Log for #openttd on 18th November 2015:
Times are UTC Toggle Colours
00:01:11  <sim-al2> I'm good
00:02:03  <drac_boy> what doing?
00:02:34  <sim-al2> Just got home, good timing too as the weather's about to get bad
00:03:21  <drac_boy> heh ok
00:03:52  <drac_boy> btw I kinda got a bit buried in other things recall what we two were talking about yesterday?
00:03:57  <sim-al2> Crazy winds, they say we might get a couple inches of rain
00:04:05  <sim-al2> Uhhh I remember the Feather River Canyon
00:04:56  <drac_boy> oh yeah
00:11:44  <drac_boy> sim-a12 if you want to know where you should keep your mouth shut for a short time then maybe this tunnel would do that :p at least these diesels get their air from just below the chassis where its cooler (if you see the curved-top bumpout on the sides)
00:12:47  <sim-al2> Heh, some steam-operated tunnels had a form of supplemental oxygen because the smoke was so bad
00:14:05  <sim-al2> THe Southern Pacific had EMD develop the Tunnel Motors, SD45T and SD40T with a modified radiator section because they had overheating problems on the long drags
00:14:26  <drac_boy> sim-a12 yeah one of the tunnel in colorado actually had a forced blower assembly at one end to make quicker recycle of the air ... till it was obsoleted by eventual tunnel reconstruction to accept higher doubledeck wagons (which meant they also had better natural ventilation causing the blower to be scrapped)
00:15:06  <sim-al2> In practice, the modified radiators didn't help so much in the tunnels themselves, but they apparently cooled better in the gaps between tunnels which helped reduce the number of engine shutdowns
00:15:20  <drac_boy> sim-a12 don't forget that part of the air intake redesign on the SD40 was because "stubborn" SP bought a few uboats and ran them hard at low speed with no overheat shutdowns .. made emd rethink things :)
00:15:28  <sim-al2> BNSF still has one at the summit of Stevens Pass
00:15:41  <sim-al2> *a blower cooling system for their tunnel
00:16:21  <drac_boy> this was the same SP who was tired of only "1500hp" and went oversea with these massive krauss-maffi diesels ... reliability was a bit of an issue but it did its job in causing the usa locomotives to get more hp if you put it that way :)
00:16:53  <drac_boy> both 4000hp (or at least for the second version) and diesel-hydraulic which were both new concepts to usa at the time as far as I recall
00:17:24  <sim-al2> Yeah, if the SD45 had been later and the mainteance crews slightly more accepting of a non-EMD they might have stuck around for a lot longer
00:18:16  *** fjb [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
00:18:19  <sim-al2> Diesel hydraulic was practically non-existant, all the diesel locomotives and even their gasoline powered predecessors were electric transmission
00:20:53  <drac_boy> sim-a12 also I forgot where I found it but I still recall from memory that canada for a very short time (specifically in montreal area) had a lone german-designed diesel-hydraulic shunter locomotive (2+crank+2 axle assembly for the siderods .. but I imagine the outter axles had some side play to them due to the curvations tho)
00:21:08  <sim-al2> There were a few switching types, GMD GMDH-1, for example, and the Budd RDCs had a similar twin-engine hydraulic tranmissions setup
00:21:46  <drac_boy> ah well it looks alike to this one except for having knuckle couplers instead
00:22:07  <drac_boy> it shows that it wasn't only usa who "borrowed" oversea trains after all tho :)
00:22:37  <drac_boy> oh yeah I almost forgot..there was this trainset that had good service life tho..let me find its name again one sec
00:24:09  <sim-al2> Nah, most countries have done that at some point, and often locomotives are exported to other countries when they get retired, the GEs running in South America
00:24:41  <drac_boy> sim-a12 what you think of this trainset "at home"?
00:25:07  <sim-al2> TEE set?
00:25:45  <sim-al2> Looks like a E-unit really, although I see a conductor compartment at the rear
00:26:18  <drac_boy> guess where a few of them end up at for some time? although I should note it would seem later on they sidelined the power units and simply ram them with pushpull-ready emd geep's instead (mechanical upkeep issues for non-usa engines maybe?)
00:26:52  <drac_boy> they're gone now naturally tho (partially because they were sharing VIA rails to get to south ontario and now this kind of traffic isn't there anymore)
00:27:05  <sim-al2> Oh I was thinking of those just now actually, weren't they rather trouble prone?
