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00:13:56 *** tokai|noir [~tokai@port-92-195-104-156.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 00:19:57 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-236-30.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:57:42 *** welshdragon [~welshdrag@client-81-107-130-178.midd.adsl.virginmedia.com] has left #openttd [] 00:57:47 *** AndroUser [~androirc@client-81-107-130-178.midd.adsl.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 00:58:03 *** AndroUser [~androirc@client-81-107-130-178.midd.adsl.virginmedia.com] has quit [] 00:58:36 *** AndroUser [~androirc@client-81-107-130-178.midd.adsl.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 01:00:07 *** AndroUser [~androirc@client-81-107-130-178.midd.adsl.virginmedia.com] has quit [] 01:07:20 *** welshdragon [~androirc@client-81-107-130-178.midd.adsl.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 01:11:49 *** Pulec [~pulec@static-cl093181068250.unet.cz] has quit [] 01:18:37 *** pugi [~pugi@host-091-097-058-163.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:20:07 *** pugi [~pugi@dyndsl-091-096-011-015.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has joined #openttd 01:24:01 *** CAmeron_ [~60346555@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 01:24:15 <CAmeron_> http://george.zernebok.net/newgrf/downloads.html 01:24:26 *** CAmeron_ [~60346555@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [] 01:28:29 *** supermop_ [~daniel_er@cpe-67-243-25-39.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 01:32:00 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: TschÃŒÃ] 01:35:32 <Eddi|zuHause> that is good to know. 01:57:06 *** Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.a98.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #openttd 02:06:52 *** Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.a98.priv.bahnhof.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:08:23 *** Biolunar_ [~mahdi@blfd-5d821cb9.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 02:09:01 *** welshdragon [~androirc@client-81-107-130-178.midd.adsl.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: AndroIRC - Android IRC Client ( http://www.androirc.com )] 02:11:21 *** TomyLobo [~foo@p54946140.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 02:14:00 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:c5fa:cb03:a9ed:fad7] has quit [Quit: bye] 02:14:38 *** Biolunar_ [~mahdi@blfd-5d821cb9.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: All your IRC are belong to us!] 02:15:13 *** Ardonel [~Ardonel@75-141-134-16.dhcp.mdfd.or.charter.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 02:15:27 *** Biolunar [~mahdi@blfd-4db19e4b.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 03:18:25 *** Mazur [~mazur@5ED2BEAE.cm-7-3c.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 04:18:35 *** z-MaTRiX [~matrix@nude.lesbianbath.com] has quit [Quit: ok] 04:43:25 *** pugi [~pugi@dyndsl-091-096-011-015.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has quit [Quit: I reject your reality and substitute my own] 04:56:00 *** Mazur [~mazur@54699639.cm-12-2c.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has joined #openttd 05:04:07 *** Xrufuian [~link@pool-98-119-100-254.lsanca.btas.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: I AM ERROR] 05:37:06 *** Moussekateer [~Moussekat@78.86.246.246] has joined #openttd 05:38:24 <Moussekateer> hiya 05:40:50 <Moussekateer> I have a (hopefully) simple question about running a server 05:42:12 <Moussekateer> I'm running a dedicated server for my friends and I and there is one aspect I am stuck on. If the server dies for whatever reason, how would I get it to reload the game state before it died instead of generating a new map? 05:52:33 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B75E16.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:52:51 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B75964.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 06:03:17 <Rubidium> Moussekateer: -g <nameofsavegame> 06:04:27 <Moussekateer> Rubidium: Ah thank you very much 06:17:02 *** Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.a98.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #openttd 06:25:15 *** Moussekateer [~Moussekat@78.86.246.246] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 06:29:41 *** Prof_Frink [~proffrink@5e0a9627.bb.sky.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:38:51 *** JVassie [~James@2.25.209.121] has joined #openttd 06:51:20 *** Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.a98.priv.bahnhof.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 07:07:54 *** Kurimus [~stabbity@dsl-tkubrasgw3-fe93dd00-34.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #openttd 07:08:41 *** JVassie [~James@2.25.209.121] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 07:20:06 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1ADEC.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 07:21:03 <planetmaker> moin 07:32:50 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@ip-86-49-59-25.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 07:52:08 *** Mazur [~mazur@54699639.cm-12-2c.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 08:05:39 *** sla_ro|master [~slaco@95.76.26.172] has joined #openttd 08:24:55 *** pjpe [ade6a119@ircip3.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 08:25:52 *** pjpe [ade6a119@ircip2.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 08:31:29 *** supermop_ [~daniel_er@cpe-67-243-25-39.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: supermop_] 08:48:33 *** Mazur [~mazur@54699639.cm-12-2c.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has joined #openttd 08:54:12 *** Neon [~Neon@dslb-178-004-183-061.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 09:28:53 <planetmaker> http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=57739&p=984732#p984732 <-- hach. That was fun 09:32:48 <peter1138> heh 09:33:24 <peter1138> ""proper proportions are attainable in pixelart and unattainable in 3D-rendered art" 09:33:29 <peter1138> what ??? 09:33:34 <planetmaker> :-) 09:33:44 <Eddi|zuHause> sure :p 09:34:20 <Eddi|zuHause> reply that the only real way is to use cubi... i mean voxels 09:34:36 * MNIM whacks Eddi|zuHause on the head 09:34:52 <peter1138> :D 09:35:25 <Eddi|zuHause> well, it is BOTH pixel art AND 3D :p 09:36:17 <planetmaker> 3D is so yesterday. 4D is the future 09:36:19 <peter1138> "looks ridiculous when you zoom out" ... and those stubby vehicles don't look ridiculous when zoomed in? 09:36:29 <peter1138> we have 4D 09:36:33 <planetmaker> psst! 09:37:11 <planetmaker> though granted, OpenTTD has only 1D 09:37:13 <peter1138> The fourth dimension: motion_counter 09:37:32 <MNIM> lol, if you were to do OTTD in proper scale trains would be a factor ten longer, and train lines hundred, or more 09:37:34 <peter1138> 1 Deluxesional? 09:37:49 <planetmaker> OpenTT_D_ ;-) 09:38:03 <peter1138> MNIM, quite 09:38:16 <MNIM> now that'd be a challenge to play 09:38:19 <planetmaker> MNIM: and towns would be larger than a 2048**2 map 09:38:30 <MNIM> true. 09:38:35 <peter1138> not all towns 09:38:52 <MNIM> well yeah, the big ones. 09:39:01 <peter1138> hmm, what tile scale was that? 09:39:14 <peter1138> at 25m, then it's 51km, which would be a bloody big city 09:39:39 <planetmaker> 51km would be like the European capitals 09:39:41 <planetmaker> so... 09:39:51 *** namad7 [aaaaa@c-67-163-246-17.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 09:40:06 <MNIM> that being said, I wouldn't object to having towns with bigger blocks. it's kind of odd to have a railway park in a city that's as big as the city itself 09:40:26 <namad7> which rolelr coaster ycoon game was best, and is there a roller coaster tycoon open project remake? also... does open TTD have a tutorial? i'd like to play but its so confusing i'm getting confused 09:40:47 <Eddi|zuHause> does "european capitals" mean "capitals of europe" or "capitals in europe"? 