Log for #openttd on 18th March 2020:
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08:22:02  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] serprinss commented on issue #5283: Scripts and pause mode
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14:11:31  <supermop_Home> yo
14:15:04  <andythenorth> yo
14:15:31  <andythenorth> supermop_Home: which continent are you on?
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14:19:38  <supermop_Home> manhattan
14:23:42  <andythenorth> what's the go?
14:27:13  <Wolf01> It seem that here you can't buy stuff which is not food, if you need a frying pan, shampoo/soap, pencils and notebooks for the children for the homeworks, you can't purchase it, they block you at the checkout... but I would like to verify that
14:27:49  <andythenorth> sounds possible
14:27:56  <supermop_Home> here you can still buy whatever, if the store is still open.. but many are not
14:28:00  <andythenorth> but also sounds like a rumour that would spread very convincingly
14:28:06  <Wolf01> They are playing with fire
14:28:19  <supermop_Home> many restaurants and cafes are open, but only for delivery or take out
14:28:38  <Wolf01> Here only for house delivery
14:29:02  <andythenorth> there was a brief twitter panic about amazon stopping orders yesterday
14:29:04  <andythenorth> not the truth
14:29:12  <LordAro> Wolf01: why would they block non-food items?
14:29:13  <supermop_Home> sunday and Monday there were still many people out and about (much less than usual but more than I expected)
14:29:38  <Wolf01> <LordAro> Wolf01: why would they block non-food items? <- to stop idiots going to buy playstations at the stores
14:29:46  <supermop_Home> most larger chain cafes and shops are closed
14:30:07  <supermop_Home> smaller independent ones seem more likely to try to stay open
14:30:09  <Wolf01> Back to work
14:30:38  <LordAro> Wolf01: well within reason, sure
14:30:46  <LordAro> but why not let people buy something to give them something to do?
14:32:58  <Wolf01> It may be a rumour, but newspapers are talking about it, also giving out the names of the stores which did it
14:34:04  <Wolf01> Maybe some guy took it too much literally... no soap, how do I wash hands? With alcohol and fire?
14:40:24  <supermop_Home> now I've ended up being basically on video calls all day instead of being able to get any work done
14:57:27  <andythenorth> you and all of the rest of the world
14:57:35  <andythenorth> people celebrated for 2 days how few meetings there would be
14:57:39  <andythenorth> so all the waste would be gone
14:57:45  <andythenorth> now we're all on the phone all day
15:04:07  <supermop_Home> they didn't let me wfh til yesterday
15:04:18  <supermop_Home> I think as they didn't trust us to keep working
15:04:25  <andythenorth> so lolz
15:04:35  <andythenorth> obviously people give less performance of working when at home
15:04:41  <andythenorth> does less work happen though?
15:04:54  <supermop_Home> and clearly they still don't as anything that used to be a quick check on slack is now a 10-30 min video call
15:05:08  <andythenorth> it's just easier to keep talking eh
15:05:20  <andythenorth> ambulance chasing is out in force
15:05:32  <andythenorth> I am being advertised "spy on your staff without them knowing" tools
15:06:19  <supermop_Home> also someone is connecting to this bluejeans call via remote desktop connection to their computer at the office....
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15:50:52  <supermop_Home> as soon as I get off this call I think I'll go for a walk
16:05:47  <andythenorth> exercise is a thing
16:05:55  <andythenorth> no walking in Italy, Spain, France
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17:07:12  <andythenorth> Wolf01: ?
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17:35:53  <Wolf01> Ok, work done for today
17:36:12  <Wolf01> andythenorth, yes, they are fantastic
17:38:21  <Wolf01> The problem is that the water traffic moves a lot of sediment, and the water is shallow in the city, it's not how they show you in movies where you can fit a submarine, if there is 1.5mt is already fine
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17:56:56  <andythenorth> oof the Italy CFR is really horrible Wolf01 :(
17:57:00  <andythenorth> it's nearly 10%
17:57:49  <milek7> or infections are underestimated?
18:07:19  <SpComb> CFR is the number that only accounts for diagnosed cases
18:07:24  <SpComb> vs IFR
18:07:57  <andythenorth> yes
18:08:11  <andythenorth> it's absolutely contextual
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18:12:22  <Wolf01> Infections are underestimated.
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18:16:04  <Wolf01> Oh nice, 35k cases today, yesterday they were 28k
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18:45:49  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] DorpsGek pushed 1 commits to master
18:45:49  <DorpsGek_III_>   - Update: Translations from eints (by translators)
18:47:57  * andythenorth hopes an antibody test becomes possible in mass supply
18:48:32  <andythenorth> I know a significant number of people who had the definitive covid symptoms from mid-Jan onwards
18:48:51  <andythenorth> but those symptoms also overlap with a few other common winter viruses that we don't usually bother much about
18:51:48  <TrueBrain> andythenorth: does it really matter? I get why it can be a bit obsessive to know if you have/had it or not, but .. does it really matter?
