Log for #openttd on 8th July 2011:
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01:31:52  <Eddi|zuHause> that was weird...
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01:32:33  <supermop> ierd
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02:01:23  <supermop> not sure what, if anything, i should draw for ottd
02:32:37  <Eddi|zuHause> i could give you a list of engines ;)
02:36:55  <supermop> never drawn a vehicle thusfar
02:37:52  <supermop> i have some rhino models of buildings/stations/bridges, and then pixel art of sheds, but i am having trouble motivating myself to work on either
02:39:08  <supermop> i need to recruit a coder
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06:54:55  <dihedral> mornings :-)
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08:15:33  <Terkhen> good morning
08:28:24  <planetmaker> moin
08:39:16  <peter1138> so, last shuttle launch today, maybe
08:39:41  <planetmaker> yeah :-(
08:39:48  * Alberth forgot to book a shuttle flight :(
08:40:34  <planetmaker> <-- book there
08:40:39  <planetmaker> next flight somewhen 2012
08:40:53  <planetmaker> and actually... equipment of my working group is booked in there :-P
08:41:21  <planetmaker> they don't dare to launch humans yet, though :-(
08:42:21  * Alberth was expecting a website of the commercial space flights :)
08:42:41  <planetmaker> <-- "cheap" flight opportunities also there
08:42:47  <planetmaker> Alberth: it is
08:43:34  <Alberth> yeah, that one :)
08:43:59  <planetmaker> also the first one ;-) - though indeed I don't find a booking option
08:45:06  <Alberth> no worries, you're not rich enough yet
08:45:22  <planetmaker> yeah :-(
08:45:36  <planetmaker> I guess one has to own Amazon in order to apply... :S
08:45:45  <planetmaker> (blue origin is owned by its founder)
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11:38:16  <__ln__> they're on their way to the shuttle
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13:23:07  <Belugas> hello
13:23:26  <Belugas> missed the bus, this morning.
13:23:36  <Belugas> damned bus
13:27:50  <Alberth> bus was too early?
13:28:51  <Belugas> naaa... the man was too slow
13:29:16  <Belugas> like... it's summer, i don't have to rush kid to school, i was reading a book while walking to to bus stup etc etc
13:29:30  <Belugas> and it's soooo  good to be outside ;)
13:31:40  <Alberth> so you wanted to enjoy outside a little longer, sounds like a good reason :)
13:44:53  <Belugas> not willingly, yes :)
13:45:15  <Belugas> subconscience slowed my walk, I guess
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14:39:48  <CIA-2> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r22643 /trunk/src/object_cmd.cpp: -Fix: Disallow building NewObjects on water tiles owned by another company.
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15:19:01  <peter1138> T-5:30
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15:24:42  <MNIM> hmmmh. has anybody ever thought of orbital transports for ttd?
15:25:00  <Zuu> I'm sure someone has though about it.
15:25:23  <MNIM> bah. stuck at T-31 seconds
15:26:12  <MNIM> running again
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15:54:21  <MNIM> lol, forum sigs
15:54:26  <MNIM> Worst Behaved IRC Member of 2008! - Wahoo!
15:54:26  <MNIM> Worst Behaved IRC Member of 2009! - Yay!
15:54:26  <MNIM> Worst Behaved IRC Member of 2010! - Even though i'm not even there anymore. How bad can I be?
15:54:47  <MNIM> guess he'll lose his title this year. >:P
15:55:28  <supermop> was fun to watch
15:57:12  <MNIM> what was?
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16:03:51  <supermop> shuttle rolling over
16:04:17  <MNIM> oh.
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16:33:46  <Eddi|zuHause> wait... shuttles play dead?
16:34:45  <Chris_Booth> they do if they are american
16:37:11  <Eddi|zuHause> well, russian shuttles never made it off the ground ;)
16:40:13  <MNIM> actually, they did, but not with human passengers :P
16:42:53  <supermop> lets have an ESA shuttle
16:43:58  <MNIM> mweh. I doubt any shuttle system similar to the exisiting american/russian will still have the same problems.
