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00:12:32 *** SpBot [~spbot@skrblz.fixme.fi] has joined #openttd 00:12:45 *** rasco [rasco@tietos.com] has joined #openttd 00:13:10 *** You're now known as Guest5581 00:18:21 *** MNIM [~LiesLies@ip5452ffad.adsl-surfen.hetnet.nl] has joined #openttd 00:27:20 *** Cursarion [ronin@viuhka.fi] has joined #openttd 00:28:49 *** fjb is now known as Guest5586 00:28:50 *** fjb [~frank@p5DDFFD89.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 00:33:28 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1B9C1.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:34:38 *** Chrill [~chrischri@h-5-149.A212.priv.bahnhof.se] has quit [] 00:35:54 *** Guest5586 [~frank@p5DDFFB3C.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:37:52 <caracal> is there a way to find your road depots besides just wandering around looking for them? some i built years ago and the city has grown up around them 00:38:00 <caracal> stations, there's a list, but depots? 00:39:48 *** el_bb_ [~el_btd@109.125.107.76.dynamic.cablesurf.de] has joined #openttd 00:41:16 <lugo> caracal, well you cam toggle visibility of city houses 00:41:20 <lugo> *can 00:41:54 <caracal> i guess that'd work ... so no separate list of them, eh? 00:42:40 <lugo> not that i knew of, but i'm not 100% sure 00:43:23 <caracal> s'cool, thanks for the suggestion ... i keep forgetting that you can make houses *disapper*, not just turn them translucent 00:44:11 <caracal> took me a while to figure out how, and managed it mostly by accident, but at least now i know ;) 00:55:41 <lugo> caracal, have you tried clicking on a vehicles 'auto-focus' button while holding down ctrl yet? :) 00:56:14 <caracal> i have not, but will try it 00:57:16 <caracal> ah ... that does a "follow" on the vehicle in the main viewport ... could be handy sometimes 00:57:47 <MNIM> alternatively, if you did enter depots into the orders 00:58:02 <MNIM> Ctrl+ Click the order to the depot 00:59:18 <caracal> sure ... if you can find a vehicle based at that depot, you can always open its view and tell it to "go to depot", then once it's there, voila, there's the depot 00:59:32 <caracal> but with a city full of busses, sometimes that's tricky <g> 01:03:23 *** Vikthor [~Vikthor@78-80-200-5.tmcz.cz] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 01:03:46 <caracal> i have at least learned that it's usually a good idea to enter a depot into the vehicle's travel orders somewhere, and that's typically the vehicle's "home" depot 01:13:59 *** Mucht [~Martin@chello084115143107.3.graz.surfer.at] has joined #openttd 01:16:29 *** Mucht [~Martin@chello084115143107.3.graz.surfer.at] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:32:29 *** devilsadvocate [~quassel@109.200.19.188] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:41:51 <caracal> gah ... i have 50-odd busses, and now a new model has come along ... any simple way to upgrade them all, or automatically, or must i catch them one at a time? 01:42:08 <caracal> i remember seeing an "autorenew" option somewhere, is that what i need? 01:43:52 <caracal> what i'd *like* to be able to say is something like "any time any vehicle X goes into any depot, replace it with a vehicle Y" 01:45:24 <caracal> ah, i think i just found it ... "replace" in the vehicles list, under the Manage List menu 01:55:28 <caracal> yep, that's just what i wanted! a bit more work for airplanes, though, since you frequently want to change their destinations from small airports to larger ones at the same time you upgrade 01:55:44 <caracal> which is where shared orders come in handy, at least saves a bit of work 02:07:53 *** bryjen [~bryjen@76.92.85.169] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:15:50 *** devilsadvocate [~quassel@109.200.19.188] has joined #openttd 02:24:17 *** rhaeder [~quix0r@dslb-094-221-137-252.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 02:26:12 *** Chris_Booth [~chatzilla@cpc7-newt30-2-0-cust37.newt.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 02:27:33 *** __ln__ [~lauri@ssh.ksenos.fi] has joined #openttd 02:29:39 *** rhaeder1 [~quix0r@dslb-094-221-158-025.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:32:11 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:355d:2dc4:77e1:a000] has quit [Quit: bye] 02:43:58 *** el_bb_ [~el_btd@109.125.107.76.dynamic.cablesurf.de] has quit [Quit: goodbye] 02:47:17 *** Intexon [~Intexon@blk-222-147-135.eastlink.ca] has quit [Quit: Sorry, this packet wasn't exactly a winner] 02:54:34 *** Chris_Booth [~chatzilla@cpc7-newt30-2-0-cust37.newt.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:01:53 *** DGMurdockIII [~dgmurdock@c-68-58-129-14.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: get satisfied!  :: core-networks.de ««« (Gamers.IRC) »»» gamersirc.net ::] 03:55:20 *** Kurimus [Kurimus@dsl-tkubrasgw3-ffa0c300-106.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #openttd 04:14:52 *** k^^ [~k^^@users192.kollegienet.dk] has joined #openttd 04:31:22 *** bryjen [~bryjen@76.92.85.169] has joined #openttd 04:47:46 *** k^^ [~k^^@users192.kollegienet.dk] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep] 04:50:42 *** bryjen [~bryjen@76.92.85.169] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 04:52:19 *** bodis [~bodis@cpc3-ando3-0-0-cust781.15-1.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 04:54:44 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B729BE.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:55:04 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B7351F.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 05:37:43 *** bodis [~bodis@cpc3-ando3-0-0-cust781.15-1.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:39:45 *** Mucht [~Martin@chello084115143107.3.graz.surfer.at] has joined #openttd 05:49:33 *** Mucht [~Martin@chello084115143107.3.graz.surfer.at] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:51:26 *** bryjen [~bryjen@76.92.85.169] has joined #openttd 05:55:07 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc18-aztw25-2-0-cust185.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 06:03:13 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc18-aztw25-2-0-cust185.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 06:06:04 *** Prof_Frink [~proffrink@5e0f84fe.bb.sky.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:15:11 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc18-aztw25-2-0-cust185.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 06:18:33 *** Br33z4hSlut5 [~static.kp@92.68.154.34] has joined #openttd 06:18:45 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc18-aztw25-2-0-cust185.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [] 06:21:30 *** KouDy [~KouDy@ip-78-102-233-119.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 06:25:02 *** Cybertinus [~Cybertinu@tunnel3304.ipv6.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 06:42:23 *** Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.A98.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #openttd 06:46:04 <dihedral> good morning 06:46:49 * dihedral wonders if someone's on the ignore list or someone else is monologuing :P 06:48:39 <planetmaker> moin 06:49:03 <dihedral> oi pm 06:49:04 <dihedral> :-) 06:49:10 <dihedral> btw. the irc connection is coming along 06:49:19 <planetmaker> sweet sweet :-) 06:51:14 <dihedral> missing a back route (irc -> openttd) and have a char which i do not expect to see in the message - i guess though that this char is the LTR or RTL char ^^ 06:51:55 <dihedral> then i can move on to the stuff like is user in channel etc. 06:52:46 <dihedral> i moved to a different irc library, as this one provides channel and user objects, with easy access to lists about the channels a certain user is in ^^ 06:54:09 <planetmaker> ? 06:55:14 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@94.142.234.1] has joined #openttd 06:58:51 <dihedral> planetmaker, ? to what? :-P 06:59:41 <planetmaker> you're saying the previously used irc lib didn't allow to find out which channel the bot or a user of the bot is in? 06:59:48 <Terkhen> good morning 07:01:03 *** Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.A98.priv.bahnhof.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 07:01:39 <dihedral> good morning Terkhen 07:02:30 <dihedral> planetmaker, basically yes, you could get hold of the channel(s) the bot was on, but not see the channels or the status of a user once you received the message 07:02:40 <planetmaker> hello Terkhen 07:02:42 <dihedral> you were only given a string (user) instead of a User Object 07:02:55 <planetmaker> i see 07:03:55 <dihedral> the lib i am working with now, is an extension of the previous lib, reworked to an Event driven lib, and provides different objects for channel and user actions 07:05:37 <dihedral> http://code.google.com/p/pircbotx/wiki/Features#Extensive_User_and_Channel_objects 07:08:30 *** Juo [~Juo@cpc11-acto2-2-0-cust244.4-2.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 07:09:25 *** Juo [~Juo@cpc11-acto2-2-0-cust244.4-2.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [] 07:18:29 *** Adambean [AdamR@82.hosts.reece-eu.net] has joined #openttd 07:44:04 *** KouDy [~KouDy@ip-78-102-233-119.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 07:45:20 *** KouDy [~KouDy@ip-78-102-233-119.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 07:57:32 *** bryjen [~bryjen@76.92.85.169] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 07:58:45 *** JVassie [~James@host-92-27-149-231.static.as13285.net] has joined #openttd 08:06:54 <JVassie> mornin' all 08:06:56 <JVassie> all mornin' 08:09:36 *** sla_ro|master [~slaco@95.76.27.160] has joined #openttd 08:11:58 <Terkhen> hi JVassie 08:12:09 <JVassie> how ya doing? 