00:27:56  <sim-al2> I'm sure the earlier German equipment was a lot of fun for the crews used to EMD
00:28:04  <drac_boy> ah I take that back..looks like they even repainted some "borrowed" emd F units too
00:28:15  <drac_boy> at least even if the roof mismatches a bit it doesn't look too bad
00:28:33  <sim-al2> I think at least one of those F-units had a Cat engine installed too
00:31:13  *** titilambert [] has joined #openttd
00:31:22  <sim-al2> Lol one of the TEE sets is now in the Netherlands
00:32:52  <sim-al2>
00:36:07  <drac_boy> sim-a12 about usa borrowing .. hows this for what could had been? :p
00:36:36  <sim-al2> Also the X2000, and I think a Danish IC3
00:36:48  <drac_boy> even had two diesel locomotives (not sure if they were custom-ordered or non-usa design...they don't look very emd/ge's) for non-wired operations too
00:37:16  <sim-al2> ICE couldn't tilt though, kinda a big deal with the Northeast Corridor
00:37:37  <drac_boy> sim-a12 ah no idea about the ic3 but I think some people called them "kiss" .. as thats what the silly inflated tube looks like when smushed together ;)
00:38:14  <drac_boy> (two trains thats a silly thought)
00:38:20  <sim-al2> Those engines were EMD F69PHACs, prototypes with Siemens three-phase AC motors
00:38:40  <drac_boy> F69? no wonder I never heard about that .. I just know of F40 period :)
00:38:46  <sim-al2> The actual nose shape was used in the some of the last production F40PHs for Metra
00:39:16  <drac_boy> I do know tho that there was supposed to be a SD40P .. but something about either 6-axle tracking or the high gravity of water tank inboard caused many derailing issues tho
00:39:21  <sim-al2> Also there was an AC F40PH on Amtrak's roster for several years
00:39:26  <drac_boy> (and thats probably how the F40PH was born from there)
00:39:53  <sim-al2> Partially the big water tanks, partially the abysmal state of basically all non- Santa Fe trackage Amtrak used
00:40:21  <drac_boy> well the F units had the water tank located below chassis (shared with fuel tank) so I suspect thats why they didn't have the issue? I dunno tbh
00:40:24  <sim-al2> Santa Fe actually bought a chunk of them and turned them into regular freight locomotives
00:40:44  <drac_boy> btw sim-a12 the ic3 reminds me of another locomotive...
00:41:31  <drac_boy> sweden X995 unoffically called a toaster for its shape right there (why am I not surprised?) .. the aem-7 that resulted wasn't too bad (even if a bit hobbled by useless FRA regulations)
00:41:52  <sim-al2> Yeah, on the SDP40F they tried to put the water above the frame at thre rear, 1350 gal above and 2150 more underneath
00:41:56  <drac_boy> as I recall they should had been able to run just one aem-7 in pushpull mode but fra apparently didn't like that idea so cue two overpowered locomotives per small trainset
00:42:34  <sim-al2> AEM-7 was not much heavier, and faster and more powerful than the Swedish units...
00:43:14  <sim-al2> AEM-7 ran push pull on the Keystone Corridor for many years
00:43:41  <drac_boy> btw not surprisingly I don't need to be told where X996 came from .. anyone who knows europe trains would immedately recognize the inward-slanted windshields ;)
00:44:14  <sim-al2> Although Amtrak tended to not sit passengers in the cabcars at one point
00:44:16  <drac_boy> I'm not sure but I think it pretty much was only NS that had these sort of cab window layout anyhow
00:45:25  <sim-al2> SNCF was the first big user
00:45:40  <sim-al2> That was the French style for years
00:46:09  <drac_boy> and well yeah I know various railroads had them but often when you're asked about roundish nose with extended buffers you usually have to think of NS again (or even 'red arrow' from SBB too)
00:47:36  <drac_boy> although I guess the SBB ones were very pronounced (perhaps to make space for extra electricals without interrupting interior space)
00:49:08  *** DDR_ [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
00:49:28  *** DDR [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
00:49:46  <drac_boy> sim-a12 and if you don't mind I recall another canadian thing that has a bit of NS/japan resemble ..
00:51:48  <drac_boy> and .. think someone was looking before designing this?
00:52:17  <drac_boy> although as I recall the corridor was eventually left un-carpeted as they never bothered running a pair together in service at all
00:52:39  <sim-al2> Uh the 789 series and the IC trains were built many years after the Turbotrain
00:52:43  <drac_boy> (probably didn't need to seeing that the set was extended to 9 cars)
00:53:37  <drac_boy> I still remember reading one book about them .. was a weird twist of story .. the amtrak ones were doing well while the canada ones were getting run down but later it was the opposite (in fact the canada ones lasted a lot longer)
00:54:03  <drac_boy> one of the problem naturally was that when the usa ones started getting old noone bothered giving them the extra maintenance they needed
00:54:28  <sim-al2> The Turbotrain adopted that style to allow a passenger walk through door, although the orginal power cars were developed from a diesel unit for the C&O (I think)
00:55:02  <sim-al2> Well the fuel economy (or lack of at partial load) of the turbines was the death blow really
00:55:35  <sim-al2> Same thing with Amtrak's later turbine trains, too much fuel and the last ones had electrical problems that were never solved
00:55:49  <drac_boy> sim-a12 even if the doors were not functional .. lets just say that one train literally struck a meat truck ... ripped some of the corridor door off but everythign stayed on track .. and soon it eventually got up to limited speed (more than 50kph still in fact)
00:56:50  <drac_boy> sim-a12 actually I think the real problem was politics .. they wanted "new unproven" instead of sticking with what worked .. heck look at the LRC which soon had no tilting capacity and later the locomotives themself were so-so
00:57:03  <sim-al2> The NS IC trains have had their doors locked out too, but that was because they weren't useful enough to justify
00:57:40  <sim-al2> At least the LRC engines were fairly reliable, just the tilting mechanism didn't work out as hoped
00:57:51  <drac_boy> at least the LRC coaches still ended up behind F's and F40's .. then politics interrupted things again and told via to order new coaches 0_o
