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00:00:11 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 00:01:12 *** Flygon has joined #openttd 00:41:16 *** Progman has quit IRC 01:21:31 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC 04:11:20 *** glx has quit IRC 06:56:21 *** longtomjr has joined #openttd 07:32:08 <longtomjr> Oooh in a hot country is out for FIRS4. Might be time for another africa-themed multiplayer game in a bit 07:40:09 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 07:41:17 <longtomjr> andythenorth, having a look at FIRS 4 alpha 4 now. A lot of exciting changes :) 07:41:34 <andythenorth> have you played previous alphas? o_O 07:42:07 <longtomjr> Played alpha 3 07:42:29 <longtomjr> Just read the changelog for alpha 4, super happy about in a hot country being back 07:43:25 <longtomjr> From recent games, my in a hot country game I ran were definately one of my favorites. 07:44:45 <longtomjr> I really like the addition of only spawning primary industries during the game, and not secondaries. 07:47:00 <longtomjr> also, I have an IH request if you are taking those (is there a box I missed on the way in?). Having ng torpedo wagons would be nice, since I tend to use ng for my factory complexes as a bit of a veriaty. 07:48:41 <longtomjr> I don't know how historically accurate it is, I don't think I have seen one in South Africa ever. 07:48:57 <longtomjr> And we tend to export most of our iron and manganese at this point 07:49:34 <longtomjr> Japan might have some 07:56:35 <longtomjr> andythenorth, there seems to be some glich with the coke oven 07:56:43 <longtomjr> sprite wise 07:56:46 <andythenorth> graphical? 07:56:50 <andythenorth> flickering sprite? 07:56:50 <longtomjr> yep 07:56:53 <longtomjr> yep 07:56:58 <andythenorth> yup, it's annoying 07:57:12 <longtomjr> so known issue? 07:57:21 <andythenorth> unfortunately :| 07:57:30 <longtomjr> is it fixable? 07:57:36 <longtomjr> or is it an ottd issue? 07:57:47 <andythenorth> it's probably something I've done wrong 07:57:57 <andythenorth> I don't really understand sprite sorting, it just mostly works 07:58:05 <andythenorth> when it doesn't I have no clue why :) 07:58:47 <longtomjr> Is the coke oven one you made larger? 08:02:28 <andythenorth> yes 08:02:39 * andythenorth looking for narrow gauge bottle cars 08:04:18 <longtomjr> I also had a look, but i am certain you have better resources for this 08:04:55 <andythenorth> doesn't need to be realistic 08:05:16 <longtomjr> found one 08:05:23 <longtomjr> https://a3.cdn.japantravel.com/photo/28288-144773/1000/fukuoka-higashida-blast-furnace-144773.jpg 08:07:03 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 08:10:41 *** nielsm has joined #openttd 08:13:34 <andythenorth> the primary issue is that I will have to rework the current sprite for size :P 08:15:59 <longtomjr> Odd, the ng ladle wagon looks like the same size, or even bigger (but that is probably the smaller rail playing tricks on my midn) 08:16:25 <andythenorth> it's moved down by 1 pixel 08:16:35 <andythenorth> so the ladle looks larger relative to wheels 08:17:06 <longtomjr> I eaaah ok 08:17:14 <longtomjr> *aah 08:17:23 <andythenorth> do you want the appearance of the bottle car, or just a dedicated pig iron wagon? 08:18:02 <longtomjr> I like the idea of transporting molten metal between the different part of my industrial complex. 08:18:08 <longtomjr> So that is about it. 08:18:21 <longtomjr> I would even be ok if the ladle wagon can just refit to pig iron 08:18:27 <longtomjr> since that makes sense for small distances 08:18:46 <longtomjr> (I think, I am not an expert on any of this) 08:19:53 <longtomjr> But I mean it is really not a big deal. Currently you can just work around it if you have a dual guage track. So you build a dual guage depot, and then just use ng trakcs 08:19:59 <longtomjr> and the pig iron wagon will work 08:21:20 <longtomjr> but this is obviously a a nice-to-have and were just a suggestion :) 08:31:44 <andythenorth> oh is there a grf with dual gauge now? 08:32:23 <longtomjr> U&Rermm 2 has a dual guage depot, don't know about other options 08:33:44 <andythenorth> might do a hot ingot car http://www.trainweb.org/pbne/images/ng/120.jpg 08:34:04 <longtomjr> Ooooh 08:34:14 <andythenorth> or I might do the torpedo 08:34:15 <andythenorth> or both 08:34:20 <andythenorth> it's been on my list for a while 08:34:37 *** jottyfan has joined #openttd 08:34:54 <longtomjr> Ah ok, will be fun to have options :) 08:35:42 <longtomjr> btw, I am getting an error when trying to make IH locally "AttributeError: 'list' object has no attribute 'pipeline'" 08:36:04 <longtomjr> in render_graphics.py 08:37:37 *** iSoSyS has joined #openttd 08:39:02 *** jottyfan has quit IRC 08:39:54 <longtomjr> whmm what am I missing 08:44:30 <longtomjr> andythenorth, it seems like you are passing in the list that you are looping over, instead of the variable assigned in the loop in line 82 of render_graphics.py 08:45:33 <longtomjr> yep, changing that fixed the build step 08:45:49 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 08:47:07 <andythenorth> there's a known current bug 08:47:28 <andythenorth> if you're using the makefile, set the var for the number of pool workers 08:47:37 <andythenorth> I use 'PW=16' 08:48:11 <longtomjr> I am not a walrus lol 08:48:23 <andythenorth> can't even remember what that's for :P 08:48:29 <andythenorth> mostly I remove outdated error messages 08:49:03 <longtomjr> hmm, getting an nmlc error now 08:49:11 <longtomjr> `nmlc ERROR: "generated/iron-horse.nml", line 4528: Switch-block requires 4 parameters, encountered 5` 08:49:36 <longtomjr> were there an update 08:50:13 <longtomjr> I am on the latest release version. Are you using a later version from git? 08:52:11 <longtomjr> https://github.com/OpenTTD/nml/commit/f2cab72c0059570aecc3a648690f0686b6bee88f 08:52:41 <andythenorth> I have a patched version, I was testing PRs 08:52:44 <andythenorth> I should update 08:53:18 <longtomjr> Aaah ok ,I think that commit that I linked can be the one that adds the extra switch params 08:53:46 <longtomjr> Sorry for bothering with this, just wanted to play around and look at the IH code. 08:56:29 <andythenorth> nah it's fine 09:12:31 *** Progman has joined #openttd 09:24:34 *** Gustavo6046 has quit IRC 09:24:39 *** Gustavo6046 has joined #openttd 09:34:44 <TrueBrain> wow, CloudFlare already replied .. in fact, they replied within 2 hours 09:34:46 <TrueBrain> impressive 09:34:54 <TrueBrain> but no, we cannot afford CloudFlare doing our binary distribution :P 09:35:05 <LordAro> a shame :p 09:35:33 <LordAro> TrueBrain: i "finished" the ansible thing btw 09:35:50 <TrueBrain> can you test it out somewhere? 09:38:25 <LordAro> hmm 09:39:22 <LordAro> not easily 09:39:50 <TrueBrain> so how do you know it works? :P 09:40:01 <TrueBrain> I will see if we can get the VPSes :) 09:40:11 <LordAro> because it looks fine :p 09:40:30 <TrueBrain> ...... rriiiggghhttt .. I don't know a lot about Ansible, but I know that isn't how it works :D 09:40:34 <TrueBrain> :P 09:40:41 <TrueBrain> setup a VM and provision that? 09:40:42 <LordAro> i have no doubt there will be additional tweaks required, hence '"finished"' ;p 09:40:49 <TrueBrain> but we can also wait for the VPSes, and "test it live" :) 09:45:14 <TrueBrain> I sent a mail to the mister in charge to rent those 2 VPSes :) 09:47:58 <TrueBrain> LordAro: did you add the proxy_pass to it already? 