Log for #openttd on 24th May 2011:
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00:33:47  * JVassie grabs Yexo
00:33:48  <JVassie> :p
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05:22:07  <Zmapper> Hello.
05:22:31  <Zmapper> Was there a openttd compile made that combines CargoDist and Infrashare?
05:22:57  <Zmapper> Someone said it was called Mega OpenTTD but google isn't providing me a suitible answer.
05:25:27  <Zmapper> Is anyone here or is my connection to the chat broken?
05:26:12  <planetmaker> moin
05:26:49  <planetmaker> Zmapper: you might try chills patch pack
05:26:51  <Zmapper> oh hi planetmaker
05:26:54  <Zmapper> ok
05:27:25  <Zmapper> I was thinking about having a infrashare+cargodist server. I think plenty of people would play it.
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05:52:47  <planetmaker> Zmapper: people need the exact same version as the server
05:53:10  <planetmaker> Thus servers with PP are usually... not that well frequented
05:53:30  <planetmaker> though I'm sure you'll find players with Chill's PP
05:55:28  <planetmaker> With patched servers you have to make very clear which version you use, or it will be no fun for players
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07:41:20  <Terkhen> good morning
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08:23:03  <ashledombos> hi, is there any admin of openttd wiki ?
08:33:35  <Yexo> all developers I think, why?
08:34:53  <Yexo> ashledombos: if you translate a page, you only have to add a link to the translation to the english page
08:35:15  <Yexo> I have a bot that'll take care of putting links on the other translations
08:35:43  <ashledombos> Yexo: oh ok sorry
08:36:06  <Yexo> it's fine if you do it yourself, it's just a lot of extra unnecessary work :p
08:36:33  <ashledombos> Yexo: in fact i have a problem : i always have "you have a new message" every where,
08:36:41  <ashledombos> and i have already read my messages
08:36:49  <ashledombos> i even tried to remove all my messages
08:36:54  <ashledombos> but it's still there :(
08:39:04  <Yexo> no idea what can cause that, or how to solve it
08:39:48  <Yexo> I've deleted your user talk page, did that help?
08:40:33  <ashledombos> Yexo: no, i still have it o_Ô
08:40:47  <ashledombos> very strange bug :D
08:43:30  <ashledombos> Yexo: :p
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10:24:19  <planetmaker> good argument about the fruit in bulk, Terkhen :-)
10:24:22  <planetmaker> I didn't think of that
10:24:48  <Thorn_> someone counted all their eggs too soon?
10:24:51  <Thorn_> er
10:24:59  <Thorn_> oh wow, i really just tried to pass an egg as a fruit
10:25:01  <Terkhen> it would be fun if he freaks out after finding that rubber is carried in bulk too :P
10:25:03  <Thorn_> ->back to bed
10:25:21  <planetmaker> :-)
10:28:18  <planetmaker> Terkhen, I'm not sure about raw rubber. It's rather a bulky (or liquid) thing... "it can be traded in liquid form or as bale or as powder"
10:29:01  <Terkhen> I didn't think about powder... in OpenTTD it has always looked liquid to me
10:31:11  <Terkhen> hmm... it is bulk only in OpenGFX; with original graphics it is carried in small barrels
10:31:21  <Terkhen> which makes more sense IMO
10:31:21  <planetmaker> oh :-)
10:31:33  <Terkhen> so maybe we should move rubber to the flatbed
10:31:34  <planetmaker> but in the bulk wagon, or how?
10:31:43  <Terkhen> I was checking road vehicles, let me check trains
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10:31:59  <Wolf01> hello
10:33:45  <planetmaker> I think, too.
10:34:03  <Terkhen> planetmaker:
10:34:09  <planetmaker>
10:34:28  <planetmaker> then I looked at the wrong sprite ;-)
10:34:53  <planetmaker> we could use bales
10:35:09  <Terkhen> for flatbed or for bulk?