00:58:20  <drac_boy> funny enough one of the major problems with the ex-europe coaches via ordered was....they froze up a lot in winter :->
00:58:32  <sim-al2> If CN could be forced to realign the tracks it wouldn't be that much of a problem
00:58:50  <sim-al2> But too expensive now
00:59:54  <drac_boy> well as I recall the turbotrain had no problem with rather rapdi schedule .. they only didn't like the montreal station which didn't have a straight-y route (cue the passive tilt system rocking passengers like silly)
01:01:41  <drac_boy> heck even the current rebuilt F40PH are still only scheduled for an average of 4.5hr ... the turbotrain used to claim 4hr .. shows that you just have little progress in the grand name of things
01:01:53  <sim-al2> I don't image they did, after all it was just 6-8 (sources are not clear) PT6 turbines, and apparently the hydraulic transmission was actually pretty reliable (once fixed), just the fuel problems
01:02:17  <sim-al2> I imagine the tracks haven't changed in 50 years either
01:02:35  <drac_boy> sim-a12 .. ah the fuel problem was only in the initial years when they found out the obvious problem with plane and trains being different (plane only vibratate for short time on land&takeoff while train always shake all times)
01:02:51  <drac_boy> the simple cure was to eventually replace all copper pipes with rubber hoses to put it that way
01:03:04  <sim-al2> I mean they burn too much, turbines have poor fuel economy at low loads
01:03:45  <drac_boy> and sim-a12 that was why they had a few different small units instead of one or two large units .. so you could only run one single genset one at station or up to all six at track speed
01:04:15  <drac_boy> heck even the UP turbines eventually did have a small diesel genset that was used for low speed shuntings or long idles
01:04:25  <sim-al2> The Jettrain concept had an auxillary diesel engine that provided train power and some propulsion power so that they turbine would only need to run once the train could actually accelerate
01:05:55  <drac_boy> sim-as12 funny thing about turbines tho .. I was reading a recent magazine that listed about the few diesel+turbine units DB used to have..eventually they all had the turbine units removed making them into mostly-conventional locomotives
01:06:52  <drac_boy> first time I thought about such a concept but it seem to make sense .. more hp without too much more axle loading
01:07:25  <sim-al2> Diesel engines didn't have as much power for the weight then, so a booster unit was added
01:08:16  <drac_boy> here we are..was easy to find
01:09:10  <sim-al2> The funny part is how many different mechanical combinations have been put into that same body design
01:10:36  <drac_boy> sim-a12 about power weight .. funny thing is I have a small hardcover Deltic book (can't find an image of it online now sorry) .. and it talked about how the deltic put down 3000hp in a lower axle loading compared to some of the recent "monsters" that only had <2000hp with a high axle loading
01:12:04  <sim-al2> The Deltic engines are a mechanical mess though, they pretty much doomed the Class 23 because of their failures
01:12:39  <sim-al2> I guess they mean the Class 40, as that had 2000hp and was heavier
01:12:57  <drac_boy> one silly section I recall from that book was that how sometimes a deltic could be unavailable and even another diesel either so they had to use a steam locomotive and by then fireman always had to get a strong pint to drink at the end of the run because of trying to keep up with the deltic timings!
01:13:16  <drac_boy> shows how much the locomotive changed things in a way I guess
01:13:56  <sim-al2> I'd imagine, I can't remember what the rule of thumb is but somewhere above ~2000hp is considered to be too much for one fireman for an extended time
01:14:22  <sim-al2> The big locomotives either carried two (not common) or used a mechanical stoker system
01:14:55  <drac_boy> sim-a12 would you believe that the deltic was supposed to have a "cleaned up" 3-piece windshield among other small subtle cosmetic changes but this was vetoed? :)
01:15:14  <drac_boy> the book had an outline drawing of what it could had looked like
01:15:31  <sim-al2> Like the Class 37 or something else?
01:15:49  <drac_boy> yeah looks a bit like that one .. but curved around the sides
01:16:18  <drac_boy> which of ... I dunno why but I sometimes like the 37 itself a bit .. probably because it doesn't look too chunky for a non-flatcab uk diesel
01:17:35  <drac_boy> sim-a12 some of the early "super" usa steam locomotives really did have two firebox holes ... crazy to think of the crew condition back then
01:17:50  <drac_boy> strokers solved that problem :)
01:19:44  <drac_boy> sim-a12 if you don't mind me mentioning it .. its not exactly my favorite but I do sorta like the class 07 .. nicknamed 'teddy bear' for some reason too as I recall .. too bad that they got built just right at the time the Breech Axe thing happened so talk about having their ground swiped from under them
01:20:04  <drac_boy> still got a few around in preservation last I remember seeing photos
01:21:36  <sim-al2> Yeah the shunters are pretty cool
01:21:53  <drac_boy> sim-a12 we should talk more tomorrow about something randomly rails ... I'm going off for tonight now tho sorry :p
01:21:57  <drac_boy> see you next time ok?
01:22:13  <sim-al2> yep, good night
01:22:21  *** drac_boy [~oftc-webi@] has left #openttd []
01:53:53  *** Myhorta [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
02:31:47  *** glx [] has quit [Quit: Bye]
02:40:23  *** FLHerne [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
02:59:31  *** rahtgaz [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
03:00:31  *** rahtgaz [] has joined #openttd
03:17:33  *** rahtgaz [] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
04:27:26  *** supermop [] has joined #openttd
04:41:47  *** Supercheese [] has joined #openttd
05:22:55  *** supermop [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
05:56:01  *** Eddi|zuHause [] has quit []
05:56:24  *** Eddi|zuHause [] has joined #openttd
06:12:18  *** liq3 [] has quit []
07:11:21  *** JezK [~jez@2407:7800:400:107f:3db5:daca:8457:e66a] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
07:21:25  <Flygon_> Damn
07:21:32  <Flygon_> I missed drac_boy again?
