Log for #openttd on 31st October 2019:
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08:33:45  <dihedral> @seen Rubidium
08:33:45  <DorpsGek> dihedral: Rubidium was last seen in #openttd 24 weeks, 3 days, 14 hours, 31 minutes, and 49 seconds ago: <Rubidium> are those from the same NewGRF?
08:33:54  <dihedral> what happened to him?
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08:45:48  <LordAro> ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
08:57:27  <andythenorth> work + openttd burnout
08:57:29  <andythenorth> the usual
08:58:12  <andythenorth> I don't know that for a fact, but it's a guess
09:02:22  <peter1138> Same.
09:02:34  <peter1138> Well, work burnout + openttd burnout + life burnout.
09:03:10  <dihedral> fuck!
09:03:15  <andythenorth> Alberth has also retired for similar reason
09:03:25  <dihedral> more fuck
09:03:44  <andythenorth> projects change :)
09:03:51  <peter1138> I haven't retired, just... not doing anything atm.
09:03:58  <dihedral> anybody have their postal address?
09:04:03  <dihedral> we could send them a card
09:04:09  <andythenorth> you sending christmas cards?
09:04:27  <andythenorth> I did try to get in touch with Yexo
09:04:34  <andythenorth> but only via linkedin, so that will never work
09:04:34  <dihedral> we could do it the same way as with the openttdcoop assocciation
09:05:00  <andythenorth> I don't have alberth or rubidium's address
09:05:06  <dihedral> snail mail a card from one person to the other, each sign and then the last person sends it on to rubidium
09:05:14  <dihedral> well i am sure someone in here does
09:05:16  <andythenorth> alberth answered my forum DM 3 days ago
09:05:38  <dihedral> did you message rubidium also?
09:05:50  <andythenorth> about a year ago, no reply
09:05:54  <dihedral> I would have though peter1138 to have a postal address
09:05:57  <andythenorth> he has been in this channel a few times since
09:06:38  <dihedral> TrueBrain, or planetmaker or even orudge ? you guyes got something ^
09:07:02  <peter1138> I have a postal address, yes.
09:07:08  <peter1138> (For myself)
09:07:42  <dihedral> peter1138, the idea would be to send a card from one person to the other, each sign, and you are the last in line. then you can send it on :-)
09:07:44  <dihedral> what say you?
09:10:19  <peter1138> andythenorth may still have my address.
09:10:54  <andythenorth> forum DM search is crap :)
09:10:55  <andythenorth> nvm
09:11:17  <LordAro> i could probably work out peter1138's address
09:11:23  <LordAro> or at least the street
09:11:31  <andythenorth> have you moved since 2014?
09:12:24  <peter1138> Nope.
09:12:35  <peter1138> LordAro :-)
09:13:59  <dihedral> i am sure we can all find someone to share our address with :-P
09:14:58  <dihedral> perhaps we can start a list who would be interested in taking part
09:15:12  <peter1138> Shame that laptop died before I really got much chance to use it :-(
09:15:27  <peter1138> Some charging/logic board issue.
09:17:59  <Eddi|zuHause> V should know my adress
09:18:41  <andythenorth> I no longer have value-less old macs to give to openttd devs :(
09:18:55  <andythenorth> we sell all the old ones on eBay, they get about £500
09:22:53  <peter1138> *nod*
09:23:04  <peter1138> I was not complaining! :-)
09:23:40  <andythenorth> I think fonso had one as well from me
09:23:50  <andythenorth> oh there's another long-lost-dev
09:23:55  <andythenorth> is fonsinchen still here?
09:26:12  <peter1138> @seen fonsinchen
09:26:12  <DorpsGek> peter1138: fonsinchen was last seen in #openttd 2 years, 34 weeks, 1 day, 16 hours, 19 minutes, and 46 seconds ago: <fonsinchen> There we go.
09:26:31  <peter1138> I'll say that's a no, although now he's been highlighted, who knows...
09:27:59  <andythenorth> I like this page
09:30:14  <peter1138> Damn, I've been so inactive for so long :(
09:30:29  <peter1138> About the time I got into gaming on Windows.
09:31:01  <andythenorth> dunno, NRT, multiple docks
09:31:10  <andythenorth> couple of the big new features you did
09:31:19  <peter1138> That's barely anything in the activty graph.
09:31:33  <andythenorth> newgrf docks then :P
09:31:40  <peter1138> Belugas got burned out cos he implemented NewGRF industries for me, and I was gone by the time he finished it.
09:31:51  <andythenorth> what's left, besides newgrf docks and a rewrite?
