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00:01:02 <TrueBrain> https://docs.openttd.org/ <- and this weekend, I will make it auto up-date, fix links referring to documentation, etc etc :) 00:01:09 <TrueBrain> but at least it now exists :D 00:03:38 *** Flygon has joined #openttd 00:04:54 <TrueBrain> did a quickfix so people going to https://noai.openttd.org/ end up in the new place. But tons of redirects to add :D 00:07:57 <LordAro> tons? https://noai.openttd.org/* -> https://docs.openttd.org/ai-scripting/* ? 00:22:26 <dwfreed> ^ that's easy, if it's a 1:1 mapping 00:22:47 <glx> TrueBrain: https://github.com/glx22/OpenTTD/pull/1/checks?check_run_id=394330267 some progress 00:25:42 *** Thedarkb has quit IRC 00:46:24 <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 updated pull request #7943: Move commit checker from Azure Pipelines to Github Actions https://git.io/JvTY7 00:59:13 <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 commented on pull request #7943: Move commit checker from Azure Pipelines to Github Actions https://git.io/JvTcL 01:37:18 *** snail_UES_ has joined #openttd 02:35:23 *** Pikka has joined #openttd 03:10:14 *** D-HUND has joined #openttd 03:13:32 *** debdog has quit IRC 03:22:46 *** glx has quit IRC 03:35:30 *** crazystacy has joined #openttd 03:51:00 *** Lejving_ has quit IRC 04:27:48 <crazystacy> is there a way to do this: "openttd -d 1 net=4" ? 04:27:56 <crazystacy> like, set it overall to 1 but 4 to one category? 04:48:37 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 04:48:41 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 05:00:03 <Eddi|zuHause> tried with two -d parameters? 05:00:42 <Eddi|zuHause> (order might be important) 05:11:48 *** mikegrb_ has quit IRC 05:22:23 <crazystacy> i did -d "1 net=4" 05:22:27 <crazystacy> seems to work properly 05:22:40 <crazystacy> will try two -d, didn't even occur to me 05:48:27 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 06:01:30 *** snail_UES_ has quit IRC 06:56:14 <crazystacy> can anyone explain why Script_Suspend is needed in singleplayer? i am reading the comment which says "simulate multiplayer"? 06:56:28 <crazystacy> so it has to wait for the command to havebeen completed, when it is completed, the callback is called? 07:11:49 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 07:14:48 <andythenorth> o/ 07:16:08 <crazystacy> o- 07:16:24 <andythenorth> new CivilAI :) 07:16:38 <crazystacy> you made that? 07:16:51 <crazystacy> oh, pikka 07:17:11 <Pikka> ya 07:17:14 <crazystacy> i haven't tried civil. i tried choochoo but i realised it's too simple. it only does point-to-point. it's supposed to make networks but i can't get it to do it 07:17:26 <crazystacy> he's just doing endless power plant to coal mine connections. 5 stations at one plant 07:17:36 <crazystacy> i might modify it to make more complex networks. does Civil do trains? 07:17:41 <Pikka> choochoo works moderately well on a completely flat map, in my experience 07:17:52 <crazystacy> oh wow 07:18:00 <crazystacy> on a big map Choochoo completely gives up. 07:18:04 <crazystacy> the pathfinding takes forever 07:18:16 <crazystacy> wow. you can turn off the grid in openttd? omg. i have to do that 07:18:37 <Pikka> Civi does do trains 07:18:56 <crazystacy> i will try it 07:21:19 <Pikka> let me know what you think :) 07:22:11 <crazystacy> more advanced than choochoo 07:22:21 <crazystacy> i will let him run for a while. but it seems he doesn't start unless i play 07:23:08 <crazystacy> tropic doesn't have trains in 1940? :S 07:24:24 <Pikka> I guess not with the default vehicles 07:24:56 * andythenorth makes civil game 07:25:35 <crazystacy> does Civil try to stay behind the player in terms of performance/income? 07:26:24 <Pikka> no 07:26:28 <andythenorth> Pikka: is it still only building chains for Food and Goods? o_O 07:26:48 <Pikka> yes andythenorth 07:26:54 <andythenorth> ok, no Steeltown then 07:27:29 <crazystacy> civil's railway lines are more pleasing than ChooChoo's, and i like the buses 07:27:37 <crazystacy> i had a similar idea of an AI which simply populates the map 07:27:47 <crazystacy> like add some cars to every city 07:29:23 <andythenorth> err ooops 07:29:31 * andythenorth forgot to update the AI :P 07:30:27 <Pikka> :D 07:32:30 <andythenorth> who has a server? 