Log for #openttd on 11th September 2020:
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02:43:38  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] James103 commented on issue #8215: Industry build cost does not take into account land clear costs
02:43:42  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] James103 closed issue #8215: Industry build cost does not take into account land clear costs
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09:26:07  <andythenorth> yo
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11:31:47  <FLHerne> andythenorth: What the heck was ?
11:33:14  <FLHerne> We already have shift-click to discover the precise cost of building something in particular circumstances
11:33:52  <FLHerne> If anyone cares about a 0.1% difference in cost, which apparently James103 does despite that being completely absurd
11:35:04  <_dp_> FLHerne, I don't think shift-click works for industries :p
11:35:56  <_dp_> or, well, it does but it just reports the funding price without land clear
11:36:28  <_dp_> and it's probably a pita to fix since it involves newgrfs
11:37:59  <FLHerne> _dp_: Industries don't currently have a land clearance cost
11:38:28  <FLHerne> andy was, if I understand, objecting to adding one because it wouldn't be shown
11:40:33  <_dp_> oh, right, I misread that bug
11:41:18  <_dp_> but, it will still be a royal pita to implement :p
11:59:30  <LordAro> indeed
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12:39:44  <andythenorth> FLHerne I am guessing that James is not neurotypical, might be inappropriate, but that's my guess
12:39:56  <andythenorth> I'm often tempted to reply 'wtf?' but I don't think that's helpful
12:40:44  <andythenorth> I think in my replies I was being a dick, and I should have been better BTH
12:40:48  <andythenorth> (TBH)
12:40:52  <andythenorth> not proud of those ones
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13:50:08  <andythenorth>
13:50:11  <andythenorth> The biggest issue, though, is the people, not the processes. The work is demanding, he said. “Debian is a bottomless pit of problems. It’s inherent in the work we do."
13:50:25  <andythenorth> replace Debian / OpenTTD? o_O
13:53:15  <LordAro> andythenorth: it's a constant OSS problem
13:53:20  <LordAro> as i'm sure you know
13:54:48  <andythenorth> Down and Out in the Magic Kingdom
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16:14:42  <andythenorth> yo entertain me
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16:22:40  <Eddi|zuHause> i'm pretty sure it's even worse in closed source project, just you'll never hear about those
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16:35:15  <andythenorth> it's the same bottomless pit of problems
16:35:23  <andythenorth> but it can be alleviated with money
16:35:37  <andythenorth> and at some point, you stop work
16:35:58  <andythenorth> OSS has this self-imposed obligation to keep going, beyond all reasonable obligation
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16:47:37  <Timberwolf> In the commercial world you need "enterprise" companies for that.
16:48:13  <andythenorth> or game dev
16:48:33  <andythenorth> or agency web dev
16:49:24  <Timberwolf> The record I saw personally was 3 years and about £3.6m on something which over its life had 24 customers... 22 of which were staff using an introductory "1p for a year" subscription.
16:50:36  <andythenorth> ouch
16:50:40  <Timberwolf> £280.20 of gross revenue, it was shut down after they put something like another £500k into it trying to get a 25th subscriber.
16:51:34  <andythenorth> I have definitely been involved in that kind of fallacy
16:51:47  <andythenorth> but with many fewer 0s on the end
16:51:59  <Timberwolf> Past a certain point you get taken over by sunk cost fallacy.
16:52:53  <_dp_> TrueBrain, is api server list not updated anymore? what should I use to get consistent data without having to make adjustments every time you switch versions back and forth?
16:52:55  <andythenorth> true sunk cost eventually becomes obvious
16:53:03  <andythenorth> zombie businesses are a killer though
16:53:10  <andythenorth> they're always just about to make money
16:53:17  <andythenorth> jam tomorrow
16:53:19  <Timberwolf> Yes, also been there :)
16:53:44  <andythenorth> they never quite do the decent thing and implode
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17:10:37  <SpComb> *g*
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17:40:12  <TrueBrain> _dp_: I rolled back the deployment of yesterday due to two critical bugs I couldn't resolve quickly. One I still don't know what is causing it, the other I don't have a clean solution for as of yet. Why the API still returns servers .. that is a third bug I guess :)
17:40:59  <TrueBrain> ah, no, I know why .. and it is because one of the two critical bugs :)
17:49:49  <TrueBrain> in ~10 minutes the API should be empty again :P (when ever the cleanup kicks in)
17:51:13  <TrueBrain> (and _dp_ , I have no clue what you mean with "every time you switch versions back and forth?" .. if you refer to the rollback, that is kinda a rude statement, so I am sure that is not what is meant :P)
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18:09:02  <_dp_> should I've added a smile? :p
18:09:08  <TrueBrain> clearly :)
18:09:28  <_dp_> whatever, don't mind me, I'm just a bit annoyed that stuff keeps breaking :p
18:09:55  <TrueBrain> tell me about it :(
18:12:02  <TrueBrain> but from the other side, realise I spent quiet a bit of free time in this, to find out it breaks in production .. ;)
18:42:20  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] standaniels commented on issue #8296: Non-latin text language not showing in mac os
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19:30:11  <TrueBrain> did I miss frosch again? Darn it :P My clients says poorly who joins and leaves
19:41:39  <TrueBrain> meh .. the issue is with master-server is that it is requesting game-info from a container (a new outgoing connection), and AWS ECS doesn't really support IPv6 yet. So I have 3 shitty choices: 1) use awsvpc, which means a redeployment will be difficult. 2) use net=host, which means a redeployment will be difficult. 3) make a "repeater" where all "game info" requests are sent to on an EC2 instance that does talk IPv6 over IPv4, which does the r
19:41:40  <TrueBrain> request, and let the container know the reply ..
19:41:47  <TrueBrain> 3) is easy, but really dirty ...
19:41:56  <TrueBrain> 1 and 2 are .. well, pretty sure that is not going to work
19:41:59  <TrueBrain> meh ...
19:45:15  <TrueBrain> guess for 3 I can use a SOCKS proxy ..
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19:54:52  <TrueBrain> that would be relative clean .. hmm .. worth testing tomorrow :)
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20:09:35  <andythenorth> life is dirty :P
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21:32:13  <andythenorth> bed
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21:58:20  <dwfreed> TrueBrain: just make sure your proxy is secure
21:58:44  <dwfreed> Don't want to be running an open proxy
22:20:13  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/bananas-api] FilmBoy84 commented on issue #59: Base-music tarballs created are incompatible with OpenTTD client
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22:52:42  * _dp_ error: ‘pain’ is not a member of ‘std’; did you mean ‘pair’?
22:57:52  <dwfreed> that's totally wrong :D
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