08:18:10 <Terkhen> I'm testing stuff so I'll know that soon :P 08:18:52 <JVassie> haha 08:18:59 <JVassie> testing anything interesting? :) 08:19:06 *** devilsadvocate [~quassel@109.200.19.188] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 08:19:36 <JVassie> hmm 08:19:52 <JVassie> CETS currently has 8 locos intro'd in the 20s, and 3 locos intro'd in the 30s 08:19:53 <JVassie> :x 08:20:31 <Terkhen> interesting mostly to me, it is for university :P 08:21:59 *** SirSquidness [~sirsquidn@zomg.dongues.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 08:22:15 <JVassie> ah hah 08:22:27 * JVassie starts on old SBB electrics.. 08:22:40 <JVassie> I guess we can do BLS as well 08:30:03 <JVassie> hmm planetmaker Eddi|zuHause there? 08:31:22 *** SirSquidness [~sirsquidn@zomg.dongues.com] has joined #openttd 08:36:41 <planetmaker> JVassie, it's about 1000% more productive, if you just share your thoughts instead of sharing that you *might* want to share thoughts... 08:36:48 <JVassie> :D 08:37:10 <JVassie> just a note regarding some of the SBB stuff im putting in 08:37:23 <JVassie> for the Ae 3/6 I and the Re 4/4 I 08:37:47 <JVassie> there are two versions with identical names, which came in seperate batches, with different stats 08:38:01 <JVassie> and in the case of the Re 4/4 I, different looks 08:39:33 <planetmaker> then add a note about that and... done ;-) 08:40:34 <JVassie> :p 08:40:36 <JVassie> yadda yadda 08:40:54 <JVassie> theres not much point being hugely extensive with the shunters i guess 08:42:46 <JVassie> a lot of them are very similar in looks and stats 08:46:47 <peter1138> i don't think people actually use them, do they? 08:49:45 *** dfox [~dfox@ip-94-113-17-246.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 08:51:16 <JVassie> well its things like the V100 of germany 08:51:22 <JVassie> which are quite common 08:51:32 <JVassie> and have a use aside from sitting in a yard shunting 08:53:35 <planetmaker> eddi considers shunting engines suitable for short-distance feeder services 08:53:43 *** ctibor [~quassel@77.48.228.43] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:54:00 <peter1138> yeah 08:55:24 <planetmaker> I'm not entirely sure whether the normal engines won't do for this purpose. But it'd mean to leave out this category entirely 08:56:30 *** ctibor [~quassel@77.48.228.43] has joined #openttd 08:57:05 *** devilsadvocate [~quassel@109.200.19.188] has joined #openttd 08:58:55 *** ctibor [~quassel@77.48.228.43] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:00:21 *** peter1138 [~petern@lachesis.fuzzle.org] has left #openttd [] 09:00:21 *** peter1138 [~petern@lachesis.fuzzle.org] has joined #openttd 09:00:24 *** mode/#openttd [+o peter1138] by ChanServ 09:08:33 *** ctibor [~quassel@77.48.228.43] has joined #openttd 09:15:40 <JVassie> planetmaker: thats why i think it best just to use those which best represent shunters 09:17:23 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1BA3E.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 09:17:26 <JVassie> Ae 8/14 09:17:30 <JVassie> 490 kN TE 09:17:32 <JVassie> dang.. 09:17:49 <JVassie> 100kph and 4650kW 09:17:52 <JVassie> in 1931 :p 09:17:55 <JVassie> quite a beast of a loco 09:23:41 *** devilsadvocate [~quassel@109.200.19.188] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 09:26:51 <caracal> is there a way to center the already-open minimap on the current viewport view? i know that closing and re-opening it will do that, but was wondering if there was another way ... couldn't find it in the hotkeys or on the UI 09:27:42 <JVassie> hi michi_cc :) 09:28:03 <planetmaker> JVassie, really... please add something meaningful to your highlights 09:28:26 <JVassie> says you! :p 09:28:54 <planetmaker> no. IRC works similar to e-mail. If you just send an e-mail like "hello" it's pointless 09:29:02 <michi_cc> Hello JVassie 09:29:15 <JVassie> he just joined the spreadsheet so i was saying hi 09:29:16 <planetmaker> irc has the advantage, if the first line sets the topic, it's clear when one returns later what is to be discussed 09:29:21 <planetmaker> :-) 09:29:25 <planetmaker> ok 09:29:50 <planetmaker> I redact the implicit conclusion I jumped to ;-) 09:29:59 <JVassie> *retract 09:30:02 <JVassie> :p 09:30:06 <JVassie> no worries 09:30:20 <JVassie> so many motors cars on the swiss railways.. 09:30:40 <planetmaker> http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/redact §3 ;-) 09:32:06 <JVassie> were not publishing nout :p 09:32:10 *** Juo [~Juo@87-194-64-202.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 09:32:31 <planetmaker> :-P 09:33:06 <Yexo> caracal: the button right of the + button 09:33:37 <caracal> backslash? 09:33:48 <Yexo> I don't think there is a hotkey for that 09:33:55 <Yexo> I meant the button in the window itself 09:33:59 <caracal> ah 09:34:32 <caracal> oh duh, that's exactly what it does, and i'm sure i saw that tooltip a hundred times ... thanks!! 09:35:15 <JVassie> least BLS doesnt have as much stock as the SBB 09:35:27 <JVassie> are there any other swiss private companies we want to represent in CETS? 09:36:19 <JVassie> perhaps BOB, MOB, RhB, SOB 09:37:05 <JVassie> and potentially AB, THURBO and ZB 09:37:34 <JVassie> thoughts welcome all 09:37:37 <caracal> so in early-year scenarios, at least (and maybe later ones as well) there's no way for a ship to load oil from an oil rig out in the open ocean, right? 09:37:58 <Yexo> caracal: if you have a ship, just order it to load at the oil rig 09:38:21 <Yexo> or is the problem that you have no ships available? 09:38:25 <caracal> oh? it'll accept the rig as a route destination? 09:38:29 <Yexo> yes 09:38:35 <caracal> oh cool, thanks 09:38:51 <Yexo> oil rigs have a special in-build station that can be used by all companies 09:38:56 <caracal> ahhh 09:39:13 <caracal> i'm too stupid for trains, so i tend to focus on ships and planes <g> 09:39:59 <JVassie> helicopters can also land at oil rigs 09:40:02 <JVassie> :) 09:40:39 <caracal> ah ... i tried that but couldn't get it to work ... must have done it wrong 09:41:14 <caracal> didn't click on the right position or something 09:41:59 <caracal> i figured it should work, since the oil rig's art has a big prominent helipad right on it <g> 09:42:24 <Eddi|zuHause> JVassie: RhB and stuff only if we allow narrow gauge 09:42:48 <Eddi|zuHause> but for swiss stuff, that would probably be necessary 09:42:52 <JVassie> true 09:43:09 <JVassie> Ill have to check how much NG track there is without OHLE 09:43:25 <JVassie> dont think there will be much 09:43:54 <JVassie> we could probably have 3 railtypes to cover NG if we can spare them 09:44:10 <JVassie> low axle weight and speed non elec 09:44:15 <JVassie> low axle weigth and speed elec 09:44:21 <JVassie> higher axle weight and speed elec 09:46:07 <Eddi|zuHause> is axle weight really that relevant for narrow gauge? 09:48:22 <JVassie> not sure tbh 09:48:31 <JVassie> i dont know a huge amount 09:48:36 <JVassie> Snail would know more 09:48:45 <peter1138> too many railtypes :S 09:48:48 <JVassie> hes offline on MSN atm though 09:49:09 <JVassie> Eddi, how would you get around it for NG then? 09:50:05 <JVassie> I mean were not gonna even look at the different NG sizes 09:50:26 <JVassie> 750mm, 1000mm for example 09:53:22 *** KouDy [~KouDy@ip-78-102-233-119.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 09:53:51 *** Vikthor [~Vikthor@78-80-200-5.tmcz.cz] has joined #openttd 09:56:07 <JVassie> mmm RhB is all electrified 09:56:11 <JVassie> 11kV or 1kV 09:56:55 <JVassie> http://www.railfaneurope.net/pix/ch/narrow_gauge/RhB/electric/emu/ABe8_12/100620-ABe812-3503-Poschiavo.jpg 09:57:03 <JVassie> NG version of the FLIRT EMU :p 09:58:38 <Eddi|zuHause> JVassie: i'd probably say expect only 2 NG railtypes, normal and electrified 09:58:46 <JVassie> thats fine 09:59:00 <JVassie> the speed limits will determine themselves for the most part with locomotive speeds 09:59:06 *** andythenorth [~Andy@78-86-194-127.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 09:59:08 *** andythenorth [~Andy@78-86-194-127.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has left #openttd [] 09:59:12 <JVassie> unless its possible to change max speed by current year? 09:59:21 <JVassie> (of a railtype) 09:59:28 *** KouDy [~KouDy@ip-78-102-233-119.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 09:59:30 <Eddi|zuHause> i don't think so 09:59:52 <peter1138> you can do that on the vehicle side 10:00:03 <JVassie> wrong useage peter 10:00:16 <JVassie> anyway the max speed RhB is 100kph 10:00:20 <JVassie> *loco 10:00:38 <peter1138> wrong usage? 10:01:05 <Yexo> <JVassie> unless its possible to change max speed by current year? <- only if you save/load the game, so not in mp 10:01:16 <JVassie> well as in i was thinkign to simulate older and newer versions of Ng track 10:01:23 <JVassie> without wasting more railtype slots 10:01:27 <JVassie> ah ok Yexo 10:01:36 <JVassie> well we could set NG speed limit to 120kph 10:01:42 <JVassie> which is reasonable enough IMO 10:01:47 <peter1138> yes, you can simulate that on the vehicle side 10:01:55 <peter1138> bit nasty, admittedly 10:02:31 <JVassie> ah i see what you mean 10:02:38 <JVassie> apologies 10:02:42 *** devilsadvocate [~quassel@109.200.19.188] has joined #openttd 10:03:02 <Yexo> JVassie: what problem are you trying to solve? what would be the difference between old and new NG tracks? 10:03:08 <JVassie> maximum speed 10:03:17 <Yexo> if it's only the speed: are there any faster ng engines available for the old track? 10:03:29 <JVassie> but 120kph seems to be the fastest any NG loco/MU goes 10:03:42 <Yexo> you can also leave out the speed limit completely for the track type 10:03:45 <JVassie> Not even sure there 'are' old tracks 10:03:50 <JVassie> i assume there is 10:04:16 <Yexo> just limiting the speed of each engine will do as well 10:04:51 <JVassie> I guess as the range of speeds isnt that great 10:04:55 <JVassie> 30-120 give or take 10:05:03 <JVassie> not much need for railtype speed limits 10:05:58 <JVassie> now what would be a really cool feature are 'points/switches' on slopes! :p 10:07:18 <peter1138> freeform landscape! 