09:48:51 <LordAro> i didn't, what was that needed for? 09:49:00 <TrueBrain> did you miss a part of the conversation yesterday? :P 09:49:02 <LordAro> i thought this was pure file serving 09:49:07 <LordAro> apparently! 09:49:19 <TrueBrain> we decided yesterday that it would be a lot easier if these nginx VPSes are cache proxies 09:49:22 <TrueBrain> and fetch their data from AWS 09:49:25 <TrueBrain> and cache it for .. a long time 09:49:35 <TrueBrain> as that means we don't have to actively push data to these VPSes 09:49:53 <TrueBrain> I linked example configuration for that 09:49:53 <LordAro> oh i see 09:50:01 <TrueBrain> then you complained your regex would be for nothing 09:50:15 <TrueBrain> but it isn't 09:50:23 <TrueBrain> as you should rewrite before doing the proxy_pass 09:50:56 <TrueBrain> it is a bit more complex configuration, but one which you can test locally :) 09:51:21 <TrueBrain> I test nginx config via a Docker :) 09:52:38 <LordAro> i'd have to reboot into linux though :p 09:52:46 <TrueBrain> WSL2! 09:53:01 <LordAro> and i need to do various disk shuffling before i can use it sanely 09:53:18 <TrueBrain> well, you can wait for the VPSes to be provisioned of course 09:54:02 <TrueBrain> right, bringing the wiki live was the next task on the list ... lets see ... 09:54:45 <TrueBrain> I think we did everything we could to prepare .. so it is now basically flipping the switch ... 09:54:56 <TrueBrain> which does require some reprovisioning of certificates, but that will be fine 09:58:33 <TrueBrain> what always the interesting thing is about changing domains with CDK and AWS .. you get these conflicts 09:58:46 <TrueBrain> one part generates the listener with the right domain etc, and outputs what he is called 09:58:54 <TrueBrain> another part uses that name to provision the container to link to that 09:59:06 <TrueBrain> the problem is ... you cannot change the listener to another domain, as that changes the name, and the old name is in use 09:59:21 <TrueBrain> it becomes this infinite: I AM STUCK, situation 09:59:27 <TrueBrain> which kinda cracks me up :P 10:02:44 *** Flygon has quit IRC 10:11:00 <andythenorth> hmm 10:11:07 <andythenorth> newgrf ponies 10:11:17 <TrueBrain> hmmm ... ponies ..... 10:11:22 <andythenorth> could I have some random bits from the vehicle group? 10:11:32 <TrueBrain> 1011100011 10:11:35 <TrueBrain> there you go! 10:11:37 <andythenorth> thanks! 10:11:45 <TrueBrain> yw mate 10:11:48 <andythenorth> can you supply that to every player in every game? 10:11:53 <andythenorth> TB-as-a-service 10:11:59 <TrueBrain> I -could-, but I really do not want to :) 10:12:15 <andythenorth> we haven't broken enough newgrf stuff recently 10:12:48 <TrueBrain> every time I think about these things, so many cool things pop in my mind, what we could do with OpenTTD etc ... LALALALALALALAALALA, I have other things to do :P 10:13:08 <andythenorth> first we need to clone ourselves 10:13:15 <andythenorth> I have only 2x as many ideas as time 10:13:18 <andythenorth> but still 10:13:26 *** Wolf01 has joined #openttd 10:13:34 <TrueBrain> I still want to finish my SNES decompiler/emulator ... 10:13:39 <TrueBrain> haven't had time for that in months now 10:13:42 <TrueBrain> stupid AWS migration :P 10:13:55 <TrueBrain> why did I build my own wiki server? :D 10:13:56 <andythenorth> what we need is to print money and not have jobs 10:14:05 <andythenorth> how could we arrange that? 10:14:19 <TrueBrain> owh, ffs, deployment is failing because of more dependencies .. silly dependencies being silly 10:14:22 <TrueBrain> ugh .. euhmm ... 10:14:47 <TrueBrain> pre-checks didn't show me it would do this .. grrr 10:15:44 <TrueBrain> meh, I am just going to remove it then .. some downtime, but what-ever 10:19:10 <TrueBrain> some days I like 100% uptime, some days I just cannot be bothered :P 10:32:04 <andythenorth> longtomjr pushed a fix to the single-process rendering, thanks 10:34:47 <TrueBrain> https://wiki.openttd.org/en/ is live, depending on your DNS cache, it might take an hour before you can see that :P 10:36:05 <TrueBrain> so many 404s coming in :P 10:36:51 <TrueBrain> why do so many browsers hardcoded try /favicon.ico, instead of what is indicated on the page? 10:36:54 <TrueBrain> I don't get that ... 10:40:58 <longtomjr> Thanks andythenorth :) 10:41:45 <LordAro> TrueBrain: gist updated as requested 10:41:50 <LordAro> and completely untested, ofc 10:41:52 <LordAro> :p 10:42:06 <LordAro> stackoverflow says it should work 10:42:13 <TrueBrain> I assume the first "location" block is a typo? :) 10:42:27 <TrueBrain> URL is bananas.cdn.openttd.org btw 10:42:50 <LordAro> yes, because i didn't want to delete it while i was still modifying it :p 10:42:58 <TrueBrain> and you are missing the line that configured the cache 10:43:20 <LordAro> so i am 10:44:51 <TrueBrain> next up would be: how do we announce these proxy VPSes to the balancer ... 10:44:59 <TrueBrain> do we hard-code it? But what if they crash for what-ever reason? 10:45:06 <Wolf01> <TrueBrain> https://wiki.openttd.org/en/ is live <- nice :D BTW, it says I'm logged in as you 10:45:15 <TrueBrain> wuuttthhh? 10:45:20 <TrueBrain> euhmm ... lol? 10:45:46 <TrueBrain> that .. is not what it should say, ofc :D 10:45:58 <Wolf01> https://imgur.com/a/AB2yPfC 10:46:01 <TrueBrain> lol .. that page is cached .. how ... 10:46:05 <TrueBrain> I believe you, no worries :) 10:46:36 <TrueBrain> you aren't really logged in, so anything that requires logged in, will tell you to login 10:46:39 <TrueBrain> but .. that is not correct :D 10:46:48 <LordAro> haha 10:47:08 <LordAro> TrueBrain: gist fixed (for when you're not fighting caching issues) 10:47:32 <LordAro> can confirm Wolf01 10:47:49 <TrueBrain> nice catch Wolf01 :) 10:47:56 <reldred> Lol I've got it as well 10:48:01 <Wolf01> It happened with our institutional sites as well, they enabled caching to keep up with the requests and you were able to see the details of the last person which logged in before you 10:48:05 <TrueBrain> solution is simple: https://github.com/TrueBrain/TrueWiki/pull/82 10:48:50 <TrueBrain> LordAro: your comment about not logging 200s is a lie 10:48:56 <TrueBrain> that part only works if there really is something in front of it :D 10:49:09 <TrueBrain> if you enabled log-rotate, I would just log everything, tbh 10:49:19 <TrueBrain> inactive=60m should also be: inactive=1y 10:49:45 <reldred> Also that newgrf list needs some work, all my stuff is on bananas/github now 10:49:58 <LordAro> i just copied the comment from your original nginx conf 10:50:08 <TrueBrain> LordAro: yeah, but I wouldn't copy that whole block 10:50:13 <TrueBrain> why not log 200s on the VPSes 10:50:33 <TrueBrain> and I like the argument: I JUST COPIED IT! I HAVE NO BRAAIINNNZZZZ :P :P :P :D <3 <3 10:50:58 <TrueBrain> reldred: I suggest you hit that Login button and fix it ;) 10:51:58 <TrueBrain> LordAro: on AWS, there is first a loadbalancer, which logs everything, and then the containers; those containers, if they also log 200s, spams the logs, which are stored in AWS for debugging. That is a lot of noise. So there we disable 200s from the logs, as if we want to know the 200s, we can check with the load balancer 10:52:11 <TrueBrain> for these VPSes, there is nothing in front of them, so I guess storing them on disk is fine, as long as there is a log rotate ofc 10:52:17 <TrueBrain> for like, what, 90 days? 30 days? 10:52:18 <TrueBrain> what-ever 10:52:48 <TrueBrain> w00p, now it is LordAro that is logged in :P 10:52:53 <TrueBrain> depplooyyy quuiiccckkkeeerrrr 10:53:10 <LordAro> :D 10:53:58 <Wolf01> :D 10:54:00 <TrueBrain> there we go 10:54:06 <TrueBrain> I like how it is always something that breaks :P 10:54:16 <TrueBrain> but I absolutely love how easy this was to fix on production .. I mean, what, 5 minutes? 