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00:00:01 *** steinn has quit IRC 00:20:47 *** Flygon has joined #openttd 00:43:41 *** Wormnest has quit IRC 00:43:54 *** hythlodaeus has quit IRC 01:02:52 *** Progman has quit IRC 01:10:16 *** snail_UES_ has quit IRC 01:16:55 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 01:20:24 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/website] LordAro merged pull request #113: Change: semantic HTML-elements for the pages main sections https://git.io/JeH4H 02:15:19 *** glx has quit IRC 03:09:44 *** D-HUND has joined #openttd 03:13:07 *** debdog has quit IRC 03:57:25 *** Wormnest has joined #openttd 04:06:40 *** Wormnest has quit IRC 06:39:18 *** nielsm has joined #openttd 06:47:32 *** tokai has joined #openttd 06:47:32 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai 06:53:21 *** nielsm has quit IRC 06:54:13 *** tokai|noir has quit IRC 07:35:40 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 07:52:26 <andythenorth> o/ 07:54:15 <andythenorth> Pikka: a release! 08:23:01 *** Wolf01 has joined #openttd 08:32:37 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro merged pull request #7850: Change: [hotkeys] add missing keycodes for hotkeys.cfg https://git.io/JeM3O 08:57:55 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 09:16:43 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro requested changes for pull request #7094: Fix #7088: Retrieve an appropriate name for a non-existant AI/GS when displaying a textfile https://git.io/JebAw 09:24:05 <peter1138> You've released? 09:26:28 <LordAro> peter1138: you haven't? 09:26:33 <LordAro> everyone is doing it 09:27:03 <LordAro> peter1138: any further thoughts on #7248? i'm tempted to rebase it and get it in 09:27:14 <andythenorth> 3 company colours then? o_O 09:27:16 * andythenorth wonders 09:27:32 <LordAro> andythenorth: shush now 09:28:13 <andythenorth> oh yes 09:28:14 <andythenorth> ok 09:28:19 <peter1138> I released a poo. 09:28:21 * andythenorth back to Horsing 09:28:31 <andythenorth> peter1138: release early, release often 09:28:33 <peter1138> LordAro, I don't know what it is. 09:28:38 <andythenorth> not too early, that's awkward 09:28:47 <peter1138> Do I have to log in to github? 09:28:58 <LordAro> https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/7248 09:29:22 <peter1138> Oh, no. There were reports that it is slower in some instances. 09:29:33 <peter1138> So it needs more thought. 09:30:07 <peter1138> I considered maintaining separate lists instead of iterating a massive one 5 times... 09:30:25 <LordAro> mm 09:31:09 <peter1138> May be more work but spread out better. Don't know. 09:31:45 <peter1138> I guess such a list would be modified only on vehicle creation/destruction, so less work. 09:36:14 <LordAro> tricky bit would be actually splitting the engine pool, as best as i can tell 09:39:00 <peter1138> Not sure how that is relevant. 09:39:53 <peter1138> It's all a lot of work "just" for some benchmarking features ;-) 09:41:37 <LordAro> well Engine is currently declared as a single _engine_pool . The pool stuff is how it's iterated over. So to have separate lists, you'd need separate pools 09:41:59 <LordAro> unless you do something with another level of abstraction, of course 09:44:11 <peter1138> I meant additional lists, pointing to the main list, indeed. 09:58:20 *** Samu has joined #openttd 10:07:29 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 10:21:50 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 10:22:04 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 10:37:27 *** Progman has joined #openttd 10:39:08 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 10:58:29 *** floodious has joined #openttd 10:58:58 *** floodious has quit IRC 11:07:32 *** snail_UES_ has joined #openttd 11:26:34 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7094: Fix #7088: Retrieve an appropriate name for a non-existant AI/GS when displaying a textfile https://git.io/Jebpi 11:39:27 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 11:44:00 *** frosch123 has joined #openttd 11:50:13 <andythenorth> quak etc 11:50:28 <frosch123> hoi 11:51:38 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] frosch123 commented on pull request #7877: Fix: Farms could be generated at sea level https://git.io/Jebp5 