Log for #openttd on 13th April 2009:
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08:40:52  <CIA-9> OpenTTD: alberth * r16051 /trunk/src/vehicle_gui.cpp: -Codechange: Adding widget numbers enum for vehicle refit window.
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10:27:28  <TrueBrain> morning all
10:29:31  <jonty-comp> apparently so
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10:47:59  <Zuu> Good morning TrueBrain, hope you had a better start than I had. (had no breakfast at home, so had to wait untill the food store opened at 10 AM)
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10:49:24  <Rubidium> Zuu: what a luxury ;)
10:50:11  <EoD> hi
10:50:27  <Zuu> Rubidium: hehe, yea food that is overrated :)
10:51:30  <Rubidium> well, more talking about the food store that opens on easter monday
10:57:38  <TrueBrain> Zuu: just enjoyed some lovely eggs :)
11:04:36  <Zuu> Okay, have actually not eaten any eggs this estern. Other than an omelet at thursday last week. :)
11:07:18  <TrueBrain> orudge: you should stop those spam-bots at the forums :p
11:15:51  <jonty-comp> I wish there was a half-decent reCAPTCHA module for phpbb
11:16:11  <jonty-comp> but the only ones I can find are fairly random and dubious looking
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11:26:49  * petern returns with £105 of tap
11:27:15  <TrueBrain> what did you drink?! :p
11:27:29  <petern> heh
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11:29:42  <petern> < old tap
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11:32:24  <petern> < new tap
11:32:26  <petern> also
11:32:46  <petern> < hole of old sink
11:33:12  <petern> < hole for new sink
11:33:50  <yorick> we have that tap too
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11:53:50  <petern> you do?
11:53:55  <petern> shit, i better exchange it
12:00:41  <petern> it's somewhat annoying that you can't reference two CNAMEs for one hostname :/
12:01:15  <TrueBrain> the idea of CNAME was round-robin .. ;)
12:01:29  <TrueBrain> (although I doubt anyone uses that method ... mostly because Windows fucked up that implementation :p)
12:01:45  <petern> i use it :p
12:02:11  <petern> windows tends to pick one and use it, but otherwise it's okay
12:02:16  <TrueBrain> Windows never falls back to the other entry ...
12:02:22  <TrueBrain> which makes the idea of round-robing kind of .. useless ;)
12:02:24  <petern> for mx servers, windows doesn't make much difference
12:02:47  <TrueBrain> but of course Windows had to fuck up .. else it wouldn't be Windows I guess :)
12:03:06  <petern> but i can't do: mx1=, mx2=, mx=cname mx1, mx=cname mx2
12:03:29  <petern> (not that i'd want to with MX, because RR is built into the MX system
12:03:31  <petern> )
12:03:54  <TrueBrain> RR .. more a fallback system :p
12:03:55  <petern> TrueBrain, yes, there is, somewhere, a recommendation to use the 'nearest' IP address
12:04:14  <petern> which fails in the real world
12:04:34  <petern> because you can't tell from an IP address whether it is near or not, heh
12:04:43  <petern> (sure, if it's in the same subnet...)
12:04:44  <TrueBrain> abs(ip1 - ip2) :p
12:05:11  <petern> in fact
12:05:19  <petern> that may be the cause of window's fuckedupness
12:05:25  <petern> i seem to remember someone made linux do it
12:05:34  <petern> and people were going "wtf is this?"
12:05:52  <petern> of course
12:05:58  <TrueBrain> it wouldn't suprise me at all if Windows did it like that :p
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12:15:37  <Zuu> lol, told a player to set a company PW on a server to secure his company, and then he just left.. :p
12:16:45  <Zuu> Though it seams like he did not do his math. initial loan is 100k, but there are no aircrafts he could afford after building two city airports.
12:18:09  <EoD> ^^
12:18:31  <yorick> are you sure he isn't just a spambot?
12:19:01  <Zuu> Then its a good spambot as it managed to build two airports :)
12:19:20  <yorick> I can make a spambot that manages to build two airports...
12:19:44  <yorick> just try enough times and when out of money, leave
12:19:51  <yorick> there there, you have your spamports
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12:57:12  <Aali> sweet mother of spambots
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13:00:31  <Wolf01> yo! there's a spambot in da forum
13:01:31  * yorick should not say spambot in this channel
13:02:26  <Wolf01> it already made 110 topics
13:02:39  <TrueBrain> orudge!!!! :p
13:02:58  <Wolf01> rudgeo!!!
13:03:40  <Alberth> he seems goal oriented :)
13:04:01  <yorick> 117
13:04:24  <yorick> ooh, google doc as website
13:04:51  <yorick> offtopic is quite filled
13:05:49  <yorick> "Austria", "26", "Law", "Performing arts"
13:05:53  <yorick> it shouldn't know
13:05:56  <yorick> art of spamming...
13:05:56  <petern> hm
13:06:45  <yorick> icq..
13:08:18  <TrueBrain> @kick yorick go away spam bot
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13:13:11  <LUADuck> Hey guess who's back at long notice
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13:13:58  <TrueBrain> euuhhh
13:14:00  <TrueBrain> I have no idea
13:14:12  <LUADuck> more a quick question - I've got a co-op game that's had the company passworded (and we don't know the password) - anything I can do to remove it without dissolving the company?
13:16:01  <yorick> autoclean
13:16:08  <yorick> or move into it
13:16:15  <LUADuck> with what RCON command
13:16:23  <yorick> rcon pw "move clientid companyid"
13:16:26  <LUADuck> ok
13:16:31  <LUADuck> TO PUTTY
13:16:39  <blathijs> Hmm, does 0.7.0 no longer include any of the old AIs?
