Log for #openttd on 16th January 2020:
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00:41:46  <hythlodaeus> hello
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01:11:59  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] floodious commented on issue #7830: Load font from openttd config file directory, not from working directory.
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01:26:35  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] floodious commented on issue #7830: Load font from openttd config file directory, not from working directory.
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03:13:04  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] James103 commented on pull request #7938: Feature: Setting for a year that repeats forever
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04:11:13  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Eddi-z commented on pull request #7938: Feature: Setting for a year that repeats forever
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07:29:20  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7938: Feature: Setting for a year that repeats forever
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07:43:41  <andythenorth> o/
07:45:49  <Pikka> o/
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08:16:22  <andythenorth> what haps Pikka?
08:16:38  <Pikka> is hand-drawing planes a good idea?
08:19:16  <andythenorth> hmm
08:19:21  <andythenorth> never tried :)
08:19:25  <andythenorth> hand drawing ships is...slow
08:21:42  <andythenorth> are ships like planes? o_O
08:22:07  <Pikka> maybe
08:32:03  * andythenorth renders all the ships
08:32:10  <andythenorth> no but maybe I should :P
08:50:20  <Pikka>
08:51:48  <crazystacy> that's so nice
08:54:21  <Pikka> two down, three to go for the basic views of one plane :) then just... 15 to go. and all the other variant sprites...
08:54:24  * Pikka bbl
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11:11:04  <_dp_> tf is sprite sorter doing
11:11:08  <_dp_> cubic sorting x_x
11:31:54  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Eddi-z commented on pull request #7938: Feature: Setting for a year that repeats forever
11:35:21  <Eddi|zuHause> _dp_: lesson learned from 20+ years of TTD modding: never question the sprite sorter. if you fix one thing, it breaks in another place
11:36:32  <_dp_> idk, replacing that crap with std::sort pretty much solves 4k :p
11:38:00  <Eddi|zuHause> what about all the corner cases?
11:41:04  <_dp_> Eddi|zuHause, what corner cases?
11:41:35  <Eddi|zuHause> overlapping bounding boxes and stuff?
11:42:14  <_dp_> how's that a corner case, that's only thing it does xD
11:42:29  <_dp_> sorting overlapping stuff
11:45:57  <Eddi|zuHause> yes, but in the translation from 3D-space (bounding boxes) to 3D-space (sprites) there are sometimes cycllic dependencies that cannot be properly resolved
11:46:30  <Eddi|zuHause> seoncd 3D shoudl be 2D
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11:46:57  <_dp_> Eddi|zuHause, yet it does somehow order them :p
11:47:12  <_dp_> only problem is to define an ordering properly
11:47:42  <Eddi|zuHause> there is no way to order it properly.
11:48:02  <Eddi|zuHause> every order you choose will cause some situation to be resolved the wrong way
11:48:26  <Eddi|zuHause> if you choose a different way, some different situation will be resolved the wrong way
11:50:16  <_dp_> Eddi|zuHause, that means current sorter is broken as well so even more reasons to replace it with something faster :p
11:51:10  <Eddi|zuHause> _dp_: what i meant to say was: you need to make sure the new "faster" method is broken in exactly the same way
11:51:33  <Eddi|zuHause> it must be "bug-for-bug" compatible :p
11:52:55  <_dp_> well, that just means "proper" ordering is the one that current sorter generates xD
11:53:42  <_dp_> should be solvable with at least quadratic algorithm
11:55:58  <_dp_> looking at this sorter though...
11:56:05  <_dp_> does this damn thing even sort? xD
11:57:38  <_dp_> seems bugged even for stuff that's unambiguously ordered
11:58:06  <Eddi|zuHause> if you don't know what it does, how do you know it's cubic?
12:01:47  <_dp_> Eddi|zuHause, coz it lags like crazy :p
12:04:56  <_dp_> also algo itself is clearly cubic, it's just that sprites are mostly unordered and somewhat pre-sorted
12:06:07  <milek7_> there was optimized version somehwere on github
12:07:31  <milek7_> and
12:08:41  <_dp_> milek7_, is that the one that was reverted? ;)
12:09:40  <milek7_> yes, but reportedly that second commit fixes it
12:10:42  <_dp_> idk, if it uses qsort why not just qsort it all the way
12:10:50  <_dp_> any bug-for-bug thing is gone already anyway
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12:19:34  <milek7_> hm, there is yet another version
12:20:02  <_dp_> well, same issue
12:21:02  <_dp_> if I understand it correctly problem is that unordered sprites aren't really unordered
12:21:23  <_dp_> otherwise just a center mass qsort already does everything that sprite sorted does
12:21:27  <_dp_> just differently
12:23:40  <milek7_> i don't get almost any performance improvement with it anyway
12:24:13  <milek7_> both original and modified cause ~100ms lag when unzooming
12:25:36  <_dp_> I haven't tested that patch but replacing everything with improves it significantly
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12:26:27  <_dp_> even more if sum is precalced
12:27:49  <_dp_> it still lags a bit but it's 150ms vs 1s
12:28:14  <_dp_> and those 150 aren't even in sorter
12:30:49  <milek7_> still ~100ms
12:31:13  <milek7_> resolution too low for it to matter?
12:31:42  <_dp_> milek7_, what res are you testing on?
12:31:52  <milek7_> 1440p
12:31:52  <_dp_> it's not a issue below 4k afaik
12:32:28  <_dp_> yeah, probably too low. you can try removing sorter completely to see what's lagging
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12:37:18  <milek7_> ok, on 3640x1440
12:37:31  <milek7_> on original 2.5s..
12:38:00  <milek7_> and 100ms with qsort
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13:22:55  <Samu> problem displaying lifetime profit, it's too long
13:23:00  <Samu> what can I do?
13:25:15  <Arveen2> earn less moneys :D
13:29:17  <Samu> it's the PR I'm doing
13:39:24  <Samu> whole map screenshot shouldn't exist
13:39:35  <Samu> now im waiting an hour for it to finish
13:46:17  <Arveen2> how big is the map ?
13:48:17  <Samu> 2kx1k
13:48:54  <Samu> anyway, i need to solve the lifetime PR
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13:49:10  <andythenorth> why are infrastructure costs?
13:49:13  <Samu> profit too big don't fit the window
13:49:18  <andythenorth> or should I stay out of problems forum? :P
13:51:55  <Eddi|zuHause> yes
13:52:20  <Eddi|zuHause> it's not like you can just turn them off
13:57:22  <Pikka> fly swallowing
13:57:40  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick commented on pull request #7919: Lifetime profit
13:59:53  <Samu> i dunno what to do
14:00:23  <andythenorth> too much fly swallowing
14:00:36  <andythenorth> 'forbid 90 degrees'
14:00:38  <Samu> there's sort by profit this year, last year, and lifetime. it would be odd not to display lifetime profit
14:00:40  <andythenorth> or just don't build them?
14:00:58  <andythenorth> 'airport noise levels' or just don't build lots?
14:01:35  <Samu> but it doesn't fit :(
14:01:45  * andythenorth isn't grumpy, just tired :P
14:02:01  <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause did I explain that I've solved cdist pax problem? o_O
14:02:14  <Pikka> samu, does it still truncate if you stretch the window out? I guess people who want to see the number can just make the window larger? :)
14:03:03  <Samu> im unsure i can do that
14:03:16  <Samu> auto stretch itself
14:03:30  <Samu> no it doesn't truncate
14:03:37  <Samu> it shows the whole thing
14:03:49  <andythenorth> isn't it solved in JGR?
14:04:30  <Pikka> andythenorth: FWIW, my recent GRFs all have a "halve costs" parameter which just sets the running and purchase cost factors 1 lower. simples for sandbox play.
14:04:31  <Samu> i dont think JGR displays lifetime profit on vehicle lists
14:04:40  <Samu> it only got sort by lifetime profit
14:04:43  <Samu> but im unsure
14:04:45  <andythenorth> reddit says it does?  Or I misunderstood
14:04:51  <andythenorth> anything you want, it's in JGR
14:04:56  <andythenorth> unrelated, it's interesting watching a community switch platform
14:05:03  <andythenorth> reddit is now pretty much 100% JGR
14:05:20  <Samu> that means you failed
14:05:21  <Samu> :(
14:05:30  <Samu> j/k
14:05:34  <andythenorth> or won
14:05:42  <Samu> i need to install JGR to see what it does
14:05:45  <andythenorth> a lot
14:05:57  <andythenorth> the added features are quite remarkable
14:06:12  <andythenorth> I find it overwhelming, and my general idea for core OpenTTD is generally 'less'
14:06:33  <Pikka> +1 to removing rivers and canals then? ;)
14:06:39  <andythenorth> there's some gradual loading thing for trains where they drive slowly through stations
14:06:43  <andythenorth> remarkable
14:06:48  <andythenorth> I don't think it got shunting though
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14:06:58  <andythenorth> Pikka: +1 to rivers and canals are broken
14:07:08  <andythenorth> I think I diverge on solutions :P
14:07:20  <Pikka> honestly I just can't be bothered drawing them for my landscape set :P
14:07:37  <andythenorth> fair
14:07:58  <andythenorth> hmm costs
14:08:00  <andythenorth> parameter
14:08:02  <andythenorth> nah
14:09:09  <andythenorth> although
14:09:29  <andythenorth> 5 out 146 trains lost money last year in my game
14:09:44  <andythenorth> but they are all on a route where I have an escape depot at the loading station
14:09:49  <Arveen2> 🍕 ?
