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00:00:51 *** fjb [~frank@p5485C4D4.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:05:44 *** fjb [~frank@p5485C4D4.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 00:12:15 *** Fast2 [~Fast2@p57AF9A70.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:15:52 *** aber [~Adium@gb049.stw.stud.uni-saarland.de] has joined #openttd 00:20:35 <aber> you guys have not so much luck with mac developers... 00:21:45 *** KritiK [~Maxim@95-27-200-9.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:22:54 *** doclzor\afk [~steffen@ti541210a080-0936.bb.online.no] has quit [] 00:23:21 <Eddi|zuHause> piro: try readin up on transfer orders. but generally you can only transfer in one direction, so its use is diminished for bi-directional cargos like passenger, mail or valuables. they are better suited for single direction cargos. 00:24:13 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: TschÃŒÃ] 00:24:41 <Eddi|zuHause> so you can either transport passengers from the town to the dock/airport, or from the dock/airport to the town, but not both 00:29:02 *** Mazur [~mazur@53551A99.cable.casema.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:36:18 *** aber [~Adium@gb049.stw.stud.uni-saarland.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 00:38:24 *** Polygon [~Poly@x0581b.wh7.tu-dresden.de] has quit [Quit: Flieht, ihr Narren!] 00:39:42 *** Devroush [~dennis@94-225-72-20.access.telenet.be] has quit [] 01:00:37 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@a62-251-30-68.adsl.xs4all.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:19:05 *** ajmiles [~aj@78-86-188-187.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:22:34 *** OwenS [~owenshep@cpc1-stkn14-2-0-cust562.11-2.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:36:47 <piro> What is the point of making longer train stations? 01:37:14 <fjb> Handling longer trains. 01:38:50 <De_Ghosty> if ur train is longer than platform the train that doesn't fit is delayed in loading/unloading 01:39:03 <DJNekkid> yes 01:39:29 <DJNekkid> if that were a q' 01:45:40 <piro> This game is so awesome 01:51:43 *** Biolunar_ [mahdi@blfd-4db1babc.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 01:56:15 *** Biolunar is now known as Guest1976 01:56:15 *** Biolunar_ is now known as Biolunar 01:59:01 *** Guest1976 [mahdi@blfd-4db1865c.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:06:16 *** Scriptdaemon [~KennyW@139.182.11.192] has joined #openttd 02:07:06 <Scriptdaemon> Does OpenTTD save anything to the registry in Windows (specifically, the .zip download)? 02:08:30 <Scriptdaemon> And if not, is there a way (e.g. command line argument) to change the settings directory? 02:08:56 <glx> it's explained in the readme 02:13:02 <Scriptdaemon> Alright, thank you. I'm developing a PortableApps.com package for OpenTTD. :) 02:17:31 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: glx * r19596 /trunk/src/network/network_internal.h: -Fix (r19593): dedicated server always fast forwarding if compiled without DEBUG_DUMP_COMMANDS 02:17:59 *** DanMacK [~here@65.94.201.53] has quit [] 02:25:18 *** Scriptdaemon [~KennyW@139.182.11.192] has quit [Quit: Politeness, n. The most acceptable hypocrisy.] 02:45:52 *** re06011988 [~wanoo@modemcable077.126-80-70.mc.videotron.ca] has left #openttd [] 02:48:58 *** Singaporekid [~notme@cm11.epsilon84.maxonline.com.sg] has joined #openttd 03:02:10 *** Fuco [~dota.keys@fuco.sks3.muni.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 03:05:07 *** Phazorx [~pavelkoll@77.239.236.193] has quit [Quit: Phazorx] 03:05:51 <Eddi|zuHause> gnah... my new (<1 year) mouse's mouse wheel is giving up... 03:08:58 *** welshdragon [~markmac@147.143.254.98] has quit [Quit: welshdragon] 03:10:39 *** lllugo [~lugo@mgdb-4db8da23.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 03:10:43 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:7dac:e9e7:263f:e126] has quit [Quit: bye] 03:11:22 <Eddi|zuHause> and it wasn't the cheapest mouse either... 03:13:41 <piro> So there is pretty much no way to easily replace lots of old vehicles if there's no better vehicles being offered, correct? 03:14:14 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, there is 03:14:26 <De_Ghosty> auto replace in options 03:14:28 <Eddi|zuHause> in advanced settings->vehicles->replace vehicles when they are old 03:15:27 <Eddi|zuHause> the english language is missing the equivalent of the german word "doch"... 03:18:02 *** llugo [~lugo@mgdb-4db8c842.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 03:19:12 *** NevEragon [639fd59f@webchat.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 03:31:50 <moot> IF YOU DO NOT COPY THIS TEXT TO 8 & 1/2 PEOPLE THERE WILL BE 2 BEARS EVERY TIME U OPEN A DOOR FOREVER!!! 03:37:49 <SirSquidness> crap. 03:37:50 <SirSquidness> oh no. 03:38:22 <piro> Eddi|zuHause: Bad ass. Thank you 03:38:50 *** De_Ghosty [~s@69-196-174-117.dsl.teksavvy.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 03:39:47 *** De_Ghosty [~s@206-248-170-129.dsl.teksavvy.com] has joined #openttd 03:40:31 <piro> Also, if I have a bunch of vehicles going to a particular station, can I change the route of a bunch of them at once? 03:40:36 <piro> Without doing order sharing 03:40:55 <piro> (Because I don't like the permanence of order sharing) 03:42:48 <Eddi|zuHause> no 03:42:55 <Eddi|zuHause> either all or nothing 03:44:45 <NevEragon> hrm, i got openttd a few days ago and ive been playing with it, but for the life of me, i cant get teh convert rail button to work... i just get "no suitable railroad track" every time. Is anyone familiar with this problem? 03:49:28 <Eddi|zuHause> NevEragon: you need to select a different railtype than you already have built 03:50:23 <NevEragon> oh hey, i didnt notice i should hold down the rail button, thanks 03:50:29 <NevEragon> thnx Eddi|zuHause 03:50:32 <Eddi|zuHause> click and hold the rail button in the main toolbar 04:00:37 *** ptr [~peter@c213-89-142-224.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:00:50 *** NevEragon [639fd59f@webchat.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 04:01:58 *** ptr [~peter@c213-89-142-224.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #openttd 04:04:33 <piro> Is there a way to show nearest depot? I can't find a depot I placed O_o 04:05:39 <Eddi|zuHause> use ctrl+x 04:07:11 <piro> What are depots considered? Stations? 04:07:24 <piro> Er, buildables. Sorry 04:08:11 <Eddi|zuHause> "stations" means all player property, including depots 04:19:10 <piro> Ok, next question :) If a station at a city is producing crap tons of passengers, does it help to create a second station? As in, does it split the load? 04:20:47 <__ln__> good morning 04:39:25 <yuriks_> do entry-exit pairs cross regular block signals? 04:40:11 *** NCommander [~mcasadeva@cpe-74-74-175-159.rochester.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 04:40:13 <NCommander> Hey all 04:47:46 * NCommander is starting to learn to play OpenTTD, and is feeling a bit overwhelmed 04:57:55 <piro> NCommander: Haha. Yes 04:58:15 <NCommander> piro: I'm also having issues with signals, although I think I'm finally getting it (although I'm too scared to turn on an AI player :-/) 05:00:10 * NCommander hasn't even turned on any NewGFXs or figure dout how add them :-/ 05:00:43 *** bryjen [~bryjen@75.81.201.131] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 05:05:48 <NCommander> Stupid quesiton, but if I want to build a second track to a station, why is it look different if I put two side by side versus build it initially with two (or more), am I doing something wrong? 05:09:28 <yuriks_> nah, it just doesn't update 05:09:40 <yuriks_> it's for all intents and purposes the same thing though, except graphically 05:09:55 <NCommander> ah, thanks 05:10:04 * NCommander is now trying to figure out how to use time tables effectively 05:10:15 <yuriks_> I havn't even looked at them yet =P 05:10:17 <yuriks_> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1990844/2010-04/Brunnwell%20Transport%2C%2025th%20Dec%201965.png 05:10:22 <yuriks_> my lovely station design ^_^ 05:14:22 * NCommander is making progress at learning how to build decent stations and hubs I think 05:14:36 <NCommander> yuriks_: OOOH, thats nice! 05:16:40 * NCommander is going to see if he can get his spur line trains being profitable in both directions by towing some empty steel cars 05:16:58 <De_Ghosty> that thing is 05:17:00 <De_Ghosty> errrrrrrrrrrrrr 05:18:06 <NCommander> De_Ghosty: well, I want to bring raw supplies up, and then have it bring back any steel from the foundary thats available 05:18:06 <yuriks_> De_Ghosty: problem? XD 05:18:21 <NCommander> Transport it to my hub station, and then have another train from there take it and bring it over to the factory 05:18:35 <yuriks_> hub stations.... that sounds like a nice idea 05:18:46 <yuriks_> currently I'm just hauling everything directly 05:18:51 <NCommander> yuriks_: I'll shot you what mine looks like if I can get this to work 05:18:55 * NCommander has bad luck with signals 05:19:05 <yuriks_> it took me a while to get the hang of then 05:19:06 <De_Ghosty> transfer is slowwwwwwwwwww 05:19:18 <De_Ghosty> yuriks_ there is a type of signal 05:19:21 <De_Ghosty> with 2 lights 05:19:32 <NCommander> De_Ghosty: not if the train is already running between those stations. This way instead of having one run be completely unprofitable, it can work in both 05:19:39 <yuriks_> and my trains still deadlock sometimes, they stopped since I gave up on combined Terminus-RoRo though =P 05:19:52 <yuriks_> De_Ghosty: the path ones? 05:19:56 <De_Ghosty> yea 05:20:02 <NCommander> The hills suck though, I need two engines on each train to get them moving quickly 05:20:05 <yuriks_> what about them? for my station? 05:20:10 <De_Ghosty> yes 05:20:14 <yuriks_> NCommander: realistic acceleration path ftw <_< >_> 05:20:15 <De_Ghosty> they are lazy man signals 05:20:23 <yuriks_> De_Ghosty: indeed they are =) 05:20:30 <NCommander> yuriks_: ? 05:20:34 <NCommander> Where do I turn that on? 05:20:35 <yuriks_> patch* 05:20:40 <yuriks_> advanced options 05:20:48 <yuriks_> http://wiki.openttd.org/Realistic_acceleration 05:21:38 <yuriks_> De_Ghosty: you're suggesting replacing all signals on my stations with path ones? 05:21:48 <NCommander> yuriks_: do I need a NewGFX for that? 05:21:53 <yuriks_> no... 05:22:12 <yuriks_> you don't need newgfx for anything afaik =-P 05:22:14 * yuriks_ doesn't use it 05:23:34 <yuriks_> hmmm, why is this water train always bringing up a net loss 05:23:45 <NCommander> yuriks_: I don't see to have it in my openttd 05:23:52 <yuriks_> NCommander: you do 05:24:20 *** Mazur [~mazur@53551A99.cable.casema.nl] has joined #openttd 05:24:28 *** nighthawk_c_m [~nighthawk@pD95047B1.