Log for #openttd on 5th March 2008:
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01:27:47  <oh> anyone know whether it's possible to save a multiplayer game and continue where you left off offline?
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01:28:24  <glx> yes, just save it
01:28:47  <glx> then load it and use "change player" cheat
01:28:57  <oh> I always end up in the wrong/a new company if I try to load
01:28:57  <oh> ah
01:29:03  <oh> cheers :)
01:29:20  <oh> autoclean is the devil
01:29:39  <glx> or start a local server, load the game and join our company with another client
01:29:51  <glx> *your
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01:39:08  <oh> I  think I'm effectively killing maarten's 1940-2000 server :S
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02:49:19  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: belugas * r12340 /trunk/src/rail_cmd.cpp:
02:49:19  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Codechange: Remove some magic numbers (sprite IDs here) with some more meaningful values.
02:49:19  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: This allows to remove an unnecessary subtraction in the MAYBE_DAW_SIGNAL macro, who was waiting for an offset, at the first place.
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09:38:05  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: peter1138 * r12341 /trunk/src/newgrf.cpp: -Fix (r11224) [FS#1827]: GRM buffer for cargos was incorrect size.
09:40:32  <peter1138> @openttd bugs
09:40:33  <DorpsGek> peter1138: Open Bugs: 28; Not assigned: 22; Closed this week: 16; Opened this week: 15
09:40:33  <SpComb> OpenTTD DRM!
09:40:35  <peter1138> Hmm
09:40:58  <peter1138> DRM in open source? hehehe
09:58:31  <SpComb> hmm, I was somehow under the vauge impression that PBS had gotten into trunk, but I appear to be delusional
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10:14:00  <peter1138> And also delusional that ‘gotten’ is a word in English...
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11:41:51  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: belugas * r12342 /trunk/src/rail_cmd.cpp:
11:41:51  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Fix(r12340): In order to avoid confusion, SIGN should be used for signs and SIGNAL for signals :)
11:41:51  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: Always check your terms with your nearest british ;)
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12:41:41  <fjb> Hello
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12:55:31  <fjb> Where did follow_track.cpp go? I don't find it in the comit messages.
12:55:46  <SmatZ> it went away
12:55:54  <SmatZ> it was unused
12:56:13  <SmatZ>;a=commit;h=a44847f2e4d12413df1a277d3e1f1b99c66794d9
12:57:02  <fjb> Ah, thank you.
12:57:29  <fjb> Now I have to find out what the yapp patch does to that file.
13:02:58  <peter1138> I don't think YAPP used it.
13:03:55  <peter1138> It fixed it, but it wasn't needed anyway. Or something.
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13:10:51  <fjb> Oh, ok. Then I will just skip that part of the patch.
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13:16:57  <fjb> Is the vehicle pool patch that patch that was talked about to go into trunk after the feature freeze?
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13:28:16  <fjb> Moin frosch123
13:28:25  <frosch123> quak fjb
13:28:32  <fjb> :-)
13:28:48  <frosch123> :o
13:29:04  <fjb> I won't kiss you. :-P
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13:38:34  <yorick> lets see, what shall I patch into my custom beta5?
13:38:43  <yorick> (with networking compat)
13:38:59  <fjb> Noting.
13:39:06  <fjb> Nothing.
13:39:09  <yorick> smallmap zoom
13:39:13  <yorick> copy-paste
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13:42:04  <fjb> I have often seen people desync after using copy-paste. And as far as I know that functionality is disabled in a network game now.
13:44:04  <yorick> nope :)
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13:45:13  <fjb> I would ban everybody who uses the copy-paste patch from my server.
13:45:18  <yorick> ...
13:45:19  <yorick> you know
13:45:25  <yorick> it can be disabled serverside ;)
13:46:02  <yorick> if you ask frostregen, he can provide you the pastespeed patch
13:46:17  <yorick> if the pastespeed patch value is set to 255, pasting is disabled
13:46:32  <SmatZ> I wonder how the "pastespeed" patch works, maybe it just limits the frequency of accepted commands
13:46:36  <yorick> no
13:46:40  <SmatZ> no?
13:46:41  <yorick> it is a patch option
13:46:55  <fjb> But how works it technically?
13:46:56  <SmatZ> it has to be compatible with clean clients
13:47:00  <yorick> it is
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13:47:25  <SmatZ> and clients with c&p do not know the pastespeed setting of the server - or do they?
13:47:26  <yorick> hmm...
13:47:28  <yorick> I'll check
13:48:02  <peter1138> Clients:  	7 / 11 (7 / 6 companies; 1 / 11 spectators)
13:48:06  <peter1138> Hmm, 7 out of 6 companies? :o
13:48:18  <SmatZ> why not :P
13:48:19  <yorick> they could have been lowered
13:48:31  <glx> peter1138: 2 joins at the same time?
13:48:43  <yorick>
13:48:56  <fjb> Limiting the frequency of accepted commands will be very bad in case of a network jam. You never know in which order or speed the ip packets reach their destination.
13:49:14  <SmatZ> yes
13:49:19  <SmatZ> that's true
13:49:26  <SmatZ> but how else could it work?
13:49:32  <SmatZ> I don't know
13:50:04  <fjb> There is no other way how it could work. The copy paste patch emulates a very fast clicking person.
13:50:22  <fjb> So that is a very bad countermeasure against a cheat.
13:51:31  <fjb> peter1138: One is a virtual company, located at the Bahamas.
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13:51:38  <yorick> ask frostregen
13:53:50  <fjb> Banning is still the prefered solution as you don't have to patch the server.
13:54:13  <yorick> it should be allowed for me to do whatever I want on my client ^^
13:54:35  <yorick> the server should decide if what I do is good or not
13:55:14  <fjb> And it should be allowed for the admin to do what ever he things is needed protecting the game.
13:55:23  <yorick> agree
13:55:33  <yorick> I won't play on your server anyway ^^
13:56:09  <fjb> And I didn't see a game yet where the copy paste patch wasn't kind of abused.
13:58:23  <peter1138> < looks strange in the detail window :o
13:58:53  <glx> nothing we can do about it I think
13:59:04  <fjb> A train going backward?
13:59:11  <peter1138> Not really, except maybe ignore the bit when showing stuff like that.
14:00:17  <fjb> Isn't it possivble to show the details independent from the direction the train is traveling?
14:00:42  <yorick> is indeed a MP patch setting
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14:06:03  <LordAzamath> elou
14:07:43  <glx> peter1138: hmm doesn't happen for all combinations
14:08:18  <peter1138> Well it just shows whatever the GRF has told it to show.
14:08:25  <fjb> Moin LordAzamath
14:08:47  <glx> sometimes only the engine "rotates"
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14:11:39  <yorick> the better graphs patch hasn't been updated recently?
14:13:12  <LordAzamath> !seen miham*
14:13:22  <LordAzamath> hmm..
14:13:27  <LordAzamath> @seen miham*
14:13:27  <DorpsGek> LordAzamath: miham* could be MiHaMeK (4 weeks, 6 days, 19 hours, 26 minutes, and 17 seconds ago) or MiHaMiX (7 weeks, 1 day, 17 hours, 51 minutes, and 48 seconds ago)
14:13:35  <LordAzamath> :O
14:14:49  <yorick> try on openttd.wt2
14:15:26  <LordAzamath> :O
14:15:50  <LordAzamath> yorick... well he is online there...
