Times are UTC Toggle Colours
00:08:57 *** DrZoidzerg [~chris@124-148-133-35.dyn.iinet.net.au] has joined #openttd 00:24:10 *** oskari89 [oskari89@62-241-226-106.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 00:24:24 *** oskari89 [oskari89@62-241-226-106.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [] 00:25:11 *** kormer [~kormer@c-68-55-166-242.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:29:09 *** Pokka [~Octomom@d58-106-19-54.rdl801.qld.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 00:30:23 *** oskari892 [oskari89@62-241-226-106.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:39:07 *** KritiK [~Maxim@0001264a.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:48:58 *** Celestar [~vici@mnch-4d04d28f.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 00:51:11 *** supermop [~daniel_er@rrcs-208-105-82-227.nyc.biz.rr.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:53:10 *** pugi [~pugi@dyndsl-091-096-010-097.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has quit [] 00:56:00 *** Celestar_ [~vici@mnch-4d04c60c.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:29:17 <Wolf01> 'night 01:29:20 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@0001288e.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 01:32:00 <Pokka> any OpenTTD forum mods still awake? :) 01:33:09 *** Devroush [~dennis@dD5765BAC.access.telenet.be] has quit [] 01:39:33 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@s55978e11.adsl.online.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:45:47 *** Jasperthecat1 [63304048@ircip4.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 01:52:31 <Jasperthecat1> I always go on the forums at 8:00PM. That's when the nightly database backup is running. 02:03:57 *** Supercheese [~Password4@76.178.163.204] has joined #openttd 02:28:04 *** Progman [~progman@p57A19ED7.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:34:19 *** kormer [~kormer@c-68-55-166-242.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 02:39:11 *** Jasperthecat1 [63304048@ircip4.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 03:00:16 *** KouDy1 [~KouDy@188.75.190.58] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 03:02:59 *** tokai|noir [~tokai@00012860.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 03:03:02 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai|noir] by ChanServ 03:06:36 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-12-141.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 04:17:55 *** Biolunar_ [mahdi@blfd-4db0ed9e.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 04:25:16 *** Biolunar [mahdi@blfd-4db13582.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 04:38:34 *** Superuser [~superuser@host81-129-133-93.range81-129.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: Hi, I'm a quit message virus. Please replace your old line with this line and help me take over the world of IRC.] 04:59:33 *** glx [glx@000128ec.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Bye !] 06:12:17 *** RavingManiac [~RavingMan@182.55.106.160] has joined #openttd 06:51:15 *** TigerVIP [7b71616e@ircip3.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 06:51:38 <TigerVIP> hello 06:51:49 <Supercheese> Greetings 06:51:56 <TigerVIP> thanks 06:52:22 *** RavingManiac [~RavingMan@182.55.106.160] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:52:40 *** RavingManiac [~RavingMan@182.55.106.160] has joined #openttd 06:56:39 *** TigerVIP [7b71616e@ircip3.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 07:32:47 *** RavingManiac [~RavingMan@182.55.106.160] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:33:07 *** RavingManiac [~RavingMan@182.55.106.160] has joined #openttd 08:05:39 *** daz [~daz@77-253-112-236.adsl.inetia.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 08:13:58 *** RavingManiac_ [~RavingMan@182.55.106.160] has joined #openttd 08:14:37 *** daz [~daz@87-205-201-178.adsl.inetia.pl] has joined #openttd 08:20:38 *** RavingManiac [~RavingMan@182.55.106.160] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 08:31:26 *** Elukka [Elukka@a91-152-213-89.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #openttd 08:51:28 *** RavingManiac_ [~RavingMan@182.55.106.160] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 08:51:43 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 08:51:52 <andythenorth> Pikka: bonsoir 08:53:15 <Pokka> hello andy 08:53:28 * Pokka is banditing around in euro truck simulator 2 08:53:47 <Pokka> why must they drive on the wrong side on the continent? :) 08:56:37 <peter1138> silly isn't it 08:56:45 <Pokka> yes 08:56:54 <peter1138> also you can coast for hundreds of miles with no fuel 08:57:00 <Pokka> then when you want to come back, they give you a french truck to drive, with the steering wheel on the wrong side. 08:57:05 <Pokka> ho ho 08:57:18 <Pokka> andy, I had a thinks 08:57:45 <Pokka> I think I will make my semis in hoqvs non-articulated 08:58:40 <Pokka> they'll be small enough 08:59:17 <Pokka> and I think I'd rather they overtake and be able to use non-drivethrough stations 09:01:41 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-62-2.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 09:03:28 <andythenorth> Pokka: your idea is intriguing 09:03:32 <andythenorth> do you have a newsletter? 09:04:31 <andythenorth> BBL 09:04:35 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 09:04:44 *** pjpe [b8af1d68@ircip2.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 09:04:58 *** mseidl [~aaa@p5DCE7629.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 09:06:03 *** tokai|noir [~tokai@00012860.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 09:07:42 *** pjpe [b8af1d68@ircip2.mibbit.com] has quit [] 09:08:35 <mseidl> hello! 09:15:41 *** tracerpt [4d565a37@ircip4.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 09:18:54 <tracerpt> gooooood morning :F 09:19:04 <tracerpt> or evening 09:19:07 <tracerpt> I get confused 09:21:10 <mseidl> it's morning for me 09:22:44 <tracerpt> theoretically for me also 09:22:54 <tracerpt> but since i didnt sleep 09:23:04 <tracerpt> i think it may still be yesterday 09:23:06 <tracerpt> :) 09:26:09 <mseidl> do you know much about the train signals tracerpt ? 09:26:42 <tracerpt> not much 09:26:48 <tracerpt> I mostly use path signals 09:27:44 <tracerpt> i dont really understand much of the game, i pop in here to try and pickup something 09:27:52 <NGC3982> Morning. 09:27:59 <mseidl> i setup a loading loop but my trains keep getting stuck 09:28:44 <NGC3982> Anything i can help you with? 09:29:39 <mseidl> NGC3982: yeah, hold on, i will show you a pic 09:29:59 <NGC3982> Great. 09:30:22 <mseidl> http://www.darkcoding.net/files/2009/05/two-loading-loops.jpg 09:30:33 <mseidl> you see the loop around ludinghattan? 09:31:14 <tracerpt> give me 1 min 09:31:20 <tracerpt> playing poker at same time 09:31:24 <tracerpt> will see 09:31:28 <tracerpt> morning ngc 09:31:37 <mseidl> i did 1 of those around each trainstation but they keep getting stuck while loading. 09:31:42 <NGC3982> Yes, that looks a bit odd. 09:32:33 <mseidl> do i need to add a block signal if i want to split up the rear track? 09:32:58 <tracerpt> i do mine on a such larger scale that i have trouble figuring out simple layouts 09:33:23 <mseidl> i tried adding another pre/path signal right before the depot but that didn't seem to work as designed 09:33:31 <tracerpt> but seems like the block signals are doing that 09:33:33 <NGC3982> I actually wouldnt know. My sollution would be to not use block signals on two way tracks. 09:33:42 <tracerpt> try using path signals 09:33:53 <tracerpt> let me just close my poker game 09:34:07 <NGC3982> Yes. Two simple two way path signals. 09:34:13 <NGC3982> At least that's what i would do. 09:34:36 <mseidl> i wanted itto be able to store 2 trains on the back side if need be 09:34:47 <mseidl> because what happens is atrain waits behind another blocking the exit 09:35:23 <NGC3982> "itto"? 09:35:30 <NGC3982> Ah, It to. 09:35:32 <NGC3982> :) 09:35:33 <mseidl> a train waits for a platform blocking the exit, so one train sits in the 09:35:36 <Terkhen> good morning 09:35:54 <mseidl> back side, but none of the trains will leave the platforms because of the train on the backside 09:36:50 <tracerpt> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/4024494/FlightSims/two-loading-loops.jpg 09:37:00 <tracerpt> try that 09:37:15 <tracerpt> put 2 path signals on those spots (red) 09:37:21 <tracerpt> remove green block signals 09:37:27 <tracerpt> should do the trick 09:37:30 <NGC3982> Yes 09:37:32 <mseidl> tracerpt: i just copied the single station 09:37:58 <mseidl> with asingle line to anothe rstation with the same loop 09:38:10 *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@d5153E72C.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 09:38:52 <tracerpt> i like larger stuff xD 09:38:53 <tracerpt> http://www.tt-forums.net/download/file.php?id=168859 09:39:09 <mseidl> wow 09:39:10 <tracerpt> that line is serving 102 trains now 09:39:18 <mseidl> tracerpt: is that yours? 09:39:27 <tracerpt> about 30 stoping there 09:39:30 <tracerpt> ye 09:39:42 <mseidl> you're at 85 million after 1 years? what the hell gets served there? 09:40:17 <mseidl> 14* 09:40:41 <tracerpt> im at over 1 billion now 09:40:47 <tracerpt> 2050+- 09:41:01 <tracerpt> thats my first game with FIRS 09:41:27 <tracerpt> I did cheat to remove a mountain 09:41:48 <tracerpt> so u can take out about 5 million from there 09:42:09 <tracerpt> thats just a test game, 1st where i used trainsets and industry stuff 09:42:37 <mseidl> tracerpt: are you mostly focusing on industry stuff? 