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00:21:11 <planetmaker> apropos, Zuu, do you have any repo which is a start of a tutorial script? 00:23:20 <Zuu> Not publicly available, but I'll send you a copy of my current state in a PM. (to late to spend time on testing/publishing right now) 00:24:28 <planetmaker> yes, too late now for most. I just saw you write a line and wanted to ask you for the last two days already ;-) 00:26:40 <planetmaker> and yes, I'd love to get a look at it - and a start to get playing with it myself 00:28:21 *** fjb|tab is now known as Guest21307 00:28:21 *** Guest21307 [~frank@p5DDFD410.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:28:22 *** fjb|tab [~frank@p5DDFD410.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 00:28:37 <Zuu> planetmaker: Have a look at your inbox 00:29:08 <Zuu> It's the same framework as I posted on the forums, just with some more Step types. 00:29:20 <Zuu> I belive save/load is not fully implemented yet. 00:29:35 <Zuu> But I really start to doubt if that is going to be a priority at all. 00:29:49 <Zuu> Anyway, it's late. So have fun and talk later. 00:30:05 <planetmaker> yeah, sleep well :-) 00:39:23 *** Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.a98.priv.bahnhof.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:42:17 *** pugi [~pugi@dyndsl-091-096-002-124.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has quit [] 01:24:45 *** Brandon_ [~Brandon@pool-71-176-37-23.nrflva.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Brandon_] 01:30:48 <vargadanis> from what company age is it allowed to buy competitors' shares? 01:33:37 <vargadanis> 6 01:34:53 *** dlr365 [~Doug@d142-59-83-184.abhsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd 01:36:44 *** mahmoud [~KEM@ALyon-158-1-122-134.w90-29.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:50:48 *** vargadanis [vargadanis@catv-89-135-23-65.catv.broadband.hu] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:55:08 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: TschÃŒÃ] 02:07:25 *** rhaeder [~quix0r@dslb-088-076-111-195.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:23:43 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:c181:57e9:8e13:f4cf] has quit [Quit: bye] 02:26:58 *** pjpe [ae5b52e7@ircip2.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 02:30:46 *** LordPixaII [~pixa@85.210.73.76] has joined #openttd 02:30:46 *** Pixa [~pixa@85.210.73.76] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:44:30 *** chris__0076 is now known as chris_0076 02:49:46 *** supermop_ [~daniel_er@cpe-67-243-25-39.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 03:12:18 <stinkyfax> what should I do when my town requires Food and Water to grow, (i provide food) but town has no buildings which would accept Water??? i'm like WTF 03:46:42 *** pjpe [ae5b52e7@ircip2.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 03:46:45 *** pjpe [ae5b52e7@ircip4.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 03:59:09 *** pjpe [ae5b52e7@ircip4.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 04:30:30 *** pjpe [ae5b52e7@ircip3.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 04:35:27 *** Elukka [~Elukka@78-27-84-248.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 05:04:20 *** Pixa [~pixa@85.210.73.76] has joined #openttd 05:06:09 *** KingPixaIII [~pixa@85.210.73.76] has joined #openttd 05:06:24 *** LordPixaII [~pixa@85.210.73.76] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 05:12:22 *** Pixa [~pixa@85.210.73.76] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 05:16:43 *** KingPixaIII [~pixa@85.210.73.76] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 05:19:13 *** LordPixaII [~pixa@85.210.73.76] has joined #openttd 05:36:49 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@ip-86-49-59-25.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 05:38:05 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@ip-86-49-59-25.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:39:36 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@ip-86-49-59-25.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 05:43:10 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@ip-86-49-59-25.net.upcbroadband.cz] has left #openttd [] 05:51:43 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B731F5.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:51:59 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B744A7.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 06:10:07 *** dlr365 [~Doug@d142-59-83-184.abhsia.telus.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:13:11 *** sla_ro|master [slaco@95.76.26.172] has joined #openttd 06:26:35 *** Prof_Frink [~proffrink@5e0a9627.bb.sky.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 07:25:32 *** sla_ro|master [slaco@95.76.26.172] has quit [Quit: Sla Mutant Co-Op for Renegade - coming back soon] 07:34:27 *** supermop_ [~daniel_er@cpe-67-243-25-39.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: supermop_] 07:46:47 *** fjb|tab [~frank@p5DDFD410.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 07:46:56 *** rhaeder [~quix0r@dslb-178-006-057-234.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 07:49:17 *** Alberth [~hat@a82-95-164-127.adsl.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 07:49:20 *** mode/#openttd [+o Alberth] by ChanServ 07:57:44 *** fjb|tab [~frank@p5DDFF31D.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 07:59:23 <Alberth> moin 08:04:42 <appe> stinkyfax: you can fund it. 08:05:22 <appe> stinkyfax: http://wiki.openttd.org/Industries#Funding_New_Industries 08:05:52 <appe> stinkyfax: check out the data under the "Tropical" section. 08:08:09 *** Neon [~Neon@dslb-094-219-186-227.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 08:10:29 *** Pulec [~pulec@static-cl093181068250.unet.cz] has joined #openttd 08:45:08 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1A5FE.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 08:55:35 *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@d5152B25B.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 09:01:23 *** LordPixaII is now known as Pixa 09:05:55 *** Adambean [~AdamR@88.97.144.82] has joined #openttd 09:15:20 *** DDR [~chatzilla@142.179.78.88] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.87 [Firefox 8.0/20111115183541]] 09:24:14 *** perk11 [~perk11@188.32.29.238] has joined #openttd 09:28:40 <__ln__> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-16292244 09:44:28 <peter1138> big fireworks 09:49:02 *** Neon [~Neon@dslb-094-219-186-227.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Python is way too complicated... I prefer doing it quickly in C.] 09:51:32 *** mahmoud [~KEM@ALyon-158-1-62-121.w90-29.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #openttd 09:56:14 <stinkyfax> appe: i can't see water tower in the list :( though there are water towers in other towns 10:01:35 *** perk11 [~perk11@188.32.29.238] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 10:07:04 *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@d5152B25B.access.telenet.be] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:11:18 <Alberth> appe: open eyes and look at the 4th entry, perhaps? 10:11:30 <Alberth> oh stinkyfax ^ 10:15:34 *** pjpe [ae5b52e7@ircip3.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 10:25:49 *** andythenorth [~Andy@host86-180-12-160.range86-180.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 10:25:56 <andythenorth> interesting physics problem 10:26:08 <andythenorth> big log trucks have planetary reduction gears in the wheel hubs 10:26:19 <andythenorth> the gears can be swapped out for different ratios 10:26:43 <andythenorth> to suit, e.g. hauling on steep grades (slow), or hauling on level roads (hammer down) 10:26:52 <andythenorth> how do I fake that in game? 10:26:58 <peter1138> gear refit ;p 10:27:32 <andythenorth> yup 10:27:35 <peter1138> ottd doesn't simulate gears, so it doesn't matter 10:27:40 <andythenorth> but what props do I change? TE? 10:28:09 <peter1138> max-speed & TE, usually 10:29:21 <andythenorth> ta 10:29:29 <andythenorth> wonder if it will suck 10:30:13 <peter1138> automatic or manual? 10:30:59 <andythenorth> transmission? Or changing of props? 10:31:47 <peter1138> property changing 10:32:10 <andythenorth> manual maybe 10:32:15 <andythenorth> haven't decided 10:32:26 <andythenorth> thinking about varying number of trailers too 10:32:28 <peter1138> if it's automatic then you won't notice it, so just give it high TE and high max speed 10:36:57 <andythenorth> hmm 10:37:03 <andythenorth> sounds complicated to play? 10:40:19 * andythenorth ponders a French economy for FIRS 10:40:24 <andythenorth> to go with French trainset 10:40:27 <andythenorth> what's French? 