Log for #openttd on 8th July 2017:
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04:35:12  <Flygon> Y'know.
04:35:29  <Flygon> A River Nile scenario'd be kinda neat, but that'd need a hell of a timepatch. :V
04:36:27  <supermop_home> not sure if should make one articulated part comfy and one with faster decay
04:36:29  <Flygon> That or some method of dividing down the reported speeds of vehicles so that while it's going 60km/h in-engine it says that boat is going just 6km/h. :VVV
04:36:56  <supermop_home> to simulate different decay rates between seated and standing
04:37:18  <supermop_home> or just a switch that changes decay rate by load %
04:37:22  <Flygon> That would be amazing.
04:37:31  <Flygon> As in, simulating crush loads.
04:37:35  <Flygon> That'd be goddamned amazing.
04:38:15  <supermop_home> because idk if there is a way to prevent something like all the pax load into the 'standing' car before the 'seated' car is full
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05:09:45  <supermop_home> also the seated passengers will be just as comfortable when surrounded by 200 standees as when they have a tram to themselves
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05:46:44  <Flygon> supermop, you've been to Melbourne during peak hour.
05:46:54  <Flygon> Nobody's truly comfortable on the world's most cramped Trams.
05:47:01  <Flygon> They merely tolerate it. With vigor.
05:47:05  <Flygon> :P
05:47:30  <supermop_home> I would ride my bike if I had to go anywhere at rush hour
05:49:07  <supermop_home> best and simplest way is probably just to degrade the cargo age bonus based on load percentage
05:50:31  <supermop_home> then you can have a few brackets, where the first one, up to full seated capacity sees little drop, then roughly average seated vs standing decay rates, then for the last 10% can have a steep drop
05:51:04  <supermop_home> unfortunately, for openttd gameplay, nearly all trams on all routes will always be 100% full
05:51:45  <supermop_home> so the worst decay rate hass to be close to default
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07:17:29  <Eddi|zuHause> supermop_home: problem with variable decay rate like that is that you have no control over where the passengers go in your vehicle, and they also don't balance themselves
07:44:17  <Flygon> supermop: Same reason boats are an issue in OTTD.
07:44:26  <Flygon> I'd love a more realistic 'long distance' game.
07:44:34  <Flygon> Where peeps pay more to go long distance, but there is far fewer of them.
07:45:24  <Flygon> It'd be an interesting mechanic, but need a near total rework of how passenger/mail mechanics, and wagons, work.
07:45:39  <Flygon> ie. certain wagons would be low capacity, but high in amnemities...
07:46:06  <Flygon> And long distance passengers would obviously attritate their paying value less with higher amnemities.
07:52:27  <Eddi|zuHause> so, i spent all night downloading 44GB shadow of mordor thingie, and then it doesn't start :/
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09:19:43  <andythenorth> o/
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09:57:08  <Alberth> hi hi
09:57:51  <andythenorth> lo Alberth
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09:58:49  <Alberth> hmm, I saved a patch too well, can't find it again :p
09:59:21  <Alberth> ah, found it
09:59:56  <andythenorth> :)
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10:19:35  <andythenorth> slightly improved ‘get started’.
10:19:40  <andythenorth> still a bit boring
10:19:41  <andythenorth> :)
10:21:08  <Alberth> There are familiar industries and cargos you'll recognise from default OpenTTD  <-- that still holds?
10:24:57  <Alberth> ECONOMIES WORK IN ALL CLIMATES - HOW TO EXPLAIN? <-- climates in economies refer to the world region used for inspiration, you can play all economies in all climates
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10:27:07  <Alberth> it's still boring indeed, too much collections of random words perhaps?   not sure how to fix it, "real" text won't work either
10:27:41  <Alberth> perhaps a graph in some way?
10:28:54  <Alberth> "6 economies" is too subtle, I think
10:29:36  <Alberth> list their aims, with a link to their page for more details?
10:29:47  <Alberth> economies seem a major feature of firs
10:30:24  <Alberth> *"6 economies" as link, I mean
10:31:47  <Alberth> merge "activate firs" and "activate vehicle newgrf" as section
10:31:56  <Alberth> pick an economy as separate section?
