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00:00:19 *** mahmoud [~KEM@ALyon-158-1-56-215.w90-29.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:01:40 *** Phoenix_the_II [~ralph@home.deboom.biz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:12:06 *** Devroush [~dennis@ip-213-49-110-194.dsl.scarlet.be] has quit [] 00:13:47 *** Devroush [~dennis@ip-213-49-110-194.dsl.scarlet.be] has joined #openttd 00:14:17 *** MNIM [~mBuntu@ip5452ffad.adsl-surfen.hetnet.nl] has joined #openttd 00:15:12 *** Devroush [~dennis@ip-213-49-110-194.dsl.scarlet.be] has quit [] 00:17:24 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@193.52.24.37] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:31:33 *** Mazur [~mazur@5ED04965.cm-7-1b.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [Quit: Partir, c'est mourir un peu.] 00:32:28 *** Mazur [~mazur@5ED04965.cm-7-1b.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has joined #openttd 00:52:06 *** supermop [~daniel_er@rrcs-72-43-171-87.nyc.biz.rr.com] has quit [Quit: supermop] 00:52:33 *** kais58 [~kais58@cpc2-cwma8-2-0-cust293.7-3.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 00:54:18 *** Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.a98.priv.bahnhof.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:23:48 *** APTX [APTX@89-78-217-144.dynamic.chello.pl] has joined #openttd 01:23:48 *** APTX_ [APTX@89-78-217-144.dynamic.chello.pl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:26:23 *** Firartix [~artixds@108.140.0.93.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:37:00 *** Firartix [~artixds@108.140.0.93.rev.sfr.net] has joined #openttd 01:45:35 *** KritiK [~Maxim@95-24-209-172.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:11:03 *** KouDy [~KouDy@115.133.8.192] has joined #openttd 02:14:40 *** cypher [~Miranda@ip-86-49-67-69.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 02:20:10 *** lofejndif [~lsqavnbok@57.Red-88-19-214.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:29:09 *** Firartix [~artixds@108.140.0.93.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:32:35 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1A36A.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:22:18 *** kkb110_ [~kkb110@NYUFGA-WLESSAUTHCLIENTS-01.NATPOOL.NYU.EDU] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:23:58 *** kkb110_ [~kkb110@NYUFGA-WLESSAUTHCLIENTS-01.NATPOOL.NYU.EDU] has joined #openttd 03:24:52 *** pjpe [ade6a119@ircip2.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 03:38:37 *** kkb110__ [~kkb110@NYUFGA-WLESSAUTHCLIENTS-03.NATPOOL.NYU.EDU] has joined #openttd 03:38:37 *** kkb110_ [~kkb110@NYUFGA-WLESSAUTHCLIENTS-01.NATPOOL.NYU.EDU] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:00:29 *** kkb110__ [~kkb110@NYUFGA-WLESSAUTHCLIENTS-03.NATPOOL.NYU.EDU] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 04:07:58 *** Pixa [~pixa@85.210.71.193] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:12:03 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:98f4:c860:c739:7046] has quit [Quit: bye] 04:13:41 *** Markavian [~Markavian@j616s.co.uk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:15:07 *** TWerkhoven2[l] [~twerkhove@cpc3-linl7-2-0-cust522.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: He who can look into the future, has a brighter future to look into] 04:44:12 *** kkb110__ [~kkb110@cpe-69-203-124-125.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 05:01:51 *** pjpe [ade6a119@ircip2.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 05:06:56 *** pjpe [ade6a119@ircip1.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 05:26:35 *** Elukka [Elukka@78-27-90-104.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [] 05:30:32 *** cmircea [~cmircea@86.124.217.99] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:35:08 *** theholyduck [~holyduck@ip-116-154-106-77.eidsiva.net] has joined #openttd 05:56:57 *** tensai_cirno [~cirno@77.232.15.216] has joined #openttd 05:59:48 *** tokai|noir [~tokai@port-92-195-68-226.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 05:59:51 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai|noir] by ChanServ 06:05:07 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-3-164.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 06:12:25 *** tk [~tk@199.76.187.233] has joined #openttd 06:13:05 <tk> is openttd not libre? my distro provides opengfx and opengsx and seperate packages 06:13:32 <tk> does it not use these libre packages by default? 06:16:17 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-118-173.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 06:21:37 *** supermop [~daniel_er@cpe-67-243-25-39.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 06:22:05 *** tokai|noir [~tokai@port-92-195-68-226.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:25:24 *** Epi [~Epil@114-198-79-215.dyn.iinet.net.au] has joined #openttd 06:25:27 <Epi> howdy 06:26:07 <Epi> anyone know... if it's a stright line how I can work out the max distance for best profit using hovercraft? 06:27:31 <supermop> trial an error? 06:28:01 <Epi> been doing that atm, takes a while. ah well 06:31:47 <supermop> i am not sure if there is a good way to calculate it on paper 06:33:15 <DabuYu> there's the operating profit graph for passengers 06:33:54 <DabuYu> hard to get the real values from that - but you can use that, and map the operating costs of the hovercraft 06:33:56 <DabuYu> i think 06:34:24 <DabuYu> but why to do all that effort, just play the game :) 06:34:32 <supermop> well see if you can get the speed of the hovercraft in tiles per day 06:34:53 <supermop> then take the passenger payment decay graph 06:35:52 <DabuYu> (is this an idea to create an in-game optimal distance graph per unit?) 06:36:04 <supermop> and at each day mark on the x axis muliply the payment y by number of tiles the boat would have traveled by that day 06:36:13 <Epi> that would be cool, although i lack any said knoledge xD 06:36:34 <DabuYu> me too :) 06:36:42 <supermop> and at the tallest point, thats the best place 06:36:44 <Epi> i might aim for the tiles crossed per day (it's not that great, i think 6ish with the hovercraft) and passanger decay graph 06:36:44 <DabuYu> but it should be possible 06:37:06 <Epi> my friend hates them, which is why i love them xD 06:37:09 <supermop> if you can get an actual function for the decay rate it woud be easier 06:46:36 <Rubidium> tk: opensfx (sound) is less free than the other packages. It's also easily possible to play the game with Transport Tycoon Deluxe's graphics, sounds and music. So having a 'soft' dependency on the graphics isn't a bad thing 06:49:06 <Rubidium> also the sounds, graphics and music are platform independent and have their own release schedules, so they can be (and are) released at other times and other intervals than OpenTTD itself 06:53:57 *** supermop [~daniel_er@cpe-67-243-25-39.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: supermop] 06:56:51 <Epi> mm another issue i found is my hovercraft gets paid 5k one way, 10k the other way. so strange (both same load of full passangers 06:57:41 <xiong> Epi, is it possible that your pax do not all originate at the terminals of the hovercraft line? 06:58:22 <xiong> Also, are you quite sure that the time on route is the same in both directions? Timetable it and see. 06:58:51 <Epi> ah! that would explain it, i have been moving one dock further out slowly. the passangers are from the origional town 07:02:00 *** kkb110__ [~kkb110@cpe-69-203-124-125.