07:21:37  *** Flygon_ is now known as Flygon
07:27:58  *** andythenorth [] has joined #openttd
07:28:02  <andythenorth> o/
07:36:14  *** fjb [] has joined #openttd
07:39:35  <Flygon> Eyyy!
07:43:12  *** oskari89 [] has joined #openttd
08:05:58  *** sim-al2 [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
08:08:17  *** fjb [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
08:08:26  *** Flygon_ [] has joined #openttd
08:11:21  *** Flygon [] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
08:31:04  *** andythenorth [] has left #openttd []
08:41:03  *** Progman [] has joined #openttd
09:18:34  *** Progman_ [] has joined #openttd
09:22:56  *** Progman [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
09:23:06  *** Progman_ is now known as Progman
09:32:36  *** fjb [] has joined #openttd
09:48:30  *** sla_ro|master [] has joined #openttd
09:55:49  *** Wolf01 [] has joined #openttd
09:55:54  <Wolf01> moin
10:00:10  *** Klanticus [~quassel@] has joined #openttd
10:04:12  *** Heftel_K [] has joined #openttd
10:04:30  *** Heftel_K_ [] has joined #openttd
10:07:27  <Heftel_K_> Guys! I play on net for company 2 and save game to file. After loading I'm owner of company 1, how to switch my company to 2?
10:12:14  *** Heftel_K [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
10:22:01  <Wolf01> V453000, the heavy oil colour in pipes bother me, i always mistake it for water
10:23:12  <V453000> hm yeah
10:23:18  <V453000> what do you suggest! ;D
10:23:36  <Wolf01> make it orange as it is the icon
10:24:43  <V453000> G
10:24:49  <Wolf01> ok, the icon is copper
10:24:50  <V453000> lets see what can we do about it :P
10:25:30  <planetmaker> Heftel_K_, use the switch-company cheat. Or open locally a server and join company2 with another openttd instance
10:25:56  <Wolf01> the light oil is gold in both the pipe and the icon, i didn't understand why the heavy oil has different colour :P
10:27:03  <V453000> yeah I know what you mean Wolf01, I will talk to dudes about it :) thanks
10:27:15  <Wolf01> thank you too ;)
10:27:26  <V453000> btw :D
10:31:14  <Wolf01> what should i look to?
10:31:33  <V453000> radar GUI :)
10:32:31  <Wolf01> didn't it have one?
10:32:51  <V453000> hint, my name is in the item name :P
10:33:17  <Supercheese> ah you got on the backer list
10:33:35  <Supercheese> I only got furnace attendant :P
10:33:43  <Wolf01> ah, yeah, i noticed that more buildings now have bakers names
10:33:47  <V453000> I bought the top tier since I was super interested in the gfx wiki
10:34:06  <Heftel_K_> planetmaker: ty, I didn't know about cheats. Lol.
10:34:08  <V453000> didnt yet know I would contribute ot it one day :P
10:34:29  <Wolf01> i'm furnace attendant too
10:35:06  <Heftel_K_> Never use it for many years.
10:36:31  <V453000> Wolf01: guess you play without Alt mode eh :)
10:37:00  <Wolf01> usually yes, i only use it when i need to find something on chests or a particular factory
10:37:06  <Eddi|zuHause> <planetmaker> Heftel_K_, use the switch-company cheat. Or open locally a server and join company2 with another openttd instance <-- you don't need another instance if you play "local" multiplayer
10:45:07  <Wolf01> bah, i need to get plastic to the other side of the complex
10:45:29  <Supercheese> bots bots bots
10:47:06  <Wolf01> i think it's time to expand and make dedicated production complexes
10:47:45  <Wolf01> i already have 14 factories in this one
10:51:39  <V453000> I hate bots when it comes to controlling how much goes where etc
10:51:45  <V453000> which is kind of inevitable sooner or later
10:52:38  <V453000> BELTS
10:52:38  <V453000>
10:53:10  <Wolf01> meh, it looks like a ottdcoop game :D
10:53:18  <Wolf01> *an
10:53:33  <V453000> yeah :)
10:53:47  <V453000> organic growth, and adding shitload of things
10:54:45  <lastmikoi> afaik Factorio is one of the few games that succesfully implemented the concept of technical debt
10:55:01  <Wolf01> factories to produce mining drills... do you really need those?
10:55:58  <V453000> I automate everything Wolf01, and mining drills are especially handy when you want to expand quickly
10:56:08  <V453000> lastmikoi: what do you mean technical debt?
10:56:21  <Wolf01> i produce them while travelling to destination
10:56:32  <lastmikoi> V453000: «let's just put this factory there, It won't last anyway»
10:56:46  <lastmikoi> 6 hours later you're forced to divert your railroad because of this factory's poor placement decision
10:57:08  <V453000> also, when biters get through your walls, they often take miners as first priority since they make a lot of pollution
10:57:16  <lastmikoi> kinda like technical debt in programming
10:57:33  <V453000> hm idk, never had that issue lastmikoi but I can see how that happens in longer games :D I dont play that long
10:57:35  <lastmikoi> «let's just put this function here, with those arguments, it'll be refactored soon anyway»
10:57:41  *** Myhorta [] has joined #openttd
10:58:04  <V453000> on the contrary, I love starting organically and keeping it forever
10:58:04  <lastmikoi> 6 months later you're forced to redo everything from scratch because the code is filled with debt
10:58:14  <V453000> right
10:58:34  <V453000> well in factorio you can just start a new factory elsewhere and keep the old mess in the worst case scenario :P
10:58:51  <V453000> OpenTTD is more fitting to that, because it has limited map, so you cannot escape the solutions forever
10:58:57  <lastmikoi> but yeah, I play factorio like I code my programs, wasting time making it perfect and never-to-be-revamped
10:59:20  <lastmikoi> I can tell you multiplayer's no fun :D
10:59:35  <V453000> sure, well, it is not like I am going to revamp my mess :)
10:59:47  <Wolf01> i play factorio like i code my programs: continuous refactoring of things
10:59:49  <lastmikoi> V453000: yeah OpenTTD seems more fitting for that, but it has been a very long time since I played it, sadly.