16:44:03  <MNIM> IE risky and expensive
16:46:00  <supermop> yep
16:46:32  <supermop> but there is certainly going to be a capacity gap until there is a replacement
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16:53:48  <MNIM> hmmmmh.
16:54:00  <MNIM> ask the russians to whip something up with the energia
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16:54:32  <MNIM> knowing the russians, they'll build the rocket faster than it took the apollo 13 to get back home
16:54:34  <__ln__> i guess it'll be chinese shuttles next
16:54:45  <Eddi|zuHause> the americans had a lot of time to find a replacement system, they didn't use it properly
16:55:12  <supermop> no, we had lots of time, but little money
16:55:30  <supermop> because NASA isnt as glamorous to congress as it used to be
16:55:46  <Eddi|zuHause> supermop: that is a symptom, not the cause
16:55:52  <__ln__> fortunately the money was well spent in iraq and afghanistan
16:56:06  <supermop> plus 8 years of a government that starved Nasa of funding due to its stance on climate change
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16:56:20  <supermop> we could have paid for both
16:56:34  <supermop> we just had a government that didn't want to
16:56:37  <andythenorth> meh
16:56:39  <andythenorth> space is silly
16:57:34  <__ln__> how does the US intend to get the starfleet headquarters into San Francisco with that attitude
16:59:08  <supermop> i assume that in 400 years governments might be very different
17:00:05  <Eddi|zuHause> just compare it with the governments 400 years ago :p
17:01:06  <supermop> anyway the hole goerge bush fort of mars is indeed silly
17:01:26  <supermop> but there is plenty of serious work to be done in orbit and with satelites
17:01:54  <supermop> plus NASA can, and should do serious work regarding climate and geology
17:02:09  <supermop> and not be collared due to politics
17:02:39  <Eddi|zuHause> nah, it'll all get "outsourced" to india and china
17:03:02  <supermop> we thats fine too
17:03:07  <andythenorth> US military space programme spending is believed to far exceed NASA's, so it's ok, the US still spend on space ;)
17:03:07  <supermop> *well
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17:03:15  * andythenorth will now do other stuff
17:03:19  <supermop> exactly andy:
17:03:30  <Eddi|zuHause> meanwhile the europeans get settled in their starting places in french guyana and kasachstan
17:03:30  <supermop> we need more academic research money
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17:08:02  <Belugas> # we need love and peace!
17:09:23  <supermop> yep
17:09:31  <andythenorth> we need the US to not default on debt
17:09:32  <Eddi|zuHause> "Wollt ihr das TOTALE WELTRAUMPROGRAMM?"
17:09:37  <andythenorth> or perhaps we don't care
17:09:47  <andythenorth> perhaps a US default might be good for us
17:09:58  <Eddi|zuHause> it probably would be
17:09:58  <andythenorth> if the world economy collapses - lots more time for ottd
17:10:08  <andythenorth> I could finish these stupid river banks
17:10:14  <andythenorth> whilst stockpiling tins of beans
17:10:15  <andythenorth> and gungs
17:10:17  <andythenorth> guns /s
17:10:19  <Eddi|zuHause> there's currently a race who can delay their default further, the EU or the USA
17:10:27  <supermop> well, that is unlikely, as we can just massively devalue our currency if it comes to that
17:10:57  <supermop> but there is a big fear in the US of what is essentially short term debt
17:10:59  <MNIM> Bah. Why do people develop a patch, a feature or a grf and then not show in a screenshot what it looks like?
17:11:43  <MNIM> it's like building a fucking car, hiding under a sheet and then trying to get customers to sign the purchase papers before they have ever seen the thing!
17:11:53  <supermop> but we can actually handle greater debt in the short term fairly well (even though it is unpopular with populist pseudo libertarian groups)
17:11:54  <MNIM> *hiding it under...