10:54:31 <TrueBrain> sorry, 10 10:55:00 <TrueBrain> I am happy you spotted it as soon as you did Wolf01 :) Otherwise it could have been hiding for a while :D 10:55:39 <LordAro> TrueBrain: fixored 10:56:14 <TrueBrain> looks good to me 10:56:30 <TrueBrain> so how are we going to announce these VPSes? 10:56:37 <TrueBrain> how do we know if they are online, basically 10:57:04 <TrueBrain> do we push or do we pull 10:57:11 <LordAro> `location = /status { return 200; }` ? 10:57:25 <TrueBrain> yeah, well, use /healthz , but yes :) 10:57:37 <TrueBrain> but we can also push 10:57:45 <TrueBrain> that the VPSes tell the balancer every 5 minutes: I AM HERE 10:57:50 <TrueBrain> possibly with a payload with some stats 10:58:22 <LordAro> could do, though that's more work :p 10:58:40 <Wolf01> That's like one of the first thing I do... check if forums etc use the same session of another user, the support forum of the development tool we use at work used to append the session string parameter to the urls, so when you wanted to link to another topic you had to remove it manually or other users were able to switch user after they clicked on you link... luckily thei fixed it after one 10:58:40 <Wolf01> user started to post contents like "[user A] hello, I'm user B, I clicked on a user A link and now I'm him" 10:58:46 <TrueBrain> LordAro: more work for who, is the question ;) 10:59:10 <TrueBrain> Wolf01: lol :) 10:59:26 <TrueBrain> LordAro: one of the two sides has to get the status of the other side, so there is some work involved no matter what 10:59:37 <TrueBrain> or we can say: WE TRUST THE VPSES ARE ALWAYS UP :D 11:00:21 <TrueBrain> ideally, what frosch123 mentioned, we would like to be informed when a VPS is down 11:00:23 <TrueBrain> which can be done via Sentry 11:00:35 <TrueBrain> but that means we have to send stats to Sentry 11:01:11 <TrueBrain> and this is why pushing can be useful, as that can include some metrics of the VPS 11:01:19 <LordAro> i would think it would much easier to get the bananas-server to do: `for server in fileservers: if server.get("/healthz"): return server.get(actualfilepath)` 11:01:24 <TrueBrain> but the free version of nginx has poor status-information 11:01:41 <TrueBrain> LordAro: we are NOT going to do that for EVERY request :P 11:01:57 <TrueBrain> you want to do health-checks every N seconds 11:02:12 <LordAro> :p 11:02:14 <TrueBrain> it would kill the balancer otherwise 11:02:18 <LordAro> i guess that is a bit much 11:02:27 * LordAro has no experience with distributed systems 11:02:39 <TrueBrain> the problem with your solution is, that adding/removing VPSes means a configuration change of the balancer 11:02:45 <TrueBrain> with pushing, it will be dynamic 11:02:50 <LordAro> true 11:02:52 <TrueBrain> (if a VPS announces itself, it is there) 11:03:02 <TrueBrain> there are pros and cons to all of this btw, there is no "right way" 11:03:26 <TrueBrain> but decoupled systems are easier to maintain, in general 11:03:27 <LordAro> ofc 11:03:39 <TrueBrain> as, if you want to upgrade one of the VPSes, you can just do that 11:04:32 <TrueBrain> but okay, for a v1 of this, we can indeed hardcode the URLs in the balancer (well, via configuration, but it would require a redeployment to change) 11:04:42 <TrueBrain> and query every N seconds if they are still there 11:04:57 <TrueBrain> I am however wondering how much work the other way around is 11:05:08 <TrueBrain> it would require a Python script on the VPS on a crontab 11:05:12 <TrueBrain> which first checks if the nginx is alive 11:05:20 <TrueBrain> then call the balancer with a secret telling: HI! 11:05:40 <TrueBrain> basically, you reverse the trust 11:09:34 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/aws-infra] TrueBrain pushed 4 commits to master https://git.io/Jk3R0 11:09:35 <DorpsGek_III> - Add: remove the "aws.openttd.org" domain alias (by TrueBrain) 11:09:36 <DorpsGek_III> - Fix: remove AWSALB cookie from our traffic (by TrueBrain) 11:09:37 <DorpsGek_III> - Add: run wiki on ECS for both production and staging (by TrueBrain) 11:09:38 <DorpsGek_III> - Add: scale up our ECS cluster to 4 nodes, as we are out of memory (by TrueBrain) 11:10:44 <LordAro> TrueBrain: a couple of lines with requests, i think? 11:11:04 <TrueBrain> it sounds trivial to write 11:11:09 <TrueBrain> I just wonder if it is a good idea :D 11:11:32 <LordAro> if requests.get(localhost/healthz): requests.post(bananas.openttd.org/update_fileserver, some_secret_here) 11:11:46 <TrueBrain> it does need to tell the URL it is on too 11:12:00 <LordAro> if requests.get(localhost/healthz): requests.post(bananas.openttd.org/update_fileserver, my_hostname, some_secret_here) 11:12:04 <LordAro> :p 11:12:22 <LordAro> tricky bit (to me) is getting the secret right 11:13:00 <andythenorth> oh Apple silicon support :o https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/8340 11:13:17 <TrueBrain> andythenorth: well, the lack thereof, is the conclusion :P 11:13:18 <andythenorth> should I buy an AS thing? 11:14:08 <andythenorth> hmm 11:14:25 <TrueBrain> LordAro: what I like about that solution, that if you want to do maintenance on a VPS, you disable that cronjob for a few minutes 11:14:29 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro commented on pull request #8340: Draft: Feature: Create Universal (x86_64 + Apple Silicon) build on macOS https://git.io/Jk3Rx 11:14:32 <TrueBrain> meaning the balancer will no longer direct traffic to it 11:14:59 <andythenorth> the raw geekbench numbers on Apple silicon are high 11:15:09 <andythenorth> maybe Mac laptops will stop being achingly horribly slow 11:15:18 <TrueBrain> LordAro: I like how your comment also announced our ticket on their tracker :D 11:15:25 <LordAro> ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ 11:15:29 <andythenorth> incentive :P 11:15:32 <TrueBrain> :D 11:15:34 <LordAro> exactly! 11:15:49 <TrueBrain> so how to deal with secrets .. hmm ... 