11:00:00  <Wolf01> i play ottd like that too
11:01:42  <lastmikoi> V453000: holy cow that's a lot of productivity modules
11:03:25  <V453000> yeah, bobs modules also allow you to put them into all kinds of products, not only intermediates
11:03:33  <V453000> I kind of like that, makes it less wtf
11:03:40  <Supercheese> they should be renamed to MOAR modules because you use them to get MOAR stuff from the same inputs :P
11:03:47  <V453000> haha
11:03:49  <lastmikoi> V453000: GOD MODULES !
11:03:52  <V453000> fuck god modules
11:03:56  <Supercheese> and we're all about moar stuff
11:04:04  *** Heftel_K_ [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
11:04:13  <Supercheese> well, except biters. Less biters.
11:04:25  <lastmikoi> (which should have been called BOB MODULES, but hey)
11:04:43  <V453000> I dont want to make the game dumb and easy with god modules, just want to make productivity modules which are harder to produce, and put them into anything I want :) the extra levels of modules are fun too
11:05:26  <Supercheese> yeah eight levels whew
11:05:47  <Supercheese> you can't even automate the last few without max tier assemblers
11:05:57  <Supercheese> well, for the merged ones that is
11:06:40  <V453000> I am using very simplified version
11:06:53  <V453000> without merged, no god modules, no bob machines or anything
11:07:09  <Supercheese> ah
11:07:13  <V453000> only modules with more levels, different recipes made of the bobs ingredients, and their own research lab with 8 tiers
11:07:36  <V453000> I like it a lot.
11:07:48  <V453000> no new ores or wtf stuff, just a bit of stuff
11:08:19  <Supercheese> like extra toolbelts, I see
11:08:45  <V453000> yeah that is the mod which adds like 20 levels to each research
11:08:54  <V453000> so you always have something to use lab for
11:09:19  <V453000> because the high-tier researches are so stupidly expensive that it takes basically forever XD I plan on setting up a giant lab though of course
11:09:33  *** HerzogDeXtEr [] has joined #openttd
11:10:06  <V453000> also, fluid barrel for president
11:10:08  <Eddi|zuHause> am i the only one here that didn't quite get captured by factorio?
11:10:09  <Supercheese> Follower Count 20 is like, what, few thousand each?
11:10:42  <Supercheese> I don't think I've ever bothered to research that high
11:10:45  <V453000> yeah like 10k I think
11:10:50  <V453000> with the mod
11:10:59  <V453000> vanilla is like 2k I believe
11:11:07  <V453000> but yeah just so many levels for follower count
11:11:45  <Supercheese> that you'll never really need
11:11:55  <V453000> NEED BIG LAB.
11:11:57  <V453000> MOAR
11:11:57  <V453000> :P
11:13:10  <V453000> the most retarded thing I saw is dytech mkIV beacon ... effect distribution of 100%, can put 11 modules into it, and area of effect is like range 20 :D
11:13:17  <V453000> not playing dytech again.
11:13:30  <V453000> not just due to the beacon, but yeah
11:16:13  <Supercheese> bob's has a mk3 beacon that is similar
11:20:40  *** FR^2 [~frquadrat@2001:41d0:1:f924::1] has joined #openttd
11:20:42  <FR^2> Hiho
11:21:11  <planetmaker> hi
11:21:25  <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause, rest assured, you're not alone
11:21:32  <FR^2> I thought "Yate Haugan" was a name of one engineer participating in the design of the Concorde. Can't find that name. What's the pun/significance of "Yate Haugan"?
11:21:44  *** sla_ro|master [] has quit []
11:22:20  <Eddi|zuHause> FR^2: all the vehicle names are of people involved in making transport tycoon (alpha testers, etc.)
11:22:33  <FR^2> Eddi|zuHause: Ah, that's the relation. okay :)
11:22:37  <FR^2> Thanks.
11:25:13  <__ln__> oh, an FR^2 on this channel.
