Log for #openttd on 8th December 2018:
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09:31:23  <planetmaker> o/
09:31:51  <Markk> \o
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10:05:22  <planetmaker> omg... "meh, someone posted a Dutch map which looks like one I made 4 years ago, please remove it"
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10:07:08  <nielsm> maybe... real geography makes for limited creativity in maps???
10:15:02  <planetmaker> I checked newly updated Dutch map in our online content against the one linked in the e-mail. They are different
10:15:19  <planetmaker> Town sizes differ at least. That's sufficient for me to consider it "not the same"
10:15:30  <planetmaker> for mostly the reason you stated
10:17:16  <planetmaker> And! The first version of that Dutch map on our online content is 1 year OLDER than the one the person complaining linked to
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12:12:28  <Wolf01> o/
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13:03:50  <Flygon_> I'd still love to be able to commission someone for more IRL maps. :V
13:03:53  <Flygon_> I've tried to make them solo.
13:03:56  <Flygon_> But I'm absolutely rubbish.
13:04:02  <Flygon_> I'm okay at modifying EXISTING maps.
13:04:06  <Flygon_> But without a base, I'm rubbish.
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13:27:11  <andythenorth> o/
13:33:25  <Wolf01> o/
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14:17:29  <andythenorth> nap time?
14:17:56  <Wolf01> Yes
14:24:49  <llugo> i guess there is a bug with firs cargos and routing restrictions
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14:26:06  <llugo> when using freight specific restrictions, signals won't act in the right way
14:26:40  <llugo> scrap metal and steel seem to interfer for example
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14:45:00  <andythenorth> was time for Euro Truck Simulator
14:45:00  <andythenorth> I crashed my truck a bit due to falling asleep
14:45:52  <andythenorth> IRL
14:50:33  <llugo> o_O
14:50:58  <llugo> hope you're alright
14:54:45  <andythenorth> I crashed my in-game truck :P
14:54:50  <andythenorth> I think I'll be fine :P
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14:55:39  <andythenorth> oof again, cdist failing to allocate cargo
14:55:39  <andythenorth> fonso spent a while trying to diagnose but it didn't get resolved :(
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18:11:33  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] J0anJosep updated pull request #6985: Fix (#6974): Add filter widget to api (and a double dot from somewhere)
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18:42:12  * andythenorth needs a new FIRS
18:42:22  <andythenorth> basic economies are too basic for a long game
18:50:31  <michi_cc> andythenorth: Any more comments on ? (Other people are allowed to comment as well of course)
18:52:30  <andythenorth> I'll check it out again
18:52:38  <andythenorth> I tested it, but it changed since then
18:53:12  <michi_cc> That was just a comment typo fix.
18:53:40  <michi_cc> Besides text layout itself, the PR also affects list sorting and cursor movement in edit boxes.
18:54:25  <andythenorth> ok I'll test those explicitly
18:54:39  * andythenorth patching the branch to get it to build
18:56:48  <michi_cc> There might be layout differences with right-to-left languages, but I'm unfortunately unable to say what is correct.
18:57:03  <andythenorth> I can't test for those
18:57:08  <andythenorth> not easily anyway
18:57:24  <andythenorth> everything looks good so far for roman L-to-R
18:57:30  <michi_cc> You can at least test if you see something at all :)
18:58:19  <andythenorth> what have we got that's R-to-L
18:58:19  <Eddi|zuHause> the usual problem with switching language to "weird" ones is: how the hell do i switch back? :p
18:58:31  <andythenorth> Arabic Egypt?
18:58:31  <Eddi|zuHause> Hebrew, Arabic
18:59:00  <michi_cc> Oh, and you need to use a system font (either from your openttd.cfg or because you use a language with uncommon glyphs) as the OTTD sprite font has no layout information.
18:59:45  <michi_cc> Korean is also a good test thing as it has composite characters (but still LTR).
18:59:48  <andythenorth> I am seeing Arabic glyphs, not sure where from
19:00:08  <michi_cc> From some random system font
19:00:13  <andythenorth> everything appears to work, but I don't know what's "correct"
19:01:00  <andythenorth> Korean too
19:01:05  <andythenorth> I'll update the PR
19:01:14  <michi_cc> Me neither :( I mostly compared ICU with this, but I do know that our ICU code might not handle everything "correct".
