Log for #openttd on 3rd October 2015:
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01:05:44  <Wolf01> 'nn
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04:33:34  <Eddi|zuHause> berndj: yes, once you set up the timetable, ctrl+click on the "start date" button to spread them out
04:34:06  <Eddi|zuHause> make sure there is enough waiting time to cancel out delays, and that the vehicles can overtake at the loading station
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06:46:20  <andythenorth> o/
06:58:18  <Alberth> moin
07:01:24  <Alberth> andythenorth:  you may want to add r27279 is still after branching 1.5.2 ?
07:01:38  <Alberth> or 1.5.0, for that matter
07:01:43  <andythenorth> urgh, yes
07:02:20  <andythenorth>*435/nba_a_netsfanbag_600.jpg
07:03:40  <Alberth> don't worry, I get numbers wrong all the time :)
07:04:25  <Alberth> git numbers are so terrible, I only copy/paste, so I make less errors there :p
07:05:11  <Rubidium> moin
07:05:16  <Alberth> moin Rb
07:07:46  <Rubidium> do you mean the short hashes or the long ones?
07:08:24  <Rubidium> but yeah, they are very suspect to typos
07:10:33  * andythenorth always c-p with hashes
07:10:52  <andythenorth> but rVWXYZ is too tempting to type :P
07:11:50  <andythenorth> this is going to keep recurring
07:12:07  <andythenorth> every page of the forum thread, I’m going to have to again clarify it’s not r24998
07:12:15  <andythenorth> because I can’t edit the original release post
07:12:56  <Eddi|zuHause> ask a mod?
07:13:21  <Eddi|zuHause> (via the ! button)
07:13:27  <andythenorth> I tried that earlier
07:13:33  <andythenorth> but there is no option for “I made a mistake"
07:13:39  <andythenorth> only “report warez” and such
07:13:48  <Eddi|zuHause> there's an "other" category
07:14:07  <andythenorth> who is mod on that forum
07:14:11  <andythenorth> how does forums work :P
07:14:35  <andythenorth> @seen pikka
07:14:35  <DorpsGek> andythenorth: pikka was last seen in #openttd 3 days, 20 hours, 50 minutes, and 19 seconds ago: <Pikka> hmm... hopefully
07:15:16  <Eddi|zuHause> you generally get worse results if you try to reach a specific mod
07:15:40  <Eddi|zuHause> anyway. gtg
07:16:54  <Alberth> people post random stuff, and other people react by writing other random stuff?
07:17:38  <andythenorth> sounds about right
07:17:46  <Alberth> but yeah, use "other", and explain in the post area what you want and why, that should work
07:17:49  <andythenorth> yeah, done :)
07:17:54  * andythenorth should fix BB
07:17:58  <andythenorth> after breakfast
07:18:07  <Alberth> good oder :)
07:18:23  <Alberth> *order
07:18:36  * andythenorth wonders how the story book works
07:19:17  <Alberth> never used it, but afaik it's a collection of pages, you can make new pages, and add text etc
07:19:17  <andythenorth> "Instead of removing the goal, you can mark it as complete and the Story Book will show that the goal is completed."
07:19:27  <Alberth> and delete / change pages too
07:19:28  <andythenorth> I would like to show won goals
07:19:34  <andythenorth> maybe that’s built in
07:19:41  <andythenorth>
07:20:25  <Alberth> probably for linking to a goal from the page?
07:20:46  <Alberth> also, we delete the goal after being finished
07:20:51  <andythenorth> yes
07:21:02  <andythenorth> maybe we should do it differently?
