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00:01:46 <drac_boy> about industries I still have to see anything regarding this but can you specify custom build before/after dates or is it only 1950 and 1960 respectly? 00:09:07 *** Devroush [~dennis@dD5765BAC.access.telenet.be] has quit [] 00:17:17 * drac_boy curses traction miscalculations 00:21:04 *** literal [hinrik@w.nix.is] has left #openttd [] 00:25:32 <Eddi|zuHause> drac_boy: yes, you can modify the appearance probabilites by callback based on year and you can prevent industry construction by callback also 00:26:35 <hnk> why are all the captains drunk? 00:26:46 <drac_boy> hmm building a new futuristic plant in 2030 could had been something .. maybe chemicals + steel = hovercrafts (instead of just plain road vehicles) :P 00:26:55 <drac_boy> not my kind of things tho ;) 00:28:39 <Eddi|zuHause> drac_boy: keep in mind that you'd be dragging a useless cargo through the centures then 00:29:25 <drac_boy> yeah theres that 00:30:01 <Eddi|zuHause> and 32 cargos are too many anyway 00:41:29 <drac_boy> dumb answer: who said you had to use all 32? 00:41:30 <drac_boy> ;) 01:03:10 <drac_boy> is this wikipage even going anywhere anyway? http://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/ObjectLabels last editted jan 2012 and only one author is even listed 01:32:49 *** EyeMWing [~Wing@c-68-33-226-154.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:43:14 *** Bad_Brett [~bad@78-69-118-27-no42.tbcn.telia.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:46:00 *** KritiK [~Maxim@0001264a.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 01:46:12 <drac_boy> seem like it doesn't matter...anyone just using their own random ids anyway apparently 01:49:23 *** Progman [~progman@p57A18E36.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:01:05 *** Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.a98.priv.bahnhof.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:02:47 * Flygon shakes drac_boy 02:04:33 * drac_boy dumps flygon into a cement mixer for a better shake 02:04:38 <drac_boy> heh heh how're you? 02:05:13 <Flygon> I'm well enough 02:05:15 <Flygon> You mate? 02:05:20 *** Markavian` [~Markavian@78-105-168-146.zone3.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 02:05:22 *** glx [glx@000128ec.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Bye !] 02:08:02 <drac_boy> doing ok 02:08:14 *** Djohaal [~Djohaal@177.96.127.126] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:10:36 *** Markavian [~Markavian@78-105-168-146.zone3.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:13:19 <Flygon> Awesome 02:13:45 <drac_boy> flygon you know how sometimes they build rather simple wood bridges over a track as to avoid having to make a crossing especially if its only for foot traffics? and far away from any apparent stations too 02:14:03 <Flygon> We prefer concrete bridges here :P 02:14:07 <Flygon> But, go on 02:15:32 <drac_boy> well sometimes they have their own interesting story .. as one article quoted "...engine was working hard as we went underneath the footbridge. you could see the planks rising upward from all that force!" 02:15:49 <drac_boy> either the nails were old .. or someone forgot to nail them down in the first place and gravity did a number heh :) 02:16:10 <Flygon> Proooobably why we use Steel-Concrete bridges :p 02:16:17 <drac_boy> the pressure from a smokestack even on small locomotive says something especially if theres little clearance 02:16:49 <Flygon> Reminds me of the big hill tunnel story, where the R-class came out with bricks on the boiler :p 02:17:06 <drac_boy> and flygon about smoke .. nothing like a heavy train stopped on a curve slight uphill at red signal .. and makes a 30+ft black plume into the sky as it restarts 02:17:32 <drac_boy> that was how much pressure some of the most modern 4-coupled locomotives could create......!! 02:18:07 <drac_boy> very few people actually took photos like these tho 02:18:09 <Flygon> Hahaha... I know EXACTLY what you mean 02:18:37 <drac_boy> :) 02:18:43 <Flygon> Oil fired R-class billow INSANE amounts of smoke when restating 02:18:53 <Flygon> I guess they push the burner to full throttle 02:21:04 <drac_boy> flygon oh and its not easy to find photos of them because they're not captioned with this at times but .. if you're on a good grade and see a train coming toward you with apparently three sources of upward steam plumes .. its not you losing your sight .... just wait for it to start passing you and more than likely the third plume was coming from the tender after all ;) 02:21:15 <drac_boy> want take a guessing why or shall i tell you? :P 02:21:42 <Flygon> Shoot 02:22:45 <drac_boy> tender boosters. more than often found on locomotives serving lines that were more after just getting a lot of tonnage over rather than speed 02:23:20 <Flygon> Oooh, I see 02:23:30 <drac_boy> at 40km/h a good part of the steam pressure isn't able to do much so...divert it to tender boosters ... clever 02:24:41 <drac_boy> I know I saw one photo somewhere before... two medium sized 2-6-2 heading uphill with six plumes in the works :P 02:25:05 <drac_boy> I don't know why but some tenders had the booster on first truck .. other on second truck 02:25:14 <drac_boy> might depend on the stroker space probably 02:27:08 <drac_boy> heres one such locomotive flygon http://www.llarson.com/steam/schenzinger/images/NA76.jpg hope you can see the small siderods ;) 02:27:29 <Flygon> It seems like a maintainence nightmare 02:28:30 <drac_boy> not so much actually .. just disconnect