Log for #openttd on 12th September 2017:
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09:03:23  <Wolf01> Moin
09:03:41  <crem> Yes.
09:06:16  <Alkel_U3> Yes, hello.
09:07:48  <andythenorth> hi hi
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09:59:42  <Wolf01> Floods floods everywhere... that's what you get when nobody clean the sewers here...
10:04:04  <Alkel_U3> cool, I just found the source of loud clicking when I'm pedalling on my bike
10:04:38  <Wolf01> Nice, how did you manage to do that?
10:06:04  <Alkel_U3> just by using it every day... I managed to break off the stem earlier this year, too
10:06:19  <peter1138> Ouch...
10:06:48  <Eddi|zuHause> seriously, how is THAT the weakest point?
10:07:00  <Alkel_U3> I thought the frame would be the only part of the bike I'm not going to replace, but...
10:08:11  <Alkel_U3> yeah, I'm quite surprised, too
10:10:32  <Wolf01> My father's bike has 40 years and it still go great... a bit ruined in the paint and rubber parts, no light, but the frame and mechanic is in a good state
10:12:20  <Alkel_U3> this is a second-hand, cheap, practically noname chineese folder and apparently a mistake
10:14:10  <Wolf01> BTW, at first I thought you was referring at this as the source of clicking: :P
10:14:41  <Alkel_U3> :D
10:19:57  <Wolf01> wonderful
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10:53:13  <Eddi|zuHause> the last game in that list doesn't quite fit the other ones thematically
10:53:25  <Wolf01> Also the first one
10:53:31  <Wolf01> "tycoon"
10:53:37  <Eddi|zuHause> also, last i heard it was delayed again
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10:55:21  <Eddi|zuHause> i've played the guild 1 quite a lot, guild 2 a bit less
10:56:06  <Wolf01> I would totally try the supermarket one, and I would love it if TF will implement a bezier tool like the railway empire one, I get tired to build curves at pieces, specially when you have to lay down a bridge or a tunne and end up with a crooked thing
10:57:14  <Eddi|zuHause> splines are better than bezier, imho
10:58:23  <Eddi|zuHause> but yes, TF definitely needs a multi-point planning mode
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11:01:07  <Wolf01> Also roads... I can't even build a road of the same size in cities, I think it is tied to the city zone, so you start with a straight piece, then you need to curve slightly and you get a different sized road with the same tool... which won't happen if you do it in one piece
11:02:13  <Eddi|zuHause> not sure what you mean
11:02:33  <Wolf01> <- like this, but the narrow part has 4 lanes too
11:06:16  <Eddi|zuHause> each road has two modes, one with narrow sidewalk and one with wide sidewalk
11:06:39  <Eddi|zuHause> typically this is used for upgrading roads
11:07:05  <Eddi|zuHause> so a small road with wide sidewalk can get upgraded to a wide road with narrow sidewalks, without removing the houses
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11:30:35  <Wolf01> I know, but I'm building it as new, without houses around
11:32:16  <Wolf01> here is the actual example
11:32:50  <Wolf01> There's a bridge which has it's own size, but I get the same even on flat land
11:33:34  <Wolf01> And it doesn't matter if I start from the large end or the narrow end, I always get the same result
11:34:04  <Wolf01> If I build it in one action then it's right
11:43:35  <Eddi|zuHause> no idea
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11:52:54  <Wolf01> Raining... thundering... really windy... not giving a fuck
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14:17:45  <peter1138> moo
14:17:47  <peter1138> quiet today
14:17:56  <crem> Moo indeed.
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15:09:38  <Eddi|zuHause> i bought moo a few months back, but only played through one game
15:13:57  <crem> The first one? The first one was great!
15:14:45  <Eddi|zuHause> the last one
15:15:26  <Eddi|zuHause> i have played all the previous ones as well, though
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16:23:58  <andythenorth> o/
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16:46:49  <supermop_> yo
16:46:54  <andythenorth> lo mop
16:47:07  <supermop_> weather is nice here
16:47:21  <supermop_> but pretty down about being back in the us and back at work
16:47:52  <supermop_> got like 4 hours worth of stuff to run by my therapist during our 1 hour appointment today
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16:51:03  <andythenorth> I would have like 39 years of stuff if I saw a therapist
16:51:07  <andythenorth> but I don’t :P
16:51:28  <andythenorth> maybe we all should
16:51:35  <supermop_> yeah i guess i could just stop going
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18:12:56  <andythenorth> quak is it?
18:14:19  <frosch123> hoi
18:40:32  * andythenorth wonders if 4x for gung ho is a good idea
18:40:46  <andythenorth> in Steeltown the chains are very additive
18:41:11  <andythenorth> to clear all the iron and steel, it has to be delivered, which ultimately results in more supplies :P
18:41:21  <andythenorth> which means more coal and iron ore
18:41:31  <andythenorth> and more iron and steel to clear :P
18:43:07  <Wolf01> o/, quak
18:43:36  <andythenorth> lo Wolf01
18:50:44  <andythenorth> what a grumpy sounding ticket
18:50:55  <andythenorth> FS needs more smilies :P
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18:51:29  <y2000rtc> Hi there. :)
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19:23:21  <andythenorth> peter1138 :P
19:23:55  <andythenorth> 20km rail line with this?
19:26:23  <Wolf01> What. Have. You. Done.
19:30:08  <peter1138> Heh
19:31:26  <peter1138> Don't think RailCraft is available for 1.12.1
19:31:50  <Wolf01> Also it's a client mod, I only play with server mods :(
19:32:07  <peter1138> I play with aesthetic client mods
19:32:27  <Wolf01> Resource packs
19:33:06  <Wolf01> I have one in my server to make some graphics more 3D, like tracks, ladders, furnaces
19:34:39  <Wolf01> lol
19:40:42  <peter1138> Nah, more than just resource packs.
