Times are UTC Toggle Colours
00:00:05 <TrueBrain> where M is 3, and K is the start-cells? 00:00:17 <Phazorx> obviously as M<<N and compressing and K is a M coordinates + value 00:00:32 <Phazorx> K is array of start cells 00:00:42 <TrueBrain> yeah, k, guess that one correctly ;) 00:00:44 <Phazorx> each elemnt is a byte value and it's cooredinates 00:01:31 <TrueBrain> any life example of this? :p 00:01:32 <Phazorx> depending on data set and K data you can in theory to compress N^N to N^M+M 00:01:36 <Phazorx> nope 00:01:45 <Phazorx> it needs a math engine to be feasible 00:01:46 <TrueBrain> any plans on making it? :p 00:02:08 <TrueBrain> I read more about such things, I try to remember where... but.. complete failure in my head :p 00:02:23 <TrueBrain> it was described differently though.. 00:02:27 <Phazorx> it is somewhat borderline with fractal thoery 00:02:56 <Phazorx> and guessing values to comeup with checksums can be based on wavelet theory 00:03:07 <Phazorx> that emphisizes on errors and deviations 00:03:29 <Phazorx> in this case you'd try to come up with data set that would have them limited to 0 00:03:38 <Phazorx> it is somewhat possible 00:03:45 <Phazorx> but how good it will be really based on math behind it 00:03:56 <Phazorx> and i simply lack capacity on that level 00:04:07 *** BigBB [~BigBB@p5B0407F0.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 00:04:15 <TrueBrain> hehe :) 00:04:23 <TrueBrain> well, it does sound nice :) 00:04:26 <Phazorx> i'm sure someone else with right approcha and background based on this can come to something much faster than i would 00:04:27 <TrueBrain> and if it works, it really compresses 00:04:37 <Phazorx> it is luck based you see 00:04:40 <ln-> this is quite nice: http://neokoo.net/28tuntia/ (not porn, sorry, but contains trains) 00:05:02 <Phazorx> but 16M to 772bytes sounds really nice 00:05:04 <TrueBrain> Phazorx: yup.. and I am still wonder about the part: unique ;) 00:05:15 <Phazorx> well why does it have to be unique 00:05:39 <TrueBrain> the end result :) 00:05:58 <Phazorx> you know binary search 00:06:39 <Phazorx> you need up to N tries to guess a number between 1 and 2^N 00:06:50 <TrueBrain> yup 00:06:50 <Phazorx> but what do you get if you have less than N tries? 00:07:07 <TrueBrain> a close-to value 00:07:18 <Phazorx> well you get probability 00:07:26 <TrueBrain> N-1 tries can never be more than +/- 1 wrong 00:07:29 <Phazorx> and also you might get it from 1st attempt 00:07:41 <Eddi|zuHause2> probability is not enough 00:07:46 <Phazorx> Eddi|zuHause2: correct 00:07:50 <TrueBrain> that is what I worry about too yes ;) 00:07:59 <Eddi|zuHause2> you have to be 100% certain that your decompression is correct 00:08:05 <TrueBrain> and that is what I don't see here... the resulting decompression needs to be correct ;) 00:08:07 <TrueBrain> lol 00:08:09 <TrueBrain> I let Eddi|zuHause2 talk :) 00:08:11 <Phazorx> but what if a number selection within probable subset is predefined 00:08:50 <Eddi|zuHause2> you need additional space to specify the subset 00:08:57 <Phazorx> if you know how "guessing" works at decompression part, you might give it appropriate data to guess it faster 00:09:14 <Phazorx> and perhaps you can guuide it so it would guess each one from 1 attempt rather than N 00:09:26 <Phazorx> Eddi|zuHause2: exactly 00:09:32 <Phazorx> that's what K array does 00:09:38 <Phazorx> it removes confusion 00:09:44 <TrueBrain> so, basicly, you guess, feed it to the decompresser, and check if the data is useful? 00:09:50 <Phazorx> but after that you still get not unique solution 00:10:03 <Phazorx> TrueBrain: essentialy that is the decompression algorithm 00:10:14 <Phazorx> and same for compression 00:10:24 <TrueBrain> but what if you make XOR values on both rows and columns? 00:10:30 <Phazorx> you feed decompression with K data untill it has enough to guess it from 1st try 00:10:36 <TrueBrain> how much values do you need to make an unique matrix? 00:10:43 <Phazorx> unknown 00:10:54 <Phazorx> and that is specific for evey case 00:10:55 <TrueBrain> as that would speed up decompression ;) 00:11:10 <TrueBrain> anyway, that guessing from the 1st try is the most trickiest part ;) 00:11:11 <Phazorx> well bumping M and lowering N will too 00:11:19 <Eddi|zuHause2> i really do not think that "speed" is an issue here :) 00:11:52 <Phazorx> Eddi|zuHause2: a math part should be very simple from computer perspective while being infinitely uncomprehendable in human eyes 00:12:17 <Eddi|zuHause2> what makes you think my eyes are human? :p 00:12:19 <Phazorx> and having rigth math parts, especialy when it comes to conclusion "sratch all, lest try another starting cell" 00:12:41 <Phazorx> Eddi|zuHause2: i wasnt refering to thee or myself spefically :) 00:13:10 <Eddi|zuHause2> but i should go to bed 00:13:20 <Phazorx> and i should have dinner 00:13:34 <TrueBrain> enjoy your dinner 00:13:34 * TrueBrain to bed too 00:13:38 <TrueBrain> Phazorx: tnx for the input :) 00:13:41 <TrueBrain> input = info 00:13:43 <TrueBrain> it is fun :) 00:13:47 <Phazorx> i know 00:13:54 <Phazorx> thinking is my kind of fun 00:13:58 <Phazorx> i like it 00:14:05 <Phazorx> good night lads :) 00:14:12 *** Wolf01|AWAY is now known as Wolf01 00:15:06 <TrueBrain> Phazorx: I miss it at my study currently ;) (hehe, and I am doing CS...) 00:15:30 <Phazorx> as far esuducation goes i dont have any formal one :) 00:15:33 <Belugas> technical question: is it possible to enabled IDE drives on a SATA system? I have to transfert quite a lot of data 00:15:55 <Phazorx> dont taky it as a guideline tho, but my point is thinking is a process and education is a base 00:16:10 <Phazorx> it would be nice if they come together but it doesnt always 00:16:31 <Phazorx> Belugas: dos your south bridge has IDE controller? 00:16:51 <Phazorx> there are sole el cheapo sata>pata addapters 00:16:57 <Phazorx> but i have not heard of reverse 00:17:37 *** smoovi [smoovi@e178249077.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Quit: #idlerpg] 00:18:58 *** Osai [~Osai@pD9EB4C72.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 00:23:52 <stillunknown> Belugas: There are converters which allow PATA drives to connect to a SATA controller. 00:24:27 *** XeryusTC [~irc@cc480157-b.sneek1.fr.home.