10:45:15 <planetmaker> crÚpes, vin, champagner, boisin, ...? :-) 10:45:15 <peter1138> planetmaker, is there a 32bpp-ez opengfx devzone yet? ;) 10:45:15 <planetmaker> I didn't create a project yet 10:45:15 <planetmaker> There's the existing project by Geektoo which creates the extra grf as 32bpp 10:45:15 <peter1138> extra grf? 10:45:15 <planetmaker> of the base sets 10:45:21 <planetmaker> there you can't simply sprite-replace 10:45:32 <peter1138> huh? 10:45:37 <planetmaker> as you don't know when the underlaying grf changes 10:45:49 <peter1138> hm 10:45:54 <planetmaker> thus you better provide your own grf (ogfxe_extra.grf / openttd.grf) 10:46:19 <peter1138> that's a sort of spanner in the works for 32bpp-only basesets. hmm. 10:46:45 <planetmaker> though.... I offered the 32bpp people to give ample notification of changes in the sprite numbers of the extra grf 10:46:51 <planetmaker> it's not like it changes all the time 10:47:33 <planetmaker> but indeed, for this reason a 8bpp + 32bpp joint baseset makes sense 10:48:21 <andythenorth> hmm 10:48:27 <andythenorth> rename the brewery to Vineyard? 10:48:30 <andythenorth> for French 10:48:49 <planetmaker> dunno... who suggested yesterday to first create a makefile which can create sprites from the blender files directly? I guess it was TB. And that makes sense 10:49:02 <planetmaker> Though one could already collect proper blender files 10:49:10 <peter1138> me & tb 10:49:19 <planetmaker> :-) 10:49:26 <planetmaker> I very much like that idea 10:49:30 <peter1138> i talked about making stuff from source using a tracking table with offsets 10:49:34 <planetmaker> And it will be feasible 10:49:37 <peter1138> i kinda implied blender source but didn't meantion it 10:49:40 <peter1138> *mention 10:49:43 <planetmaker> yeah :-) 10:50:19 <planetmaker> It needs a bit of work, and I don't yet know whether and how well blender can be run as non-gui scripted application 10:50:37 <planetmaker> gimp can. But also has some issues with that ;-) 10:50:40 <peter1138> still need a concenus on png-in-tar-file vs custom-container 10:50:53 <planetmaker> that's your call :-) 10:51:17 <planetmaker> imho don't let yourself guide by existing sprites. Just create a sane spec 10:51:50 <planetmaker> with blender files present, and giving wrong lighting, dimensions, ... of existing, it will need re-rendering of most anyway 10:52:00 <peter1138> yeah 10:52:04 *** Biolunar [~mahdi@blfd-4d083446.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 10:52:10 <peter1138> but grfcodec is kind of a pain :) 10:52:13 <planetmaker> feasible, probably even relatively easy, if blender files and definitions are there 10:52:25 <planetmaker> why grfcodec? 10:52:35 <planetmaker> you want them really within the grf itself? 10:52:42 <peter1138> just as an example of a tool needed to put sprites in a container 10:52:48 <planetmaker> ah 10:52:58 <planetmaker> well... so within a tar won't do? 10:53:03 <planetmaker> maybe tar in tar? 10:53:11 <planetmaker> if that would make it easier? 10:53:19 <peter1138> within a tar is ok, but our filescanning isn't geared up to be used this way 10:53:41 <planetmaker> yes :S 10:54:23 <peter1138> what i'm thinking of is checking for 'related' files when *opening* a grf file 10:54:57 <peter1138> then LoadNextSprite can check the related files 10:56:05 <peter1138> i.e. ogfx1_base.grf -> ogfx1_base_2x.tar & ogfx1_base_4x.tar 10:56:24 <planetmaker> as a new 'property' or feature for the grf files? 10:56:30 <planetmaker> ah 10:56:56 <peter1138> implied filenames, no new property. it needs to work for non-newgrfs too :) 10:57:08 <planetmaker> non-newgrfs? 10:57:14 <planetmaker> like base sets? yeah 10:57:26 <peter1138> base grfs, yes 11:00:18 * SpComb replaces newgrf with lua 11:00:25 <peter1138> do it 11:01:32 <peter1138> i could use a file slot for each png :p 11:01:40 <planetmaker> :-P 11:02:05 <SpComb> I was just playing PewPew, and started wondering if it'd be fun to write a clone in OpenGL/Qt 11:02:06 <planetmaker> SpComb: if you do that, do it properly: use xml and let it define the single voxels bit by bit 11:02:30 <SpComb> but then it'd be JS, not lua 11:02:34 <andythenorth> croissant factory 11:02:56 <planetmaker> hm... jummi 11:03:06 <peter1138> openlocomotion's going well 11:03:10 <andythenorth> BN factory? 11:03:35 * SpComb has never done OpenGL directly 11:04:49 <SpComb> bt understanding it would be useful for writing animated eye-candy GUIs 11:05:00 <SpComb> which is what you tend to get paid for these days 11:05:15 *** andythenorth [~Andy@host86-180-12-160.range86-180.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 11:05:39 <stinkyfax> SpComb: u get payed for gui in html5 with javascript, not opengl :) 11:05:57 <peter1138> u? 11:05:58 <SpComb> but that html5 gui stuff uses OpenGL 11:06:04 <SpComb> in the background 11:06:33 <stinkyfax> aye, and opengl uses assembly, so make an assembly wrap? 11:06:43 <SpComb> done that already 11:06:52 <SpComb> althoguh, well, not x86 or GPU 11:06:54 <stinkyfax> :)) 11:08:46 <stinkyfax> i afraid people playing TTD care the least about graphics :) 11:10:14 <SpComb> they care the most 11:10:36 <SpComb> doing loving pixel-pushing by hand, rather than just rendering 3D models by machine 11:10:54 <stinkyfax> ok, good luck with that. if you need some help let me know, I did a coursework with opengl, so i might remember few bits, buut mostly not :D 11:11:22 <stinkyfax> 3d pushes pixel by pixel as well but does it many more times :))) 11:11:53 <planetmaker> stinkyfax: write an OpenGL blitter for OpenTTD... 11:11:54 <stinkyfax> i think u should focus on delivering 2d first :) 11:12:05 <planetmaker> and it's "you", not "u" 11:12:14 <SpComb> planetmaker: didn't someone do that already? 11:12:35 <peter1138> opengl blitter, hehe 11:12:44 <stinkyfax> planetmaker: but it's an irc chat, why be so official? 11:13:37 <peter1138> r u shore u 1t 2 b slakin jus cuz its on irc 11:14:11 <planetmaker> :-) 11:14:37 <peter1138> planetmaker, I feel dirty :( 11:14:41 <stinkyfax> peter1138: there is always a reasonable border 11:16:03 * planetmaker gives a language gargle solvent to peter 11:16:22 <fjb|tab> stinkyfax: Not everybody is a native English speaker here. 11:16:34 <planetmaker> I'd bet the majority isn't ;-) 11:17:35 * planetmaker looks at op list and finds... two 11:17:41 <peter1138> I'd bet stinkyfax isn't :) 11:18:26 <peter1138> "u" doesn't look very native English to me ;) 11:18:36 <fjb|tab> And most are old enough to not have to kewl anymore. 11:18:37 <stinkyfax> I'm not. But it has nothing to do to native English 11:19:22 <planetmaker> that's exactly the reason to write proper English, though 11:19:41 <stinkyfax> this slang is common among gamers, internet lovers, etc, not native English people 11:19:44 <planetmaker> it's about making it easy for people from all around the globe to understand this channel 11:19:58 <SpComb> #openttd - your internet lovers :) 11:20:26 <planetmaker> "all flies eat shit - so just dig in?" 11:20:46 <stinkyfax> if only I was a fly 11:21:18 <stinkyfax> cya (see you) later. 11:21:27 * fjb|tab bets that there are more train and truck lovers in here than internet lovers. 11:21:57 <__ln__> stinkyfax: what's common is irrelevant, because the channel topic states "English only". 11:27:21 <planetmaker> http://devs.openttd.org/~planetmaker/patches/indstatr-v0.8.1.tar.zip <-- anyone fancy a quick check whether it works alright? 11:31:07 <peter1138> the station triggers don't seem to work 11:31:08 <Alberth> stinkyfax: slang tends to get in the way of clearly explaining problems in a precise manner 11:34:58 *** rhaeder [~quix0r@dslb-178-006-057-234.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:37:16 *** rhaeder [~quix0r@dslb-188-100-221-014.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 11:37:17 <planetmaker> peter1138: got an example (I'm not aware I changed any of that code...) 11:38:30 <planetmaker> or could you check whether it's the same behaviour with 0.8.0? 11:38:37 <planetmaker> by just replacing newgrfs? 11:39:00 *** TGYoshi [~TGYoshi@86.81.146.146] has joined #openttd 11:40:28 *** mkv` [~Markavian@j616s.co.uk] has joined #openttd 11:42:38 *** Svish [~torleif85@ti0009a380-dhcp1384.bb.online.no] has joined #openttd 11:42:39 <peter1138> planetmaker, station triggers aren't implemented ;) 11:43:17 *** Svish is now known as Guest21371 11:43:49 *** andythenorth [~Andy@host86-180-12-160.range86-180.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 11:43:55 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1A5FE.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:44:11 *** Guest21371 [~torleif85@ti0009a380-dhcp1384.bb.online.no] has left #openttd [] 11:47:16 *** Markavian` [~Markavian@j616s.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:47:22 <planetmaker> :-P 11:48:28 *** rhaeder1 [~quix0r@dslb-178-009-014-242.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 11:53:01 <andythenorth> cheese 11:53:21 *** rhaeder [~quix0r@dslb-188-100-221-014.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:53:28 <andythenorth> cheese is french 11:54:55 <planetmaker> or Swiss 11:56:49 <andythenorth> maybe a 'Euro' economy is sufficient :P 11:57:09 <Alberth> The French don't have cheese, they have 'fromage' 11:57:27 <peter1138> ah oui oui, le fromage 12:00:05 *** fjb|tab is now known as Guest21372 12:00:05 *** Guest21372 [~frank@p5DDFF31D.