11:51:38 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] frosch123 closed pull request #7877: Fix: Farms could be generated at sea level https://git.io/Jebot 11:52:46 <LordAro> hoihoi 11:53:24 <LordAro> frosch123: tbf, he often does ask here first whether it would be a good PR 11:53:30 <LordAro> doesn't normally get a response 11:54:29 * andythenorth wonders about PR-ing 3 company colours :P 11:55:14 <frosch123> andythenorth: isn't win32 paintbrush open source or something? maybe add it as "paint on your own vehicles" 11:55:26 <andythenorth> voxels 11:55:27 <frosch123> s/win32/win 3.11/ 11:56:06 <andythenorth> I did a PR once 11:56:07 <andythenorth> https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/7340 11:56:11 <andythenorth> but it got closed 11:56:56 <frosch123> for valid reasons, it's almost a samu pr 11:57:45 <frosch123> i had a coworker at my old job 11:58:25 <frosch123> whenever there was a bug, he determined where each if would need to branch to get to the desired result, and then just add "not" to all ifs that did not match 11:59:22 <frosch123> actually, it's kind of similar to training neural networks. is it "reinforment coding"? 11:59:30 <frosch123> +ce 12:00:03 <Pikka> andythenorth, zounds! 12:00:31 <andythenorth> Pikka: it's good eh? 12:00:34 <andythenorth> no more bugs found 12:00:51 <Pikka> hooray! 12:00:59 <andythenorth> it's built a narrow gauge train 12:01:05 <Pikka> I found one or two but I'll hold on to them until someone else finds more. ;) 12:01:07 <Pikka> ooh :D 12:01:16 <andythenorth> it's really quite civil about building trains 12:01:31 <andythenorth> I've upped the route limit to 256 tiles to see if it builds more 12:01:40 <andythenorth> and gave each AI £10m to play with 12:01:47 <Pikka> :) 12:02:15 <Pikka> as far as industries go, it will only build to 12:02:20 <Pikka> a) industries that produce nothing 12:02:26 <Pikka> b) industries that produce goods or food 12:02:41 <Pikka> c) industries that happen to be in the catchment area of a station it already built 12:02:55 <Pikka> so it tends to stay out of the way of complex industry chains like FIRS has 12:03:01 <andythenorth> I gave it FIRS Tropic Basic to play, it's mostly food 12:03:17 <Pikka> :D 12:03:37 <andythenorth> https://firs-test-1.s3.eu-west-2.amazonaws.com/firs-v4-previews/docs/html/economies.html#tropic_basic 12:03:46 <andythenorth> it does alcohol quite well 12:04:39 <andythenorth> frosch123: I thought it was a valid 'fix' for tropic landscape :) 12:04:46 <andythenorth> it doesn't address the root cause :P 12:05:14 <LordAro> frosch123: are you sure he wasn't actually a neural network? :p 12:06:23 <andythenorth> Pikka: can I fork it as UncivilAI? :) 12:06:34 <andythenorth> it's good for testing Horse, but needs to be more aggressive 12:07:00 * andythenorth probably as enough projects 12:07:15 <Pikka> ya 12:07:32 <Pikka> you do tend to end up just watching the game and not playing it when you're developing AIs :P 12:09:10 <andythenorth> FFWD with 6 AIs :P 12:09:16 <andythenorth> my battery dies quick :) 12:10:32 <andythenorth> although the 6 AIs don't use much game loop time 12:10:36 <andythenorth> it's graphics rendering 12:10:50 <andythenorth> FFWD is running at the fantastic speed of 1.3x 12:11:42 <andythenorth> oh I opened a news window, now it's back up to 2.5x 12:11:48 <andythenorth> such a weird optimisation tactic 12:13:33 *** snail_UES_ has quit IRC 12:13:45 <andythenorth> oh window-shading the fps window gets me 3.5x 12:14:08 * peter1138 ponders switching to Garmin from Fitbit. 12:14:26 <andythenorth> https://www.jstor.org/stable/pdf/188430.pdf 12:17:11 <andythenorth> 3.65x if I make the ottd window really small 12:18:44 <andythenorth> @calc 1.65 / 2.65 12:18:44 <DorpsGek> andythenorth: 0.622641509434 12:19:07 <andythenorth> @calc 1 / 2.65 12:19:07 <DorpsGek> andythenorth: 0.377358490566 12:19:28 <andythenorth> ok so windowshading fps window causes the game to run ~37% faster on ffwd 12:19:54 <andythenorth> I'm probably wrong, but is updating that window really expensive? 