Log for #openttd on 11th September 2008:
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00:39:30  <Brianetta> Sacro: New section added to Standard Server site
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00:59:42  <ln> did anyone think star wreck was any good?
01:01:26  <TrueBrain> burp
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10:04:47  <Tim> Nobody said anything for about 2 hours now Oo
10:05:05  <Forked> and you ruined that :p
10:05:17  <Tim> Hehe
10:05:21  <TrueBrain> yeah, Tim, boohoo :( We were almost in the guiniss book of records
10:05:36  <Tim> hrhr *evilgrin*
10:10:42  <peter1138> Do I have someone on ignore?
10:10:58  <peter1138> Cos I don't see anything said for 9 hours...
10:11:30  <Tim> dunno, i only joined 2 hours ago
10:11:37  <TrueBrain> peter1138: I also have my 'burp' as latest entry :p
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10:15:35  <Tim> Hm, since we have no topic, what do you think about ?
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11:03:28  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: truebrain * r14287 /branches/noai/src/ai/api/ai_station.cpp: [NoAI] -Fix: AIStation::SetName() always renamed station 0 .. oopsie ;)
11:05:53  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: truebrain * r14288 /branches/noai/src/ai/api/ai_vehicle.cpp: [NoAI] -Fix: AIVehicle::GetLocation() wasn't updated in air for aircrafts (Yexo, based on patch FS#2280)
11:10:07  <FauxFaux> Heh.
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11:37:23  <guru3> anyone have an idea why with array[2][2]; i can't do array[0] = {1, 2}; ?
11:38:59  <jni> you can't use { } and use with assignment, only with init
11:39:07  <guru3> damn
11:39:08  <ln> because C is not PHP.
11:39:13  <guru3> extra lines of code then :<
11:39:41  <Gekz> lol
11:39:47  <Gekz> I love javascript
11:39:59  <Gekz> it's so terrible, try and initialise a multidimensional array
11:40:05  <Gekz> you must loop.
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11:50:48  <ln> welshdra-gone: not interesting
11:52:59  <Doorslammer> Ha haa, wordplay :P
12:02:25  <guru3> bloody hell... does IMG_Load always get the image upside down?
12:05:24  <FauxFaux> boost::assign. ¬_¬
12:05:36  <guru3> referencing from the wrong corner... go figure
12:05:46  * guru3 slaps the pyopengl devs
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12:30:52  <dih> only holds sound, correct?
12:32:39  <dih> if yes, could the need of that file not be made optional and simply disable sound if that file is not there?
12:33:01  <FauxFaux> The game continues to work (normally) with an empty
12:33:05  <FauxFaux> ie. touch
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12:35:36  <Ammler> :-o
12:37:16  <dih> Ammler: is that not unrelated to
12:37:45  <planetmaker> if the only difference is an empty or the original one: obviously not (completely)
12:38:08  <dih> (opengfx grf's?)
12:38:29  <dih> i whish you had played that in german
12:38:39  <dih> then i would at least know if my translation fits in that window :-D
12:38:53  <Ammler> dih: I did on my nightly tests :P
12:39:12  <Ammler> no opengfx
12:39:19  <Ammler> just the
12:39:31  <planetmaker> Ammler: static grfs?
12:39:50  <Ammler> you see that from the fences
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12:41:23  <Ammler> planetmaker: static grfs will be included at the end, so I don't use them... :-)
12:41:48  <Ammler> not well useable with newgrfs
12:42:18  <planetmaker> well, yes. But some people might do nevertheless :)
12:43:14  <planetmaker> but I was just checking :)
12:48:02  <Ammler> planetmaker: checked and I can say definitly no
12:49:08  <planetmaker> :)
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13:00:10  <peter1138> So...
13:03:35  <planetmaker> I can confirm Ammler's observation. Just tested it on my installation with an empty of the same size as the original
13:03:48  <planetmaker> I get the same newgrf error, too and desync also immediately
13:04:52  <peter1138> Do you have multiple original data files?
13:05:03  <planetmaker> peter1138: no.
13:05:03  <peter1138> It might be switching from Windows to DOS or vice versa.
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13:07:00  <dih> planetmaker: empty should not have the same size as the original :-P
13:07:02  <planetmaker> That I don't know. The only debug output I get is a desync one. The only difference is in installation between the two start-ups of OpenTTD is
13:07:16  <planetmaker> dih: it has. spaces and line breaks. I made sure :)
13:07:26  <dih> that is not empty then :-)
13:07:31  <planetmaker> well, yes :P
13:07:35  <peter1138> You generally get more debugging output if you turn debuggin on.
13:07:42  <planetmaker> :) I'll try
13:08:01  <peter1138> Hmm, 552MB copied.
13:08:22  <planetmaker> peter1138: which debugging parameters would you like me to set?
13:08:43  <dih> -d 9
13:08:44  <dih> :-P
13:09:05  <peter1138> That'll do.
13:09:59  <SmatZ> I can't reproduce it
13:10:19  <SmatZ> but maybe that's because I have both DOS and WIN grf files...
13:10:34  <dih> SmatZ: you wanna go swim?
13:11:15  <dih> thought perhaps you'd like to build a pool?
13:11:37  <SmatZ> :-)
13:11:40  <SmatZ> I may try :)
13:12:16  <dih> hihi
13:12:18  * dih hugs SmatZ
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13:15:44  <peter1138> Right, I have a disk image, from using dd...
13:15:49  <peter1138> How do I mount it?
13:15:56  <planetmaker> hm. openttd -d 9 > output.log leaves an empty log file. An idea how to get the debug output into a file then?
13:16:03  <peter1138> Use &>
13:16:06  <Gekz> &>
13:16:12  <Gekz> peter1138: damn you
13:17:14  <penfold> :)
13:17:35  <glx> planetmaker: try 2>
13:17:48  <planetmaker> neither worked :S
13:18:00  <glx> windows?
13:18:06  <planetmaker> everything is still shown in my terminal. And it's history is too short. MacOS 10.4
13:18:22  <Gekz> X.4
13:18:23  <Gekz> lol
13:18:26  <glx> > log 2>&1
13:19:01  <eekee> 10.4 uses ancient bash
13:19:13  <planetmaker> glx^^?
13:19:28  <eekee> glx's way should work
13:19:36  <planetmaker> openttd -d 9 > logfile.log >> & 1
13:19:44  <glx> 2>&1
13:19:54  <glx> redirect error to std
13:20:03  <TinoDidriksen>  >> is append. Can't both > and >> in the same command.
13:21:37  <TinoDidriksen> Ah, yeah, 2> does not mean two >'s...
13:23:06  <planetmaker> err... I guess, I have to ask for the complete command line... sorry :S
13:23:35  <glx> openttd -d 9 > logfile.log 2>&1
13:24:16  <glx> but "openttd -d 9 2>logfile.log" should be enough
13:25:10  <planetmaker> the first line (I tried it before) has NO effect. Nothing's started. No output. Very strange.
13:25:35  <glx> no output is normal as everything is redirected to the file
13:25:46  <planetmaker> well. But OpenTTD isn't started.
13:26:31  <planetmaker> !password
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13:28:03  <planetmaker> :D
13:28:12  <planetmaker> ok... right 3.3 MB log file...
13:29:50  <planetmaker> g2g quickly. will post later
13:35:16  <dih> (./openttd 2>&1) > logfile
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13:55:40  <Eddi|zuHause> <peter1138> Right, I have a disk image, from using dd... <- it'd be easier if you had a partition image
13:56:18  <Eddi|zuHause> but generally, loop devices will get the job done
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13:59:57  <Hassan> I am experiencing problems with getting the server list from the master server in the ingame multyplayer system
14:00:11  <Hassan> It just doesn't show up anything...
14:00:24  <dih> hello to you too Hassan
14:00:30  <Hassan> hi ;)
14:00:32  <dih> i am fine, and how are you?
14:00:40  <Hassan> well no so well :P
14:00:47  <dih> shame
14:01:05  <dih> i would have been better too, had you not just blasted in without greeting etc ;-)
14:01:09  <dih> hehe
14:01:17  <dih> (uh i enjoyed that, thank you Hassan)
14:01:18  <dih> :-P
14:01:20  <Hassan> I will remember that :
14:01:24  <dih> hihi
14:01:42  <dih> did you try visiting ?
14:01:47  <Hassan> yes I have
14:01:57  <Hassan> all servers are listed, and according to that page
14:02:07  <Hassan> no problems should be encountered :D
14:02:45  <dih> you can join servers over the console, command: connect ip:port#company
14:02:53  <dih> where company = 255 means spectator
14:03:08  <Hassan> Lets try that one :)
14:03:11  <dih> where when you start the game from the console
14:03:16  <SmatZ> Hassan: what OTTD version are you using?
