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00:23:39 *** Flygon has joined #openttd 00:40:16 *** ToBeFree has quit IRC 01:21:06 *** glx has quit IRC 01:55:35 *** sim-al2 has joined #openttd 04:36:11 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 05:23:17 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 05:56:24 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 05:59:47 *** Cubey has quit IRC 06:49:48 *** twb has joined #openttd 06:49:59 <twb> Hi, it's me again, the prison guy. 06:50:13 <__ln__> o/ 06:50:34 <twb> I unpacked the DOOM basemusic (from bananas) into /usr, and now when a new user starts openttd, they get doom by default instead of openmsx 06:50:47 <twb> What governs which gfx/sfx/msx is the default? 06:56:48 <V453000> I need to give that a try someday 06:57:45 <twb> I also noticed that doom was listed on banana's web UI but not on the in-game content manager 06:57:48 <twb> which is weird 06:58:44 <V453000> wt 06:58:45 <V453000> f 06:59:09 <V453000> I see it from r27892 06:59:16 <V453000> does it have any version requirements? 06:59:20 <twb> V453000: oh maybe 06:59:30 <twb> I didn't look very hard so I might have just screwed things up 06:59:41 <twb> I mean: I might have looked wrong, and it *is* there, I'm just stupid 06:59:54 <twb> When I delete DOOM music, the default music is Scott Joplin 07:00:08 <V453000> well if you delete it of course there is some default 07:00:19 <V453000> however that is defined, no clue 07:00:21 <twb> is it just sorting alphabetically? 07:00:55 <twb> http://sprunge.us/JgZi 07:01:47 <V453000> damn now I need to obtain also the old ttd music 07:01:49 <V453000> I lost it somewhere 07:02:21 <V453000> the doom music is awesome if you have a map where is a shitload of trains, fits to the insanity 07:02:38 <V453000> in the startup screen it's a bit megamayhem XD need to change startup screen I guess 07:05:19 <twb> This fixes things: 07:05:20 <twb> root@alef:~# ln -s openmsx /usr/share/games/openttd/baseset/OpenMSX 07:05:37 <twb> So it is probably just using the first one, sorted alphabetically in C locale 07:05:38 <V453000> wow didn't take long to pirate original music :D cba searching on my disks 07:05:51 <V453000> openmsx is trash I don't even download it 07:06:35 <twb> Maybe but I don't want to change the default to doom or joplin in case it triggers a riot 07:08:17 <V453000> well the default is noMusic 07:08:27 <andythenorth> V453000 trains are ass 07:08:34 <V453000> SICK STATEMENT 07:08:36 <V453000> why andythenorth ? 07:08:39 <V453000> trains wreck all shit 07:08:42 <V453000> they best 07:08:48 <andythenorth> my nice engine scheme falls apart when speeds get high 07:08:58 <andythenorth> always problems when high 07:09:29 <andythenorth> think problem is reality 07:09:31 <twb> http://www.idlewords.com/2007/04/the_alameda-weehawken_burrito_tunnel.htm ← better than trains 07:09:35 * andythenorth deletes reality 07:10:36 <V453000> why would there be a problem just because of speedS? 07:10:40 <V453000> poor acceleration? 07:10:44 <V453000> wagon limit shit? 07:11:31 <andythenorth> nah, two fast engines, one electric, one diesel 07:11:34 <twb> Hey my dad said last week that if you use continuous welded rail, you don't need to ever re-weld using thermite because it's a single piece of track 07:11:56 <andythenorth> V453000: reality has electric engine 155mph, diesel engine 125mph 07:11:57 <twb> And I'm like "that's bullshit, if the track cracks dude to subsidence or something, you still have to reweld it" 07:12:04 <twb> I don't suppose you guys know 07:12:32 <andythenorth> no :) 07:12:38 <twb> Ha- wikipedia says I'm right 07:12:54 <twb> »Thermite welding is used to repair or splice together existing CWR segments.« 07:13:03 <twb> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Track_(rail_transport)#Continuous_welded_rail 07:13:14 <__ln__> but was his point that it won't crack at the point where it was welded earlier (any more likely than at any other point) 07:13:22 <andythenorth> V453000: also wtf 07:13:24 <__ln__> many points in that sentence 07:13:47 <V453000> I don't get the problem andythenorth 07:13:50 <twb> __ln__: yeah I grant that breaks are less common because fewer stress points &c 07:14:16 <andythenorth> is BS problem V453000, I just remembered that me and Dan invented the 155mph engine 07:14:19 <andythenorth> is not even realisms :P 07:14:42 <andythenorth> such non-problem 07:15:03 <andythenorth> schema must rule 07:15:33 <andythenorth> problem solved 07:15:36 <V453000> ._. 07:15:57 <andythenorth> electric vs. non electric is challenge 07:16:02 <andythenorth> should be about equsl 07:16:12 <V453000> electric vs. non electric is just a change of one flag 07:16:18 <V453000> nothing more 07:16:19 <andythenorth> reason to build electric: Because Like The Sparks Animation 07:16:21 <twb> you mean electric vs. diesel-electric? 07:16:23 <andythenorth> not economics 07:16:29 <V453000> yes andythenorth 07:16:40 <twb> or like coal-fired steam shit like in northern china 07:16:57 <andythenorth> all of the above twb :) 07:17:11 <twb> coal-fire blows 07:17:12 *** supermop has quit IRC 07:17:25 <andythenorth> V453000: ok thanks, such many insights 07:17:28 <andythenorth> and it’s not even 9am yet 07:17:31 <andythenorth> winning day 07:19:15 <V453000> I mean 07:19:23 <V453000> if you can figure out a nice and sensible way how to make them differ, sure thing 07:19:29 <V453000> one can have more power while other can have more T.E. 07:19:35 <V453000> one can be faster or something 07:19:57 <andythenorth> well yes 07:19:58 <V453000> or you can just have them be an upgrade to diesels in each of the classes 07:20:00 <andythenorth> and also eye candy 07:20:10 <andythenorth> should I do maglev? 