09:32:02  <andythenorth> rewrite is such a bad idea :D
09:32:21  <andythenorth> I miss the music composition trading :P
09:32:24  <andythenorth> come back belugas
09:32:47  * dihedral is not listed :-(
09:32:52  <andythenorth> why not though?
09:32:54  <andythenorth> I wondered
09:33:25  * dihedral sobs
09:33:43  <andythenorth> you should do some commits :D
09:33:59  <dihedral> they were always by someone else
09:34:03  <andythenorth> oof
09:34:09  <peter1138> I used to work on some Linux-based audio tools as well.
09:34:16  <andythenorth> hmm
09:34:27  <peter1138> That all petered out, when I looked it was 10 years ago that me & belugas were making music.
09:34:51  <dihedral>
09:35:06  <andythenorth> newgrf docks, 'newgrf stations are weird', station objects, consist management, watertypes, 1 tile locks, performance stuff, and a rewrite? o_O
09:35:21  <andythenorth> oh and mumble mumble GS
09:35:37  <andythenorth> also tanks in Blitz :P
09:35:45  <andythenorth> 3 hours of every day :P
09:37:10  <peter1138> Hi.
09:37:48  <andythenorth> hmm, but I've mastered all the tank destroyers
09:37:54  <peter1138> Well, docks was coming on okay but I go stuck with layouts/no layouts and then someone mentioned state machines...
09:38:03  <andythenorth> in mediums I'm too slow and I make too many poor choices
09:38:07  <peter1138> And also there was variants but I got frustrated on that too :p
09:38:09  <andythenorth> maybe Blitz is over soon
09:38:17  <andythenorth> docks was solid
09:38:33  <andythenorth> variants *might* be that I had a terrible idea and I might be regretting the whole thing
09:38:33  <peter1138> I don't even have the pics any more :p
09:39:08  <andythenorth> does twitch archive streams? :P
09:40:01  <dihedral> andythenorth, on youtube :-D
09:40:01  <peter1138> No. They are kept for a few weeks and that's it.
09:40:36  <andythenorth> oh dear
09:41:03  <peter1138> Quite.
09:41:27  <peter1138> Hmm, wonder why I used GRF ID "PN 09 01"
09:41:38  <andythenorth> google images doesn't find them either
09:43:30  <andythenorth> how much survived here?
09:43:59  <peter1138> That's all there? That's the authoritative place after all?
09:44:08  <peter1138> Anyway, I wasn't doing development on my server.
09:44:21  <andythenorth> I didn't read the code, so I don't know if that's just the stuff that's already merged to master
09:44:23  <peter1138> I still have all that on a local VM on my desktop PC. Not backed up though.
09:44:47  <dihedral> YOU NEED TO BACKUP
09:44:50  <dihedral> :-P
09:44:55  <andythenorth> I haven't backed up for weeks
09:45:07  <peter1138> Problem is I need to back up the backups...
09:45:11  <andythenorth> dropbox, gmail, icloud, github, bitbucket :P
09:45:15  <peter1138> Yeah, true.
09:45:32  <andythenorth> there is stuff I would be sad about if my mac bricks, but 85% of it is covered
09:45:32  <dihedral> or some other cheap storage
09:46:07  <peter1138> ~/Projects/OpenTTD$ git branch | wc -l
09:46:07  <peter1138> 50
09:46:08  <peter1138> Mmm
09:46:24  <dihedral> ha!
09:46:34  <peter1138> Probably some of those are PR checkouts.
09:46:38  <dihedral> at least you still have the source of openttd on your computer :-(
09:46:40  <peter1138> Some are obsolete. Some are rebases.
09:46:48  <peter1138> Yes.
09:47:11  <peter1138> Hmm, I have an idea.
09:47:33  <peter1138> I should uninstall lots of games from Steam that I never play, then I can use the spare storage as backup.
09:48:05  <peter1138> (1x 256GB M.2 SSD, 1x 256GB SATA SSD, and 2x 2TB SATA SSD should be enough for Windows)
09:48:12  <peter1138> That'll give me 2x 3TB HDD to use.
09:48:38  <dihedral> i use a nas
09:48:41  <peter1138> Although... I don't have anything else to put them in!
09:48:53  <peter1138> Yeah, my NAS has 2x 3TB and... it's full.
09:49:00  <peter1138> RAID1 though.
09:49:02  <dihedral> and if you are using windows, checkout veeam backup free
09:49:16  <dihedral> with cbt
09:50:00  <peter1138> Seems to be VMWare related?
09:51:13  <peter1138> Remember when Google was not evil? And Google Chrome was good...