07:32:44 <andythenorth> we should leave a Civil test server up and watch it :) 07:33:19 <crazystacy> i do 07:35:07 <andythenorth> it makes the best livery choices https://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/9618/civil-liveries.png 07:35:35 <crazystacy> not sure how to start AIs tho 07:36:42 <Pikka> the console command is "startai <ainame>" 07:37:44 <crazystacy> it's dedicated. i guess i want a game script which auto starts ais 07:37:58 <Pikka> can't rcon? 07:39:04 <crazystacy> oh 07:40:08 <crazystacy> that works 07:41:21 <crazystacy> but then i also need to install those AIs on the server 07:42:51 <crazystacy> ok. i have set up Battle of the Bots, which other AIs should i run 07:45:01 <andythenorth> civil v civil :) 07:45:13 <andythenorth> with Iron Horse :P 07:45:23 <andythenorth> and a twitch stream 07:46:18 <crazystacy> hm. i downloaded AIs, not sure how to activate 07:46:58 <crazystacy> they don't show up in list_ai 07:49:33 * andythenorth will now watch Steel Town on YT :) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_hlfqggGOZw 07:50:27 <Pikka> steel town seems to be over to the right somewhere 07:54:28 <andythenorth> this video is pretty definitely inspired by FIRS 07:54:50 <andythenorth> all the industry chains are a direct copy of mine 07:54:59 <Pikka> typical 07:56:48 <andythenorth> hmm, they have invented some extra stuff about rolling steel though, in different mills 07:57:06 <crazystacy> ll 07:57:07 <crazystacy> lol 07:57:28 <andythenorth> that's not realistic 08:12:53 <andythenorth> Pikka: does it do anything to calculate hp/ton or hp/speed? o_O 08:18:01 <Pikka> it doesn't specifically use either in its calculations, but hp and weight and speed all have influence on its choices 08:18:19 <Pikka> has it done something ridiculous? 08:19:40 <crazystacy> kirby paul on a 30 length coal hauler 08:20:07 <andythenorth> two of them are favouring high speed EMUs 08:20:16 <andythenorth> 105mph / 600hp 08:20:31 <andythenorth> but then it's attaching 3 more full size unpowered pax/mail coaches 08:21:07 <andythenorth> it has also worked out they're not profitable, so it's scrapping them 08:22:36 <andythenorth> @calc (105/600)*134 08:22:36 <DorpsGek> andythenorth: 23.45 08:22:51 <andythenorth> nope 08:22:59 <andythenorth> @calc (105/18.75)*134 08:22:59 <DorpsGek> andythenorth: 750.4 08:23:22 <andythenorth> train has enough HP to reach max speed, just very slow acceleration :) 08:25:36 <andythenorth> it's all fine 08:29:24 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 08:54:58 <planetmaker> andythenorth: as it stands, it's me and only me who funds the coop servers with a very rare exception that someone donates a buck. So if you ask whether coop could use a buck to fund servers: it would be highly appreciated :) 09:07:45 *** Thedarkb has joined #openttd 09:25:17 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 09:26:02 <crazystacy> i found some EnforcePrecondition which do EnforcePrecondition(false, x || y); 09:26:17 <crazystacy> should they maybe be split into Enforce(false, x); Enforce(false, y);? 09:26:23 <crazystacy> makes it less confusing when debugging 09:26:48 <crazystacy> oh wait i get it now 09:32:56 *** Thedarkb has quit IRC 09:36:35 * andythenorth considers UnCivilAI 09:36:56 <crazystacy> :P 09:37:02 <planetmaker> seems I chose a bad tim to reply to you :P andythenorth: as it stands, it's me and only me who funds the coop servers with a very rare exception that someone donates a buck. So if you ask whether coop could use a buck to fund servers: it would be highly appreciated :) 09:37:35 <crazystacy> i wondered about that, if you did that reinforcement learning thing with an openttd AI it might learn to block all other players as soon as they perform any kind of action 09:38:13 <planetmaker> crazystacy, but how would it react, if it had a similar AI acting as anti-cheat and anti-griefing in form of a game script? 09:38:26 <planetmaker> which then would simply ban it and undo its actions? 