07:20:14 <V453000> depends if you treat them as a train class or a generation 07:20:18 <andythenorth> class 07:20:22 <V453000> I think maglev is awesome, monorail just as much 07:20:40 <andythenorth> I need some unrealism speeds after 2020 or so 07:20:42 <V453000> if as a class then give them specific behaviours : ) 07:20:43 <andythenorth> boring 07:20:49 * andythenorth never plays past 1990 or so 07:21:06 <V453000> I find making a set last 1950-2050 is like the minimum for full functionality 07:21:13 <V453000> even vanilla does that 07:21:19 <andythenorth> I go 1900-2000 07:21:21 <V453000> so nuts has 1900 - 2100 07:21:29 <andythenorth> fast trains, you just have to build a perfect network 07:21:34 <andythenorth> no fucked up andythenorth junctions 07:21:39 <V453000> XD 07:21:52 <V453000> depends on their power and TE :P 07:22:06 <V453000> trains with giant TE simply don't give fucks 07:22:16 <andythenorth> super-fast acceleration 07:23:12 <twb> TE? 07:23:24 <andythenorth> tractive effort 07:23:33 <andythenorth> so…dedicated railtype for super-fast train? 07:23:34 <twb> oh like how much shit they can pull 07:24:10 <V453000> more like how fast they accelerate at low speed, when translated to what it actually does 07:24:28 * andythenorth must biab 07:24:29 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 07:25:06 <V453000> in my priimitive explanation I always say that T.E. matters in low speeds and power makes trains reach top speed faster 07:25:22 <V453000> it's not perfectly accurate but from observation seems to be sufficient of an explanation for myself 07:25:35 <twb> Hey, if you're curious, ttd is the 7th most popular game at the main prison: http://sprunge.us/BWeI 07:26:05 <V453000> like in an actual prison people play openttd? 07:26:12 <V453000> fuck I am murdering people right now 07:26:31 <twb> V453000: yes 07:27:03 <V453000> nice 07:27:17 <V453000> I'm not sure if it's the best way how to re-socialize but trainz man 07:28:08 <twb> If I limit to only games, http://sprunge.us/RJUj 07:28:43 *** blocage has joined #openttd 07:29:25 <twb> TBH I was surprised how popular it is 07:30:45 <V453000> I'd expect GTA to be most popular in prison XD 07:30:58 <twb> only FOSS games 07:31:23 <__ln__> won't you get sued and put into prison for calling things "something-registered-trademark clone"? 07:31:46 <V453000> __ln__: they are already in prison, can't put them anywhere :P 07:31:49 <twb> Dunno, legal people said it was OK 07:31:57 <twb> If we get a C&D we can easily change it 07:32:12 <twb> It was just a lost clearer than all the wacky names that the underlying packages have 07:32:26 <twb> especially KDE apps 07:32:38 <__ln__> i can see that perspective, yes 07:33:11 <twb> I forget that you guys probably have a bunch of windows users still — most places I hang out are like 60/40 linux/macos, with like 2 token windows users 07:33:39 <V453000> is free to play FOSS? 07:33:47 <twb> V453000: nope 07:33:59 <V453000> was just curious :) 07:34:25 <twb> V453000: it needs to meet either the Free Software Definition (from FSF) or the Debian Free Software Guidelines / Open Source Definition 07:34:39 <V453000> y 07:34:43 <twb> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Four_freedoms 07:34:46 <V453000> right 07:35:28 <twb> The technical reason why they do games on the computer instead of a separate console, is that prison staff can impose automatic curfews, and remove computer privileges, without having to physically go into the cell with a violent inmate 07:36:00 <twb> If that means they can only get 90s-era games instead of like COD and GTA, they're like "meh whatever" 07:39:03 <V453000> wait so they actually have a computer in the cell? 07:39:08 <twb> yes 07:39:11 <V453000> that's nuts 07:39:31 <twb> how else would they study or talk to their lawyers and family 07:39:46 <V453000> XD 07:40:01 <V453000> why am I not in prison 07:40:04 <twb> p 08:00:00 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 08:10:00 <andythenorth> so basically V453000, you’re saying I should do a full generation of trains in 2020? 08:10:07 <andythenorth> and not just novelty BS? 08:20:13 *** chomwitt has joined #openttd 08:24:34 <V453000> well what does a generation mean for you 08:24:52 <V453000> for me generation is just "same kind of engine, but better in every way", with new graphics ofc 08:30:57 *** happpy has joined #openttd 08:31:04 *** happpy has left #openttd 08:33:56 <V453000> there are probably more ways to do it, I just come from the approach in nuts which is trying to keep it simple 08:34:26 <V453000> 1 class, generations in the class for time progression 08:34:46 <V453000> sure you can have hybrid trains which kind of belong to multiple classes but it will just become harder to make clear distinctions 08:35:08 <V453000> doesn't mean it's wrong, especially if the train has valid uses in some cases in the game 08:37:15 <andythenorth> classes are best 08:37:42 <andythenorth> can I be arsed to do classes in 2020 though :P 08:37:57 <andythenorth> or is 1990 end of Iron Horse progression? :P 08:38:11 <V453000> well they are just easier to develop and easier to understand for the player, someone might be more interested in not having them written anywhere and having them not so obvious so that they can discover themselves but... 08:38:29 <V453000> I believe true end should be at least 2050 to not be worse than vanilla :P 08:38:48 <V453000> the frequency at which trains come out by the end of the game doesn't need to be too high though 08:38:58 <V453000> just some 2 generations in 2000+ can easily be enough 08:39:15 <andythenorth> if I go to 2020 on 30 year generations 08:39:21 <andythenorth> then 2050 is reached 08:39:41 <andythenorth> when does monorail come in default game? 08:39:44 <V453000> in PART I plan to have generations every 20 years at the moment 08:39:44 * andythenorth looks 08:39:47 <V453000> 2001 ish 08:39:54 <V453000> monorail train is called X2001 :P 08:39:58 <andythenorth> 1999 08:40:03 <V453000> k :D 08:40:18 <andythenorth> probably high-speed rail then 08:40:22 <andythenorth> 300km/h 08:40:39 <andythenorth> compatible with ELRL + power-changing BS? 08:40:45 <andythenorth> or just own thing, no compatible? 