the one steam line (piped from firebox) and remove it like a normal truck ... then there its pretty much rather too easy to work on from the top :) 02:29:41 <drac_boy> and flygon they were so much easier than trailing axle boosters which were hard to get to underneath the firebox .. and as for removing it? forget it unless you want to find big cranes :-> 02:30:04 <drac_boy> still a bit curious as to why the big locomotives never had tender booster but only trailing axle ones ... meh 02:30:08 <Flygon> Oh, geeze 02:30:09 <Flygon> What fun 02:30:25 <Flygon> See, this is why Steam-Electric should have taken off 02:30:39 <Flygon> More powerful locomotives without the maintainence problems :p 02:30:47 <Flygon> Or... with less problems :p 02:30:55 <drac_boy> flygon btw a few roads had the weird misconcept that a booster was to be used all the times rather than to avoid stalling on grades .. aka they were out of service too often! 02:31:37 <drac_boy> to be honest.. a booster equipped 2-8-0 (like that one) could equal to a much bigger and likely much more costly locomotive in term of tractive 02:31:40 <Flygon> I don't think we ever really had boosters in Victoria 02:31:52 <Flygon> We just made more powerful locomotives, or double headed 02:32:01 <drac_boy> so thats why some railroads were contend with booster equipped tenders as a cost measure especially if it was only needed a few times 02:32:40 <Flygon> (probably driven by competition with New South Wales... in trying to make overall faster trains :p) 02:33:17 <Flygon> Hmm 02:33:20 <Flygon> Actually 02:33:29 <Flygon> I think New South Wales may have used boosters 02:33:35 <Flygon> But don't quote me on that 02:34:44 <drac_boy> heh flygon if you really wanted competition .. for some time there were PRR, B&O, and Milwaukee running between Chicago and Twin Cities ... got hot with fast locomotives then lightweight coaches then streamlined diesels ... but post-WWII this started to slowly fail .... 02:35:28 <drac_boy> more stops were added ... speed dropped ... one by one pulled out finally leaving only scattered nameless local trains till amtrak creation 02:35:56 <Flygon> Heh 02:36:05 <drac_boy> this was where B&O ran their Zephyr ... and Milwaukee had their Hudsons .. etc 02:36:29 <Flygon> Here, Victorian Railways just sort of kept expanding, covered, quite literally, 95% of the population with railways by 1935 02:36:36 <Flygon> And then slowly declined after WWII 02:36:55 <Flygon> Barely used unprofitable brachlines were ripped up for steel 02:37:06 <Flygon> And after WWII... some were just unprofitable :p 02:38:10 <Flygon> The only place the same shit didn't really happen (to such a severe extent), to my recollection, is Europe (and possibly Britian... except for that shedevil Thatcher) 02:49:03 <drac_boy> flygon the funny thing about either the Breech Axe closures or the recent (maybe not so recent anymore..I forgot how long its been now) SNCF move to shutter small trains is they both pretty much almost lost sight of another bigger issues... 02:49:30 <Flygon> It was in the 60s, for Britian 02:49:34 <drac_boy> 4 money-questionable shunting moves = 1 big train on mainline .... guess what happens when you axe some or most of the former? you get less of the latter! 02:50:10 <Flygon> So they ended up with one moderate sized train? 02:50:14 <drac_boy> at least in usa it usually turned over to shortline railroads to manage the 'few wagons' while the bigger railroads sticked to long hauls many of the times 02:50:24 <drac_boy> a better method than just shutting down lines 02:50:41 <Flygon> Mm 02:50:53 <Flygon> Here, lines weren't so much shut down, as shut off to passeger traffic 02:50:58 <Flygon> Then degraged slowly... 02:51:10 <Flygon> Not helped that they're a different gauge to the rest of Australia 02:51:42 <Flygon> Part of the calls to standardize the lines, is because doing so would result in SG Concrete sleepers... which would uplift 25-40km/h speed limits to 80km/h+ 02:51:49 <Flygon> Even if the rails are 80+ years old @______@ 02:52:17 <Flygon> But 02:52:17 <drac_boy> flygon when you think about it .. moving two boxcars 80km to a yard to be marshalled probably gained little profit and still costed labour+fuel .. but these same two boxcars leaving the yard in a 500km distanced train = several thousand dollars of cargo profit there 02:52:20 <Flygon> It's not likely to happen 02:52:32 <Flygon> Discussing rail in Australia (for closed lines) is almost like the uS 02:52:33 <drac_boy> so its wise to never kill the short hauls unless they really don't make cargo senses ;) 02:52:33 <Flygon> US* 02:52:42 <Flygon> Except that the public supports rail 02:52:49 <Flygon> The Govt is just too terrified :p 02:53:16 <Flygon> Mmm, indeed 02:54:50 <drac_boy> flygon mind you for the last 2+ years they have been starting to organize 'forwarding' (forgot if that was the actual word) yards especially between different railroads too in france, etc 02:55:12 <Flygon> Define forwarding? 