14:03:25  <Hassan> 0.6.2
14:03:30  <dih> -n <ip>:<port>#<company>
14:04:31  <Hassan> The console use has succeeded
14:05:06  <dih> enjoy the game
14:05:11  <dih> you are welcome
14:06:14  <Hassan> but i manually did put in the ip of the server in the server list
14:06:22  <Hassan> and it showed me an offline server
14:06:43  <Hassan> might some setting of mine be incorrect?
14:07:19  <yorick> your internet connection.
14:07:36  <yorick> mabe 3979 and 3978 are being blocked?
14:08:05  <Hassan> Hmm good point.. But then it shouldn't have connected to the server I joined now...
14:09:50  <yorick> udp?
14:10:19  <glx> the dropdown is on internet or lan ?
14:10:21  <Hassan> I am unfamiliar with that word
14:10:27  <Hassan> dropdown?
14:10:40  <glx> on top of the server list
14:10:50  <Hassan> internet of course
14:10:50  <Hassan> :)
14:11:12  <yorick> hm, I manage a packet loss of 33/157
14:12:08  <yorick> oh, that's the packets that are not lost
14:12:50  <Hassan> are you experiencing problems also?
14:13:42  <yorick> no, it works the second time
14:14:21  <yorick> after I fixed the query script :-p
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14:16:08  <dih> nessi :-D
14:16:44  <welshdragon> ln, i have used welshdra-gone for a while now, it suprises me you only just noticed it
14:17:04  <yorick> ln?
14:17:48  <welshdragon> * You are now known as welshdra-gone
14:17:48  <welshdragon> <ln> welshdra-gone: not interesting
14:18:10  <welshdragon> i was replying to his comment
14:18:32  <yorick> I don't remember having ln on ignore
14:18:46  <Eddi|zuHause> you just fail.
14:18:52  * yorick unignores ln
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14:20:04  <ln> welshdragon: the point was that it's not interesting that you are gone, therefore don't use away nicks.
14:20:23  <dih> just set /away ;-)
14:20:26  <dih> that's all you need
14:20:27  <ln> indeed
14:20:35  <dih> good clients display that anyway
14:20:52  <ln> and anyone doing a /whois on you sees that you are away.
14:21:08  <dih> + you can set auto reply to private messages when you actually are gone
14:21:18  <dih> so anybody trying to contact you in private can see
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14:21:32  <Hassan> dih, thx for helping me anyway :D
14:21:43  <Hassan> I will reroute some ports I think
14:21:49  <dih> and anybody contacting you in public will quickly notice you are gone, either by the long pause, or by the client side displayed away statys
14:21:54  <Hassan> Bey bey dih (This good enough for you) :P
14:21:56  <welshdragon> dih and ln i have used that for at least 3 months, ask Prof_Frink, ill remember in future to /part before i set that nick in future
14:22:01  <dih> Hassan: :-)
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14:22:29  <dih> where are you _that_ important that others need to know?
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14:22:50  <dih> seriously, it's seldom anything other than trying to appear important or funny
14:23:18  <dih> well - that suits me too :-)
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14:40:59  <Ammler> welshdragon: the problem is, if you like to ignore "rename" spam, you also have to ignore join/parts, at least on my client....
14:42:55  <Ammler> (away nick=rename spam) ;-)
14:44:11  <welshdragon> when are the new zoom levels going to be implemented?
14:44:21  <hylje> /ignore * NICKS -pattern "(afk|zzz|off)"
14:44:31  <Eddi|zuHause> welshdragon: they don't
14:44:47  <welshdragon> Eddi|zuHause, oh?
14:45:11  <welshdragon> is being used anymore?
14:45:42  <Eddi|zuHause> it's been decided that at most one further zoom level might come. anything more than that won't fit the game style (especially vehicle movement)
14:46:20  <welshdragon> aah
14:47:48  <welshdragon> they look very simcityesque
14:47:54  <eekee> 15:30:35 < ib> lalo, 42 is the answer to everything except "how many make jobs  do you want?"
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14:56:16  <Rubidium> isn't that the adviced number of jobs for a 19.5 core CPU?
14:57:04  <Gekz> you cant have half a core
14:57:35  <TrueBrain> give me a saw and I show you
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14:58:01  <Rubidium> Gekz: but a Celeron is half a core of a Pentium 4
14:58:23  <Gekz> it's not half a core at all.
14:58:37  <TrueBrain> get a saw and yuo can give Gekz a half of a core
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14:59:15  <TrueBrain> Gekz: why are you stil lhere?
14:59:20  <Gekz> TrueBrain: you have Romance language tendencies
14:59:25  <Gekz> but your native language isnt a romance language
14:59:29  <Gekz> it's quite amusing :)
14:59:30  <TrueBrain> me caesar!
14:59:51  <Belugas> hoo... Gekz likes romance :)
14:59:52  <TrueBrain> you nero
14:59:53  <TrueBrain> you burn
15:00:00  * Belugas sends flowers and poems to Gekz :D
15:00:06  <Gekz> I have a girlfriend Belugas
15:00:10  <Gekz> I dont need you anymore
15:00:13  <Gekz> :>
15:00:13  <TrueBrain> Gekz: and he has a wife, so?
15:00:36  <Gekz> my point was proven in the second line
15:00:42  <dih> a reason, no hinderance.
15:01:28  <Gekz> well, anywho
15:01:30  <Gekz> good night :)
15:01:30  <Eddi|zuHause> nero doesn't burn here... k3b does ;)
15:03:38  <Eddi|zuHause> am i the only person that did not get what he meant with "romance language tendencies"?
15:04:40  <peter1138> Half a core of a Pentium 4? But a Pentium 4 only had one core... Or maybe that's the point.
15:05:57  *** stillunknown [] has joined #openttd
15:06:49  <TrueBrain> Eddi|zuHause: I tried to ignore it :p
15:07:24  <Rubidium> peter1138: a Celeron is a P4 with broken caches etc. disabled, basically they're failed P4s
15:07:47  <Brianetta> With the possible exception of the mobile version
15:08:14  <Brianetta> which is a P4 where they did without all those caches to make the thing small
15:08:17  <Belugas> i guess he meant romane, instead
15:08:35  <Belugas> like coming from latin
15:08:43  <Brianetta> Romance
15:09:05  * Belugas googles
15:09:13  <Eddi|zuHause> i'd have said "romanic", but still, the statement makes absolutely no sense
15:09:27  <Brianetta> Romance means "of Rome" and in linguistics refers to languages including French, Spanish, Portuguese, Italian and Romanian
15:10:08  <Belugas> mmh
15:10:09  <Belugas> right
15:10:15  <Brianetta> In western Europe, the other languages tend to be Germanic ones, including German, English, Dutch and all those scandie ones.
15:10:27  <Belugas> i have to agree with Eddi|zuHause, "Romanic" sounds better
15:10:45  <peter1138> It's not the right word, though.
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15:11:27  <Eddi|zuHause> Brianetta: yes, i know language classifications, but that does not give any further sense to the statement
15:12:19  <Brianetta> Probably referring to that post you made on the forum
15:12:33  <Brianetta> about capitalisation
15:12:46  <Brianetta> to be perfectly honest, he didn't make a lot of sense to me, either
15:12:52  <Eddi|zuHause> how does that fit in?
15:13:05  <Brianetta> At a guess
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15:13:40  <Brianetta> Latin, being the Romance progenitor, only had capitals for carved legibility.
15:13:50  *** Dr_Jekyll [] has joined #openttd
15:14:27  <Eddi|zuHause> the german capitalisation rules are not that old...
15:15:26  <Brianetta> They're also brilliant
15:15:43  <Eddi|zuHause> german bible translator Martin Luther is said to have made that rule widespread
15:15:55  <Brianetta> Capitalising all Nouns makes it so much easier to parse a Sentence
15:16:03  <Brianetta> Time flies like an Arrow
15:16:11  <Brianetta> Fruit Flies like a Banana
15:16:16  *** extraPrima [] has joined #openttd
15:16:19  <extraPrima> hallo
15:16:31  <Eddi|zuHause> all objects that were created by god got one capital letter
15:16:40  <Belugas> Like Herod
15:16:57  <Kloopy> Big Breasts?
15:16:58  <peter1138> I hate him!
15:17:11  <Kloopy> You hate Herod? He probably would say the same thing about you. :(
15:17:20  *** Eddi|zuHause [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
15:17:26  <extraPrima> i need some nice mods for citys bridges and trian stations
15:17:32  <Brianetta> TschÌß, Eddi....