09:40:59 <peter1138> capitals in europe 09:41:46 <Eddi|zuHause> "capitals of europe" would be brussels, luxemburg and straÃburg 09:42:07 <MNIM> well, that's what they claim, yes. 09:42:08 <peter1138> but i still doubt they're 51km in length/width 09:42:22 <MNIM> but we all know that europe's true capitals are berlin and paris. 09:42:42 <Eddi|zuHause> that's 1/3 of the way from here to berlin 09:42:54 <MNIM> peter: paris counts, I think 09:43:01 <peter1138> paris isn't that big 09:43:06 <MNIM> that is, including it's suburbs. 09:43:57 <peter1138> anyway 09:44:03 <peter1138> it's still a silly scale :) 09:44:15 <planetmaker> @calc sqrt(891) 09:44:15 <DorpsGek> planetmaker: 29.8496231132 09:44:17 <Eddi|zuHause> @calc sqrt(892) 09:44:17 <DorpsGek> Eddi|zuHause: 29.8663690461 09:44:19 <planetmaker> well, 30 09:44:21 <planetmaker> 30km 09:44:29 <MNIM> paris urban area covers 2845km2 09:44:36 <MNIM> metro is even bigger. 09:44:41 <peter1138> @calc sqrt(2845) 09:44:41 <DorpsGek> peter1138: 53.3385414124 09:44:44 <peter1138> just ;) 09:44:55 <MNIM> @calc sqrt(17175) 09:44:55 <DorpsGek> MNIM: 131.053424221 09:45:03 <planetmaker> @calc sqrt(1572) 09:45:03 <DorpsGek> planetmaker: 39.6484552032 09:45:06 <MNIM> 131 across for the metropolitan. 09:45:08 <planetmaker> London is 40km 09:45:19 <peter1138> anyway, i'd like to see 32bpp ez sprites done in the correct dimensions 09:45:27 <peter1138> apparently it "looks ridiculous when you zoom out" 09:45:33 <planetmaker> :-) 09:45:43 <MNIM> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paris 09:45:50 <MNIM> that's my reference anyway :P 09:45:52 <peter1138> ttd vehicles look ridiculous? heh 09:46:12 <Eddi|zuHause> peter1138: isn't that just a matter of cropping correctly? 09:46:26 <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause: not for the vehicles 09:46:31 <peter1138> Eddi|zuHause, cropping? 09:46:37 <planetmaker> their dimensions are differently weighted than the TTD vehicles 09:46:48 <planetmaker> and houses are very much inconsistent, too 09:46:49 <peter1138> http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=984248#p984248 < you saw that right? 09:47:32 <Eddi|zuHause> i don't check the 32bpp forum 09:47:37 <peter1138> :) 09:48:33 <peter1138> it's blatantly obviously wrong when compared like that :) 09:48:42 <peter1138> as planetmaker says, toyland maybe :) 09:48:59 <peter1138> i have no idea how well those tall sprites will work with bridges/tunnels though 09:49:01 <planetmaker> I love actually their looks. They're very nice. For toyland 09:49:19 <planetmaker> indeed, workings with tunnels & co will need looking at 09:49:27 <MNIM> meh, lets face it, dimensions are always fucked in games, especially strategy games. 09:49:40 <Eddi|zuHause> but since they're 3D models, can't you just adjust like 3 parameters and get useful results? 09:49:53 <planetmaker> not sure 09:49:55 <peter1138> not really 09:50:02 <planetmaker> one would need to ask them 09:50:24 <peter1138> that particular one needs to have stuff added in the middle 09:50:35 <namad7> does open TTD have a tutorial? i'd like to play but its so confusing i'm getting confused 09:50:38 <peter1138> and the be stretched to be a bit wider 09:50:56 <peter1138> also there's too much contrast in the lighting 09:51:06 <Eddi|zuHause> hm, ok. 09:51:23 <peter1138> the original sprite looks like an engine, albeit a bit shorter 09:51:37 <peter1138> the 32bpp one looks... stubby, brio-toy like 09:51:42 <planetmaker> namad7: not really. There are tutorial pages on the wiki, though. Did you check them? 09:51:45 <Eddi|zuHause> 32bpp needs a project manager. a BIG one. 09:51:50 <planetmaker> And there's various videos on youtube 09:52:04 <MNIM> namad7: http://wiki.openttd.org/Tutorial 09:52:09 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@ip-86-49-59-25.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 09:52:09 <planetmaker> a 'BIG' one, Eddi|zuHause? 09:52:26 <planetmaker> I thought it had a 'project manager'? 09:52:33 <peter1138> http://www.entropy.com.au/shopping_cart/images/prod_11605.jpg 09:52:34 <peter1138> oh 09:52:40 <peter1138> even brio do long ones 09:53:01 <planetmaker> he 09:53:41 <peter1138> heh, brio shinkansen :) 09:54:35 <MNIM> hmmmh, that reminds me, I need to look for kid's toys some time this (next) year... 10:01:33 *** pjpe [ade6a119@ircip2.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 10:01:57 *** DDR [~chatzilla@142.179.78.88] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.87 [Firefox 8.0/20111115183541]] 10:02:25 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=792478#p792478 10:03:43 <planetmaker> oh. :-P 10:04:40 <peter1138> :) 10:05:02 <peter1138> and PM's response is precisely why minecraft-style infinite worlds won't work :) 10:05:12 <peter1138> as much as i'd love it... 10:06:55 <planetmaker> you mean RB's response? 10:08:28 <peter1138> erm 10:09:00 <peter1138> yes, that one 10:14:12 * peter1138 smirks at pikka 10:14:45 <peter1138> or with, i suppose 10:19:23 <Eddi|zuHause> whit! 10:22:28 <SpComb> minecraft has some very explicity block-length limits for what area it runs game state in around the player :) 10:23:47 <peter1138> hmm 10:23:56 <peter1138> SpComb, yes 10:24:08 <SpComb> monsters only spawn 64 block away etc 10:26:54 <peter1138> hmm, blitter bug 10:27:49 <peter1138> opengfx rail fences at 2x zoom out.. 10:28:01 <peter1138> appear to be doubled up 10:28:05 <Eddi|zuHause> have the black lines in 4x zoom been fixed yet? 10:28:15 <peter1138> ages ago 10:30:06 <peter1138> oh 10:30:07 <peter1138> apparently 10:30:31 <peter1138> it's a local bug :p 10:34:32 <peter1138> hmm 10:34:41 <peter1138> how can i have persistent tar files? 10:38:36 <planetmaker> persistent? 10:38:43 <planetmaker> aren't they? 10:39:58 <peter1138> erm 10:40:08 <peter1138> i mean give them a file slot 10:41:26 <peter1138> spriteloader/png.cpp uses PNG_SLOT 10:43:24 <peter1138> looks like major work :( 10:43:42 <peter1138> hmm, no, can't be 10:43:54 <peter1138> because newgrfs are in tars... 10:51:19 <peter1138> hmm, wind sock animation looks too fast 10:56:27 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 10:56:58 *** sla_ro|master [~slaco@95.76.26.172] has quit [Quit: Sla Mutant Co-Op for Renegade - coming back soon] 10:58:48 <planetmaker> nah, we just have strong winds 10:58:59 <planetmaker> just look how angled the smoke of the power plant is 10:59:47 <peter1138> yeah 10:59:52 <peter1138> in a different direction :D 11:03:55 *** Nicd [~nicd@ip-39-111.dhcp.opintanner.fi] has joined #openttd 11:05:51 *** Nicd [~nicd@ip-39-111.dhcp.opintanner.fi] has quit [] 11:09:12 <peter1138> http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=984709#p984709 11:09:15 <peter1138> hehe, if only... 11:18:38 <Noldo> let me guess, it uses random? 11:18:44 <peter1138> no 11:19:23 <peter1138> those effects are vehicles 11:19:45 <peter1138> thus they had better be synchronised between client & server 11:20:08 <planetmaker> :-) 11:20:25 * peter1138 ponders having a go at look-ahead path reservations 11:20:37 <Noldo> does that also mean they are generated all over the map? 11:20:43 <peter1138> yup 11:21:24 *** TWerkhoven2[l] [~twerkhove@cpc3-linl7-2-0-cust522.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 11:21:31 <Noldo> that sounds as brilliant as the way the lift animations 11:21:43 <peter1138> lift animations are fine 11:22:00 <Noldo> they aren't in the tile loop? 11:22:06 <peter1138> they're bit hardcoded 11:23:08 <peter1138> no, they're done in the tile animation system 11:23:39 <Noldo> great 11:23:55 <peter1138> they're a bit to fast for tileloop :) 11:24:28 <Noldo> but is the state stored in the map anyway? 