Log for #openttd on 25th December 2019:
Times are UTC Toggle Colours
00:00:17  <TrueBrain> :D
00:00:29  <frosch123> it's 00:00 utc \o/
00:00:42  <TrueBrain> Staging is already correct
00:00:49  <LordAro> happy new year!
00:00:50  <LordAro> wait
00:00:55  <TrueBrain> Dev files look weird on mobile
00:01:07  <TrueBrain> List bullet is there
00:02:19  <TrueBrain> Does look so much better to have them separate
00:02:51  <frosch123> yes, the layout is different also on non-mobile
00:02:57  <frosch123> bullets vs no-bullets
00:04:10  <glx> looks the same for me
00:04:29  <glx> mobile/non-mobile I mean
00:04:44  <TrueBrain> Dev files have bullet, binaries do not
00:05:06  <glx> yes I see that on both
00:05:37  <frosch123> news is live :p
00:05:40  <TrueBrain> LordAro: we found your post and frosch/glx brought it to life :p gratz on new beta :)
00:06:24  <glx> (well a retrigger would have worked too, but now we are future proof ;) )
00:06:38  <TrueBrain> :)
00:06:44  <TrueBrain> Night all!
00:13:39  <frosch123> hmm, 888 followers, 222 too much
00:14:00  <glx> huhu
00:14:34  <LordAro> TrueBrain: :))
00:14:35  <frosch123> yay, found the logout button
00:14:47  <frosch123> was hidden under "more"
00:14:56  <glx> everything is hidden
00:15:17  <glx> the useful tweets are hidden behind promoted
00:18:04  <frosch123> it also gets directly retweeted/responeded by scam bots :)
00:18:19  <glx> one RT is me
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00:20:42  <glx> byt yeah the immediate reply is pure garbage
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01:40:12  <tokai|noir> frosch123: I'm not a scan bot! :)
01:40:26  <tokai|noir> -n+m
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09:08:25  <andythenorth> thanks LordAro :)
09:15:00  <Pikka> merry christmas and custard o/
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09:49:59  <andythenorth> :)
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09:51:09  <Wolf01> :)
09:58:45  <peter1138> When you wait for the next free game on the Epic store... and you already have it ;(
10:06:30  <Samu> hello
10:06:55  <Samu> so, today is 25th...
10:06:58  <Samu> pff
10:07:29  <Pikka> it is
10:07:32  <Pikka> far too much lunch!
10:15:36  <Wolf01> <peter1138> When you wait for the next free game on the Epic store... and you already have it ;( <- that's the reason I won't give even a 0.01€ to epic, but I get all the free games
10:16:36  <Wolf01> Also... Iron Horse? @andythenorth
10:19:44  <andythenorth> Horse!
10:20:08  <andythenorth> well played
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10:49:58  <TrueBrain> Haha, epic xmas present Wolf01 :)
10:58:26  <andythenorth> child-based feedback
10:58:30  <andythenorth> hmm
10:59:38  * andythenorth does YT instead
11:00:35  <peter1138> Yeah, I'll happily pick up the freebies :-)
11:01:34  * peter1138 ponders moving his server downstairs, where the UPS is.
11:01:49  <Wolf01> Should I open that big cardboard box sitting in an angle of the living room?
11:01:59  <peter1138> Plan was to have the UPS upstairs and do PoE for the modem & router, but I haven't got a PoE switch yet.
11:02:17  <peter1138> Seems silly to NOT have the server on the UPS, heh.
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11:06:47  <snail_UES_> merry Xmas everyone
11:06:53  <Pikka> o/
11:07:40  <peter1138> What fun things can I do with two routers at home. I'm guessing... nothing really :p
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11:20:28  <Samu> I had an idea for snowline, display it in red if the map won't generate snow
11:20:40  <Samu> display it in black if it does
11:21:39  <Wolf01> <peter1138> Plan was to have the UPS upstairs and do PoE for the modem & router, but I haven't got a PoE switch yet. <- I found having a UPS protected router is 90% useless now that I have the new contract, the chances that power goes off only on my house are little, and when it goes off on the town internet doesn't work anyway
11:25:02  <peter1138> I have the modem router on it because I needed to test with the house power off :-)
11:25:25  <peter1138> Just haven't moved it yet. Just server would be more useful, but if I can move things around to have it all on UPS then that's better.
11:25:38  <Samu> - snow line is red because bad number
11:25:43  <Samu> what u think?
11:25:52  <peter1138> Cos my ISP is nice I have a /29 at home ;p
11:27:03  <peter1138> Plus /48 of IPv6.