19:01:55  <michi_cc> OTOH, for some RTL/LTR mixing I suspect that our languages files are in fact incorrect and not the text layout.
19:03:22  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] andythenorth commented on pull request #6949: Eliminate ICU for OSX
19:04:18  <Eddi|zuHause> that might be a case of the code being incorrect at some (maybe completely unrelated) place, and people coming into a habit of doing what "works" instead of what's "correct"
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19:10:14  <w4zz> Hello, I have made an dedicated server an have a problem when its autosaving, it lags for 2-4 seconds. Map is 2048x2048. Runs at 1Gb inet line, xeon cpu, ssd and 16gb of ram. Its only when it autosaves or I manually save.
19:10:14  <michi_cc> andythenorth: If you dare you could approve...
19:11:23  <LordAro> w4zz: that seems about right
19:11:28  <LordAro> 2k map is *big*
19:11:29  <andythenorth> I can approve? ;O
19:11:39  <LordAro> (it will be cpu limited)
19:12:36  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] andythenorth commented on pull request #6949: Eliminate ICU for OSX
19:12:52  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] andythenorth approved pull request #6949: Eliminate ICU for OSX
19:12:52  <w4zz> Okey, so its nothing I can optimize to make it use less cpu when saving so game does not freeze LordAro ?
19:13:29  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] michicc merged pull request #6949: Eliminate ICU for OSX
19:13:34  <LordAro> probably not a lot
19:13:45  <LordAro> without a faster cpu (single core speed), or a smaller map
19:13:57  <LordAro> other people here may know more
19:13:59  <w4zz> okok, what I thought. Thanks for your help bud :)
19:23:40  <w4zz> Anyone know how to enable this on a dedicated server: CARGO DISTRIBUTION FOR PASSENGERS: SYMMETRIC
19:30:14  <andythenorth> @seen pikka
19:30:14  <DorpsGek> andythenorth: pikka was last seen in #openttd 7 weeks, 3 days, 7 hours, 5 minutes, and 38 seconds ago: <Pikka> yo
19:35:37  <Eddi|zuHause> w4zz: typically you either edit openttd.cfg, or upload a savegame to the server. alternatively try "list_settings cargodist" or something in the server console
19:43:13  <w4zz> Eddi|zuHause: I have tried to find it in the config but I cant find what setting to change.
19:43:14  <planetmaker> w4zz, I *think* it's a setting which needs to be set in the savegame before multiplayer
19:44:29  <Eddi|zuHause> try this one: distribution_pax = 2
19:44:36  <planetmaker> w4zz, look in config for [linkgraph] section
19:45:19  <w4zz> Eddi|zuHause: will do.
19:45:28  <w4zz> planetmaker: ok, will try to find it :)
19:46:28  <w4zz> Eddi|zuHause: found it, thanks man!
19:46:32  <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause, gave the exact one, yes
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20:37:44  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] msikma commented on pull request #6986: Allow the center tile to always get a house when playing with 3x3/Better
20:44:47  <michi_cc> glx: Do you know if is alright with mingw/Win9x? There's a comment about using gnu++0x instead of c++0x in one of the removed parts, but it might not apply for anything current anymore.
20:45:50  <michi_cc> Also, does anyone know of a compiler that would not understand -std=c++11, e.g. icc maybe, or is it universal?
20:46:44  <nielsm> maybe openwatcom?
20:50:36  <michi_cc> But does it support c++11 at all?
20:50:48  <nielsm> no idea
20:51:13  <michi_cc> The dos build that is theoretically supported was always done with djgpp (i.e. gcc).
20:52:24  <michi_cc> And the makefile has no explicit support for OW, but it does have ICC.
20:53:44  <frosch123> we did an analysis last year
20:53:53  <frosch123> there is no compiler chain that supports c++11 and win9x
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20:54:05  <frosch123> win9x is no longer part of the new compile farm
20:54:19  <LordAro> michi_cc: icc uses -std=c++11 afaict
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20:57:09  <michi_cc> So basically I can hit the button on that PR?
