Log for #openttd on 17th April 2012:
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05:14:46  <andythenorth> mm
05:14:48  <andythenorth> lighthouses
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05:19:39  <telanus> hi
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08:24:27  <Wolf01> hello
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11:29:53  <Amaury> Hi everbody
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11:32:10  <FLHerne> Hello
11:32:23  <FLHerne> This channel is a bit quiet :P
11:32:37  <Amaury_> =)
11:32:44  <Amaury_> is there a probleme with server to join ?
11:32:44  <Sacro> that's just how it seems
11:33:01  <Amaury_> i'm not able to update server list
11:33:23  <Amaury_> may be because of 1.2 ?
11:34:08  <Amaury_> anyone able to play ?
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11:44:11  <Amaury_> is there someone here ?
11:44:22  <Amaury_> Sacro, FLHerne ?
11:44:58  <Sacro> ?
11:45:08  <Sacro> Looks fine
11:45:32  <Amaury_> hum ... how can I diagnostik the probleme ?
11:46:04  <Amaury_> when I want to update TTD answer unable to connect server
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11:51:18  * FLHerne doesn't use multiplayer enough to know :-(
11:56:39  <planetmaker> If you can't connect to a server, you the server's down or it has mal-configured ports somewhere. Usually
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12:09:16  <planetmaker> ^ Amaury_
12:11:17  <NGC3982> marknadsundersökningsprogrammering.
12:11:20  <NGC3982> swedish. <3
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12:30:02  <krinn> hi
12:44:24  <andythenorth> Pikka le bird
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12:51:59  <Pikka> oui
12:53:31  <Eddi|zuHause> lö börd?
12:54:49  <andythenorth> le Eddi|zuHause
12:54:51  <andythenorth> or das Eddi|zuHause
12:55:06  <andythenorth> have you mastered pixa yet?
12:55:16  <Eddi|zuHause> as long as it's not "die Eddi|zuHause" :p
12:55:16  <andythenorth> I should have called it pikka :P
12:55:43  <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: i have not continued yet from the state of yesterday
12:55:50  <andythenorth> looked pretty good
12:56:18  <andythenorth> I'm going to make an example teaching how to generate 'hello world' text using pixels :P
12:56:19  <andythenorth> in increasingly complex ways
12:56:23  <andythenorth> but not today
12:56:30  <andythenorth> today I am trying to sell something to Australia
12:57:41  <Eddi|zuHause> i hope it's not didgeridoos :)
12:58:50  <andythenorth> they have them I think
12:58:55  <andythenorth> probably got enough
13:11:12  <Pikka> wobbleboards
13:11:19  <andythenorth> need some?
13:11:32  <Pikka> probably not
13:11:45  * andythenorth has been poking at FIRS some more
13:11:58  <andythenorth> Pikka: when is your industry set ready? :P
13:12:08  <andythenorth> you should include a minecraft mine :P
13:12:23  <FLHerne> For mining minecraft?
13:12:31  <andythenorth> yup
13:12:44  <andythenorth> ideally, if you click on it, we provide a new cb for 'game over'
13:13:01  <FLHerne> What does mined minecraft from a minecraft mine look like when you mine it? :P
13:13:02  <Pikka> I had contemplated a minecraft grf
13:13:19  <Wolf01> me too
13:13:20  <andythenorth> discuss?
13:13:22  <Pikka> it's one of those things that seems like a cool idea
13:13:27  <Pikka> but on more thought
13:13:30  <Pikka> even I wouldn't use it
13:13:30  <andythenorth> implementing minecraft in ttd :P
13:13:40  <andythenorth> implementing TTD in minecraft seems more plausible
13:13:59  <Pikka> yes
13:14:01  <andythenorth> someone I know patched a full js interpreter into minecraft iirc
13:14:11  <andythenorth> so build a C++ emulator in javascript :P
13:14:17  <Pikka> D;
13:14:44  <andythenorth> :)
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13:14:50  <Pikka> minecraft is silly, really
13:15:07  <Pikka> although I have been playing a bit of old yobgox recently
13:15:15  <andythenorth> I've stayed out of minecrack
13:15:18  <andythenorth> I know what would happen :P
13:15:19  <Pikka> I'd play newer yobgox but it's very unstable
13:15:27  <andythenorth> I've nothing against MC, but I only get one life
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13:15:50  <Pikka> there are worse things to do with your life than minecraft
13:16:06  <FLHerne> Is OTTD one of them? :P
13:16:13  <Pikka> not necessarily
13:16:56  <andythenorth> I've run out of discretionary time, for the next 18 years or so
13:17:11  <andythenorth> I do work, children, ottd and sleep in that order
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13:23:30  <Eddi|zuHause> surely, playing minecraft will only need dropping one of those :p
13:24:04  <Pikka> minecraft is actually pretty boring
13:24:11  <Pikka> one tends to play it in spurts
13:26:04  <andythenorth> as far as I can see, it's project based
13:26:08  <andythenorth> seems like online lego
13:26:15  <andythenorth> 'can I build a cannon in minecraft?'
13:26:20  <andythenorth> 'can I build a roller coaster'
13:26:36  <andythenorth> 'can I build an automated mine cart dispatching system?'
13:26:43  <andythenorth> 'how far can I throw stuff?'
13:26:45  <Pikka> eh
13:26:49  <andythenorth> no?
13:26:49  <Pikka> depends
13:27:13  <Pikka> well, online is even more griefer-prone than openttd
13:27:25  <andythenorth> all the players I know just hack on it
13:27:28  <andythenorth> rather than playing
13:27:45  <CornishPasty> I wonder if you can create OpenTTD systems in minecraft... :P
13:30:08  <oskari89> Pikka?
13:30:14  <Pikka> andy: and because it's so griefer-prone, all the servers use whitelists and only let people in who they know.  and getting to know minecraft players is not much fun.
13:30:21  <andythenorth> he :)
13:30:46  <Pikka> I think sss on the forums would be at the "thoughtful, intelligent and mature" end of the minecraft community spectrum.
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13:31:52  <Pikka> even with mods it's a fairly shallow game, in either single or multi player imo
13:32:03  <andythenorth> millions of downloads!
13:32:08  <andythenorth> €8 per download!