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13:16:57  <SmatZ> blathijs: yes
13:16:58  <petern> nope
13:17:04  <petern> heh
13:17:05  <TrueBrain> blathijs: NoAI replaced them ;)
13:17:07  <Rubidium> I suggest reading the changelog ;)
13:17:07  <petern> yes it doesn't :D
13:17:10  <SmatZ> :o)
13:17:24  <TrueBrain> 1 question, 4 replies
13:17:26  <TrueBrain> how cool
13:17:47  <Rubidium> but you all gave him fish, I learned him how to fish ;)
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13:17:59  <TrueBrain> "altijd baas boven baas"
13:18:08  <petern> sshd[31170]: error writing /proc/self/oom_adj: Permission denied
13:18:10  <petern> :o
13:18:17  <TrueBrain> lol @ petern :)
13:18:26  <SmatZ> hehe
13:18:28  <blathijs> So, any old games with AIs you load will probably be messed up (or is there any AI that will deal will with the crap the old AI built gracefully?)
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13:18:44  <yorick> "sell the man a fish, and he'll eat for one day, teach the man how to fish, and you threw a great money making chance away"
13:18:45  <TrueBrain> blathijs: I don't think there is one, no :)
13:18:48  <petern> TrueBrain, in my vserver :s
13:18:54  <blathijs> petern: I see that stuff on my server as well, seems it's caused by vserver somehow
13:18:57  <TrueBrain> petern: yeah, I was about to say that .. vserver, not? :p
13:18:59  <TrueBrain> 2.2 kernel?
13:19:08  <petern> 2.2?
13:19:14  <TrueBrain> you had lenny, not?
13:19:15  <TrueBrain> so 2.3 ..
13:19:19  <TrueBrain> I thought they fixed that :p
13:19:19  <petern> yes, lenny
13:19:20  <petern> so 2.6.26
13:19:31  <blathijs> TrueBrain: You mean vserver-2.2 I guess :-)
13:19:40  <blathijs> TrueBrain: Not linux-2.2
13:19:41  <petern> although i haven't rebooted to debian 5.0.1 yet
13:19:43  <TrueBrain> blathijs: yes, of course, we were talking about vserver, not? :)
13:19:49  <petern> "2.2 kernel" :p
13:20:28  <blathijs> TrueBrain: Is there any AI I could recommend in my NEWS.Debian file?
13:20:54  <petern> hmm, i need... PTFE tape, 2 gender benders, a rose and some sealant
13:21:01  <TrueBrain> blathijs: ask Yexo .. or Rubidium .. :p
13:21:12  <EoD> NoCab e.g.?
13:21:26  <Rubidium> one that doesn't have a broken saveload
13:21:28  <glx> blathijs: let the user add what he wants from content download
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13:21:52  <blathijs> glx: Obviously, but if there was one "preferred
13:22:02  <blathijs> glx: Obviously, but if there was one "preferred" or "standard" AI, I could mention that
13:22:15  <blathijs> Or one maintained by the openttd team perhaps
13:22:35  <blathijs> Rubidium: A lot of them are broken when saving?
13:22:51  <glx> most of them don't save
13:23:15  <petern> so they don't know what they were doing when they reload?
13:23:34  <SmatZ> hmm... I was rewriting some code... and it wasn't working the same way as the old code did - now I finally found there was a bug in the old code :-P
13:23:41  <petern> hehe
13:24:12  <LUADuck> Is there any way to stop these bloody "queried from blah.blah.blah.blah" messages?
13:24:25  <petern> debug_level net=1
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13:24:35  <Rubidium> IIRC there is one that reads the information from the map and continues there. I'd say that that is the best one for 'recovering' the old AI mess
13:25:03  <Rubidium> the ones that save stuff (and load that) usually don't check for stuff that is already build (but not by them)
13:25:08  <blathijs> glx: But they don't mention that in the description, I think...
13:25:29  <blathijs> Rubidium: Any clue on which one that is?
13:26:17  <Rubidium> blathijs:
13:26:42  <blathijs> Thanks
13:28:37  <petern> pah
13:28:44  <petern> they should all use information from the map ;)
13:28:54  <petern> i don't get to save what i was doing... heheh
13:29:18  <Rubidium> you're free to place signs ;)
13:29:28  <petern> so are they :D
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13:30:46  <blathijs> Heh, AIs that just drive cars around town. Brilliant :-)
13:31:04  <petern> there's a grf for town cars too, i believe
13:31:20  <petern> gives them no running cost or some such
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13:33:00  <LUADuck> Any way to increase the limit on "dropping due to no responce in 3 game days"
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13:33:27  <blathijs> Can opengfx already completely replace the original graphics?
13:33:41  <petern> no
13:33:42  <Rubidium> if you like black buildings/trains, then yes
13:33:45  <Rubidium> otherwise no
13:33:53  <frosch123> and you need a empty
13:34:09  <blathijs> Since I still can't start openttd withoug and the grfs, so I can't access the download service to download opengfx when I don't have the originals...
13:34:25  <petern> indeed
13:34:46  <LUADuck> Yeah everyone's getting dropped due to no responce
13:34:49  <LUADuck> :/
13:35:05  <frosch123> 3 gamedays is quite a lot
13:35:29  <LUADuck> I know it is, but is it increasable to allow debugging?
13:35:39  <Rubidium> the major reason not to 'package' OpenGFX and such is because they are not finished
13:36:10  <frosch123> debugging in multiplayer? why?
13:36:28  <Rubidium> when they are finished (and thus relatively bug free) there's no reason to make it an installation package or so
13:36:30  * petern wasn't even aware there was a message "dropping due to no responce in 3 game days"
13:36:49  <petern> (i can't find it in the source...)
13:37:00  * LUADuck reminds petern that it's 4 game days, and that LUADuck fails at copy-pasta
13:37:08  <blathijs> Rubidium: Would it be a lot of work to make the main menu work without any base graphics package?
13:37:16  <blathijs> Rubidium: I guess the buttons and window decorations are also in there?
13:37:16  <Rubidium> yes
13:37:26  <petern> i wasn't searching for the number :p
13:37:27  <blathijs> And bitmap fonts?
13:37:32  <Rubidium> that too
13:37:33  <blathijs> Or are we using TT all over?
13:37:54  <Rubidium> we default to the bitmap font
13:38:01  <frosch123> blathijs: easier to write an external tool that can access bananas :)
13:38:10  <Rubidium> frosch123: why?