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 05:24:55 <De_Ghosty> no your fine 05:24:59 <De_Ghosty> err 05:25:04 <De_Ghosty> they wait too long too slow? 05:25:54 <yuriks_> De_Ghosty: hmm, yeah, they wait quite a bit I think, water supply is just 40k a month 05:26:05 <yuriks_> but I'm trying to bring that up by having a train always idle there loading 05:26:06 * NCommander has some junctions he has to optimize 05:26:52 <yuriks_> De_Ghosty: it also travels very far =P 05:28:13 <yuriks_> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1990844/2010-04/Brunnwell%20Transport%2C%2025th%20May%201967.png 05:28:20 <yuriks_> this is my horrible home-made junction =P 05:28:46 *** ecke [~ecke@188.75.128.2] has quit [Quit: ecke] 05:29:06 <yuriks_> also, is that return on the back thing I did on the top-most stations a horribly bad idea or is it fine? 05:32:19 <nighthawk_c_m> design can be simplified with faster access to the Brunwell North, but that junction will cause trouble with faster trains 05:32:32 <NCommander> ok that's working 05:32:33 <NCommander> hrm 05:32:38 * NCommander needs to get his signals working 05:32:52 <yuriks_> nighthawk_c_m: yeah, it was kind of bolted on 05:33:16 <nighthawk_c_m> For thr Station try a Terminus with PBS 05:33:24 <nighthawk_c_m> its much smaller 05:33:31 <De_Ghosty> junctions are good if u have lots of train 05:33:45 <De_Ghosty> also fast and doesn't jam 05:34:03 <yuriks_> nighthawk_c_m: like I have on Brunnwell? (that's a slanted terminus) 05:34:08 <NCommander> I'm guessing I'm not using combo signals correctly 05:34:09 <De_Ghosty> tips : don't use such short turns it slows the trains down 05:34:22 <De_Ghosty> you two should play together :D 05:34:23 <yuriks_> De_Ghosty: yeah, comes from the bolted on part ;P 05:34:39 <nighthawk_c_m> http://wiki.openttd.org/images/c/cb/Terminus.png 05:34:52 <yuriks_> yup 05:35:12 <yuriks_> I was gonna use that, but though maybe that would be faster 05:35:32 <nighthawk_c_m> Oh that is pretty fast usually 05:35:41 <piro> Jesus. I can't keep up with the demand! 05:35:47 <piro> And towns are getting really angry at me :( 05:35:52 <nighthawk_c_m> I think it wont be slower 05:36:18 <nighthawk_c_m> For curves I had something .. gimme a sec 05:36:24 <yuriks_> any pointers on doing a junction to feed both stations? 05:36:40 <yuriks_> I need to redesign that whole mess, anyway 05:36:58 <NCommander> http://wiki.openttd.org/Tutorial:Two_Platforms what type of signals are those? 05:37:29 <yuriks_> looks like vanilla block signals 05:37:50 <nighthawk_c_m> well ... hmmmmm http://wiki.openttd.org/images/c/ce/3way_trackmerge.png 05:37:57 * NCommander is trying to get his station to work right, but I'm guessing combo is not the right type of signal 05:38:04 <nighthawk_c_m> http://wiki.openttd.org/Junction 05:38:06 <yuriks_> nighthawk_c_m: do two of those in a row? 05:38:43 <yuriks_> maybe I could do some kind of modified cloverleaf with exits/entrances at the loops 05:39:28 <nighthawk_c_m> Maybe, I never used a cloverleaf, I try to get my LL_RR Mainline with three sidelines to work 05:39:37 <piro> This is ridiculous. What the heck are you supposed to do when a town needs a bunch of crap but won't let you build anything? 05:39:48 <yuriks_> piro: plant trees, of course :) 05:39:55 <nighthawk_c_m> weait, plant trees, sleep with the mayors wife and so on 05:40:14 <yuriks_> how do I bribe towns, anyway? is it the 'rebuild roads' option? 05:41:00 <yuriks_> "LL_RR Mainline with three sidelines" what would that be? 05:41:04 <nighthawk_c_m> yeah, but prtetty expensive, dont do it unless you have enough cashflow 05:41:06 <yuriks_> two roads for each direction? 05:41:24 <nighthawk_c_m> no, gimme a sec, anyone have a good picture uploading place? 05:41:26 <NCommander> yuriks_: I don't get how to do it properly if the station is two tracks and an end point 05:41:35 <yuriks_> nighthawk_c_m: hmm, tinypic? 05:42:08 <yuriks_> NCommander: two tracks along the entire railway? 05:42:37 <NCommander> yuriks_: its two tracks feeding into a single station that can cross over each other but currently don't overlap 05:43:12 <yuriks_> NCommander: http://wiki.openttd.org/images/c/cb/Terminus.png 05:43:14 <yuriks_> NCommander: this? 05:43:30 <NCommander> That 05:43:33 <NCommander> No idea how to do that prpoerly 05:43:42 <yuriks_> well, the solution is in the screenshot ;P 05:43:47 <yuriks_> (the lower one) 05:43:54 <NCommander> heh 05:43:59 * NCommander fels retard 05:44:02 <NCommander> *retarded >.<; 05:44:09 <yuriks_> those are path signals 05:44:46 <NCommander> yuriks_: ugh, but they are still all read ... 05:44:53 <nighthawk_c_m> http://de.tinypic.com/view.php?pic=6pun7o&s=5 05:44:54 <yuriks_> how come I'm not transporting 100% of the production on this water supply if I always have a train loading there at all times? -_- 05:45:10 <yuriks_> NCommander: path signals are always red until a train approaches it 05:45:15 <NCommander> yuriks_: oh 05:45:24 * NCommander thinks he finally has a grip on signals! 05:45:28 <nighthawk_c_m> 100% is basically impossible unless you have a high end high speed engine etc 05:46:04 <NCommander> yup 05:46:06 <NCommander> that seems to work now 05:46:07 <NCommander> yay 05:46:07 <nighthawk_c_m> btw that screenshot shows mainline with a sideline junction, pretty basic, I just learned how to do them 05:46:31 <yuriks_> nighthawk_c_m: that seems to take a lot of space =P, tidy, though 05:46:40 <yuriks_> well, 'tidy', bridges and tunnels everywhere 05:47:16 <nighthawk_c_m> well, it is designed for a trainlength of 5 tiles (10 wagons including locos) so they dont slow down or jam 05:48:23 <yuriks_> oh, transport rate falls if you take too long to transport? 05:48:37 <nighthawk_c_m> Hmmhmm.. yepp, that too 05:48:52 <yuriks_> ah, that could be the reason then 05:49:02 <yuriks_> those water tanks take very long trips =P 05:50:07 <yuriks_> nighthawk_c_m: can trains do returns with that setup? 05:50:24 <nighthawk_c_m> what do you mean with returns 05:50:41 <yuriks_> reverse direction (changing to the correct track) 05:51:43 <NCommander> ahaha 05:51:44 <NCommander> awesome 05:51:47 * NCommander has transfers working 05:52:10 *** nighthawkcm [~nighthawk@pD950523C.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 05:52:45 <NCommander> argh 05:52:52 <NCommander> my path signals aren't working properly :-/ 05:53:39 <nighthawkcm> maybe plain old entry - exit - combo signals work better? 05:54:00 <nighthawkcm> i find them easier in terms of the logic of larger networks, dont like pbs there too much 05:56:00 <NCommander> Ah, got it 05:56:01 <piro> So if you create more bus stations, you give yourself more passengers to take care of? 05:56:03 <NCommander> bahaha 05:56:04 <NCommander> Sweet 05:56:06 <NCommander> that worked 05:56:17 * NCommander isn't sure how cost effective this route is, but that was awesome to watch 05:56:44 <nighthawkcm> hehe, eyecandy sometrimes totally wins over usefulness / effectiveness of a network 05:58:23 <nighthawkcm> if the spreads of the stations dont overlap too much yes - it increases the amount of passengers per station 05:58:37 <nighthawkcm> i mean the amount in general increases 05:58:57 <nighthawkcm> on the single stations it depends how much there is in their coverage 05:59:11 <piro> Fuck. These stations are getting overloaded. How do you cope with it besides throwing more buses at them? 05:59:36 *** nighthawk_c_m [~nighthawk@pD95047B1.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:04:32 <nighthawkcm> you cant except to change toa method of transportation with much higher loading capacities 06:04:44 <nighthawkcm> meaning trains / airplanes 06:05:10 <piro> I'm not sure I follow you 06:05:50 <nighthawkcm> well, you have a passenger bus stop that accumulates more passengers then your busses can haul, right? 06:06:46 <yuriks_> speaking of eye candy, I just burned a bunch of money doing this: 06:06:48 <yuriks_> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1990844/2010-04/Brunnwell%20Transport%2C%2023rd%20Feb%201970.png 06:07:11 <piro> yuriks_: Yes. 06:07:54 <nighthawkcm> cute, maybe move further west (left to increase the size of the loops for train speed? 06:08:38 <piro> nighthawkcm: So what should I do? 06:09:30 <yuriks_> yay, I have one million pounds =P 06:09:34 <nighthawkcm> Well, you cant do much usually except more busses, if the bus station is at the edge of a town/ city you can try to use trains to transport a larger amount of passengers, but besides that not really anything 06:11:59 * piro has mil :D 06:12:23 <nighthawkcm> 194 fastly shrinking due to many trains being purchased 06:12:30 <yuriks_> =o 06:12:48 <yuriks_> what year? I'm on 1970 still =P 06:13:29 <piro> 1988 06:13:36 <NCommander> wow 06:13:40 <NCommander> transfers work amazingly well 06:13:49 * NCommander has everything feeding into a hub station 06:14:00 <piro> This is my first game. I am quite overwhelmed 06:14:26 <yuriks_> I always start a new one, I need to stop doing that =P 06:15:03 <nighthawkcm> 1986 - 14 Planes 41 trains 06:15:16 * yuriks_ has 13 trains 06:15:22 <nighthawkcm> I hope to reach 250 Trains in this network .. hopefully it works out 06:18:47 <yuriks_> what do the circle colors in the train overview window mean? 06:20:30 *** PeterT [~PeterT@rdlbnc.com] has joined #openttd 06:20:40 <nighthawkcm> judges the income I think, green is very good, yellow is ok, grey is hard limit and red means you loose money 06:20:56 <yuriks_> hmm, makes sense 06:21:03 <yuriks_> they're all on green ^_^ 06:21:20 *** Jolteon [~Jolt@rdlbnc.com] has joined #openttd 06:25:52 <NCommander> wow 06:26:01 * NCommander is incredibly happy with his performance 06:26:10 <NCommander> Is there a good way to take a screen shot so people can see how much crack I am on? 06:26:49 <nighthawkcm> cmd + s 06:27:07 <nighthawkcm> strg + s on my keyboard 06:28:32 <NCommander> http://img641.imageshack.us/i/fadingworthtransport24t.png/ - yuriks_ 06:28:39 <NCommander> so how much crack am I on for this design? 