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00:01:08 *** pugi [~pugi@p4FCC46FE.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: ALL YOUR BASE ARE BELONG TO US!] 00:01:54 <Eddi|zuHause> Aali: IMHO, the back of a one way signal should behave exactly like end of line. 00:02:58 <Aali> yes and it works fine if there is no other way to go 00:04:26 <Aali> but with one track in each direction trains tend to choose the wrong way and end up bouncing forever 00:04:28 <glx> you should not have lost trains 00:04:32 *** zachanima [~zach@2506ds3-od.0.fullrate.dk] has quit [Quit: leaving] 00:04:44 <Eddi|zuHause> Aali: the train just shouldn't get lost in the first place 00:04:53 *** Player48 [xx@80-186-90-78.elisa-mobile.fi] has joined #openttd 00:05:03 <Eddi|zuHause> Aali: if the train is lost, that means there is no right way 00:05:06 <Aali> yeah, I'm sure you've never had a train get lost on you 00:05:37 <Eddi|zuHause> Aali: yes, i did, that's why it throws a message to alert the player to take action 00:06:16 <Aali> sure 00:06:29 <Aali> I just can't see why this behaviour was changed in the first place 00:07:04 *** zachanima [~zach@2506ds3-od.0.fullrate.dk] has joined #openttd 00:07:16 *** zachanima [~zach@2506ds3-od.0.fullrate.dk] has quit [] 00:07:20 *** zachanima [~zach@2506ds3-od.0.fullrate.dk] has joined #openttd 00:07:24 <Eddi|zuHause> there's a flyspray task. but i can't be bothered to look it up 00:07:50 <Aali> there are two of them, the original one asking for the change and a new one asking for a revert 00:08:19 <Aali> so, I guess we'll see what happens 00:08:23 <ccfreak2k> A bug and an anti-bug? 00:08:27 <ccfreak2k> Don't get them too close together. 00:08:50 <Eddi|zuHause> the one i meant involved a depot at the "wrong" end of the station 00:09:04 <Eddi|zuHause> which was based on a ncommon ewbie-error 00:09:23 <Eddi|zuHause> common newbie error 00:09:31 <Eddi|zuHause> damn keyboard 00:11:00 *** ajmiles [~aj@78-86-188-187.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:11:23 <Eddi|zuHause> Aali: the point is, that "lost trains" are not something where you can do any sane estimate what might be what the user considers "right" 00:11:36 <Eddi|zuHause> whatever you do, it will break for half of the people 00:11:56 <Aali> I agree, so why was a change made in the first place? 00:12:18 <Eddi|zuHause> so the only thing you can do is to come up with a situation where the trains are NOT lost, but still behave wrongly 00:13:02 <Eddi|zuHause> otherwise this isn't worth discussing 00:13:33 <Aali> oh its not worth discussing, I'm just ranting 00:13:51 <Aali> I want the record to show that I oppose this change :) 00:13:52 *** Chillosophy [~fu@82-170-139-109.ip.telfort.nl] has quit [] 00:14:15 <Eddi|zuHause> the reaons why things were done are in the commit messages and the flyspray tasks 00:24:45 <Aali> hmm, the original bug was solved in a bit of a weird way 00:26:15 <Aali> the fix allows the train in question to reserve a path to a one-way PBS just so it can stop and reverse at a station before reaching the signal 00:26:38 <Aali> it seems to me the fix should have been to make the train aware of the fact that it can do that instead 00:45:40 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1D29F.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:47:20 *** zachanim1 [~zach@2506ds3-od.0.fullrate.dk] has joined #openttd 00:48:03 *** zachanima [~zach@2506ds3-od.0.fullrate.dk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:48:58 *** zachanim1 [~zach@2506ds3-od.0.fullrate.dk] has quit [] 00:50:27 *** zachanima [~zach@2506ds3-od.0.fullrate.dk] has joined #openttd 00:52:38 *** wollollo [~martin@host86-175-29-208.wlms-broadband.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:23:21 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 01:49:32 *** llugo [~lugo@mgdb-4db8ccdc.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 01:53:13 *** davis [~b@p5B28A518.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:56:38 *** lllugo [~lugo@mgdb-4db8c096.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:57:10 *** davis [~b@p5B28B870.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 01:58:12 *** JVassie [~James@92.27.149.231] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:01:18 *** lllugo [~lugo@mgdb-4db8dd96.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 02:08:38 *** llugo [~lugo@mgdb-4db8ccdc.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:09:24 *** Devroush [~dennis@94-225-67-91.access.telenet.be] has quit [] 02:30:03 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:bdfc:ee0:5be3:c7ae] has quit [Quit: bye] 02:39:17 *** nicfer1 [~nicfer@190.50.56.143] has joined #openttd 02:40:01 *** lllugo [~lugo@mgdb-4db8dd96.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:42:25 *** nicfer [~nicfer@190.50.35.219] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 03:12:14 *** trebuchet [~Trebuchet@69.51.104.87] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:26:53 *** davis [~b@p5B28B870.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 03:37:15 *** trebuchet [~Trebuchet@69.51.104.87] has joined #openttd 03:41:47 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 04:19:35 *** nicfer1 [~nicfer@190.50.56.143] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:25:17 *** trebuchet [~Trebuchet@69.51.104.87] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:30:21 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 04:34:36 <SmatZ> morning 04:35:24 <LaSeandre> good morning to yoooou, SmatZ! 04:35:35 <LaSeandre> although I'm leaving now. 04:37:04 <SmatZ> bye LaSeandre :) 04:53:58 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 04:56:04 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B75162.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:56:29 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B77A28.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 05:19:53 *** elmz [~elmz@184.213-167-126.customer.lyse.net] has joined #openttd 05:49:23 <Terkhen> good morning 05:54:40 *** Joni_ [~Joni-@dsl-vsabrasgw1-fe00dc00-41.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #openttd 06:00:08 *** Joni- [~Joni-@dsl-vsabrasgw1-fe00dc00-41.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:00:29 *** Joni- [~Joni-@dsl-vsabrasgw1-fe00dc00-41.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #openttd 06:02:47 *** Joni_ [~Joni-@dsl-vsabrasgw1-fe00dc00-41.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:03:39 *** Mucht [~Martin@chello084115143107.3.graz.surfer.at] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:04:53 *** TomyLobo [~foo@port-212-202-171-176.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 06:14:12 *** Prof_Frink [~proffrink@5e06c3db.bb.sky.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:31:55 *** Cybertinus [~Cybertinu@tunnel3304.ipv6.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 06:38:02 *** TheUros [~chatzilla@BSN-77-150-182.static.dsl.siol.net] has joined #openttd 06:38:08 *** ^Spike^ [~spike@d200003.upc-d.chello.nl] has joined #openttd 06:51:03 *** TomyLobo [~foo@port-212-202-171-176.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Quit: Standby mode...] 06:51:50 *** Kurimus [Kurimus@dsl-tkubrasgw1-fe83de00-38.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #openttd 07:04:45 *** ar3k [~ident@87-239-75-101.internetia.net.pl] has joined #openttd 07:04:47 *** DDR [~DDR@66.183.113.224] has joined #openttd 07:07:24 *** Br33z4hSlut5 [~static.kp@92.68.154.34] has joined #openttd 07:08:21 <V453000> Eddi | zuHause: well that is awesome but from gameplay point of view it does nothing but break the game 07:13:09 *** JVassie [~James@92.27.149.231] has joined #openttd 07:17:41 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host105-234-dynamic.5-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #openttd 07:18:27 <Wolf01> 'morning 07:21:38 <TheUros> i have the latest openttd .. is there a limit how much can city growth ? .. i mean radius limit ? 07:32:29 *** avdg [~Adium@94-227-100-192.