08:40:54 <V453000> power changing bs? 08:41:16 <andythenorth> like HSPD can go on ELRL, but loses power 08:41:18 <andythenorth> or some shit 08:41:30 <andythenorth> and ELRL can go on HSPD, but blocks the route because it’s slow 08:42:01 <V453000> well I really like to use monorail and maglev because you already have that in the base graphics and it gives more variety to the set, but it has one big drawback that you need to address - autoreplacing between track types ... you can just recommend univrail / purr I guess 08:42:08 <twb> ARGH 08:42:09 <V453000> I understand 08:42:19 <twb> I just spent 20 minutes trying to work out why openttd was saying "file not writable" 08:42:22 <V453000> it's not a horrible concept but if you don't have a big reason for it, I would guess it's just confusing 08:42:28 <twb> $PWD was / rather than $HOME 08:42:38 <andythenorth> are waypoints ass? I never use them 08:42:48 <andythenorth> not sure how else to keep slow trains off the MOAR tracks 08:43:01 <V453000> having vehicles adjust their max speed property based on railtype also allows for some high level mayhem that only 0.01% of people will ever use :P 08:43:02 <twb> Hrm that's not the problem 08:43:09 <V453000> waypoints are useful 08:43:14 <twb> Guess I'll have to strace 08:43:22 <V453000> but generally you should try to have all trains same speed 08:44:59 <andythenorth> auto-replacing :P 08:45:03 <andythenorth> such mess 08:45:28 <V453000> it's important :) 08:46:13 <V453000> Pikka's way of doing it in UKRS isn't stupid, making the maglev engines totally obscure lengths so that it makes no sense to autoreplace them, or you have to really prepare for it from earlier 08:46:31 <V453000> but I don't like that solution because it means "ok now you built that network, now abandon it and build an extra reinforcing line" 08:46:38 <andythenorth> yeah 08:46:47 <V453000> while I think it's much more interesting to motivate you to fix your old shit and build on it 08:46:48 <andythenorth> that is why I didn’t bother with this in Horse 1 08:47:01 <andythenorth> also, types compatibility is ass 08:47:09 <andythenorth> if HSPD can go on ELRL, ELRL can go on HSPD 08:47:15 <andythenorth> because fuckwittedness 08:47:17 <V453000> haha 08:47:33 <andythenorth> frosch wants to fix that stupidity 08:47:34 <V453000> more sense to use monorail and/or maglev :P 08:49:32 <andythenorth> meh 08:49:44 <andythenorth> I am more interested in drawing cute trains with cargos + random 08:49:51 <andythenorth> than sorting out railtypes bollocks :P 08:50:08 <V453000> well sure you can draw whole cute generation for a railtype :P 08:50:13 <V453000> no messing and sorting out 08:51:19 <andythenorth> high speed is planes, no? :P 08:51:24 <andythenorth> but players have asked https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=1173195#p1173195 08:52:43 <V453000> some players on our servers don't even consider trains under 300km/h proper :P 08:52:49 <V453000> it's just fun to see them go fast 08:52:57 <V453000> also gives you the feeling of modern age 08:53:10 <V453000> if the game is in 160-200kmh forever it's just stale and the same 08:53:47 <V453000> my cap is around 500km/h, more is just dumb, 400km/h is fast as fuck, 300km/h is fast, 265km/h is slug-fast which is awesome 08:57:35 <andythenorth> 300km/h is also super-realism 08:57:50 <V453000> lawyered 08:59:40 *** gelignite has joined #openttd 09:16:06 *** FLHerne has joined #openttd 09:18:00 *** twb has quit IRC 10:11:33 <andythenorth> so probably not railtypes then 10:11:35 <andythenorth> due to bollocks 10:11:38 <andythenorth> just fast trains 10:19:41 <peter1138> Just make it go 65535km/h 10:19:57 <andythenorth> ok 10:20:05 <andythenorth> how far does it move per tick? 10:20:06 <peter1138> Use callbacks to actually limit it to a proper speed. 10:20:21 <peter1138> That'll confuse no-one. 10:20:33 * andythenorth now trying a silly fast train 10:21:55 <andythenorth> meh 10:21:59 <andythenorth> 9000 is too large 10:22:41 <peter1138> Doesn't move? 10:24:46 <andythenorth> nml won’t accept it 10:24:51 <andythenorth> action 0 property too large 10:25:02 <andythenorth> won’t accept any value > 200 10:28:16 <andythenorth> hmm lies 10:33:48 <V453000> the fuck 10:34:40 <V453000> do you give it units? 10:34:41 <V453000> I didn't 10:34:53 <V453000> also I know that callbacks can give more values 10:35:09 <V453000> but not sure if it relates to speed 10:36:16 <andythenorth> no units :| 10:36:20 <andythenorth> weird 10:36:33 <andythenorth> seems I ran into this before 10:36:40 <andythenorth> my code sets a warning if the speed is too high 10:36:43 <andythenorth> some bollocks 10:54:05 <V453000> wtf XD 10:54:25 <V453000> try disabling the REALISTIC_SPEEDS flag 11:14:07 <V453000> hm, haz moar plan 11:14:12 <V453000> ideas, gg 11:41:07 *** chomwitt has quit IRC 11:45:23 *** Wolf01 has joined #openttd 11:47:41 <Wolf01> o/ 11:48:37 <__ln__> \o 11:52:29 <andythenorth> hi Wolf01 12:03:07 <Wolf01> http://drinkdecaf.com/magicavoxel_animate huhuhuhu 12:04:25 <Wolf01> I should do an app for this 12:05:13 <Wolf01> Mmmh maybe with autohotkey 12:11:53 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 12:32:59 <peter1138> Why is it so slow? 12:33:14 <peter1138> Is it raytracing? 