for proclaiming that he had drugs and something else
18:54:09  <Bjarni> basically the drugs thing was enough
18:54:12  <MarkMc> :>
18:54:32  <huma> i think i'm addicted to green tea :)
18:54:34  <Bjarni> btw did you write your (fake) real name while you were high?
18:54:49  <MarkMc> What?
18:55:15  <Bjarni> come on
18:55:22  <Bjarni> like you are really named "Hestporr M. Lingonsylt"
18:55:26  <MarkMc> Ah
18:55:27  <MarkMc> :D
18:55:42  <MarkMc> That's a internal joke between me and a friend of mine
18:56:05  <Bjarni> not to mention that your other client's real name is "Mjew Fucker"
18:56:12  <MarkMc> :>
18:56:26  <MarkMc> I don't like to have my real name in stuff on my computer, thats all
18:56:26  <Bjarni> you have to be high to get ideas like that
18:56:29  <MarkMc> No
18:56:40  * dihedral needs a grf...
18:56:53  <skidd13> dihedral: hmmpf
18:56:55  <MarkMc> All that I came up with when I didn't even had tried drugs
18:57:03  <dihedral> :-)
18:57:14  <dihedral> hmmpf what?
18:57:39  * AntB is trying to work on the celebratory GRF gfx
18:57:41  <Bjarni> so you went "oh nobody can tell the difference if I do drugs so I might as well do them"?
18:57:56  <MarkMc> No
18:58:02  <MarkMc> Have I said that?
18:58:06  <Bjarni> no
18:58:10  <MarkMc> Exactly
18:58:11  <MarkMc> :)
18:58:18  <MarkMc> You see
18:58:25  <Bjarni> you are just giving away a personal profile
18:58:26  <MarkMc> I only do cannabis
18:58:31  <Bjarni> so I assumed
18:58:40  * dihedral pats AntB on the back :-)
18:58:44  <MarkMc> That don't fuck you up so badly so you dont rembember anything
18:58:53  * AntB is stuck at the first hurdle...
18:58:57  <Bjarni> but it's still really bad for you
18:59:03  <MarkMc> Shoot
18:59:10  <MarkMc> I have a deathwish, so who cares?
18:59:12  <MarkMc> :)
18:59:24  * Bjarni notes never to drive with MarkMc
18:59:42  <MarkMc> I don't drink alcohol though, THAT's bad for you
18:59:44  <MarkMc> Haha
19:00:12  <Bjarni> you know you don't have to select alcohol or drugs... it's not like you have to use one of them
19:00:20  <MarkMc> No, of course not :)
19:00:32  <skidd13> dihedral: Damned work. I have to do some extra work. One presentation and one advertising CD for the company I'm working (deadline tomorrow 12.00). I'd have done something ;)
19:00:36  <AntB> lol, at least you know what you getting with alcohol
19:00:43  <MarkMc> No
19:01:02  <MarkMc> Bjarni, you banned me for having acid at home
19:01:13  <MarkMc> And theres a song namned "Hardstyle and Acid"
19:01:17  <Belugas> [15:02] <@Bjarni> you know you don't have to select alcohol or drugs... it's not like you have to use one of them  <--  both! Both!!!!
19:01:21  <Bjarni> MarkMc: did you know that smoking cannabis will make your sperm more or less barren for a week?
19:01:21  <MarkMc> :D
19:01:40  <Bjarni> oh right
19:01:47  <Bjarni> it was hardstyle stuff
19:01:53  <Belugas> i don't mind, i have my kid!
19:01:54  <AntB> Is there any limits to drawing lanturn sprites?
19:02:01  <MarkMc> Bjarni, barren = you can get laid without have a child?
19:02:05  <Belugas> who cares what my sperm looks like :S
19:02:29  <skidd13> Can we please stop this discussion! It's a IRC about OpenTTD and not a drug helpline.
19:02:32  <MarkMc> :D
19:02:39  *** Fluidicspace [] has quit []
19:02:44  <dihedral> lo
19:02:46  <dihedral> l
19:02:50  <Belugas> sniff sniff sniff
19:02:53  <dihedral> i wonder why he left
19:03:04  * Belugas was just sad, not sniffing ;)
19:03:09  <AntB> lol
19:03:41  <Bjarni> Belugas: good... you know... I ban people who do drugs or talk about benefits of drugs ;)
19:03:57  <MarkMc> But what is barren?