07:21:14  <andythenorth> maybe this ‘won_goals’ structure I’ve patched is daft
07:21:32  <andythenorth> oh, but we don’t want them to stick around in the current goals list
07:21:38  <Alberth> in new context, anything you made is daft
07:22:12  <Alberth> no, I'd like a nice short list of things to do
07:22:53  <Alberth> but you can make story pages with things that you did
07:23:40  <Alberth> What could be done, but it kind-of belongs in BR, is to measure time you needed to achieve the goal
07:25:01  <andythenorth> yeah
07:25:09  <andythenorth> I don’t want to care about that in BB :)
07:25:22  <andythenorth> but BB seems like a nice platform for forks
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07:34:48  * andythenorth wants a goal debug window
07:34:53  <andythenorth> where I can mark them as done :P
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07:40:14  <Alberth> not sure if that's possible, is there a "user clicked/selected something" event?
07:40:25  <Alberth> then you can react by asking a question
07:40:47  <planetmaker> Alberth, yes, such should exist; it's used iirc in the tutorialGS
07:40:50  <planetmaker> good morning also
07:40:54  <Alberth> alternatively, use the widely employed cheat of making a sign "goal done" :p
07:41:01  <Alberth> moin pm
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07:47:36  <andythenorth> hmm
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07:47:45  <andythenorth> some goals, the source is just too far away
07:47:53  <andythenorth> that’s the downside of my won_goals approach :P
07:48:12  <andythenorth> goals were being repeated because they were the only ones meeting distance rules
07:48:30  <andythenorth> also 128x1024 map
07:48:31  <andythenorth> :P
07:49:04  <Alberth> add stricter rules for accepting a goal?
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07:50:55  <Alberth> you can also keep records about cargoes, and prefer cargoes with more available options
07:51:06  <Alberth> however, that pushes you to pax :p
07:54:44  <andythenorth> yeah
07:54:46  <andythenorth> I think it’s fine
07:54:52  <andythenorth> I just have to accept ignoring some goals
07:55:08  <andythenorth> I’m not going 256 tiles for 37 crates of wool
07:55:20  <andythenorth> map shows absolutely no logic
07:55:23  <andythenorth> it’s great
07:55:42  <Alberth> ha :)  I was ignoring all supplies in my last game :)
07:56:22  <andythenorth> planes :P
07:56:25  <Hiddenfunstuff> hey you people! are messing with timetables worth it at all?
07:56:28  * andythenorth doesn’t have planes yet
07:56:56  <andythenorth> don’t use timetables, except for making pax vehicles wait a few days at stations where full-load would take too long
07:57:44  <Hiddenfunstuff> since theres no real "wait for X vehicle to pass" or something like that they're quite useless?
07:57:52  <andythenorth> some people find them essential
07:58:06  * andythenorth is a bad guide to timetables
07:58:15  <andythenorth> I’m too stupid to understand them
07:58:17  <Alberth> some people make elaborate time schedules for all trains
07:58:31  <Hiddenfunstuff> Good.. we never found use for them either in what? 7 years of playing the game
07:58:38  <Alberth> nice map andy, lots of ships? doesn't look like you have
07:58:59  <andythenorth> I don’t see the purpose of timetables
07:59:13  <Alberth> Hiddenfunstuff: different playing styles, different ideas of what you need ?
07:59:22  <Alberth> I have yet to find a use for groups :)
07:59:22  <andythenorth> I don’t understand how having thousands of ‘vehicle is running late’ messages is interesting or fun
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07:59:45  <planetmaker> OpenTTD supports varying playing styles. Not every playing style needs everything which is possible
07:59:46  <andythenorth> timetables can’t actually do anything to affect vehicle behavious
07:59:51  <Hiddenfunstuff> only thing the vehicle grouping helps at when switching from 1 to another railtype
08:00:11  <andythenorth> the ‘wait at stations’ is useful, but they don’t do anything else
08:00:21  <Hiddenfunstuff> there was one game which had features on the timetable like "wait for X amount time", "wait for train X to pass" etc which was useful
08:00:24  <andythenorth> except cause you to waste a lot of time scheduling, and then getting a lot of news messages
08:00:45  <andythenorth> it’s yak-shaving for people who like real trains
08:01:03  <Hiddenfunstuff> "Train 582 is lost"
08:01:05  <andythenorth> Alberth: groups are just for replacing :P
08:01:11  <andythenorth> they have zero other use
08:01:41  <andythenorth> sometimes you start with a 1000hp engine, and then you only want to replace 50% of them when the 2000hp engine is introduced
08:01:51  <andythenorth> otherwise they’re more yak-shaving for foamers
08:02:13  <Alberth> euhm, why not do the other 50% too?