06:28:53 * NCommander notes that everything is actually profitable, although its not 100% clear 06:30:00 <yuriks_> two-way rails! yuck! 06:30:02 <yuriks_> =) 06:30:22 <nighthawkcm> nice feeder service ^^ 06:31:04 <NCommander> yuriks_: it works extremely well 06:31:08 <NCommander> nighthawkcm: thanks, this is my first night playing 06:32:00 <nighthawkcm> welcome to the most addictive transport game .. I played Transport Tycoon back in the days when they first released it anno domini before the pope was born ^^ 06:32:52 <NCommander> nighthawkcm: I'm thinking of setting up truck service to funnel livestock into the factory, as those farms aren't making enough to warrent running additional train cars 06:33:45 <NCommander> yuriks_: what's wrong with two way track? If I made this one way, I'd have to run four tracks for six trains 06:33:48 <nighthawkcm> careful, if you service them well they might increase production, usually its suggested to use trucks on short routes, but thats if you aim for efficiency, otherwise its cool, and chaotic ^ 06:34:41 <yuriks_> NCommander: was talking about your mainline 06:34:45 <NCommander> nighthawkcm: indeed. I thought about using trucks to feed from the Mines to the factory, but it didn't seem too much 06:34:48 <yuriks_> which seems to be two way 06:34:49 <NCommander> yuriks_: I know 06:34:54 <NCommander> yuriks_: and it is, 06:35:05 <yuriks_> you don't need more tracks, you just put more trains on the same track 06:35:17 <NCommander> yuriks_: its a matter of where trains are going 06:35:39 <NCommander> yuriks_: right now, I cna get better performance using both tracks as iron moves a LOT faster than coal 06:35:47 <NCommander> since its feeding 06:36:07 <NCommander> so I can run two trains the same direction, and then have the coal trains run in parallel with each other 06:37:20 <yuriks_> huh? 06:37:31 <yuriks_> you can run two trains in the same direction with one way tracks =P 06:40:18 <NCommander> yuriks_: I suppose, maybe time to change things up 06:42:19 * NCommander should start replacing his trains 06:44:58 <NCommander> yeah 06:45:02 <NCommander> time to make the mainline one way 06:47:15 <piro> Thank god for autoreplacing of old vehicles. I think I'd die if I had to manually replace them all 06:51:08 <NCommander> oops 06:51:12 * NCommander just crashed two trains 06:51:14 <NCommander> Oh well 06:51:17 <NCommander> I think I finally have the hang of this 06:51:18 <yuriks_> it happens 06:51:22 <NCommander> although I'm sitll no where near perfect 06:51:58 <NCommander> anyone up for some multiplayer? (if they don't mind playing with a noob) 06:53:29 <yuriks_> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1990844/2010-04/Brunnwell%20Transport%2C%2026th%20Jun%201973.png 06:53:32 <yuriks_> I probably over-engineered this 06:53:48 <NCommander> yuriks_: probably 06:55:20 <yuriks_> NCommander: I would play, but I'm gonna stop playing now for the night XD 06:55:32 <NCommander> yuriks_: no need to stop ;-) 06:55:49 <yuriks_> yes there is, 4am 06:56:27 <yuriks_> ugh, why does this city randomly starts and stops accepting food 07:07:40 <piro> You can crash trains? 07:07:51 <nighthawkcm> yes you can 07:10:21 <De_Ghosty> yuriks_ cuz ur station is on the edge of town 07:10:34 <De_Ghosty> use the question mark and click on a building 07:10:40 <De_Ghosty> it tell you what it accepts 07:10:50 <yuriks_> ooooo 07:11:13 *** SmatZ [~SmatZ@vs241204.vserver.de] has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net] 07:11:13 *** dih [~dih@vs241204.vserver.de] has quit [Quit: knock knock - gone] 07:11:13 *** tneo [~tneo@vs241204.vserver.de] has quit [Quit: ZNC by prozac - http://znc.sourceforge.net] 07:11:13 *** Osai [~Osai@vs241204.vserver.de] has quit [Quit: bye - http://www.openttdcoop.org] 07:11:13 *** XeryusTC [~XeryusTC@vs241204.vserver.de] has quit [Quit: Solong, and thanks for all the fish] 07:11:13 *** planetmaker [~pm@vs241204.vserver.de] has quit [Quit: ...und tschÃŒÃ!] 07:11:14 <De_Ghosty> when build changes sometimes it change to accept goods 07:11:22 <yuriks_> yeah, I'm on the edge of the map 07:11:22 <De_Ghosty> or other stuff 07:11:27 <yuriks_> of the town* 07:11:34 <yuriks_> any way around that? =| 07:11:46 <De_Ghosty> yea make a bigger station 07:11:47 <De_Ghosty> lol 07:11:54 <De_Ghosty> so you touch more of the city 07:12:06 <yuriks_> De_Ghosty: there are tracks between the station and the city =P 07:12:44 <De_Ghosty> is ur game on network? 07:12:59 <De_Ghosty> well 07:13:00 <yuriks_> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1990844/2010-04/Brunnwell%20Transport%2C%2013th%20Nov%201974.png 07:13:02 <yuriks_> yeah 07:13:16 <yuriks_> I'm on network mode, but playing solo xD 07:13:39 <De_Ghosty> why don't u just turn your station sideways? 07:13:41 *** dih2 [d9e16b88@webchat.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 07:13:46 <dih2> ^^ 07:13:58 <yuriks_> De_Ghosty: tracking get's tricky, I think 07:14:30 <yuriks_> hmm, I think I'll do that 07:17:47 <Jupix> long term solution might be to start growing that town and concentrate on other parts of the network while it does that :P 07:18:06 *** fonsinchen [~fonsinche@brln-4dbc14ab.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 07:18:09 <yuriks_> kind of hard to grow the town if I can't reliably deliver food to it 07:18:42 <Jupix> does it need food to grow? it's outside the desert 07:18:53 <De_Ghosty> fyi only edge of town accept food i think city accept goods and something 07:19:08 <De_Ghosty> it need water on desert 07:19:14 <De_Ghosty> scenario 07:19:24 <Jupix> right 07:21:03 <Jupix> Any town where the centre square is in the desert requires food and water to grow. Non-desert towns require neither food nor water. 07:21:13 *** moot [moot@nom.nom.delicious.strawberrycupcak.es] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 07:21:29 <Jupix> i'd run a few buses there and see if starts to grow 07:21:51 <andythenorth> the town window tells you if food + water are required 07:22:09 *** moot [moot@nom.nom.delicious.strawberrycupcak.es] has joined #openttd 07:22:44 <De_Ghosty> o rly? 07:22:48 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1FDF2.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 07:22:51 <yuriks_> hah 07:23:18 *** einKarl [~einKarl@95-89-121-65-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #openttd 07:24:38 <yuriks_> well, heh, turns out it didn't need food nor water to grow 07:24:50 <yuriks_> so, passenger trains? 07:25:00 <yuriks_> or do you mean local buses? 07:26:50 <Jupix> local buses 07:27:10 <yuriks_> is it a good idea to set buses to fully load? 07:27:13 <Jupix> passenger trains might also work but might also disrupt the cargo station 07:28:43 <Jupix> i'm not sure which is better but personally i often build 2 bus stops and 2 or 4 buses with one full load stop per bus, with each bus full loading a different stop 07:28:56 <NCommander> when playing with competeriors, they don't start at the beginning? 07:29:03 <yuriks_> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1990844/2010-04/Brunnwell%20Transport%2C%2026th%20Dec%201975.png 07:29:42 <Jupix> that should work :P 07:30:21 *** dih2 [d9e16b88@webchat.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 07:31:03 <Jupix> might be a good idea to terraform the fruit plantation / farm side of the train station so that you can tunnel underneath it and expand the city there 07:32:03 <yuriks_> hmmm? 07:32:25 <Jupix> that's just splitting hairs, though :P 07:32:43 <yuriks_> what do you mean with terraform, though? 07:33:32 <nighthawkcm> change the landscape round it to your needs 07:33:35 <Jupix> lower the land next to the station so that you can demolish one of the buildings on the other side of the hill and build a tunnel 07:34:07 <Jupix> then you can build roads in the free space and the city will possibly grow there 07:34:24 <Jupix> and the train station will become encapsulated in the city and receive a lot of passengers 07:34:41 <yuriks_> oh, you mean making a road tunnel? 07:34:45 <Jupix> yeah 07:34:51 <yuriks_> ah, will do 07:37:04 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590fefeb.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 07:37:44 <yuriks_> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1990844/2010-04/Brunnwell%20Transport%2C%2023rd%20Aug%201976.png 07:37:47 <yuriks_> like this? 07:38:48 <Jupix> exactly 07:41:56 <yuriks_> wow 07:42:03 <yuriks_> I didn't know buses helped this much =( 07:42:12 <yuriks_> town already has 1k people 07:43:26 <Jupix> :) 07:44:31 <Jupix> is it starting to grow to the SE? 07:44:47 <yuriks_> wait, I read it wrong 07:44:53 <yuriks_> it has 700 =P 07:45:10 <Jupix> i was thinking that was pretty fast :D 07:45:46 <yuriks_> so I have 2.5mil and have no idea what to do with the money 07:45:55 <yuriks_> apart from more silly mega projects 07:49:03 <yuriks_> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1990844/2010-04/Brunnwell%20Transport%2C%2012th%20Jun%201977.png 07:49:10 <yuriks_> hmm, can you see what's wrong with my signaling? 07:49:25 <yuriks_> the trains exit fine via the bottom tunnel if the left section of the station isn't full 07:50:45 *** einKarl [~einKarl@95-89-121-65-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:51:03 * NCommander is a very successful trucking and rail company going 07:51:26 <Jupix> yuriks_: you probably need an entry signal at the west side tunnel entrance 07:52:04 <yuriks_> hmm 07:52:11 <Jupix> i mean east side 07:52:12 <Jupix> :D 07:53:35 <Jupix> the east section exit signals are showing red because the fruit train is stopped within that block 07:53:47 <Jupix> unless this is some PBS thing that i can't decipher 07:53:59 <yuriks_> the fruit train got stuck there 07:54:06 <yuriks_> because none of the trains would exit the station 07:54:17 <yuriks_> I tried to make one ignore the signals a few times and it got itself there somehow 07:55:08 <Jupix> yeah, try removing the piece of track that connects the right side tunnel to the loop at the bottom and see if the trains start leaving the station 07:55:27 <Jupix> if they do then you need to add signals 07:55:34 <yuriks_> ok, I did some manual plumbing and cleaned up the trains 07:57:00 *** Alberth [~hat@a82-95-164-127.adsl.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 07:58:56 *** welshdragon [~markmac@147.143.254.98] has joined #openttd 08:02:14 <Jupix> anyway, gonna go put summer tires on my car 08:02:16 <Jupix> later 08:04:32 * NCommander finds the AI isn't doing anything useful 08:04:33 <NCommander> :-/ 08:07:43 <NCommander> wow 08:07:48 <NCommander> both AIs just got closed by creditors 08:07:49 <NCommander> :-/ 08:10:09 <yuriks_> crap 08:10:15 <yuriks_> my new station positioning isn't supplying maize 08:10:18 <yuriks_> and I hadn't noticed 08:13:46 *** Phazorx [~pavelkoll@77.239.236.193] has joined #openttd 08:14:49 *** APTX [~APTX@chello089076052083.chello.pl] has joined #openttd 08:17:21 *** APTX_ [~APTX@chello089076052083.chello.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 08:18:13 <yuriks_> lol, I cheated 08:18:26 <yuriks_> stuck out a bunch of 1x1 stations to reach the farm 08:20:20 <yuriks_> ugh, trains are stuck again 08:21:15 <yuriks_> oh, problem solved 08:35:38 *** ragzid [~ragzid@173-231-207-85.jizmorava.adsl-llu.static.bluetone.cz] has joined #openttd 08:41:10 *** Wizzleby [~wizzleby@pool-108-2-18-119.phlapa.east.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:55:10 *** Wizzleby [~wizzleby@pool-108-2-18-119.phlapa.east.verizon.net] has joined #openttd 09:01:18 *** XeryusTC [~xeryustc@82.73.10.91] has joined #openttd 09:04:01 <andythenorth> morning 09:04:38 <Alberth> good morning andy 09:18:07 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@a62-251-30-68.adsl.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 09:25:39 *** llugo [~lugo@mgdb-4db8d6bb.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 09:29:58 *** owenshep 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joined #openttd 10:20:00 <Ammler> good day :-) 10:20:15 <Ammler> how does someone debug seg faults? http://ps.openttdcoop.org/stable/crash.log 10:20:40 *** APTX [~APTX@chello089076052083.chello.pl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:20:59 *** APTX [~APTX@chello089076052083.chello.pl] has joined #openttd 10:25:26 <peter1138> either: run it in a debugger, or run it in a debugger with the core dump 10:31:17 <Ammler> hmm, for start I could enable asserts? 