10:35:26  <planetmaker> for OpenGFX it doesn't matter. For OpenGFX I'd move it to flatbed
10:35:40  <planetmaker> hm... :-) Last sentence: OpenGFX+
10:36:28  <Terkhen> I think so too, yes
10:37:05  <planetmaker> and we could offer two representations... bales and barrels :-)
10:37:59  * Terkhen has no sprites for either representation
10:38:10  * planetmaker currently neither
10:38:28  <planetmaker> But I'm sure that can *somewhere* or *somehow* be come up with
10:38:37  <Terkhen> I should also try to adapt the oil barrels from OpenGFX+ Trains one of these days, but I had enough sprite magic for a while :P
10:38:40  <planetmaker> and if it's two hours of gimp-ing
10:38:53  <planetmaker> hehe :-)
10:39:35  <planetmaker> gimp 2.8 is supposed to have (alternatively IIRC) a much more standard interface with one window only
10:45:01  <Terkhen> hmm... the current layout works once you get used to it, but maybe a single window interface would be more efficient
10:45:31  <planetmaker> yes indeed
10:45:41  <planetmaker> I guess my biggest "problem" is my 13" screen ;-)
10:46:06  <Ammler> you mean tools and image in same window?
10:46:15  <Ammler> then you never worked with 2 screens
10:47:24  <planetmaker> Ammler, I do. But not when I use gimp for drawing sprites ;-)
10:47:42  <planetmaker> IIRC they'll keep it optional. So...
10:48:13  <Ammler> kinda like docking?
10:48:21  <Ammler> that would be nice
10:48:25  <planetmaker> dunno. Just briefly read it somewhere on their site
10:51:18  <planetmaker>
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11:11:54  <Terkhen> hmm... no screenshots?
11:13:01  <planetmaker> seems not. I've been looking for them, too
11:13:14  <planetmaker> but now ended up reading up on layer masks :-P
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11:18:07  <Eddi|zuHause> sounds dirty
11:18:39  <Terkhen> what are they for?
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11:23:07  <planetmaker> they allow to define which parts of a layer become visible in a range from 0 (completely invisible) to 255 (competely visible) with values between defining the degree of transparency
11:25:00  <Terkhen> is that useful for paletted images?
11:25:22  <planetmaker> at least in the yes / no way it can be useful, I think
11:25:39  <planetmaker> But I haven't yet used it as I didn't quite master their use / their interface :-)
11:26:12  <planetmaker> how well that works with indexed images and incomplete transparency... will have to be seen :-)
11:26:49  <Eddi|zuHause> it should be useful to put things like cargo graphics onto wagons
11:27:01  <planetmaker> you don't need transparency masks for that
11:27:09  <planetmaker> normal layers suffice
11:27:36  <planetmaker> and yes, that's how we started to use it
11:28:00  <Eddi|zuHause> even if you want the cargo graphics to fit multiple wagons with different shape?
11:28:01  <planetmaker> Terkhen, was the first one to provide layers with cargos for opengfx+rvs
11:29:11  <planetmaker> that'd require to be able to attach selectively several layer masks to a layer. I think that's not possible
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11:29:41  <planetmaker> though maybe by drawing the vehicle over the cargo... maybe :-)
11:29:58  <Terkhen> I don't have that problem, I don't have the same cargo graphics used for trucks with different shape
11:30:18  <Terkhen> hmmm... that's an interesting idea
11:30:30  <planetmaker> I think that's rather difficult and not necessarily easier to do
11:30:37  <planetmaker> might work for bulk
11:30:46  <Terkhen> only for bulk probably, yes
11:30:55  <planetmaker> hm... or for partial loading stages of them
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11:56:06  <Eddi|zuHause> 'German Police Union warns: "If Miss Merkel thinks she can just restart the shut down nuclear power stations and then call 110 when there is protest, she'll have the wrong number"'
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12:06:30  <__ln__> source?