13:32:12  <Pikka> yes
13:32:14  <Pikka> there is that
13:32:20  <andythenorth> notch!
13:32:21  <andythenorth> etc
13:32:43  <Pikka> it would be nice if the openttd devs had three million dollars that they decided they didn't really need so could give away to their friends.
13:33:20  <andythenorth> we should help them get it
13:33:20  <zooks> minecraft alse is loaded with really bad bugs
13:33:22  <andythenorth> bananas!
13:33:25  <zooks> like memleaks and stuff
13:33:29  <Pikka> yes zooks
13:34:10  <zooks> as there is only 5 people working on the game and they are only interested in adding features to attract more sales
13:34:24  <Pikka> no zooks
13:34:31  <zooks> well maybe more heh
13:37:35  <Pikka> andythenorth: I'm not sure how monetisable GPL-licenced content is, though.
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13:38:26  <Fori> Hi!
13:39:10  <Pikka> from my point of view, as far as possibly making money from OTTD goes, I can only see grfs as an audience-building tool, rather than saleable products in themselves.
13:39:19  <dihedral> oi
13:39:21  <dihedral> :)
13:39:48  <Pikka> hello dihedral
13:39:59  <dihedral> uh - hi :-) a Pikka :-)
13:42:05  <andythenorth> Pikka: we just charge for the pipe, i.e. Bananas
13:42:12  <andythenorth> conwenience
13:42:36  <andythenorth> same reason I pay apple, instead of doing illegal limewire-ish type things
13:42:38  <andythenorth> but yeah
13:42:39  <andythenorth> and no
13:42:50  <Fori> Is there any possibility for trains being replaced by the same train but a newer model?
13:43:05  <andythenorth> yes and no
13:43:19  <andythenorth> pikka does it
13:43:34  <andythenorth> but not in a way you can use with auto-replace :P
13:43:41  <Pikka> yes
13:43:43  <andythenorth> I invented a spec for it the other day
13:43:43  <Pikka> it is a bad idea
13:43:55  <andythenorth> give vehicles an incremental version number
13:43:58  <andythenorth> it would be neat
13:44:05  <Pikka> there's no shortage of IDs any more
13:44:05  <Fori> But for now there is none? ^^
13:44:14  <andythenorth> but probably it's just as easy to use more IDs
13:44:21  <Pikka> stat upgrades are to be avoided
13:44:30  <andythenorth> I use them in HEQS
13:44:33  <andythenorth> avoid buy menu spam
13:44:41  <planetmaker> Fori, there's autorenew
13:44:42  <andythenorth> as model life is a total crap shoot and broken imho
13:44:44  <Pikka> if they're minor upgrades, perhaps
13:44:53  <planetmaker> whic hreplaces with the same
13:45:00  <Pikka> but things like the early steam locomotives in NARS, the difference is too great
13:45:01  <planetmaker> and autoreplace, which replaces with another engine
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13:45:28  <Fori> I'm using NARS in fact.
13:46:51  <Fori> So I'll have to wait for a new engine?
13:47:01  <andythenorth> ach
13:47:16  <andythenorth> 'buy menu availability' cb is probably a trivial patch for vehicles
13:47:17  <andythenorth> let's patch it
13:47:21  <andythenorth> stations have it
13:47:26  <Pikka> after you
13:47:30  <Pikka> I've always wanted that
13:47:31  <andythenorth> not today, but remind me
13:47:33  <andythenorth> seriously
13:47:37  <Pikka> to have different vehicles for different players ;)
13:47:41  <Pikka> AI only vehicles, etc
13:47:46  <andythenorth> in my idea....hmm
13:47:47  <andythenorth> bad
13:48:02  <andythenorth> I want to be able to make availability of vehicle x depend on availability of vehicle y
13:48:11  <andythenorth> I'm *sure* that won't be circular :P
13:48:17  <Pikka> nah
13:49:15  <andythenorth> _probably_ it's called in a deterministic order, perhaps by ID
13:49:20  <andythenorth> and so loops would be impossible :P
13:49:24  <andythenorth> _probably
13:52:58  <andythenorth> iirc the hardest part about adding cbs looks like patching nforenum :P
13:53:03  <andythenorth> I may regret that comment
13:53:39  <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: is 'buy menu availability' cb of interest to CETS?
13:54:08  <Eddi|zuHause> in what sense?
13:54:45  <andythenorth> in the sense of making vehicles appear in buy menu by returning 0x00 or 0x01 etc
13:54:50  <andythenorth> and I might patch it
13:54:55  <andythenorth> but it will need a reviewer :P
13:55:01  <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: it would be useful to tie availability of one vehicle to the availability of another vehicle
13:55:09  <andythenorth> so it might need new vars
13:55:28  <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: but that may interfere with the prototype phase
13:55:39  <andythenorth> ok, so things to think about
13:55:48  <andythenorth> but a useful cb?
13:56:00  <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: for example, i introduce "ICE1", i may want to introduce it as a "10 Wagon", "12 Wagon" and "14 Wagon" version
13:56:21  <Eddi|zuHause> as separate buy menu items
13:56:45  <andythenorth> you want all to appear at same time?