17:12:11  <supermop> what our problem is is long term debt
17:12:15  <Alberth> not all patches can be usefully screenshotted
17:12:19  <andythenorth> MNIM: tell them in the thread no?
17:12:21  <supermop> on the scale of the next 50-70 years
17:12:48  <supermop> whith rising healthcare costs et cetera
17:13:02  <Eddi|zuHause> supermop: no, what your problem is is that the likes of china don't want to buy any more of your debts
17:13:38  <supermop> they like to buy it so long as we dont let our currency devalue, and they dont have to let theirs appreciate
17:14:15  <MNIM> don't have a forum account
17:14:38  <supermop> what we need is to ensure strong regrowth in the short to medium term, so that we can pay for the huge wall of cost that is coming in a few decades
17:14:42  <Belugas> yup, forums accounts are hard to get :)
17:15:07  <Eddi|zuHause> supermop: that is exactly the point, the USA has constantly been devaluating their currency over the last 10 years
17:15:33  <supermop> which is actually good for us
17:15:35  * Belugas wonders: what would it be like for a country to bankrupt?
17:15:37  <supermop> bad for china
17:15:58  <andythenorth> MNIM: bah.  Why do people complain about forum threads lacking stuff, but then not register an account ;)
17:16:01  <andythenorth> :D :P etc
17:16:23  <supermop> but china has problems of its own to worry about, as its middle class grows, they will need greater purchasing power
17:16:24  <Eddi|zuHause> Belugas: that has happened plenty of times over the past centuries
17:16:45  <supermop> which will hurt their manufacturing capacity
17:16:56  <supermop> so it will be hard to balance
17:17:01  <MNIM> andy: because I haven't seen anything worth making a forum account yet
17:17:04  <MNIM> anyway, dinnertime
17:17:14  <supermop> but has already happened for better or worse in europe and the us
17:17:46  <Eddi|zuHause> Belugas: and there's still a chance we might see that happening with greece in the near future
17:17:57  <supermop> yeah
17:17:59  <Eddi|zuHause> or spain, or portugal, or ireland
17:18:18  <Eddi|zuHause> and if it's going really bad, even italy
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17:18:28  <Belugas> right
17:18:29  <supermop> ireland and portugal seem to coping better than greece
17:18:37  <supermop> but italy is a big problem
17:20:48  <Eddi|zuHause> i know there's lots of players in that game, but it might lead to a common european economical government
17:21:01  <supermop> or it might break up the euro
17:21:26  <Eddi|zuHause> that is not a contradiction
17:21:29  <supermop> germany would be better out without a few Greece's on the periphery
17:21:35  <supermop> *off
17:21:58  <Eddi|zuHause> on the contrary
17:22:22  <Eddi|zuHause> germany is the greatest benefactor from having the likes of spain and greece in the euro
17:22:32  <supermop> the problem would be keeping the peripheral emerging european economies viable markets for central 'strong' europe to export to
17:23:11  <supermop> the euro helps that greatly by inflating those countries purchasing power
17:24:14  <Eddi|zuHause> it's kinda funny, the euro was the invention of the WWII victorial powers (france, britain, USA) to keep a unified germany at bay, but in effect, it has made germany stronger ;)
17:24:24  <supermop> Eddi, what would you think of a more federalized european goverment/economy?