12:30:29 <andythenorth> https://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/9560/fps-windowshade.m4v 12:33:40 <Pikka> andythenorth, when I want it to ff as fast as possible I zoom right in on a patch of water :) 12:34:56 <andythenorth> I get highest fps at 1x zoom 12:35:29 <Pikka> oh 12:35:31 <andythenorth> usually in southern corner of map, with mostly blac 12:35:33 <andythenorth> black 12:35:50 <Pikka> I guess my landscape tiles are 4x, it runs fastest when it doesn't have to resize them? 12:36:06 <andythenorth> probably yes 12:36:43 <andythenorth> hmm my laptop now smells of lightbulb 12:36:47 <andythenorth> or electrical heater 12:41:13 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/website] Smatchcube opened pull request #120: Add HTML lang attribute https://git.io/Jebhw 13:19:42 <Samu> ewm... PR was closed 13:25:35 <andythenorth> ok so for coal and similar stuff, these are the wagon choices 13:25:36 <andythenorth> https://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/9561/mineral_wagons.png 13:25:58 <andythenorth> all perform the same [only difference is capacity varies by length] 13:26:52 <andythenorth> for industrial liquids / petrochemical stuff, these are the wagon choices :P 13:26:52 <andythenorth> https://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/9562/tankers.png 13:27:02 <andythenorth> but they recolour to suit the cargo 13:27:56 <Pikka> noice 13:28:00 <andythenorth> localised feedback is that recolouring is weird 13:28:08 <andythenorth> feedback is very in my face here 13:28:16 <andythenorth> 9 year olds are persistent 13:28:21 <Pikka> yes 13:28:47 <andythenorth> I tried splitting up the tank cars by cargo, with different colours 13:29:00 <andythenorth> but they're all still just cylinders 13:29:16 <andythenorth> the mineral wagons look quite different, to me at least 13:31:13 * andythenorth will find an answer :P 13:33:53 <Samu> out of 20480, 4 were generated at height 0 13:34:07 <Samu> @calc 4/20480 13:34:07 <DorpsGek> Samu: 0.0001953125 13:36:53 <andythenorth> hmm 13:37:02 <andythenorth> I basically want black, grey and CC tankers 13:37:06 <andythenorth> and no recolour 13:37:30 <andythenorth> but 'Class B Tanker' and 'Class A Tanker' is very UK-specific railway stuff 13:37:38 <andythenorth> as names 13:42:34 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/website] glx22 commented on pull request #120: Add HTML lang attribute https://git.io/JebjW 13:46:38 <Pikka> oil tanker, petrol tanker, chemical tanker, etc? 13:47:45 <andythenorth> I think that's where it's head yair 13:47:48 <andythenorth> headed * 13:48:06 <andythenorth> NARS 3 ones can be black and white 13:48:20 <andythenorth> NARS 3 or riot! 13:48:28 <Samu> 1 out of 20480 now 13:49:05 <Samu> so, it's not a bug, it's only rare 13:49:15 <Samu> hmm ok, time to move on 13:57:57 <Samu> that means snowline level at 3 14:03:44 *** y2kboy23 has joined #openttd 14:04:19 *** cHawk- has quit IRC 14:04:32 *** cHawk- has joined #openttd 14:08:26 *** y2kboy23_ has quit IRC 14:10:37 *** Flygon has quit IRC 14:13:02 <Samu> I have this ready again, now accounting for the intended rarity https://github.com/SamuXarick/OpenTTD/commit/7aa9f7f5dcc249d4380af834fcf4e65db90faf19 14:13:08 <Samu> should I PR? 14:14:11 <Samu> all its missing is removing strings from foreign languages, which is boring to do 14:14:16 *** Pikka has quit IRC 14:22:08 <LordAro> Samu: 6 seems quite high 14:22:16 <LordAro> why is it so high? 14:23:03 <Samu> it's the only way to have both farms and forests on the map 14:24:00 <LordAro> farms don't need 6 levels... 14:24:02 <Samu> and it's not really a 6, terragenesis apparently maxes out at that value - 1 14:24:44 <Samu> farms can only be below snowline - 2 14:25:45 *** nielsm has joined #openttd 14:26:12 <LordAro> hmm 14:26:20 <LordAro> still feels like the wrong solution 14:26:47 <LordAro> nielsm: thoughts on the above? 14:27:52 <Samu> nielsm wanted a histogram, but i dunno how to do that, i made it the way I know 14:29:15 <LordAro> unfortunately "hacking at stuff you don't understand" is rarely a good answer 14:31:51 <nielsm> uh just a moment, pulling up logs... 14:35:01 <nielsm> my birds decree it unimportant 14:44:55 *** y2kboy23 has quit IRC 14:45:13 *** dwfreed has quit IRC 14:45:15 *** dwfreed has joined #openttd 14:45:16 *** y2kboy23 has joined #openttd 14:45:16 *** urdh has quit IRC 14:47:39 <andythenorth> what was the goal? 14:48:17 *** nielsm is now known as Guest12509 14:48:28 *** nielsm has joined #openttd 14:50:56 *** nnyby_ has quit IRC 14:51:34 *** urdh has joined #openttd 