10:32:02 <Ammler> it needs days until it segfaults 10:32:35 *** snack23 [~nn@dsl-mlimmlgw1-ff1ec000-127.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #openttd 10:34:29 <frosch123> just type "ulimit -c unlimited" in the console before starting the server to enable core file generation 10:35:01 <frosch123> or put it directly in .bashrc or similiar :) 10:36:02 <frosch123> except you likely do not want corefiles on a webserver which regulary needs to restart services :p 10:42:56 <OwenS> frosch123, you mean, if you run lightHTTPd? :p 10:43:33 <frosch123> no idea, iirc it was best to not remeber anything about it, or so 10:55:05 <Rubidium> Ammler: by any chance, do you still have the autosave from the previous month and the desync logs? 10:55:36 *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@94-224-31-113.access.telenet.be] has quit [Quit: oO] 10:56:25 <Ammler> Rubidium: before this seg fault? 10:56:35 <Rubidium> yes, from before the segfault 10:56:44 <Rubidium> one from after it is kinda useless, ain't it? 10:57:48 <Rubidium> maybe SmatZ can, with his assembler knowledge, determing where in that function it crashed if he has the binary 10:57:58 <Ammler> :-( forgot to enable debug desync again 10:58:17 <Ammler> and disabled autosave because of the desync saves, so no 10:58:22 <Ammler> except the crash.sav 10:59:31 <Ammler> http://ps.openttdcoop.org/stable/save/autosave/?C=M;O=D 10:59:43 <OwenS> Rubidium: On systems which support it, you should keep -g in and separate the debugging information out using the GNU debug link feature 11:01:01 *** KenjiE20 [~KenjiE20@92.0.27.246] has joined #openttd 11:03:39 <planetmaker> a very good day to you :-) 11:04:29 <planetmaker> Ammler: do I get it right, we have a crashing PS?! 11:04:49 <Ammler> no 11:04:55 <Ammler> stable was it 11:05:09 <Ammler> ps is quite stable 11:05:18 <planetmaker> oh. crash on stable?! 11:05:30 <Ammler> yeah, we should enable asserts 11:05:42 <Rubidium> PNG: 1.2.15beta5 11:05:43 <planetmaker> hm. 11:06:17 <Rubidium> that's 2007... 11:06:30 <Rubidium> what about all the CVEs that have been fixed since then? 11:06:34 <Ammler> ups 11:06:45 <Ammler> currentyl nightly is running with fast forward :-D 11:07:03 <Ammler> how do I slower that? 11:07:03 <planetmaker> 1.4.1 is current... 11:07:39 <Rubidium> or 1.2.43 11:07:49 <Rubidium> if you don't trust just-released libraries 11:08:09 <Rubidium> Ammler: I've made that for http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=29&t=47959 :) 11:08:35 <Rubidium> Ammler: to fix it, see the last commit 11:09:18 <OwenS> Rubidium, if it is, say, RHEL, then the fixes will have been backported (Though you would expect to see a .rh5 or such on the end...) 11:09:53 <Rubidium> OwenS: exactly 11:10:13 <Rubidium> still, releasing a beta in a long-time-stable release sounds kinda odd 11:10:21 <OwenS> True 11:10:21 <Ammler> this is debian lenny, afaik 11:10:52 <Rubidium> Ammler: no, it isn't... that has 1.2.27-2+lenny2 11:11:09 <Rubidium> it might be etch with 1.2.15~beta5-1+etch2 11:11:21 <Rubidium> but that doesn't have security support anymore 11:12:12 <Ammler> ah, etch, those debian names are confusing for outsiders :-) 11:12:48 <Ammler> you think, our crash could be because of the png? 11:12:57 <Ammler> or was that a side note? 11:13:08 <Rubidium> Ammler: then call it 4.0 11:13:20 <OwenS> Considering you're not running 32bpp on the server 11:13:20 <Rubidium> quite unlikely it's png 11:13:26 <peter1138> debian lenny, but your kernel is 2.6.18.1.20061155-ralph.33.p4? :s 11:13:48 <Rubidium> but something quite funky must have happened 11:14:16 <planetmaker> nice... TTRS is now on bananas. 11:14:23 <Rubidium> anyhow, please keep the binary and the crash log stuff around so "we" can look at it later; don't have the time to do that now 11:14:42 *** aber [~Adium@gb049.stw.stud.uni-saarland.de] has joined #openttd 11:16:00 <SmatZ> Rubidium: I tried it few times, but OTTD code is too complicated to find the correct place... one chance would be to compile binary with the same parameters, but do not strip it 11:16:05 <SmatZ> so there is at least some info 11:16:29 <SmatZ> code & addresses stay the same 11:17:37 <OwenS> This kind of thing is why I love the GDB debug links. You keep the small executables, but debugging information remains available 11:18:55 *** Terkhen [~Terkhen@117.69.220.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #openttd 11:19:07 <Terkhen> hello 11:20:36 <Ammler> Rubidium: for reference: http://ps.openttdcoop.org/stable/lastcrash/ 11:27:08 *** mrruben5 [~mrruben5@s5594146e.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #openttd 11:28:00 *** ajmiles [~aj@78-86-188-187.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 11:35:30 <SmatZ> Ammler: I will get the binary and see what I can do :) 11:36:12 <SmatZ> hmm I need to get my ssh keys from backup... 11:37:16 <Ammler> http://cz.binaries.openttd.org/openttd/binaries/nightlies/trunk/index.html <-- last nightly not mirrored? 11:39:24 <Ammler> TrueBrain: ^ 11:39:54 <Rubidium> guess rsync failed and didn't notify us 11:41:02 <Rubidium> what does "protocol version mismatch -- is your shell clean? 11:41:08 <Rubidium> mean? with rsync? 11:41:59 <Ammler> Rubidium: looks like the other side made some bashrc hacks? 11:43:24 <Ammler> I added once "tail /var/log/messages" to bashrc and that failed my rsync script... 11:44:12 *** OwenS [~owenshep@cpc1-stkn14-2-0-cust562.11-2.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:52:06 *** welterde [~welterde@not.welterde.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:54:54 *** Adambean [CG1@82.hosts.reece-eu.net] has joined #openttd 12:00:34 *** fjb is now known as Guest2026 12:00:35 *** fjb [~frank@p5485EC3E.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 12:01:04 *** welterde [~welterde@2001:470:1f0b:592:ff:0:1:3] has joined #openttd 12:02:13 <Jolteon> [12:59] <+Server> <Tepo99> LOL Fartfield :D :D :D 12:02:17 <Jolteon> OpenTTD has some delightful names. 12:06:11 <Eddi|zuHause> i have never seen any of those... :p 12:06:33 <Jolteon> Well, it's on a server. 12:06:42 <Jolteon> and players can't change names, i don't think? 12:06:46 <Jolteon> So it must have been auto-generated. 12:06:48 <Eoin> nope they cant 12:07:08 <Jolteon> auto-gen thne :p 12:07:09 <Jolteon> amusing 12:07:12 <Eddi|zuHause> => only british people are childish enough to care about that 12:07:32 *** Guest2026 [~frank@p5485C4D4.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:10:31 <SmatZ> Ammler: Rubidium: http://ps.openttdcoop.org/stable/lastcrash/ crashed at company_cmd.cpp:654 12:10:33 <SmatZ> c = Company::Get(_local_company); 12:10:41 *** DanMacK [~DanMacK@206.191.69.149] has joined #openttd 12:10:48 *** Devroush [~dennis@94-225-72-20.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 12:10:51 <SmatZ> which is strange, _local_company != COMPANY_SPECTATOR is checked 12:10:56 *** DanMacK [~DanMacK@206.191.69.149] has quit [] 12:11:08 <SmatZ> Ammler: setting show_finances 0 should prevent the crash 12:16:19 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:d1e3:2c4:ff2a:3d4] has joined #openttd 12:16:22 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 12:22:30 <SmatZ> Ammler: can you open a bugreport with http://ps.openttdcoop.org/stable/lastcrash/ please? 12:23:17 <Ammler> SmatZ: I can, but I have no more infos... 12:23:31 <SmatZ> Ammler: I will add what I have found :) 12:23:41 <Ammler> I wasn't around and we don't have any presaves or logs 12:24:09 <SmatZ> no problem 12:24:18 <SmatZ> the issue is _local_company == 0 for dedicated server 12:24:22 <SmatZ> which is strange 12:27:09 <peter1138> and there's no company 0 in this case? 12:28:40 <Ammler> http://bugs.openttd.org/task/3749 12:29:42 <SmatZ> peter1138: yes, there isn't 12:40:35 <jordi> Rubidium: see, it built on sparc now 12:40:45 *** KritiK [~Maxim@93-80-81-112.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd 12:45:00 *** fonsinchen [~fonsinche@brln-4dbc14ab.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:53:03 *** tokai [~tokai@port-92-195-186-84.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:55:19 *** tokai [~tokai@port-92-195-58-246.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 12:55:22 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai] by ChanServ 12:57:01 *** Devroush [~dennis@94-225-72-20.access.telenet.be] has quit [] 13:00:57 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: frosch * r19597 /trunk/src/newgrf_gui.cpp: -Fix: Removing NewGRFs from the GUI list leaked. 13:01:55 *** Devroush [~dennis@94-225-72-20.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 13:14:15 *** avdg [~Adium@78-22-165-5.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 13:35:23 *** fonsinchen [~fonsinche@brln-4dbc14ab.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 13:39:54 *** Biolunar [mahdi@blfd-4db1babc.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:44:00 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590fefeb.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:49:04 *** Biolunar [mahdi@blfd-4db1941d.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 13:53:04 <PeterT> I've opened my 3979 port, and yet the server isn't working: http://paste.openttd.org/225525 13:58:22 *** welterde [~welterde@2001:470:1f0b:592:ff:0:1:3] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:58:42 *** welterde [~welterde@2001:470:1f0b:592:ff:0:1:3] has joined #openttd 13:59:23 <Eddi|zuHause> then you didn't open it correctly 13:59:54 <PeterT> I'll take another look 14:00:23 <PeterT> after a port is opened, do you need to restart the router or anything? 14:01:42 <Eddi|zuHause> this looks like local networking/firewall problems, not router problems 14:02:20 *** snack2 [~nn@dsl-mlimmlgw1-ff1ec000-127.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [Quit: ( www.nnscript.com :: NoNameScript 4.22 :: www.esnation.com )] 14:03:00 <PeterT> Oh, I probably forgot to allow an exception in the firewall 14:08:00 *** ecke [~ecke@188.75.128.2] has joined #openttd 14:10:37 *** Fuco [~dota.keys@fuco.sks3.muni.cz] has joined #openttd 14:10:41 *** welterde [~welterde@2001:470:1f0b:592:ff:0:1:3] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:21:38 *** saLOUt [~rriemann@dslb-088-073-099-109.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 14:26:19 <saLOUt> hi all, I just installed openttd 1.0.0 from opensuse repos. I have two problems. 14:27:02 <saLOUt> 1) admiralAI produces errors: http://pastie.org/912819 14:28:17 <saLOUt> 2) how do I get the old windows music to work? with old versions it works after I copied the files into the right place, but now the files seems to not be found as there is no windows options in the music settings. 