13:56:50  <Eddi|zuHause> then only one of these versions should be offered as prototype
13:56:58  <Eddi|zuHause> and all others should get available at the same time
13:57:06  <Eddi|zuHause> but only to the person accepting the prototype
13:57:14  <Eddi|zuHause> and then he should only need to buy one of them
13:57:27  <Eddi|zuHause> to fulfill the "bought prototype" condition
13:57:41  <andythenorth> interesting
13:57:49  <andythenorth> doesn't sound batshit crazy
13:58:06  <andythenorth> I'd have to read src to see how that could be done though :P
13:58:18  * andythenorth back to work
13:58:22  <Eddi|zuHause> it may be possible to do this by other means though
13:58:31  <Eddi|zuHause> i.e. don't code these as different vehicle IDs
13:58:41  <Eddi|zuHause> but code a "multiple variants" callback
13:58:55  <Eddi|zuHause> that is registering multiple buy-menu entries
13:59:31  <Eddi|zuHause> and which one was selected is passed to the purchase callbacks as extra callback info
13:59:42  <Eddi|zuHause> so the articulation callback may return different stuff
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14:00:44  <andythenorth> I had the multiple variants idea too
14:00:54  <andythenorth> points to vehicle-local-storage imo
14:01:06  <andythenorth> but in this case, on the type, not the instance
14:01:59  <Eddi|zuHause> this has nothing to do with storage
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14:03:52  <andythenorth> I think authors would want to customise what they're doing with this
14:04:16  <andythenorth> storage / extend arbitrary properties /s
14:05:21  * andythenorth doubts it's wise
14:05:25  <andythenorth> or possible
14:05:49  <Eddi|zuHause>
14:07:37  <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: this could just be a separation of "cargo subtypes" from cargos. and one could allow dropdown boxes in the buy menu listing the cargos and the subtypes
14:07:46  <CornishPasty> Eddi|zuHause: winner
14:08:32  <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: same comment could apply to other things
14:08:34  <andythenorth> but yes
14:08:39  <andythenorth> +lots
14:09:12  <andythenorth> - articulated vehicle lengths
14:09:14  <andythenorth> - liveries
14:09:22  <Eddi|zuHause> but making subtypes changeable after building would conflict with the idea of having the articulation callback depend on it
14:09:38  <andythenorth> yes
14:09:43  <andythenorth> - stat variations (power, weight etc)
14:09:56  <andythenorth> hmm
14:12:10  <Eddi|zuHause> CornishPasty: what?
14:12:35  <CornishPasty> Eddi|zuHause: the Prince of Persia source
14:12:47  <Belugas> hello
14:13:18  <Eddi|zuHause> CornishPasty: the whole sentence
14:13:44  <CornishPasty> Never mind. You'll be forever wondering
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14:25:36  <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: one big problem for separating subtypes from cargos is handling backwards compatibility for existing GRFs
14:27:04  <andythenorth> always that :P
14:27:09  <andythenorth> just don't break it?
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14:27:18  <andythenorth> respect all current vars and cbs, it just keeps working
14:28:10  <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: but that duplicates memory and stuff
14:28:20  <andythenorth> [shrug]
14:28:24  <Eddi|zuHause> if done "the wrong way"
14:28:31  <andythenorth> worse is better :P
14:28:49  <andythenorth> but also...better is better
14:29:09  <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: i didn't even understand what that meant
14:29:29  <andythenorth> you're familiar with worse is better though? :)
14:29:40  <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: it seemed to argue a "grand design" vs. a "step by step" approach
14:29:49  *** Vadtec [~Vadtec@2001:470:1f06:13e0::1337] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
14:29:50  <andythenorth> approximately yes
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14:30:05  <andythenorth> primarily it advocates simplicity of implementation *above* other factors
14:30:12  <andythenorth> it doesn't say ignore other factors
14:30:13  <Eddi|zuHause> and then cited some artificial reasons why one should be superior
14:30:24  <andythenorth> nor does it say make things deliberately worse
14:30:40  <andythenorth> it's basically a pretty simple argument that shipping something beats shipping nothing
14:32:13  <Eddi|zuHause> the tower of babel was a "grand design". and that's the reason why it failed.
14:34:01  <andythenorth> it doesn't necessarily recommend burning all future possibilities to ship today :P
14:34:11  <andythenorth> nor breaking everything that was already built to ship today :P
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14:36:05  <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: that's why i didn't understand the whole argument
14:36:26  <andythenorth> it originates in the question 'why did C and Unix together beat Lisp'
14:36:41  <andythenorth> it's a bit like 'why did PHP comprehensively beat Python and Perl'
14:39:35  <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: because the properties that someone defines as "best" do not automatically create the biggest "market share"
14:39:51  <andythenorth> exactly
14:40:04  <Eddi|zuHause> why did VHS win over Betamax?
14:40:13  <andythenorth> because porn was available on VHS
14:40:22  <andythenorth> dunno why that was, but it's the usual reason given :P
14:40:26  <Eddi|zuHause> why did Bluray win over HD-DVD?
14:40:30  <andythenorth> politics :P
14:40:49  <Eddi|zuHause> why did "free market" win over "communism"?
14:41:40  <andythenorth> it did?
14:41:43  * andythenorth missed that :)
14:41:44  <Eddi|zuHause> even in china
14:42:03  <andythenorth> seems to me like 'markets captured by elites' won
14:42:16  <Eddi|zuHause> why did mammals win over dinosaurs?
14:43:27  <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: sometimes the label doesn't accurately describe the content :p
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15:15:30  <Fori> Is this "Town growth can be accelerated by loading and unloading at least one item of cargo at up to five stations within town influence within a two month period. It does not matter which cargos are loaded/unloaded. " still accurate with 1.2?
15:15:56  <Eddi|zuHause> yes
15:16:06  <Eddi|zuHause> unless you load a GoalScript
15:16:19  <Eddi|zuHause> that can override this behaviour
15:19:13  *** Fori_DC [] has joined #openttd
15:19:18  <Fori_DC> Uhm, had a DC.
15:19:22  <Fori_DC> Did someone answer me?
15:19:25  *** Fori [] has quit [Quit: ajax IRC Client]
15:19:32  *** Fori_DC is now known as Fori
15:19:48  <Eddi|zuHause> yes, unless you load a GoalScript
15:19:50  <Eddi|zuHause> that can override this behaviour
15:20:56  <Fori> Thx Eddi|zuHause
15:21:15  <Fori> One should use timetables for that, huh?
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15:24:15  <Eddi|zuHause> if your vehicle arrives less than every two months, you probably do something wrong
15:25:35  <Fori> I seem to be doing something wrong. It continuesly says "This town doesnt grow."
15:25:51  <Fori> Even though water / food are green and I got some mail trains stopping by from while to while.
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15:30:20  <Eddi|zuHause> can't help you with that
15:30:39  <Fori> kk
15:34:18  <planetmaker> maybe you use a game script?
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15:49:07  <Fori> I don't.
15:50:01  <FLHerne> Are you using some strange townset?
15:50:33  <FLHerne> I believe TaI Houses does something to town growth...
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15:51:43  <Fori> I just tested on temperate and made a bus line in town.
15:51:44  <Fori> All good.
15:52:02  <Fori> Seems like my deliveries are not fast enough. Strange.