09:39:11 <crazystacy> well it would have to learn that beforehand 09:39:20 <crazystacy> if you trained it on "normal" games it would be beat by that, i believe 09:39:38 <crazystacy> i haven't done any machine learning stuff but it should be "easy". i mean i've seen some guys at uni doing reinforcement learning for various games 09:39:42 <crazystacy> but i don't know how easy :| 09:39:51 <crazystacy> i suspect my computer won't be able to do it in less than 1 year 09:39:55 <andythenorth> Pikka: teach it ENSP and FMSP or riot :) 09:40:05 <andythenorth> that will mess with human players :) 09:40:26 <crazystacy> what i wonder is. should the AI modify its own source code, or... yes it has to doesn't it? you have to modify the source, see what the result is, if it's bad, modify again, and so on 09:40:40 <crazystacy> either that or some AI design where it has "patterns" of actions 09:44:50 <planetmaker> crazystacy, why... wouldn't it? 09:45:00 <planetmaker> have it play on online servers and learn :D 09:45:26 <planetmaker> but granted, that needs a modified client... something we explicitly don't support so that players need effort to bot the game for themselves 09:46:29 <crazystacy> why wouldn't it what? 09:47:06 <planetmaker> ah, why wouldn't it learn it faster than in a year? 09:47:48 <crazystacy> hm. because my laptop is old 09:47:52 <crazystacy> presumably it needs a lot of computing power 09:48:03 <crazystacy> one year is maybe an exaggeration 09:48:09 <planetmaker> do you need some server to train your AI on and have it play? 09:48:16 <crazystacy> i dunno 09:48:21 <crazystacy> i never trained an AI before 09:49:09 <planetmaker> Let's put it that way: I do have the ressources for the server. And I found it a compelling idea to setup something which either or both: 09:49:34 <planetmaker> a) makes AI competitions with various settings and publishes the results. Like a CI for AI 09:49:35 <crazystacy> but the people i know who are into machine learning all have big gaming desktops for running their stuff 09:49:54 <planetmaker> b) if wanted offer an alternative where the map is also open to human players where the AI can compete 09:50:06 <crazystacy> a) sounds nice. i thought about too after i saw a forum post about it. that doesn't need a lot of resources. i mean, depending on how long you want 1 game to run 09:50:40 <andythenorth> can AIs communicate? 09:50:41 <planetmaker> if b) a game usually runs for, say, a week or around that, depending on usage 09:50:51 <planetmaker> @andythenorth, not that I know 09:50:59 <planetmaker> PR? :P 09:51:05 <crazystacy> but i believe for reinforcement learning, you would basically run tens of thousands of game instances where the AI has to learn to play from scratch 09:51:11 * andythenorth wondered about creating AIs that can deploy compete / collaborate strategies 09:51:16 <crazystacy> like, tell it how to place a rail, buy a train, let it combine theseactions until it makes millions 09:51:28 <crazystacy> if a certain model makes a lot of money, that's a good one, and it builds on that. i think that's how it works... :P 09:51:33 <andythenorth> this is a classic text in modern political science https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Evolution_of_Cooperation 09:51:43 <andythenorth> it was modelled using agent based simulations 09:52:02 <planetmaker> crazystacy, you might not want to go that basic as placing rails on individual tiles. But train it on which things to connect and how 09:52:15 <crazystacy> i suppose so 09:52:28 <planetmaker> AI do have functions to build rail from A to B (and there might be different options to do that with, say, different libraries which could be compared) 09:52:30 <crazystacy> but it would be interesting to see what crazy strategies it comes up with if it has complete freedom 09:52:57 <crazystacy> i'll look into it when i have finished my current project 09:56:24 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 10:06:06 *** Lejving has joined #openttd 10:09:19 <Pikka> so what metric are you training this AI towards? 10:10:49 <Pikka> and is the purpose of OTTD AI's to be "good at playing the game", whatever metric you choose to quantify that? Is the "best" AI the one that maximises its profits, or builds the most vehicles, or drives other players bankrupt? 