09:43:04 <tracerpt> its a small map, not much towns 09:43:35 <tracerpt> 1024x256 i think 09:43:47 <tracerpt> but most is industry yes 09:44:28 *** andythenorth_ [~andytheno@2002:4d66:7022:0:d954:fac1:b620:db9f] has joined #openttd 09:44:33 *** pugi [~pugi@host-091-097-098-190.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has joined #openttd 09:44:35 <tracerpt> FIRS keeps me busy 09:44:46 <tracerpt> i really liked it 09:45:17 <tracerpt> when i get bored from this game will start a really big map and do it properly 09:45:18 <mseidl> FIRS? 09:45:32 *** andythenorth_ [~andytheno@2002:4d66:7022:0:d954:fac1:b620:db9f] has quit [] 09:45:45 *** andythenorth_ [~andytheno@2002:4d66:7022:0:d954:fac1:b620:db9f] has joined #openttd 09:45:49 <tracerpt> adds industries to the game 09:45:51 <tracerpt> wait 09:46:50 <tracerpt> mseidl: http://wiki.openttd.org/FIRS 09:47:06 <tracerpt> i would make it confusing if i tried to explain 09:47:51 <andythenorth_> Is that wiki page outdated? O_o 09:49:09 <tracerpt> probably 09:49:13 <tracerpt> :) 09:49:23 <tracerpt> i wouldnt know 09:49:37 <tracerpt> mseidl: ask andy he knows a bit about firs 09:49:39 <tracerpt> :D 09:49:40 <mseidl> oh another question? i see sawmills on the map? but havent found a lumber yard to pick up wood? did i just miss it somewhere? 09:50:20 <tracerpt> u need to fund them 09:50:24 <Supercheese> Outdated wiki page is outdated 09:50:39 <tracerpt> on the forest patches in the hills 09:51:00 <mseidl> ok 09:51:10 <tracerpt> i dont think they show up in the game by themselves 09:51:18 <tracerpt> if they do i've never seen one 09:51:54 <tracerpt> oh, and when they start taking down trees 09:52:02 <tracerpt> u'll need to plant more 09:52:09 <tracerpt> but its a good investment 09:52:14 *** Alberth [~hat3@a82-95-164-127.adsl.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 09:52:17 *** mode/#openttd [+o Alberth] by ChanServ 09:52:36 <mseidl> tracerpt: why? 09:52:40 <mseidl> to keep people happy? 09:52:48 <tracerpt> to make money :D 09:53:14 <mseidl> ha 09:53:57 *** andythen_ [~andytheno@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 09:54:19 <andythen_> Outdated wiki page for FIRS :p 09:54:27 <tracerpt> lumber mills will chop down trees around them 09:54:35 <tracerpt> eventually depleting the forest 09:54:40 <tracerpt> then u plant more 09:54:54 <Supercheese> only in tropical vanilla OTTD eh 09:54:55 <tracerpt> keep the $$$ flowing 09:55:07 <tracerpt> lol 09:55:45 <mseidl> tracerpt: what's your general strategy for starting out? 09:55:57 <tracerpt> coal 09:56:05 <Alberth> tracerpt: I stop caring for money once I get more than I can spend 09:56:15 <tracerpt> true 09:56:27 <Alberth> pax is also good, as you have two-way cargo 09:57:01 <tracerpt> i always start by locating a coal mine at medium range from a power station 09:57:22 <mseidl> pax? 09:57:29 <Alberth> coal is easier, I agree, in temperate, at least :p 09:57:29 <tracerpt> passengers 09:57:47 <tracerpt> the tropical one also 09:57:54 <Alberth> in arctic, I usually start with wood 09:57:58 <mseidl> ah 09:58:02 <tracerpt> never played artic 09:58:17 <tracerpt> nor the toy stuff 09:58:28 <mseidl> is there a way to slow down the time too? 09:58:39 <Alberth> and in toyland with batteries and plastic, for the toy factory 09:59:05 <Alberth> mseidl: there are several patches that attempt that, but each has problems 09:59:30 <Alberth> never tried them though 09:59:50 <tracerpt> I'm using a fairly old pc 09:59:51 <Alberth> 5,000,000 years game time seems sufficient to me :) 09:59:56 *** andythenorth_ [~andytheno@2002:4d66:7022:0:d954:fac1:b620:db9f] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:00:06 <tracerpt> and when overloading firefox with flash stuff 10:00:29 <tracerpt> and running everything else 10:00:35 <tracerpt> poker clients etc 10:00:51 <tracerpt> 1 year may take 5 more seconds to go by 10:01:01 <tracerpt> so i think thats effective lol 10:01:17 <mseidl> is anybody here responsable for play-ttd.com? the online js version? 10:01:36 <Supercheese> I don't think the author of that hangs out here 10:01:58 <tracerpt> speaking of online 10:02:18 <tracerpt> how does it works online? competitive? 10:02:21 <tracerpt> work* 10:02:45 <tracerpt> not the js version 10:02:48 <Supercheese> People start a company and build stuff, and transport stuff 10:02:48 <tracerpt> ottd 10:02:57 <Supercheese> multiple people can do that at the same time :P 10:03:07 <NGC3982> I love faceraping. 10:03:07 <Supercheese> it's not very complex unless you make it 10:03:12 <tracerpt> is it persistent? 10:03:33 <tracerpt> or do everyone else needs to be online to get the game resumed 10:03:42 <tracerpt> does* 10:03:51 <NGC3982> http://i.imgur.com/rbbPr4d.png 10:04:11 <Supercheese> wat 10:04:17 <mseidl> face raping? 10:04:30 <NGC3982> My girl friend forgot her ipad logged in 10:04:31 <tracerpt> wtf 10:04:34 <tracerpt> lol 10:04:35 <Supercheese> and yes, games on servers are persistent 10:04:46 <Supercheese> they can either keep running or autopause when no one is connected 10:04:49 <mseidl> NGC3982: are you swedish? 10:04:53 <Alberth> tracerpt: depends on server settings, and you can play competition, co-operation, and everything in between 10:04:54 <NGC3982> Yes. 10:05:11 <tracerpt> god morgen :D 10:05:30 <mseidl> guten morgen 10:05:35 <mseidl> ;) 10:05:43 <NGC3982> tracerpt: For instance, i have three dedicated (advertised) servers running, and two out of three servers run only when >1 player is online. The third runs ..Always. 10:06:01 <tracerpt> so if i was to join one of those games 10:06:03 <Supercheese> I forgot about OTTD javascript implementation 10:06:11 <Supercheese> people were like "No way, that's impossible!" 10:06:17 <tracerpt> if it was competitive 10:06:23 <Supercheese> then boom, some virtually anonymous dude implements it 10:06:24 <NGC3982> Wait what. 10:06:35 <NGC3982> Java and OpenTTD? 10:06:40 <NGC3982> Oh, that site? 10:06:45 <tracerpt> i can have someone buy out my company when im not there? 10:06:48 <Supercheese> Well, OTTD-in-browser 10:06:57 <Supercheese> I have no idea what the actual code is, I presume javascript 10:06:58 <mseidl> there are funny bugs 10:07:04 <Supercheese> http://play-ttd.com 10:07:19 <mseidl> i tried to buy a bus but it cost me 7 billion pounds 10:07:30 <NGC3982> tracerpt: Yes, if you are facing bancruptcy, and the configuration of the server allow it. 10:07:46 <Supercheese> Heh, no newgrfs 10:08:15 <mseidl> is anybody working on higher res version of ttd? 10:08:27 <Supercheese> zBase is 10:08:34 <Supercheese> you can download it from Banananananaannas 10:08:49 <NGC3982> The Bananarama. 10:08:53 <Supercheese> Oh, and zBase is the thing, not the person 10:08:55 <tracerpt> 7 billion pounds 10:08:58 <Supercheese> in case that was ambiguous 10:09:06 <tracerpt> u bough the whole tfl buses 10:09:07 <tracerpt> xD 10:09:13 <tracerpt> all the tfl buses 10:09:18 <NGC3982> mseidl: That sounds like three hundred years of inflation in play. 10:10:05 <tracerpt> well i tryed the zbase 10:10:12 <tracerpt> colours are well annoying 10:10:23 <tracerpt> went back to default after 10 minutes 10:10:47 <tracerpt> but i am using the 32bpp trains on my game though 10:10:54 <tracerpt> they do look good 10:10:59 <Rubidium> NGC3982: pff... 300 years is unimaginable, maybe 170 but no more 10:11:58 <NGC3982> Doesn't inflation stop after some time, btw? 10:12:15 *** KouDy [~KouDy@188.75.190.58] has joined #openttd 10:12:22 <mseidl> did anybody make a clone of sim city? 10:12:36 <Rubidium> yes 10:12:47 <tracerpt> the original game? 10:12:55 <tracerpt> or the crap they fed us after it? :) 10:13:05 <mseidl> any of them? 10:13:19 <Rubidium> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lincity 10:13:29 *** andythen_ [~andytheno@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:14:20 <Supercheese> good night 10:14:29 *** Supercheese [~Password4@76.178.163.204] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90 [Firefox 19.0/20130215130331]] 10:14:40 <tracerpt> gn 10:16:01 <mseidl> good night 10:17:13 <tracerpt> speaking of night 10:17:19 <tracerpt> i should get some sleep 10:17:46 *** sridharan_eee [7ab29344@ircip1.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 10:18:54 <sridharan_eee> Hi everybody... May I ask in this forum, is it possible to add train timings to simulate real time schedule for trains running between stations..? 10:19:23 *** andythenorth_ [~andytheno@2002:4d66:7022:0:30ca:4ea6:5ee5:de20] has joined #openttd 10:21:31 <tracerpt> hello 10:21:53 <mseidl> night 10:22:00 <mseidl> tracerpt: thanks for your help and NGC3982 10:22:08 <tracerpt> theres a timetable thing on the train orders, but i just use it to set max speed 10:22:17 <tracerpt> yw :) 10:22:51 <tracerpt> i tried to get a jet to fly once a month but failed miserably 10:22:54 <tracerpt> ;) 10:23:48 <tracerpt> sridharan_eee: http://wiki.openttd.org/Timetable 10:23:58 <tracerpt> i'm too tired to read 10:24:06 <tracerpt> going to bed :) 10:24:09 <tracerpt> laters all 10:25:20 <sridharan_eee> thank you 10:26:51 *** tracerpt [4d565a37@ircip4.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 10:27:04 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1A7D0.