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 07:33:45 *** Joni_ [~Joni-@80.220.0.41] has joined #openttd 07:39:02 *** Joni- 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09:31:28 *** Cybertinus [~Cybertinu@tunnel3304.ipv6.xs4all.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:32:56 *** heffer [~felix@hyperion.fetzig.org] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:34:16 <fjb> Moin 09:34:38 *** heffer [~felix@hyperion.fetzig.org] has joined #openttd 09:38:05 *** Chris_Booth [~chatzilla@cpc7-newt30-2-0-cust37.newt.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.6.10/20100914125854]] 09:46:25 *** Sacro [~ben@adsl-87-102-8-110.karoo.KCOM.COM] has joined #openttd 09:52:08 *** dfox [~dfox@ip-89-176-209-74.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:04:59 *** Adambean [AdamR@88.97.144.82] has joined #openttd 10:06:10 *** Cybertinus [~Cybertinu@tunnel3304.ipv6.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 10:15:22 *** Fuco [~dota.keys@pc-209-82.sks3.muni.cz] has joined #openttd 10:16:29 *** Yrol_Denjeah [~SomeOne@hmbg-5f774ba1.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: And crawling on the planets face...Some insects called the human race...Lost in time...And lost in space...And Meaning......] 10:16:42 *** wollollo [~martin@host86-175-24-127.wlms-broadband.com] has joined #openttd 10:35:36 <TheUros> i have the latest openttd .. is there a limit how much can city growth ? .. i mean radius limit ? 10:35:55 <V453000> why the hell would you need a large city 10:35:55 <V453000> :) 10:36:18 <V453000> but if there is any limit, it is so large that it will suffice you for a looong time :p 10:36:25 <TheUros> ok thanx 10:36:39 <TheUros> why i need a large city ... well . i want just one large city 10:37:22 <V453000> there is no problem in growing a city all over 256x256 10:37:49 <V453000> I believe that will be enough :) 10:38:28 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 10:38:42 <TheUros> yep .. more than enought 10:39:53 <TheUros> how long train stations you usually build ? i allways use 7 tiles long stations 10:39:54 <V453000> oh and I recommend to turn off the automatic building of roads for towns 10:40:10 <V453000> so you can control where the roads go, the cities screw up ;) 10:40:33 <Eddi|zuHause> lots of long road tunnels tend to help growing a city over a large area 10:40:37 <V453000> I use mostly 3 tiles, it is probably the most all-over versatile and good choice imo 10:40:56 <Eddi|zuHause> i hate grids... 10:40:59 <planetmaker> TheUros: there's an implicit limit in the town growth code 10:41:20 <TheUros> what limit ? 10:41:26 <planetmaker> : city action can mean 'new house' or replace house. So in the limit expansion gets more and more unlikely 10:42:30 <TheUros> just 3 tiles ?? .. maybe for small passengers trains .. but for cargo you need at least 7 tiles long stations ?? or no 10:43:02 <Eddi|zuHause> for short cargo trips i occasionally use 2 tiles 10:43:14 <Eddi|zuHause> especially in feeder systems 10:43:42 <Eddi|zuHause> long distance maybe 8 or 10 tiles 10:44:13 <Eddi|zuHause> i used 15 tiles once 10:54:14 <V453000> distance doesnt really matter, throughput does :) 10:57:30 *** wollollo [~martin@host86-175-24-127.wlms-broadband.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:59:33 <Eddi|zuHause> there's a tricky balance there 10:59:45 <Eddi|zuHause> long trains tend to be slower, and block the junctions longer 11:00:18 *** APTX [~APTX@chello089077244008.chello.pl] has joined #openttd 11:00:22 <Eddi|zuHause> so it means the non-blocking junctions need to get more complicated 11:03:06 *** avdg [~Adium@94-227-100-192.access.telenet.be] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:03:23 *** avdg [~Adium@94-227-100-192.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 11:04:28 <dihedral> morning 11:08:23 *** wollollo [~martin@host86-175-24-127.wlms-broadband.com] has joined #openttd 11:08:39 <roboboy> hello 11:09:22 *** Chillosophy [~fu@82-170-139-109.ip.telfort.nl] has joined #openttd 11:13:57 <andythenorth> one piece flow :P 11:15:06 <andythenorth> http://www.strategosinc.com/onepieceflow.htm 11:38:34 <dihedral> how's your patch coming along 11:39:04 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:39:54 *** heffer_ [~felix@hyperion.fetzig.org] has joined #openttd 11:41:17 *** heffer [~felix@hyperion.fetzig.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:41:54 *** ecke [~ecke@188.75.128.2] has quit [Quit: more listen, more understand, more know] 11:42:20 *** heffer_ is now known as heffer 11:42:38 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@88.130.162.139] has joined #openttd 11:44:44 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 11:47:06 *** KenjiE20 [~KenjiE20@92.10.87.89] has joined #openttd 11:49:11 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 [~Flex@88.130.165.63] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:54:07 *** SpComb [terom@zapotek.paivola.fi] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:54:12 *** SpComb [terom@zapotek.paivola.fi] has joined #openttd 11:58:34 *** Lurimax [~quassel@ti0028a380-dhcp1175.bb.online.no] has joined #openttd 12:06:38 *** lasershock [lasershock@hd9483b29.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:06:41 <dihedral> got to work to find a corupted hard disk in my computer... no mote booty, nono rescue.... 12:07:01 *** lasershock [lasershock@hd9483b29.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has joined #openttd 12:07:07 <dihedral> yay for not having a raid 1 setup 12:13:11 <planetmaker> backups rule ;-) 12:13:57 <Noldo> and raid is not backup 12:14:50 <planetmaker> sure enough 12:15:11 <planetmaker> raid won't help you if the machine catches fire ;-) 12:16:00 <Rubidium> backups won't help when they're in a fire safe in the same building that's on fire :) 12:16:31 <Noldo> the most common thing raid doesn't protect against is user error 12:16:34 <planetmaker> won't they? 12:17:02 <heffer> planetmaker: if you delete a file on a raid it's gone 12:17:08 <heffer> it's not if you have a real backup 12:17:25 <heffer> because it's a. on the raid and b. in the backup media 12:18:55 <dihedral> in this case raid would have saved a lot of wasted time 12:20:39 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:518b:12e1:d2bf:274b] has joined #openttd 12:20:42 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 12:21:52 <planetmaker> heffer, sure; I wanted to reference the fire proof sfe, though ;-) 12:21:54 <planetmaker> *safe 12:26:01 *** tokai [~tokai@port-92-195-54-241.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:27:52 <planetmaker> I think I even know where you could get one for free. Provided you pick it up 12:28:07 <planetmaker> The size is approx. 4 cubic meter ;-) 12:28:12 *** tokai [~tokai@port-92-195-56-52.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 12:28:15 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai] by ChanServ 12:28:16 <planetmaker> The weight... dunno... several tons 12:28:51 <planetmaker> but maybe they already disposed of it... 12:29:12 *** Biolunar [Mahdi@blfd-4db1aad8.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 12:30:42 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:43:37 <__ln__> http://narf-archive.com/pix/bf1b39cef6a2c3211b73ca08a7396e78423c0225.jpg 12:47:48 <SmatZ> nice :) 12:50:03 <Eddi|zuHause> doesn't _really_ look like fibonacci... 12:50:19 * avdg hears the word photoshop 12:51:12 <Eddi|zuHause> YES. certainly photoshopped. no way the arrows and the caption were really there. 12:51:41 <Eddi|zuHause> they don't cast proper shadows! 12:53:10 <__ln__> avdg: wrong, you hear the *trademark* Photoshop® 12:53:57 <__ln__> besides pigeons would be scared of big arrows hanging over them and would fly away 12:54:32 *** Sacro [~ben@adsl-87-102-8-110.karoo.KCOM.COM] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:56:14 <SmatZ> not if they were glued 12:57:18 *** wollollo [~martin@host86-175-24-127.wlms-broadband.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:57:58 *** X-2 [~X-2@5ED67292.cm-7-7b.