11:24:31 <peter1138> yes 11:24:36 <peter1138> the state has to be stored somewhere 11:25:03 <Noldo> it's not really game critical, is it? 11:25:13 <peter1138> not especially 11:25:52 <planetmaker> questionable though whether it really is essential to have them synced. Can NewGRFs read their state? 11:26:16 <peter1138> they don't need to be, no 11:26:17 <planetmaker> Or whether we could make them pure eye candy w/o gameplay effect 11:26:27 <peter1138> but you'd need to introduce a new system just for unsynchronised animations 11:26:44 <planetmaker> yes 11:26:56 <peter1138> newgrf animations *can* affect things 11:27:05 <planetmaker> also yes :-) 11:27:06 <peter1138> at least i think :) 11:27:15 <planetmaker> definitely 11:27:40 <planetmaker> they're varaction2 - accessible, thus could e.g. influence industry acceptance or production or vehicle properties 11:27:46 <peter1138> yeah 11:27:46 <SpComb> oh noes, my lifts are in different positions on different clients 11:28:12 <peter1138> it bugs me enough that the clouds in minecraft aren't synchronised 11:28:20 <peter1138> mainly because people try to use them to give directions... 11:28:30 <SpComb> heh 11:28:45 *** TWerkhoven[l] [~twerkhove@cpc3-linl7-2-0-cust522.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:29:16 <peter1138> "place that bus stop in front of the building with the lift at the top" 11:29:18 <peter1138> yeah 11:29:50 <planetmaker> now, giving me the idea of sync'ed / unsync'ed animation would be interesting for NewGRFs, too 11:30:05 <planetmaker> that unsynced just would need to be unexposed to variables 11:30:36 <peter1138> you could make effect vehicles unsynced too 11:30:59 <peter1138> need to move them out of the vehicle pool 11:31:27 <peter1138> originally we had 1024 vehicles allocated in the pool for effect vehicles 11:31:31 <peter1138> and they didn't need to be synced 11:33:38 <planetmaker> would make possibly sense. Could help move them in a separate thread ;-) 11:33:45 <peter1138> oh, i found my de-global fio routines 11:34:02 <peter1138> heh 11:34:13 <peter1138> if you only added effect vehicles for things on screen then there wouldn't be many 11:35:49 <planetmaker> I'm not sure... but what do sparks, fume and smoke influence? 11:37:14 <peter1138> viewports :) 11:38:43 <peter1138> hmm, r19896. quite old now. 11:39:53 *** Elu [Elukka@78-27-103-88.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [] 11:48:01 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@ip-86-49-59-25.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 12:03:48 <peter1138> hmm 12:03:53 <peter1138> pbs is hard :p 12:05:40 <Yexo> <planetmaker> that unsynced just would need to be unexposed to variables <- if it's unexposed to variables the grf can't do anything with it, so you have no animation 12:05:54 <Yexo> however you could expose it only when graphics are drawn, ie cb 0 12:06:10 <Yexo> that cb is desync-safe, so you can expose it there 12:06:43 <planetmaker> I thought of a way via (adv.) action1 to supply n graphics for n animation frames. But yes, cb0 might be more interesting 12:06:50 <peter1138> tmwftlb, imho 12:08:56 <peter1138> hmm 12:09:22 <peter1138> yapp still works with out yapf, right? 12:10:59 *** Zeknurn [~Zeknurn@hd9483b29.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:12:28 <Sacro> p? 12:12:30 <Sacro> pp? 12:12:36 <Sacro> patchpak? 12:13:02 <peter1138> yet another pbs patch 12:13:11 <peter1138> aka pbs in openttd 12:13:28 <Sacro> ahh 12:13:36 <Sacro> I miss HackyKid 12:16:09 <peter1138> yey 12:16:12 <peter1138> heh, even 12:19:10 *** Wolfsherz [~Wolfsherz@46.115.2.24] has joined #openttd 12:23:47 *** Zeknurn [~Zeknurn@hd9483b29.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has joined #openttd 12:24:50 <peter1138> cool, i reserved at least 10 tiles 12:25:01 <peter1138> uncool, the signal state is red :D 12:29:43 *** Ardonel [~Ardonel@75-141-134-16.dhcp.mdfd.or.charter.com] has joined #openttd 12:31:34 <Eddi|zuHause> we need "yellow" signals... 12:37:10 <lugo> yellow = "limit to speed of train ahead"? 12:37:34 <peter1138> n 12:39:22 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, basically 12:39:40 <Eddi|zuHause> "real" signals differentiate that quite a bit, though 12:40:38 <Eddi|zuHause> there's different things for "next signal is red", "next signal is green, but has speed limit 40/60km/h", "next signal is green, but has speed limit 100km/h" and stuff 12:41:02 <lugo> well _that_ would be over the top :) 12:41:22 *** welshdragon [~welshdrag@client-81-107-130-178.midd.adsl.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 12:41:26 <lugo> i mean implementing that 12:42:19 <Eddi|zuHause> well, you need feedback from the train to the signal anyway, so if the speed limit is known from the reservation, it might as well be displayed (varaction2 for signals!) 12:51:01 <peter1138> bah, having non-pbs tiles is a spanner in the works 12:51:05 <peter1138> why did we keep them? :S 12:51:12 <peter1138> tiles? signals 12:51:43 <Eddi|zuHause> just treat a reserved tile like a train were on it 12:51:50 <Eddi|zuHause> i.e. turn all block signals red 12:51:58 <Eddi|zuHause> (except the reserved one) 12:58:47 <TrueBrain> Eddi|zuHause: didn't we once have yellow signals? Or was that a patch? 13:00:14 *** welshdragon [~welshdrag@client-81-107-130-178.midd.adsl.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: welshdragon] 13:00:43 <peter1138> see, i'm on that "train stopping distance" thing 13:01:07 <peter1138> which "just" needs the path finder to reserve at least X tiles 13:01:16 <peter1138> instead of to the first signal 13:01:32 <planetmaker> TrueBrain, that was a patch 'advance signals'. iirc by michi 13:01:32 <peter1138> then reserved signals become green 13:01:49 <TrueBrain> I remember yellow triangles, blue circles and green rectangles or something similar? 13:01:59 <peter1138> seens simple but there are so many details 13:02:00 <planetmaker> that's different. that's route markers 13:02:09 <TrueBrain> where you could set speed limits on them? 13:03:07 <Eddi|zuHause> no, but you could sort trains by max speed 13:03:10 <planetmaker> No. See http://www.icosahedron.de/openttd/patches/ for what I thought of 13:03:26 <Eddi|zuHause> but there also was a very old "yellow signals" patch 13:03:35 <michi_cc> peter1138: You know http://www.icosahedron.de/openttd/git/openttd.git/shortlog/refs/heads/advance_nostop ? 13:03:58 <peter1138> 2009 :) 13:05:08 <TrueBrain> michi_cc is also becoming a true: "I have a patch for that" :D 13:05:16 <planetmaker> :-D 13:05:32 <planetmaker> I've yet have to recall himself saying that, though ;-) 13:06:15 <dihedral> oi 13:08:41 <peter1138> http://i389.photobucket.com/albums/oo336/CrazyBricker/TTD%20Forums/Scania_Flatbed.gif 13:08:53 <peter1138> when can we have articulated RVs doing that? :p 13:08:55 *** welshdragon [~welshdrag@client-81-107-130-178.midd.adsl.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 13:09:02 <peter1138> without the sprite ordering glitches 13:09:35 *** welshdragon [~welshdrag@client-81-107-130-178.midd.adsl.virginmedia.com] has left #openttd [] 13:10:16 *** welshdragon [~welshdrag@client-81-107-130-178.midd.adsl.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 13:10:36 <TrueBrain> planetmaker: http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=24187 13:10:39 <TrueBrain> that was what I meant :) 13:10:43 <Eddi|zuHause> bah... 11MB 13:11:57 <peter1138> giant animated gif, sorry 13:12:04 *** welshdragon [~welshdrag@client-81-107-130-178.midd.adsl.virginmedia.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:12:39 <peter1138> TrueBrain, that's possible with railtypes now ;) 13:12:57 <peter1138> which does waste railtype slots, i suppose 13:12:59 <planetmaker> TrueBrain, that's really ooold ;-) 13:13:07 <TrueBrain> planetmaker: I AM OLD 13:13:12 <planetmaker> true :-P 13:13:15 <TrueBrain> I only remember things from back then :P 13:13:29 <planetmaker> condolences, cookie? 