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 10:27:54 <mseidl> i installed zbase via the download menu and it crashes when loading now 10:29:22 *** andythenorth_ [~andytheno@2002:4d66:7022:0:30ca:4ea6:5ee5:de20] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:29:41 <mseidl> fixed it 10:30:28 <mseidl> are there any must have grfs? 10:35:17 *** andythenorth_ [~andytheno@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 10:39:34 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-62-2.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:41:46 *** Pensacola [~quassel@h220216.upc-h.chello.nl] has joined #openttd 10:44:21 *** tokai [~tokai@00012860.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 10:44:24 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai] by ChanServ 10:45:03 *** DDR [~chatzilla@d108-180-71-172.bchsia.telus.net] has quit [Quit: DDR is not Dance Dance Revolution.] 10:47:26 *** andythenorth_ [~andytheno@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:48:36 <Alberth> mseidl: no 10:48:47 <Alberth> as in, everybody has different favorite ones 10:49:10 <Alberth> it depends on how you play the game 10:50:02 *** mseidl [~aaa@p5DCE7629.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:50:30 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-16-78.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 10:53:04 *** tokai [~tokai@00012860.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:57:23 *** Biolunar_ [mahdi@blfd-4db0ed9e.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: My life for Aiur] 11:02:36 *** kormer [~kormer@c-68-55-166-242.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:04:06 *** sridharan_eee [7ab29344@ircip1.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 11:04:48 *** Rhamphoryncus [~rhamph@d173-183-156-148.abhsia.telus.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:12:56 *** andythenorth_ [~andytheno@178.104.217.31] has joined #openttd 11:14:44 *** lofejndif [~lsqavnbok@foto.ro1.torservers.net] has joined #openttd 11:19:06 *** oskari89 [oskari89@62-241-226-106.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 11:23:07 *** andythenorth_ [~andytheno@178.104.217.31] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:32:41 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host49-232-dynamic.41-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #openttd 11:32:49 <Wolf01> moin 11:42:35 *** andythenorth_ [~andytheno@2002:4d66:7022:0:21a1:21c6:49cc:a0dc] has joined #openttd 11:44:08 <Alberth> moin 11:44:16 <Alberth> nice changes andy! 11:44:52 *** DrZoidzerg [~chris@124-148-133-35.dyn.iinet.net.au] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 11:47:40 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-4d009337.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 11:48:31 <andythenorth_> Alberth I considered tabs for lang page, would be more usable 11:48:55 <andythenorth_> But needs more js and complicated markup 11:50:21 <andythenorth_> I'm trying to keep this so anyone could hack on it 11:51:38 *** andythen_ [~andytheno@2002:4d66:7022:0:add2:aa55:aadf:2f1c] has joined #openttd 11:51:57 <Alberth> :o a pretty 'upload language' page as well! 11:52:32 *** Tvel [~Thunderbi@84.40.82.221] has joined #openttd 11:52:55 <Alberth> I don't exactly know what to put at that page, tbh 11:55:10 *** Biolunar [mahdi@blfd-4db0ed9e.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 11:56:21 <Alberth> I find it a waste to dump all strings there, somewhat. Just the names makes it even quite useless imho 11:57:34 <Alberth> perhaps add a link from the project page directly to the string-edit page? that's what most people would do 11:58:21 *** andythenorth_ [~andytheno@2002:4d66:7022:0:21a1:21c6:49cc:a0dc] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:59:41 *** andythen_ [~andytheno@2002:4d66:7022:0:add2:aa55:aadf:2f1c] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:01:02 *** andythenorth_ [~andytheno@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 12:05:19 *** lofejndif [~lsqavnbok@9KCAAAZ00.tor-irc.dnsbl.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: gone] 12:10:01 <andythenorth_> Phone irc is poor 12:13:17 <Kjetil> it can't afford food ? 12:13:25 <Alberth> you may want to throw the phone out the window, but that may have a dramatic effect on your ability to irc 12:19:58 *** andythenorth_ [~andytheno@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:21:33 *** fonsinchen [~fonsinche@dslb-092-078-248-048.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 12:25:06 *** Tvel [~Thunderbi@84.40.82.221] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:30:31 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@s55978e11.adsl.online.nl] has joined #openttd 12:31:35 *** andythenorth_ [~andytheno@2002:4d66:7022:0:2921:209b:677d:9e49] has joined #openttd 12:33:01 *** APTX [APTX@aptx.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:39:00 *** zeknurn [~Zeknurn@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:39:59 *** zeknurn [~sup@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has joined #openttd 12:41:23 *** andythenorth_ [~andytheno@2002:4d66:7022:0:2921:209b:677d:9e49] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:48:19 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 12:48:45 *** joey8 [~JoeEvans@host86-172-149-179.range86-172.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 12:49:05 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [] 12:52:24 *** Stimrol [~Stimrol@46-239-219-51.tal.is] has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in] 12:53:41 *** andythenorth_ [~andytheno@2002:4d66:7022:0:d149:7eef:2f8a:ebfd] has joined #openttd 12:53:41 *** andythenorth_ [~andytheno@2002:4d66:7022:0:d149:7eef:2f8a:ebfd] has quit [] 12:54:11 *** andythenorth_ [~andytheno@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 12:55:56 <andythenorth_> Alberth is the intention to host one instance of web translator someshere, or distribute it? Assuming host...? 12:56:34 <Alberth> imho, different sites can make different decisions there 12:57:29 <andythenorth_> Might have licensing shenanigan, some of the libraries I've added are MIT etc, not GPL :) 12:57:30 <Alberth> it's single threading at the moment, so a single instance wouldn't really work now 12:58:07 <andythenorth_> Single threading is not uncommon for python web apps 12:58:30 <Alberth> true, but you better prepare for several instances then, imho 12:58:35 <andythenorth_> Yes 12:59:12 <andythenorth_> Use haproxy or something to farm work to instances 12:59:32 <andythenorth_> But then locking needs considering :) 12:59:50 <Alberth> so we should make more explicit what license holds for which part 13:00:11 <Alberth> perhaps even distributing the 3rd -party data as separate archives 13:00:23 <andythenorth_> When i have my laptop again i can look at the licenses 13:00:56 <Alberth> I considered locking a bit, but decided aginst implementing it now, as the problem is big enough without race conditions :p 13:02:02 <andythenorth_> One thread per xml file :p 13:02:04 <Alberth> I am also still wondering whether files are really the way to go 13:02:20 <andythenorth_> Probably files are bad :) 13:02:35 <andythenorth_> Sqlalchemy might be worth a look 13:02:48 *** Devroush [~dennis@dD5765BAC.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 13:02:58 <andythenorth_> Adapter to sql, makes it act like objects 13:03:11 <andythenorth_> Python 13:03:20 <Alberth> but merging all strings of all projects together also didn't look like a good solution 13:03:56 <Alberth> you mostly need just the base language and the translation you work on 13:05:00 <Alberth> stuff like updating the base language breaks that idea, and initial loading does due to re-generation strings state 13:05:21 <Alberth> the latter is solvable, the latter is harder to fix 13:05:45 <Alberth> euhm, the *former* is harder to fix :) 13:06:50 <frosch123> someone knows some nasty train sets using cargo subtypes? :) 13:08:29 <andythenorth_> Canrail - some of the flat wagons do 13:08:36 <andythenorth_> Nars 2 regearing 13:08:47 <andythenorth_> Db set i assume does 13:09:29 <peter1138> ukrs 1? dunno though 13:11:56 <andythenorth_> Alberth have you implemented any file locking at all yet? :) 13:12:13 <Alberth> no 13:13:03 <andythenorth_> If this was a work project it would just use zodb which is a neat persistent object db for python 13:13:23 <andythenorth_> But nobody in this community will know how to host zodb 13:14:12 <andythenorth_> Writing our own locks etc for files is ... undesirable? 13:15:07 <V453000> frosch123: nuts has cargo subtypes too for passengers/mail/gold :P 13:16:14 <frosch123> really? i guess i never transported those cargos with nuts 13:16:46 <frosch123> are there articulated wagons for gold? 13:19:02 <Alberth> andythenorth_: it is not, but I think the project is complicated enough without threading, currently at least 13:19:31 <V453000> yes frosch123, on maglev 13:20:04 *** joey8 [~JoeEvans@host86-172-149-179.range86-172.