13:38:29  <Rubidium> <- that's basically what you need (for Debian)
13:39:32  <Rubidium> either you install the (unfinished) opengfx graphics or you install the stubs for the original graphics, which you then need to copy from your CD
13:40:22  <blathijs> Where can I enable truetype rendering?
13:40:40  <Rubidium> set a font in the config file
13:40:52  <Rubidium> or use a language whose characters are not in the default font set
13:41:37  <fonsinchen> Has anyone got some experience running gdb in mingw?
13:42:04  <blathijs> Rubidium: Hmm, the diff.gz in that directory is gzip'd twice :-)
13:42:30  <fonsinchen> I'd like to interrupt an openttd running in gdb, but CTRL-C leads to termination of gdb instead.
13:43:44  <blathijs> Rubidium: What font does it default to in the latter case then?
13:44:18  <Rubidium> the font that fontconfig thinks is the best for the given iso language code (en_GB/en_US/nl_NL/nl_BE/etc)
13:44:35  <Rubidium> and that language code is stored in the language file
13:45:49  <Rubidium> that ofcourse requires the binary to be built with fontconfig and freetype
13:46:22  <Rubidium> and good luck with making lintian and friends shut up about the generated .debs ;)
13:47:28  <Rubidium> which is due to the fact that icu-config does not allow us to chose a specific sub library and just tells us to link to *all* icu libraries
13:47:42  <Rubidium> see for the warnings
13:48:52  <blathijs> Rubidium: Ah, fontconfig can do the guessing :-)
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14:04:22  <CIA-9> OpenTTD: alberth * r16052 /trunk/src/vehicle_gui.cpp: -Codechange: Applying VehicleRefitWidgets in RefitWindow, fixed widget number comment in _vehicle_refit_widgets
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14:09:52  <LUADuck> Is there anyway to restrict MagLev in a game?
14:10:04  <LUADuck> or does that need a source edit
14:10:08  <CIA-9> OpenTTD: alberth * r16053 /trunk/src/vehicle_gui.cpp: -Codechange: Added nested widgets to vehicle refit and vehicle details windows.
14:10:37  <yorick> LUADuck: how do you mean?
14:10:56  <LUADuck> I need a Monorail-only game
14:11:22  <SmatZ> you can code a simple GRF for that
14:11:41  <SmatZ> or end your game in 2020 :-p
14:11:44  <LUADuck> meh
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14:31:18  <fonsinchen> How do you debug openttd on windows? There must be someone who has done that ...
14:31:52  <TrueBrain> the same as on any other system: with a debugger
14:32:08  <fonsinchen> gdb has quirks in mingw
14:32:15  <TrueBrain> then use MSVC
14:32:16  <fonsinchen> I can't interrupt openttd
14:32:44  <fonsinchen> Can I debug a mingw-compiled openttd with that?
14:32:57  <TrueBrain> or else you make a msvc compiled binary
14:32:59  <yorick> gdb works here with mingw
14:33:08  <fonsinchen> how do you interrupt?
14:33:35  <yorick> specify breakpoint?
14:34:12  <fonsinchen> I don't know where. I want to wait until it hits the infinite loop, then press a key combo to interrupt it and examine the backtrace
14:34:34  <fonsinchen> An msvc compiled binary won't help with a mingw-specific problem
14:35:16  <fonsinchen> On Linux you can press CTRL-C in gdb to interrupt the program
14:35:26  <fonsinchen> on mingw it interrupts gdb instead
14:35:57  <blathijs> What's the official name for the content downloading stuff? "Content Download Service"? Or Downloading?
14:36:24  <yorick> try "start gdb openttd"
14:36:30  <yorick> instead of "gdb openttd"
14:36:36  <yorick> BaNaNaS
14:38:22  <blathijs> yorick: Which is an acronym for?
14:38:38  <fonsinchen> doesn't help. Now it doesn't catch the CTRL-C at all.
14:38:53  <blathijs> yorick: Ah, found it on
14:38:54  <yorick> Base graphics and Newgrfs and Noais And Scenarios
14:39:04  <TrueBrain> blathijs: or just: content service :)
14:39:09  <yorick> fonsinchen: try doing it inside openttd
14:39:41  <blathijs> TrueBrain: Ah, that works for me :-)
14:40:08  <yorick> tomatoes left to be...
14:40:33  <fonsinchen> nice, like this I should be able to catch it once at least ...
14:40:39  <fonsinchen> thanks
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14:58:45  <jonty-comp> thank you guys for clearing out the ottd forums :3
15:10:07  * TrueBrain finally gets idea for WT3 ...
15:10:08  <TrueBrain> about time :p
15:22:21  <Wolf01> nice, saved a game and now I can't load it -.-'''
15:22:55  <Wolf01> now worked
15:22:57  <Wolf01> bah
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15:31:39  <yorick> entering of complex characters fails (Chinese, Japanese, CJK), fee FS#2484 <-- LOL
15:40:26  *** orudge` [~orudge@2a01:348:178:0:21b:fcff:fe77:5692] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
15:43:00  <glx> it's just yet another OSX only bug
15:44:12  <EoD> Is it possible to add some text to a station name which the player can't change?
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16:16:27  <yorick> ok, FS#1829 is obsolete :/
16:17:47  <petern> why ":/" ?
16:18:49  <TrueBrain> [17:44] <EoD> Is it possible to add some text to a station name which the player can't change? <- then what use is it? :p
16:18:53  <yorick> because server-side string messages are no longer supported
16:19:07  <yorick> NETWORK_ACTION_SERVER_MESSAGE no longer supports string
16:22:16  <EoD> TrueBrain: For example a lock sign for "locked" airports
16:22:37  *** TinoDid is now known as TinoDidriksen
16:22:51  <TrueBrain> locked airports?