13:13:42 <TrueBrain> as long as you didnt bake them 13:14:08 <planetmaker> well.... I did 13:15:04 <peter1138> http://i.imgur.com/GbMqd.jpg 13:15:08 <peter1138> oh, the wonders of scale :p 13:15:30 <peter1138> th ebuildings aren't too bad 13:15:31 <TrueBrain> I want 2 rails on 1 tile now 13:15:36 <peter1138> but that signal? 13:15:43 <peter1138> the bus seems kinda big too 13:15:49 <TrueBrain> the signals are for the blind 13:15:53 <TrueBrain> avoids "running through red" 13:16:23 *** DOUK [~KEM@ALyon-158-1-64-157.w90-29.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #openttd 13:19:10 *** mahmoud [~KEM@ALyon-158-1-26-165.w90-29.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:19:18 <peter1138> http://www.tt-forums.net/download/file.php?id=149697 13:19:25 <peter1138> ^ locomotion looks so good? ;) 13:23:05 <planetmaker> peter1138, cets will look similar ;-) 13:24:02 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:c50d:abaf:34e0:54e0] has joined #openttd 13:24:06 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 13:36:47 *** Hinrik [~hinrik@w.nix.is] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:41:37 <Eddi|zuHause> it'd not look as severe, if the vehicle center followed the rail 13:41:48 <Eddi|zuHause> (would disconnect from other vehicles though) 13:42:04 <Eddi|zuHause> i don't think CETS will be that bad 13:50:57 <planetmaker> no, cets is smaller 13:51:06 <planetmaker> as are openttd's rail sprites 13:54:43 <Eddi|zuHause> reminds me, i wanted to rewrite the articulation pattern 13:55:31 <Eddi|zuHause> "16k vehicles ought to be enough for anybody"? 13:58:03 <planetmaker> :-D 13:58:28 <planetmaker> good that it only reads "16k articulated vehicles shoud be enough for anybody" ;-) 14:01:10 <Eddi|zuHause> so how does this new articulation callback work? 14:03:42 <Eddi|zuHause> so... i'm thinking: each vehicle is made up of 3 parts, the first part will be (ID#+16k), the second part (ID#) and the third part (ID#+8k) 14:03:52 <Eddi|zuHause> that means we can have 8k vehicles 14:04:26 <Eddi|zuHause> and we save the magic for "dummy vehicles" 14:08:00 <planetmaker> 8k vehicles should be enough for everyone ;-) 14:08:08 <planetmaker> I'd not want to look through that purchase list ;-) 14:08:27 <Eddi|zuHause> we already have like 400 14:08:56 *** artti [~artti@m213-102-86-116.cust.tele2.ee] has joined #openttd 14:09:38 <planetmaker> so only a factor of 20. omg ;-) 14:13:00 <artti> Hey everyone, hope this is right place to ask a question or two. So I downloaded chill's patchpack. Should I just write into terminal patch p0 -i chillspatchpack.diff or I have to go to openttd folder or somewhere. 14:13:29 <artti> I have ubuntu 14:13:43 <Noldo> how did you get openttd in the first place? 14:14:01 <Noldo> and have you heard of compiling 14:14:03 <glx> you must be in openttd source root dir 14:17:35 <Belugas> hello 14:19:22 <artti> I'm trying to find openttd source root dir, but unsuccesfully. 14:19:47 <TinoDidriksen> How did you install OpenTTD? 14:21:37 <planetmaker> artti, did you download or checkout OpenTTD's source code? 14:21:42 <artti> Well fromSoftware center 14:21:47 <planetmaker> That does NOT come with the game you download for playing 14:21:53 <artti> from Ubuntu Software center 14:21:57 <planetmaker> Patches for OpenTTD do NOT apply to compiled software 14:21:58 *** Adambean [~AdamR@82.hosts.reece-eu.net] has joined #openttd 14:22:06 <planetmaker> e.g. not to the binary you run to play the game 14:22:26 <artti> I found finally root dir 14:22:30 <TinoDidriksen> Software Center doesn't give you the source. You need to download that separately. 14:23:39 <artti> Software center provides with 1.0.3 version, but I downloaded 1.4.something and then Software center install it. 14:24:14 <artti> so I move patch file to root dir and run code, right 14:24:16 <TinoDidriksen> Even so, a .deb generally does not give you the source. 14:24:37 <Pinkbeast> artti> Um. Do you know what "source" is, and have you ever compiled anything? 14:25:13 <TinoDidriksen> Wasn't there a wiki page for applying patches? 14:25:23 <planetmaker> you didn't download version 1.4. Trust me 14:25:55 <artti> Maybe I have complied(haven't been behind the computer for long time), I could follow the instructions easily... 14:25:58 <artti> 1.1.4 it was 14:26:11 <planetmaker> artti, may I suggest that you just use the pre-compiled binaries of chill's patchpack? 14:26:14 <Pinkbeast> Not "complied", but "compiled". 14:26:33 <artti> So I can't apply patch on already installed game. I have to download the source. 14:26:34 <planetmaker> http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/chillpp/releases/ 14:26:43 <planetmaker> yes, (of course) 14:26:51 <artti> Compiled, yes. =) 14:27:16 <artti> Already downloaded the patch 14:27:32 <TinoDidriksen> You downloaded the source patch. That link has the finished package. 14:28:10 <Pinkbeast> ... as an RPM but not a Debian package (sure, alien or whatever they use these days, but maybe not so easy all the same) 14:28:54 <artti> Confusing... I have to go to this link to download finished package? 14:29:25 <Pinkbeast> artti> You might take a look at http://wiki.openttd.org/GNU/Linux which explains how to obtain the source and compile it on Linux. 14:29:26 <planetmaker> the link I gave gives you a working version of OpenTTD 14:29:30 <planetmaker> no further work needed 14:29:56 <planetmaker> it's not meant to patch anything, it's a complete game 14:29:56 <artti> Right... yes, I see it now, I thought it's just place for patch. 14:30:06 <artti> Great. 14:30:32 <Pinkbeast> planetmaker> perhaps I'm missing something, but in LATEST there I see only Red Hat packages. 14:31:03 <planetmaker> I could have sworn to have deleted 'LATEST'. Ignore that 14:31:08 <planetmaker> go by the creation date 14:31:34 <Pinkbeast> Ah, so artti wants http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/chillpp/releases/hca7f5804/ 14:32:13 <Pinkbeast> ... assuming they're on an x86/amd64 system anyway. :-/ 14:32:59 <artti> And now I just extract it into openttd root dir? 14:33:07 <planetmaker> there, gone, Pinkbeast ;-) 14:33:12 <planetmaker> Thx for the notification 14:33:50 <Pinkbeast> artti> It would be more clear if you stated explicitly which directory you propose to untar which files into. 14:34:00 <planetmaker> that should have builds for all OS? But yes, OpenTTD is only compiled by our CF for i386 / x64 platforms 14:34:04 <planetmaker> Irrespective of OS 14:34:05 <artti> /usr/share/games/openttd 14:34:14 <planetmaker> artti, use your home dir 14:34:30 <Pinkbeast> Er... how do you know artti's the only user? 14:34:30 <planetmaker> and create a new dir just for the chillpp 14:34:52 <Pinkbeast> And which files you propose to extract there. 14:34:57 <planetmaker> Pinkbeast, I don't. But replacing the /usr/... openttd by a patchpack version... is usually not what you want 14:35:04 <planetmaker> And it will surely mess up your package management 14:35:07 <planetmaker> Thus: don't do it 14:35:29 <Pinkbeast> surely> not with appropriate use of dpkg-divert but I take your point 14:35:58 <planetmaker> with the appropriate use of the right tools you can do nearly anything ;-) 14:36:11 <planetmaker> point is "appropriate" and "having that knowledge" 14:36:55 <Pinkbeast> Anyway, yes, if artti _is_ the only user it would certainly be best to do it in their home directory 14:36:59 <Eddi|zuHause> self compiled stuff should go in /usr/local 14:37:02 <planetmaker> it's mostly a matter of keeping maintenance work to 'very low' 14:37:59 <Pinkbeast> I think you two may have mistakenly thought I said "/usr/share/games/openttd is a good idea". :-) 14:38:40 *** artti [~artti@m213-102-86-116.cust.tele2.ee] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:38:53 <Pinkbeast> *blink* well, I guess it's academic now 14:39:26 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: you think factor 20 is difficult if all you have to do is, say, include the rest of europe, in the table? 