15:52:26  <Fori> It should be enough when a train catches some mail bags all 2 months. Isnt that right?
15:53:52  <Fori> Now I've seen that there was loading / unloading in these two months but it didnt grow. Strange that is.
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16:01:42  <Sacro> @seen bjarni
16:01:42  <DorpsGek> Sacro: bjarni was last seen in #openttd 27 weeks, 4 days, 15 hours, 47 minutes, and 11 seconds ago: <Bjarni> heh
16:03:03  *** frosch123 [] has joined #openttd
16:07:44  <Fori> @seen Fori
16:07:44  <DorpsGek> Fori: Fori was last seen in #openttd 13 minutes and 52 seconds ago: <Fori> Now I've seen that there was loading / unloading in these two months but it didnt grow. Strange that is.
16:08:05  <Fori> @seen drac_boy
16:08:05  <DorpsGek> Fori: drac_boy was last seen in #openttd 17 hours, 26 minutes, and 40 seconds ago: <drac_boy> manual>gameplay>multiplayer
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16:40:24  <supermop> when did this canadian station drama happen? and why?
16:41:35  *** telanus1 is now known as telanus
16:51:41  <Fori> Eddi|zuHause: Ich found the problem!
16:52:38  <Fori> lol, Ich = I, sorry.
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17:01:25  *** Fori [] has quit [autokilled: Spam. Contact for further information and assistance. (2012-04-17 17:06:01)]
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17:05:50  <Terkhen> hello
17:06:23  <Wolf01> hello Terkhen
17:13:38  <andythenorth> lo Terkhen
17:13:47  <andythenorth> did you solve Metal Fabrication Plant? ;)
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17:16:21  <Alberth> good evenink
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17:17:16  <Terkhen> andythenorth: yes :P
17:17:52  <andythenorth> it makes metal...stuff
17:18:43  <Terkhen> something that takes metal and produces "metal" :P
17:18:51  <Eddi|zuHause> there's not enough doctor who in this spring...
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17:25:37  <Alberth> it should make question marks!
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17:34:38  <andythenorth> !
17:38:42  <Alberth> a question mark stretching itself :p
17:40:55  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: translators * r24123 /trunk/src/lang/ (afrikaans.txt french.txt slovak.txt):
17:40:55  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
17:40:55  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: afrikaans - 8 changes by telanus
17:40:55  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: french - 22 changes by OliTTD
17:40:55  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: slovak - 6 changes by teso
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18:12:14  <michi_cc> Last chance to dig out your old, rusty and forgotten patch! ;)
18:13:03  <NGC3982> what!
18:13:04  <NGC3982> oh
18:13:15  <NGC3982> i should exclude rusty off my hilight list.
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18:34:53  <Fori> Can I influence how often a town grows? E.g. 100 or 200 days?
18:35:06  <Fori> Cause I got 2 cities and one grows every 100 and the other every 199 days.
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18:41:15  <Alberth>
18:41:26  <zxbiohazardzx> quicky question: is there a limit to the ammount of bridges one can have in OTTD?
18:41:54  <zxbiohazardzx> as in different bridge-types, newgrf wise
18:41:55  <Alberth> less than inifinite?
18:41:57  <frosch123> not yet
18:42:18  <Fori> Alberth: Does that article cover the new changes of 1.2?
18:42:25  <Alberth> oh bridge types, that something else
18:42:47  <supermop> 12 i though?
18:42:50  <supermop> thought
18:43:11  <Alberth> Fori: no idea
18:43:15  <zxbiohazardzx> yeah TTDP its 11, but is this hardcoded and can this ammount be raised?
18:43:26  <Fori> I don't think so. That's why I asked here ^^
18:44:09  <Alberth> Fori: I don't even know exactly what has changed, except that you've got much more control now with a game script
18:44:12  <zxbiohazardzx> in TTDP the number is 11 - if I'm not mistaken. What I've never understood though is why bridges must be identical in both views. Having a different view in the 2nd direction would give us 22 different bridges - assuming we're talking TTDP here. Could the similar number for OTTD be 13/26?
18:44:18  <zxbiohazardzx> thats the question actually
18:44:23  <supermop> would need to be patched
18:45:19  <Alberth> static const uint MAX_BRIDGES = 13; ///< Maximal number of available bridge specs.
18:45:32  <zxbiohazardzx> hardcoded to 13 because?
18:45:41  <zxbiohazardzx> uint can hold > 13 right?
18:45:41  <zxbiohazardzx> XD
18:45:58  <Alberth> newgrf specs????
18:46:25  <Alberth> historic reasons????
18:46:28  <Alberth> who knows
18:46:41  <zxbiohazardzx> Alberth stupid specs again? why is it limited to 13 and can this not be altered via a setting or via the newGRFs ???
18:46:52  <zxbiohazardzx> what cpp is that in btw?
18:47:15  <Alberth> zxbiohazardzx: OpenTTD follows specs, not the other way around :)
18:47:32  <Alberth> bridge.h file
18:48:42  <zxbiohazardzx> Alberth makes me wonder about those "specs" more and more
18:48:59  <zxbiohazardzx> where are the specs defined, who defined them, and why are they so holy-bile-styled
18:49:23  <supermop> bridge specs need a lot of work
18:49:44  <Alberth>
18:50:08  <Alberth> historically, a lot of them came from the original program and from TTDPatch
18:50:40  <Alberth> people do make extensions though, eg the 32bpp support
18:51:16  <supermop> more types, custom sprite layout, callbacks to be aware of neighboring bridges, and ability for new grf to determine different sets of bridge type for each way type
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18:53:28  <zxbiohazardzx> supermop yeah custom bridgeheads etc
18:53:34  <zxbiohazardzx> but i was more wondering why it was set to 13
18:53:48  <zxbiohazardzx> and if that limit could be increased to allow more newgrf bridges :P
18:54:09  <supermop> well custom bridgeheads would be have little to do with new grf specs
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18:54:46  <supermop> unless you want to set the property to allow them for each tipe
18:54:48  <supermop> type
18:59:46  <zxbiohazardzx> hmmz fair nough
18:59:57  <zxbiohazardzx> lemmy see if spec says anything about those 13 hardcoded number
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19:00:49  <zxbiohazardzx> we already added 2 in OTTD?