12:11:40  <Eddi|zuHause> it says "Handelsblatt" but no link
12:23:58  <__ln__> good news everyone, the end of the world has been postponed for 5 months
12:24:06  <__ln__> *by
12:30:00  <Terkhen> I'll believe it when they start giving everything they own and await the end of the world owning nothing
12:30:07  <Terkhen> I could use some free stuff
12:30:17  <Yexo> Terkhen: some people already did that last week
12:30:27  <Terkhen> oh :(
12:30:43  <Terkhen> I hope they sue this guy then
12:33:36  <Eddi|zuHause> "people who tell you they speak with god are fine, but beware of people who say he answered"
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13:20:43  <Belugas> hello
13:22:38  <Nite> Hi
13:22:45  <planetmaker> hi nite
13:25:14  <Nite> Hi
13:25:39  <Nite> not too much ottd 4 me because of the nice hott weather :-D
13:27:05  <Eddi|zuHause> nite weather... great.
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13:39:37  <Nite> great hot weather shoudl be definately a feature of ottd 2.0 , and make it so taht it actually emmits heat and rays you can get a tan from ... while playing ... ;-P
13:40:48  <Nite> (usb solarium light)
13:40:58  <Noldo> *facepalm*
13:41:03  <Eddi|zuHause> your monitor can probably do that...
13:41:25  <Nite>
13:41:52  <Eddi|zuHause> get an usb laptop charger :p
13:42:11  <Terkhen> you could always break your microwave's door and stand in front of it
13:44:08  <__ln__> *a usb
13:45:03  <Nite> *the usb ...
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13:52:58  <Eddi|zuHause> __ln__: the rule is to put an "n" when _I_ speak the "u" as "u" [instead of "ju"]
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13:57:34  <__ln__> oh, right
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14:46:01  <peter1138> oh shiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiit
14:46:11  <peter1138> i accidentally left ottd running :S
14:47:21  <Thorn_> is that one 'i' for every year that passed?
14:47:32  <peter1138> no, that would have rather more is
14:47:35  <peter1138> it's now 2051
14:47:40  <peter1138> and my company went bankrupt
14:47:49  <peter1138> (probably because disasters are enabled)
14:48:16  <peter1138> and network_client.tmp isn't used any more
14:48:17  <peter1138> oh cock
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14:49:36  <Terkhen> patch: pause automatically after X days without any action
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14:50:02  <peter1138> yeah!
14:50:25  <supermop> that is a decent idea
14:50:26  <planetmaker> a heaven for autosaves
14:50:30  <Thorn_> huh? but i quite often leave it for a while until some event happens (new plane invented, etc)
14:50:45  <peter1138> Thorn_, hence "X" days, i.e. user fiddlable
14:50:46  <supermop> turn off the patch then?
14:51:12  <supermop> also, maybe its like fast forward, you can switch it on and off at will?
14:51:13  <Thorn_> i hope that's real days? ;p
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14:52:02  <peter1138> erm, nope?
14:52:06  <Terkhen> heh :D
14:52:37  <Thorn_> :(
14:52:38  <peter1138> yeah, i can see the big green patch on the map where my network would've been
14:52:42  <peter1138> destroy by disasters
14:52:46  <peter1138> the rest of it is brown
14:53:20  <peter1138> Thorn_ appears to have a problem with something that 1) doesn't exist yet and 2) would be optional if it did
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14:53:43  <Thorn_> i dont mind if its optional
14:53:46  <Thorn_> ;p
14:53:47  <Terkhen> Thorn_: it could use big numbers, for example, 5000 in-game days
14:53:55  <Terkhen> or be disabled
14:54:08  <planetmaker> of course there'll be an option to disable it.
14:54:17  <planetmaker> like setting it to 0 ;-)
14:54:18  <peter1138> who's writing this? hehe
14:54:25  <planetmaker> oh... sempersaudumquerens
14:55:16  * Terkhen goes back to what he was doing before talking :P
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14:58:12  <Eddi|zuHause> crawling? crying? wearing diapers?
14:59:13  <Terkhen> given how boring this is, I guess I'll go with crying
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15:39:08  <Belugas> boring? surely not as boring as reading those logs :S
15:39:23  <Belugas> 30 freaking faulty transactions.
15:39:26  <Belugas> 20 days
15:39:45  <Belugas> 3 different systems to follow events
15:39:53  <Belugas> BOOOOOOOOOORING!!!