14:28:47 <PeterT> Game options -> Music set 14:28:59 <PeterT> report that error in the appropriate AI thread 14:29:30 <saLOUt> PeterT: there is only one music set: openmsk 14:29:43 <PeterT> No original_windows? 14:29:47 <PeterT> Strange. 14:30:21 <Eddi|zuHause> saLOUt: you're sure that it's the right place, AND the files are unmodified? 14:30:27 <saLOUt> PeterT: I tested openttd with admiralAI on windows XP and got no error. So the error may probably not related to the AI itself... 14:31:00 <Eddi|zuHause> saLOUt: can you check the md5sums of the files, and compare them with original_windows.obm (in the game directory) 14:31:01 <saLOUt> Eddi|zuHause: I only know that it worked before with an old release. I think it was something like 0.7 14:31:25 <Eddi|zuHause> saLOUt: yes, the old releases did not check the md5sum 14:32:57 *** Chillosophy [~fu@195-241-120-76.ip.telfort.nl] has joined #openttd 14:33:06 <saLOUt> Eddi|zuHause: in /usr/share/openttd/gm there is a openmsx.obm but no original_windows.obm. 14:33:31 <Eddi|zuHause> saLOUt: it should have been installed with the game 14:33:59 <saLOUt> so it should be placed next to openmsx.obm? 14:34:00 <Eddi|zuHause> ./bin/gm/orig_win.obm 14:34:01 <Eddi|zuHause> ./bin/gm/no_music.obm 14:35:31 <Ammler> /use/share/openttd/gm 14:35:38 <Ammler> usr* 14:37:07 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590fefeb.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 14:37:17 <saLOUt> Ammler, Eddi|zuHause: the opensuse repo package called openttd-data doesnt contain any other obm-files. 14:37:37 <Eddi|zuHause> saLOUt: no, the openttd package itself must contain it 14:37:42 <Ammler> you used the games repo, I assume? 14:37:59 <saLOUt> I don't know if this is really a bug, because you have to copy some files manually anyway 14:38:00 *** avdg [~Adium@78-22-165-5.access.telenet.be] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:38:02 *** avdg [~Adium@78-22-165-5.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 14:38:13 <saLOUt> yes, the game repo 14:38:19 <Ammler> saLOUt: you have to copy the original ttd files, yes. 14:38:47 <saLOUt> Ammler: so the next time i copy these files i will pay attention to copy the obm file, too. 14:38:48 <Ammler> you need to copy those to ~/.openttd/ 14:39:00 <Eddi|zuHause> saLOUt: this is a bug in the packaging, if the openttd package (not openttd-data) does not contain those two files 14:39:08 <Ammler> saLOUt: no need, they should be in the package 14:39:27 <saLOUt> Ammler: do you use the same repo? 14:39:35 <Ammler> but I guess, the guy there does because of some reason do a manual install 14:40:04 <Ammler> no, I use http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/home:/openttdcoop/ 14:40:07 <saLOUt> prusnak@suse.cz is the mail adress mentioned in the .rpm meta infos 14:40:30 <Ammler> yeah, I know, I already prepared a patch for him... 14:41:03 <saLOUt> so i don't report the bug as you will already do? 14:41:16 <Ammler> if you like, do 14:41:25 <Ammler> so he might see others having issues 14:41:32 <saLOUt> whats the difference between those two openttd repos? 14:41:46 <Ammler> games is kinda official suse 14:41:57 <Ammler> the other one is "my factory" 14:43:09 <Ammler> it does also have dev tools for newgrfs 14:43:26 <Ammler> or the package to join #openttdcoop server 14:45:03 <Ammler> or dedicated server version :-) 14:45:11 <saLOUt> Ammler: you should try to get a copy of your packages directly into the games repo. I think there is something like a copy-function in opensuse build service to reach this 14:45:31 <Ammler> yes, called submit-request, I know :-) 14:46:20 <Ammler> because of support for dedicated and patches and branches, my spec is a bit too complicated for mainstream, I fear. 14:46:58 *** marmotz [~hynea@sju13-4-88-161-80-194.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #openttd 14:50:15 <marmotz> hi, excuse my english but i'm french... i'm using Ubuntu (10.04 but 9.10 has the same problem). I've downloaded openttd 1.0, opensfx and openmsx. No soucy with openttd and opensfx. No music played. when i launch openttd music player, all the tracks was displaying very quickly but no music played. 14:50:42 <marmotz> i must install a midi player on my ubuntu to play music in openttd ? 14:50:48 <glx> yes 14:50:51 <Ammler> timidity 14:51:12 <marmotz> i trying 14:51:15 <glx> and also check known-bugs.txt 14:51:21 <marmotz> i already check 14:51:33 <Ammler> I would guess, if you install with apt-get, such things does happen automatically 14:51:33 <marmotz> i follow all instructions, but nothing to do... 14:52:09 <marmotz> Ammler: no, openttd was installed by .deb on openttd website 14:52:20 <marmotz> \o/ 14:52:31 <marmotz> thanks Ammler i've got the music :) 14:52:40 <Ammler> yaw :-) 14:52:42 <marmotz> oh yes it's good 14:53:08 <marmotz> thanks !! 14:53:23 <Ammler> doesn't the openttd deb packages recommend to install timidity? 14:53:23 <marmotz> and thank you to understand my very bad english :) 14:53:35 <PeterT> how interesting: <bja> Sorry to bug but todays connection is a bit flakey 14:53:36 <marmotz> i don't see 14:53:40 <PeterT> Oops. 14:53:41 <PeterT> http://img442.imageshack.us/img442/4541/blackmap.png 14:53:43 <PeterT> rather 14:53:45 <Ammler> or maybe you disalbed installing recommends? 14:53:56 *** Kovensky [~kovensky@abraxo.bluebottle.net.au] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:54:03 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 14:54:39 <marmotz> Ammler: it was installed with GDebi 14:55:05 <marmotz> one click on install... i don't check recommanded package 14:55:08 <Ammler> I do not know software managers of debian, was just a guess. :-) 14:56:57 <marmotz> ok :) 14:57:01 <marmotz> thank you :) 14:57:07 <marmotz> and good bye :) 14:57:19 *** marmotz [~hynea@sju13-4-88-161-80-194.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 14:57:38 *** welterde [~welterde@2001:470:1f0b:592:ff::6] has joined #openttd 15:08:29 *** Kovensky [~kovensky@abraxo.bluebottle.net.au] has joined #openttd 15:08:46 *** ragzid [~ragzid@173-231-207-85.jizmorava.adsl-llu.static.bluetone.cz] has quit [Quit: leaving] 15:09:20 <saLOUt> Ammler: did your repo openttd version works with admiralAI? 15:09:37 <Ammler> no idea, why shouldn't? 15:10:19 <saLOUt> maybe there is a second packaging bug as there is always this error: http://pastie.org/912819 15:11:41 <saLOUt> i change the AI settings to start from the first day on and increse the playing speed... 15:13:10 *** Terkhen [~Terkhen@117.69.220.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:14:03 *** bryjen [~bryjen@75.81.201.131] has joined #openttd 15:14:37 <saLOUt> Ammler: your openttd version cannot be found via webpin... 15:15:14 <Ammler> yep, webpin is broken quite some time already... 15:15:42 <Ammler> http://software.opensuse.org/search 15:16:30 *** Lakie [~Lakie@91.84.251.149] has joined #openttd 15:16:32 <Ammler> the only missing repo here is packman, which you have installed anyway. 15:17:49 <saLOUt> Ammler: download.opensuse is down... 15:19:58 <Ammler> oh, bad, "they" are aware of 15:22:38 <__ln__> dihedral: what do you say: http://bugs.openttd.org/task/2585 15:24:59 <__ln__> Rubidium: unless dihedral says something unexpected, all the comments indicate that #2585 has either got fixed on its own, or it is not-a-bug in openttd. 15:26:52 <avdg> what should be tested? 15:33:23 *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@94-224-31-113.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 15:35:25 *** Tennel [~Tennel@port-ip-213-211-212-60.reverse.mdcc-fun.de] has joined #openttd 15:41:59 *** Terkhen [~Terkhen@199.69.220.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #openttd 15:43:26 *** Singaporekid [~notme@cm11.epsilon84.maxonline.com.sg] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:46:27 <saLOUt> Ammler: what is the difference between openttd-data and openttd-data-opengfx? 15:48:24 *** Biolunar [mahdi@blfd-4db1941d.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Bye] 15:48:56 *** Biolunar [mahdi@blfd-4db1941d.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 15:49:25 <planetmaker> probably included sound an music 15:51:50 <saLOUt> planetmaker: thought that would be already included in openttd-data 15:52:10 *** avdg [~Adium@78-22-165-5.access.telenet.be] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:52:16 <planetmaker> saLOUt: yes. But not in ...opengfx 15:52:47 *** avdg [~Adium@78-22-165-5.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 15:53:00 <planetmaker> and one might be quite content with just installing opengfx. A base graphics set is needed. Sound and music are purely optional 15:53:17 <planetmaker> (or the NoSound set is part of OpenTTD rather ;-) ) 15:55:58 <saLOUt> admiralAI seems to be platform dependant. works with winXP and doesn't with linux. 15:56:20 <planetmaker> use the same version on both? 15:56:55 <saLOUt> sure 15:57:30 <saLOUt> dbg: [ai] [1] [S] Your script made an error: the index 'GetHeight' does not exist 15:59:31 <frosch123> GetHeight is ancient, you are using a very outdated version of admiral ai 15:59:52 <saLOUt> frosch123: good to know. I used the the ingame downloader. 16:00:02 <saLOUt> admiralAI seems to be v22 16:00:08 <frosch123> maybe it does not find the compatibility wrappers 16:00:11 <planetmaker> that sounds about current 16:01:07 <frosch123> ok, it got removed in 1.0, so agreed not that ancient :) 16:01:42 <frosch123> saLOUt: likely you are missing "compat_0.7.nut", resp ottd does not find it 16:02:38 <saLOUt> frosch123: where do this file have to be placed? 16:04:29 <saLOUt> frosch123: indeed, there is no compat_.. file in my /usr/share/openttd 16:04:44 <frosch123> for me it is in the ai folder next to the data folder, no idea where it goes in a regular installation 16:05:03 <Eddi|zuHause> saLOUt: another bug in the packaging? 16:05:22 <saLOUt> Eddi|zuHause: seems so. Also in the package of Ammler. 16:05:36 <saLOUt> what is in your ai folder? 16:05:40 <saLOUt> only this one file_ 16:05:41 <saLOUt> ? 16:05:53 *** owenshep [~owenshep@cpc1-stkn14-2-0-cust562.11-2.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 16:06:04 *** owenshep is now known as OwenS 16:06:25 <frosch123> if you installed 1.0 there should also be compat_1.0.nut, if you installed nightly then also compat_1.1.nut 16:06:56 <Eddi|zuHause> ./bin/ai/compat_1.0.nut ./bin/ai/compat_1.1.nut ./bin/ai/compat_0.7.nut 16:07:22 <frosch123> Eddi|zuHause: that is in your working copy :) 16:07:39 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, he asked what was in my folder :) 16:07:55 <frosch123> you are lacking the regression 16:08:09 <Eddi|zuHause> no, i just did not mention it :) 16:09:33 *** ecke [~ecke@188.75.128.2] has quit [Quit: ecke] 16:09:48 <Eddi|zuHause> ... weather just turned drastically worse... 16:10:25 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: and I thought it was quiet because everyone was out in the sun :o 16:11:46 <frosch123> what are you doing in the sun without a notebook? 