17:24:58  <Eddi|zuHause> what do you mean by "federalized"
17:25:01  <Belugas> but it's a bit of an irony, though... a country goes bankupt, but unlike a real company, it does not cease to exist.  It will face hard time, granted, but will go on
17:25:10  <supermop> it has had the effect of making war between two european powers untenable, so thats good
17:25:31  <supermop> most bankrupt companies carry on
17:25:59  <supermop> they have to go through tough processes, but emerge in one form or another
17:26:34  <supermop> i guess by federalized, i mean more centralized organization of the economy
17:27:20  <Eddi|zuHause> i think you mix up the meaning of "federalized" there
17:27:20  <supermop> one 'economy' for the core of the euro, instead of several closely bound 'economies'
17:27:38  <supermop> not one state though,
17:28:38  <Eddi|zuHause> "federalized" means "separately, but working together"
17:29:04  <supermop> yes
17:29:50  <supermop> i would say that the current european powers are not even at a federal level yet,
17:30:20  <andythenorth> 1/16 of rivers are drawn :) :| :(
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17:40:07  <Eddi|zuHause> supermop: no, and it's a very difficult way to get there. somebody will always think they're screwed over if they have to give away sovereign powers
17:41:16  <Eddi|zuHause> there's always a chance the euro-sceptics rise in power in some country, like denmark, or czechia
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17:48:06  <Eddi|zuHause> supermop: there is probably never going to be a system similar to the american structure. the existance of nations in europe will always get in the way of that
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17:57:13  <Eddi|zuHause> that is a great description of the 2ccSet: "Considering we already have a quite long depot list, a few additional [...] shouldn't make much difference."
17:57:25  <Terkhen> :D
17:57:40  * Terkhen will end up making a patch to get only the metro trains
17:58:43  <Eddi|zuHause> doesn't it have parameters for that yet?
17:58:51  <Terkhen> nope
17:58:55  <Eddi|zuHause> i thought that kind of parameter was discussed quite a while ago
17:59:08  <Terkhen> I have been waiting for those parameters for months :P
17:59:33  <Terkhen> it was discussed but, to my knowledge, never implemented
18:00:05  <Eddi|zuHause> i guess it comes down to a "just do it" situation
18:04:21  <andythenorth> it's an easy parameter :P
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18:10:27  <supermop> has Dj been coding lately?
18:20:31  <MNIM> back.
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18:25:22  <Eddi|zuHause> probably not
18:26:18  <supermop> i was asked if some of my sheds could be used by nutracks, but as far as i know it hasn't happened
18:27:03  <Eddi|zuHause> "Der cottbusser Postkutscher putzt seinen cottbusser Postkutschkasten"
18:27:42  <supermop> wait what is being cleaned here?
18:28:39  <Eddi|zuHause>
18:29:33  <Eddi|zuHause> google insists that it should be written with one s...
18:29:59  <supermop> google translate doesnt translate cottbusser
18:30:09  <Eddi|zuHause> very unlikely
18:30:16  <Eddi|zuHause> Cottbus is a city
18:30:31  <Eddi|zuHause> so a cottbus(s)er is someone from Cottbus
18:30:46  <supermop> so this is a carriage for this city
18:30:53  <supermop> and it cleans something?
18:31:11  <Eddi|zuHause> no, the driver cleans it
18:31:48  <Eddi|zuHause> anyway, it's actually a tongue twister
18:34:04  <supermop> ahh ok
18:34:23  <supermop> i need a new german dictionary
18:34:33  <supermop> also i need to get lunch
18:34:37  <supermop> back later
18:35:02  <Eddi|zuHause> german dictionaries tend to be difficult to read if you have no clue how to concatenate words ;)
18:35:33  <__ln__> but the U-bahn station is actually Kottbusser Tor, funny
18:35:52  <supermop> i used to be pretty efficient with one
18:36:01  <supermop> when i was studying german
18:36:03  <Eddi|zuHause> __ln__: who ever said people from berlin know how to spell? :p
18:36:22  <supermop> later
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18:37:38  <Eddi|zuHause> anyway, the city's real name in lower sorbian is actually Chóśebuz
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19:01:33  <Eddi|zuHause> "Wer anderen eine Grube grÀbt, der hat ein GrubengrabgerÀt"
19:01:44  <MNIM> wass>
19:01:46  <MNIM> ?
19:01:50  <Eddi|zuHause> "Wer anderen eine Bratwurst brÀt, der hat ein BratwurstbratgerÀt"
19:02:21  <MNIM> ah.