14:16:47  <SmatZ> aahahahahhaahah
14:17:26  <LordAzamath> was that a scream or laughing?
14:17:28  <LordAzamath> :P
14:18:38  <SmatZ> laughing
14:19:49  * fjb knows why he doesn't use Microssoft Software it ever avoidable.
14:20:24  * keyweed smiles.
14:25:55  <fjb> Gonozal should update his patch pack. :-)
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14:42:54  <yorick> does anyone have an updated version of the better graphs patch?
14:43:37  <LordAzamath> peter1138, you here?
14:44:23  <fjb> yorick: I fear you have to update that patch.
14:44:32  <yorick> total nightmare
14:44:37  * yorick tried
14:45:14  <yorick> but it tries to remove things on line 500 of openttd.h
14:45:24  <LordAzamath> I just tried that if I add that missing tag to the wagon articles ( picture: ), then it won't show it anywhere... SO I can define the tags before and then you change the template and everything is automatically correct..
14:45:47  <peter1138> Sure...
14:46:15  <LordAzamath> so I'll give the 27 articles those tags and you update template? good :)
14:53:03  <fjb> yorick: Look what it tries to remove and remove that line by hand.
14:53:43  <yorick> fjb: there is the problem, there is no line 512
14:53:58  <yorick> it ends around 419
14:54:17  <fjb> But the diff tells you the contend of that line. You have to find that content anywhere.
14:54:55  <yorick> you seem to know, goodluck!
14:58:35  <fjb> Maybe that line was relocated to another file.
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14:59:28  <fjb> FollowTrack_t was completely removed?
15:03:54  <glx> yes
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15:06:44  <fjb> I think I have to reintroduce it to get the yapp patch working.
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15:13:39  <fjb> I should set up my own repository.
15:15:17  <hylje> or go decentralized all the way
15:16:48  <LordAzamath> peter1138, you here:P?
15:17:39  <LordAzamath> I've finished I hope..
15:17:53  <LordAzamath> if any typos came in, we'll see it :P
15:18:06  <fjb> hylje: No, that is not an option.
15:19:13  <hylje> elaborate
15:20:19  <fjb> I don't see the advantage of decentralisation.
15:21:37  <hylje> several repositories, which can share changesets trivially
15:21:48  <peter1138> Allegedly.
15:24:25  <fjb> And why should I have several repositories when I can have several branches in one repository?
15:24:55  <Eddi|zuHause2> because you can't have branches in THE repository
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15:25:38  <fjb> But I can have a replication of that repository and branch as will in my own replecated repository.
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15:27:04  <glx> <fjb> I think I have to reintroduce it to get the yapp patch working. <-- why?
15:27:59  <SmatZ> fjb: are you a new YAPP developer?
15:28:14  <fjb> yapp uses FollowTrack_t
15:28:21  <glx>
15:28:33  <fjb> No, I'm just porting the patch to the actual source.
15:28:40  <glx> YAPP can use FollowTrack()
15:29:00  <fjb> Ok, I will look at that
15:29:31  <SmatZ> michi_cc isn't developing / updating YAPP anymore?
15:29:37  <SmatZ> ah...
15:29:45  <SmatZ> he said you to update it :)
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15:34:59  <Draakon> hi
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16:19:14  <fjb> SmatZ: He is still developing it. But I want to patch the actual OpenTTD.
16:19:57  <peter1138> The *actual* OpenTTD?
16:20:15  <peter1138> Wasn't it already a patch of the, er, 'actual' OpenTTD?
16:20:36  <fjb> Ok, I meant latest trunk.
16:20:51  <fjb> My English is not perfect.
16:21:40  <peter1138> Quite.
16:21:54  <peter1138> You want to update. Enjoy ;)
16:22:10  <fjb> I'm enjoying it.
16:22:14  <SmatZ> :-D
16:22:44  <fjb> Only think that bogs me is FollowTrack_t.
16:22:48  <fjb> bugs
16:27:11  <LordAzamath> peter1138... do you ignore me? :P ^^
16:27:24  <peter1138> No
16:27:52  <LordAzamath> yeah right.. :P
16:28:05  <LordAzamath> you just don't have time?
16:28:39  <Belugas> time or... interest somewhere else ? ;)
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16:29:48  <LordAzamath> heh.. I have irritated him for two days now..
16:30:11  <LordAzamath> maybe me leaving him alone would be enough motivation to get interested :P
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16:39:01  *** Gonozal_VIII [Gonozal_VI@] has joined #openttd
16:39:23  <LordAzamath> hello Gonozal_VIII
16:39:26  <Gonozal_VIII> hi
16:39:51  <LordAzamath> yorick is offline so you won't be invited  to #? :P
16:39:58  <Gonozal_VIII> ^^
16:41:08  <LordAzamath> by him :P
16:41:14  <fjb> Hi Gonozal_VIII, you dindn't do your homework.
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16:48:59  <Gonozal_VIII> homework?
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16:50:20  <fjb> Yes. Your patch pack doesn't apply to the latest trunk.
16:50:29  <dih> :-)
16:50:52  <Gonozal_VIII> i never said that it does :P
16:50:53  <dih> i need to test if pasting under os x works or not ^^
16:51:07  <dih> you never said anything to pasting under os x
16:51:09  <Gonozal_VIII> it applies to 12180
16:51:29  <fjb> Gonozal_VIII: You adopted it, now you have to take care of it.
16:51:59  <dih> hehe
16:52:13  <dih> _have to_ ?
16:52:43  <Gonozal_VIII> i wanted to wait for a new yapp version to come out before i update again... because michi said it will be today (a week ago or something)
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16:53:52  <LordAzamath> nice address...
16:54:08  <LordAzamath> hello dihedral
16:55:19  <Gonozal_VIII> i have most of the patches updated to 12263, some to 12332... but nothing merged yet
16:55:37  <peter1138> Update to current trunk :D
16:55:56  <LordAzamath> gonozal updates and peter makes another commit....
16:55:59  <Gonozal_VIII> release 0.6.0 :P
16:56:46  <Ammler> Gonozal_VIII: yould you release a patchpack without pass dest
16:57:03  <Gonozal_VIII> you can deactivate it
16:57:20  <Ammler> hmm, yes :-)
16:57:24  <Ammler> need to try that
16:58:10  <Gonozal_VIII> i didn't include it at first because of the problems the patch causes but there was a high demand
16:58:36  <fjb> Does it cause desyncs?
16:58:51  <Eddi|zuHause2> most certainly
16:59:04  <Gonozal_VIII> somebody wrote that... i don't know for sure
16:59:51  <Gonozal_VIII> but my game crashed once with it
17:00:13  <Gonozal_VIII> with some clicking around in the station window
17:00:39  <Gonozal_VIII> but i couldn't reproduce it, so no idea...
17:01:26  <Eddi|zuHause2> the only thing i noticed is having a station window open causes heavy load
17:02:02  <Eddi|zuHause2> and the amount of passengers generated does not match my scale ;)
17:02:16  <Gonozal_VIII> the patch is not really finished
17:02:31  <Gonozal_VIII> well... passenger numbers can be adjusted
17:04:19  <fjb> What is your scale? The thousands of passengers waiting at a bus stop are also a bit out of scale.