14:09:56  <andythenorth> and the problem is I have 4 more trains than I need
14:10:00  * andythenorth deletes 4 trains
14:11:04  <Samu> testing  JGR, he's cheating
14:11:42  <andythenorth> o_O
14:11:49  <Samu> [img][/img]
14:12:02  <Samu> the window is large by default thx to that extra cargo list stuff
14:12:41  <andythenorth> hmm
14:12:53  <andythenorth> cargo list filter eh
14:13:01  * andythenorth wonders
14:13:39  <andythenorth> I did start using JGR to see what would be worth adopting
14:13:53  <andythenorth> but I couldn't see the wood for the trees, and found gameplay very confusing initially
14:20:15  <SpComb> I think that could be said for anyone trying vanilla OpenTTD for the first time :/
14:21:01  <andythenorth> familiar things are familiar
14:21:01  <hythlodaeus> i'm relatively new to openttd and i did not find it all that confusing
14:21:25  <hythlodaeus> the game could use a real manual tho
14:21:51  <SpComb> I suppose the fact that a bunch of useful features are hidden behind ctrl-clicks doesn't really hurt beginners, they just won't use things like shared ordered
14:22:05  <andythenorth> wiki hythlodaeus? o_O
14:22:15  <Pikka> a UI overhaul is well overdue
14:22:21  <hythlodaeus> the wiki is frankly poorly organised
14:22:29  <andythenorth> potato / potato
14:22:35  <Pikka> every feature that's ever been added has been stuck in sideways to an interface designed for a much simpler game in 1994
14:22:40  <SpComb> BTW the concept of distinct lines in TpF2 would definitely be worth considering, with vehicles assigned to lines
14:22:46  <andythenorth> I don't like wikis, but I went through our wiki assuming it was crap and needed fixing
14:22:55  <andythenorth> and in some places it was easy to spot what was wrong
14:23:01  <andythenorth> but lots of it kind of 'eh ok'
14:23:07  <SpComb> although please keep the "skip order" thing so that you can control which station individual vehicles are going to
14:23:09  <hythlodaeus> I do not think wikis are replacement for manuals
14:23:21  <andythenorth> you prefer the product of a single mind?
14:23:57  * andythenorth waits for JGRPP to compile :|
14:24:02  <hythlodaeus> no, just something that's organised in a coherent way and doesn't mix gameplay tips and pseudo tutorials with feature listing
14:24:08  <SpComb> although with the more dynamic pathfinding in OpentTD, it would probably be difficult to get the same kind of line overlay as TpF2 has
14:25:03  <SpComb> which is, I guess, the most useful feature for that concept
14:25:18  <hythlodaeus> as for the UI, I do not find it so bad. Some things are indeed poorly sandwiched here and there, but i have seen much much worse
14:25:25  <SpComb> you can zoom in on a piece of track and see what lines are using that track
14:25:28  <hythlodaeus> I like the UI in fact.
14:25:39  <andythenorth> ok first problem in JGR
14:25:42  <andythenorth> I have to make plans?
14:25:44  <andythenorth> what is a plan?
14:25:55  <SpComb> I haven't run into any of that
14:25:57  <milek7_> automatically creating group when creating shared orders
14:26:05  <milek7_> would be useful
14:26:06  <andythenorth> I also need to configure my zones
14:26:08  <andythenorth> what are zones?
14:26:45  <hythlodaeus> sounds like you're playing a mod that's the fruit of specific individual tastes
14:26:52  <hythlodaeus> does it come with proper documentation?
14:27:11  <milek7_> static platform allocation in tf2 annoyed me
14:27:29  <Eddi|zuHause> documentation? what fantasyworld do you live in?
14:27:32  <FLHerne> andythenorth: Plans are just a way to doodle on the map
14:28:01  <hythlodaeus> Eddi|zuHause: documentation is sort of my thing
14:28:07  <andythenorth> so how do I build the plan?
14:28:12  * hythlodaeus wants to write manual for openttd in the future
14:28:19  <andythenorth> where's the button for 'build this plan'?
14:28:20  <FLHerne> andythenorth: Click 'New', click-and-drag on the world, there'll be a squiggly line on the world
14:28:26  <milek7_> nobody reads manuals
14:28:34  <FLHerne> Under 'Plan list' in the map menu
14:28:38  <Eddi|zuHause> hythlodaeus: there was a guy who wrote a german manual once. he sold about 3 copies...
14:28:44  <hythlodaeus> milek7_:  except when they do
14:28:46  <SpComb> yeah, the routing/pathfinding in TpF2 is way too static, being able to better balance trains across multiple platforms would definitely be an improvement
14:29:13  <andythenorth> plans are not on the minimap?
14:29:23  <FLHerne> No
14:29:31  <hythlodaeus> no, openttd needs an ingame manual that functions a bit more like help topics on office software
14:29:39  <Eddi|zuHause> SpComb, milek7_: yeah, that was a problem since train fever. it means you need one platform per line, and makes stations bigger than they need to be
14:29:47  <SpComb> ooh yes clippy
14:29:53  <hythlodaeus> no, not clippy
14:30:06  <hythlodaeus> although a little train mascot would be cool
14:30:11  <andythenorth> first thing I did with plans was write my name
14:30:16  <andythenorth> then try and see it on minimap
14:30:16  <Eddi|zuHause> "looks like you're trying to build a train line. can i help you with that?" :p
14:30:18  <FLHerne> andythenorth: Functionally, they're sort of a long sign?
14:30:19  <hythlodaeus> "it seems your train has crashed. woul you like to help with that?"
14:30:26  <andythenorth> what's the % button in vehicle orders?
14:30:31  <andythenorth> it doesn't do anything when I click it
14:30:45  <andythenorth> well it toggles up / down, to be precise
14:30:48  <andythenorth> but nothing else happens
14:31:13  <Eddi|zuHause> hythlodaeus: iirc there is a tutorial scenario/game script, maybe start with that?
14:31:22  <hythlodaeus> but essentially an in game manual with a search function would help a lot
14:31:38  <hythlodaeus> i've seen the tutorial scenario, and i did not like it
14:31:41  <andythenorth> 'load if available' would fix cargodist
14:31:44  <FLHerne> andythenorth: It toggles a column
14:31:50  <Eddi|zuHause> hythlodaeus: and who would keep that ingame manual up to date?
14:31:54  <FLHerne> If there are any actual orders
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14:32:09  <andythenorth> 'load if available' / 'load by cargo type' /s
14:32:13  <FLHerne> It shows you what the average load was for each order
14:32:27  <andythenorth> if cargodist loads the wrong cargo, the link appears to then never be destroyed
14:32:39  <andythenorth> always using 'load by cargo type' would solve that
14:32:44  <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: in TF2 you can set loading/unloading per cargo type
14:33:02  <Eddi|zuHause> "only load steel at this station"
14:33:08  <hythlodaeus> Eddi|zuHause: the same people who keep the game up to date
14:33:12  <andythenorth> oh but I have to set all the things I don't want to load?
14:33:18  <andythenorth> hythlodaeus: we can't even get a blog post approved
14:33:23  <FLHerne> andythenorth: There's a "set all" at the bottom
14:33:25  <andythenorth> there is no way we'd do a manual
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14:33:27  <Eddi|zuHause> hythlodaeus: sorry, i had to actually laugh out loud on that thought :p
14:33:35  <andythenorth> FLHerne: yeah thanks
14:33:58  <FLHerne> I should do jgrpp again
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14:34:22  <FLHerne> It does solve a lot of the things I find irritating about trunk still
14:35:02  <hythlodaeus> my point is, the game is made by volunteers, so you get some volunteers to work on the manual too
14:35:11  <andythenorth> they do that in the wiki
14:35:13  <hythlodaeus> why would it be any different from code and graphics
14:35:23  <milek7_> it's less fun
14:35:30  <andythenorth> to be clear, I quite liked the idea of having official docs
14:35:34  <andythenorth> but having done it
14:35:35  <hythlodaeus> great, so they can do the same to a manual
14:35:40  <andythenorth> it's pretty frustrating
14:36:00  <andythenorth> nobody wants to do it, but everybody wants to nitpick it when others do
14:36:04  <andythenorth> and nobody is in charge
14:36:17  <hythlodaeus> i'm saying i'd like to do it
14:36:26  <andythenorth> and only 1 person will have an opinion on infosec issues, but 10 will have an opinion on comma placement
14:36:47  <hythlodaeus> that's why you agree on a style guide beforehand
14:36:49  <Eddi|zuHause> hythlodaeus: we have a wiki
14:36:53  <andythenorth> we have a wiki
14:37:00  <FLHerne> It's not a very good wiki
14:37:07  <andythenorth> I just fixed the wiki, no bikeshedding, no PRs, no nitpick
14:37:15  <andythenorth> I just deleted and rearranged the entire development section
14:37:27  <andythenorth> I didn't fix all the wiki :P
14:37:30  <andythenorth> just development
14:37:38  <hythlodaeus> guys, first you tell me "no one wants to do, it's frustating"
14:37:58  <hythlodaeus> when i say I want to do it, you're telling me we have a wiki so don't do it
14:38:12  <Eddi|zuHause> that's not what we said
14:38:20  <hythlodaeus> seems like a bit of a vicious cycle
14:38:23  <hythlodaeus> you implied it
14:38:31  <andythenorth> no no
14:38:38  <andythenorth> if you try it, you will find it very frustrating
14:38:45  <andythenorth> and you will likely rage quit
14:39:02  <andythenorth> as this is 100% predictable in advance, I think it's unfair to not warn you
14:39:22  <andythenorth> I came close to rage quitting over 1 blog post
14:39:29  <hythlodaeus> because of writing itself or other people?