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:20:12 <andythenorth_> Also it's nice that the project can be run without building deps (db etc) 13:20:53 <Alberth> andythenorth_: another point you could start from is the ProjectMetaData object, which loads/saves/unloads projects 13:21:31 <Alberth> yeah, you can simply copy a file back, restart the server, and try again :) 13:22:53 <Alberth> you could also give each language a file 13:23:30 <Alberth> a project would be a directory then 13:28:01 <andythenorth_> Hmm 13:28:25 <andythenorth_> So my guess is that performance will simply be fine most of the time 13:28:45 <andythenorth_> Low number of concurrent users 13:29:04 <andythenorth_> Relatively simple read / write tasks 13:30:56 *** Tvel [~Thunderbi@84.40.82.221] has joined #openttd 13:33:53 <andythenorth_> Stuff that might chug - like large exports - could be a standalone app reading same files (read only) 13:34:26 <Alberth> I agree 13:35:25 <Alberth> except that I'd pull langfile updates also over http from the application 13:35:47 <Alberth> so you don't need to have file access 13:36:09 <andythenorth_> Wsgi can combine multiple apps trivially afaik btw 13:36:34 <andythenorth_> And yes, i was thinking of curling lang updates for my grfs 13:37:27 <andythenorth_> I might want them as json for more processing though, not just a lang file ;) 13:37:31 *** Stimrol [~Stimrol@46-239-219-51.tal.is] has joined #openttd 13:38:12 <Alberth> another extension is to make a file format to express what needs to be translated, so translators can download that into a local application 13:38:34 <Alberth> I used json first, but I don't have control over its contents 13:39:10 <Alberth> xml gives me the option of inspecting each node 13:39:28 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-4d009337.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:40:22 <Alberth> unless I write a json parser, of course :) 13:43:37 *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@d5153E72C.access.telenet.be] has quit [Quit: oO] 13:45:04 <Alberth> btw, do you have a library that converts a time-delta (in number of seconds) to something nicely readable, like "3 weeks ago" ? 13:45:35 *** MNIM [~mBuntu@ip5452ffad.adsl-surfen.hetnet.nl] has joined #openttd 13:46:27 <andythenorth_> I think it's quite trivial to output json from objs - there's a repr module for it iirc 13:46:53 <andythenorth_> Hmm time offsets. Maybe babel can do that? 13:47:22 <Alberth> sure, output is no problem, it's loading it back that I worry about :) 13:47:50 <andythenorth_> http://babel.edgewall.org/ 13:47:53 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-4d009385.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 13:47:57 <Alberth> I looked around a bit, and there are a number of implementation floating around at the new 13:48:12 <andythenorth_> I was going to add babel for time formatting etc 13:48:26 <andythenorth_> Then decided it's overkill 13:48:34 <andythenorth_> Brb 13:48:41 *** andythenorth_ [~andytheno@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 13:49:33 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 13:49:39 <andythenorth> real computer 13:49:41 <andythenorth> real keyboard :P 13:50:56 <Alberth> :) 13:51:26 <Alberth> bable does seem overkill unless we're going to translate our application :) 13:51:31 <Alberth> *babel 13:51:54 <Alberth> I am somewhat surprised nobody wrote an implementation for adding to datetime 13:51:54 <andythenorth> it is overkill 13:52:53 <andythenorth> well date1-date2 should work 13:52:54 <Alberth> but all texts and changes have time stamps, which need to be displayed as well 13:53:01 <andythenorth> it's just the formatting is a bit of work 13:53:12 *** daz [~daz@87-205-201-178.adsl.inetia.pl] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.9.1] 13:53:28 <andythenorth> http://labix.org/python-dateutil claims delta computation 13:53:42 <Alberth> yeah, you don't want 1 year, 5 months, 21 days, 6 hours, 39 minutes and 1 second :) 13:54:05 <Alberth> 17 months is precise enough :) 13:54:58 <andythenorth> that's just a set of 'if blah:' stuff :) 13:55:05 <andythenorth> if we can't find one, I could write it 13:55:08 <andythenorth> later... 13:55:58 <Alberth> k 13:57:47 <Alberth> oh, epydoc makes the .pyc mess 13:58:39 <Alberth> as it's using python2 :) 14:03:05 <andythenorth> wrap it in a script that deletes all .pyc afterwards :P 14:08:31 <Alberth> you added .pyc ignore already :) 14:12:56 <jonty-comp> i swear i'm missing some repos in my brand-new ubuntu install or something 14:13:15 <jonty-comp> first i wanted to install steam, and the wiki said it was in apt, but it wasn't 14:13:30 <jonty-comp> and now i want to install a theme switcher which it also says is in apt but clearly is not 14:14:42 <frosch123> are you sure "steam" would already be in a "stable" ubuntu release? 14:14:51 <frosch123> maybe you need unstable or experimental or whatever 14:15:47 <jonty-comp> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2013/02/steam-added-to-ubuntu-software-center-celebrates-with-big-sale 14:16:45 <Alberth> using a mirror repo? 14:16:54 <jonty-comp> ah, that might be it 14:17:03 <jonty-comp> although one would assume the UK mirror has all the packages 14:17:08 * jonty-comp switches to main 14:17:46 <peter1138> in valves world where ubuntu == linux == ubuntu 14:18:09 <jonty-comp> probably because canonical are buying them flowers and promising them millions 14:18:55 <Alberth> more likely because their average unix customer thinks that way :) 14:23:55 <peter1138> "so very special" 14:23:58 <peter1138> aww, radio edits... 14:25:40 *** kormer [~kormer@c-68-55-166-242.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 14:28:28 * NGC3982 is on a X51. 14:31:49 *** fonsinchen [~fonsinche@dslb-092-078-248-048.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:40:47 *** ntoskrnl [~not@a91-153-231-146.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #openttd 14:51:18 *** LordAro [~LordAro@host217-43-119-76.range217-43.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 14:52:05 <LordAro> heyo all 14:53:25 *** Tvel1 [~Thunderbi@212.36.5.170] has joined #openttd 14:54:36 *** Tvel1 [~Thunderbi@212.36.5.170] has quit [] 14:56:13 *** Tvel [~Thunderbi@84.40.82.221] has quit [Quit: Tvel] 14:56:55 *** Generalcamo [~Generalca@h179.167.213.151.dynamic.ip.windstream.net] has joined #openttd 14:57:35 <Generalcamo> Hey, I am having trouble with OpenTTD. I cannot seem to get the MIDI files it plays to go onto the proper MIDI driver 14:57:53 <Generalcamo> It always defaults to the Terrible Windows Driver 15:03:08 *** mseidl [~aaa@p5DCE6A46.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 15:03:16 <mseidl> does it make sense to connect small towns with roads? 15:03:18 <mseidl> do they grow faster? 15:03:56 <andythenorth> http://wiki.openttd.org/Town_growth#Town_Growth 15:06:08 <mseidl> thanks andythenorth 15:10:25 <andythenorth> $someone who is bored might consider updating this? o_O http://wiki.openttd.org/FIRS 15:10:52 <andythenorth> Pikka how much are limes where you live? 15:12:11 <jonty-comp> oh wow, the nouveau driver did *not* like me opening bbc radio 1 15:12:17 * jonty-comp presses the reset buttan 15:19:52 <mseidl> question, i just grouped a bunch of vehicles together that are too old, and i wanted to replace them all using the replace all , but the button is grayed out? 15:20:04 <peter1138> nobody likes you opening bbc radio 1 15:21:06 <Pokka> limes, andy? 15:25:53 <mseidl> it seems as if there is nothing on the right hand column 15:26:43 <mseidl> to select as a replacement vehicle 15:29:37 <Pokka> maybe you can no longer build vehicles of that type, mseidl? 15:30:07 <NGC3982> Xbox Kinect really sucks. 15:30:19 <Alberth> throw it out the window quickly! 15:30:33 <NGC3982> Seriosly, it's in the Rob the Robot category. 15:30:41 <Pokka> throw it out of the window slowly 15:31:01 <mseidl> Pokka: why? they are still available in my new vehicle list from the depot all these trucks are at 15:31:10 <mseidl> NGC3982: why you say that? 15:31:13 <NGC3982> It doesn't even handle a menue. 15:31:32 <NGC3982> Trying several angles, with no or lots of stuff around me, different distances. 15:31:39 <Pokka> maybe you can then 15:31:46 <NGC3982> It is not bad. It's -broken-. 15:31:49 <Pokka> I'd post a screenshot and savegame on the forum :) 15:33:30 <mseidl> are there any must have grfs? 15:34:02 <NGC3982> mseidl: Not really, but personaly, i never play vanilla without the OpenGFX+ NewGRF pack. 15:34:28 <peter1138> is it vanilla with that? 15:34:39 <Pokka> andy: stop stirring 15:34:57 <NGC3982> peter1138: Not ..really. I guess. 15:35:23 <peter1138> my must-have grf: trg1r.grf 15:35:45 <jonty-comp> it has become apparent to me that ubuntu still hates my entirely-normal desktop computer 15:35:49 <Pokka> that grf sucks, per 15:35:53 <Pokka> and peter1138 15:36:12 <andythenorth> Pikka: stirring? Limes? 15:36:13 <NGC3982> Wha'zat? 15:36:36 <Pokka> stirring simutranscape 15:36:39 <Pokka> and limes? 15:40:20 <Pokka> the limes in climes fall mainly on the rhymes 15:40:35 <peter1138> no u 15:40:59 <Pokka> her too 15:41:53 <peter1138> what's this, FIRS to be removed from bananas and hosted solely on simuscape? 15:42:14 <Pokka> sounds plausible 15:43:41 <Pokka> but mostly advising SAC she should consult mb for advice on the best way to handle content violations :) 15:44:08 <andythenorth> I'm genuine 15:44:23 <Pokka> you're still stirring :P 15:44:37 <andythenorth> nah, I actually think maria is heading into a license headache 15:44:42 <Pokka> and what are these limes I've heard so much about? 