11:54:13  <Wolf01> derp... i'm stupid, i just finished a railway for iron ore and i linked it directly to the factory chain
12:22:09  <V453000> Supercheese: yes but only for 6 modules and much(I think much :) ) smaller coverage area :)
12:31:19  *** Supercheese is now known as Guest9188
12:31:25  *** Supercheese [] has joined #openttd
12:32:14  *** Hiddenfunstuff [] has joined #openttd
12:36:30  *** Guest9188 [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
12:39:33  *** andythenorth [] has joined #openttd
12:39:47  *** sla_ro|master [slamaster@] has joined #openttd
12:57:31  <argoneus> rip france
12:57:59  <V453000> zerg rush
12:58:46  <argoneus> they killed a police dog apparently
12:58:48  <argoneus>
12:58:50  <argoneus> rip Diesel
12:59:19  <V453000> yeah well we probably have bigger issues than a dog :P
12:59:31  <argoneus> well no humans died
12:59:36  <argoneus> only some isis people and a dog
13:00:00  <argoneus> isis members*
13:00:02  <V453000> rite
13:00:17  <Wolf01> isis minions*
13:01:00  <argoneus> we need a nuke that selectively kills only members of a given group
13:01:17  <argoneus> so the good muslims wont get in trouble
13:01:17  <argoneus> ;_;
13:01:25  <V453000> well we mainly need our inner politics to be less retarded
13:01:34  <Wolf01> ^
13:02:21  <argoneus> inner as in
13:02:28  <argoneus> EU politics
13:02:29  <argoneus> or czech
13:05:04  <andythenorth> politics
13:05:06  *** andythenorth [] has left #openttd []
13:05:25  <Wolf01> i really need divivers in factorio, splitters are cool, but to make a divider you need to build a contraption with splitters and underground belts
13:05:37  <Wolf01> *dividers
13:15:05  *** andythenorth [] has joined #openttd
13:25:55  *** Progman [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
13:31:04  *** BlackSnow [~Ew8eSZvPb@] has joined #openttd
13:31:09  <BlackSnow> test
13:31:42  <argoneus> it works BlackSnow
13:31:45  <argoneus> \o/
13:44:44  *** fjb [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
13:45:46  <FR^2> I'm often trying to plan ahead with enlarging stations and airports. Therefore I buy land. Is there any way to buy a larger area other than buying each land field one by one?
13:46:38  *** tokai [] has joined #openttd
13:46:41  *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai] by ChanServ
13:51:38  *** BlackSnow [~Ew8eSZvPb@] has quit [Quit: CIIC is irc client -]
13:53:05  *** tokai|noir [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
13:54:31  *** sim-al2 [] has joined #openttd
13:55:35  *** shirish [~quassel@] has joined #openttd
14:02:35  *** andythenorth [] has quit [Quit: andythenorth]
14:18:26  <Flygon_> I back
14:18:33  <Flygon_> I back FR^2's question*
14:18:37  *** Flygon_ is now known as Flygon
14:22:07  <FR^2> bulldoze works much easier ;)
14:28:49  <planetmaker> FR^2, there is no such way. Mostly it was not (yet) implemented on grounds of easier griefing that way.
14:31:02  <FR^2> hmm, yes, I can understand that, but then again, there's lots of possibilities to do nasty things ;)
14:31:21  <FR^2> well, the question is answered - currently there is no easy way.
14:31:52  <planetmaker> yes, you're right, it's easy to do loads of nasty things
14:32:27  <planetmaker> tbh I argued against area-drag for buying. But now I'm not so sure it's the best argument - as there are ways to grief anyway, and not really more difficult
14:33:25  *** Progman [] has joined #openttd
14:33:38  <argoneus> planetmaker: what about horizontal railroads
14:33:41  <Wolf01> for example you could drag&drop railway all over the area, you could only do it in straight lines but with just some more work it's almost the same
14:34:05  <planetmaker> argoneus, that's another way to grief. But obviously one you can't forbid
14:34:45  <planetmaker> and that's the reason I'm not sure anymore it's a good argument to not implement area-drag buy land
14:35:04  <planetmaker> but then, how often is it needed to area-buy land?
14:35:32  <Wolf01> city shaping
14:37:38  *** Mazur [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
14:37:47  <planetmaker> and there you need area-buy instead of single tiles?
14:37:59  <planetmaker> If I want to shape a city, I guy single tiles where roads would continue
14:38:36  <Wolf01> not if you are in the middle of a city trying to build a subway
14:39:09  *** Mazur [] has joined #openttd
14:39:13  <Wolf01> i often demolish a 4x12 rectangle to build a station and i need to keep it clean for just some time
14:39:17  <FR^2> I'm using it in order to prevent cities to grow all around my airport - so that later on I can replace that airport with a larger variant
14:39:54  <FR^2> (but then again, gaining profit with airplanes is far to easy if you don't restrict it ;)
14:41:10  <planetmaker> Wolf01, I usually don't have the reputation to demolish that much of a city :)
14:43:13  <Wolf01> cities really like me :)
14:44:16  <Wolf01> i can only do it one or twice a year, and if some new building gets in the way i must wait
14:47:45  *** Mazur [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
14:49:28  *** Mazur [] has joined #openttd
14:58:07  *** Mazur [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
14:59:31  *** Mazur [] has joined #openttd
15:00:50  *** Rejf [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
15:04:10  *** Rejf [] has joined #openttd
15:07:02  <Wolf01> got to go, bye
15:07:05  *** Wolf01 [] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.]