14:39:40  <andythenorth> other people of course
14:39:48  <hythlodaeus> oh don't worry about it
14:40:04  <andythenorth> the project applies a software code review methodology to content
14:40:06  <andythenorth> which is fail
14:40:09  <andythenorth> it's broken
14:40:25  <andythenorth> nobody is prepared to fix it as there's no-one in charge
14:40:36  <hythlodaeus> andythenorth:
14:40:39  <andythenorth> but those with the power are comfortable with the software code review methdology applied to all
14:40:46  <hythlodaeus> the last post was written by m
14:40:49  <FLHerne> hythlodaeus: I think the message is "do it, but on the wiki" ?
14:40:54  <andythenorth> the only applicable route is to vote with your feet
14:41:16  <FLHerne> hythlodaeus: I mean, the wiki already has pages describing most of the features in some way
14:41:42  <andythenorth> +1
14:42:08  <FLHerne> So a manual would effectively be an improved version of most of the wiki's existing purpose
14:42:18  <andythenorth> FLHerne: do you know how to do the 'trains of any length can load in stations' thing in JGR?
14:42:23  <andythenorth> where they advance as they load?
14:42:35  <FLHerne> andythenorth: No, that's a thing?
14:42:42  <andythenorth> it was in a video in forums
14:42:49  <andythenorth> JGR needs it's own sub-forum
14:43:02  <FLHerne> andythenorth: I do the opposite, and use the programmable routing restrictions to keep my long trains out of short platforms
14:43:02  <andythenorth> it's pretty much 100% of OpenTTD discussion
14:43:16  <FLHerne> (also, make bay platforms work sanely without a million waypoints)
14:43:19  <andythenorth> and the JGR thread is unworkable
14:44:06  <andythenorth> the cdist cargo over-rides in settings eh?
14:45:19  <SpComb> that tooltip PR is a little unfortunate indeed, agreeing on the design/style beforehand would be a better idea IMO than trying to split up the commits, it would be a massive pain to rebase those kinds of changes
14:45:58  <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: i think it's in the clickthrough for "stop at start/middle/end of station"
14:46:01  <Samu> which PR is it mine?
14:46:05  <hythlodaeus> it's impossible to split up the commits
14:46:14  <andythenorth> thanks Eddi|zuHause :)
14:46:18  <hythlodaeus> and we've agreed on a style before
14:46:28  <andythenorth> ha ha the 'through loading' is so funny to watch
14:46:56  <andythenorth> the % load option in vehicle orders absolutely doesn't work though
14:47:02  <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: it's another case for "the order GUI is way too overloaded"
14:47:04  <andythenorth> it now says 50% but I have not set that
14:47:10  <hythlodaeus> the rest is just re-writing, which cannot simply be discussedo n every single entry
14:47:12  <andythenorth> wtf is this %
14:47:16  <andythenorth> it magically changes
14:47:31  <andythenorth> it's supposed to control the amount of cargo refitted to?
14:47:38  <andythenorth> I can refit 50% of vehicles to coal?
14:48:24  <andythenorth>
14:48:36  <andythenorth> oof JGR won't thank me for bug reports, he gets enough :x
14:48:44  <andythenorth> but this just doesn't work
14:48:49  <Eddi|zuHause> i've not seen this feature
14:49:16  <andythenorth> it's so you can control how the % of the consist refitted to
14:49:27  <andythenorth> so 50% coal, 50% iron ore
14:49:29  <SpComb> hythlodaeus: yeah, I agree that the "split it up into commits so that we can review/decide on each one separately" is a bad idea, the commits would all conflict with eachother if you tried to change them
14:49:31  <andythenorth> but it doesn't work
14:49:54  <andythenorth> the % should be in the 'refit to' menu, it's just broken like this
14:50:04  <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: i can't imagine what that is supposed to mean
14:50:35  <hythlodaeus> SpComb: I'll find a way to work it out, but thank you for your support!
14:50:55  <hythlodaeus> if you can drop a line with your opinion on the commit thread, I'd like to read it :)
14:51:17  <hythlodaeus> there's still some stuff I am currently rewriting and some more lines to fix here and there
14:51:25  <FLHerne> andythenorth: I don't understand
14:51:35  <FLHerne> You're looking at the percentages on the right?
14:51:42  <andythenorth> yes, for amount to refit to
14:51:46  <hythlodaeus> but so far I am quite happy with the tooltips I'm working on
14:52:04  <andythenorth> so if I want 50% coal, 25% iron ore, 25% limestone
14:52:45  <FLHerne> andythenorth: That's not what that does
14:53:05  <andythenorth> ?
14:53:11  <FLHerne> andythenorth: It displays the average load for that journey segment over the last few things
14:53:15  <andythenorth> oh
14:53:29  <FLHerne> Unless I'm still confused about what you're looking at
14:53:39  <andythenorth> in the screenshot
14:53:44  <andythenorth> it shows 100% loading order
14:53:47  <andythenorth> 0% loading order
14:53:53  <andythenorth> and then some 50% I never asked for?
14:53:57  <andythenorth> and I can't type in the box
14:54:19  <FLHerne> The '100% 0%   [50%]' column?
14:54:31  <FLHerne> Is what I said ^
14:54:50  <andythenorth> yeah I understand now
14:55:43  <FLHerne> The button shows the overall average, and you can toggle per-segment averages
14:56:32  <andythenorth> it's kind of weird
14:56:51  <andythenorth> but this is something we might want
14:56:55  <FLHerne> andythenorth: There are some more conditional-order types that help with managing weird CDist stuff
14:56:58  <Eddi|zuHause> this window needs to be split into 3 at least: orders, schedule, statistics
14:57:02  <andythenorth> obviously ^^ that's broken, but the concept is fine
14:57:39  <andythenorth> so where's the departure boards?
14:57:45  <andythenorth> station window
14:58:28  <Eddi|zuHause> i've not looked at the departure boards since ChillPP
14:58:43  <Eddi|zuHause> which is 5-ish years ago?
14:58:49  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SpComb commented on pull request #7870: Change: improved english tooltips
14:58:59  <andythenorth> I'm looking at timetables now
14:59:10  <andythenorth> Timetabling full load orders is not recommended?
14:59:11  <andythenorth> why?
15:00:24  <FLHerne> Well, what's the point?
15:00:54  <andythenorth> hmm
15:01:04  * andythenorth tries timetables
15:01:07  <FLHerne> If the vehicle ever has to wait for a full load longer than the timetable, the timetable did nothing and now it's late
15:01:12  <andythenorth> so a train takes 10 days to run a route
15:01:25  <andythenorth> I set it to 20, but the train didn't travel at half the speed?
15:01:37  <FLHerne> If it doesn't, you might as well leave out the 'full load' bit
15:01:55  <andythenorth> yeah I got rid of the full load
15:02:00  <andythenorth> but the train is still taking 10 days to travel
15:02:01  <andythenorth> not 20
15:02:02  <FLHerne> No, it'll just arrive at the next place earlier
15:02:06  <FLHerne> And then wait
15:02:19  <Eddi|zuHause> if you allow combining full load with timetabling, you immediately run into conflict between the people that want it to leave at the earlier or the later time
15:02:36  <FLHerne> Timetabling never affects the way trains move, just how long they wait in stations
15:02:41  <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: you can configure a max speed separately
15:02:51  <FLHerne> I'm not sure why the dwell time can be set separately, tbh
15:03:09  <andythenorth> oh I found the speed limit
15:03:17  <FLHerne> Well, it'll wait once you've set a start date
15:03:28  <FLHerne> Speed limit is in upstream OTTD now, I think?
15:03:34  <Eddi|zuHause> yes
15:03:43  <andythenorth> I don't understand
15:03:46  <andythenorth> I never use timetables
15:03:48  <FLHerne> ChillPP used to have speed-limiting signals
15:03:55  <FLHerne> I don't know if jgr has them
15:03:59  <andythenorth> I just set the 'wait at station' time for pax and mail trains and ships
15:05:07  <FLHerne> Doesn't seem to
15:05:48  <andythenorth> how do I use this to approximate % full load?
15:05:53  <andythenorth> which is the point of it no?
15:06:01  <Eddi|zuHause> setting up train timetables is a pain, which is why almost nobody uses them
15:06:04  <andythenorth> we won't add % full load, because the UI is overloaded
15:06:09  <andythenorth> so it's all solved in JGR
15:06:13  <andythenorth> with timetables
15:06:25  <FLHerne> andythenorth: If you set all the times, and set a start date, you can control when vehicles get anywhere and how long they wait
15:06:27  <andythenorth> and the main reason people are switching to JGR is for this
15:06:34  <FLHerne> andythenorth: I don't think JGR does anything to timetables
15:06:41  <FLHerne> What are you talking about?
15:06:51  <FLHerne> Oh, no, the automate thing
15:07:12  <andythenorth>
15:07:21  <Eddi|zuHause> autoseparation is horrible if you ever want to deviate from it. that's why it never made it to trunk
15:07:30  <andythenorth> it's literally impossible to play OpenTTD without JGR timetables
15:07:47  <andythenorth> I thought we had auto-separation in trunk, but only for trains?
15:07:57  <andythenorth> there's some magical ctrl-click a button to make timetables work?
15:07:58  <Eddi|zuHause> no
15:08:04  <andythenorth> I tried it for ships, it doesn't work
15:08:18  <FLHerne> andythenorth: There's auto-start-date, but it's basically useless
15:08:26  <andythenorth> hmm
15:08:27  <andythenorth> ok
15:08:28  <Eddi|zuHause> there's nothing "auto" abut that ctrl+click
15:08:29  <andythenorth> thanks
15:08:51  <FLHerne> (because you have to get the timetable worked out in advance, and then it breaks as soon as you add any more trains or there are significant delays)
15:09:05  <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: it needs a fully timetabled order list to work
15:09:13  <FLHerne> Eddi|zuHause: It automatically calculates evenly-spread start dates, no?