19:01:05  <supermop> the tube bridges
19:01:09  <zxbiohazardzx> according to the spec, ID (dec) ID(Hex) has 2 extra ones for OTTD that arent in TTDP
19:01:10  <zxbiohazardzx> yeah
19:01:18  *** zooks [] has joined #openttd
19:01:27  <zxbiohazardzx> so why would it be impossible to add more / make it more variable?
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19:02:24  <supermop> no one has done it yet
19:02:36  *** Avenger [~rafinha21@] has quit []
19:02:43  <supermop> nml doesnt support bridges, but i really want it to
19:02:57  <zxbiohazardzx> well there are bridge renewal sets
19:03:05  <zxbiohazardzx> but im wondering if i want to combine or add more:P
19:03:07  <supermop> but i doubt it will until there is some better agreed upon spec
19:03:24  <zxbiohazardzx> eg grey brick, red brick etc variations
19:03:34  <supermop> those only allow up to 13 too, anc can only use one of the default sprite layouts
19:05:53  <zxbiohazardzx> yes i know they only use 13
19:06:02  <zxbiohazardzx> as the spec lists 13 slots/ids that you can then modify
19:06:07  <zxbiohazardzx> but the main question again is why
19:06:25  <zxbiohazardzx> as the hex gives you at least 15/16 options
19:06:35  <zxbiohazardzx> 00 -> 0F
19:06:40  <zxbiohazardzx> and we use 00-> 0C
19:07:29  <andythenorth> maybe the higher parts of the byte are used for something else
19:07:29  <planetmaker> well, the current approach won't be extended to further IDs. The next extension would need to be real NewGRF bridges with action0 etc
19:07:41  <planetmaker> just adding new IDs which need hard-coding is not a good thing
19:07:49  <zxbiohazardzx> @Planetmaker thats the question
19:07:52  <andythenorth> or maybe there were only 13 original bridges
19:07:59  <zxbiohazardzx> if i have sprites for lets say 26 or more bridges
19:08:05  <zxbiohazardzx> how would that work ingame?
19:08:12  <planetmaker> andythenorth: there were 11. And 2 added
19:08:14  <zxbiohazardzx> do i get 13 and the rest gets cut out?
19:08:22  <zxbiohazardzx> 11 original, 2 got added indeed
19:08:47  <planetmaker> zxbiohazardzx: with a newgrf support, you would get more. Whatever then is the allowed amount of bridges ;-)
19:09:05  <zxbiohazardzx> planetmaker i recon that support is not in?
19:09:22  <Alberth> zxbiohazardzx: somewhere along the path from source to loaded in openttd, you'd lose 13 currently
19:09:29  <planetmaker> oh, it's a very nice thing. But it does not yet exist nor even a patch (that I know of)
19:09:30  <zxbiohazardzx> bridge-types not ammount of total bridges ingame
19:09:44  <zxbiohazardzx> so yeah Planetmaker hardcoded is the limit atm
19:09:50  <planetmaker> yes
19:09:56  <Alberth> zxbiohazardzx: if it exists, it would be in the newgrf spec
19:09:59  <zxbiohazardzx> would it not be an idea to add 3 empty/dummy slots that newgrfs can overwrite as they do now?
19:10:12  <zxbiohazardzx> newGRF spec lists 00-> 0C ids
19:10:22  <planetmaker> it's actually not even a limit. It's an exact amount of bridge types. Though you can change availability date to reduce bridge types available
19:10:32  <zxbiohazardzx> so afaik you can add 0D,0E,0F to at least fill it up Hex
19:10:54  <zxbiohazardzx> planetmaker, total bridge renewal etc do change the ammount?
19:10:59  <planetmaker> zxbiohazardzx: no, that's not an idea
19:11:08  <planetmaker> as the sprites need hard-coding, too
19:11:09  <Alberth> zxbiohazardzx: as said by planetmaker, it is a wrong direction.
19:11:19  <planetmaker> as does the sprite layout
19:11:22  <planetmaker> not good
19:11:51  <planetmaker> and hard-coding invisible sprites so that they *might* be replaced... urgs
19:12:08  <planetmaker> then someone just changes availability.. and voila :-)
19:12:10  <Alberth> finally an invisible bridge :p
19:12:11  <planetmaker> invisible bridges
19:13:28  <Alberth> zxbiohazardzx: in other words, we need a new  newgrf spec for bridges :p
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19:16:06  <zxbiohazardzx> haha so the un-change able spec needs a change
19:16:36  <Alberth> an extension :p
19:17:04  <zxbiohazardzx> reasonable
19:17:05  <planetmaker> no change. As usual an extension. In a similar manner as vehicles, houses, industries
19:18:03  <zxbiohazardzx> and then in theory the ammount of bridges and the design/lenght/spriteuseperlenght will all move to the GRF?
19:18:11  <zxbiohazardzx> as all those are linked
19:19:32  <andythenorth> spec can be extended
19:19:40  <andythenorth> existing stuff can't be changed :(
19:19:43  <supermop> brb
19:19:44  *** supermop [] has quit [Quit: supermop]
19:19:45  <planetmaker> there'll be a maximum amount of allowed bridge types. Not sure how high that can be, that dependso n the free bits in the map array
19:20:04  <planetmaker> but the actually available bridges will be then newgrf-determined as the other stuff
19:20:26  <planetmaker> the 13 default bridges still would be there, unless made unavailable or also changed by the newgrf. So yes
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19:22:21  <Eddi|zuHause> bridge availability depending on railtype would be nice
19:22:36  <Eddi|zuHause> don't offer 400km/h bridges for an 80km/h railtype
19:22:36  <zxbiohazardzx> ^^
19:22:49  <zxbiohazardzx> alot of good features relate to it :P
19:24:33  *** zooks [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
19:24:51  <zxbiohazardzx> now the next question
19:25:06  <zxbiohazardzx> in relation to patches etc, how hard is it to modify the spec to accept above idea's ?:P
19:25:36  <andythenorth> about as hard as patching in some cases
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19:25:51  <andythenorth> in other cases, modiying the spec is much harder than patching
19:26:18  <zxbiohazardzx> i cant even patch :P but i was just wondering in general :P
19:26:36  <zxbiohazardzx> my coding skills end after the interwebs & a bit of java
19:28:37  <Alberth> getting some agreement on the new spec is a challenge enough for now, I think ;)
19:29:37  <zxbiohazardzx> Alberth well as i mentioned, there is more then just changing the number of bridges
19:29:39  <andythenorth> good luck :P
19:30:02  <zxbiohazardzx> as Eddi suggested, availability depending on railtype etc would also be part of that i guess?