20:57:49  <glx> I have compile error with mingw, but probably unrelated
20:58:38  <michi_cc> glx: Something about = {} not valid?
20:58:59  <glx> strcasecmp undeclared
20:59:18  <LordAro> that seems weird
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20:59:26  <michi_cc> okay, that really should be unrelated to c++11.
20:59:30  <glx> trying mingw64
21:00:39  <glx> mingw64 fails too but somewhere else
21:00:59  <LordAro> heh
21:01:21  <glx> D:/developpement/GitHub/OpenTTD/src/strgen/strgen.cpp:383:23: error: too many arguments to function 'int mkdir(const char*)'
21:01:47  <LordAro> that doesn't feel like it was me..
21:02:07  <glx> let's check with master :)
21:02:21  <michi_cc> That would mean WIN32 is not defined.
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21:08:17  <glx> master works
21:08:30  <glx> so indeed something si wrong in the PR
21:08:42  <LordAro> damn
21:10:37  <LordAro> i've definitely not touched the os defines though
21:10:45  <LordAro>
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21:13:53  <LordAro> glx: can you shove the output of configure into the PR? (just the flags at the bottom will do)
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21:17:45  <glx> $ diff configmaster.txt configPR.txt
21:17:45  <glx> 63c63
21:17:45  <glx> < using CXXFLAGS_BUILD...  -flifetime-dse=1 -std=gnu++14
21:17:45  <glx> ---
21:17:45  <glx> > using CXXFLAGS_BUILD...  -flifetime-dse=1 -std=c++11
21:17:47  <glx> 66c66
21:17:47  <glx> < using CXXFLAGS...  -flifetime-dse=1 -std=gnu++14
21:17:49  <glx> ---
21:17:49  <glx> > using CXXFLAGS...  -flifetime-dse=1 -std=c++11
21:17:51  <glx> ok it's weird
21:18:21  <glx> because it's the only change
21:18:34  <michi_cc> Does it work with -std=gnu++11? Maybe some of the mingw windows headers depend on non-standard stuff.
21:18:46  <LordAro> that would be disappointing
21:20:23  <LordAro> i'd rather fix that, rather than switching to gnu standard
21:20:28  <michi_cc> The MS Windows SDK used to be quite incompatible to standard-conforming c++. It's been fixed in more recent SDK versions, but the initial MinGW windows headers used to be based on some very old MS headers.
21:25:17  <glx> with gnu++11 it compiles
21:25:49  <glx> well gnu++14 works too as it is in master
21:26:22  <LordAro> wonder if it's just a case of removing that ifdef block
21:26:28  <LordAro> do you have a msvc setup nearby? :p
21:26:48  <glx> yes
21:26:52  <frosch123> does it work with std++14 ? :)
21:27:10  <LordAro> frosch123: not if it's breaking with the very much posix mkdir :p
21:27:25  <LordAro> at least, i'd very much hope not
21:29:01  <frosch123> <- they say "mkdir" is deprecated, but using something with _ in front sounds wrong
21:31:12  <frosch123> oh, that's just ms being pedantic
21:31:44  <glx> still waiting for VS to start
21:31:52  <glx> can be slow
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23:26:16  <glx> <-- seems to work as intended, and should be fixable in our code
23:28:27  <LordAro> :)
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23:46:56  <glx> oh nice it seems WIN64 is not defined in MSVC even for x64 builds
23:47:22  <glx> I guesse one day MSVC won't define WIN32 too
23:48:01  <glx> as the doc only says _WIN32 and _WIN64
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23:54:28  <glx> now the question is should we keep using WIN32 and define it if it's not, or should we replace all WIN32 with _WIN32
23:55:20  <nielsm> _WIN32 is the correct way to detect a compiler that's targeting win32 api
23:55:40  <nielsm> so changing to that across the board would be preferable imo
23:56:23  <glx> and I'll remove WIN64 (or replace them with _WIN64), because they are useless for now :)

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