10:07:40 <JVassie> you could simulate rack railways with points on slopes 10:08:01 <JVassie> and stations 10:08:08 <peter1138> stations on curves! 10:08:13 <peter1138> (i had a patch for that, once) 10:08:14 <JVassie> and that 10:08:16 <JVassie> oh? 10:08:19 <JVassie> what happened to it? 10:08:24 <peter1138> lost long ago 10:08:28 <JVassie> seems to eb your favourite by-line :D 10:08:30 <JVassie> *be 10:08:32 <peter1138> it was before newstations support 10:09:55 <JVassie> ah 10:10:53 <Eddi|zuHause> it used to be "i have a patch for that" :p 10:11:10 <peter1138> yeah 10:11:14 <peter1138> newgrf bridges were cool too 10:11:22 <Sacro> heh, the glory days of /o/ 10:11:32 <peter1138> :D 10:11:38 <peter1138> hmm, still exists 10:12:19 <Sacro> so it does 10:12:25 <Sacro> i wonder if we merged a load of them patches 10:12:56 <peter1138> some, but not many 10:14:13 <peter1138> a lot of enginepools from 2008, heh 10:15:11 <Eddi|zuHause> give them to MB ;) 10:20:46 <JVassie> some 172 entries in the tracking table so far 10:20:47 <JVassie> :p 10:22:56 *** AD [wilberforc@drinks.mountaindew.org] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:25:44 <Terkhen> do you have more engines than 2cc already? :P 10:26:02 <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause, re #2784: in order to allow higher wagons I left space above the sprites, so that's allowed for :-) 10:26:22 <planetmaker> I'd also prepare an alignment template right away for normal and extended height wagons. 10:26:33 <planetmaker> Like I have for the pikka-style alignment templates 10:26:39 <Yexo> planetmaker: you should be able to use a single template 10:26:45 <Yexo> just prepare it for the extended height 10:26:55 <Yexo> the autocrop feature of nml/grfcodec should do the rest 10:26:59 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: some of the sprites have darker dots in the middle, those were the original anchor points from my test run 10:27:22 <planetmaker> I see :-) That's what they're for, I wondered about them 10:27:31 <JVassie> Terkhen: i imagien so 10:27:33 <JVassie> *imagine 10:27:48 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: some have two, depending on direction they needed different ones 10:27:50 <Terkhen> :P 10:28:15 <planetmaker> Yexo, yes, should work. I guess that works when there are no sprites yet. For the 'normal' vehicles I need both as I have vehicles following one or the other. 10:28:21 *** AD [wilberforc@drinks.mountaindew.org] has joined #openttd 10:28:59 *** AD is now known as Guest5638 10:29:16 *** planetmaker [~planetmak@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has left #openttd [... und tschÃŒÃ!] 10:29:23 *** planetmaker [~planetmak@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 10:29:26 *** mode/#openttd [+o planetmaker] by ChanServ 10:29:50 <planetmaker> hm... somehow I managed to detach this channel's view in a separate window... without a way to merge it back into my xchat one :S 10:30:06 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: i haven't researched too much, but i expect 4 different wagon sizes throughout the game: ca. 9-10m, ca. 12-14m, ca. 18-20m and ca. 24-26m, i'd say make them 6lu, 8lu, 12lu and 16lu 10:30:45 <Terkhen> planetmaker: right click->xchat->attach 10:30:49 <planetmaker> Yes... though 8 and 6 lu don't need anything special, they can follow the pikka templates 10:30:58 <JVassie> lu = how many px? 10:31:02 <JVassie> 4? 10:31:03 <planetmaker> Terkhen, thanks. I'll try to recall next time :-) 10:31:16 <JVassie> in the ___ direction obviously 10:31:20 <planetmaker> JVassie, 8/8 is 32px 10:31:21 <Eddi|zuHause> JVassie: 4px in - directio 10:31:31 <JVassie> ta 10:31:51 <Eddi|zuHause> but this is the second-least interesting direction ;) 10:31:56 <planetmaker> anyhow, that means we need two over-length templates 10:32:10 <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause, do we need the additional views also for the 8/8 and 6/8 wagons? 10:32:38 <Eddi|zuHause> not sure 10:32:44 <planetmaker> he, ok :-P 10:32:54 <planetmaker> we might give it a try without and see 10:34:47 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 10:35:37 <Eddi|zuHause> hm... i guess the DRG didn't take the 18t/20t limits too strictly... 10:36:07 <Eddi|zuHause> BR 03.10 -> 18.4t 10:36:12 <Eddi|zuHause> BR 01 -> 20.2t 10:37:10 <Eddi|zuHause> changed the limits for the colours to 18.5 and 20.8 10:38:56 <Eddi|zuHause> i made the axle weight column with automatic colour 10:40:14 <Ammler> are you aware that those 1tile waggons glitch or is there a patch to apply? 10:40:30 <Eddi|zuHause> yep, they glitch 10:40:33 <planetmaker> we're aware of it 10:40:54 <Eddi|zuHause> a solution is in the works, but not quite there yet 10:41:05 <planetmaker> and... I haven't given eddi's patch a try 10:41:28 <Ammler> what about smaller waggons? 10:41:31 <Eddi|zuHause> the var 60+ patch is not supported in the grf yet ;) 10:41:35 <Ammler> like 80% or so 10:41:54 <planetmaker> smaller in what way? 10:42:21 <Ammler> soemthing between 10:42:40 <Eddi|zuHause> Ammler: actual scale would be another 50% bigger ;) 10:42:47 <Eddi|zuHause> so they are already smaller ;) 10:42:49 *** keky___ [~stefan@p5098b65a.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 10:42:59 *** Blacklite [~Blacklite@76.10.223.136] has quit [Quit: www.sacnr.com] 10:43:32 <Ammler> Eddi|zuHause: you do compare in relation with original set? 10:47:13 <Ammler> (keeping the special scale in mind) 10:47:20 <Eddi|zuHause> Ammler: no, i don't care about the original set 10:48:03 <Eddi|zuHause> Ammler: take the DBSet as example, a passenger wagon is almost the same length as a BR 01, but the BR 01 is twice as long in the game 10:50:57 <Ammler> I had some 4LV feelings as I watched the train going around on my circle :-) 10:53:47 <peter1138> hmm? 10:54:26 *** a1270 [~a1270@72-24-233-98.cpe.cableone.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:55:09 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, indeed, they do have some relation. but imho the 4LV vehicles are too high 10:55:26 <peter1138> so are the screenshots yet? 10:55:29 <Ammler> on the curves, they are nice 10:55:34 <planetmaker> there's a test grf, peter1138 10:55:40 <peter1138> o_O 10:55:49 <Ammler> but climbing tiles and tunnels could use some love :-) 10:56:12 <planetmaker> http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/cets/nightlies/r4/ 10:56:27 <Eddi|zuHause> Ammler: yep, read http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=68&t=53511 and http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=68&t=51697 10:56:59 <planetmaker> which is basically eddi's original implementation as an engine becoming available in 1877 11:02:23 *** a1270 [~a1270@72-24-233-98.cpe.cableone.net] has joined #openttd 11:03:35 <peter1138> hmm, not too bad 11:05:07 <Eddi|zuHause> currently known glitches are: tunnel, bridge, foundation, slope. also sometimes wagons are not drawn in the right order 11:05:15 <JVassie> hmm 11:05:30 <JVassie> sounds to me ike we should also provide support for 'normal' scale ;p 11:05:32 <JVassie> *like 11:05:36 <michi_cc> planetmaker: Shorter wagons might still need the same tricks as the longer wagons. Otherwise mixing short and long wagons will look very weired in curves. 11:06:17 <michi_cc> Or try to patch OpenTTD to eliminate those issues wherever possible :) 11:06:51 <Eddi|zuHause> i fear shorter wagons might suffer from fs#3569-related glitches (point 5 in the above post) 11:07:08 <Eddi|zuHause> because you can't extend the last wagon part to 8lu 11:08:10 <Eddi|zuHause> or shorter wagons consist of one part, and use var45 related to the actual wagon before/after it 11:08:31 <planetmaker> the latter is what I thought of 11:08:49 <Eddi|zuHause> only doesn't work with the last wagon ;) 11:08:59 <Eddi|zuHause> (or the first) 11:09:15 <planetmaker> well... that could get an extra case. 11:09:38 <planetmaker> first and last vehicle of a chain is relatively easily queried for 11:10:10 <Eddi|zuHause> well, it'll be have like the first wagon is always directly straight related to the non-existing wagon 11:10:13 <planetmaker> michi_cc, and patching OpenTTD is indeed an option ;-) 11:11:02 <planetmaker> but this all then needs careful testing. 11:11:43 <Ammler> the ugly thing on the original set are the gaps between waggons, not sure, if I missed the long waggons 11:13:44 <Eddi|zuHause> there are plenty of sets with not-long-wagons ;) 11:13:45 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@i59F6C94A.versanet.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:14:36 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@i59F6D726.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 11:14:39 <planetmaker> s/plenty/only/ ;-) 11:14:48 <Ammler> yes, just mean if wagons are adjacent, do you miss this feature? 11:15:05 <planetmaker> the gaps? 11:15:11 <planetmaker> why should I miss that? 11:15:20 <Ammler> :-P 11:15:31 <Ammler> (the one 1tile wagons) 11:16:16 <Ammler> you don't see single wagons on a new generation train from the newer sets 11:21:47 *** k^^ [~k^^@users192.kollegienet.dk] has joined #openttd 11:28:50 <Sacro> :\ everyone has gone 11:32:11 <Terkhen> :P 11:33:05 <peter1138> why has nobody replaced engines with real-time 3d models yet? 11:44:29 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: intro date of the BR 44 maybe increase to 1937 (that's when series production started), before that, the BR 43 was preferred 11:47:05 *** Amis [~Amis@mail.paks.hu] has joined #openttd 11:50:29 *** ctibor [~quassel@77.48.228.43] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:51:13 *** Blacklite [~Blacklite@76.10.223.136] has joined #openttd 11:52:35 *** ctibor [~quassel@77.48.228.43] has joined #openttd 11:52:40 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 12:05:21 *** Neon [~Neon@dslb-094-219-026-104.