14:39:42 <planetmaker> no, I don't think you said that, Pinkbeast ;-). I'm just splitting hairs :-P 14:40:01 <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause, possibly achievable 14:40:21 *** artti [~artti@m83-176-22-19.cust.tele2.ee] has joined #openttd 14:40:48 <artti> Now I didn't see what you were writing 14:40:50 <Eddi|zuHause> and with that i mean the standard gauge europe. france, italy, britain, hungary, yugoslavia, ... 14:41:12 <artti> Much before 14:41:33 <artti> Something with package and problems 14:42:11 <planetmaker> you missed only pedantic banter, artti ;-) 14:42:19 <artti> Anyway, seems like it's running now. 14:42:27 <planetmaker> just install the chillpp into a separate dir in your home dir and you'll be fine 14:42:29 <artti> With patch already included 14:42:33 <planetmaker> Or do other people use your machine? 14:43:09 <Pinkbeast> Good, but if you used /usr/share/games/openttd bear in mind that the package manager will likely stomp it next time the Ubuntu package is updated. 14:44:05 <artti> Nope, I'm fine keeping it in the home folder... or should I move it somewhere. 14:44:34 <Pinkbeast> If you are the only user, the home directory is a good choice. 14:44:43 <Pinkbeast> good> well... reasonable anyway 14:44:59 <artti> Thanks guys 14:46:09 <Eddi|zuHause> "Berlins senator of justice resigns after 12 days in office" 14:46:16 <artti> Yup, found openttd recently, seems lot of fun for me. 14:47:12 <Eddi|zuHause> (there were strong allegations about fishy legal advice/scams) 14:49:28 <planetmaker> oh, 12 days? 14:53:06 <TinoDidriksen> How much did the Yoggscast stream affect traffic? 14:55:44 *** TGYoshi [~TGYoshi@86.81.146.146] has joined #openttd 14:56:06 *** enr1x [~kiike@62.57.4.46.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #openttd 14:56:40 <artti> Hmm... opening a save game it says invalid chunk size. 14:57:01 <Pinkbeast> It's not compatible with saved games from other versions, no. 14:58:21 <planetmaker> artti, yes. Savegames between patched versions may not be compatible 14:58:46 <artti> All right... I live with that. I just make a new game then. :P 14:58:47 <planetmaker> that's an issue which should not happen with unpatched openttd versions and their savegames 14:59:38 <artti> Save game is from unpatched openttd version. 14:59:40 <MNIM> whole versions, mind you. not nightlies 15:02:07 <artti> Same game's earlier saves are working, but not later ones. 15:02:51 <artti> If I remember then I updated my 1.0.3 version to 1.1.4 and continued playing with saved game. 15:07:16 *** supermop_ [~daniel_er@cpe-67-243-25-39.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 15:24:54 <Eddi|zuHause> TinoDidriksen: see forum 15:28:51 <planetmaker> one could say double to triple 15:29:01 <planetmaker> with spike at 4x 15:36:39 <TinoDidriksen> And how many stuck around? 15:37:18 <planetmaker> what is "stuck around"? 15:37:44 <TinoDidriksen> Hm, difficult to quantify, I guess... 15:38:02 <planetmaker> we're still at twice the traffic 15:38:12 <TinoDidriksen> Aha, nice. 15:38:13 <planetmaker> http://stats.openttd.org/usage_201112.html 15:41:35 <__ln__> http://i.imgur.com/oxI6T.jpg 15:43:19 <peter1138> hehe 15:45:01 <peter1138> http://www.google.com/search?q=what+defines+an+english+person 15:45:07 <SpComb> tea 15:45:12 <peter1138> DO IT 15:45:18 <SpComb> oh 15:45:58 <peter1138> might give a different result for different locations i suppose 15:46:12 <SpComb> no, it gives the right result :) 15:46:22 <Eddi|zuHause> from the results page i see, i'd say "it works" :p 15:46:23 <planetmaker> I see 15:46:42 <planetmaker> but is it safe for work? :-P 15:47:11 <peter1138> well... it's google :p 15:47:12 <Eddi|zuHause> if shakespeare is safe for work, then this is as well :p 15:48:25 <Eddi|zuHause> http://usaerklaert.wordpress.com/2010/10/26/warum-landliche-angelegenheiten-bei-shakespeare-unanstandig-sind/ 15:51:17 <peter1138> hmm, wonder if my stats are back to normal 15:51:33 <peter1138> hmm no 15:51:44 <peter1138> as pm said, about double 15:51:51 <peter1138> not like the huge spike though :p 15:55:36 <peter1138> oh crap, i forgot to pause my game :S 15:55:59 <Eddi|zuHause> that rarely happens to me 15:56:11 <peter1138> oh crap, i just reverted the wrong checkout 15:56:52 <peter1138> just lost my fileslot changes :( 15:57:15 <peter1138> oh well, probably wasn't useful 16:02:30 <peter1138> hmm 16:02:33 <peter1138> pause_on_idle :p 16:04:07 <TrueBrain> NoGo 0.3 is being compiled :D Has some nice new features ... now I need someone to test them ... :D:D :) 16:04:13 <peter1138> commit!! 16:11:17 *** TWerkhoven2[l] [~twerkhove@cpc3-linl7-2-0-cust522.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: He who can look into the future, has a brighter future to look into] 16:14:11 <peter1138> TaI is nice. pikka should finish it 16:17:45 <peter1138> god damn, i keep playing as if i have CD available 16:18:00 <Eddi|zuHause> commit!! 16:18:02 <Eddi|zuHause> :p 16:21:25 <peter1138> is CETS set up for the new shorter wagon offsets yet? 16:22:36 <Eddi|zuHause> nope 16:23:02 <Eddi|zuHause> maybe in a day or two 16:23:27 <peter1138> are long vehicles drawn as parts or just one sprite? 16:24:33 <Eddi|zuHause> as parts, if they are all in a straight line, as one otherwise 16:24:34 <peter1138> oops, forgot about YAIM 16:24:42 *** Prof_Frink [~proffrink@5e0a9627.bb.sky.com] has joined #openttd 16:24:49 <peter1138> ah 16:25:09 <peter1138> cos getting alignment right around bends is a pita 16:25:24 <peter1138> £88,728/yr 16:25:28 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, i need some kind of callback for that 16:25:31 <peter1138> maybe i should not have doubletracked that... 16:25:51 <planetmaker> peter1138, TAI has IMHO one big flaw: it limits town radius actively 16:25:52 <Eddi|zuHause> otherwise it's near impossible to work around the glitches around slopes and bridges 16:26:00 <peter1138> planetmaker, does it? 16:26:03 <planetmaker> Thus a town will - from a certain point onwards - only build stupid roads 16:26:12 <peter1138> hmm 16:26:18 <planetmaker> thus you get a road grid surrounding every town. Looks ugly 16:26:23 <planetmaker> Otherwise: very nice 16:26:34 <planetmaker> at least that was my last experience with it :-) 16:26:34 <peter1138> well it is a beta 16:26:39 <Hawson> planetmaker: could you have a conditional? 16:26:42 <Eddi|zuHause> NewGRF town control!! 16:27:03 * planetmaker can have a condition :-P But wonders about the context 16:27:10 <Eddi|zuHause> this part of TaI is probably better ported to GS 16:27:14 <Hawson> if (townPop > biglimit) { use_growth_big()} else { use_growht_small() } 16:27:29 <peter1138> operating profit: £-18000 :( 16:27:34 <planetmaker> Hawson, not really. The town decides to grow. Then the house set has to supply what shall grow 16:27:43 <planetmaker> if it doesn't supply a house, a road is built 16:27:46 <planetmaker> That's what is to it 16:28:00 <planetmaker> And that's why denying all houses being built IMHO is the wrong approach 16:28:09 <planetmaker> to limit towns. Indeed the better approach here is via GS 16:28:31 <peter1138> oh, my airports are the killer 16:28:47 <peter1138> oh well, i'll get rid of them 16:28:57 <peter1138> can't afford that kinda cost :) 16:29:33 <peter1138> oh 16:29:39 <peter1138> i don't have enough money to remove them :( 16:29:46 <Eddi|zuHause> haha :p 16:30:05 <Hawson> Oooh....evil thought: 16:30:18 <Hawson> if a town hates you enough...it claims stuff via eminent domain. 16:30:32 <peter1138> removing them should put me into a money making position 16:30:51 <peter1138> would've helped if i'd remember to build up the other end of the airport link 16:31:02 <peter1138> £4,600/yr 16:31:11 <peter1138> instead of £88,000/yr 16:31:12 <peter1138> yes 16:34:58 <peter1138> hmm, road pieces cost money to maintain now 16:35:09 <peter1138> so maybe i won't randomly build pieces, heh 16:35:36 <peter1138> hrmm, still not making enough, heh 16:36:32 *** swissfan91 [5e046369@ircip1.