14:51:46 *** Guest12509 has quit IRC 14:52:15 *** nnyby has joined #openttd 14:53:11 *** ST2 has quit IRC 14:54:13 <Samu> have snow on the map and not fail to generate industries 14:55:03 *** ST2 has joined #openttd 14:59:04 <nielsm> I still hold that the solution to that problem is to change the map generation rules so you cannot generate a map without mountains 14:59:26 <nielsm> make it always generate a mix of mountains and whatever else you select 15:03:04 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7852: Feature: Show the name of the NewGRF in the build vehicle window. https://git.io/JeNed 15:04:22 <Samu> how would it respect max height? 15:04:25 <Samu> :( 15:08:03 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 15:14:00 <andythenorth> hmm 15:14:11 * andythenorth tries to work out how to take a vector across a heightmap png 15:14:27 <andythenorth> that's represented as a linear list of values :P 15:14:52 * andythenorth considering a naive erosion-based terrain generator 15:20:56 <andythenorth> hmm 15:21:23 <andythenorth> I can understand the computational efficiency of perlin noise, but it doesn't actually look good 15:28:00 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 15:28:53 <andythenorth> https://github.com/dandrino/terrain-erosion-3-ways 15:30:47 <nielsm> next crazy idea: integrate a WASM VM and use for future extension, allow GS and AI to be written in it, and allow it to supply terrain generators 15:31:07 <nielsm> and allow it to add every kind of object newgrf does 15:31:21 <nielsm> (deprecating squirrel and newgrf for new projects) 15:31:28 <andythenorth> o_O 15:32:20 <_dp_> nielsm, haven't I mentioned that idea before? 15:32:27 <nielsm> you have? 15:32:39 <_dp_> it's actually pretty reasonable way to do extensions imo 15:32:39 <nielsm> it's not a far grasp so I'm not surprised 15:32:58 <_dp_> yeah, I even did a bit of coding 15:33:05 <_dp_> tiny bit though, nothing useful so far 15:50:32 <nielsm> and step after that would be recompiling squirrel to wasm :P 15:50:54 <frosch123> tb kicked me when i suggested a html+js gui :p 15:51:03 <nielsm> :D 15:51:38 <Samu> i just noticed i have the snowline determined at the wrong place. I thought that location was the final stage of landscape generation, but there's some FixSlopes next :/ 15:51:46 <_dp_> dunno about squirrel but moving newgrf stuff to wasm would be neat 15:52:09 <frosch123> what benefits do you expect? 15:52:13 <nielsm> I just fear that recompiling existing newgrf to something else might have weird results 15:52:44 <nielsm> (or rather, be difficult to do correctly) 15:53:15 <_dp_> not recompiling newgrf files but runtime than runs them 15:53:19 <_dp_> for backwards compatibility 15:53:40 <nielsm> actually, maybe that would be a useful exercise, translate newgrf to a sequence of instructions in another language 15:54:28 *** snail_UES_ has joined #openttd 15:54:54 <_dp_> nml2wasm?) 15:56:09 <nielsm> why not 15:59:25 <nielsm> sprite and sound data could probably also be included straight in a wasm module as static data 16:04:41 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 16:04:53 <_dp_> static data is the least worry 16:05:23 <_dp_> though something like procedural sprites can be a neat feature 16:05:42 <nielsm> I fear what andy might do :P 16:06:01 <nielsm> really the entire pynml framework could be implemented right in the VM 16:06:58 <nielsm> distribute image processing and 3D rendering libraries as part of the addon 16:08:12 <_dp_> I fear what I've already done :p https://i.imgur.com/sMKH8WG.png 16:15:08 <andythenorth> allow the insertion of C++ methods and classes via WASM :P 16:15:17 <andythenorth> extensibility-in-place via mods 16:15:22 <andythenorth> what could go wrong? 16:16:34 <frosch123> how about clojure? 16:18:15 * LordAro dislikes wasm 16:18:25 <LordAro> lua seems like a more sensible bet 16:18:45 <nielsm> luajit isn't bad either, I suppose 16:19:05 <frosch123> isn't that unmainteined for 5 years? 16:19:11 <nielsm> is it? 16:19:56 <nielsm> that makes wasm look even more like the pragmatic best bet for a system likely to be maintained and get high-quality implementations 16:20:23 <frosch123> is it a functional language though? 