19:03:58  <MarkMc> :o
19:04:38  *** huma [~huma@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
19:04:56  <MarkMc> Oh
19:04:57  <MarkMc> Nice
19:05:03  <Eddi|zuHause> Bjarni: did i tell you that the mushrooms were great?
19:05:14  <MarkMc> Haha
19:05:15  <MarkMc> :D
19:05:23  <Bjarni> somehow I think you are pulling my leg :P
19:05:43  <Belugas> i did drugs, in my pre-marital life.  Does it count?
19:05:55  <Bjarni> sort of
19:05:59  * hylje pulls Bjarni's leg
19:06:09  <MarkMc> Psilocybe semilanceata?
19:06:10  <MarkMc> :)
19:06:14  * Bjarni sort of sets mode +b *!Belugas@*
19:06:22  <MarkMc> :D
19:07:14  *** G [~njones@] has joined #openttd
19:07:25  <MarkMc> Cool nick
19:07:42  <MarkMc> But it kinda reminds me of "Ali G" and thats gay
19:07:43  <MarkMc> :D
19:07:45  <Bjarni> it's short and to the point
19:07:52  <MarkMc> Exactly
19:08:06  <Bjarni> except if it were really to the point, it would be P
19:08:06  <Belugas> too bad it's not J
19:08:08  <Belugas> J point
19:08:10  <Belugas> lolo
19:08:21  <MarkMc> Bjarni, do you want to know the best thing with me?
19:08:21  <MarkMc> :D
19:08:33  <Bjarni> that sounds really scarey
19:08:36  <Bjarni> -e
19:08:45  <MarkMc> I'm 15
19:08:45  <MarkMc> :D
19:08:51  <MarkMc> (years old)
19:09:10  <Bjarni> I presume it's not months or decades
19:09:16  <MarkMc> Nope
19:09:23  <AntB> lol
19:10:51  <Eddi|zuHause> MarkMc: more like Macrolepiota procera :p
19:10:52  <MarkMc> So quiet...
19:10:53  <Bjarni> so basically you went "oh I have a potential great future where I can meet a great woman, have great sex, a big house and a nice family.... but I will just throw all that away and do drugs instead"
19:11:02  <Bjarni> before growing up
19:11:04  <MarkMc> Exaclty
19:11:10  <MarkMc> Hmm
19:11:13  <MarkMc> Exactly*
19:11:24  <MarkMc> Eddi|zuHause ^^
19:11:29  <Bjarni> you shouldn't do drugs
19:11:49  <MarkMc> Gosh, you sound like an american anti-drugwoman
19:11:52  <MarkMc> :P
19:11:57  <Bjarni> you mistyped exactly and then you corrected it into the same mistake again
19:12:00  <hylje> soccer mom
19:12:02  <Bjarni> hey
19:12:05  <MarkMc> Fuck
19:12:05  <MarkMc> :D
19:12:06  <Bjarni> I'm not American
19:12:09  <Bjarni> or a woman
19:12:09  <MarkMc> I know
19:12:16  <MarkMc> Even worse
19:12:17  <MarkMc> Danish
19:12:18  <MarkMc> :o
19:12:22  <hylje> implied that you *sound* like one
19:12:29  <hylje> not that you *are* one
19:12:29  <MarkMc> :)
19:12:32  <hylje> stop taking drugs
19:12:34  <MarkMc> hylje, thanks
19:12:35  <hylje> you hypocrite
19:12:35  <MarkMc> Haha
19:12:54  <MarkMc> Danish people dont like when you point guns at them I found out
19:13:01  <hylje> well who does?
19:13:03  <Maedhros> does anyone?
19:13:06  <MarkMc> Me+
19:13:07  <MarkMc> ?*
19:13:10  <hylje> aww
19:13:11  <MarkMc> IÀm swedish
19:13:15  <MarkMc> -À
19:13:19  <MarkMc> +'
19:13:38  <Bjarni> I once heard a guy saying that you couldn't talk about drugs if you never tried them and my first thought was "based on that theory it's kind of hard to talk about successful suicides"
19:13:48  <AntB> lol
19:13:49  <MarkMc> :)
19:13:58  <dihedral> rofl
19:14:26  <Belugas> in a matter of fact, it is true
19:14:50  <Belugas> apart from saying "he's dead", what else there is to talk about?