11:16:21 <andythenorth> my kids' £400 2016 iPads substantially outperform my £2500 i9 Mac 11:16:26 <andythenorth> oof 11:16:31 <andythenorth> Apple laptops are crap 11:17:01 <andythenorth> as per all those issues we have about OpenTTD mac performance 11:17:05 <LordAro> that is... surprising 11:17:11 <TrueBrain> LordAro: guess you have to look into Ansible Vault :P 11:17:28 <andythenorth> we should get Apple to focus on OpenTTD benchmarks TBH 11:17:33 <andythenorth> maybe I will email them 11:17:59 <LordAro> TrueBrain: quite likely! 11:18:18 <TrueBrain> is that doable? As I agree with you that the most complex part of this idea is how to share the secret 11:18:22 <LordAro> we just put passwords into the config files in ansible at work, as it's all fully internal :p 11:18:33 <TrueBrain> .... don't ..... 11:18:37 <TrueBrain> I am going to pretend I did not read that 11:18:52 <LordAro> heh 11:18:58 <TrueBrain> but otherwise we can just do it the hard-coded way 11:19:04 <TrueBrain> I mean .. that would be fine for now too 11:20:27 * LordAro does some ansible-vault reading 11:20:44 <TrueBrain> wow ... our request/sec doubled, with the switch of wiki :P 11:21:57 <TrueBrain> might be interesting to see if we hit AWS ALB limits :P 11:22:12 <TrueBrain> it is funny .. all the domains are in a single list on the ALB, and it triest to match them from top to bottom 11:22:17 <TrueBrain> I add new services at the bottom, because that is easier 11:22:26 <TrueBrain> meaning 7 rules are evaluated before wiki is considered 11:22:30 <TrueBrain> I... might want to change that :D 11:23:13 <LordAro> ALB? 11:23:23 *** iSoSyS has quit IRC 11:23:36 <TrueBrain> Application Load Balancer 11:29:40 <TrueBrain> our main website is 60% of the requests compared to the wiki 11:31:04 <TrueBrain> it is like: 1000 / 680 / 150 / 23 requests per 5 minutes for wiki / www / eints / binaries 11:31:05 <TrueBrain> :D 11:31:29 <TrueBrain> (CDN information is not part of the same graph, so I don't know that) 11:32:37 <TrueBrain> and other than a lot of people getting 404s, it seems stable, the wiki 11:34:35 <LordAro> oof 11:34:48 <TrueBrain> takes a bit of time for search engines to update :) 11:34:51 <TrueBrain> not something we can help/fix 11:35:25 <LordAro> indeed 11:35:26 <TrueBrain> hmm .. pretty sure my caching is too aggressive ... Categories and Folders are cached, but never invalidated ... :P 11:45:24 <LordAro> TrueBrain: i wrote some more things in the gist 11:45:45 <LordAro> i should point out that i am being really bad - every single bit of this has been written in the github web interface 11:45:55 <LordAro> not even slightly been checked for syntax, other than using the highlighting :p 11:51:42 <TrueBrain> What could possibly go wrong, right? :D 11:51:53 <LordAro> exactly! 11:51:54 <andythenorth> hmm will I update nml to trunk? 11:52:00 <andythenorth> I have some PR I am depending on 11:52:08 <andythenorth> what could go wrong? :P 11:52:11 <LordAro> which PR? 11:52:17 <LordAro> we merged most of them.. 11:53:35 * andythenorth looks 11:54:52 <andythenorth> wow nml trunk got noisy 11:55:15 <LordAro> yeah, we rewrote everything 11:55:45 <andythenorth> 3729 Horse warnings where previously there were none 11:55:51 <LordAro> :D 11:56:06 <andythenorth> dunno which of these are spurious and which are the actual errors 11:56:17 <LordAro> ideally none of them are spurious :p 11:57:08 * andythenorth looks what broke 11:58:52 <andythenorth> getting a lot of 'not referenced' for cases I don't understan 11:58:55 <andythenorth> understand * 11:59:04 <andythenorth> what triggers not referenced now? 11:59:07 <TrueBrain> LordAro: how does Ansible Vault work, as in, can you commit these playbooks? Does it need a password to unlock? 11:59:35 <LordAro> TrueBrain: aiui, yeah 11:59:48 <TrueBrain> aiui? Wuth? 11:59:53 <LordAro> as i understand it 11:59:58 <andythenorth> example https://pastebin.com/raw/pZ34Jn9M 12:00:02 <LordAro> --ask-vault-pass when running the playbook 12:00:07 <TrueBrain> cool 12:00:10 <LordAro> https://docs.ansible.com/ansible/latest/user_guide/vault.html 12:00:12 <TrueBrain> well, that works, I guess 12:00:23 <andythenorth> 'breeze_switch_create_effect_check_railtype_unreversed' is unreferenced 12:00:32 <andythenorth> but that paste suggests otherwise 12:00:44 <TrueBrain> now the question: how often do we do the healthz check 12:00:49 <TrueBrain> on AWS everything run on 30 seconds 12:00:52 <LordAro> andythenorth: sounds like a bug that you should complain at glx about 12:00:54 * andythenorth tanks for a bit, 3729 errors are a lot 12:00:59 <LordAro> (i.e. file an issue) 12:01:29 <TrueBrain> guess 30 seconds is fine here too 12:01:53 <TrueBrain> (direct people to a broken server for 5 minutes sounds too much, but I dunno) 12:02:05 <LordAro> difficult to run a cron more than once a minute :p 12:02:07 <TrueBrain> well, no, AWS does a check every 30 seconds, and if you missed 2, you are marked unhealthy 12:02:16 <TrueBrain> owh, yes, cron .. hmm 12:07:35 *** jottyfan has joined #openttd 12:08:08 <LordAro> TrueBrain: thought: will proxying http -> https actually work? 12:08:30 <LordAro> i.e. bananas-1.cdn:80 -> bananas.cdn:443 12:08:32 <reldred> I've done it with nginx and haproxy before 12:08:35 <TrueBrain> it is not a proxy, what we are doing 12:08:43 <TrueBrain> nginx fetches the file 12:08:47 <TrueBrain> and returns it as if it was his 12:08:47 <LordAro> proxy_pass'ing 12:09:04 <TrueBrain> well, it is a proxy, but .. euh .. it is not forwarding 12:09:08 <TrueBrain> so nginx creates the connection 12:09:10 <LordAro> but if you say so :p 12:09:12 <TrueBrain> so yeah, that works 12:09:17 <TrueBrain> well, test it out! :P 12:09:20 <TrueBrain> :D :D 12:09:22 <LordAro> D: 12:10:53 <TrueBrain> oeh, someone found a bug! :D 12:11:45 <TrueBrain> well, that is a most unusual request that someone did to the server 12:11:46 <TrueBrain> lol 12:12:24 <andythenorth> hmm, now I need to bisect to a functional nml rev :) 12:12:25 <andythenorth> oof 12:12:29 <andythenorth> Horse is quite broken in game 12:13:12 <LordAro> :( 12:13:30 <andythenorth> stuff happens 12:13:48 <andythenorth> we can fix it! 12:13:55 <LordAro> :o 12:17:17 <andythenorth> introduced by https://github.com/OpenTTD/nml/commit/7f62081693d5e3b0e4a0ea84d5f17bfb5e7947b9 12:17:26 <andythenorth> not sure Horse is actually broken in game 12:18:06 <TrueBrain> the input LordAro gives to this conversation is amazing :D 12:18:13 <TrueBrain> so happy he hasn't found the UTF-8 variants :P 12:18:22 <andythenorth> are constants being substituted for switch results, leaving the switch orphaned? 