11:45:45  <Samu> STR_MAPGEN_SNOW_LINE_TOOLTIP                                    :{BLACK}Control at what height snow starts in sub-arctic landscape. Snow also affects industry generation and town growth requirements. A value displayed in red means some of the requirements are not met
11:45:56  <Samu> is this good explanation/english?
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12:08:18  <Samu> ;/
12:08:39  <Samu> this doesn't seem valid for heightmaps
12:08:59  <Samu> better disable tooltip and colors there
12:09:13  <Samu> unsure
12:09:15  <Samu> must think
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13:08:26  <andythenorth> how many types of tank wagon are too many? :P
13:08:42  <andythenorth> localised feedback is that changing the colour per cargo is silly
13:08:51  <andythenorth> and all the colours should just be in the buy menu
13:18:09  <andythenorth> eh only 6 actual colour choices
13:18:14  <andythenorth> and 2CC doesn't count, so 5
13:18:46  <frosch123> you can reduce the number of items in the purchase list: attaching a blue and a yellow wagon results in two green wagons
13:19:28  <andythenorth> that would be quite something
13:19:37  <frosch123> anyway, V law mandates that different sprites for different cargos is a good thing
13:19:50  <andythenorth> 9 year old disagrees :P
13:20:05  <andythenorth> he wants the one he sees in the menu, with option to toggle company colour on flip :P
13:20:06  <andythenorth> oof
13:20:29  <andythenorth> you don't want to know what I seriously considered doing, but I'll tell you anyway :)
13:20:42  <frosch123> add an age gate?
13:20:47  <andythenorth> starting from front of consist, read depot-flip bit as a bitmask
13:21:08  <andythenorth> encoding multiple liveries for all vehicles :P
13:21:17  <frosch123>
13:21:26  <andythenorth> yup
13:21:38  <andythenorth> that's how we used to configure electronics
13:21:47  <andythenorth> still do even
13:22:32  <andythenorth> it was something like 'default font is monospaced if dip switch 1 is set' etc
13:22:37  <andythenorth> that sort of thing
13:25:06  <frosch123> as kid i was very confused why there was a setting for CRLF vs LF
13:27:25  <frosch123> <- i had access to one of those
13:29:46  <andythenorth> is that an Epson 400 or something?
13:29:51  <andythenorth> or I see in the url
13:29:55  <frosch123> fx 800
13:29:59  <frosch123> 9 needles a4
13:30:20  <frosch123> well, i guess it also fit similar us formats
13:31:10  <frosch123> the tractor for paper rolls was detachable
13:32:27  <andythenorth> I remember
13:32:40  <andythenorth> it had an alternative lid
13:32:58  <andythenorth>
13:33:02  <andythenorth> we had one
13:33:25  <frosch123> looks similar :)
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13:38:46  <Pikka> o/
13:41:58  <andythenorth> waiting for it to build more trains pikka :)
13:44:17  <Pikka> :)
13:44:37  <andythenorth> it's really quite pleasing
13:45:22  <Pikka> :D
13:50:06  <andythenorth>
13:51:29  <andythenorth> nice of it to build brake vans on pax trains :)
13:51:33  <andythenorth> safety first
13:52:46  <Pikka> hmmm
13:53:09  <Pikka> I bet that's actually a 'cargo' train serving an industry (hotel maybe?)
13:53:36  <Pikka> I'd thought that it would build those to passenger train rules now but I admit I never actually tested it
13:53:47  <andythenorth> it is serving a hotel
13:53:58  <andythenorth> the brakevan is there in case of moose
13:54:16  <Pikka> moose are only allowed to ride in the brakevan?
13:55:23  <andythenorth> yes
13:55:29  <andythenorth> and only when bear are predicted
13:55:31  <andythenorth> loading for bear
13:56:27  <Pikka> huh. it should never be building brakevans on passenger trains now. in fact, it should always be building a mailvan instead. and it shouldn't be mixing passenger coach types. this was definitely a train build by v22?
13:57:29  <andythenorth> oh noes
13:57:31  <andythenorth> it's v15
13:57:43  <andythenorth> but but I downloaded the bananas v22
13:57:44  <andythenorth> hmm
13:59:42  <andythenorth> I broke it somehow, sorry
14:00:38  <andythenorth> :(
14:00:39  <Pikka> cool :D
14:01:21  <Pikka> yep, there's an empty file required there that I ended up not using, it must have been efficiencied out somewhere in the bananas process
14:01:35  <Pikka> give me 1 minute
14:04:02  <Pikka> there
14:04:05  <Pikka> try v23!