16:20:47 <nielsm> no, thoroughly stateful 16:21:10 <frosch123> so, not suitable :) 16:21:20 <nielsm> hm yeah I suppose that can actually be problematic for newgrf and reproducability 16:21:41 <nielsm> across network 16:22:02 <frosch123> can your browser run 4000 vms in parallel? 16:22:32 <frosch123> how do you map trains to vms? 16:22:59 <LordAro> lua itself isn't slow, last time i checked 16:23:51 <nielsm> this discussion came from terrain generators initially, I'm not sure I'd have lua generate a 2k or 4k map 16:23:55 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 16:24:05 <nielsm> and newgrf became a bonus option 16:29:06 <frosch123> yexo wrote a squirrel mapgen some years ago 16:29:11 <frosch123> and abandoned it due to speed 16:29:54 <andythenorth> this makes an adequate heightmap https://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/9563/dandrino-generator-6.png 16:30:01 <andythenorth> it's processed version of https://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/9564/dandrino-generator-5.png 16:30:23 <frosch123> http://devs.openttd.org/~yexo/mapgen/ 16:30:27 <andythenorth> from https://github.com/dandrino/terrain-erosion-3-ways fbm with domain warping 16:31:16 <nielsm> regarding wasm as a newgrf execution environment, I wonder if it wouldn't be possible to have a VM fault on memory writes 16:32:04 <nielsm> basically letting the newgrf have an init stage where it can set up its memory of data, and after init the memory becomes static data stored as part of the savegame 16:36:13 <_dp_> nielsm, what for? if there is wasm it makes more sense to use it for extensions directly in future and not develop newgrf runtime much further 16:37:16 <nielsm> the issue frosch123 hints at is the network game model of ottd, every client needs to execute the same, and two independent vehicles should not affect each other intentionally or through bugs in the add-on 16:37:50 <nielsm> if a vehicle procedure (callback) has access to mutable state then things quickly become weird and non-deterministic 16:39:10 <nielsm> like a vehicle acting differently on two clients because one client has the vehicle information window open and that causes a procedure to be called 16:40:23 <_dp_> you mean wasm will allow developers to make bad extensions? 16:40:59 <_dp_> coz wasm runtime itself seems pretty deterministic 16:41:02 <nielsm> newgrf as designed makes it (in principle) impossible to make extensions that cause desyncs 16:41:06 <nielsm> apart from bugs in ottd itself 16:41:14 <peter1138> hahaa 16:42:54 <nielsm> wasm itself is deterministic, but even then if deterministic code that accesses mutable state can be run based on non-deterministic data (such as user inputs that differ on clients), the total system is non-deterministic 16:43:23 <milek7_> luajit seems maintained 16:43:24 <milek7_> https://github.com/LuaJIT/LuaJIT/commits/v2.1 16:43:49 <milek7_> but for some reason it is stuck on 5.1 syntax 16:44:17 <_dp_> well, with great power comes great responsibility 16:44:33 <nielsm> lua syntax not being forward-compatible is a major issue imo, and probably a reason for luajit sticking to 5.1 16:44:39 <_dp_> if something like nml2wasm is made that can probably guarantee desync-safety 16:45:00 <_dp_> but when written directly it's coders responsibility 16:47:54 <_dp_> though it may be possible to isolate gui writeble memory from game state code within wasm idk 16:48:16 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 16:49:23 <milek7_> wasm vm probably does bounds-check already, so it should be possible to disallow specific areas 16:50:17 <milek7_> code in luajit is fast itself, but I'm not sure how fast is c->lua transition 16:50:51 <milek7_> lua_call api is annoying, and luajit ffi callbacks are globally limited to few hundred functions or so 16:51:38 *** Wormnest has joined #openttd 16:51:56 <milek7_> 'Callbacks are slow! First, the C to Lua transition itself has an unavoidable cost, similar to a lua_call() or lua_pcall(). Argument and result marshalling add to that cost. And finally, neither the C compiler nor LuaJIT can inline or optimize across the language barrier and hoist repeated computations out of a callback function. ' 16:52:15 <milek7_> 'Callbacks take up resources — you can only have a limited number of them at the same time (500 - 1000, depending on the architecture).' 