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has joined #openttd 13:00:25 <planetmaker> hm... adding epoxy to the places pigeos usually land, eh? ;-) 13:00:33 *** TheUros [~chatzilla@BSN-77-150-182.static.dsl.siol.net] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.6.10/20100914125854]] 13:00:40 <SmatZ> :) 13:05:04 <dihedral> planetmaker, lol 13:05:24 <dihedral> i have quick glue, with an activator for my rc plane models 13:05:41 <planetmaker> though I always wanted to combine a microwave oven and a satellite dish to a remote microwave ;-) 13:05:55 <dihedral> a drop of glue on the back of the fly makes it fly away, spraying the fly while it's flying makes it "land" :-D 13:06:10 <planetmaker> your neighbour is too loud? Just use it on his stereo ;-) 13:10:00 *** fanioz [~fanioz@180.214.232.3] has joined #openttd 13:10:22 <Beklugas> hello 13:11:01 <planetmaker> moin 13:14:41 *** Player48 [xx@80-186-90-78.elisa-mobile.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:16:22 *** Beklugas [~belugas@216.191.111.238] has quit [Quit: On snow, everyone can follow your traces] 13:17:02 *** Belugas [~belugas@216.191.111.238] has joined #openttd 13:17:05 *** mode/#openttd [+o Belugas] by ChanServ 13:17:31 <Belugas> good to be myself again 13:17:46 <planetmaker> :-) 13:18:25 <dihedral> welcome back Belugas ;-) 13:19:10 <Belugas> was not gone that lng ;) but thanks anyway 13:27:34 <dihedral> <Belugas> good to be myself again <- was referring to that 13:27:46 <Belugas> i know :) 13:28:41 *** fanioz [~fanioz@180.214.232.3] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:30:52 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 13:38:17 *** davis [~b@p5B28B870.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [] 13:38:29 *** davis [~b@p5B28B870.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 13:41:31 *** Xaroth [~Xaroth@86.92.135.101] has joined #openttd 13:45:44 <fjb> Moin Belugas 13:47:10 <Belugas> hey fjb 13:51:27 * Belugas thinks about buying a 8gb sd card. current one is too small for a decent set of songs. 13:53:42 <dihedral> Belugas, get one with 20MB/s write speed :-) 13:53:49 *** Sacro [~ben@dhcp-150-237-218-212.wireless.hull.ac.uk] has joined #openttd 13:53:57 <dihedral> ok, be fair - take one with 12MB/s 13:54:46 <Belugas> in terms of class, what would those be? 13:54:56 <Belugas> i do't need a speedy one 13:55:00 <Rubidium> why bother about writing speed? 13:55:19 <Belugas> even my camera would bnot be able to take advantage of a fast one 13:55:26 <Rubidium> you just start copying your song to it and go to bed. In the morning it'll likely be done 13:55:29 <Belugas> none, Rubidium, absolutely none 13:55:36 <Belugas> indeed :) 13:56:06 <Rubidium> at least, I'd assume it's not as slow as the internet used to be... oh the times where downloading the kernel's source package took 2 hours 13:56:52 <Rubidium> now we're complaining if it isn't down within like a minute 13:57:42 <Belugas> :) 13:58:03 * Belugas remembers browsing with a 2400 modem 13:58:30 <Belugas> downloading one song took the whole night 13:58:45 <Rubidium> ghehe... 13:58:57 <Rubidium> 14k4 was the slowest modem I've ever used 13:59:27 <Rubidium> although... I know I've "worked" with some hardware that used 300 baud (yay ATMs) 13:59:27 <SmatZ> 28.8k here :) 13:59:47 <Rubidium> though the 2 hours was IIRC with a 64k ISDN line 14:00:30 <planetmaker> 33k here :-) 14:00:46 * avdg has sometimes a connection of 28kbps 14:00:54 <avdg> isp limits 14:01:19 <SmatZ> :( 14:01:48 <avdg> still fast enough to play openttd minus loading 14:01:52 <Rubidium> the only thing I like about modems is the first 30 seconds 14:02:20 <SmatZ> avdg: to play online? syncing that several-minutes-long download will probably cause connection lost 14:02:38 <avdg> not anymore actually :p 14:02:53 <avdg> there was a time where my download stopped after 3 sec 14:04:34 *** Sacro_ [~ben@150.237.218.212] has joined #openttd 14:05:11 <Belugas> 14k4 was already a good speed :) 14:06:03 <Belugas> to be fair, i'd have to confess I had that 2400 modem for less than a week 14:06:14 *** luckz [~lkz@luckz.de] has left #openttd [] 14:06:20 <Belugas> we've upgraded to the state-of-the-art 9600 one 14:06:25 <SmatZ> :) 14:06:26 <Belugas> wow... blazing fast..! 14:08:17 *** fanioz [~fanioz@180.214.232.3] has joined #openttd 14:08:36 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:08:53 <dihedral> in average you'll hit a 3MB/s writing speed 14:08:57 *** Sacro [~ben@dhcp-150-237-218-212.wireless.hull.ac.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:09:11 <dihedral> and there are cameras that can make use of faster writing speeds 14:09:21 <dihedral> e.g. Nikon 7D 14:10:15 <dihedral> take pictures at 8fps and you can do something like 16 in one batch, then you'll have to wait for the camera to finish writing the data to the card ... 3MB/s will take quite some time ^^ 14:14:39 *** luckz [~lkz@luckz.de] has joined #openttd 14:14:52 *** fanioz [~fanioz@180.214.232.3] has quit [Quit: Leaving, good bye] 14:15:15 *** fanioz [~fanioz@180.214.232.3] has joined #openttd 14:26:54 *** Sacro_ [~ben@150.237.218.212] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:27:00 *** Uresu [~Wes@5ad16f54.bb.sky.com] has joined #openttd 14:27:09 *** nicfer [~nicfer@190.50.52.106] has joined #openttd 14:30:53 *** Belugas [~belugas@216.191.111.238] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:31:59 *** Belugas [~belugas@216.191.111.238] has joined #openttd 14:31:59 *** mode/#openttd [+o Belugas] by ChanServ 14:32:19 <Belugas> in raw, i can only do 1.5fps 14:32:33 <Belugas> in jpg, i've got a big 3fps 14:32:36 <Belugas> so... 14:32:45 *** Uresu [~Wes@5ad16f54.bb.sky.com] has left #openttd [Konversation terminated!] 14:33:01 <Belugas> until i've get my hands on Canon 7d, i'll keep low profile low cost sd cards :) 14:33:17 <Belugas> and 7d deals with compact flash 14:33:19 <Belugas> so.. 14:34:02 <Belugas> and that's such a fantastic machine, that 7d... i'm jsut drooling every tiume i look at the specs or even have one on my hands att he nearest camera shop 14:35:20 *** KritiK [~Maxim@95-27-201-172.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd 14:38:12 <Belugas> dihedral: what are you talking about? I can't see any nikon 7d 14:38:23 <Belugas> have you mixed nikon with canon??? 14:38:28 *** KouDy [~KouDy@ip-89-176-216-203.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 14:38:29 <Belugas> HOW DARE YOU??? 14:39:20 <dihedral> ops - sorry - got 2 friends confused :-D 14:39:44 <planetmaker> :-D 14:39:47 <dihedral> nikon D300s 14:40:40 <Belugas> haaaa... better :) 14:41:11 <planetmaker> seriously considering 7D, Belugas ? :-) 14:44:35 <Belugas> you bet 14:44:41 <Belugas> all the advantages it has? 14:44:45 <Belugas> of course i do 14:45:18 <Belugas> i mean... i doubt i could seriously use it to its full potential 14:45:25 <Belugas> but... hey.. waht a piece! 14:45:35 <Belugas> wirelss flash built in support 14:45:50 <Belugas> environment sealed 14:45:57 <Belugas> 2 digits 4 14:46:04 <planetmaker> :-) 14:46:08 <Belugas> 8fps, in raw and else 14:46:21 <Belugas> etc etc 14:46:23 <Belugas> man... 14:46:28 <Belugas> i don't care about the video 14:46:30 <Belugas> but the rest... 14:46:37 <Belugas> i downladed the manual 14:46:41 <Belugas> 297 pages 14:46:50 <Belugas> but so good to read :) 14:49:53 <Belugas> would you not, planetmaker? 14:50:27 <Belugas> but to be honest, i know my son will use my 1000D at one point. So i must be ready to have a new one by then ;) 14:50:51 <planetmaker> Belugas, surely I would :-) 14:55:38 <dihedral> Belugas, a friend of mine bought it (iirc) 14:56:18 <Belugas> what were his impressions? 