15:17:35  <peter1138> He would.
15:17:40  *** Eddi|zuHause [] has joined #openttd
15:17:45  <extraPrima> some that look a kind of "real"
15:17:56  <Ammler> extraPrima: ask Belugas
15:17:57  <extraPrima> can you show me some?
15:18:02  <Brianetta>
15:18:04  <peter1138>
15:18:06  <peter1138> Damn you :o
15:18:07  <Brianetta> That's a great place
15:18:20  <peter1138> Belugas, when are you seeing them?
15:19:23  <Aylomen> Try total bridge renewal set, if you want bridges
15:19:28  <extraPrima> ok
15:19:45  <Belugas> peter1138 : 23 of september :)
15:19:55  <peter1138> :D
15:20:03  <Belugas> tick tock time marches on and on!
15:20:35  <Belugas> and guess who's next on the list?
15:20:36  <Belugas> NIN!
15:21:10  <extraPrima> does dbset work together with other sets such as total brigde renewal
15:21:11  <extraPrima> ?
15:21:16  <Eddi|zuHause> yes
15:21:33  <peter1138> Hehe
15:21:56  <Eddi|zuHause> just using several sets of the same kind will get you in trouble, like two trainsets, or two roadsets
15:22:29  <extraPrima> ok
15:22:42  <extraPrima> now a have new trains and new bridges
15:22:52  <extraPrima> just need nice cities
15:22:55  * peter1138 puts CODY on.
15:23:16  * Belugas follows :)
15:23:30  <Aylomen> Total Town replacement or that American Town Set, don't know, waht it is called
15:24:00  <Aylomen> but look at grf crawler, there are many nice sets
15:24:04  * Belugas fails to follow
15:24:12  <Belugas> damned song's at home :(
15:24:13  <Belugas> grrr
15:24:27  <extraPrima> thats the prob
15:24:33  <extraPrima> there are too many
15:24:34  <extraPrima> :D
15:24:39  <Aylomen> try them all ;)
15:24:48  <Eddi|zuHause> two house sets should be fine
15:24:50  <Belugas> but one at a time...
15:25:00  <Belugas> in order to spot the difference ;)
15:25:02  <Eddi|zuHause> two station sets are definitely fine
15:25:09  <Belugas> AND NOT MIDGAME!
15:25:39  <Eddi|zuHause> two industry sets are only fine if they are designed to cooperate with each other
15:25:44  *** sunkan [] has quit [Quit: - nbs-irc 2.36 - -]
15:25:59  <Aylomen> station sets I always have all on
15:27:42  <Belugas> damned... CODY is not even on my cell phone
15:27:43  <Belugas> boo!!
15:29:02  <Eddi|zuHause> there are still the intartubes
15:29:17  <extraPrima> ok
15:29:23  <extraPrima> I'll try some
15:30:29  <Aylomen> or just download the openttdcoop grf package and you have the most important ones
15:30:41  <extraPrima> link pls
15:30:49  <Aylomen> öhm...
15:31:02  <Eddi|zuHause>
15:31:07  <Aylomen>
15:31:41  <extraPrima> t h x
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15:37:18  <Chris82> good evening guys :)
15:37:38  <Chris82> I just got the latest trunk revision via SVN (r14289) and I have a strange problem with it
15:38:00  <peter1138> It has a green lump on the end of its penis?
15:38:01  <Chris82> when I try to start the game it says "Failed to find a graphics set. Please acquire a graphics set for OpenTTD."
15:38:34  <dih> Chris82: hi
15:38:35  <Belugas> did it worked before?
15:38:39  <dih> long long long long time no see
15:38:59  <yorick> try converting your obg files to windows/linux
15:39:12  <yorick> but svn should have done that...
15:39:16  <Chris82> hehe yep
15:39:31  <Chris82> well it worked with ChrisIN-R2 which is 11xxx something
15:39:43  <Chris82> haven't tried any newer versions except that buggy Russian patch pack and that worked too
15:39:48  <Chris82> but latest trunk doesn't work
15:40:03  <yorick> is it a svn checkout?
15:40:11  <Chris82> yes
15:40:16  <Chris82> what are these .obg files?
15:40:25  <Chris82> I copied the three .grfs from the data dir to my openttd dir
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15:41:17  <Chris82> lol ok didn't figure I have to copy the .obg files to the openttd/data dir as well :p
15:41:20  <Chris82> now it works :D
15:41:37  <yorick> :->
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15:43:25  <Chris82> just wanted to compile a small patchpack that's multiplayer save because the last ChrisIN doesn't have all the nice features from current trunk :D
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15:43:53  <yorick> but trunk doesn't have all the nice features from ChrisIN
15:44:21  <Bjarni> however the trunk is somewhat more bugfree
15:44:28  <ln> B!
15:44:37  <Bjarni> or at least known bugs are more likely to be fixed
15:44:38  <yorick> J!
15:44:51  <Chris82> yorick: thus the patchpack
15:45:06  <Chris82> I will just add daylength, distant join stations and stuff I use really frequently
15:45:16  <yorick> cargodest.
15:45:21  <Chris82> I am just coding a new daypatch seems to have gotten much simpler with current trunk
15:45:37  <ln> Bjarni: there's some issue with OS X version crashing, and Rubidium suspected it is because of the locale detection code. his evidence was that Bjarni has messed with the code.
15:45:49  <Bjarni> :s
15:45:55  <ln> (see the logs to confirm that)
15:46:13  <Bjarni> is there a bug report somewhere?
15:47:07  <Chris82> would it be bad to replace "Money GetDisplayRunningCost() const { return (this->GetRunningCost() >> 8); }" in vehicle_base.h line 440 with something along "Money GetDisplayRunningCost() const { return (this->GetRunningCost() >> 8) * _veh_runcost_factor; }"
15:47:19  <Chris82> this way I could adjust the gui with just one line :)
15:47:50  <yorick> try ;)
15:47:51  <Chris82> at least if that does what I think it does *g*
15:47:56  <ln> Bjarni: dunno.  and indeed there was no other indication that it would be related to locale detection in any way.
15:52:39  <peter1138> ...
15:52:51  <peter1138> Copy files to run OpenTTD? It all works in-place for me...
15:54:29  <peter1138> Bjarni, the issue was compile-time detection of OS X version... which clearly can't work if a binary is to work on 10.3 up to 10.5...
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16:02:42  <yorick> hm, my happiness just left, and now nothing else can come in
16:02:45  * yorick feels empty
16:02:57  * SmatZ fills yorick
16:02:59  <peter1138> :o
16:03:06  <peter1138> Get a room for that.
16:03:10  <SmatZ> :)
16:03:11  <Chris82> was there a wiki somewhere what the different patch settings like NC, MS, 0 etc. mean?
16:03:34  <yorick> I can't even leave the room
16:03:47  <yorick> Chris82: yes, there is
16:04:29  <yorick>
16:04:53  <yorick> NC = without thousand separators
16:04:59  <yorick> MS = multi-string
16:05:02  <Chris82> thx
16:05:05  <yorick> NO = network_only
16:05:12  <yorick> CR = currency
16:05:21  <yorick> N = no network sync
16:05:29  <yorick> S = no save or network sync
16:05:42  <yorick> C = don't save in openttd.cfg
16:05:49  <yorick> 0 = default
16:06:09  <peter1138> But we don't have patches any more ;)
16:06:21  <yorick> lets rename the article
16:06:33  <yorick> or page
16:07:14  <peter1138> OH! HOW THE DOGS STACK UP
16:07:24  <yorick> they cant go through my door either
16:07:51  <Eddi|zuHause> let's rename everything back to "patches" :p
16:08:02  <peter1138> Yeah, I was used to patches...
16:08:29  <Chris82> uhm how is it called now if not patch?
16:08:35  <Chris82> Add-On or Plug-In ?
16:08:38  <yorick> advanced setting
16:08:47  <Chris82> ahhh ;)
16:08:48  <Eddi|zuHause> they were never patches at all
16:09:06  <Eddi|zuHause> same as they are not addons or plugins
16:09:22  <Chris82> I think you can call them all that, it's just not a bugfix :D
16:09:38  <yorick> lets name them something nonexistant, a patting or something
16:09:42  <hylje> a pony
16:09:56  <FauxFaux> :D
16:10:09  <yorick> FAUX!
16:10:24  <yorick> or a satch
16:11:18  <yorick> satch is shorther than patch
16:13:29  <SpComb> is still the most recent cargo-dest?