15:09:22  <FLHerne> Which is marginally more auto than before
15:09:37  <FLHerne> But still doesn't make it worth doing
15:09:44  <Eddi|zuHause> FLHerne: pretty much
15:10:57  <FLHerne> andythenorth: Hm, this 'scheduled dispatch' thing is new to me
15:11:44  <FLHerne> andythenorth: The 'automate' and 'auto separation' things dynamically modify the timetable so it matches running times but avoids bunching
15:12:38  <FLHerne> There always used to be a problem that if some major delay/jam happened, the delay got automated into the timetable, and then it would remain a self-fulfilling prophecy
15:13:05  <FLHerne> (because the trains would wait, and block trains on other lines, and then everything cascaded)
15:13:23  <FLHerne> Maybe it's been improved since
15:19:12  <andythenorth> does it break when vehicles upgrade?
15:19:31  <Eddi|zuHause> probably.
15:19:40  <FLHerne> I don't think so
15:19:49  <FLHerne> Not that I noticed, anyway
15:19:54  <andythenorth> what else is in JGR
15:19:57  * andythenorth looks in the repo
15:20:10  <FLHerne> andythenorth: Ship collision avoidance is nice
15:20:21  <andythenorth> I think I tried the patch for that
15:20:21  <FLHerne> And multi-track level crossings that don't kill all your buses
15:20:43  <Eddi|zuHause> i think i wrote a patch for that
15:21:14  <andythenorth> I already tried the polylines track tool last time I played JGR
15:21:16  <FLHerne> I think Eddi did write the patch for that :P
15:21:34  <FLHerne> There must be /some/ way to solve the savegame-upgrade issue?
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15:22:06  <FLHerne> (temporary third state?)
15:22:40  <Eddi|zuHause> FLHerne: it just needs a saved setting, which i didn't include back then because updating it would have been a pain
15:22:48  <Eddi|zuHause> FLHerne: should be easier with the new system
15:23:28  <Eddi|zuHause> FLHerne: so old games would just load with the setting turned off, and it would "only" crash all your vehicles if you enabled it mid-game
15:25:48  <andythenorth> building rivers!
15:34:16  <andythenorth> how do I custom bridge head?
15:35:24  <Eddi|zuHause> build a track onto it?
15:35:42  <andythenorth> oh yes
15:35:48  <andythenorth> I was trying to build the bridge onto track
15:35:54  <andythenorth> order matters
15:37:07  <hythlodaeus> in regards to the previous topic: my idea is that timetabling is primarily meant to be used on passenger vehicles, especially buses (and now trams too)
15:37:20  <andythenorth> more town growth speeds!
15:37:21  <FLHerne> Wait, jgr has that?
15:37:33  <andythenorth> custom bridge heads?
15:37:34  <andythenorth> yes
15:37:37  <andythenorth>
15:37:40  <andythenorth> JGR has a *lot*
15:38:12  <FLHerne> hythlodaeus: The problem is that timetabling as it actually exists is clearly not "meant" to do anything sane :P
15:38:24  <andythenorth> I thought it was for use with BROS?
15:38:30  <andythenorth> for those realistic UK maps etc?
15:38:38  <andythenorth> seriously there are people in reddit doing that
15:38:53  <hythlodaeus> i don't see how one could harmonize it will full load orders either
15:39:10  <hythlodaeus> but I can imagine it working very well on bus and a tram routes
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15:39:25  <FLHerne> It seems very much to have been designed and implemented without assessing the user-experience for any use case
15:39:25  <hythlodaeus> because it can prevent traffic jams
15:39:46  <FLHerne> hythlodaeus: The version in JGR handles that alright
15:39:47  <hythlodaeus> agreed, but how could we improve on that?
15:39:53  <hythlodaeus> how so?
15:39:57  <FLHerne> Because of the automate/auto-separation thing
15:40:04  <andythenorth>
15:40:09  <andythenorth> it's for model trains
15:40:12  <hythlodaeus> what does it do, if I may ask?
15:40:17  <andythenorth> but it's sold and used for vehicle separation
15:40:33  <FLHerne> Upstream doesn't have that, so it needs impractical levels of micro-managing to get timetables set up usefully and then keep them updated
15:40:49  <andythenorth>
15:41:38  <FLHerne> hythlodaeus: In upstream, you manually set the time for each journey segment and station (there's an 'Autofill' tool, but it's useless because it leaves no margin for delays)
15:42:18  <FLHerne> (especially if used when the route is first set up, because then there's no waiting cargo and it doesn't account for loading times either)
15:42:30  <FLHerne> Then you set the start times for each vehicle
15:43:16  <FLHerne> There's a hidden ctrl-click that sets them all at once for a set of shared-orders vehicles with <overall time>/<number of vehicles> spacing
15:43:51  <FLHerne> If anything changes later (there are delays, or a new stop, or more vehicles) you have to manually redo most of the above
15:44:13  <hythlodaeus> aah i see
15:44:30  <FLHerne> JGR has a thing that automatically updates the timetable to match actual running times
15:44:35  <hythlodaeus> yeah I usually just trash vehicles and do it all over, when i need to readjust
15:44:45  <FLHerne> And, optionally, manipulates it to maintain even vehicle spacing
15:44:47  <hythlodaeus> it's easier to just do one vehicle and clone all over
15:44:59  <FLHerne> When it works, it's great
15:45:09  <hythlodaeus> when does it not work?
15:45:51  <FLHerne> It can get stuck in feedback loops, particularly when multiple routes interact
15:46:12  <hythlodaeus> how do you think it can be improved?
15:46:41  <FLHerne> Some delays happen, the timetable gets updated to allow for them, vehicles wait to keep the service spread out but block other vehicles
15:47:14  <FLHerne> ...which get delayed, so /their/ timetable gets lengthened, and they wait and block the first ones
15:47:36  <FLHerne> I'm not really sure :P
15:47:42  <hythlodaeus> i see, but still why not suggesting an improved version of this to upstream?
15:47:59  <hythlodaeus> certainly someone will be able to come up with a solution
15:48:01  <FLHerne> tbh, I think it works about as well as an automated non-super-intelligent thing could do
15:48:02  <andythenorth> trains, not timetabled :P
15:48:13  <andythenorth> they block, not like the reddit post
15:48:20  <FLHerne> hythlodaeus: I mean, that patch has been around for about a decade
15:48:38  <hythlodaeus> so what
15:48:43  <FLHerne> No-one actually /has/ come up with a solution that fixes the various perceived problems :P
15:48:54  <hythlodaeus> has someone ever tried?
15:49:08  <FLHerne> It's definitely an improvement
15:49:14  <hythlodaeus> also have we had a look to how other games do it?
15:49:27  <FLHerne> There was also
15:49:35  <hythlodaeus> i suppose transport fever might have timetabling
15:49:42  <FLHerne> Which is a much bigger rework of how timetables as a concept should exist
15:50:51  <hythlodaeus> well it's never to late to re-assess things
15:51:12  <FLHerne> The problem there is that a complete change from how they currently work is confusing
15:51:20  <hythlodaeus> just right now they're working on to implement water depth, which will actually make ship gameplay interesting
15:51:23  <FLHerne> (and might cause compat problems)
15:51:34  <hythlodaeus> everything always does
15:51:46  <FLHerne> And also that it's still very complicated to use
15:51:51  <andythenorth> honestly, I think we'd have cover to throw out timetables :P
15:51:51  <hythlodaeus> and again, water depth will likely break a ton of savegames
15:51:54  <andythenorth>
15:51:58  <FLHerne> The difference is that the complexity actually achieves something :P
15:52:26  <FLHerne> But unlike the auto-separation hack, it's not a "one-click" solution to vehicle bunching
15:52:37  <FLHerne> Which is probably the main thing people actually want from timetables...
15:53:20  <andythenorth> I think it's back to the goals tbh
15:53:45  <andythenorth>
15:54:13  <andythenorth> we have people actually using timetables to build model railways, which is a thing people do in model railway world
15:54:17  <FLHerne> In general, TIP is a much better way to achieve what the (few) people already using timetables use them for
15:54:28  <andythenorth> and we have people trying to use timetables for a better game, and failing
15:55:26  <FLHerne> Whereas auto-sep is a hack that solves a commonly-requested basic usecase, but does nothing for the existing users
15:55:38  <andythenorth> simplifying timetables probably ruins life for the people who are creating spreadsheets to configure their timetables
15:56:00  <hythlodaeus> apparently Transport Fever has no timetables at all ahah
15:57:07  <hythlodaeus> what's TIP?
15:58:49  <FLHerne> Timetable Improvement Patch
15:58:55  <FLHerne> the thread I linked above
15:59:01  <hythlodaeus> oh yeah
15:59:23  <hythlodaeus> what is the concept behind that one? and what are the shortcomings?
16:00:30  <hythlodaeus> hmm it uses route nodes
16:00:38  <hythlodaeus> isn't it sort of what waypoints are for?
16:15:27  <nielsm> argh the baseset translation building is so terribly slow in the windows cscript implementation
16:15:29  <nielsm> I hate it
16:19:15  <nielsm> (will the cmake build fix/improve that?)
16:23:45  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] lcd047 opened pull request #7942: Fix: [SDL2] support pasting from clipboard on Linux
16:24:22  *** nielsm has quit IRC
16:25:53  <Samu> jesus, visual studio is really making me wanna buy an SSD
16:26:12  <Samu> they no longer care optimizing software for HDDs
16:26:21  *** nielsm has joined #openttd
16:27:45  <Samu> finally it cancelled build
16:27:52  <Samu> only took 10 minutes ffs
16:29:08  <supermop_work> people still buy HDDs?