14:08:12  <andythenorth> huzzah
14:08:18  <andythenorth> I had to restart openttd
14:08:23  <andythenorth> it seems to cache previous AI version
14:10:37  <LordAro> i think there's an issue about that
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14:19:02  <andythenorth> Pikka: super! :)
14:19:06  <andythenorth> awesome colour choices
14:19:27  <andythenorth> it makes more interesting engine choices now
14:20:06  <Pikka> yep. I made the biases stronger and more different between companies. and it can build electric now too of course ;)
14:20:15  <andythenorth> is it random that it favours tank cars for milk?
14:20:23  <andythenorth> previously it mixed a lot of wagons
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14:21:55  <Pikka> it will only do random wagons for piece goods. and even then it will stick to one best wagon if nothing else is as fast or high capacity
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14:29:34  <andythenorth> oh the red one scrapped it's train :)
14:30:45  <andythenorth> this is fun
14:36:30  <Pikka> how's the track building? slightly less entertaining passing places? :P
14:38:37  <andythenorth> yup reduced lolz
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14:49:31  <frosch123> looks like there went a lot of effort into making the ai name stuff :)
14:55:05  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] james5922 commented on issue #6566: Very long loading of the maximum "zoom out" level in 4K resolution
14:55:09  <andythenorth> pikka does it do sue and sweep as well as sooty?
14:56:03  <Pikka> is it a bug if it doesn't?
14:56:49  <Pikka> it does have thomas, but only for blue companies. ;)
14:58:24  <andythenorth> quite lolz
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15:10:29  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro reopened issue #6566: Very long loading of the maximum "zoom out" level in 4K resolution
15:10:29  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro commented on issue #6566: Very long loading of the maximum "zoom out" level in 4K resolution
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15:55:00  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on issue #6566: Very long loading of the maximum "zoom out" level in 4K resolution
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16:03:59  <Pikka> bedtime, merry christmas
16:04:22  <Pikka> andythenorth, let me know if AI does anything cool, lolz or stupid :)
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16:40:07  <tuxmax> hi i'm new user of openttd who can tell me if you see my game
16:42:17  <frosch123> check
16:44:14  * andythenorth full of dinner
16:44:54  <frosch123> early dinner
16:45:22  <andythenorth> lunch
16:45:26  <andythenorth> something
16:46:35  <nielsm> eat all the food all the time, no need to distinguish between breakfast/lunch/dinner/anything else in-between
16:56:57  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh updated pull request #7868: Feature: NewGRF callback profiling
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17:13:30  <nielsm> okay measuring newgrf performance in microseconds is not entirely useless in release builds, it still does get a number of non-zero values
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18:23:47  * andythenorth removes bad features
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18:45:49  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] DorpsGek pushed 1 commits to master
18:45:50  <DorpsGek_III>   - Update: Translations from eints (by translators)
19:24:18  <nielsm> rediscovered my video scaling branch, I wonder if I should PR it?
19:24:45  <nielsm> even if it just remains a secret feature on only the win32 video driver
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19:32:06  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh opened pull request #7876: Feature: [Win32] Full window/display scaling
19:32:54  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh updated pull request #7876: Feature: [Win32] Full window/display scaling
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20:08:26  <andythenorth> oof
20:08:38  <andythenorth> I played warcraft again
20:09:23  <frosch> starcraft was significant progress
20:15:29  <nielsm> okay let's start over with the GS perfrating branch, my previous attempt didn't get very far but I think the initial work was from the wrong end
20:15:34  <nielsm> (or grasping too many ends at once)
20:30:37  <Samu> the currently selected base graphics set is missing 5 sprites
20:30:55  <Samu> OpenGFX 0.5.5
20:31:58  <Samu> there's no newer than 0.5.5 on online content
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20:35:50  <Samu> - what u think of red numbers?
20:36:32  <Samu> and tooltip
20:39:13  <LordAro> Samu: yes, there needs to be a 0.5.6 before 1.10.0
20:42:18  <nielsm> it's NRT that has new sprites required, right?