16:13:38  <glx> no
16:14:34  <SpComb>
16:14:36  <glx> <-- this one is
16:15:43  <FauxFaux> JINX
16:17:17  <Chris82> uhm how can I "access" patch settings
16:17:22  <Chris82> doesn't work anymore
16:17:35  <Chris82> and doesn't work either
16:18:18  <glx>
16:18:18  <Eddi|zuHause> _setings_game.<type>.<name>
16:18:32  <Chris82> ah ok :) thx
16:18:46  <Eddi|zuHause> or _settings_client
16:19:35  <Bjarni> ln: any idea of when this crashing issue was discussed?
16:20:30  <ln> Bjarni: on monday or something
16:20:58  <Bjarni> and nobody posted a bug report to inform me?
16:21:06  <Bjarni> what a great bunch of guys you all are :P
16:21:33  <Bjarni> it took you 3 days to inform me of a crashing bug that you expect me to fix
16:22:02  <glx> 2 days ago
16:22:18  <glx> [17:55:50] <@Rubidium> LilDood: the best you can do is post a bug report on flyspray that the 0.6.2 release doesn't work on 10.3 and that the nightlies do
16:22:24  <glx> from my logs
16:23:19  <SpComb> Logs:
16:23:19  <Bjarni> !logs
16:25:19  <Bjarni> found it
16:26:36  <Rubidium> Bjarni: I'm not going to post bugreports of things I can't reproduce myself as we then still can't tell whether the issue is fixed or not because the reporter is unknown
16:28:09  <peter1138> Well, we informed you now ;)
16:28:20  * welshdragon thought of a nice addition  for buses, but is unsure whether it would be any good
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16:31:16  <welshdragon> have a feature that lets you use a destination baord type feature, that appears alongside the name window, and you can set the destinations in the orders window
16:31:39  <Chris82> build_vehicle_gui.cpp line 185 .... cunning should be running I think :)
16:31:46  <welshdragon> and any buses that are going to the depot can display not in service
16:35:39  <Bjarni> I think I will ignore this crash report until I have access to some fully working 10.3 and 10.4 again
16:35:46  *** |Jeroen| [] has joined #openttd
16:36:13  <Bjarni> either that or some guy who will actually test what I tell him/send him
16:36:24  <Chris82> what was the difference between static and static inline again?
16:37:04  *** yorick [] has quit [Quit: I guess it has to do with the name! Poef!]
16:38:02  <Rubidium> not much more than that the latter suggests the compiler to inline the function
16:39:33  <Forked> meep meep
16:42:51  <SpComb> oh noes, cargodest-desyncs :(
16:43:53  <Ammler> SpComb: we have a stable server at
16:44:03  <SpComb> running what revision?
16:44:05  <Ammler> should be latest version
16:44:09  * Ammler check...
16:44:25  <Ammler> Game version is hc23c4457
16:44:27  <SpComb> this is ac3014e37a77
16:44:31  <Chris82> I am off for today, bye bye
16:44:37  <Ammler> so it isn't :-)
16:45:05  <SpComb> "unknown revision 'hc23c4457'"
16:45:09  <SpComb> where did you pull from?
16:46:04  <blathijs> SpComb: Remove the "h"
16:46:08  <Ammler> SpComb: we running the server with latest nightly build :-)
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16:46:38  <SpComb> right, silly indeed, h is hardly a valid hex char
16:46:39  <Ammler>
16:47:57  <SpComb> ac3014e37a77 is more recent (Tue Sep 09 07:39:08 2008 +0200) than c23c4457 (Sun Sep 07 18:02:58 2008 +0200)
16:48:04  <blathijs> SpComb: It took me a week or so to draw that conclusions for a kernel revision some time ago (but then with the "g" of git)
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16:48:44  <SpComb> heh
16:48:53  <SpComb> the tools should complain about those :)
16:49:06  <SpComb> well, I'll try downgrading to c23c4457
16:49:18  <Ammler> the "h" is from openttd :-)
16:49:30  <blathijs> SpComb: It's not just hashes that are valid revisions, of course
16:50:12  <SpComb> is "h...." ever a valid hg revision?
16:50:55  <Ammler> like "r...."
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16:52:13  <Ammler> if you want, we can start a new game at ...
16:52:14  <planetmaker> back
16:52:21  <FauxFaux> SpComb: One assumes it's hex.
16:52:45  <SpComb> Ammler: I have my own server and my own co-op game with a friend :)
16:52:54  *** [com]buster [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:53:08  <planetmaker> glx: the log which I created with the empty, is it still useful or was some further insight obtained meanwhile?
16:53:08  <Ammler> SpComb: :-(
16:53:14  <Ammler> :-P
16:53:16  <SpComb> const char _openttd_revision[] = "-e hac3014e3";
16:53:24  <SpComb> lolwut?
16:53:35  <hylje> magic
16:53:36  <glx> weird echo
16:53:44  <glx> fixed in trunk
16:53:44  <blathijs> That would be my fault, though I think SmatZ fixed that
16:54:08  <blathijs> SpComb: Yes, if I create a tag that has the name "h...."
16:54:13  <Ammler> planetmaker: you reported already?
16:54:16  <SpComb> oh, tags are revisions
16:54:23  <blathijs> SpComb: At least that's the case on git, I don't know hg well
16:54:36  <planetmaker> Ammler: I did nothing since getting the log. Had to leave immediately due to RL right then.
16:54:57  <Ammler> log of?
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16:55:25  <planetmaker> what openttd -d 9 tells us when desyncing with the "empty" on our PS.
16:56:01  <Belugas> i doubt they can tell you anything
16:56:02  <Eddi|zuHause> i hate my wireless mouse cable...
16:56:35  <Ammler> yeah, empty sample cat is silent, so it can't talk anymore :P
16:57:03  <Belugas> hehehe
16:57:09  <Ammler> Eddi|zuHause: batteries and heavy weight
16:57:46  <Eddi|zuHause> batteries i have, but the cable for charging the batteries is broken, it does not charge properly
16:58:22  <Ammler> planetmaker: what does it "tell"?
16:58:51  <planetmaker> Ammler: 3.3 MB plaintext file...
16:58:59  <SpComb> hmm... why does OpenTTD think that this is rev ac3014e3
16:59:10  <Ammler> planetmaker: ok, :-D
16:59:11  <SpComb> tip=ac3014e3, but my working copy is c23c445783d6
16:59:25  <Ammler> SpComb: only first 8 chars
16:59:35  <SpComb> still, different
16:59:40  <Ammler> you might forgot hg up?
16:59:51  <hylje> maybe it doesn't count working copies as the current version
17:00:00  <SpComb> I specifically did `hg up -r c23c4457`
17:00:17  <planetmaker> I correct myself. 32MB.
17:00:27  <Ammler> indeed, you already pulled more :-)
17:03:48  <SpComb>         HASH=`LC_ALL=C hg tip 2>/dev/null | head -n 1 | cut -d: -f3 | cut -c1-8`
17:03:50  <SpComb> faaaail
17:03:58  <SpComb> working copy != tip
17:04:44  <blathijs> I just copy pasted that from the Makefile :-)
17:05:02  <blathijs> tip is the tip of the current branch, but you can have another rev checked out?
17:06:23  <SpComb> sure, you can `hg up` yourself to something older than tip
17:06:51  <blathijs> How to find the checked out rev, then?
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17:07:59  <SpComb> I suspect it might be the first row of `hg parents`
17:08:03  <SpComb> bah, another desync
17:14:27  <Belugas> how was the desynching made ?
17:14:40  <Belugas> was it a simple file no byte?
17:15:40  <Ammler> Belugas: touch
17:16:05  <Ammler> but I didn't find a 2. server yet. it only desyncs at coop ps.
17:16:41  <Eddi|zuHause> did coop ever do a ship only game? :p
17:16:47  <Ammler> works also with 0.6.2
17:17:08  *** Aylomen [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:17:55  <Ammler> might it be possible, there is a newgrf, which does use sounds?
17:18:33  <FauxFaux> Eddi|zuHause: Oh, that'd be heart.
17:18:33  <SpComb> hmm... if the version-detection fails like that, would that be a good explanation for the persistent desyncs?
17:18:43  <Belugas> ammler, sorry, i have no idea what yu are talking about -> touch
17:19:21  <Belugas> [13:17] <Ammler> might it be possible, there is a newgrf, which does use sounds?  <-- yes, absolutely piossible
17:19:21  <Ammler> Belugas: that's how I created the empty
17:19:30  <Belugas> grrrrr
17:19:39  <Belugas> DEFINE touch !
17:20:00  <Ammler> it creates a file with 0 byte size
17:20:08  <Belugas> ok
17:20:12  <Belugas> thanks
17:20:26  <Ammler> sorry, thought, that is a common used tool :-)
17:20:27  <Eddi|zuHause> touch --help
17:20:30  <Eddi|zuHause> [...]
