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Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 00:31:20 *** Pixa [~pixa@85.210.69.200] has joined #openttd 00:31:36 *** KouDy [~KouDy@175.137.100.254] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 00:32:55 *** KouDy [~KouDy@175.137.100.254] has joined #openttd 00:36:37 *** LordPixaII [~pixa@79-68-111-207.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:40:32 *** Devroush [~dennis@dD5765BAC.access.telenet.be] has quit [] 00:41:22 *** KouDy [~KouDy@175.137.100.254] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 00:42:09 *** KouDy [~KouDy@175.137.100.254] has joined #openttd 00:47:44 *** KouDy [~KouDy@175.137.100.254] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 00:52:06 <Wolf01> 'night 00:52:09 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@95.232.234.29] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 00:54:08 *** KouDy [~KouDy@175.137.100.254] has joined #openttd 01:04:16 *** Supercheese [~Password4@76.178.163.204] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:06:35 *** Supercheese [~Password4@76.178.163.204] has joined #openttd 01:17:16 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:4da7:344b:2694:b88b] has quit [Quit: bye] 01:56:46 *** Elukka [Elukka@78-27-97-92.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [] 02:16:08 *** pugi_ [~pugi@host-091-097-177-142.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has joined #openttd 02:22:04 *** pugi [~pugi@host-091-097-024-096.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:22:05 *** pugi_ is now known as pugi 03:24:03 *** roadt [~roadt@223.240.107.33] has joined #openttd 04:01:25 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 [~Flex@i59F6A3C8.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 04:07:25 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@i59F6B04B.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 04:34:14 *** Elukka [Elukka@78-27-97-92.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 04:43:01 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p57BD43EC.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [] 04:43:16 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p5DC67CAF.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 04:44:42 *** DDR [~chatzilla@d172-218-2-5.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd 04:52:06 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 04:55:49 <andythenorth> bongiorno 04:56:11 <Supercheese> e ti 04:58:25 *** pugi [~pugi@host-091-097-177-142.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has quit [] 05:06:21 <telanus> hellllo 05:10:00 *** M1zera [~Miranda@ip-78-102-217-126.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 05:51:31 <andythenorth> if else blocks like this http://paste.openttdcoop.org/show/1604/ 05:51:37 <andythenorth> I always find them a bit clunky 05:51:57 <andythenorth> but then I leave them in place because they're so easily read 05:58:25 <Eddi|zuHause> render = lambda self: templates.get(self.custom_template, templates['ship_template.pynml'])(vehicle = self) 06:00:51 <andythenorth> yeah 06:00:54 <andythenorth> I had something like that 06:01:03 <andythenorth> I deleted it as less readable 06:01:11 <andythenorth> but I'm not convinced 06:01:21 * andythenorth tends to get distracted by meta issues when coding :P 06:04:19 <andythenorth> template = templates[('ship_template.pynml', self.custom_template)[self.custom_template is not None]] 06:17:28 *** sla_ro|master [slaco@78.96.213.97] has joined #openttd 06:21:53 <Eddi|zuHause> that doesn'T look right 06:23:57 <Eddi|zuHause> use "self.custom_template or 'ship_template.pynml'" 06:26:30 <Eddi|zuHause> "a or b" is an abbreviation for "a if a is something non-0 else b" 06:27:33 <Eddi|zuHause> so "template = templates[self.custom_template or 'ship_template.pynml']" 06:27:50 <Eddi|zuHause> with the added side effect that it handles also empty strings and such 06:30:44 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: thanks, amended 06:30:46 <andythenorth> pretty clean 06:43:13 *** roadt [~roadt@223.240.107.33] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:50:08 *** roadt [~roadt@223.240.107.33] has joined #openttd 07:08:40 <andythenorth> hmm 07:08:51 <andythenorth> python's boolean 'and' boggles my brain 07:08:54 <andythenorth> I kind of get it 07:09:02 <andythenorth> had to read it four times :P 07:09:22 <andythenorth> http://docs.python.org/release/2.5.2/lib/boolean.html 07:11:51 <Eddi|zuHause> yes. "false" is different from "False" 07:21:36 <andythenorth> version number shenanigans 07:21:49 <andythenorth> FISH current release is 0.9.2 07:22:15 <andythenorth> trunk is now quite different, the set has changed in multiple ways 07:22:27 <andythenorth> so I'm thinking of going to 2.0.0, skipping 1.0.0 07:22:30 <andythenorth> is that silly? 07:22:48 <andythenorth> (not really anything to do with nfo vs. nml, that's just implementation) 07:27:06 <Eddi|zuHause> seriously... what's the significance? 07:27:32 <Eddi|zuHause> might as well go 0.10 07:28:03 <Eddi|zuHause> or "FISH 2" version 0.1 07:32:18 *** DDR [~chatzilla@d172-218-2-5.bchsia.telus.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:34:13 *** DDR [~chatzilla@d172-218-2-5.