15:44:42 <andythenorth> and she'll just end up sad about it 15:44:55 <andythenorth> nothing interesting http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-21519050 15:45:07 <andythenorth> you won't miss anything if you don't click 15:46:42 <peter1138> i'm going to click anyway 15:46:45 <Pokka> eh 15:53:17 * andythenorth teaching the 3 year old Big Trak 15:53:25 <andythenorth> "it's magic" 15:55:53 <Pokka> D: 15:57:11 <Pokka> anyway, what "licence headache"? It's her stuff, she can choose to do with or not do with it as she likes. :) 15:59:42 <andythenorth> the one where it's a made up license, full of holes? 16:01:17 *** APTX [APTX@aptx.org] has joined #openttd 16:01:31 <andythenorth> I would rather have a happy team simuscape 16:01:55 <andythenorth> and fewer dramas with the neighbours about who's dog has crapped on the lawn 16:02:04 <andythenorth> whose / who's /s ? 16:02:06 <Pokka> I like my licence 16:02:16 <andythenorth> you should just use WTFPL 16:02:37 <Pokka> I use the opposite :) 16:03:31 <Pokka> largely because I'm not labouring under the illusion that I'm going to sue anyone over TTD graphics 16:03:53 <andythenorth> Team SS should adopt your licence ;) 16:04:22 <andythenorth> what does Michael use? 16:05:54 <Pokka> hmm 16:06:25 <andythenorth> bit confusing 16:06:46 <andythenorth> the DB Set 0.8 copyright notice includes right to distribute 16:08:07 <Kjetil> why can't everyone just be friends ? 16:08:33 <Pokka> who knows :) 16:09:35 <Pokka> you'd better upload it to bananas then, andythenorth 16:09:44 <Pokka> except the bananas ToS says you can't :) 16:12:07 <Pokka> but yes, why can't everyone just be friends? because entitlement and playing pretend lawyer is more fun than respecting other people's right to do what they want with their own work, probably. 16:14:08 * Pokka well past bedtime :) 16:14:31 <Pokka> goodnight gentlemen and charlies 16:14:34 *** Pokka [~Octomom@d58-106-19-54.rdl801.qld.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:15:00 <jonty-comp> i take offense at that! 16:15:29 <Kjetil> You are not a friend ? 16:16:39 <Kjetil> Or are you not a gentleman ? 16:17:03 <jonty-comp> that is not for me to decide 16:17:43 <Kjetil> then how can you take offence ? 16:18:39 <__ln__> Kjetil: please, no space in front of the questionmark. 16:19:02 <Kjetil> why ? 16:19:11 <Kjetil> (; 16:19:14 <__ln__> because this channel is english only. 16:19:49 <Kjetil> does it break your head ? 16:20:06 <jonty-comp> i think you are answering your "why can't everyone just be friends" question quite well there 16:20:28 <Kjetil> breaks* 16:20:32 <Kjetil> haha 16:20:32 <jonty-comp> because everyone does something that annoys someone else, no matter how hard they try :P 16:20:43 <frosch123> [16:29] <Kjetil> does it break your head ? <- if in doubt, the reverse smiley did for sure :p 16:21:02 *** Devroush2 [~dennis@62.205.79.20] has joined #openttd 16:23:23 <Kjetil> -breaks* I guess i broke my own head 16:25:53 *** KritiK [~Maxim@0001264a.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 16:27:43 *** Devroush [~dennis@dD5765BAC.access.telenet.be] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:28:28 *** Devroush [~dennis@dD5765BAC.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 16:29:02 *** fonsinchen [~fonsinche@dslb-092-078-248-048.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 16:29:06 *** Devroush2 [~dennis@62.205.79.20] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:29:39 *** M1zera [~Miranda@ip-78-102-228-126.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 16:36:35 *** perk11 [~perk11@broadband-46-242-13-101.nationalcablenetworks.ru] has joined #openttd 16:40:37 *** glx [glx@000128ec.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 16:40:40 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 16:41:40 *** Pixa [~pixa@85.210.73.68] has joined #openttd 16:44:00 <Generalcamo> OpenTTD uses Pre-Rendered sprites, right? 16:45:09 <__ln__> as opposed to what? 16:45:15 <Generalcamo> Graphics 16:45:31 <__ln__> uses sprites instead of graphics, hmm 16:46:21 <Generalcamo> I would love to model up a train and convert it to sprite form... 16:47:11 <__ln__> the sprites are drawn by hand, pixel by pixel. 16:47:49 <Generalcamo> What? That doesn't fit at all with this thread I am reading... 16:48:37 <frosch123> maybe ln is living 5 years in the past 16:48:44 <frosch123> well, maybe only 2 16:49:04 <__ln__> i am 16:49:15 <Generalcamo> Yeah, it's 3d models.. 16:49:22 <__ln__> but that's not as bad as OTTD living 15 years in the past. 16:49:42 <frosch123> i guess the reverse smiley hit you hard 16:49:45 <Generalcamo> And he is 15 years in the past: The original TTD used the same techinique (Only with 3d studio max) 16:50:02 <Generalcamo> From Chris Sawyer's blog.. 16:50:03 <__ln__> i'm not offended by reverse smilies 16:50:42 <Generalcamo> How do I create new shell maps though? 16:51:00 <Generalcamo> Because once I am done with this mod, the shellmap will be horribly broken.. 16:55:06 <__ln__> so TTD graphics were rendered with 3d studio max, without pixel-by-pixel manual intervetion? 16:55:30 <Generalcamo> They probably used some manual intervention to correct errors, but yes 16:57:43 <Alberth> different people use different techniques to derive unique collections of pixels 17:13:15 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p57BD466E.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 17:17:40 *** DabuYu [~jkuckartz@128.250.79.165] has quit [] 17:30:37 <DorpsGek> Commit by frosch :: r25040 trunk/src/vehicle_cmd.cpp (2013-02-24 16:40:32 UTC) 17:30:38 <DorpsGek> -Add: a mode to CmdRefitVehicle to preserve the current subtype, also when refitting multiple vehicles. 17:31:57 <DorpsGek> Commit by frosch :: r25041 /trunk/src (7 files in 2 dirs) (2013-02-24 16:41:51 UTC) 17:31:59 <DorpsGek> -Remove [FS#3764-ish]: ordered refit with subtypes, since the cases where it worked were corner cases rather than the general case. 17:32:36 <DorpsGek> Commit by frosch :: r25042 trunk/src/vehicle_gui.cpp (2013-02-24 16:42:30 UTC) 17:32:38 <DorpsGek> -Codechange/Fix: Simplify accumulation of refit options; also don't compare GRF local IDs from different GRFs. 17:33:30 <DorpsGek> Commit by frosch :: r25043 /trunk/src (core/smallvec_type.hpp vehicle_gui.cpp) (2013-02-24 16:43:24 UTC) 17:33:31 <DorpsGek> -Change [FS#3764]: Only display subtypes in the refit GUI which are available for all selected vehicles. Also add a generic list item to refit while keeping the subtypes of individual vehicles. 17:33:51 <DorpsGek> Commit by frosch :: r25044 trunk/src/vehicle_gui.cpp (2013-02-24 16:43:45 UTC) 17:33:52 <DorpsGek> -Change: Collapse subtypes in the refit GUI and only expand them after selecting the cargo type. 17:34:18 <frosch123> andythenorth: we should do some tram game in the next week or so 17:34:31 <frosch123> i need to know whether the new refit gui makes sense or is crap :p 17:34:43 <andythenorth> frosch123: I would like to play MP GS later 17:34:58 <andythenorth> if we start setting up a save now, we might be ready by 8pm? :) 17:35:22 <frosch123> ok, i can try that :p 17:35:50 *** wakou2 [~stephen@host109-145-49-167.range109-145.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 17:36:08 <wakou2> Hi guys 17:36:36 <wakou2> I have got to about 1990 and passenger/mail carriages are no longer available... 17:36:46 *** perk11 [~perk11@broadband-46-242-13-101.nationalcablenetworks.ru] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 17:36:56 <wakou2> Any ideas why? 17:37:07 <frosch123> your trainset is broken apparently :p 17:37:15 <Alberth> not upgraded to electric trains? 17:37:24 <frosch123> you can work around it by disabling vehicle retirement 17:38:59 <Alberth> http://wiki.openttd.org/Railway_Construction#Types_of_railways 17:39:28 <wakou2> I am in a sub-arctic game, thee are no electrics! (?) 17:39:45 <Alberth> oh, that's normal 17:39:57 <Alberth> at least for a default game 17:41:30 *** frogzilla [4d782755@ircip3.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 17:41:44 <frogzilla> Hello people 17:41:45 <Alberth> http://wiki.openttd.org/Train_Comparison no 'S' climate with 'electric' 17:41:51 <Alberth> @seen people 17:41:51 <DorpsGek> Alberth: I have not seen people. 17:41:57 <frogzilla> Is this the main OpenTTd chat? 17:42:07 <Alberth> yep 17:42:36 <frogzilla> I've figured out a new junction design. 17:42:46 <frogzilla> You can view it here: http://i.imgur.com/lsJ4vfd.jpg 17:43:20 <frogzilla> Now could you please tell me whether it's really new or it's just a repetition of a known design? 17:43:42 <Alberth> did you look at the wiki? 17:43:47 <TinoDidriksen> Looks familiar to ones on the wiki. 17:43:51 <Alberth> it has tons of these things 17:44:17 <frogzilla> Yes it does, but nevertheless I couldn't find an identical one on the wiki. 17:44:21 <Alberth> personally, I don't use any of them, as my land is never flat 17:44:40 <frogzilla> It never hurts to flatten the land a bit 17:44:50 <Alberth> it does! :) 17:45:20 <Alberth> you can post your design on the forum for comments, and/or add it to the wiki if you like 17:45:56 <frogzilla> Also, is it better to make a left-turn branch longer, like in the left quarter of the junction, or to make it shorter, like in the other three quarters? 17:46:08 <wakou2> Is that 'vehicles never expire setting? in advanced/trains? 17:46:18 <frogzilla> No 17:46:36 <frogzilla> That was just an ordinary game in Arctic climate 17:46:38 *** mseidl [~aaa@p5DCE6A46.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:46:56 <Alberth> wakou2: http://wiki.openttd.org/FAQ_gameplay#How_to_get_expired_vehicles_back.3F should explain the things afaik 17:46:58 <TinoDidriksen> I never saw the point of complex junctions - even very simple solutions will prevent deadlocks. 