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:00:06 *** fjb|tab [~frank@p5DDFF31D.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 12:04:03 *** rhaeder1 [~quix0r@dslb-178-009-014-242.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:07:33 <andythenorth> hmm 12:07:42 <andythenorth> trucks were crappy in 1910 12:09:40 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-227-214.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 12:14:02 <peter1138> trains 12:14:06 <peter1138> and barges 12:15:51 *** tokai [~tokai@port-92-195-142-240.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:17:11 <andythenorth> barge trains 12:18:22 <andythenorth> does the game use short ton, metric ton, or long ton? 12:18:34 <Eddi|zuHause> yes 12:18:45 <andythenorth> ok 12:18:46 <andythenorth> good 12:18:50 <andythenorth> :/ 12:19:21 <planetmaker> nfo uses iirc uk tons 12:19:30 <planetmaker> whatever that is 12:20:23 <planetmaker> for the sake of newgrf programming I use them with a conversion factor 1:1 - though OpenTTD's gui does a correct conversion depending on the unit settings you chose 12:22:39 <andythenorth> ho 12:22:41 <andythenorth> "A century ago, trucks were hardly more than an idea among forward-thinking vehicle manufac- turers. Long-distance haulage was undertaken by rail and water, local distribution by horse-drawn wagon. There was simply no market for trucks, the pundits noted. But optimists saw an unex- ploited business opportunity." 12:30:13 <Eddi|zuHause> sounds horribly over-glorified 12:31:51 *** Biolunar [~mahdi@blfd-4d083446.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: All your IRC are belong to us!] 12:31:53 <andythenorth> from a Scania 'centenary of Scania' PDF :P 12:33:28 <andythenorth> so basically trucks are crap until about 1930 12:33:48 <andythenorth> although you could haul 120t with three traction engines at 5mph 12:39:09 *** vargadanis [~vargadani@130.43.194.45] has joined #openttd 12:39:22 <vargadanis> well hello TTD Fans :) 12:40:59 <Alberth> where? 12:41:21 * planetmaker favours openttd ;-) 12:41:27 * Alberth never played TTD, only TTDX and a lot of OpenTTD :) 12:41:51 <planetmaker> Alberth: ttd == ttdx, if I'm not mistaken ;-) 12:41:56 <KenjiE20> ^ 12:41:57 <planetmaker> TT is the predecessor 12:42:20 <Alberth> ah, ok. Thanks :) 12:43:22 <TrueBrain> DeluXe 12:43:27 <TrueBrain> never understood why 12:43:55 <KenjiE20> mine was DeLuXe 12:44:07 <TrueBrain> so TTDLX? 12:44:13 <KenjiE20> always installed to C:\MPS\TTDLX 12:49:08 *** Dani_ [~vargadani@130.43.194.45] has joined #openttd 12:56:03 *** vargadanis [~vargadani@130.43.194.45] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:56:25 *** Dani_ [~vargadani@130.43.194.45] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:56:33 *** Dani_ [~vargadani@130.43.194.45] has joined #openttd 13:07:01 <Dani_> how do I share orders between trucks? 13:07:13 <Alberth> clone the orders 13:07:47 <Dani_> will that mean that if I change the order on the 'lead' truck the orders will change among all the trucks that share the order? 13:08:22 <Alberth> any truck that uses the orders will do, they are shared, you know :) 13:10:05 *** Svish [~torleif85@ti0009a380-dhcp1384.bb.online.no] has joined #openttd 13:10:27 <Svish> anyone here? 13:10:37 *** Svish is now known as Guest21382 13:11:00 <Alberth> no 13:11:05 <planetmaker> I think 175 people are here... theoretically 13:11:18 <planetmaker> But... no, it's all bots, really 13:11:27 *** Guest21382 is now known as Svish 13:11:45 <Svish> sweet 13:11:47 <Alberth> but if you want to know something, our bots are quite smart :) 13:12:22 <DorpsGek> roger roger 13:12:42 * Alberth pets DorpsGek 13:12:53 <Svish> how do you set up a dedicated server? do I have to run the game normally first and set all the settings in the title screen there, and then exit and start as dedicated server? and how do I set settings which are not in the Advanced Settings tree? 13:13:46 <planetmaker> edit your cfg to suit your needs and start openttd by ./openttd -D -c configfile 13:15:13 <Svish> ah, so I can create a copy of the config file and use that specifically when I start the server? 13:15:15 <Svish> cool 13:15:44 <planetmaker> you don't need to create a copy really. You can also use the same cfg. But might be nicer to not overwrite it with your single player settings 13:17:46 <Svish> right 13:19:03 *** Devroush [~dennis@ip-83-134-181-162.dsl.scarlet.be] has joined #openttd 13:27:18 <Svish> is it possible to download the config of a running server? 13:28:02 <Dani_> OMG! Shared orders for the win! 13:28:07 <Alberth> not as file, but the config is part of the savegame 13:28:12 <Belugas> hello 13:28:26 <planetmaker> Svish: not really 13:28:48 <planetmaker> but every savegame / map has the config within it which it was created with 13:28:56 <planetmaker> just need to check all interesting settings 13:29:21 <Svish> so I can just use the save thing in a multiplayer game and then open up the save file? 13:30:12 <Svish> hm seems opening up a save file wasn't just a matter of opening it with 7zip :p 13:30:33 * andythenorth tries to have a nap 13:30:34 *** andythenorth [~Andy@host86-180-12-160.range86-180.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 13:31:20 <planetmaker> Svish: what do you expect to see then? It's binary data... 13:31:27 <Alberth> Svish: 'opening' can only be done by loading it in the the game 13:35:46 *** andythenorth [~Andy@host86-180-12-160.range86-180.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 13:36:09 *** andythenorth [~Andy@host86-180-12-160.range86-180.btcentralplus.com] has quit [] 13:36:11 <Svish> well, since you wrote "every savegame has the config within it", I assumed it was an archive file including that file or something :) 13:36:49 <Svish> found I could write listsettings in the console when connected to a server though. although it's a pain to look through it... but at least I can see it :) 13:38:12 <Svish> how can I set the autoclean options so that a player can be go and have a decent night of sleep before returning without having their company disappear? 13:38:45 <Alberth> you want your users to sleep? :D 13:39:49 <Alberth> http://wiki.openttd.org/Autoclean_companies there is probably more, but I never looked into MP config stuff 13:40:12 <Svish> well, I would like to be able to sleep myself yes, and then come back to continue :p 13:45:55 <Svish> how long is a game month in regular time? 13:46:00 *** sla_ro|master [slaco@95.76.26.172] has joined #openttd 13:46:15 <Alberth> http://wiki.openttd.org/FAQ_gameplay#How_long_is_a_game_day_in_real_time.3F 13:46:34 <Alberth> you may want to extend the page for your question :D 13:48:08 *** fjb|tab [~frank@p5DDFF31D.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:49:53 <Svish> so 24 hours would be roughly 105 game years 13:50:23 <V453000> about that yes :) 13:51:02 <Eddi|zuHause> that is one whole game (from 1950 to 2050) 13:51:35 <Svish> is it possible to extend this somehow? or perhaps just stretch out the time so that you get new vehicles slower or something? 13:51:52 <Eddi|zuHause> no official way (yet) 13:51:59 <Eddi|zuHause> but unofficial "daylength patches" 13:52:04 <Svish> thinking something along the lines of Civilization 5 where you have quick games, longer and epic games 13:52:11 *** dlr365 [~Doug@d142-59-83-184.abhsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd 13:52:24 <Svish> ok 13:52:45 <Eddi|zuHause> being "unofficial" makes them very ill-suited for multiplayer, though 13:53:52 <Svish> right 13:54:12 <Alberth> you can play until the year 5000000 or so 13:54:51 <Alberth> but you don't get new vehicles after 20XX-somthing 13:54:53 <Eddi|zuHause> you should start in 2050 in this case, so you won't have any development at all 13:54:56 <Svish> the reload_cfg, is that for it to reload the cfg when game is restarted? 13:55:18 <Eddi|zuHause> that's for when you modified the file 13:55:37 <Svish> ah, so it will reload it everytime I change it? 13:55:57 <Eddi|zuHause> no, by default all changes to the file are ignored (and overwritten) 13:56:12 <Eddi|zuHause> reload_cfg will override that default 13:58:06 <Svish> aah 13:59:46 *** andythenorth [~Andy@host86-180-12-160.range86-180.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 14:01:46 *** Lakie [~Lakie@109.176.221.103] has joined #openttd 14:02:32 *** andythenorth [~Andy@host86-180-12-160.range86-180.btcentralplus.com] has quit [] 14:08:10 *** Dani__ [~vargadani@130.43.194.45] has joined #openttd 14:15:03 *** Dani_ [~vargadani@130.43.194.45] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:17:19 *** TomyLobo2 [~foo@p4FC23E9E.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 14:19:03 *** Dani__ [~vargadani@130.43.194.45] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:23:10 *** TomyLobo [~foo@p4FC23B9E.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:23:11 *** TomyLobo2 is now known as TomyLobo 14:23:23 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@ip-86-49-59-25.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 14:27:11 <Svish> hm, I cannot start server... is there a log somewhere with why? 14:29:26 *** andythenorth [~Andy@host86-180-12-160.range86-180.