Log for #openttd on 28th August 2015:
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00:04:29  *** OneArmJoe [] has joined #openttd
00:04:42  <OneArmJoe> Hello all
00:05:49  <OneArmJoe> Hello? I have question
00:07:19  <OneArmJoe> Awww...
00:07:53  <OneArmJoe> Shall keep checking forum then; really enjoying game!
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06:09:03  <Supercheese> multiplayer is fun, but Reddit #2 uses too many train grfs
06:09:15  <Supercheese> and they have vehicles never expire, so the list is enormous
06:11:20  <Supercheese> at least they have daylength, so when I go afk it's still the same century when I come back
06:12:54  <Supercheese> but dang... I start building my network, turn around to check the time and five hours have passed
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06:43:48  <Alberth> yep, it's one of the open problems, openttd eats time :)
06:44:29  <Alberth> sp has the advantage you can just save, and do a little more the next day
06:52:59  <Supercheese> Indeed
06:53:29  <Supercheese> but I rarely, if ever, leave my singleplayer game running overnight, and risk a catastrophic traffic jam or whatnot while I'm unable to fix it
06:54:05  <Supercheese> it's a bit exiting to have that risk hanging over you; "Will my network withstand 12 hours of running without something breaking?"
06:56:42  <Supercheese> it's also very fun to send Farm/Eng supplies to every single producing industry on the network
06:57:45  <Supercheese> requires a station route to every industry, rather than just ctrl+joining a bunch of tiles together to create one megastation
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07:43:46  <planetmaker> o/
07:52:33  <Alberth> moin
07:53:36  <Alberth> I build a loop along the industries when delivering supplies
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07:54:52  <Wolf01> hi o/
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08:00:58  <Wolf01> hello Celestar
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08:13:06  <Alberth> hi hi
08:14:10  <Alberth> planetmaker: hehe, I was so tempted to reply: "With your notion of 'not using a GS', I believe that immediately"  :p
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08:34:13  <Flygon> Supercheese: It'd be kinda fun to have some sort of infinitely horizontally scrolling (like Civ II) OpenTTD map... with MP
08:34:15  <Flygon> That's a giant size
08:34:28  <Flygon> Basically: Start an Earth MP map with real world GRFs
08:34:43  <Supercheese> I dunno, huge maps are just too sparsely populated
08:34:44  <Flygon> Issue is that the giant size would cause desyncs, and you'd hit issues with OTTD's other engine limitations :U
08:35:00  <Supercheese> I mean you can have ten guys all building huge networks... each in their own corner of the map, never seeing each other
08:35:26  <Supercheese> so the MP becomes SP with no pause button
08:41:24  <Alberth> indeed
08:41:42  <planetmaker> hehe, Alberth, yeah, thought along those lines, too (re using GS)
08:42:06  <Alberth> you can fill about 512x512 on your own, so 2048x2048 gives you 16 players doing that
08:42:12  <planetmaker> it was to me once again a lesson: ask for a savegame showing the problem right upfront
08:42:37  <Alberth> don't even bother about 4096x4096 it's just a sea of nothing
08:43:34  <Alberth> planetmaker: yeah, but it was so obvious a user problem, I mean all options work but one, and he's the only one having it
08:43:51  <Alberth> oh sure, it's a bug to report :p
08:44:07  <planetmaker> yes, true. But still no point in guess work w/o savegame :)
08:44:38  <Alberth> indeed, that's why I stopped after 'do you have a GS'
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08:47:30  <Wolf01> we need to think again about the game features... the reality is a lot more weird than ottd
08:47:40  <Supercheese> Boy, one disruption to your supplies, and your entire feedback loop crashes
08:47:44  <Supercheese> eesh
08:48:01  <planetmaker> you need overflow loops :)
08:48:07  <planetmaker> err s/loops/depots/
08:48:14  <Supercheese> not traffic
08:48:17  <Supercheese> I mean production