19:30:21  <zxbiohazardzx> and i know 0.0 of what that new spec would have to contain
19:30:32  <zxbiohazardzx> i just suggested something in the IRC or asked about it :P
19:30:33  <Alberth> zxbiohazardzx: yes, so making a spec is non-trivial, and getting agreement on them is more complicated
19:31:42  <Rhamphoryncus> .. oi, I just realized 1.2.0 has been released :P
19:32:00  <Alberth> someone woke up :D
19:32:19  <michi_cc> Rhamphoryncus: It's going to be outdated in a minute :p
19:32:26  <Rhamphoryncus> heh
19:32:39  <zxbiohazardzx> lolled]
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19:32:48  <drac_boy> hi
19:32:52  <Alberth> hi
19:33:17  <drac_boy> how're you Alberth?
19:33:36  <zxbiohazardzx> i gotta go :(
19:33:41  <zxbiohazardzx> ill keep this in mind though :P
19:33:50  <zxbiohazardzx> thx alberth&planet for answering :)
19:33:57  <Alberth> bye zxbiohazardzx :)
19:34:23  <Alberth> drac_boy: happy, /me has 0x28 in the RCD data file :p
19:36:28  <drac_boy> rcd?
19:37:55  <Alberth> Roller Coaster Data file, in my freerct project :)
19:38:29  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24124 /trunk/src/ (engine_type.h vehicle.cpp): -Add [FS#4658]: [NewGRF] Misc engine flag to disable breakdown smoke. (Hirundo)
19:38:34  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24125 /trunk/src/group_gui.cpp: -Add [FS#3705]: Drag destination highlighting to the group GUI. (sbr)
19:38:36  <Alberth> the bad news is now that I have to load that value again in my program, and I don't have code for it yet
19:38:38  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24126 /trunk/src/newgrf_gui.cpp: -Feature [FS#3854]: Drag and drop support for the NewGRF list window. (Based on patch by sbr)
19:38:43  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24127 /trunk/src/ (16 files in 6 dirs): -Feature [FS#1497]: Allow closing airports for incoming aircraft. (Based on patch by cirdan)
19:38:48  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24128 /trunk/src/vehicle.cpp: -Change: Don't let vehicles break down directly after servicing.
19:38:57  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24129 /trunk/src/ (6 files in 3 dirs): -Feature [FS#3660]: Option to minimise signal distance when dragging over obstacles. (adf88)
19:38:59  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24130 /trunk/src/rail_gui.cpp: -Feature(ette): [FS#2314]: Deselect 'remove' button when changing signal types in the GUI. (Alberth)
19:39:04  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24131 /trunk/src/ (company_gui.cpp lang/english.txt): -Add [FS#1952]: Ctrl-Clicking to change colour of all colour schemes at once. (Roest)
19:39:07  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24132 /trunk/src/ (genworld.cpp landscape.cpp misc.cpp saveload/afterload.cpp): -Change [FS#4713]: Improve randomness of tile order in the tile loop. (monoid)
19:39:12  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24133 /trunk/src/ (currency.cpp currency.h lang/english.txt): -Add [FS#4984]: Lithuanian currency. (devastator)
19:39:17  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24134 /trunk/src/ (8 files in 4 dirs): -Add: Configurable limits for tree planting.
19:39:22  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24135 /trunk/src/tree_gui.cpp: -Remove [FS#4757]: Tree drag size limit.
19:39:28  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24136 /trunk/src/ (14 files in 4 dirs): -Feature [FS#4465]: Autoreplace vehicles only when they get old. (Vikthor)
19:39:33  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24137 /trunk/src/build_vehicle_gui.cpp: -Feature(ette): Draw indicator icon in the replace vehicle window for vehicles which have a replacement set.
19:39:36  <drac_boy> hmm alberth whats freerct supposed to do?
19:39:39  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24138 /trunk/src/ (group_cmd.cpp group_gui.cpp): -Feature(ette): Ctrl+drag to add all vehicles with a shared order list to a group. (Juanjo)
19:39:42  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24139 /trunk/src/ (5 files in 2 dirs): -Add: Creating a new vehicle group by drag and drop. (Based on patch by Juanjo)
19:40:02  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24140 /trunk/src/ (52 files in 3 dirs): -Add [FS#1117]: Group name in the replace vehicle window caption. (Juanjo)
19:40:07  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24141 /trunk/ (8 files in 4 dirs): -Feature: Display rating in the town directory window. (Inspired by patch from MagicBuzz)
19:40:12  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24142 /trunk/src/vehicle.cpp: -Feature [FS#3576]: Randomise count of passengers killed in a crash. (riffraffselbow)
19:40:12  <Alberth> drac_boy: open source variant of a well know rollercaster tycoon program :)
19:40:21  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24143 /trunk/src/rail_cmd.cpp: -Change [FS#5145]: Improve fence placement for rail. (Eddi)
19:40:21  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24144 /trunk/src/rail_gui.cpp: -Change [FS#4605]: Reset 'convert signal' button when signal GUI is closed. (yorick)
19:40:24  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24145 /trunk/src/settings.cpp: -Cleanup: Switch coding style.
19:40:26  <andythenorth> ho ho
19:40:29  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24146 /trunk/src/settings.cpp: -Fix [FS#5153]: Use default value when reading an invalid setting value. (Eddi)
19:40:37  <drac_boy> alberth hmm what kind of system requirement?
19:40:41  <michi_cc> Rhamphoryncus: See, outdated :p
19:40:48  <Alberth> there is no stopping michi_cc, andythenorth :)
19:41:05  <andythenorth> it's a spree
19:41:31  <michi_cc> Now I have to close all those tickets :( :p
19:41:43  <andythenorth> close airports
19:41:59  <Alberth> drac_boy: currently it only builds from source, at a linux system, if you have python 2.7
19:42:22  <Alberth> michi_cc: ask TB for an automagic close-on-commit :p
19:43:07  <Alberth> drac_boy: but there is nothing moving yet :)
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19:43:26  <drac_boy> Alberth hmm so probably just as low resource more or less like the original one?