10:14:18 <crazystacy> i haven't said anything about what an AI should be (if you are talking to me). i simply wanted to see what would happen if you told an AI to make as much money as possible. for me the best AI would be one that creates "interesting" railway networks 10:14:57 *** Thedarkb has joined #openttd 10:15:10 <crazystacy> i saw some reinforcement learning video where an AI intentionally crashed itself because it reduced the game time (they had defined the goal as having an as short as possible game time i believe) 10:15:36 <crazystacy> (not openttd) 10:15:40 <crazystacy> crashed/killed 10:16:00 <crazystacy> and i didn't say that you should let loose this insane troll AI on random people 10:16:10 <crazystacy> :P 10:22:32 <Pikka> more just general musing :) 10:23:09 <Pikka> I think the general concept of putting AIs head-to-head to find out which is "better" is flawed. And not just because CivilAI doesn't usually do very well in those contests ;) 10:23:55 <crazystacy> oh i forgot who you are :P 10:24:10 <crazystacy> still, there are goal servers, some people are into that sort of thing 10:39:00 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 10:39:35 *** Thedarkb has quit IRC 10:43:54 <LordAro> iirc the most "complex" AI is trAIns - it was the author's masters thesis 10:45:47 <crazystacy> i saw that 10:49:40 <peter1138> Is it breakfast time yet? 11:05:15 <crazystacy> coffee time 11:06:46 <LordAro> tea time 11:38:41 *** crazystacy has quit IRC 11:58:14 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 11:58:26 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 12:00:27 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 12:05:25 *** Borg has joined #openttd 12:05:27 <Borg> howdy.. 12:05:59 <Borg> anyone done experiments with negative look_ahead cost? 12:06:28 <Borg> Im doing some right now.. and... im suprised how well it works.. 12:09:20 <Borg> or not.... ;) 12:19:33 <Pikka> no? 12:20:54 <Borg> unfortunately no... it works well in one setups.. but fails in others.. 12:26:30 *** crazystacy has joined #openttd 12:33:33 <Borg> lets try asymetrical... 12:49:49 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 12:52:35 <andythenorth> peter1138: I hope it's breakfast soon 12:56:19 <crazystacy> about time now 13:02:31 *** Samu has joined #openttd 13:04:04 <crazystacy> how do i figure out what a command is? in gdb i put a breakpoint in DoCommandP, print cmd, and it says something like 232319321 13:04:07 <crazystacy> shouldn't it be 10? 11? 13:12:25 <andythenorth> so many metro maps in reddit 13:12:28 <andythenorth> it's like a mini craze 13:12:32 *** crazystacy has quit IRC 13:26:03 <peter1138> Yeah, it was. 13:26:06 <peter1138> I had... er... a salad. 13:26:16 <peter1138> And a piece of a piece of cake. The cake is horrible. 13:26:24 <peter1138> I guess that's Costco for you! 13:29:12 *** crazystacy has joined #openttd 13:29:50 <crazystacy> hm, i got dced. dunno if anyone gave me any advice earlier 13:31:52 <Borg> and YAPF experts? how pathfinder decides to thrown altpath? cost difference big enough? 13:39:52 *** agentsmith101 has joined #openttd 13:46:09 *** agentsmith101 has quit IRC 13:48:07 *** agentsmith101 has joined #openttd 13:49:28 *** agentsmith101 has quit IRC 13:50:11 *** agentsmith101 has joined #openttd 13:54:26 *** snail_UES_ has joined #openttd 13:56:21 <andythenorth> Pikka: it's pretty good eh 13:58:32 *** agentsmith101 has quit IRC 13:59:03 *** agentsmith101 has joined #openttd 14:01:18 *** agentsmith101 has quit IRC 14:02:49 *** agentsmith101 has joined #openttd 14:08:15 *** snail_UES_ has quit IRC 14:10:26 <Pikka> andythenorth, it is? 14:10:49 <andythenorth> yes 14:11:11 <Borg> really... reallly.. we miss pathfinder cost setting in waypoints 14:11:19 <Borg> that would be A..WE..SOME 14:23:05 *** nielsm has joined #openttd 14:28:02 *** crazystacy has quit IRC 14:29:45 *** Flygon has quit IRC 14:29:52 <Samu> god damn it, i broke a feature 14:30:08 <Samu> thx to stupid regression compliance 14:31:41 <Samu> unless it was already broken 14:45:19 <Samu> incorrect for dock and buoy, correct for ship depot, lock 14:45:29 <Samu> testing industries is the hardest part 14:49:09 <Samu> wtf i can't place oil rigs on 64x64 maps now? 14:49:12 <Samu> :/ 14:59:13 <nielsm> the "must be built near edge" scaling? 14:59:39 <andythenorth> https://axelrod.readthedocs.io/en/stable/ 15:03:39 <andythenorth> so I have bought a thermal camera 15:03:48 <andythenorth> going to figure out which bits of my house leak heat outrageously 15:04:00 <andythenorth> probably the hot tub is the most :P 15:04:57 <Samu> i can, but not near the edge of the map 15:05:05 <Samu> for some weird reason 15:09:46 <Samu> make water keeping class is not doing what I want 15:21:25 <Samu> i found the problem... MakeStation was zeroing m8 15:29:42 <Samu> meahwhile i found a crash with funding industries as owner_none in scenario editor 15:29:46 <Samu> fixed 15:30:03 <Samu> related to my patch, not openttd 15:39:27 <Samu> is this doing what I think? SB(_me[t].m8, 0, 14, 0); 15:39:49 <Samu> zero 14 bits, except bit 15? 