08:48:23  <planetmaker> ah, yeah
08:48:30  <Supercheese> Ore -> Metal -> Supplies -> More ore
08:48:38  <planetmaker> it's even realistic ;)
08:48:42  <Supercheese> one link breaks, suddenly production volume plummets
08:48:49  <Supercheese> I kno rite
08:48:58  <planetmaker> I kno yu kno :P
08:49:08  <Supercheese> but hey that's what makes it fun
08:49:17  <planetmaker> :) And that's what counts
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09:01:41  <Alberth> Wolf01: nah, that's a bug in reality
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09:31:02  <Supercheese> Man, it's amazing what 1 ton a month of Manufacturing Supplies will do to productivity
09:31:49  <Alberth> ha :)
09:53:51  <Supercheese> Wellp, time to leave my network overnight
09:54:03  <Supercheese> hopefully it survives until morning
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14:37:30  <meslinjf> Can anyone help me compile a source document for OpenTTD? I've received the following error messages after entering the make command :\
14:38:40  <meslinjf> F:\OpenTTD\ogfx-rv>make
14:41:39  <Alberth> please use a pastebin
14:42:16  <Alberth> ie paste in, and copy the link into the channel
14:42:37  <Alberth> @paste
14:42:54  <Alberth> hmm, Dorpsgek needs an extension :)
14:52:37  <Alberth> meslinjf:   <-- about  that I guess?
14:53:47  <meslinjf> Thanks. I've posted my error message on the thread.
14:55:55  <Alberth> I wonder how to debug that
14:56:04  <Alberth> does "make -n" say anything?
14:56:26  <Alberth> (it should dump the commands it would do if you type 'make')
14:58:13  <Alberth> ha, nice it totally freaks out here :)
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15:02:42  <meslinjf> make -n did quite a lot of things.
15:02:57  <Alberth> nah, it just prints stuff
15:03:13  <Alberth> lots of gimp things probably?
15:03:31  <Alberth> I wonder about the first part
15:03:33  <meslinjf> In that set, yes.
15:03:59  <Alberth> there is a cc command near the top, which fails
15:05:33  <Alberth> but what I don't get is that "cc.exe:  cc ...."   sort of implies that cc.exe prints it cannot find itself :p
15:05:52  <Alberth> ok,  what  does  cc --version   do?
15:05:59  <Alberth> you get a version number?
15:06:27  <meslinjf> Oh. It might be that all the openttd and coding related programs are on a flash drive. It probably can't find cc since it's on drive C
15:06:58  <meslinjf> oh. It still gives me the version, even if i'm on drive F:
15:07:22  <meslinjf> gcc is version 4.8.1
15:07:28  <Alberth> the setup guide speaks about 'Adding all programs to the PATH variable'  so that should work, wouldn't it?
15:08:07  <Alberth> cc -D REPO_REVISION=5718 -D NEWGRF_VERSION=5718  -C -E -nostdinc -x c-header -o ogfx-rv.nml ogfx-rv.pnml
15:08:22  <Alberth> My make -n says ^
15:08:51  <Alberth> what happens if run that manually?
15:09:28  <Alberth> it should produce a ogfx-rv.nml  file, by the looks of it
15:10:04  <Alberth> planetmaker:   got your ears on?  maybe you can have a look too?
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15:52:59  <meslinjf> I've looked around, still can't find the reason the origin of cc: No such files or directory
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15:56:55  <__ln__> (sfw)
15:58:45  <Alberth> it comes from the cc command?
15:59:52  <Alberth> I just need to watch part-time, eh?
16:03:25  <meslinjf> eh, sorry. I'm doing many things at once. So don't bother looking at your screen every second. I just started trying to figure out compiling today.
16:04:06  <meslinjf> What do you mean by if it comes from cc command? To make this clear, I'm on windows 7, using the cmd
16:05:38  <meslinjf> So far, every source I've tried compiling ended up giving me the same cc.exe: error: cc: No such files or directory
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16:11:37  <Alberth> yeah
16:12:07  <Alberth> to figure where it goes wrong, you need to skip 'make', and execute its commands directly
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16:12:36  <Alberth> one option is  the 'cc' command that make -n produces
16:12:53  <Alberth> so if you run that, do you get an error?