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20:42:54  <Samu> I have no idea
20:43:37  <peter1138> Christmas pudding time :D
20:44:06  <Samu> the tooltip explanation is a bit off
20:44:08  <Samu> help me out
20:44:30  <Samu> maybe criteria
20:44:36  <Samu> instead of requirements
20:46:03  <Samu> it shows red if it can't place snow, farms or forests
20:46:23  <nielsm> I won't help you because I think you're doing the wrong thing to attempt to solve that
20:46:27  <nielsm> completely wrong approach
20:46:45  <Samu> oh :(
20:48:38  <Samu> so red text is a bad idea :(
20:50:21  <nielsm> it's unusual but the correct thing to do IMO is to change the terrain generation rules such that sub-arctic and sub-tropic landscapes cannot be configured to generate "invalid" maps
20:50:41  <nielsm> and I don't mean changing the GUI, I mean changing the terrain generator code
20:53:01  <Samu> hmm
20:53:25  <andythenorth> can 'invalid' be determined?
20:54:04  <frosch> there is already a popup after mapgen when ottd could not place some industry types
20:54:16  <frosch> but it takes a the mapgen to run :)
20:54:26  <frosch> i favour the factorio solution
20:54:52  <frosch> there should be a mapgen preview which shows the most basic things, like height, water, maybe snow
20:55:01  <andythenorth> strikes me that we can't adapt mapgen to weird newgrf requirements
20:55:02  <andythenorth> or GS
20:55:06  <frosch> oh, and possibly "too steep slopes"
20:55:38  <nielsm> yeah I mean, if you select a sub-arctic map it should always generate a map with at least 33% above the snow line height, and if you select a sub-tropic map it should always generate a map with around 50% rainforest-mountains
20:55:56  <frosch> maps are incredibly ugly when the mapgen generates slopes too steep for the slope model in ottd, so there are like 20 tile long stretches of just 45° uphill
20:59:29  <Samu> there's in tgp.cpp a check for water level, and it adjusts the height of the world in order to get to a certain % of water
20:59:48  <Samu> maybe something similar for slowline could be created
21:00:25  <Samu> but I'm far from understanding tgp
21:04:06  <nielsm> TTD generates those maps always as a half/half split of high/low land
21:04:16  <nielsm> north/south or east/west split
21:04:42  <nielsm> so north or east is mountaneous and south or west is lower land
21:05:23  <nielsm> I think the good approach for TGP would be to create a low-resolution map of areas designated to be mountains and areas designated to be low
21:05:40  <nielsm> and filter the terrain by that or whatever
21:05:59  <nielsm> I think the original terrain gen still does what TTD did?
21:06:08  <peter1138> Yup
21:06:09  <Samu> yes
21:06:15  <peter1138> Wouldn't be too hard to emulate ;p
21:06:20  * peter1138 builds Lego
21:07:14  <nielsm> but the hard half/half split is kind of dumb with huge maps, the distance to high or low land from the opposite corner will be too large
21:07:24  <nielsm> hence having splotches of everything around
21:07:41  <nielsm> also, I think sub-arctic having fjords would be nice, but that's something else :)
21:09:21  <Samu> i think arctic already looks good in terragenesis, main issue is basically snow line
21:10:16  <Samu> and the very flat terrain type just shouldn't exist
21:10:32  <Samu> the choice of very flat
21:11:11  * andythenorth wondered about writing a bitmap heightmap generator in python :P
21:11:16  <andythenorth> it would be hideous though
21:11:46  <nielsm> rather I think the terrain type setting for sub-arctic and sub-tropic should either be disabled (as it is in original mapgen), or should only be used for the "low" areas of the map
21:11:47  <andythenorth> I've read quite a bit about terrain generation techniques, but they're all aimed at realism
21:12:09  <andythenorth> I want pseudo-realism, optimised for gameplay
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21:12:31  <nielsm> so if you select "very flat", you get a map of very flat areas together with mountaneous areas
21:12:46  <nielsm> if you select mountaneous terrain type, everything is mountains
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21:13:12  <andythenorth> oof wifi
21:13:27  <andythenorth> I don't really understand how to get good maps from TGP
21:14:13  <andythenorth> they're not bad though
21:24:08  <Samu> I see
21:27:27  <Samu> for the snowline, i have a rough idea: instead of being the user to submit a value, it's automatically determined
21:27:51  <Samu> like this
21:28:31  <Samu> terragenesis makes the map, while at the same time it takes note of the highest tile it generated
21:28:47  <Samu> then sets the snowline at maybe half of that value
21:30:27  <Samu> gonna experiment this
21:36:49  <nielsm> might work, except count the number of tiles with each height value, and select a value such that at least 1/3 of the total tiles are above the snow line
21:37:57  <peter1138> TGP basically sucks.