17:20:31  <Eddi|zuHause> Eine DATEI, die nicht existiert, wird leer angelegt.
17:20:51  <Belugas> so it means that right form the start, there is a lot of differences in the internals.  the list is not the same
17:21:50  <planetmaker> Belugas: for my test, I created a file the same size as the original, containing spaces and line breaks.
17:21:53  <blathijs> t/win 21
17:21:56  <blathijs> woops
17:22:19  <Belugas> planetmaker, there are verifications of the internal structure of the file upi loading
17:22:35  <planetmaker> yes, OpenTTD rightfully proclaims that it is corrupted.
17:22:44  <Belugas> if it's incompatible or empty, it gives the same result
17:22:45  <Eddi|zuHause> isn't a binary file? spaces and linebreaks won't do a lot of good with that
17:23:11  <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause: but should it change the length of vehicles? In my understanding it contains sound...
17:23:27  <Belugas> bring a decent, one with 73  sounds, and you willnot have problems
17:23:33  <Belugas> even if it's not th original one
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17:24:13  <Belugas> what is the relation with vehicle length???
17:24:19  <planetmaker> :) Well. I don't know.
17:24:21  <Ammler> that is the error msg.
17:24:34  <planetmaker> you got the image, Ammler^^
17:24:35  <Belugas> ho... just... saying stufff in thin air.. I see hehhe
17:24:45  <Ammler>
17:25:09  *** Rexxars [~rexxars@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:25:10  <Ammler> after that, you will be kicked with desync
17:25:12  <yorick> there is an error in that message
17:25:18  <planetmaker> Also: with broken sound I wouldn't expect a desync.
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17:26:08  <Fantasya> Hi guys :)
17:26:55  <SmatZ> hi guy
17:26:56  <Belugas> Ammler, looks like a general message related to callbacks and all
17:28:20  <Ammler> I could imagine, a newgrf likes to use a sound sample and you get that because there is no real
17:28:44  <planetmaker> hm, yeah. Maybe.
17:29:14  <Belugas> has anyone tried to search where that message comes from?
17:29:17  <Ammler> we could now grep our newgrfs for that sound actions
17:29:18  <planetmaker> Background was to test whether we could do without sound, so that - given OpenGFX - there could be a completely free OpenTTD :)
17:29:28  <planetmaker> Belugas: I have a 32MB log file...
17:29:41  <planetmaker> ... but to me it plainly tells nothing.
17:29:52  <Belugas> and i have a one line grep result telling me the same :P
17:30:01  <planetmaker> sync ?
17:30:08  <planetmaker> :P
17:30:30  <Ammler> Belugas: fixeable?
17:30:33  <planetmaker> If it's helpful, I can try to upload it somewhere or extract some parts.
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17:30:51  <Belugas> Ammler, of course: get the right file :P
17:30:58  <planetmaker> :)
17:31:43  <Belugas> void CheckTrainsLengths()  <--  this is where the problem triggers the message
17:31:52  <Belugas> it smells like a callback has failed,
17:32:01  <Belugas> making the lenght of the train wrong
17:32:15  <Belugas> the acvllback failed maybe because of the absence of the proper sound
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17:33:33  <Ammler> we use UKRS there, smells like another NewGRF "forced" bug of ??? :-)
17:33:51  <Belugas> there is no bug if yuo are using the proper file
17:34:03  <Ammler> missfeature?
17:34:07  <Belugas> it sounds like own inflected one
17:34:12  <Eddi|zuHause> Ammler: UKRS has newsounds, if the original sounds are missing, the newsounds get at the wrong place, and everything gets confused
17:34:16  <Belugas> not missfeature
17:34:26  <Belugas> FUCKING THE SYSTEM!
17:34:36  <Ammler> :-P
17:35:09  <planetmaker> :D
17:35:25  <planetmaker> a fuck a day keeps the madness away :P
17:35:30  <Ammler> maybe it is possible, grf coder can detect that and if no available disable newsounds?
17:35:40  <Belugas> lol
17:35:52  <peter1138> I don't see why a callback result would be dependent on sounds...
17:36:18  <Belugas> that is what i try to find, right now
17:36:42  <Eddi|zuHause> i have no idea either...
17:38:44  <peter1138> Clearly it is to spite Ammler  :D
17:39:17  <Ammler> indeed.
17:39:34  <Fantasya> where can I get yorick's patch?
17:39:41  <yorick> not here
17:40:32  <Eddi|zuHause> where can i find out my current DNS settings?
17:40:37  <peter1138> cat /etc/resolv.conf
17:40:43  <Belugas> Fantasya, why? are you suicidal??
17:41:02  <Fantasya> ?
17:41:13  <Fantasya> why?
17:41:17  <Belugas> Ammler, have you been able to isolate the grf that causes it?
17:41:32  <Belugas> Fantasya, i would not trust his patches at all ;)
17:41:38  <Ammler> shall I try with UKRS?
17:41:47  <Ammler> I joined around 10 servers
17:41:48  <peter1138> Try without, then try with.
17:41:58  <Ammler> every server was ok, just ps faild
17:42:02  <Ammler> and we have UKRS there
17:44:08  <Bjarni> <Chris82> what was the difference between static and static inline again? <-- static will be inlined if only one call is made but it's more likely to be a function if it's called a lot. If inline is used then it will be inline except if it's not possible (like recursive calls)
17:44:15  *** Sacro_ [~Ben@adsl-87-102-39-137.karoo.KCOM.COM] has joined #openttd
17:44:43  <Bjarni> generally using inline will make the code a bit bigger but also a bit faster at execution time
17:45:30  <Belugas> ps?
17:45:40  <planetmaker> PublicServer
17:45:54  <peter1138> Belugas, everyone is supposed to know the OpenTTDCoop abbreviations... ;)
17:46:03  <planetmaker> :P
17:46:12  <Belugas> indeed... where was my head :S
17:46:21  <Bjarni> somewhere far away
17:46:24  <Eddi|zuHause> i have it
17:46:25  <Bjarni> like Canada :p
17:46:26  <glx> like my script is supposed to know all OpenTTDCoop commands ;)
17:46:38  <Eddi|zuHause> it's a nice trophy on my whale chamber
17:47:04  <Belugas> heheh
17:47:04  <planetmaker> glx: so it's your doing to kick people, asking for password? :)
17:47:21  <planetmaker> Honestly, it's a nice function :)
17:47:25  <Eddi|zuHause> no, DorpsGek kicks
17:47:25  <glx> planetmaker: you didn't know?
17:47:27  <guru3> would be be a bad idea to strcpy from bits of the same string?
17:47:37  <guru3> ie strcpy(string + 1, string)
17:47:41  <guru3> it does seem to segfault :/
17:47:54  <SmatZ> guru3: use memmove
17:47:57  <planetmaker> glx: I know - I "tested" it before :P . But I knew not who made it :)
17:48:23  <glx> it's a simple script in my client
17:48:25  <Bjarni> ok, I'm out of here
17:48:26  <guru3> SmatZ: thanks, i'll try that
17:48:39  <SmatZ> The strings may not overlap,
17:48:40  <SmatZ>        and the destination string dest must be large enough to receive the copy.
17:48:41  <peter1138> You can type !password as often as you like when glx is not here.
17:48:50  <SmatZ> from man strcpy
17:48:51  <planetmaker> :)
17:48:55  <Bjarni> !passport
17:48:58  <SmatZ> :)
17:49:04  <planetmaker> !beer
17:49:09  <glx> Bjarni: it's a "smart" script
17:49:11  <guru3> *whistles* i might not have read the entire man page...
17:49:13  * SmatZ beers planetmaker
17:49:15  <Ammler> Belugas: approved desynced with UKRS only
17:49:23  <planetmaker> :P
17:49:31  <Bjarni> glx: it kicked me once by mistake >_<
17:49:38  <guru3> well holy moly
17:49:40  <guru3> that seems to have worled
17:49:45  <SmatZ> :-)
17:49:55  <glx> the first version did yes
17:49:57  * planetmaker drinks
17:49:59  <SmatZ> :)
17:50:06  <guru3> thanks SmatZ
17:50:12  <SmatZ> you are welcome guru3
17:50:12  <guru3> i now have a 170 character line :D
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17:52:02  <Ammler> Belugas: it doesn't load UKRS at all, it seems
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17:54:38  <Ammler>
17:54:49  * Fantasya np: MDB - BEAUTIFUL VOICES 028 (SOLARSTONE SPECIAL EDITION) [79:04m/256kbps/44kHz]
17:55:19  * yorick waits for ln to say "turn that of"
17:55:28  <Belugas> Ammler: good, so you now have something to chew :)
17:55:37  * peter1138 np: Stereolab - Miss Modular
17:55:46  <ln> yorick: i would never say "turn that of", because it should be "off"
17:55:57  <yorick> off*
17:55:59  <Belugas> it may be OR your server, OR your UKRS
17:56:02  <Fantasya> amip?