16:23:47  <EoD> airports which give no landing permissions to aircrafts
16:24:04  <TrueBrain> sounds useless, those airports :p
16:24:17  <Ammler> yorick: petern didn't ask, why obsolete, he asked why skeptical ;-)
16:25:02  <EoD> TrueBrain: that's not the issue ;)
16:26:03  <yorick> it could be fixed, I think
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16:29:06  <Aali> wow, another really stupid annoyance in MSVC
16:29:21  *** combuster [] has joined #openttd
16:29:44  <Aali> ctrl-c with nothing selected still copies one character from the current position
16:29:51  *** [alt]buster [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:31:14  <Aali> so, if you hit it by accident when pasting something, you've just replaced your clipboard with a single character
16:33:06  <EoD> in visual studio you copy a whole line when you press ctrl+c with nothing selected...
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16:34:33  <Aali> which version? I just get the character behind the current position :/
16:34:49  <EoD> 9.0
16:34:56  <EoD> or 2008
16:35:42  <Aali> hmm, maybe I should upgrade
16:36:18  *** snorre [] has joined #openttd
16:37:55  <Aali> I keep putting it off since I don't do much windows deving
16:38:05  *** snorre_ [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
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16:58:51  <EoD> Aali: Actually i don't recommend windows deving :)
16:59:45  <Aali> it's a real pain in the ass, but sometimes I have no other choice
17:00:19  <Aali> that or all the other choices are much worse :P
17:00:41  <yorick> when making a new gui, would I need to do old-style widget defs?
17:09:11  <Wolf01> bye
17:09:15  *** Wolf01 [] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.]
17:13:51  <petern> no
17:14:19  <yorick> :)
17:18:01  *** Frostregen [] has joined #openttd
17:18:31  <Zuu> The first coordinate in info-window is it the X or Y coordinate?
17:19:33  *** Swebonny [] has joined #openttd
17:19:55  <CIA-9> OpenTTD: glx * r16054 /trunk/src/vehicle_gui.cpp: -Fix: non advanced vehicle list didn't handle company switching correctly
17:20:07  <Swebonny> Hello guys, one question here. Is it possible to change the amount of money trough console?
17:20:25  <yorick> no.
17:20:37  <Swebonny> Ah ok
17:20:53  <Swebonny> Was a idiot that joined and spent them all on terraforming :/
17:21:20  <glx> password ;)
17:22:23  <Swebonny> Heh, it was supposed to be a server for the members of Facepunch forum, but seems like there are idiots there too.
17:22:31  <Zuu> Hmm, why does the shade move sideways of aircrafts when they land.. just to make it harder to figure out the holding rect?
17:22:38  <Swebonny> Oh, LUAduck is here.
17:23:48  <yorick> Zuu: ctrl-b?
17:24:46  <Zuu> yorick: Good tip, but unfortuanally not. I'll hack togeather an AI that put tiles on the aircraft locations. :)
17:24:52  <Zuu> put signs*
17:25:25  <yorick> pause-screenshot
17:25:29  <yorick> repeat
17:25:51  <yorick> and photoshop it together
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17:26:26  <EoD> Where is the definition of GetStation(uint index)?
17:26:42  <Zuu> yorick: How will that help me? Or is that an answer to someone else?
17:26:56  <yorick> no, you need to know the holding rect
17:27:16  <yorick> (the rectangle in which they circle, right?)
17:27:22  <Zuu> Yep
17:27:39  <yorick> can't you just comment out the line that makes them dirty before they move?
17:27:42  <Zuu> But the shade is not on the tiles that the aircrafts are on.
17:27:50  <yorick> oh, that
17:27:55  <yorick> hm
17:28:03  <Zuu> Because they shift sideways about a tile when they land.
17:28:10  <yorick> why do you need to know that
17:28:28  <Zuu> So to get it right I make an AI that puts signs on all tiles aircrafts visit, so I can probably figure that out.
17:28:41  *** DephNet[Paul] [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
17:28:56  <frosch123> EoD: oldpool.h, it is created by ## in some macro
17:29:02  <frosch123> DECLARE_OLD_POOL or so
17:29:06  <Zuu> NoAI don't provide any function to get number of airplanes waiting nor the size of holding pattern of airports, so I'll need to hardcode the holding patterns for now.
17:29:33  <Zuu> Getting the usage of stations is usefull so you know when they are crowdy or not.
17:29:41  <yorick> it isnt in airport_movement.h?
17:30:06  <EoD> frosch123: thx :) - now i have to figure out what's going on there...
17:30:11  <Zuu> You can probably get it from the source as well, but haven't checked there :)
17:31:04  <yorick> -31, 193, 1, 1, 257, 1, 273, 49
17:31:06  <CIA-9> OpenTTD: translators * r16055 /trunk/src/lang/ (7 files): (log message trimmed)
17:31:06  <CIA-9> OpenTTD: -Update: WebTranslator2 update to 2009-04-13 17:30:44
17:31:06  <CIA-9> OpenTTD: catalan - 10 fixed by arnaullv (10)
17:31:06  <CIA-9> OpenTTD: czech - 1 changed by Hadez (1)
17:31:08  <CIA-9> OpenTTD: finnish - 10 fixed by jpx_ (10)
17:31:08  <CIA-9> OpenTTD: french - 9 fixed by glx (9)
17:31:10  <yorick> for country airfield
17:31:10  <CIA-9> OpenTTD: german - 10 fixed by planetmaker (10)
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17:32:43  <yorick> north-east, north-west, south-west, south
17:32:46  <yorick> x,y
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18:10:32  <George3> There is no version of R16043 for win32?
18:10:37  *** George3 is now known as George
18:12:30  <Aali> you couldn't wait 30 minutes for the new nightly? :P
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18:14:59  <planetmaker> :)
18:15:53  *** phidah [] has joined #openttd
18:19:33  <George> no. I want to sleep :(
18:19:45  <petern> no
18:19:50  <petern> we don't make win32 builds any more
18:20:03  <George> :)
18:20:12  *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
18:20:31  <TrueBrain> it was too much effort for too little gain
18:20:49  <George> :)
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18:21:54  <EoD> you could make sparc/linux builds. Much effort for a lot of gain :-p
18:22:18  <TrueBrain> explain that 'gain' part please :p
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18:22:31  <EoD> I don't have to compile it myself anymore ;)
18:22:39  <Noldo> :D
18:22:39  <petern> gain in compile time
18:22:41  <TrueBrain> fair enough :)
18:22:56  <petern> i don't think i'd want to run it on my SS5
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18:23:25  <EoD> compiling openttd on my 500MHz sparc takes ~45min
18:23:37  <Noldo> how long does kernel take?