19:14:53  <hylje> at least somewhere in the earth you can get shot for failed suicide
19:15:12  * MarkMc are doin business on my laptop that stands at the right of me, and chatting on this computer
19:15:17  <Belugas> apart from saynig he's stoned, what else can one who didn't used drugs can talk about?
19:15:18  <MarkMc> Guess what kind of business
19:15:20  <MarkMc> :)
19:15:21  *** stillunknown [] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
19:15:36  <Bjarni> drug dealing?
19:15:40  <Rubidium> oh god, you're a Nigerian scammer
19:15:43  *** sPooT [] has joined #openttd
19:15:43  <MarkMc> :D
19:16:21  <Maedhros> hylje: suicide is illegal in the uk, i think
19:16:23  *** stillunknown [] has joined #openttd
19:16:28  <MarkMc> :)
19:16:52  <Rubidium> Maedhros: as if they're going to prosecute you when you kill yourself
19:16:55  <Bjarni> I don't think we need special laws regarding suicide... it's murder and that's it
19:17:03  <Bjarni> attempted suicide is attempted murder
19:17:06  <Eddi|zuHause> suicide is illegal pretty much everywhere
19:17:12  <Prof_Frink> Bjarni is schizophrenic!
19:17:22  <MarkMc> :)
19:17:25  <Bjarni> what?
19:17:30  <MarkMc> Prof_Frink, no, hes danish
19:17:31  <MarkMc> :D
19:17:33  <MarkMc> he's
19:17:35  <Bjarni> what?
19:17:37  <Eddi|zuHause> even the Koran forbids suicide
19:17:41  <MarkMc> cool
19:17:47  <Bjarni> Prof_Frink: based on what???
19:17:47  <Eddi|zuHause> we are not schitzophrenic
19:18:28  <Prof_Frink> Bjarni: You're murdering the voices
19:20:01  <skidd13> This IRC is too wired for me ATM. I'm off
19:20:02  *** skidd13 [] has left #openttd []
19:20:07  <MarkMc> :D
19:20:31  <Prof_Frink> skidd13: Get an 802.11 connection.
19:21:21  <Eddi|zuHause> "Identity" was a great movie
19:21:28  *** AntB [] has quit [Quit: *poof!* I am gone -=- Using ChatZilla]
19:21:37  <MarkMc> Prof_Frink :D
19:21:54  <Prof_Frink> Eddi|zuHause: Was that the one with the motel?
19:21:55  *** AntB [] has joined #openttd
19:22:05  <Eddi|zuHause> yeah
19:24:43  * Bjarni just realised something
19:24:49  <MarkSlap> What? :o
19:24:54  <Bjarni> about MarkMc's deathwish
19:25:00  <Bjarni> if we don't go against it, he will die
19:25:00  <MarkSlap> :o
19:25:06  <Bjarni> then he will not buy any more drugs
19:25:07  <MarkSlap> Nono
19:25:09  <Prof_Frink> You've got some fucking jaffa cakes in your coat pocket?
19:25:18  <Bjarni> and then he will no longer fund terrorism
19:25:22  <MarkSlap> :P
19:25:40  <MarkSlap> I cant see how a cb-grow in sweden founds terrorism?
19:25:51  <Bjarni> now you added a new info
19:25:59  <MarkSlap> Yes
19:25:59  <MarkSlap> :)
19:26:01  <Bjarni> it's not imported
19:26:15  <Bjarni> you never told that
19:26:36  <MarkSlap> No
19:26:44  <MarkSlap> You just assumed that
19:27:14  <Bjarni> then you are reduced to a burden on society
19:27:19  <Bjarni> not a terrorist funder
19:27:30  <MarkSlap> Yay
19:27:46  <Bjarni> do you pay VAT on your weed?
19:27:59  *** izhirahi1er is now known as izhirahider
19:28:06  <MarkSlap> No, I do it through a business
19:28:10  <MarkSlap> WHat do you think?
19:28:19  <Bjarni> so you cheat on taxes as well
19:28:53  <MarkSlap> You I got to the "VAT-company" and say: "Hi! I bought some hasch, now I want to pay VAT. How much VAT should I pay?"