09:51:51  <dihedral> comes with a vmware background, however they have released a windows computer version which does a good job with cbt of local disks
09:52:30  <dihedral> we use the enterprise version for the vmware cluster, but workstations (also linux) are backup up with this
09:52:44  <dihedral> the really nice part is: if you need to restore an entire computer it is a charm
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10:11:57  <Eddi|zuHause> my 4x3TB Raid5 is also full :/
10:16:35  <andythenorth> how do people gather so much stuff? :)
10:17:51  <andythenorth> I have 500GB total lifetime data, and back it up to this occasionally
10:18:33  <Eddi|zuHause> TV recordings, mostly
10:18:35  <andythenorth> ah
10:18:40  <peter1138> Steam Humble Monthly :p
10:19:03  <andythenorth> yeah, so at work one of our companies does film
10:19:06  <Eddi|zuHause> my steam library is like 300GB
10:19:15  <andythenorth> there's 1 cubic metre of terrabyte hard drives
10:19:33  <andythenorth> we have to assess the lift capacity when we move office :P
10:20:00  <Eddi|zuHause> well, if you're dealing with film stuff, you're probably using uncompressed video
10:20:07  <andythenorth> yes
10:20:18  <andythenorth> from multiple cameras, at probably a 4:1 shooting ratio
10:20:28  <Eddi|zuHause> or at least, lossless image compression and no temporal compression
10:20:34  <Sacro> Eddi|zuHause: i'd move off that RAID5, you'll not recover it
10:21:02  <Eddi|zuHause> Sacro: what?
10:21:17  <Sacro> Statistically once you get past 750GB you'll have a read failure during recovery
10:21:40  <Sacro> Though perhaps MTBF is different these days
10:22:13  <Eddi|zuHause> there's other errors than complete drive failures
10:22:44  <Sacro> That's just a single bit failure
10:22:47  <Sacro> That stops the rebuild
10:23:23  <andythenorth> peter1138: newstations :P
10:23:57  <Eddi|zuHause> like, once i tried installing windows, and didn't unplug the raid disks, and it decided to use some of the raid for its boot stuff. had to resync that bit (500MB or so?)
10:28:53  <dihedral> Eddi|zuHause, prefer RAID6 over 5
10:29:25  <dihedral> if the hot spare has to jump in there is a lower risk of it killing any other disk during the rebuild
10:29:59  <Eddi|zuHause> dihedral: yes, but i didn't have enough budget for 4 disks, and when i got the 4th i needed the space.
10:30:12  <andythenorth> what happened to RAID 10? Or was that just marketing?
10:30:14  <dihedral> ah....
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10:30:47  <peter1138> It's still used.
10:30:52  <Eddi|zuHause> dihedral: and next i'd probably upgrade the disk size, which will be... tricky
10:31:04  <peter1138> RAID6 and RAID5 are less common these days.
10:31:22  <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: raid 10 is more for when you are using 2 separate physical locations
10:31:23  <dihedral> raid 10 is fun when you do not have too many disks and need the performance
10:31:26  <peter1138> Disks are cheap so the performance hit is not worth it.
10:31:33  <dihedral> raid 6 across 24 and more disks is the real joy :-P
10:31:44  <andythenorth> are we still striping for performance?
10:31:54  <peter1138> RAID5 and RAID6 don't scale well with lots of disks.
10:31:57  * andythenorth is so out of the loop these days
10:32:04  <Eddi|zuHause> striping as in raid0?
10:32:08  <dihedral> peter1138, netapp :-P
10:32:09  <andythenorth> or 10
10:32:24  <peter1138> RAID5 generally means you can survive one failure.
10:32:27  <peter1138> RAID6 means two.
10:32:31  <dihedral> + block level deduplication
10:32:55  <SpComb> ZFS or GTFO
10:32:59  <peter1138> Problem with failures is they tend to cascade as you get a flurry of unusual activity when rebuilding.
10:33:09  <andythenorth> how fast to we need to record TV shows anyway? :)
10:33:14  <andythenorth> to / do /s
10:33:45  <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: as fast as the data comes in. :p
10:34:26  <andythenorth> are you still spinning disks?
10:34:53  <Eddi|zuHause> for the things that need lots of space? yes.
10:35:02  <andythenorth> I took one apart to show my kids
10:35:14  <andythenorth> how things from the olden days worked
10:35:16  <dihedral> i get more sas storage than ssd for the same amount of money
10:35:26  <dihedral> totally depends on the purpose
10:35:42  <Eddi|zuHause> if you're playing games, you're better off with SSDs
10:35:55  <Eddi|zuHause> because there the access time matters the most
10:36:06  <dihedral> aye
10:36:27  * dihedral recalls a youtube video demonstrating 10 ssd's with raid0 :D
10:37:21  <andythenorth> sas is quite expensive?