18:23:48  <Gazelle> hey, I was wondering, can you download the original transport tcyoon scenarios for open ttd ?
18:24:29  <petern> you can find them on your CD
18:24:33  <EoD> Noldo: Don't know. I always start compiling when i go to university and when i'm back it's finished ;)
18:24:54  <Noldo> EoD: use time make next time
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18:25:33  <EoD> but i have a relatively small kernel, so there is no real comparison
18:25:56  <petern> i can't remember the last time i regularly compiled kernels
18:26:23  <Gazelle> I dont have a cd, just downloaded the needed files from the transporttycoon website
18:26:48  <TrueBrain> Gazelle: that is illegal; we don't discuss illegal things here
18:27:15  <TrueBrain> (like telling in here you stole a car and wonder how you could now get it to start with a key instead of hotwiring ...)
18:27:26  <Gazelle> ok sorry
18:27:35  <Gazelle> but I thought it was free
18:27:55  <Gazelle> because it is such an old game?
18:28:06  <Gazelle> you cant buy it somewhere
18:28:07  <Gazelle> where can i?
18:28:18  <TrueBrain> so stealing a 30 year old car is not stealing .. I mean .. it is old!
18:29:39  <TrueBrain> I always refer to, but I am sure there are others out there which still sell the original Transport Tycoon Deluxe
18:29:53  <Gazelle> ok thanks!
18:29:54  <petern> no
18:29:59  <petern> because that's not legit
18:30:01  <petern> le sigh
18:30:05  <petern> anyway
18:30:09  <petern> the original scenarios suc
18:30:10  <petern> *suck
18:30:17  <Gazelle> why ?
18:30:25  <TrueBrain> petern: it isn't? That sucks :)
18:30:30  <petern> TrueBrain, you fool :p
18:30:53  <TrueBrain> petern: you know me :)
18:30:56  <petern> using that site is worse than just downloading it
18:31:07  <TrueBrain> petern: so give us a better alternative! :)
18:31:35  <Gazelle> hm but that site is legal?
18:31:40  <Gazelle> because you can also dwonload it there
18:31:42  <Gazelle> they say
18:31:45  <Gazelle> ok you have to pay..
18:31:48  <petern> that site it not legal
18:31:54  <Gazelle> but I can also host and ask payment
18:32:10  *** Zahl [~Zahl@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
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18:32:57  <KingJ> I remember looking at the prebuilt scenarios and thinking "How you could possibly do something this bad?"
18:33:25  <TrueBrain> there are nicer ones at BaNaNaS yes :)
18:33:56  <petern>
18:34:06  <Gazelle> but some of banananas are not working here
18:34:10  <Gazelle> because they are .sc0
18:34:18  <Gazelle> but you need svn or something like that, isnt it ?
18:34:29  <Gazelle> eh
18:34:30  <Gazelle> scn
18:34:57  <Gazelle> indeed petern
18:34:59  <Gazelle> it is not legal
18:35:21  <TrueBrain> petern: nasty :)
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18:59:02  <Ammler> petern: I thought, openttd doesn't link to "illegal" original graphics pages?
19:01:15  <Ammler> else it would be better to link to tt-forums thread then that page.
19:01:24  <Prof_Frink> 3407!
19:19:42  <petern> Ammler, what?
19:20:18  *** welshdragon [~welshdrag@] has joined #openttd
19:20:22  <Ammler> well, sorry, it was TrueBrain first refering to that "bad" site.
19:21:11  <Ammler> just liked to mention if you link that page, you should also link the pages from i.e. orudge.
19:21:12  *** Swebonny [] has quit [Quit: ajax IRC Client]
19:21:23  <petern> well no
19:21:25  <TrueBrain> @kban Ammler 30 Either read the whole conversation, or don't speak at all
19:21:26  *** mode/#openttd [+b *!] by DorpsGek
19:21:26  *** Ammler was kicked from #openttd by DorpsGek [Either read the whole conversation, or don't speak at all]
19:21:32  <petern> :D
19:21:54  <orudge> "
19:21:54  <orudge> The other patches that we sell are owned and programmed by us. They do
19:21:54  <orudge> not use any of the game's software code and do not infringe any
19:21:54  <orudge> trademarks or copyrights.
19:21:54  <orudge> "
19:21:57  *** mode/#openttd [-b *!] by DorpsGek
19:21:57  <orudge> which is clearely a load of rubbish
19:23:01  <TrueBrain> if he would just have read that petern was correcting me for pasting that site .. but no .. he just had to start saying the same thing all over again :(
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19:23:11  <glx> they own and program ttdpatch?
19:23:23  <Nite_Owl> Hello all
19:23:39  <orudge> glx: it must be patchman behind it!
19:24:38  <TrueBrain> ghehe :)
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19:28:54  <Sacro> Gazelle: the original Transport Tycoon didn't come with Scenarios
19:29:05  <TinoDidriksen> I love how their product page for Transport Tycoon Collection says "Star Control is a science-fiction wargame which pits the forces of the Alliance of Free Stars..."