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 12:06:51 <planetmaker> ok :-) I haven't yet looked thoroughly at balancing and intro dates in the post ~1920 era 12:09:05 <Eddi|zuHause> the idea sounded so good to me that i just did it ;) 12:09:41 *** Chruker [~no@5634a56d.rev.stofanet.dk] has joined #openttd 12:11:12 <JVassie> lol 12:16:49 <planetmaker> :-) excellent 12:20:48 <Eddi|zuHause> something doesn't sound right: engine with additional tender: 57t, almost identical engine with builtin tender: 74t 12:21:06 *** k^^ [~k^^@users192.kollegienet.dk] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep] 12:21:06 <Eddi|zuHause> maybe they forgot the additional tender in the weight 12:21:19 <planetmaker> in the first case? Probably 12:21:45 <planetmaker> because a separate vehicle doesn't add to the vehicles mass itself and its axle weight 12:21:59 <Eddi|zuHause> but the total weight that must be moved 12:22:08 <planetmaker> as do all other wagons 12:22:10 <Eddi|zuHause> (and braked) 12:22:31 <planetmaker> but different tenders may be used, so it might not make too much sense to include an arbitrary one 12:23:04 <planetmaker> while a built-in is clearly part of the vehicle and has well-defined properties 12:23:05 <Eddi|zuHause> tender carries 16m³ water, 6t coal, and weighs something itself 12:23:34 <planetmaker> thus like 25 ... 30t 12:23:45 *** bdavenport [~bdavenpor@mail.companioncabinet.com] has joined #openttd 12:25:10 <Eddi|zuHause> i'll just add 30 to the number then... should be good enough ;) 12:25:42 <Eddi|zuHause> (or keep it like it is, and check if that was done to the other engines as well, where it isn't that apparent?) 12:27:40 <planetmaker> I'd add the weight and check others 12:27:41 <Eddi|zuHause> i don't think the other engines did it like this, they have empty and full mass given 12:29:21 <michi_cc> Eddi|zuHause: What about http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/DRG-Baureihe_86 for a light cargo engine, that category is a bit thin right now. Problem is though that this would give a slight engine bunching around 1928 (and the electrics add to that as well). OTOH, the engines fall into three different axle weights, so it might be okay here. 12:29:40 <Eddi|zuHause> michi_cc: i wasn't that far yet 12:31:11 <michi_cc> NP, I was just looking for something for the light cargo category. I'm going to add it to the engine list anyway, core/ext/whatever can come later. 12:31:58 <planetmaker> :-) 12:37:12 *** k^^ [~k^^@users192.kollegienet.dk] has joined #openttd 12:39:31 <Eddi|zuHause> i'm not quite content with choosing the T18 12:40:05 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:9559:979a:419e:9308] has joined #openttd 12:40:08 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 12:44:56 <planetmaker> what's wrong about it? 12:45:43 *** ashledombos [~ashledomb@marvin-18-230.cnt.nerim.net] has joined #openttd 12:47:57 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@94.142.234.1] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:49:02 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@94.142.234.1] has joined #openttd 13:01:06 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 13:06:09 <Belugas> hello 13:18:25 *** Juo [~Juo@87-194-64-202.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:22:20 *** Juo [~Juo@87-194-64-202.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 13:24:46 *** Juo [~Juo@87-194-64-202.bethere.co.uk] has quit [] 13:24:59 *** Juo [~Juo@87-194-64-202.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 13:28:07 *** Chris_Booth [~chatzilla@cpc7-newt30-2-0-cust37.newt.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 13:33:11 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@94.142.234.1] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:51:22 <JVassie> whats the greyish background colour on the timeline Eddi|zuHause? 13:51:42 <Eddi|zuHause> that's a blue-ish colour 13:51:52 <JVassie> oh :p 13:51:53 <JVassie> kk 13:52:10 <JVassie> and the different shades indicate? 13:52:20 *** TWerkhoven [~twerkhove@cpc14-linl7-2-0-cust28.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 13:53:40 *** Devroush [~dennis@ip-213-49-109-213.dsl.scarlet.be] has joined #openttd 13:54:57 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@94.142.234.1] has joined #openttd 13:55:17 <michi_cc> JVassie: look at the top row :) 13:55:31 <JVassie> those are the different colours 13:55:32 <JVassie> :p 13:55:43 <JVassie> im just wondering why some of the greens are lighter than others 13:55:45 <JVassie> for example 13:56:46 *** Amis [~Amis@mail.paks.hu] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:57:55 <michi_cc> Because a different colour is easier to differentiate. 13:58:06 <JVassie> gotcha :) 13:58:12 *** Intexon [~Intexon@blk-222-147-135.eastlink.ca] has joined #openttd 14:02:17 *** Guest5638 is now known as AD 14:02:49 *** AD is now known as Guest5664 14:06:14 *** Guest5664 [wilberforc@drinks.mountaindew.org] has quit [Quit: leaving] 14:08:50 *** AD [wilberforc@drinks.mountaindew.org] has joined #openttd 14:09:41 <planetmaker> nice progress on the timeline chart :-) 14:09:57 <Eddi|zuHause> yep, looking good :) 14:12:33 <JVassie> :) 14:13:37 <JVassie> also Eddi|zuHause; why the vertical line dividign Express into tow? 14:13:40 <JVassie> *two 14:14:08 <Eddi|zuHause> what line? 14:14:23 <JVassie> i see 3 columns in the timeline for express 14:14:36 <JVassie> there is a vertical lien between the 2nd and 3rd columns 14:17:46 *** sllide [~jari@ip565eb113.direct-adsl.nl] has joined #openttd 14:21:57 *** pugi [~pugi@p4FCC583B.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 14:23:38 <michi_cc> Now there isn't :) 14:25:26 <JVassie> yeah i fixed it :p 14:25:38 <JVassie> couldnt see a need for it 14:28:36 <Eddi|zuHause> i'm fairly sure i removed that line when i added the column, and it didn't show up here 14:29:02 *** mksen [~mks@c83-176-234-98.cust.tele2.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:30:46 *** Mucht [~Martin@chello084115143107.3.graz.surfer.at] has joined #openttd 14:35:01 *** ZirconiumX [561b9caa@ircip2.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 14:35:22 <ZirconiumX> meh - haven't been here for a while 14:35:24 <ZirconiumX> hello all 14:36:07 <ZirconiumX> I come with a programming question - and to haunt 14:36:08 *** Mks [~mks@c83-176-234-98.cust.tele2.se] has joined #openttd 14:36:20 <ZirconiumX> what is the ideal amount of assertions 14:36:34 <ZirconiumX> and how do you use an assertion 14:37:11 *** Br33z4hSlut5 [~static.kp@92.68.154.34] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:38:47 *** Pulec [~pulec@static-cl093181068250.unet.cz] has joined #openttd 14:41:26 * ZirconiumX appears to be talking to a brick wall 14:41:35 * ZirconiumX talks to the one to his right 14:43:22 <Terkhen> ideal amount of assertions = one for each place that requires an assertion 14:43:32 <planetmaker> :-) 14:43:37 <ZirconiumX> ok... 14:43:45 <michi_cc> Eddi|zuHause: Another railtype? ;) 14:43:52 <Eddi|zuHause> yep ;) 14:43:54 <planetmaker> assert(patient > sufficient) 14:43:54 <Terkhen> http://www.cplusplus.com/reference/clibrary/cassert/assert/ <--- and for their uses 14:43:59 <Eddi|zuHause> i'm thinking two, actually 14:43:59 <ZirconiumX> what the heck is an assertion other than an annoying error 14:44:10 <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause, what for? 14:44:14 <Terkhen> openttd assertions probably does not follow those rules though 14:44:20 <Eddi|zuHause> 3rd rail 14:44:22 <Terkhen> ZirconiumX: errors that should never be triggered 14:44:33 <Terkhen> if they are triggered, then either the assertion is wrong or your code is wrong 14:44:35 <planetmaker> hm... :-S 14:44:38 <Eddi|zuHause> one "light" (either A or B) and one "heavy" (C) 14:45:53 <__ln__> http://mashable.com/2011/06/22/lytro/ 14:45:58 <michi_cc> I'd use only one axle weight and instead include a 3rd + catenary. Two axle weights only make sense if there are several engines at the same time. 14:46:11 <Eddi|zuHause> i don't think combined 3rd-rail+catenary is too realistic 14:46:47 <ZirconiumX> @calc 8*16 14:46:48 <DorpsGek> ZirconiumX: 128 14:46:54 <ZirconiumX> thank DorpsGEk 14:47:13 <ZirconiumX> thanks DorpsGek / village idiot in dutch 14:47:31 <Eddi|zuHause> michi_cc: for example the "Wannseebahn" had 3rd rail on the commuter track, and on the long-distance track, to allow the express-trains (ET125) with 120km/h to overtake the other trains with 80km/h 14:48:25 <planetmaker> well. We IMHO we should not need a separate track type for 3rd rail. That label is already there 14:48:33 <Eddi|zuHause> the commuter track would then use the A3 railtype, since they are not heavy at all, and the long-distance would use C3, because it is shared with heavy trains 14:48:40 <planetmaker> thus we can resort to existing track types there 14:49:56 <Eddi|zuHause> that's probably true, but is irrelevant to the discussion ;) 14:49:56 *** k^^ [~k^^@users192.kollegienet.dk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:50:45 <michi_cc> Okay, that makes sense, so the question is more if that is really needed from a gameplay POV. 14:53:08 <JVassie> There arent many german 3rd rail sets are there? 14:53:17 <JVassie> aside from sbahn 14:53:48 <Eddi|zuHause> only S-Bahn Hamburg and S-Bahn Berlin 14:53:49 *** k^^ [~k^^@users192.kollegienet.dk] has joined #openttd 14:54:16 <JVassie> mmm, they 14:54:23 <JVassie> operate as seperate metro systems entirely 14:54:29 *** zachanima [~zach@2506ds3-od.0.fullrate.dk] has joined #openttd 14:56:21 *** zachanim1 [~zach@2506ds3-od.0.fullrate.