19:28:53  <MarkSlap> :D
19:29:25  <Bjarni> you don't have to ask
19:29:30  <Bjarni> you can calculate it yourself
19:29:32  <Bjarni> oh wait
19:29:34  <Bjarni> you can't
19:29:39  <Bjarni> if you used the weed
19:29:49  <Bjarni> but everybody else can :P
19:30:01  <MarkSlap> :>
19:30:26  <MarkSlap> We have like, 12% VAT on grocerys
19:30:31  <Bjarni> basically you take the price you paid and multiply it with 0,25. The result is how much you should pay
19:30:43  <Bjarni> it's not like weed is a food
19:30:45  <MarkSlap> Wonder if cannabis goes in under "grocerys"
19:30:48  <MarkSlap> :(
19:30:54  <Bjarni> I guess it's a luxury goods
19:31:04  <MarkSlap> Mmkey
19:31:12  <MarkSlap> Then its like, eh,, 10%
19:31:14  <MarkSlap> Yay
19:31:22  <Bjarni> err... are you sure?
19:31:31  <MarkSlap> No
19:31:33  <MarkSlap> Not at all
19:31:33  <MarkSlap> :D
19:31:40  <Bjarni> it's 25% in Denmark
19:31:47  <MarkSlap> It's probably still 12%
19:31:50  <MarkSlap> :P
19:32:11  <MarkSlap> We have between 27-34% tax on our income
19:32:21  <Bjarni> not more?
19:32:57  <MarkSlap> No, not basicly
19:33:00  <Bjarni> here you can pay up to 68% of parts of your income
19:33:04  <MarkSlap> Oh, fuck
19:33:05  <MarkSlap> :D
19:33:11  <MarkSlap> I like ireland still
19:33:25  <MarkSlap> 10-12% tax on the income
19:33:25  <MarkSlap> :D
19:33:57  <Bjarni> surprisingly some parties wants to increase the taxes o_O
19:34:09  <MarkSlap> :P
19:34:56  <Bjarni> we have the highest income taxes in the world, but lets increase it because only rich bigots pay taxes and if you are a good communist you don't make money
19:35:04  <Bjarni> or something
19:35:46  <Bjarni> shit
19:36:06  <Bjarni> I'm telling about political parties to a drug addict
19:36:16  <Bjarni> aka I'm wasting my time >_<
19:36:27  <Bjarni> you will not vote on any of them anyway
19:36:43  <Prof_Frink> Better than talking about your drug habits to politicians
19:37:38  <Bjarni> well... if I did that to the politicians who wants to increase the taxes, then they would stare at me and don't trust me because they think that everybody do drugs
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19:47:18  <MarkSlap> :>
19:51:37  <dihedral>
19:52:05  <dihedral> the one after that is pretty good too
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19:56:10  <Bjarni> the last one... I think they are even more expensive than normal weapons... you see they are damn expensive to drop
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20:09:31  <Wolf01> i just looked at mirc and i thought: "i don't remember to have joined Command&Conquer channel" lol
20:10:21  <hylje> lol
20:14:04  <Bjarni> you joined a C&C channel?
20:14:09  <Bjarni> there is a C&C channel?
20:14:20  <hylje>  * <- the joke
20:14:21  <hylje>  o
20:14:24  <hylje> -|-
20:14:27  <hylje> \
20:14:31  <hylje> ah, i fail
20:14:39  <hylje> you get the point
20:14:44  <Bjarni> .
20:14:50  <Bjarni> you can have the point back
20:14:59  <hylje> aww, sweet
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20:17:57  <Eddi|zuHause> · <- this one's much better
20:18:34  <hylje> :o
20:18:39  <hylje> it floaaats
20:19:50  <Eddi|zuHause> ˙
20:19:54  <Bjarni> Eddi|zuHause appears to use modern hardware where floating point has a decent speed. When using old hardware you should avoid floating point at all costs
20:20:25  <Bjarni> I still tend to think about how to avoid floating point and stay in the int domain even though I don't have to anymore
20:21:43  <Wolf01> dihedral: i was looking at some screenshot topics, i found that this roadset does have the lanterns you need
20:22:08  <hylje> this is very silly
20:23:42  <dihedral> Wolf01: i am really sorry to have to dissapoint you
20:23:42  <dihedral> i am not looking for the lantern itself...