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 16:36:36 *** artti [~artti@m83-176-22-19.cust.tele2.ee] has left #openttd [] 16:36:43 <swissfan91> evenin' 16:40:30 *** welshdragon [~welshdrag@client-81-107-130-178.midd.adsl.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 16:40:39 <peter1138> who put these rivers in the game? 16:40:45 <peter1138> they're annoying, i have to bridge them :p 16:40:53 <Eddi|zuHause> that'll need some getting used to... not trying to fix the town roads 16:40:59 <peter1138> yeah 16:41:45 <Eddi|zuHause> maybe we need a GS that fixes them 16:41:50 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: TschÃŒÃ] 16:45:02 <__ln__> http://torrentfreak.com/copyright-corruption-scandal-surrounds-anti-piracy-campaign-111201/?_ 16:46:39 *** Jocke [~jocke@h132n1-t-a11.ias.bredband.telia.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:50:10 *** Jocke [~jocke@h132n1-t-a11.ias.bredband.telia.com] has joined #openttd 17:00:41 *** Wolfsherz [~Wolfsherz@46.115.2.24] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 17:01:36 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@ip-86-49-59-25.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:02:08 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@ip-86-49-59-25.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 17:17:09 *** pugi [~pugi@dyndsl-091-096-011-015.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has joined #openttd 17:18:07 *** sla_ro|master [~slaco@95.76.26.172] has joined #openttd 17:24:22 *** TomyLobo [~foo@p54946140.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Standby mode...] 17:27:33 *** TWerkhoven[l] [~twerkhove@cpc3-linl7-2-0-cust522.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 17:36:37 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@88.130.171.194] has joined #openttd 17:37:31 <swissfan91> how many snow transitions can a building handle? 4? 17:38:41 <TrueBrain> over 9000? 17:39:21 <V453000> 8999 :p 17:40:41 *** pugi [~pugi@dyndsl-091-096-011-015.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has quit [Quit: I reject your reality and substitute my own] 17:41:10 <swissfan91> as in... the transition from having no snow, to full snow. 17:41:40 *** andythenorth [~Andy@78-86-194-127.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 17:41:47 *** andythenorth [~Andy@78-86-194-127.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has left #openttd [] 17:43:04 <swissfan91> i think planetmaker told me it was 4 17:43:14 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 [~Flex@88.130.164.107] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:47:24 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 17:50:53 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590f5bf8.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 17:52:45 *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@d5152B25B.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 17:53:34 <planetmaker> TrueBrain, technically 253 as the height variable is limited to that distinction... though of course one could introduce a gradient on flat terrain, too ;-) 17:54:04 <TrueBrain> planetmaker: you shouldn't ask me :) Or you completely missed the joke :) 17:54:06 <TrueBrain> like by miles :) 17:54:10 <TrueBrain> ask = tell 17:54:12 <planetmaker> I didn't :-P 17:54:37 <planetmaker> I just wanted to nitpick on the wrong path :-P 17:55:22 <planetmaker> I guess we have a limit somewhere with the sprite limit... not sure though where that actually might be... hm 17:55:37 <planetmaker> action2 IDs? 17:57:27 <planetmaker> in any case there's 4 snowy states + no snow 18:00:07 <swissfan91> I see. so 5 sprites of the same building, plus two construction stages is it? 18:01:23 <planetmaker> times. And however many construction stages you want. You can go from 1 (only finished) to 4 (3 building in progress, 1 finished) 18:01:36 <planetmaker> your choice on how many you use 18:02:00 <planetmaker> But having at least one construction stage is nice imho 18:02:31 <planetmaker> and indeed the snow state need not necessarily be reflected on the building being built (though imho should on the ground also for constructio nstages) 18:11:12 *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@d5152B25B.access.telenet.be] has quit [Quit: oO] 18:11:25 *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@d5152B25B.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 18:11:34 <frosch123> hmm, ottd settings are so screwed up... 18:13:24 <frosch123> i would like to change the title of "advanced settings" window into "advanced settings for new games" resp. "advanced settings for current game". then i notices i should do the same for difficulty settings and game options. except that in game options only a few settings affect the current game, while the rest is not game specific :p 18:14:40 <frosch123> looks like "currency", "drive side" and "town names" need to be moved 18:14:50 <frosch123> the latter 2 would fit into map generation 18:14:57 <frosch123> no idea where to put "currency" :p 18:15:54 <michi_cc> Maybe we need to dust of http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=876616#p876616 again :) (The different panes, not the NewGRF GUI). 18:16:31 *** George [~George@212.113.107.39] has joined #openttd 18:16:36 <frosch123> but that's not the five minute patch i was heading for :p 18:22:14 *** Devroush [~dennis@ip-213-49-88-200.dsl.scarlet.be] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:26:48 <planetmaker> :-) 18:27:11 *** swissfan91 [5e046369@ircip1.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 18:27:16 <planetmaker> We need three things, probably: game options, user settings and (newgame) settings 18:27:28 <planetmaker> though I'm not sure about the distinction of game options and user settings 18:29:22 <Yexo> there is also a 3rd category: company settings 18:29:38 <Yexo> those affect a new company in a MP game, but they are stored in the savegame 18:30:11 <Yexo> 1) Settings that are stored in a savegame (including advanced settings, newgrf settings, AI settings and difficulty settings) 18:30:36 <Yexo> 2) GUI settings (most of game options, all client-only advanced settings) 18:30:49 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: rubidium * r23499 /extra/masterserver_updater/src/masterserver/ (handler.cpp masterserver.h udp.cpp): 18:30:49 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: [MSU] -Feature: send multiple packets, instead of limiting the amount of servers returned 18:30:49 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: [MSU] -Change: reduce the MTU so packets are getting through to those that are cut off from proper internet 18:31:14 <Yexo> 3) Company settings (those affect a new company, but they are stored in the savegame). This doesn't fit in well with either 1) or 2) 18:31:15 <planetmaker> good point, Yexo 18:31:27 <planetmaker> thus: 18:31:30 <Yexo> I think 1) needs to be moved to the newgame window 18:31:35 <planetmaker> 1) User (UI) settings 18:31:42 <planetmaker> 2) per-company settings 18:31:49 <planetmaker> 3) per-game settings 18:32:13 <planetmaker> yes, I agree. Everything only affecting new games should be behind the "new game" button 18:32:21 <planetmaker> especially newgrfs and AI 18:33:13 *** supermop_ [~daniel_er@cpe-67-243-25-39.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: supermop_] 18:36:17 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@ip-86-49-59-25.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:38:02 *** pjpe [ade6a119@ircip2.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 18:38:08 *** pjpe [ade6a119@ircip2.mibbit.com] has quit [] 18:38:41 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@ip-86-49-59-25.