19:29:07  <Sacro> I don't think they appeared till Deluxe
19:32:26  <orudge> Sacro: World Editor
19:33:06  <petern> GAH
19:33:10  <petern> if there is one thing
19:33:12  <petern> more annoying
19:33:20  <petern> that trying to play a music score with 4 staves
19:33:21  <petern> it is
19:33:36  <petern> trying to play a music score with 4 staves whilst the page keeps turning back by itself
19:34:04  <Sacro> orudge: hmm, still, none in the original
19:35:20  <orudge> Sacro: no, but the World Editor is an add-on for the original
19:35:23  <orudge> none in the original original, no
19:35:34  <orudge> but you were wrong about "not appearing until Deluxe" is what I was meaning
19:35:34  <orudge> ;)
19:36:23  <Sacro> Oh true
19:36:27  <Sacro> I only had TTO
19:36:33  <Sacro> kinda skipped TTD, couldn't get into TTDP
19:36:36  <Sacro> loving OTTD
19:36:42  <orudge> skipped TTD? :o
19:36:46  * orudge got TTD when he first got the Internet
19:36:47  <petern> also
19:36:48  <orudge> found it on some web site
19:36:51  <orudge> took about 45 minutes to download
19:36:54  <yorick> I never had TTO or TTD
19:36:55  <petern> the score for wicked is evil
19:36:56  <orudge> it was all new and different
19:36:58  <petern> so i gave up on that
19:37:22  <orudge> then I found TTDPatch a while later, but thought it was some kind of cheat program
19:37:24  <orudge> and didn't want it
19:37:30  <orudge> kept an eye out on it though
19:37:36  <orudge> and saw it coming out with all these fancy features
19:37:49  <orudge> throughout this time, I was always playing the DOS version of TTD, too, until I got Windows XP and couldn't
19:37:58  <orudge> it was always smoother and more reliable than the Windows version, on Win98 at least
19:44:00  *** KritiK [] has joined #openttd
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19:46:53  *** Maarten is now known as Guest321
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20:17:33  <Kojiri> I have a bug with debian
20:17:54  <TrueBrain> and you join #openttd
20:17:57  <TrueBrain> this should be good :)
20:18:22  <Kojiri> imim lying the debians kicked me
20:18:42  <Kojiri> they tkae it too seriously
20:19:14  <TrueBrain> I wonder how long it takes you to get kicked here
20:19:25  <Kojiri> why?
20:19:27  * TrueBrain sits down at a place with a nice view over this channel
20:19:40  <Kojiri> fag
20:20:14  <welshdragon> Kojiri: go moan on another channel, unless it relates to the game #openttd?
20:20:32  <welshdragon> er, OpenTTD even
20:20:36  <Kojiri> which game?
20:21:51  *** Ameecher [] has joined #openttd
20:22:34  *** Mucht [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20:22:42  <jonty-comp> do you even know what OpenTTD is? D:
20:22:47  <frosch123> it's not a game, it's serious business
20:22:49  <orudge> jonty-comp: do you know what OpenTTD is?
20:22:55  <Ameecher> where am I?
20:22:56  <jonty-comp> touché
20:23:02  <orudge> what are birds?
20:23:04  * orudge waits for Prof_Frink
20:23:04  <Guest321> Kojiri: Didn't you know you that linux users are not allowed to ask questions and are supposed to figure out everything for themselves by using the "man" command? The channels here are just to talk about chicks etc.
20:23:18  <jonty-comp> yes, chicks
20:23:23  <jonty-comp> I saw a nice chick today
20:23:26  <orudge> did you eat it?
20:23:28  <Prof_Frink> What is water?
20:23:30  <TrueBrain> I did :)
20:23:33  <jonty-comp> no, I did not eat it
20:23:38  <jonty-comp> it was rather raw
20:23:46  <Ameecher> not much meat on chicks
20:23:47  <Nite_Owl> peeps
20:23:47  <Kojiri> talk about chicks? you guys never get pussy fuckin homo's
20:23:57  <TrueBrain> @kban Kojiri 10000000 strike 3
20:23:58  *** mode/#openttd [+b *!] by DorpsGek
20:23:58  *** Kojiri was kicked from #openttd by DorpsGek [strike 3]
20:23:58  <Ameecher> oh really?
20:24:06  <Ameecher> boo
20:24:06  <Guest321> lol
20:24:07  *** Mucht [] has joined #openttd
20:24:09  <TrueBrain> I love my job :)
20:24:12  <jonty-comp> aww
20:24:14  <jonty-comp> spoilsport
20:24:19  <welshdragon> TrueBrain: lol, awesome
20:24:20  <Guest321> no wonder he got kicked from #debian
20:24:20  * jonty-comp complains at DorpsGek
20:24:21  <Ameecher> time to leave since all the sport has gone
20:24:31  <TrueBrain> I wonder why I gave a time with the kban ...
20:24:40  <TinoDidriksen> Wasn't he the same troll who wanted material for Bash?
20:24:41  <Prof_Frink> Pfft, sport
20:24:46  <frosch123> @calc 10000000 / 3600 / 24
20:24:46  <DorpsGek> frosch123: 115.740740741
20:24:46  <TrueBrain> Ameecher: so you only came to see how long Kojiri survived?
20:24:54  <Ameecher> pretty much
20:24:59  <TrueBrain> TinoDidriksen: it was :p
20:25:01  <jonty-comp> you needed more 0s there TrueBrain D:
20:25:06  <Ameecher> I can't say I can contribute much else to this channel
20:25:10  <Ameecher> or any channel really
20:25:10  <jonty-comp> in 115.7 days he will be back!
20:25:15  <TrueBrain> Ameecher: it was not our first 'visit' of him, so ... :)
20:25:16  <jonty-comp> and god help us all then.
20:25:23  <Ameecher> W-hoo!
20:25:39  <welshdragon> can you not set an infinite ban?
20:25:43  <Ameecher> oh wait, I have to hang around for a third of a year before he returns? sod that
20:25:51  <TrueBrain> welshdragon: that would have been better .. but no fun ;)
20:26:00  <jonty-comp> just keep adding 0s until it overflows
20:26:21  <Nite_Owl> do you have marshmallow peeps 'over there'
20:26:32  <glx> Guest321: change your nick
20:26:36  * yorick makes note to see if he will return
20:26:36  <EoD> jonty-comp: so he will be banned for -10000000 days? How does that work?
20:26:37  <Prof_Frink> TrueBrain: So I have 115 days to invent that stab-in-the-face-over-IP machine?