21:50:24  <Samu> what about water
21:51:49  <Samu> maybe won't count water tiles
22:17:09  <nielsm>  well there's at least a couple more ways to display rating items
22:18:17  <nielsm> (boolean flag, volume, weight, and those not immediately visible: thousands and millions of pounds, to get around 32 bit limits, and inverted requirements implemented as a general approach to how loan has worked as a special case)
22:48:23  <Samu> while (tile_count < _height_map.size_x * _height_map.size_y * 2 / 3 && cur_height <= highest_height) {
22:49:05  <Samu> 2/3 of the map below snowline
22:49:08  <Samu> 1/3 above
22:50:12  <nielsm> I can't figure out what you're trying to do with that loop, but it looks wrong
22:51:42  <Samu>
22:51:50  <nielsm> std::vector<uint> tilecount_heights; tilecount_heights.resize(mapgen_map_height); for (all tiles) tilecount_height[tile height] += 1;
22:51:54  <Samu> resulting cur_height becomes snowline
22:51:54  <nielsm> in pseudo code
22:52:31  <Samu> oops, missing 2 lines
22:53:28  <Samu> there, everything i'm trying
22:54:51  <nielsm> much more complex than needed
22:55:22  <nielsm> just build a histogram over height levels
22:55:50  <nielsm> calculate how many tiles minimum need to be snow, then go from the max height level in the histogram and sum "downwards" until you pass the required number of snow tiles, then you have your snow line level
22:58:18  <Samu> there's already a histogram somewhere there
22:58:23  <nielsm> or, frequency distribution table, rather than histogram (histogram is a graphical representation of a frequency distribution)
22:58:24  <Samu> by tgp itself
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23:00:04  <nielsm> if you already have height level distributions somewhere, you shouldn't need to loop over the map data again to determine a snow line height
23:05:04  <Wolf01> Hmmm, I finished Astroneer
23:06:40  <frosch> the more reviews of sw9 i read, the more i conclude that it is kind of a masterpiece of parody
23:08:02  <peter1138> I enjoyed it.
23:08:13  <frosch> it will take months to decode all the puns
23:08:22  <Samu> the histogram is being used to generate the desired % of water
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23:08:40  <peter1138> Btw, if messing with terrain, ensure that variety bollocks is off too.
23:09:02  <frosch> didn't they reinvent variety earlier?
23:09:08  <Samu> but it's being done with heights of the perlin map
23:09:14  <peter1138> Probably. It needs it.
23:09:20  <Samu> those heights are not yet translated to openttd
23:09:44  <Samu> i dunno how to make a histogram :(
23:10:26  <nielsm> Samu: you just make an array (a vector) of appropriate size, initialise it to all zero, then loop over your data (the map data) and add 1 to the right bucket for every value
23:12:50  <nielsm> frosch, can I get you to read over this?
23:13:20  <nielsm> in particular I'd like some opinions on how to handle the rating name and tooltip, I think the approach described right now is bad
23:13:56  <nielsm> I'm thinking about packing both StringIDs into the text field of the Set rating component command
23:14:24  <nielsm> (because they need to be string id's and not character strings)
23:14:52  <frosch> did you check out some gs?
23:15:21  <frosch> those that i played (mainly nocargoal and my own silicon valley) have a solution to display a score progress
23:15:38  <nielsm> yeah I know they do stuff for that
23:15:51  <nielsm> the idea here is to use the proper game GUI for it
23:16:08  <nielsm> and have it represented on the company performance rating graph
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23:16:28  <frosch> ah, ok, "graph" is something new
23:16:49  <frosch> if it was just for the detailed score table, i would have suggested to just drop it :p
23:17:37  <nielsm> by that argument, the entire company rating idea (and high score) may as well be removed from the game
23:18:09  <nielsm> since it doesn't really measure anything but one specific play style/game goal
23:18:26  <frosch> well, there is a specific goal window for gs
23:18:46  <frosch> so why also use the old less flexible one
23:20:05  <frosch> (btw. i killed 3/4 of the old highscore when i removed difficulty settings :p and i consider the endgame screen a nuisance)
23:21:22  <frosch> but ok, so my interpretation is: the goal gui can display multiple goals and their progress, but you want some "sum" of that progress and plot it in the graph over time?
23:21:36  <nielsm> yes
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23:23:26  <Samu> how to histogram?