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:27:25 <Belugas> there is one IDE port-controler and 5 SATA, but somehow, if IDE is detected, it looks like disabling the SATA 00:29:20 <Tefad> i think i finally found the source 00:29:23 <Tefad> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Gnomes_plan.png 00:29:26 <stillunknown> Strange, have you tried using the 4 normal ports and not the 1 "seperate" one. 00:29:58 <glx> Belugas: weird system ;) 00:30:14 <glx> ide works well with sata in my machine 00:30:19 <Belugas> not mine, mother's in law 00:30:27 <Belugas> anything special you did? 00:31:06 <glx> I have an HDD in SATA, a CD-RW and a DVD+-RW on IDE 00:33:08 <Gonozal_VIII> same here plus an ide hdd 00:33:42 <Belugas> so, sata and ide HD can coexist 00:33:50 <Gonozal_VIII> yes 00:33:55 <Belugas> so , why is it not the case here??? 00:34:03 <Belugas> anythng special in the BIOS maybe? 00:34:16 <Wolf01> Belugas, try to set ide compatibility on bios for sata, i used it when i needed to clone the ide hard disk on a sata one 00:34:36 <Gonozal_VIII> don't know... i did nothing special, it just worked 00:35:08 <Belugas> noted Wolf01 00:37:21 <Wolf01> some motherboards allow 3 settings for hdd: sata only, sata & ide, sata as ide (or something like this), the last is more compatible but disables raid if i'm not wrong 00:39:32 *** Brianetta [~brian@82-39-52-234.cable.ubr03.benw.blueyonder.co.uk] has quit [Quit: TschÃŒÃ] 00:42:59 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: glx * r11398 /trunk/src/newgrf_industries.cpp: -Fix [FS#1414]: industry variables 67 and 68 return was incorrect 00:45:21 *** G_ [~njones@202-154-147-204.ubs-dynamic.connections.net.nz] has joined #openttd 00:45:39 <Belugas> good point, Wolf01. i will try that tomorrow 00:46:09 <Belugas> it sounded so weird to me that ide and sata on same machine were not meant to communicate 00:46:11 <Belugas> well.. 00:46:14 <Belugas> you know what i mean 00:46:24 <Wolf01> eheh, that's my job :P 00:47:07 *** G [~njones@202-154-147-204.ubs-dynamic.connections.net.nz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:47:12 *** Vikthor [~Vikthor@212.24.150.226] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 00:48:09 *** stillunknown [~stillunkn@82-171-87-247.dsl.ip.tiscali.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:48:49 <Belugas> lucky for me :D 00:55:47 *** ludde [~ludde@ua-83-227-238-252.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:59:12 <Eddi|zuHause2> i have 2 ide HD, 2 ide DVD and 1 sata HD, works like a charm 00:59:40 <Eddi|zuHause2> i somehow have a 3rd ide port, but i never got that one running... 00:59:59 <glx> I have 2 IDE ports and 4 SATA 01:00:30 <glx> I'm free to updgrade when needed ;) 01:01:21 <Eddi|zuHause2> according to my board documentation, i have 2 dual IDE controllers, and a raid controller with the 3rd ide port (suitible for one drive) and 2 sata ports 01:02:30 <Gonozal_VIII> 1 hdd raid :-) 01:03:05 <Eddi|zuHause2> no, 3 drives 01:03:21 <Eddi|zuHause2> 1 ide + 2 sata 01:03:32 <Gonozal_VIII> aah 01:04:05 <Eddi|zuHause2> but you don't have to put the drives into a raid 01:04:15 <Eddi|zuHause2> and i only have 1 drive connected 01:05:59 *** Osai [~Osai@pD9EB4C72.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Osai] 01:11:03 <Wolf01> 'night 01:11:10 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host203-233-dynamic.8-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 01:12:04 *** LeviathNL [~thomas@vdburgt.xs4all.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:16:44 *** sPooT [~spoot@spoot.xs4all.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:17:32 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: belugas * r11399 /trunk/ (25 files in 3 dirs): 01:17:32 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Feature(ette): transparency settings can now be saved and thus remembered. 01:17:32 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Codechange: Wrap all transparency settings in accessors, hiding the implementation 01:17:32 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Change: Clicking "transparent building" menu will toggle Houses And Trees only. The other options can be used in the transparency gui. 01:17:33 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: Initial patch by Smatz (FS#1349), with some rework by BigBB and your humble servant. 01:23:59 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1E739.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Progman] 01:26:34 *** Gonozal_VIII [~Gonozal_V@N779P008.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:31:35 *** Eddi|zuHause3 [~johekr@p54B76D1D.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 01:38:02 *** Eddi|zuHause2 [~johekr@p54B7720E.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:43:52 *** Grey [~Greyscale@86.160.172.101] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:48:00 <fjb> Good night 01:48:03 *** fjb [~frank@p5485EAB9.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: KVIrc 3.2.0 'Realia'] 02:02:04 *** BigBB [~BigBB@p5B0407F0.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:05:30 *** Ammler [~Ammler@adsl-89-217-15-110.adslplus.ch] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:22:42 *** glx [glx@bny93-6-82-245-156-124.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Quit: bye] 03:28:25 *** XeryusTC [~irc@cc480157-b.sneek1.fr.home.nl] has joined #openttd 03:31:44 *** Dephenom [~paul@91.186.11.8] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 03:52:44 *** Dephenom [~paul@91.186.11.8] has joined #openttd 03:58:22 *** Dephenom [~paul@91.186.11.8] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:59:56 *** Dephenom [~paul@91.186.11.8] has joined #openttd 04:18:52 *** XeryusTC [~irc@cc480157-b.sneek1.fr.home.nl] has quit [Quit: May the ducttape be with you] 05:05:01 *** Diabolic-Angel [~dia@xdsl-84-44-131-98.netcologne.de] has joined #openttd 06:21:14 *** DaleStan_ [~Dale@pool-71-98-83-82.ipslin.dsl-w.verizon.net] has joined #openttd 06:25:25 *** DaleStan [~Dale@pool-71-98-83-82.ipslin.dsl-w.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:28:35 <Phazorx> ": 06:58:32 *** Frostregen_ [SADDAM@dslb-084-058-189-051.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 07:00:43 *** Osai [~Osai@pD9EB6AA5.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 07:03:50 *** Frostregen [~sucks@dslb-084-058-182-130.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 07:04:12 *** Frostregen_ is now known as Frostregen 07:32:10 *** ThePizzaKing [~jeff@c211-28-164-75.eburwd2.vic.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 08:06:59 *** Ammler [~Ammler@adsl-89-217-15-110.adslplus.ch] has joined #openttd 08:11:05 *** Ammller [~Ammler@adsl-84-227-166-11.adslplus.ch] has joined #openttd 08:11:05 *** Ammler [~Ammler@adsl-89-217-15-110.adslplus.ch] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:11:55 *** Osai [~Osai@pD9EB6AA5.