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 14:30:49 <Eddi|zuHause> console output? 14:37:00 <Svish> well, in the console it just said could not startserver 14:37:33 <Svish> when I start the serverfrom the windows console, itopens a new window which flashes some error and closes again 14:38:40 <Eddi|zuHause> try setting debug_level net=2 on the console 14:38:51 <Eddi|zuHause> (the ingame console i mean) 14:39:23 <Eddi|zuHause> (and possibly "developer 2") 14:41:58 <Svish> can I do that in the config file? 14:43:08 <Eddi|zuHause> the debug level cannot be set in the config file 14:43:19 <Eddi|zuHause> but from the command line 14:44:15 <Eddi|zuHause> start with "openttd.exe -d net=2" or similar 14:49:10 <Svish> aah, you can open that ingame console while in the title screen too 14:54:02 *** mahmoud [~KEM@ALyon-158-1-62-121.w90-29.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Quit: Quitte] 14:58:28 <andythenorth> hmm 14:58:37 <andythenorth> there's no point putting really crappy trucks in a set 14:58:52 <andythenorth> start trucks later, or fake speeds? 14:59:15 <andythenorth> irl, speeds were restricted by law more than by engineering 14:59:21 *** dlr365 [~Doug@d142-59-83-184.abhsia.telus.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:04:42 <Svish> aaa, I can't get this server to run. turning on debug_level didn't make anything more helpful appear in the console either 15:06:25 <Ammler> the time you need to solve a issue on windows, you can setup a linux system 15:06:51 <Ammler> (well, with other issues included) :-P 15:07:16 <Svish> i'll take the issues in windows over the mess in linux any day :p 15:08:04 <Svish> besides, it works to start a server on my laptop, so it must be something weird on my other computer... are there issues with the 64bit version when it comes to servers? 15:08:15 <Ammler> no 15:09:30 <Ammler> does it just say "could not start server", nothing more? 15:10:23 <Ammler> openttd works as usual client? 15:11:04 *** TheDude [~honza3@2.237.broadband7.iol.cz] has joined #openttd 15:13:56 <Svish> Ammler: yeah. very unhelpful. and when starting from the console, it does seem to says something but it flashes open in a new window which closes too fast 15:17:32 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1A5FE.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 15:18:40 *** Lakie [~Lakie@109.176.221.103] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:22:07 <Eddi|zuHause> Svish: did you set "developer 2" like i told you? 15:24:34 *** fjb|tab [~frank@p5DDFE7A1.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 15:27:13 <Svish> oh, is that different from the debug_level net=2? 15:27:34 <Svish> tried to just set debug_level 2 as well, does that include developer? 15:28:09 <Eddi|zuHause> no 15:28:32 <Eddi|zuHause> the "developer" setting decides where debug output appears (stdout vs. ingame console) 15:30:35 *** mahmoud [~KEM@ALyon-158-1-62-121.w90-29.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #openttd 15:34:02 <Svish> ooh, ok 15:34:04 <Svish> will try that then 15:36:26 <andythenorth> traction engines + trailers: BANDIT or HEQS? 15:37:54 <Eddi|zuHause> HEQS 15:38:01 <andythenorth> +1 15:41:04 <Svish> Eddi|zuHause: http://i42.tinypic.com/aev21j.png 15:41:26 <Svish> why does it try to look up the hostname E? is that why it fails? 15:41:40 <Eddi|zuHause> very likely 15:41:50 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: beer - barrels or crates? :P http://www.hankstruckpictures.com/pix/trucks/goudy/white/standard_brewing_1911_white_3t.jpg 15:41:56 <Eddi|zuHause> maybe you have a weird HOSTS file? 15:42:04 <Eddi|zuHause> or something in your .cfg? 15:48:06 <Svish> can't find anything 15:49:52 <Svish> meh, I give up 16:01:55 *** supermop [~daniel_er@rrcs-72-43-171-87.nyc.biz.rr.com] has joined #openttd 16:06:19 *** vargadanis [vargadanis@catv-89-135-23-65.catv.broadband.hu] has joined #openttd 16:07:24 <peter1138> http://fuzzle.org/~petern/ottd/cc3.png < reasonable? 16:12:47 <Alberth> looks like black/coloured camouflage at first sight :p 16:15:31 *** DabuYu [DabuYu@128.250.79.189] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:27:07 *** snack2 [~nn@dsl-prvbrasgw1-fe05dc00-37.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #openttd 16:27:59 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: yexo * r23656 /trunk/ (.gitignore .hgignore docs/): -Fix: make all vcs ignore docs/gamedocs/ just like docs/aidocs/ 16:29:35 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@D5225594.static.ziggozakelijk.nl] has joined #openttd 16:31:31 <andythenorth> meh 16:31:33 *** perk11 [~perk11@188.32.29.238] has joined #openttd 16:31:42 <andythenorth> adult lego fans are sometimes fuckheads 16:31:55 <andythenorth> "omg, this set looks like it was designed for little children" 16:32:02 <andythenorth> (recommended age on the box 6-12) 16:34:28 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590fe02f.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 16:34:37 *** Svish [~torleif85@ti0009a380-dhcp1384.bb.online.no] has left #openttd [] 16:35:02 <Eddi|zuHause> peter1138: now make a full replacement set :) 16:35:37 <peter1138> quite 17:03:35 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: yexo * r23657 /trunk/src/saveload/town_sl.cpp: -Fix (r22958): loading of very old savegames with custom town names failed 17:04:03 <Eddi|zuHause> @openttd log 22958 17:04:12 <Eddi|zuHause> @openttd commit 22958 17:04:13 <DorpsGek> Eddi|zuHause: Commit by rubidium :: r22958 /trunk/src/saveload (company_sl.cpp town_sl.cpp) (2011-09-23 19:49:45 UTC) 17:04:14 <DorpsGek> Eddi|zuHause: -Fix [FS#4778]: the savegame description and loading of savegames would crash with savegames from a patched stable (which didn't bump the savegame version) 17:10:31 *** Svish [~torleif85@ti0009a380-dhcp1384.bb.online.no] has joined #openttd 17:10:55 <Svish> what kind of signal distance do you guys use? 17:15:05 <planetmaker> any. You'll probably get every answer from 1 to 15 17:17:22 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@ip-86-49-59-25.net.upcbroadband.cz] has left #openttd [] 17:18:14 <Svish> if most of my trains are between 4 and 5 tiles long, what distance would you recommend? 17:19:19 <Yexo> it really depends on your playing style 17:19:36 <Yexo> if you play with trunk and enable infrastructure maintenance, probably 5 or 6 17:19:54 <Yexo> if you play without that and are optimizing your network for efficiency, 2 17:20:07 <Yexo> otherwise whatever looks best for you 17:25:05 <frosch123> http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=986651#p986651 <- Xaroth: was there a diff which was removed after your post? 17:35:26 <peter1138> it's on the luukland.net site 17:35:52 <peter1138> "Download Single Player City-Builder" 17:38:27 <frosch123> does that count as gpl violation? 17:38:56 <planetmaker> imho yes, though it's border line 17:39:09 <planetmaker> look at copying, frosch123 17:39:27 *** welshdragon [~welshdrag@client-82-31-3-251.midd.adsl.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 17:40:31 *** welshdragon [~welshdrag@client-82-31-3-251.midd.adsl.virginmedia.com] has left #openttd [] 17:41:18 <frosch123> oh, that's even better 17:41:50 <frosch123> quite a bad-ass gang :p 17:42:16 <Rubidium> should we send a nice mail to their provider? 17:42:46 <frosch123> i don't think its worth the effort 17:43:22 <andythenorth> heh 17:43:29 <andythenorth> at least COPYING is somewhat funny 17:44:08 <Rubidium> it's a serious violation 17:44:26 <Rubidium> IMO even more serious than not adding one, as this has definitely been added this way 17:45:18 <andythenorth> "and they were all like, whatever dude" 17:45:48 *** KouDy [~KouDy@ip-89-176-248-203.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 17:45:56 <andythenorth> nothing in their stuff about GPL or attribution that I could find 17:47:12 *** Belugas [~belugas@216.191.111.237] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:49:54 *** Belugas [~belugas@216.191.111.237] has joined #openttd 17:49:57 *** mode/#openttd [+o Belugas] by ChanServ 17:59:20 <Eddi|zuHause> somewhen i want to play a game with signal distance 24 17:59:50 <Eddi|zuHause> but not before CETS is somewhat playable, and we have "realistic braking" 18:03:37 <V453000> realistic braking? 18:03:39 <V453000> o_O 18:04:52 <Eddi|zuHause> V453000: a train reserves (at least) its braking distance, and when there is a speed limit (bridge, curve, red signal, ...) within that reservation, it gradually slows down (like with stations) 18:05:59 <V453000> right 18:06:11 <V453000> but what if a red signal suddenly flicks in front of it 18:06:18 <Eddi|zuHause> that never happens 18:06:38 <Eddi|zuHause> (except with player intervention) 18:07:27 <Rubidium> a green path signal never goes red; even in the real world it's really hard to get it back to red 18:07:40 <V453000> oh, it works only with path signals? 