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 18:39:03 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@ip-86-49-59-25.net.upcbroadband.cz] has left #openttd [] 18:42:23 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: translators * r23500 /trunk/src/lang/ (10 files): (log message trimmed) 18:42:23 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0: 18:42:23 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: belarusian - 24 changes by Wowanxm 18:42:23 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: czech - 65 changes by ReisRyos 18:42:23 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: estonian - 16 changes by runekri3 18:42:24 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: french - 3 changes by glx 18:42:24 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: german - 6 changes by NG 18:51:33 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: yexo * r23501 /trunk/src/saveload/saveload.cpp: -Fix: loading scenarios downloaded from the online content didn't work anymore 18:52:29 <Xaroth> planetmaker: and game scripts 18:52:30 <Xaroth> :P 18:53:55 <planetmaker> :-) 18:54:27 *** pjpe [ade6a119@ircip1.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 18:55:44 <Xaroth> but with what michi showed, would be useful to integrate newgrf/gs into that same UI 18:56:04 <Xaroth> instead of having 5 settings windows for 5 areas, 1 with 5 tabs is more easy to navigate to 19:00:25 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host48-239-dynamic.16-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #openttd 19:00:37 <Wolf01> evenink 19:06:08 *** JVassie [~James@2.25.209.121] has joined #openttd 19:12:13 <planetmaker> Xaroth: no doubt, yes 19:12:47 *** DOUK [~KEM@ALyon-158-1-64-157.w90-29.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:13:03 <planetmaker> Xaroth: my idea is to add the other tabs similarily http://imagebin.org/188048 19:13:35 <planetmaker> but... looong way and not too high on my too full list of things to do 19:15:06 <Eddi|zuHause> it wasn't that long ago that our settings window was changed from tabs to tree :) 19:16:06 <planetmaker> I know :-) 19:16:33 <planetmaker> I'd keep the settings as tree 19:17:10 <planetmaker> actually a start might be to link the different 'settings' (adv. settings, difficulty, newgrf, ai at least) from the new game window 19:17:15 <planetmaker> and work on from there 19:17:17 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc1-aztw25-2-0-cust298.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 19:17:24 <Xaroth> yeh 19:17:30 <Xaroth> but the tree works, but only so far 19:17:32 <Xaroth> atm the tree is too big 19:17:38 <Xaroth> and no clear boundries exist 19:17:43 <Xaroth> making it hard to find certain settings 19:17:52 <planetmaker> you can minimize it to less than a dozen entries ;-) 19:18:18 <Eddi|zuHause> maybe a start to splitting the settings into basic/advanced/expert is to put them in different levels of the tree 19:18:24 <andythenorth> efening 19:18:35 <planetmaker> and many options have no clear affiliation to one or the other category 19:18:40 <andythenorth> make it user configurable 19:18:43 <andythenorth> and in squirrel 19:18:45 <andythenorth> with xml 19:18:49 <Eddi|zuHause> doesn't need any architectural changes 19:18:50 <andythenorth> [whatever it is] 19:21:03 <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause: imho that doesn't solve the issue really. It's cosmetic on the symptoms 19:21:22 <planetmaker> might even make it worse to find a setting 19:21:32 *** RetiredNavyVet [~Gary_n_Sa@cpe-76-88-70-139.san.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 19:23:43 <andythenorth> can a newgrf detect which base set is in use and change graphics appropriately? 19:24:23 <Eddi|zuHause> no 19:24:26 <andythenorth> why not? 19:24:27 <Eddi|zuHause> and never ever will 19:24:35 <andythenorth> besides the obvious MP explosion potential with varact2 19:24:49 <Eddi|zuHause> that is the exact reason 19:24:53 <andythenorth> hmm 19:25:07 <andythenorth> so I have to provide a parameter to switch graphics :( 19:25:13 <andythenorth> or spam the station building menu 19:25:29 <Eddi|zuHause> won't help with multiplayer either 19:25:58 <andythenorth> meh 19:26:05 <Eddi|zuHause> if of 5 players 2 have original and 3 have opengfx 19:26:57 <RetiredNavyVet> sorry, but whats varact2? 19:27:06 * andythenorth applies for official 'victim' status 19:27:09 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: frosch * r23502 /trunk/src/ (newgrf_engine.cpp vehicle_base.h): -Fix (r23143): Vehicle var 42 used a cargo translation table of the wrong GRF. 19:27:26 <Eddi|zuHause> either your sprites must be generic enough to fit both, or you need to reference the baseset sprites 19:28:21 <Terkhen> hello 19:28:24 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: frosch * r23503 /trunk/src/newgrf_engine.cpp: -Fix (r23143): Desync debug wants to resolve vehicle variables of vehicles without NewGRF. So, let it. 19:28:29 <andythenorth> there's some reason (I forget) why stations can't use base tiles 19:28:34 <andythenorth> it's railtype related 19:28:39 <andythenorth> or I am telling lies 19:29:19 <planetmaker> they can afaik 19:29:25 <planetmaker> or? 19:29:47 <RetiredNavyVet> nice work in OpenGFX+ pm..thanks for the tip! 19:29:56 * andythenorth should specify the case more precisely 19:30:03 <andythenorth> I don't know why I care tbh 19:35:02 *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@d5152B25B.access.telenet.be] has quit [Quit: oO] 19:38:00 *** KritiK [~Maxim@95-24-170-82.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd 19:41:01 <planetmaker> :-) thx, RetiredNavyVet. 19:41:16 <planetmaker> thouch I only did some coding parts 19:46:19 *** mahmoud [~KEM@ALyon-158-1-64-157.w90-29.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #openttd 19:47:25 *** TWerkhoven[l] [~twerkhove@cpc3-linl7-2-0-cust522.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: He who can look into the future, has a brighter future to look into] 19:49:14 *** Biolunar [~mahdi@blfd-5d823439.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 20:02:38 *** DOUK [~KEM@ALyon-158-1-80-53.w90-29.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #openttd 20:03:52 <andythenorth> hmm 20:04:02 <andythenorth> I could action A the base set sprite 20:04:32 <andythenorth> replacing it to match CHIPS, rather than vice-versa 20:05:14 <Eddi|zuHause> how crazy 20:06:02 <andythenorth> you think? :P 20:06:09 <andythenorth> it's become a minor obsession 20:06:14 <andythenorth> pointlessly 20:06:21 <andythenorth> like playing solitaire or such 20:06:38 <frosch123> station tiles with track should use the default railsprite as first ground sprite 20:06:46 *** mahmoud [~KEM@ALyon-158-1-64-157.w90-29.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:06:52 <frosch123> so that railtype grfs can draw the proper overlay 20:07:01 <frosch123> non-track station tiles can draw whatever they want 20:07:14 <frosch123> and of course you can draw additional groundsprites on top 20:09:12 <andythenorth> I don't even think this is a valid issue to solve 20:10:06 <andythenorth> I'm just being strange and obsessive 20:12:56 * andythenorth doesn't like it when there's no right answer 20:13:24 <frosch123> oh, i think there is a right answer in many cases; just that you do not like it :p 20:13:53 <andythenorth> what's the right answer in this case? 20:14:23 <frosch123> i do not know the question 20:14:37 <frosch123> so i try 42 20:14:54 <andythenorth> make CHIPS 'mud' stations match both OpenGFX and original sprites, in MP safe way 20:15:10 <frosch123> is there some screenshot? 20:15:42 <andythenorth> no 20:15:42 <andythenorth> http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=984780#p984780 20:15:51 <andythenorth> there is a right answer 20:15:53 <andythenorth> remove them 20:16:05 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: take the baseset grass as base tile, and the mud as partially transparent sprite? 