15:39:58 <Samu> bits 14-0 are zero'ed? 15:40:01 <Eddi|zuHause> <andythenorth> can AIs communicate? <-- IIRC there was a library designed around communication via signs 15:55:39 *** Wormnest has joined #openttd 15:58:51 *** crazystacy has joined #openttd 16:03:40 <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick updated pull request #7937: Build on competitor canal https://git.io/JvUIQ 16:04:04 <crazystacy> omg! 16:04:07 <crazystacy> someone fixed it :P 16:04:45 <crazystacy> permanent rivers sounds amazing. 16:06:35 <Samu> they told me to separate the features 16:06:45 <Samu> I can't do that yet 16:09:32 <Samu> everything is tightly related to each other, especially 1 and 3 16:10:20 <Samu> im currently trying to have this work first, then I'll separate features, number 2 seems to be easy enough to do 16:11:29 <Eddi|zuHause> i'm not a fan of a too strict river preservation 16:11:44 <Samu> its a setting 16:12:55 <crazystacy> we need tru-scale openttd 16:13:02 * crazystacy rattles a pitchfork 16:14:31 *** Compu has joined #openttd 16:15:40 <FLHerne> That would be very weird 16:20:38 <FLHerne> crazystacy: https://www.tt-forums.net/download/file.php?id=169751 16:20:53 <crazystacy> that's nice, but is it true scale? 16:21:02 <FLHerne> (created by 'Seeker' here https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=1071113) 16:21:02 <crazystacy> depends on what kind of boats they are 16:21:14 <crazystacy> i mean tankers are bigger i think, having seen some :P 16:21:30 <FLHerne> I think bridge to train is reasonable, but the boats are still too small 16:21:32 <crazystacy> well there are all sizes i guess 16:21:34 <crazystacy> yeah 16:21:42 <FLHerne> And the trees are too big :P 16:21:58 <crazystacy> i mean i am thinking back on this summer. i was abroad and saw a massive freighter/tanker (can't tell the difference) going under a huge bridge (the bosphorous bridge in turkey or whatever it's called) 16:22:01 <crazystacy> and... it was bigger 16:22:02 <crazystacy> :D 16:22:04 <FLHerne> Actually, the containers /on/ the boat are the right size for the train 16:22:09 * crazystacy makes an inappropriate joke 16:22:31 <FLHerne> But real container ships carry more than 30 containers :P 16:22:39 <crazystacy> http://i.hurimg.com/i/hdn/75/0x0/5d108f137af5071efc4fef34.jpg 16:28:16 *** agentsmith101 has quit IRC 16:31:51 <andythenorth> TTD scale more :P https://www.123rf.com/photo_123784501_rotterdam-netherlands--may-9-2019--a-small-container-ship-on-the-new-meuse-river-aerial-view.html 16:32:04 <andythenorth> this problem gets posed, but it's not really a problem :P 16:35:49 <crazystacy> no. i was joking 16:36:22 <crazystacy> do containers ever fall off ships and sink to the bottom of the ocean? 16:36:24 <crazystacy> i'd like to see that 16:37:11 <crazystacy> a container of diapers fell into the sea off australia's east coast 16:37:24 <crazystacy> maybe they'll soak up the entire sea 16:37:37 <peter1138> I might play OpenTTD tonight. 16:37:42 <peter1138> Or I might go to the cinema. 16:37:56 <peter1138> I had a slice of cake today but I threw it away as it was awful. 16:39:02 <crazystacy> what kind of cake? 16:40:50 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 16:41:26 <andythenorth> they often float crazystacy 16:41:35 <andythenorth> it's a well known hazard for smaller boats 16:41:47 <andythenorth> striking a floating ISO box is a serious hazard 16:42:48 <crazystacy> striking? you mean with a vessel? 16:42:56 <crazystacy> i want to open it up and take the ferraris 16:43:09 <crazystacy> i am sure i can sail it home like a motorboat 16:44:56 <andythenorth> MSC Napoli 16:58:44 *** Pikka has quit IRC 17:04:22 *** Progman has joined #openttd 17:05:23 <Samu> how many stations are placed on water 17:05:32 <Samu> dock, oilrig, buoy 17:06:58 <FLHerne> I think that's it for stock 17:07:28 <FLHerne> FIRS has fishing grounds and dredging site 17:10:35 <Samu> those are oilrigs with another name 17:12:31 <nielsm> opengfx+ airports? 17:15:36 <Samu> really? 17:15:42 <Samu> need to test that then 17:17:57 <Samu> Small Seaplane Port = can't build on water 17:19:23 <Samu> can't build it on water, but it does look to have water 17:19:31 <Samu> what is wrong? 