10:37:29  <andythenorth> £160 for 1TB
10:38:05  <dihedral> hitachi disks with netapp firmware are around 1k eur for 1.8 tb
10:39:00  <dihedral> but that's just something we use at work
10:48:16  <andythenorth> hmm
10:48:18  <andythenorth> BBL
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12:32:32  <planetmaker> well, I do have alberth's address somewhere... I think. But he's not out-of-the-world.
12:32:50  <LordAro> @seen Alberth
12:32:50  <DorpsGek> LordAro: Alberth was last seen in #openttd 14 weeks, 1 day, 18 hours, 11 minutes, and 36 seconds ago: <Alberth> andy: I bisected the build-train bug back to d54b6ac09b6fe88c09f7886739fe9c05f16b8222  (feb 28th)
12:33:15  <LordAro> hadn't realised it had been quite that long
12:33:21  <planetmaker> but... for what reason do we need RL addresses and snail mail cards?
12:33:41  <LordAro> dihedral had "an idea"
12:36:35  <planetmaker> and yexo surely can be stalked via facebook :P
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13:02:19  <peter1138> Is it lunch time?
13:02:32  <peter1138> Also...
13:02:38  <peter1138> My Garmin ran out of juice mid ride last night.
13:02:48  <peter1138> This would normally be "okay" as I can use the Strava app as a backup.
13:02:59  <peter1138> However... they've removed support for external sensors!
13:03:14  <peter1138> Like... something that was totally working fine for me, completely removed because some people had bugs with it. Huh.
13:04:54  <Eddi|zuHause> was andy in charge of that? :p
13:07:19  <peter1138> Probably.
13:07:46  <peter1138> And damn, my favourite discount supplies doesn't have the protein bars I like :(
13:15:45  <andythenorth> is it lunch time?
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13:37:58  <andythenorth> did anyone approved the README yet? :P
13:38:21  <andythenorth>
13:42:15  <peter1138> I have lunch timed.
13:42:47  <peter1138> Actually I'm still eating because my salad was huge. I need to stop doing that. Everyone thinks it's two meals :/
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14:24:54  <dihedral> LordAro> dihedral had "an idea" <- thanks for the quotes
14:24:58  <dihedral> peter1138, what garmin?
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14:26:28  <peter1138> 130
14:26:43  <peter1138> It was very cold and wasn't fully charged, so it just gave up a bit sooner than expected.
14:27:10  <dihedral> ah
14:27:53  <dihedral> i was thinking
14:28:24  <dihedral> thought someone here might be in to aviation :)
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14:35:53  <LordAro> dihedral: i mean, you didn't elaborate further
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14:42:04  <dihedral> yeah i did - a card which can be signed by whoever wants to, to send greetings to those missing
14:43:10  <LordAro> my bad, must have missed that
14:43:14  <LordAro> does sound like a nice idea :)
14:43:40  <dihedral> \o/
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15:07:44  <peter1138>   1 Raw_Read_Error_Rate     0x000f   108   099   006    Pre-fail  Always       -       16932064
15:08:09  <peter1138> That seems high, considering smart errors reported is 0.
15:08:46  <LordAro> the two are not necessarily linked
15:08:52  <LordAro> reading smart data is basically a black art
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15:09:01  <LordAro> sometimes the values mean something, sometimes they don't
15:09:11  <LordAro> and "smart errors" is almost never useful
15:12:44  <peter1138> True.
15:13:15  <peter1138>   1 Raw_Read_Error_Rate     0x000f   108   099   006    Pre-fail  Always       -       16947568
15:13:19  <peter1138> That's... gone up quickly
15:15:55  <LordAro> mm, i'd be very concerned about that disk
15:16:01  <LordAro> no offline sectors or anything though?
15:17:50  <peter1138>   5 Reallocated_Sector_Ct   0x0033   100   100   010    Pre-fail  Always       -       0
15:18:16  <peter1138>  12 Power_Cycle_Count       0x0032   100   100   020    Old_age   Always       -       31
15:18:20  <peter1138>   9 Power_On_Hours          0x0032   085   085   000    Old_age   Always       -       13530
15:18:30  <peter1138> Looks like it's been left powered on for a while o_O
15:18:47  <LordAro> @calc 13530 / 31
15:18:47  <DorpsGek> LordAro: 436.451612903
15:18:55  <peter1138> Hours.