18:07:45 <Rubidium> IIRC here the route stays locked for at least two minutes 18:07:58 <Eddi|zuHause> even a green block signal never goes red, because all other block signals will be forced to red in that case 18:08:10 *** Pulec|MCM [~pulec@static-cl093181068250.unet.cz] has joined #openttd 18:09:07 <Eddi|zuHause> V453000: it should work with block signals as well 18:09:08 <V453000> well a green pre-signal can go red basically anytime based on the conditions 18:09:30 *** Neon [~Neon@dslb-094-219-186-227.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 18:09:33 <V453000> or when an another train tries to enter the same block? 18:09:52 <Rubidium> not with the premise that the reserved path acts like a train being there 18:09:56 <Eddi|zuHause> V453000: another train cannot enter the block, as a reservation counts like a train being in the block 18:10:16 <TWerkhoven[l]> the train reserves the entire path or blocks, and all signals therein will be red 18:10:18 <TWerkhoven[l]> right? 18:10:25 <blathijs> Doesn't this need yellow signals for a train to slow down? 18:10:30 <Eddi|zuHause> and the presignal condition will be ignored once the reservation has been placed through the signal 18:10:36 <blathijs> Otherwise there is nothing that could ever stop a train? 18:10:37 <TWerkhoven[l]> only cosmetically 18:10:45 *** Pulec [~pulec@static-cl093181068250.unet.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:10:56 <Eddi|zuHause> blathijs: "yellow signal" is just eyecandy 18:10:58 <TWerkhoven[l]> the train will see the red signal within its stopping distance, and slow down 18:11:03 <V453000> I am wondering how is that going to work 18:11:16 <TWerkhoven[l]> so when are you starting on implementing it eddi? 18:11:17 <Eddi|zuHause> blathijs: a train slows down, when the reservation fails (because of a forced-red signal) 18:11:43 <blathijs> Eddi|zuHause: Ah, right, you just prevent a signal from going red when the train passes by, not it going red when the train is far away 18:11:46 <blathijs> I see :-) 18:11:50 <Eddi|zuHause> TWerkhoven[l]: my implementation status is "waiting on michi_cc to pop up with a ready implementation" :) 18:12:23 <TWerkhoven[l]> hehe 18:13:49 <Terkhen> hello 18:18:46 *** Elu [~Elukka@78-27-84-248.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 18:19:45 <Yexo> blathijs: don't want to bug you too much, but a new OpenGFX will require a package of nml 18:22:30 *** Adambean [~AdamR@88.97.144.82] has quit [Quit: Gone fishing] 18:24:04 *** Elukka [~Elukka@78-27-84-248.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:24:08 *** TheMask96 [~martijn@lust.vhost.ne2000.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:26:05 *** perk11 [~perk11@188.32.29.238] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 18:28:44 *** TheMask96 [~martijn@wrath.vhost.ne2000.nl] has joined #openttd 18:33:31 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host48-239-dynamic.16-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #openttd 18:33:37 <Wolf01> o/ 18:41:40 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: translators * r23658 /trunk/src/lang/ (9 files): (log message trimmed) 18:41:40 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0: 18:41:40 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: german - 12 changes by planetmaker 18:41:40 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: hungarian - 52 changes by Brumi, IPG 18:41:40 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: indonesian - 17 changes by fanioz 18:41:41 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: italian - 4 changes by Snail_, lorenzodv 18:41:41 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: malay - 156 changes by kazlan68 18:42:58 *** pjpe [ae5b52e7@ircip3.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 18:42:58 *** Xaroth [~Xaroth@059-057-128-083.dynamic.caiway.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:48:11 <Eddi|zuHause> it's a wolf!! all hide!! 18:49:49 *** fjb|tab is now known as Guest21417 18:49:49 *** Guest21417 [~frank@p5DDFE7A1.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:49:50 *** fjb|tab [~frank@p5DDFE7A1.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 18:56:14 * Alberth hides behind eddi 18:56:46 <Wolf01> aww.. I don't see anymore Alberth :( 18:57:12 * Alberth unhides from eddi, and hugs Wolf01 :) 18:57:18 *** pugi [~pugi@host-091-097-005-171.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has joined #openttd 18:57:40 <Wolf01> :D 18:57:45 <blathijs> Yexo: No problem, keep bugging me :-) 18:57:55 <blathijs> Yexo: I'll probably have some time this weekend or next week 18:58:02 <Eddi|zuHause> "i don't have to outrun the wolf, i only have to outrun YOU" 18:58:41 * Wolf01 repeatly clicks on blathijs (like on warcraft 2) 18:58:58 <planetmaker> blathijs: and by Saturday you'll have a new release of OpenGFX 18:59:11 <planetmaker> or somewhen Saturday latest 18:59:36 <blathijs> planetmaker: Good to keep the pressure on ;-) 18:59:46 <planetmaker> :-P 19:00:00 * planetmaker hugs blathijs 19:04:33 *** Xaroth [~Xaroth@059-057-128-083.dynamic.caiway.nl] has joined #openttd 19:05:36 <Rubidium> only saturday? ;) 19:06:02 *** Devroush [~dennis@ip-83-134-181-162.dsl.scarlet.be] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:06:37 <planetmaker> I shall see 19:10:55 <Eddi|zuHause> saturday is when the presents are delivered 19:13:53 <andythenorth> are we releasing anything for Christmas? 19:13:54 <andythenorth> new FIRS? 19:14:07 * andythenorth is chasing BANDIT 19:23:05 *** Lakie [~Lakie@109.176.242.224] has joined #openttd 19:30:04 <Eddi|zuHause> "Finland discovers patriot rockets en route from germany to south korea, declared as 'fireworks'" 19:33:23 <andythenorth> electric trucks? 19:33:31 <andythenorth> stupid idea? 19:34:21 <Eddi|zuHause> maybe futuristic ones? 19:34:42 <andythenorth> 1905 19:34:56 <andythenorth> quite a lot of battery trucks before internal combustion engines were good 19:35:24 <Eddi|zuHause> that fits around the time when prussia experimented with battery powered railcars 19:36:19 <Eddi|zuHause> (to replace steam engines on its vast network of minor branch lines) 19:36:31 <andythenorth> is it worth limiting range? 19:36:45 <andythenorth> nah 19:37:04 <andythenorth> the diesel trucks don't have to refuel either 19:37:16 <Eddi|zuHause> range limits are only effective for aircraft 19:39:16 *** Mucht [~Martin@chello084115143107.3.graz.surfer.at] has joined #openttd 19:39:28 *** Lakie [~Lakie@109.176.242.224] has quit [Quit: bbiab] 19:40:07 *** sla_ro|master [slaco@95.76.26.172] has quit [Quit: Sla Mutant Co-Op for Renegade - coming back soon] 19:41:52 *** KritiK [~Maxim@89-178-77-58.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd 19:43:15 *** TheD [~honza3@2.237.broadband7.iol.cz] has joined #openttd 19:44:30 *** Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.a98.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #openttd 19:47:20 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: rubidium * r23659 /trunk/ (known-bugs.txt readme.txt): -Doc: behaviour of file searching in general, and in tars specifically 19:48:03 *** TheDude [~honza3@2.237.broadband7.iol.cz] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 19:52:36 *** TheD [~honza3@2.237.broadband7.iol.cz] has quit [] 19:52:49 *** TheDude [~honza3@2.237.broadband7.iol.cz] has joined #openttd 19:56:39 *** pjpe [ae5b52e7@ircip3.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 20:01:36 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: rubidium * r23660 /trunk/src/crashlog.cpp: -Feature-ish: add the game script to the crash log 20:02:06 <vargadanis> I can see text like road expansion complete above the heads of the competitor AIs.. what are those? 20:02:19 <vargadanis> above competitors' HQ that is 20:03:13 <Rubidium> probably debug texts 20:04:10 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1A5FE.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Progman] 20:04:24 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1A5FE.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 20:08:16 <Eddi|zuHause> in the nightlies you can disable showing competitor's signs 20:16:24 *** Elu [~Elukka@78-27-84-248.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [] 20:18:41 <andythenorth> hmm 20:18:47 <andythenorth> rv-wagons for christmas? 20:19:04 <Terkhen> don't know, ask santa 20:19:04 <Rubidium> definitely not this one ;) 20:19:30 *** Svish [~torleif85@ti0009a380-dhcp1384.bb.online.no] has left #openttd [] 20:21:38 <andythenorth> @seen santa 20:21:39 <DorpsGek> andythenorth: I have not seen santa. 20:22:48 <andythenorth> bah 20:22:55 *** George [~George@212.113.107.39] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:23:34 * andythenorth looks forward to a lot of dicking around with refits for trailers :| 20:25:26 *** Svish [~torleif85@ti0009a380-dhcp1384.bb.online.no] has joined #openttd 20:26:05 *** Svish is now known as Guest21425 20:27:27 *** Guest21425 [~torleif85@ti0009a380-dhcp1384.bb.online.no] has left #openttd [] 20:29:48 *** Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.a98.priv.bahnhof.se] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:31:41 *** George [~George@212.113.107.39] has joined #openttd 20:31:58 *** Adambean [~AdamR@82.hosts.reece-eu.net] has joined #openttd 20:35:41 *** Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.a98.