17:20:28 <Samu> fake water 17:20:43 <nielsm> I'm not really sure I never used it myself 17:21:21 *** frosch123 has joined #openttd 17:22:30 *** Thedarkb has joined #openttd 17:25:00 *** glx has joined #openttd 17:25:00 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v glx 17:27:36 <Samu> should terraform still automatically clear river tiles if the setting is off? 17:27:45 <Samu> permanent river setting off 17:28:49 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 17:29:07 <Samu> or say to the user something like, "can't land raise here, must clear river first"? 17:30:00 <Samu> and the user is forced to bulldoze river first before terraforming 17:32:56 <Samu> rivers are still demolishable, but not with the terraform tool 17:33:02 <Samu> good or bad idea? 17:33:36 <crazystacy> i'm no authority but it seems like they should be undestroyable, like radio towers 17:34:19 <glx> hmm but rivers would be more annoying than radio towers then 17:34:36 <glx> a tower is one tile, a river is many 17:35:19 <glx> but terraforming limitation is part of the challenge 17:39:28 <crazystacy> well it's an optional and non-default setting presumably? i don't know 17:39:45 <crazystacy> but it's more "realistic". it would force you to use one bridge every now and then at least :P 17:39:47 <crazystacy> i like bridges 17:40:22 <Samu> or annoy the player too :o 17:40:58 <LordAro> definitely the sort of change that can't be introduced without a setting 17:41:12 <LordAro> default for new stuff could still be unmovable, though 17:41:54 <Samu> maybe 3 choices 17:42:19 <crazystacy> well why add permanent rivers if they are not permanent O_o 17:43:54 <Samu> permanent rivers: "off, can clear with terraform", "off, can't clear with terraform, must bulldoze first", "on, can't clear nor bulldoze" 17:44:00 *** hythlodaeus has joined #openttd 17:44:50 <crazystacy> if you bulldoze, they disappear permanently? or come back like ocean? 17:44:59 <Samu> disappear permanently 17:45:20 <Samu> the way it is right now 17:45:21 <crazystacy> sounds god 17:45:22 <crazystacy> o 17:45:27 <FLHerne> I think just "permanent" and "must bulldoze first" make sense 17:45:53 <FLHerne> It's consistent with the way terraforming interacts with most other objects 17:45:59 <crazystacy> original/permanent 17:46:47 <FLHerne> And there aren't enough rivers that anyone will be inconvenienced 17:46:54 <crazystacy> should i feel stupid if it took me 12 hours to finally track down the 1 line of code that i needed to fix? 17:47:04 <crazystacy> well rivers are a setting. i play with max rivers cause i love em 17:47:22 <crazystacy> that'll be great. i'll make a server with extra rivers. modify the map gen to make rivers all over. then i'll boat everyone to death 17:47:34 <crazystacy> try to bridge your way over 30 rivers with you 100k starting loan 17:48:27 <FLHerne> Sounds good, boats are underappreciated 17:49:42 <crazystacy> i am a champion of boats 17:49:58 <crazystacy> maybe i should fix some boat related issues. but i am glad Samu fixed the canal lock bug. Samu did you see my complaint or was it a known issue? 17:50:14 <Samu> what lock bug? where 17:51:06 *** Thedarkb has quit IRC 17:51:33 <Samu> where your complaint, I don't think i saw that 17:51:42 <crazystacy> oh, just in irc 17:51:50 <crazystacy> there is a bug where you can place a canal lock over other people's canals 17:52:22 <Samu> ah, i see, yeah, the patch deals with that 17:52:25 <crazystacy> # <- your canal tile. #^# <- someone else made a hill with another canal. now they can build a lock and block your canal 17:52:41 <Samu> but i had this idea since 2016, it's just that i'm too slow 17:52:57 <Samu> the idea of patching it 17:53:24 <crazystacy> :P 17:53:26 <Samu> oh, that 17:53:39 <crazystacy> i tried *so hard* to make an ungriefable canal system on the Reddit Vanilla server 17:53:43 <Samu> no, i didn't deal with that. ppl can still block each other with locks 17:53:48 <Samu> :p 17:54:20 <Samu> unless there's already a canal over there and it isn't theirs 17:54:40 <crazystacy> man. 17:54:41 <Samu> then yes, that my patch will deny if the setting is on 17:54:42 *** Thedarkb has joined #openttd 17:54:44 <crazystacy> it's up to me then. the champion of boats 17:56:06 <Samu> if the canal is yours, only you can place stuff on it, but rivers is free for all 17:57:00 <Samu> just test the PR, maybe it does what you ask 17:57:22 <crazystacy> ok 17:57:49 <Samu> if you get crashes or wrong behaviours, plz report, cus it's still work in progress 18:23:11 *** Fahrradkette has joined #openttd 18:25:22 <Fahrradkette> hi everyone. Is there a way to prioritize cargo pickup? I'm playing a FIRS game and like to make sure, that the boosting cargo is delivered first. 