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:56:45 *** Belugas [~belugas@216.191.111.237] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:56:49 <Yexo> peter1138: what would be the best way to make an engine run on railtype A if it's available but on railtype B if A is not available? 14:57:24 <Yexo> currently I'm thinking of writing a different value to the railtypetable depending on the availability of A and always using the same index 14:58:53 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, that was the original thought 14:59:26 *** Belugas [~belugas@216.191.111.237] has joined #openttd 14:59:29 *** mode/#openttd [+o Belugas] by ChanServ 14:59:40 <ZirconiumX> hello Belugas 14:59:54 <Belugas> i was not gone, i just changed the water of the pool :) 14:59:57 <Yexo> ok, thanks eddi 15:05:32 *** Amis [~Amis@dsl51B65519.pool.t-online.hu] has joined #openttd 15:07:03 <Eddi|zuHause> there's water and electricity coming from the sky 15:07:30 <Belugas> pick up your camera and shoot! 15:08:48 <michi_cc> Yexo: http://wiki.openttd.org/Peter1138/Railtypes#Railtype_fallbacks 15:09:51 <Yexo> I'll be using action6, as the action7 approach outlined there doesn't work if you want to test multiple railtypes apart from eachother 15:10:03 <Yexo> you'd end up with 2**num_railtypes actions 15:12:09 <Eddi|zuHause> that sounds like a good idea 15:12:45 <Eddi|zuHause> bah... there's like two dozen different diesel railcars in the 1930's 15:13:56 <Eddi|zuHause> but all only in small quantities, so none really stick out as "core" 15:15:55 <Eddi|zuHause> and they don't have proper numbers, either 15:17:30 <planetmaker> the action6 approach sounds indeed much more flexible 15:17:31 <michi_cc> Pick something that fits into the holes :) Local/commuter could still use a bit more whereas express is quite full already. 15:17:45 <planetmaker> which actually... I should do such a thing for OpenGFX+ Trains ;-) 15:18:47 <Yexo> planetmaker: not possible yet, needs implementation in nml :) 15:19:10 <planetmaker> :-) 15:19:31 <planetmaker> though I wonder which railtypes I want to test against 15:19:43 <dihedral> lol - potential customer is planing a new website ... "we expect to have about 350 requests per second" 15:20:35 <planetmaker> @calc 350 * 86400 15:20:36 <DorpsGek> planetmaker: 30240000 15:20:42 <planetmaker> wow. 3 million per day 15:20:49 <Eddi|zuHause> 30 million 15:20:57 <planetmaker> indeed 15:21:03 <peter1138> yeah, the fallback approach works when you don't have 5 million types 15:24:38 <planetmaker> good we have action6 ;-) 15:29:30 *** Lakie [~Lakie@82.152.164.38] has joined #openttd 15:30:51 <Terkhen> :) 15:31:27 * ZirconiumX has done epic switch...case fallthrough 15:31:54 <JVassie> dihedral: whats the website for? 15:32:03 <JVassie> some sort of ecommerce outfit i guess? 15:32:04 *** bryjen [~bryjen@76.92.85.169] has joined #openttd 15:35:05 <JVassie> Eddi|zuHause: whats your thoughts on sets from sbahn berlin and sbahn hamburg, should we set the company to SBahn Berlin and SBahn Hamburg respectively? Or as theyre both subsiduaries of DB jsut use that? 15:35:40 <Eddi|zuHause> JVassie: keep them as DRG, and disable if no 3rd rail type is available 15:35:58 <JVassie> gotcha 15:36:03 <JVassie> ill start adding them as entries 15:36:12 <JVassie> will give the set some nice early commuter options 15:36:17 <Eddi|zuHause> "company"/"region" is meant as a selector for the different epoch sets 15:36:26 <Eddi|zuHause> so don't do too many of them 15:36:33 <Eddi|zuHause> combine them if applicable 15:36:49 <Eddi|zuHause> e.g. "swiss" instead of "SBB" 15:36:59 <JVassie> so merge SBB and BLS? 15:37:14 <Eddi|zuHause> or use "swiss,SBB" and "swiss,BLS" 15:37:28 <Eddi|zuHause> so you can choose either, or "all swiss" in the epoch selector 15:37:35 <JVassie> right gotcha 15:37:56 <JVassie> ill just set company of these sbahn sets to DRG then 15:38:00 <JVassie> if that keeps it simpler 15:40:09 *** ashledombos [~ashledomb@marvin-18-230.cnt.nerim.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:40:14 <Sacro> I need a new mail cilent that supports exchange and isn't Outlook 15:40:32 *** Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.A98.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #openttd 15:41:24 <JVassie> Outlook works fine with exchange 15:44:48 <Sacro> I want a threaded view 15:44:54 <Sacro> Outlook doesn't provide one 15:46:44 *** murr4y [~murray@229.84-48-69.nextgentel.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:48:25 <JVassie> berlin + hamburg sbahn sets added 15:48:27 <JVassie> 3 a piece 15:48:40 <JVassie> oh derp 15:48:45 <JVassie> ignore that 15:50:44 <Sacro> herp derp 15:51:17 <dihedral> my boss did not believe me when i said what kind of traffic i would expect from those calculations 15:51:25 <dihedral> he said he'd give them 200GB/Month :-D 15:51:34 <dihedral> i had a laugh and did have to shake my head :-P 15:52:21 *** Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.A98.priv.bahnhof.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:52:40 <JVassie> haha 15:54:01 <Terkhen> :D 15:54:45 *** ZirconiumX [561b9caa@ircip2.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 15:57:06 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B7351F.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:57:26 <Yexo> planetmaker: not possible yet, needs implementation in nml :) 15:58:45 <planetmaker> hu? 15:58:53 <planetmaker> the railtype action6? Yes, I know 15:58:54 <Yexo> sorry, up+enter in the wrong window 15:59:15 <planetmaker> :-) 16:09:16 *** fjb [~frank@p5DDFFD89.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:17:41 *** fjb [~frank@p5DDFFD89.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 16:20:44 *** Prof_Frink [~proffrink@5e0f84fe.bb.sky.com] has joined #openttd 16:27:16 <caracal> i keep seeing "tourists" on some cost graphs, which i assume are a type of "passenger", but ... where do they come from? where do they (want to) go? 16:28:07 <caracal> in simutrans, there were specific "tourist attractions" that were pretty much like normal industries, but i haven't found the equivalent in ottd yet 16:28:35 <planetmaker> you need to play with the ecs newgrfs. 16:28:49 <planetmaker> One of them (towns vector? base vector?) provides them 16:30:27 <caracal> ah, more newgrf stuff ... which you told me must be selected in advance, before a scenario is even designed 16:31:46 <caracal> i just checked ... this scenario (sw usa) calls for town vector, but that one doesn't seem to be available for download 16:32:02 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: TschÃŒÃ] 16:34:15 *** ar3k [~ident@eca155.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #openttd 16:34:31 *** bodis [~bodis@cpc3-ando3-0-0-cust781.15-1.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 16:37:01 <caracal> so the scenario is just messed up, outdated, whatever 16:37:13 *** sallan [~0a0a6567@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 16:37:29 *** sallan [~0a0a6567@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [] 16:38:05 *** ar3kaw [~ident@ecn206.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:38:52 <planetmaker> and you tried to find the missing files from the file load dialogue, did you? 16:38:58 <caracal> yes 16:39:13 <caracal> it lists a half dozen, all red-tagged, and says "these aren't available" 16:39:50 <caracal> clearly scenario design, or at least maintenance, isn't a priority in the ottd community <g> 16:39:52 <planetmaker> then you're probably screwed unless you find that version elsewhere.... or again enable the scenario_developer and allow a (more or less) compatible version of the same newgrf to fill in 16:39:59 <planetmaker> oh. Then it's... a pain. 16:40:36 <planetmaker> it's missing good tools And that scenario pre-dates probably the online content 16:40:51 <caracal> apparently yes 16:49:07 *** devilsadvocate [~quassel@109.200.19.188] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:55:10 *** Devroush [~dennis@ip-213-49-109-213.dsl.scarlet.be] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:01:43 *** supermop [~daniel_er@rrcs-72-43-171-87.nyc.biz.rr.com] has joined #openttd 17:02:19 *** sllide [~jari@ip565eb113.direct-adsl.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:05:03 *** Juo [~Juo@87-194-64-202.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: Juo] 17:13:02 *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@d5152B25B.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 17:19:22 *** TheMask96 [martijn@lust.vhost.ne2000.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:24:46 *** TheMask96 [martijn@envy.vhost.ne2000.nl] has joined #openttd 17:27:17 *** Samwelnella [~wircer@mobile-198-228-224-019.mycingular.net] has joined #openttd 17:28:35 *** Samwelnella [~wircer@mobile-198-228-224-019.mycingular.net] has left #openttd [] 17:28:37 *** devilsadvocate [~quassel@109.200.19.188] has joined #openttd 17:29:20 *** murr4y [~murray@229.84-48-69.nextgentel.com] has joined #openttd 17:29:45 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590fc59c.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 17:33:14 *** ashledombos [~ashledomb@ris91-2-82-227-26-30.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #openttd 17:40:26 *** dfox_ [~dfox@ip-94-113-17-246.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 17:41:36 *** dfox [~dfox@ip-94-113-17-246.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:43:37 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B7320C.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 17:44:33 *** Mucht [~Martin@chello084115143107.3.graz.surfer.at] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:44:35 <Eddi|zuHause> please excuse this unscheduled downtime 17:45:10 <supermop> i will not. it is unexcusable 17:45:28 <Eddi|zuHause> we used this downtime to do some necessary maintenance work, to ensure further excellent service 17:47:44 <Eddi|zuHause> so, whatcha screwed up in the mean time? 17:48:15 <planetmaker> I'm afraid, time stood still without your presence ;-) 17:49:41 <SpComb> excuse me 17:50:51 *** Pixa [~Pixa@85.210.75.24] has joined #openttd 17:51:08 <Eddi|zuHause> one can really not leave you people alone... damn 17:54:20 *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@d5152B25B.access.telenet.be] has quit [Quit: oO] 17:54:50 *** keky___ [~stefan@p5098b65a.