08:02:19  <andythenorth> fortunately openttd is a flexible game, supporting many more styles than just andythenorths
08:02:22  <andythenorth> :P
08:02:42  <andythenorth> sometimes the small engine is fine for small trains
08:02:45  <andythenorth> why upgrade? o_O
08:03:00  <Alberth> Hiddenfunstuff: lost trains usually means your tracks are not complete somewhere
08:03:12  <Alberth> less hassle with groups?  :p
08:03:19  <andythenorth> fair
08:03:25  <andythenorth> Hiddenfunstuff: try timetables?
08:03:26  <andythenorth> :P
08:03:43  <Hiddenfunstuff> Been there, done that.. It didnt really feel important or useful
08:03:55  <andythenorth> eh BB changes my usual freight playing style a lot
08:04:21  <andythenorth> usually I have many mines, farms etc -> small number of of processors
08:04:30  <andythenorth> so that there is a lot of output at a single steel mill or such
08:04:38  <andythenorth> BB has cargo going to all the processors
08:04:44  <andythenorth> sometimes one mine is going to multiple destinations
08:05:08  <Hiddenfunstuff> usually the game ends when i r un out of certain industries like iron and coal or oil
08:05:27  * andythenorth wonders
08:05:44  <andythenorth> if BB can’t find any valid industry goals, maybe it should start constructing industries?
08:05:46  <andythenorth> o_O
08:05:55  <andythenorth> maybe it should construct industries anyway
08:06:03  <Hiddenfunstuff> who knows
08:06:16  <andythenorth> nobody yet
08:06:23  <andythenorth> have to code it, test it :P
08:06:44  <Alberth> /me likes that thought :)
08:06:52  * Hiddenfunstuff has no idea whats going on
08:07:12  <Alberth> andy is hacking Busy Bee
08:07:17  <Hiddenfunstuff> and that is?
08:07:33  <Alberth> a game script providing cargo goals to fulfil
08:07:46  <andythenorth> I am not hacking it right now much, my game is fun, and I’m scared of breaking it :P
08:07:48  <Hiddenfunstuff> Oh right.. think got it installed and played one game.. Didnt impress much
08:07:59  <Hiddenfunstuff> it had potential.. but it wasent totally captured
08:08:11  <andythenorth> what was the potential? o_O
08:08:15  <andythenorth> and what lacked? o_O
08:08:44  <Hiddenfunstuff> To keep the game and player not from dying to exhaustion due to lack of new industries?