14:56:27 <Belugas> apart the weight, of course ;) 15:00:11 <andythenorth> Olympus Pen EP2 15:00:14 <andythenorth> total win 15:00:20 <andythenorth> v. expensive, but very awesome 15:00:58 <andythenorth> http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/EP2/EP2A.HTM 15:01:46 *** Lakie [~Lakie@91.84.251.149] has joined #openttd 15:02:19 <planetmaker> andythenorth, you haven't seen the price tag on the Canon EOS 7D then ;-) 15:02:38 <andythenorth> no 15:03:16 <andythenorth> I used to have 3 Olympus 35mm SLRs and a full range of prime lenses from 24mm-500mm for the price of one Pen 2 :P 15:04:06 <planetmaker> http://dpreview.com/reviews/canoneos7d/page20.asp 15:07:06 *** fanioz [~fanioz@180.214.232.3] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:10:34 <Belugas> andythenorth, if i recall, you cannot use your regular olympus lens on that unit, it's 4/3,micro that is. 15:10:43 <Belugas> plus, i have to admit, i NEED the view finder 15:11:00 <Belugas> working wht the LCD is not really comfy, especially outside 15:11:11 <Belugas> but it all depends on what your doing, i agree 15:11:29 <Belugas> and i do agree it looks like a nice machine 15:11:50 <andythenorth> Belugas: the EP2 comes with an awesome electronic viewfinder 15:12:14 <andythenorth> it's a bit weird, converting photons to electrons, then back again when a mirror would do just as well, but it works 15:12:32 <andythenorth> I can use OM lenses, but only with a really expensive adapter 15:12:38 <andythenorth> the default lens is awesome 15:13:25 *** robotx [~robotx@141-70-75-133.user.wh-stuttgart.de] has joined #openttd 15:13:49 <Belugas> yeah, everything comes with a price :S 15:14:40 <Belugas> some Canon have a Live View mode, which is the same as the feature you describe. I have sucg a monde on my 1000D. Honestly, I only use it when i';m composing stuff with the tripod 15:14:47 <Belugas> and inside only 15:15:11 <Belugas> maybe it's the stuff they used to bult it, but i don't really like the reflections and all 15:15:33 <andythenorth> the one I mean is an eyepiece 15:16:04 <andythenorth> http://www.olympus.co.uk/consumer/21693_pen-camera_vf-2_22807.htm 15:16:09 *** robotx [~robotx@141-70-75-133.user.wh-stuttgart.de] has left #openttd [] 15:17:20 <Belugas> hooo... COOL :) 15:17:28 <Belugas> now that is awesome :D 15:19:04 *** VVG [~sdfkhksd@85.249.0.40] has quit [] 15:19:54 <Belugas> but... why that camera? http://www.slrgear.com/reviews/showproduct.php/product/1246/cat/39 why not that one? 15:20:02 <Belugas> just curious 15:20:04 <Belugas> size? 15:20:49 *** wollollo [~martin@host86-175-24-127.wlms-broadband.com] has joined #openttd 15:31:55 *** Sacro [~ben@adsl-87-102-87-110.karoo.KCOM.COM] has joined #openttd 15:34:40 <andythenorth> Belugas: size 15:34:50 <andythenorth> and nostalgia 15:35:14 <andythenorth> here's my 'other' camera: http://camaracoleccion.es/imagenes/Olympus_om2.jpg 15:35:24 <andythenorth> it's about the same size and similar form factor 15:36:49 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1DB83.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:39:23 *** pugi [~pugi@p4FCC440C.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 15:40:39 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1DB83.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 15:41:27 <Belugas> quite good reasons :) 15:58:42 *** nicfer [~nicfer@190.50.52.106] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:24:57 *** wollollo [~martin@host86-175-24-127.wlms-broadband.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:30:27 *** KouDy [~KouDy@ip-89-176-216-203.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 16:30:34 *** KouDy [~KouDy@ip-89-176-216-203.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 16:30:48 *** Prof_Frink [~proffrink@5e06c3db.bb.sky.com] has joined #openttd 16:35:23 *** fanioz [~fanioz@180.214.233.11] has joined #openttd 16:36:43 *** TomyLobo [~foo@port-212-202-171-176.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 16:38:12 *** avdg [~Adium@94-227-100-192.access.telenet.be] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 16:38:37 *** avdg [~Adium@94-227-100-192.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 16:43:44 *** Mucht [~Martin@chello084115143107.3.graz.surfer.at] has joined #openttd 16:49:05 *** ecke [~ecke@188.75.128.2] has joined #openttd 16:55:42 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590f7056.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 16:57:47 <Belugas> mmh 16:57:48 <Belugas> a shame 16:57:54 <Belugas> ho.. Hello frosch123 :) 16:58:16 <Belugas> yeah, a shame, another fork which did not last long 16:58:26 <Belugas> the Inverted one. 16:58:46 <Belugas> funny to see the guy is now active in the NoAI section 16:58:49 *** einKarl [~einKarl@77-23-166-116-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #openttd 16:59:08 <frosch123> who? dih? 16:59:16 <Belugas> naa. 16:59:19 <Belugas> wait 16:59:21 <frosch123> hello belugas btw :) 16:59:36 <Belugas> http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=30976 16:59:41 <Belugas> tath one 16:59:47 <Belugas> that 16:59:48 <Belugas> :S 17:00:19 *** Amis [~Amis@catv-89-135-77-239.catv.broadband.hu] has joined #openttd 17:00:26 <Amis> hello o/ 17:00:33 <planetmaker> hello 17:00:50 <frosch123> what? avertising simutrans? :p 17:01:22 <Amis> I would like to ask about game mechanics, more specific: industry production changes. I have a feeling wiki does not tell me everything. 17:01:52 <Amis> It seems that the number of same industries near eachother affect production change in a negative way. Is that right? 17:02:16 <frosch123> for default industries? certainly not :) 17:02:36 <planetmaker> I'm not aware of newgrf industries with that behaviour either 17:02:46 <Belugas> frosch123: nope. The guy wanted to write a fork of Ottd, and his list of features has been quite.. laughable 17:03:14 <Belugas> Amis, i cna confirm. unless you have solid ground to your saying, tough 17:03:31 <Amis> They why each time fund a few, for example fruit plantations and I have excellent service (85-95%) they all drop in production 17:03:46 <Lakie> A lot of 'patches' for OpenTTD are quite ambitious Belugas... 17:04:00 <Belugas> true that, Lakie :) 17:04:21 <Belugas> speaking of ambitions, i'm going outside shooting the photo of the century now... 17:04:24 <Belugas> yeah right... 17:04:51 <Lakie> Well, make it a good photo anyways? :) 17:05:39 <Lakie> (Probably better pharsed as hope you get a nice photo anyway). 17:07:57 *** Chris_Booth [~chatzilla@cpc7-newt30-2-0-cust37.newt.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 17:09:34 *** Nite [5472b1fc@ircip3.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 17:09:38 <Nite> Hi 17:10:01 <Chris_Booth> hi all 17:10:29 <Nite> any way to convert many or all semaphores to "normal" siganls fast ?? 17:10:55 <Chris_Booth> delete old signals and then ctrl drang new ones 17:11:04 *** Klanticus [~quassel@200-161-120-132.dsl.telesp.net.br] has joined #openttd 17:11:05 <Chris_Booth> or just keep semaphore 17:11:43 <Nite> well i luckily never use semaphores ... 17:12:02 <Nite> but another one tapped into that trap ;) 17:12:09 <frosch123> there is a signal conversion button in the signal gui 17:12:20 <frosch123> that way you do not need to select the position and orientation when converting 17:12:22 <frosch123> only the type 17:12:56 <frosch123> for the next game it is useful to configure semaphores to only appear before 1492 :p 17:12:57 <Nite> woudl be neat if you could squaredrag with the signalconvert tool 17:13:02 <Chris_Booth> frosch123: that only doesn 1 singla at a time though? 17:13:13 <frosch123> really? 17:13:25 <Nite> afaik 17:13:46 <Nite> (i have semaphores off - for me its all about readability) 17:13:53 <frosch123> hmm indeed :s 17:14:28 <Nite> guess hter are 100 of thousands of signals often in games 17:15:34 <Nite> kind of afk ... 17:17:22 <Nite> ok i see squaredrag is not that easy because you dont only replace semaphore to normal, but also the type 17:17:30 <Nite> exact type 17:17:57 <Chris_Booth> yes you would need to have a type check 17:18:17 <Nite> but isnt there som ctrl + alt + caps + click kind of method ? 