17:47:02 <frogzilla> In fact, this was year 1968 17:47:09 <wakou2> Alberth: 17:47:14 <wakou2> TY! 17:47:23 <frogzilla> Yes, but good junctions increase throughput 17:48:20 <Alberth> frogzilla: for this kind of questions, you should post it at the forums, there are lots of people obsessed with optimal design of junctions there :) 17:48:46 <frogzilla> Decent junctions, like this one, have no crossings. that way no train EVER blocks the path of a train going in another direction. 17:49:04 <frosch123> for that you forgot to add the priority lines :p 17:49:08 <frogzilla> I don't want to register on a forum just for a couple of questions 17:49:20 <V453000> frogzilla: see openttdcoop.org if you want to build effectively 17:49:22 <frogzilla> I cannot into priority lines. 17:49:42 <V453000> ? 17:49:43 <frogzilla> And the opennttdcoop designs are way too difficult for me. 17:49:55 <wakou2> Alberth: Git now, ty... Into the 2,000 with steam! 17:50:04 <wakou2> (got it) 17:50:13 <Alberth> frogzilla: ok, perhaps someone else can help you then 17:50:18 <Alberth> wakou2: :) 17:50:38 <frogzilla> At least someone else now knows about my design... 17:50:54 <frogzilla> Ok, goodbye now. 17:50:57 *** frogzilla [4d782755@ircip3.mibbit.com] has left #openttd [] 17:51:04 <V453000> :D 17:51:12 <Alberth> indeed :) 17:51:33 <Alberth> V453000: how long does NUTS have steam? 17:51:42 <V453000> what do you mean 17:52:01 <Alberth> wakou2 seems to be interested in running steam engines well into the 2,000 's :) 17:52:55 <V453000> vehicles never expire? 17:53:01 <V453000> ah right 17:53:11 <V453000> well the standard steamers are like until 1960 17:53:38 <V453000> but 1960 brings another steamer for monorail, and then there is a strong steamer in 2010, and an express steamer in like 2030 17:56:46 <Alberth> :o monorail already? 17:57:10 <Alberth> I am in 1972, didn't expect it that early :) 17:58:08 <Alberth> it seems I have some track converting to do :) 17:58:24 <Kjetil> If people kept using steamers they would't expire? 18:02:45 <Alberth> Of course, most vehicle sets are based on real life, so if we would only use steam as main form of propulsion today in the entire world, we would not have all these other trains. 18:07:16 *** ntoskrnl [~not@a91-153-231-146.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:13:24 *** tracerpt [4d565a37@ircip4.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 18:13:30 <tracerpt> morning all 18:13:31 <tracerpt> :) 18:18:09 *** Tvel [~Thunderbi@84.40.82.221] has joined #openttd 18:20:20 *** fonsinchen [~fonsinche@dslb-092-078-248-048.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:31:11 *** Tvel [~Thunderbi@84.40.82.221] has quit [Quit: Tvel] 18:41:03 *** tracerpt [4d565a37@ircip4.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 18:41:13 <andythenorth> frosch123: can we have a FIRS 0.9.3 game with temperate or tropic economy? 18:41:18 <andythenorth> I need to test those economies 18:42:28 <frosch123> i have 0.9.3, but used arctic 18:42:38 <frosch123> but i can also generate tropic 18:42:57 <andythenorth> :) 18:43:07 <andythenorth> arctic works, I'm happy with it, give or take some bugs I fixed 18:43:23 <andythenorth> the others are unknown 18:56:30 <peter1138> hmm, what defines an "ergonomic" keyboard these days? 18:56:42 <frosch123> the price? 18:58:29 *** andythenorth_ [~andytheno@2002:4d66:7022:0:c87c:711a:c367:8fe4] has joined #openttd 18:59:05 *** Jasperthecat1 [63304048@ircip1.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 19:01:47 *** chester_ [~chester@93-80-41-183.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd 19:04:01 <Jasperthecat1> Anybody here? 19:04:23 <frosch123> we are all driving on the highway 19:05:09 <Jasperthecat1> What? 19:05:19 <Jasperthecat1> Oh. 19:06:33 *** andythenorth_ [~andytheno@2002:4d66:7022:0:c87c:711a:c367:8fe4] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:08:16 <frosch123> do you by any chance speak tamil? 19:08:29 <frosch123> actually, reading is more interesting that speaking 19:09:48 <Jasperthecat1> I don't speak that language, I speak English. 19:09:58 <frosch123> how boring 19:10:00 *** andythenorth_ [~andytheno@31.100.83.183] has joined #openttd 19:10:03 <frosch123> everyone in this channel does that 19:11:32 <Jasperthecat1> I didn't see any features in the changelog of OpenTTD 1.3.0-RC1. 19:11:48 <frosch123> it only lists stuff since beta2 19:11:53 <Jasperthecat1> Oh. 19:12:11 <frosch123> check the wiki for a composed list of everything since 1.2.3 19:12:36 <Jasperthecat1> You said that there is some final features in that beta. 19:12:48 <Jasperthecat1> But, thank you. 19:12:55 <michi_cc> Jasperthecat1: Look again, my changelog has a fat "- Feature" at the top. 19:13:03 <frosch123> yup 19:13:09 <Jasperthecat1> Oh. 19:13:14 <frosch123> technically at line 3 though 19:13:51 <Jasperthecat1> I know, it's a new GFXCrawler feature. 19:15:34 <andythenorth_> Newgrf effect vehicles! 19:15:46 <Jasperthecat1> What vehicles? 19:16:02 <Jasperthecat1> Oh, you mean all of them? 19:16:57 <Jasperthecat1> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bWdQ_NGo6kY 19:17:03 <Jasperthecat1> What train is this? 19:17:12 <Jasperthecat1> Nvm. 19:17:22 <peter1138> would it be an SD90MAC? 19:17:24 <Jasperthecat1> SD90MAC's. 19:17:31 <frosch123> let me guess, it's written in the description? 19:17:40 <peter1138> yup 19:17:47 <peter1138> and the in-film title 19:17:48 <Jasperthecat1> I said never mind. 19:18:10 <frosch123> but i want to get the joke without clicking on the link 19:18:34 <Jasperthecat1> I already read the description. 19:19:26 <Jasperthecat1> I have a model railway. But I don't use it. 19:19:46 <frosch123> that's the normal purpose of a model railway 19:20:40 <Jasperthecat1> Parts of the video, the train sounds like an older truck engine. 19:21:48 <Jasperthecat1> Also, what is that marker that shows a number. 19:22:11 <Jasperthecat1> Right by the signals. 19:35:37 <DorpsGek> Commit by translators :: r25045 /trunk/src/lang (4 files) (2013-02-24 18:45:26 UTC) 19:35:38 <DorpsGek> -Update from WebTranslator v3.0: 19:35:39 <DorpsGek> catalan - 1 changes by bufalo1973 19:35:40 <DorpsGek> korean - 45 changes by telk5093 19:35:41 <DorpsGek> brazilian_portuguese - 7 changes by Tucalipe 19:35:42 <DorpsGek> russian - 1 changes by Lone_Wolf 19:35:43 <DorpsGek> gaelic - 86 changes by 19:35:57 *** Rhamphoryncus [~rhamph@d173-183-156-148.abhsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd 19:36:03 *** andythenorth_ [~andytheno@31.100.83.183] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:37:47 <frosch123> Alberth: http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=1067733#p1067733 <- i guess that's for you 19:38:13 <Alberth> quite possibly it is :) 19:38:26 *** andythenorth_ [~andytheno@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 19:38:47 <Alberth> not sure whether I am "any Dutch user" though, I don't even use the Dutch language in games :p 19:41:30 *** Ot [d5c0131a@ircip1.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 19:41:56 <Ot> hi please could u say me if OTTD runs on 7s by lan? 19:42:35 <Ot> we wanted to try it but we cant join the another one 19:44:43 <frosch123> 7s sounds like a cellphone or similar 19:45:00 <frosch123> in that case you should ask at the place where you got the binary from 19:46:33 *** andythenorth_ [~andytheno@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:46:41 *** Ott [d5c0131a@ircip2.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 19:46:46 <Ott> so? 19:46:55 <DorpsGek> Commit by frosch :: r25046 trunk/src/lang/korean.txt (2013-02-24 18:56:50 UTC) 19:46:56 <DorpsGek> -Fix: Korean genders. 19:47:04 <frosch123> [19:54] <frosch123> 7s sounds like a cellphone or similar 19:47:05 <frosch123> [19:55] <frosch123> in that case you should ask at the place where you got the binary from 19:48:23 *** Ot [d5c0131a@ircip1.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 19:50:57 *** mseidl [~aaa@p5DCE6A46.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 19:55:45 *** RavingManiac [~RavingMan@182.55.106.160] has joined #openttd 19:57:06 <Ott> thats lan or what do u think? 19:59:07 <Eddi|zuHause> he says that he doesn't know what 7s is. 20:02:41 <andythenorth> frosch123: what nightly version? o_O 20:03:30 <kormer> I'm trying to compile just the standard trunk using MinGW. Compile goes fine, but I keep getting errors when I run the binary. 20:03:31 <frosch123> todays 20:03:40 <frosch123> r25046 20:03:40 <kormer> crash report: http://pastebin.com/NfgzjVmt 20:04:49 <frosch123> that tells nothing except your version detection does not work 20:05:41 <kormer> anything else that might help narrow it down? 20:06:30 <Eddi|zuHause> http://bugs.openttd.org/task/4468 <-- the first google result for "Exception: E1212012" 20:07:32 <Eddi|zuHause> (likely not related at all) 20:08:07 <kormer> yea, I don't think that's it. 20:08:33 <kormer> This is my first time compiling myself, so I may have screwed something up, but I followed the wiki's instructions for the MinGW guide exactly. 20:08:40 <Alberth> start it from the debugger? 20:09:12 <frosch123> Alberth: Terkhen: planetmaker: anyone joining the nocargoal party? 20:09:21 <Alberth> did the configure output look sane 20:09:39 <Alberth> frosch123: there is one? if so, sure :) 20:10:01 <frosch123> i think andy wants to start in 40 minutes 20:10:13 <Eddi|zuHause> you mean the refitlist test game :) 20:11:42 <Eddi|zuHause> kormer: you could try recompiling with debug symbols "./configure --enable-debug=1", and then run it in the debugger "make run-gdb" 20:11:57 *** Jasperthecat1 [63304048@ircip1.