20:26:44  <jonty-comp> EoD: something like that
20:26:46  <jonty-comp> crashes OFTC
20:26:50  *** Progman [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20:26:51  <yorick> it'd be maarten
20:27:01  <TrueBrain> Prof_Frink: let me know when it is finished :)
20:27:19  <jonty-comp> hmm, WMD-over-IP
20:27:56  *** yorick [] has quit [Quit: Poef!]
20:29:56  <Prof_Frink> TrueBrain: You'll be the second person I tell.
20:30:05  <Prof_Frink> Right *after* the patent office.
20:30:10  <TrueBrain> I hope you just send me a prototype
20:30:14  <TrueBrain> so you can stab me over and over :p
20:31:08  <Nite_Owl>
20:31:43  <TrueBrain> a) why did I just open that site
20:31:44  <TrueBrain> b) wtf?
20:31:53  <glx> same for me :)
20:31:56  <Rubidium> c) thank you, now I don't have to open it ;)
20:31:58  <TrueBrain> that is just sick! :p
20:32:11  <TrueBrain> clearly I trust Nite_Owl .. doesn't happen too often in this channel :p
20:32:14  * EoD too... peer pressure
20:32:19  <TrueBrain> "For extra entertainment at any Easter gathering.... put some Peeps in the microwave and watch them expand until they explode! Marshmallowy goodness everywhere!"
20:32:43  <Rubidium> :O the first 0.7-ish server I see with more than 11 players ;)
20:32:53  * TrueBrain parties
20:32:59  <Nite_Owl> I was asking if you all had marshmallow peeps on the other side of the pond
20:33:57  <Nite_Owl> no answered so I thought that you did not know what peeps are so I showed you an example
20:34:07  <TrueBrain> ;)
20:34:10  <Nite_Owl> *no one
20:35:02  <frosch123> "dentists luv us! tm" ...
20:36:32  <LUADuck> Anyone know of any way to find out who's deleting all our co-op rails?
20:37:22  <welshdragon> Nite_Owl: never heard of them in the UK
20:37:36  <welshdragon> LUADuck: are you a server host?
20:38:02  * Zuu lols at PAXLink for building *lots of* buses just becuase the the number of waiting pax at the airport got below the threashold for some time. :)
20:38:55  <Nite_Owl> Thank you welshdragon - that answers my question
20:38:55  <frosch123> you are building more busses the less passengers are there?
20:39:08  <frosch123> there are?
20:39:45  <Zuu> frosch123: Nope, but it takes time for passengers to be deliveried, and for every x tick that there is to few passengers it builds a new bus, if there is enough waiting in town.
20:39:49  <Nite_Owl> peeps are an Easter tradition in the US
20:40:39  <frosch123> hmm, somehow all ais seem to react on jams with building more vehicles
20:41:04  <Zuu> I have just added code to do the opposite for stations :)
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20:41:44  <Zuu> By measure number of vehicles in the stations over time. (and number of aircrafts in queue for airport)
20:43:19  <Zuu> But if there would be a jam between stations it will still build more vehicles untill the jam impact the number of vehicles in the bus stops.
20:43:41  <Zuu> (this is in a yet to be released version of PAXLink)
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20:47:47  <LUADuck> welsh: Yes
20:48:50  <Sacro> LUADuck: press tab to complete nicks
20:49:01  <LUADuck> Ok, now we've got a guy deleting orders, we need to know who it is
20:49:56  <glx> it's not possible
20:50:36  <glx> you can just know who play is in the company
20:50:44  <LUADuck> arf
20:50:47  <TinoDidriksen> No togglable action log?
20:50:48  <LUADuck> this is fun
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21:30:35  <CIA-9> OpenTTD: rubidium * r16056 /trunk/src/order_gui.cpp: -Fix (r16037): clicking twice on the "end of orders" crashed.
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21:56:46  <Patrick> does the new PBS work with YAPF?
21:57:13  <Zuu> Yes?
21:57:37  <Zuu> If you talk about PBS in 0.7.0
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21:59:30  <Patrick> yeah
22:00:09  <Patrick> hey, so I have an idea with big-load stations I've been throwing around, wondered if anyone had come up with it or had some thought
22:00:39  <Patrick> if I have a stream of tightly-packed trains and I break that up by putting them into a station, it's going to break the stream pattern
22:00:40  <Aali> there's really no reason to use anything but yapf for trains in 0.7
22:00:47  <Patrick> i.e. trains won't reassemble at all
22:00:54  <Patrick> ones will wait
22:00:55  <Patrick> etc
22:01:15  <Patrick> but if every single path through the station is the same length, then every single train should take the same length of time in the station
22:01:21  <Patrick> and thus reassemble seamlessly
22:01:55  <Aali> loading/unloading times will mess up that scheme though
22:02:42  <Patrick> they'd all be full loads of the same cargo
22:02:44  <Patrick> identical trains
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22:03:08  <Patrick> openttdcoop would have a better handle on heavy-load concepts but I get the feeling it's more of a brute force approach over there
22:03:24  <Patrick> I'm going for almost, the maths and pushing the boundaries of networking
22:03:32  <Ameecher> Aali, would be fine with timetabling
22:03:47  <Ameecher> ie, make them load for the same length of time and leave regardless of cargo
22:04:04  <Patrick> would also work
22:04:18  <Patrick> now I just need to program a calculator to tell me how many platforms I need to host for a full stream :)
22:04:31  <Patrick> it's somewhere between 4 and 5 for monorail
22:06:00  <planetmaker> that depends upon train length
22:06:10  <planetmaker> train speed, wagon loading speed
22:10:20  <Patrick> well, yes, I figured that much out :P
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22:21:51  <Cutter> hello
22:21:56  <Zuu> Hello Cutter
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22:27:33  <CIA-9> OpenTTD: rubidium * r16057 /trunk/src/ (station_cmd.cpp train_cmd.cpp): -Fix [FS#2834] (r16037): division by zero when having an order with only one station that has either middle or near end stop location and where the platform is (significantly) longer than the train.