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19:44:05  <Alberth> hopefully, but I don't really design on that
19:44:29  <Alberth> first it needs to move, and get playable
19:46:26  <drac_boy> Alberth well if it'll work smoothy with a full&busy park on a P3 I don't see any problem in it hopefully catching on big time
19:46:42  <andythenorth> there's only one Alberth :)
19:46:51  <andythenorth> he needs a network effect ;)
19:47:28  <drac_boy> mind you I know I've changed computers by then but the only reason I never ever got to rct2 was because when I tried the demo I found that it always ran rather sputterly even for small parks
19:48:12  <drac_boy> andythenorth heh
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19:49:00  <Alberth> andythenorth: indeed, any good in Python hacking? :p
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19:49:18  <andythenorth> Alberth: ask pixa
19:49:29  <Alberth> bummer, he just left :(
19:49:56  <andythenorth> oops
19:50:16  <Alberth> :)
19:51:48  <drac_boy> heh
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19:57:56  <Alberth> good night all
19:58:01  <andythenorth> bye
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19:59:12  <oskari89> michi_cc: Did those features go to 1.2.1?
19:59:17  <michi_cc> No.
19:59:41  <oskari89> Ok.
19:59:54  <oskari89> They are going in 1.3x or so?
20:00:04  <michi_cc> Yes, trunk is 1.3 now.
20:00:29  <oskari89> Even more new features than that? :)
20:04:31  <Terkhen> trunk = new stuff
20:05:19  <Zuu> Warning: I just posted a very silly GS interface idea :-)
20:05:27  <Zuu> (in the NoGo thread)
20:05:32  <drac_boy> zuu where? :)
20:05:42  <Zuu> its in the development forum
20:06:17  <Zuu> It maybe should be moved to the AI/NoGo subforum now, but that is up to the moderators to decide.
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20:13:31  <Zuu> r24124 just killed the need for CluelessPlus to build service airports (for sending aircrafts there when upgrading airports). At least if that change included an AI api function.
20:13:38  <Zuu> :-)
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20:15:35  <michi_cc> If you meant 24127, you're lucky.
20:16:16  <Zuu> Yep, I ment 24127, I was too happy to see the commit sphere to type the correct number. :-)
20:16:34  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24147 /trunk/bin/ai/regression/regression.txt: -Fix (r24132): AI regression output.
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20:52:13  <frosch123> Zuu: wrt. fs#5151. the crash is related to in-game switching of blitters
20:52:29  <frosch123> so, it only happens if you do not enforce a particular blitter with the -b or blitter options
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20:53:13  <Rubidium> and only on windows
20:53:15  <Zuu> hmm, so I should actually not set the blitter in openttd.cfg to the one that the crash reporter used in order to reproduce it.
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20:55:02  <Zuu> assuming that 8bbp is still the default one.
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20:59:53  <FLHerne> Is that bug Windows-specific?
21:00:20  <Eddi|zuHause> win64 specific, iirc
21:00:24  <Zuu> 64bit windows specific as far as we know now.
21:00:46  <Terkhen> yes
21:00:56  <Terkhen> I only managed to reproduce it with win x64
21:01:38  <FLHerne> Thought I hadn't encountered it :P
21:03:17  <FLHerne> I did get this one though:
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21:11:37  <drac_boy> btw is 'willing to entertain on price' right or was there a different wording I should be thinking of? its for an ad post
21:12:43  <FLHerne> That doesn't make a lot of sense to me :P
21:12:50  <supermop> hey Eddi|zuHause, does your post mean that the fence thing is in trunk?
21:13:04  <drac_boy> FLHerne heh any idea how to say that you're flexible on the price rather than the one you listed?
21:13:23  <Eddi|zuHause> supermop: there's an easy way to find that out...
21:13:26  <TWerkhoven[l]> reasonable offers accepted?
21:13:33  <drac_boy> hm thanks TWerkhoven[l]
21:14:04  <FLHerne> Now [i]that[/i] makes sense to me :D
21:14:07  <drac_boy> ok posted :)
21:14:50  * FLHerne waits for someone to invent IRC with markup that works :P
21:15:04  <FLHerne> Oh, and more smilies :-)
21:15:19  <drac_boy> FLHerne nope, thats not text so not going to happen
21:16:09  <TWerkhoven[l]> it could, but parsign would have to happen clientside
21:16:28  <TWerkhoven[l]> im sure theres clients out there (java mostly) that will change smileys into graphics
21:17:37  <Rubidium> which is incredibly annoucing when you're talking about code
21:17:53  <drac_boy> Rubidium yeah theres that :p
21:18:13  <TWerkhoven[l]> agreed
21:18:16  <Rubidium> (or for someone that uses parenthesis)
21:18:56  <Rubidium> any 'respectible' text-to-smiley code would introduce at least two smileys there
21:20:06  <TWerkhoven[l]> no, thats just the crap version, to be called respectible it would have to filter out common parenthesis usage
21:20:35  <FLHerne> My IRC client already parses smilies :P
21:20:48  <FLHerne> Just not enough variations...
21:21:46  <FLHerne> Standardised client-side parsing of markup would actually be possible, wouldn't it?
21:22:07  <FLHerne> 'Standardised' being the issue, I guess
21:22:47  <TWerkhoven[l]> yup
21:23:48  <Rubidium> pff... standards.
21:23:56  <Rubidium> the standard is pretty clear about the markup
21:24:12  <Rubidium> only everyone decides to make custom additions to that standard
21:24:15  <FLHerne>
21:24:58  <drac_boy> four ads posted so far
21:25:10  <drac_boy> wouldn't be surprised if I could clear all four out this week too :)
21:25:29  <Terkhen> good night
21:25:33  <drac_boy> bye Terkhen
21:25:37  <FLHerne> 'night Terkhen
21:25:50  <FLHerne> drac_boy: four of what?