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 20:12:21 <kormer> thanks eddi, I'll try that now, be back in 20minutes... 20:13:13 <Eddi|zuHause> you can also do "--enable-debug=3", that will also disable optimisations 20:14:20 <kormer> ok 20:15:41 <kormer> I shouldn't have to add any other outside files to the directory after a compile do I? 20:16:29 <Eddi|zuHause> no, that should all be handled automatically now 20:23:51 <Alberth> the data files of a baseset would be useful for playing a game :p 20:28:19 <andythenorth> "Strings Status" 20:28:23 <andythenorth> or "Status of Strings" 20:28:24 <andythenorth> ? 20:28:51 <Alberth> I'd prefer the latter 20:28:56 <andythenorth> me too 20:28:57 <Eddi|zuHause> me as well 20:28:58 <andythenorth> that's handy 20:29:08 <Eddi|zuHause> "we have a consensus" 20:39:06 * andythenorth gets the nightly 20:46:15 <oskari89> Andythenorth: Is brewery removed from FIRS trunk? O_o 20:46:22 <andythenorth> no 20:46:26 <oskari89> Since the string gone 20:46:36 <andythenorth> it needs updating ;) 20:46:40 <oskari89> Ok :) 20:49:25 *** RavingManiac_ [~RavingMan@182.55.106.160] has joined #openttd 20:50:35 <kormer> eddi: when I run it with the debugged I get "No available language packs (invalid versions?)" 20:51:15 *** Pensacola [~quassel@h220216.upc-h.chello.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:51:47 <Alberth> then you didn't build all projects 20:53:19 <kormer> Is that the make bundle command? 20:53:43 <Eddi|zuHause> kormer: then we need the output of your configure and make. something is wrong there but we cannot guess it... 20:54:28 <Alberth> normally just 'make' after ./configure is enough 20:55:38 *** RavingManiac [~RavingMan@182.55.106.160] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:57:36 <Eddi|zuHause> www.informatik.uni-halle.de/~krause/Bildschirmfoto21.png <-- what the hell is wrong here? 20:57:46 <andythenorth> 404? 20:57:59 <Eddi|zuHause> err... 20:58:41 <Eddi|zuHause> wth? 20:59:08 <Eddi|zuHause> that's something i can't fix 20:59:17 <kormer> config: http://pastebin.com/4TE1RtZ9 make: http://pastebin.com/ygGMYj1s 20:59:39 <kormer> nothing jumps out at me as obvious, but I don't compile often 21:02:00 <andythenorth> MP GS, #openttdcoop.nightly 21:02:43 <DorpsGek> Commit by rubidium :: r25047 trunk/src/lang/dutch.txt (2013-02-24 20:12:37 UTC) 21:02:44 <DorpsGek> -Fix [FS#5483]: Dutch language had a few bogus unicode characters 21:03:24 *** pjpe [b8af1d68@ircip1.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 21:03:32 *** pjpe [b8af1d68@ircip1.mibbit.com] has quit [] 21:06:49 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@s55978e11.adsl.online.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:08:31 <Eddi|zuHause> anyway: http://imagebin.org/index.php?mode=image&id=247991 21:12:10 *** goodger [~ben@host86-166-165-94.range86-166.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 21:13:57 *** RavingManiac_ [~RavingMan@182.55.106.160] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:15:09 *** Supercheese [~Password4@76.178.163.204] has joined #openttd 21:16:02 <Supercheese> Salvete, amici 21:17:53 <Eddi|zuHause> prosciutto 21:19:52 *** DDR [~chatzilla@d108-180-71-172.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd 21:20:26 <peter1138> heh, i don't see it :S 21:20:30 <peter1138> (r25047) 21:21:05 <Eddi|zuHause> peter1138: something like "zero-width space" 21:27:06 <Supercheese> Interesting, collapsed subtypes until cargo selected? 21:27:12 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@5070A0D5.static.ziggozakelijk.nl] has joined #openttd 21:29:32 <Supercheese> Neat 21:30:00 <Supercheese> Suggestion: Indent the subtype entries 21:30:07 <Supercheese> Make it clearer they're sub-entries 21:33:58 <Supercheese> anyway, very nice feature :) 21:34:24 <peter1138> god damn this keyboard is horrible 21:35:41 <Supercheese> You should get a Logitech G15 (classic version), otherwise known as the Best Keyboard Ever 21:37:22 <Rubidium> pff... those old IBM keyboards were probably even better ;) 21:38:21 <glx> Eddi|zuHause: E1212012 means ERROR, it's our custom stuff 21:39:04 <Eddi|zuHause> sorry, my 1337 skills are somewhat out of shape :p 21:39:16 <NGC3982> Evening. 21:39:22 <NGC3982> Or Afton. 21:40:35 <Eddi|zuHause> everybody should get a Das Keyboard 21:41:01 <peter1138> i want a split keyboard (like MS natural) but with a clicky feel 21:41:06 <peter1138> unpossible, apparently 21:41:47 *** Superuser [~superuser@host81-129-133-93.range81-129.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 21:42:27 <Eddi|zuHause> get a ms natural keyboard from 15 years ago? :p 21:42:32 <peter1138> guess i'll have to get a ms natural 4000 21:42:40 <peter1138> they're not clicky 21:42:40 <Superuser> don't 21:42:41 <peter1138> but 21:42:43 <Superuser> the spacebar is awful 21:42:46 <NGC3982> I might be off, but didn't Keytronic come in split models? 21:42:47 <Supercheese> it's a tra 21:42:50 <Supercheese> trap* even 21:42:52 <Superuser> the keyboard is great, but the spacebar is really stiff 21:42:59 <NGC3982> And Keytronic == "Clicky", afaik. 21:43:09 <peter1138> other people in my office had 4000s but they kept dying 21:43:19 <NGC3982> Horrible, horrible keyboards. 21:43:30 <Superuser> http://xahlee.info/kbd/ergonomic_keyboards.html -- enjoy 21:44:28 <Kjetil> keytronic is far from ibm clicky 21:44:40 *** Stimrol [~Stimrol@46-239-219-51.tal.is] has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in] 21:44:55 <peter1138> there are cherry mx blues about which are reasonable 21:45:07 <peter1138> but only straight 21:45:24 <peter1138> and of course the over-the-top maltrons 21:45:24 <NGC3982> I used to own a 4000, and my finger suffered from the plague, gangrene and AIDS at the same time. 21:45:38 <Superuser> this page by Xah Lee is my bible http://xahlee.info/kbd/keyboarding.html 21:45:43 <NGC3982> A keyboard that suprised me is the one that ships with the Acer Aspire Revo. 21:45:44 <Superuser> actually Xah Lee is my bible in general xD 21:45:55 <NGC3982> From such a cheap package, the keyboard is fantastic on the fingers. 21:46:34 <peter1138> hmm the 'truely ergonomic' actually exists? 21:46:44 <peter1138> last time i looked it was some kind of vapourware 21:46:51 *** mseidl [~aaa@p5DCE6A46.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:46:57 <NGC3982> http://xahlee.info/comp/i/proper_elbow_position_during_typing.png 21:46:58 <NGC3982> Harr. 21:47:13 <peter1138> o_O 21:47:15 <peter1138> sexist 21:47:15 <Superuser> haha 21:47:18 <NGC3982> http://images.techtree.com/ttimages/story/105218_bundle.jpg 21:47:19 <NGC3982> That one. 21:47:26 <Superuser> peter has no humour 21:47:29 <Superuser> like whatsoever 21:47:43 <peter1138> that looks aweful 21:47:50 <NGC3982> Yes, it does 21:47:51 <Superuser> yes 21:47:56 <Superuser> no numpad either 21:48:00 <Eddi|zuHause> i totally hate such "designer keyboards" 21:48:02 <peter1138> what are the headphones for? 21:48:03 <NGC3982> But as i said, it is (for some reason) a really good keyboard, key wise. 21:48:09 <Superuser> I mean if you're going to get a normal keyboard, you should at least have a numberpad 21:48:11 <peter1138> (they're too small to be speakers, surely...) 21:48:18 <peter1138> it's also flat 21:48:24 <NGC3982> That keyboard is used for the Aspire Revo, as a HTPC. 21:48:25 <Eddi|zuHause> no key is where it's supposed to be 21:48:27 <NGC3982> Hence, the small size. 21:48:48 <NGC3982> ..As a HTPC keyboard* 21:49:28 <Eddi|zuHause> i throw out such things immediately when i come into an office where i have to type things 21:50:10 <Eddi|zuHause> "can you fix <thing>?" -- "no, i can't type on this keyboard, get me a real one" 21:50:10 <NGC3982> Well, working with a HTPC keyboard is just asking for trouble. 21:50:17 <NGC3982> ;-) 21:50:17 <jonty-comp> i got a tiny wireless keyboard for my HTPC 21:50:34 <jonty-comp> it's really small, which is useful, but the keys are in awful places 21:51:03 <NGC3982> I have gotten used to laptop layouts 21:51:26 <NGC3982> Delete to the far right, for instance. 21:53:20 <glx> backspace is usullay too small too 21:54:44 <NGC3982> I like it. 21:54:54 <jonty-comp> I have gotten used to the small keyboard on my transformer 21:54:54 <NGC3982> Although, i'm no programmer. 21:55:00 <jonty-comp> since it is so bloody useful in every other way 21:55:19 <NGC3982> Also, of relevance: http://sphotos-g.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/59781_10200662880395360_543115805_n.jpg 21:55:23 <Eddi|zuHause> it's bad enough when you sit in front of a new keyboard and don't hit the right letters the first few times, that adjusts rather quickly, but then go searching where the home and end keys have moved to this time? 21:56:38 <NGC3982> I don't know why, but i very rarely use home and end. 21:56:59 *** RavingManiac [~RavingMan@182.55.106.160] has joined #openttd 21:57:02 <NGC3982> Oh, well. Whilst typing long things in Irssi, i guess i use them 21:57:14 <Eddi|zuHause> you don't notice how you rely on such keys, until they're not where they belong :p 21:57:20 <NGC3982> That is, every year or so that happends. 21:57:24 <NGC3982> Hehe. 21:57:54 <NGC3982> Actually, i recently noticed that i very rarely write stuff that exceeds the standard Putty width in Windows. 