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 07:03:29 <Epi> slowly moving the dock further out lets you make the ship goto said dock without using a bouy 07:19:47 *** Zeknurn [~Zeknurn@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has quit [Quit: - nbs-irc 2.39 - www.nbs-irc.net -] 07:20:09 *** Zeknurn [~Zeknurn@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has joined #openttd 07:21:13 *** JVassie [~James@2.27.104.165] has joined #openttd 07:43:12 *** ET [62f79666@ircip2.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 07:43:29 <ET> hey all 07:45:34 *** cypher [~Miranda@ip-86-49-67-69.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 07:45:42 <ET> I seem to have run into a problem with FIRS industry replacement. I have a forest connected to a sawmill connected to a lumber yard. I have a single train which refits after dropping off the wood. the problem is that if I drop off 120 wood, I only seem to pick up about 25 lumber. I am waiting 10 days at the sawmill... any ideas? 07:46:13 *** MJP [~TdlQ@hq.z77.fr] has joined #openttd 07:49:10 *** ET [62f79666@ircip2.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 07:59:08 *** JVassie [~James@2.27.104.165] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 08:02:36 *** kkb110_ [~kkb110@cpe-69-203-124-125.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 08:03:28 *** sla_ro|master [slaco@95.76.26.172] has joined #openttd 08:04:10 *** theholyduck [~holyduck@ip-116-154-106-77.eidsiva.net] has quit [Quit: Forlater kanalen] 08:12:31 *** theholyduck [~holyduck@ip-116-154-106-77.eidsiva.net] has joined #openttd 08:17:16 *** tokai|noir [~tokai@port-92-195-97-76.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 08:17:19 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai|noir] by ChanServ 08:22:33 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-118-173.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 08:24:49 *** cypher [~Miranda@ip-86-49-67-69.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 08:26:32 *** Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.a98.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #openttd 08:38:56 *** Phoenix_the_II [~ralph@home.deboom.biz] has joined #openttd 08:44:44 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1A4F8.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 08:54:04 *** Epi [~Epil@114-198-79-215.dyn.iinet.net.au] has quit [Quit: sleep time] 08:56:37 *** Prof_Frink [~proffrink@5e0f234c.bb.sky.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 08:59:42 *** Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.a98.priv.bahnhof.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 09:00:11 *** KouDy [~KouDy@115.133.8.192] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 09:00:52 *** KouDy [~KouDy@115.133.8.192] has joined #openttd 09:09:03 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@178.248.252.207] has joined #openttd 09:11:03 *** kkb110_ [~kkb110@cpe-69-203-124-125.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 09:20:48 *** kkb110_ [~kkb110@cpe-69-203-124-125.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 09:31:16 *** MJP [~TdlQ@hq.z77.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 09:31:21 *** Firartix [~artixds@108.140.0.93.rev.sfr.net] has joined #openttd 09:39:06 *** andythenorth [~Andy@host86-169-180-203.range86-169.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 09:39:10 <andythenorth> moin 09:41:18 <andythenorth> also au revoir :) 09:41:24 *** andythenorth [~Andy@host86-169-180-203.range86-169.btcentralplus.com] has quit [] 09:58:44 *** pjpe [ade6a119@ircip1.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 10:01:05 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@178.248.252.207] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 10:05:20 *** theholyduck [~holyduck@ip-116-154-106-77.eidsiva.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:05:35 *** kkb110_ [~kkb110@cpe-69-203-124-125.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:15:26 *** kkb110_ [~kkb110@cpe-69-203-124-125.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 10:25:50 *** pugi [~pugi@host-091-097-003-018.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has joined #openttd 10:53:07 *** kkb110_ [~kkb110@cpe-69-203-124-125.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:03:02 *** kkb110_ [~kkb110@cpe-69-203-124-125.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 11:04:03 *** Pixa [~pixa@79-68-100-204.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com] has joined #openttd 11:15:17 *** cypher [~Miranda@eduroam-cl-186.feld.cvut.cz] has joined #openttd 11:31:17 *** DDR [~chatzilla@d142-179-78-88.bchsia.telus.net] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.88 [Firefox 10.0.1/20120210023155]] 11:35:57 *** tensai_cirno [~cirno@77.232.15.216] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 11:37:24 <V453000> hello, I have a question - is there a way to make a industries "funding only" map in the scenario editor? Or is the only way create map with funding only -> make it a sav->scn -> scenario with funding only 11:39:34 <Ammler> do you still need to rename a save to load it with scenario editor? 11:41:22 *** lugo [lugo@209.141.56.5] has joined #openttd 11:42:11 <V453000> yes 11:42:20 <V453000> at leas I think so 11:42:46 <V453000> yes you do 11:44:03 *** sla_ro|master [slaco@95.76.26.172] has quit [] 11:44:06 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-34-1.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 11:49:32 *** tokai|noir [~tokai@port-92-195-97-76.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:50:17 <Ammler> FRs on bugs.o.o are indeed useless :-) 11:50:48 *** tokai [~tokai@port-92-195-119-24.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 11:50:52 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai] by ChanServ 11:54:32 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-34-1.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:56:04 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-42-173.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 12:01:52 *** tokai [~tokai@port-92-195-119-24.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:15:20 *** cypher [~Miranda@eduroam-cl-186.feld.cvut.cz] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 12:28:03 *** cypher [~Miranda@eduroam-cl-239.feld.cvut.cz] has joined #openttd 12:36:02 *** tokai|noir [~tokai@port-92-195-107-165.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 12:36:06 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai|noir] by ChanServ 12:42:22 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-42-173.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:51:04 *** Twofish [~Twofish@77-95-76-210.bb.cust.hknett.no] has joined #openttd 12:57:03 *** Twofish [~Twofish@77-95-76-210.bb.cust.hknett.no] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 12:59:00 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r23949 /trunk/src/lang/ (english.txt english_US.txt): -Fix (r23947): Wrong positional parameter for timetable string. 13:01:22 *** andythenorth [~Andy@host86-169-180-203.range86-169.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 13:07:41 <andythenorth> hola 13:07:51 <andythenorth> could we make vehicle expiry date a little more deterministic? 