16:53:02 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] btzy updated pull request #7028: Feature: Option to group vehicle list by shared orders https://git.io/fhGxd 16:55:46 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] btzy commented on pull request #7028: Feature: Option to group vehicle list by shared orders https://git.io/JeNJx 17:05:19 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 17:08:29 <milek7_> but lua works fine for my christmas tree decoration ;) 17:09:12 <frosch123> sounds like a complex decoration 17:09:19 <frosch123> what does it do? play darude? 17:10:39 <milek7_> https://milek7.pl/.stuff/26gru.webm 17:11:16 <andythenorth> [to the tune of darude] 17:11:56 <milek7_> https://i.imgur.com/8kftNEb.png 17:12:19 * andythenorth is hungry 17:13:01 * andythenorth wonders how many types of tank car to add 17:13:04 <frosch123> i think "christmas" is a weird excuse to have fun with light :) 17:13:14 <andythenorth> I add lights to my van this year :P 17:13:21 <andythenorth> we should all light our vehicles / bikes 17:14:13 <andythenorth> oof I had an idea 17:14:28 <frosch123> oh, i saw a car with (fake) elk horns on the external mirrors 17:14:48 <frosch123> i felt happy to not sit inside that car 17:16:26 <andythenorth> https://photos.smugmug.com/Railroad-Leasing-Companies/SMBC-Rail-Services-LLC/Tank-Cars/i-FxXVJNv/1/f07b384e/L/shpx_tankcar_202715-L.jpg 17:16:35 <andythenorth> sulphur ^ 17:16:35 <andythenorth> http://s3.amazonaws.com/rrpa_photos/63457/GATX%2021781%20-1A%20WB%20on%20BNSF%20at%20Plattsmouth%20NE%204-10-10%20%201024N.JPG 17:16:42 <andythenorth> phosporic acid ^ 17:16:55 <andythenorth> maybe I can do a cargo coloured stripe :P 17:17:07 <andythenorth> currently I recolour the whole sprite :P 17:17:16 * andythenorth pixels 17:17:30 <Samu> determine snow line height can be extended to Original land generator, just checking out 17:17:40 <Samu> instead of a constant 7 17:19:17 <frosch123> you can also do two sprite layers and recolour them independently 17:19:48 <andythenorth> I could 17:19:55 <andythenorth> I do that for containers 17:21:42 <Samu> hmm, not the result I expected https://i.imgur.com/6obbyoU.png 17:22:06 <Samu> that's 33% snow at the top you suggested ;p 17:23:20 <nielsm> yeah maybe a different amount is better 17:27:02 <andythenorth> this tank car is refittable to canadians! https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/1260/4747/products/20151219-175418-C1-Trainz-P12168159-STILL-00_be72734e-323b-407f-827b-5f2b6cf6b0b4.jpg?v=1571722634 17:31:29 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] btzy updated pull request #7028: Feature: Option to group vehicle list by shared orders https://git.io/fhGxd 17:31:42 <frosch123> maple sirup tanker? 17:31:57 <Samu> with 50%, the result matches 7 17:32:06 <Samu> down from 12 17:32:29 <Samu> 7 was TTD's snowline height, right? 17:37:39 *** Maarten has joined #openttd 17:39:28 <andythenorth> canadian economy 17:39:33 <andythenorth> maple syrup, moose 17:40:22 <frosch123> it gets harder after that :) 17:40:53 <Samu> with 50% snow[img]https://i.imgur.com/mLkeRah.png 17:41:08 <Samu> on terragenesis 17:41:38 <Samu> it's quite damn good imo 17:47:03 <frosch123> apparently there are now official pieces to put lego on h0 tracks 17:48:34 <Samu> interesting find, seems to be that terragenesis is afraid of making too high terrain 17:48:43 <Samu> at least % wise 17:48:55 <Samu> original has more tiles higher than terragenesis on alpinist 17:50:55 <Samu> heh, snowline height even decreases when set to very rough 17:51:20 <Samu> smooth and very smooth generates more tiles higher 17:51:25 <Samu> than rough and very rough 17:54:57 <Samu> gonna test some real heightmaps 18:01:45 <Samu> eww first map i opened, looks really bad 18:01:55 <Samu> snow line set to 4, it was Europe 4k 18:07:57 <Samu> this thing wastes quite a bit of time to determine the right height, would the histogram be faster? maybe I wanna learn how to do it 18:11:37 <Samu> woah, heightmaps isn't afraid of throwing big heights 18:13:24 <Samu> i set a max height of 255, this europe map peaks at 135 18:14:39 <Samu> this peak is somewhere in spain 18:14:42 <Samu> heh, 18:14:55 <Samu> not sure if I buy that 18:19:42 <andythenorth> not tenerife? 18:22:54 <Samu> no, somewhere in main land 18:25:45 <Samu> I discovered something... 