16:11:59 <andythenorth> holding the baby... 16:12:48 <Ammler> [18:05] <saLOUt> Eddi|zuHause: seems so. Also in the package of Ammler. <-- :-o 16:13:02 <Ammler> I do use make install, nothing fancy 16:15:42 <frosch123> Ammler: does your rpm install the ai compatibilitiy stuff? 16:15:43 <Ammler> AdmiralAI works here 16:16:29 <Ammler> frosch123: how would I need to install that locally? 16:16:38 <Ammler> something else than make install? 16:17:02 <George> Does CB 36 happen for a train when a wagon is attached? Or if it is coming out of depot? 16:17:24 <frosch123> that is different for every property 16:17:25 <frosch123> iirc 16:17:36 <Ammler> marcel@inspiron:/usr/share/openttd/ai> l *.nut 16:17:38 <Ammler> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 7538 2010-04-01 11:07 compat_0.7.nut 16:17:39 <Ammler> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 646 2010-04-01 11:07 compat_1.0.nut 16:18:13 <saLOUt> Ammler: for me there was no ai folder at all 16:18:28 <Ammler> then you didn't install from the coop repo 16:18:47 <saLOUt> i did a forced upgrade to your repo version 16:19:00 <Ammler> how does that work? 16:19:21 <Ammler> hmm, i might see the issue 16:19:39 <Ammler> you need also to install openttd-data from my repo 16:22:41 <saLOUt> Ammler: from yast: http://pastie.org/912922 16:23:33 <Ammler> yes, that isn't "my" data package 16:24:30 <Ammler> I splitted openttd in gui dedicated and data, 16:25:35 <Ammler> looks like I need to hurry with my bug report :-) 16:25:48 <George> frosch123: speed, TE, speed, power 16:26:27 <OwenS> " 16:26:27 <OwenS> WebGL is well defined, based on existing standards, and already has working implementations. So naturally Microsoft wont support it." Hehe 16:26:30 <saLOUt> Ammler: so which packages do i need for a fullfeatured opensource non-dev opentttd installation? 16:26:46 <saLOUt> OwenS: ^^ 16:26:59 <Ammler> openttd and openttd-data 16:27:05 <Ammler> from "my" repo 16:27:39 <Ammler> http://software.opensuse.org/ymp/home:openttdcoop/openSUSE_11.2/openttd.ymp 16:27:42 <saLOUt> Ammler: ok, maybe i did some mistakes... 16:28:00 <frosch123> George: those are most likely updated when attaching/removing/reordering wagons, when refitting, and when leaving the depot 16:28:07 <Ammler> yeah, I assume, you only updated openttd and forgot about openttd-data 16:28:22 <Ammler> I need to make that dependency more specific, it seems 16:28:42 <Ammler> wasn't aware that official maintainer used that too, as it is useless there 16:29:23 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123, George: what about changing railtype? 16:29:46 <frosch123> te and power most likely also when chaing railtype, speed maybe not 16:30:22 <saLOUt> maybe my mistake: wrong rpm .. versions i am going to see if everything works for now. after all the games rpms are really broken. 16:34:03 *** b_jonas [~x@dsl4E5C09BD.pool.t-online.hu] has joined #openttd 16:35:00 <b_jonas> is the 1.0.0 release for real or an april fools? 16:35:54 <avdg> what do you think? 16:36:13 <Eddi|zuHause> yes. 16:36:36 <avdg> what yes, its an option question :) 16:37:14 *** avdg [~Adium@78-22-165-5.access.telenet.be] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:37:53 *** avdg [~Adium@78-22-165-5.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 16:43:07 *** avdg [~Adium@78-22-165-5.access.telenet.be] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:44:29 *** avdg [~Adium@78-22-165-5.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 16:48:40 *** fjb [~frank@p5485EC3E.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:49:05 *** avdg [~Adium@78-22-165-5.access.telenet.be] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:49:12 *** avdg [~Adium@78-22-165-5.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 16:49:13 *** devilsadvocate [~devilsadv@202.3.77.231] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:51:52 *** welterde [~welterde@2001:470:1f0b:592:ff::6] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:06:09 *** Fast2 [~Fast2@p57AF8ED2.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:07:13 <SpComb> hmm... is there a known division-by-zero crash caused by road vehicles with a zero weight? 17:08:26 <SpComb> http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=869455#p869455 <-- this crash.png shows a vehicle weight of 0t, and the crash.dmp shows an "Integer division by zero" exception in GroundVehicle<T, Type>::GetAcceleration() where `mass` is 0 17:12:10 <SpComb> reproducible in vanilla r19596 17:12:18 <Terkhen> yes, but I thought I solved it long before committing RV acceleration 17:12:27 <Terkhen> thanks for the report, I'll take a look at it later 17:12:37 <SpComb> should I file something on bugs.openttd.org? 17:13:39 <Terkhen> that will ensure that I don't forget this again :) 17:14:44 *** devilsadvocate [~devilsadv@202.3.77.202] has joined #openttd 17:14:56 <SpComb> urgh, I can't register my username because I need to merge it :( 17:15:04 * SpComb doesn't have a flyspray account yet 17:15:30 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 17:15:43 <planetmaker> SpComb but you have some OpenTTD account, do you? 17:15:59 <SpComb> apparently I once made a bananas account 17:16:08 <SpComb> the merge page was kind enough to tell me 17:16:37 *** kyo313 [~kyo@92.3.9.107] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:16:39 * andythenorth new FISH. not a big update, just some tanker sprites 17:19:08 *** welterde [~welterde@2001:470:1f0b:592:ff::6] has joined #openttd 17:25:17 <b_jonas> oh argh 17:31:03 <SpComb> Terkhen: http://bugs.openttd.org/task/3751 17:32:25 *** aber [~Adium@gb049.stw.stud.uni-saarland.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 17:34:22 <Terkhen> SpComb: thanks 17:40:22 *** Dreamxtreme [~Dreamxtre@host86-160-186-96.range86-160.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: +++ OK ATH OK] 17:42:52 <andythenorth> stupid farms 17:44:43 * andythenorth thinks a bit 17:45:38 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: translators * r19598 /trunk/src/lang/ (4 files): 17:45:38 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0: 17:45:38 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: traditional_chinese - 5 changes by josesun 17:45:38 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: portuguese - 2 changes by JayCity 17:45:38 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: turkish - 2 changes by canbu 17:45:40 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: ukrainian - 8 changes by Madvin 17:47:49 * andythenorth ponders how to make grain farms locate near each other 17:49:47 <frosch123> check for fields? 17:50:09 <frosch123> but you might get trouble for the first farm :p 17:50:12 <Eddi|zuHause> make a randomised location callback that makes it increasingly unlikely to plant farms the higher the area is. then farms will cluster in the lower regions of the map 17:50:53 <frosch123> and the reverse for forrests? 17:51:05 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: yep, I think something like that 17:51:52 <andythenorth> I can check how many farms are already on the map 17:52:00 <andythenorth> that will sort the first one out :) 17:52:48 <andythenorth> currently I find farm transport really dull....which is a bit dull because I put lots of farms into FIRS :P 17:53:05 <Eddi|zuHause> well, if you strictly look for the first one on the map, then they make some continuous space, which might be suboptimal on large maps 17:53:32 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: I can occasionally randomly branch and just build one 'anywhere' 17:53:42 <andythenorth> farms need low output, and they need to cluster. Then RVs can move small amounts to a railhead or port. 17:53:45 <frosch123> what makes transporting other cargo less dull? 17:53:58 <andythenorth> it just looks stupid building a train line to every farm 17:54:07 <andythenorth> and equally stupid servicing one farm with twenty or more rvs 17:58:23 <b_jonas> 20? seriously? 17:58:51 <andythenorth> easy 18:01:08 <Terkhen> I have 43 rv for an arable farm + fruit plantation, and the destination is roughly 20 tiles away 18:01:29 <andythenorth> does it look silly? :) 18:02:28 <andythenorth> is it a good idea to force farms to locate *away* from town? I think not 18:02:53 <Terkhen> only quite busy... the arable farm is producing 423+423 and the fruit plantation produces 387 18:02:56 <b_jonas> Terkhen: but how many farms and plantations are there? 18:03:13 <b_jonas> I mean 20 per farm would be a lot 18:03:17 <b_jonas> but 20 in a complex is okay 18:03:22 <Terkhen> a single arable farm and a single fruit plantation 18:03:52 <andythenorth> farm production is going to be lower in future FIRS :) 18:04:36 <andythenorth> frosch123: what are the possible range of values for the production multiplier? I can't seem to find it documented :o 18:04:40 <b_jonas> nice 18:05:07 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: i think the default industries don't go below 4 18:05:13 <frosch123> hmm, i can think of several things that could be called production multiplier :s 18:05:29 <andythenorth> nvm, I found it straight after asking the question m( 18:06:02 <andythenorth> production rate is a value between 04h and 80h 18:07:11 <andythenorth> I assume the rate is multiplied by the values of prop 12 or 13 in industry action 0? 18:07:16 <andythenorth> that seems to be the case anyway 18:07:52 <andythenorth> or perhaps not 18:07:54 <frosch123> yes, but there is also a flag to multiply the production callback result by the rate 18:09:05 <andythenorth> interesting...where is that? 18:09:38 <andythenorth> my purpose here is just setting an upper limit on primary production 18:09:40 <frosch123> bit 14 of prop 1a 18:10:30 *** heffer [~felix@static-87-78-98-150.netcologne.de] has joined #openttd 18:12:54 * andythenorth does some maths to try and understand primary productin 18:12:57 <andythenorth> production /s 18:15:02 <andythenorth> @calc 21*6*80 18:15:02 <DorpsGek> andythenorth: 10080 18:15:15 <andythenorth> so the coal mine has prop 12 as 21, which would imply max production of 10,080t when rate is 80 18:15:27 <andythenorth> But that leve is never reach 18:15:32 <andythenorth> ahem, bad typing 18:15:40 <andythenorth> that level is never reached 18:16:40 * andythenorth meh, read the source 18:17:38 <nighthawkcm> I wish industries you se3rvice dont suddenly close, and actually rise more as you service them well ... 18:18:04 <nighthawkcm> I think the time / year you are in also modifies the output, my coal mines produce way more since 2010 18:19:13 *** pazifi [~pazifi@76-94.105-92.cust.bluewin.ch] has joined #openttd 18:19:16 <pazifi> hi 18:20:39 <pazifi> i have a quastion to openttd. how can i sell or rid busses or trains? 