17:56:03  <peter1138> Belugas, a patch from Ammler?
17:56:03  <Fantasya> :D
17:56:11  <Belugas> ho no... not at all
17:56:22  <peter1138> Oh, then he needs to not use an empty
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17:56:22  <Ammler> gimme commit rights :P
17:56:27  <Belugas> indeed
17:56:36  <Belugas> ARE YOU KIDDING Ammler>????
17:57:09  <ln> Belugas: do unitedstatesians need a passport for entering Canada?
17:57:35  <Ammler> Belugas: seriously, you think it's not up to ottd?
17:57:43  <guru3> how do you know if they're from the us unless they have a passport?
17:57:46  <Ammler> shall I report it at UKRS thread then?
17:57:55  <peter1138> Ammler, no. It's because your is empty.
17:58:03  <peter1138> You ought to have figured that one out.
17:58:16  <peter1138> guru3, they'll be the only people without a passport...
17:58:23  <guru3> lol
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17:58:56  <Belugas> Ammler, OpenTTD is assuming you have a valid
17:59:13  <ln> guru3: well it's not unheard of that one doesn't need a passport to enter another country.
17:59:24  <Belugas> if ever OpenTTD decides that it does not need, it will behave correctly
17:59:31  <ln> guru3: especially you should know that
17:59:41  <Belugas> you are raising issues that are totally invalid
18:00:24  <guru3> true, but it's not exactly 'best practice' in most countries either
18:00:36  <Ammler> Belugas: well, I don't like to tell people where the "illegal" download locations are...
18:00:49  <guru3> i remember the time we nearly drove into russia...
18:00:55  <Belugas> now...thank you very much, Ammler, you just ruined the time i allowed myaself to do some ottd coding for Phantasm's bug
18:01:17  <Belugas> Ammler, just DON'T tell them, just make them SEARCH
18:01:32  *** lobster [~michielbi@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
18:01:37  <peter1138> It is an incredibly hard search...
18:01:38  <Belugas> baby feeding seems to be the commun way of doing nowaday :(
18:02:09  <ln> Belugas: 20:57 < ln> Belugas: do unitedstatesians need a passport for entering Canada?
18:02:43  <Ammler> I would also like to ofter a legal solution to join us...
18:02:47  <guru3> peter1138: no it's not... i just got it in under a minute
18:03:14  <peter1138> Sarcasm detectors failing :D
18:03:22  <guru3> yes
18:03:24  <guru3> yes
18:03:34  <guru3> your voice does not lend itself to sarcasm
18:03:41  <Belugas> Ammler, do as you wish
18:03:44  <Ammler> Belugas: also for dedicated server, it would be cool, if it could handle it.
18:03:56  <Belugas> but your efforts might be better spent by making a replacement...
18:04:07  <Belugas> well why don't you do it?
18:04:48  <Belugas> do you know how many things wold be cool? plenty
18:05:01  <planetmaker> :)
18:05:01  <guru3> ifndef is an anagram of define
18:05:03  <guru3> :o
18:05:08  <guru3> well
18:05:09  <guru3> almost
18:05:10  <Ammler> I start my games with -snull, so a silent option wouldn't hurt :P
18:05:23  <Ammler> I know, I am not the only one, never listen to sounds...
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18:23:49  <Ammler> orudes sound replacment project seems stocked...
18:24:22  <Ammler> and it needs a patch :-/
18:27:13  <Belugas> seems like you will have to do it on your own
18:28:08  <Ammler> or you think about supporting empty :-)
18:28:20  <Ammler> as you mostly do already.
18:32:57  <Belugas> why in the name of WHOMEVER should i get myslef in that kind of fucking boring one-more-time-job???
18:33:21  <Belugas> just for Thou, my Laziness King???
18:34:01  <welshdragon> Belugas, that was well said ;)
18:34:35  <Ammler> omg, you are really a poor guy.
18:34:44  <TrueBrain> pompiedom
18:34:59  <Rubidium> tralala
18:35:15  <peter1138> Why would be bother supporting an empty
18:35:47  <TrueBrain> peter1138: a long outstanding question ;)
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18:38:28  <Belugas> tsouin tsouin
18:39:24  <Eddi|zuHause> for servers that do not have sounds anyway?
18:39:33  <Belugas> Ammler, the equation is so simple : OR YOU work OR I work.  Do I care about empty  Not at all.  Do YOU?  yes you do.  so move your butt and try to be helpfull.
18:39:53  <Belugas> and i do not consider myself poor at all.
18:40:19  * peter1138 ponders tinkling the ivories.
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18:47:55  <Swallow> peter1138: Regarding your comment on the improved breakdowns patch (to calculate power/speed only when it changes)...
18:48:09  *** Mortal [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
18:48:25  <Swallow> You'd prefer to save the value in v->u.rail.cached_power/max_speed?
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18:49:54  <Eddi|zuHause> that sounds reasonable
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18:51:30  <Swallow> consequence would be that the max speed displayed in the gui is changed as well
18:52:15  <peter1138> Hmm
18:52:39  *** Sacro_ [~Ben@adsl-87-102-39-137.karoo.KCOM.COM] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
18:52:51  <peter1138> Well maybe not then :p
18:53:09  <peter1138> i just wonder about performance if there are lot of broken down vehicles... hehe
18:54:06  <Swallow> if that is the problem... fix your trains :)
18:55:20  <Swallow> Well, I don't really mind whether it's cached or not
18:55:23  <peter1138> I don't think that answer will hold :)
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18:55:42  <peter1138> Certainly the GUI max speed point is relevant.
18:56:47  *** mortal` [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
18:57:41  <Swallow> I'm not sure if there are any other things, besides GUI, that depend on it...
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18:59:26  <Swallow> looking at the code, there's also a reference to cached_max_speed in economy.cpp for calculating station rating
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19:01:29  <Swallow> peter1138: Did you have any other remarks, besides caching/not caching?
19:01:43  *** Sacro [~Ben@adsl-87-102-39-137.karoo.KCOM.COM] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
19:01:44  <peter1138> Yeah, cached_max_speed needs to have the real max speed :o
19:01:51  <peter1138> Swallow, can't actually remember, heh...
19:02:05  <peter1138> Also, is it me, or does zoom in/out not zoom at the mouse pointer?
19:03:07  *** Czeko [~Czeko@] has joined #openttd
19:03:11  <Swallow> it zooms at the centre of the screen AFAIK
19:03:17  <eekee> I think scroll-wheel zoom zooms at the pointer.
19:03:28  <eekee> (in fact I'm fairly sure it does)
19:03:47  <eekee> I guess keyboard zoom replicates the buttons, which zoom center
19:03:49  <peter1138> It doesn't for me :o
19:03:54  <eekee> wierd
19:10:06  <guru3> anyone any good with sdl/opengl programming?
19:10:31  <FauxFaux> Retarded question 1010.
19:11:12  <guru3> now that we know who's not, anyone else?
19:11:56  <FauxFaux> Okay, I'll play. I'm good at OpenGL, imho. What's your real question?
19:12:24  <guru3> when i switch between full screen and windows my textures stop rendering correctly, they become white blocks
19:13:05  <guru3> if i reload them, it comes out looking like there are two on top of each other
19:14:28  <guru3> (and the transparency goes away)
19:14:55  <TrueBrain> Ammler: you finished with the Features update?
19:16:26  <Ammler> TrueBrain: <-- maybe someone else likes to read it over?
19:16:33  <TrueBrain> going once?
19:17:18  <peter1138> IIRC with some cards you basically need to reinitialize the whole thing when switching from windowed to fullscreen. But I'm probably wrong.
19:17:53  <frosch123>   * window mode with double zoom (CTRL+D to toggle) (MS Windows only) <- no longer true, is it?