21:58:08 <Supercheese> Home and end are incredible useful 22:01:21 <Supercheese> incredibly* 22:01:30 *** chester_ [~chester@93-80-41-183.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:01:41 <Supercheese> I typo "ble"-bly way too often 22:01:49 <Supercheese> :S 22:02:39 <NGC3982> You don't have to worry about linguistic irregularity when i'm around. 22:02:54 <NGC3982> I kan tace kare off dat. 22:03:13 *** RavingManiac [~RavingMan@182.55.106.160] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:03:21 <Supercheese> The problem is the spellcheck doesn't mark them as incorrect 22:03:37 <NGC3982> What IRC software uses spellcheck? 22:03:40 <jonty-comp> i never realised how much I used pageup/down until I used a Mac 22:03:44 <Supercheese> ChatZilla 22:03:46 <Eddi|zuHause> it's a spellcheck not a grammarcheck 22:03:51 <NGC3982> CatZilla, apparently. 22:03:52 <jonty-comp> and pgup/pgdown don't fecking work in OS X terminal 22:03:56 <jonty-comp> unless you dick around with escape commands 22:03:58 <NGC3982> ..CatZilla. 22:04:00 <Eddi|zuHause> it's a valid word, so the spellcheck is correct 22:04:03 <Supercheese> Mrow 22:04:21 <NGC3982> Freud just turned in his grave. 22:04:21 <Eddi|zuHause> whether it's what you meant to write is out of scope :) 22:04:23 <__ln__> jonty-comp: yes they do 22:04:34 <NGC3982> jonty-comp: I hate that. 22:04:37 <NGC3982> __ln__: No? 22:04:43 <jonty-comp> don't on any of my OS X computers 22:04:56 <NGC3982> Unconfigured, Page Up/Down does nothing in a OSX terminal, afaik. 22:05:10 <jonty-comp> and i've used panther, leopard, snow leopard, lion & mountain lion 22:05:16 <jonty-comp> home/end don't work either iirc 22:05:23 <NGC3982> Sure, i guess escape+command is the more classic way of doing stuff like that, but i can't stand it. 22:05:30 <__ln__> try with a modifier, Option, Shift, fn. 22:05:41 <jonty-comp> option+left is home 22:05:44 <NGC3982> Does the normal Linux terminal commands go all the way back to Unix? 22:05:46 <jonty-comp> but then WHY DOES THIS KEYBOARD HAVE A HOME KEY 22:05:52 <jonty-comp> it's still an apple keyboard 22:05:56 <NGC3982> Alt+fX, and so on? 22:06:07 <Eddi|zuHause> everybody knows you should use shift-pgup/pgdown in terminals 22:06:18 <NGC3982> jonty-comp: I guess nobody really wants you to use a terminal in a newer OSX system. 22:06:28 <NGC3982> Eddi|zuHause: O'rly? 22:07:02 <__ln__> rly 22:07:12 <NGC3982> If your system bundled keyboard contains page up or down, i fail to see the reason for it. 22:07:27 <NGC3982> More than the fact that it might have been that way for a long time. 22:08:31 <__ln__> page up/down without modifiers does another thing, it scrolls up/down the terminal's backlog. 22:08:57 <NGC3982> I se. 22:09:04 <NGC3982> +e*. 22:09:34 <jonty-comp> which is what up/down are for 22:09:39 <Wolf01> 'night 22:09:44 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@0001288e.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 22:10:14 <__ln__> and that's what they do in OS X's terminal as well. 22:10:29 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@5070A0D5.static.ziggozakelijk.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:11:14 <NGC3982> But, i remember clearly that i couldn't get them to work with or without a modifier in OSX. 22:11:22 <NGC3982> I guess that goes down to SBS. 22:13:37 *** Bad_Brett [~bad@78-69-118-27-no42.tbcn.telia.com] has joined #openttd 22:16:08 *** joey8 [~JoeEvans@host81-155-58-4.range81-155.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 22:22:14 <peter1138> pom te pom 22:23:53 *** Generalcamo [~Generalca@h179.167.213.151.dynamic.ip.windstream.net] has quit [] 22:24:11 <peter1138> time to dismantle the old ms keyboard 22:24:21 <SpComb> what now 22:24:44 <peter1138> yes, right now 22:25:15 <SpComb> no comma there 22:25:19 <__ln__> i was going to say stephen elop wouldn't approve of that, but then i realized he's not the ceo of microsoft. 22:32:10 *** Tvel [~Thunderbi@84.40.82.221] has joined #openttd 22:34:45 <kormer> alright, I'm giving up on trying to compile under MinGW. I followed the directions in the wiki exactly twice now, and still no luck with it. 22:36:24 <Superuser> You can always try VS if you're uncomfortable with GCC/MinGW... though no guarantee that will work 22:36:29 <peter1138> FS2~2~2~2~2~2~2~2~2~2~ 22:36:45 <peter1138> BB 22:36:51 <Superuser> wat 22:36:58 <SpComb> new keyboard 22:37:44 <__ln__> seems to be working great 22:37:54 <SpComb> yes 22:37:59 <kormer> I'm trying VS 2010 now 22:38:22 <kormer> I couldn't find 2008 for download direct from MS, and the secondary google results looked shady 22:40:48 <Superuser> The Pirate Bay is banned in your country too eh? :( 22:40:51 <Superuser> Those bastards 22:42:45 <Eddi|zuHause> the coherency of peter1138's lines is shady usually, but these last two lines are beyond any measurement boundaries :p 22:42:54 <Supercheese> I compile with VC++ 2008 Express 22:42:58 <Supercheese> works great 22:43:37 <Superuser> I said no guarantees because OTTD is normally compiled with MinGW 22:44:27 <peter1138> ACVNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNVND 22:44:35 <peter1138> nah, i give up 22:45:03 <kormer> I didn't really have any issues with MinGW, but I'm not experienced enough to know why the darned thing wouldn't work. 22:46:34 <Superuser> I dunno about MinGW but I've always found g++ pretty easy in Linux 22:47:01 <Eddi|zuHause> kormer: really, if you don't tell us what exactly you do and what you get in return, we can't help you 22:47:04 <Alberth> Linux is actually an order of magnitude easier for compiling 22:47:36 <kormer> I followed these instructions to the letter: http://wiki.openttd.org/Compiling_on_MinGW 22:48:14 <kormer> The error I got when debugging was about missing/wrong version lang files, which weren't present in the bundle or bin directories. 22:48:58 <kormer> I found some related threads in the forums, but no actual solutions, also copying the lang files from the download of the same version I was attempting to compile didn't work either. 22:49:22 <kormer> "no available language packs" was the actual error 22:49:24 <Alberth> kormer: quite likely you are doing something different that you don't even see 22:49:38 <Eddi|zuHause> kormer: i already told you what i want to see 22:49:49 <Eddi|zuHause> kormer: the whole output of configure and make 22:50:09 <kormer> sorry, I posted those like two hours ago, I'll dig them up again 22:50:18 <kormer> config: http://pastebin.com/4TE1RtZ9 make: http://pastebin.com/ygGMYj1s 22:50:34 <Eddi|zuHause> ah, i guess i missed them 22:51:20 <peter1138> that isn't the *output* of make 22:51:42 <frosch123> night 22:51:45 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-4d009385.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:52:58 <kormer> is the output going to be in a file or do I need to pipe my console output someplace? 22:53:07 <andythenorth> bye 22:53:08 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has left #openttd [] 22:53:25 <peter1138> it's the stuff you see when you run make 22:53:27 <Alberth> you need to redirect the output 22:56:42 <kormer> ok got it, I'll re-run that and see what happens if VS doesn't work out 22:57:06 *** joey8 [~JoeEvans@host81-155-58-4.range81-155.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:00:34 <Supercheese> makefiles are weird 23:00:59 <SpComb> we wouldn't be very far without them 23:03:22 *** Alberth [~hat3@a82-95-164-127.adsl.xs4all.nl] has left #openttd [] 23:08:10 <jonty-comp> pfft, it's not linux-from-scratch unless you've compiled your kernel with just gcc 23:08:53 <SpComb> humanity would still be stuck copy-pasting gcc command lines endlessly 23:10:14 <jonty-comp> in related news, it turns out i had to fix my nvidia driver on my brand-new ubuntu install by installing linux-headers and running depmod 23:10:37 <jonty-comp> i'm not quite sure why ubuntu didn't do that anyway, since it was the first thing i did after install + update 23:11:01 <jonty-comp> now i just have to make this stupid old card's automatic fan control work, since there is no rivatuner for linux 23:11:04 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@i59F6B6C9.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 23:16:38 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 [~Flex@i59F6CA48.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:17:37 <jonty-comp> screen -Dr 23:18:27 <Eddi|zuHause> you said that before 23:27:09 *** Elukka [Elukka@a91-152-213-89.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [] 23:27:20 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1A7D0.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:39:11 <kormer> When compiling under VS, do I need to extract all the tars insude the essential zip, or is just unzipping the essentials to a directory enough? 23:42:47 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@5070A0D5.static.ziggozakelijk.nl] has joined #openttd 23:43:03 *** oskari89 [oskari89@62-241-226-106.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [] 23:45:52 <kormer> and I just realized I downloaded the source file when I really wanted the headers/libraries 23:50:25 *** Pixa [~pixa@85.210.73.68] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:50:57 <jonty-comp> god dammit 23:51:04 <jonty-comp> why do i keep forgetting to fix that 23:51:07 <jonty-comp> i shall fix it now! 23:57:53 *** LordAro [~LordAro@host217-43-119-76.range217-43.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]