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Osai] 08:23:13 *** Diabolic-Angel [~dia@xdsl-84-44-131-98.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: leaving] 08:51:29 *** Farden [~jk3farden@AMontsouris-156-1-159-64.w83-202.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #openttd 08:51:38 *** Gonozal_VIII [~Gonozal_V@N885P023.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #openttd 09:15:17 *** Jello [Papa@S01060060080d1060.gv.shawcable.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 09:20:09 *** BigBB [~BigBB@p5B042EA6.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 09:24:07 *** Gekz [~gekko@CPE-121-217-203-4.nsw.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 09:25:12 *** G_ is now known as G 09:35:36 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host203-233-dynamic.8-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #openttd 09:35:41 <Wolf01> hello 09:35:50 *** Jello [ok@S01060060080d1060.gv.shawcable.net] has joined #openttd 09:36:53 *** Eddi|zuHause3 [~johekr@p54B76D1D.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:39:19 *** dihedral [~dihedral@dslb-084-057-251-036.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 09:40:24 * dihedral greets the lot 09:40:59 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B7682B.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 09:41:15 *** Peakki [antti@cs181247045.pp.htv.fi] has joined #openttd 09:43:57 *** Jello [ok@S01060060080d1060.gv.shawcable.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 09:44:53 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B7682B.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:45:08 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B7682B.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 09:47:56 *** stillunknown [~stillunkn@82-171-87-247.dsl.ip.tiscali.nl] has joined #openttd 09:52:12 *** Jello [ok@S01060060080d1060.gv.shawcable.net] has joined #openttd 09:53:39 <dihedral> !seen soup 09:53:40 <_42_> dihedral, I found 2 matches to your query: [1]Soup, Soup. [1]Soup (~Soup@66-230-114-105-dsl-rb1.nwc.acsalaska.net) was last seen being kicked from #openttd by TrueBrain ( Go kick) 11 hours 52 minutes ago (09.11. 22:01), after spending 16 seconds there. 09:53:40 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1EE3C.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 09:53:42 <dihedral> :-) 10:00:17 *** Jello [ok@S01060060080d1060.gv.shawcable.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:00:37 *** BigBB [~BigBB@p5B042EA6.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:07:21 <Wolf01> does the intro screen viewport scrolling (like locomotion or rollercoaster) interests somebody? 10:09:24 <Gonozal_VIII> you could scroll around in an earlier version when you desynced from multiplayer while the right mouse button was pressed 10:10:05 <Gonozal_VIII> not very interesting there 10:11:02 *** BigBB [~BigBB@p5B042EA6.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 10:13:13 <Eddi|zuHause> i'm pretty sure he means automatically jumping between starting screen locations (useful with a starting screen that has multiple sceneries set up 10:13:16 <Eddi|zuHause> ) 10:14:05 <Gonozal_VIII> well it doesn't 10:14:48 *** ludde [~ludde@ua-83-227-238-252.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #openttd 10:15:06 <Wolf01> i'm trying to add jumping locations with signs 10:16:11 <Gonozal_VIII> the currently used map is not interesting outside the standard view, would have to use a different one 10:18:04 <Wolf01> but you can always put your best game there 10:18:06 *** TinoM [~Tino@i5387CB0F.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 10:22:23 *** mikl [~mikl@0x57372ee2.mrbnqu1.broadband.tele.dk] has joined #openttd 10:25:45 <Eddi|zuHause> Gonozal_VIII: you can replace the title screen with any savegame 10:26:03 <Eddi|zuHause> just rename it to opntitle.dat 10:26:21 <Gonozal_VIII> oh... i didn't know that 10:27:20 <Eddi|zuHause> likewise, you can play the title screen by renaming it .sav 10:27:47 <Gonozal_VIII> already at it 10:30:15 *** Jello [~ok@S01060060080d1060.gv.shawcable.net] has joined #openttd 10:38:15 *** mikk36 [~mikk36@pc97.host5.starman.ee] has quit [Quit: ( www.nnscript.de :: NoNameScript 4.1 :: www.regroup-esports.com )] 10:42:47 *** Gekz [~gekko@CPE-121-217-203-4.nsw.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:43:32 *** Gonozal_VIII [~Gonozal_V@N885P023.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:45:40 *** Ailure [Cat@194.47.44.201] has quit [] 11:00:02 *** LeviathNL [~thomas@vdburgt.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 11:04:28 *** lugo [~lugo@p4FD5CFB0.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 11:09:31 *** ThePizzaKing [~jeff@c211-28-164-75.eburwd2.vic.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Quit: ThePizzaKing] 11:26:39 *** Gonozal_VIII [~Gonozal_V@N717P031.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #openttd 11:28:54 *** Diabolic-Angel [~dia@xdsl-84-44-209-206.netcologne.de] has joined #openttd 11:30:00 <Gonozal_VIII> i've changed my title screen a bit now, interconti airport instead of the normal one, helidepot instead of heliport, drive through bus/mail station and i also added a bridge over some diagonal rail tiles :-) 11:30:19 <Gonozal_VIII> and some presignals... 11:33:20 <LeviathNL> glx, nice work with the ind var 67 68 fix. 11:35:27 <LeviathNL> Is it correct still more than 1 tourist centre of the same type is generated (is this because of bigger maps?) 11:36:26 *** Vikthor [~Vikthor@212.24.150.226] has joined #openttd 11:42:58 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~dex@i59F7F696.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 11:44:19 *** tokai|ni [~tokai@p54B80E1A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:45:54 <Gonozal_VIII> http://gonozalviii.go.funpic.de/titlescreen.png 11:46:15 *** tokai|ni [~tokai@p54B82DD8.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 11:50:04 *** HerzogDeXtE1 [~dex@i577B7274.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:56:00 <mikl> Gonozal_VIII: hvad er det sjove ved det? 11:56:17 <Gonozal_VIII> ? 11:56:40 <mikl> ah, sorry - wrong channel... 11:57:28 <Gonozal_VIII> ok... 12:01:34 *** BigBB [~BigBB@p5B042EA6.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:09:50 *** Wolfensteijn [~Wolfenste@dhcp-077-250-019-098.chello.