12:33:45 <Wolf01> Dunno 12:34:07 <Wolf01> https://github.com/tommyettinger/IsoVoxel also this, is already done 12:35:16 <Wolf01> But uses its own render 12:41:57 *** Compu has quit IRC 12:41:57 *** quiznilo has quit IRC 12:41:57 *** DDR has quit IRC 12:41:57 *** mindlesstux has quit IRC 12:41:57 *** Laedek has quit IRC 12:41:57 *** Tharbakim has quit IRC 12:41:57 *** Ttech has quit IRC 12:41:57 *** Maarten has quit IRC 12:41:57 *** techmagus has quit IRC 12:41:57 *** bwn has quit IRC 12:41:57 *** cHawk has quit IRC 12:41:57 *** agentthom has quit IRC 12:41:57 *** _dp_ has quit IRC 12:41:57 *** Sylf has quit IRC 12:41:58 *** nahkiss has quit IRC 12:41:58 *** ccfreak2k has quit IRC 12:41:58 *** Vadtec has quit IRC 12:41:58 *** Extrems has quit IRC 12:41:58 *** mikegrb has quit IRC 12:41:58 *** sim-al2 has quit IRC 12:41:58 *** Flygon has quit IRC 12:41:58 *** Speedy has quit IRC 12:41:58 *** OsteHovel has quit IRC 12:41:58 *** supermop_home has quit IRC 12:41:58 *** Smedles has quit IRC 12:41:58 *** jinks has quit IRC 12:41:58 *** dvim has quit IRC 12:41:58 *** greeter has quit IRC 12:44:29 *** greeter has joined #openttd 12:44:29 *** dvim has joined #openttd 12:44:29 *** jinks has joined #openttd 12:44:29 *** Smedles has joined #openttd 12:44:29 *** supermop_home has joined #openttd 12:44:29 *** OsteHovel has joined #openttd 12:44:29 *** Speedy has joined #openttd 12:44:29 *** Flygon has joined #openttd 12:44:29 *** sim-al2 has joined #openttd 12:44:29 *** Vadtec has joined #openttd 12:44:29 *** ccfreak2k has joined #openttd 12:44:29 *** Extrems has joined #openttd 12:44:29 *** mikegrb has joined #openttd 12:44:29 *** nahkiss has joined #openttd 12:44:29 *** Sylf has joined #openttd 12:44:29 *** _dp_ has joined #openttd 12:44:29 *** agentthom has joined #openttd 12:44:29 *** cHawk has joined #openttd 12:44:29 *** Compu has joined #openttd 12:44:29 *** quiznilo has joined #openttd 12:44:29 *** DDR has joined #openttd 12:44:29 *** mindlesstux has joined #openttd 12:44:29 *** Laedek has joined #openttd 12:44:29 *** Tharbakim has joined #openttd 12:44:29 *** Ttech has joined #openttd 12:44:29 *** Maarten has joined #openttd 12:44:29 *** techmagus has joined #openttd 12:44:29 *** bwn has joined #openttd 12:47:41 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v orudge 12:47:41 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v Rubidium 12:47:41 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v Terkhen 12:47:41 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v planetmaker 13:30:06 *** supermop has joined #openttd 13:35:27 <supermop> yo 13:36:17 <crem> Indeed, yo. 13:45:37 *** sim-al2 has quit IRC 14:45:01 *** Flygon has quit IRC 14:55:22 *** smoke_fumus has joined #openttd 15:14:08 *** Alberth has joined #openttd 15:14:08 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Alberth 15:14:13 <Alberth> o/ 15:14:56 <andythenorth> lo Alberth 15:15:06 <Wolf01> o/ 15:15:11 <supermop> yo again 15:18:04 *** blocage has quit IRC 15:31:08 <Wolf01> https://xkcd.com/1892/ true 15:31:31 <Wolf01> Also pub and out for dinner, BBL 16:05:12 *** TheMask96 has quit IRC 16:07:37 *** TheMask96 has joined #openttd 16:13:11 *** frosch123 has joined #openttd 16:22:33 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 16:42:46 *** yorick_ has joined #openttd 16:42:51 *** Cubey has joined #openttd 16:51:29 *** glx has joined #openttd 16:51:29 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v glx 16:52:12 *** Speedy has quit IRC 17:01:40 <Eddi|zuHause> i have an unusually long usb cable 17:02:23 <frosch123> diameter is more important than length 17:04:52 <supermop> heyoo 17:05:21 <andythenorth> so how fast should trains go? 17:05:40 <frosch123> should there be a limit? 17:06:46 <supermop> C? 17:08:37 <frosch123> anyway, for cargo gameplay behaviour, the increase of speed*capacity should match the increase of industry output 17:08:57 <frosch123> or you need to sell trains after upgrading 17:09:36 <frosch123> (and yes, that is not easy to answer for firs :p) 17:11:29 <andythenorth> FIRS is silly 17:11:40 <andythenorth> we need that ‘go to depot and sell’ thing 17:11:41 <andythenorth> eh 17:11:46 <andythenorth> also consist management :P 17:12:17 <frosch123> i went the lazy route and use overflow depots 17:12:41 <andythenorth> +1 17:13:06 <andythenorth> I use an order though, not the force-depot track layout 17:14:01 <frosch123> is use the force-depot directly in front of the station 17:14:12 <frosch123> all trains go the the depot and wait there until a platform is free 17:14:19 <frosch123> laziest setup of all :) 17:14:40 <frosch123> using the complete vertical storage space of depots 17:20:33 *** Stimrol has joined #openttd 17:21:47 <V453000> haha "P 17:21:48 <V453000> :P 17:21:59 <V453000> it's like saying automating in factorio is lazy 17:22:47 *** Speedy` has joined #openttd 17:22:57 *** Speedy` is now known as Speedy 17:23:52 <frosch123> isn't that what the achievements communicate? 17:24:20 <frosch123> also, i want a cogwheel shaped wheelchair 17:24:27 <frosch123> no, not wheelchair, the other thing 17:24:40 <frosch123> rocking chair 17:24:51 <frosch123> cogwheel shaped rocking chair :) 17:29:51 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: also add a "clone this train if it's full" order 17:30:09 <andythenorth> might as well add UI scripting eh :) 17:30:22 <Eddi|zuHause> 1: goto A, 2: clone train, 3: goto B, 4: sell train 17:31:06 <frosch123> good point, that also solves the train replacement 17:31:19 <frosch123> you only have to adjust a single train 17:31:29 <frosch123> and the older ones will phase out on their own 17:32:29 *** Progman has joined #openttd 17:39:34 *** Speedy has quit IRC 18:08:13 *** Coobies has joined #openttd 18:13:24 *** Cubey has quit IRC 18:19:17 *** supermop has quit IRC 18:32:14 *** TrueBrain-Bot has joined #openttd 18:32:28 *** TrueBrain_ is now known as TrueBrain 18:32:44 *** Wormnest has joined #openttd 18:33:50 <andythenorth> supermop_home: name some trains :P 18:34:02 * andythenorth is lacking inspiration for Brit roster for 1990 onwards 18:34:08 <andythenorth> 1) I never play this late 18:34:23 <andythenorth> 2) it exactly co-incides with my teenage train obsession 18:34:28 <andythenorth> so I know too much realism 18:46:05 <planetmaker> good evening :) 18:47:13 <frosch123> hoi, any new planets? 