17:05:06  *** nzvip [~svip@] has joined #openttd
17:05:58  <Gonozal_VIII> i didn't play enough to be sure but in my testgames the number of passengers seemed to be just right
17:07:07  <fjb> The only thing that doesn't work is to put just one station at the center of a town and then filling hundreds of trains that way.
17:07:27  <Gonozal_VIII> obviously
17:09:03  <fjb> But that is the style that many are playing.
17:09:26  <Ammler> really? How ugly.
17:10:16  <fjb> Really ugly. Look at most screen shots or look at multiuser games.
17:10:45  <peter1138> Hmm?
17:13:00  <fjb> Look at the scrren shots that many people show at the diffenred TTD forums when they have questions or problems. I often see people using station walking or placing only one station per town alsways under the town name.
17:14:10  <Gonozal_VIII> doesn't that cut the town growth if you build directly under the name?
17:14:27  <fjb> Don't know, I never tried it.
17:14:40  <Slowpoke> I don't think so
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17:16:59  <Slowpoke> do I need an additional grf so that those zepelins or blimps or however they're called in englich work correctly? they just stop anywhere on my airports and dont move anymore
17:17:33  <Gonozal_VIII> they use helipads
17:17:39  <Ammler> Slowpoke: did you change the set on a running game?
17:18:12  <Ammler> maybe you overwrote a plane from previous set
17:18:15  <fjb> Zeppelins and blimps are very different. But that should not matter in your case. Which set are you using?
17:18:34  <Slowpoke> hm I did, then deactivated again and activated it again not in a running game...
17:18:40  <Slowpoke> still no difference
17:19:02  <Gonozal_VIII> what type of airport?
17:19:44  <Slowpoke> those lagre heliports and smal airports
17:19:48  <Slowpoke> +l
17:19:51  <fjb> They should work on any airport.
17:19:54  <Gonozal_VIII> and does it have correct orders..
17:20:06  <Gonozal_VIII> and where's the screenshot? :P
17:20:45  <Slowpoke> yes it does... and even if I change them they don't move... not even into a hangar
17:21:13  <Gonozal_VIII> hmmmm do you have a vehicle stopped halfway inside the hangar?
17:21:24  <fjb> Is there a stopped vehicleon that airport?
17:23:24  <Slowpoke>
17:24:10  <Slowpoke> they just aren't moving, there is nothing in the way... I tested with only one at a similar heliport and it didn't work either...
17:24:12  <Gonozal_VIII> that looks really strange^^
17:25:13  <Gonozal_VIII> ..and german... looks strange and german
17:25:35  <Eddi|zuHause2> how would you know what german looks like :p
17:26:05  <Gonozal_VIII> because it looks like austrian but more complicated :P
17:26:42  <Eddi|zuHause2> Slowpoke: have you tried in a new game?
17:27:02  <Slowpoke> yeah, ut only on a smal airport... Ill try again
17:27:04  <Gonozal_VIII> and the vehicle window you have opened there is the wrong one, that one can
17:27:09  <Gonozal_VIII> 't move anyways
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17:32:08  <Slowpoke> howeveeer, I stared a new game and same thing, now on a intercontinental airport
17:33:47  <Slowpoke>
17:35:04  <fjb> What grfs do you have loaded in which sequence?
17:39:20  <Slowpoke> newships, newstations, ttrsv3.02a,  generic tramset and last the aviator-set
17:40:59  <fjb> And which version of OpenTTD?
17:41:11  *** Prof_Frink [~proffrink@] has joined #openttd
17:41:46  *** Prof_Frink is now known as Guest204
17:42:38  <Slowpoke> r12322
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17:43:17  <fjb> I
17:43:21  <peter1138> Problem with plane speed patch, it seems.
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17:43:37  <fjb> Oh the speeeds drops to 0?
17:43:43  <fjb> speed
17:43:49  <peter1138> Well
17:44:01  *** ProfFrink [~proffrink@] has joined #openttd
17:44:42  <peter1138> No.
17:45:54  *** ProfFrink is now known as Prof_Frink
17:46:25  *** Slowpoke_ [] has joined #openttd
17:47:18  <Slowpoke_> sorry, connection failed...
17:47:41  <Slowpoke_> speed doesn't drop to 0
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17:49:43  *** llugo [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:51:13  <Slowpoke_> I'll have to do something else now, I'll update openttd tomorrow and see what happens. thanks for your help anyway :)
17:51:41  <peter1138> Well it's not fixed yet, heh.
17:51:48  <fjb> What do I have to do to add a file to the source? Just add it to source.list?
17:52:07  <SmatZ> fjb: and run projects/generate
17:52:16  <Belugas> yup
17:52:17  <SmatZ> and svn add
17:52:25  <SmatZ> and svn keywords...
17:52:37  <SmatZ> hmm not needed
17:52:43  <SmatZ> only svn add
17:52:47  <Belugas> and svn commit
17:52:50  <SmatZ> :-D
17:52:50  <Belugas> lol
17:52:55  <fjb> I think I don't need to tell svn about it.
17:53:00  <fjb> :-)
17:53:08  <SmatZ> you do if you want to do svn diff
17:53:29  *** Slowpoke [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:54:13  <fjb> I even didn't need projects/generate, I think.
17:54:26  <peter1138> That's only for MSVC.
17:55:59  <fjb> I found that out after running the script. But it didn't harm anything.
17:56:38  *** Osai [] has quit [Quit: Osai]
17:57:36  <SmatZ> it helps MSVC users to later modify your patch
17:57:39  *** SmatZ [] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
17:58:44  <fjb> The patch will stay at home. :-) It is just the yapp patch.
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18:00:12  <Wolf01> hello
18:00:31  <fjb> Hello Wolf01
18:01:09  *** UnderBuilder [~chatzilla@] has joined #openttd
18:04:10  *** Ammler [] has joined #openttd
18:15:15  <fjb> I'm one error further. :-)
18:18:51  *** Purno [] has joined #openttd
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18:24:11  <fjb> I need a three way diff.
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18:28:59  <yorick> a patch that allows custom server actions from console isn't so hard :0
18:29:02  <yorick> :)*
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18:33:51  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: peter1138 * r12343 /trunk/src/aircraft_cmd.cpp: -Fix (r12293): Slow helicopters never got the 'chance' to finish the landing routine.
18:35:46  *** NukeBuster [] has left #openttd []
18:38:30  <yorick> and having "say" during connecting could be possible too
18:39:05  * yorick sees soo much
18:39:10  *** NukeBuster [] has joined #openttd
18:44:34  *** peter1138 [] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat]
18:51:38  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: skidd13 * r12344 /trunk/src/stdafx.h: -Codechange: Check uint64 bitsize on compiletime too.
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18:53:38  *** Gonozal_VIII [Gonozal_VI@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
18:53:39  <yorick> how big would spamming risks be if I let unknown clients chat?
18:56:18  *** Ammler [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
18:59:20  <yorick> ok, so it's not like *start* *enlargeyourpenisnow* *buyxtc* *donatemoneyforkittensinbottles* *spreadthismessage* *newcomputervirusdiscovered*?
19:00:00  *** Ammler [] has joined #openttd
19:00:21  *** peter1138 [~petern@] has joined #openttd
19:00:24  *** mode/#openttd [+o peter1138] by ChanServ
19:00:41  * yorick repeats it for missing users:
19:00:41  <yorick> [19:53] <yorick> how big would spamming risks be if I let unknown clients chat?