16:33:02  <Samu> yes, 9 years ago
16:56:28  <peter1138> nielsm, that may have been my fault? :( I think there's an md5sum in there, heh.
16:58:53  <supermop_work> andythenorth: i use timetables for 'better game'
16:58:57  <supermop_work> seems to work fine
16:59:10  <supermop_work> ofc could be less tedious
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17:00:18  <supermop_work> 24 clock helped, now i generally just schedule everything at like 30 day period, try to have services sharing a line 10 or 15 days apart
17:00:43  <supermop_work> its generally fine and not too hard for simple things
17:00:52  <supermop_work> like a tram running in a loop in a city
17:01:25  <andythenorth> what do I click?
17:01:29  <supermop_work> autofill timetable, add a bit a slack to get a round number
17:01:42  <andythenorth> I never use them, i just use the 'wait at station' tool
17:01:47  <supermop_work> the buy that many trams and ctrl click start date
17:02:13  <supermop_work> works fine, seems better than any attempt at 'autoseparation'
17:03:16  <supermop_work> "oh it takes tram 1 27 days to complete its run, pad it out to 30 days, buy two more trams"
17:04:10  <supermop_work> next time tram 1 completes the first item in orders, ctrl click set start date
17:04:28  <supermop_work> set to the expected date, then start the new trams
17:11:22  <_dp_> great sorting, much effecient xD
17:12:17  <_dp_> surprisingly seems correct though
17:12:29  <_dp_> just cubic xD
17:19:56  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh updated pull request #7924: Feature: Water tiles have a depth
17:24:12  <andythenorth> deep and shallow oil rigs :P
17:24:23  <andythenorth> deep sea ones have a very slow animation cycle, they bob up and down :P
17:24:27  <andythenorth> also ships that roll and pitch
17:25:06  <nielsm> so many bad ideas
17:25:26  <nielsm> deep and shallow fishing grouns producing different cargo
17:26:14  <nielsm> freshwater fishing grounds that only exist on deeplakes at high elevation
17:27:24  <hythlodaeus> tiles look fine, but hard to tell the difference without an ingame screenshot
17:28:30  <nielsm> deep water? I consider the current efforts at making tiles for it very much experimental stage
17:34:34  <hythlodaeus> but good work so far
17:34:49  <supermop_work> bridges that have max depth in addition to length
17:34:54  <hythlodaeus> this will be one hell of an update for ships, that's for sure
17:35:06  <Samu> bridges max height and max depth
17:35:09  <nielsm> well it's not approved yet :P
17:35:11  <Samu> so special
17:35:19  <Heiki> water depth should also affect
17:35:34  <hythlodaeus> people seem excited about it, so it's good
17:36:01  <nielsm> eugh I can't find a free cb variable to put water depth info in for industries
17:36:35  <Samu> question: how many digits is considered too much money?
17:37:01  <Samu> I put 10 for resizing purposes, but I don't know openttd approach to that
17:37:13  <supermop_work> various long span types of bridges could be set to have a higher basic cost than those with shorter span, but be better / cheaper at tall heights or deep water
17:37:25  <Samu> like finances window, how do you resize money displays?
17:38:26  <hythlodaeus> also as this will affect the positioning of ports, I really hope they get revised as structures. I'd personally would like port building to be a bit more like train stations, with differing platform lengths and such
17:39:09  <supermop_work> so building a wood trestle across a shallow valley is cheaper than spanning it with a suspension bridge, but a trestle over a deep fjord is prohibitively expensive
17:39:11  <nielsm> Samu: if you're okay with rounded values you can use {CURRENCY_SHORT} to "shorten" the values to millions/billions/etc instead
17:39:55  <supermop_work> but the suspension bridge is reasonable
17:40:29  <supermop_work> as it doesn't care how far down the dirt is under the main span
17:40:30  <Samu> lifetime profit displaying CURRENCY_SHORT, hmm
17:41:30  <supermop_work> so you can do this over a shallow lake easy:
17:41:43  <supermop_work> but not over the open ocean
17:41:49  <nielsm> yeah
17:42:21  <nielsm> supermop_work: first would be adding bridges with longer spans than 3 tiles
17:42:31  <nielsm> (I think that's the max right now?)
17:43:11  <supermop_work> well its more a limit of the period of repeating sprites for bridges
17:43:15  <nielsm> and having some kind of dynamic way to select span lengths, either for the player or automatic cost-minimising
17:43:25  <supermop_work> there are only a few patterns hardcoded to use
17:43:36  <supermop_work> better newgrf bride support would help
17:44:58  <supermop_work> you can make a bridge with a huge 'clear span' now, but it is only in the form of : [A-B-B-B-B...-B-A]
17:46:03  <supermop_work> and the others are like A-B-C-B-A
17:47:13  <supermop_work> or A-B-C-B-D-B-C-B-A
17:47:31  <supermop_work> SC4 was interesting for building bridges
17:53:06  <andythenorth> we need a decent ship set
17:53:54  <nielsm> lol
17:54:00  <nielsm> "does not work"
17:54:00  <andythenorth> 'nope'
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17:58:07  <Samu> Money CompanyFinancesWindow::max_money = INT32_MAX;
17:58:14  <Samu> heh
17:58:15  *** andythenorth has quit IRC
17:58:22  <Samu> just INT32_MAX
17:59:09  <Samu> let's experiment it
18:00:31  <Samu> @calc INT32_MAX
18:00:31  <DorpsGek> Samu: Error: There's really no reason why you should have underscores or brackets in your mathematical expression.  Please remove them.
18:02:16  <nielsm> it's 2 billion and something
18:02:21  <Samu> #define INT32_MAX        2147483647i32
18:02:43  <Samu> 10 digits
18:02:53  <Samu> heh, what I had, but with a different code
18:03:00  <nielsm> it's very easy to get more than that also
18:03:47  <Samu> 				resize->height = GetVehicleListHeight(this->vli.vtype, 1);
18:03:47  <Samu> 				for (uint i = 0; i < 4; i++) SetDParamMaxValue(i, INT32_MAX);
18:04:03  <Samu> *size = maxdim(*size, GetStringBoundingBox(STR_VEHICLE_LIST_PROFIT_THIS_YEAR_LAST_YEAR_LIFETIME));
18:04:33  <Samu> i had MaxDigits
18:04:38  <Samu> with magic number 10
18:04:45  <Samu> but i guess this is more elegant
18:08:36  <nielsm> huh also why are grf bridges different from most other grf features, it does not use action 1/2 to indicate graphics
18:12:37  <Eddi|zuHause> nielsm: because everybody was too scared to specify/implement it
18:13:03  <Samu> what are the chances a single vehicle can make 10 digits profits this year + last year + lifetime?
18:13:16  <Samu> 30 digits
18:14:02  <nielsm> aaaa no this won't work, I have to make it a 60+x variable to be able to query tiles at other locations
18:19:16  <Eddi|zuHause> nielsm: if we ever attempt action1/2/3 for bridges, it must be able to have custom layouts, not just the builtin tile configurations
18:19:48  <nielsm> agree
18:20:14  <nielsm> and support making tiles below impassable (occupied by pylons)
18:21:58  <Eddi|zuHause> ... and possibly wider bridges (i.e. connect to neighbouring bridge)
18:25:04  <Eddi|zuHause> i always thought bridges should be built more like stations, so you could have some buttons for suspension bridge span and total length
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18:26:38  <Eddi|zuHause> the GRF part could then inherit much of the object spec
18:31:07  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick updated pull request #7919: Lifetime profit
18:31:31  <Samu> check
18:31:48  <Samu> I'm not too good at gui resizes
18:32:04  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh updated pull request #7924: Feature: Water tiles have a depth
18:32:12  <Samu> tell me if I broke the display with your choice of fonts
18:33:30  <Samu> probably should have done max(size->width, bodingbox.width)
18:35:48  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7924: Feature: Water tiles have a depth
18:36:06  <nielsm> i'm so good at run-on sentences
18:36:09  <Samu> fixing it...
18:37:17  <supermop_work> Eddi|zuHause: would a 2 tile wide bridge be able to have road on one side and rail on the other?
18:38:20  <Eddi|zuHause> supermop_work: since they would still be technically 2 separate bridges, all that needs is the right detection code
18:39:13  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick updated pull request #7919: Lifetime profit
18:39:17  <supermop_work> manhattan bridge would be tough to model
18:40:19  <Eddi|zuHause> is that a dual layer bridge?
18:40:27  <Samu> plz test #7919 by opening vehicle list windows
18:40:32  <supermop_work>
18:40:37  <supermop_work> geeez
18:40:53  <Samu> tell me if the width is fine, or broken with your choice of fonts
18:41:16  <Samu> the width about displaying tiny text of profits
18:42:46  <Eddi|zuHause> long url is long
18:43:06  <andythenorth> state machines?
18:43:12  <Eddi|zuHause> that's like 3 nested urls?
18:43:18  <supermop_work>
18:43:29  <Eddi|zuHause> i herd u liek urls, so we put some urls in ur url
18:45:23  * andythenorth Horses
18:45:31  <andythenorth> oh I was looking at JGR also eh
18:45:33  * andythenorth forgot
18:45:37  <supermop_work> basically 8 tracks and 3 road lanes when opened
18:46:59  <Samu> versus
18:47:15  <Samu> extra width vs no fix
18:47:35  <andythenorth> :o
18:47:44  <andythenorth> JGR fixes RV overtaking
18:47:52  * andythenorth sees why everybody is switching
18:48:24  <Samu> andythenorth, test my stuff too :p
18:49:11  <Samu> there's now a square between "Aircraft Available" and "Manage List" buttons
18:49:21  <supermop_work> now is 4 tracks and 3 lanes on bottom with 4 lanes on top
18:49:21  <Samu> unclickable, but it looks ugly
18:49:58  <andythenorth> hmm, JGR fixes depot flipping as well, not sure about that
18:50:14  <andythenorth> articulated RV overtaking just works as far as I can tell
18:50:50  <Samu> what if the vehicle is extra-extra-extra-long?