18:50:02 *** supermop has joined #openttd 18:50:08 <planetmaker> yeah... some 18:50:20 <planetmaker> I was actually busy to erode planets :D 18:50:30 <supermop> oooh 18:50:57 <supermop> i spent liek 8+ hours trying to erode a map in the SE this past weekend 18:51:08 <planetmaker> my eroded micro-planets: https://photos.app.goo.gl/5jEDufWQ9iPXWgxr2 :p 18:54:53 <frosch123> is that a mm scale on the right? 18:55:46 <andythenorth> supermop you have a question from me…at home :P 18:56:16 <supermop> i don't know if that computer is on? 18:56:23 <supermop> supermop_home: oh maybe it is 18:56:53 <supermop> well this one was asleep so i didn't see it 18:57:02 <andythenorth> http://webster.openttdcoop.org/?channel=openttd&date=1505865600#1505932430 18:58:33 <planetmaker> jo, mm-scale 18:59:12 <planetmaker> but I was only doing it for this: https://photos.app.goo.gl/ihaL4IQkG0hLSf422 :P 19:00:19 <frosch123> did you fly 542 times with that plane? 19:02:37 <supermop> andythenorth: similar, 90s is not enough locomotives, and all of them i've actually seen 19:03:31 <planetmaker> 31 parabols per flight. So that was awarded after 17 flights 19:03:46 <planetmaker> but that's the sum over the last 17 years or so 19:03:57 <supermop> how many more until you get a free flight? 19:04:11 <planetmaker> they were all free ... I was paid ;) 19:04:24 <Alberth> :) 19:04:31 <frosch123> 31 sounds like they avoided 42 19:04:49 <planetmaker> reasoning is: 30 parabols. Plus a 0th for getting used-to 19:05:15 <Alberth> 17 flights is more mysterious :p 19:05:39 <supermop> also why not give the award for 500 19:05:42 <frosch123> ah, you throw up on the first one, and then you can get out the technical stuff which should stay clean :) 19:05:45 <Alberth> I mean, it's not a natural number to give anything 19:05:58 <planetmaker> it's now 18 flights ;) 19:06:16 <planetmaker> but depends on amount of team members of how many flights per campaign there are per person 19:06:33 <supermop> so if you are flying on a parabolic trajectory, how many miles do you earn? 19:07:02 <Alberth> I hope you're not starting to wonder why a commercial airplane never seems to be starting the 'normal' parabole flight pattern :p 19:07:10 <planetmaker> hm... 2 miles up, 2 miles down. And 1 minute flight at ~600 mph. 19:07:13 <V453000> I feel like I don't understand a word but I feel the urge to congratulate pm! :D 19:07:14 <supermop> the length of the parabola, or the straight line distance projected on earth? 19:07:33 <supermop> V453000: zero gravity 19:07:51 <Alberth> 17 x 31 times :) 19:08:21 <frosch123> V453000: tl;dr; pm gets paid for testing fun parks 19:08:24 <planetmaker> https://www.flightradar24.com/data/aircraft/f-wnov#eda7154 <-- last flight route 19:08:37 <planetmaker> hehe 19:09:12 <V453000> so you fly an airplane up and down to get zero gravity state? :D like rollercoaster? :D 19:09:45 <frosch123> like a rollercoaster with a 2miles downhill 19:09:59 <V453000> the flight chart of altitude suggests that XD 19:10:05 <Alberth> rollercoaster doesn't quite reach zero gravity 19:10:08 <V453000> that's utterly awesome 19:10:14 <V453000> yeah blabla Alberth :P 19:10:22 <Alberth> those chair lifts that fall down do, though 19:10:26 <planetmaker> V453000, yeah, exactly taht 19:10:30 <V453000> that's sick pm :D 19:10:37 <frosch123> "sick" :p 19:10:38 <V453000> may I ask what kind of research is it for? :P 19:10:45 <planetmaker> only if you easily get motion-sickness. Otherwise it's great fun :) 19:10:52 <V453000> haha 19:10:58 <V453000> I think I am quite resistant to that 19:11:19 <planetmaker> V453000, I'm not joking with my nickname :) Planet making or formation is what I'm getting paid for ;) 19:11:34 <V453000> well that I know 19:11:47 <V453000> oh so are you simulating space environment by that? 19:12:09 <planetmaker> yeah, the start of planet formation happens in the absence of big gravity :) 19:12:17 <V453000> :0 cool 19:13:49 <planetmaker> the sick thing is: their promotional video is from my previous campaign... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9dkFLobZsJg 19:15:12 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 19:18:31 *** ic111 has joined #openttd 19:19:38 <V453000> damn that's awesome 19:19:56 <V453000> so you are the pilot or one of the scientists on board? or both? XD 19:22:17 <planetmaker> lol, pilot? No 19:22:40 <planetmaker> I'm just one of the science guys floating several times through the images 19:22:40 <V453000> in english "flying airplanes" is a confusing term :P 19:22:44 <V453000> cool 19:22:50 <V453000> hm I didn't notice you 19:22:52 <V453000> damn 19:24:37 * andythenorth tries to spot PM 19:25:17 <V453000> FOUND HIM :> 19:25:35 <andythenorth> I thought I saw him in a seat 19:26:54 <V453000> he's definitely investigating the hell out of that mysterious box in 4:42 right :) 19:26:55 <Rubidium> andythenorth: you mean at 1:31? 