02:56:51 <drac_boy> so what happens is eg a 5700 ton rated 4900 ton train comes into the yard ... drops off 400 ton of wagons heading in another direction and notes theres 700 ton that was on their route so after a quick check (especially that its <=5700 too) they marsh this onto their train then take off as soon as air test is done 02:57:18 <Flygon> Ah, interesting 02:57:20 <drac_boy> some of these yards have a shunter on standby, others rely on the road locomotive to do this job itself 02:57:50 <drac_boy> probably a sensible way to get high tonnage with routing flexibility altogether at same time 02:58:01 * Flygon nod 02:58:04 <Flygon> Sounds it 02:59:44 <drac_boy> flygon I guess another way to put it is .. you have a 'X' .. theres a yard right in middle ... A is northwest, B northeast, C southwest, D southeast ... a train leaves A and drops some wagons for B in yard then leaves to D ... train leaves C and notes the wagons in yard to take with it to B 02:59:54 <drac_boy> only two trains needed even although it seem to be more than two routes :) 03:00:05 <Flygon> Shame it's not possible in OpenTTD :P 03:00:12 <drac_boy> thats a dumbed down way to explain it I guess ^^ 03:00:15 <drac_boy> flygon....ha 03:00:33 <drac_boy> flygon...technicially you can with that cargodist thing ... not sure if its "really" the same idea tho 03:00:43 <Flygon> Indeed 03:05:26 <drac_boy> flygon btw how compactible or incompactible are the various locomotives and emu/dmu in term of MU controls? :) 03:05:34 <Flygon> In Victoria? 03:05:36 <drac_boy> for australia that is 03:05:37 <drac_boy> mm 03:05:44 <Flygon> Not sure about Australia-wide 03:05:54 <drac_boy> well victoria works too :p 03:06:02 <Flygon> But Victorian Railways built loco (and by extension, V/Line) are all intercompatible 03:06:09 <drac_boy> nice 03:06:15 <Flygon> And other locos (inc steam) are retrofitted 03:06:27 <Flygon> But EMU and DMU is tricky 03:06:48 <Flygon> Generally, MU and loco lack full MU compatibilty (barring brakes, iirc) 03:07:12 <Flygon> And EMU and DMU lack much compatibility, barring coupling (they need multiple crew) 03:07:16 <drac_boy> europe has the problem (even then the Rail EU are slowly trying work on that) of local MU makers being incompactible with each others even sometimes between similar models from same company too 03:07:21 <Flygon> And between EMU's... it's a mass again 03:07:28 <drac_boy> funny thing is american-built units are all compactible .... doh! 03:07:36 <drac_boy> (that including the EMD 66 too yeah) 03:07:40 <Flygon> DMU's, Sprinters and VLocity, are designed to be 100% compatible 03:08:06 <Flygon> Despite one being a short trip lower speed tin can, and the other reaching theoretical early Shinkansen speeds :p 03:08:44 <drac_boy> tin can? heh 03:08:53 <Flygon> DRC's (Diesel Railcar) only were compatible with certain other DRC's 03:08:59 <Flygon> And PERM/DERM... not a clue 03:09:10 <Flygon> x Electric Rail Motor 03:14:48 <drac_boy> I'm going to bed, bye ok mr.fireman :P 03:14:59 <drac_boy> heh 03:15:56 *** drac_boy [~drac_boy@bas1-ottawa08-1176109482.dsl.bell.ca] has left #openttd [I'm done being in this room!] 03:26:49 *** mkv` [~Markavian@78-105-168-146.zone3.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 03:33:59 *** Markavian` [~Markavian@78-105-168-146.zone3.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 05:17:02 *** RavingManiac [~RavingMan@182.55.106.160] has joined #openttd 05:24:49 *** Supercheese [~Password4@76.178.163.204] has joined #openttd 05:43:25 *** KouDy [~KouDy@188.75.190.58] has joined #openttd 05:44:07 *** RavingManiac [~RavingMan@182.55.106.160] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 05:56:02 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p5DC67FA0.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [] 05:56:18 *** Eddi|zuHause 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[~Zeknurn@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has joined #openttd 11:10:00 *** Vadtec_ [~Vadtec@2001:470:1f06:13e0::1337] has joined #openttd 11:10:35 *** jonty-co1p [~jonty@borealis.jontysewell.net] has joined #openttd 11:11:18 *** Netsplit resistance.oftc.net <-> graviton.oftc.net quits: jonty-comp, roboboy, Vadtec, Flygon, DDR, InducTrackerOTTD, LordPixaII, Zeknurn, Markk, +tokai|noir, (+2 more, use /NETSPLIT to show all of them) 11:11:18 *** Vadtec_ is now known as Vadtec 11:11:19 *** Zeknurn` is now known as Zeknurn 11:11:31 *** Netsplit over, joins: Markk 11:12:50 *** welshdragon [~heswelsh@2a01:4f8:160:3241:1:0:7fa7:e1c3] has joined #openttd 11:14:33 *** BtbN [~btbn@btbn.de] has joined #openttd 11:15:27 *** tokai|noir [~tokai@00012860.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 11:15:30 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai|noir] by ChanServ 11:18:22 *** xdccFrien [~maravilla@193.144.61.240] has joined #openttd 11:18:23 <xdccFrien> http://www.carolinaherrera.com/212/es/areyouonthelist?share=HyjA8uQ0DhXVArDkeEKzcr-ndZR6Hu9HUYpNrsGkBXbkz4rz3EUUdzs6j6FXsjB4447F-isvxjqkXd4Qey2GHw#episodio-6 11:19:24 *** xdccFrien [~maravilla@193.144.61.240] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:21:24 *** InducTrackerOTTD [~WeeChat@48.63.196.88.sta.estpak.ee] has joined #openttd 11:22:20 <Eddi|zuHause> who dares click on that link? :p 11:24:33 *** DDR [~chatzilla@d154-20-135-189.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd 11:31:34 *** drac_boy [~drac_boy@bas1-ottawa08-1176109482.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #openttd 11:31:39 <drac_boy> hi 11:33:33 *** oskari89 [oskari89@62-241-226-106.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 11:35:10 *** sla_ro|master [~slaco@89.137.75.224] has quit [Quit: DANGER sla.ro is OFFLINE DANGER] 11:43:58 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@46.115.124.235] has joined #openttd 11:44:11 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@46.115.124.235] has quit [] 12:20:10 *** DDR [~chatzilla@d154-20-135-189.bchsia.telus.net] has quit [Quit: for the love of god this is not safe for work] 12:20:49 *** Elukka [Elukka@a91-152-213-89.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [] 12:45:50 *** EyeMWing [~Wing@c-68-33-226-154.hsd1.va.