12:18:31 <LordAro> :ꙮ 12:18:49 <LordAro> https://github.com/golang/go/issues/42552 is this better? (check the fix commit) 12:19:45 <LordAro> andythenorth: if you could produce a minimal example, i'm sure glx would appreciate it :p 12:20:57 <andythenorth> I have a feeling the cases are obvious 12:21:03 * andythenorth will await glx 12:21:58 *** frosch123 has joined #openttd 12:31:54 <milek7> LordAro: apart from cron, there is systemd timers thing 12:32:03 <LordAro> very true 12:32:10 <LordAro> not sure if that can run more often than 1min though 12:32:16 <LordAro> or if it's advisable to do so 12:32:30 <TrueBrain> right, pushing a few to wiki now to fix cache invalidation issues :) 12:32:38 <TrueBrain> not that anyone would have noticed, as nobody is editing :( 12:32:38 <TrueBrain> :P 12:32:46 <TrueBrain> a few? a fix 12:32:46 <TrueBrain> ffs :P 12:32:47 <LordAro> clearly just have 2 cron rules - `./foo` and `sleep 30 && ./foo` :p 12:33:04 <TrueBrain> LordAro: we could also just make a Python process run for-ever, I guess 12:33:15 <LordAro> we could 12:33:21 <milek7> knowing systemd, it likely can :P 12:33:38 <TrueBrain> but that is making things even more complicated, honestly 12:34:05 <TrueBrain> you know what, lets first get this to work, and extend on it later 12:34:10 <TrueBrain> so hardcoding a list it is 12:34:11 <milek7> AccuracySec= Specify the accuracy the timer shall elapse with. Defaults to 1min. [...] To get best accuracy, set this option to 1us. 12:34:18 <TrueBrain> and bananas will query the server regular for healthz 12:42:52 <TrueBrain> what to do if there are no servers? Hmm 12:42:56 <TrueBrain> fall back to AWS, I guess 12:43:16 <LordAro> what if AWS doesn't work? :p 12:43:24 <TrueBrain> you cannot reach the service ;) 12:50:29 <andythenorth> oof I have discovered Horse lacks many wagon types 12:50:33 * andythenorth much to do 12:53:05 <TrueBrain> 2020-11-14 13:52:53 ERROR CDN server "http://127.0.0.1:8080" offline: Cannot connect to host 127.0.0.1:8080 ssl:default [Connect call failed ('127.0.0.1', 8080)] 12:53:10 <TrueBrain> that will go to sentry if a server goes offline 12:53:14 <TrueBrain> sounds good enough to me :D 12:54:47 <TrueBrain> LordAro: owh, btw, can you also provision "staging" variant? 12:55:08 <TrueBrain> so they should listen on both bananas-1.cdn.openttd.org as bananas-1.cdn.staging.openttd.org 12:55:49 <TrueBrain> hmmm .. TrueWiki error .. a cache file is not there that should be there ... interesting ... 12:56:25 <TrueBrain> ah, of course, oops 12:57:52 *** tokai has joined #openttd 12:57:52 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai 12:59:18 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/team] andrejmoltok opened issue #87: [ro_RO] Translator access request https://git.io/Jk3r8 13:01:53 <TrueBrain> so many fixes for the caching .... it is funny :D 13:04:01 <TrueBrain> deploying fix for the page that broke ... pompiedom :) 13:04:44 *** tokai|noir has quit IRC 13:06:05 <Wolf01> Deploying fixes, deploying bugs, deploying fixes for bugs that weren't :P 13:06:15 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/bananas-server] TrueBrain opened pull request #37: Add: support more than one CDN url https://git.io/Jk3oL 13:06:24 <TrueBrain> LordAro: how about we start with something simple like that ^^ ? 13:06:49 <TrueBrain> means you can do away with the cron + Python script 13:06:52 <TrueBrain> only /healthz is needed 13:08:12 <TrueBrain> if it misses a single health-check, the server is marked as offline 13:08:20 <TrueBrain> we could fancy-pancy that a bit by allowing to miss 1 or 2 13:08:29 <TrueBrain> but .. we can test this on staging, see how often that happens 13:11:13 <TrueBrain> means you can remove the vault stuff too btw :P 13:11:48 <TrueBrain> and now we wait for orudge to read his email :P :D :) 13:33:10 *** glx has joined #openttd 13:33:10 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v glx 13:44:17 <frosch123> TrueBrain: i cannot use [[Folder:foo | bar]] to link to folders? 13:44:26 *** rptr_ has joined #openttd 13:44:44 <TrueBrain> frosch123: [[:Folder:en/]] should work 13:46:54 <frosch123> nope, depending on leading : or trailing / i get different error messages, but none work 13:49:00 <TrueBrain> it is was is used internally .. let me check :D 13:49:24 <frosch123> https://wiki.openttd.org/en/Wiki/Manual%20of%20Style <- updated the manual of style (rewrote 50%) 13:49:37 <TrueBrain> [[:Folder:Page/en/]] 13:49:38 <TrueBrain> works for me 13:49:48 <frosch123> ah, with Page .) 13:49:53 <TrueBrain> yeah, ofc with Page :) 13:50:13 <TrueBrain> well, ofc .. Folder is the exception I guess 13:50:19 <TrueBrain> but I hope that does make sense :P 13:51:02 <TrueBrain> okay ... for the led-strip I had in mind, I need a 18A power supply .. which costs 20 euro .. pffff 13:51:10 <TrueBrain> the powersupply is more expensive than the led-strip itself 13:52:20 <frosch123> [[:Folder:Page/en/]] works, but [[:Folder:Page/en/ | foobar]] does not 13:52:48 <TrueBrain> https://wiki.staging.openttd.org/en/Main%20Page 13:52:50 <TrueBrain> works for me 13:53:02 <TrueBrain> lose the spaces, I guess 13:53:20 <frosch123> yes, spaces are the problem :) 13:53:35 <TrueBrain> guess it is missing a strip() somewhere :) 13:53:46 <TrueBrain> submit an issue :D 13:53:56 <TrueBrain> maybe the author can be bothered to fix it :P 13:54:05 <TrueBrain> btw, frosch123 , how about a news item? :D :D :P 13:54:20 <frosch123> i am working on the pages i want to link from it :p 14:01:50 <frosch123> ah, no dorpsgek yet? 14:01:55 <frosch123> https://github.com/OpenTTD/wiki-data/pull/1 14:02:50 <TrueBrain> yeah .. from "en" and "nl" those references are already removed 14:02:55 <TrueBrain> maybe you want to put them back :P 14:03:14 <TrueBrain> https://github.com/OpenTTD/wiki-data/commit/469c872d79102b195e3d99e3a351d55fa8c1f445 and https://github.com/OpenTTD/wiki-data/commit/0327edec7710cba6f2452277906673d5a56941bb 14:03:17 <frosch123> yeah, from the frontpage. but they do not belong tehre 14:03:27 <frosch123> so, no, i won't put them back :p 14:03:33 <frosch123> but yes, frontpage is next 14:03:50 <TrueBrain> I mention it, as for other languages you do change them 14:03:58 <TrueBrain> (in that PR) 14:04:07 <frosch123> yes, sed applies to everything 14:04:13 <frosch123> not my fault when people edit stuff manually :p 14:04:16 <TrueBrain> ah, fineeeee 14:04:28 <TrueBrain> if you promise to remove them for other languages too :P 14:04:48 <frosch123> i may ask the translators to do so :) 14:05:14 <frosch123> did we ever test update on push? 14:05:19 <TrueBrain> I did on staging 14:05:21 <TrueBrain> not yet on production 14:05:34 <TrueBrain> well, I did in pre-production 14:05:35 <frosch123> it worked :) 14:06:04 <TrueBrain> well, the action triggered 14:06:06 <TrueBrain> :P 14:06:54 <TrueBrain> it did work for some languages, not for others 14:06:58 <TrueBrain> either cache invalidation failed ... 14:07:23 <TrueBrain> or you didn't do all languages :P 14:07:31 <TrueBrain> ah, you only did the english links 14:07:32 <TrueBrain> yes, ofc 14:07:39 <TrueBrain> the translated sandboxes don't work :D 14:08:18 <TrueBrain> cannot believe the reload "just worked" 14:08:20 <TrueBrain> that is pretty neat :) 14:08:30 <TrueBrain> and no, someone has to add a .dorpsgek.yml to the repo 14:08:32 <TrueBrain> with the right settings 14:08:39 <TrueBrain> don't know if we want to announce pushes here 14:08:41 <TrueBrain> for wiki changes 14:08:48 <frosch123> probably not :) 14:17:01 <andythenorth> Horse 98% 14:21:03 <Eddi|zuHause> is that more or less than last time? 14:25:05 <andythenorth> yes 14:26:19 <andythenorth> no-one did the next line of lyrics also Eddi|zuHause :| 14:26:53 <Eddi|zuHause> i don't know the lyrics well enough 14:27:16 <Eddi|zuHause> well, that goes for almost any lyrics, really :) 14:30:08 <frosch123> https://wiki.openttd.org/en/Main%20Page <- no more dead links, no more duplicate links, only one archive link 14:30:20 <TrueBrain> w00p! 14:30:21 <TrueBrain> you go girl :) 14:30:48 <TrueBrain> still twice NewGRF 14:30:50 <TrueBrain> that looks weird 14:31:04 <TrueBrain> and I count at least 2 archive links :o 14:31:27 <frosch123> then your cache shows a different page 14:31:32 <frosch123> or you are looking at dutch again :) 14:32:09 <TrueBrain> hmm, cache issue indeed 14:32:12 <TrueBrain> why ... WHY??!!! 14:32:13 <LordAro> frosch123: i removed the deadlinks from the main page a few hours ago 14:32:32 <TrueBrain> right .. I go hunting again why the cache did not invalidate as it should 14:32:43 <LordAro> didn't know you were planning to rewrite them to staging 14:32:46 <frosch123> LordAro: ok, let's say there are "dead" links, and there are "zombie" links 14:33:00 <TrueBrain> owh, I know why ... lol ... 