19:00:41  <yorick> [19:56] *** Ammler quit (Ping timeout: 480 seconds)
19:00:41  <yorick> [19:59] <yorick> ok, so it's not like *start* *enlargeyourpenisnow* *buyxtc* *donatemoneyforkittensinbottles* *spreadthismessage* *newcomputervirusdiscovered*?
19:03:26  <glx> @kick yorick for spamming :)
19:03:26  *** yorick was kicked from #openttd by DorpsGek [for spamming :)]
19:03:38  *** yorick [] has joined #openttd
19:03:41  <yorick> :D
19:03:56  <yorick> I expected that for some reason
19:10:08  *** Brianetta [] has joined #openttd
19:12:31  <yorick> ...
19:12:39  <yorick> my mouse just got broken
19:13:03  <yorick> working again :)
19:13:46  * yorick spoke to it using a hamer
19:16:20  <yorick> I assume some server admins might like the custom actions
19:16:29  <yorick> maybe the coop guys
19:17:13  *** Draakon [] has joined #openttd
19:17:29  <Belugas> yorick, i strongly suggest you submit your patch on forums and just let us quietly sleep
19:17:49  * Belugas hates meaningless monologues
19:17:50  <yorick> you don't have to read :p
19:17:51  * peter1138 would just suggest shutting up...
19:17:52  <Draakon> hello
19:17:55  <yorick> hello
19:18:05  <peter1138> Or getting me a beer.
19:18:27  <Draakon> so whats cooking here?
19:18:29  * yorick gives peter1138 an imaginary beer
19:18:54  * Belugas picks it up before it reaches peter's hand
19:19:17  * Draakon snaps it from you
19:19:31  <yorick> fighting for an imaginare beer eh?
19:19:35  <yorick> imaginary*
19:19:47  <Draakon> lol
19:20:20  *** peter1138 [~petern@] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
19:20:41  *** Gonozal_VIII [Gonozal_VI@] has joined #openttd
19:23:28  <Gonozal_VIII> i can't sleep right because i'm dreaming too much :-/
19:23:32  <Draakon> lol
19:23:46  <Draakon> I NEED MORE FEATURES! xD
19:23:56  <yorick> I'm uploading a patch to flyspray
19:23:59  <Gonozal_VIII> and i can't understand the dreams because they are in japanese without subtitles :-/
19:24:00  <yorick> so calm down ;)
19:24:09  <Draakon> lol gonozal
19:24:14  <Draakon> yorick: what patch?
19:24:22  <yorick> custom networking actions
19:24:34  <Draakon> what it does?
19:24:39  <yorick> *** Server is shutting down in this minute...
19:24:51  <yorick> do "Server is shutting down in this minute..."
19:24:55  <Draakon> that kind of text?
19:24:59  <yorick> yes
19:25:16  <Draakon> useless for me
19:25:25  *** lolman [] has joined #openttd
19:25:33  <Draakon> because i cant host :(
19:27:27  <yorick> devs, you can sleep after you've read or included(or both) fs1829
19:27:48  *** yorick is now known as Yorick|AFK
19:29:59  <Draakon> eh
19:30:01  <Draakon> booring
19:32:09  * Belugas does not feel the need to do so
19:32:14  <Draakon> do what?
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19:35:08  *** mode/#openttd [+o peter1138] by ChanServ
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19:37:40  * |Jeroen| doesn't feel like doing anything
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19:43:30  *** Yorick|AFK is now known as Yorick
19:46:37  <fjb> src/rail_cmd.cpp:2171: error: invalid conversion from `int' to `TrackdirBits'
19:46:45  <fjb> I must have done something wrong.
19:47:44  <fjb> if ((b & 0x8) == 0) red_signals |= (TRACKDIR_BIT_LEFT_N | TRACKDIR_BIT_X_NE | TRACKDIR_BIT_Y_SE | TRACKDIR_BIT_UPPER_E) << 16;
19:48:20  *** Gonozal_VIII [Gonozal_VI@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
19:48:31  <Yorick> probably <<16
19:48:38  <Yorick> what should that stand for?
19:48:42  <fjb> red_signals is of type TrackdirBits
19:49:06  <fjb> It'a a left shift by 16 bits.
19:49:29  *** peter1138 [~petern@] has quit [Quit: bwaaahahaha, te eeeh eeehee boingk!]
19:50:09  <fjb> But what size is TrackdirBits?
19:50:35  *** peter1138 [] has joined #openttd
19:50:37  *** mode/#openttd [+o peter1138] by ChanServ
19:54:27  <fjb> Looks like TrackdirBits is only 16 bit wide.
19:56:28  <ln> what would you say if...
19:58:06  *** ln is now known as Bjarni
19:59:05  <Yorick> Bjarni!
19:59:16  <fjb> You are not Bjarni, I didn't see you kick people.
19:59:45  * Bjarni kicks fjb []
19:59:53  <fjb> :-P
19:59:58  <fjb> You are not Bjarni
20:00:20  <Bjarni> more Bjarni than Bjarni himself at the moment
20:01:49  *** MDGrein [] has quit []
20:02:06  <Yorick> ln | nl?
20:02:18  <ln-> wtf are you talking about?
20:02:20  *** Ammler [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20:02:28  <Yorick> just...
20:02:41  <Yorick> I want to know if it is mirrored
20:02:46  <ln-> of course not.
20:02:51  *** Ammler [] has joined #openttd
20:03:17  <fjb> ln- is from Finland.
20:03:41  <Bjarni> I want Sacro
20:03:43  *** Bjarni is now known as ln
20:03:49  <ln-> @seen Bjarni
20:03:50  <DorpsGek> ln-: Bjarni was last seen in #openttd 8 seconds ago: <Bjarni> I want Sacro
20:04:00  <ln-> great success \o/
20:04:32  <LordAzamath> ln!
20:05:02  <LordAzamath> or should I say.. Bjarni! ?
20:05:15  <ln-> Bjarni is not here!
20:05:40  <LordAzamath> then who?
20:05:54  <LordAzamath> garr
20:06:01  * LordAzamath reads upper things..
20:06:09  <LordAzamath> [21:58] *** ln changed nick to Bjarni
20:07:23  *** LordAzamath [~LAlord]] has quit [Quit:  zzzzzz...]
20:07:44  <peter1138> GAH
20:07:54  <peter1138> I can't play without YAPP any more :(
20:08:20  <Yorick> :D
20:08:45  <fjb> You ahve to update the patch... :-)
20:08:58  *** Noldo [] has joined #openttd
20:09:52  * fjb votes for yapp in the patch after feature freeze. Everything else would be unhealthy.
20:10:16  <fjb> yapp in trunk
20:10:37  * fjb is a bit confused after counting to many bits.
20:10:51  * Belugas votes for a lot more stuff after freeze...
20:11:09  * Yorick edited his openttd quit message
20:11:43  <Yorick> ***Yorick has left the game(bye!)
20:11:50  * fjb is curious what Belugas has on his list.
20:13:01  <Belugas> WE have a lot on lists
20:13:52  * fjb knows. peter1138 seams to have an almost ready patch for everything.
20:14:05  <ln-> * seems
20:14:35  * fjb will leans proper English in this or his next life one day.
20:15:03  <fjb> learn
20:15:14  * fjb can't type anymore.