19:02:30  <Eddi|zuHause> "Wer gegen ein Minimum an Aluminium immun ist, besitzt AluminiumminimumimmunitÀt"
19:05:01  <MNIM> Ouch, eddi, that hurts my brain trying to translate it
19:05:11  <planetmaker> :-D Nice word
19:05:16  <planetmaker> good evening
19:05:39  <andythenorth> pneumonoultramicroscopicsilicovolcanoconiosis
19:06:52  <Eddi|zuHause> MNIM: what's difficult in translation there? just replace -Àt with -y
19:07:39  <Eddi|zuHause> unless you're american, then you also have to remove one i from Aluminium
19:07:49  <MNIM> Well, Im neither
19:07:54  <MNIM> I live, like next door.
19:08:17  <Eddi|zuHause> i'm fairly sure you're closer to andythenorth than to me ;)
19:08:22  * __ln__ muß wahrscheinlich morgen deutsch in der real life sprechen
19:08:38  <MNIM> but I think the main issue is that a hugely long word like that triggers some kind of latent disleksion or something ;)
19:08:55  <andythenorth> stupid rivers
19:09:07  <MNIM> also, there's at least a whole atlantic ocean between me and andy if I have to believe his hostmask
19:09:11  <Eddi|zuHause> MNIM: well, in that particular case, it's kinda meant to do that :p
19:09:19  <MNIM> oh.
19:09:21  <MNIM> ouch.
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19:09:27  * MNIM whacks eddi on the head
19:09:35  <andythenorth> hmm
19:10:16  <fjb> __ln__: Your German is quite good.
19:10:24  <andythenorth> there are two types of terrain in arctic and tropic
19:10:31  <andythenorth> so I have only done 1/24 of the stupid rivers
19:10:47  * andythenorth should whine less and draw more
19:11:48  <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: you included toyland in that? :p
19:12:02  <andythenorth> kind of have to
19:12:27  <MNIM> well, toyland could be skipped, since it isn't /meant/ to look realistic
19:12:35  <Eddi|zuHause> MNIM: what do you mean? a traceroute from here to andythenorth goes Leipzig->Frankfurt->London->Manchester
19:12:59  <andythenorth> oh god
19:13:03  <andythenorth> they know where I am :P
19:13:07  <andythenorth> not hugely accurately
19:13:19  <MNIM> eh, he shows to me as having a cable virgin, and being in internic commercial.
19:13:34  <MNIM> which is america
19:13:53  <Eddi|zuHause> MNIM: they're not allowed to have a "virgin cable" in britain?
19:13:55  <planetmaker> you err
19:14:03  <planetmaker> virgin is in many places
19:14:09  <__ln__> fjb: danke, obwohl schreibe ich besser als ich spreche.
19:14:11  <andythenorth>
19:14:23  <andythenorth> the ones with coloured dots and such are...not done :P
19:14:43  <fjb> __ln__: Then you should speak more. ;-)
19:14:44  <MNIM> well, as far as I know virgin is American, and besides that, Internic Commercial as country code means america
19:14:45  <planetmaker> sweet, andythenorth :-)
19:14:49  <andythenorth> I haven't done any corner pieces.  would anyone notice?
19:14:55  <MNIM> so unless he's being proxy'd
19:15:04  <andythenorth> they're as-decoded-from-the-grf
19:15:34  <Eddi|zuHause> __ln__: that reminds me of when SmatZ called and my mother answered the phone, afterwards my mother said SmatZ spoke good german, while SmatZ said he spoke bad german :p
19:15:51  <MNIM> lol
19:16:05  <__ln__> heh
19:16:14  <andythenorth> it's pretty easy to see where I am
19:16:28  <MNIM> well, as long as they don't speak it as bad as I do, no disasters are bound to happen.
19:16:34  <Eddi|zuHause> that was on the way to r20k
19:16:35  <andythenorth> virgin even give away the switch number I think
19:16:55  <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: i'm sure there are pretty detailed geoip-databases out there
19:16:57  <MNIM> I can read, and to an extent, understand, but speaking is beyond my capabilities
19:16:59  <planetmaker> MNIM: choose one:
19:17:33  <MNIM> wait, that's all the same country?