17:18:40 <Nite> ;) 17:18:46 <Chris_Booth> I dont know never used it myself. I always start with Lights not semaphores 17:19:30 <Nite> yeh its not so serious problem 17:19:51 <Chris_Booth> TBH when are you going to use it? 17:19:56 <Nite> a super readable also from behind signals newgrf woudl be nice though 17:20:02 <Chris_Booth> semaphores are just as good as lights 17:20:22 <Nite> i did not use it but another player - who is somewhat into eyecandy 17:20:29 *** glx_ [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:518b:12e1:d2bf:274b] has joined #openttd 17:20:32 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx_] by ChanServ 17:20:53 <Chris_Booth> semaphores are more readable IMO than lights but lights look nicer 17:21:10 <Nite> well imo not 17:22:37 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 17:26:26 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has quit [] 17:26:31 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:518b:12e1:d2bf:274b] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:28:00 *** glx_ is now known as glx 17:35:13 *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@d5152B6A8.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 17:47:00 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: translators * r20830 /trunk/src/lang/ (4 files in 2 dirs): 17:47:00 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0: 17:47:00 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: belarusian - 3 changes by Wowanxm 17:47:00 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: marathi - 186 changes by jcravi 17:47:00 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: spanish - 5 changes by Terkhen 17:47:01 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: urdu - 21 changes by thastig 17:48:02 <planetmaker> <frosch123> for the next game it is useful to configure semaphores to only appear before 1492 :p <-- hehehe :-) I guess I have such introduction date 17:48:10 *** dfox [~dfox@ip-89-176-209-74.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 17:48:35 <frosch123> i always mention 1492 in this context :p 17:48:40 <planetmaker> :-) 17:50:15 <Chris_Booth> 1492? that seems early to start openttd 17:50:40 <planetmaker> that's fine, if you start on a water map with sailing boats :-) 17:50:47 <planetmaker> OpenTTD - hanse theme :-) 17:50:51 <planetmaker> hm... 17:50:54 <Chris_Booth> and horses! 17:50:58 <planetmaker> that indeed *might* be interesting 17:51:11 *** Sacro [~ben@adsl-87-102-87-110.karoo.KCOM.COM] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:51:19 <Chris_Booth> sailing boats horses and mules 17:51:32 <planetmaker> midieval transport... 17:51:39 <Chris_Booth> hell yeah 17:51:42 <planetmaker> camels replace horses in desert... 17:51:52 <planetmaker> you have oxes, cows, horses.... 17:51:58 <planetmaker> some wagons to span them... 17:52:03 <planetmaker> that *might* be very interesting 17:52:16 <Chris_Booth> dirt tracks 17:52:24 <frosch123> litters instead of busses? 17:52:29 <Chris_Booth> then canal boats 17:52:36 <planetmaker> all that :-) 17:52:57 <planetmaker> http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=49040, 17:52:59 <planetmaker> http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=49040 17:53:01 <Ammler> yeah, do it! 17:55:22 <Belugas> Lakie, not a single one taken. I guess I'm not in the mood or something 17:57:18 *** avdg [~Adium@94-227-100-192.access.telenet.be] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:57:22 *** avdg [~Adium@94-227-100-192.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 17:57:27 <Lakie> Thats a shame, Belugas. :( 17:57:48 <Terkhen> http://devs.openttd.org/~terkhen/screenshots/custom_sea_level.png <--- do you think this is enough water for a map, or will someone want even more? 17:58:17 <planetmaker> that's about ok :-) 17:58:25 <fjb> That old ship grf has the first ship in 1701. 17:58:27 <Belugas> well.. given that downtown is under heavy construction, i would say it's pretty normal... 17:58:47 <X-2> Nice screenshot Terkhen :P 17:58:50 <Belugas> nice Terkhen :D 18:00:14 <andythenorth> evening 18:00:16 <dihedral> is that too much water or too little land :-P 18:00:23 *** ajmiles [~aj@78-86-188-187.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 18:00:57 <Terkhen> for me it is already too much water, I'm just wondering if someone will complain because he can't get more than 80% water 18:02:08 <dihedral> lol 18:02:16 <dihedral> people can complain about everything 18:02:32 <Terkhen> :P 18:03:02 <planetmaker> haha @ Terkhen :-) 18:03:13 <planetmaker> Terkhen, it'd actually make sense to play such map :-) 18:03:18 <planetmaker> I'd definitely give it a try 18:03:34 <Terkhen> hm, let me make a screenshot with 90% 18:03:54 <Lakie> Would that not be bordering unplayable? 18:03:55 <frosch123> make it more rough and with less variation to get more islands? 18:04:06 <__ln__> I would complain for anything below 130% of water. 18:04:30 <Chris_Booth> __ln__: can the water be in water towers? 18:04:44 <__ln__> Chris_Booth: sure 18:04:50 <Terkhen> Lakie: I think so, that's why I'm currently limiting the patch at the amount shown at the screenshot 18:05:11 <Chris_Booth> cool then i can float water towers in the sea 18:05:27 <Terkhen> but I guess the player should be able to do whatever he wants, even if the results are unplayable 18:05:31 <Chris_Booth> and still have 35$ land 18:05:36 <Chris_Booth> 35% 18:06:24 <planetmaker> Terkhen, "unplayable" is anyway a relative term. Everyone might define it differently 18:07:56 <__ln__> if you had 100% water with two oil platforms, couldn't you establish a profitable passenger route between them? 18:08:29 <planetmaker> :-O 18:08:56 <planetmaker> __ln__, you won't have such map. A map needs at least one town 18:09:02 <__ln__> damn 18:09:07 <planetmaker> yeah 18:09:19 <planetmaker> still... I wonder how small it can be ;-) 18:09:30 <__ln__> ok, are underwater towns on the roadmap already? 18:09:34 <planetmaker> 1 complete tile and its shore? 18:09:35 *** Sacro [~ben@adsl-87-102-87-110.karoo.KCOM.COM] has joined #openttd 18:10:29 <avdg> towns on water :) 18:10:58 <Terkhen> http://devs.openttd.org/~terkhen/screenshots/custom_sea_level_90.png <-- actually, with rough 90% looks nice 18:11:02 <planetmaker> I thought so, too... but you'd need to modify houses 18:11:17 <planetmaker> indeed, Terkhen :-) 18:12:19 <fjb> Nice, but isn't ttd a railway game? *hides* 18:13:06 <Terkhen> you can build tiny networks at each one of the tiny islands 18:13:12 <__ln__> fjb: It's a railway game which only lacks the ability to carry trains on ferries. 18:13:44 <avdg> trains are just the best way to create profit 18:13:51 <Chris_Booth> planetmaker: you need 1 town but that town doesnt need people 18:14:10 <Chris_Booth> 0 pop town counts 18:14:23 <Chris_Booth> then 2 oil platforms = playable 18:15:07 *** einKarl [~einKarl@77-23-166-116-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:16:26 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1DB83.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:17:16 <Belugas> mmmh... town on piles project comes back to mind 18:17:47 <fjb> And exploding oil platform desaster. 18:17:53 <avdg> does it had stations on the water? 18:18:19 <avdg> building a dock requires land 18:21:32 *** Muxy [~Muxy@main.goulp.net] has joined #openttd 18:21:39 *** Muxy [~Muxy@main.goulp.net] has left #openttd [] 18:21:48 *** rTypo [rTypo@pc54.clicknet.iasi.rdsnet.ro] has quit [] 18:22:57 <Belugas> if you are building a dock, yes it will reauire land. if you are building a seaport, no it does not 18:23:09 <Belugas> imagination, people, imagination... 18:23:34 <andythenorth> only after 1960 or so :P 18:23:47 <andythenorth> can you distant join a train station to an oil rig? 18:24:29 <V453000> OpenTTD 2: Sea Life? 18:25:17 <andythenorth> http://www.google.co.uk/images?client=safari&rls=en&q=lego%20aqua%20raiders&oe=UTF-8&redir_esc=&um=1&ie=UTF-8&source=og&sa=N&hl=en&tab=wi&biw=1265&bih=588 18:25:39 <V453000> ... 18:25:54 <V453000> hmm screw this 18:26:01 <V453000> im gonna buy myself a lego instead of openttd :D 18:27:50 <olleman> any recommended newgrf airports? 18:28:09 *** jpx_ [jpx_@a91-156-245-170.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:29:05 <frosch123> i guess there is only one grf (or it there one at all?) 18:29:21 <andythenorth> there is a test grf somewhere? 