20:15:18  * fjb hates C even more.
20:15:24  <Noldo> haha
20:15:45  <Noldo> those bloody compilers are not reading your comments?
20:16:15  <fjb> They are annoying me.
20:17:14  <Noldo> I wonder what I had on my openttd ToTinkerWith list
20:18:03  *** UnderBuilder [~chatzilla@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
20:18:15  <peter1138> Hmm, I've got 800MB free... I had 2GB free the other day...
20:18:43  <fjb> What did you do?
20:20:18  <Yorick> its fun to see the #openttdcoop and #openttd conversation merged :)
20:20:54  <Yorick> Hmm, I've got 800MB free... I had 2GB free the other day... <-->  But the ML<>SL hookups are there
20:21:00  <fjb> Yorick: Don't confuse their highly optimized conversations.
20:21:32  <fjb> One more error resolved. Now for the next one.
20:22:06  *** Deathmaker [] has joined #openttd
20:22:15  <Belugas> how to set an ignore again?
20:22:19  <Belugas> ho... good... found it
20:22:40  <Yorick> you like ignoring me?
20:26:45  <fjb> How does ./objs/lang/table/strings.h get generated?
20:27:12  <Wolf01> mmmh, 0.6might-be-last-rc, now everybody is waiting for the stable to come and the big river of features on the nightlies
20:27:26  <peter1138> fjb, strgen creates it.
20:28:52  <Wolf01> I'm writing an how to in Italian in my forum, where can I link it?
20:29:02  <fjb> Is a new entry in ./src/lang/english.txt enough to make it appear in ./objs/lang/table/strings.h?
20:29:06  <Wolf01> *how to for TTD
20:29:44  <Yorick> yes
20:29:50  <peter1138> fjb, yes.
20:30:11  *** ben_goodger_ [] has joined #openttd
20:30:22  <fjb> Why didn't it appear in ./objs/lang/table/strings.h then? I have to investigate...
20:31:05  *** remaxim [~remaxim@] has joined #openttd
20:31:54  <remaxim> ping belugas
20:32:14  *** Yorick [] has quit [Quit:  pong Yorick]
20:34:52  *** ben_goodger [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
20:35:57  *** NukeBuster [] has left #openttd []
20:36:12  <fjb> One whitespace was that problem.
20:39:22  <Belugas> pong remaxim
20:39:25  *** NukeBuster [] has joined #openttd
20:41:20  <fjb> Now I'm having r12342 with YAPP, passenger destinations and engine pools.
20:43:22  <fjb> Now for the update to r12344.
20:50:19  *** thgerg1 [] has joined #openttd
20:52:59  *** Gonozal_VIII [Gonozal_VI@] has joined #openttd
20:54:27  <Gonozal_VIII> wow, 12344
20:55:18  *** thgergo [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
20:55:39  <fjb> ne is still missing. :-)
20:55:46  <fjb> +O
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21:00:48  <Gonozal_VIII> what new good patches are there that i should include in my patchpack?
21:01:04  *** remaxim [~remaxim@] has left #openttd []
21:01:27  <Belugas> NONE!
21:01:47  <peter1138> You stole my line.
21:01:50  <fjb> Just keep the current up to date. That will keep you from getting bored.
21:02:17  <Belugas> lol!
21:02:46  * Belugas is discovering with pleasure 30 Ghosts IV
21:02:57  <peter1138> Ah, you got it all now :D
21:03:54  *** skidd13 [] has joined #openttd
21:04:09  <Belugas> yup :D
21:04:19  <Belugas> and... hooooo.... and  haaaaaaaa....
21:04:23  <Belugas> and merci ;)
21:06:14  <Gonozal_VIII> what's that airdrag.diff thingy?
21:13:06  <Belugas> the effect of air's dragg on a vehicle, slowing it down, maybe?
21:14:57  <Gonozal_VIII> yes, i read the diff, seems to be so... but i thought asking here might cause an explanation by peter^^
21:19:51  <peter1138> the effect of air's dragg on a vehicle, slowing it down
21:20:02  <Gonozal_VIII> :P
21:20:31  <Belugas> lol
21:20:33  <Gonozal_VIII> seems to depend only on the engine topspeed
21:21:04  <Belugas> you're right... it should also be applied to the engine speed once stopped :D
21:21:08  <Gonozal_VIII> the sides and roof of the train have airdrag too :-)
21:21:09  *** |Jeroen| [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
21:21:24  <Gonozal_VIII> long train, more drag
21:21:43  <Belugas> somehow, i doubt it has much impact
21:21:51  <Gonozal_VIII> but it has
21:21:58  <Belugas> iirc, the train makes some kind of a tunnel
21:22:07  <Belugas> and on the other hand...
21:22:16  <Belugas> it's a realistic stuff
21:22:17  <Belugas> thus
21:22:19  <Belugas> boooo!
21:22:23  <Gonozal_VIII> ^^
21:22:28  <Belugas> not so realistic either :S
21:24:29  <Eddi|zuHause2> air drag is really unimportant for speeds <100km/h
21:25:42  <Eddi|zuHause2> which is why the streamlining of steam engines often got removed... the saving in fuel did not match up with the more difficult maintenance
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21:26:55  <Vikthor> On the other hand it is essential for HST
21:27:16  *** NukeBuster [] has joined #openttd
21:27:57  <Gonozal_VIII> like the vacuum maglev that melts away if the tube breaks :-)
21:28:53  <Eddi|zuHause2> yes, air drag is cubic in terms of speed, so double speed means 8 times air drag
21:31:06  <Gonozal_VIII>
21:33:41  <Gonozal_VIII> airdrag is already more than the rest at 100 km/h there
21:38:09  <Eddi|zuHause2> there are many facts missing about that picture...
21:38:31  <Eddi|zuHause2> but it does support my point, it is unimportant with speeds < 100km/h
21:38:47  <Gonozal_VIII> i know that it is
21:38:57  <Gonozal_VIII> but modern trains are faster than that
21:39:52  <valhalla1w> massenbeschleunigung?
21:40:01  <Gonozal_VIII> mass acceleration
21:40:07  <valhalla1w> ah right
21:40:17  <valhalla1w> strange graph then :D
21:40:18  <Gonozal_VIII> with the right brakes, you should be able to get most of that back
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21:40:43  <valhalla1w> I mean, air resisitance is a force and the energy is dependent on the distance travelled
21:40:47  <Eddi|zuHause2> i also don't know what that means...
21:40:57  <valhalla1w> while mass accelleration isnt dependent on the distance
21:41:02  *** valhalla1w is now known as valhallasw
21:41:35  <valhallasw> but I guess this is averaged on a large number of rides?
21:41:53  <Gonozal_VIII> i think that's statistical data for average use
21:43:03  <Gonozal_VIII> i asked a friend of mine that studied physics about the airdrag and he gave me that link
21:43:10  <valhallasw> ah
21:44:21  <Gonozal_VIII> according to him, airdrag over the lenght of the train is only bad if there's for example a container wagon after a flatbed...
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21:45:15  <Eddi|zuHause2> ever heard of the term "wind shadow"?
21:45:50  <Eddi|zuHause2> it's why ducks always fly in a V formation
21:45:52  <Gonozal_VIII> there are turbulences
21:46:36  <Gonozal_VIII> he also wrote that small turbulences along the sides of the train are good because they prevent big ones
21:46:45  <peter1138> Our 'realistic' acceleration routine sucks.