15:40:05  <Terkhen> sounds quite boring too
15:42:27  <frosch123> maybe faulty transactions would become more interesting if they direct towards your own bank account
15:43:27  <Belugas> to say the least, Terkhen :)
15:43:33  <Terkhen> :P
15:43:48  <Belugas> i would that so much, frosch123 :)
15:43:58  <Belugas> it's for a jewelery store
15:44:04  <Belugas> you should see the amounts...
15:44:17  <Belugas> i would <LIKE>...
15:44:45  <frosch123> :p
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15:53:50  <planetmaker> :-)
15:54:03  <planetmaker> Belugas, you should have the power to 'fix' it 'properly' ;-)
15:54:20  <Terkhen> grep them out? :P
15:54:56  <planetmaker> That's not enough... or how would that direct anything to his bank account? ;-)
15:55:26  <frosch123> planetmaker: i guess the optimum would be money to him, gems to his wife :p
15:55:48  <planetmaker> :-D
15:56:00  <planetmaker> sounds like a good plan, I guess
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15:56:42  <planetmaker> Like "if you give me the gems, I'll make sure that I'll transfer the money to my account"? and hoping the flaw in that logic will not be detected :-P
15:56:58  <Belugas> i love that plan :D
15:57:18  <Belugas> i'll send an email to the owner riht now
15:57:24  <planetmaker> :-)
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16:45:58  <ChoHag_> In YACD, given an accepting industry, is there a way to quickly see which industries will supply it?
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17:17:38  <Eddi|zuHause> no
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17:29:52  <Eddi|zuHause> there was once a case of two transaction software authors who programmed the rounding routine to transfer everything < 10^-4¢ to their own account
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17:31:12  <Eddi|zuHause> if millions of transactions go through there every day, that is quite an amount of money
17:31:34  <Eddi|zuHause> they only got caught like 20 years later, when the software was reviewed
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17:44:10  <SpComb> michi_cc: your AAAA was broken a short while ago, but seems to have magically fixed itself
17:46:26  <Rubidium> you better avoid IPv6 with that host; it seems to fail more often than not :(
17:47:20  <michi_cc> SpComb: My ISP changed their IPv6 network some time ago and it seems they still don't have worked out all the kinks yet.
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17:48:17  <SpComb> yeah, it was an ICMPv6 Destination unreachable from within their network
17:50:01  <SpComb> ew, `make` pollutes my home directory with .renum files :(
17:50:33  <SpComb> and throws a hellofalot of errors
17:50:37  <michi_cc> Not that I'm totally happy about that, but at least as an "early adopter" I'm not paying anything extra.
17:50:47  <SpComb> "A portion of sprite ... could not be processed."
17:51:57  <Rubidium> SpComb: you need a newer nforenum
17:52:14  <SpComb> *blink* I have nforenum?
17:52:25  <Ammler> michi_cc: that you don't pay is the issue
17:52:36  <Ammler> so you can't "force" those to fix it :-)
17:52:40  <Rubidium> SpComb: otherwise there wouldn't be a .renum directory
17:52:43  <SpComb> hmm, seems I have the apt package installed
17:52:54  <Rubidium> that's ancient
17:53:04  <SpComb> can I just remove it?
17:53:10  <Rubidium> yes
17:53:19  <SpComb> or tell OpenTTD to not use it?
17:53:20  <Rubidium> though remove grfcodec as well
17:53:44  <Ammler> openttd should make version check
17:54:01  <Rubidium> OpenTTD will always use it if it is there and the source files for the .grf are newer than the .grf
17:54:04  <SpComb> I can't even remember installing nforenum from apt
17:54:25  <Rubidium> SpComb: I guess you installed the build-deps
17:54:31  <SpComb> that I did
17:54:49  <Rubidium> Debian fancies building everything from source
17:55:36  <Rubidium> Ammler: it tries to, IIRC
17:57:42  <Ammler> Rubidium: I guess it just fails because it can't handle png
17:59:54  <Rubidium> but the fact that older versions don't give an error when --version doesn't exist and it doesn't quite give a useful version for that
18:01:10  <Ammler> Rubidium: those versions would be too old anyway, wouldn't?