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22:37:02  <Cutter> I would like to know how to increase the font size
22:37:27  <Cutter> I haven't found this setting in the preferences, nor in the config file
22:37:44  <Rubidium> large/medium/small_size ?
22:38:42  <Cutter> how to switch from one to another?
22:39:09  <Patrick> so what's the rationale with one-way PBS?
22:39:18  <glx> you don't, you just change the values
22:39:29  <Cutter> ok
22:39:29  <Patrick> how is it different from normal signal directions?
22:39:51  <Cutter> what where the values in v0.6.3?
22:39:56  <Cutter> *what were
22:40:03  <Zuu> The non-one-way PBS signal can be passed from behind, given that a path can be reserved to a front side of another signal.
22:40:03  <Patrick> I guess it made more sense to have two signal types than depend on signals being placed on both sides or not
22:40:11  <Rubidium> the same as in 0.7.0
22:40:22  <Patrick> I meant more the design of having them like that
22:40:25  <glx> just 0.6.3 didn't autoselect a font ;)
22:40:30  <Cutter> did the font change?
22:40:40  <glx> default are 6, 10, ?
22:40:51  <Cutter> 6, 10, 16
22:41:01  <Cutter> but the font appeared larger in 0.6.3
22:41:02  <glx> I use 7, 11, 18 with arial
22:41:08  <Patrick> Zuu: ok, so is it more realistic, what?
22:41:16  <Patrick> does it let you build much cooler networks?
22:41:19  <Rubidium> Cutter: in 0.6.3 your language would have missing characters
22:41:31  <Zuu> Patrick: Try it out :)
22:41:52  <Patrick> well, I can prove on a test network that they behave like that
22:41:55  <glx> oh Cutter, it's because µ :)
22:42:00  <Patrick> but I'm not going to easily see the rationale
22:42:12  <Patrick> aaah
22:42:21  <Patrick> actually, I remember reading a wiki about "realistic signalling
22:42:36  <Patrick> it lets trains temporarily go on the "wrong side" as long as they can get back
22:42:42  <Cutter> does openttd now use system fonts?
22:42:53  <Patrick> niiiice
22:43:37  <glx> yes, it select the first system font able do draw all chars in language file
22:43:40  <Rubidium> if your language contains characters that are not part of the base font then it does use the system fonts
22:43:58  <glx> Rubidium: he's french, and the missing char is µ
22:44:06  <glx> (OSK)
22:44:33  <Rubidium> why's that character on your keyboard anyway?
22:44:42  <Rubidium> is it that useful?
22:44:49  <Cutter> if that's the only missing char, I will switch back to the default language
22:45:04  <Rubidium> (can't remember writing that character during French class)
22:45:05  <glx> yes it's useful to type µtorrent ;)
22:45:33  <glx> dunno why AZERTY creators decided to put it on the keyboard
22:45:54  <Patrick> so my option for "show building tools for when no suitable vehicles are available" but I still can't build monorail or maglev early
22:45:57  <Patrick> whats' the deal with that?
22:46:06  <Rubidium> anyways, /me is off to sleep
22:46:28  <Cutter> can I switch back to the font used in 0.6.3 without changing keyboard layout or game language?
22:46:38  <Nite_Owl> later Rubidium
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22:47:02  <Rubidium> compile without freetype support
22:47:17  *** carter [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
22:47:17  <glx> you can also set a non existing font for *_font
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22:49:47  <glx> hmm no that doesn't work it seems
22:49:50  <Cutter> glx: doesn't work
22:52:29  <glx> try "arial bold" with 7, 11, 18
22:52:34  <DJNekkid> is it "out of the box" easy to reverse a trains 8sprite direction to opposite, just by adding something to its reference in VarAction2's?
22:52:43  <DJNekkid> i.e. A0 80
22:52:46  <DJNekkid> or A0 FF
22:52:49  <DJNekkid> or similar
22:52:51  <DJNekkid> ?
22:53:07  <DJNekkid> (instead of A0 00)
22:54:48  <Cutter> arial bold doesn't work but verdana bold does
22:54:54  <Cutter> why?
22:56:41  <glx> don't set any font, start "openttd -dfreetype1" and check what is the fallback font
22:58:53  <Cutter> glx: then the same font as with default settings is used
22:59:15  <glx> I mean the text in the console :)
22:59:30  <Cutter> a message says "using sprite font" before the game starts
22:59:46  <Cutter> this font doesn't look like the one from 0.6.3
23:00:27  <glx> and the language is set to french?
23:00:54  <Cutter> yes
23:00:55  <Cutter> language = french.lng
23:01:40  <glx> for me it says "using sprite font" "using sprite font" "fallback font" "using sprite font" "fallback font"
23:02:36  <glx> and when you change language it retry to detect a suitable font
23:03:31  <Cutter> when I switch to English the font is right
23:03:44  <glx> that's sprite font
23:03:53  <glx> (included in TTD files)
23:04:27  <Cutter> so the console is lying about using sprite font when I add the -dfreetype1 parameter
23:05:14  <Cutter> uh sorry there's more messages later
23:05:22  <Cutter> which I didn't see
23:05:32  <Cutter> because of fulscreen
23:05:41  <Cutter> Fallback font: Arial
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23:06:55  <glx> anyway the only way is to specify the font in openttd.cfg
23:07:21  <Cutter> may I specify "Sprite" or something like that?
23:07:26  <glx> no
23:07:55  <glx> IIRC tahoma bold is quite similar to sprite font
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23:09:18  <glx> but you can do some testing and use what looks the best for you
23:09:35  <glx> even comic if you want ;)
23:09:41  <Cutter> Tahoma will do
23:09:43  <Cutter> thanks :)
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23:14:55  <Patrick> how do I do "transfer and leave empty" in 0.7 ?
23:15:27  <Patrick> ah never mind
23:15:35  <Patrick> a most elegant new design
23:15:36  <Nite_Owl> Time to fly - later all
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23:41:38  <EoD> i'm off. Good night
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