13:08:08 <andythenorth> one option would be a cb 13:08:45 <andythenorth> maybe accompanied by a new grf-wide var to check availability of one or more vehicles 13:18:34 *** TGYoshi [~TGYoshi@86.81.146.146] has joined #openttd 13:26:33 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-157-131.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 13:27:16 *** FLHerne [~francis_h@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has joined #openttd 13:32:34 *** tokai|noir [~tokai@port-92-195-107-165.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:35:00 * andythenorth ponders 13:35:31 <andythenorth> ¿ special spriteset syntax that lets nml do compile-time compositing of pngs? 13:35:41 <andythenorth> using the offsets, bounding box etc 13:35:54 * andythenorth wonders if PIL can be taught about alpha masks 13:37:01 <andythenorth> Image.composite() 13:37:08 <andythenorth> oh dear 13:37:14 <andythenorth> this is something I could try for myself :o 13:38:03 <planetmaker> http://stackoverflow.com/questions/1962795/how-to-get-alpha-value-of-a-png-image-with-pil 13:39:15 <andythenorth> if run-time compositing for vehicles is a bad idea....compile time might be ok 13:39:34 <andythenorth> whether it's TMWFTLB is another question 13:39:43 <andythenorth> but photoshop twiddling is dull 13:39:46 <andythenorth> code is fun 13:44:37 <dihedral> hihihi - i was getting tons of requests to one of my servers ip addresses, for i have no idea what, so i wrote a rewrite rule to send all requests to a single php script. the php script outputs a 404 response header and adds the source ip to be dropped in the firewall :-D 13:45:38 *** cypher [~Miranda@eduroam-cl-239.feld.cvut.cz] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 13:45:38 *** tokai|noir [~tokai@port-92-195-82-138.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 13:45:41 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai|noir] by ChanServ 13:48:54 <andythenorth> hmm 13:49:00 <andythenorth> cargo colouring could be done at compile time 13:49:09 <andythenorth> probably make the compile *much* slower 13:49:40 <andythenorth> ho ho ho 13:49:49 <andythenorth> PIL has a putpixel() method 13:49:57 * andythenorth smells procedural generation 13:49:57 *** Snail_ [~jacopocol@CPE78cd8e5ccf20-CM78cd8e5ccf1d.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #openttd 13:50:54 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-157-131.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:56:42 <andythenorth> anyone written a graphics shader before? 13:56:51 <andythenorth> no point in me reinventing wheel 14:09:43 *** Snail_ [~jacopocol@CPE78cd8e5ccf20-CM78cd8e5ccf1d.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has quit [Quit: Snail_] 14:10:28 * andythenorth is very bad at maths, so will probably do it wrong 14:23:49 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@178.248.252.207] has joined #openttd 14:39:46 *** andythenorth [~Andy@host86-169-180-203.range86-169.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 14:47:05 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@178.248.252.207] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 15:05:21 *** [1]Mark [~Mark@5ED06D58.cm-7-1b.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has joined #openttd 15:05:23 *** Mark is now known as Guest2679 15:05:23 *** Guest2581 is now known as Mark 15:05:53 *** Mark is now known as Guest2680 15:05:53 *** [1]Mark is now known as Mark 15:06:25 *** Guest2679 [~Mark@5ED06D58.cm-7-1b.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:07:36 *** supermop [~daniel_er@rrcs-72-43-171-87.nyc.biz.rr.com] has joined #openttd 15:12:47 *** Rhamphoryncus [~rhamph@d161-184-227-133.abhsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd 15:17:03 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:c5da:b0f7:bbbd:71d4] has joined #openttd 15:17:07 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 15:30:04 <Belugas> hello 15:30:28 *** KouDy [~KouDy@115.133.8.192] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 15:56:09 *** TWerkhoven [~twerkhove@cpc3-linl7-2-0-cust522.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 16:06:29 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: truebrain * r23950 /trunk/src/goal.cpp: -Fix (r23731) [FS#5063]: never show GSGoal::Question() to spectators. Accidently INVALID_COMPANY == COMPANY_SPECTATOR 16:14:57 *** Elukka [Elukka@78-27-90-104.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 16:35:53 *** APTX [APTX@89-78-217-144.dynamic.chello.pl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:35:55 *** APTX [APTX@89-78-217-144.dynamic.chello.pl] has joined #openttd 16:39:51 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 17:05:06 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 17:10:27 *** supermop [~daniel_er@rrcs-72-43-171-87.nyc.biz.rr.com] has quit [Quit: supermop] 17:14:16 *** Snail_ [~snail@166.137.11.159] has joined #openttd 17:31:40 *** Snail_ [~snail@166.137.11.159] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:49:44 *** TWerkhoven [~twerkhove@cpc3-linl7-2-0-cust522.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: He who can look into the future, has a brighter future to look into] 17:50:43 *** cypher [~Miranda@ip-86-49-67-69.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 17:53:47 *** supermop [~daniel_er@rrcs-72-43-171-87.nyc.biz.rr.com] has joined #openttd 17:59:05 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@193.52.24.37] has joined #openttd 18:01:26 *** sla_ro|master [slaco@95.76.26.172] has joined #openttd 18:02:36 *** Prof_Frink [~proffrink@5e0f234c.bb.sky.com] has joined #openttd 18:04:20 <Rhamphoryncus> Hmm, that'll definitely need cleanup. I've got a function with i, j, k, and l temporaries. :) 18:04:35 *** cyph3r [~Miranda@ip-86-49-73-178.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 18:05:12 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590d55bd.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 18:08:32 <frosch123> http://paste.openttdcoop.org/show/1105/ <- i think whoever translated that into german trolled his client 18:09:13 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-27-35.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 18:09:49 <Rhamphoryncus> frosch123: a volunteer translator for minecraft put racist messages in one :( 18:10:47 *** cypher [~Miranda@ip-86-49-67-69.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:10:56 *** TWerkhoven [~twerkhove@cpc3-linl7-2-0-cust522.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 18:11:41 <frosch123> ohoh, maybe it was automatically translated from chinese... and the dictionary used circumscroptions for words which have no definite translation 18:12:24 <frosch123> Rhamphoryncus: can always happen, but then you can just ban people 18:12:25 *** tokai|noir [~tokai@port-92-195-82-138.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 18:12:53 <Rhamphoryncus> frosch123: yeah, but it waited until they got complaints 18:13:01 <Rhamphoryncus> Might have been with a prerelease version though 18:17:10 *** cmircea [~cmircea@86.124.217.99] has joined #openttd 18:24:13 *** Devroush [~dennis@ip-213-49-111-135.dsl.scarlet.be] has joined #openttd 18:28:57 <Terkhen> hello 18:32:25 *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@d5152B25B.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 18:35:34 *** nicfer [~Administr@190.50.46.117] has joined #openttd 18:35:44 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 18:36:32 <nicfer> hi everyone 18:44:56 *** MJP [~TdlQ@hq.z77.fr] has joined #openttd 19:02:18 *** lofejndif [~lsqavnbok@57.Red-88-19-214.