18:51:01  <Samu> with many articulated pieces
18:51:37  <andythenorth> didn't test that
18:51:39  <andythenorth> try it? :)
18:51:49  <andythenorth> give JGRPP a test
18:51:54  <Samu> no way
18:52:33  <andythenorth> I might switch to developing for JGR
18:53:14  <Eddi|zuHause> ... or you could start backporting stuff?
18:53:59  <andythenorth> it's a different newgrf spec
18:54:09  <andythenorth> and player base is switching
18:54:23  <Samu> the end of OpenTTD
18:54:25  * andythenorth trying to work out what programmable signals is for
18:54:34  <andythenorth> no, OpenTTD is in the best shape for years
18:54:44  <andythenorth> and JGRPP is important for that
18:54:57  <andythenorth> it reduces social pressure to incorporate dubious fixes
18:55:12  <andythenorth> and reduces the amount of 'devs are horrid horrid people' stuff in forums
18:55:19  <andythenorth> which is project death
18:55:47  <Eddi|zuHause> still, some things are worth backporting
18:55:53  <andythenorth> I'm tending to agree
18:56:02  <andythenorth> but whether we'll agreee on what those are.... :D
18:56:21  <andythenorth> I can make a signal that is programmable with 'deny'
18:56:29  <andythenorth> but I don't see the point, it just blocks a route
18:56:31  <andythenorth> so why bother?
18:57:27  <andythenorth> oh there's supposed to be a conditional before it
18:57:28  <andythenorth> ok
18:59:39  <andythenorth> anyone know what the new cdist modes do?
18:59:50  <andythenorth> asymmetric (nearest), asymmetric (equal)
19:00:02  <andythenorth> I didn't find any docs apart from the giant forum thread
19:00:08  <andythenorth> src eh? :P
19:00:33  <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: i think it's for your problem that the distance influence should be high for passengers, but low for cargo
19:00:47  <andythenorth> not sure
19:00:57  <andythenorth> there is also a cdist setting for every cargo in JGR
19:00:58  <Eddi|zuHause> so "equal" wouldn't take into account distance
19:01:39  <supermop_work> is setting cdist individually per cargo 'fun'?
19:02:14  <andythenorth> I haven't tried
19:02:17  <andythenorth> only got one train :P
19:02:48  <andythenorth> it's not optimal, for FIRS Steeltown
19:03:06  <andythenorth> 41 cargos
19:03:11  <andythenorth> they're over-rides on defaults though
19:03:57  <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: looks like you had experience with programmable signals?
19:04:19  <andythenorth> oh wait, there's 2 kinds of programmable signal? :o
19:04:25  <andythenorth>
19:04:35  <Eddi|zuHause> yeah, there's different kinds
19:04:44  <supermop_work> the grf that defines the cargos should define how CDist-y they are
19:04:57  <Eddi|zuHause> one is "turn X green when Y is red" which only makes sense for block signals, so is useless
19:05:13  <Eddi|zuHause> and one is "only allow trains with speed > blah"
19:05:31  <supermop_work> same what that it essentially sets what the payment rate and decay are
19:06:43  <andythenorth> nah, it's too specific to a map and play style supermop_work :)
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19:07:08  <supermop_work> then the user should also set all the payment rates per map....
19:08:05  <supermop_work> i mean that the user should still have a general setting for cargo distance demand, but how coal might be different to grain would scale with that
19:08:39  <andythenorth> it would work if demand was economic
19:08:45  <andythenorth> which I would like to try, but eh
19:08:59  <supermop_work> having coal prefer to go far and grain near on map X, but other way around on map Y makes no sense
19:09:04  <andythenorth> oh vanilla can turn off the signal GUI :o
19:09:05  <andythenorth> wow
19:09:14  <andythenorth> amy ignorance never ends :)
19:09:17  <andythenorth> my *
19:10:23  <supermop_work> maps also shoulding put a power plant in a far corner from coal in the middle of nowhere though
19:10:28  <supermop_work> shouldn't
19:12:22  <andythenorth> signals on bridges and tunnels eh
19:14:00  <supermop_work> funnily enough the manhattan bridge only allows one train per track at a time
19:14:08  <supermop_work> as it bounces too much otherwise
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19:19:11  <andythenorth> TEMPLATE BASED TRAIN REPLACEMENT :o
19:19:18  <andythenorth> oh, but how do I use it :(
19:19:55  <andythenorth> oh lolz
19:19:56  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7942: Fix: [SDL2] support pasting from clipboard on Linux
19:20:19  <andythenorth> there are buttons, but I can make the window small enough to fit on my screen
19:20:40  <andythenorth> so template-based train replacement is only for users with > 13" screens
19:21:05  <nielsm> iirc when TBTR was submitted as a PR for master it also had big trouble with UI scaling here
19:21:14  <andythenorth> well I can't test it :P
19:21:18  <andythenorth> the window doesn't scale
19:21:23  <andythenorth> what are slots?
19:21:38  <andythenorth> I need to manage slots in vehicle groups
19:21:46  <andythenorth> but I don't know why
19:23:52  <Eddi|zuHause> supermop_work: it would make sense to have the grf be able to set a cargodist category, instead of the way too generic "passengers, express, everything else" that we have now
19:25:16  <andythenorth> I suspect players know better than authors
19:25:17  <supermop_work> Eddi|zuHause: exactly
19:26:11  <Eddi|zuHause> supermop_work: there are two problems with that: 1) which categories should there be, and 2) what to do with older grfs?
19:26:46  <supermop_work> old grfs, all of the 'cargo' cargo is in one category, same as now
19:27:01  <andythenorth> show train length in vehicle window?
19:27:03  <andythenorth> seems quite nice
19:27:06  <andythenorth> I often want to know that
19:27:14  <andythenorth> I have to send train to depot to find out
19:27:16  <supermop_work> can't you just look at the train?
19:27:54  <andythenorth> to figure the length?
19:27:57  <andythenorth> surprisingly not
19:27:57  <Eddi|zuHause> i don't think that is a problem i ever came across
19:28:07  <andythenorth> how to build correct length station?
19:28:24  <andythenorth> or passing loops
19:29:24  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] lcd047 updated pull request #7942: Fix: [SDL2] support pasting from clipboard on Linux
19:29:41  <Eddi|zuHause> dunno, maybe i'm too good at remembering what train lengths i built
19:30:23  <andythenorth>
19:30:33  <andythenorth> lots of additions there
19:30:43  <supermop_work> yeah i've never had this problem andy
19:30:49  <andythenorth> although the 'running' is a bug, those are el engines on non-el track
19:32:11  <andythenorth> 'Group' is an addition
19:32:14  <andythenorth> and 'Slot'
19:32:25  <andythenorth> and all the extra info per engine
19:34:46  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick commented on pull request #7919: Lifetime profit
19:35:08  <Eddi|zuHause> first impression? i don't like the multi-line entries
19:35:49  <andythenorth> I think they're tied to an improved breakdowns implementation
19:35:54  <andythenorth> I should turn breakdowns on or something
19:36:56  <andythenorth>
19:40:24  <TrueBrain> that one nightly build I want ... gets stuck on MacOS build for some reason :( BOOOOO
19:40:38  <TrueBrain> cancel + rerun, see if that helps ...
19:41:04  <TrueBrain> now the step that took 36+ minutes took 2 seconds
19:41:06  <TrueBrain> guess that is better :D
19:44:00  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] lcd047 updated pull request #7942: Fix: [SDL2] support pasting from clipboard on Linux
19:46:24  <TrueBrain> "xz: (stdin): File format not recognized"
19:46:25  <TrueBrain> awhhhhhh
19:47:01  <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: that breakdown patch thread escalated quickly :o
19:47:06  <TrueBrain> who doesn't install xz these days :(
19:47:12  <andythenorth> bring back Dalestan
19:47:16  <andythenorth> or DaleStan?
19:47:19  <andythenorth> capitalisation eh
19:47:54  <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: i haven't read any threads in ages, no clue what you mean
19:48:05  <andythenorth> link above
19:48:11  <andythenorth> breakdowns
19:48:26  <Eddi|zuHause> i have no intention of clicking on any links
19:48:48  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] lcd047 commented on pull request #7942: Fix: [SDL2] support pasting from clipboard on Linux
19:48:48  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] lcd047 closed pull request #7942: Fix: [SDL2] support pasting from clipboard on Linux
19:48:56  <TrueBrain> HE WHO CANNOT BE PHISHED
19:49:23  <TrueBrain> the security dude in me applauds you Eddi|zuHause :)
19:49:29  <TrueBrain> and lol @ PR ... that is ... a new one :P
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19:57:05  <Eddi|zuHause> bot-induced ragequit?
19:57:20  <Eddi|zuHause> to be fair, the CI still does not propagate error messages properly
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19:59:46  <TrueBrain> on that I agree .. someone should port it to GitHub Actions :D
19:59:49  * TrueBrain looks at glx :P
19:59:52  <TrueBrain> aawwwwhhh :D
20:00:08  <glx> what ?
20:00:50  * glx opens log
20:01:22  <glx> ah
20:01:29  <TrueBrain> :D
20:02:15  <glx> <-- like that ?