21:26:49  <Eddi|zuHause> in KDE you can configure the smilies
21:27:30  * Rubidium claims the Zzzz smiley
21:27:30  <FLHerne> I'm using KDE :P
21:28:26  <FLHerne> It's all shiny, and widgety, and ooh, I can make that section both semi-transparent [i]and[/i] animated! :D
21:28:28  <drac_boy> FLHerne you need to read the whole line silly :p
21:28:40  <FLHerne> I did
21:28:57  <TWerkhoven[l]> dont forget the blink tag
21:28:58  <drac_boy> well you probably didn't to be asking such question :P
21:29:00  <FLHerne> Then I went off on a random tangent for no reason...
21:29:46  <FLHerne> clear all four ads out?
21:30:06  * FLHerne gets baffled again
21:34:42  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24148 /trunk/src/ (currency.cpp currency.h lang/english.txt): -Add [FS#4907]: South Korean and South African currencies. (PaulC)
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21:37:26  <NGC3982> hmz
21:37:29  <NGC3982> i wonder
21:37:47  <NGC3982> how can a train like the CC 40100 achieve speeds like 240km/h?
21:37:51  <NGC3982>
21:37:58  <NGC3982> doesnt look that aerodynamic? :E
21:39:07  <drac_boy> actually it is...its more or less flat except on the front .. and from the sizing of the middle its probably got a lot of hp
21:39:42  <TWerkhoven[l]> aerodynamics isnt everything, though it sure helps
21:40:18  <Eddi|zuHause> it says 160km/h on wikipedia
21:42:22  <Wolf01> 'night
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21:43:53  <TWerkhoven[l]> french one sais 160/240kmh, but also 2 different kw outputs
21:45:19  <NGC3982> sure, aerodynamics isnt everything. though, i thought speeds like that required a more ..not that flat faced form.
21:45:29  <TWerkhoven[l]> maybe it depends on the line voltage, as it can draw 4 different voltages
21:46:46  <TWerkhoven[l]> anyway, bedtime for me
21:47:19  <NGC3982> night :)
21:48:06  <Eddi|zuHause> voltage is really only relevant for DC
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21:52:36  <drac_boy> eddi actually not quite true. theres low voltage ac as well
21:52:54  <drac_boy> they're in small number tho of course
21:53:58  <drac_boy> probably ever smaller for old dual-pantograph systems too (although the london system still uses the 3rd+4th rail version of this I recall)
21:54:56  <Eddi|zuHause> drac_boy: i meant: you can draw the same amount of power in low and high voltage AC
21:55:31  <Eddi|zuHause> lower voltage may mean slightly more losses over distance
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21:55:42  <Eddi|zuHause> but you need smaller security distance
21:56:42  <Eddi|zuHause> but in DC, you can't make the current arbitrarily high, so you only have pretty much linear dependency between voltage and power
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21:57:13  <Eddi|zuHause> P = U*I
21:57:37  <FLHerne> <(although the london system still uses the 3rd+4th rail version of this I recall)> London is DC. Maybe I misunderstood you again though...
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22:02:21  <drac_boy> FLHerne some of the double panto systems were dc too mind you
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22:07:04  <NGC3982> my word
22:07:37  <NGC3982> when i get my own garden, forget the garden gnomes
22:07:45  <NGC3982> ill get a uac turbo train.
22:08:19  <drac_boy> NGC3982 heh why? you'll need a large yard for something approaching express-like speeds :)
22:09:31  <NGC3982> i dont want it running
22:09:40  <drac_boy> oh outdoor display model?
22:09:42  <NGC3982> i just want it to sit there, in its yellow glory.
22:09:47  <NGC3982> indeed
22:10:01  <drac_boy> hmm so the question then would be...what kind of set makeup and in which livery then? :)
22:10:21  <NGC3982> and i feel quite serious. even though i dont know that much about trains (yet), i feel compelled to create my own museum.
22:10:31  <NGC3982> drac_boy: i have no idea.
22:11:50  <drac_boy> NGC3982 well I asked because it varied between 3-car (only one intermidate coach yeah) up to a bit over ten cars
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22:12:19  <NGC3982> oh, i have no clue
22:12:29  <NGC3982> i just want the end.
22:12:36  <NGC3982> or at least the engine
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22:12:55  <drac_boy> thats not much of a train then :p
22:13:06  <drac_boy> especially with half of its truck missing :)
22:13:35  <NGC3982> :)
22:14:51  <drac_boy> if you really need a single-unit something, model that one modified rail speed record setting budd rdc with the two red/gray jet engines on its roof :)
22:15:00  <drac_boy> heh
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22:17:57  <NGC3982> oh
22:18:29  <NGC3982>
22:18:30  <NGC3982> harr.
22:18:30  <NGC3982> :D
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22:29:51  <drac_boy> NGC3982 btw also try look up the Xplorer from C&O .. it was supposed to be 'the' next generation passenger train .. lighter and lower gravity (it was pretty much the usa version of talgo concept yeah)
22:30:15  <drac_boy> did not have a good life tho.  one of the major ops was not ordering the rear locomotive unit so the tail always rode a bit harsh :-s
22:30:58  <NGC3982> oh
22:31:01  <drac_boy> a different New haven version with more conservative nose did actually have a loco at both ends..but again short life mainly from one thing - it caught fire on the press run, not so much fun :-/
22:31:51  <drac_boy> these two were the only known lightweight trainset in usa afaik
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22:38:53  <drac_boy> NGC3982 you probably could still do a tgv locomotive .. they were seperated end units (from the articulated consist) anyhow
22:39:13  <drac_boy> although whether you want to do the well known electric one or the one-off gas turbine one is up to you :)
22:39:16  <drac_boy> same livery for both tho
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23:08:09  <V453000> hm, how do I remove an AI company? :D
23:08:24  <V453000> ERROR: Company is owned by an AI. on reset_company :D
23:10:08  <Mazur> rcon stop_ai <company_slot>
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23:13:18  <Zuu> Don't forget to also reduce the company count in difficulty settings, if you don't want a new AI to start soon.
23:14:00  <Mazur> Or unset ai_in multiplayer
23:14:10  <Mazur> Which had already been done.
23:17:15  <Zuu> requires that you have a MP game, but I guess you do :-)
23:17:47  <Mazur> Stable.
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