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #openttd 19:12:29 *** Snail_ [~snail@166.137.11.159] has joined #openttd 19:13:17 *** Snail_ [~snail@166.137.11.159] has quit [] 19:20:44 <andythenorth> how interesting 19:20:50 * andythenorth just created a raw image with PIL 19:20:54 <andythenorth> it's useless :P 19:21:02 <andythenorth> but that's a new trick 19:22:14 <Terkhen> can you teach it to draw good trucks? 19:23:05 <andythenorth> I'm contemplating that 19:23:23 <andythenorth> I'm pretty certain I can teach it to comp load sprites onto trucks 19:23:34 <andythenorth> e.g. so I draw a flat trailer of length x 19:23:46 <andythenorth> and it comps on loads for steel, wood, tractors, crates etc 19:24:32 <andythenorth> I think I can teach it to recolour things as well 19:26:24 <andythenorth> I'm also certain I could teach it to draw flat trailers 19:26:41 <andythenorth> and tank trailers 19:27:03 <andythenorth> other types - might be more work defining the procedures than I save by automating it 19:27:34 <andythenorth> there's some threshold of complexity where defining rules for automation gets hard 19:31:38 *** kkb110_ [~kkb110@cpe-69-203-124-125.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:31:41 *** kkb110 [~kkb110@cpe-69-203-124-125.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 19:33:25 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: translators * r23951 /trunk/src/lang/ (6 files): (log message trimmed) 19:33:25 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0: 19:33:25 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: dutch - 10 changes by habell 19:33:25 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: german - 6 changes by NG, planetmaker 19:33:25 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: italian - 6 changes by lorenzodv 19:33:26 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: latvian - 9 changes by Parastais 19:33:26 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: lithuanian - 33 changes by Stabilitronas 19:42:40 *** lmergen [~lmergen@5352EA70.cm-6-3d.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has joined #openttd 19:42:49 *** mahmoud [~KEM@ALyon-158-1-98-237.w90-29.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #openttd 19:46:36 *** peteris [~peteris@78.84.97.170] has joined #openttd 19:47:13 <andythenorth> ho 19:47:18 * andythenorth has ideas 19:47:45 *** cyph3r [~Miranda@ip-86-49-73-178.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 19:47:47 <supermop> nice 19:48:36 *** TheMask96 [martijn@sirius.ne2000.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:49:10 *** peteris_ [~peteris@78.84.97.170] has joined #openttd 19:52:25 *** peteris_ [~peteris@78.84.97.170] has quit [] 19:53:10 *** TheMask96 [martijn@greed.vhost.ne2000.nl] has joined #openttd 19:56:43 <andythenorth> I can seed pixels from a basic floorplate 19:56:51 <andythenorth> using magic colours probably 19:57:34 <andythenorth> it's then quite trivial to say 'if pixel is hue xx: draw 4 pixels in y direction, using pattern aaba' or whatever 19:58:45 <andythenorth> this will be completely adequate for trailers 19:58:52 <andythenorth> it's kind of like extruding splines 19:59:01 <supermop> this sounds far more complicated than drawing it yourself 19:59:09 <andythenorth> supermop: it's more fun this way 19:59:12 <andythenorth> want to draw some trucks? 19:59:14 <andythenorth> :) 19:59:19 <andythenorth> I will accept donations 19:59:37 <andythenorth> but if the alternative is me drawing, I'd rather learn something new and interesting 19:59:39 <supermop> ok 19:59:43 <supermop> a few 20:00:13 <supermop> if i can draw the murdered out renault from that episode of top gear 20:00:33 <andythenorth> you could draw a magnum for the euro version of BANDIT 20:00:39 <andythenorth> although I'm not working on that atm 20:00:41 <andythenorth> ;) 20:00:52 <andythenorth> and at BANDIT scale, trucks mostly look alike 20:00:53 *** Phoenix_the_II [~ralph@home.deboom.biz] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:01:07 <supermop> 'refit to matte black vinyl' 20:02:09 *** JVassie [~James@2.27.104.165] has joined #openttd 20:02:28 <andythenorth> :) 20:03:11 <supermop> ive made progress on my EZ hitachi style monorails 20:03:11 *** Firartix [~artixds@108.140.0.93.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:03:30 <supermop> it would have made more sense to trace renders though 20:03:39 <andythenorth> voxels! 20:03:41 <andythenorth> sorry :P 20:03:49 <andythenorth> qubicles! 20:03:51 <andythenorth> sorry :P 20:03:54 <supermop> ha 20:04:46 <andythenorth> oh dear 20:05:00 * andythenorth discovers the PIL ImageDraw module 20:05:06 <supermop> they looks nice and ugly so far 20:05:26 <andythenorth> this is no good 20:05:27 *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@d5152B25B.access.telenet.be] has quit [Quit: oO] 20:05:28 <supermop> but muddy at regular 1x zoom 20:06:02 <andythenorth> PIL already has drawing support for lines, polygons, fills etc :( 20:06:25 <andythenorth> where's the fun in that :| 20:06:36 <supermop> what is pil? 20:06:45 <supermop> more of your python business? 20:06:47 <andythenorth> python imaging library 20:06:51 <supermop> i see 20:06:57 <andythenorth> it can draw pixels 20:07:06 <supermop> is python a marketable language? 20:07:14 <andythenorth> in what sense? 20:07:39 <supermop> more and more it seems us old fashioned real world designers and architects should know some code 20:07:56 <supermop> for when our industries collapse and we have to fall back on real jobs 20:07:58 <andythenorth> lots of engineers know a small amount certainly 20:08:15 <andythenorth> and biological scientists seem to know an insane amount on average 20:08:19 <supermop> yeah 20:08:35 <andythenorth> architecture remains one of the highest paid professions btw 20:08:42 * andythenorth nearly did architecture 20:08:44 <supermop> not for me 20:08:48 <andythenorth> not for all 20:09:02 <andythenorth> I guess average earnings are skewed by the calatravas and fosters 20:09:04 <andythenorth> :P 20:09:17 <supermop> my friends are making around 50-55 in the city, best place in the country to do it 20:09:36 <supermop> whereas people whe know who work with money make 70-80 20:10:02 <supermop> and some lucky jerks are near 100 20:10:28 <supermop> for a 27 or 28 year old that is quite comfortable 20:10:35 <supermop> im stuck around 40 atm 20:10:52 <supermop> but im taking a tangent in furniture 20:11:28 <supermop> engineers in the city make money closer to finance guys than to architects 20:12:34 <supermop> anyway thats all depressing to think about 20:12:53 <supermop> if i wanted to learn something, would you suggest python over others? 20:13:11 <andythenorth> python is fun most of all :) 20:13:42 <supermop> i think my brother knows some and writes scripts for GIS with it 20:13:50 <supermop> (little brother is an engineer) 20:13:58 <andythenorth> and yes, the civil engineering course I did > 50% went into finance, only 25% into engineering 20:14:05 <andythenorth> I quit and did other stuff too ;) 20:14:26 <supermop> haha 20:14:36 <supermop> my brother stuck with hydrology 20:14:45 <supermop> my dad has a phd in civil 20:15:20 <supermop> but after about 6 years of work moved into management instead 20:16:27 <andythenorth> supermop: try a python tutorial :) 20:16:43 <supermop> ok 20:16:55 <supermop> did that for grasshopper and it helped 20:17:45 <supermop> is C better for helping with ottd? 20:20:05 <andythenorth> brb 20:20:19 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 20:22:03 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 20:22:11 *** Markavian [~Markavian@j616s.co.uk] has joined #openttd 20:25:34 <andythenorth> supermop: can't comment on C++ vs python - I've failed to learn much C++ ;) 20:26:07 <andythenorth> I can read most lines of ottd code, or at least guess 20:26:19 <andythenorth> but that doesn't help me understand the bigger picture ;) 20:27:52 <supermop> how does one add stuff to nml? is nml a thing that people patch? 