14:33:09 <TrueBrain> okay, if you are not logged in, you see old pages :D 14:33:10 <TrueBrain> hihi 14:36:14 <FLHerne> andythenorth: I thought you said Horse was 100% the other week? :p 14:36:22 <FLHerne> I guess you found more things to put in it... 14:37:16 <andythenorth> not enough metals wagons 14:40:26 <TrueBrain> this is now, what, fix 6 for cache? I wish I never added it :P :P 14:41:12 <andythenorth> 'you added caching, now you have 6 problems' 14:41:24 <TrueBrain> yeah .. and I am not really surprised either :P 14:41:46 <TrueBrain> when you are logged in, browser-cache is enabled, but server-side on-disk cache is not 14:41:46 <andythenorth> caching is like monitoring windows 14:41:52 <andythenorth> there's no optimum answer 14:41:52 <TrueBrain> so it became a bit complex logic :D 14:47:03 <TrueBrain> so I do time.time(), and store this file 14:47:05 <TrueBrain> after that, I write a file 14:47:10 <TrueBrain> I do getmtime() of the file 14:47:15 <TrueBrain> it is from before time.time() 14:47:16 <TrueBrain> how?! 14:47:44 <TrueBrain> difference of 0.01 seconds 14:47:50 <TrueBrain> so not rounding or anything 14:54:04 <milek7> "Internally, the ext4 filesystem code calls current_fs_time() which is the current cached kernel time truncated to the time granularity specified in the file system's superblock which for ext4 is 1ns. The current time within the Linux kernel is cached, and generally only updated on a timer interrupt. So if your timer interrupt is running at 10 milliseconds, the cached time will only be updated once every 10 milliseconds." 14:54:11 <milek7> https://stackoverflow.com/a/14393315 14:54:28 <milek7> (maybe outdated, it is from 2013) 14:55:46 <TrueBrain> seems it is still accurate ;) 15:05:03 <TrueBrain> right ... rewrote this patch a few times now, I think this should be it :P 15:05:09 <TrueBrain> but clearly I have to simplify it a bit :P 15:07:44 *** rptr_ has quit IRC 15:12:31 <TrueBrain> https://wiki.openttd.org/en/Main%20Page <- now we can see what you did frosch123 :D 15:13:02 <frosch123> i feel exposed 15:13:08 <TrueBrain> :D 15:13:29 <TrueBrain> lot simpler, the page now :D Which is good 15:26:36 <TrueBrain> frosch123: for some reason I am very tempted to make a tool that tells translators when the original language has changed, by looking at the structure of the page 15:26:47 <TrueBrain> I am just scared 90% of the pages would require attention :D 15:27:09 <frosch123> not sure what you mean with "structure" 15:27:22 <TrueBrain> so headers, paragraphs, sentences 15:27:26 <TrueBrain> image locations 15:27:28 <TrueBrain> link locations 15:27:52 <TrueBrain> if links point to a page that is the translation of the english page 15:27:55 <TrueBrain> stuff like that :) 15:27:59 <frosch123> you could check whether both pages contain the same links (while evaluating Translation:) :) 15:28:11 <frosch123> yeah, exactly :p 15:28:29 <TrueBrain> but, honestly, I think next week I am going to do nothing for OpenTTD :P 15:28:42 <frosch123> haha :) 15:28:55 <frosch123> "led week" 15:29:05 <TrueBrain> well, aliexpress ... won't be in for a few weeks :P 15:29:58 <TrueBrain> I hope it is in before xmas ... even that you can't be sure about :D 15:30:55 <TrueBrain> can you still "force" a reindex on search engines these days 15:30:59 <TrueBrain> or is it just a matter of waiting 15:34:23 <TrueBrain> slowly you see the covid map in The Netherlands turning a light-blue color again (meaning no infections) 15:34:28 <TrueBrain> damn, that took for-ever .... 15:35:39 <TrueBrain> lot longer than in March/April at least ... 15:39:49 <frosch123> here they just keep changing the colour scale :) 15:40:08 <frosch123> anyway, duckduck still does not find "github truewiki" 15:53:25 <TrueBrain> Google did already pick it up 15:53:32 <TrueBrain> #1 hit even 15:53:40 <TrueBrain> Shows it is a good name :D 15:56:53 <glx> we just have different red levels here 15:58:56 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/website] frosch123 opened pull request #173: Newwiki https://git.io/Jk3xj 15:59:03 <frosch123> there you go :) 16:00:30 <frosch123> i did not replace links in old news posts 16:00:56 <frosch123> various links just did not make sense, so i would have had to change the news text as well 16:02:34 <frosch123> lol, we already got the first mail, that google+bing link to dead wiki lniks 16:03:15 <TrueBrain> I earlier had one on Discord .. but he understood it quickly enough :) 16:03:37 <TrueBrain> https://wiki.openttd.org/en/Community/Community <- so much community :D 16:03:53 <frosch123> yeah, "Main Page" did not quite fit in that case 16:07:07 <TrueBrain> lol, nice read frosch123 :) I wouldn't mind highlighting a bit more the amount of work you put int he restructuring, but otherwise a nice read :) 16:07:43 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/website] TrueBrain approved pull request #173: Newwiki https://git.io/Jk3pA 16:11:15 <frosch123> oh, i forgot to mention the elephant 16:11:26 <frosch123> i wanted to add a note about the search :) 16:13:14 <TrueBrain> owh LordAro ....... I have credentials for yooouuuuu 16:13:45 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/website] frosch123 dismissed a review for pull request #173: Newwiki https://git.io/Jk3pA 16:13:46 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/website] frosch123 updated pull request #173: Newwiki https://git.io/Jk3xj 16:14:00 <frosch123> added on item about the search :) 16:14:33 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/website] TrueBrain approved pull request #173: Newwiki https://git.io/Jk3h1 16:16:12 <TrueBrain> so I try to login to OVH, it sends an confirmation code by email .... which ... is ... not ... arriving :P 16:16:48 <frosch123> it already sent 7 mails 16:17:34 <TrueBrain> yup 16:17:49 <TrueBrain> VPSes only have an IPv4, hmmmmm 16:17:54 <TrueBrain> I hope that is a setting :D 16:18:42 <TrueBrain> well, soon we will migrate the mail to Zernebok, hopefully that helps with these annoying delays :P 16:20:18 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/website] frosch123 merged pull request #173: Newwiki https://git.io/Jk3xj 16:22:09 <TrueBrain> okay, IPv6 is assigned, but the box doesn't pick it up .. fine, we will figure that out :) 16:24:24 <TrueBrain> orudge: you are awesome :) Just wanted to mention that :D 16:24:45 <frosch123> we need to bake more cookies :) 16:25:12 <TrueBrain> yes 16:25:25 <TrueBrain> okay, DNS entries created 16:25:29 <TrueBrain> VPSes are online 16:25:53 <TrueBrain> now it is LordAro's job .. job 1, reset the passwords ASAP :P 16:26:16 <TrueBrain> vps-be46 is bananas-1.cdn, the other bananas-2.cdn 16:26:40 <TrueBrain> if this works, with the caching proxies ... this is a very simple, elegant, and money-saving solution :D 16:27:22 <TrueBrain> frosch123: you could add a <!