21:46:50  <Eddi|zuHause2> turbulences only have an effect if you try to stay in course
21:47:10  <Eddi|zuHause2> which is only relevant for planes
21:47:15  <Gonozal_VIII> they drag a lot of air along
21:47:48  * Belugas prepares Zirkos real acceleration "fine tuning" for commit ;)
21:48:06  <SpComb> hooking up all the coal mines on a 512x512 map to a given power station isn't that trivial
21:48:11  <Eddi|zuHause2> is that the one that removes max speed?
21:48:14  <SpComb> takes a fair few hours
21:48:32  <valhallasw> Gonozal_VIII: yes, that sounds reasonable.
21:48:44  <valhallasw> trains are fairly wind-resistance-efficient anyway
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21:49:24  <valhallasw> as they are long objects without too big parts inbetween (except when coupling a container car to a flatbed of course)
21:49:28  <SpComb> although OpenTTD's lack of PBS really hurts
21:49:46  <Gonozal_VIII> use yapp
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21:52:14  <Belugas> and/or wait for it to eventually (and mostly surely) be in trunk
21:52:38  <Gonozal_VIII> then hurry up with 0.6.0 release :P
21:52:45  <SpComb> although I gather YAPP works quite differently from TTDPatch's PBS
21:52:52  *** Ammlller [] has joined #openttd
21:53:07  <Belugas> well... it is still a PBS
21:53:25  <Belugas> and it is my time to leave home
21:53:27  <Belugas> good night
21:53:41  <Gonozal_VIII> yapp is actually very easy to understand... it's only difficult because you can't build signals like you're used to
21:53:43  <Eddi|zuHause2> leave _to_ home?
21:54:00  <Eddi|zuHause2> YAPP signals are much more natural
21:54:06  <Gonozal_VIII> yes
21:54:27  *** Ammller [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
21:54:45  *** Jezral is now known as TinoDidriksen
21:55:02  <Gonozal_VIII> but if you place them like you used to place the normal signals, you get deadlocks everywhere
22:01:01  <globester> yes i've noticed :(
22:01:19  <globester> still trying to figure them out
22:02:16  <Eddi|zuHause2> it's so easy...
22:02:33  <Eddi|zuHause2> wherever you would normally put an exit signal, you place no signal at all
22:02:53  <peter1138> CUNNING
22:03:15  <ln->
22:03:20  <peter1138> Cunninger than a cunning thing on national cunning day!
22:03:20  <globester> so just one before the junction nothing behind?
22:03:39  <Eddi|zuHause2> exactly
22:04:01  <peter1138> ln-, useful crossing... :o
22:04:15  <globester> what's that entry pbs signal for then?
22:04:23  <peter1138> It's not.
22:04:28  <peter1138> It's a one-way PBS signal.
22:04:31  *** SmatZ [] has joined #openttd
22:04:46  <Gonozal_VIII> nice openttd screenshot ln
22:05:17  <ln-> peter1138: well it's for getting to the platform in the middle.
22:05:45  <Eddi|zuHause2> globester: it forbids the train to go backwards through that signal (like normal one-way signals)
22:05:45  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: glx * r12345 /trunk/src/order_cmd.cpp: -Fix [FS#1828](r12296): don't try to restore backupped timetable when timetabling is disabled
22:05:55  <Gonozal_VIII> bars for people that want to reach a platform? never seen that in rl
22:06:21  <Gonozal_VIII> yay 12345!!!!!
22:06:25  <Eddi|zuHause2> i'd also mention that... it doesn't look realistic
22:06:32  <SpComb> no, it's for the cars
22:06:42  <Gonozal_VIII> cars :S
22:06:47  <Gonozal_VIII> why would cars go there?
22:07:19  <peter1138> To cause train crashes.
22:08:19  <Gonozal_VIII> a car wouldn't even fit between the rails and the crossing bar^^
22:09:23  *** TinoDidriksen [] has quit [Quit:]
22:13:34  <Gonozal_VIII> everybody go watch dokuro-chan
22:14:43  <Eddi|zuHause2> i just finished watching stargate
22:15:06  <Gonozal_VIII> new episode sga :O
22:15:35  <Gonozal_VIII> hmm no... friday
22:16:22  * fjb finished r12344 with YAPP, passsenger destinations and vehicle pools. And it is working. At least at the first glance.
22:16:42  <Gonozal_VIII> hmm yay?^^
22:17:31  <SmatZ> fjb: go for 12345!
22:17:41  <Gonozal_VIII> don't forget to change the savegame version to 91
22:18:37  <fjb> No, not today. r12345 sounds cool, but is not that important to me.
22:18:53  <Patrick`> mm
22:19:11  <glx> fjb: just svn up, it won't conflict
22:19:58  <fjb> glx: Ok, so I'm not finished yet.
22:20:12  <Gonozal_VIII> because 12345 is just a fake revision that glx did because he wanted to have that number
22:20:29  <glx> 12345 is just a 2 lines change in order_cmd
22:20:35  <Gonozal_VIII> see
22:20:56  <glx> but it fixes a bug :)
22:21:02  * SmatZ could commit 1 whitespace change
22:21:02  *** Morloth is now known as Morloth|Pack
22:21:09  <ln-> Morloth|Pack: wtf?
22:21:12  <SmatZ> to be "the 12345 hero"
22:21:18  <ln-> gimme ops
22:21:22  <Morloth|Pack> ln-: I'm packing :)
22:21:22  <Gonozal_VIII> maybe you planned that in advance and planted that bug there :P
22:21:25  <SmatZ> ln-: no way!
22:21:38  <Morloth|Pack> ln-: I'm going to Dublin for a couple of days :)
22:21:39  <ln-> Morloth|Pack: i don't want to know. no one wants to know.
22:21:43  <glx> Gonozal_VIII: was not intended
22:21:58  <ln-> Morloth|Pack: away nicks are bad.
22:22:06  <Morloth|Pack> ln-: you've got a disturbed mindset ;)
22:22:18  <Gonozal_VIII> or you had the fix ready for weeks, just waiting for somebody to commit 12344^^
22:22:22  <glx> so no work on noai?
22:23:05  <Gonozal_VIII> do thay have internet in that dublin place?
22:23:09  <glx> Gonozal_VIII: I don't like fixing my bugs
22:23:22  <fjb> Ok, compiling r12345. :-)
22:23:30  <glx> I try to add bug free code
22:24:02  <Gonozal_VIII> there is no such thing as bug free code
22:24:11  <glx> it was not a fatal one, just annoying
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22:24:32  <Prof_Frink> Oh, adding bug free code is easy
22:24:54  <Prof_Frink> Just make sure it starts with /* and ends with */
22:25:00  <Gonozal_VIII> hehe
22:25:15  <fjb> That will be a bug in Pascal.
22:25:17  <glx> #if 0 ... #endif is safer
22:25:27  <SmatZ> you can make uncompilable code even when it starts with /* and ends with */
22:26:46  <Wolf01> 'night
22:26:50  *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.]
22:28:02  <fjb>  /* ... /* ... */ ... */ thinks like that can lead to errors.