19:18:06  <TrueBrain> frosch123: correct
19:18:10  <TrueBrain> please remove it from the wiki
19:18:42  <Eddi|zuHause> i really liked that feature ;)
19:18:56  <TrueBrain> sure you did
19:19:01  <TrueBrain> didn't expect you to do anything else :p
19:19:56  <Eddi|zuHause> i find this distinct lack of CIA disturbing
19:20:55  <Belugas> Eddi|zuHause, #openttd.notice does the same job :)
19:21:01  <Belugas> plus, it's more reliable ;)
19:21:11  <frosch123> TrueBrain: done :)
19:21:20  <TrueBrain> tnx
19:21:48  <Eddi|zuHause> @openttd commit
19:21:48  <DorpsGek> Eddi|zuHause: Commit by frosch :: r14291 trunk/src/tunnelbridge_cmd.cpp (2008-09-11 19:12:31 UTC)
19:21:49  <DorpsGek> Eddi|zuHause: -Fix [FS#2288] (r12853): For tunnels DrawCatenary() draws only pillars; DrawCatenaryOnTunnel() draws only wires.
19:28:14  <yorick> @openttd bugs
19:28:14  <DorpsGek> yorick: Temporary Offline
19:28:36  <yorick> stupid flyspray lacking xmlrpc
19:29:43  <Ammler> we have 40 languages?
19:29:56  <yorick> 39, last time I checked
19:29:58  <TrueBrain> tnx Ammler for your work
19:30:13  <Ammler> dih helped me a little
19:31:55  <Ammler> hmm, now I see, what I wanted to add
19:32:05  <Ammler> links to related wiki pages...
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19:53:07  <Czeko> hello
19:53:12  <Czeko> i have a question
19:53:52  <Czeko> how can i make a city name list to openttd?
19:54:19  <Noldo> it's behind one of the buttons
19:55:03  <Ammler> Czeko: with newgrf
19:55:34  <Ammler> ActionF, if I remember correctly...
19:55:51  * Belugas is impressed :D
19:55:52  <Czeko> is there any tutorial for that? i just want to make a Mexican cities list
19:55:58  <Ammler> :-P
19:56:10  <Belugas> i am , trule!
19:56:37  <Ammler> Czeko: how many names?
19:56:44  <Ammler> real names?
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19:57:12  <Czeko> yup, for all the states and the main cities.
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19:57:41  <Belugas> states will be pointless, unless yuouwant to have cities barien statesnames ...
19:57:46  <Belugas> baring
19:58:20  <Ammler> you could use them as filter, like canada town set.
19:59:10  <Ammler> Czeko: fast howto: make a list like
20:00:09  <Czeko> awesome, do i have to change the numbers too?
20:00:18  <Czeko> do they represent something?
20:00:23  <Ammler> Czeko: that is not all :-)
20:00:44  <Czeko> no, but a simple enough first step :-)
20:01:01  <Eddi|zuHause> the file is not utf-8 :(
20:01:07  <Ammler>
20:01:10  <Czeko> so ill just change the names then
20:01:17  <Ammler> Eddi|zuHause: afaik, nfo can't be utf-8
20:01:53  <Eddi|zuHause> iirc i read somewhere that utf-8 strings need a certain prefix
20:02:09  <Ammler> Eddi|zuHause: yes
20:02:37  <Ammler> well, I used iso-8859-1
20:03:12  <Ammler> hmm, dunno, maybe grfcodec is able to convert?
20:03:33  <Eddi|zuHause> grfcodec does not need to convert anything
20:03:42  <Eddi|zuHause> it reads bytes, not characters
20:03:50  <Ammler> nah
20:04:12  <Ammler> it reads chars between double quotes
20:04:38  <Eddi|zuHause> it can't because it has no idea of input encoding
20:04:43  <Ammler> well, I did it that way, worked for me...
20:05:37  <Belugas> maybe time to make it better?
20:06:06  <Ammler> better like as utf-8?
20:06:15  * Belugas nods
20:07:57  <peter1138> You need to prefix the string with a thorn to use UTF-8
20:07:59  <peter1138> ß
20:08:04  <peter1138> Or something like that.
20:08:42  <Noldo> how is that thorn encoded?
20:10:01  <peter1138> Well that's the question ;)
20:11:25  <Ammler>
20:11:39  <Ammler> iso-8859-1
20:11:40  <glx>
20:11:52  <glx> those use utf8 strings
20:12:22  <Ammler> but the nfo is 8859-1 encoded, isn't?
20:13:02  <Belugas> there is a scetion called UTF-8 Support in that page ;)
20:14:49  <DaleStan> How is that thorn encoded? <-- In UTF-8, just like the rest of the string it flags.
20:15:47  <DaleStan> Strings in NFO are encoded in NFO encoding. Some combination of Latin-1, Latin-15, and UTF-8.
20:16:08  <Eddi|zuHause> Ammler: オヌストリア does not look like 8859-1
20:16:27  <Ammler> :-)
20:16:44  <Eddi|zuHause> Ammler: like i said, grfcodec cannot know any encoding, it just parses bytes
20:17:06  <Ammler> but you need to save it right way
20:17:15  <Ammler> to write "right" bytes
20:17:34  <Eddi|zuHause> any sane editor lets you specify the encoding
20:18:02  <Ammler> hmm, why didn't it work here, as I saved it as utf-8
20:18:27  <Ammler> (default)
20:18:36  <DaleStan> Did you prefix all strings containing high-ascii characters with a thorn? (U+00DE)
20:19:23  <Ammler> I even didn't use any "high-ascii" chars
20:19:32  <DaleStan> Actually, that's "characters beyond U+007F".
20:19:38  <Ammler> german Umlauts aren't?
20:19:44  <DaleStan> Yes, they are.
20:20:12  <eekee> Plain ascii is strictly US-centric
20:20:24  <eekee> ($ but no £, for instance)
20:20:37  <FauxFaux> No ¬ either, majorly insufficient.
20:21:04  <DaleStan> Low ASCII contains no accents, and only the following symbols: ~!@#$%^&*()_+`-={}|[]\:";'<>?,./
20:21:43  <Ammler> that contains german and french "Umlauts":
20:22:14  <Ammler> didn't use that prefix
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20:23:52  <DaleStan> That's because it's encoded in Latin-TTD (Approximately Latin-15, IIRC), which does contain umlauts.
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20:25:48  <Ammler> so if I like to support UTF-8, I would need to prefix every "strange" name and save as UTF-8?
20:27:08  <DaleStan> That, or you write your own editor that automatically does the right thing with all strings.
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20:28:42  <Ammler> then I see my fault, I did only prefix non iso-8859-1 chars.
20:29:00  <Eddi|zuHause> prefix the strings, not the characters
20:29:17  <Ammler> yeah, of course, I prefixed only the strings with those chars.
20:29:28  <Eddi|zuHause> that should suffice
20:29:31  <Ammler> in that case language names.
20:29:55  <Eddi|zuHause> like this: 39 C3 9E "オヌストリア (grf)" 00
20:29:59  <Ammler> that's why it has now not all languages defined :-)
20:31:16  <Ammler> that was huge work to copy all languages from src/lang and then as I saved, the whole nfo was screwend ;-)
20:32:02  <Eddi|zuHause> well, you can byte-encode the strings first
20:32:09  <Eddi|zuHause> then you don't need to worry
20:34:18  <Ammler> low ascii is 7bit?
20:34:27  <Eddi|zuHause> yes
20:34:36  <Eddi|zuHause> 32 to 127
20:35:00  <Ammler> and the high ascii depense on the codepage?
20:35:10  <Eddi|zuHause> yes
20:35:23  <Ammler> thanks, should get it now :-)
20:36:07  <Eddi|zuHause> <32 are usually not displayable control characters (beep, line feed, etc.)
20:36:44  <peter1138> 'codepage' being a DOSism...
20:36:57  <Ammler> it wouldn't hurt if I prefix all strings
20:37:18  <glx> doesn't matter as ASCII is part of UTF8 ;)
20:38:30  <Ammler> will the resulting GRF be bigger?
20:38:47  <peter1138> Yes.
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20:44:34  <Eddi|zuHause> two bytes per string bigger ;)
20:46:25  <Ammler> 2bytes per char, isn't
20:46:38  <Ammler> *it"
20:46:43  <peter1138> No, per string.
20:46:49  * yorick encourages devs to review newly submitted patch for FS#2241
20:46:51  <Eddi|zuHause> no, the characters are not changed
20:46:52  <peter1138> You don't prefix every character...
20:47:01  <Eddi|zuHause> only the prefix needs additinal storage
20:47:09  <Eddi|zuHause> and that prefix is two bytes long
20:47:40  <Ammler> but..., it needs 2byte per char for utf-8,:-(
20:47:41  <Eddi|zuHause> grfcodec does absolutely not care what encoding the strings are in, it copies the bytes verbatim into the grf
20:47:51  <peter1138> Ammler, no it doesn't.
20:48:03  <Ammler> now, I am lost again...