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 13:24:10 *** jonty-co1p is now known as jonty-comp 13:42:18 *** RavingManiac [~RavingMan@182.55.106.160] has joined #openttd 13:49:43 <drac_boy> btw does anyone even know how to use the UIC classification to label something like the Africa Garratt which obviously has not one but two bogies basically? 13:56:44 <Eddi|zuHause> you have a link? 13:57:03 <Eddi|zuHause> the UIC (german) scheme is really simple 13:57:27 <Eddi|zuHause> a single axle is 1, two axles is 2, a single driven axle is A, two driven axles is B 13:58:02 <Eddi|zuHause> ' means the bogie is movable towards the body, and () for more complex bogies 13:58:22 <drac_boy> hmm .. think the garratt falls under both of these at the same time? ^ 13:58:35 <Eddi|zuHause> so (A1A)(A1A) is an engine with 3 axle bogeys, whereof 2 axles are driven 13:59:09 <Eddi|zuHause> () implies ', but sometimes it's written anyway 13:59:22 <Eddi|zuHause> so the above could also be written (A1A)'(A1A)' 13:59:33 <drac_boy> so I'm going on a wild guessing here but something like (1'D2)(2D'1) for a 2-8-4+4-8-2 garratt? 13:59:34 <Eddi|zuHause> drac_boy: PLEASE GIVE A LINK 13:59:42 <Eddi|zuHause> i don't know which engine you are talking about 14:00:11 <drac_boy> one sec 14:01:27 <Eddi|zuHause> i guess you meant (1'D2')(2'D1') 14:03:08 <drac_boy> ugh I almost could not find any 'clean' side photos but this is close tho http://www.culture24.org.uk/asset_arena/3/34/08/180433/v0_master.jpg slight different axle arrangement but its still a garratt nevertheless 14:03:22 <drac_boy> too many frontal or dirty photos to sort through :| 14:03:45 <Eddi|zuHause> then you have it turned around 14:03:54 <Eddi|zuHause> that is (2'D1')(1'D2') 14:04:28 <drac_boy> sorry about being slow with the link...thanks a lot nevertheless 14:04:59 <peter1138> at the late-night 14:05:01 <peter1138> double-feature 14:05:05 <peter1138> picture show 14:05:24 <drac_boy> heh? 14:06:21 <peter1138> anyone got "trains vs zombies 2"? 14:06:58 <Eddi|zuHause> are you drunk? :) 14:07:24 <peter1138> no :( http://store.steampowered.com/app/222540/ 14:08:15 <Eddi|zuHause> you should be! :p 14:09:17 <drac_boy> eddi ignore that the best photo I could find was not a real one but would http://www.blocksetter.co.uk/beyer garratt locomotive 2-6-0+0-6-2.jpg had been (1'C)(C'1) or (1'C')(C'1') ? its a 2-6-0+0-6-2 yeah 14:09:44 <Eddi|zuHause> no, (1'C)(C1') 14:10:17 <Eddi|zuHause> as a rule of thumb, the driven axles are usually not movable :) 14:10:25 <drac_boy> ah I see my error 14:10:27 <drac_boy> :) 14:10:44 <drac_boy> think I'm starting to understand the entire UIC classification by now 14:12:03 <Eddi|zuHause> it gets non-trivial to distinguish (1'C)(C1') from 1'C+C1' though :) 14:12:33 <drac_boy> :) 14:13:01 <Eddi|zuHause> the first is one locomotive whereas the second could at least theoretically function as two individual units 14:14:28 <drac_boy> the mallets are kinda a bit interesting sometimes 14:14:59 <drac_boy> a 0-6-6-0 can be just C'C but when its 2-6-6-0 they put it as (1'C)C ... guess thats a good way to describe the nondriving axles on a bogie 14:15:30 <drac_boy> then of course like you mentioned... electric tractions have the same thing with A1As and whats not 14:16:43 * drac_boy goes back to working on the table now that I know how to classify the garratts anyway 14:20:40 <Eddi|zuHause> drac_boy: well, it's logical, C'C is equivalent to (C)C, and then you add an axle, so you get (1'C)C 14:25:02 <Eddi|zuHause> but take for example this engine: http://www.zackenbahn.de/e91_3.html it can be argued whether to call that B'B'B' or B+B+B 14:25:44 <Eddi|zuHause> (this page has the former, wikipedia the latter) 14:27:53 *** Pensacola [~quassel@phys9212.phys.tue.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:31:29 <drac_boy> huh thats a very interesting locomotive I hadn't noticed before .. have been to a bit of that site before tho 14:31:45 <drac_boy> I would call it B'B'B' indeed since its three seperate fixed B sections 14:32:01 *** Belugas [~belugas@216.191.111.230] has joined #openttd 14:32:04 *** mode/#openttd [+o Belugas] by ChanServ 14:32:05 * drac_boy must look up more about this locomotive later tho 14:51:37 *** Flygon_ [Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:51:49 *** Flygon_ [Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has joined #openttd 14:54:47 *** Djohaal [~Djohaal@177.96.127.126] has joined #openttd 14:57:14 <drac_boy> does give me an idea for my list finally tho 15:00:13 *** Flygon__ [Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has joined #openttd 15:00:13 *** Flygon_ [Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:01:35 <drac_boy> does make me wonder if theres a name for that thing where the motor axle is inbetween the drive axles 15:03:05 *** Djohaal [~Djohaal@177.96.127.126] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:03:15 *** Djohaal [~Djohaal@177.96.127.126] has joined #openttd 15:04:48 *** Flygon__ [Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 15:05:20 *** Flygon [Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has joined #openttd 15:13:25 *** Flygon [Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:20:10 *** KouDy [~KouDy@188.75.190.58] has joined #openttd 15:20:17 *** ntoskrnl [~not@a91-153-231-146.