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:19:52 *** mikl [~mikl@0x57372ee2.mrbnqu1.broadband.tele.dk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:38:58 *** Farden123 [~jk3farden@AMontsouris-156-1-48-232.w90-24.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #openttd 12:45:09 *** Farden [~jk3farden@AMontsouris-156-1-159-64.w83-202.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:45:09 *** Farden123 is now known as Farden 12:45:29 *** mikk36|w [~mikk36@ntsrv.lakrito.ee] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:49:13 *** csaba [~chatzilla@catv54030072.pool.t-online.hu] has joined #openttd 12:49:31 *** fjb [~frank@p5485EAB9.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 12:49:35 <csaba> hi 12:49:37 <fjb> Moin 12:49:49 <csaba> how can change the road direction? 12:50:02 <csaba> when im building it 12:50:26 <csaba> there are onliy two directions in the build road menu 12:50:29 <csaba> only 12:50:42 <Gonozal_VIII> there is no diagonal road 12:50:53 <fjb> Roads can be build only in two directions. 12:51:36 <csaba> ok 12:51:40 <csaba> thanks 12:57:36 <csaba> on more : can i rotate the live map? 12:57:38 <csaba> how? 12:57:46 <Gonozal_VIII> no 12:57:54 <csaba> ok thanks 12:58:33 *** Greyscale [~Greyscale@host86-138-70-184.range86-138.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 12:58:52 <Gonozal_VIII> but you can make the buildings/trees transparent to look behind them 12:59:45 <csaba> cover up 12:59:50 <csaba> how 13:00:53 <Gonozal_VIII> hold the mouse button down on the third menubutton and select transparency options 13:01:20 <csaba> ok ok 13:02:46 <Greyscale> Rebooty 13:02:51 *** Greyscale [~Greyscale@host86-138-70-184.range86-138.btcentralplus.com] has quit [] 13:04:07 <fjb> Or just press x to toggle the transparency. 13:04:39 *** Hendikins [~wolfox@ppp121-44-16-194.lns10.syd7.internode.on.net] has quit [Quit: Any technology, no matter how primitive, is magic to those who don't understand it] 13:04:55 <csaba> x does not work 4 me 13:07:19 <csaba> sorry i play with standard ttd because im practicing 13:07:25 <Ammller> omg 13:08:01 <Gonozal_VIII> practicing? 13:08:02 <Ammller> :) 13:08:53 <Ammller> csaba: really TTD or at least TTDPatch? 13:09:46 <csaba> i dont know exactly but i had to apply something patch for xp 13:11:20 <Ammller> csaba: there is also an official TTDPatch channel, #tyccon @ quakenet 13:11:37 <csaba> and ? 13:12:02 <Ammller> yeah, they can help you better with i.e. how to make something transparent 13:12:22 <Ammller> or you switch to OTTD, should be easier 13:13:24 *** Vikthor [~Vikthor@212.24.150.226] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:13:31 <csaba> because im a beginner i dont want to wander on the map without aim on the online wersion 13:14:04 *** eJoJ [~ejoj@89.10.29.107] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:14:46 *** Hendikins [~wolfox@ppp121-44-16-194.lns10.syd7.internode.on.net] has joined #openttd 13:14:55 *** |Bastiaan| [~kvirc@ip87-205-173-82.adsl2.versatel.nl] has joined #openttd 13:15:09 <Gonozal_VIII> openttd is not only multiplayer, it can do anything that the original ttd could 13:15:52 *** eJoJ [~ejoj@89.10.29.107] has joined #openttd 13:16:14 *** Brianetta [~brian@82-39-52-234.cable.ubr03.benw.blueyonder.co.uk] has joined #openttd 13:16:17 <csaba> i did not know that 13:17:27 <csaba> really great game 13:18:02 <Gonozal_VIII> that's true :-) 13:18:14 <csaba> that is all i know tell :) 13:18:31 <csaba> can 13:20:17 <csaba> there is 4 kind of bridge:) 13:20:20 <csaba> there are 13:20:24 <TrueBrain> morning 13:20:55 <fjb> Moin TrueBrain 13:20:57 <Gonozal_VIII> hi 13:21:04 <Gonozal_VIII> there are more than 4 13:21:36 <csaba> i meant in ttd 13:21:45 <csaba> i believe in you 13:22:13 <Gonozal_VIII> oh no! the pressure! it's too much! 13:23:54 <Gonozal_VIII> but i think there are also more then 4 bridges in ttd 13:24:10 <csaba> caused by me, ok wont ask 13:24:15 <csaba> i 13:25:36 <fjb> Feel free to ask. 13:26:08 <csaba> ok, i warned you :) 13:26:49 <Gonozal_VIII> you can ask anything you want 13:29:02 *** LeviathNL [~thomas@vdburgt.xs4all.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:30:37 *** Vikthor [~Vikthor@212.24.150.226] has joined #openttd 13:30:45 <fjb> But don't expect an answer to every question. ;-) 13:30:56 <Gonozal_VIII> hehe 13:31:47 <csaba> great:) 13:34:14 *** glx [glx@bny93-6-82-245-156-124.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #openttd 13:34:17 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 13:39:37 <csaba> is there undo ?:) 13:39:49 <Gonozal_VIII> no^^ 13:40:24 <Gonozal_VIII> you have to think ahead ;-) 13:40:45 <csaba> the slopes the slopes 13:41:14 <Gonozal_VIII> what about them? 13:41:31 <fjb> You will learn how the slopes are working. Every beginner has some trouble with slopes. 13:42:25 <csaba> ok ok 13:45:45 *** Brianetta [~brian@82-39-52-234.cable.ubr03.benw.blueyonder.co.uk] has quit [Quit: TschÃŒÃ] 13:47:20 <csaba> thanks everything see you soon:) 13:47:28 *** csaba [~chatzilla@catv54030072.pool.t-online.hu] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 2.0.0.9/2007102514]] 13:51:37 *** XeryusTC [~irc@cc480157-b.sneek1.fr.home.nl] has joined #openttd 13:51:37 *** |Bastiaan| [~kvirc@ip87-205-173-82.adsl2.versatel.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:53:43 *** |Bastiaan| [~kvirc@ip87-205-173-82.adsl2.versatel.nl] has joined #openttd 13:54:45 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B7682B.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:56:34 <Ammller> [14:40] <csaba> the slopes the slopes <-- they are really hard in TTD 13:57:06 <glx> too late Ammller 13:57:25 <Ammller> oh,:) 13:57:35 <Ammller> but still true 13:57:39 <Gonozal_VIII> can't remember if i had problems with them at first, that's so many years ago 13:58:09 <Ammller> you had no foundations, if I remember right? 13:59:33 *** |Bastiaan| [~kvirc@ip87-205-173-82.adsl2.versatel.nl] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 14:02:16 *** |Bastiaan| [~kvirc@ip87-205-173-82.adsl2.versatel.nl] has joined #openttd 14:08:52 *** eJoJ [~ejoj@89.10.29.107] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:13:35 *** Mucht [~Martin@chello080109200215.3.sc-graz.chello.at] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:15:24 *** Mucht [~Martin@chello080109200215.3.sc-graz.chello.at] has joined #openttd 14:21:44 *** helb [~helb@84.244.90.159] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:22:30 *** helb [~helb@84.244.90.159] has joined #openttd 14:39:06 *** Farden123 [~jk3farden@AMontsouris-156-1-30-103.w90-2.