23:23:31  <Samu> wait
23:23:37  <frosch> you suggest a new "rating id", i would recommend to use the existing "goal id"
23:23:41  <frosch>
23:24:19  <frosch> essentially the same as SetProgress, but instead of a text also some numerical percentage or weighted score
23:25:22  <nielsm> uh I tried starting a game with NoCarGoal and this looks wrong:
23:25:41  <frosch> that's not nocargoal
23:26:18  <Samu> cleaner version
23:26:20  <nielsm>
23:26:58  <Samu> lines 1 to 8 is code already from tgp.cpp, unchanged, i added code afterwards
23:27:04  <frosch> it works fine for me
23:27:13  <frosch> i think you have a broken table/strings.h
23:27:43  <frosch> or language files from another version
23:28:21  <frosch> nocargoal display "x %" as progress text
23:28:55  <frosch> i think if i wanted a plot of that i would want a plot for the individual goals, not as a whole
23:30:37  <frosch> sv does not seem to use that progress text
23:30:52  <frosch> so i assume that was a newer addition, and not part of the original goal stuff
23:33:19  <frosch> about storing gs stuff in savegames. since the gs only runs on the server, multiplayer requires that you store the result of all gs actions in the savefile
23:33:53  <frosch> it may still be recommended that gs recalculate stuff, but ottd has to stick to whatever they set last
23:35:04  <frosch> hmm, though i am not sure whether some stuff is actually only loaded from savegames when joining network games, and discarded when loaded alone
23:35:35  <nielsm> okay I have no idea what was going on, but after doing a full rebuild that goals window bug went away
23:35:49  <nielsm> (didn't need to rerun strgen, just openttd itself)
23:36:26  <nielsm> hinted by the fact that the debugger claimed there were no symbols for the goal_gui.cpp code I tried to put breakpoints in
23:40:27  <Samu> TileHeight is less cpu than GetTileZ
23:40:32  <Samu> intensive
23:40:59  <Samu> reads the height from the _m directly
23:41:15  <Samu> _m[tile].height;
23:41:46  <nielsm> GetTileZ considers the contents of the tile, TileHeight just the base terrain
23:42:12  <nielsm> (contents of the tile can make foundations that affect the "perceived height")
23:42:36  <Samu> SetTileHeight writes directly into _m[tile].height too
23:42:56  <Samu> TileHeight is then correct
23:43:11  <Samu> gotta go sleep, take care
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23:44:20  <frosch> SetProgress and SetText and all that stuff are 1.4 additions
23:44:50  <frosch> now i remember that sv actually had to constantly delete and recreate goals... because there was no method to update them in 1.2
23:48:23  <frosch> so maybe a GSGoal::SetRating(goal_id, current_rating, max_rating)
23:48:56  <frosch> that allows both computing a percentage and plotting of that percentage, and computing a weighted total score and plotting of that
23:49:56  <glx> <nielsm> hinted by the fact that the debugger claimed there were no symbols for the goal_gui.cpp code I tried to put breakpoints in <-- happened a lot when I was doing FOR_ALL replacements
23:49:57  <nielsm> _dp_ has previously mentioned he'd also like rating items with unlimited score
23:50:30  <glx> I guess the dependencies detection doesn't work very well, or maybe some ghost includes
23:50:41  <frosch> hmm, so just GSPlot? :p
23:50:58  <nielsm> frosch: one issue with using GSGoal is that goals of different companies don't easily correlate, so if you give two companies the same goal you wouldn't be able to graph those against each other
23:51:08  <frosch> dp is a city builder, so they probably want to plot the cargo transport of the main town of each company
23:52:10  <frosch> hmm, so you need matching of the goals between companies
23:52:54  <nielsm> my initial inspiration for doing this:
23:53:34  <nielsm> (damn that's almost two years ago I started on that patch now, before even doing the music stuff)
23:53:40  <frosch> funnily in the case of ncg and sv, the goals of individual companies are only similar in structure, but not the same :p
23:56:37  <nielsm> yeah it would only make sense to plot the totals for each company against each other
23:57:44  <nielsm> unless you kept track of non-goals for all companies too, and then just marked the graphs for the real goals specially
23:58:14  <nielsm> so you could graph the amount of every single cargo transported for any company, and then have marks on the cargoes that actually mattered for scoring
23:58:18  <frosch> what about ignoreing the rating gui, and just allow gs to create custom plots? i.e. they create some plot_id and then can record a sample every now and then. ottd stores the sample over N years and plots them
23:58:18  <nielsm> way way complicated
23:58:32  <nielsm> maybe yes
23:59:44  <nielsm> and then as a bonus mark one of the plots as "replaces company rating", and if a company rating replacement is selected then the normal game end rules don't apply (the score screen never shows at a specific date)

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