20:30:17 *** Snail_ [~snail@166.137.11.159] has joined #openttd 20:30:41 <supermop> like for it to support bridges, someone has to write a patch to make that happen? 20:30:56 <Hirundo> there are already (partial) patches for that lying around 20:31:33 <supermop> do people want to improve bridges in ottd first? 20:31:47 <Hirundo> what do you mean by that? 20:31:48 <supermop> (bridgeheads, custom sprite layouts etc) 20:31:56 <andythenorth> that would need ottd patched 20:32:16 <supermop> yeah, are they waiting to add bridges to nml until that happens? 20:32:30 <Hirundo> not really 20:33:07 <Hirundo> basically it's a combination of a) bridges are not used that much and b) bridges require special constructs / code (for the sprite property) 20:34:36 <Hirundo> There has been some discussion, see http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/1348 20:36:21 <supermop> i am not sure which is more important to me - the ability to have bridges with more than 6 unique tiles, or the ability to code a bridge in nml 20:36:24 <Hirundo> If you want to get something done, providing patches generally helps, though in this case the low-hanging fruit is already picked 20:36:28 *** FLHerne [~francis_h@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has left #openttd [] 20:37:05 <Hirundo> Alternatively, a use case (I need nml feature X to write grf Y, and look I already have these cool looking sprites) helps a lot, too 20:39:26 <Hirundo> supermop: Do you have a proposal for action123 for bridges? 20:40:44 *** Alberth [~hat3@a82-95-164-127.adsl.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 20:40:47 *** mode/#openttd [+o Alberth] by ChanServ 20:41:59 <supermop> what is that? 20:42:15 <supermop> i have ideas for things i'd like to be able to do 20:42:19 *** Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.a98.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #openttd 20:42:28 <supermop> and things i do in nfo take me forever 20:43:37 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 [~Flex@88.130.163.64] has joined #openttd 20:44:33 <Hirundo> supermop: Make an overview of what properties / variables / callbacks you'd like to add 20:44:59 <supermop> ok 20:46:17 <Zuu> The new speed limit feature by michi_cc made me think about a wild idea. Partial order lists. 20:46:38 <supermop> i love the speed limit thing 20:46:46 <supermop> have wanted that for ages 20:46:58 *** Chav` [~Chav@217-19-26-59.dsl.cambrium.nl] has joined #openttd 20:47:03 <Zuu> And if you assign a partial order list to a waypoint, all vehicles that goes to that waypoint will execute that partial order after visiting the waypoint. 20:47:26 <Hirundo> use-case? 20:48:00 <Zuu> To create a few common partial order lists that you can reuse. 20:48:06 <Chav`> Hey all 20:49:08 *** Pixa [~pixa@79-68-100-204.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:49:18 *** Pixa [~pixa@79-68-100-204.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com] has joined #openttd 20:49:24 <Zuu> Though it is maybe just a wild idea with some inspiration from Vissim. 20:49:27 <Alberth> all hey! 20:50:50 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@88.130.185.140] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:50:59 <Alberth> sounds very weird :) 20:54:10 <supermop> is it better to have all bridges be able to be used for all types of transit, or to have specific types of bridges exclusive to certain types of infrastructure? 20:55:11 <andythenorth> all types 20:55:12 <Zuu> Maybe the assignment to waypoint should rather be that you can define a partial order list for how to travel between two waypoints. So if a order list uses A -> Wp1 -> Wp2 -> B, you could have a partial order list defining an exact routing between Wp1 and Wp2 with speed limits. Only problem is that the waypoints you use to change speed limits need to not be counted towards partial order list selection. ... 20:55:18 <supermop> if a monorail bridge is the same price as a steel rail bridge, that eliminates one of the only real advantages of monorails 20:55:56 <supermop> (imagine the quintessential elevated monorail on concrete pillars) 20:55:59 *** Guest2538 [~George@212.113.107.39] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:56:08 <Hirundo> both infrastructure-specific and generic bridges should be possible, methinks 20:56:34 <supermop> also a two-lane road on a rail tressel looks silly 20:57:49 <andythenorth> supermop: I have no particular preference - 'all types' just seems easier ;) 20:58:00 <supermop> but then a big suspension bridge, like the manhattan bridge, can an should be able to carry rail or road on any of its decks 20:58:18 <supermop> and that raises an idea about converting bridges 20:58:21 <andythenorth> so bridges gain a list of route types 20:58:37 <andythenorth> oh - converting was one reason I think they should be all types 20:58:42 <supermop> not just between rail types, but from rail to road 20:58:43 <andythenorth> otherwise big headache 20:58:53 <Hirundo> rail<>road is very tricky 20:58:58 <Snail_> Multiple-deck bridges in OTTD? 20:59:07 <andythenorth> Hirundo: GS? :) 20:59:11 <andythenorth> demolish-rebuild 20:59:24 <supermop> (as in brooklyn and manhattan bridges) where some of the rail and tram decks were converted to road 20:59:45 <Hirundo> could be done, needs additional coding in ottd though 21:00:02 <Snail_> The brooklyn bridge is a one-deck bridge ;) 21:00:12 <Hirundo> as far as I can tell (looking at ottd source now), all newgrf rail types use the rail bridges 21:00:24 <Hirundo> normal rail that is, not mono/mglv 21:00:30 <supermop> the passenger deck is elevated about the two road decks 21:00:30 <Snail_> Unless you count the pedestrian section, of course 21:00:49 <supermop> road decks are separate between north and south 21:01:16 <supermop> with call back you can do multiple decks as adjacent bridges detecting each other and changing graphics to look joined up 21:01:17 <Snail_> Yep but the elevated part is only accessible by pedestrians and bicycles 21:01:22 <supermop> but you dont save any money 21:01:47 *** George [~George@212.113.107.39] has joined #openttd 21:02:00 *** KritiK [~Maxim@93-80-80-100.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd 21:02:01 <supermop> (can do meaning could do if that was added to ottd) 21:04:58 <Snail_> The concept of changing graphics if two bridges are adjacent could also be possible for tunnels, if thf custom tunnel portals get implemented 21:10:24 <Hirundo> frosch123: ctt_include_mask / ctt_exclude_mask is never reset, so you can only set bits, not clear them. Is that intentional? 21:11:09 <andythenorth> ho ho ho 21:11:16 * andythenorth is reading pixels 21:11:19 <frosch123> no idea :) 21:11:30 <frosch123> railtype compatibility also behaves like that 21:11:42 <frosch123> everything else resets stuff upon reassignment though 21:13:22 <Hirundo> It means that if engine pool is off, cargos excluded this way can never be included by later grfs 21:15:09 *** Nat_AS [8627e57d@ircip4.