16:14:31  <meslinjf> So I look into the text make -n produced to find anything related to cc?
16:15:11  <Alberth> you type "make", you get a weird cc error
16:15:29  <Alberth> with "make -n" you can see what it is supposed to be doing
16:15:45  <Alberth> so yeah, I'd hope there is a cc in there
16:16:17  <Alberth> in addition, you can try to run that command yourself, to verify its crash
16:16:26  <Alberth> or error, rather
16:16:37  <Alberth> maybe it gives more information or so
16:20:16  <meslinjf> Ok. Here is what I found among all the text that make -n gave me. It's quite similar from what you posted earlier:
16:20:17  <meslinjf> MinGW/bin/cc.exe cc -D REPO_REVISION=0 -D NEWGRF_VERSION=0  -C -E -nostdinc -x c-header -ogfx-rv.nml ogfx-rv.pnml
16:21:26  <meslinjf> cc.exe is located in the bin folder, as it should
16:21:39  <Alberth> wow, with a "cc" as first argument?
16:22:32  <Eddi|zuHause> possibly someone messed up the cflags?
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16:25:43  <Alberth> CC             ?= $(shell which gcc 2>/dev/null)      <---   meslinjf   what does   "which gcc" say?
16:27:00  <meslinjf> I should also find that line in the make -n?
16:27:19  <Alberth> probably not
16:27:28  <Alberth> just type it at the command line
16:28:09  <Alberth> $(shell ....)  gets run while doing text/macro expansion
16:29:43  <meslinjf> If I write this in command line, I get: The system cannot find the path specified
16:31:57  <glx> no gcc ?
16:32:29  <Alberth> glx:
16:33:42  <meslinjf> I've tested the path registries by running these and everything worked: nmlc --version hg python exit() gcc --version bash exit
16:34:33  <glx> oh I see, which is an msys command
16:41:48  <Eddi|zuHause> meslinjf: if you're not interested in a proper solution but only a dirty workaround, replace $(CC) with cc
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16:43:24  <meslinjf> I can change it in the makefile document?
16:43:43  <Eddi|zuHause> yes, in the line that Alberth quoted
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16:45:09  <andythenorth> o/
16:48:19  <meslinjf> It's working. I'll let it compile, test it and come back to you.
16:49:29  <andythenorth> compile cat
16:49:52  <andythenorth> probably cats are self-compiling
16:50:48  <Eddi|zuHause> in japan they have cats running train stations
16:57:00  <Alberth> other cats are just lazy, sleeping in chairs
16:58:19  <andythenorth> Alberth: hi hi
16:58:25  <andythenorth> any comments on new FIRS?
16:58:30  <andythenorth> other than the tickets
16:58:46  <Alberth> +1
16:59:13  <andythenorth> hopefully I’ve removed a lot of the minor irritations
17:00:02  <Alberth> it all seemed to work nicely, as far as I can see
17:00:33  <andythenorth> thanks
17:00:48  <Alberth> new smaller industries like the clay/sand quarry look much better
17:01:10  <andythenorth> agreed
17:01:16  <Alberth> more similar to a 'normal' sized industry
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17:14:44  <Terkhen> hello
17:21:10  <Alberth> hello
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17:24:36  <Alberth> quak
17:25:39  <frosch123> moin
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17:52:53  <snorre_> My servers is showing up on the serverlist quite sporadically. What coud be the reason?
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21:37:35  <snorre_> I don't get the "advertising to the master server is failing" message. Still my servers dissapear from the list (and reappears after some time).
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22:13:20  <Wolf01> 'night
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22:49:08  <drac_boy> something I kinda still recall before if I remember right - wasn't there another openttd channel with in-game chat bot?
22:50:40  <Eddi|zuHause> that sentence doesn't make a lot of sense.
22:51:17  <Eddi|zuHause> anyway, there are proably several channels that are related to specific servers
22:51:35  <Eddi|zuHause> none of those are "official" openttd channels
23:17:51  <drac_boy> ah heh I see...I still remember coop now :->
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