19:27:15 <andythenorth> yes 19:27:23 <andythenorth> was that PM? 19:27:38 <V453000> the window seat? 19:27:41 * andythenorth has only seen one picture of most ottd people 19:27:59 <V453000> andythenorth: saddest part is that I saw him at least twice in person XD 19:28:03 <V453000> memory is a bitch 19:28:15 <andythenorth> such meetups 19:28:31 <planetmaker> 1:29, 1:51, 2:10, 2:22, 2:25, 4:41, 4:51 19:29:01 <planetmaker> or roughly 19:29:07 <planetmaker> so... what's new here? 19:29:14 <V453000> =D nice 19:29:25 <V453000> andythenorth is wrecking hs newgrfs every day, nothing new 19:29:33 <V453000> I'm finishing BRIX and planning next train set 19:29:37 <V453000> no drama anywhere :( 19:30:05 <planetmaker> no cats? Or slugs set free accidentially and on rampage? 19:30:13 <V453000> no cats 19:30:17 <andythenorth> drama such forums V453000 19:30:21 <andythenorth> but really low grade 19:30:22 <V453000> can't confirm no slugs 19:34:12 <Wolf01> I have 3 hours before sleepflix, what could I do? 19:34:26 <frosch123> sports :p 19:34:27 <andythenorth> watch this video https://www.eurobricks.com/forum/index.php?/forums/topic/154440-land-carrier-khagaan/ 19:34:27 <Rubidium> plan a vacation? 19:34:45 <andythenorth> Wolf01: 5km on exercise bike 19:34:54 <Wolf01> Oh god, they built it 19:35:02 <andythenorth> it’s a great video 19:35:28 <ic111> Wolf01 - If I get https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=63721&start=120#p1192050 right you wanted to show me something? 19:35:41 <Wolf01> Oh, yes 19:35:44 <V453000> andythenorth: it won't get an video-of-the-evening award but it's still awesome 19:35:50 <ic111> (happily, after about 4 days, my internet provider brought back service...) 19:37:07 <Wolf01> Wow, great video indeed 19:37:45 <V453000> and I'm sitting here making dumb ass trees for a 90s game :P 19:39:01 <Wolf01> ic111: https://imgur.com/a/n3i1I 19:39:43 <Wolf01> I'm aiming to something like this: https://imgur.com/a/jlUxq 19:42:02 <supermop> ok so why does the first little rover have to go up on deck to drop off it's cargo 19:42:12 <supermop> looks like something from Dune 19:42:31 <Wolf01> deserts od karak 19:42:35 <Wolf01> *of 19:42:35 <supermop> or what i imagined dune looking like when i read it 19:42:53 <ic111> Ah, so a rewrite of the map generator GUI? 19:42:54 <supermop> i never played the game or saw any of the films 19:43:05 <Wolf01> I played with dune before reading the books, so I had few things left to immagination 19:43:13 <ic111> I extended that one in my rivers patch 19:43:52 <ic111> The rainfall river generator patch contains an additional option to choose the river generator, and a setting dialog to configure the generator settings 19:44:02 <Wolf01> ic111: yes, but I didn't use the classic "put everything on one window and remove what it's not really needed and move it to settings" 19:44:39 <ic111> Yes, you group the settings in something like tabs 19:44:44 *** blocage has joined #openttd 19:44:51 <Wolf01> Actually they are tabs 19:45:27 <ic111> Yes, they are (had the appearance of browser tabs in mind when I wrote "something like") 19:46:18 <ic111> I just start thinking - where would I place my river settings in that concept? 19:47:24 <Wolf01> I'd say on gameplay, as rivers alter the gameplay, not the map creation 19:48:10 <ic111> Hm, my first thought was "map, as rivers are part of the map" 19:48:23 <ic111> But you are right, everything in that dialog is related to the map 19:48:25 <andythenorth> planetmaker: don’t you to use tricks to build the seaplane airport? 19:48:28 <ic111> somehow 19:48:30 <andythenorth> +need 19:48:41 <andythenorth> with canal or so? 19:49:01 <Wolf01> "Map" should be "general", you have the most common changed settings for generation 19:49:16 <ic111> What I meant is especially: I have one additional dropdown for choosing the generator - but then a couple of generator settings that are currently in a separate dialog 19:49:52 <ic111> So, either one would need a button under "Gameplay" to access that dialog, or an additional tab - which might interfere with overall design of that window... 19:50:16 <ic111> Especially, as my dialog is wider than one column of widgets 19:51:05 <Wolf01> The window I made is really small compared to the old one 19:51:22 <Wolf01> So I think there's some margin of expansion 19:52:00 <ic111> See here https://www.tt-forums.net/download/file.php?id=182200 (page 16) for a screenshot of my generator GUI changes (some small changes occured lateron, but the concept stayed the same) 19:53:05 * andythenorth needs art 19:54:46 <Wolf01> Yes, could have a tab on its own or a button on the gameplay tab 19:55:45 *** Stimrol has quit IRC 19:55:55 <ic111> Anyway, probably the timetable patch consumes enough of my time at the moment ;-) 19:56:54 <Wolf01> Oh, mine was just a demo to show you that you can change the old approach to create UIs, they don't need to be a static rectangle filled with widgets ;) 19:56:59 <Wolf01> The SELECTION widget is really powerful, it only needs to be handled carefully 19:58:28 <ic111> Though I learned quite a lot about the limits of the OpenTTD GUI engine when I designed that river configuration window 19:58:37 <ic111> (maybe also about my limits to understand it...) 20:00:34 *** Stimrol has joined #openttd 20:05:13 <ic111> Current screenshot of the adjusted timetable window is now here: https://www.tt-forums.net/download/file.php?id=199737 20:05:20 <V453000> hmm, ALL 4 climates are wrong in my "tree sprite ID table" :D 20:05:21 <V453000> somehow 20:07:16 <andythenorth> ok such http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/8629/pony%20speeds.png 20:07:19 <andythenorth> need advice / ideas 20:07:27 <andythenorth> ?? need deciding 20:07:32 <andythenorth> or don’t continue to 2020 20:08:06 <V453000> continue to 2020 20:08:28 <andythenorth> realism says 125mph, then 186mph, but only special train on special railtype 20:08:34 <V453000> 90 - 125 - 125? 