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 21:15:58 <Nat_AS> is there anyway to make industries free? 21:16:43 <Nat_AS> I forgot to turn on the manual industry newgrif and all the specificly placed factories in the scenerio I was playing expired 21:17:02 <Nat_AS> I want to rebuild them, but I don't want to use the moneyadd cheat 21:17:12 <Nat_AS> and can't afford 2mil 21:17:21 <Alberth> play a bit longer :) 21:17:47 <Nat_AS> not sure how I'd make that much money without factories 21:17:53 <Alberth> but no, you cannot build them for free 21:18:16 <Alberth> what's the point of asking 2mil for it otherwise :p 21:18:32 <Nat_AS> I have a nice oil and food chain (although half my farms vanished JUST as I was connecting to them) but I don't think I can expand without a factory to diliver to 21:18:39 <Nat_AS> and the only factory is on an ISLAND 21:18:48 <Alberth> you can transport passengers and mail :) 21:18:51 <Rhamphoryncus> woops! Went afk while testing my timetabling fix and my town of 1000 grew to 7500 :D 21:18:55 * andythenorth embarks on insane project 21:19:05 <Nat_AS> seriously, scenerio devs ought to include manual industries always 21:19:10 * Alberth likes the insane project 21:19:18 <Nat_AS> fuck, industries not vanishing ought to be a toggle 21:19:30 <andythenorth> Alberth: you don't know what it is yet :P 21:19:50 <Hirundo> procedural graphics generation? 21:19:55 <Nat_AS> >Scenerio dev places industries in specific places for intresting gameplay 21:20:03 <Alberth> unfortunately, NewGRF is fully in control of industry closure, there is nothing the openttd program can do about it 21:20:21 <Nat_AS> >Game decides to distroy industrys and place them in illogical places 21:20:23 <Nat_AS> why? 21:20:45 <Alberth> andythenorth: http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=68&t=58543 <-- is my guess 21:21:02 <Alberth> no, newgrf industry decides, and the program just follows 21:21:24 <andythenorth> Alberth: I invented a third method for that project 21:21:47 <Nat_AS> hmm, is there a Grif that can make industries free? 21:21:48 <Alberth> the newgrf spec makes it impossible to have control from the program 21:21:49 <Nat_AS> :P 21:22:10 <Alberth> no idea, but you are not able to add it to your running game :p 21:22:15 <Alberth> andythenorth: nice :) 21:22:17 <Nat_AS> yes I can :P 21:22:20 <Nat_AS> and I did 21:22:45 <Nat_AS> (turn on scenario developer.) 21:23:01 <Nat_AS> I sometimes swap out entire sets of newgrifs in the middle of the game 21:23:18 <Nat_AS> however you can't do this if you have anything from the old grif in existance 21:23:21 <Nat_AS> or it will crash I think 21:23:29 <Nat_AS> but if you are carefull it can work. 21:23:34 <V453000> sometimes it doesnt :) 21:23:55 <Alberth> things like vehicles are also part of the game data even if you cannot buy them yet 21:24:21 <Alberth> and industries that only 'exist' in the future :) 21:26:06 *** Chris_Booth [~chatzilla@client-86-23-41-5.brhm.adsl.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 21:26:44 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host101-141-dynamic.31-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #openttd 21:27:38 <Wolf01> evenink 21:27:38 <Alberth> moin mr W 21:28:49 <Nat_AS> Ffffffffffffffffffffffff 21:29:11 <Nat_AS> I can't find an oil car in the tropic set 21:29:13 <Alberth> Nat_AS: and "does not crash" is not the same as "works". Usually some data is corrupted that will not cause trouble until much later 21:30:21 * Nat_AS shrugs 21:30:34 <Alberth> that could be a consequence of your newgrf changes :p 21:30:34 <Nat_AS> who is in charge of the tropic refurbishment set? 21:30:57 <Nat_AS> how? I have not messed with train newgrifs 21:31:01 <Nat_AS> just industries 21:31:44 <Alberth> indstries define cargo 21:32:08 <Alberth> so unless you have trains that do not transport cargo...... 21:32:56 <Alberth> better test it in a clean environment first before reporting anything 21:33:49 *** lmergen [~lmergen@5352EA70.cm-6-3d.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:34:36 <Nat_AS> you might be right 21:34:51 <Nat_AS> just make a new game with just the tropic set and no other newgrifs in the same date 21:35:13 <Alberth> in your mind you have a picture how it works, but your picture may be very wrong 21:35:39 <Nat_AS> I guess so 21:37:48 <Alberth> it's normal behavior of the brain, and very hard to suppress as source 21:38:05 <Nat_AS> editing the scenerio with the manual industry newgrif added at the same date also has the proper cars 21:38:12 <Nat_AS> so it seems to be safe to add it then 21:38:53 <Alberth> you don't know, there are an awful lot of bits in a megabyte of data 21:39:05 <Nat_AS> I guess this solves both problems 21:39:08 <Nat_AS> :V 21:39:13 <Nat_AS> restart from the begining 21:39:25 <Alberth> :) 21:41:42 *** pjpe [ade6a119@ircip2.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 21:41:47 <Nat_AS> I learned a lot about station design from this map 21:42:28 *** perk11 [~perk11@46.242.11.118] has joined #openttd 21:42:48 <Nat_AS> and that it 21:42:59 <Nat_AS> it's almost always easier to start with industry 21:43:16 <Nat_AS> find a convenient one and use it to fund more complex ventures. 21:43:26 *** Chav` [~Chav@217-19-26-59.dsl.cambrium.nl] has quit [] 21:43:30 *** perk11 [~perk11@46.242.11.118] has quit [] 21:43:39 *** Grrrlpow1r [~kiike@62.57.4.46.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #openttd 21:43:48 <Nat_AS> AND, always buy the train with the lowest running cost that is strong enough to move the cargo 21:45:28 *** perk11 [~perk11@46.242.11.118] has joined #openttd 21:45:35 *** Grrrlpower [~kiike@62.57.4.46.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:46:55 * Alberth usually buys the train with the highest reliability 21:46:57 <Nat_AS> also, trams are better than trucks 21:47:12 <Nat_AS> well reliability is important too 21:47:13 <Alberth> I always forget to include a newgrf for them :) 21:47:50 <andythenorth> hoho ho 21:47:50 <Nat_AS> but it can be hard to earn a profit if your train with a million HP is eating all the income with it's maintnance bills. 21:47:58 * andythenorth is nearly drawing trucks with code 21:48:20 <Nat_AS> cargo trams are like trucks without pathfindingissues 21:48:30 <Alberth> I always play with the default set, which is not that expensive :) 21:48:31 <Nat_AS> although articulated trucks are awesome 21:48:40 <Nat_AS> esp the tractor ones. 21:48:40 <Rubidium> andythenorth: if only you could be coding with draw ;) 21:48:45 <Nat_AS> they look so cool. 21:49:00 <Nat_AS> Rubidium: I fucking wish 21:49:34 <Nat_AS> I think artists would be better programers than programers if there was a programing language that could parse art into code. 21:49:36 <Alberth> andythenorth: using a visual programming language? 21:49:41 *** Chris_Booth_ [~chatzilla@client-86-23-41-5.brhm.adsl.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 21:50:02 <Nat_AS> that way games with good art would also have good code 21:50:03 <Zuu> Nat_AS: Trams in OpenTTD are however very prone to lockups if you have a tiny error in your tram tracks in city center where you can't easily resolve a track leading into a building. 