18:20:59 <OwenS> pazifi, send them to depot then drag them to the trash 18:21:12 <b_jonas> does it happen in openttd too that if you don't service oil refineries from oil wells then all of them close up before the first sea oil rig appears 18:21:30 <andythenorth> yep pretty much 18:22:09 <nighthawkcm> can happen, same with factories 18:22:13 <pazifi> OwenS: okay. where is the trash-symbol? but i don't see the trashsymbol :/ 18:22:42 <OwenS> pazifi, on the right hand side of the depot window 18:23:00 <pazifi> orudge: with one car and a cross? 18:23:05 <andythenorth> after reading the source, I am not much the wiser about industry production 18:23:16 <pazifi> Àhm OwenS,.. sorry not orudge 18:23:30 <frosch123> andythenorth: a primary industry produces every 256 ticks (8 or 9 times a month). everytime it produces prop12 resp. prop13 * productionrate / 16 (with 16 being the default ratE) 18:23:34 <pazifi> OwenS: ahhh 18:23:40 <OwenS> pazifi, that sounds right. I may be thinking original graphics 18:23:44 <pazifi> OwenS: i must drag an drop 18:23:51 <andythenorth> frosch123: thanks. make sense 18:23:57 <pazifi> OwenS: very thanks :D 18:24:20 * pazifi happy 18:25:03 <andythenorth> that would make perfect sense with maxing out coal mines at 1080t, which is what FIRS does IIRC 18:40:08 *** bryjen [~bryjen@75.81.201.131] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 18:41:34 <Eddi|zuHause> <b_jonas> does it happen in openttd too that if you don't service oil refineries from oil wells then all of them close up before the first sea oil rig appears <-- theoretically the last industry is supposed to be protected from closing 18:44:17 <b_jonas> Eddi|zuHause: good 19:01:01 *** Tennel [~Tennel@port-ip-213-211-212-60.reverse.mdcc-fun.de] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.1.1] 19:03:28 *** Nite_Owl [~Nite_Owl@c-98-254-113-47.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 19:03:42 <Nite_Owl> Hello all 19:06:07 *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@94-224-31-113.access.telenet.be] has quit [Quit: oO] 19:24:07 *** welterde [~welterde@2001:470:1f0b:592:ff::6] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:24:18 *** Nite_Owl [~Nite_Owl@c-98-254-113-47.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Read You Soon] 19:25:55 *** Rhamphoryncus [~rhamph@d198-53-213-246.abhsia.telus.net] has quit [Quit: Rhamphoryncus] 19:30:51 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: terkhen * r19599 /trunk/src/ground_vehicle.cpp: -Fix [FS#3751]: Vehicles with a weight of zero crashed the game when using realistic acceleration. 19:36:37 *** bryjen [~bryjen@75.81.201.131] has joined #openttd 19:40:09 <planetmaker> hm... my download content seems to be broken, the tars I get seem to be trunkated. Any pointers how to start digging into the issue? 19:40:20 <planetmaker> Deleting and re-downloading is not what's going to help 19:40:34 <planetmaker> it's reproducable for me, with a number of grfs / AI 19:41:04 <planetmaker> if I leave content download and re-enter it, the just downloaded stuff is also marked as not present (again) 19:41:54 <planetmaker> so OpenTTD regognizes that the previous download has not the correct md5sum, though immediately after download I have a green bullet next to the stuff 19:42:40 <planetmaker> And it seems I'm not the only one as I've talked to another person who has the same issue... might be yet another OSX... 19:42:54 <Eddi|zuHause> somewhere in the forum it said something about known bug... 19:42:59 <Eddi|zuHause> but i don't know any details 19:43:11 <planetmaker> it's not known in the sense of "is on FS yet" 19:43:22 <planetmaker> but I'd like to know more :-) 19:43:38 <planetmaker> And I posted in at least one of those threads. 19:43:45 <peter1138> i think i had it on windows, actually 19:44:05 <peter1138> maybe it's a mirror being odd? 19:44:08 *** kkb1101 [~kkb110@host133-16.student.udel.edu] has joined #openttd 19:44:10 <planetmaker> peter1138: my testcase is the current NoCAB 2.0.4. 19:44:26 <planetmaker> I have no idea whether it's the mirror or not. How could I test? 19:44:37 <planetmaker> If I manually download the tar from the forum - all is fine. 19:44:58 <planetmaker> My mirror is the NL mirror afaik 19:45:21 <planetmaker> at least that's where I end up with binaries.openttd.org 19:46:20 *** heffer [~felix@static-87-78-98-150.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: heffer] 19:47:45 <planetmaker> when I get the tar.gz from that mirror, gunzip it, all is fine, too 19:48:02 *** heffer [~felix@static-87-78-98-150.netcologne.de] has joined #openttd 19:48:05 <planetmaker> (doing that manually that is) 19:51:28 *** pazifi [~pazifi@76-94.105-92.cust.bluewin.ch] has quit [Quit: Ich bin gegangen] 19:53:29 *** Coco-Banana-Man [~Stephan.D@p5B2DA90F.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 19:53:51 <planetmaker> hm... can I teach OpenTTD to keep the tar.gz which it downloaded? 19:55:40 <frosch123> he, also happens for me 19:55:44 <frosch123> so, no osx 19:56:35 <planetmaker> *uff* ;-) 19:56:52 <frosch123> but, the tar arrives and looks all fine 19:57:00 <planetmaker> it's truncated 19:57:09 <planetmaker> and too small and wrong md5sum 19:57:13 <frosch123> how does the gui detemine whether a version is present? 19:57:28 <planetmaker> filename and for AIs the version 19:57:34 <planetmaker> I *think* 19:57:53 <planetmaker> hm... 19:58:37 <planetmaker> don't mind me 19:59:09 * SmatZ minds planetmaker 19:59:17 <planetmaker> :-) 20:00:04 <frosch123> it is not truncated for me 20:00:31 <frosch123> if i download the tar.gz from bananas webinterface and extract it, i get the same file 20:00:45 <planetmaker> oh? 20:00:50 <planetmaker> I don't 20:00:51 <frosch123> but the gui shows it as not installed 20:01:04 <planetmaker> it's missing 26kByte for NoCAB 2.0.4 20:01:09 *** Fast2 [~Fast2@p57AF8ED2.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 20:01:19 <frosch123> 430080 <- that is my filesize 20:01:43 <frosch123> 88912 <- resp. the compressed one 20:02:24 <planetmaker> that's the one which works for me, too. But the content_download one is only 409600 bytes 20:03:27 *** avdg [~Adium@78-22-165-5.access.telenet.be] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:03:33 <planetmaker> But I get the same thing with virtually every ai I tried to update 20:03:38 <frosch123> restarting ottd makes the gui show the correct thing 20:04:18 *** avdg [~Adium@78-22-165-5.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 20:04:23 <OwenS> Thats an odd number. Which for some reason reminds me of the case of a mail server failing to send mail to sites beyond a certain distance 20:04:55 <frosch123> ok, verified with trans ai. downloading work, but closing and reopening the content gui makes the "dot" vanish, while restarting ottd makes it permanent 20:05:01 <frosch123> so, different issue :) 20:05:10 <planetmaker> wait. 20:05:22 <planetmaker> is your trainsAI working? 20:05:41 <planetmaker> what you report wrt GUI is the same here. Additionally the file is really broken 20:06:02 <frosch123> hmm, trans or trains :s 20:06:16 <planetmaker> but different is: a re-start won't make the dots green for me. 20:06:25 <frosch123> trAIns-2.tar <- ok, ls -ltr says it downloaded that one :p 20:06:53 <planetmaker> trAIns 20:07:18 <frosch123> yeah, there seem to be two issues :) the files are not properly rescanned/marked. and for you they are not downloaded properly 20:08:03 <planetmaker> ok. Any ideas how I should tackle the wrong download and /or gunzip? 20:08:26 <planetmaker> I guess I should start with not gunzipping and looking whether the gzip is the same... 20:08:43 <frosch123> and trans has incomplete dependencies on bananas 20:08:48 <planetmaker> :-) 20:09:05 <planetmaker> I'll test with simpleAI. Least traffic 20:09:27 <frosch123> unlink(GetFullFilename(this->curInfo, false)); <- comment that line 20:10:03 <frosch123> hmm, wrong line, that one is for music :) 20:10:56 <frosch123> unlink(GetFullFilename(this->curInfo, true)); <- that one :) 20:11:23 <frosch123> network_content.cpp:480 20:12:19 <planetmaker> let's see... 20:13:05 <frosch123> oh, the library trans requires is not even on bananas? 20:13:26 <frosch123> how useful :p 20:13:43 <planetmaker> :-P 20:15:38 <frosch123> 9938 downloads, i wonder how many found the forum post for downloading the required libraries 20:15:48 <planetmaker> frosch123: thanks. The downloaded gzip is fine. 20:15:54 <planetmaker> So gunzip fails 20:16:21 <frosch123> that would be zlib 20:17:32 <planetmaker> yes 20:17:50 <frosch123> makes it sound like an osx issue again :p 20:18:12 <planetmaker> hm... 20:18:39 <planetmaker> maybe... maybe it's all the ****** new zlib version 20:19:22 <planetmaker> zlib @1.2.4 archivers/zlib 20:19:43 <planetmaker> it was working with my previous one. But I don't quite know wheter it also worked for some time with this one... 20:19:50 <planetmaker> hmpf... downgrade... 20:22:02 <frosch123> "If everything gonna right, there are a few days to go to Bananas." Sat Mar 13, 2010 12:26 pm <- so there is some hope :) 20:22:26 <planetmaker> hu? 20:22:53 <frosch123> that is the last post in the topic about the library trans needs 20:23:03 <planetmaker> ah :-P 20:31:42 *** Grelouk [~Grelouk@206.146.88-79.rev.gaoland.net] has joined #openttd 20:33:47 <planetmaker> btw, it would be nice, if FS3750 could be considered. People compiling complain about that "bug" which is no bug... 20:34:01 <planetmaker> it's not OpenTTD's bug either, but... 20:35:57 *** Phazorx is now known as FS1063 20:36:21 *** George [~George@212.113.107.216] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:38:20 <planetmaker> hm... we can conclude that zlib 1.2.4 is broken on mac(ports) 20:38:32 <planetmaker> with zlib 1.3.3_3 I don't have issues 20:39:02 <planetmaker> which was the long-term version till they started to work again in late 2009 on the lib. 20:40:30 <planetmaker> and then I have the same issue as you, frosch123, with the availability-bullets 20:41:10 <frosch123> already debugging :p 20:41:38 <planetmaker> what zlib version do you use? 20:41:45 *** heffer [~felix@static-87-78-98-150.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: heffer] 20:42:08 <planetmaker> I wonder whether it's really OSX-specific, or if most others just didn't update yet. 20:42:18 <frosch123> dbg: [misc] Found tar '/home/frosch/.openttd/content_download/ai//trAIns-2.tar' with 42 new files 20:42:20 <frosch123> dbg: [misc] Found tar '/home/frosch/.openttd/content_download/ai/trAIns-2.tar' with 0 new files 20:42:28 <frosch123> something looks wrong :p 20:42:31 *** Terkhen [~Terkhen@199.69.220.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:42:41 <planetmaker> hm... :-) 20:43:27 *** Terkhen [~Terkhen@70.68.220.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #openttd 20:43:31 *** fonsinchen [~fonsinche@brln-4dbc14ab.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:44:16 * SpComb silently curses memcached for not accepting objects >1MB 20:44:47 <frosch123> planetmaker: 1.2.3-r1 20:44:59 <planetmaker> seems even older ;-) 20:45:09 <frosch123> gentoo stable 20:45:17 <frosch123> "stable" 20:45:18 <planetmaker> older than 2006 :-P 20:45:49 <planetmaker> Changes in 1.2.3.1 (16 August 2006) <-- zlib 20:48:13 *** ajmiles2 [~aj@78-86-188-187.