20:23:46  <Eddi|zuHause> Wolf01: next time, link to the picture in question, not the whole thread with 50 giant screenshots
20:24:50  <Wolf01> lol, i forgot that this forum don't have the feature to link one post instead of the whole topic
20:25:26  <dihedral> and we possibly would have to get in touch with the author to modify those lanterns...
20:25:56  <Wolf01> not if i redraw them very different
20:26:18  <Wolf01> i only take the idea from them
20:27:27  <Eddi|zuHause> and who in his right mind uses a BR 01 to haul Coal?
20:28:58  <Eddi|zuHause> especially since two posts above he talks about realism
20:29:21  * Prof_Frink uses a BR103 to haul Eddi|zuHause
20:30:26  <dihedral> Wolf01: sure, the idea is good - needs some color :-)
20:30:28  <dihedral> party
20:30:31  <dihedral> celebration
20:30:33  <dihedral> :-)
20:30:35  <dihedral> go for it :-)
20:30:43  <Wolf01> do you like green?
20:30:52  <dihedral> i like a lot of colors :-)
20:31:12  <Bjarni> go look at a rainbow
20:31:23  <Bjarni> play rainbow islands... it's colourful :P
20:31:26  <dihedral> aint got on here Bjarni
20:32:00  <Bjarni> rainbow islands... is it 5 or 6 bit colours? ;)
20:32:11  <Bjarni> looked colourful back then, but not anymore
20:32:36  <Bjarni> I think it's 5
20:33:00  <CIA-5> OpenTTD: rubidium * r11291 /trunk/src/settings.cpp: -Fix [FS#1345]: changing the wagon_speed_limits patch option caused desyncs.
20:33:15  <Bjarni> heh nice one
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20:34:21  <CIA-5> OpenTTD: rubidium * r11292 /trunk/src/player_face.h: -Fix [FS#1350]: don't desync when generating random faces. Patch by SmatZ.
20:35:53  <Rubidium> SmatZ: FS#1349 doesn't look like a bug to me
20:36:15  <CIA-5> OpenTTD: glx * r11293 /trunk/src/ (industry_cmd.cpp newgrf_text.cpp strgen/strgen.cpp): -Fix: newgrf defined industry news messages use TTD format for args, which is not the same as our. So we must detect those strings and pass them the right params
20:38:20  <SmatZ> Rubidium: yes, but once you said I should mark everything as bug
20:38:31  <SmatZ> else it won't ever get commited
20:38:36  <SmatZ> as you look at bugs only...
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20:38:54  <Bjarni> !bug 1349
20:39:01  <Rubidium> no, I said that patches that fix bugs should be files as bugs, not patches
20:39:02  <Bjarni> !Openttd bug 1349
20:39:11  <Bjarni> so much for being lazy :P
20:39:21  <Rubidium> *filed
20:39:23  <glx> Bjarni: @openttd bugs 1349, but DorpsGek is not here
20:39:48  <SmatZ> the has been waiting for some time...
20:39:50  <Bjarni> ahh
20:39:54  <Rubidium> and I didn't say I never look at patches, it's just that I don't look as often at them
20:40:20  <Rubidium> SmatZ: there are a lot of patches that have been waiting for "some" (even more than your "some") time
20:41:34  <SmatZ> ah okay
20:42:43  <SmatZ> you know, there is  a problem - the time I spend with updating the patch to be applicable for never revisions, could be spent in a much more useful way
20:43:06  <SmatZ> and I am often very nervous when something is unfinished...
20:43:13  <SmatZ> it stresses me a lot
20:44:17  <Phazorx> Rubidium: thanks for 11291
20:44:20  <Phazorx> thatw as fast :)
20:44:54  <Rubidium> Phazorx: I already knew the solution yesterday, just didn't have the time to implement it
20:44:58  * Wolf01
20:44:58  <Wolf01> dihedral, what do you think about this? i draw some people that can be copied and pasted to make a crowd
20:45:11  <Phazorx> Rubidium: it did look like soemtihng rather basic
20:45:24  <Phazorx> do trains ened to depot to have afefct of the patch option change now?