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #openttd 20:36:14 *** Wolfsherz [~Wolfsherz@p57A6DF1D.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 20:38:23 <Eddi|zuHause> i think CETS is nearing nmlc-explosion 20:39:21 <Eddi|zuHause> took something like 5:20 now... 20:39:51 <Eddi|zuHause> and memory consumption doesn't look well either 20:40:19 *** chris_0076 [~Chris_007@adsl-98-66-254-30.asm.bellsouth.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:40:27 <Rubidium> so start optimising nmlc ;) 20:40:49 <Eddi|zuHause> i just tripled the amount of vehicles... 20:44:16 *** Wolfsherz [~Wolfsherz@p57A6DF1D.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 20:45:08 <peter1138> have you hit 100000 sprites yet? 20:48:15 <Eddi|zuHause> cets.grf has 106932 sprites, maxx 65, maxy 41, maxs 983. 20:48:27 <Eddi|zuHause> but that's a temporary hiccups, i believe 20:48:45 <Eddi|zuHause> it should be less if i'm done 20:49:22 *** Lakie [~Lakie@109.176.242.224] has joined #openttd 20:49:54 <Eddi|zuHause> now... fixing graphics... 20:51:33 <Eddi|zuHause> hm... why do tenders not work? 20:54:34 *** Alberth [~hat@a82-95-164-127.adsl.xs4all.nl] has left #openttd [] 20:55:49 <Eddi|zuHause> oh... i think i know... 20:56:07 <Eddi|zuHause> hm... that complicates a few things 21:01:04 <Eddi|zuHause> Rubidium: i have no idea how to do python profiling 21:01:53 <andythenorth> I had no idea how to write nfo 21:01:56 <andythenorth> :) 21:03:10 <Eddi|zuHause> one problem: the dependency run takes almost as long as the final run... 21:03:22 <Eddi|zuHause> and i still don't understand why that is needed at all... 21:04:39 <Eddi|zuHause> just do a complete run, and fish the dependendcies out afterwards 21:06:25 <stinkyfax> How can I refit my train to have passengers wagons + tourist wagons. so far I found only way to have passangers or tourist wagons, but not both together 21:06:50 <Eddi|zuHause> in the refit window you can select parts of the wagons to refit 21:06:59 <Yexo> you can't do that in a stable, you'll need a nightly version 21:07:02 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:c806:255f:d535:3731] has joined #openttd 21:07:05 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 21:07:15 <Eddi|zuHause> is that a new feature` 21:07:24 <Eddi|zuHause> i thought that was already old 21:07:27 <Yexo> quite new, yes 21:07:34 <stinkyfax> ooh :( 21:07:46 <Eddi|zuHause> anyway, the other way is to remove parts of the wagons, refit, and then add the wagons again 21:08:07 <Yexo> oh, it's old already, yes 21:08:10 <Yexo> it's part of 1.1 21:08:27 <Terkhen> IIRC it should be in 1.1.x, yes 21:08:39 <Yexo> - Feature: Allow to refit only the selected part of a train consist (r21567) <- from 1.1.0-beta1 changelog 21:08:42 <Eddi|zuHause> i think that was one of the last features included in 1.1 21:08:55 <Yexo> that's about right eddi :) 21:09:10 <stinkyfax> lovely, thanks 21:09:53 <Eddi|zuHause> real 8m28.762s 21:09:54 <Eddi|zuHause> user 7m46.709s 21:09:56 <Eddi|zuHause> sys 0m5.977s 21:10:34 <Yexo> <Eddi|zuHause> one problem: the dependency run takes almost as long as the final run... <- planetmaker was busy fixing that, so it only does a single run 21:11:54 <Eddi|zuHause> Yexo: that'd easily cut off 30% 21:12:08 <stinkyfax> anyone knows solution to supply town with water when it has no water tower nor I can fund a new building "water tower"? 21:12:21 <Yexo> you need to fund the water tower industry first 21:12:53 <stinkyfax> Yexo: I can't fund water tower, there isn't such in list 21:13:00 <stinkyfax> but there are water towers in other towns 21:13:12 <Yexo> you can adjust the settings so you can fund it 21:13:20 *** TGYoshi [~TGYoshi@86.81.146.146] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:13:23 <stinkyfax> can you help me here? 21:14:13 <Yexo> advanced settings -> economy -> industry funding or so 21:14:32 <Eddi|zuHause> so... tenders working again... graphics still broken 21:15:20 * Zuu blames the OTTDAU problems reported on the forums on TrueBrain 21:15:35 <Zuu> Or more specificly, the commit message of r23649 21:15:44 <stinkyfax> Yexo: I believe it is bugged due to some of the opengfx industry vectors. 21:15:55 <stinkyfax> I tried to enable all, Now I can build water supply, but still no water tower in the list 21:15:56 <TrueBrain> @commit 23649 21:15:57 <DorpsGek> TrueBrain: Commit by truebrain :: r23649 trunk/src/saveload/game_sl.cpp (2011-12-21 12:40:29 UTC) 21:15:57 <Zuu> It has unbalanced square brackets which triggers a bug :-) 21:15:58 <DorpsGek> TrueBrain: -Fix [FS#4905) (r23634): loading a savegame with an empty GSTR chunk caused assert 21:16:08 <TrueBrain> hahahahahahaha 21:16:13 <TrueBrain> I love fiding bugs in your script :D 21:16:15 <Yexo> lol :) 21:16:25 <Yexo> stinkyfax: ok, let me try 21:16:25 <Zuu> It keeps trying to find the matching "]" over and over again. 21:17:42 <Yexo> stinkyfax: what is the value of "advanced settings -> economy -> industries -> manual primary industry construction method"? 21:18:02 <stinkyfax> it was none, I tried changing to Prospecting 21:18:33 <Yexo> "prospecting" means you give a lot of money and the game will place the industry somewhere random 21:18:40 <Yexo> or fail to place it, in which case your money is lost 21:18:56 <Yexo> anyway, the water tower should show up in the list if you set it to that 21:19:05 <Yexo> did you change the setting in-game or via the main menu? 21:19:10 <stinkyfax> in-game 21:19:48 <stinkyfax> I have many industry vectors, I think that's the cause of issue 21:19:57 <Yexo> many industry vectors? which ones? 21:20:10 <Yexo> or better yet, can you upload your savegame? 21:20:49 <stinkyfax> (all?) ECS.* Agricultural, Basic II, Chemicals II, Construction vector beta 5, Houses, Machinery vector, Wood vector 21:21:06 <Yexo> don't mix ECS with FIRS or with OpenGFX+Industries 21:21:15 <Yexo> pick one of those 3 and stick with it 21:21:33 <stinkyfax> opengfx+industries? 21:21:35 <Yexo> how did the they load at all? 21:21:37 <stinkyfax> I don't have firs 21:21:53 <stinkyfax> it's all ECS. 21:22:01 <Yexo> <stinkyfax> Yexo: I believe it is bugged due to some of the opengfx industry vectors. <- so what was that about? 21:22:18 <stinkyfax> I mean NewGFX* sorry :) 21:22:32 <Yexo> I still don't know what NewGRF would be 21:22:44 <Yexo> if you mean newgrf, you should say which newgrf, ie ECS in your case 21:22:52 <stinkyfax> well I though it's how modifications are called in openttd: newgfx 21:22:58 <Yexo> <Yexo> I still don't know what NewGRF would be <- ehm, I meant NewGFX there 21:23:08 <Yexo> no, those files are called NewGRFs 21:23:28 <stinkyfax> oh, this naming confuses me, I'll try to remember 21:23:57 <Yexo> OpenGFX is a baseset with all basic graphics which you need to play at all, OpenGFX+ is a set of NewGRFS (like OpenGFX+Trains, OpenGFX+Industries) which modify various aspects of the game 21:24:15 <Yexo> anyway, for ECS problems go complain in the forum topic about ECS 21:24:18 <stinkyfax> anotehr town requires water and food, I have trains supplying both but town doesn't grow. Should both food and water trains come to the station in same time in order to grow? 21:24:22 <Yexo> don't forget to upload your savegame there 21:24:45 <Yexo> see http://wiki.openttd.org/Towns#Town_Growth for town growth 21:24:51 <stinkyfax> thanks 21:25:38 <vargadanis> I actually tested what is written on the wiki page 21:26:08 <vargadanis> and my town went from 1500 to 17000 in the time the biggest town went from 14000 to 17000 21:26:13 <vargadanis> so that works 21:26:57 <vargadanis> ahm is there a pack for newgrfs? 21:27:13 <Yexo> why would you need a pack? You can download a lost of them via the ingame content system 21:27:14 <planetmaker> use online content# 21:28:46 <stinkyfax> Yexo: can i somehow do hacky way and insert a water tower on a given tile? 21:29:11 <Yexo> stinkyfax: no clue without your savegame 21:31:12 <stinkyfax> mhm, thanks for help :) 21:31:18 * andythenorth needs names for truck makers 21:31:34 <peter1138> ATN 21:31:46 <peter1138> OXYE 21:31:47 <andythenorth> I see what you did there 21:32:02 <andythenorth> DMK 21:32:27 <andythenorth> the other sets use geography crap 21:32:27 <peter1138> stinkytrux 21:32:33 <peter1138> maybe not :p 21:32:46 <andythenorth> mountains, glaciers, shipping areas, suburbs 21:33:04 <andythenorth> and rivers 21:33:07 <peter1138> WOMAN 21:33:47 <stinkyfax> I am curious in which language NewGRF are made? 21:33:59 <peter1138> they're made in newgrf language 21:34:04 <Yexo> nfo or nml 21:34:17 <Yexo> http://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/Main_Page or http://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/NML:Main respectively 21:36:28 <stinkyfax> ah, doubt I have enough time to pass the learning curve of new language at the moment :( 21:37:44 <andythenorth> hmm 21:37:45 <andythenorth> forests 21:37:46 <andythenorth> ? 