18:29:23 <andythenorth> I have a copy 18:29:32 <andythenorth> it's limited 18:29:38 <andythenorth> dunno if there are any 'real' ones 18:29:44 <olleman> interesting 18:29:57 <olleman> I suppose the code isn't mature enough? 18:30:48 *** Amis [~Amis@catv-89-135-77-239.catv.broadband.hu] has quit [Quit: Távozom] 18:34:14 *** perk11 [~perk11@81.17.157.195] has joined #openttd 18:34:36 <Belugas> i suppose more that it's not available ingame, actually. Unless you have compiled your own one :) 18:34:39 <Belugas> i think... 18:34:42 <Belugas> not sure now... 18:34:43 <olleman> that makes sense 18:34:52 <Belugas> trunk moves so fast these days ... 18:39:42 *** avdg [~Adium@94-227-100-192.access.telenet.be] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:39:44 *** avdg [~Adium@94-227-100-192.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 18:46:34 *** uros [~chatzilla@BSN-77-156-227.dsl.siol.net] has joined #openttd 18:46:50 <Nite> cya 18:46:53 *** Nite [5472b1fc@ircip3.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 18:47:35 *** fonsinchen [~fonsinche@brln-4dbaa367.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:48:45 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: terkhen * r20831 /trunk/src/ (genworld_gui.cpp lang/english.txt): -Add: Show selected number of towns in the map generation window when using a custom amount. 18:52:54 *** jpx_ [jpx_@80-186-240-107.elisa-mobile.fi] has joined #openttd 18:56:58 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: terkhen * r20832 /trunk/src/ (7 files in 4 dirs): -Feature: Allow to select a custom percentage of water in the map generation window (based on patch by CommanderZ). 18:58:06 <planetmaker> woah :-) 18:58:11 * planetmaker pulls 18:58:50 <andythenorth> :o 18:59:04 <Terkhen> don't forget to translate :) 18:59:55 <planetmaker> already done 18:59:58 <planetmaker> :-) 19:00:57 *** jpx_ [jpx_@80-186-240-107.elisa-mobile.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:02:53 <planetmaker> Terkhen: /Users/ingo/ottd/trunk/src/genworld_gui.cpp: In member function âvirtual void GenerateLandscapeWindow::OnDropdownSelect(int, int)â: 19:02:55 <planetmaker> /Users/ingo/ottd/trunk/src/genworld_gui.cpp:762: warning: comparison between signed and unsigned integer expressions 19:03:58 <Terkhen> hm, too much copypaste 19:07:29 <Terkhen> planetmaker: can you check if it is gone when applying this diff? http://devs.openttd.org/~terkhen/patches/warning.diff 19:07:30 <fjb> Already 1717 and I'm still not rich... 19:09:41 <Terkhen> wait, I caused another in tgp :P 19:11:02 <Rubidium> fjb: it's 2010 and I'm not rich either... 19:11:07 <Terkhen> planetmaker: http://devs.openttd.org/~terkhen/patches/warning.diff <-- diff updated 19:11:22 <fjb> Oh, already that late? 19:11:57 *** FloSoft [bouncer@www.siedler25.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:13:06 <planetmaker> all fine, Terkhen :-) 19:13:42 <Terkhen> okay, thank you :) 19:15:00 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 19:15:43 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: terkhen * r20833 /trunk/src/ (genworld.h tgp.cpp): -Fix (r20832): Remove a warning. 19:19:26 <planetmaker> nice thing, Terkhen :-) Finally it's easy to create atoll-like scenarios :-) 19:19:49 <planetmaker> some map type which makes for nice challenges :-) 19:20:10 <Aali> yay, I've long wanted this feature too 19:20:53 <glx> planetmaker: not hard if you just raise land :) 19:21:20 <planetmaker> glx: it is. Because you have to acutally rise the land. Now I just random generate it. 19:21:27 <planetmaker> and adjust a few places 19:21:54 <glx> I mean raise land to join atolls ;) 19:22:45 <Terkhen> :) 19:23:00 <planetmaker> :-) 19:23:01 <Terkhen> small things like this always manage to keep me from playing 19:23:07 *** Chillosophy [~fu@82-170-139-109.ip.telfort.nl] has quit [] 19:23:09 <planetmaker> hehe 19:23:25 <Terkhen> whenever I start a game, I think of something mising or that I'd like to try 19:23:37 <Terkhen> let's try again 19:24:06 <frosch123> :p 19:24:19 <planetmaker> :-P 19:24:35 <andythenorth> I haven't played a game in ages 19:24:38 <planetmaker> Terkhen: I guess that's one of the reasons I mostly play online... 19:24:42 <andythenorth> I keep thinking of new things I need to implement :P 19:24:58 <andythenorth> I have no idea if current FIRS is any good :| 19:25:04 <planetmaker> I can play a little there, others might carry one... and it's fine when I get distracted ;-) 19:25:05 <Terkhen> then again, sometimes I also find bugs 19:25:12 <Aali> FIRS is great 19:25:23 <andythenorth> and I know I'm going to keep breaking savegames so I don't invest in a new game :( 19:25:25 <planetmaker> andythenorth: we just play a FIRS 0.3 on our stable 19:25:29 <Aali> alot less insane than ECS but still alot more interesting than default industries 19:25:29 <planetmaker> It's quite fun :-) 19:25:34 <V453000> firs is quite good 19:25:46 <andythenorth> also, there's so much left to do, I don't have time to actually play :P 19:25:47 <Terkhen> I've played online only a few times with friends, mostly I play alone 19:25:50 <V453000> but imo the latest additions are going a bit too far :) 19:25:57 *** Chillosophy [~fu@82-170-139-109.ip.telfort.nl] has joined #openttd 19:26:07 <V453000> we will see what comes out of it ;) 19:26:16 <andythenorth> V453000: give feedback in the dev thread 19:26:18 <andythenorth> or here 19:26:53 *** FloSoft [~oftc@www.siedler25.org] has joined #openttd 19:28:06 <V453000> one of the things I really liked was the way how it works quite precisely ... from the united industry starting production, through the multiple cargoes delivered -> multiple times more output, to the way how the engineering supplies seem to work 19:28:27 <V453000> currently the supplies seem to work quite oddly :) but I havent tested that much 19:28:31 <planetmaker> yep, that's great 19:29:02 <V453000> I also liked the amount of industries before, but that is just me and taking time before I adjust ;) I havent played the latest version yet 19:29:31 <V453000> but what I wanted to say ... 19:29:54 <V453000> woulnt it be more "interesting" to make engineering supplies consumed by primaries over time? 19:30:06 *** Chruker [~no@port113.ds1-vj.adsl.cybercity.dk] has joined #openttd 19:30:10 <V453000> now it doesnt really matter how much you make, only how often you deliver 19:30:31 <andythenorth> I've thought about it 19:30:46 <andythenorth> unless players want to micromanage routes every month, the gameplay effect will be identical to now 19:30:56 <V453000> it is in my opinion better because you can control which industry grows better 19:31:10 <andythenorth> this is how ECS does it? 19:31:16 <V453000> well players usually do timetable it monthly 19:31:26 <V453000> I think yes, ECS probably does it that way 19:31:32 <V453000> but well .. I hate ECS tbh :p 19:32:03 <Aali> I would like to see a system where the same amount of supplies generate the same amount of primary goods, no matter where and when you deliver it 19:32:07 <planetmaker> actually... I consider it a bit of a challange to really deliver by the month 19:32:11 <Aali> but maybe thats just a fantasy of mine 19:32:33 <andythenorth> FIRS will stay with monthly for the forseeable future 19:32:41 <V453000> pm: yea it could maybe be a setting through parameters? 19:32:43 <planetmaker> otherwise it means to introduce stockpiles... something I don't like ;-) 19:32:48 <frosch123> somewhen we discussing something like: all supplies are stockpiled. the more there are stockpiles the more is produced. and every month 10% of the stockpile is consumed 19:32:57 <planetmaker> V453000: you can set anything by parameter. But who programmes it 19:33:00 *** Kurimus [Kurimus@dsl-tkubrasgw1-fe83de00-38.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [] 19:33:04 <V453000> pm: I know :) 19:33:28 <andythenorth> "It's not realistic" :P 19:33:37 <V453000> fuck realistic, this is a game ;) 19:33:39 <planetmaker> frosch123: the limit is 65k or so for a stockpile w/o limit? 