20:48:09  <Eddi|zuHause> no, only "high" characters are 2 or more bytes
20:48:17  <Eddi|zuHause> ascii characters are 1 byte
20:48:37  * Pikka wonders if you can copy bytes "verbatim" ;)
20:48:57  <Eddi|zuHause> the highest bit in the character is used to indicate "this is a multi-byte character"
20:49:28  <Ammler> ok, now, I see again :-)
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20:50:11  <Eddi|zuHause> i think a character can be up to seven bytes
20:50:25  <peter1138> 4 is the maximum, IIRC.
20:50:28  <DaleStan> <Ammler> it wouldn't hurt if I prefix all strings <-- Well, prefixing strings that contain the control characters 7D..7F without properly changing them to E07D..E07F them will cause things to go badly.
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20:51:10  <DaleStan> 4 is the maximum for Unicode. 7 is the maximum for UTF-8. (7FFFFFFFh, IIRC)
20:51:28  <peter1138> Wrong.
20:51:40  <peter1138> RFC 3629 limits the range to 10FFFFh.
20:51:57  <DaleStan> Range for UTF-8? or range for Unicode characters?
20:52:08  <peter1138> Range for Unicode, I believe.
20:52:35  <peter1138> Hmm, possibly UTF-8.
20:52:46  <peter1138> It's limited to 4 bytes, anyway.
20:52:55  <DaleStan> I know that Unicode is limited to a much smaller range than UTF-8 can technically encode.
20:53:08  *** Spoons [] has joined #openttd
20:55:45  <DaleStan> But "technically possible" does not mean "valid"; "FE 80 80 80 80 80 80" would (I hope) decode to 0, except that the UTF-8 RFC disallows encodings that are not minimum-length.
20:56:12  <peter1138> FE was never valid.
20:56:34  <peter1138> UTF-8 allowed up to 6 bytes originally, before it was limited to 4.
20:56:45  <peter1138> (Indeed, my original UTF-8 stuff for OpenTTD allowed 6 bytes)
20:56:57  <DaleStan> Oh. Then FC and drop an 80.
20:57:14  <peter1138> It would decode to an error ;)
20:57:19  <peter1138> As you said.
20:57:31  <dih> there are no Spoons !
20:57:40  <Spoons> Lies!
20:57:47  <Spoons> 𒁹
20:57:52  *** Spoons is now known as FauxFaux
20:58:13  *** Aylomen [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
20:59:55  <peter1138> See?
21:01:22  *** Fantasya [~Fantasya@] has quit []
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21:08:42  <Belugas> night all
21:12:32  <dih> the wording PBS signal in the english lang file is odd
21:12:36  <dih> it's a souble signal
21:12:43  <dih> Path Based Signal signal
21:14:10  <blathijs> actually, it's Path Based Signalling signal
21:14:17  <blathijs> which i slightly less weird :-)
21:15:01  <dih> still double signals
21:15:06  <dih> ugly :-P
21:16:33  <nckomodo> Public Broadcasting Station signal
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21:41:29  <Czeko> im back, i have the list of some mexican cities (about 90)... now what?
21:42:32  <Ammler> so you just like to make a example?
21:42:50  <Ammler> because 90 is not that much for 4k² map
21:43:19  <dih> Ammler: there are no 4k^2 maps
21:43:28  <Ammler> psst
21:43:29  <dih> at least not in standard shipped OpenTTD
21:43:40  <Czeko> hahaha
21:43:56  <Czeko> should i write more before proceeding?
21:43:57  <dih> but 90 is still not enough for 2K^2 map
21:44:07  <Czeko> how many should i write?
21:44:10  <Czeko> 200?
21:44:19  <Ammler> that is ok
21:44:21  <dih> Czeko, why dont you start a game with that map size?
21:44:34  <dih> set number of towns to the max value
21:44:36  <Czeko> and count the number of cities
21:44:43  <dih> set number of industries to minimum value (none)
21:44:51  <dih> then open the towns directory
21:44:57  <dih> and it will tell you how many there are
21:45:11  <Ammler> my swisstowns has around 2k possibilites
21:45:20  <Czeko> ok :-)
21:45:21  <Ammler> and frenchtown around 400
21:45:26  <Czeko> damn
21:45:44  <Ammler> but you should be able to start with around 200
21:48:05  <dih> small games
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21:49:03  <Ammler> and coding is easier if you have not more then 255 names
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21:51:46  <Kasceh> is there any date on openttd 7.0 ?
21:51:57  <FauxFaux> Whyh?
21:52:14  <Kasceh> I want PBS when i play multiplayer
21:54:56  *** Zeal [] has joined #openttd
21:54:59  <planetmaker> Kasceh: join a nightly server. E.g. the openttd fairplay nightly by dih
21:56:12  <Kasceh> planetmaker, i like to do different game modes :P im not exactly desperate for 7, just wanted to know if anyone had a date on its release :P
21:56:42  <Rubidium> OpenTTD 7.0 is likely to be released somewhere far into one of the next decades or centuries
21:57:02  <planetmaker> :P
21:57:02  <dih> nice one Rubidium
21:57:05  <dih> hihi
21:59:14  <Kasceh> =[
21:59:43  <planetmaker> Kasceh: you know the current stable version number?
21:59:53  *** Zealotus [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
22:00:02  <dih> Kasceh, what is wrong with my nightly server?
22:00:03  <Kasceh> im on 6.2 idk if its the current
22:00:13  <Kasceh> nothing?
22:00:17  <planetmaker> read again.
22:00:44  <Kasceh> Ill probably see the same people, which is more like a group than a server :/
22:00:47  <planetmaker> or read the website.
22:01:08  * Rubidium ponders installing Windows NT 2600
22:01:17  <Kasceh> The latest stable version is 0.6.2, released on August 1st 2008.
22:01:25  <Kasceh> oh
22:01:28  <planetmaker> :D
22:01:32  <Kasceh> 0.7.0 then ;]
22:02:21  *** [com]buster [] has joined #openttd
22:02:35  * Rubidium summons MrMist to extrapolate the previous releases and give us a release date
22:04:46  <SmatZ> hehe
22:05:28  * Rubidium ponders making releasing next major stable release before a Christmas
22:06:28  <SmatZ> Christmass 2011?
22:07:19  <peter1138> London Olympic 2012 Release
22:07:36  <Rubidium> yeah, during the tt-forums meet :)
22:08:23  <dih> Kasceh, you can invite as many people to that server as you like
22:08:31  <peter1138> Let's try to beat TTDPatch's record for time between releases.
22:08:36  <peter1138> (stable releases)
22:08:39  <dih> it upgrades every day at 20.15 CEST
22:08:49  <dih> and save games are done every hour and available for download
22:09:32  <peter1138> nini
22:09:37  <dih> night peter
22:10:09  <SmatZ> nn
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23:07:53  <TrueBrain> sjoep sjoep
23:11:51  <TrueBrain> you people go to bed too early
23:12:17  <glx> I don't :)
23:12:21  <Nite_Owl> Depends on the time zone
23:12:22  <TrueBrain> that is very true
23:14:13  *** Czeko [~Czeko@] has quit [Quit: Czeko]
23:14:32  <TrueBrain> so I can just safely say this channel is boring ;)
23:14:34  <TrueBrain> fine by me too :)
23:36:41  <Kasceh> would be awesome if i could only see servers with breakdowns set to off :/
23:37:19  <Pikka> breakdowns > you
23:38:57  <ln> gooooood eveniiiiinggg
23:38:59  <Kasceh> They are annoying without PBS
23:39:00  <Kasceh> hi
23:40:14  <Pikka> I say I say I say
23:40:31  <Pikka> does anyone know how town var 41	B	Town index is handled in ottd?
23:43:38  <glx> case 0x41: return t->index;
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23:45:13  <glx> and it's an uint16
23:45:18  <Pikka> goodo
23:45:22  <Pikka> thanks
23:46:33  *** Wezz6400 [] has quit [Quit: Release the hounds]
23:48:31  <glx> hmm maybe I should "fix" the wiki for OpenTTD (it's a word, not a byte)
23:49:03  <FauxFaux> Double-octet. ¬_¬
23:51:37  * Pikka is only using the bottom nibble, so I don't care ;)
23:52:09  <glx> and I think we can have more than 69 towns
23:52:15  <glx> *70
23:52:45  <Pikka> yes...
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23:56:19  <Kasceh> Jesus christ
23:56:27  <Kasceh> some people..
23:56:38  <Kasceh> Going out of their way to spoil everyone's work
23:56:49  <Kasceh> Such as blocking off my sea oil supply
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23:59:21  <Belugas> Pikka : var 47 for house zy position, in  ?
23:59:24  <Belugas> would be good enough?
23:59:33  <Phantasm> Örr.
23:59:35  <Belugas> xy, not zy

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