18:01:51  <Rubidium> yes, but also others that give a version with --version are too old
18:03:22  <Ammler> grfcodec has --version now?
18:03:50  <Rubidium> well, -v but what's the difference?
18:04:48  <Ammler> didn't work here
18:05:56  <Ammler> well, the problems will arise, if there are different grfcodec with png support
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18:06:17  <Rubidium> it shows a human readable version useful for debugging stuff
18:06:17  <Rubidium> then you're using a too old grfcodec
18:06:33  <Rubidium> as -v definitely works for me
18:06:46  <Ammler> yes -v does, --version doesn't
18:06:50  <Ammler> also -V doesn't
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18:20:52  <andythenorth> am I the only one who thinks offsetting canal boats to one side is daft?
18:20:53  <andythenorth> :P
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18:21:27  <frosch123> make them change sides on wednesday or so :p
18:22:00  <frosch123> alternatively you can start putting green buoys in the middle of canals
18:22:05  <frosch123> then noone can complain
18:23:13  <frosch123> but yes, ships should take the whole tile
18:23:14  <andythenorth> doing this thing would cause bug reports
18:23:22  <frosch123> and canals should be two tiles wide
18:23:35  <frosch123> most locks also have two sides
18:25:08  <andythenorth> one way canals?
18:25:45  * frosch123 notices he has no idea how canal junctions work
18:29:17  <TWerkhoven> not so much junctions as forks, as there would be in a river
18:35:15  * SpComb wonders if smooth animations when pressing "Location" buttons would be feasible
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18:37:01  <SpComb> do all industry/vehicle GRFs work okay with YACD?
18:37:11  <andythenorth> no
18:37:19  <SpComb> problematics?
18:37:41  <Eddi|zuHause> SpComb: smooth scroll is already an option, iirc
18:37:55  <andythenorth> eGRVTS capacities are too high for later vehicles - use 'vehicles never expire' and 'low breakdowns (or off)'
18:38:08  <andythenorth> FIRS is insanely hard with YACD
18:38:13  <andythenorth> FISH needs more small boats
18:38:15  <SpComb> Eddi|zuHause: correct
18:38:22  * SpComb enables it
18:38:28  <andythenorth> AV8 is - if anything - much better with YACD
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18:38:48  <Eddi|zuHause> i find airplanes really hopeless with destinations
18:38:53  <SpComb> andythenorth: tram/road capacities too high?
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18:40:00  <Eddi|zuHause> SpComb: you might want to check ;)
18:40:16  <SpComb> Eddi|zuHause: I noticed
18:40:37  <SpComb> brought back bad memories about git
18:40:51  <Eddi|zuHause> hehe ;)
18:41:25  <SpComb> I'm not sure if I want to go and try and do the same git tricks with yacd
18:41:31  <SpComb> upstream rebases kill
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18:43:38  <SpComb> ah, city view shows the pax routing
18:43:59  <SpComb> although slightly confusingly in terms of "outgoing cargo"
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18:45:37  <peter1138> hm
18:45:44  <peter1138> i suppose i should start a new game :p
18:46:07  * andythenorth feels the same
18:46:12  <andythenorth> mp yacd :P
18:46:20  <peter1138> it was!