-- more --> tag to the news 16:27:27 <TrueBrain> so it doesn't take up so much space on the frontpage 16:27:33 <TrueBrain> but .. meh, I am good with this what-ever 16:27:45 <frosch123> oh, never used that 16:28:10 <TrueBrain> we added that for these kinds of posts :P 16:28:37 <TrueBrain> I could have thought about that before the merge, ofc, but meh 16:28:47 <TrueBrain> foooooodddd 16:31:22 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/website] frosch123 opened pull request #174: Fix: front page should have shortened news. https://git.io/Jkse1 16:33:01 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/website] TrueBrain approved pull request #174: Fix: front page should have shortened news. https://git.io/JkseF 16:36:37 *** Wormnest has joined #openttd 16:38:16 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/website] frosch123 merged pull request #174: Fix: front page should have shortened news. https://git.io/Jkse1 16:47:56 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/website] frosch123 created new tag: 1.4.3 https://git.io/JksfN 17:00:56 * andythenorth is dense 17:00:59 <andythenorth> 1: return palette_2cc(company_colour1, COLOUR_CREAM); 17:01:15 <andythenorth> instead of COLOUR_CREAM, how do I return 8 other indexes (of my choice) 17:04:05 <frosch123> you have to create a set of 16 recolourmaps for each company_colour1 and your custom seconds 17:05:05 <frosch123> or use spritestacks :) 17:07:07 <andythenorth> I can probably create the 16 recolourmaps 17:07:15 <andythenorth> that sounds generatable :P 17:14:20 <andythenorth> ha I think I already had the company colour indexes for use in docs python image recolouring 17:14:21 <andythenorth> hmm 17:15:12 <andythenorth> https://github.com/andythenorth/iron-horse/blob/master/src/render_docs.py#L136 17:25:55 *** rptr_ has joined #openttd 17:27:48 <frosch123> https://github.com/frosch123/TTDViewer/blob/master/src/recolor.xml#L186 <- all your answers 17:28:28 <frosch123> and you cannot find them in the ottd source, they are in the baseset 17:28:41 <frosch123> i believe pikka had a "better cc" grf or so 17:29:06 <TrueBrain> https://github.com/TrueBrain/TrueWiki/issues/86 <- don't know why (as it isn't mentioned), but someone is missing Special:Random :P 17:32:17 <andythenorth> ta 17:33:07 <TrueBrain> tatatatata 17:33:11 <TrueBrain> now you are a gun :D 17:33:50 <andythenorth> oh can I re-randomise bits within a switch chain? 17:33:56 <andythenorth> I want to make 2 independent choices :P 17:36:00 <TrueBrain> frosch123: I see I was too forgiving in the use of / :P :P 17:36:49 <TrueBrain> frosch123: do we want to support both [[Folder and [[:Folder ? Or do we want to promote the one over the other? 17:37:04 <frosch123> he, i asked that question :p 17:37:15 <TrueBrain> ghehe :) 17:37:20 <TrueBrain> I just don't know ... wikilinks are WEIRD 17:37:26 <TrueBrain> [[:File is always a link 17:37:35 <andythenorth> can I slice only some of the random bits, and use different ones later in the varaction2 chain? 17:37:37 * andythenorth ponders 17:37:39 <TrueBrain> and otherwise there is no real difference between [[NNN and [[:NNN 17:37:46 <frosch123> i am fine with :Folder, maybe later we get some magic folder page, that would be shown for Folder without leading : 17:37:54 <TrueBrain> [[Media also makes a link ... and [[:Media doesn't work 17:37:57 * andythenorth pretends to know what talking about 17:38:20 <frosch123> TrueBrain: oh, yeah, Folder: without leading : could be a TOC that you can transclude 17:38:28 <frosch123> so, yeah, link is :Folder: only 17:38:31 <TrueBrain> k k 17:39:20 <TrueBrain> [[:Category:en/Bla | bla]] 17:39:23 <TrueBrain> etc is also invalid :) 17:39:41 <frosch123> two fixes for one? :) 17:39:55 <andythenorth> I am only really doing this rainbow in case it amuses frosch123 :P https://grf.farm/images/rainbow_horses_again.png 17:40:24 <frosch123> i like the "send instructions" in the bottom right corner 17:40:35 <andythenorth> ha 17:40:37 <TrueBrain> frosch123: guess I mostly didn't want to support [[:Category: en/Bla]] (space after second :) 17:40:41 <andythenorth> if only that were intentional :) 17:42:43 *** gelignite has joined #openttd 17:42:50 <frosch123> TrueBrain: don't worry, i removed all [[File:<-- yo, how is the weather? -->Image<!-- png rulez-->.png]] in the conversion 17:42:59 <andythenorth> I have random switch chaining to other random switches https://github.com/andythenorth/iron-horse/blob/master/src/templates/procedures_colour_mapping.pynml#L65 17:43:23 <andythenorth> but some results in some of the random switches seem to be never reached 17:43:37 <andythenorth> unless it's just that I need a larger sample set 17:44:01 <TrueBrain> https://github.com/TrueBrain/TrueWiki/pull/88 <- so many strips :P 17:44:03 <frosch123> andythenorth: don't use "random_switch" except when you have to rerandomise 17:44:13 <TrueBrain> now [[:Folder: en/Bla | Bla]] will work 17:44:21 <frosch123> use getbit(random_bits, ....) or something 17:44:26 <andythenorth> hurrah 17:45:05 <glx> you can use dependant and independant too I think 17:45:37 <andythenorth> yes, but I think that's for a different case? 17:45:55 <frosch123> no, it's for this case 17:46:01 <frosch123> but i don't trust it working :) 17:46:20 <frosch123> 8 random bits are too few for automatic allocation 17:46:55 <frosch123> TrueBrain: they can leave their hat on? 17:47:10 <TrueBrain> frosch123: sorry? 17:47:33 <frosch123> song reference 17:47:42 <andythenorth> hmm I've forgotten how to bits 17:47:48 <andythenorth> I have 5 possible results 17:48:00 <andythenorth> getbits(random_bits, 0, 5) or getbits(random_bits, 0, 3)? 