20:16:30 <andythenorth> which mud though? 20:16:42 <andythenorth> original TTD mud, or OpenGFX mud? 20:17:41 <frosch123> the mud station i just build does not seem to be very baseset specific 20:17:59 <andythenorth> I suspect that removing *is* the correct solution to this problem, conceptually 20:18:08 <andythenorth> practically, it's not very desirable 20:19:06 <frosch123> i see no problem with the current mud station... so i do not get the question 20:19:24 <andythenorth> are you using opengfx? 20:19:29 <frosch123> yes 20:19:34 <frosch123> tried both 20:19:54 *** pugi [~pugi@dyndsl-091-096-011-015.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has joined #openttd 20:21:39 <andythenorth> hmm 20:21:42 <Eddi|zuHause> is there an nml constant for "end articulation callback"? 20:21:44 <andythenorth> concrete tiles have the same issue 20:22:34 <frosch123> Eddi|zuHause: "it was forgotten" was the result of a recent discussion 20:23:11 <frosch123> andythenorth: chips mud looks neither like opengfx mud nor like original mud 20:23:16 <frosch123> so what's the problem? 20:23:18 <frosch123> it fits with both 20:23:58 <andythenorth> the problem is that I am obsessive :P 20:24:39 <andythenorth> but yes - it doesn't match original mud tile(s) either 20:24:51 <andythenorth> it was supposed to, but I guess I screwed up :) 20:25:05 <Eddi|zuHause> why is that necessary? 20:25:58 <andythenorth> matching to original mud? 20:26:07 <Eddi|zuHause> yes 20:26:21 <andythenorth> CHIPS is designed to fit seamlessly with FIRS 20:26:33 <andythenorth> when I play FIRS, it uses original mud tile (the one with wheel tracks) 20:26:37 <andythenorth> for many industries 20:27:30 <andythenorth> I'd file it under 'does this really matter?' though 20:27:46 <frosch123> andythenorth: well, if you want to use the same mud as the basetile, then draw the mud the same way as the basetiles do 20:28:02 <frosch123> note that railtiles get their mud via recolouring, not via different sprites 20:28:19 <frosch123> (though i am not sure that railtypes properly handle that, but they might/should) 20:28:59 <frosch123> so, draw the default rail ground tile, but recoloured with sprite 0x317 20:29:07 <andythenorth> that is intriguing 20:29:32 <andythenorth> didn't think of that route 20:30:23 <andythenorth> so this silly discussion led to something productive :) 20:34:44 *** NicoNet2k [~Chris@cpe-76-188-161-222.neo.res.rr.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:35:06 *** NicoNet2k [~Chris@cpe-76-188-161-222.neo.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 20:37:47 <RetiredNavyVet> see Mom!?! games are productive!!! 20:39:13 <planetmaker> that's indeed a very interesting approach, frosch123 :-) 20:39:30 <frosch123> not my idea :p 20:40:13 <frosch123> but of course all of you should study ttdviewer more closely :p 20:41:28 <planetmaker> :-P 20:54:07 *** Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.a98.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #openttd 20:56:37 * andythenorth has nothing left to do but play the game 20:56:39 <andythenorth> :o 20:57:21 <frosch123> what game? open trucky truck deluxe? 20:57:57 <andythenorth> open tram tycoon deluxe 20:58:01 <andythenorth> no trucks in 1894 :P 20:58:04 <andythenorth> no good ones anyway 20:59:07 <planetmaker> maybe it's time again for an open toy tycoon deluxe... 20:59:20 * andythenorth tries FIRS 20:59:26 <andythenorth> apparently it's nearly done :P 21:00:19 <planetmaker> or open toy tycoon diaper? 21:09:32 <V453000> open trucky truck deluxe :DD 21:10:06 <frosch123> do not blame me for that :) 21:10:50 *** Devroush [~dennis@ip-213-49-88-200.dsl.scarlet.be] has joined #openttd 21:17:05 *** Lakie [~Lakie@host81-141-101-27.wlms-broadband.com] has joined #openttd 21:21:13 <andythenorth> that would be more like open trucky truck (pick subtypes to refit the number of trailers needed) deluxe 21:23:20 <andythenorth> hmm 21:23:27 <andythenorth> why is there nowhere to take milk in FIRS? 21:24:36 <frosch123> what kind of milk? liquid or piece goods? :p 21:25:48 <V453000> or alcoholic milk? 21:26:04 <andythenorth> frosch123: I've no idea :P 21:26:09 <andythenorth> did Eddi|zuHause fix the spec yet? 21:27:19 *** RetiredNavyVet [~Gary_n_Sa@cpe-76-88-70-139.san.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: ( www.nnscript.com :: NoNameScript 4.22 :: www.esnation.com )] 21:40:28 *** Devroush [~dennis@ip-213-49-88-200.dsl.scarlet.be] has quit [] 21:42:54 *** Lakie [~Lakie@host81-141-101-27.wlms-broadband.com] has quit [Quit: .] 21:44:24 *** Cahata [~Ugnis@78.60.166.204] has joined #openttd 21:50:17 <frosch123> night 21:50:21 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590f5bf8.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:52:18 *** Adambean [~AdamR@82.hosts.reece-eu.net] has quit [Quit: Gone fishing] 21:55:23 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc1-aztw25-2-0-cust298.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 21:56:13 <Terkhen> good night 21:58:33 *** Neon [~Neon@dslb-178-004-183-061.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Python is way too complicated... I prefer doing it quickly in C.] 22:05:30 <Markk> http://i.imgur.com/xUiBp.jpg http://i.imgur.com/M5xOG.jpg 22:05:40 <Markk> My four towns are growing a bit too big now. 22:10:26 <peter1138> heh 22:14:48 <Cahata> hello ai want to ask is openttd works only with ttd or maybe also with tt ? 22:17:48 <Zuu> It works without TTD or TT 22:18:09 <Zuu> You can use the TTD graphics if you have access to the CD, but it is not neccessary. 22:19:20 <Cahata> it can use tt graphic not ttd ? 22:19:24 <appe> Markk: neat. 22:19:39 <Markk> appe: :) 22:19:45 <Zuu> Cahata: I don't think the TT graphics will work. 22:20:28 <Zuu> Just get the installer (or apt-get install openttd) and you should get started with the free/open graphics. 22:20:52 <Cahata> thanks 22:21:00 <Cahata> great game :) 22:21:18 <Zuu> There are several people who prefere them over the original graphics. Others prefere to use the old graphics. 22:22:15 <Markk> I prefer the original one. 22:22:42 <Zuu> I like OpenGFX better 22:26:49 <planetmaker> TT graphics won't work, only TTD and OpenGFX; the installers can only install OpenGFX. 22:28:00 <Cahata> that sad tt more sexy 22:28:13 <Cahata> ttd have some not very relistic stuff 22:28:37 <Cahata> of cource i mean tt winh no moon graphic pach 22:29:04 <Cahata> tt is superior stategic game icream graphic not very make its fun 22:29:27 <Cahata> thats only my opinion but i believe so ... 22:30:28 *** DDR [~chatzilla@142.179.78.88] has joined #openttd 22:34:04 *** TGYoshi [~TGYoshi@86.81.146.146] has quit [Quit: Popidopidopido] 22:42:18 <Wolf01> 'night 22:42:22 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host48-239-dynamic.16-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 23:19:39 *** Kurimus [~stabbity@dsl-tkubrasgw3-fe93dd00-34.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [] 23:23:01 *** JVassie [~James@2.25.209.121] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:23:06 <planetmaker> g'night 23:25:21 *** Cahata [~Ugnis@78.60.166.204] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:33:23 *** pjpe [ade6a119@ircip1.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 23:37:07 *** KenjiE20 [kenjie20@free.blinkenshell.org] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.5] 23:37:11 *** Elukka [Elukka@78-27-74-30.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 23:37:16 *** KenjiE20 [kenjie20@free.blinkenshell.org] has joined #openttd 23:43:00 *** sla_ro|master [~slaco@95.76.26.172] has quit [Quit: Sla Mutant Co-Op for Renegade - coming back soon] 23:46:16 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: TschÃŒÃ] 23:50:55 *** Biolunar [~mahdi@blfd-5d823439.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: All your IRC are belong to us!] 23:56:32 *** sllide [~jari@ip565eb113.direct-adsl.nl] has joined #openttd