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12:33:44  * andythenorth will think on about that, thanks
12:37:21  <Alberth> just random thoughts  :p
12:41:27  * andythenorth back to chores :)
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13:55:09  <frosch123> andythenorth: just write: economies work in all climates - thereis nothing wrong with playing in-a-hot-country in arctic climate - in fact it makes you look creative
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18:22:30  <supermop_home> hmm
18:23:12  <supermop_home> trying to make either the 2nd or 3rd part of a 4 part tram contain the pantograph
18:23:48  <supermop_home> instead both the 2nd and 3rd part each randomly decide to have one
18:24:15  <supermop_home> so some trams have no panto, and some have two
18:25:34  <supermop_home> because each articulated part navigates the switch chain on its own, with different random bits
18:27:54  <Eddi|zuHause> so what's the problem here?
18:28:27  <Eddi|zuHause> you can run the random switch on the PARENT bits instead
18:28:32  <Eddi|zuHause> to have the same one for both
18:28:39  <supermop_home> generally i'd like to enforce trams to have at least one pantograph
18:28:44  <supermop_home> oh yeah
18:28:52  <supermop_home> makes sense
18:29:24  <Eddi|zuHause> and just have the decision chains reversed
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19:42:45  <Eddi|zuHause> a little beethoven for a quiet weekend?
19:43:46  <Eddi|zuHause> (bonus: watch out for the spontaneous synchronization at 1:50)
19:59:45  <andythenorth> right
19:59:51  <andythenorth> let’s FAB FIRS
19:59:59  <andythenorth> why play FIRS?
20:00:10  <andythenorth> (FAB = Feature, Advantage, Benefit)
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20:05:17  <frosch123> 1 play firs, 2 ???, 3 profit
20:07:09  <andythenorth> why FIRS not The Other Industry Sets?
20:07:20  <supermop_home> firs is better
20:07:25  <supermop_home> industries cuter
20:07:38  <andythenorth> why not No Industry Set?
20:07:48  <supermop_home> and firs more maintained
20:08:06  <andythenorth> is there any kind of challenge?
20:08:17  <andythenorth> “You’re Mario, rescue Princess” etc
20:09:46  <frosch123> challenge: make andy happy
20:11:02  <supermop_home> frosch123 no one has won that yet
20:11:18  <supermop_home> complexity is itself a challange
20:11:23  <supermop_home> enge
20:11:47  <supermop_home> if you want to play like a clock maker, watching pixels move about
20:12:13  <supermop_home> more types of pixels and different places for them to go is meaningful in and of itself
20:16:16  <andythenorth> is supplies significant or not?
20:16:31  <frosch123> it's kind of the core of firsd
20:16:33  <andythenorth> I am always disatisfied with the mechanic, so not keep to push it
20:16:35  <supermop_home> supplies is the firs brand
20:16:42  <andythenorth> keep / keen /s
20:16:50  <supermop_home> regardless of if they are meaningful
20:17:02  <andythenorth> so how do we describe that?
20:17:11  <andythenorth> “Unique supplies for primary industries?
20:17:21  <andythenorth> But do people know what primary industries are?
20:17:37  <frosch123> i think the point is that industries do *not* change production randomly
20:18:11  <frosch123> but react directly to players supplying them
20:18:57  <andythenorth> “Industry Production Re-imagined”
20:19:27  <SpComb> a minimalist industrial set that only has coal mines and power stations
20:19:58  <supermop_home> Firs Industries Require Supplies?
20:20:18  <frosch123> andythenorth: if you want to write bs, write "the most popular industry set"
20:20:45  <frosch123> add a "in the west" to make it even more bs
20:26:16  <andythenorth> “FIRS: play industries your way"
20:26:37  <andythenorth> “Vorsprung Durch FIRS"
20:29:02  <andythenorth> what was the original pitch? o_O
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20:38:29  <Eddi|zuHause> surely it'd be "in the north"
20:39:30  <frosch123> the best industry set in the north?
20:45:12  <andythenorth> Northern Industries
20:46:31  <frosch123> live the dream of a someone in the north in a hot country?
20:46:36  <frosch123> sounds dangerous
20:48:17  * andythenorth must to bed :)
20:48:21  <andythenorth> bye
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