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #openttd 15:42:23 * drac_boy thinks about how much hp a small early 0-4-0T could make ... saturated water and nothing else 15:42:32 *** RavingManiac [~RavingMan@182.55.106.160] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:43:26 <Eddi|zuHause> drac_boy: take the heat output, multiply it by an efficiency 15:44:15 <drac_boy> yeah yeah I'm still thinking about that one :P 15:44:29 <drac_boy> the efficiency thing is stumbling me a little bit 15:44:39 <drac_boy> I do know it probably has to be low tho 15:45:44 <drac_boy> it also reminds me for some reason of the nickname in uk .. Pugs 15:56:11 <Eddi|zuHause> steam engines rarely exceeded 10% efficiency 15:58:09 <michi_cc> drac_boy: http://www.schsm.org/html/estimating_hp_of_a_steam_engin.html 15:59:05 *** Djohaal [~Djohaal@177.96.127.126] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:59:16 *** Djohaal [~Djohaal@177.96.127.126] has joined #openttd 16:01:35 <Eddi|zuHause> michi_cc: do they have that same page in metric units? :) 16:07:16 <drac_boy> heh 16:08:50 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@wirenat2.strw.leidenuniv.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:11:50 <michi_cc> Just put in base SI units and it just works⢠:) Power in W if you ignore the final HP conversion. 16:13:26 <michi_cc> Actually, http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=727420#p727420 is probably the better reference in this case. 16:18:53 *** LordAro [~LordAro@host81-155-173-100.range81-155.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 16:28:26 *** FLHerne [~quassel@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has joined #openttd 16:29:07 *** FLHerne [~quassel@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:32:00 *** FLHerne [~quassel@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has joined #openttd 16:32:22 *** FLHerne [~quassel@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:33:00 *** Prof_Frink [~proffrink@5e0097ae.bb.sky.com] has joined #openttd 16:33:24 *** FLHerne [~quassel@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has joined #openttd 16:34:07 <drac_boy> ok looks like steam and electric are almost done except for power specs 16:39:03 <drac_boy> oh yeah and Eddi|zuHause thankfully it didn't take me too long to figure that out although I admit I probably should had known earlier ... if the electric/diesel is B' then its siderod driven but Bo' is individual traction motors instead as far as I've assumed 16:39:21 <Eddi|zuHause> yes 16:39:28 <Eddi|zuHause> o means separately driven 16:39:41 <Eddi|zuHause> there was a german 1'Do1' steam engine :) 16:40:04 <drac_boy> four pistons? 16:40:18 <Eddi|zuHause> no, 8 16:40:26 <Eddi|zuHause> 2 per axle 16:40:32 <drac_boy> eight..... 16:40:47 <drac_boy> why does that sound like the streamlined V2 locomotive to me ... 16:40:53 <Eddi|zuHause> http://schneider-mayenfisch.com/drg_lokomotiven_19_1001.htm 16:40:54 <drac_boy> two pistons in V arrangement over each axle 16:41:01 <Eddi|zuHause> yes 16:41:11 <drac_boy> duh...yeah THAT 16:41:30 <drac_boy> I actually noticed it on that "strange and wild" locomotives site 16:43:32 <Eddi|zuHause> otherwise, 1'Do1' was the typical wheel arrangement of high speed electric engines of that time 16:45:14 <Eddi|zuHause> basically these: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/DR-Baureihe_E_16 http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/DR-Baureihe_E_17 http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/DR-Baureihe_E_18 http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/DR-Baureihe_E_19 16:46:06 <Eddi|zuHause> there was also a smaller version of the E17 with 1'Co1' wheel arrangement: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/DR-Baureihe_E_04 16:52:22 *** Sturmi [~sturmi@p4FEDCA9C.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 16:52:22 <drac_boy> took a while to figure out which category it was but here http://www.douglas-self.com/MUSEUM/LOCOLOCO/steamotor/steamotor.htm near bottom 16:52:43 <drac_boy> and apparently the french people thought about it too 16:55:23 *** RavingManiac [~RavingMan@182.55.106.160] has joined #openttd 17:04:51 *** Pensacola [~quassel@h220216.upc-h.chello.nl] has joined #openttd 17:08:14 *** glx [glx@000128ec.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 17:08:16 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 17:09:04 *** Hyronymus [~chatzilla@5ED1CCB7.cm-7-2d.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has joined #openttd 17:09:20 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590f72ec.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 17:12:04 *** sla_ro|master [~slaco@89.137.75.224] has joined #openttd 17:16:44 *** Mucht [~Martin@000128e2.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 17:18:09 * drac_boy is thinking by 1920 everything is superheated except for the few small low-cost locomotives 17:19:58 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p57BD4B3D.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:20:13 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p57BD4B3D.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 17:38:29 *** RavingManiac [~RavingMan@182.55.106.160] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:38:43 *** RavingManiac [~RavingMan@182.55.106.160] has joined #openttd 17:58:26 * drac_boy needs a break from this goddamn tracking table already! 17:58:30 *** drac_boy [~drac_boy@bas1-ottawa08-1176109482.dsl.bell.ca] has left #openttd [I'm done being in this room!] 17:59:02 *** kais58 [~kais58@cpc2-cwma8-2-0-cust293.7-3.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 18:17:57 *** Chrill [~chrischri@c83-253-77-105.