15:08:24  *** Mazur [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:10:00  *** Mazur [] has joined #openttd
15:18:39  *** Mazur [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:20:10  *** Mazur [] has joined #openttd
15:29:04  *** Mazur [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:30:32  *** Mazur [] has joined #openttd
15:39:10  *** Mazur [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:40:28  *** Mazur [] has joined #openttd
15:49:19  *** Mazur [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:50:56  *** Mazur [] has joined #openttd
15:51:19  *** Alberth [~alberth@2001:981:c6c5:1:be5f:f4ff:feac:e11] has joined #openttd
15:51:22  *** mode/#openttd [+o Alberth] by ChanServ
15:56:43  <Alberth> moin
15:57:16  *** teste [~oftc-webi@] has joined #openttd
15:59:38  *** Mazur [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:02:08  *** Mazur [] has joined #openttd
16:02:50  *** teste [~oftc-webi@] has quit [Quit: Page closed]
16:08:19  *** liq3 [] has joined #openttd
16:08:44  *** fjb [] has joined #openttd
16:10:47  *** Mazur [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:13:03  *** Mazur [] has joined #openttd
16:17:49  <FR^2> Are there any graphics patches to make the rail signs more clearly distinguishable? ;)
16:19:55  <Alberth> I guess you mean signals rather than signs :)
16:20:40  <Eddi|zuHause> i'm sure several people attempted that, and ended up with something that worked for them, but is equally confusing to everybody else
16:21:42  <Eddi|zuHause> like dvorak keyboards, which you find people swearing on that it makes all the difference, but asymptotically doesn't change anything
16:21:54  *** Mazur [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:22:45  <FR^2> Alberth: indeed ;)
16:23:11  <Alberth> zbase (the 32bpp baseset) and NUTS have different signals, but they also change a lot of other things
16:23:29  <Alberth> there may be more newgrfs
16:24:24  *** Mazur [] has joined #openttd
16:25:33  <Alberth>   lists 2 other newgrfs with changed signals, never tried them
16:26:28  <Eddi|zuHause> i meant particularly this one
16:27:35  <Alberth> ha, fun :)
16:27:47  *** Myhorta [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:28:40  <Alberth> I still don't know the non-electric signals, but I set the startdate for the electric signals around 1800 or so, and never see the non-electric ones
16:29:14  <Alberth> in the end, it may be simpler to get used to the normal signals, as everybody uses those.
16:29:28  <Alberth> it makes communication about signal layout possible
16:29:39  *** Wormnest [] has joined #openttd
16:30:01  <Alberth> note that you pretty much only need the one-way path signal at first
16:30:21  <Alberth> with the two-way path signal at some special cases
16:31:19  *** oskari89 [] has quit []
16:32:32  *** sim-al2 [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:32:48  <Alberth> the basic block signal is also often used, although there is no need for it, so you may want to recognize that one too
16:33:00  *** Mazur [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:33:10  <Alberth> the combo signals are very very special case
16:36:12  *** Mazur [] has joined #openttd
16:45:05  *** Mazur [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:48:30  *** Mazur [] has joined #openttd
16:50:46  *** TheMask96 [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:55:06  *** TheMask96 [] has joined #openttd
16:57:08  *** Mazur [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:59:13  <Eearslya> meow
16:59:57  *** DDR_ [] has joined #openttd
17:00:10  *** DDR [] has joined #openttd
17:00:29  *** Mazur [] has joined #openttd
17:07:03  <FR^2> Hmm. zBase seems neat :)
17:09:23  *** Mazur [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:09:54  <Alberth> not really, but ymmv
17:12:35  *** Mazur [] has joined #openttd
17:21:28  *** Mazur [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:24:34  *** Mazur [] has joined #openttd
17:33:40  *** Mazur [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:36:25  <Eearslya> meow
17:36:47  *** Mazur [] has joined #openttd
17:39:52  <TrueBrain> we now have 2 cats in this channel?
17:43:12  <peter1138> urgh
17:43:14  <peter1138> leg swolen
17:43:20  <peter1138> hope it isn't too fucked :S
17:43:45  *** glx [] has joined #openttd
17:43:48  *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ
17:45:17  <DorpsGek> Commit by translators :: r27449 trunk/src/lang/spanish.txt (2015-11-18 18:45:09 +0100 )
17:45:18  <DorpsGek> -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
17:45:19  <DorpsGek> spanish - 2 changes by SilverSurferZzZ
17:45:42  *** Mazur [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:48:19  *** Mazur [] has joined #openttd
18:05:46  *** Mazur [] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
18:09:06  *** oskari89 [] has joined #openttd
18:17:40  *** frosch123 [] has joined #openttd
18:19:11  <Alberth> quak
18:19:28  <frosch123> hoi
18:23:34  <__ln__> @seen SmatZ
18:23:34  <DorpsGek> __ln__: SmatZ was last seen in #openttd 2 years, 15 weeks, 6 days, 20 hours, 51 minutes, and 36 seconds ago: <SmatZ> wish I were so lucky...
18:23:40  <TrueBrain> LIES
18:33:32  *** andythenorth [] has joined #openttd
18:37:00  *** shirish [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
19:02:11  *** sim-al2 [] has joined #openttd
19:03:43  *** fjb [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
19:09:18  *** FLHerne [] has joined #openttd
19:15:39  <Terkhen> hello
19:16:54  <frosch123> hej
19:18:10  *** gelignite [] has joined #openttd
19:22:18  <andythenorth> o/
19:24:10  <frosch123> hmm, you didn't like the cargoflow graphs :p
19:31:37  <andythenorth> I did an oops :)
19:33:00  <argoneus> TRAINS TRAINS TRAINS TRAINS
19:33:42  * andythenorth is refactoring some yuck
19:47:24  <andythenorth> merged functions with ‘if’ statements to control their behaviour
19:47:33  <andythenorth> give the illusion of efficient programming
19:49:43  <frosch123> hmm, btw. the is no "else" in pyramid templated, is there?