18:51:53  <andythenorth> yes
18:52:07  <andythenorth> it affects who can care for the vulnerable etc
18:52:16  <andythenorth> I know multiple doctors already self-isolating
18:52:25  <andythenorth> but it might be just for a cold
18:52:26  <TrueBrain> you said "mass supply"
18:52:30  <TrueBrain> that is not needed to be able to do that ;)
18:52:57  <andythenorth> semantics of 'mass'
18:53:02  <andythenorth> I don't mean the whole population
18:53:11  <andythenorth> but tens and tens of thousands
18:53:13  <TrueBrain> fair enough; it sounded like you wanted everyone to be able to test himself
18:53:26  <andythenorth> no that's probably not much value
18:53:45  <glx> there's no mass testing here, only people with symptoms are tested
18:53:48  <andythenorth> but healthcare, social care, teachers, pharmacists etc
18:53:58  <andythenorth> the antibody test is to find out who has already had it
18:54:22  <andythenorth> therefore, based on currently available evidence, is unlikely to get it again soon
18:54:27  <TrueBrain> glx: same here, and even than only people who have severe symptons
18:54:29  <andythenorth> therefore isn't transmitting it
18:54:42  <glx> and it's said most have it without symptoms at all
18:55:05  <andythenorth> this isn't about specifically covid
18:55:07  <glx> TrueBrain: yes those already in the hospital due to the severity
18:55:21  <andythenorth> it's about all the cancer patients, heart patients etc who will die as a side effect
18:55:24  <TrueBrain> yeah, exactly glx :)
18:55:30  <andythenorth> due to lack of care
18:55:46  <andythenorth> anyway, it's not yet a thing so eh :P
18:56:00  <TrueBrain> but I have to say, all this covid left,covid right, it is starting to get old that every conversation is about covid
18:56:08  <TrueBrain> and, maybe more annoying, everyone has become a doctor
18:56:09  <glx> so the ratio death/positive may seem high, but most positive are indeed not detected
18:56:55  <frosch123> TrueBrain: at most 50% of talk is abotu covid, the other 50% is about how to increase the vpn bandwidth or how to better utiliize it
18:56:57  <TrueBrain> today our gov had a long debate about the actions we are taking
18:57:15  <glx> you're not confined yet ?
18:57:19  <andythenorth> I have tried having covid free days, but tbh, it's a major societal change and we do kind of talk about that
18:57:23  <TrueBrain> frosch123: ugh, don't get me started on the last one ... running Teams with your whole company over a single VPN is .. not fun :P
18:57:27  <andythenorth> a year of quarantine is very long
18:57:43  <andythenorth> hmm social distancing, not quarantine, wrong word
18:57:49  <SpComb> I've noticed that rationing your news consumption is beneficial for your mental health :)
18:58:07  <TrueBrain> SpComb: ack
18:58:11  <andythenorth> the headline fonts generally got smaller
18:58:27  <frosch123> irc font is always same size
18:58:58  <TrueBrain> not if you use Riot client :P
18:59:01  <andythenorth> mine is monospace with formatting stripped
18:59:04  <andythenorth> old skool
18:59:10  <TrueBrain> # This looks bigger
18:59:55  <andythenorth> wonder how much of a scam this is?
19:00:12  <SpComb> when I started I wasn't happy with how difficult our VPN setup was to manage, because it doesn't configure any default route, only specific addresses. Now I'm happy, no VPN issues at work so far :)
19:00:13  <TrueBrain> without opening the link, on a scale from 1 to 10? about a 20
19:00:26  <TrueBrain> SpComb: lucky you!
19:00:26  <andythenorth> £150 bargain price, 15 min result
19:00:40  <glx> only 15 minutes for the result ?
19:00:41  <TrueBrain> you have to wonder ... if it takes 2 days for official tests ....
19:00:55  <glx> 4-5 hours here
19:01:43  <SpComb> TrueBrain: having spent the time to setup AWS Global Accelerator etc and file tickets for each individual VIP address to route, yes, it was worth the time :)
19:01:57  <TrueBrain> nice :D
19:02:04  <glx> with PCR in dedicated labs
19:27:42  <Samu> got a crash in 1.10.0-RC1
19:27:59  <Samu> ---------------------------
19:27:59  <Samu> Error!
19:27:59  <Samu> ---------------------------
19:27:59  <Samu> Assertion failed at line 302 of d:\a\s\src\economy.cpp: old_owner != _local_company
19:27:59  <Samu> ---------------------------
19:28:01  <Samu> OK
19:28:01  <Samu> ---------------------------
19:29:19  <TrueBrain> thank you for that spam; I will file it with the rest ;)
19:32:07  <DorpsGek_III_> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick opened issue #8037: Crash when Reloading AI in single player
19:34:10  <_dp_> Samu, wasn't that fixed recently?