20:08:48 <andythenorth> or 90, 140, 186 or so 20:08:48 <V453000> sure why not 20:08:53 <V453000> no need for special railtype 20:08:59 <andythenorth> railtype bollocks boggles my brain 20:09:07 <andythenorth> scrap railtype 20:09:10 <V453000> mono and mglv is cute 20:09:21 <andythenorth> did anyone make a decent mglv grf? 20:09:24 <V453000> but if you don't like it then it's not just pure benefit, has some downside 20:09:29 <V453000> andythenorth: nuts? :P 20:09:35 <V453000> other than that not really 20:09:38 <andythenorth> ok fine, add NUTs with Horse 20:09:40 <andythenorth> Horse Nuts 20:09:43 <V453000> XD 20:09:47 <V453000> amazing 20:10:46 <andythenorth> up to 1990 horse is ‘engine’ and ‘pax cars’ and ‘mail cars' 20:11:05 <andythenorth> switch to some unit thing? 20:11:07 <andythenorth> mail: http://www.lightstraw.co.uk/gpo/tpo/emu325_1024.jpg 20:11:22 <V453000> you can always have it look like an unit :) 20:11:35 <andythenorth> pax http://www.gaugemaster.com/media/wysiwyg/articles/guides/eurostar03.jpg 20:11:43 <andythenorth> problem is, I don’t really care :) 20:11:49 <andythenorth> never goes well 20:11:53 <V453000> well in that case it's clear XD 20:11:55 <andythenorth> was useful having a DanMacK 20:11:58 <andythenorth> to do some caring 20:11:59 <V453000> I really like passenger trains looking like units 20:12:04 <andythenorth> outsource caring, I just code and draw 20:12:06 <V453000> all passenger class trains in nuts do that 20:12:10 <V453000> shitload of switches for graphics 20:12:19 <andythenorth> do you use two-headed train thing? 20:12:46 <andythenorth> cabooses are two-headed 20:12:50 <V453000> yes often 20:14:28 <andythenorth> hmm 20:14:29 <V453000> generally for passenger trains yeah 20:14:36 <V453000> not really much for freight 20:14:40 <andythenorth> could mess with dates, add whole new class of trains, two-headed 20:14:40 <V453000> except mono, mglv and slugs 20:14:53 <andythenorth> introduce 1980 or so, mess up nice order 20:15:09 <V453000> I really like double headed trains, makes trains reverse nicely in dead end stations :OP 20:18:12 <frosch123> andythenorth: you can have early engines which are really fast, but too weak to reach topspeed with more than 2 wagons 20:19:02 <V453000> I would imagine the express freight to do that yeah 20:19:24 <andythenorth> 100mph in 1860 20:19:31 <andythenorth> possible 20:19:42 <andythenorth> what is most eye candy things 20:19:46 <andythenorth> after 1990? 20:20:01 * andythenorth could just do 1860-1960 :P 20:20:07 <andythenorth> still 100 years, right? 20:20:21 <frosch123> generally, the train front 20:20:31 <Wolf01> https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/95/Penistone_Station_geograph-2383830-by-Ben-Brooksbank.jpg does it really need all those pantographs? 20:20:51 <frosch123> tgv and ice look very similar, shinkansen looks really different 20:22:14 <andythenorth> Wolf01: is to keep contact in poor weather 20:22:33 <andythenorth> also that station is notorious for people taking pictures with part of station name obscured by train 20:22:39 <andythenorth> rude words :P 20:22:53 <Wolf01> :D 20:23:16 <supermop> frosch123: tgv and the first ice have locomotives 20:23:26 <supermop> shinkansen was emu from the start 20:23:42 <andythenorth> wow some ugly new train https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/36/Eurostar_Class_374_on_HS1.jpg/1200px-Eurostar_Class_374_on_HS1.jpg 20:24:21 <Wolf01> I always thought the pantographs were linked so you raise the right one based on the direction you need to go 20:24:25 <frosch123> supermop: shinkansen is extremely long in the front 20:24:41 <supermop> that's new since 97/00 ish 20:24:47 <Wolf01> "ugly" 20:24:50 *** ic111 has quit IRC 20:24:55 <supermop> before they were more bullnosed 20:25:11 <supermop> to reduce shock in tunnels 20:25:27 <frosch123> https://static.b-europe.com/~/media/MediaRepository/Images_LowRes/Carriers/TGV_ICE_France_Germany/700x432_tgv_ice_v1.ashx?h=432&la=de&w=700 <- while these two are very similar 20:25:44 <FLHerne> Wolf01: Woodhead was 1500V DC 20:26:08 <FLHerne> Wolf01: So considerably higher-current than the 25kV things you get now 20:26:33 <FLHerne> If you just had one pantograph, you'd probably be melting the wire over the contact point 20:26:50 <FLHerne> Er, no, that makes no sense 20:26:54 <frosch123> https://netmobius.global.ssl.fastly.net/images-stn-japan/2-shinkansen-7.jpg <- only nuts has engines in that shape 20:27:01 <frosch123> and possibly some actual shinkansen set 20:27:11 <FLHerne> Oh, maybe it does 20:28:11 <supermop> frosch123: that's a JR maglev 20:28:23 <V453000> nuts doesn't really use that shape I think 20:28:30 <V453000> something similarly fucked up, probably yes 20:28:35 <supermop> n700 sets are somewhat similar, just less extreme 20:29:21 <FLHerne> andythenorth: You could have a 365 also https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3298/3533687710_793d495366_b.jpg , and have a single pax/mail-refittable unit? 20:29:38 <andythenorth> I could yes 20:29:41 <supermop> i would argue that tgv is quite different from the ice, not just for having a locomotive, but because of the way the 'sides' of the front roll off 20:29:48 <FLHerne> (inb4 someone gets pedantic and insists that 325s are really more like 319s underneath) 20:30:06 <andythenorth> FLHerne: there is the tin rocket thing from 1998 currently, 100mph, pax, express freight 20:30:10 <andythenorth> looks like a sprinter 20:30:18 <andythenorth> not convinced by it 20:30:48 <andythenorth> 100mph is not a speed point 20:30:52 <andythenorth> in new Horse 20:31:13 <andythenorth> 1990, 90mph probably 20:31:23 <andythenorth> then 2020: bi-mode??, ??? mph 20:31:29 <frosch123> V453000: hmm, i thought there were more engines which looked like mono-fast-endgame 20:31:40 <frosch123> no idea what i remembered 20:31:48 <V453000> some of the early version might have more wtf shapes actually 20:32:48 * andythenorth has forgotten 20:33:01 <andythenorth> why is it total kitten-killing to have engines carry mail? 20:33:15 <frosch123> andythenorth: make a japanese roaster, the engines look way more interesting 20:33:15 <FLHerne> andythenorth: Because it causes stations to start providing mail 20:33:24 <V453000> if they can't carry passengers, then it makes stations provide mail 20:33:24 <FLHerne> andythenorth: While not providing any real mail capacity 20:33:25 <V453000> yeah that 20:33:30 <andythenorth> frosch123: once I have a schema :P 20:33:48 <FLHerne> So then it forces you to build a mail network, which can be annoying if you didn't really want to 20:33:50 <andythenorth> Africa roster is 50% done already, and had more schema, I am ret-conning now 20:33:56 <andythenorth> Japan roster is valid 20:34:02 * FLHerne does anyway usually, so doesn't care 20:34:25 <andythenorth> so, something like HST with mail on engines, no no no 20:34:33 <andythenorth> means fast mail car needed then 20:35:21 <andythenorth> which means fast express freight also 20:35:32 <andythenorth> dunno 180mph food seems daft 20:36:01 *** cosmobird has joined #openttd 20:36:03 <V453000> 13 tropic trees, 2 cacti, 3 more tropic trees 20:36:05 <V453000> in that order 20:36:07 <V453000> the fuck :D 20:36:45 <andythenorth> just make sure they are integer heights 20:37:07 <supermop> i wrote out a japan roster 20:37:17 <andythenorth> o_O 20:37:21 <andythenorth> was it real, or made up? 20:37:32 <V453000> I really hate "this country" newgrf at this point 20:37:47 <V453000> my 2c :D 20:38:01 <FLHerne> andythenorth: https://www.railwaymagazine.co.uk/gb-railfreight-wants-spare-hsts-for-high-speed-parcels-traffic/ 20:38:13 <andythenorth> V453000: you shock me :) 20:39:01 <andythenorth> FLHerne: seems legit 20:42:00 <FLHerne> (hasn't actually happened yet) 20:45:25 <frosch123> V453000: do you prefert 2cc's "every country"? :p 20:49:52 <andythenorth> how fast then? 20:52:31 *** frosch123 has quit IRC 20:54:53 *** Alberth has left #openttd 20:55:47 <Wolf01> andythenorth: any advice on the size of the locomotives? In cubes maybe 20:56:04 <andythenorth> they’re 8 wide? 20:56:35 <Wolf01> Yes 20:56:51 <Wolf01> I noticed that they get really weird if I need to keep space for pantograph 20:58:17 *** ToBeFree has joined #openttd 20:58:32 *** sim-al2 has joined #openttd 21:00:11 <Wolf01> Also I whink I'll switch to voxelshop 21:00:31 <Wolf01> Supports textures and skeletal animation 21:01:13 <Wolf01> Meh, java 21:02:58 <Wolf01> Wow, I can import a square palette 21:04:28 *** chomwitt has joined #openttd 21:05:12 *** Montana has joined #openttd 21:06:21 <Wolf01> Ok, nice but too much powerful for what I'm doing 21:08:00 <andythenorth> 8 wide, probably 40 long 21:14:10 *** Stimrol has quit IRC 21:15:25 *** chomwitt has quit IRC 21:20:33 *** Stimrol has joined #openttd 21:25:46 *** chomwitt has joined #openttd 21:34:50 *** Stimrol has quit IRC 21:40:35 <Wolf01> https://imgur.com/OYsPzrj 21:40:36 *** sim-al2 has quit IRC 21:44:58 <andythenorth> integer length? o_O 21:45:21 <Wolf01> Should be 1 tile long 21:46:02 <Wolf01> Articulated (2 parts), I want to do a 1 tile long (or more) in 3 parts 21:46:51 <andythenorth> going to 2050 is daft :P 21:47:06 <andythenorth> just ends up with multiple daft OP, super-fast units 21:50:40 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC 21:51:03 <Wolf01> I think for the 3 part one I'll stick to the crocodile design :/ 21:52:07 <Wolf01> Even if I wanted to do this one, but more modern design: https://assets.catawiki.nl/assets/2017/5/27/b/0/c/b0c72373-80c6-4f32-8694-b279e60c58e2.jpg 21:53:05 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 21:53:16 <andythenorth> I like those chunky electric trains 21:53:25 * andythenorth wants to do a roster of those 21:55:47 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC 21:56:10 <Wolf01> https://mthtrains.com/sites/default/files/513.jpg mmmh 22:02:13 *** cosmobird_ has joined #openttd 22:05:24 *** tokai|noir has joined #openttd 22:05:25 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai|noir 22:08:16 *** cosmobird has quit IRC 22:08:25 *** Biolunar has joined #openttd 22:10:45 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 22:12:17 *** tokai has quit IRC 22:17:54 *** Progman has quit IRC 22:26:53 *** gelignite has quit IRC 22:29:06 *** blocage has quit IRC 22:29:23 <Wolf01> http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-uD_2_GqeThw/VW-TfgrxyHI/AAAAAAABOQc/hv0n-72Kfu0/s1600/Milwaukee%2BRoad%2BRailroad%2BGE%2BElectric%2BTrain%2B1971.JPG heavy breathing... 2 tile long articulated engine 22:29:24 *** Wormnest has quit IRC 22:30:17 *** blocage has joined #openttd 22:33:23 <Wolf01> peter1138: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xuk1jcx36Ek 22:44:06 <peter1138> Scale is wrong on that mod, though :( 22:44:34 <Wolf01> Like there was something right in minecraft :( 22:44:40 <Wolf01> *like if 22:45:15 <Wolf01> I think MC and TT can compete with the scale problems 22:45:47 <Wolf01> https://imgur.com/r/factorio/3Mfsy V453000! 22:46:04 <peter1138> There's a different mod that gives a better scale, iirc. 22:47:27 <peter1138> Hmm, no, I was imagining it. 22:51:19 <Wolf01> Maybe I could make a rooster of the most strangest locomotives I find, like the big boy cab forward, the "half locomotive", the 4-units articulated, some weird steam prototypes and some huge gas turbine electric locomotives 22:58:32 *** cosmobird_ has quit IRC 23:07:43 *** ToBeFree has quit IRC 23:12:40 *** Biolunar has quit IRC 23:31:46 *** FLHerne has quit IRC 23:55:59 *** sim-al2 has joined #openttd