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #openttd 18:45:24 <DorpsGek> Commit by translators :: r24825 /trunk/src/lang (dutch.txt malay.txt) (2012-12-18 18:45:15 UTC) 18:45:25 <DorpsGek> -Update from WebTranslator v3.0: 18:45:26 <DorpsGek> dutch - 1 changes by habell 18:45:27 <DorpsGek> malay - 3 changes by richz 18:57:09 *** Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.a98.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #openttd 19:06:59 *** RavingManiac [~RavingMan@182.55.106.160] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:09:23 *** Supercheese [~chatzilla@50-37-99-94.mscw.id.frontiernet.net] has joined #openttd 19:20:12 *** Supercheese [~chatzilla@50-37-99-94.mscw.id.frontiernet.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:20:42 *** Supercheese [~chatzilla@50-37-104-117.mscw.id.frontiernet.net] has joined #openttd 19:27:29 *** Chrill [~chrischri@c83-253-77-105.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:36:07 *** Zeknurn [~Zeknurn@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:37:12 *** Djohaal [~Djohaal@177.96.127.126] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:37:59 *** robotboy [~robotboy@0001164c.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:38:22 *** Zeknurn [~Zeknurn@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has joined #openttd 19:49:04 *** TheMask96 [martijn@polaris.ne2000.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:52:10 *** TheMask96 [martijn@polaris.ne2000.nl] has joined #openttd 19:55:58 *** KritiK [~Maxim@0001264a.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 20:01:09 <Terkhen> hello 20:02:52 <Supercheese> Buenos dias 20:05:20 *** supermop [~daniel_er@rrcs-208-105-82-227.nyc.biz.rr.com] has joined #openttd 20:08:03 <__ln___> elvish only 20:12:31 *** Flygon [Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has joined #openttd 20:14:31 <Terkhen> buenas noches, Supercheese 20:15:45 <Supercheese> Well, OTTD time is always daytime, unless you use that old nighttime grf :P 20:24:53 *** Chrill [~chrischri@c83-253-77-105.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #openttd 20:28:46 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host115-94-dynamic.180-80-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #openttd 20:28:55 <Wolf01> hello :D 20:31:28 *** Elukka [Elukka@a91-152-213-89.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #openttd 20:32:06 *** drac_boy [~drac_boy@bas1-ottawa08-1176109482.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #openttd 20:32:11 <drac_boy> hi 20:32:36 *** supermop [~daniel_er@rrcs-208-105-82-227.nyc.biz.rr.com] has left #openttd [] 20:34:06 <Terkhen> it's night here :P 20:34:30 <frosch123> it always is 20:34:36 <frosch123> day = work, night = ottd :p 20:34:42 <V453000> http://gifs.gifbin.com/112012/1354558133_train_multitrack_drift_deal_with_it.gif 20:34:47 <frosch123> esp. in winter 20:34:50 <Supercheese> GMT -8, 12:37 PM 20:34:52 <Supercheese> :d 20:34:54 <Supercheese> :d* 20:35:00 <Supercheese> oh frigging capslock 20:35:04 <Supercheese> :D* 20:35:05 <Eddi|zuHause> it's night when i sleep, not when it's dark outside :) 20:35:25 <drac_boy> actually 'night' does refer to the time of the day :P 20:35:40 *** pugi [~pugi@dyndsl-091-096-061-085.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has joined #openttd 20:35:40 <frosch123> Eddi|zuHause: good point; it's night in ottd when i sleep 20:36:11 <frosch123> all trains sleep at night when noone plays 20:37:12 <Eddi|zuHause> V453000: looks like stop-motion :) 20:38:55 *** ntoskrnl [~not@a91-153-231-146.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:38:56 <Terkhen> that subtle difference between evening and night does not exist in spanish :P 20:40:14 <Terkhen> it's night when it's night, it does not matter if you are sleeping or not 20:41:32 <drac_boy> agreed Terkhen 20:46:21 *** Pensacola [~quassel@h220216.upc-h.chello.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:51:46 *** Chrill [~chrischri@c83-253-77-105.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [] 21:12:18 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@5070A0D5.static.ziggozakelijk.nl] has joined #openttd 21:28:57 *** Flygon_ [Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has joined #openttd 21:28:57 *** Flygon [Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:30:30 *** Flygon [Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has joined #openttd 21:30:31 *** Flygon_ [Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:31:17 <oskari89> Who nobody has done a patch for drag&drop land purchasing? 21:31:44 <frosch123> isn't there about a dozen of them? 21:31:50 <Terkhen> I remember at least three 21:32:20 <Terkhen> neither of them is adapted to the new limiting mechanic for terraform stuff 21:32:29 <frosch123> i wonder why noone has made a patch about removing buy-land though :p 21:32:54 <planetmaker> :-) I think I once did... via parameter to forbid it 21:32:56 <Belugas> they are waiting for the undo knob 21:33:03 <planetmaker> ^^ 21:33:22 <frosch123> well, it has it's use cases for airport construction 21:33:28 <frosch123> but that is about the only one 21:34:08 <oskari89> Yes, and stations upgrading in cities... 