19:33:47 <planetmaker> andythenorth: it might be a good idea, though 19:33:54 <andythenorth> yeah, I don't hate it 19:33:55 <frosch123> something like that, yes 19:33:59 <andythenorth> I just don't find it interesting 19:34:09 <andythenorth> it just makes primary industry a stockpiling secondary industry 19:34:20 <andythenorth> means a coal mine is just like a PBI factory 19:34:24 <V453000> well if an industry growing more and more would consume more and more supplies it could be still quite appealing I think 19:34:28 <andythenorth> output = input 19:34:42 <andythenorth> output != input for primary industry 19:34:48 <andythenorth> our whole civilisation is built on that 19:34:57 <V453000> because at one point you wouldnt be able to deliver enough supplies or the industry would be maxed :) 19:35:05 <planetmaker> :-) 19:35:51 <planetmaker> andythenorth: or something like quadratic efficiency of supplies: 1: 1% increase chance, 2: 2:, 4: 3%:, 8: 4%, 16: 5%, 32: 6% etc pp 19:36:01 <andythenorth> sounds like ECS :) 19:36:11 <planetmaker> what? 19:36:19 <planetmaker> the increase behaviour? 19:36:22 <andythenorth> yes 19:36:33 <planetmaker> I don't want to change the mechanism 19:36:43 <planetmaker> Just the efficiency 19:36:45 <andythenorth> just the probability? 19:36:48 <planetmaker> yes 19:36:58 <planetmaker> probability = f(#supplies) 19:37:06 <andythenorth> would it need to be explained to players in the industry window? 19:37:16 <planetmaker> possibly 19:37:35 <planetmaker> but a generic explanation suffices: 19:37:47 <planetmaker> industries need supplies to increase their production. 19:37:56 <andythenorth> "More supplies = greater chance of increase" 19:38:01 <planetmaker> More supplies will help more 19:38:23 <planetmaker> But not linearlily or so 19:38:32 <andythenorth> it would make for interesting strategy 19:38:46 <andythenorth> if the 'primary production never decreases' parameter is enabled.... 19:39:08 <andythenorth> it would then make sense to dump *all* supplies on the map into one primary to max production 19:39:15 <andythenorth> then when it is maxed, move on to the next 19:39:19 <planetmaker> :-) yep 19:39:34 <andythenorth> hmm 19:39:36 <planetmaker> though you'd be faster to supply all linearily probably 19:39:52 <planetmaker> as the overall gain per unit time would be bigger 19:39:54 <andythenorth> depends on how f(supplies) is calculated 19:39:57 <Aali> could the "interval" between supply checks be increased to be longer than one month in a simple fashion? 19:40:07 <andythenorth> yes and no 19:40:11 <andythenorth> what are you thinking 19:40:12 <andythenorth> ? 19:40:25 <Aali> so you only need to deliver supplies, say every 3 months to get maximum growth 19:40:52 <andythenorth> it would be possible to code 19:41:01 <andythenorth> I don't see any benefit from it though :o 19:41:06 <andythenorth> what does it improve? 19:41:22 <planetmaker> the delicacy of the tuning required 19:41:26 *** uros [~chatzilla@BSN-77-156-227.dsl.siol.net] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.6.9/20100825164301]] 19:41:38 <planetmaker> currently you need to adjust deliveries quite carefully 19:42:02 <andythenorth> so deliver at least 1t every three months instead? 19:42:03 <Aali> I think it would be a nice parameter to have, to "relax" the supply system a bit 19:42:07 <planetmaker> with 3x the time you could probably set a number of vehicles to distribute supplies in the fashion of ABACADAE 19:42:33 <andythenorth> it's not a hard thing to implement. with a parameter it might be harder 19:42:52 <Aali> is FIRS open source? 19:42:57 <andythenorth> yes 19:43:04 <andythenorth> a great deal of the current supplies handling mimicks the town cargo handling 19:43:07 <Aali> good stuff 19:43:28 <frosch123> you can count the days in one register, reset to 0 on delivery, and compare that to the parameter 19:44:04 <andythenorth> similar code exists for handling other delivery at some industries 19:44:15 <andythenorth> it would be easy to hook in 19:44:28 <andythenorth> it would also be possible to make the number of months a parameter 19:44:43 <andythenorth> however, it means some more work with strings + translations 19:45:01 <andythenorth> doing anything with the text stack is usually harder than just...writing more strings 19:45:56 <Aali> figures 19:49:36 <andythenorth> planetmaker: ^^ write a ticket for 0.2 ? :P 19:49:42 <andythenorth> sorry FIRS 2.0 :m 19:49:47 <planetmaker> what? 0.2?! 19:49:58 <planetmaker> :-) 19:50:52 <Aali> oh and while I'm here, nutracks has a rather "interesting" problem 19:51:07 * andythenorth ponders 19:51:45 <Aali> selling more expensive track types doesn't give you a fraction of the money back you would get by first downgrading to the cheapest rail type, then selling 19:51:54 <V453000> :D 19:52:05 <V453000> intereting 19:52:19 * fjb need fish food. 19:52:36 <andythenorth> making a FIRS production increase more likely in a month would have the same production effect as increasing the number of months 19:52:39 *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@d5152B6A8.access.telenet.be] has quit [Quit: oO] 19:52:52 <andythenorth> but it might have a different effect on number of vehicles players route 19:53:33 <andythenorth> it would also be (slightly) easier to code support for a parameter 19:53:44 <andythenorth> except I don't really understand random in hex 19:53:47 <andythenorth> :o 19:54:06 <Aali> then you would be able to get more growth by supplying every month 19:54:25 <andythenorth> yes 19:54:30 <Aali> which doesn't really "relax" the system at all :) 19:54:40 <andythenorth> over time it would have the same effect 19:54:53 <Aali> it just encourages players even more to deliver every month 19:55:05 <andythenorth> 12 * 10% increase or 6 * 20% should have same effect (statistically) 19:55:19 <andythenorth> i.e. deliver every two months 19:55:39 <andythenorth> but it may not seem that way to players 19:55:52 <andythenorth> I often forget how random works when repeated enough times 19:55:59 <andythenorth> so other people might too :o 19:56:09 <Aali> I think you're missing the point :) 19:56:19 <andythenorth> which one :) 19:58:12 <Aali> with that solution, if player A delivers every month and player B only every 3 months, player A will win big 19:59:13 <Aali> I wanted an option that doesn't reward player A's obsessive compolsive disorder :) 19:59:23 <Aali> *compulsive 19:59:29 <andythenorth> player B could pick up cargo from player A's industry :P 20:00:06 <andythenorth> so in the '3 month' version, there is only one chance every 3 months for a boost? 20:00:10 <Aali> gold star for thinking outside the box :P 20:00:15 <Aali> yes, exactly 20:00:20 <andythenorth> ok 20:00:33 <andythenorth> would the increases need to be 3x larger? 20:01:04 *** wollollo [~martin@host86-175-24-127.wlms-broadband.com] has joined #openttd 20:01:15 <Aali> I'll leave that decision up to you :) 20:01:22 *** Sacro [~ben@adsl-87-102-87-110.karoo.KCOM.COM] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:01:45 <andythenorth> no no, I've designed and coded the way I want it to work :P 20:01:54 <andythenorth> I'm not solving all those problems again 20:02:29 <Aali> hehe 20:02:31 <Aali> well I'm out 20:02:56 <Aali> I hope that I will some day be able to contribute to one of your projects :P 20:05:44 <andythenorth> I would consider changes, but only where all the conceptual stuff is worked out clearly :) 20:05:44 <andythenorth> otherwise I have n other things to do ;) 20:06:26 *** perk11 [~perk11@81.17.157.195] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 20:09:30 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: TschÃŒÃ] 20:11:26 <Ammler> Aali: :'-( 20:12:00 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 20:12:11 *** FloSoft [~oftc@www.siedler25.org] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:12:15 * fjb still doesn't understand how inflation is working. 