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #openttd 14:40:47 *** eJoJ [~ejoj@ti211110a080-7900.bb.online.no] has joined #openttd 14:42:45 *** |fjb| [~frank@p5485CD7F.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 14:45:47 *** Farden [~jk3farden@AMontsouris-156-1-48-232.w90-24.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:45:47 *** Farden123 is now known as Farden 14:45:56 <SpComb> Logs: http://spbot.marttila.de:8120/logs/oftc-ottd (old: http://zapotek.paivola.fi/~terom/logs/openttd ) 14:45:56 <|fjb|> !logs 14:49:37 *** fjb [~frank@p5485EAB9.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:54:32 *** Wolf01 is now known as Wolf01|AWAY 15:00:05 *** |fjb| is now known as fjb 15:06:59 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B753B4.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 15:10:23 *** skidd13 [~skidd13@p548A45EB.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 15:10:26 <skidd13> Hi folks 15:10:33 <Gonozal_VIII> hi 15:10:33 <TrueBrain> hi skidd13 15:12:02 *** eJoJ [~ejoj@ti211110a080-7900.bb.online.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:12:50 <skidd13> TrueBrain: I've been thinking over the code. There are functions missplaced in various files. And I come to the conclusion that file cleanup would be usefull. My thinking got into the direction to split the engine from the game (or at least to clarify the border a bit better) 15:13:10 <TrueBrain> skidd13: many tried, many failed :) 15:13:18 <TrueBrain> resolving the include mess for example 15:13:21 <TrueBrain> is always a good thing 15:13:22 <TrueBrain> but hard 15:13:31 <skidd13> I knew. But I'm not many :D 15:13:38 <TrueBrain> true :) 15:13:39 <fjb> Moin skidd13 15:13:44 <skidd13> Moin 15:13:49 <TrueBrain> a while back we made a purposal for directory structure 15:13:57 <TrueBrain> which should help for things like that 15:14:01 <TrueBrain> but I guess it got lost... 15:14:06 <skidd13> Do you have a backup? 15:14:08 <TrueBrain> (like newgrfs in newgrf/ ) 15:14:57 <TrueBrain> if I remember correctly, Rubidium had that file on his http, but I am sure I am making things up 15:15:32 <skidd13> Moving the random functions and the templates of macros.h should be collected in something like mat.h 15:15:45 <skidd13> :%s /Moving//g 15:15:54 <TrueBrain> skidd13: wrote down a purposal, and I am sure someone will look into it :) 15:16:07 <skidd13> Wiki, or FS? 15:16:07 <Gonozal_VIII> hehe how long will you remember that "making things up" comment? 15:16:31 <TrueBrain> skidd13: wiki sounds nice 15:16:37 *** lugo [~lugo@p4FD5CFB0.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:16:37 <skidd13> K 15:17:45 *** xyz [~sss@bas4-montreal02-1096737886.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #openttd 15:25:51 *** dihedral [~dihedral@dslb-084-057-251-036.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 2.0.0.9/2007102514]] 15:35:38 *** eJoJ [~ejoj@ti211110a080-5559.bb.online.no] has joined #openttd 15:39:33 *** Farden123 [~jk3farden@AMontsouris-156-1-66-84.w90-24.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #openttd 15:46:24 *** Farden [~jk3farden@AMontsouris-156-1-30-103.w90-2.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:46:24 *** Farden123 is now known as Farden 15:50:02 *** eJoJ [~ejoj@ti211110a080-5559.bb.online.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:59:56 *** xyz [~sss@bas4-montreal02-1096737886.dsl.bell.ca] has left #openttd [] 16:04:48 <skidd13> TrueBrain: http://wiki.openttd.org/index.php/New_directory_structure <- The first ideas wait for expansion, critisism ;) 16:05:46 <TrueBrain> skidd13: I miss newgrf :p 16:05:55 <TrueBrain> maybe 'command'? :) 16:06:18 <skidd13> Add it where you thing it should be! 16:06:28 <TrueBrain> no time today :) 16:11:54 *** skidd13 [~skidd13@p548A45EB.dip.t-dialin.net] has left #openttd [ZZZzzzz.] 16:18:39 *** thgergo [~Administr@dsl51B65D92.pool.t-online.hu] has joined #openttd 16:21:28 *** eJoJ [~ejoj@89.10.29.107] has joined #openttd 16:22:30 <Eddi|zuHause> that sounds like yet another patchkilling feature ;) 16:23:14 *** MaSch [~masch@p5091A631.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 16:23:16 <MaSch> Hi 16:23:48 <MaSch> Is there a option to enable/disable Pre/Combo/Exit Signals? 16:24:11 <Eddi|zuHause> i don't think so 16:24:21 <MaSch> because i cant find them O.o i know that some time ago i used them, but there are no such signals 16:24:40 <fjb> Just right click on a signal. 16:24:41 <Eddi|zuHause> ctrl+click on a signal with the signal tool 16:24:59 <fjb> Ok ctrl-click, I was too fast. 16:25:09 <MaSch> oh.. okay thanks 16:25:22 <MaSch> but i remember a window to control these things 16:25:39 <Eddi|zuHause> that existed but was never in trunk 16:26:14 <MaSch> okay.. so its only in the nightly builds? 16:26:25 <Eddi|zuHause> no 16:26:29 *** h3lb [~helb@84.244.90.159] has joined #openttd 16:26:35 <Eddi|zuHause> the nightly builds are done directly from trunk 16:27:14 <MaSch> okay.. but how i got this window ?? i only use nightly builds 16:27:24 <MaSch> or stable ones 16:27:36 <fjb> It's in ChrisIN. 16:27:37 <Eddi|zuHause> my best guess, you used an "integrated nightly" once 16:27:57 <Eddi|zuHause> which has not much to do with a regular nightly 16:28:18 *** Farden [~jk3farden@AMontsouris-156-1-66-84.w90-24.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Quit: ( www.nnscript.de :: NoNameScript 4.02 :: www.XLhost.de )] 16:28:46 <MaSch> okay.. whatever.. with ctrl + click it works, too ^^ thanks a lot 16:30:55 <Eddi|zuHause> while we are at signals... what happened to tecky and his PBS attempt? 16:31:12 *** helb [~helb@84.244.90.159] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:33:19 <fjb> Maybe he is burried under the signals. He was senn some months ago the last time. 16:34:19 *** h3lb is now known as helb 16:34:54 *** KritiK [~Maxim@78-106-142-7.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd 16:44:05 <ln-> is there a nice design pattern for adding new data members to a class without adding them to the class definition? 16:45:26 <Gonozal_VIII> subclass :-) 16:46:52 <ln-> not really an option. :) 16:47:07 *** skidd13 [~skidd13@p548A55EA.