08:08:46  <Alberth>
08:09:24  <Hiddenfunstuff> and when you have already turned the whole map into ocean and have huge straight lines of rails going around the place.. it tends to get boring
08:09:34  <Hiddenfunstuff> to a point where you start to flush out the cities with water
08:09:54  <Alberth> we usually quit playing after a 50-100 years :)
08:10:17  <Hiddenfunstuff> my games stretch some 2000 years
08:10:34  <Alberth> straight lines are way too boring
08:10:58  <Alberth> I had a lot of fun again when I stopped terraforming the map for my tracks
08:11:38  <Alberth> and instead built the tracks on the landscape, and use eg height differences for bridges etc
08:12:31  <andythenorth> +1
08:12:42  <andythenorth> it’s why tropic map gen is sooooo boring
08:13:34  <andythenorth> the map I’m playing has a single small mountain of 6 height levels
08:13:40  <andythenorth> the rest of it is ~flat
08:14:25  <andythenorth> terrain type ‘alpinish'
08:14:33  <andythenorth> yeah, if the alps are in Holland :P
08:15:20  <Hiddenfunstuff> max height levels: 600
08:15:50  <Alberth> number of height levels is irrelevant
08:16:15  <Alberth> it doesn't matter if your trains is at level 50 or 500, it behaves the same
08:16:18  <andythenorth> the ‘problem’ is that in addition to terragenesis, and all the player setttings there
08:16:26  <andythenorth> tropic also has its own rules
08:16:32  <andythenorth> so the player settings are somewhat moot
08:16:36  <andythenorth> which is always nice
08:24:32  <andythenorth> bah
08:24:36  <andythenorth> town of 70 pax
08:24:41  <andythenorth> pax per month: 0
08:24:45  <andythenorth> mail per month: 0
08:24:47  <andythenorth> :(
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08:30:51  <Wolf01> hi hi
08:31:56  <andythenorth> o/
08:33:30  <andythenorth> biab
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14:03:55  <andythenorth> o/
14:12:50  * andythenorth buys a competitor
14:12:53  <andythenorth> such tycoon
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14:46:02  * andythenorth hates shrinking towns
14:46:03  <andythenorth> tedious
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16:02:16  <Demosthenex> so, any "fast" way to fix a timetable? i can't seem to find any shortcuts, and autofill isn't what i mean ;]
16:08:30  <Demosthenex> talk about tedious, the "add some slack to each timetable entry" drives me nuts.
16:08:34  <Demosthenex>
16:09:09  <Demosthenex> it'd be nice to have an option, like "add X% extra time to autofilled timetables", and "default stay duration for timetables"
16:09:30  <Demosthenex> then i'd only have to do data entry (without any hotkeys, grunt and click) on the exceptions.
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16:20:44  <Eddi|zuHause> try one of the timetable improvement patches
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16:42:28  <Demosthenex> Eddi|zuHause: a newgrf, or a real patch where i have to recompile?
16:42:40  <Eddi|zuHause> a "real" patch
16:44:11  <Demosthenex> ah.
16:44:39  <Demosthenex> if i could doubleclick, or apply a % extension to timetables by defualt, or specify a default stay length, those are things i would patch for.
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16:59:58  <Eddi|zuHause> i could imagine someone did that... but i don't actually know.
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19:46:57  <andythenorth> is super cat
19:54:10  <andythenorth> @seen danmack
19:54:10  <DorpsGek> andythenorth: danmack was last seen in #openttd 1 week, 3 days, 5 hours, 21 minutes, and 44 seconds ago: <DanMacK> Hey all
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20:55:25  <ThreeNoses> hello, I reported FS#6376 so if you need any feedback just ping me
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21:15:47  <peter1138> Probably just need to remove the NewGRFs.
21:16:03  <peter1138> Or rather, not use them.
21:17:58  <peter1138> ^ ThreeNoses
21:20:00  <Sylf> that old wagons with new cargos, and use-able default aircraft, are pointless without industry newgrf loaded in the game
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21:21:53  <DanMacK> @seen andythenorth
21:21:53  <DorpsGek> DanMacK: andythenorth was last seen in #openttd 1 hour, 27 minutes, and 43 seconds ago: <andythenorth> @seen danmack
21:22:09  <DanMacK> great minds think alike... lol
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22:05:49  <ThreeNoses> hey Sylf: which industry newgrf in particular?
22:06:15  <ThreeNoses> peter1138: would his suggestion help? or am I better disabling them after all?
22:06:49  <ThreeNoses> the game didn't allow me to refit those mail wagons
22:14:15  <Sylf> any
22:14:30  <Sylf> anything that introduce new cargo
22:15:12  <Sylf> everything from opengfx+ industries to TaI industries to FIRS to YETI etc
22:16:56  <Eddi|zuHause> just remember, only one of those at a time :p
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