19:50:43  <frosch123> hmm, though there is a switch, so switch(condition) + case(true) + case(false) :p
19:57:08  <andythenorth> there is no else
19:57:18  <andythenorth> occasionally a PITA
19:57:31  <andythenorth> but usually you / one pre-prepares the data structure for rendering
19:57:37  <andythenorth> and handle it there
19:57:52  <andythenorth> but yeah, sometimes there are clunky conditionals
19:58:31  <andythenorth> chameleon/tal is not perfect, but I have been using it a long time and it suits my brain :)
19:59:07  <andythenorth> right, 48 hours later, I’ve refactored FIRS enough to swap Grain for Maize in one economy :P
19:59:14  <andythenorth> "think of the time saved"
20:08:36  <frosch123> :)
20:10:06  <Eearslya> I wish MSVC wasn't completely inept at refactoring
20:12:24  <andythenorth> it doesn’t have find-replace? :O
20:13:08  *** Progman_ [] has joined #openttd
20:13:59  <Eearslya> It has find-replace, but not real IDE-style refactoring
20:14:10  <Eearslya> i.e. rename an object across the entire project
20:17:47  *** Progman [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
20:17:57  *** Progman_ is now known as Progman
20:18:03  * andythenorth has never done any proper programming :)
20:29:01  *** frosch123 [] has quit [Quit: be yourself, except: if you have the opportunity to be a unicorn, then be a unicorn]
20:45:44  <glx> Eearslya: it can do it (it does it for C# IIRC)
20:46:13  <Eearslya> Sure, for C# it does..It sucks doing it to a normal C project
20:46:18  <Eearslya> er, C++ in this case
20:52:25  *** kais58_ [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20:52:46  *** kais58_ [~kais58@] has joined #openttd
20:59:11  <__ln__> Eearslya: try
21:02:05  *** andythenorth [] has quit [Quit: andythenorth]
21:03:51  *** Zuu [] has joined #openttd
21:04:17  <Zuu> Eearslya: Visual Studio 2015 have refactor rename (Ctrl+R,R) at least in C#.
21:04:45  <Zuu> Oh.. reading along backlog, you said that yourself. :-)
21:06:00  <Eearslya> __ln__: That's a pretty steep price for something I would not nearly get enough use out of.. XD
21:07:37  <Eearslya> It -looks- like it has refactor rename in C++, but it's..incredibly stupid. i.e. if you tried to refactor Object1::name, it will also refactor Object2::name, Object3::name, and just..literally any variable named 'name'
21:09:36  *** Myhorta [] has joined #openttd
21:15:37  <Zuu> Looks like wholetomato may also be a toolset useful for users who are stuck at an old version of visual studio. Eg. if you in corperate settings depend on on a library only available for some visual studio version.
21:24:55  *** Alberth [~alberth@2001:981:c6c5:1:be5f:f4ff:feac:e11] has left #openttd []
21:28:51  *** sla_ro|master [slamaster@] has quit []
21:44:16  <__ln__> Zuu: That thing has features that VS2015 doesn't.
22:02:39  *** JezK [~jez@2407:7800:400:107f:3db5:daca:8457:e66a] has joined #openttd
22:16:59  *** Hiddenfunstuff [] has quit [Quit:  HydraIRC -> <- In tests, 0x09 out of 0x0A l33t h4x0rz prefer it :)]
22:18:49  *** HerzogDeXtEr [] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
22:20:47  * Supercheese reads xkcd, goes to Google, views source.
22:20:49  *** oskari89 [] has quit []
22:20:51  <Supercheese> good lord
22:26:52  <Eearslya> Yeah, google has this thing where their pages are obfuscated in javascript..I have no idea why.
22:28:17  <Eearslya> I have no idea how ALL THAT JAVASCRIPT can be more efficient than just HTML
22:28:49  <Supercheese> Google magick
22:35:11  <Eearslya> It barely saves 20kB of transfer too (at least on
22:37:27  <planetmaker> 20kB * how many requests per hour?
22:38:21  <Supercheese> I believe the scientific number for Google's requests per hour is, "Like, a billion"
22:38:52  <Eearslya> fair enough
22:49:24  <Zuu> __ln__: Sure. And the price is not that bad if you would use VS a lot at work. But it said also that it provided some additional features present in todays VS for older versions.
22:50:15  *** Zuu [] has quit [Quit: night]
22:54:36  <Rejf> Eearslya: with html and older browsers google used to render results server-side. now, with all that javascript they can use it to render search results on your machine and just produce and send some basic json data from their servers. win for them all the way
22:55:12  *** Mazur [] has joined #openttd
22:57:13  <Eearslya> Google does all this..and yet they end up sending their own google wallet e-mail into my spam folder. Welp.
23:08:18  *** Wormnest [] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
23:12:14  *** Biolunar [] has joined #openttd
23:24:42  *** gelignite [] has quit [Quit:]
23:26:12  *** sim-al2 [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:36:43  *** DDR_ [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
23:36:43  *** DDR [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
23:37:59  *** rahtgaz [] has joined #openttd
23:39:33  *** fjb [] has joined #openttd
23:48:05  *** drac_boy [~oftc-webi@] has joined #openttd
23:48:25  <drac_boy> hmmm wheres that silly train nut friend now :->
23:50:18  *** FLHerne [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:54:30  <Flygon> I aint silly
23:55:49  <Mazur> Yes, yous is.
23:56:21  <drac_boy> who said anything about you flygon
23:56:43  <Flygon> Dunno xP
23:56:50  <Flygon> But it's been over a year since I last saw ya
23:59:23  *** DDR [] has joined #openttd
23:59:32  <drac_boy> so what both of you doing atm anyhow?

Powered by YARRSTE version: svn-trunk