18:46:27  <peter1138> but no newgrfs
18:46:31  <andythenorth> lame :(
18:46:44  <peter1138> cos frankly they're still too hard to install on a server :(
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18:47:23  <SpComb> and the station window doesn't actually show what mode of destiantion breakdown is currently selected
18:47:42  <andythenorth> bah
18:47:49  * andythenorth should write code or draw pixels
18:47:54  <andythenorth> but a yacd game is more appealing
18:47:59  <peter1138> i'm not saying i won't use newgrf
18:48:01  <peter1138> just that i hadn't
18:48:49  <peter1138> also i still don't know the correct way to specify newgrfs downloaded from the content system :p
18:49:13  <peter1138> (or rather, how to find out what to list)
18:50:35  <peter1138> content select all
18:50:40  <peter1138> mightn't've been a good idea :p
18:50:50  <Eddi|zuHause> peter1138: easiest to make a scenario on the client, and upload it onto the server
18:51:09  <peter1138> otoh, is... er... localhost there
18:51:09  <Eddi|zuHause> handles all newgrf trouble automatically
18:53:26  <peter1138> well i'm lazy then
18:53:41  <peter1138> so someone want to set up a scenario for a yacd 2.2 game? :p
18:55:23  * andythenorth hopes someone does that
18:55:27  <andythenorth> and invites him to the game
18:56:24  <andythenorth> I'll need to update
18:56:30  <andythenorth> YACD 1.2 is so...old school
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19:03:05  <peter1138> yeah
19:04:25  <SpComb> nice to see a cargodist-variant on yacd
19:06:32  * peter1138 mumbles about mb's newstations not being on bananas :p
19:08:22  <supermop> heh
19:10:04  <andythenorth> how do I update yacd?
19:10:12  <andythenorth> it always tells me I already have the patch
19:10:18  <andythenorth> patch -r ?
19:10:19  <andythenorth> first?
19:10:27  <SpComb> does YACD still do silly things with pax going from a station to itself, and not bringing in any income?
19:11:03  <Rubidium> SpComb: if it did with the version from 2 weeks ago, then it still does (though there hasn't been a new version)
19:11:43  <SpComb> mine seems to say YACD 2.2
19:12:20  <Rubidium> yeah, then you're using 'head'
19:12:50  <SpComb> ah, found the 2.2 "release" post
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19:16:20  <Eddi|zuHause> i'm amazed how quickly someone can conclude from one single (unreleased) grf to "all grfs do it like this"
19:17:00  <Terkhen> assuming that seems simpler and faster than "I should try all grfs to know for sure"
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19:21:46  <andythenorth> I guessed what you'd be referring to
19:21:48  <andythenorth> and I was right
19:21:52  <andythenorth> can I have my prize?
19:22:28  <Eddi|zuHause> yes. go to and get a cooke.
19:25:20  <andythenorth> hmm
19:25:25  <andythenorth> he's often right though
19:25:30  <andythenorth> often for the wrong reasons
19:25:35  <andythenorth> or wrong, with right reasons
19:28:12  <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: for your suggestion - is the significant fact that it makes more/less money?
19:28:17  <andythenorth> or that it adds nice intricacy?
19:28:24  <andythenorth> or is it just realism?
19:31:51  <Eddi|zuHause> i thought i explained that in the thread
19:33:24  <Eddi|zuHause> no, the significant fact is not "more money", the significant fact is "sensible game balance model"
19:33:55  <SpComb> it would be nice to be able to hide some .grf's from the full list of GRF files
19:34:11  <SpComb> when picking GRFs for a new game
19:34:16  <SpComb> e.g. the z_obsolete stuff from the ottdc grf pack
19:35:35  <Eddi|zuHause> only GRFs for which a newer version (as per action 14) exists are hidden
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19:36:22  <SpComb> in terms of managing it
19:36:52  <SpComb> not entirely sure I really like the NewGRF Settings window anyways
19:41:03  <SpComb> best rv set for temperate with DB Set?
19:41:08  <SpComb> still German RVs?
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19:48:58  <Eddi|zuHause> it still doesn't have useful trucks though
19:52:14  * SpComb has no clue what's been happening on the GRF scene since he last played a year ago
19:54:07  <Eddi|zuHause> MB threw a fit (or multiple) because andythenorth keeps changing the cargo scheme :p
19:54:38  <andythenorth> apparently it's both perfectly flexible by design, but also shouldn't be changed :P
19:54:43  <andythenorth> ermm
19:54:46  <andythenorth> what else?
19:54:54  <andythenorth> planetmaker has made about 9,000 grfs
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20:06:53  <Eddi|zuHause> "linux 3.0"? i think they're getting crazy :p
20:07:18  <Eddi|zuHause> brb
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20:08:17  <Terkhen> weren't they talking about 2.8?
20:12:36  <TWerkhoven> either or afaik
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20:23:32  <Rubidium> Eddi|zuHause: actually, the current numbers are crazy as well...