19:17:35  <andythenorth> whichever geo IP suggests manchester is a bit off
19:17:38  <MNIM> ehh, I mean, company?
19:17:55  <andythenorth> 'adult friend finder' ads manage to locate me pretty accurately :P
19:18:01  <MNIM> lol
19:18:12  <planetmaker> and... virgin is a UK-based holding ;-)
19:18:15  <andythenorth> aztw is a big clue for those in the know
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19:18:24  <andythenorth> anyways
19:18:29  <fjb> r30k is far too far away...
19:18:32  <andythenorth> someone answer my question about river corners?
19:19:21  <Alberth> not until they try to make a 2 tile wide stupid river :)
19:19:36  <Eddi|zuHause> fjb: but we missed r22222
19:19:40  <MNIM> saw it. looks nice, I just hope you;ll be doing better rapids as other river .grf-s out there
19:19:48  <planetmaker> andythenorth: anyone - maybe. someone: sure
19:19:53  <fjb> Oh... :-(
19:21:15  <andythenorth> ok so I leave all the tiny corner pieces until someone complains
19:21:20  <andythenorth> there are a boring amount of them
19:21:26  <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: interestingly, those ads randomly show me any minor city in a ~30km radius, but not the major city ;)
19:21:36  <andythenorth> most of you have no idea what corner pieces I refer to :P
19:21:51  <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: maybe they're gaming you to think they're more specific
19:22:01  <Alberth> andythenorth: and you need some work for the next version :p
19:22:23  <andythenorth> Alberth: ?
19:22:27  <Eddi|zuHause> none of them managed to pick the right village, though ;)
19:22:41  <Alberth> andythenorth: removal of the corner pieces :)
19:22:57  <andythenorth> they're being removed?
19:23:03  * andythenorth is confused somewhat
19:23:08  <andythenorth> maybe I should have a beer
19:23:17  <Chris_Booth> beer
19:23:19  <Chris_Booth> <3
19:23:40  <MNIM> coding always gets better with beer, right
19:23:59  <Chris_Booth> yeah
19:25:05  <glx> or not
19:25:06  <MNIM> What the fuck.
19:25:16  <MNIM> apparently crashes my mozilla
19:26:45  <MNIM> that's the third time!
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19:30:56  <Wolf01> helo
19:31:04  <MNIM> Oh lol. at least they got the country right this time
19:31:13  <andythenorth> chris sawyer would have probably got online via aztw
19:31:13  <MNIM> still some 300kms off, but oh well. :P
19:45:42  <planetmaker> @base 16 10 37
19:45:42  <DorpsGek> planetmaker: 55
19:45:44  <planetmaker> hm
19:45:53  <planetmaker> @base 10 16 37
19:45:53  <DorpsGek> planetmaker: 25
19:46:03  <planetmaker> what is callback 25 for industries?
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19:48:12  <Eddi|zuHause> Animation control (1B/25/140/152/159)
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19:49:06  <planetmaker> ah, thanks
19:49:50  <Eddi|zuHause> but after reading the wiki entry, i am totally confused about what it actually does :p
19:50:49  <planetmaker> returns an animation frame explicitly or a pseudo-frame which means next or stop
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20:19:28  <Eddi|zuHause> AH! he's a ghost!
20:23:42  <andythenorth> stupid connection
20:25:45  <Eddi|zuHause> better than Moffat's version of "Ghosting" in the 51st century ;)
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20:51:55  <Terkhen> good night
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20:52:54  <planetmaker> good night Terkhen and all others as well
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22:53:30  <Wolf01> 'night
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23:57:32  <Hellaciouss> hello
23:58:19  <Hellaciouss> sorry for this newb question but, how do I get sawmills/factories/etc to actually produce goods? For the saw mill I have a depo next to it and dropping off wood but it won't produce anything with the wood
23:59:45  <Zuu> Hellaciouss: Do you look in the industry window or the station window?

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