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 17:56:54 <michi_cc> Eddi|zuHause: I moved the E44 to universal because WP says that it was designed as such (and has a pic with passenger wagons) 17:57:06 <Eddi|zuHause> alright 18:00:46 <Eddi|zuHause> we could maybe join the different SVT into one, with refit options to 2,3 or 4 wagons? 18:01:01 <Eddi|zuHause> the express diesel ones 18:01:37 <planetmaker> probably, yes 18:01:51 <planetmaker> probably also a good idea :-) 18:02:39 <Eddi|zuHause> they don't fit in the table 18:06:30 *** KouDy [~KouDy@ip-78-102-233-119.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:09:19 *** KouDy [~KouDy@ip-78-102-233-119.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 18:10:48 *** amkoroew [~matze@p5B106D78.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 18:14:24 *** Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.A98.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #openttd 18:18:01 *** murr5y [~murray@229.84-48-69.nextgentel.com] has joined #openttd 18:24:17 *** murr4y [~murray@229.84-48-69.nextgentel.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:30:51 *** murr5y is now known as murr4y 18:32:55 *** Juo [~Juo@cpc11-acto2-2-0-cust244.4-2.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 18:41:14 *** Juo [~Juo@cpc11-acto2-2-0-cust244.4-2.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: Juo] 18:46:57 *** enr1x [~kiike@62.57.225.29.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #openttd 18:47:52 <Eddi|zuHause> i think DRG/Epoch 2 is now complete 18:50:35 *** Hyronymus [~chatzilla@s53757898.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #openttd 18:53:30 <Hyronymus> evening 18:54:31 <planetmaker> hello Hyronymus 18:54:36 <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause, good news :-) 18:54:48 <michi_cc> Eddi|zuHause: Not sure what to pick, but there should be something non-electric for passengers after 1942 18:54:50 <planetmaker> seems though that VOne ignores us 18:54:53 <Eddi|zuHause> for epoch 3/4: do we make separate timelines for DR/DB? or focus on one first? 18:55:18 <planetmaker> IMHO we should consider them separately 18:55:20 <Eddi|zuHause> michi_cc: i was thinking making the BR22 appear earlier, since it was a DRG design, just not completed 18:55:39 <Eddi|zuHause> and P10 longer, obviously 18:55:48 <planetmaker> personally I'd opt to priorize DR as that does not yet exist 18:57:47 <michi_cc> Regardless of of DR/DB, we should do one complete timeline first (i.e. continue the existing prussian, DRG one). 18:59:07 <michi_cc> And related to the P10, every engine that was just built 3-4 years needs to get some extension, otherwise gone faster than you can buy any. 18:59:57 <Eddi|zuHause> http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/DRB-Baureihe_23 <- this, probably a good idea 19:00:28 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc18-aztw25-2-0-cust185.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 19:00:37 <Eddi|zuHause> one of those "would be more, if there wasn't war" 19:01:19 <andythenorth> errrp 19:01:30 <andythenorth> + wheerrrrrp 19:01:32 <Eddi|zuHause> http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/DB-Baureihe_23 <-- probably join with this one 19:01:36 <andythenorth> + hello 19:02:07 <planetmaker> hello andythenorth 19:03:48 <andythenorth> Yexo: someone has asked me about 'bare tile' stations for CHIPS 19:03:58 <andythenorth> iirc, we discussed that, and it's either not possible, or TMWFTLB? 19:04:49 <andythenorth> or maybe that was something else 19:05:25 <michi_cc> Eddi|zuHause: Indeed, that one looks quite good as a "war gap" filler. 19:05:39 <planetmaker> andythenorth, what is a 'bare tile' station? 19:06:03 <planetmaker> to me it sounds like the cargo tiles with tracks which are already there 19:06:13 <andythenorth> looks like a track tile 19:06:25 <andythenorth> "a void platform, a piece of track without anything but the underlying grass/desert/etc. as a station tile" 19:06:33 *** enr1x [~kiike@62.57.225.29.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:07:04 <planetmaker> definitely possible. But... relatively boring, eh? 19:08:13 <Eddi|zuHause> NewStations has such an empty tile, but it has no railtype-support 19:08:22 <Eddi|zuHause> well, it has, but is unreleased :p 19:08:24 <andythenorth> that is why I am being asked about it 19:08:44 <andythenorth> I may be mistaken, but I think there was a problem doing it with full terrain support + new tracks 19:08:53 <andythenorth> don't see why, but I'm not very familiar with station spec 19:09:00 <Eddi|zuHause> michi_cc: looks better now? 19:09:31 *** enr1x [~kiike@62.57.225.29.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #openttd 19:10:42 <michi_cc> Eddi|zuHause: Yes, looks quite okay. Passenger engines ar still a bit thin, but that should be okay by stretching the buy period a bit. 19:14:00 <Eddi|zuHause> some realism oddity: the 01.10 (1939) goes 150, but the 01.5 (1962) only 130 19:15:19 <Chris_Booth> Eddi|zuHause: better loading times? acceleration? so its better at short runs? 19:15:45 <Eddi|zuHause> Chris_Booth: the DR just didn't have the capability to run fast trains post-war 19:16:24 <Eddi|zuHause> except on one test track, where they needed 180km/h locomotives, the top speed was generally 120km/h 19:17:00 <Chris_Booth> DR? 19:17:06 <planetmaker> GDR railways 19:17:14 <Chris_Booth> oh 19:17:16 <Hyronymus> planetmaker: are NML files already allowed on the forum? 19:17:20 <planetmaker> yes 19:17:25 <Hyronymus> ok :) 19:17:47 <Hyronymus> guess you'll have to wait for Owen to be bored from Australia though 19:17:48 <planetmaker> at least I think I asked for that already ;-) 19:18:03 <planetmaker> yes, probably. It's nothing urgent, but there it won't be forgotten 19:18:56 <michi_cc> It took a loooooong time to get back to the pre-WWII travel time on Berlin-Hamburg. 19:19:09 <planetmaker> like mid 1990s, right? 19:20:01 <michi_cc> 1997 or so 19:21:07 * andythenorth has turned into a bad person 19:23:16 <planetmaker> what happened, andythenorth ? ;-) 19:23:28 <andythenorth> I am tempted to troll lego forums 19:23:32 <andythenorth> I didn't :P 19:23:58 <andythenorth> I tried hanging out in those communities for last year or so 19:23:58 <planetmaker> :-D 19:24:03 <andythenorth> I don't really get on with them 19:24:09 <andythenorth> I like lego, I don't like lego communities 19:24:37 <planetmaker> :-) 19:24:46 <planetmaker> This community is pretty good indeed 19:25:51 <andythenorth> lego community is full of people whining 19:25:58 <planetmaker> that sucks 19:25:59 <Hyronymus> must be the age 19:26:18 <andythenorth> yeah 19:26:22 <andythenorth> men in their thirties :P 19:26:29 <planetmaker> :-P 19:26:37 <Terkhen> what are they whining about? 19:26:46 * andythenorth ponders 19:26:56 <andythenorth> I think the meta issue is that lego is an odd system 19:26:56 <Hyronymus> hey! nothing wrong with being a man in your 30's 19:27:12 <Hyronymus> lol, meta issue 19:27:17 <andythenorth> as a system for creating things, lego is hugely flexible 19:27:26 <andythenorth> but you can't hack it :P 19:27:30 <planetmaker> :-) 19:27:33 <andythenorth> bit weird now I think about it 19:27:34 <planetmaker> it needs a flexible mind 19:27:46 <planetmaker> and it depends on the definition of "hack" 19:27:54 <andythenorth> modding parts 19:28:06 <andythenorth> using third party parts 19:28:07 <andythenorth> etc 19:28:15 <planetmaker> become more flexible :-P 19:28:23 <andythenorth> well that's my approach 19:28:42 <andythenorth> but many people rely on Lego group to 'give them what they want' 19:28:45 <planetmaker> but modding lego might be interpreted as 'that's not lego anymore' 19:28:49 <andythenorth> and they have two standard whines 19:29:04 <andythenorth> 1. "all lego is driven by marketing research" 19:29:12 <planetmaker> *gasp* 19:29:16 <andythenorth> 2. "lego never ask their fans nor meet their needs" 19:29:23 <planetmaker> lol 19:29:26 * andythenorth doesn't like hanging out with retards 19:29:39 <andythenorth> 1 != 2? 19:29:57 <planetmaker> it's two different things 19:30:13 <planetmaker> It's the same like we never listen to our users. Nor do we meet our players demands ;-) 19:30:23 <planetmaker> We just do *stuff* 19:30:27 <planetmaker> Just like you ;-) 19:30:41 * Terkhen finds those complains kind of familiar 19:30:46 <planetmaker> ^^ :-) 19:31:15 <Terkhen> s/marketing research/never doing what whoever asked things that should be done/ 19:31:24 <Terkhen> thinks* 19:31:42 <Terkhen> people don't seem to mind modding (patches) though 19:32:07 <andythenorth> anyway 19:32:22 <andythenorth> it (lego) will become interesting when 3D printers are more common 19:32:28 <andythenorth> already people are printing lego parts 19:32:35 <andythenorth> it will make lego system open source 19:32:42 <planetmaker> :-D 19:32:43 <andythenorth> dunno what lego group will do about that 19:32:49 <planetmaker> 3D printers are quite nice 19:32:59 <andythenorth> copyright is hard to enforce, unless 3D printers have DRM in 19:33:10 <andythenorth> one of my friends is getting a 3D printed wedding 19:33:11 <andythenorth> ring 19:33:26 <planetmaker> you can't enforce a printer to not print an arbitrary piece of lego... 19:33:49 <andythenorth> with enough computing power you could... 19:33:55 <andythenorth> pattern matching... 