21:50:05 <Nat_AS> and visa versa 21:50:26 <Alberth> Nat_AS: that exists :) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piet_%28programming_language%29 21:50:47 <Nat_AS> yes, but because you place the track yourself, you don't have to worry about truck pathfinding 21:50:49 <Rubidium> Alberth: I don't think labview is suitable for OpenTTD-ish things 21:51:09 <Nat_AS> which seems to want to make right turns just because they can 21:51:43 <Alberth> Rubidium: that's not a visual programming language, it's just pretending to be one :) 21:52:00 <andythenorth> Alberth: I used visual programming languages before. I hated them 21:52:06 <andythenorth> I was...younger 21:52:15 <Nat_AS> that's an inneficant programing language 21:52:15 *** Firartix [~artixds@108.140.0.93.rev.sfr.net] has joined #openttd 21:52:19 <andythenorth> right now I'm just having 'adventures with PIL' 21:52:24 <Nat_AS> that uses bitmaps instead of text strigs 21:52:27 <Rubidium> andythenorth: okay, then Visual Basic ;) 21:52:28 <Nat_AS> strings 21:52:37 <Rubidium> s/andythenorth/Alberth/ 21:52:44 <andythenorth> I never saw the benefit in visual programming 21:52:56 <Nat_AS> suposed to be easier 21:52:56 <andythenorth> it's like cooking soup underwater 21:53:03 <Nat_AS> IDK though 21:53:03 <Rubidium> andythenorth: less typos for dyslexic people 21:53:08 <Alberth> never played with VB :) 21:53:18 <Rubidium> and more spaghetti 21:53:20 <Nat_AS> ha nice metaphor. 21:53:46 <Alberth> I once saw a c++ program where you could draw a box, and it would compute the volume of it :p 21:53:47 <Nat_AS> a GUI Newgrif complier would be nice to have 21:53:49 <Rubidium> I especially like the "example" labview code on the net... jpg 21:54:03 <Nat_AS> feed it PNGs and type values into boxes, 21:54:04 <Prof_Frink> VB is easier than V0. 21:54:11 <Nat_AS> and it will churn out .grfs 21:54:31 <Nat_AS> maybe even edit the sprites in the same program 21:54:36 <Alberth> Nat_AS: that's called grfmaker 21:54:40 *** Chris_Booth [~chatzilla@client-86-23-41-5.brhm.adsl.virginmedia.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:54:43 <Nat_AS> it exists? 21:54:55 *** Chris_Booth_ is now known as Chris_Booth 21:54:56 <andythenorth> Nat_AS: like the BANDIT-building CMS I made? http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/2372/BANDIT_build.png 21:55:04 <andythenorth> it's only for me, due to security issues 21:55:27 <Alberth> I am told it does, it doesn't run at my system so I never tried it 21:55:59 <Nat_AS> intresting 21:56:16 <Nat_AS> but a polished one,maybe even built into OTTD would be cool 21:56:20 * andythenorth needs a palette with numbers on it 21:56:34 <Nat_AS> or at least a standalone app that has the same style GUI 21:56:52 <Alberth> paint on it would be more useful perhaps :) 21:57:38 <Nat_AS> the paint functonality would probably be for checking and adjusting alignment 21:58:47 <Nat_AS> but you could also in theroy draw the whole thing in it if you really hate paint. 21:58:51 <Alberth> andythenorth: http://devs.openttd.org/~alberth/colours-palid.png does this look ok? (not sure it is the right palette) 21:59:29 <Nat_AS> it would have ISO lines and croshairs for alignment checking. 21:59:50 <Nat_AS> a program for isometric pixel art would be nice to have period 21:59:56 <andythenorth> Alberth: I'd have to check it matches the palette I have :) 22:00:03 <andythenorth> I can actually just get PIL to print out ids 22:00:14 <Nat_AS> with lines that snap to the exact 2:1 grid lines 22:00:22 <Nat_AS> and easy layers 22:00:39 <Nat_AS> most graphics programs with layers suck at pixel art 22:00:57 <Alberth> andythenorth: just make your own palette with numbers with PIL :) 22:01:00 <Nat_AS> and MS paint only has one layer (why it does not have that basic feature even today baffles me) 22:02:16 <Alberth> layers is not a basic feature for the average win* user 22:02:32 <Nat_AS> Hurrrr M$ 22:04:05 <Nat_AS> right now I sometimes play aroundin SAI, but that is in no way for pixel art 22:04:16 <Nat_AS> or anything that's not freehand painting 22:04:22 <Nat_AS> it does not even have rulers 22:04:40 <Nat_AS> I'd like to see a program that makes isometric grid rulers 22:05:19 <Rubidium> after all, paint is to write a letter ;) 22:05:34 <Nat_AS> Pppphahahahat 22:05:34 <Rubidium> and word is to draw (vector-ish) images 22:05:41 <Nat_AS> do people do that? 22:05:58 <Rubidium> you'd be amazed 22:07:05 <Rubidium> the preferred format for sending images by someone on my work is actually in an excel file 22:07:21 <Rubidium> (and sadly enough I'm serious about that) 22:07:31 <Nat_AS> why not powerpoint 22:07:36 <Nat_AS> bitches love powerpoint 22:07:43 <andythenorth> Nat_AS: I just use photoshop 22:07:59 <Rubidium> Nat_AS: because powerpoint thinks for you and starts resizing the shit out of stuff 22:08:25 <Nat_AS> photoshop is expensive, Gimp has an awquard GUI, and Sai is freehand only 22:08:27 <Rubidium> and then things aren't the same size between slides anymore and that annoys me 22:08:44 <Nat_AS> and all of them are overkill for pixel art 22:09:09 <Nat_AS> you have to turn a million things off just to get a single pixel instead of a brush 22:09:17 * andythenorth has one bugbear about python: it refuses && for logical ANDY 22:09:28 <andythenorth> logical ANDY? 22:09:32 <andythenorth> logical AND :P 22:09:38 *** Rhamphoryncus [~rhamph@d161-184-227-133.abhsia.telus.net] has quit [Quit: Rhamphoryncus] 22:10:07 <Rubidium> andythenorth: just run it through a preprocessor that replaces && with and 22:10:15 <andythenorth> oic :P 22:10:22 <andythenorth> or patch python? 22:10:55 <Rubidium> that'd be the easy way out 22:11:01 <Nat_AS> why don't more scenerios start before 1950? 22:11:13 <Nat_AS> that's like cutting out half the game 22:11:25 <Rubidium> I'd suggest writing a CPU in VHDL that catches that corner case in hardware and replaces it with the appropriate code ;) 22:11:38 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r23952 /trunk/ (11 files in 4 dirs): -Feature: [NewGRF] Customisable tunnel portals for rail types (sprites by Snail). 22:11:51 <Rubidium> because before 1950 many vehicle (types) are not necessarily available 22:12:10 <Nat_AS> needs to be more legacy types 22:13:07 <Nat_AS> well the grifs I play with do have shit like horsedrawn carrages 22:13:28 <Nat_AS> I think when I restart my game, I'm gonna set the start date to 1900 22:13:32 <Nat_AS> :3 22:13:51 <supermop> want to draw sprites at work 22:13:59 <Nat_AS> then when high tech maglev shit comes out, I will be able to afrord them 22:14:00 <Nat_AS> :V 22:14:11 <supermop> but coworkers are around so can't use the big imac with PS 22:14:18 <Rubidium> in theory you can set it to ~0, just takes a long time before you're finding any newgrf that supports vehicles for that era 22:14:25 <supermop> and there is not ms paint type thing on this macbook 22:14:27 <Nat_AS> AH 22:14:46 <Nat_AS> New vehicle type, SLAVES 22:14:59 <Nat_AS> no running cost 22:15:02 <Nat_AS> but really slow 22:15:31 <Nat_AS> too bad you can't make towns and industries change with time (can you?) 22:15:39 <Nat_AS> I want to make an antiquity grif now. 22:16:05 <Nat_AS> with slave carried litters, runners carrying mail, caravans for cargo 22:16:12 <Nat_AS> maybe Spice and silk cargo types. 22:17:35 * Alberth thought Spice was only available at Dune 22:18:24 <Nat_AS> Frankensense and Mir 22:18:34 <Nat_AS> also, Irakis map 22:18:41 <Nat_AS> to replace toyland 22:18:51 <Alberth> but I like toyland! 