21:34:21 <planetmaker> nah. There you don't need it 21:34:23 <frosch123> who needs purchase land for thaT? 21:34:36 <frosch123> just place rails 21:34:53 <planetmaker> ^ 21:35:06 * drac_boy simply clears things then puts station right away .. not wait 21:35:33 <drac_boy> and which of I sometimes wish I could shoot whoever invented different meanings of 'tons' and 'tonnes' :| 21:35:48 <Eddi|zuHause> drac_boy: that ignores the cases where you cannot remove enough buildings at once (town rating) or when the airport is not available yet 21:36:03 <planetmaker> you should shoot the person which keeps continuing to use non-metric units ;-) 21:36:34 <frosch123> or even worse, fahrenheit :p 21:36:52 <planetmaker> that's non-metric in my book :P 21:36:53 <Belugas> or mix both at the same time! 21:37:02 <frosch123> the only affine linear scale with a single fixpoint 21:37:03 <planetmaker> oh, beloved, yes ;-) 21:37:05 <Eddi|zuHause> we should all use Kelvin!!! 21:37:06 <drac_boy> Eddi|zuHause mm I never build airports in middle of city anyway? :P 21:37:13 <Eddi|zuHause> and m/s!! 21:37:21 <Eddi|zuHause> SI base units only 21:37:31 <planetmaker> though odd units come in handy, if you depserately want to tune your result to read 42 - irrespective of how strange your units will turn out ;-) 21:37:34 <frosch123> planetmaker: most non-metric units have _some_ sense; but fahrenheit has none 21:37:48 <frosch123> well, or half of what any other non-metric unit has 21:38:11 <planetmaker> I've to agree somewhat, indeed :-) 21:38:21 <drac_boy> looks like I may have to figure out some weight conversions for the sake of the nfo fields 21:38:30 <Supercheese> The disadvantage of using rails to reserve land rather than buying land is rails incur maintenance costs if playing with those enabled 21:38:34 <drac_boy> at least kw<>hp is rather easy 21:39:24 <Rubidium> but furlong per fortnight is a much better way to define speed ;) 21:39:39 <Supercheese> Fathoms per watch 21:40:10 <Supercheese> Leagues per half-hour 21:40:26 <Rubidium> also, we should get rid of light years or astronimical units 21:40:39 <Eddi|zuHause> mornings per day! :p 21:40:42 <planetmaker> I once handed in an assignment where I then finally used like brithish thermal units per fathom and fortnight or so 21:40:50 <Rubidium> or parsecs ;) 21:40:50 <planetmaker> but the result was 42,... ;-) 21:40:53 <Eddi|zuHause> actually, that doesn't make sense 21:40:57 <Eddi|zuHause> morning is an area 21:41:47 <Supercheese> Cubits per second (not to be confused with q-bits per second) 21:42:09 <Eddi|zuHause> cubicles! 21:42:24 <planetmaker> I think we're back to undo knobs now ;-) 21:43:27 <Eddi|zuHause> one of those in-jokes that pile up over time :) 21:43:35 <planetmaker> :-) 21:43:46 <Belugas> hehe 21:44:13 <frosch123> yeah, those which make you worry if you understand them :p 21:44:14 <Belugas> feels like old fouls remembering THE DAYS by the fire... 21:50:19 <Belugas> 11 more minutes... 21:50:29 <Belugas> or 9, depending where i look... 21:53:47 <peter1138> hi 21:55:38 *** sla_ro|master [~slaco@89.137.75.224] has quit [Quit: DANGER sla.ro is OFFLINE DANGER] 21:57:31 <drac_boy> hmm interesting http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:OPE1-393.jpg thats apparently supposed to be 'one 2-unit locomotive but the thing is ... one body is purely overhead electric and other body is purely diesel-electric ... talk about an unusual electro-diesel setup 22:02:06 *** Supercheese [~chatzilla@50-37-104-117.mscw.id.frontiernet.net] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.89 [Firefox 17.0.1/20121128204232]] 22:12:20 <Kjetil> I guess it wouldn't be unusual in a railway system that isn't totally electrified 22:12:24 <Eddi|zuHause> so basically they built two engines but with only one cab each? 22:13:23 <Eddi|zuHause> i'd rather expect they have some power transmission so always all 4 bogeys are powered 22:13:35 <frosch123> diesel / electric is completely normal 22:13:51 <frosch123> you need the diesel to drive 22:14:00 <frosch123> and the electricity for the time travel 22:14:16 <Kjetil> but where would you fit the flux capactior ? 22:14:34 <frosch123> next to the bath room 22:14:37 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: http://www.wuv.de/digital/jung_von_matt_und_sixt_verlosen_weltuntergangs_fluchtauto ;) 22:15:41 <drac_boy> Kjetil well if I heard 'electro-diesel' I was expecting a single unit with part of its space for electric and other part for diesel with a limited fuel tank located below chassis? 22:16:01 <drac_boy> :) 22:16:44 <Eddi|zuHause> how does it matter where the tank is? 22:17:45 <frosch123> put the ventilation of the tank next to the pantograph 22:20:13 <drac_boy> no thanks frosch123 :p 22:20:37 <drac_boy> Eddi|zuHause just saying...the body is full with the engine + transformer sections .. so may as well as put fuel down underneath where theres probably space anyway 22:20:48 <peter1138> bah, i'm missing a nice set of stations that work with railtypes :S 22:21:41 <Eddi|zuHause> drac_boy: the engine is in the bogey... 22:22:27 <Eddi|zuHause> that's the biggest advantage of electric engines, they're rather small... 22:23:07 <Eddi|zuHause> peter1138: newstations 0.5 22:23:10 <drac_boy> Eddi|zuHause a engine tiny enough to go inside the bogie would probably be only good for several hp .. not at least 600+hp? :) 22:23:17 <peter1138> and that's out? 22:23:33 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, it actually is, as unbelievable as it sounds :) 22:23:34 <drac_boy> peter1138 MB's download page is up ... but the main page is still "not ready" 22:23:40 <drac_boy> so you can go see for yourself :p 22:23:42 <peter1138> holy shit 22:23:46 <peter1138> but of course, not on bananas 22:24:09 <frosch123> at least not only on simuscape :p 22:24:59 <frosch123> drac_boy: the interesting part on the download page is newships :) 22:27:08 <drac_boy> yeah I wonder whats been updated there 22:27:33 <Eddi|zuHause> the download page is somewhat "hidden" 22:28:14 <frosch123> drac_boy: cargo support; but i meant actually that it is also one of those sets with a release date in the past 22:28:20 <frosch123> but no actual release 22:29:30 <drac_boy> oh I see frosch123 22:29:34 *** Supercheese [~Password4@76.178.163.204] has joined #openttd 22:29:37 <Eddi|zuHause> i'm fairly sure i have seen a downlaod for that somewhere 22:29:47 <frosch123> george leaked it 22:30:12 <frosch123> everyone though george made an ecs update to it 22:30:35 <drac_boy> someone remind me if Objects still can choose initial sprites depending on whats on the adjacent tiles? 