15:18:59  <LordAro> @calc 436 / 24
15:18:59  <DorpsGek> LordAro: 18.1666666667
15:19:11  <peter1138> 18 months, yeah.
15:19:16  <LordAro> 2-3 weeks at a time? i do that
15:19:33  <peter1138> Probably not, probably always on and an occasional reboot, heh.
15:19:39  <peter1138> This is an external USB drive.
15:19:51  <peter1138> (But it's a regular 3.5" 7200RPM drive inside)
15:21:14  <peter1138> The seek error rate is a 48bit value, 1852733 is 0x0000001C453D hex.  First 16bits is 0x0000, last 32bits are 0x001C453D.  Basically, zero seek errors over 1852733 total seeks.  Source
15:21:28  <peter1138> So it's that mean *seeks* not seek errors.
15:21:31  <peter1138> *many
15:21:35  <peter1138>
15:21:51  <peter1138> I misread Seagate as Samsung, heh.
15:22:12  <peter1138> I think the it's a Samsung USB enclosure, with a Seagate drive, heh.
15:22:31  <LordAro> this doesn't surprise me at all
15:22:35  <LordAro> like i said, black art
15:22:40  <peter1138> I'm gonna say, despite not being new, it's safe. There's no IO errors reported, no remapped sectors.
15:22:52  <peter1138> Anyway, it's plugged in to a raspberry pi.
15:23:33  <peter1138> I'm just using it instead of the MicroSD for frequently written stuff. Logs, email.
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15:23:43  <peter1138> Okay, so email is kinda important, but I'll back that up.
15:24:02  <peter1138> I'd use NFS but NFS on my NAS gets really confused with user mapping.
15:24:15  <peter1138> Also, large files + NFS is not really good.
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15:32:06  <peter1138> I was thinking about switching to maildir, but large folders are not that good either :p
15:33:43  <LordAro> maildir is much better for backing up
15:33:50  <peter1138> Yes.
15:33:51  <LordAro> (with rsync-ish stuff)
15:33:57  <peter1138> And deleting.
15:34:04  <LordAro> mm
15:34:26  <peter1138> I'm using dovecot which also has its own formats which are "better" but then you are locked into dovecot.
15:34:29  <peter1138> So I dunno.
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16:18:56  <peter1138> Hmm, now, should I find another USB disk and run it in a RAID1 config... hehe
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16:40:27  <_dp_> how do I set up git fork that only updates to releases?
16:40:55  <_dp_> i.e. I want to be able to merge/rebase to a specific tag/commit without fetching everything into my repo
16:42:25  <_dp_> I did it previously with a branch that I updated manually from source packages but that feels kinda wrong :/
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17:05:57  <LordAro> _dp_: not sure you can
17:06:08  <LordAro> given tags are just commits
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18:15:11  <NGC3982> <- where do i find this addon when in kodi?
18:15:33  <NGC3982> im on leia and i cant seem to locate it
18:16:44  <NGC3982> oh, im in the wrong place
18:16:45  <NGC3982> lol. sorry.
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18:45:48  <Wolf01> Holy fuck LEGO... 543543 shippings and blocked my credit card because of suspicious transactions
18:47:36  <glx> lego bricked your card ?
18:47:40  <Wolf01> Yep
18:49:59  <Wolf01> I already unlocked it, but now the lego assistance is closed... probably until monday, I sent them an email with "retry with the payment"
18:51:57  <NGC3982> lego assistance.
18:52:00  <NGC3982> what a world we live in.
18:54:29  <Wolf01> Why not? They had it since... the 70's?
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19:12:06  <andythenorth> is this done? :)
19:17:25  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] mpavlase opened issue #7813: export map into picture
19:18:47  <LordAro> uh
19:18:50  <LordAro> a screenshot?
19:19:43  <nnyby> haha
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22:51:56  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on issue #7767: Large numbers of trains and signals cause low FPS
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23:12:01  <FLHerne> LordAro: No, they have a point
23:14:18  <FLHerne> LordAro: With a small resolution and biggish world, you can need to tile multiple screenshots to get a legible zoom level
23:14:49  <FLHerne> And even if you don't, cropping a screenshot to show only the map is a slight pain
23:17:34  <LordAro> giant & zoomed screenshots are a thing, aren't they?
23:17:51  <LordAro> i don't understand what's special about this, is all
23:17:53  <LordAro> there's no examples
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23:33:09  <FLHerne> LordAro: You can get large screenshots of the world easily
23:34:05  <FLHerne> LordAro: If you want a screenshot of the map window contents, it can be a pain
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