Log for #openttd on 17th May 2017:
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08:27:22  <Alkel_U3> @logs
08:27:22  <DorpsGek> Alkel_U3:
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08:36:12  <Wolf01> o/
08:44:17  <Alkel_U3> o/
08:45:22  <crem> \o
08:46:24  <Alkel_U3> question - is it possible to code dual-gauge track so I can have a shared track for narrow-gauge and standard one? I want this because of reasons (Iron Horse actually).
08:47:08  <Alkel_U3> I couldn't find whether I asked already :-)
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08:50:18  <Wolf01> I think it is possible, look at the compatible railtypes section
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09:23:25  <Alkel_U3> so, one railtype would have multiple labels?
09:26:10  <Alkel_U3> the 'compatible railtypes' affects rolling stock of this particular railtype, it doesn't say what other types can run on it
09:27:12  <Wolf01> Then is the powered railtypes, or both
09:28:30  <Alkel_U3> that's also 'Provide a list of rail types that trains of this type are powered on.'
09:30:29  <Wolf01> Then you should make a XYZ railtype and change both RAIL and NG to have power on XYZ
09:32:35  <Alkel_U3> oh, right, I took RAIL for something untouchable but it probably is overridable...
09:33:42  <Wolf01> I always find this way not intuitive, it should be the current railtype to define what it can run on it, not the others
09:35:05  <Wolf01> But I think it was made this way to not lookup continuously the tile railtype from a vehicle
09:35:59  <__ln___>
09:36:13  <Wolf01> :D
09:37:06  <Alkel_U3> I'd like to see them encrypt punch cards :-)
09:37:48  <Arveen> aes256 encryption sure is fast on that box
09:38:10  <Alkel_U3> well, thanks for adwice Wolf01, I hope I'll actually amount to make use of it
09:40:31  <Wolf01> Luckily on NRT is easier as there isn't the "compatible" stuff
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10:43:33  <EnraBahn> hi all..  just wondering if there is a 32bpp build available since i can't seem to find it on the site
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10:44:57  <Wolf01> You need to download a 32bpp baseset from the content download within the game
10:47:54  <EnraBahn> ahh, the turorial i found must be a bit outdated then lol
10:48:01  <EnraBahn> thanks for that Wolf01
10:54:40  <FLHerne> Are there any such basesets yet that aren't zBase?
10:55:36  <planetmaker> there's only zBase as a complete 32bpp baseset
10:55:53  <planetmaker> iirc. Unless something changed
10:56:38  <Wolf01> There's aBase (derived from zBase) and the one from V, which might take some time to be finished
10:56:41  <peter1138> heh yeah, all builds for years are 32bpp :p
10:56:42  <planetmaker> Alkel_U3, one railtype can only have one label. but it can have compatible railtypes. thus you could make one which is compatible to two others
10:58:20  <Wolf01> planetmaker, I think there's a bit of confusion, we should make a drawing XD
10:58:41  <planetmaker> :)
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11:12:58  <Alkel_U3> planetmaker: yes, but if I understand the issue correctly I can't just make DUAL and declare "RAIL vehicle type can use this", only that DUAL vehicle can go on RAIL track. So if there isn't a way of altering/overriding RAIL (and possibly ELRL) I'd have to make a new arbitrary regular railtype in place of RAIL and have the trainset use that railtype as default. Right?
11:15:26  <Alkel_U3> or just that all RAIL vehicles would become DUAL vehicles. DUAL vehicles can also go on RAIL and NRGL can also go on DUAL.
11:16:12  <Alkel_U3> tl;dr: is it possible to bend the default railtype to allow the compatibility?
11:19:19  <planetmaker> Alkel_U3, yes, you can change the meaning of RAIL. And you can define a tracktype which is compatible with RAIL, so that RAIL vehicles can drive on it, too (e.g. like RAIL vehicles can use ELRL by default)
11:19:48  <planetmaker> it should suffice to define for an arbitrary type to be compatible with RAIL so that RAIL vehicles can drive on it
11:21:03  <Wolf01> You have to make the vehicles as DUAL and RAIL.powered -> DUAL, NG.powered -> DUAL as far as I remember
11:22:08  <planetmaker> so yes... you probably want to modify RAIL with the property  compatible_railtype_list and add your DUAL to that
11:22:28  <planetmaker> and define a new NRGL which is also compatible with DUAL
11:22:38  <Alkel_U3> ok, thanks for clarifying
11:22:48  <planetmaker> then any vehicle powered for RAIL *or* NRGL can drive on DUAL
11:23:19  <Alkel_U3> yeah, that's the way I hoped would be possible :-)
11:23:24  <planetmaker> (you might additionally need to define them also in the  powered_railtype_list property
11:24:37  <planetmaker> there is another way: define all your own track labels. And make use of the  alternative_railtype_list; add RAIL to the railtype which shall replace RAIL.