20:12:44 * andythenorth turns it off 20:12:44 <andythenorth> unexpected consequences on long game 20:15:10 <V453000> exactly 20:15:10 <V453000> I thought it just multiplies everything but it obviously doesnt :O 20:15:10 <fjb> Unexpected consequences on a short game. Everything more than doubled its costs in less than 20 years. 20:15:10 <SmatZ> inflation on cargo payment rates is different than inflation on things you buy 20:15:10 <fjb> An inflation on running costs? 20:15:10 <SmatZ> that too 20:15:14 <SmatZ> all costs :p 20:15:16 <V453000> he 20:15:32 <V453000> well that just works oddly :) and by some time you arent able to actually make profit with trains 20:15:56 <andythenorth> setting vehicle running costs in a savegame with inflation can also cause mistakes :P 20:15:57 <andythenorth> for me at least 20:15:57 <V453000> I once played with URKS, I used the AL-10 engines and I was barely making any money after few hundreds of years 20:16:01 <V453000> with inflation 20:16:12 <andythenorth> we should implement this in OTTD :P 20:16:13 <andythenorth> http://railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=338369&nseq=0 20:16:24 <andythenorth> I have implemented it in Lego many times recently :D 20:16:40 <planetmaker> hm.. .break-downsà 20:16:44 <planetmaker> ? 20:16:58 <andythenorth> stringlining on tight curves 20:17:05 <andythenorth> another incentive to not use 90' 20:17:48 <andythenorth> :P 20:17:58 <V453000> :D 20:18:29 <planetmaker> andythenorth: ... if that means to break down in tight curves: newgrf-possible 20:18:29 <frosch123> night 20:18:32 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590f7056.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:18:33 <planetmaker> night frosch123 20:18:36 <andythenorth> good night 20:18:38 <planetmaker> ha! 20:18:38 <planetmaker> :-) 20:18:41 <andythenorth> missed him 20:18:48 <planetmaker> it's a speed test 20:18:54 <planetmaker> :-P 20:26:50 *** Sacro [~ben@adsl-87-102-87-110.karoo.KCOM.COM] has joined #openttd 20:30:31 *** lewymati [~lewymati@static-78-8-146-157.ssp.dialog.net.pl] has joined #openttd 20:40:46 *** KouDy [~KouDy@ip-89-176-216-203.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 20:45:31 *** tokai [~tokai@port-92-195-56-52.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:47:42 *** tokai [~tokai@port-92-195-244-180.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 20:47:45 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai] by ChanServ 20:54:50 <Terkhen> good night 20:54:57 <SmatZ> good night, Terkhen 20:56:26 <Belugas> nigth Terkhen, sir of waters 20:56:32 *** Lurimax [~quassel@ti0028a380-dhcp1175.bb.online.no] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:58:13 *** Sacro__ [~ben@adsl-87-102-6-82.karoo.KCOM.COM] has joined #openttd 21:00:26 *** asnoehu [~thok@524B7349.cm-4-4b.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:01:37 *** nicfer [~nicfer@190.50.52.106] has joined #openttd 21:02:23 *** Sacro [~ben@adsl-87-102-87-110.karoo.KCOM.COM] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:07:35 <Wolf01> 'night 21:07:38 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host105-234-dynamic.5-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 21:08:35 *** Adambean [AdamR@88.97.144.82] has quit [Quit: Gone fishing] 21:09:07 *** Klanticus [~quassel@200-161-120-132.dsl.telesp.net.br] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:11:10 <Belugas> my turn 21:11:12 *** Sacro__ [~ben@adsl-87-102-6-82.karoo.KCOM.COM] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:11:13 <Belugas> GOOD NIGHT! 21:11:28 *** Sacro [~ben@adsl-87-102-6-82.karoo.KCOM.COM] has joined #openttd 21:15:42 *** asnoehu [~thok@524B7349.cm-4-4b.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has joined #openttd 21:21:57 *** Fuco [~dota.keys@pc-209-82.sks3.muni.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:40:00 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1DB83.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 21:48:17 * fjb thinks that using a high inflation was not the best idea. 21:49:19 <avdg> putting it off sounds like a better idea 21:50:16 *** Chruker [~no@port113.ds1-vj.adsl.cybercity.dk] has quit [] 21:58:41 <__ln__> I just found out that the Netherlands has more provinces than Canada! 22:02:10 <davis> 12? 22:03:39 <__ln__> Yes. 22:03:47 <davis> germany has even more ;p 22:04:02 <__ln__> They are not provinces. 22:04:09 <davis> well federal states 22:05:12 <__ln__> Entirely different. 22:05:49 <davis> "A province is a territorial unit, almost always an administrative division, within a country or state." 22:07:26 <Eddi|zuHause> prussia had provinces 22:08:20 <davis> i'm probably wrong , but i couldn't name the difference between the dutch provinces and the federal states of germany 22:08:58 <Prof_Frink> Easy. They're in different countries. 22:09:14 <davis> thanks prof obvious 22:09:15 <davis> ;p 22:09:20 <Eddi|zuHause> i'd say level of competences 22:09:24 <__ln__> The other begins with an 'f' and the other with a 'p'. 22:09:46 <Eddi|zuHause> no, they actually begin with a 'b' :p 22:10:00 <davis> smartasses in the house :D 22:10:18 <__ln__> And when the Netherlands decides to invade Canada, they'll have an 1:1 exchange ratio for provinces. 22:10:29 <davis> comforting to know. 22:10:53 <davis> then again , why would anyone want to invade canada :/ 22:11:06 <Eddi|zuHause> i'd say a province has less power over its own policies than a federal state 22:11:24 <davis> thanks Eddi :) 22:11:40 <Eddi|zuHause> but that's a purely subjective view 22:18:17 *** Cybertinus [~Cybertinu@tunnel3304.ipv6.xs4all.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:28:56 *** lewymati [~lewymati@static-78-8-146-157.ssp.dialog.net.pl] has quit [] 22:42:20 *** JVassie_ [~James@92.27.149.231] has joined #openttd 22:42:45 *** TomyLobo [~foo@port-212-202-171-176.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Quit: A key, command, or action that tells the system to return to a previous state or stop a process.] 22:46:51 *** Chillosophy [~fu@82-170-139-109.ip.telfort.nl] has quit [] 22:48:08 *** JVassie [~James@92.27.149.231] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:49:27 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: TschÃŒÃ] 22:51:43 *** fanioz [~fanioz@180.214.233.11] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:02:21 *** ^Spike^ [~spike@d200003.upc-d.chello.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:03:02 *** Sacro_ [~ben@adsl-87-102-6-82.karoo.KCOM.COM] has joined #openttd 23:07:18 *** Sacro [~ben@adsl-87-102-6-82.karoo.KCOM.COM] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:07:27 *** echo465_ [~chatzilla@c-98-223-160-180.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 23:12:36 *** echo465 [~chatzilla@c-98-223-160-180.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:12:38 *** echo465_ is now known as echo465 23:14:55 *** fjb is now known as Guest225 23:14:56 *** fjb [~frank@p5485DA73.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 23:16:11 *** pugi [~pugi@p4FCC440C.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: ALL YOUR BASE ARE BELONG TO US!] 23:17:56 *** ajmiles [~aj@78-86-188-187.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:18:17 *** ajmiles [~aj@78-86-188-187.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 23:18:38 *** dfox [~dfox@ip-89-176-209-74.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:21:58 *** Guest225 [~frank@p5485DCB7.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:26:06 *** a1270 [~a1270@72-24-233-98.cpe.cableone.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:31:45 *** trebuchet [~Trebuchet@69.51.104.87] has joined #openttd 23:36:05 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 23:38:53 *** snorre [~snorre@c692BBF51.dhcp.bluecom.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:40:46 *** KenjiE20 [~KenjiE20@92.10.87.89] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:49:34 *** Biolunar [Mahdi@blfd-4db1aad8.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: gn8] 23:51:34 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1DB83.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]