18:26:11 <Samu> FixSlopes is being run twice for heightmaps 18:26:18 <Samu> isn't one enough? 18:36:56 *** gelignite2nd has joined #openttd 18:47:58 <Samu> can I make a PR about this finding? 18:48:12 *** glx has joined #openttd 18:48:12 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v glx 18:49:12 <Samu> you have FixSlopes here: https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/blob/master/src/landscape.cpp#L1369 18:49:57 <Samu> and here: https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/blob/master/src/heightmap.cpp#L502 18:50:51 <Samu> the one on landscape should stay imo, and the other on heightmap should be removed, but then landscape needs to be removed of one extra step 18:51:21 <dwfreed> "Do not call IncreaseGeneratingWorldProgress() before FixSlopes()" 18:51:42 <dwfreed> there's a IncreaseGeneratingWorldProgress call right after LoadHeightmap 18:52:33 <Samu> this step needs remove https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/blob/master/src/landscape.cpp#L1308 18:52:49 <Samu> and this line https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/blob/master/src/landscape.cpp#L1297 18:52:53 <Samu> needs -1 18:53:00 <Samu> to the number of steps 18:53:58 <dwfreed> does the second FixSlopes make changes? 18:54:12 <dwfreed> before assuming it's redundant, perhaps you should check :P 18:55:36 <nielsm> I'd suggest tracing the code back through "blame" to figure out when the second was added and get an idea why 18:59:06 *** Wormnest has quit IRC 19:03:31 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 19:06:07 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 19:15:02 <andythenorth> so I am pretty much at one wagon type per cargo :P 19:15:34 <andythenorth> in a context where FIRS Steeltown has 41 cargos :P 19:25:18 *** Smedles_ has quit IRC 19:25:58 *** Smedles has joined #openttd 19:32:03 *** snail_UES_ has quit IRC 19:32:21 <frosch123> oh dear, now you probably change firs to have less cargos... 19:33:14 <andythenorth> hmm 19:33:26 <andythenorth> minimalism doesn't seem to extend that far 19:33:37 <andythenorth> oof imagine if minimalism was really big :P 19:36:15 <andythenorth> hmm 19:36:32 <andythenorth> RL sulphur tanker fails to be yellow https://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/img/s/v-3/p929693567-3.jpg 19:36:36 * andythenorth deletes all plans 19:37:03 *** gelignite2nd has quit IRC 19:41:21 <frosch123> that's sulphur acid 19:42:00 <andythenorth> for some reason I don't distinguish in game 19:42:22 <andythenorth> sulphuric acid / molten sulphur / sulphur rock all same 19:42:25 <andythenorth> maybe I should :P 19:44:03 <frosch123> https://comps.canstockphoto.com/coal-cars-full-of-yellow-sulfur-stock-photography_csp6443220.jpg <- quite yellow 19:44:59 <frosch123> https://www.logisticsmiddleeast.com/sites/default/files/logme/styles/full_img/public/images/2017/10/18/Etihad-Rail-sulphur.jpg?itok=ezPGBi_Z <- if it was that yellow in ottd, people would call it unrealistic 19:46:35 <frosch123> anyway, i expected silo vans, but apparently it's more like coal 19:47:54 <andythenorth> it has been yellow in my sets for ages :) 19:47:57 <frosch123> oh dear... when you search for vehicle images, and factorio screenshots show up 19:48:03 <andythenorth> or OpenTTD :P 19:48:09 <andythenorth> often this channel 19:50:34 <frosch123> hmm, i wonder whether i have a misconception of how sulphur exists in nature 19:53:18 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] stormcone updated pull request #7852: Feature: Show the name of the NewGRF in the build vehicle window. https://git.io/JeMKL 19:57:08 <andythenorth> in eggs 19:57:09 <andythenorth> mostly 19:57:55 <frosch123> apparently it exists in surface minnig 19:58:16 <frosch123> but i don't understand how that was created historically 19:58:27 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] stormcone commented on pull request #7852: Feature: Show the name of the NewGRF in the build vehicle window. https://git.io/JeNI7 19:59:15 <frosch123> they say vulkans, but then it should have been burnt 19:59:59 <andythenorth> there are good pictures of it being mined 20:00:02 <andythenorth> historical 20:00:20 <andythenorth> isn't it a deposit from hot springs etc? 20:00:39 <frosch123> hmm, hot springs 20:04:11 <Samu> this is strange 20:04:36 <Samu> FixSlopes on the 2nd run still fixes slopes, is the algorythm wrong 20:04:40 <Samu> ? 