19:40:53  <peter1138> Better Foliage and Dynamic Surroundings.
19:43:53  <peter1138> Don't forget about TrainCraft :p
19:45:54  <peter1138> Which has the scale completely wrong, but hey.
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20:17:10  <Eddi|zuHause> i've never tried minecraft mods
20:17:37  <frosch123> are they like newgrf? :p
20:18:06  <Eddi|zuHause> worse, probably :p
20:18:31  <Eddi|zuHause> i've watched some lets play using
20:19:16  <Eddi|zuHause> i've no idea why they used 1.7.10, though
20:19:56  <Eddi|zuHause> last time i used minecraft i updated to 1.8, which let me repair the crazy imba bow i fished out of the river
20:20:35  <Eddi|zuHause> with, like, infinite, power 5, fire 2 or so
20:20:50  <LordAro> lots of mods never updated past 1.7.10
20:20:53  <Wolf01> 1.8 changed some mechanic which was used by the mods
20:20:57  <LordAro> 1.8 had lots of internal changes
20:22:15  <Eddi|zuHause> so it's like chills patchpack which died with the grfv8 changes?
20:23:17  <frosch123> that's only a timely correlation, is it?
20:23:59  <Wolf01> It's like my old mods which died with UI refactoring
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20:24:01  <Eddi|zuHause> no, afair there was quite a bunch of major patches in that area, which made updating it too big of a task
20:24:39  <Eddi|zuHause> at least big enough that it would have been easier to start from scratch
20:24:45  <Eddi|zuHause> and then nobody did that
20:25:46  <andythenorth> does minecraft break savegames sometimes?
20:26:22  <Eddi|zuHause> usually not, i think
20:26:41  <Eddi|zuHause> but if you remove mods, you first need to remove all blocks from that mod
20:26:51  <Eddi|zuHause> otherwise nasty things may happen
20:27:02  <Wolf01> Nah, they disappear or are changed to a base block
20:27:19  <Eddi|zuHause> also, i had some ancient alpha or beta world, which i could not load when i tried minecraft again with 1.4
20:27:24  <Wolf01> MC only breaks the worlds with terrain generator updates
20:27:49  <Eddi|zuHause> yeah, you get chunk errors if you update and then explore new areas
20:27:59  <andythenorth> btw, why do we need a loading indicator setting?
20:28:06  <Wolf01> Not really errors, just a different terrain
20:28:09  <Eddi|zuHause> like one chunk is ocean and the next is a giant mountain
20:28:11  <andythenorth> it’s also in transparency (it has the daft train icon)
20:28:23  <Eddi|zuHause> with a straight wall
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20:30:13  <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: i think the question is backwards. why shouldn't all the other transparency stuff show in settings as well?
20:32:07  <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: the problem with the settings window isn't really that there are too many settings. it's that the new players are overwhelmed because the settings come up all at once, instead of being introduced step by step
20:32:20  <Eddi|zuHause> because individually, every setting is quite logical
20:34:15  <andythenorth> at some point, settings drown progress :P
20:34:26  <andythenorth> maybe not this one
20:36:35  <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: we had a similar discussion a while back which was about the world generation window, and whether the things which appear there should be duplicated in the settings
20:37:00  <LordAro> factorio does the same when you upgrade, it's just not as noticeable
20:37:47  <Eddi|zuHause> well, eu4 completely breaks savegames when they do map changes
20:38:19  <Eddi|zuHause> which means almost every release, sometimes every second release
20:43:39  <andythenorth> sometimes breaking savegames isn’t the worst thing ever
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20:45:28  <ic111> Question: Can the same widget constant (e.g. something like WID_VT_NON_STOP_DROPDOWN) occur multiple times in the nested tree, or is this forbidden / impossible?
20:46:35  <ic111> I ask because space in the timetable / order window might be distributed better, if the Selections would be above the button rows
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20:49:58  <ic111> (damn connection...)
20:50:47  <ic111> E.g. SELECTION_ONE for one kind of selected line (e.g. Station) having ButtonOne, DropdownTwo, ButtonThree
20:51:14  <ic111> SELECTION_TWO for another kind of selected line (e.g. Waypoint) having ButtonOne, DropdownFour, ButtonFive
20:51:34  <ic111> where some things, like the non-stop-dropdown occur for multiple kinds of selected lines
20:57:40  <frosch123> the widget constant is used as a key in a map
20:57:43  <frosch123> so it must be unique
20:58:47  <ic111> Ok, so if one wants the same button in multiple SELECTION variants, one would really need to duplicate the constants
20:59:19  <ic111> Thank you
21:05:33  <Wolf01> Or just don't use the constants
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21:08:59  <ic111> Wolf01: Hm, but if I handle a button in a click handler, I need the constant there - or do I miss something?
21:09:23  <Wolf01> Widget-constant_start
21:10:05  <Wolf01> Look at the "invisibility" buttons in the transparency toolbar
21:10:23  <Wolf01> (that's the last place where I've seen that)
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21:11:05  <ic111> Ah, you mean lines like "ToggleInvisibility((TransparencyOption)(i - WID_TT_BEGIN));"?
21:11:23  <Wolf01> Yes
21:11:42  <ic111> Ok, thank you, that might indeed make things easier
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21:37:32  <Eddi|zuHause> why am i not surprised that the lotto numbers are 4,8.15,16,23,42?
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22:43:41  <Wolf01> <Eddi|zuHause> why am i not surprised that the lotto numbers are 4,8.15,16,23,42? <- I would have done 3, the last 3... also 8.15?
22:43:57  <Eddi|zuHause> typo
22:44:02  <Eddi|zuHause> s/./,/
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23:23:06  <Wolf01> 'night
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