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 16:47:46 <Eddi|zuHause> i think C++ allows to split the class definition into several parts 16:48:02 <Eddi|zuHause> but what exactly are you trying to do? 16:50:49 <ln-> something like class A { Z z; }, but Z is something that requires too many headers included and isn't available for all platforms, so i wouldn't want the A header file to depend on it at all. 16:52:32 <fjb> Hm, how about #ifdef ? 16:52:58 <ln-> omfg, an #ifdef inside a class definition is so ugly 16:53:09 <ln-> and doesn't remove the dependencies 16:53:11 <Eddi|zuHause> ln-: like i said, i think you can have several "class A {}" definitions which then are merged 16:54:00 <ln-> Eddi|zuHause: interesting, i haven't been aware of that. gotta test. 16:54:12 <Eddi|zuHause> so in the header file you put all public members, and in the .cpp file you put the private members and implementation details 16:55:15 <ln-> error: class A redefined 17:00:13 *** wolfy [~Wolfenste@dhcp-077-250-019-098.chello.nl] has joined #openttd 17:02:15 *** wolfy is now known as Wolfensteijn 17:10:54 <fjb> How about letting A inherit from Z and provide an empty Z for some platforms? 17:12:22 <ln-> still the dependency problem 17:13:40 <fjb> I don't know another way around the dependency beside #ifdef. 17:15:07 <fjb> Ups, banks get placed far outside the towns with ECS. 17:15:08 <ln-> the header with A is included either directly or transitionally in a lot of places. making A include something extra makes everything #including A depend also on Z. 17:16:05 <fjb> Then put the #ifdef into the header for A. 17:16:21 <Eddi|zuHause> how about adding a portable (abstract) superclass to Z instead? 17:16:26 *** skidd13 [~skidd13@p548A55EA.dip.t-dialin.net] has left #openttd [ZZZzzzz.] 17:17:37 <ln-> Eddi|zuHause: that's the least bad alternative so far. 17:18:21 <ln-> fjb: #ifdefs are not acceptable and do not solve dependency problems. 17:20:14 *** Vikthor [~Vikthor@212.24.150.226] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:20:31 <ln-> basically one could also have a table with pointers to A and pointers to Z in the .cpp, to connect instances of A with instances of Z, and so the header file of A wouldn't need to know anything about Z. 17:20:55 *** DaleStan_ is now known as DaleStan 17:21:02 <ln-> but updating and accessing such a table would of course need thread synchronization which is unpleasant. 17:21:12 <ln-> (it would be static) 17:21:37 <Eddi|zuHause> you could also have void pointers and then cast them to Z pointers everywhere... 17:21:58 <Eddi|zuHause> urgh... that sounds even ugly to me :p 17:22:16 <fjb> Sounds like many page faults... 17:26:56 *** Brianetta [~brian@82-39-52-234.cable.ubr03.benw.blueyonder.co.uk] has joined #openttd 17:32:02 *** Vikthor [~Vikthor@212.24.150.226] has joined #openttd 17:35:45 *** eJoJ [~ejoj@89.10.29.107] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:36:44 *** eJoJ [~ejoj@89.10.29.107] has joined #openttd 17:44:53 <blathijs> nx 17:44:58 <blathijs> woops 17:54:54 *** |Bastiaan| [~kvirc@ip87-205-173-82.adsl2.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:04:35 *** MaSch [~masch@p5091A631.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: shutdown -s now . . . will halt now] 18:05:42 *** LeviathNL [~thomas@vdburgt.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 18:19:18 *** RamboRonny [magic.powe@90-230-201-111-no37.tbcn.telia.com] has joined #openttd 18:19:32 *** RamboRonny [magic.powe@90-230-201-111-no37.tbcn.telia.com] has quit [] 18:19:41 *** RamboRonny [magic.powe@90-230-201-111-no37.tbcn.telia.com] has joined #openttd 18:28:02 *** skidd13 [~skidd13@p548A76B2.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 18:30:47 *** fjb is now known as fjbAWAY 18:32:09 *** BigBB [~BigBB@p5B042D4E.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 18:38:45 *** paul_ [~paul@91.186.11.8] has joined #openttd 18:38:45 *** Dephenom [~paul@91.186.11.8] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:43:11 *** SmatZ [~smatz@a40-prg1-5-107.static.adsl.vol.cz] has joined #openttd 18:44:06 *** csaba [~chatzilla@catv54030849.pool.t-online.hu] has joined #openttd 18:44:16 <csaba> hi 18:44:36 <csaba> can somebody help me? 18:45:45 <skidd13> what's the problem? 18:46:16 <csaba> i can not travel grain or livestock between the farm and factory 18:46:27 <csaba> i have depots next to them 18:46:31 <ln-> csaba: http://www.wxwidgets.org/wiki/index.php/IRC#Don.27t_Ask_To_Ask 18:46:48 <csaba> ln: answer me 18:46:57 <csaba> dont command me 18:47:17 <ln-> csaba: shut the fuck up 18:47:41 <ln-> csaba: i have no obligation to answer you 18:47:42 <csaba> ln if you cant help pls leave me alone 18:47:56 <skidd13> @kick ln- 18:48:42 <csaba> i have never said that fuck up 18:48:47 *** Gonozal_VIII [~Gonozal_V@N717P031.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:48:50 <skidd13> csaba: depots? You need a station. a depot is only needed to handle trains 18:48:51 <csaba> kick yourself out 18:50:58 <csaba> where is the station icon ? 18:51:34 <csaba> ok i will find out 18:51:40 <csaba> great community 18:51:48 <skidd13> http://wiki.openttd.org/index.php/Construction 18:52:19 <skidd13> You might try the newbee guide in the wiki. 18:52:47 <ln-> skidd13: why would you want to kick me, sir? 18:53:08 <skidd13> ln-: rude behavior 18:53:22 *** Gonozal_VIII [~Gonozal_V@N853P009.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #openttd 18:53:33 <ln-> skidd13: in response to stupid and rude behavior. 18:54:35 <skidd13> You should be friendly. OpenTTD is such a peacefull game. So please calm down. Thanks 18:55:16 <ln-> skidd13: i started by giving friendly instructions on how to ask for help on irc. 18:55:43 <csaba> i have found the lorry station 18:56:30 <skidd13> ln-: Some people are not native english, so their questions might sound not nice... Keep that in mind ;) 18:56:32 <SpComb> Logs: http://spbot.marttila.de:8120/logs/oftc-ottd (old: http://zapotek.paivola.fi/~terom/logs/openttd ) 18:56:32 <Gonozal_VIII> !logs 18:56:57 <csaba> sorry my bad english i mixed the meaning of lorry 18:57:10 <csaba> thanks 18:57:17 <skidd13> no problem 18:58:04 <csaba> yes i mixed the meaning of ferry and lorry 18:58:09 <csaba> many thanks again 18:59:21 * Phazorx pings TrueBrain 18:59:30 * TrueBrain replies 18:59:32 <skidd13> ln-: And there is no need to insult someone 19:00:25 <csaba> im back to the game 19:00:26 <Phazorx> TrueBrain: i got some reading material for ya 19:00:31 <Phazorx> dcc ? 19:00:32 <TrueBrain> cool :) Show me ;) 19:00:35 <TrueBrain> can't handle DCC 19:00:37 <TrueBrain> either http or mail 19:02:04 <ln-> skidd13: i was not insulting, i merely ordered him to shut his mouth after he ignored my help. 19:03:13 <ln-> skidd13: not significantly worse than "not funny! end of discussion." 