18:27:56 <Fahrradkette> Like for petrol: 1st prio machine shop, 2nd prio gas station 18:28:35 <Samu> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ywWBy6J5gz8 18:30:57 <Samu> I've separated "permanent rivers" from that PR into its own 18:31:06 <Samu> shall I PR it? 18:34:01 <Samu> but haven't yet taken it out of the other 18:37:07 <Samu> nvm, found a bug with lock middle tile... arggg 18:38:14 <Samu> deconstructing commits sucks :/ 18:39:36 <Samu> bug also present in 1.10.0-beta2, but I don't think you care much about it 18:41:26 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 18:42:23 <andythenorth> yo innit 18:46:36 <peter1138> Is it lunch time? 18:46:39 <peter1138> Dinner time 18:46:40 <peter1138> ? 18:46:46 <peter1138> Take-away time? 18:49:15 <andythenorth> Deliveroo or something 18:49:19 <andythenorth> hopefully 18:49:29 <andythenorth> then maybe tanks 18:49:31 <andythenorth> or ottd 18:49:39 <andythenorth> I have played a *lot* of OpenTTD recently 18:50:17 <andythenorth> helpfully MMORG tanks Blitz games were completely unusable recently due to events sucking in terrible clueless players 18:50:41 <andythenorth> my 60% WR dropped to 45% or something, so I stopped playing 18:51:22 <andythenorth> hmm 5 out of 6 of pikka's AIs have crashed :) 19:05:19 <peter1138> I'm having grilled chicken chipolatas, grilled vegetables and stirfried veggies too. 19:05:25 <peter1138> Such a feast :D 19:17:59 *** Wolf01 has joined #openttd 19:26:26 *** Fahrradkette has quit IRC 19:30:36 * andythenorth orders curry 19:37:41 <frosch123> which colour? 3cc? 19:39:26 <andythenorth> 2CC 19:39:32 <andythenorth> red and white 19:40:27 <frosch123> sounds familar 19:43:57 <Samu> i'm unsure if this is a bug 19:43:59 <Samu> Demolishing a lock built on a river with rocky land does not restore the river 19:45:41 <Samu> for me it's a bug 19:49:08 <andythenorth> rivers pretty much are a bug :) 19:51:50 <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick opened issue #7944: Demolishing a lock built on a river with rocky land does not restore the river https://git.io/JvT9g 19:53:34 <crazystacy> hm. maybe i'll develop an AI of my own 19:56:32 <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick opened issue #7945: Building docks does not account the cost of clearing the sloped tile https://git.io/JvT9H 20:04:30 <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick opened pull request #7946: Fix #7944: Demolishing locks built on rivers didn't always restore the river https://git.io/JvTHm 20:09:21 <andythenorth> Horse 91% 20:09:29 <andythenorth> just 40 trains to draw :P 20:10:43 <Samu> docks have more problems... 20:11:11 <nielsm> but can we get ducks in the game? 20:11:26 <Samu> i can place a buoy on top of rock land 20:11:27 *** Wormnest has quit IRC 20:11:39 <Samu> i can place ship depot, lock, but not dock 20:12:55 <andythenorth> nielsm: considered this https://media.gettyimages.com/photos/giant-yellow-vinyl-duck-joins-sailing-ships-and-motorboats-during-the-picture-id1031683492 20:13:23 <andythenorth> I think we're waiting to see if peter1138 finds his newgrf ducks patch 20:13:26 <andythenorth> it got lost 20:15:04 <peter1138> No it didn't. 20:15:18 <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick opened pull request #7947: Fix #7945: Add cost of clearing the sloped tile when placing a dock https://git.io/JvTH0 20:15:36 <andythenorth> newgrf ducks! 20:15:39 <andythenorth> hurrah 20:15:50 <crazystacy> is there a lame "huge coal train" AI? 20:15:51 <frosch123> boo ducks. we need amphibians 20:16:09 * peter1138 tries to not eat 20:16:15 <andythenorth> what's that idea about everything is a roadtype? 20:16:17 <nielsm> can we have newgrf disasters and make a bunch of reskins of the submarine? 20:16:50 * andythenorth considers decrementing dredging site production for every depth level 20:16:54 <andythenorth> cycle time :P 20:17:09 <frosch123> nielsm: NewNessie? 20:18:01 <andythenorth> now that water improvements are all solved.... 