22:19:26 <Nat_AS> better idea to replace toyland is internet map type 22:19:37 <Nat_AS> towns are socal networks 22:19:56 <Nat_AS> cargos are Clicks, Likes, lulz, ect 22:20:03 <Nat_AS> trains are based on memes 22:20:22 * Nat_AS just wants to see a longcat express 22:20:32 <Terkhen> good luck drawing / coding that 22:20:41 <andythenorth> V453000 ^ 22:20:52 <andythenorth> ;) 22:20:58 <Alberth> there was a tron-like idea recently where those would fit in very good imho 22:21:07 <V453000> I already heard that from him andy dont worry :p 22:21:15 <Nat_AS> Yeah, I'd imagine the map would look like tron 22:21:21 <Nat_AS> and the tracks would be light beams 22:21:22 <andythenorth> Alberth: '9' in my image is pink. whereas in my palette and yours it's grey :) 22:21:43 <Rubidium> tron is long gone 22:21:53 * andythenorth may have to adventure in palettes 22:22:13 <Nat_AS> OH, the trains would start out as tron style things in the 80s, but slowly morph into modern internet memes in the 2000s 22:22:38 <Nat_AS> game cannot be played prior to the 70s-80s 22:22:51 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: frosch * r23953 /trunk/src/town_cmd.cpp: -Fix [FS#5062]: When the population of a town changes the town view might even have to change size due to different cargo requirements. 22:22:55 <Alberth> you'd miss out all the disco colours ! 22:23:39 <Nat_AS> SHIT! 22:23:41 <Nat_AS> gotta go 22:23:47 *** Nat_AS [8627e57d@ircip4.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 22:26:52 *** Snail_ [~snail@166.137.11.159] has quit [Quit: Colloquy for iPhone - http://colloquy.mobi] 22:27:03 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r23954 /trunk/config.lib: -Fix (r23952): Update required grfcodec version. 22:30:46 *** Alberth [~hat3@a82-95-164-127.adsl.xs4all.nl] has left #openttd [] 22:32:56 *** Snail_ [~snail@166.137.11.159] has joined #openttd 22:33:02 *** Snail_ [~snail@166.137.11.159] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:35:01 *** cmircea [~cmircea@86.124.217.99] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:35:15 *** perk11 [~perk11@46.242.11.118] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 22:36:54 <andythenorth> http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/2449/procedural_truck_body.png 22:37:13 <andythenorth> http://paste.openttdcoop.org/show/1112/ 22:37:28 *** LordPixaII [~pixa@85.210.65.138] has joined #openttd 22:38:26 *** Pixa [~pixa@79-68-100-204.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:38:48 <Chris_Booth> hi 22:39:43 *** Pixa [~pixa@79-68-101-225.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com] has joined #openttd 22:40:27 <frosch123> night 22:40:31 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590d55bd.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:42:59 * andythenorth basically draws the floor plan in construction colours. Each colour maps to a sequence of other colours, which are drawn in the y direction 22:44:15 <Hirundo> next step: a floor plan generator? ;-) 22:44:18 <andythenorth> nope 22:44:22 <andythenorth> :) 22:44:39 <andythenorth> I considered trying to do 3D transforms and things for each angle needed 22:45:10 <andythenorth> but this way is easy. I just draw the plan for each angle + length needed ;) 22:45:31 <andythenorth> tanker trailers will be...interesting 22:45:34 *** LordPixaII [~pixa@85.210.65.138] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:45:49 *** Chris_Booth [~chatzilla@client-86-23-41-5.brhm.adsl.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.88 [Firefox 11.0/20120208012847]] 22:47:24 <supermop> draw the meridian of the tank, have it then draw down and up for you? 22:48:00 *** cypher [~Miranda@ip-86-49-73-178.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 22:58:05 *** Snail_ [~snail@166.137.11.159] has joined #openttd 22:58:16 <dihedral> good evening 23:00:01 <xiong> Is there any way at all for user to assign hotkeys? 23:02:01 <andythenorth> supermop: good idea 23:03:46 *** Snail_ [~snail@166.137.11.159] has quit [Quit: Colloquy for iPhone - http://colloquy.mobi] 23:03:50 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1A4F8.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:05:18 <andythenorth> oh dear 23:05:21 <andythenorth> where's frosch? 23:07:15 <andythenorth> Rubidium: I have just worked out how to do the (quite simple joke) of encoding nfo in a bitmap then reading it with PIL 23:07:29 <andythenorth> what I can't figure out is how to tie XML into this joke 23:07:31 <andythenorth> :P 23:07:40 <valhallasw> andythenorth: import xmlrpclib 23:07:52 <valhallasw> and create a SOAP web service 23:09:02 <valhallasw> or maybe create enterprise integration with SAP! At least, I guess they use XML. Maybe they intermix it with COBOL? 23:09:29 <andythenorth> I could arbitrarily limit the size of the input png 23:09:41 <andythenorth> then force the use of XML to tie a stream of pngs together 23:10:15 <andythenorth> that might be an amusing limitation 23:11:10 <andythenorth> also I propose to encode using 4px squares (2x2), to make it 'easier' to draw 23:11:29 <andythenorth> which will need error checking to see if all pixels in a square are same :D 23:11:40 <andythenorth> when is April 1st this year? 23:11:53 <valhallasw> in about 6 weeks 23:14:17 <Mazur> I believe for a change they've put it directly after March 31st? 23:14:34 <Mazur> I don't know why. 23:16:54 *** sla_ro|master [slaco@95.76.26.172] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:17:08 *** sla_ro|master [~slaco@95.76.26.172] has joined #openttd 23:17:51 <andythenorth> hmm 23:18:11 * andythenorth stops plotting april fool stupidity 23:18:20 <andythenorth> procedural truck body drawing just kind of works 23:18:29 * andythenorth hmm 23:18:55 <andythenorth> lighting for different angles - would I use transforms, or just manually code different sequences? 23:21:09 <andythenorth> eddi would know :P 23:25:09 <supermop> just made an ad-hoc tyvek wallet 23:25:25 <supermop> out of a used envelope 23:26:34 <andythenorth> how handy 23:27:44 *** theholyduck [~holyduck@cm-188.126.201.147.customer.telag.net] has joined #openttd 23:28:36 <supermop> my real wallet was quite worn and ratty and i havent been able to decide between buying a fancy new one or making one out of leather myself (would take more hours than the fancy one costs) 23:28:56 *** break19 [~break19@c-71-229-1-99.hsd1.al.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 23:28:57 <supermop> and felt bad about throwing away the envelope as it was still in near new shape 23:30:16 *** TGYoshi [~TGYoshi@86.81.146.146] has quit [Quit: Popidopidopido] 23:32:53 *** peteris [~peteris@78.84.97.170] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 23:33:03 *** DDR [~chatzilla@d142-179-78-88.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd 23:33:28 <Wolf01> 'night 23:33:32 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host101-141-dynamic.31-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 23:35:03 *** cypher [~Miranda@ip-86-49-73-178.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:40:44 *** sla_ro|master [~slaco@95.76.26.172] has quit [] 23:42:14 * andythenorth -> bed 23:42:16 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 23:44:48 *** MJP [~TdlQ@hq.z77.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:53:31 *** theholyduck [~holyduck@cm-188.126.201.147.customer.telag.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:55:20 *** Firartix [~artixds@108.140.0.93.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]