11:25:12  <planetmaker> then it works in an environment where RAIL is not available - or re-defined by some other NewGRF to something else
11:25:45  <planetmaker> but that seems to be thought around too many corners :)
11:30:16  <Alkel_U3> I think I'll stick with just bending the defaults :-)
11:46:55  <planetmaker> good choice, I think
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14:02:03  <Wolf01> o/
14:02:08  <Alberth> hi hi
14:02:13  <supermop> yo
14:03:34  <Wolf01> supermop, I agree with your post about unspooled, but it would be really cool to have some road connections between cities pre-generated too
14:03:41  <Wolf01> I should look into that
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14:19:38  <supermop> Wolf01: i think a GS that builds some would be nice
14:19:52  <supermop> or let cities build more types of roads
14:20:51  <supermop> obviously, like i real life, a trucking company will be more profitable when the state builds nice roads it can use
14:27:30  <Wolf01> A gamescript which runs on map generation
14:35:13  <supermop> if a freight company build's it's own roads, they usually are dirt or gravel, or some other lower speed type
14:36:00  <supermop> that may not be fun for those players who like to play the role of a public transit company shaping an urban area
14:36:16  <Alberth> they favour safe driving of their employees :)
14:38:41  <Wolf01> I think a gamescript or such, configurable to [try to connect major cities|try to connect all cities|try to connect cities and industries] could be a good approach
14:39:02  <Wolf01> Maybe with NRT support too
14:39:47  <Wolf01> IIRC there was something already on some gamescript tutorial
14:42:21  <FLHerne> There's an AI that tries to do it in-game
14:42:21  <FLHerne> But it's too slow
14:42:21  <FLHerne> WMDoT, IIRC
14:54:45  <Alberth> CityConnector may also work, it seems
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15:07:26  <Alberth> o/
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15:10:57  <andythenorth> hi
15:10:58  <andythenorth> bye
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15:11:28  <LordAro> short visist
15:11:35  <LordAro> visit*
15:34:16  <quiznilo> since when was ottd 1.7 released?
15:34:37  <quiznilo> hell, I didn't even notice 1.6 was in my package system and installed
15:35:06  <Alberth> it's old anyway :p
15:35:12  <Alkel_U3> since 1st april as tradition dictates
15:35:47  <quiznilo> perhaps I'm getting my versions mixed up
15:36:18  <Alkel_U3> what system / repo are you using?
15:38:26  <quiznilo> gentoo portage, but I was doing out of band downloading from the repo
15:38:36  <quiznilo> compiling
15:39:00  <Alberth> as long as you don't install in system-space, it should be alright
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15:53:29  <supermop> Wolf01: i don''t think it should build fast highways at game start though
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16:25:30  <supermop> maybe dirt trails to small villages
16:39:23  <supermop> planetmaker: is there any apetite, if i output my trolleybi sprites with 1st CC cabs and no trolleypoles, use those in ogfx+?
16:39:29  <supermop> to use?
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16:46:15  <supermop> i don't know if i really want a separate, non-trolleybi truck set as weel, seeing as the intent was to match the stats and function of ogfx+ RVs
16:46:42  <supermop> and the truck cabs/bus bodies are still same as ogfx
16:47:14  <supermop> just the truck bodies are a bit more 'improved', and 2cc is added
16:55:34  <quiznilo> don't have to open no browser to get train radio scanner now: mplayer -cache 256
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18:04:57  <frosch123> how many stations does isr have?
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18:06:35  <LordAro> Bhootrk_: you need a better internet connection
18:06:37  <andythenorth> o/
18:06:51  <frosch123> andythenorth: how many station does isr have? :)
18:06:58  <andythenorth> ‘lots’
18:07:02  <andythenorth> want me to count?
18:07:14  <frosch123> more than 200?
18:07:21  <andythenorth> tiles?
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18:08:08  <frosch123> things to select from the build menu
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18:09:35  <andythenorth> I count about 168 buildable things
18:09:37  <andythenorth> approx
18:10:06  <andythenorth> it’s quite hard in my station gui as I have 2x zoom, and it’s hard to use :D
18:10:19  <frosch123> some unknown (to me) guy submitted a patch to increase the limit of stations per newgrf from 255 to 65535
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18:10:51  <andythenorth> that’s….useful?