19:03:16 *** SERVEPRO [~SERVEPRO_@71.114.48.3] has joined #openttd 19:03:44 <skidd13> It's OK ln- 19:03:51 <TrueBrain> Phazorx: tnx, reading.. 19:04:00 <Phazorx> sure :) 19:04:15 <Phazorx> i hope it at least worthy of time spent 19:04:19 <TrueBrain> Phazorx: btw, I did some matrix compression today, I could reduce any 18 bits with 3 bits :p 19:04:23 <csaba> fullload buttton has been activated:) 19:04:23 <TrueBrain> (and any 50 bits with 11 bits) 19:04:39 <Phazorx> TrueBrain: any bits or some ? 19:04:45 <TrueBrain> Phazorx: any combination of bits 19:04:53 <TrueBrain> some cases it was better, but never worse 19:05:01 <Phazorx> that's good 19:05:16 <Phazorx> 266^3 chunk would be nice tho 19:05:37 <TrueBrain> I did it by hand, the checking of the matrix, as I was too lazy to write an application for it :p 19:05:47 <TrueBrain> so ... 6x6 was biggest I tried, with each cell containing 2 bits 19:06:02 <Phazorx> 72 bits 19:06:45 <Phazorx> one thing i can say for sure - checksum validation gains value with number of dimentions 19:06:55 <TrueBrain> yup 19:07:18 <Phazorx> so each next dimention used probably reduces needed data exponentialy 19:07:29 <TrueBrain> in my method, not exponential 19:07:52 <TrueBrain> but still, I found it suprising that you can reduce any amount of bitstream with several bits (up to a given limit) 19:07:56 <TrueBrain> just it takes a bit of CPU time :) 19:08:01 <Phazorx> well given that number of dimentions is much less than data row/column 19:08:26 <Phazorx> yeah,i can foresee that being a storage method for future 19:08:45 <Phazorx> where it is always a balance between time spend and final sized 19:08:51 <Phazorx> rather thana fixed number 19:09:19 <Phazorx> and i can assure you that it works better on noneuniform data, so you ebtter of compressing it with soemtihng very fast 1st 19:09:20 <TrueBrain> your document finally clears up a few things ;) 19:09:31 <Phazorx> i hoped so 19:09:54 <TrueBrain> I didn't use XOR, as the results can be doubtful, but I used SUM 19:09:55 <Phazorx> the idea is very close to encrypton and can be used to encrypt as wellas compress 19:10:18 <Phazorx> TrueBrain: well sum with overflow? 19:10:28 <TrueBrain> Phazorx: no, that is why it isn't exponentional :) 19:10:33 <Phazorx> ahh 19:10:49 <Phazorx> well my aprach is mroe generic 19:11:01 <Phazorx> but it could be any of known hash methods 19:11:05 <Phazorx> doesnt matter that much 19:11:20 <Phazorx> xor is just faster and has enough invariety to it to make it work 19:12:02 <TrueBrain> downside of XOR is that when you have something like: 10 ?? ?? => 00, the last two ?? are set, but the middle row can be either 10 or 01 19:12:10 <TrueBrain> (where => is the XOR of the first 3 pairs of 2 bits) 19:12:59 <Phazorx> well that's why you have more than just one dimension 19:13:08 <Phazorx> so a cross check would clear up soem things 19:13:16 <TrueBrain> but still doesn't make it unique 19:13:20 <Phazorx> and 3rd dimetion will give you even more detail 19:13:22 <TrueBrain> or worse: the checksum isn't unique 19:13:49 <Phazorx> as i mentined yesterday uniqueness isnt the goal 19:13:56 <Phazorx> it still is a guess 19:14:02 <TrueBrain> for lossless compression, in the end it is :) 19:14:15 <Phazorx> i beg to differ 19:14:32 <TrueBrain> euh, in the end you want to be able to decompress 19:14:41 <Phazorx> if you can guess from first try of many guess and have enough guideance to have a 100% probability on 1st guess being correct 19:14:45 <TrueBrain> so, lossless defines that you need to get an unique solution ;) 19:15:00 <Phazorx> it doesnt matter tha there can be 1000000 more incorrect guesses as long as they are not 1st one 19:15:03 <TrueBrain> oh, k, you mean it like that ;) 19:15:13 <TrueBrain> in my book, it means you did define enough uniqueness :) 19:15:28 <TrueBrain> (filling in spots in the matrix, does define uniqueness :)) 19:15:28 <Phazorx> you can read it like that 19:15:36 <Phazorx> but a meant from math side of things 19:15:42 <Phazorx> it is not a unique solution 19:15:44 <Phazorx> it is a subset 19:15:57 <TrueBrain> anyway, what I ment with the XOR problem, is that you have to give the middle row on every entry. It can not be calculated in any way 19:16:03 <TrueBrain> your method kind of avoids that btw 19:16:22 <TrueBrain> (by pre-defining what it should be, and giving addition information if it is not ;)) 19:16:34 <Phazorx> yeah i guess, and i like xor because evey bit is meangfull in every step 19:16:43 <Phazorx> but 2 dimentions is the least to make it mena enoughj 19:16:44 <TrueBrain> I agree :) 19:16:51 <Phazorx> and more dimentions - more meaning it has 19:17:23 <TrueBrain> btw, the word 'guessing' gets a whole other meaning ;) 19:18:03 <TrueBrain> funny enough, what I wrote today isn't far off from what you wrote down :) Just you present a very clever way to produce enough results to create the matrix 19:18:36 <Phazorx> i think it is a worth idea 19:18:42 <Phazorx> just the math part is lacking 19:21:17 <Phazorx> i'm not sure if you are familiar with simple block variation ciphers but they sort of do same thing but in reverse, where key bits are used to encrypt in same fashion as i position this idea to "guess" the original data 19:22:01 <Phazorx> you can write an app to brute force it tho 19:22:32 <Phazorx> on some smaller chunks like 16x16x16 bytes 19:22:57 <Phazorx> much less yield tho 19:23:40 <TrueBrain> as a proof-of-concept doesn't care about how much CPU it uses, you can create it without the math 19:23:43 <TrueBrain> by just brute forcing it 19:24:03 <Phazorx> im pretty sure since the concept is trivial someone would already have doe it 19:24:11 <Phazorx> and smatr math part is the key 19:24:24 <Phazorx> to make it somewhat usable 19:24:51 <TrueBrain> the invention of the wheel, don't you think someone was thinking too, someone else would have thought it up? 19:24:58 <Phazorx> could be fun to get some cray time and encoe like a gig into few megabytes :) 19:25:11 <TrueBrain> this Soup guy is funny.. it is joining all channels I am on and starts annoying :p 19:25:43 <Phazorx> you know that i banned all ISPs in his town in #openttdcoop ? 