19:34:22 <planetmaker> those people using them for rapid prototyping will LOVE it 19:34:40 <andythenorth> they are quite cool 19:34:50 <andythenorth> already in this city, Airbus are printing airplane parts with them 19:34:55 <andythenorth> *large* airplane parts 19:35:16 <planetmaker> he 19:35:33 <Terkhen> oooh, that sounds interesting :) 19:36:09 <andythenorth> http://www.popsci.com/technology/article/2011-02/using-3-d-printing-tech-eads-wants-print-out-entire-aircraft-wing 19:36:12 <planetmaker> I wonder... those 3D printer output is a kind of dust with glue... 19:36:44 <andythenorth> http://www.gizmag.com/eads-bristol-announces-nylon-airbike-manufactured-by-alm-technology/18094/ 19:36:52 <andythenorth> titanium in airbus case 19:37:26 <andythenorth> hmm 19:37:29 <planetmaker> he, that *is* interesting technique 19:37:29 <andythenorth> maybe I buy one: http://www.hp3dprinting.co.uk/?gclid=COCiyeqhyqkCFYpB4QodXEi5Ng 19:37:42 <andythenorth> maybe I print pixel art 19:38:16 * andythenorth ponders printing ottd :P 19:38:19 <andythenorth> somehow 19:38:22 <planetmaker> I wonder what the 100g of 'ink' cost 19:38:46 <Terkhen> :P 19:39:07 <Terkhen> (cost of normal printer ink) ** 3 19:39:19 <planetmaker> I mean... I 'play' with dust which costs in the range of 100g = 1000 ... 5000⬠19:39:52 <planetmaker> but that's no use for printing and is just plain sand chemically speaking ;-) 19:40:11 <andythenorth> my friend was a phd student 19:40:24 <andythenorth> she was making gears by depositing individual crystals 19:40:29 <andythenorth> nudged into place with lasers 19:40:49 * andythenorth doesn't do that :P 19:41:47 *** KritiK [~Maxim@95-27-219-109.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd 19:46:00 *** Zuu_ [~Zuu@h-114-141.A98.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #openttd 19:47:28 * andythenorth ponders doing some game 19:55:26 *** Twerkhoven[L] [~twerkhove@cpc14-linl7-2-0-cust28.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 19:56:29 <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause: so.. whom should we recruit as sprite artist? Or is in this channel anyone person daring to take on the trains of central Europe? 19:58:07 <michi_cc> Not me :) At least definitely not for anything more than pushing two or three pixels around 19:58:18 <planetmaker> :-) 19:58:22 *** Juo [~Juo@cpc11-acto2-2-0-cust244.4-2.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 19:58:25 <planetmaker> Though we could well start without sprites 19:58:41 <planetmaker> like... green and blue boxes driving around 19:58:53 <planetmaker> with a puff of smoke or an electric spark emitted from the first one... 19:58:56 <Eddi|zuHause> good test for the templates ;) 19:59:12 <planetmaker> indeed 20:01:25 <michi_cc> Maybe we should patch OpenTTD first :) I was wondering how hard it would be to implement non-bending articulated vehicles natively. If we could then use three sprites for each wagon, most glitches should be gone. 20:01:52 <Terkhen> use coloured boxes, the first person that gets annoyed by the boxes is promoted to sprite artist 20:02:35 <Terkhen> and IIRC there was an extensive post about the issues at the long road vehicles thread 20:03:20 <planetmaker> oh, eddi has an extensive post on the issues with this very thing about trains ;-) 20:04:17 <Terkhen> ok :) 20:04:50 <Eddi|zuHause> michi_cc: http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=68&t=53511 and http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=68&t=51697 20:04:51 <andythenorth> planetmaker: you could try and recruit DanMacK 20:05:01 <andythenorth> I am worried he has lost his mojo :( 20:05:17 <andythenorth> but probably he is over-committed, and a new project is the last thing he needs :( 20:05:37 <andythenorth> recruit Pikka! 20:05:43 <andythenorth> recruit MB! 20:05:51 <Eddi|zuHause> currently unsolved is the part of Extra-Callback-Info being set when called from a GUI (vehicle details, vehicle list) 20:05:56 <andythenorth> neko can actually draw it turns out 20:06:38 <Terkhen> there is someone who can draw missing from your volunteer list, andythenorth :P 20:06:45 <andythenorth> ?? 20:06:47 <Eddi|zuHause> i'm not sure i'd be able to survive that many intensive conversations with neko... 20:06:58 <Terkhen> :D 20:07:10 <andythenorth> frick 20:07:17 <Eddi|zuHause> why does "Personenwagen der GÃŒterwagenbauart" sound so evil... 20:07:22 <andythenorth> now I have to remember to switch FIRS branch :P 20:08:33 <andythenorth> how do I ensure I'm at the head of the branch? 20:08:36 <planetmaker> he... sometimes ignorance could be a blessing, I guess 20:08:45 <planetmaker> hg up, andythenorth 20:08:56 <planetmaker> it doesn't update accross branches 20:09:01 <andythenorth> I did hg up 'branch(default)' 20:09:21 <andythenorth> hg branch tells me 'default' 20:09:27 <andythenorth> but hg tip tells me 0.6 20:09:35 <andythenorth> which is ok? 20:09:40 <planetmaker> that's ok. As the last commit was there 20:09:43 <planetmaker> tip = last commit 20:09:49 <andythenorth> good 20:09:52 <andythenorth> that's as should be then 20:09:54 <planetmaker> hg parent 20:10:09 <andythenorth> yep that's all fine then 20:10:11 <andythenorth> no drama 20:10:14 <planetmaker> :-) 20:11:16 <Eddi|zuHause> "hg heads" may be interesting 20:11:24 <andythenorth> yarp 20:13:05 <andythenorth> grr 20:13:09 <andythenorth> I need a new photostrop 20:16:17 <Terkhen> why? 20:18:04 <andythenorth> crash 20:18:08 <andythenorth> photostop 20:18:36 *** Amis [~Amis@dsl51B65519.pool.t-online.hu] has quit [Quit: *pop*] 20:19:34 <Terkhen> oh :( 20:24:40 <Terkhen> good night 20:25:38 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: i'm fairly sure now that weight is usually given without the extra tender 20:25:52 <planetmaker> good night Terkhen 20:26:42 <andythenorth> change the tender weight according to distance travelled :P 20:27:04 <andythenorth> cb36 probably can't do that :P 20:27:43 <planetmaker> interesting, Eddi|zuHause 20:28:48 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: and make speed = 1/3 when it's empty? :p 20:29:28 <Eddi|zuHause> i think trains need a "turn around" time 20:29:56 <Eddi|zuHause> so engines which can go same speed backwards have lower time 20:30:27 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: speed = 1/6 when it's empty :P 20:30:31 <Eddi|zuHause> and push/pull service is fastest 20:31:11 <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause: in the time chart: are that still real times or already some game-play adjusted? 20:31:21 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: those are still real 20:31:24 <planetmaker> ok 20:32:00 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: gameplay would probably best if an engine is at least available until the next of the same category 20:32:41 <planetmaker> of course 20:32:53 <planetmaker> I just wondered :-) 20:33:01 *** bdavenport [~bdavenpor@mail.companioncabinet.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:33:43 <michi_cc> I'd say some gaps are quite okay, to provide a bit of a challenge that you don't always have the perfect engine. Obviously, the gaps can't be too big. 20:35:39 <planetmaker> some yes, we have 6 or 7 categories. But sometimes the gaps are at the same time 20:38:16 <michi_cc> Sure, just like an engine that can only be bought 2-3 years is useless. 20:39:03 <planetmaker> quite 20:39:31 *** Zeknurn [~lasershoc@hd9483b29.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:39:56 *** Zeknurn [~lasershoc@hd9483b29.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has joined #openttd 20:44:37 *** Zuu_ [~Zuu@h-114-141.A98.priv.bahnhof.se] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:44:58 *** enr1x [~kiike@62.57.225.29.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Quit: leaving] 20:48:00 *** Zeknurn [~lasershoc@hd9483b29.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:57:43 *** Juo [~Juo@cpc11-acto2-2-0-cust244.4-2.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: Juo] 20:59:17 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 21:02:23 *** repiwm [~repiwm@vatapa.cinbesa.com.br] has joined #openttd 21:03:22 *** Juo [~Juo@cpc11-acto2-2-0-cust244.4-2.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 21:05:25 *** repiwm [~repiwm@vatapa.cinbesa.com.br] has quit [Quit: Saindo] 21:10:18 <Yexo> andythenorth: the problem for a bare station tile is indeed climate support 21:10:18 *** Hyronymus [~chatzilla@s53757898.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:10:33 <andythenorth> it can't be done? Or it's tmwftlb? 21:10:42 <Yexo> the "ground tile" for stations has to be some default tile, otherwise it doesn't work with railtypes 21:10:55 <Yexo> that means that if you want snow/desert etc. you have to create an overlay with just snow/desert 21:11:11 <Yexo> but having the overlay in the newgrf means you can't properly support both the TTD baseset and OpenGFX 21:11:17 <Yexo> you'll have to chose either one 21:11:24 <andythenorth> we can't switch the ground tile depending on terrain? (like industries) 21:11:42 <Yexo> the ground tile can't be switched, there is a static value that has to be used or railtypes don't work 21:11:57 <andythenorth> no branching to alternative layout? 21:12:13 <andythenorth> that's how FIRS does it for forests etc 21:12:16 <Yexo> sure, but that alternative layout has to have the same groundtile 21:12:26 <andythenorth> ah 21:12:32 <andythenorth> I see the issue in that case 21:12:40 *** devilsadvocate [~quassel@109.200.19.188] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:13:00 <andythenorth> I assume there are 'hysterical raisins' for stations being so different to industries :P 21:13:04 <andythenorth> wrt layouts 21:13:27 <Yexo> yes, there are indeed: different coders for ttdpatch who designed the specs individually 21:13:35 <andythenorth> what larks 21:13:48 <andythenorth> advanced sprite layouts are available for stations? 