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18:11:08  <andythenorth> probably useful for AIs
18:11:10  <frosch123> @ban Bhootrk_
18:11:46  <andythenorth> I think the game doesn’t need any more patches :)
18:11:48  <andythenorth> it’s done
18:11:48  <frosch123> @mode +b Bhootrk_
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18:12:32  <andythenorth> is it a good patch?
18:13:08  <frosch123> it bumps the grf version to 9
18:13:32  <frosch123> i would rather modify grf version 8 retroactively
18:14:01  <andythenorth> seems like it’s worthy-but-useless
18:14:08  <andythenorth> how many station tiles does Michael need?
18:14:13  <andythenorth> maybe he has a case for it
18:14:20  <frosch123> and modify some related things in a similar way
18:14:42  <andythenorth> are there 65536 name strings?
18:15:34  <frosch123> only the recently added 8k
18:16:37  <frosch123> but i guess 8k is also enough for the gui :p
18:17:59  <FLHerne> frosch123: Dutch Stations Addition is another one with an insane number of buildable types
18:18:01  <FLHerne> (counts)
18:20:06  <FLHerne> frosch123: Dutch Stations Addition has 248 buildable types
18:20:41  <frosch123> ok, so people really reach the 256 limit
18:20:43  <frosch123> thanks :)
18:21:04  <frosch123> i wanted to know whether it's one of the "i can easily make a savegame with 5k trains" guys
18:21:31  <FLHerne> Well...I've hit 5000 RVs before
18:21:48  <andythenorth> they shouldn’t be making so many station tiles :P
18:21:54  <andythenorth> but nobody put andythenorth in charge
18:22:20  <FLHerne> andythenorth: It has, like, ten different kinds of lineside cabinet ;-)
18:22:26  <andythenorth> right
18:22:30  <FLHerne> All of which are about six pixels of tiny box
18:22:36  <andythenorth> but the realism
18:22:42  <frosch123> andythenorth: you only have not reached that amount with cargos/industries, because you remove them at about the same speed as you add them
18:23:15  <andythenorth> it’s important to cull the weakest
18:31:49  <Alberth> think of all the evolutionary buildings you could have throughout the ages! :p
18:37:42  <supermop> i honestly could see myself doing that
18:49:44  <andythenorth> is FIRS done yet?
18:49:51  * andythenorth keeps finding new bugs :P
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18:50:16  <Alberth> I agree with andy, it's simple to throw everything at one big heap and dump the selection problem onto the user, as author of set however, it's very nice if you save that work for your users
18:50:35  <Alberth> bugs in new stuff, or also in old? :)
18:50:42  <andythenorth> newly found old bugs
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18:50:51  <andythenorth> or genuine refactoring needed
18:50:58  <andythenorth> also…station names need work
18:50:59  <andythenorth>
18:51:07  <andythenorth> (sort by ‘station name’)
18:51:26  <andythenorth> ideally there would be more variety, or all unique
18:51:34  * andythenorth is out of ideas right now
18:51:57  <andythenorth> mines particularly could use more
18:52:48  <FLHerne> andythenorth: I tend to rename them to "North Shaft" or so
18:52:56  <FLHerne> Er, coal
18:53:33  <Alberth> I mostly disable station names, so I don't see them at all :p
18:54:07  <andythenorth> ha
18:54:08  <Alberth> but I'd remove the bad ones, and leave it at that
18:54:17  <FLHerne> Of course, in multiplayer it's just <Foo> Coal Mine #n :P
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18:54:36  <andythenorth> it’s tempting to remove them all and use the industry name :P
18:54:52  <andythenorth> but that might be in the same direction as making all cargo units 'tonnes'
18:54:57  <Alberth> hmm, I'd think the ones with the industry names are bad :p
18:55:00  <andythenorth> logical, but less interesting
18:55:32  <Alberth> as well as "power plant", but ymmv
18:55:56  <andythenorth> it appeals to me to use quirky UK-specific things
18:56:07  <andythenorth> just to test the will of translators :)
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18:57:00  <Alberth> UK-specific things add flavor, imho
19:00:22  * andythenorth googles
19:02:08  <Alberth> google is not a UK company :p
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19:04:33  <andythenorth> they have a UK campus :P
19:04:38  <andythenorth> I saw it today
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19:45:48  <Alberth> :)
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