21:38:03 <peter1138> New forst? 21:38:04 <peter1138> +e 21:38:12 <peter1138> Forest of Dean 21:38:24 <peter1138> Amazon Rain :p 21:38:39 <andythenorth> Nottingham 21:40:48 *** DDR [~chatzilla@142.179.78.88] has joined #openttd 21:40:57 *** fjb|tab [~frank@p5DDFE7A1.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:42:57 *** fjb|tab [~frank@p5DDFE7A1.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 21:50:16 *** enr1x_ [~kiike@62.57.4.46.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #openttd 21:50:23 *** mahmoud [~KEM@ALyon-158-1-62-121.w90-29.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Quit: Quitte] 21:52:04 *** enr1x [~kiike@62.57.4.46.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:58:54 * andythenorth ponders 21:58:58 <andythenorth> real truck models? 21:59:01 <andythenorth> meh 22:00:46 *** Neon [~Neon@dslb-094-219-186-227.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Python is way too complicated... I prefer doing it quickly in C.] 22:09:00 *** mahmoud [~KEM@ALyon-158-1-62-121.w90-29.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #openttd 22:21:19 *** KouDy [~KouDy@ip-89-176-248-203.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:22:56 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 22:23:18 <stinkyfax> would be cool if powerstations were part of town grow :) 22:24:20 <Yexo> hmm, disabling auto-crop for cets leads to higher compile times :s 22:26:23 <michi_cc> Yexo: The current CETS sprites have a lot of extra blue, auto-cropping is probably less expensive than the double compression here. 22:26:42 <Yexo> yep, seems so 22:27:37 <Terkhen> I wonder if you can use NoGo + NewGRFs to make power stations part of town growth 22:27:46 <Terkhen> hmm... probably, yes 22:28:28 <Eddi|zuHause> power stations need some measurable output that GS can read 22:29:15 <Yexo> cets nfo output only takes 1m10s, grf output takes 2m30s 22:29:39 <frosch123> Terkhen: we were looking into letting gs define new town effects 22:29:46 <Terkhen> http://vcs.openttd.org/svn/browser/trunk/src/town.h#L78 <--- true, it would need a TownEffect for coal 22:30:12 <Terkhen> oh, that would be nice :) 22:30:20 <Eddi|zuHause> Terkhen: that's not the proper solution, since that would include coal delivered to steel mills 22:30:21 <frosch123> but one of the problems is that newgrfs must be loaded before gs, so it needs some implicit definition 22:30:55 <frosch123> i wrote down some things to consider, but did not got yet to a sane spec :p 22:31:03 <Terkhen> so it's one of those "gets more complicated the more you think about it" problems 22:31:19 <frosch123> the idea was basically to make industries and houses produce town effects 22:31:49 <frosch123> while this seems to be easy for industries, we have no house production yet 22:32:01 <frosch123> that is, house production triggered by acceptance 22:32:25 <frosch123> you would somehow need to collect what towneffects the houses produce within the catchment area of the station :s 22:33:16 <Terkhen> hmm... what do you mean with "producing town effects"? 22:33:49 <frosch123> for industries it would be just a flag for the cargotype like "this cargo is not transportable by vehicles" 22:34:15 <frosch123> so a grf could define a cargo "electric power" with town effect "power". industries which produce it, deliver it directly to the nearest town 22:34:43 <frosch123> it could also define a cargotype "heating" or so 22:34:56 <frosch123> though maybe that would have some maximum transport distance or so :p 22:36:04 <Terkhen> oh, I see what you mean now 22:36:06 <frosch123> i.e. towneffect would be normal industry output production like any other cargo, just that it is not delivered to the nearest station, but to the nearest town 22:36:34 <frosch123> for houses we would need something similar. like "produce this towneffect, if this cargo is accepted" 22:36:39 <andythenorth> power station -> town growth is trivial 22:36:48 <andythenorth> have the industry put a value in storage 22:36:52 <andythenorth> on the town 22:36:55 <andythenorth> have nogo read the value 22:37:00 <frosch123> currently the towneffect is defined for a cargo, but defining it at the industry/house would be nicer :) 22:37:00 <andythenorth> grow the town. or not 22:37:26 <frosch123> andythenorth: yes, industries are easy :p 22:37:45 <andythenorth> frosch123: also "this cargo is not transportable by vehicles" - please ship that :) 22:37:48 <frosch123> but with the "virtual towneffect-cargo" you would also have a proper industry gui displaying the production 22:37:51 <andythenorth> I think it enabled pipelines ;) 22:38:43 <frosch123> however, the hardest problem is still the definition of the towneffects 22:39:01 <frosch123> imo gs shall define them, but grfs somehow have to know which types exist 22:39:14 <andythenorth> I'd file it under 'hard problem' 22:39:15 <andythenorth> :P 22:39:19 <frosch123> either gs must define them in advance via info.nut, or grfs may only test form them in varact2 22:39:36 <frosch123> since action7/9 are processed before any gs is loaded 22:39:42 <andythenorth> frosch123 can we take a simpler case? 22:39:47 <andythenorth> e.g. Building Materials 22:39:50 <frosch123> (unless we define them in info.nut) 22:40:03 <frosch123> (which would be stupid, since they could not be affected by settings or so) 22:40:33 *** snack2 [~nn@dsl-prvbrasgw1-fe05dc00-37.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [] 22:40:36 <andythenorth> hmm 22:40:46 <andythenorth> this makes my head hurt 22:41:30 <andythenorth> why have a magic cargo? 22:41:35 <Terkhen> good night 22:41:35 <andythenorth> cargo(s) 22:41:36 <Eddi|zuHause> so GS need loading stages 22:41:45 <andythenorth> bye Terkhen 22:42:11 <Eddi|zuHause> to set up stuff before newgrfs get activated 22:43:04 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: it's easier the other way round, NewGRFs define town effects, and GS checks for which ones are defined 22:43:14 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@D5225594.static.ziggozakelijk.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:43:44 <frosch123> sure it's easier. but is it useful? 22:44:59 <frosch123> why should a grf produce "power", "heating", "employment" or "wastedisposal" , if there is no gs which makes use of them? 22:46:00 <andythenorth> hmm 22:46:03 <frosch123> so, imo the gs must define which effects exist, then the grf can provide them, and then the gs can check again which types can actually be provided with the available grfs 22:46:33 <andythenorth> what's the goal? 22:47:13 *** KritiK [~Maxim@89-178-77-58.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:48:35 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: you're heading into a chicken-egg loop then 22:48:59 <frosch123> yup :p 22:49:17 <frosch123> but i like chicken more than eggs 22:49:17 <andythenorth> is the aim that arbitrary GS is compatible with arbitrary newgrf? 22:49:31 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: and what harm does defining town effects in the grf do, which are not checked in the GS? 22:50:10 <frosch123> a grf might check for alternatives. it might want to produce power or heating depending on whether they exist 22:50:10 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: at least you'll get funny statistics :) 22:50:32 * andythenorth wonders if it's viable to maintain separation between GS and industry newgrf 22:50:33 <frosch123> however, letting the grf defnie the towneffect puts the towncontrol into the grf, and not into the gs 22:50:53 <frosch123> andythenorth: they shall stay as separate as possible, just like house and industry grfs 22:51:09 <andythenorth> but nobody can yet define 'as possible' :P 22:51:17 <frosch123> if your house grf add powerstations which accept fuel, it might want to disable them if no fuel cargo is available 22:51:19 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: the GS must check anyway whether the GRFs actually support the TE 22:51:26 <andythenorth> ultimately seems like newgrf and GS are going to bleed together 22:51:41 <frosch123> Eddi|zuHause: currently the gs can set any te requirement, and ottd ignores not available ones 22:51:44 <andythenorth> maybe it's just better if the industry newgrf is tied to the GS 22:51:53 <frosch123> that's why alpine acutally works now in trunk :p 22:52:09 <frosch123> the food requirement in arctic is now ignored, if there is no foodish cargo 22:52:34 <Eddi|zuHause> interesting. so the Goods->TE_WATER hack can be removed from FIRS 22:52:41 <andythenorth> your house grf shouldn't be adding industry anyway, thats doing it wrong 22:53:03 <frosch123> andythenorth: sure the canadian theme pack will be extended with a canadian gs which features the exact economical data of canada from 1850 to 2010, and which will stop the game in 2010 22:53:11 <frosch123> but that should never be the goal 22:53:33 <frosch123> the goal should be modularity in independent parts, which can operate with eath other unless they mess up 22:53:46 <andythenorth> black box modularity? 22:53:58 <andythenorth> or publicly-declared interfaces modularity? 