20:03:08  <TrueBrain> if it aint a pull-request .... :P
20:03:19  <glx> it's not fully done
20:03:33  <TrueBrain> :)
20:03:43  <TrueBrain> I guess adding the commit checker alone would help a lot
20:03:50  <TrueBrain> you can even look into annotation
20:04:01  <glx> <-- but there's a PR ;)
20:04:24  <glx> only way to test actions "locally"
20:08:55  <TrueBrain> I push stuff to master in my fork
20:08:57  <TrueBrain> that works well too
20:10:14  * andythenorth donates to forums
20:10:28  <andythenorth> TrueBrain: OpenTTD funds are still 'fine'?
20:10:32  <andythenorth> or AWS ate it all? :D
20:11:01  <TrueBrain> I did not receive any PANIC message from mister o :)
20:11:12  <glx> should be ok then :)
20:11:13  <andythenorth> planetmaker: does coop need any funds?
20:12:16  <frosch123> very likely, it needed funds when it was active
20:13:35  <TrueBrain> I believe andythenorth is in the wrong xmas month or something :P
20:13:54  <andythenorth> I didn't pay my tax bill yet :P
20:14:02  <andythenorth> I have a lot of money in my account until end of month
20:15:07  <frosch123> TrueBrain: maybe he sold all unwanted xmas gifts on ebay
20:15:34  <TrueBrain> andythenorth .. that makes no sense at all :P
20:15:53  <andythenorth> sense of spending is related to money in account NOW
20:16:14  <andythenorth> currently I feel rich and can donate
20:16:28  <andythenorth> Feb I will feel poorer :P
20:16:40  <andythenorth> life is contextual :P
20:16:45  <Eddi|zuHause> just make sure your tax report shows the donation as tax-deductable
20:17:06  <andythenorth> I never bother :P
20:17:22  <Eddi|zuHause> what's the point of donating, then?
20:17:32  <Samu> I have a coding style issue
20:17:34  <Samu>
20:17:38  <Samu> is that alright?
20:17:43  * andythenorth is not very tax efficient
20:17:59  <Samu> or is this preferrable:
20:18:46  <TrueBrain> andythenorth: just leave out the word "tax" :P
20:18:53  <andythenorth> also
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20:22:56  <Samu> Original:
20:22:57  <Samu>
20:23:15  <Samu> which style for this?
20:23:55  <Samu> vote!
20:25:44  <nielsm> 3 if it has to change, but it smells like a wrong approach to whatever it is
20:26:01  <Samu> ok 3
20:28:07  <Samu> im trying to deconstruct
20:28:19  <andythenorth> why is google SERPS awful now?
20:28:24  <andythenorth> it's showing favicons and crap
20:29:07  <Samu> trying to have my patch with the least amount of changes
20:29:15  <Samu> when compared with original
20:32:22  <Samu> patching backwards sucks
20:32:32  <Samu> always conflicts
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20:39:12  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 opened pull request #7943: Move commit checker from Azure Pipelines to Github Actions
20:39:50  <glx> and of course this PR will escape commit check ;)
20:40:28  <TrueBrain> hmm .. that is fixable .. how did I do that ..
20:40:34  <TrueBrain> basically, it needs to see a workflow once
20:40:38  <TrueBrain> and it will run your PR workflow after that
20:40:46  <TrueBrain> not sure it matters, tbh
20:40:52  <TrueBrain> for other repos, we simply did [Actions] btw
20:40:55  <TrueBrain> not really important
20:41:31  <glx> github prevents running actions from "external" PR
20:41:47  <glx> it's a safety measure for paid plans
20:43:25  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #7943: Move commit checker from Azure Pipelines to Github Actions
20:43:34  <TrueBrain> silly enough, that is a false statement :)
20:43:43  <TrueBrain> forks cannot use secrets
20:43:45  <TrueBrain> that is true
20:44:05  <TrueBrain> but I noticed last week that it runs the workflow from my PRs, once the master has any workflow
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20:45:07  <TrueBrain> glx: can you run your code in your fork, so we can see it works? :D
20:45:23  <glx> ah yes I can PR it there
20:46:11  <Samu> this line is too big
20:46:16  <Samu> Money base_cost = IsCanal(tile) ? _price[PR_CLEAR_CANAL] : IsRiver(tile) && _game_mode == GM_NORMAL && ! && !_cheats.magic_bulldozer.value ? (Money)0 : _price[PR_CLEAR_WATER];
20:46:50  <glx> yes split it
20:47:02  <glx> ternary should be a last resort choice
20:47:20  <glx> and use parenthesis with imbricated ternarys
20:47:52  <glx> or at least around complex && args
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20:49:00  <nielsm> ternaries: simple condition (no && or ||), simple values (no chaining or internal ternaries)
20:49:18  <nielsm> if it gets any more complex than that, split it into multiple lines
20:49:32  <nielsm> or see if it might make sense to make a function out of it
20:49:38  <glx> don't try to be smarter than the compiler ;)
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20:49:59  <Samu> linux builders complained about the 0
20:50:05  <Samu> so I added (Money)0
20:50:48  <nielsm> Money{ 0 } would be better
20:50:56  <nielsm> example:
20:51:29  <nielsm> I considered making that a ternary, but figured I may as well make a function of it
20:52:05  <nielsm> it would have ended up as a horribly long chained one otherwise
20:52:15  <Samu> funny, this is the ClearTile_Water function
20:52:17  <Samu> too
20:53:37  <Samu> so it's ok to create a function for a DoCommand
20:53:47  <Samu> CommandCost, actually
20:54:51  <nielsm> simple, static helper functions like that can make code easier to read, and the compiler might often inline them anyway
20:55:46  <nielsm> (also reminder that the "inline" keyword in C++ does not mean the function must or even just should be inlined, it just means it's legal to define the function multiple times and you promise every definition of it across all translations units are identical)
20:56:00  <TrueBrain> <- frosch123: w00p :)
20:56:22  <nielsm> what a clear front page
20:56:42  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 updated pull request #7943: Move commit checker from Azure Pipelines to Github Actions
20:56:56  <TrueBrain> <- I kinda like Actions the more I use it :)
20:57:48  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 commented on pull request #7943: Move commit checker from Azure Pipelines to Github Actions
20:58:04  <frosch123> TrueBrain: \o/
20:58:19  <TrueBrain> all that is left is to trigger this when a build is done :)
20:58:41  <TrueBrain> glx: how ironic, that your example failed :P
20:58:42  <glx> weird it ran fine before the rebase and forced push
20:58:45  <Samu>
20:58:52  <Samu> does it look better?
20:59:04  <TrueBrain> glx: checkout@v2 changed some rules
20:59:14  <TrueBrain> (it checks out a lot less code)
20:59:14  <frosch123> how does the nightly work? does the nightly trigger a rebuild of the whole jekyll?
20:59:21  <TrueBrain> frosch123: yes
20:59:27  <glx> the rebase failed
20:59:33  <glx> other stuff skipped
20:59:50  <TrueBrain> glx: yes. Most likely because @v2 changed stuff :) It seems origin/master doesn't exist ;)
21:00:06  <TrueBrain> it never fetches 'master' in @v2
21:00:18  <TrueBrain>
21:00:26  <glx> ha yes, I'll need the openttd checkout I guess
21:00:51  <TrueBrain> no, you need to checkout 'master' too :)
21:01:09  <TrueBrain> "fetch all branches", but only for master, basically
21:01:17  <TrueBrain> @v1 did a full git clone
21:01:21  <TrueBrain> which is TERRIBLY slow
21:01:28  <TrueBrain> @v2 only picks up what is absolutely needed
21:01:33  <TrueBrain> the rest you have to get yourself
21:01:36  <TrueBrain> like .. the master branch :)
21:01:47  <glx> I see
21:02:12  <TrueBrain> "git fetch --no-tags --prune --depth=1 origin +refs/heads/master:refs/remotes/origin/master" or something?
21:02:12  <TrueBrain> not sure
21:03:06  <TrueBrain> @v1 took 40 seconds for OpenTTD .. @v2 only 7
21:03:14  <TrueBrain> just to highlight how much better it got :)
21:03:49  <Samu> the way I have rivers being permanent is hacky
21:04:12  <Samu> it actually demolishes the river at cost 0 and rebuilds it right away
21:04:26  <Samu> with the same random bits
21:04:58  <Samu> no actual error pops up
21:05:06  <Samu> saying "you can't do that"
21:05:06  <TrueBrain> frosch123: why did you ask?
21:06:15  <frosch123> i just assumed it would be cron/time triggered
21:06:35  <TrueBrain> nah, it is a huge chain :)
21:06:49  <TrueBrain> otherwise new tags are annoying :D
21:06:55  <LordAro> Samu: yup, that's terrible
21:06:59  <LordAro> evening all
21:07:09  <TrueBrain> hello mister awesome
21:07:12  <Samu> why is it terrible :(
21:07:31  <Samu> it gives the idea nothing is done
21:07:39  <Samu> there's no £0 floating
21:07:42  <LordAro> Samu: you said it yourself, it's really really hacky
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21:07:59  <LordAro> TrueBrain: that's lord awesome to you
21:08:00  <LordAro> :p
21:08:22  <TrueBrain> my apologizes lord sinky
21:08:23  <Samu> but it's doing fine
21:08:31  <TrueBrain> sinky? Well, I guess I am going with this now
21:08:46  <LordAro> lol
21:09:27  <LordAro> Samu: ok, why do you think it's hacky?