20:23:53  <Rubidium> that's 60 bugfix releases of the same kernel
20:24:43  <Eddi|zuHause> it's a fairly old kernel, though
20:25:23  <Rubidium> then? ;)
20:25:35  <Eddi|zuHause> i mean, try to apply that same versioning to the windows kernel :p
20:26:03  <Rubidium> they use the 3.0 "format"
20:26:52  <Rubidium> 2k cam with the 5.0 kernel, XP came with 5.1, Vista with 6, 7 with 6.1
20:26:56  <Eddi|zuHause> the 3.0 thing is more like java 1.5 -> java 5
20:27:35  <Rubidium> Eddi|zuHause: true, but the development model changed as well
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20:28:28  <Rubidium> pre 2.6 major development happened in x.y (y % 2 = 1), now all development happens in 2.6
20:28:33  <Eddi|zuHause> so when we change development model here we release openttd 2.0? ;)
20:29:04  <Rubidium> once we figured out we're not going to do the old method, yes!
20:30:16  <Rubidium> but then, our flux is much smaller so backports are easier to do
20:30:47  <Rubidium> and we don't have to provide support for state of the art hardware
20:31:33  <Eddi|zuHause> you have blocked out the storm of "support XYZ mobile device" threads in the forum? :p
20:31:56  <planetmaker> good evening
20:32:49  <Rubidium> it'll work fine if the resolution is big enough, the mouse precision good enough, and the operating system being supported by e.g. sdl or allegro
20:33:21  <Rubidium> evening maker of planets
20:35:30  <Wolf01> 'night
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20:42:56  <planetmaker> [21:54]	andythenorth	planetmaker has made about 9,000 grfs <-- eh?
20:43:30  <andythenorth> well a few anyway
20:43:38  <andythenorth> he asked what had changed in newgrf recently
20:43:50  <Eddi|zuHause> at least half a dozen OpenGFX+ grfs
20:44:36  <planetmaker> yes. Though I didn't write all on my own. And some I only added tiny pieces ;-)
20:44:39  <Rubidium> pff... count the revisions in the hg repositories (and multiply by 6 for the ogfx repository)
20:44:47  <planetmaker> :-)
20:45:18  <planetmaker> andythenorth: you've done surely as much as I, though
20:45:31  <andythenorth> not recently
20:45:32  <planetmaker> I didn't do much graphical work. You did lots.
20:45:37  <Rubidium> ~450 revisions in OGFX -> ~2.5k
20:45:50  <Rubidium> so it can't be off by an order of magnitude
20:45:59  <planetmaker> :-)
20:46:22  <planetmaker> that's astrophysical assessment. within +/- 1 order of magnitude is accurate :-P
20:47:00  <Rubidium> @calc 2500/900
20:47:00  <DorpsGek> Rubidium: 2.77777777778
20:47:09  <Rubidium> @calc 9000/2500
20:47:09  <DorpsGek> Rubidium: 3.6
20:47:15  <Rubidium> hmm, okay... not quite there yet
20:47:25  <Rubidium> 200 in FIRS
20:48:08  <Rubidium> 200 in Swedish rails
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20:49:28  <SpComb> yacd tells me I have 141pax waiting at a station, with 129 en-route via ... - where are the rest?
20:49:42  <Rubidium> some 100 in total for TTRS, snowline, ogfx trees, ogfx+, ... which makes 3k
20:49:46  <Rubidium> @calc 3000/900
20:49:46  <DorpsGek> Rubidium: 3.33333333333
20:49:53  <Rubidium> @calc 9000/3000
20:49:54  <DorpsGek> Rubidium: 3
20:50:19  <Rubidium> so the number of commits is relatively closer to 9000 than to 900
20:52:16  <planetmaker> hehe :-)
20:54:06  <planetmaker> hg log -u planetmaker --template='{desc}\n' | wc -l over all newgrf projects ogfx+*, opengfx, swedish rails, snowlinemod and incl. firs, heqs, fish, 2cctrainset, nutracks gives...