20:45:33  <Wolf01> so cities might look like new york :P
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20:45:56  <Rubidium> Phazorx: it had nothing specifically to do with vehicles going to a depot
20:46:02  <dihedral> Wolf01: sure - sounds like a good idea
20:46:28  <Phazorx> Rubidium: i know that, but before the fix in order to get trains to readjust to wagon speed limits off they need to go to depot and be updated
20:47:03  *** Maedhros [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
20:47:30  <dihedral> In Fact Wolf01
20:48:35  <dihedral> i am not familiar with grf's, but are there 2 separate ones for lanterns and for the side walks of town roads?
20:49:08  * Phazorx pings Eddi|zuHause
20:49:14  <Eddi|zuHause> ?
20:49:27  <Phazorx> whatw as your idea bout no trees patch before?
20:49:36  <Eddi|zuHause> rubbish :p
20:49:45  <Eddi|zuHause> take ammlers patch
20:50:00  <Phazorx> Ammler ?
20:50:16  <Eddi|zuHause>
20:51:04  <Phazorx> heh
20:51:21  <Phazorx> not quite what i meant tho
20:51:29  <Phazorx> that stops trees functinality
20:51:42  <Phazorx> only think i wanted to prevent - trees growing everywhere on random
20:52:10  <dihedral> so that you would still be able to 'up' your standing with the local auth?
20:52:27  <Phazorx> well you will be able to manualy plant trees
20:52:27  <Eddi|zuHause> OnTick_Trees() is the function that places random trees on the map
20:52:29  <Phazorx> but they will not grow
20:52:39  <Eddi|zuHause> TileLoopTree() is the function that grows them
20:52:39  <Ammler> Phazorx: they will
20:52:43  <Phazorx> Eddi|zuHause: is there a separated functiona that grows them?
20:53:30  <Phazorx> Ammler: what rev it can go agaisnt and is it wgetable as .patch form soemwhere? :)
20:53:47  <Ammler> I guess, it works since revision 1
20:53:59  <Eddi|zuHause> Phazorx: click on "download" above the pist
20:54:01  <Eddi|zuHause> post
20:54:18  <Phazorx> ahh see it
20:54:21  <Phazorx> thansk
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20:54:45  <Wolf01> oh hello TrueBrain :D
20:55:04  <TrueBrain> hi :)
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20:55:46  <Eddi|zuHause> who was that again who said he was "always on"?
20:56:02  <TrueBrain> shit happens
20:56:04  <TrueBrain> connection problems too
20:59:37  <Phazorx> heh
20:59:45  <Phazorx> reminds me of an issue i had 2 hours ago
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21:10:50  <Wolf01> ahahahahahahh
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21:11:39  <TrueBrain> Phazorx: sadly enough, if this client is dropped, the problems are slightly bigger than yours :p
21:11:47  <TrueBrain> (as that means around 10000 customers can't see their website :p)
21:11:51  <TrueBrain> but okay, minor detail :)
21:11:54  <dihedral> TrueBrain: :-)
21:12:06  <Phazorx> TrueBrain: that's all matter of preception :)
21:12:16  <TrueBrain> I am gone :) Have fun all!
21:12:32  <Phazorx> my OSes suddenly loosing tcpip.sys was big problem AFAIC
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21:15:02  <valhallasw> I still need some comic groeper
21:15:04  <valhallasw> grouper*
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21:16:35  <valhallasw> something that groups xkcd, little gamers, megatokyo, etc :)
21:17:08  <Wolf01> we should make a webcomic on ottd
21:17:13  <Prof_Frink> valhallasw: It's called an RSS aggregator
21:17:23  <Wolf01> maybe with sacro as protagonist
21:17:41  <valhallasw> Prof_Frink: yes. but most web comics don't embed the comics in RSS
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21:35:52  <Sacro> Wolf01: eh?
21:36:02  <Wolf01> nothing
21:42:32  <Phazorx> err what do i do with .cpp.rej after unsuccessful patching?
21:42:39  <Phazorx> from what i can see it should have worked
21:42:44  <Phazorx> and output does not make sense to me
21:43:31  <glx> .rej contains rejected part of diff
21:44:45  <Phazorx> glx: i figured that but from looks of it it should work
21:45:06  <glx> maybe a trailing space somewhere
21:45:16  <glx> enough to make it fail
21:45:41  <Phazorx>
21:48:12  <glx> this paste miss the important thing :)
21:48:19  <glx> content of patched file
21:49:47  <Phazorx> ints rej shows original and patch both?