20:06:59 <Samu> nevermind 20:07:04 <Samu> a bug with my code :o 20:07:09 <Samu> retesting 20:08:24 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh approved pull request #7852: Feature: Show the name of the NewGRF in the build vehicle window. https://git.io/JeNLJ 20:08:47 <Samu> yep, nothing to fix on the 2nd run 20:09:10 *** gelignite2nd has joined #openttd 20:15:32 <Samu> blame says this https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/commit/3850b5912f80250526b953da5bf6359199aabc85 20:15:35 <Samu> 10 years ago lol 20:17:37 *** snail_UES_ has joined #openttd 20:17:38 <Samu> https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/commit/14f52cf29e5beb45c4cf1ae24f9a668e21443f74 20:17:40 <Samu> or this 20:17:45 <Samu> 11 years ago 20:19:47 <Samu> seems that it was a change to make it run only once 20:19:51 <Samu> :9 20:22:16 <Samu> MarkWholeScreenDirty is this needed? 20:22:28 <nielsm> probably not really 20:24:05 <Samu> ok removing it 20:26:16 <Samu> IncreaseGeneratingWorldProgress also has a MarkWholeScreenDirty 20:26:28 <Samu> guess it's safe to remove 20:26:57 <glx> this one force redraw of the progress window I think 20:27:34 <glx> so yes other are redondand probably 20:32:00 <Samu> Fix: Fixing the slopes was being done twice on heightmaps when one suffices 20:32:04 <Samu> good name? 20:36:45 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick opened pull request #7880: Fix: Fixing the slopes was being done twice on heightmaps when one suffices https://git.io/JeNLr 20:39:41 <Samu> GLS_HEIGHTMAP = 2 could even be removed as it's now the same as GLS_ORIGINAL, but too late 20:40:01 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 20:40:17 *** gelignite2nd has quit IRC 20:41:09 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 20:46:57 <Samu> https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/issues/7872 - I'm not sure where I'm going with this atm 21:04:07 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick commented on issue #7872: Default openttd.cfg world gen settings don't allow Forests in Sub-Arctic https://git.io/JeFfG 21:05:44 *** Flygon has joined #openttd 21:08:56 <Samu> oh, and i had an email from github, almost forgot 21:11:05 *** nielsm has quit IRC 21:26:17 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] James103 commented on issue #7872: Default openttd.cfg world gen settings don't allow Forests in Sub-Arctic https://git.io/JeFfG 21:50:21 <Samu> https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/7094/files - i can remove the retrieval of the name 21:50:24 <Samu> just tested 21:50:58 <Samu> it makes the commit description deprecated though 21:51:14 <Samu> :| 22:01:28 *** frosch123 has quit IRC 22:08:32 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC 22:23:28 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick updated pull request #7094: Fix #7088: Retrieve an appropriate name for a non-existant AI/GS when displaying a textfile https://git.io/fhrqY 22:24:25 <Samu> PR needs a rename 22:24:50 <glx> you can do it easily 22:25:09 <Samu> done 22:36:03 *** Pikka has joined #openttd 22:36:45 <Samu> hmm 22:37:09 <Samu> James103 wants an auto as a choice 22:38:46 <Samu> hmmm, must think what to do 22:39:08 <Samu> 2 is the very minimum 22:39:18 <Samu> that widget displays numbers 22:39:32 <Samu> it isn't ready to display a text saying 'auto' 22:40:25 <andythenorth> the chances of removing snowline setting are zero 22:40:32 <andythenorth> if I was betting money 22:41:14 <Samu> the setting itself... 22:41:40 <Samu> is 2-253, how am I gonna make an auto here? 22:41:41 <Samu> 1? 22:41:44 <Samu> 254? 22:41:55 <Samu> both 1 and 254 are autos? 22:43:57 <Samu> or add another setting? 22:44:18 <Samu> call it auto_snow, enabled, disabled 22:44:30 <Samu> enabled, does the auto snow line 22:44:41 <Samu> disabled, uses the value of the other 22:45:10 <Samu> how then would I put this into the world gen ui 22:47:51 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 22:48:04 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 22:48:44 <Samu> I think i'm off to bed to think better of this 22:48:59 <Samu> cyas 22:49:11 *** Samu has quit IRC 22:56:17 *** andythenorth has left #openttd 23:47:20 *** Wolf01 has quit IRC