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd 07:34:49 <andythenorth> last option is best 07:37:31 *** Supercheese [~Password4@76.178.163.204] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.88.2 [Firefox 14.0.1/20120713134347]] 07:40:50 <andythenorth> feature request 07:41:05 <andythenorth> the toddler wants to have blue buses and yellow buses and pink buses 07:41:11 <andythenorth> and I can't be bothered to newgrf it :P 07:41:17 <V453000> im just counting versions as +1 to the latest :) no fuss 07:41:29 <andythenorth> (he wants to set colour per vehicle, and be able to change it) 07:41:36 <V453000> nuts has that for trainz :p 07:42:21 <andythenorth> if we had a colour cycle var, we could abuse it for other purposes 07:42:26 <andythenorth> it would find interesting uses 07:42:37 <V453000> :D 07:42:45 <V453000> I just have various sprites for it 07:42:55 <andythenorth> I know that looks like wrong thinking, but I suspect it's a variant of 'worse is better' 07:43:27 <V453000> flickering rainbow vehicles? 07:43:29 *** Zeknurn [~Zeknurn@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:44:11 *** Zeknurn [~Zeknurn@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has joined #openttd 07:48:08 *** tycoondemon [~ashnohoe@524B5F54.cm-4-4b.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 07:54:12 *** tycoondemon [~ashnohoe@524B5F54.cm-4-4b.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has joined #openttd 07:56:04 *** Sacro [~ben@150.237.48.99] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 08:02:02 *** DDR [~chatzilla@d172-218-2-5.bchsia.telus.net] has quit [Quit: for the love of god this is not safe for work] 08:16:29 <andythenorth> if I make it FISH 2, does it need a new banananaas entry? :P 08:17:45 <V453000> if there would be a reason to use FISH1 :D 08:17:52 <andythenorth> can't think of any 08:17:52 <V453000> then I would say yes 08:18:14 <V453000> idk, just update fish1 then I think 08:18:25 <andythenorth> seems easiest 08:24:51 <Terkhen> good morning 08:24:54 <andythenorth> hi Terkhen 08:32:03 <andythenorth> Terkhen: want to help test FISH 2? http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/3161/fish-nml-test.zip 08:32:17 <andythenorth> the log tugs are missing, think all other ships are there 08:32:26 <andythenorth> I haven't turned off default ships yet either 08:32:34 <andythenorth> or reset the water construction costs 08:33:27 <andythenorth> things like costs might be quite wrong in some places :P 08:36:25 *** FLHerne [~francis_h@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has joined #openttd 08:42:01 <Terkhen> sure, I'll test it later :) 08:42:15 <Terkhen> OpenTTD nightly or 1.2.1? 08:42:50 <andythenorth> probly works with stable 08:43:07 <andythenorth> I never use stable, so not sure ;) 08:49:13 <andythenorth> hmm 08:49:34 <andythenorth> are there are any escapes that let me dump a block of nfo into an nml file? 08:49:44 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@95.232.234.29] has joined #openttd 08:49:51 <Wolf01> hello o/ 08:50:17 <andythenorth> hmm 08:50:27 <andythenorth> do nml and nfo use same chars for comments? :P 08:51:01 <andythenorth> shame :P 08:54:38 *** TGYoshi [~TGYoshi@86.81.146.146] has joined #openttd 09:09:31 *** tokai|noir [~tokai@port-92-195-1-145.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 09:09:35 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai|noir] by ChanServ 09:10:11 <andythenorth> V453000: I do like you sprite style :D 09:10:15 <andythenorth> *your 09:12:09 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@s55978e11.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #openttd 09:15:19 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-94-215.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 09:23:50 <andythenorth> should ships reduce run cost whilst docked? 09:24:14 <Terkhen> andythenorth: ok, I'll take a note to test it :) 09:24:44 <andythenorth> thanks 09:36:51 <petern_> andythenorth, not greatly. that's one of the busiest times for staff 09:37:12 <Yexo> good morning 09:39:07 *** Biolunar [~mahdi@blfd-4db0e81f.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 09:51:16 <Terkhen> hi Yexo :) 09:51:55 * andythenorth doesn't adjust running costs whilst docked in that case 09:51:59 <andythenorth> hi Yexo 09:59:49 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590f5f81.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 10:00:27 <NGC3982> http://i.imgur.com/6jvHT.png 10:00:47 <NGC3982> V453000: it works, but slowly. 10:00:55 <NGC3982> as i thought, it's a maglev thing. 10:01:20 <NGC3982> although, 792 tonnes produced and maximum production reached? 10:05:05 <andythenorth> NGC3982: what FIRS version? 10:07:10 <NGC3982> andythenorth: 0.7.2 10:07:38 <andythenorth> NGC3982: production amounts probably got changed 10:08:06 <NGC3982> ah, i see. 10:08:16 <andythenorth> you should be safe to update to 0.7.5 10:08:27 <NGC3982> isnt that process automagic these days? 10:08:47 * NGC3982 knows how andy loves magic. 10:08:55 <andythenorth> hmm 10:09:05 <andythenorth> actually we broke savegames at 0.7.3 10:09:06 <andythenorth> sorry 10:09:10 <andythenorth> no upgrade for you ;) 10:09:31 <Yexo> NGC3982: updating newgrfs is never done automatically for existing savegames 10:10:37 <NGC3982> http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_mmBw3uzPnJI/TA94kZlvlMI/AAAAAAABU1c/0PC3xl8Gjq0/s1600/sad_keanu_reeves_meme_20.jpg 10:10:52 <NGC3982> Yexo: it's not a savegame. i started yesterday. 10:12:56 <Yexo> in that case just open the online content and click update 10:19:26 <NGC3982> will do. :) 10:32:53 *** Devroush [~dennis@dD5765BAC.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 10:43:21 *** Rhamphoryncus [~rhamph@d161-184-227-133.abhsia.telus.net] has quit [Quit: Rhamphoryncus] 10:49:23 *** Chrill [~chrischri@c83-253-89-11.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #openttd 11:06:10 <Terkhen> which IAs use ships? 11:07:05 <frosch123> i would guess for nocab 11:07:16 <frosch123> isn't there a comparison table on the wiki? 11:07:19 <frosch123> which lists such stuff 11:07:31 <Terkhen> oh, ok, thanks :) 11:08:22 <frosch123> nocab, otvi, terron and trans :) 11:11:11 <petern_> Anyone familiar with expect scripts? 11:11:35 <petern_> Can I hide output from the spawned program? 11:13:42 <Terkhen> ok :) 11:16:12 *** Biolunar [~mahdi@blfd-4db0e81f.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:17:41 <andythenorth> anyone want to contribute to FISH? 11:17:52 <andythenorth> need a parameter (bool) that resets various water costs 11:18:12 * andythenorth is deep in converting log tug sprite chains :P 11:19:09 <andythenorth> nfo for it water costs param is here: http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/fish/repository/entry/sprites/nfo/header.pnfo 11:21:00 <andythenorth> - it 11:21:14 * andythenorth seems to get ever more illiterate :P 11:28:15 <Yexo> rewrite it in nml :p 11:30:13 <andythenorth> that's my request :) 11:30:14 <andythenorth> the nfo works 11:30:32 <andythenorth> Yexo you probably missed that I'm converting FISH to nml :) 11:30:44 <Yexo> yes, I missed that 11:30:52 <Yexo> just got back from a 3 weeks holiday 11:31:37 <andythenorth> nearly finished it 11:31:41 <andythenorth> took about 3 weeks :P 11:31:48 <petern_> Rewrite it in GRFEdit 11:32:06 <petern_> Or was that GRFMaker... I can never remember... 11:32:09 <andythenorth> yeah 11:32:11 <andythenorth> those 11:32:17 <andythenorth> what does an nml spriteset look like? 11:32:29 <petern_> Fred 11:32:32 <andythenorth> this page is somewhat missing a canonical example http://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/NML:Spriteset 11:32:41 <Yexo> "list of realsprites" is a link 11:32:54 <andythenorth> oh that works 11:32:59 <andythenorth> [can't use a template here] 11:33:08 <andythenorth> [otherwise I wouldn't be asking :P ] 11:33:12 <Yexo> http://www.tt-wiki.net/wiki/NMLTutorial has an example 11:35:24 <Terkhen> andythenorth: the new ships and their buy menu sprite look nice :D 11:38:10 *** KritiK [~Maxim@95-24-83-136.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd 11:38:40 <andythenorth> thanks 11:39:01 <andythenorth> shame that Eddi|zuHause has a patch that makes my work pointless :P 11:39:40 <Eddi|zuHause> why has nobody cleaned it up and committed it yet? :) 11:45:51 *** pugi [~pugi@host-091-097-177-142.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has joined #openttd 12:26:57 * andythenorth wonders now if nmlc is faster than nmlc->grfcodec 12:30:13 <Eddi|zuHause> i doubt it 12:31:39 <andythenorth> FISH is getting slow to build 12:32:00 <andythenorth> 12s 12:32:05 <andythenorth> boring :P 12:35:09 <andythenorth> ~55s for nml 12:35:15 <andythenorth> second pass is much faster 12:35:28 <andythenorth> ~10s once cached 12:35:30 <Yexo> second pass is the more important one 12:35:37 <Yexo> that's the speed you'll most often see while developing 12:36:54 * andythenorth switches to building with nmlc 12:38:07 <andythenorth> faster = better :) 12:40:18 *** roadt [~roadt@223.240.107.33] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:40:42 <FLHerne> andythenorth: Have you bodged a way to make those log tugs articulate yet? :P 12:40:58 <andythenorth> has someone extended the newgrf spec? :o 12:42:03 <FLHerne> Unlikely :-( 12:42:35 <FLHerne> But if you were considering roads as railtypes, there must be some nasty hack you could make :P 12:43:40 <andythenorth> implement ship routes as railtypes 12:43:44 <andythenorth> simples 12:44:10 <FLHerne> *facepalm* 12:45:53 <andythenorth> I don't see the problem 12:47:57 * NGC3982 poops 12:48:15 <Pinkbeast> There's only 16 railtypes and we want them all for rails 12:48:39 <frosch123> just make a searchable railtype dropdown 12:48:52 <frosch123> there is for sure no more than than selecting the right railtype from a list of 1000 12:49:05 <frosch123> *no more fun than 12:49:16 <Pinkbeast> That's not the issue; the issue is that each extra bit of railtype adds a bit per map tile. 12:49:17 <andythenorth> michi_cc: does autorefit evaluate capacity anyway? 12:49:23 <andythenorth> *in any way 12:49:38 * andythenorth is wondering if it needs turned on or off when capacity is refittable 12:50:45 *** M1zera [~Miranda@ip-78-102-217-126.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 12:51:53 <frosch123> Pinkbeast: i think it was a mistake to limit railtypes to 16. for some reason this makes grf developers want to fill all of them with pointless types. if there would be a hillarious limit like 64k, they might have considred to only add useful types 12:52:01 <andythenorth> +1 12:52:01 <frosch123> same for cargso 12:52:04 <andythenorth> -1 12:52:15 <frosch123> every industry set wants to use all 32 slots for some reason 12:52:20 <andythenorth> yarp 12:52:25 <andythenorth> the game is to find 32 useful cargos 12:52:28 <frosch123> if the limit would be 64k, they might have used less :p 12:52:39 <andythenorth> and then string them together with 3 in / 2 out at industries 12:52:55 <andythenorth> without the limit, FIRS would have 50 or so cargos by now I think 12:52:59 <andythenorth> and I would hate it even more 12:53:09 <andythenorth> limits enforce sub-editing :P 12:53:13 <Pinkbeast> frosch: I think one can easily exceed 16; and I'd rather the game had 10 or 12 or 16 bits of railtype and sod the memory footprints. But the developers appear to disagree. 12:55:02 <Pinkbeast> (After all, 16 bits of railtype on a 1024^2 map is, er, 128Kb.) 12:55:14 <frosch123> yeah, that would limit the railtypes only by usabiilty, when you have to scroll the dropdown over 5 screenpages to find the right railtype :p 12:55:36 <Pinkbeast> As you said, though, that's hardly an unconquerable UI issue. :-) 12:55:41 <michi_cc> Pinkbeast: Just what would you need so many railtypes for? 12:56:05 <Eddi|zuHause> i could have filled that rather easily :) 12:56:27 <Pinkbeast> 2 bits of gauge x 2 bits of electrification scheme x 2 bits of speed x 2 bits of axle loading... well, I'm up to 8 without even thinking about it. 12:56:45 * andythenorth has 8 bits of confusion 12:56:47 <Eddi|zuHause> that won't even fit 12:56:54 <andythenorth> ugh 12:56:58 <andythenorth> too many railtypes :P 12:57:01 <Eddi|zuHause> 3 electrification and 3 axle load 12:57:17 <frosch123> Eddi|zuHause: riddle of the day: how to define operator ^ and * so that 16 bits on 1024^2 map result in 128Kb 12:58:14 <Pinkbeast> Is there a comedy maths error here? 12:58:58 <Eddi|zuHause> Pinkbeast: 1024^2 is already 1M, so 2 bytes make that 2MB 12:59:23 <andythenorth> riddle of the day (2): log tug does 11mph loaded, 20mph unloaded. Should it go faster if the load is 80t versus 400t? 12:59:28 <Pinkbeast> Yeah, my bad, brain fart. I still don't think it's a prohibitive quantity, though. 12:59:41 <frosch123> Pinkbeast: compare 2MB with 512MB for 32bpp extra zoom 12:59:50 * andythenorth thinks loaded speed is a factor of safety, and not losing logs 13:00:13 <Eddi|zuHause> Pinkbeast: it's not. the question is how to do it "properly" to guard for all (sane) future demands of "more map bits" 13:00:22 <Pinkbeast> Acceleration? If ships had an acceleration model. 13:00:41 * andythenorth solves it 13:01:25 <andythenorth> the issue was an exploit, where a 400t ship with 50% load factor would go faster than equivalent 240t ship 13:01:28 <andythenorth> solve 13:01:30 <andythenorth> d 13:01:52 <Pinkbeast> Eddi: mm, but "perfect" can be the enemy of "good enough" - and the existing bits of railtype are clearly (IMAO) too few. 13:05:06 <andythenorth> autorefit appears to be ignoring subtype currently 13:05:11 <andythenorth> [same cargo] 13:05:42 <frosch123> it's the same as for autorenew and clone 13:05:49 <frosch123> it tries to find one with the same text 13:05:56 <andythenorth> maybe I just disable autorefit for this ship 13:06:33 <andythenorth> solved 13:09:36 <frosch123> so the log tug does not work for steel logs? 13:10:07 <frosch123> (what is it refittable to at all?) 13:10:21 <andythenorth> wood! 13:10:29 <andythenorth> 80t / 240t / 400t 13:10:44 * andythenorth proposes a slider for capacity :P 13:11:11 <frosch123> sounds like those orders which are always requested 13:11:19 <frosch123> "load up to 50%" or so 13:12:26 <andythenorth> I worked around that :P 13:25:47 *** DOUK [~KEM@ALyon-158-1-31-146.w90-29.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #openttd 13:28:37 <andythenorth> FISH mostly now converted 13:28:40 <andythenorth> :P 13:31:01 *** mahmoud [~KEM@ALyon-158-1-29-83.w90-29.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:31:35 <andythenorth> does nml support parameters? 13:31:39 * andythenorth is trolling 13:38:57 * FLHerne is rather confused by OTTD's RAM usage priorities 13:39:51 * andythenorth was confused because a14 stuff is cached 13:39:55 <andythenorth> but that's solved :P 13:40:48 <FLHerne> 32bpp+EZ seems to dwarf all the other 'that would be too memory-hungry' suggestions :P 13:42:43 <Pinkbeast> In fairness, if you're on a steam-powered computer, no-one's making you use 32bpp 13:43:10 <Pinkbeast> But if eg railtypes become 16-bit that's affecting everyone. 13:43:15 *** Zeknurn [~Zeknurn@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:43:17 <andythenorth> so in nml, how do I connect my a14 option (bool) to a basecost adjustment? 13:43:37 <Yexo> if (option_name) { do_basecost_adjustment; } ? 13:43:56 *** Zeknurn [~Zeknurn@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has joined #openttd 13:44:14 <Yexo> http://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/NML:Setting_base_costs documents basecost adjustments, just wrap that in an if-block 13:44:20 <andythenorth> ta 13:44:54 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: basecost = option?0:-2; 13:45:19 <Eddi|zuHause> (or whatever) 13:45:43 <Yexo> Eddi|zuHause: that also changes the basecost when the option is turned of 13:45:52 <Eddi|zuHause> ah. right 13:46:20 *** Chrill [~chrischri@c83-253-89-11.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [] 14:06:12 <petern_> aw man 14:06:14 <petern_> just got a gas leak :S 14:06:54 <petern_> trying to fix a load of wobbly floorboards 14:06:55 <petern_> oh well 14:07:01 <petern_> that'll cost money to fix :p 14:07:22 <andythenorth> nail through pipe? 14:08:25 <petern_> screw 14:08:28 <petern_> and 14:08:31 <andythenorth> oops :o 14:08:34 <petern_> it was the last screw 14:08:42 <andythenorth> standard 14:08:53 <petern_> the rest of the floor is all fixed now 14:08:54 <petern_> except 14:08:59 <petern_> it'll have to come up to fix the pipe 14:09:01 * andythenorth has done that with a water pipe in a kitchen refit 14:09:18 <petern_> water pipe is probably messier 14:09:20 <petern_> unless you don't notice 14:09:26 <petern_> and then the gas pipe is, erm, very bad 14:09:26 <andythenorth> didn't noticed for months 14:09:31 <andythenorth> -d 14:09:31 <petern_> oops 14:09:33 <petern_> bad 14:09:40 <petern_> fortunately i can smell 14:09:44 <andythenorth> how handy 14:09:44 <petern_> and, infact, hear 14:09:58 <andythenorth> 'boom' is never very good 14:10:06 <petern_> no, that would've been pretty bad 14:10:07 * andythenorth wonders if anyone will find the joke in FISH 14:11:11 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p5DC67CAF.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:11:22 <petern_> my missus says 14:11:27 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p5DC67CAF.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 14:11:28 <petern_> should be turn everything off 14:11:33 <petern_> uh, ... bad idea :) 14:11:43 <petern_> *we 14:12:19 <andythenorth> I'd be thinking of turning the gas off maybe 14:12:24 <andythenorth> probably not the rest :P 14:12:26 <petern_> yes quite 14:12:28 <petern_> i did 14:12:51 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p5DC67CAF.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [] 14:12:54 <andythenorth> if you turn the rest off, no interwebs 14:12:55 <petern_> turning things off is what causes sparks... 14:13:23 <petern_> maybe if there's a motor nearby it 14:14:01 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p5DC67CAF.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 14:14:20 <andythenorth> meh 14:14:27 <andythenorth> how much do I care about breaking people's savegames? 14:14:52 <FLHerne> Lots! :P 14:15:25 <andythenorth> or not at all :P 14:15:42 <Terkhen> there are probably not many people playing FISH nightlies 14:16:01 <FLHerne> Terkhen: I am :P 14:16:56 <Terkhen> hurry up and finish your game then 14:16:57 <Terkhen> :) 14:17:37 <andythenorth> the issue is that in December 2010, I 'removed' some unwanted ships by setting them to 'no climate' 14:17:48 <andythenorth> I can't be bothered to find them and add them to the nml conversion 14:18:20 <petern_> heh 14:18:26 <andythenorth> and I don't want to bump FISH because it's compatible in all other ways afaik 14:19:02 <Terkhen> keep those until the end of times :D 14:21:26 *** Biolunar [~mahdi@blfd-4db0e81f.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 14:21:48 <andythenorth> leaving this broken will 'just' result in some invalid vehicles 14:21:49 <andythenorth> :P 14:22:36 <petern_> and another thing 14:22:41 <petern_> why are modern door hinges so tiny? 14:23:23 <andythenorth> vindictiveness 14:23:31 <FLHerne> andythenorth: Do many people still have actively-used savegames (which they might want to update FISH in) from 2010? 14:23:37 <andythenorth> dunno 14:23:43 <andythenorth> going to find out by releasing it 14:23:52 <andythenorth> there's a key for every lock :P 14:25:06 <andythenorth> I reckon that's FISH done for now 14:25:20 <andythenorth> now I have to figure out makefiles again :( 14:32:05 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 14:37:51 *** Stimrol [~Stimrol@dsl-149-87-36.hive.is] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:39:10 *** Stimrol [~Stimrol@dsl-149-87-36.hive.is] has joined #openttd 15:13:55 *** mahmoud [~KEM@ALyon-158-1-25-186.w90-29.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #openttd 15:19:08 *** DOUK [~KEM@ALyon-158-1-31-146.w90-29.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:41:20 *** telanus1 [~telanus@196-215-60-175.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #openttd 15:45:09 *** telanus [~telanus@196-215-60-175.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:07:34 *** telanus1 [~telanus@196-215-60-175.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:13:14 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 16:16:03 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: frosch * r24441 /trunk/ (3 files in 3 dirs): -Update: Version number to 1.3 in some more files. 16:18:36 <andythenorth> lo 16:19:03 <andythenorth> is petern_ still alive? 16:27:36 *** Sacro [~Ben@2001:0:5ef5:79fb:34d7:2630:a9fc:a8ad] has joined #openttd 16:27:46 <Rawh> whois him and look at his idle time? 16:31:26 <Sacro> hmm 16:31:27 <Sacro> did that work 16:31:29 <Sacro> yes :d 16:31:38 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: frosch * r24442 /trunk/ (8 files in 3 dirs): -Codechange: Split some members of Vehicle into a new class BaseConsist. 16:32:10 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: frosch * r24443 /trunk/src/ (5 files): -Codechange: Move Vehicle::name to BaseConsist. 16:32:33 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: frosch * r24444 /trunk/src/ (order_backup.cpp order_backup.h saveload/order_sl.cpp): -Codechange: Base OrderBackup on BaseConsist. 16:32:54 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: frosch * r24445 /trunk/src/saveload/order_sl.cpp: -Fix: Do not load order backups when loading a server-saved game in single player. 16:34:10 <petern_> andythenorth, yes 16:34:59 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: frosch * r24446 /trunk/src/ (6 files in 2 dirs): -Add [FS#5199]: Store more consist properties in order backups. 16:35:48 <andythenorth> oh spiffing 16:36:08 <petern_> Jolly good show ol' chap! 16:36:29 <andythenorth> well, can't stand around gassing all day, what? 16:36:40 <petern_> Quite so. 16:37:22 * andythenorth toddles off to the club 16:53:43 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:c0e5:bae3:a43:7cdf] has joined #openttd 16:53:46 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 17:15:45 *** Sacro_ [~Ben@cpc5-reig5-2-0-cust81.6-3.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 17:22:54 *** Sacro [~Ben@2001:0:5ef5:79fb:34d7:2630:a9fc:a8ad] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:24:01 *** Sacro_ is now known as Sacro 17:32:12 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: translators * r24447 /trunk/src/lang/ (french.txt latvian.txt): 17:32:12 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0: 17:32:12 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: french - 1 changes by glx 17:32:12 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: latvian - 6 changes by Parastais 17:44:29 *** TWerkhoven[l] [~twerkhove@cpc10-linl9-2-0-cust80.18-2.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 17:50:52 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1BF68.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 17:55:50 <andythenorth> so...who wants to translate FISH 2? :D 17:55:56 <andythenorth> I have Afrikaans already 17:56:03 <andythenorth> Terkhen: ^ 17:56:12 <andythenorth> planetmaker: ^ 17:56:13 <andythenorth> :) 17:59:15 <Hirundo> andythenorth: Need dutch? 17:59:21 <andythenorth> yarp 17:59:44 <andythenorth> hmm I should add a translation comment 18:02:04 <andythenorth> done 18:02:13 <andythenorth> no point translating generated code ;P 18:02:56 <andythenorth> bah 18:03:04 <andythenorth> I have the nfo makefile for FISH 18:03:24 <andythenorth> (logically, as it was built for nfo, and still is by the makefile) 18:06:01 <petern_> bah, stty -echo doesn't do what i want it to do :S 18:06:20 <andythenorth> it's keeping company with my makefile in that case 18:10:11 <Terkhen> andythenorth: I'll translate it now :) 18:10:20 <andythenorth> :) 18:11:10 <Terkhen> pylng? 18:11:27 <andythenorth> yup 18:11:43 <andythenorth> the .lng files are generated from that 18:12:01 <andythenorth> there's nothing much scary in it though :) 18:16:53 <frosch123> Hirundo: would your start from scratch? or base it on afrikaans? :) 18:19:59 <Hirundo> I'm starting from scratch :-) 18:22:31 <Terkhen> andythenorth: what does "sea going" means? a ship that will go far from the coast? 18:24:19 <andythenorth> capable of travelling on sea 18:24:41 <andythenorth> typically it will have things like: higher freeboard (sides), and locking doors / hatches etc 18:24:50 <Terkhen> ok, let's see how I can translate that :P 18:24:56 <andythenorth> 'sea capable' ? 18:25:06 <frosch123> "Hochseetauglich" 18:25:42 <andythenorth> can't find you a convenient wiki page for reference :P 18:25:52 <frosch123> Terkhen: "de alta mar" 18:26:02 <frosch123> says my dictionary 18:27:28 <Terkhen> found it, "de altura" :P 18:27:43 <Terkhen> I remember hearing it somewhen, but I did not know it meant that 18:28:16 <Terkhen> usually we don't have words for things as specific as this one 18:29:44 <frosch123> http://dict.leo.org/esde?lp=esde&lang=de&searchLoc=0&searchLocRelinked=1&search=Hochseeschiff&trestr=0x801 http://dict.leo.org/esde?lp=esde&lang=de&searchLoc=0&searchLocRelinked=1&search=hochseet%C3%BCchtig&trestr=0x8004 <- a nomen and an adjective 18:30:14 <frosch123> Terkhen: spain should have the history for ship terms, shouldn't it? 18:31:11 <Terkhen> I don't know many, but maybe it is just because I'm not very knowledgeable about nautic stuff 18:34:27 <Hirundo> I used the dutch equivalent of 'sea worthy' for 'sea going' 18:38:35 <andythenorth> Hirundo: Terkhen frosch123 I gave you FISH commit rights 18:38:47 <andythenorth> saves administration for translations ;) 18:39:08 <andythenorth> I *think* the makefile now works for the nml conversion too 18:39:29 <Hirundo> andythenorth: The 'vehicle ferry' is used for transporting vehicles or people? 18:39:37 <andythenorth> both 18:39:41 <andythenorth> refits all cargos 18:39:52 <andythenorth> has vehicles decks and passenger cabins 18:43:06 *** DDR [~chatzilla@d172-218-2-5.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd 19:14:19 <andythenorth> should the buy menu gain an 'extra info' progressive disclosure thingy? 19:14:29 <andythenorth> cargo decay rate, loading speed 19:14:51 <andythenorth> autorefit support 19:15:28 <andythenorth> I can put it in with the text cb, but it gets big and nasty 19:26:03 <Eddi|zuHause> i was thinking about total vehicle length (in tiles) 19:26:27 <Eddi|zuHause> which needs some awkward conversion function 19:27:01 <Eddi|zuHause> i already have railtype and axle scheme in there 19:27:23 <Eddi|zuHause> where axle scheme is purely cosmetic 19:49:23 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: frosch * r24448 /trunk/src/core/smallvec_type.hpp: -Fix [FS#5255]: Copy constructor and assignment operator cannot be implicit template specialisations. (adf88) 19:56:31 *** LordPixaII [~pixa@85.210.79.155] has joined #openttd 20:01:23 *** Pixa [~pixa@85.210.69.200] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:08:41 *** petern_ [~petern@217.64.121.22] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:10:09 *** KritiK [~Maxim@95-24-83-136.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:13:23 * Terkhen likes translating andy's NewGRFs 20:13:27 <Terkhen> I learn a lot of words :P 20:13:35 <andythenorth> :) 20:13:59 <andythenorth> I learn them from wikipedia :P 20:15:10 *** KritiK [~Maxim@95-24-83-136.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd 20:15:32 <frosch123> i thought you are making them up 20:16:11 * Terkhen searches them on wikipedia and clicks on "spanish" 20:17:50 <frosch123> is there a wikipedia based translator bot? 20:18:17 <__ln__> i hope not 20:18:37 <Terkhen> frosch123: no, but for some pages, you can check the same page in a different langue 20:18:39 <Terkhen> language* 20:18:53 <Terkhen> it is useful when you are looking for complicated terms :P 20:19:24 <frosch123> yeah, i am doing the same 20:19:44 <frosch123> but i am wondering whether some online translator would generate its dictionary using wikipedia 20:19:55 <Rubidium> and I'm doing something else ;) 20:20:38 * andythenorth doesn't know what cycloidal is either 20:20:57 <andythenorth> :P 20:21:08 * andythenorth provides support for translating vehicle names 20:26:45 <andythenorth> ho ho 20:26:53 <andythenorth> 10 bazillion lang warnings from nml :P 20:27:06 <andythenorth> I have made it angry by adding new strings :P 20:27:35 <NGC3982> christ 20:27:39 <NGC3982> took a three hour walk today 20:28:14 <Terkhen> andythenorth: what is the difference between a "gas turbine" and a "maritime gas turbine"? 20:28:15 <frosch123> did you get lost? 20:28:19 <NGC3982> no 20:28:36 <andythenorth> Terkhen: I have no idea :) 20:28:48 <andythenorth> one sits on the outside of a hovercraft and is weatherproof I guess 20:28:52 <Terkhen> ok, I'll just translate it verbatim :P 20:28:56 <andythenorth> the other sits inside a ship...and probably isn't :P 20:35:04 *** Blaster [~heliduels@host-2-98-212-32.as13285.net] has joined #openttd 20:35:50 <Blaster> What newgfxs improve city building variety and allow me to build, perhaps, simcity-like cities 20:36:12 <Terkhen> hi Blaster , depends on what you mean with "simcity-like cities" 20:36:15 <andythenorth> ho 20:36:18 * andythenorth crashed ottd 20:36:27 <Blaster> Well, firstly, more building variety 20:36:31 <andythenorth> oh and again :P 20:36:32 <Terkhen> andythenorth: I'm lazy to open my VM and commit the translation, can you commit it instead? :P 20:36:40 <andythenorth> Terkhen: yup :) 20:36:48 <Blaster> I have only seen mods that replace the current buildings, which means there is still the same number of different buildigns 20:36:53 <andythenorth> right now I've done something with strings that crashes ottd :P 20:37:31 <Terkhen> andythenorth: http://paste.openttdcoop.org/show/1611/ <--- thanks :D 20:38:19 <Terkhen> Blaster: well, there are not many house sets... I only know about swedish houses and TAI, and I don't know how much development the latter saw 20:38:41 <Blaster> More than just houses preferably 20:38:49 <Terkhen> what do you mean? 20:38:50 <FLHerne> TTRS is quite nice, UK TownSet improving to some extent 20:38:56 <Blaster> Maybe multiple ones at the same time would work? 20:39:04 <FLHerne> Both have huge towerblocks and such now 20:39:13 <Terkhen> Blaster: probably not, unless they are made to be compatible 20:39:22 <frosch123> multiple housesets should work fine 20:39:59 * FLHerne finds completely incompatible answers confusing :P 20:40:19 * andythenorth is baffled why this crashes :P 20:40:27 <frosch123> personally i consider ttrs quite ugly though 20:40:29 <Blaster> Secondly, is there anything that would add larger/wider/highertraffic roads? 20:40:35 <Blaster> Like motorways 20:40:40 <NGC3982> motorways <3. 20:41:09 <Terkhen> Blaster: there is IIRC a newgrf which adds eyecandy motorways, but they still work like the normal roads (OpenTTD only has those) 20:41:23 <andythenorth> crash log: http://paste.openttdcoop.org/show/1612/ 20:41:34 * NGC3982 googles for it. 20:41:37 <andythenorth> I know it's a bad grf string, but I have 'wtf' about which 20:42:06 <Blaster> That newgrf will be fine since default roads already have excessive capacity 20:42:24 <NGC3982> cocoa! \o/ 20:42:41 <frosch123> andythenorth: contains no useful info 20:42:46 *** sla_ro|master [slaco@78.96.213.97] has quit [Quit: DANGER sla.ro is OFFLINE DANGER] 20:43:00 <frosch123> maybe plurals or genders? 20:43:08 <frosch123> something whcih references other string parts 20:43:33 <frosch123> andythenorth: just upload the grf to fs 20:43:35 <Blaster> What is the newgrf for eyecandy motorways? 20:43:55 <andythenorth> ach, I think I know what it is 20:44:05 <FLHerne> Blaster/GC398: http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=67&t=58107 ? 20:44:53 <FLHerne> I think there might have been another one, too :-) 20:44:59 <andythenorth> I'm relying on returning split('[')[0] on strings that don't contain '[' 20:45:31 <Blaster> yeah that looks good 20:45:36 *** Pixa [~pixa@79-68-107-133.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com] has joined #openttd 20:45:59 <andythenorth> hmm 20:46:01 <andythenorth> not that :( 20:46:40 <NGC3982> FLHerne: neat. 20:46:45 <Blaster> And I am still using 1.1.5 ... 20:46:56 <Blaster> Does 1.2 add any new features or is it just bugfixing? 20:47:26 <frosch123> most modern grfs will only work with 1.2 20:48:00 <frosch123> http://wiki.openttd.org/OpenTTD_1.2.0 <- for the rest 20:48:13 <Blaster> River generation on creation of map 20:48:14 <Blaster> YUS 20:48:16 * Blaster is happy now 20:48:30 <andythenorth> ha 20:48:31 <andythenorth> fixed 20:49:46 *** KingPixaIII [~pixa@85.210.75.76] has joined #openttd 20:50:07 *** LordPixaII [~pixa@85.210.79.155] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:52:28 <NGC3982> http://www.wimp.com/saltmine/ 20:52:31 <NGC3982> speaking of maglev.. 20:54:44 * andythenorth is duck tape coding 20:54:47 <andythenorth> seems to work 20:55:08 *** Pixa [~pixa@79-68-107-133.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:56:36 <andythenorth> python is witty 20:56:39 <andythenorth> this works: type_suffix = self.title.split('[')[1].split(']')[0] 20:56:51 <andythenorth> despite being quite silly to read 20:57:50 <Blaster> Oh 20:57:57 <Blaster> Those motorways are entirely non-functional 20:58:02 <frosch123> andythenorth: only works as long as you do not nest [ ] 20:58:09 <Blaster> Don't even work like normal roads 20:58:12 <andythenorth> yeah, I won't do that 20:58:20 <frosch123> Blaster: i think you have to build the stuf next to normal roads 20:58:24 <andythenorth> this is a one-shot kind of effort I'm writing here 20:58:32 <andythenorth> anything complicated, it will break :P 21:00:12 <Blaster> Oh, I see 21:00:18 <Blaster> Its supposed to be used with the normal roads 21:01:58 <Terkhen> Blaster: yes, as I mentioned it is only eyecandy 21:04:02 <Blaster> the readme said the roads were unusable and I didn't realise the pieces overlayed the regular roads as opposed to being designed to replace them 21:07:11 <andythenorth> FISH supports translatable names now (the type suffix) 21:07:15 <andythenorth> Hirundo: ^ 21:08:12 <andythenorth> names can be seen here if interested http://www.tt-foundry.com/sets/FISH/list_all_vehicles 21:08:20 * andythenorth -> bed 21:08:52 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has left #openttd [] 21:10:29 *** Blaster [~heliduels@host-2-98-212-32.as13285.net] has left #openttd [] 21:10:37 <Wolf01> 'night 21:10:42 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@95.232.234.29] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 21:12:26 <frosch123> night 21:12:29 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590f5f81.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:15:39 <__ln__> http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/newfoundland-labrador/story/2012/07/25/nl-u-boat-labrador-discovery-725.html 21:25:34 *** TGYoshi_ [~TGYoshi@86.81.146.146] has joined #openttd 21:25:34 *** TGYoshi [~TGYoshi@86.81.146.146] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:29:36 <NataS> pretty cool 21:30:33 <FLHerne> But what was it doing up there!? :0 21:30:44 <NataS> doing some sort of black ops mission 21:30:52 <NataS> or maybe it's got nazi zombies on it 21:31:14 *** FrosTa23 [~fuck@p5B31F33E.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 21:33:57 *** FrosTa23 [~fuck@p5B31F33E.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [] 21:39:26 <__ln__> that's an inappropriate comment 21:52:16 *** FLHerne [~francis_h@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has left #openttd [] 21:55:22 *** KritiK [~Maxim@95-24-83-136.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:57:45 *** TWerkhoven[l] is now known as twerkhoven 21:59:00 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@s55978e11.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:05:18 *** TWerkhov1n [~TWerkhove@cpc10-linl9-2-0-cust80.18-2.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 22:05:18 *** twerkhoven is now known as Guest1185 22:05:18 *** TWerkhov1n is now known as twerkhoven 22:05:54 *** Guest1185 [~twerkhove@cpc10-linl9-2-0-cust80.18-2.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: He who can look into the future, has a brighter future to look into] 22:09:42 *** Rhamphoryncus [~rhamph@d161-184-227-133.abhsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd 22:19:04 *** Illegal_Alien [~Illegal_A@ipd50adc22.speed.planet.nl] has joined #openttd 22:20:30 <Terkhen> good night 22:20:47 * Illegal_Alien CUDDLES Terkhen 22:23:55 *** TGYoshi_ [~TGYoshi@86.81.146.146] has quit [Quit: Hugs to all] 23:08:59 *** Sacro [~Ben@cpc5-reig5-2-0-cust81.6-3.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:18:37 *** Illegal_Alien [~Illegal_A@ipd50adc22.speed.planet.nl] has quit [Quit: HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- Now with extra fish!] 23:28:30 *** perk11 [~perk11@46.242.11.65] has joined #openttd 23:33:26 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1BF68.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]