20:18:08 <andythenorth> I was thinking about breakdowns 20:18:23 <andythenorth> frosch123 makes me feel very guilty about turning breakdowns off :P 20:18:46 <frosch123> harsh original gameplay :) 20:19:39 <andythenorth> I should use them, they would maybe offer more texture to replacing vehicles 20:19:41 <nielsm> let's bring back the industry-randomly-announces-closure disaster 20:19:49 <andythenorth> but until end of life, it's so trivial to fix reliability :P 20:19:52 <andythenorth> just use force-depots 20:20:32 <hythlodaeus> imagine a World War disaster 20:20:45 <hythlodaeus> bombers taking down your train lines and such 20:21:04 <frosch123> hythlodaeus: you can trigger that by entering "restart" in the console 20:21:21 <Samu> crap that was a bad fix 20:21:28 <andythenorth> I miss subsidence 20:21:30 <andythenorth> I don't really 20:21:41 <nielsm> just make disasters triggerable by GS, there are a bunch of bombers and such in already 20:21:51 <peter1138> "just" :-) 20:21:53 *** y2kboy23 has quit IRC 20:22:30 <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick updated pull request #7947: Fix #7945: Add cost of clearing the sloped tile when placing a dock https://git.io/JvTH0 20:22:31 <Samu> fixed the fix 20:23:53 *** y2kboy23 has joined #openttd 20:26:53 <Wolf01> Eddi|zuHause: https://www.windowscentral.com/nvidia-lowers-price-rtx-2060-down-299 20:28:05 <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick updated pull request #7937: Build on competitor canal https://git.io/JvUIQ 20:29:11 <Samu> oh crap, i forgot about regression 20:32:33 <Samu> https://dev.azure.com/openttd/OpenTTD/_build/results?buildId=5289&view=logs&j=4f922444-fdfe-5dcf-b824-02f86439ef14&t=4c4abf72-efdc-56c9-eda1-40e8147e4c4d&l=613 20:32:44 <Samu> exactly the cost difference that wasn't accounted for 20:33:32 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 20:34:19 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 20:36:19 <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick updated pull request #7947: Fix #7945: Add cost of clearing the sloped tile when placing a dock https://git.io/JvTH0 20:41:54 <frosch123> the "screenshots" in this week's fff are filled with eastereggs 20:58:05 <Samu> I can't fix something without breaking the other :( 20:58:30 <Samu> so, i fixed dock clearing costs, now I have another change which permits docks to be placed on rocky water, by clearing it 20:58:47 <Samu> but those costs aren't accounted for 20:59:02 <Samu> do i make a separate PR or can I add up to that PR? 21:04:11 *** crazystacy has quit IRC 21:06:05 <andythenorth> is cat? 21:06:44 <Samu> i really suck at making separate PRs 21:06:51 <Samu> that's why I make everything 1 commit 21:08:19 <Samu> here goes nothing 21:09:52 <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick updated pull request #7947: Fix #7945: Add cost of clearing the sloped tile when placing a dock https://git.io/JvTH0 21:09:58 <Samu> I hope you understand me 21:11:34 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 21:12:45 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 21:14:54 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 21:18:55 *** Flygon has joined #openttd 21:23:37 *** Eddi|zuHause2 has joined #openttd 21:24:36 *** Borg has quit IRC 21:28:21 *** Eddi|zuHause has quit IRC 21:32:08 *** Eddi|zuHause2 is now known as Eddi|zuHause 21:32:47 *** frosch123 has quit IRC 21:33:31 <Eddi|zuHause> Wolf01: i don't think that is anything i need right now 21:36:18 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 21:59:54 *** crazystacy has joined #openttd 22:17:51 <peter1138> OpenTTD 20200115-master-g3b177af826 eh? 22:18:16 <andythenorth> the best version 22:28:28 <peter1138> newgrf-docks? 22:28:49 *** crazystacy has quit IRC 22:30:43 <peter1138> K, too much work :p 22:37:09 <andythenorth> :| 22:38:18 *** supermop_work has quit IRC 22:52:11 *** nielsm has quit IRC 23:00:03 *** andythenorth has left #openttd 23:07:36 *** crazystacy has joined #openttd 23:07:44 <crazystacy> the openttd ai api is decidedly wonky 23:07:47 <crazystacy> the site i mean 23:08:33 <glx> blame doxygen ;) 23:09:02 <crazystacy> >:( 23:09:12 <crazystacy> i'll doxx him 23:09:35 <crazystacy> this is where he lives: https://docs.openttd.org/ai-api/annotated.html 23:09:42 <Eddi|zuHause> why did i not play baba is you before? 23:09:53 <Eddi|zuHause> it's been in my steam suggestions for ages 23:11:41 *** Samu has quit IRC 23:15:32 <crazystacy> tell me about it 23:15:57 *** hythlodaeus has quit IRC 23:16:46 *** Wolf01 has quit IRC 23:37:10 *** Progman has quit IRC 23:40:51 *** crazystacy has quit IRC