22:28:03  *** divo [] has quit [Quit: Quitting]
22:29:49  <SmatZ> :)   though you will receive compiler warnings
22:30:08  *** Osai [] has joined #openttd
22:31:22  <fjb> Depends on how advanced the compiler is. The VAX C compiler was very advanced.
22:33:45  *** a1270 [] has joined #openttd
22:35:26  <fjb> Gonozal_VIII: Where did you get the vehicle pool patch?
22:35:38  <Gonozal_VIII> peter
22:37:22  *** Chrill [] has joined #openttd
22:37:36  <fjb> Oh. I think I found kind of a bug. A grf reising the base cost raises it for every grf, even if that is in its own pool.
22:38:14  <glx> fjb: happens without this patch too
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22:38:49  <fjb> Yes, I know, but I thought the pools should decouple the grfs.
22:39:04  <glx> base cost is global
22:39:12  <SmatZ> what GRF should it affect if not all?
22:39:24  * SmatZ thinks it is correct behaviour
22:39:27  <SmatZ> *g
22:39:31  * SmatZ shame...
22:39:36  <SmatZ> *k
22:39:39  <SmatZ> :-x
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22:40:38  <fjb> But one GRF toying with the base cost can make the pools mostly useless.
22:41:07  <Gonozal_VIII> then tell the grf authors not to toy with the base costs
22:41:46  <fjb> Then they have trouble to make expensive vehicles. George hat that problem with LV4.
22:43:10  <Eddi|zuHause2> then make the range bigger instead
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22:43:24  <jez9999> I'm having trouble building OpenTTD NoAI
22:43:31  <fjb> That would break the nfo specification.
22:43:49  <glx> jez9999: what kind of troubles?
22:43:50  <Eddi|zuHause2> no, it would extend the NFO specification
22:43:53  <Gonozal_VIII> change the nfo specification :-)
22:43:54  <SmatZ> hello jez9999
22:43:56  <jez9999> hi
22:44:48  <SmatZ> jez9999: what revision is the first you have problems with?
22:44:50  <fjb> Eddi|zuHause2: I don't think that could be easily done in TTDP. But we should ask Dale Stan.
22:45:06  <jez9999> hmm, first im gonna read
22:45:10  <Chrill> - Comments?
22:45:16  <jez9999> OK, i've read that
22:45:23  <jez9999> i dont have any of those editions, i have VS8.0 :-)
22:45:35  <Eddi|zuHause2> fjb: for example there is a standard introduction date, and then there is a long introduction date when the range got extended
22:45:39  <glx> if you can build openttd, you can build noai
22:46:55  <SmatZ> Chrill: what king of comments would you like? Is it North America?
22:47:01  <jez9999> doesnt openTTD use SDL?
22:47:09  <fjb> Eddi|zuHause2: But that would make TTDP and OpenTTD incompatible. And TTDP is the reference for GRFs.
22:47:15  <glx> not required for windows
22:47:18  <Chrill> It's a random map. More like, suggestions for improvements, or if it's looking good so far, SmatZ
22:47:27  <jez9999> isnt SDL much more lightweight than the whole directX sdk?
22:47:29  <jez9999> i'd rather use it :-)
22:47:36  <Eddi|zuHause2> fjb: no, the grf spec is the reference for grfs
22:48:07  <glx> jez9999: sdl is just a wrapper over GDI or DX
22:48:22  <fjb> Eddi|zuHause2: But TTDP is the reference implementation. At least nobody will use it if it doesn't work in TTDP.
22:49:04  <Patrick`> TTDP is the reference but they keep changing the code to make it incompatible with us
22:49:04  <Eddi|zuHause2> fjb: but that is the problem of TTDP, not of the grf spec
22:49:23  <glx> Patrick`: that's wrong
22:49:44  <fjb> I don't think you can decouple TTDP and the grf spec.
22:49:47  <Patrick`> oh, TTDP stopped doing that?
22:50:00  <Eddi|zuHause2> fjb: nobody asked for that
22:50:47  <glx> the grf specs are quite stable
22:50:56  <fjb> We can ask Dale Stan what he thinks about your idea if he comes online.
22:52:35  *** peter1138 [] has quit [Quit: sleep]
22:54:11  <fjb> @seen dale
22:54:11  <DorpsGek> fjb: I have not seen dale.
22:54:24  <fjb> @seen Dale_stan
22:54:24  <DorpsGek> fjb: I have not seen Dale_stan.
22:54:34  <fjb> How is his nick?
22:54:45  <glx> Dalestan
22:55:02  <glx> but is on vacation
22:55:37  <fjb> Then we have to wait till he comes back.
22:56:59  <fjb> There is more than one GRF that has to chage the base cost or even uses base costs of other vehicle classes.
22:57:07  <jez9999> is the plan eventually to merge openttd noAI into the main branch?
22:57:37  <fjb> Would a bigger range for vehicle costs be hard to implement in OpenTTD?
22:58:06  <glx> jez9999: it's far from finished
22:58:09  <jez9999> for me that would really complete openTTD
22:58:20  <jez9999> having all the current patches and the customizable AI
22:58:32  <jez9999> kinda makes the game as it ideally would have been in the first place :-)  really fun to play
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22:58:55  <Eddi|zuHause2> "all the patches" will hardly get in
22:59:29  <Eddi|zuHause2> fjb: i guess it would be quite easy
22:59:54  <jez9999> i meant the ones currently in the main branch
22:59:57  <jez9999> just them and noAI
23:00:35  <jez9999> (now it also has customizable faces :-D)
23:00:47  <Eddi|zuHause2> the "main branch" does not have any patches
23:00:58  <jez9999> eh?
23:01:45  <Eddi|zuHause2> the "main branch" is the main reference, like the name suggests... all "patches" have to be relative to that
23:02:10  *** Zavior [] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
23:02:10  <jez9999> it has a 'configure patches' area; that's what i mean
23:02:24  <Eddi|zuHause2> that is a big misnomer ;)
23:02:33  <jez9999> not really
23:02:42  <jez9999> they are patches... on the original reverse-engineered ttd code
23:02:43  <Gonozal_VIII> are you trying to make up for the lack of dalestan eddi?
23:03:05  <Eddi|zuHause2> i have always said that...
23:03:55  *** Axamentia [] has joined #openttd
23:04:06  <glx> I called them "advanced configuration" in french
23:04:26  <glx> that's what it should be
23:04:48  <Gonozal_VIII> advanced configuration isn't french :-)
23:05:06  <jez9999> well anyway the current config options and noAI
23:05:11  <jez9999> would make it pretty much perfect
23:05:25  <jez9999> of course the track copy/paste stuff in the MiniIN is nice but it almost feels like cheating
23:05:28  <Chrill> BRB
23:05:29  <jez9999> no work to create a cloverleaf :-)
23:05:30  <Eddi|zuHause2> there is no such thing as "perfect"
23:05:43  <Gonozal_VIII> why don't you just use the noai branch? it was synced with trunk not long ago
23:05:49  <ln-> couldn't someone just change the "configure patches" string to something more appropriate once and for all?
23:05:55  <jez9999> im working to get my machine to be able to compile it now
23:05:59  <jez9999> it's a bit involved...