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 20:54:12 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@a62-251-30-68.adsl.xs4all.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:54:20 *** ajmiles [~aj@78-86-188-187.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:54:38 *** aber [~Adium@gb049.stw.stud.uni-saarland.de] has joined #openttd 20:56:15 <planetmaker> where would it need being noted that zlib 1.2.4 is incompatible with openttd? 20:58:07 <Ammler> known-bugs.txt? 20:58:26 *** aber [~Adium@gb049.stw.stud.uni-saarland.de] has quit [] 20:58:57 <planetmaker> ah... yes, possibly :-) 21:04:48 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1FDF2.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:12:29 *** |Terkhen| [~Terkhen@66.69.220.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #openttd 21:12:58 *** Terkhen is now known as Guest2081 21:12:58 *** |Terkhen| is now known as Terkhen 21:15:50 *** Guest2081 [~Terkhen@70.68.220.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:20:11 *** rhaeder [~quix0r@dslb-094-221-204-086.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:21:31 <SmatZ> planetmaker: how "incompatible"? 21:22:00 <planetmaker> incompatible as in won't gunzip successfully --> broken unusable online content 21:22:28 <planetmaker> fs 3752 21:22:42 <planetmaker> oh, you probably read that ;-) 21:23:10 <planetmaker> nothing which I downloaded was usable, everything truncated 21:23:27 <SmatZ> FS#3752 - Crash after using hovercrafts 21:23:28 <planetmaker> the downloaded .gz file was correct, though 21:23:28 <SmatZ> ? 21:23:36 *** aber [~Adium@gb049.stw.stud.uni-saarland.de] has joined #openttd 21:23:39 <SmatZ> FS#3753 ;) 21:23:39 <planetmaker> oh. 3753 :-) 21:24:06 *** Maarten [~dutchusa@cpe-67-49-76-8.socal.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 21:24:07 <SmatZ> planetmaker: does the breakage apply to all files? 21:24:26 <planetmaker> yes. All I tested 21:24:56 *** Grelouk [~Grelouk@206.146.88-79.rev.gaoland.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:25:05 * SmatZ tests 21:25:08 <planetmaker> I tested 3 AI and 3 newgrf 21:25:32 <SmatZ> how do I know it's broken? 21:25:39 <planetmaker> truncated tar 21:25:47 <planetmaker> tar tf filename will tell you 21:25:53 <SmatZ> ok 21:28:00 <SmatZ> OpenGFX-0.2.3/changelog.txt 21:28:01 <SmatZ> tar: Unexpected EOF in archive 21:28:05 <planetmaker> yep 21:28:08 <planetmaker> the error 21:28:42 <planetmaker> you tested on the 2nd largest file available, though ;-) 21:28:57 <SmatZ> :) 21:29:03 <SmatZ> I knew that is a tar ;) 21:29:05 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 21:29:14 <planetmaker> :-) 21:30:14 <planetmaker> you built with zlib 1.2.4, too, yes? 21:30:40 <SmatZ> yes 21:30:43 <SmatZ> fine with 1.2.3 21:31:08 *** Maarten- [~dutchusa@cpe-67-49-76-8.socal.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:33:06 <planetmaker> there are many different 1.2.3 ;-) 21:33:22 <planetmaker> 1.2.3 ... 1.2.3.9 21:34:30 *** Maarten- [~dutchusa@cpe-67-49-76-8.socal.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 21:34:37 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: frosch * r19600 /trunk/src/network/network_content.cpp: -Fix (r18994): Presence of online content was not properly updated after download due to duplicate slashes in the path. 21:35:45 <planetmaker> SmatZ: I wonder whether to file a bug report with zlib... 21:36:08 <SmatZ> planetmaker: it can be bug in OTTD 21:36:11 *** Maarten [~dutchusa@cpe-67-49-76-8.socal.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:36:52 <planetmaker> then I'll refrain from doing so :-) 21:37:07 *** aber [~Adium@gb049.stw.stud.uni-saarland.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:37:08 <SmatZ> I think we will report it upstream if it is zlib bug ;) 21:39:15 <SmatZ> - Fix memory leaks in gzclose_r() and gzclose_w(), file leak in gz_open() 21:39:19 <SmatZ> at last! 21:39:21 <planetmaker> but looking at network_content.cpp:368-400 doesn't show much 21:39:45 <SmatZ> Rubidium (and a bit me) spent quit some time with that 21:40:20 <planetmaker> :-) 21:45:24 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@a62-251-30-68.adsl.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 21:46:51 <SmatZ> @calc 5373952 / 64 21:46:51 <DorpsGek> SmatZ: 83968 21:46:54 <SmatZ> @calc 5373952 / 65536 21:46:54 <DorpsGek> SmatZ: 82 21:46:56 <SmatZ> hmm 21:49:45 <planetmaker> hm... I'll continue tomorrow. Have a good night, dear Smatz :-) and all others, too 21:51:47 <SmatZ> good night, planetmaker :) 21:52:40 *** nighthawkcm [~nighthawk@pD950523C.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 21:55:09 <SmatZ> @calc 5386240 - 5373952 21:55:09 <DorpsGek> SmatZ: 12288 22:00:50 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1FDF2.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 22:05:03 *** aber [~Adium@gb049.stw.stud.uni-saarland.de] has joined #openttd 22:09:21 *** Adambean [CG1@82.hosts.reece-eu.net] has quit [Quit: Gone fishing] 22:13:33 *** snack23 [~nn@dsl-mlimmlgw1-ff1ec000-127.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [Quit: ( www.nnscript.com :: NoNameScript 4.22 :: www.esnation.com )] 22:14:40 <SmatZ> that f**** zlib doesn't have any bugzilla nor a f***** mail list archive 22:14:45 <SmatZ> no wonder their software sucks 22:14:51 *** kyo313 [~kyo@92.3.9.107] has joined #openttd 22:17:10 <SmatZ> open mail list archive, that is 22:17:23 <SmatZ> WHYYY 22:18:10 <SpComb> You have been Euphemized 22:18:16 <SpComb> it's zlib from the 1970's or something? 22:18:19 <SmatZ> very 22:18:46 <SmatZ> the webpage looks like from the 1970's 22:25:02 *** b_jonas [~x@dsl4E5C09BD.pool.t-online.hu] has quit [Quit: leaving] 22:25:55 <frosch123> so, gzeof() is broken 22:26:28 <frosch123> if (read == 0 && gzeof(fin)) break; <- replacing the "while (!gzeof(fin))" with that fixes it for me 22:26:54 <frosch123> http://www.mail-archive.com/debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org/msg422293.html <- maybe related to that one 22:29:38 <SmatZ> frosch123: yeah, I read that 22:29:57 <SmatZ> but I wonder when that was implemented 22:37:04 <Rubidium> the debian maintainer of zlib kind-of doesn't trust zlib 1.2.3.5 (and hasn't even bothered with 1.2.4 yet) 22:37:40 <SmatZ> good :) 22:39:05 <Rubidium> so any zlib >= 1.2.3.5 is broken beyond use 22:40:12 <SmatZ> looks so, I don't have 1.2.3.x in my repo though 22:40:29 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@a62-251-30-68.adsl.xs4all.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:40:38 <SmatZ> but the zlib 1.2.3 I am using is from October 2010 22:40:40 <Rubidium> 1.2.3 for you might very well be 1.2.3.4 or so 22:40:42 <SmatZ> so <1.2.3.5 22:41:26 <Rubidium> - Note in zlib.h that gzerror() should be used to distinguish from EOF 22:41:37 <Rubidium> from zlib's changelog 22:41:44 <frosch123> i did not found that note though :p 22:41:51 <Rubidium> 1.2.3.9 22:42:01 <frosch123> in 1.2.4 22:43:00 <SmatZ> since when does that apply? 22:43:20 <frosch123> the description of gzeof says that it may return false, while eof has actually been reached (i.e. gzread will return 0), but that it gzread will not read anymore after gzeof returned true 22:43:40 *** saLOUt [~rriemann@dslb-088-073-099-109.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:44:06 *** devilsadvocate [~devilsadv@202.3.77.202] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:44:22 <SmatZ> frosch123: that's for the case when "we are exactly at the end of the file, but haven't read past the end yet" 22:45:30 <frosch123> yup 22:46:10 <SmatZ> gzeof() doesn't work according to documentation :) 22:46:41 <Terkhen> good night 22:46:45 *** Terkhen [~Terkhen@66.69.220.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Quit: ...] 22:49:36 <Rubidium> SmatZ: there's a mailing list: http://zlib.net/mailman/listinfo/zlib-devel_madler.net 22:50:05 <SmatZ> Rubidium: yeah, I need to authorize first 22:50:14 <SmatZ> but my account hasn't been approved (yet) 22:50:24 <frosch123> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=575994 <- sounds similar 22:51:08 <SmatZ> also, what a stupidity is it to have "subscribers-only" read-only mail archive 22:51:17 *** Coco-Banana-Man [~Stephan.D@p5B2DA90F.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Regel Nr. 1: Jeder hört auf mein Kommando! - Regel Nr. 2: Jeder bleibt auf dem Weg! - Regel Nr. 3: ... ... Der, der blÀht, als hinterster geht!] 22:51:26 <SmatZ> frosch123: nice :) 22:58:55 *** devilsadvocate [~devilsadv@202.3.77.231] has joined #openttd 23:00:08 *** Neon [~Neon@dslb-088-069-225-140.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Something strange must have happened...] 23:00:33 *** avdg [~Adium@78-22-165-5.access.telenet.be] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 23:12:35 *** kyo313 [~kyo@92.3.9.107] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:14:30 *** kyo313 [~kyo@92.3.9.107] has joined #openttd 23:19:33 *** fjb [~frank@p5485EC3E.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 23:20:39 <SekiSelu> Anyone got a second to help me with a GRF cargo question? 23:21:44 <Eddi|zuHause> ... you wasted so many seconds by now... 23:23:07 *** FS1063 [~pavelkoll@77.239.236.193] has left #openttd [] 23:24:25 * Yexo wonders if adding http://www.hm2k.com/articles/how-to-ask-a-question to the channel topic would be a good idea 23:25:21 <Yexo> and yes SekiSelu, part of it applies to you (as Eddi|zuHause already said) 23:25:26 <frosch123> return state->mode == GZ_READ ? (state->eof && state->have == 0 && state->strm.avail_in == 0) : 0; <- changing gzlib.c:435 seems to fix it. let's see whether one can find some vcs 23:28:40 <SekiSelu> Calculator broke? :) 23:34:51 *** SekiSelu [~Seki@c-71-237-70-85.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:35:10 * NCommander finds the AI is quite difficult to beat even 0on easy; its extremely agressive 23:35:24 *** SekiSelu [~Seki@c-71-237-70-85.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 23:39:47 <fjb> Which AI? 23:42:38 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590fefeb.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:48:51 <Eddi|zuHause> people can never make up their minds... the AI is either too easy or too hard... 23:52:39 *** KritiK [~Maxim@93-80-81-112.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:54:27 * fjb still wonders which AI is that hard. 23:58:32 <SekiSelu> If it's too hard, turn on "Build while paused" and go to town :P 23:58:43 <SekiSelu> Then at least the playing field is level 23:59:03 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B74917.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [] 23:59:23 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B77C5E.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 23:59:50 *** KenjiE20 [~KenjiE20@92.0.27.246] has quit [Quit: ãããã¿]