21:14:03 <Yexo> yes 21:14:25 <Yexo> but nforenum doesn't support advanced sprite layouts in action0, ie for stations 21:14:36 <Yexo> frosch123 has an incomplete patch for that 21:14:39 <andythenorth> ok 21:14:45 <andythenorth> I'll tell him it can't be done ;) 21:15:54 *** Adambean [AdamR@82.hosts.reece-eu.net] has quit [Quit: Gone fishing] 21:17:39 * andythenorth -> bed 21:17:43 <andythenorth> good night 21:17:46 <Yexo> gn andythenorth 21:17:54 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc18-aztw25-2-0-cust185.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has left #openttd [] 21:19:20 *** Twerkhoven[L] [~twerkhove@cpc14-linl7-2-0-cust28.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: He who can look into the future, has a brighter future to look into] 21:29:00 *** Juo [~Juo@cpc11-acto2-2-0-cust244.4-2.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: Juo] 21:32:48 *** TWerkhoven [~twerkhove@cpc14-linl7-2-0-cust28.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: He who can look into the future, has a brighter future to look into] 21:33:19 *** sllide [~jari@ip565eb113.direct-adsl.nl] has joined #openttd 21:40:49 *** amkoroew [~matze@p5B106D78.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:44:46 *** Pixa [~Pixa@85.210.75.24] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:50:00 *** Cybertinus [~Cybertinu@tunnel3304.ipv6.xs4all.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:51:39 *** devilsadvocate [~quassel@109.200.19.188] has joined #openttd 21:52:36 *** Pulec [~pulec@static-cl093181068250.unet.cz] has quit [] 21:59:25 *** Zeknurn [~lasershoc@hd9483b29.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has joined #openttd 22:00:19 *** sla_ro|master [~slaco@95.76.27.160] has quit [Quit: The Third Tiberium War - http://www.moddb.com/mods/the-third-tiberium-war] 22:00:49 *** devilsadvocate [~quassel@109.200.19.188] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:01:07 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590fc59c.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:02:59 *** devilsadvocate [~quassel@109.200.19.188] has joined #openttd 22:06:43 *** bodis [~bodis@cpc3-ando3-0-0-cust781.15-1.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:07:39 *** ashledombos [~ashledomb@ris91-2-82-227-26-30.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:07:58 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@94.142.234.1] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:08:43 <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause: do you have gimp installed and in the path? 22:08:54 <Eddi|zuHause> yes 22:09:07 <planetmaker> I wonder whether I could make it a build dependency ;-) 22:09:42 <planetmaker> so in principle yes ;-) 22:11:35 *** Chruker [~no@5634a56d.rev.stofanet.dk] has quit [] 22:12:57 *** KouDy [~KouDy@ip-78-102-233-119.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:14:15 <planetmaker> that'd allow us to operate directly on xcf or psd files, no need for png then 22:14:31 *** sllide [~jari@ip565eb113.direct-adsl.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:21:27 *** Night [aefe20e0@ircip1.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 22:22:03 <Night> Hello? 22:22:11 <Yexo> Hello! 22:22:18 <planetmaker> Hello. 22:22:35 <Night> Hi there, this.. is going to seem newbie-ish 22:23:05 <Night> but i was wondering, is it possible to develop an AI in C/C++? 22:23:36 <planetmaker> that'll not be supported 22:23:37 <Yexo> depending on your definition of "possible". However it's not supported 22:23:40 <Night> ah 22:23:46 <Night> okay 22:24:00 <Yexo> of course if you hack at the code enough it's possible, but you will be on your own 22:24:18 <Night> ah okay, i see. 22:24:40 <Night> so squirrel it is 22:25:38 <Night> any tips on getting started? 22:25:50 <Yexo> the wiki: 22:25:53 <Yexo> http://wiki.openttd.org/NoAI 22:26:08 <planetmaker> And have a look at existing AIs 22:26:15 <planetmaker> many are GPL v2-licensed 22:26:20 <Yexo> and the forum for info and code form existing AIs: http://www.tt-forums.net/viewforum.php?f=65 22:26:58 <Yexo> and I would recommend this IRC channel if you have any questions, but you obviously already found it :) 22:27:02 <JVassie> hi all 22:27:06 <Yexo> hey JVassie 22:27:09 <Night> haha 22:27:12 <Night> hello 22:28:13 <Night> sorry if i appear clueless, i was challanged to write an AI by a friend, figured id ask around here before i got started 22:28:14 *** Neon [~Neon@dslb-094-219-026-104.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Python is way too complicated... I prefer doing it quickly in C.] 22:29:06 <Yexo> do you have any prior programming experience? 22:29:17 <Night> yep 22:29:30 <Night> professionally im a C++ developer 22:29:48 <Yexo> great. Writing a good AI is very hard, so that helps a lot 22:30:11 <Yexo> I'd advise to start with (very boring) aircraft, just to get a feel for the API / how things work 22:30:27 <Yexo> after that try road vehicles, and if you feel really adventures try a train AI 22:31:28 <Night> whats squirrel like? at a glance it looked like C... 22:31:43 <Yexo> it looks a lot like C++ 22:31:50 <Yexo> or C for that matter 22:31:50 <Night> yeah 22:32:24 <Night> (sorry i use C for the C derived languages, its a bad habit im trying to get rid of) 22:32:44 <Night> C with classes C++ java etc.. habit i picked up from my professor. 22:32:51 <Yexo> official documentation can be found here: http://squirrel-lang.org/doc/squirrel2.html 22:33:05 <Yexo> it might be easier to pick up the syntax by reading other AIs though 22:34:08 <Night> alright ill look at the tutorial AI 22:34:29 <Night> thanks for the pointers 22:34:38 <Night> .... pun not intended. 22:35:21 *** Night [aefe20e0@ircip1.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 22:42:54 <JVassie> hmm 22:43:04 <JVassie> is there any way to change the default size of the station gui? 22:43:16 <JVassie> so that it doesnt display the list of tiles in the class in a single column? 22:43:40 <Yexo> you should be able to change that in the code 22:43:54 <planetmaker> :-) 22:44:00 <JVassie> how hard is it to add it as an advanced option in the menu? 22:44:22 <planetmaker> that'd be wrong IMHO. But it could remember the size 22:44:44 <Yexo> not sure, but not trivial since the default size is a hardcoded constant 22:44:56 <Yexo> and I agree with planetmaker 22:45:18 <JVassie> meh :p 22:45:23 <JVassie> tis a pet peeve of mine 22:46:38 <Yexo> if it would remember the size it'd be a problem only once per time you start openttd 22:47:12 <JVassie> that'd be fine tbh :p 22:47:33 <JVassie> openttd rarely gets closed anyway 22:47:44 <JVassie> but even still, would greatly reduce the problem :) 22:47:58 <JVassie> cause often i need to demolish a tile, landscape here or there 22:48:13 <JVassie> go back to build (more) station tiles, and the window is shrunk again :p 22:48:56 <planetmaker> Yexo: this remembering could even perpetuate through the cfg to a restart. But it (just) has no place in the GUI of the adv. settings 22:49:10 <Yexo> hmm, true 22:51:18 <JVassie> :) 22:52:06 <planetmaker> but I have a place in my bed now ;-) 22:52:11 <planetmaker> Good night 22:52:22 <Yexo> gn planetmaker 22:52:42 <JVassie> nn 22:53:30 <Sacro> I want to blast out Holst 23:17:45 *** Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.A98.priv.bahnhof.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:19:08 *** k^^ [~k^^@users192.kollegienet.dk] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep] 23:21:16 <Eddi|zuHause> hm... BR 130 for 140km/h (only few prototypes) and BR 132 for 120 km/h? or only one of them? 23:21:56 <fjb> I wouldn't include prototypes in the base set. 23:24:24 <Eddi|zuHause> but it's basically the only way to introduce anything faster than 120km/h 23:24:55 *** dfox_ [~dfox@ip-94-113-17-246.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:25:16 <Eddi|zuHause> fjb: we alread included the BR 23, of which only 2 were built due to the war 23:27:02 <fjb> That BR 23 was totally different from the post war BR 23 23:30:14 <Eddi|zuHause> there was a post-war DB 23 and post-war DR 23 23:30:36 *** KritiK [~Maxim@95-27-219-109.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:30:47 *** DDR [~DDR@66.183.113.68] has joined #openttd 23:33:23 <fjb> The prototypes were different from both. 23:35:30 <JVassie> Eddi|zuHause: the timeline your working on is german stuff only right? 23:36:11 <Eddi|zuHause> JVassie: yes, currently we want to finish one series, but you can make your own timeline 23:36:22 <JVassie> no worries 23:36:24 <JVassie> just checking 23:36:29 <JVassie> maybe rename the sheet to clarify? 23:36:40 <JVassie> its not just epoch 1-2 these days 23:36:49 <JVassie> perhaps German Series Timeline ? 23:37:04 <JVassie> Core German Series Timeline* 23:37:23 <JVassie> kk :p 23:38:36 <Eddi|zuHause> fjb: there were prototypes of 130 without heating, and then there were the first of the 132 with heating, which got renumbered to 130 23:39:42 <Eddi|zuHause> fjb: and then there were some that were rebuilt to 140km/h after reunification 23:41:09 <JVassie> well we need express more than universal for 1970 23:42:16 <JVassie> also Eddi|zuHause, the letters you are appending mean what please? 23:42:34 <Eddi|zuHause> the axle scheme? 23:43:20 <JVassie> i see O, R and N 23:43:31 <Eddi|zuHause> oh, those 23:43:57 <Eddi|zuHause> mean "Ost" (east), "Reko" (reconstruction) and "Neubau" (new) 23:44:23 <JVassie> ah kk 23:44:40 <Eddi|zuHause> to avoid possible conflicts with western engines of same number 23:45:22 <JVassie> gotcha 23:45:24 <JVassie> hmm 23:45:39 <JVassie> wonder if there will be m/any SBB/BLS stuff not in core :p 23:49:51 <JVassie> I think the ET30 should definitely be in the core 23:54:57 *** Lakie` [~Lakie@82.153.139.65] has joined #openttd 23:56:34 *** Vikthor [~Vikthor@78-80-200-5.tmcz.cz] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 23:59:09 * fjb wonders where his BLS engine stats book is.