21:09:59  <Samu> because in the settings, i say that rivers are "indestructible"
21:10:15  <Samu> they really aren't, they're destroyed and rebuilt at cost 0
21:10:33  <LordAro> right, so something that says it is one thing but is actually another
21:10:36  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 updated pull request #7943: Move commit checker from Azure Pipelines to Github Actions
21:10:41  <LordAro> do you think that's a good thing?
21:10:47  <Samu> gives the effect that it's indestructible, so it's all good
21:11:00  <LordAro> just because it works, doesn't mean it's maintainable, understandable, or just straight up good code
21:11:09  <LordAro> by the sound of it, it's all 3
21:11:37  <LordAro> hacky is fine when you need to demonstrate something to a customer in 3 hours time and you need to get something working
21:11:45  <milek7_> TrueBrain: content-type is text/html
21:11:47  <LordAro> there are no time or space pressures here, so take the time to do it properly
21:12:10  <milek7_> while content looks rather like xhtml
21:12:14  <glx> ok more work needed
21:12:23  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/workflows] TrueBrain opened pull request #1: Add: workflow to automate publishing of documentation
21:12:35  <TrueBrain> milek7_: I hope you understand your comment is fully out-of-context to me :)
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21:12:56  <Samu> I don't know of another way :(
21:13:01  <Samu> would have to think
21:13:13  <LordAro> the horror.
21:13:30  <TrueBrain> glx: it did do the fetch, I guess
21:13:37  <Samu> i don't want to pass an error to the command
21:13:51  <Samu> would break area clearing :(
21:13:52  <TrueBrain> glx: debugging becomes a bit easier if you add "set -x" at the start of the script
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21:14:27  <TrueBrain> glx: did you rebase locally btw?
21:14:30  <Samu> i actually want it to skip clearing the tile
21:15:19  <glx> yes locally master and the branch are in sync with openttd master
21:15:29  <glx> and on github too
21:15:38  <TrueBrain> so why does the rebase fail .. odd
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21:16:16  <TrueBrain> replace "master" with "${GITHUB_BASE_REF}" btw, before I forget to mention :D
21:16:56  <milek7_> TrueBrain: serves xhtml files but Content-Type in header is text/html
21:17:04  <milek7_> it should be application/xhtml+xml
21:18:03  <TrueBrain> nah, you are solving the wrong problem there
21:18:09  <Samu> gonna try return CommandCost(); see what happens, instead of clearing at 0
21:18:16  <TrueBrain> let me convert those pages to html5
21:19:08  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 updated pull request #7943: Move commit checker from Azure Pipelines to Github Actions
21:19:17  <Samu> * Creates a command cost return with no cost and no error
21:19:20  <Samu> oh really?
21:19:28  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/workflows] TrueBrain updated pull request #1: Add: workflow to automate publishing of documentation
21:22:00  <TrueBrain> milek7_: fixed
21:22:49  <TrueBrain> right, time to provision this in production
21:23:20  <milek7_> doxygen output is still xhtml
21:24:02  <TrueBrain> ah, you only mention the root, which was xhtml for some silly reason
21:24:15  <TrueBrain> owh well
21:24:24  <glx> hmm trailing whitespace errors during the rebase it seems
21:25:06  <Samu> wow, i can return CommandCost(); just like that!
21:25:43  <TrueBrain> glx: still weird, as it is a clean rebase .. so that should also be an issue locally?
21:26:22  <glx> locally it works if I type the commands
21:27:00  <TrueBrain> strange
21:29:44  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 updated pull request #7943: Move commit checker from Azure Pipelines to Github Actions
21:31:02  <TrueBrain> glx: seems the PR checkout is already a merge
21:31:15  <TrueBrain> (..) origin +739695c458412cf2760f17d2d6d8dd687298cec1:refs/remotes/pull/2/merge
21:31:23  <TrueBrain> still, rebase should work tbh
21:32:21  <TrueBrain> "HEAD is now at 739695c Merge d734ced058d4d28781665b29f54eaee3da8a5021 into 3b177af8263df5212bf3ea3bcd048846f704a868"
21:32:23  <TrueBrain> after checkout
21:32:25  <TrueBrain> so something is funky
21:33:52  <TrueBrain> the @v1 also did that
21:35:07  <TrueBrain> glx: I would guess it has to do with fetch-depth
21:35:15  <TrueBrain> so I guess you just have to set fetch-depth to 0
21:35:18  <TrueBrain> which is too bad
21:36:09  <TrueBrain> but it is what it is :)
21:36:18  <TrueBrain>       uses: actions/checkout@v2
21:36:18  <TrueBrain>       with:
21:36:18  <TrueBrain>         fetch-depth: 0
21:36:38  <glx> I guess default works fine for PRs with only 1 commit
21:36:45  <glx> or maybe not
21:37:06  <TrueBrain> fetch-depth by default is 1
21:37:09  <TrueBrain> so possibly it only gets the merge commit
21:37:13  <TrueBrain> and not the commits below it
21:37:15  <TrueBrain> so yeah, that is possible
21:38:40  <TrueBrain> would even make sense, I guess
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21:38:45  <glx> oh the checkout HEAD^ scenario looks better
21:39:09  <glx> I think
21:39:28  <TrueBrain> that removes the merge commit :P
21:39:30  <TrueBrain> bit cheating :D
21:39:51  <TrueBrain> yeah, fetch-depth of 2
21:39:57  <TrueBrain> so that would be the merge commit + 1 more from the PR
21:40:02  <TrueBrain> but this is always an issue for us
21:40:08  <TrueBrain> as you don't know how many commits are in the PR
21:40:20  <TrueBrain> us wanting to rebase to master is the issue here
21:40:29  <TrueBrain> why did we do that again?
21:41:05  <TrueBrain> fetch-depth of 2 and checkout HEAD^ removes the merge-commit. Commit-checker should "just work" after that I guess
21:42:02  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 updated pull request #7943: Move commit checker from Azure Pipelines to Github Actions
21:42:10  <glx> still testing things :)
21:43:04  <TrueBrain> and I am waiting for ACM to provision me a certificate
21:43:33  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick updated pull request #7937: Build on competitor canal
21:45:16  <Samu> bah.. water_cmd.cpp is still a large diff
21:45:34  <Samu> I don't think I can make it shorter without ruining code style
21:45:49  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 updated pull request #7943: Move commit checker from Azure Pipelines to Github Actions
21:46:23  <LordAro> Samu: lines of code is not a bad thing
21:46:42  <LordAro> Samu: incidentally, you're aware that commit should really be split up much more
21:46:50  <LordAro> probably into 3 separate PRs, given it's doing 3 different things
21:48:22  <glx> hmm ok  HEAD^ is wrong, it's head of master
21:49:04  <LordAro> bit weird that the checkout is already a merge? can't that be "fixed" ?
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21:49:37  <Samu> split into more commits hmm
21:49:39  <glx> I guess I can set the rigth ref
21:49:40  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/workflows] TrueBrain updated pull request #1: Add: workflow to automate publishing of documentation
21:49:49  <Samu> deconstructing and patching backwards, you mean
21:50:52  <Samu> thing 1 and thing 3 can't be separated that easily
21:52:42  <TrueBrain> glx: pretty sure you are on the wrong track there :)
21:52:51  <TrueBrain> basically, GitHub pulls in the pr/merge, which is fine
21:52:58  <TrueBrain> but for some reason, which I cannot remember, we want to rebase to master
21:53:05  <TrueBrain> that is only going to work if you do fetch-depth of 0
21:53:12  <TrueBrain> as you don't know how many commits are in a PR
21:53:16  <TrueBrain> if we don't do the rebase
21:53:38  <TrueBrain> other solution arrise
21:53:46  <TrueBrain> but as long as you want the rebase .. you are a bit out of luck :)
21:54:05  <glx> I don't remember why we rebase :)
21:55:55  <TrueBrain> so in that case do a fetch-depth of 2, do a "checkout HEAD^" (that removes the merge commit)
21:55:56  <TrueBrain> and off you go
21:56:21  <TrueBrain> hmm, no, I am not sure which side of the merge it picks
21:56:31  <glx> but doing that it picks master head :)
21:56:38  <TrueBrain> so the left side, makes sense
21:56:50  <TrueBrain> so yeah, checkout@v2, ref: ${{ github.ref }}
21:57:00  <TrueBrain> so avoids the merge I would guess
21:57:01  <TrueBrain> not sure
21:57:02  <TrueBrain> interesting :D
21:57:20  <glx> GITHUB_REF is the merge
21:57:25  <TrueBrain> also interesting: my certificate is still not there :(
21:57:41  <glx> but I'm sure there's the correct ref somewhere
21:58:23  <TrueBrain> dump the env in an action and see
21:58:36  <TrueBrain> (maybe not in this branch, as you are making Azure Pipelines going maddddd :P)
21:58:52  <TrueBrain> I work on Actions in 2 branches: 1 to trigger actions in my fork, and one for the PR :)
21:59:14  <glx> I can do the tests on my other branch indeed
22:00:22  <TrueBrain> hmm, the pr/merge is done, to make sure things like workflows are as they are in master
22:00:24  <TrueBrain> which makes sense
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22:00:37  <TrueBrain> so not doing that might be a bit bad :D
22:00:49  <TrueBrain> so I guess we have to change the commit-checker instead :D
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22:49:33  <Samu> crap, i broke a feature :(
22:50:54  <Samu> stupid me, how do I undo a rebase now :(
22:51:49  <Samu> nevermind, i still have my very old patch file here to see what I had
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23:47:10  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick updated pull request #7937: Build on competitor canal
23:48:18  <Samu> I don't have time to fully test this now, but at least I restored some functionality I broke by mistake
23:48:45  <Samu> cyas gn
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23:58:09  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/workflows] TrueBrain merged pull request #1: Add: workflow to automate publishing of documentation

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