23:06:14  <Patrick`> or at least remove some patch options to a config file
23:06:21  <jez9999> not sure whether this old directx7 SDK will be good enough to compile it
23:06:26  <Patrick`> the list just keeps growing
23:06:35  <jez9999> trouble is, the directx sdk available now is November, which the wiki page says is too late
23:06:38  <jez9999> i need an earlier version
23:06:58  <jez9999> but this version i have is ancient, like 1999
23:07:00  <jez9999> i think
23:07:54  <jez9999> "You should not use a version newer then August 2007 as DirectMusic is no longer support as of the November 2007 release."
23:08:01  <jez9999> so, like, where do i get the Aug 2007 release
23:08:35  <Patrick`> mmm, directmusic
23:08:58  <glx> it is available on msdn
23:09:10  <glx> not easy to find (as often there)
23:09:31  <SmatZ> mmm donuts
23:09:34  <fjb> UKRS or DBset is also changing the base cost. So you can not mix them. Same goes for LV4 and any other road vehicles set.
23:09:39  <jez9999> Validation Required though
23:09:40  <jez9999> :-(
23:09:42  *** Frostregen_ [] has joined #openttd
23:09:48  <jez9999> need a bullsh*t-free download
23:09:54  <mrfrenzy> hmm, I just built 12328 with the copypaste patch using BuildOTTD, why does it get version r12328M?
23:10:46  <Gonozal_VIII> modified
23:10:47  <fjb> M for modified.
23:11:22  <Gonozal_VIII> ah, you mean because it should be able to work with unmodified 12328?
23:11:36  <mrfrenzy> yes, I don't want to have to rebuilt my server
23:11:42  <mrfrenzy> as the patch is completely client side
23:11:42  <Gonozal_VIII> i guess you have to force the version there, but don't ask me, i never did that
23:11:54  *** keyweed_ [] has joined #openttd
23:12:07  <mrfrenzy> it also says on the patch thread it should work with unmodfied server
23:12:08  <jez9999> think i found the August 2007 SDK :-)
23:12:18  *** Frostregen [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:12:22  *** Frostregen_ is now known as Frostregen
23:12:22  <jez9999> as for the MS platform SDK; doesn't it come with CS 2003?
23:12:24  <jez9999> VS 2003?
23:12:26  <mrfrenzy> is this a "feature" of BuildOTTD?
23:12:29  *** Slowpoke_ [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
23:12:36  <jez9999> VS2005 i mean?
23:13:02  <Gonozal_VIII> i don't think that buildottd is able to do that
23:13:32  <mrfrenzy> I mean is it buildottd that added the M automatically?
23:13:40  <Gonozal_VIII> no
23:14:04  <mrfrenzy> if I get the .exe from here it has no M
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23:21:25  <jez9999> installing directX sdk
23:21:32  <jez9999> this is one heck of a heavy load of stuff
23:24:25  <fjb> You could use UNIX and a cross compiling kit.
23:24:45  <jez9999> UNIX?
23:25:39  <glx> you can also disable directmusic in project config
23:25:57  <jez9999> why?  that's the whole reason i downloaded this version of the sdk
23:26:00  <jez9999> i like the music
23:26:15  <glx> you can have the music without direct music :)
23:26:23  <jez9999> then why does the wiki say use the Aug version
23:26:35  <fjb> UNIX, a modern, widely used operating system.
23:26:47  <glx> because MSVC builds can have directmusic
23:26:53  <jez9999> UNIX is an old, rarely-used operating system
23:27:02  <jez9999> actually it's a family of them
23:27:02  <glx> but mingw don't have it
23:27:51  <Gonozal_VIII> hmmm follow_track.cpp is gone
23:28:31  <fjb> UNIX including the BSD branch is widely used today, so are some clones like Linux and AIX.
23:28:50  <glx> (and OSX ;) )
23:28:50  <jez9999> you said UNIX, not clones
23:29:12  <fjb> Gonozal_VIII: Yes, I had the same problem some hous ago.
23:29:34  <fjb> Gonozal_VIII: You have to reintroduce it.
23:30:01  *** dih [] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
23:30:22  <fjb> glx: Ofcourse OSX, half of it is BSD, the other half is the Mach kernel and the graphical user interface.
23:30:36  *** SmatZ [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
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23:33:39  <fjb> Solaris (UNIX Sytem V) is one of the most modern operating sytems.
23:35:03  <Gonozal_VIII> what's that bitshift stuff in rail_cmd.cpp?
23:35:33  <Vikthor> 'night
23:35:44  <Gonozal_VIII> night
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23:36:17  <jez9999> who uses Solaris?
23:36:34  <SpComb> hmm, missing classes because of OpenTTD
23:37:27  <fjb> Gonozal_VIII: cut the << 16 stuff.
23:37:55  <Gonozal_VIII> really?
23:38:02  <Gonozal_VIII> but yapp introduces that...
23:38:03  <fjb> Gonozal_VIII: Trust me
23:38:25  <Gonozal_VIII> and trunk has different names for the trackdirs...
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23:39:30  <fjb> jez9999: A lot of companies and even people on their PCs are using Solaris. And BSD is also widely used.
23:39:42  <jez9999> depends how you define 'a lot', i guess
23:40:04  <Gonozal_VIII> but doesn't matter... i wanted to wait for new yapp version anyways
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23:40:11  <fjb> jez9999: It is always used when you need releiable systems.
23:40:20  <Gonozal_VIII> all the other patches are at 12345 now
23:40:32  <jez9999> woot, MS platform sdk now installed too
23:40:35  <jez9999> HUGE SDKs
23:40:39  <jez9999> seriously massive
23:44:06  <jez9999> ok building
23:44:13  <jez9999> how long does this thing usually take to build from, scratch?
23:44:21  <jez9999> from memory, it's a couple of minutes
23:44:35  <Gonozal_VIII> 5-10 minutes..
23:45:26  <jez9999> ouch
23:45:38  <fjb> Gonozal_VIII: It is not that hard to get YAPP working with current trunk.
23:45:51  <Gonozal_VIII> yes but i want new yapp^^
23:46:28  <fjb> Current YAPP has only few bugs.
23:46:49  <jez9999> what does YAPP stand for?
23:47:01  <Gonozal_VIII> and i talked to vikthor, he will update his stuff today
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23:48:58  <fjb> Yet Another Pbs Patch
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23:49:47  <fjb> I'm voting for separate base costs for every GRF in the pool.
23:50:06  <jez9999> hmm, i've now successfully compiled NoAI
23:50:16  <jez9999> now i need to figure out how to get a custom AI :-)
23:51:10  <fjb> You have to write it.
23:51:36  <jez9999> heh
23:51:48  <jez9999> aren't there any kind of good AIs already written?
23:52:34  <fjb> Don't think so. noAI didn't get released yet and is far from ready yet.
23:53:12  <jez9999> hum
23:53:13  <jez9999> shame
23:53:37  <jez9999> could be fun writing one
23:53:46  <jez9999> probably one of those things that sounds fun, but when you write it it gets boring
23:53:47  <jez9999> :-)
23:53:52  <fjb> You can be the first one who writes a new ai.
23:54:03  <jez9999> nah there are already 2 or 3
23:54:11  <jez9999> wrightAI and overambitiousAI
23:54:20  <Gonozal_VIII> try a train ai
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23:54:46  <jez9999> heh
23:54:57  <glx> Gonozal_VIII: he will need to write the API first ;)
23:55:13  <Gonozal_VIII> nah, he will bug you to write it ;-)
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23:59:51  <fjb> How many vehicles per class are possible with the pools?

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