19:34:45  <Samu> what was the other one, I forgot
19:34:59  <Samu> i think this is different, as it's in single player mode
19:35:13  <_dp_> try in master anyway
19:37:56  <supermop_Home> andythenorth someone got arrested at LAX trying to bring those in from the UK
19:38:20  <supermop_Home> customs at least believed them to be fake
19:39:32  <Samu> oww.. a visual studio update, this will take a while
19:39:35  <andythenorth> if I've read correctly it's a scam
19:40:01  <andythenorth> it relies on conflating 'Covid produces an IGG or IGM response' with 'IGG / IGM response means you have Covid'
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19:47:06  <Samu>
19:47:08  <Samu> hah
19:47:12  <Samu> there is no other company
19:47:29  <Samu> at least momentaneously
19:47:37  <Samu> which is enough to trigger the assert
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20:21:11  <Samu> interesting, a spectator slot in single player would solve the problem :p
20:29:38  <Samu> planning ahead for unprofitable routes with infrastructure maintenance costs isn't an easy task :(
20:29:43  <Samu> for airports
20:30:37  <Samu> at least I learned something
20:30:53  <Samu> helicopters are profitable and easy to do
20:31:07  <Samu> the other airports, not so quite
20:31:37  <Samu> totally didn't expect that
20:32:43  <Samu> it also looks like faster planes are preferred
20:33:19  <Samu> than a large one with big capacity that travels half-loaded most of the time
20:33:41  <Samu> *points at Darwin 300
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20:34:30  <_dp_> Samu just don't send it half-loaded :p
20:34:32  <Samu> or, maybe my income formula is fooling me
20:35:03  <_dp_> A21 and darwin are best moneymakers
20:35:05  <_dp_> for air
20:36:25  <Samu> my formula so far has always picked darwin 300, dinger 200, and if neither exists, it's the darwin 600, bakewell lb-8
20:36:33  <Samu> the typical largest capacity available
20:37:08  <Samu> but with infrastructure maintenance costs, it goes on to pick yate haugan, or dinger 1000
20:37:56  <Samu> it's just that planning ahead is a whole mess of a code
20:38:44  <Samu> i'm still planning routes that are already unprofitable to begin with
20:38:54  <_dp_> and why is infra maintanance affecting plane choice?
20:39:21  <Samu> i am including these costs in the formula
20:39:38  <_dp_> even if you consider small/large planes maintanance is too insignificant
20:41:31  <Samu> small maps, like 256x256, only helicopters seem to profit
20:42:05  <Samu> the ai is unable to terraform for a good large airport spot
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20:42:40  <_dp_> oh, that... mb, planes need some distance indeed
20:42:53  <_dp_> though would probably be much better running rvs or trains than helis
20:43:14  <Samu> it's still possible, if i happen to find good enough places
20:43:30  <Samu> but it's usually routes that cross a corner of a map to another
20:43:41  <Samu> and yet it's still not profitable enough
20:52:20  <Samu> local income_max_speed = (primary_capacity * AICargo.GetCargoIncome(cargo, distance_max_speed * days / 1000, days) + secondary_capacity * AICargo.GetCargoIncome(Utils.getCargoId(AICargo.CC_MAIL), distance_broken_speed * days / 1000, days) - running_cost * days / 365) * multiplier;
20:52:53  <Samu> oh, that's actually wrong
20:53:54  <Samu> good thing that I copy pasted.. horizontal coding made it go unnoticed until now
20:54:07  <Samu> distance_broken_speed isn't supposed to be here
21:07:32  <nielsm> that's a good argument for breaking long lines up and having more intermediate variables :)
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21:14:53  <_dp_> that formula doesn't seem to take take off and landing into account
21:14:59  <_dp_> so basically worthless
21:17:56  <nielsm> that really makes a big difference for short distances especially, and also adds lots of downtime if one or more airpots are too busy
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21:46:44  <Samu> trying to improve
21:47:07  <Samu> local income_max_speed = (primary_capacity * AICargo.GetCargoIncome(cargo, distance_max_speed * days / 1000, days) + secondary_capacity * AICargo.GetCargoIncome(Utils.getCargoId(AICargo.CC_MAIL), distance_max_speed * days / 1000, days) - running_cost * days / 365 - 2 * infra_cost * 12 * days / 365 / max_count) * multiplier;
21:47:48  <Samu> this at least worked well for sampson u52 with high costs + infrastructure
21:47:55  <Samu> it deemed it unprofitable
21:48:08  <Samu> and it is
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21:51:23  <Samu> breakdowns are preventing cotswald lb-3 from being picked as profitable
21:51:35  <Samu> otherwise, it is profitable, let me just confirm
21:54:00  <Samu> arg... almost
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21:55:03  <Samu> [img][/img]
21:55:42  <Samu> it needed 10
21:55:51  <Samu> there was only money for 9
21:56:03  <Samu> also, more than 9 and airports would go overcapacity
21:56:15  <Samu> map too small perhaps, let me try a larger map
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22:11:24  <andythenorth> now is a nice time to remember that modern money is simply invented by lending it
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22:19:26  <andythenorth> 'oops'
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22:42:07  <Heiki> my favourite ‘oops’:
22:46:59  <glx> oups
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