20:54:33  <planetmaker> @calc 577+236+19+43+259+69+145+95+304+301+138+165
20:54:33  <DorpsGek> planetmaker: 2351
20:54:45  <planetmaker> oh well... :-)
20:54:49  <planetmaker> that number :-)
20:54:52  <Rubidium> opengfx must be multiplied by 6
20:55:02  <planetmaker> hm, I forgot ttrs
20:55:09  <planetmaker> and ogfx+trees
20:55:49  <planetmaker> that*s another 63.
20:55:54  <Terkhen> meh, I broke my mingw
20:55:59  <planetmaker> then opengfx is 577*6
20:56:21  <planetmaker> @calc 577*5 + 2351 +63
20:56:22  <DorpsGek> planetmaker: 5299
20:56:36  <Rubidium> wow, you're even closer to 9000 absolutely
20:58:39  <planetmaker> and openmsx, opensfx and the newgrf framework if one wants. But not every commit to opengfx changes all 6 grfs
20:59:47  <Rubidium> it does... it's a new release under a new version
21:00:07  <Rubidium> it might not physically change everything, but you can definitely sell it as a new version
21:00:12  <planetmaker> the 5 grfs have no version. The version is only in the opengfx.obg
21:00:41  <planetmaker> and in the extra grf of course
21:00:45  <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: that cargo aging debate is getting a bit silly?
21:00:50  <andythenorth> -?
21:01:25  <Eddi|zuHause> MB does have that effect on longer lasting discussions
21:02:27  <andythenorth> is your proposal better than enhancing the existing profit calculation cb?
21:02:29  <Rubidium> tip: never discuss something NewGRF related that is used in something MB released
21:02:36  <andythenorth> hmm
21:02:39  <andythenorth> oh yes
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21:02:47  <andythenorth> I maintain he's often right though
21:03:31  <planetmaker> he has a solid understanding of how it works. But... that makes not all deductions of how things *should work* right
21:03:54  <Eddi|zuHause> this isn't about whether he is right or not. this is about once he made up his mind he stays there
21:04:22  <Eddi|zuHause> and at that point the arguments go in circles
21:04:27  <andythenorth> he probably admitted he was wrong somewhere once
21:04:32  <andythenorth> probably in the german forum
21:04:38  <andythenorth> which is now archived I imagine
21:05:22  <Eddi|zuHause> some ancient newsgroup thread :p
21:05:34  <Eddi|zuHause> or better: a private mail conversation :p
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21:13:42  <SpComb> heh, trains are teleported out of depots?
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21:24:54  <SpComb> argh, managed to screw up that game
21:25:12  <SpComb> hardware reset itself, and I didn't have autosave on for various banal reasons
21:25:36  <SpComb> lost like two game-years of play or so :(
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21:25:53  <SpComb> no point playing that map anymore, really :(
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21:49:53  <Eddi|zuHause> a 2MB diff... how crazy
21:52:36  <Terkhen> :O
21:54:17  <Terkhen> 47841 lines
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22:41:26  <Terkhen> good night
22:47:36  <planetmaker> good night Terkhen
22:47:48  <planetmaker> and... sounds like a VERY good idea. So good night all :-)
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23:07:37  <TomyLobo> hi
23:07:59  <TomyLobo> we started our multiplayer map in the wrong year, but we like that map. any way to fast-forward a few years?
23:08:47  <TomyLobo> it's a dedi
23:14:05  <Ammler> no
23:14:21  <Ammler> just save it locally, cheat and load it again
23:14:40  <TomyLobo> meh
23:14:47  <TomyLobo> it's only 2 more years anyway :)
23:14:56  <Ammler> half an hour
23:15:08  <Eddi|zuHause> then load locally, fast forward, and load it back
23:15:37  <TomyLobo> thanks, that helps :)
23:15:53  <Ammler> how does that help more?
23:16:18  <TomyLobo> i can go afk
23:17:08  <Ammler> ah, you mean "half an hour"
23:17:42  <Ammler> 1year ~ 14mins
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23:26:16  <Eddi|zuHause> wasn't it more like 12 minutes?
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