21:50:22  <glx> .rej contains exactly the same as .patch
21:50:38  <glx> but only the failed hunk
21:51:05  <glx> and in a different format
21:51:21  <Wolf01> 'night
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21:51:40  <Phazorx>
21:52:52  <glx> patching should have work indeed
21:53:31  <Phazorx> my point :/
21:53:38  <Eddi|zuHause> just edit the file and search for ">>>"
21:53:46  <Phazorx> edit what file?
21:53:55  <Eddi|zuHause> the .cpp file
21:54:05  <glx> Eddi|zuHause: doesn't work with patch
21:54:19  <Phazorx> /home/trunk# grep ">>>" src/landscape.cpp
21:54:19  <Phazorx> /home/trunk#
21:54:38  <glx> >>>> is for when you have .mine and .rXXXX
21:54:54  <Eddi|zuHause> hm
21:55:01  <Eddi|zuHause> well, then edit the file manually :p
21:55:25  <glx> yes it's a one line change
21:55:53  <Phazorx> i did already
21:56:06  <Phazorx> i want to get the point whi it fails and what does .rej supposed to show
21:57:03  <dihedral> good night
21:57:07  * dihedral is off to bed
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22:01:28  <Eddi|zuHause> Phazorx: i'm guessing tab vs. spaces
22:02:09  <Ammler> try this file:
22:02:52  <Phazorx> Ammler: i did
22:03:12  <Phazorx> actualy nope
22:03:16  <Phazorx> i had a screen copy
22:03:29  <Phazorx> which doesnt maitain spaces and crlfs
22:03:42  <Phazorx> i direct link is nice for patches
22:03:52  <Phazorx> otherwise "smart" services are getting in the way
22:04:29  <Ammler> Eddi|zuHause: this patch should work on server side only, right?
22:04:51  <Eddi|zuHause> Ammler: it has to be on both clients and servers
22:05:22  <Ammler> so does every single client generate randomly trees?
22:05:47  <Ammler> if you have more clients you will also have more trees?
22:05:47  <Eddi|zuHause> yes.
22:05:52  <Eddi|zuHause> no
22:06:07  <Eddi|zuHause> all clients generate the same tree
22:06:22  <Eddi|zuHause> otherwise they desync
22:06:45  <Ammler> does not the server generate the tree and tell clients where?
22:06:52  <Eddi|zuHause> no
22:07:16  <Eddi|zuHause> communication like that is only initiated for player instructed commands
22:07:53  <Eddi|zuHause> all (pseudo)random stuff is calculated on each client
22:08:04  <Eddi|zuHause> after each 100 ticks, the randomseed is compared
22:08:10  <Eddi|zuHause> if different -> desync
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22:10:05  <Ammler> and why is that needed?
22:10:24  <Ammler> wouldn't be better to do that stuff on server only?
22:10:31  <Eddi|zuHause> because you cannot send all that data through the net
22:10:45  <Ammler> oh, ok
22:10:58  <Eddi|zuHause> there are multiple thousand random decisions each tick
22:12:00  <Eddi|zuHause> you'd practically have to send the entire map each tick, because almost all tiles can change
22:14:28  <Eddi|zuHause> Ammler: the premise of that system is to send as few data through the net as possible, so whenever you can deterministically recalculate something on all clients, you do that
22:14:43  <Eddi|zuHause> that goes for pretty much everything, except player intervention
22:15:15  <Ammler> ok, now, I see, thanks
22:16:00  <Ammler> how many ticks has a day?
22:16:28  <Eddi|zuHause> grep "#define DAY_TICS"?
22:16:32  <Eddi|zuHause> something like 72
22:17:29  <Ammler> 74,
22:17:38  <Eddi|zuHause> yeah
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22:19:11  <Ammler> now, I also understand, why there are so many desyncs on some patches
22:19:15  <Ammler> like pax dest
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23:11:09  <Maarten> you know you have played openttd too much when you receive your paycheck, and the "ka-ching" sound rings in your head.
23:11:57  <Eoin> lol
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23:50:28  <Greyscale> snore time. Night
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