22:54:37 <frosch123> no idea, whatever suits 22:54:45 <Eddi|zuHause> i think GS defining TE is heading into a nightmare 22:54:55 <Eddi|zuHause> GRF should define TE 22:54:55 <andythenorth> I think TE is a nightmare full stop 22:55:10 <andythenorth> whatever happened to town control grfs? 22:55:59 <peter1138> i guess that idea is obsolete :) 22:56:03 <frosch123> Eddi|zuHause: the available te in a game should be the intersection of what newgrfs and gs know 22:56:43 <frosch123> it only gets hard when one of them wants to define their part of the intersection depending on the part of the other :p 22:57:29 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: railtypes can't check whether a vehicle for that railtype will be made available by any grf 22:57:32 * andythenorth is certainly confused :) 22:57:53 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: only vehicles can check whether a railtype will be available 22:57:57 <frosch123> Eddi|zuHause: but they can define tons of compatibility in case there is a vehicle for a similar railtype 22:58:04 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: and the game decides an intersection 22:58:30 <frosch123> you could do the same for te like this newgrf produces A, but if A is not present produce B instead 22:58:43 <frosch123> it would be as complicated as railtype compatibility though :p 22:59:12 <Eddi|zuHause> but not as complicated as creating a dependency on GS being loaded first 22:59:48 <andythenorth> hmm 23:00:14 *** Adambean [~AdamR@82.hosts.reece-eu.net] has quit [Quit: Gone fishing] 23:00:23 <andythenorth> so reduced to absolutes, this is *not* about GS at all, but about how one newgrf might vary production depending on presence or absence of another newgrf 23:00:57 <andythenorth> ? 23:01:06 <Eddi|zuHause> no, worse... 23:01:21 <frosch123> andythenorth: newgrfs can do that 23:01:22 * andythenorth might have skipped a few steps of the argument 23:01:35 <frosch123> but they cannot check for present gs, resp. what they do 23:01:42 <Eddi|zuHause> presence of other GRFs is a solved problem 23:01:51 <Eddi|zuHause> presence of GSs is the problem 23:02:05 <frosch123> while newgrfs are somewhat transparent to gs in at least what they define (not how it behaves), gs are totally intransparent to newgrfs :p 23:02:24 * andythenorth is not convinced it's a solved problem wrt a town grf that suddenly expects to define industries too 23:02:31 <andythenorth> but without defining cargos 23:02:33 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: i think it's best if it stays this way 23:02:42 <andythenorth> town / house /s 23:02:43 <frosch123> luckily the latter is no problem in most cases, since gs do only global stuff 23:02:56 <frosch123> Eddi|zuHause: likely :) 23:03:17 <frosch123> allows to fix stupid grfs via gs :p 23:03:59 <Eddi|zuHause> it'll get some occasional "meh"s, like not being able to check for base set 23:04:11 <Wolf01> 'night 23:04:18 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host48-239-dynamic.16-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 23:04:20 <Eddi|zuHause> but it's least likely to actually break any concepts 23:04:32 <Eddi|zuHause> or backfire 23:04:54 <andythenorth> so this proposal is - newgrf cannot change behaviour depending on GS? 23:05:18 *** TheD [~honza3@2.237.broadband7.iol.cz] has joined #openttd 23:05:22 <Eddi|zuHause> that's the "do nothing" solution :) 23:05:23 <frosch123> at least not on load 23:05:41 <frosch123> but i would assume grfs want to check for te themself :p 23:05:50 <frosch123> to display appropiate houses for towns etc 23:06:46 <andythenorth> :) 23:06:50 <frosch123> so, maybe grfs can define whatever te they want, and produce it. but the gs decides which are displayed or hidden from the user, and what effect they really have 23:07:09 <andythenorth> te is a flag? or new cargo(s)? 23:07:19 <Eddi|zuHause> grfs get a TE callback, which sorta works like the production callback 23:07:26 <frosch123> e.g. a powerplant could still produce power and make houses lighted, but the gs would not care 23:07:43 <Eddi|zuHause> i.e. by default a house produces X TE_PASSENGER upon receiving X Passengers 23:08:18 <frosch123> andythenorth: not yet decides. te are simliar to cargos is many ways, but there are also differences 23:08:30 <Yexo> if it would be a separate callback, is there any need to keep calling it "town effect"? 23:08:32 <andythenorth> I can't shake the idea of using storage 23:08:51 <andythenorth> N arbitrary registers, marked by labels if that helps compatibility 23:09:01 <Yexo> as it seems to me this would be introducing some "miscellaneous GS effect" 23:09:04 <andythenorth> newgrf can increment / decrement the amounts in the register 23:09:17 <andythenorth> GS can also increment / decrement the amounts in the register 23:09:26 <Eddi|zuHause> Yexo: so "Game Effect"? 23:09:32 <frosch123> Yexo: call it like you want, the current town effect properties would have no meaning anymore, so the term is kind of unused again :p 23:09:48 <andythenorth> but it currently has meaning, so that's confusing :P 23:09:53 <Yexo> but already calling it town effect now creates confusion with the existing town effect 23:09:59 *** TheDude [~honza3@2.237.broadband7.iol.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:10:20 <frosch123> well, the effects are summed at the nearest town 23:10:25 <frosch123> so, it is still a town effect 23:10:48 <Yexo> "New Town Effect" NTE for short? 23:10:55 <Yexo> YATE 23:11:18 <andythenorth> YAAF 23:11:25 <andythenorth> Yet Another Acronymed Feature 23:11:49 <Eddi|zuHause> basically the suggestion is to move TE from cargos to houses/industries 23:11:56 <andythenorth> urgh 23:12:04 <andythenorth> but yes 23:12:46 <andythenorth> is there anything wrong with using town storage for this? 23:12:58 <Eddi|zuHause> yes. 23:13:05 <andythenorth> ...? 23:13:10 <frosch123> towneffects are essentially the same as town storage 23:13:35 <Eddi|zuHause> "town storage" implies some kind of random access 23:13:37 <frosch123> you just have limited access to them as newgrf 23:13:42 <Eddi|zuHause> across grfs, etc. 23:13:58 <Eddi|zuHause> but the TE callback would be write only 23:14:06 <Eddi|zuHause> from GRFs side 23:14:14 <Eddi|zuHause> and read only from GS side 23:14:20 <andythenorth> so remind me... 23:14:22 <frosch123> if we make towneffects freely defineable, they would get labels. so ottd would translate them for every grf 23:14:29 <frosch123> that's not possible with registers 23:14:40 <andythenorth> for current town storage design, grf can read other grfs registers, and write it's own only? 23:14:44 <frosch123> registers would require all grf authors to agree on something, and that never worked :p 23:15:20 <Eddi|zuHause> what happened to GRM, anyway? :) 23:16:04 * andythenorth -> bed 23:16:05 <frosch123> it's used for actiona sprites 23:16:12 <andythenorth> have fun with this :P 23:16:23 <andythenorth> good night ;) 23:16:42 <frosch123> hmm, though i am not sure whether custom actiona sprites are still required somewhere 23:16:56 *** andythenorth [~Andy@host86-180-12-160.range86-180.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 23:17:01 <frosch123> ah, yes, for custom vehicle recolouring :) 23:17:02 <michi_cc> Recolour sprites? 23:17:30 <frosch123> michi_cc: yeah, but industries/houses/objects can define their recolouring in action1 meanwhile :) 23:17:44 <frosch123> so, only vehicles :p 23:18:11 <michi_cc> Advanced sprite layout for vehicles? ;) 23:18:17 <vargadanis> this is completly addicting 23:18:32 <michi_cc> Might even make sense for vehicle + cargo layering. 23:18:55 <frosch123> michi_cc: just never allow grf authors to define bounding boxes :p 23:19:11 <michi_cc> No pony for Eddi then? :) 23:19:16 <frosch123> that was already a mistake for stations and houses 23:19:39 <frosch123> custom bounding boxes are completely unneeded for stations/houses/industries, grf authors can only mess things up :p 23:22:09 <frosch123> anyway, i have a great idea! 23:22:12 <frosch123> -> bed 23:22:16 <frosch123> night :) 23:22:20 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590fe02f.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:26:13 <peter1138> http://paste.openttdcoop.org/show/856/ 23:26:14 <peter1138> ^ help? 23:27:26 <peter1138> personal_dir and shared_dir are set to \"1\" :S 23:29:17 <Yexo> you have a very old grfcodec :p 23:29:20 <peter1138> yes 23:29:31 <peter1138> but it doesn't throw an error then 23:29:38 <peter1138> it just continues with spurious values 23:31:11 <peter1138> it does return 0 23:31:19 <peter1138> i think it should either not return, or exit 1 23:31:32 <peter1138> config.lib:947 & 953 23:32:08 <peter1138> removing the "return 0s" lets it carry on and work normally 23:32:18 <peter1138> i still get that wobbly message but it's not deadly 23:32:59 <Yexo> the return 0 there is wrong indeed 23:53:09 *** TheD [~honza3@2.237.broadband7.iol.cz] has left #openttd [] 23:53:26 *** vargadanis [vargadanis@catv-89-135-23-65.catv.broadband.hu] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]