19:25:46 <TrueBrain> Phazorx: I can get CPU time, and a lot 19:26:17 <Phazorx> TrueBrain: when more power to you, i still would like more proper math appraoch than brute force 19:26:28 <Phazorx> as it is now it is possible to be done but not feasible to be used 19:26:29 <TrueBrain> I Agree :) 19:26:40 <TrueBrain> have you tried it? :p 19:26:48 <Phazorx> nope 19:27:01 <Phazorx> been a while since i actualy done a C app from scratch 19:27:08 <Phazorx> like 10 years at least :) 19:27:14 <TrueBrain> lol :) 19:27:25 <TrueBrain> if you don't mind, I will give it a spin? 19:27:31 <Phazorx> you definately should 19:27:51 <Phazorx> but i;d like to spin it too if you publish the code :) 19:27:58 <Phazorx> and most definately enhance the guesing part 19:28:06 <TrueBrain> just minor things that don't make sense... 71 XORed is 81? 19:28:28 <Phazorx> 71 xored to what ? 19:28:38 <Phazorx> you mean when cheating was done? 19:28:40 <TrueBrain> let's get an other channel for this ;) 19:29:01 <TrueBrain> #openttd.compress 19:29:05 <TrueBrain> anyone who cares, can join too :p 19:38:12 *** Jello [~ok@S01060060080d1060.gv.shawcable.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:44:34 *** Jello [ok@S01060060080d1060.gv.shawcable.net] has joined #openttd 19:52:02 *** Klanticus [~Klanticus@201-43-54-129.dsl.telesp.net.br] has joined #openttd 19:58:07 *** skidd13 [~skidd13@p548A76B2.dip.t-dialin.net] has left #openttd [ZZZzzzz.] 20:08:03 <Brianetta> It's a shame only 255 UK servicemen were lost in the Falklands War. One more and it would have wrapped to zero, what with it being 1982 and all. 20:08:57 <hylje> i *so* saw a bitness joke coming 20:10:26 <Brianetta> Th\at's why I had to get the whole thing out in one line 20:11:17 *** XeryusTC [~irc@cc480157-b.sneek1.fr.home.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:16:28 <fjbAWAY> :-) 20:16:28 *** fjbAWAY is now known as fjb 20:16:35 <fjb> back 20:20:13 *** BigBB [~BigBB@p5B042D4E.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:21:10 *** BigBB [~BigBB@p5B042D4E.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 20:25:12 *** LeviathNL [~thomas@vdburgt.xs4all.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:30:53 *** Klanticus [~Klanticus@201-43-54-129.dsl.telesp.net.br] has quit [Quit: Saindo] 20:37:45 *** TinoDidriksen [~projectjj@users.kollegienet.dk] has joined #openttd 20:45:01 *** xerxes [user@xerxes.foocode.net] has joined #openttd 20:48:46 *** svip [~svip@cpe.atm2-0-78233.0x535a2072.boanxx18.customer.tele.dk] has quit [Quit: poof] 20:50:02 <Rubidium> TrueBrain: you mean the thing like http://rbijker.net/openttd/misc/guideline.txt ? 20:51:25 *** shodan [user@xerxes.foocode.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:51:26 *** xerxes is now known as shodan 20:51:54 *** thgergo [~Administr@dsl51B65D92.pool.t-online.hu] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:59:03 *** G_ [~njones@202-154-147-204.ubs-dynamic.connections.net.nz] has joined #openttd 21:00:52 *** G [~njones@202-154-147-204.ubs-dynamic.connections.net.nz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:05:01 *** csaba [~chatzilla@catv54030849.pool.t-online.hu] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 2.0.0.9/2007102514]] 21:12:50 *** svip [~svip@cpe.atm2-0-78233.0x535a2072.boanxx18.customer.tele.dk] has joined #openttd 21:20:12 *** G [~njones@202-154-147-204.ubs-dynamic.connections.net.nz] has joined #openttd 21:22:02 *** G_ [~njones@202-154-147-204.ubs-dynamic.connections.net.nz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:27:11 *** CIA-1 [~CIA@208.69.182.149] has quit [] 21:36:32 *** TinoM [~Tino@i5387CB0F.versanet.de] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 21:38:56 *** CIA-1 [~CIA@208.69.182.149] has joined #openttd 21:47:38 <fjb> Belugas? 21:50:05 <fjb> !seen belugas 21:50:06 <_42_> fjb, please look a bit closer at the memberlist of this channel. 21:50:12 <fjb> :-) 21:51:55 <Rubidium> he's usually not online in the weekends 21:52:31 <Rubidium> and if he's online, it's when it is 'late' for him, i.e. in about 4 to 6 hours 21:53:19 <fjb> Ok, thank you. I think I found a bug in newindustries. 21:54:17 <Rubidium> it's just an undocumented OTTD specific feature ;) 21:55:06 <fjb> But my citicens complain, there is no bank in their town... 21:55:51 <Rubidium> poor them ;) 21:57:01 <fjb> And the banka are complaining, they have no customers. 21:58:36 <Rubidium> fjb: FS#1382? 21:58:41 *** Peakki [antti@cs181247045.pp.htv.fi] has quit [Quit: LÀhdössÀ] 22:00:41 *** Wolf01|AWAY [~wolf01@host203-233-dynamic.8-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 22:01:26 <fjb> Yes, looks like others have the same problem. 22:23:19 <SmatZ> wow, rbijker.net, Rubidium's own website ;-) 22:23:42 <Rubidium> boring, ain't it? 22:23:51 <SmatZ> not at all 22:23:57 <SmatZ> I didn't know about it 22:24:07 <Rubidium> poor soul ;) 22:24:10 <SmatZ> Nothing yet 22:24:15 <SmatZ> hmm yes, a bit boring :-D 22:24:55 *** ThePizzaKing [~jeff@c211-28-164-75.eburwd2.vic.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 22:25:03 <Rubidium> it "just" contains loads of crappy patches 22:25:09 *** SmatZ [~smatz@a40-prg1-5-107.static.adsl.vol.cz] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:29:12 <fjb> Oh, strato... 22:31:24 <Rubidium> thus? 22:36:27 <fjb> One of the biggest providers around here, nothing more. 22:38:22 <Rubidium> for good reasons ;) 22:38:35 <Rubidium> I haven't found a compelling reason to go somewhere else 22:42:25 <fjb> I was just curious. :-) 22:55:18 *** lolman is now known as John 22:55:25 *** John is now known as lolman 22:57:08 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r11400 /trunk/src/vehicle.cpp: -Fix [FS#1409]: assign orders during cloning after refitting as it needs the cargo types to be the same. 23:00:41 *** Gekz [~gekko@CPE-121-217-203-4.nsw.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 23:09:53 *** Gekz [~gekko@CPE-121-217-203-4.nsw.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:10:15 *** Gekz [~gekko@CPE-121-217-203-4.nsw.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 23:13:27 *** BigBB [~BigBB@p5B042D4E.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:22:44 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r11401 /trunk/src/macros.h: -Fix [FS#1391]: make all min functions do exactly the same instead of branching on either < or <=. 23:44:01 *** Anon1180 [~FakeYou@cc613633-a.groni1.gr.home.nl] has joined #openttd 23:44:32 *** Anon1180 [~FakeYou@cc613633-a.groni1.gr.home.nl] has quit [] 23:51:01 *** Diabolic-Angel [~dia@xdsl-84-44-209-206.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: leaving] 23:54:53 *** lugo [~lugo@p4FD5F46F.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd