Log for #openttd on 15th September 2012:
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00:17:59  <Supercheese> What foolishness is this, Visual C++ Express wants me to register to continue using
00:18:07  <Supercheese> yeah right, like THAT's gonna happen
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01:01:17  <Kylie> this ai is being problematic
01:01:34  <Kylie> it made a coal to power plant trip with trucks
01:01:39  <Kylie> but
01:02:01  <Kylie> the peak capacity was such that it would require almost 70 trucks to even satisfy it
01:02:42  <Kylie> plus lots more with the relative distance
01:02:53  <Kylie> (what, 10 more? i'm not sure)
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01:05:09  <Kylie> 60 tiles at a max speed of 112 km/h
01:06:41  <Eddi|zuHause> the equation <num vehicles>*<vehicle capacity>*<roundtrip time (ticks)> = <production per cycle>/256 must be satisfied
01:07:50  <Eddi|zuHause> err, one of the * must be a /
01:07:55  <Kylie> I doubt this AI is doing that really
01:08:18  <Kylie> how do i calculate the <prod per cycle>
01:08:46  <Eddi|zuHause> an industry does 8 or 9 cycles per month
01:09:47  <Eddi|zuHause> for default industries, the lowest is 4 per cycle, so minimum of 32/36 production
01:10:06  <Kylie> that sounds like a small number
01:10:27  <Eddi|zuHause> it is
01:12:11  <Eddi|zuHause> the highest is 255 per cycle for primary industries
01:12:34  <Eddi|zuHause> which is 2000something
01:12:38  <Eddi|zuHause> per month
01:15:56  <Eddi|zuHause> anyway, 2 (roundtrip) times 60 tiles times 16 steps per tile times 256 substeps divided by 112 speed
01:16:09  <Eddi|zuHause> @ 2*60*16*256/112
01:16:14  <Eddi|zuHause> @calc 2*60*16*256/112
01:16:14  <DorpsGek> Eddi|zuHause: 4388.57142857
01:16:20  <Kylie> oh fuck
01:16:51  <Eddi|zuHause> @calc 2*60*16/112
01:16:51  <DorpsGek> Eddi|zuHause: 17.1428571429
01:17:26  <Eddi|zuHause> means the vehicle capacity must be 17 times the production per cycle
01:17:49  <Kylie> oh my god
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01:19:24  <Eddi|zuHause> so if the mine produces 128/144 per month, that makes 16 per cycle
01:19:45  <Eddi|zuHause> if your vehicle carries 20t
01:19:50  <Eddi|zuHause> then you need
01:19:58  <Eddi|zuHause> @calc 16*17/20
01:19:58  <DorpsGek> Eddi|zuHause: 13.6
01:20:03  <Eddi|zuHause> 14 trucks
01:20:14  <Kylie> this ai needs to use trains
01:20:15  <Eddi|zuHause> plus a bit for loading time
01:20:29  <Eddi|zuHause> and acceleration
01:20:49  <Eddi|zuHause> which we did not consider in the round trip calculation
01:22:31  <Kylie> thx for the math
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01:28:35  * Kylie earns >  mil income / year
01:28:45  * Kylie earns > 20 mil income / year
01:30:55  <Eddi|zuHause> 20 thousand is not a large number
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06:37:36  <__ln__> good "morning"
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07:45:55  <Terkhen> good morning
07:46:02  <Supercheese> salve
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07:54:12  <Wolf01> monrining o/
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08:00:42  <Wolf01> moin Alberth :)
08:00:55  <Alberth> moin
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08:33:55  <Knogle> morning
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09:17:13  <fjb> Moin
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09:19:35  <Alberth> moin fjb
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10:28:42  <__ln__>
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10:46:19  <fjb> __ln__: Software patents are plain evel.
10:46:48  <planetmaker> quite so
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10:51:29  <SpComb> fun links there
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10:56:02  <SpComb> endgame: lawyers win
10:56:02  <SpComb> and even if the patent trolls lose, the lawyers win
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10:58:33  <fjb> At least one tenth of the German population are lawyers.
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11:18:19  <__ln__>  an OS X improvement only waiting to be committed
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11:29:28  <planetmaker> I guess we should close the task then
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11:31:52  <__ln__> without committing?
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11:32:23  <planetmaker> I didn't say that
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11:38:42  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: planetmaker * r24525 /trunk/os/macosx/openttd.icns: -Add [FS#4539]: [OSX] Additional high-resolution icons for the app bundle (Zydeco)
11:39:43  <Rubidium> so... when are you going to add 2048x2048 icons?
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11:40:58  <planetmaker> next year
11:41:13  <Rubidium> well, first fix the real issues
11:41:20  <planetmaker> yeah
11:41:53  <Rubidium> 'look, OS X 10.10 supports OpenTTD as it has 4096x4096 pixel 64 bits per channel icons'
11:42:09  <Rubidium> while not even working right on 10.6
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11:42:48  <Simonn> Can I build bridges with railroad tracks over houses
11:42:49  <Simonn> and stuff?
11:43:07  <Simonn> like if I want to build a maglev station in the middle of a city, could I do that?
11:43:19  <Rubidium> a few cases of dynamite
11:43:23  <planetmaker> houses cannot have bridges above them
11:43:30  <Simonn> what about under?
11:43:34  <planetmaker> they can have tunnels below them
11:43:51  <Simonn> can I choose to make my meglav railroad tracks elevated?
11:44:03  <Simonn> like is there a button so I can higher/lower my track? that would be neat
11:44:49  <planetmaker> lowering an exisiting track without first removing, then lowering land, then re-building track? Quite unrealistic ;-)
11:45:05  <Beardie> what your asking makes me think of Locomotion rather than OpenTTD
11:45:32  <Simonn> can I make double deck tracks?
11:45:36  <Simonn> like in new york city central station
11:46:11  <Simonn> what about underground stations?
11:46:53  <Hirundo> nope, and nope
11:47:31  <Simonn> man
11:47:40  <Simonn> how am I supposed to get a decent transportation system in my supermegacool city
11:47:46  <Simonn> when all I Can do it put a railroad on the side?
11:47:53  <Simonn> what do you people normally do?
11:48:38  <planetmaker> I build a track system with many tunnels. And I use loads of trams and bus
11:48:57  <Rubidium> make the huge HEQS tram support loads of passengers ;)
11:49:01  <Beardie> tunnels with stations one level lower etc
11:49:16  <Lassikki> Does anyone know where can i get gertrams.grf?
11:49:22  <Beardie> or be really mean and provide them with a inadequate bus system
11:49:28  <Simonn> [13:49] <Beardie> tunnels with stations one level lower etc
11:49:34  <Alberth> Lassikki: google?
11:49:43  <Lassikki> Cant find
11:49:45  <Simonn> underground station
11:49:46  <Simonn> ?
11:49:47  <Simonn> you mean?
11:49:50  <Beardie> one sec Simmonn i can find a screenshot
11:50:03  <Simonn> yeah gimme some design tips
11:50:15  <Simonn> I just discovered that you can choose city size in the settings
11:50:24  <Simonn> so I generated myself a map full of megacities
11:50:36  <Simonn> I mean I live in brussels and it has a north, central and south station in the middle of the city
11:50:43  <Simonn> the tracks go underground and brussels central is completely underground
11:50:58  <Alberth> Simonn: just lower the station one level compared to the houses, so your tunnel connects straight to the station platforms
11:51:34  <Simonn> soo you are saying
11:51:51  <Simonn> destroy some houses in the middle of the city
11:51:54  <Simonn> then lower the land -1
11:51:58  <Simonn> and build your station there
11:52:24  <Beardie> This topci may help you Simonn
11:52:31  <Rubidium> <- ooh... photoshop ;)
11:52:35  <Rubidium> who remembers that one?
11:53:09  <Alberth> Rubidium: never seen it before :)
11:53:18  <planetmaker> that is photoshopped?
11:53:23  <Rubidium> yes
11:53:41  <planetmaker> hm, yes. The railroads on the edges, right?
11:53:57  <Rubidium> no
11:54:00  <Rubidium> keep guessing
11:54:03  <Beardie> that ramp at the back
11:54:09  <Beardie> double track up the hill
11:54:11  <Beardie> left track
11:54:19  <Rubidium> no
11:54:20  <Beardie> land not high enough for that really?
11:54:24  <Beardie> humm lol
11:54:50  <Rubidium> see the two trains departing towards the west?
11:55:09  <Rubidium> they would have been within the same signal block
11:55:22  <Beardie> lol
11:55:27  <Rubidium> however, the signals are block signals
11:55:36  <Rubidium> well... they were PBS signals
11:56:05  <Rubidium> from the brief time OpenTTD had (very) broken PBS signals before the last incarnation
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11:56:28  <planetmaker> so... not photoshopped or didn't that allow two trains in one block?
11:56:56  <FLHerne> Does adding housesets ingame cause breakage? ;-)
11:56:58  <Rubidium> since PBS wasn't in a release, the signals were photoshopped to be of a type that was in the release
11:57:18  <planetmaker> ah
11:57:24  <FLHerne> Also, is it safe to remove vehicle sets if no vehicles provided by that set exist?
11:58:00  <planetmaker> FLHerne, both questions can be answered with 'yes'.
11:58:16  <Rubidium> planetmaker: really?
11:58:29  <planetmaker> FLHerne, also with 'probably not' and 'very much depends'
11:59:00  <planetmaker> and actually... my first statement must have been "'yes' and 'no' respectively"
11:59:21  <FLHerne> EDIT: Is it safe to remove vehicle sets (that don't modify other vehicle sets) if no vehicles provided by it exist
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11:59:38  <Simonn> can I disable the local authoritys?
11:59:45  <planetmaker> Simonn, you can't
11:59:50  <Simonn> or make them super insensitive?
11:59:54  <planetmaker> try to disable your local major.
12:00:29  <FLHerne> Simonn: Difficulty settings (I think) has a setting, doesn't make very much difference :-(
12:00:40  <planetmaker> FLHerne, vehicle sets usually define things other than vehicles, like base costs etc.
12:00:48  <planetmaker> they will persist
12:01:08  <Simonn> it's already on permissive
12:01:08  <Simonn> :(
12:01:16  <Simonn> but I want to destroy some blocks in the middle but it'll always be impossible
12:01:20  <Simonn> they won't let me do my masterplan
12:01:22  <Simonn> I need SPACE man
12:01:35  <FLHerne> So what happens if I remove a set that modified base costs, then add another that also does? Errors? :P
12:01:47  <FLHerne> Simonn: Bribe them ;-)
12:02:01  <Simonn> how
12:02:03  <Simonn> can't find a buttn
12:02:04  <Simonn> button
12:02:13  <Simonn> I already looked for this ;x
12:02:59  <FLHerne> In the list of things to do with the local authority
12:03:12  <Rubidium> ... but only when you have an adequate amount of money
12:03:29  <Simonn> how much do they normally want?
12:03:33  <Rubidium> ... which, now I think about it might not be the best design wise
12:03:50  <Simonn> And does bribing give me full access? or just some more "permissive" till they revoke it again?
12:03:52  <Rubidium> Simonn: depends on the amount of inflation and the size of the town (IIRC)
12:05:12  <FLHerne> Simonn: Just 'more permissive' :P
12:05:27  <Simonn> pfft
12:05:28  <Simonn> that suxx
12:05:34  <FLHerne> Same as building a million trees, except the map doesn't end up full of trees :D
12:05:43  <FLHerne> *not literally a million :P
12:05:43  <Simonn> how can I properly put in a railroad system if they won't let me
12:05:45  <Simonn> amagad
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12:06:03  <Simonn> wait what if I pause the game
12:06:05  <Simonn> and then build?
12:06:09  <FLHerne> Simonn: Trams, and interchange with rail on the outskirts :P
12:06:19  <Simonn> will the town permissions update instantly?
12:06:23  <Simonn> or just after the pause?
12:06:29  <Simonn> FLHerne: I wanna do it with megalev
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12:07:12  <Simonn> yeah maybe I should do the trams
12:08:07  <FLHerne> Simonn: The cargodist patch makes that work a lot better ;-)
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12:08:22  <Simonn> wait I don't have trams in my menu
12:08:22  <Simonn> lol
12:08:35  <planetmaker> yes. they're only available as add-on
12:08:42  <FLHerne> Simonn: You might need a tram-supplying newgrf :P
12:09:06  <FLHerne> Adding vehicle newgrfs in-game is (relatively) safe, right?
12:09:48  <Simonn> Are tramways good for big cities?
12:09:52  <Simonn> 40.000 inhabitants?
12:09:57  <Simonn> and then go monorail on the edges?
12:10:03  <Simonn> is it an upgrade from buses?
12:10:36  <planetmaker> FLHerne, also that cannot be confirmed in a lot of cases. Just look at pikka's defaults
12:14:25  <FLHerne> planetmaker: Pff :-(
12:14:46  * FLHerne wants a way to use combinations of town-name grfs :P
12:14:58  <FLHerne> Ideally in clusters :-)
12:17:32  <planetmaker> anyone, FLHerne ? :D
12:21:30  <Simonn> FLHerne
12:21:31  <Simonn>
12:21:33  <Simonn> is this good?
12:23:37  <FLHerne> planetmaker: That looks neat :-)
12:24:30  <NGC3982> I wish i understood that page.
12:24:43  <NGC3982> Is regions.hg some kind of NewGRF?
12:25:24  <FLHerne> NGC3982: Looks like a patch queue :P
12:25:43  <Alberth> NGC3982: only the "description" line is interesting :)
12:30:39  <NGC3982> Oh.
12:30:56  <NGC3982> What regions are we talking about? Specific regions of a current map?
12:30:56  <planetmaker> FLHerne, it's a modified openttd
12:44:17  <FLHerne> planetmaker: Ah. Branch thing? I use svn more :P
12:48:00  <NGC3982> You guys work a lot with licenses.
12:48:14  <NGC3982> I wish to torrent my collection of public domain movies
12:48:40  <planetmaker> call it branch if you want, FLHerne :-) it's a separate repo. A fork. A patch queue. A simple, modified clone de-facto
12:48:43  <planetmaker> all very similar
12:48:44  <NGC3982> And i wonder, the material is public domain, but surely - the company that released the new DVD with the public domain material must hold a normal copyright on the specific DVD?
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12:57:51  <FLHerne> planetmaker: Patch-organising terminology isn't my strong point :P
12:59:30  <planetmaker> FLHerne, it's not a patch either really. It's a complete repository. Independent of everything. You make a checkout and have all you need
12:59:36  <planetmaker> svn is... so yesterday ;-)
13:00:01  * NGC3982 solved it.
13:02:12  <FLHerne> planetmaker: Well, thing-you-can-use-to-make-a-patch terminology then :P
13:02:47  * FLHerne really should spend more time learning how to use version control thingies
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14:04:30  <NGC3982> guys
14:04:43  <NGC3982> Oops.
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14:06:30  <Simonn> damnit
14:06:34  <Simonn> I am patiently trying to build something
14:06:41  <Simonn> but the authorities won't allow me to do it
14:06:47  <Simonn> and when I try to build up a reputation, destroy some pieces
14:06:50  <Simonn> they arej ust rebuilded
14:06:50  <Simonn> :/
14:07:03  <NGC3982> Im trying to find a NewGRF that allows me to haul industry cargo in >1000km/h
14:08:20  <Pinkbeast> Simon: Buy each piece of land after demolition
14:08:28  <Simonn> how do you do that
14:09:35  <Pinkbeast> There's a tool looking like a signpost for buying land
14:10:12  <Pinkbeast> It's between "demolish" and "tree" on the landscaping toolbar
14:10:24  <Pinkbeast> NGC: some aircraft are >1,000 km/h
14:10:47  <NGC3982> Yes, i know. But let me emphase: Trains.
14:10:47  <NGC3982> :P
14:11:14  <Pinkbeast> Well, you didn't say that. :-) Do the logic trains carry cargo?
14:12:13  <Pinkbeast> I can't think of any serious railway newgrf that gets to those speeds. Not saying they don't exist, but...
14:13:03  <Pinkbeast> Google says the 2cc Chimaera is 1,005 km/h
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14:16:59  <NGC3982> I can't get the logic trains to haul anything :(
14:17:17  <planetmaker> wrong trainset to be combined with?
14:17:40  *** fjb [] has joined #openttd
14:18:08  <fjb> Moin
14:18:27  <Kylie> Why doe my town rating seem to be appalling  forever
14:19:03  <Pinkbeast> NGC: I find the logic train doesn't. There are some vactube / maglev sets, but most of the sane ones only let you do pax/mail/goods
14:19:35  <Pinkbeast> Appalling's a big range and if you killed too many trees it can be appalling for a long time. I dislike town ratings.
14:21:01  <fjb> Plant trees.
14:21:19  <Pinkbeast> I tend to start with a tramline in every town so I don't have the frustrating situation of "rating too low to build stations, cannot raise rating with good stations"
14:21:45  <fjb> And well served stations raise the rating fast.
14:22:22  <Pinkbeast> Hence the tramline. :-)
14:23:26  <Pinkbeast> Planting trees is all very well for a short fix but then every time you build anything near the town... ratings crash.
14:24:13  <fjb> Serve the town and the town serves you.
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14:32:06  <Kylie> so uh
14:32:14  <Kylie> what was done re subsidiaries
14:32:14  <Kylie> ?
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14:47:35  <planetmaker> exactly nothing, Kylie
14:51:04  <Alberth> not for a long time, at least
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14:59:52  <Simonn> if an authority is mad
14:59:57  <Simonn> but you haven't build anythign there
15:00:04  <Simonn> so you can't transport people so they are impressed
15:00:11  <Simonn> how do you gain reputation then?
15:00:50  <BtbN> plant some trees
15:01:29  <Simonn> ok tnx
15:04:18  <Alberth> wait
15:04:30  <Alberth> but usually it takes a long itme
15:04:33  <Alberth> *time
15:05:42  <fjb> Or do some real world like thing: bribe it.
15:06:51  <Alberth> or if you are a country: invade it as preventive strike :p
15:08:16  <fjb> Claim they had weapons of mass destruction before hand.
15:15:07  <BtbN> When installing NewGRFs via console, how am i supposed to see a list, so i can find out which ID i need?
15:18:52  <Simonn> why can't I build a train station and add an airport to it
15:18:56  <Simonn> it says station too spread out
15:18:59  <Simonn> what can I do about this
15:19:34  <planetmaker> allow larger stations in the advanced settings
15:20:14  <Simonn> thanks
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15:25:20  <Simonn> is there an easy way to copy orders from one vehicle in a station
15:25:25  <Simonn> to all other vehicles in the station
15:25:29  <Simonn> I mean depot*
15:29:48  <Alberth> Simonn: you can copy orders from another vehicle
15:30:02  <Alberth> or copy it while building a clone
15:30:17  <planetmaker> goto + click on other vehicle
15:30:41  <planetmaker> or even better: goto + strg + click on other vehicle to ensure those two always have the same
15:30:53  <Alberth> hmm, RE is really much faster :p
15:31:27  <Alberth> My NML scanner needs 120 seconds for the regression test, while standard PLY lex uses less than 40 :p
15:31:59  <planetmaker> hu? Rewriting the lexer?
15:32:28  <Alberth> I want to process #include etc lines
15:33:25  <planetmaker> ah, nice :-)
15:33:45  <Alberth> well, at this speed, not nice at all :(
15:36:02  <planetmaker> hm, well :-)
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15:49:35  <BtbN> nice... updating content list fails, as the server has an ipv6 address, but does does not respond on it...
15:53:33  *** keoz [] has quit [Quit: keoz]
16:11:44  <planetmaker> which server?
16:11:54  <planetmaker> or one of the mirrors?
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16:26:17  <peter1138> planetmaker, I guess you'll never know...
16:26:57  <planetmaker> well. More his than my problem, I guess...
16:27:37  <BtbN> planetmaker: dbg: [net] Connecting to []:3978 (IPv6)
16:28:37  *** Devroush [] has quit []
16:28:46  <BtbN> and after a while: dbg: [net] [tcp] could not connect IPv6 socket: Connection timed out
16:28:53  <BtbN> connecting to the server via Ipv4 works just fine
16:29:44  <planetmaker> hm.... TrueBrain ^ should have a look possibly
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16:51:04  <BtbN> I can't get NewGRFs to work on my server... i copied them to the same location, and use the same config. But they just don't get enabled.
17:00:47  <TrueBrain> why isnt my tab complete working? :(
17:00:57  <TrueBrain> tab isnt working ... fucking VNC
17:01:23  <TrueBrain> anyway, planetmaker (I have to type it now! :(), it is a known bug yes
17:01:31  <TrueBrain> all configuration seems fine, yet it doesnt work
17:01:37  <TrueBrain> a typical case of: *shrug*
17:02:31  <Kylie> shrug = idk ?
17:03:18  <TrueBrain> shrug is the motion of raising both your shoulders, which is a sign of unknowing or not caring (depending on the situation presented)
17:03:37  <Alberth> BtbN: enabled?
17:03:48  <TrueBrain> For more details, please open up any browse, go to wikipedia, and look up the word 'shrug'
17:03:55  <TrueBrain> it has an excellent image that comes with it
17:04:01  <BtbN> Alberth: ?
17:04:13  <Alberth> you stop the server before copying the config in-place, right?
17:04:29  <BtbN> i just start it after modifing it sure
17:04:36  <BtbN> but it just removes them ouf
17:04:39  <BtbN> *out of the cfg
17:06:50  <BtbN> hm, putting an absolute path there seems to work
17:07:15  <BtbN> but the plugin seems to be broken. Installed OpenGFX+ Trains and Road Vehicles
17:07:23  <BtbN> and can't build any trains now, and don't have a bus
17:09:41  <Alberth> ./openttd -d grf=<number>  dumps debug info for newgrfs. number goes up to 9, but 2 may be enough
17:11:17  <BtbN> no idea what's wrong now, there just are no trains
17:11:19  <BtbN> and no busses
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17:12:33  <Alberth> wrong year?
17:12:45  <BtbN> no idea if they need any special starting year
17:13:07  <Alberth> opengfx+ start around 1950
17:13:21  <BtbN> i did not modifiy the default 1950
17:16:00  <BtbN> There's a lot of GetGroupFromGroupID(0xEA:0x89): Groupid 0x0000 does not exist, leaving empty
17:18:21  <Alberth> 0x00 does not exist sounds quite fundamental :)
17:18:34  <Alberth> openttd version is 1.2 or newer?
17:18:43  <BtbN> current stable
17:19:05  <Alberth> weird
17:20:23  <BtbN> i can't figure out how to download them via the command line
17:20:30  <BtbN> and the broken IPv6 server makes  it even harder
17:21:16  <Alberth> newgrfs are active in the game?
17:21:21  <BtbN> yes
17:21:43  <BtbN> trains were there before
17:21:54  <Alberth> I regularly play with opengfx+, and never have problems
17:22:06  <Alberth> oh, did you change newgrfs in a game?
17:22:41  <Alberth> or do you start a new game?
17:22:43  <BtbN> sure, i needed several trys to make the server find them
17:23:09  <BtbN> and the content commands need a running game
17:23:31  <__ln__> *tries
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17:24:27  <BtbN> Alberth: do you start in 1950 when playing with ogfx+?
17:24:41  <Alberth> 1948 or so
17:24:51  <BtbN> nope, when i do so, no trains, no busses
17:24:51  <Alberth> but 1950 should work
17:25:03  <BtbN> i don't get it
17:25:33  <Alberth> I don't get your error output, so something else is wrong, I think
17:25:50  <BtbN> there is a lot of spam when I enable grf debugging
17:25:58  <BtbN> can't scroll up far enough to see it all
17:26:11  <BtbN> and i'm not sure if my way of installing it is ok
17:26:19  <BtbN> and as the automated download is broken...
17:26:40  <Terkhen> try a game without newgrfs and check if you have vehicles
17:26:48  <BtbN> i did, and there are...
17:26:48  <Terkhen> ogfx+ should not affect vehicle availability at all
17:26:55  <Terkhen> check the parameters then
17:27:00  <Terkhen> maybe you disabled all vehicle types
17:27:01  <BtbN> no parameters.
17:27:10  <Terkhen> what does "no parameters" mean?
17:27:20  <BtbN> i have not given any parameters to ogfx+
17:27:48  <Terkhen> but did you check the parameter window to make sure?
17:27:58  <BtbN> there is no parameter window, it's a serve.r
17:27:59  <Alberth>  md5 checksums
17:28:43  <BtbN> i got zip files oO
17:29:00  <Alberth> that's not going to work
17:29:19  <Alberth> either unpack to a directory, or re-pack into tar :)
17:29:44  <Terkhen> BtbN: given how parameters are implemented in ogfx+, no parameters appearing in openttd.cfg for that NewGRF could mean anything :P
17:29:52  <Terkhen> all 0 could even mean "no vehicles at all"
17:30:04  <BtbN> Terkhen: how do i find out which parameters to give?
17:30:46  <Terkhen> prepare them in a client with a GUI, copy the cfg part of that newgrf
17:31:06  <Terkhen> the simplest way to prepare savegames for a server is to just create them on a client and upload, btw
17:32:19  <BtbN> savegames embedd all grfs?
17:32:28  <BtbN> ccabc366f7eac60c7438a5726820172a  ogfx-rv.grf   /// 4e0b2d42462f295f36afba90d239a323  ogfx-trains.grf
17:33:57  <Alberth> no
17:34:12  <Alberth> they keep references to them
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17:34:32  <BtbN> so i still need to make the server find them
17:35:26  <Terkhen> yup
17:36:51  <BtbN> ok, putting the .grf files to ~/.openttd/newgrf, and not to downloaded_content/newgrf seems to make relative paths work
17:36:55  <BtbN> parameters are also ok
17:40:08  <BtbN> ok, parameters seem to fix it
17:41:16  <BtbN> now it's just the map generator which is gone mad. I set it to generate a landscape as much land as possible. And i still get a lot of big lakes
17:43:02  <BtbN> wtf... if i generate the same map(same settings, same seed) on my local PC, it comes out as i expected it
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17:44:33  <Alberth> different generator?
17:44:39  <BtbN> exact same config
17:45:11  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: translators * r24526 /trunk/src/lang/latvian.txt:
17:45:11  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
17:45:11  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: latvian - 2 changes by Parastais
17:45:38  <Terkhen> if you don't use the same seed for map generation you can't be sure
17:48:16  <BtbN> Terkhen: the seed is in the config, or does it ignore it?
17:49:14  * fjb likes lakes.
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17:57:28  <Simonn> if stations are a little apart
17:57:32  <Simonn> and you want to make them "one station"
17:57:35  <Simonn> is there any way to link em?
17:57:41  <Simonn> or do they have to be like sticking to eachother
17:57:46  <BtbN> Strg while placing
17:57:51  <Simonn> strg?
17:57:54  <BtbN> Ctrl
17:58:02  <Simonn> okay
17:58:03  <Simonn> thanks
17:58:15  <BtbN> Always forget that it's not Strg on non-german keyboards.
17:59:17  <planetmaker> best joke is, if German people call it the "string-taste" - totally ignoring that it's called control in English ;-)
17:59:18  <SpComb> Steurung!
18:00:14  * planetmaker donates an "e" to SpComb
18:00:35  <__ln__> SpComb: SteuererklÀrung!
18:01:15  <SpComb> Steuerung?
18:01:44  <planetmaker> ^
18:01:53  <SpComb> Das Steuerung muß sein!
18:02:05  <planetmaker> *Die ;-)
18:02:06  <__ln__> what, who has been mistyping on my keyboard
18:02:53  <SpComb> Mit die Steuerung
18:03:26  <__ln__> SpComb: mit + dativ, no?
18:03:31  <planetmaker> :D Mit der... ;-)
18:03:37  <planetmaker> casus cactus
18:05:53  <__ln__> SpComb: words ending with -ung are always feminine, iirc.
18:06:01  <Terkhen> BtbN: the seed is randomly generated unless you specifically select one
18:06:04  <Terkhen> bbl
18:11:04  <SpComb> just trolling with them silly Germans' grammars
18:11:59  <Supercheese> Hey Simonn, if you're still there, there are now Subways in OTTD
18:12:10  <Simonn> there are?
18:12:13  <Supercheese> but they're rather hack-ish and have some issues; nonetheless they function
18:12:21  <Supercheese>
18:12:21  <Simonn> hmmmmmmm i'd rather wait a lil then
18:12:24  <Simonn> if they are unstable
18:12:24  <Simonn> :p
18:12:25  <__ln__> Supercheese: the fast food chain?
18:12:47  <Simonn> Supercheese
18:12:51  <Simonn> can I use them if I already got a map?
18:12:57  <Supercheese> technically, yes
18:13:05  <Supercheese> it's recommended to start a new game though
18:13:16  <Simonn> hmm
18:13:24  <Simonn> but I just got a good thing going here :(
18:13:34  <Supercheese> and for sure if you want to put them in your existing game, make a backup save before trying
18:13:38  <Supercheese> in case things go wrong
18:14:26  <Supercheese> Honestly, when adding a vehicle set I forgot to put in the game at start, I have yet to find any issues
18:14:29  <Supercheese> but YMMV
18:15:03  <Simonn> If caught on a level crossing and a train contacts the subway, it will result in a crash, like with any other RV impacted on a level crossing.
18:15:07  <Simonn> what does this mean exactly
18:15:41  <Supercheese> If you've got a level crossing, and the subway is sitting "on" it, and a superfast train comes through the crossing before the subway can get across
18:15:46  <Supercheese> the subway will be destroyed
18:15:47  <SpComb> vehicle crash, I'm assuming, not OpenTTD crash? :)
18:15:54  <Supercheese> as if it were a surface vehicle being hit by a train on a crossing
18:16:05  <Simonn> I don't understand
18:16:06  <Simonn> if I got an X
18:16:10  <Simonn> subway going under a train station
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18:16:17  <Simonn> and a train comes while the subway is crossing under the train
18:16:19  <Simonn> the subway gets hit?
18:16:23  *** Frankr [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
18:16:25  <Supercheese> no
18:16:34  <SpComb> they're just road vehicles
18:16:36  <SpComb> fake1
18:16:38  <Supercheese> "level crossing" meaning a road with a train track running over/through it
18:16:41  <SpComb> *!11
18:17:02  <Supercheese> Perhaps I should've added a screenshot to demonstrate
18:17:08  <Supercheese> although I've hit the attachment limit...
18:17:33  <Simonn> train track
18:17:40  <Simonn> I also have trams
18:17:46  <Simonn> they can't go with trams I assume?
18:18:01  <Supercheese> they can go with trams, they just can't go "under" them
18:18:11  <Simonn> so they'll be stuck in traffic along with them?
18:18:12  <Supercheese> if there's a tram and a subway is following, it cannot go faster than the tram
18:18:14  <Supercheese> yes
18:18:18  <Supercheese> that's one of the limitations
18:18:21  <Simonn> hmmmmm
18:18:26  <Simonn> maybe it's still interesting
18:18:31  <Simonn> so the "load" gets off the stations?
18:18:35  <Simonn> of the trams?
18:18:43  <Supercheese> the subway can be *passed* by other non-articulated RVs/trams
18:18:48  <Supercheese> but it cannot pass
18:18:56  <Supercheese> err, not trams, lol
18:18:58  <Supercheese> those can't pass
18:19:02  <Simonn> :(
18:19:19  <Supercheese> only non articulated RVs can pass, I think
18:19:52  <Supercheese> Anyway:
18:20:04  <Supercheese> that applies to the "subways" since they're technically road vehicles
18:20:13  <Supercheese> I'mma add that to thread
18:21:14  <Simonn> wait I didn't see your name on the thread
18:21:16  <Simonn> this is your work?
18:21:20  <Supercheese> yeah
18:21:27  <Simonn> nice
18:21:30  <Supercheese> thanks
18:21:31  <Simonn> ALL FO ME??? <33333
18:21:54  <Supercheese> As with most GRFs, I'd wager, I primarily did it because *I* wanted it in OTTD
18:22:02  <Supercheese> but naturally wanted to share it too
18:22:48  <planetmaker> :-)
18:24:00  <Supercheese> Oh man, I cannot decipher what SkiddLow means by "I Sure Create the London Undergorund 2009 Stock now Inuse for Graphic, thanks."
18:24:13  <Supercheese> Is he gonna try and contribute sprites?
18:24:55  <planetmaker> sounds like
18:25:20  * Supercheese wonders about the 2CC set subway sprites
18:25:26  <Supercheese> those are GPLed too
18:25:37  <planetmaker> his English is an adventure game into finding the borders of being understood. But he works for his dreams
18:27:04  <Supercheese> Is an up to date repository?
18:27:15  *** KouDy [~KouDy@] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
18:27:22  <Supercheese> last revision in January, looks like
18:27:53  <planetmaker> sounds about right. Kinda abandoned
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18:28:31  <Supercheese> now to decipher their .png naming conventions
18:30:45  *** KouDy [~KouDy@] has joined #openttd
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18:44:14  <planetmaker> doesn't each vehicle have its own file in the 2ccTS, Supercheese ?
18:44:29  <Supercheese> it does, but their names aren't necessarily obvious
18:44:40  <Supercheese> not too difficult though
18:44:54  <planetmaker> hm, I thought they gave them the name of the engine(s) :-)
18:45:21  <Supercheese> I can't find the U-Bahn via ctrl+F, for instance
18:45:30  <Supercheese> visual inspection required
18:52:59  <planetmaker> there's no single vehicle called "u-bahn" afaik
18:53:14  <Supercheese> U-Bahn C II or some such
18:53:30  <Supercheese> Only U-bahn I see
18:59:01  <planetmaker> indeed... it's a PITA
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19:22:12  <NGC3982> A pita bread?
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19:59:39  <Leander> two planes just collided
19:59:41  <Leander> what happened? :s
19:59:44  *** Leander is now known as Simonn
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20:10:08  <Supercheese> planes collided?
20:10:30  <FLHerne> Simonn: That's not possible, AFAIK :o
20:10:52  <Simonn> ooh
20:10:55  <Simonn> maybe just one crashed then?
20:10:57  <Simonn> on the runway?
20:11:02  <Simonn> I thought I saw 2 colliding
20:11:06  <FLHerne> That sounds more likely :-)
20:11:10  <Supercheese> yeah
20:11:54  <Simonn> man how come
20:11:56  <Simonn> thats an 38
20:11:59  <Simonn> a380
20:12:33  <Simonn> I am starting to get the game spirit
20:12:41  <Simonn> I am making these transport hubs
20:12:47  <Simonn> like train/tram/bus/airport
20:12:52  <Simonn> every city has one or two and they are all linked
20:13:13  <Simonn> and then there is one airport which is the large hub, and it is at the center of all the railworks too
20:13:18  <Simonn> man I really like this game when was this invented
20:13:32  <Supercheese> yep, very good game
20:13:59  <Rubidium> 1994-ish
20:14:06  <Simonn> I don't want to brag you know
20:14:08  <Simonn> but just saying
20:14:18  <Simonn> my city might be the best city out of all those cities out there
20:14:19  <Simonn> :x
20:14:20  <Simonn> just sayin
20:14:45  <FLHerne> Simonn: Probably not. I've seen som insane cities :D
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20:14:52  <Simonn> :(
20:15:19  *** KouDy [~KouDy@] has quit []
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20:17:19  *** KouDy1 [~KouDy@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
20:22:05  <Terkhen> good night
20:24:32  <Simonn> bye bye Terkhen
20:24:33  <Simonn> sleep well
20:24:37  <Simonn> dream about me that's alwahys nice
20:24:37  <Simonn> whehe
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20:59:20  <planetmaker> <-- look at those 3 cities, simonn :-)
21:00:07  <NGC3982> "usual suspects"
21:00:07  <NGC3982> :D
21:00:24  <planetmaker> <-- you might need some of those newgrfs
21:00:28  <planetmaker> hehe, yeah, NGC3982 :-)
21:00:48  <planetmaker> #gm I'm quite proud of "my" 1M city there and its transport network :-P
21:00:52  <NGC3982> My god, what kind of housing is that?
21:01:00  <planetmaker> TTRS
21:01:22  <glx> it generates way too many passengers :)
21:01:46  <planetmaker> yes. The monthly transported passengers per each of the three towns were like 100.000
21:01:47  * NGC3982 finds translation credits by planetmaker.
21:02:40  <planetmaker> I do that sometimes, yes
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21:06:29  * NGC3982 tries it out.
21:08:04  <NGC3982>
21:08:06  <NGC3982> Oh my word!
21:08:08  <NGC3982> That looks great.
21:10:32  <Eddi|zuHause> looks like a very asymmetrical world
21:11:18  <Eddi|zuHause> you should disable the landscape feature distribution with such worlds
21:11:57  <Eddi|zuHause> it only looks good with 1:1 or 1:2 worlds
21:12:25  <NGC3982> Yes, i know.
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22:41:58  <fjb> Hm,
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23:53:27  <Supercheese> Devzone seems very very slow
23:53:31  <Supercheese> can't access
23:53:58  <Supercheese> maybe just me

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