22:30:36 <frosch123> but it was actually mb who did it, gave it to george for testing, and george put it on his webspace for convienence 22:30:41 <frosch123> and everyone else got it from there :p 22:30:57 <frosch123> drac_boy: yes they can 22:31:03 *** DDR [~chatzilla@d154-20-135-189.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd 22:31:10 <frosch123> just like houses and industries can as well 22:31:14 <drac_boy> thanks 22:31:35 <drac_boy> was wondering about a trackside-facing object ... with just one single entry in the construction menu 22:31:51 <frosch123> check the dutch road funiture set 22:31:54 <frosch123> it does such things 22:31:54 <drac_boy> of course it'll be four different sprites in term of directions ^_^ 22:32:01 <Eddi|zuHause> also interesting that MB "backdated" his (delayed) newstations release to the date he actually intended 22:32:05 <planetmaker> drac_boy, you can check for road or track. But not how the road or track looks like 22:32:07 <drac_boy> mmm I still have to look up that set, one day I'll get to that I guess 22:32:25 <planetmaker> and... look at that set for details ;-) 22:32:27 <drac_boy> planetmaker thats ok...straight or diagonal tracks whatever .. as long as its still "trackside" technically 22:33:03 <Eddi|zuHause> drac_boy: so what happens when it's inbetween tracks, or the tracks get removed/rebuilt? 22:33:53 <Eddi|zuHause> it's one of the most annoying thing about the UK houses 22:34:06 <Eddi|zuHause> they change appearance when building/removing road 22:37:31 <FLHerne> Eddi|zuHause: That isn't that annoying :P 22:37:33 <drac_boy> hmm inbetween tracks..it'll show two faces if it was meant to ... as for removed I'll have to think about that one 22:38:07 <Eddi|zuHause> FLHerne: annoying enough that i immediately stopped using the set because of that 22:38:19 <FLHerne> It's more annoying IMO when they don't, because they then face in a silly direction :P 22:38:28 <FLHerne> Eddi|zuHause: Overreaction much? 22:38:41 *** oskari89 [oskari89@62-241-226-106.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [] 22:38:43 <Eddi|zuHause> not at all... 22:39:02 <planetmaker> FLHerne, I consider that highly annoying :-) 22:39:16 <FLHerne> Why? 22:39:24 <planetmaker> A house doesn't just change when you re-build roads or tracks 22:39:27 *** Mucht [~Martin@000128e2.user.oftc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:39:38 <planetmaker> It's like a train changing colour while driving or so 22:39:44 <FLHerne> Just argue that the road moving required them to rebuild the house :P 22:40:04 <Eddi|zuHause> FLHerne: the worst thing: a house suddenly faces a depot when it faced the street before 22:40:08 <planetmaker> FLHerne it's more so annoying as there are means to make it work properly 22:40:33 <planetmaker> might be a bit of a hack, but ... works ;-) 22:41:05 <drac_boy> Eddi|zuHause one reason I could see houses changing sprite would be to have the driveway (or whatever other terms its called as) disappear when its front is not facing a road anymore? 22:41:12 <drac_boy> otherwise yeah I can't think of any good uses 22:41:29 <Eddi|zuHause> drac_boy: but these houses turn around 90° 22:45:18 *** Hyronymus [~chatzilla@5ED1CCB7.cm-7-2d.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.89 [Firefox 17.0.1/20121128204232]] 22:45:43 <drac_boy> only mobile trailer homes should be doing that? :) 22:45:47 <drac_boy> heh 22:56:14 <Terkhen> good night 22:56:15 <Eddi|zuHause> exactly... 22:56:19 *** Flygon [Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:56:27 *** Flygon [Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has joined #openttd 22:57:23 <drac_boy> I know its only a rough guessing but think that two first class seats could roughly translate into three or four second class seat? (for the sake of deciding number of seats in a grf coach wagon) 23:00:21 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@5070A0D5.static.ziggozakelijk.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:04:06 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590f72ec.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:05:00 <FLHerne> I bumped several patches 500 revisions and then combined them, and my game hasn't crashed yet! :D 23:05:13 * FLHerne suspects it will shortly... 23:05:20 <drac_boy> heh 23:07:50 *** LordAro [~LordAro@host81-155-173-100.range81-155.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:07:53 <Wolf01> 'night all 23:07:58 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@0001288e.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 23:09:17 *** Beardie [~chatzilla@cpc7-pres16-2-0-cust242.18-3.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 23:14:36 *** Sturmi [~sturmi@p4FEDCA9C.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Sturmi] 23:28:31 <FLHerne> Ah, now it crashed :-) 23:28:33 <FLHerne> 'night 23:58:46 *** Devroush [~dennis@dD5765BAC.access.telenet.be] has quit []