17:48:11 <frosch123> the latter 17:48:23 <TrueBrain> r/woosh, sorry :P 17:49:27 <glx> 5 values -> at least 3 bits 17:49:37 <frosch123> so, how does this dorpsgek.yml work? 17:49:41 <TrueBrain> frosch123: https://wiki.staging.openttd.org/en/Folder%20Links <- fixed! :) 17:49:48 <TrueBrain> frosch123: copy it from any other repo :P 17:50:05 <TrueBrain> https://github.com/OpenTTD/bananas-server/blob/master/.dorpsgek.yml for example 17:51:15 <TrueBrain> or https://github.com/OpenTTD/website/blob/master/.dorpsgek.yml if you want also changes to the wiki being announced 17:51:25 <TrueBrain> that looks like this: 17:51:26 <TrueBrain> [OpenTTD/wiki-data-staging] DorpsGek pushed 1 commits to master https://git.io/JksIU 17:51:26 <TrueBrain> - new page: en/Folder Links (by frosch123) 17:52:11 <andythenorth> hmm this doesn't work as expected 17:52:17 <andythenorth> and I am only doing it for lolz :) 17:52:41 <TrueBrain> aren't we all? 17:53:03 <frosch123> will "Libararian" work for "except-by"? it's no gh user 17:53:27 <andythenorth> https://github.com/andythenorth/iron-horse/blob/master/src/templates/procedures_colour_mapping.pynml#L65 17:53:38 <andythenorth> I still have random_switch elsewhere in the chain though :| 17:53:56 <andythenorth> not sure how to get evenly balanced results with random_bits 17:54:08 <andythenorth> given, e.g. odd number of choices 17:55:04 <frosch123> oh, i think i misunderstood what "push" really is 17:55:09 <frosch123> it's "push" without "pr" 17:56:03 <andythenorth> glx also I didn't do a ticket, but nml since 7f62081693d5e3b0e4a0ea84d5f17bfb5e7947b9 produces about 3700 warnings with Horse 17:56:28 <andythenorth> a lot are switches 'unused' because they resolve to a constant 17:56:39 <frosch123> https://github.com/OpenTTD/wiki-data/pull/2 <- so, i guess, just that? 17:56:41 <glx> optimised and unused yes 17:56:42 <andythenorth> but the switch in some cases exists to do a necessary STORE_TEMP 17:57:04 *** otetede has joined #openttd 17:57:44 <glx> if there's a store_temp it should not optimise 17:57:47 <andythenorth> can the constant result also do the STORE_TEMP? I have no idea how it all resolves to advanced varact2 internally 17:58:25 <andythenorth> e.g. https://pastebin.com/raw/pZ34Jn9M 'breeze_switch_create_effect_default_unreversed' is unused 18:03:45 <glx> https://github.com/OpenTTD/nml/blob/7f62081693d5e3b0e4a0ea84d5f17bfb5e7947b9/nml/expression/spritegroup_ref.py#L80 and https://github.com/OpenTTD/nml/blob/dfb4499a70ef3c84ebde7d1eda10a8173f1e8a9f/nml/expression/storage_op.py#L130 18:04:01 <glx> if there's a STORE_TEMP it's not optimised 18:04:58 <andythenorth> I try nml head again shortly and see 18:05:04 <andythenorth> currently lost in random bits :P 18:05:41 <andythenorth> does reading the random bits destroy them? 18:06:57 <andythenorth> oh do I have to read specific bits? 18:07:06 <andythenorth> "Feature-specific random data: triggers in low byte, bits in other three bytes. Bits of the variable not associated with random or trigger bits are reserved." 18:07:31 * andythenorth understands 18:07:53 <frosch123> randombits should already be only the random bits, without triggers 18:08:20 <andythenorth> if I read the same random bits twice, and expect a different result 18:08:26 <andythenorth> disappointment will ensure 18:08:33 * andythenorth fixes that 18:08:33 <frosch123> yes :) 18:11:26 <andythenorth> ha ha 'totally random' looks like puke :) 18:12:01 <LordAro> TrueBrain: so i'm guessing you want a public key? 18:19:35 <andythenorth> ha I sack this totally random :D 18:19:42 <andythenorth> looks....BAD 18:23:08 <TrueBrain> LordAro: no, I want to give you the root credentials :P 18:23:26 <TrueBrain> LordAro: can you access info@ mailbox? 18:23:45 <frosch123> ^^ that's a trap :p 18:23:49 <LordAro> i cannot 18:24:21 <TrueBrain> username: debian 18:24:27 <TrueBrain> host: bananas-N.cdn.openttd.org 18:24:40 <TrueBrain> IPv6 won't work, as the box isn't configured for it, it seems 18:24:52 <glx> you could do it in PM :) 18:25:11 <TrueBrain> glx: no shit :P Possibly exactly what I just did ;) 18:25:40 <LordAro> s'ok, i haven't got IPv6 anyway :p 18:26:07 <TrueBrain> https://docs.ovh.com/gb/en/vps/configuring-ipv6/#persistent-application-on-debian-and-its-derivatives-ubuntu-crunchbang-steamos 18:26:11 <TrueBrain> no clue how that works with Ansible :) 18:26:50 <LordAro> i'll see what i can figure out :p 18:26:58 <LordAro> might not get round to doing anything with it oday 18:27:04 *** glx has quit IRC 18:27:40 <TrueBrain> for the IPv6 you can dig the AAAA 18:27:43 <TrueBrain> the gateway is at ::1 18:28:09 <TrueBrain> if there is anything I can help with, let me know! 18:28:26 <LordAro> :+1: 18:29:11 <TrueBrain> and if you have it working etc, feel free to make an "ansible" folder here: https://github.com/OpenTTD/aws-infra 18:29:13 <TrueBrain> and commit it there 18:29:39 <TrueBrain> having everything in a single place is nice :) 18:29:48 <TrueBrain> hmm, certificate of webster expired 18:29:51 <LordAro> :) 18:29:56 <TrueBrain> guess I really should hurry up with supybot 18:32:33 <andythenorth> ok let's try this nml thing 18:32:42 <TrueBrain> oh-oh 18:34:19 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/wiki-data] frosch123 merged pull request #2: Add: IRC announcements for PRs and issues. https://git.io/JksLx 18:34:28 <andythenorth> ok looks like 3742 warnings 18:34:48 <TrueBrain> owh, frosch123 solved 20k in a few days, so you can solve 4k in an hour 18:34:49 <TrueBrain> I BELIEVE IN YOU 18:35:07 <andythenorth> so do I need to refactor my code generation? 18:35:10 <andythenorth> to avoid returning constants? 18:35:24 <TrueBrain> owh, btw, frosch123 , push owner is which ever account is used to push; it doesn't matter what the author or commiter is (for .dorpsgek.yml) 18:35:29 <TrueBrain> so it is always DorpsGek, basically 18:36:03 <frosch123> ok :) 18:36:20 <andythenorth> oof this is going to be a thing :| 18:36:37 <andythenorth> code generator assumes it's ok to have switches that only have one value 18:37:02 <andythenorth> I will need to do a lot of python conditionals on len(foo) 18:37:12 <TrueBrain> :( 18:38:05 <andythenorth> I have done this kind of thing before to try and optimise compile speed 18:38:08 <andythenorth> so I know what's required 18:38:29 <andythenorth> but codebase gets very confusing 18:38:30 <TrueBrain> doesn't make it better now, does it? :D 18:38:31 <LordAro> len(foo) == x or x < len(foo) < y ? 18:38:39 <LordAro> if the former, you could use a dict 18:39:29 <andythenorth> I have to tell the templater to conditionally insert different things :P 18:39:35 <andythenorth> the conditions are in the templater langauge 18:40:00 <LordAro> do they have to be? 18:40:14 <andythenorth> yes, it's the method for generating conditional nml :P 18:40:30 <andythenorth> there are alternatives, but they get worse 18:40:41 <andythenorth> meh this is a shitload of work :) 18:42:35 *** glx has joined #openttd 18:42:35 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v glx 18:43:22 <andythenorth> I kind of assumed this would be fine https://github.com/andythenorth/iron-horse/blob/master/src/templates/create_effect.pynml#L31 18:43:53 <andythenorth> I've written a lot of nml on the basis that there can be a single default result 18:45:05 *** rptr_ has quit IRC 18:45:42 <andythenorth> oh can I trick it like we used to trick renum? 18:45:49 <andythenorth> by inserting a spurious range check? 18:46:01 <andythenorth> or does it resolve the entire switch chain? 18:48:35 <andythenorth> hmm that seems like the wrong approach 18:49:18 <andythenorth> oof 18:49:44 <andythenorth> glx I can't figure out what my goal should be 18:50:00 <andythenorth> presumably I need to refactor my nml generation to not return these constants via switches? 18:50:37 <glx> oh webster certificate expired 18:52:55 <glx> well at some point optimisation warnings will be mutable 18:53:13 <glx> same for deprecated warnings 18:53:34 *** gelignite has quit IRC 18:54:18 <andythenorth> hmm 18:55:23 * andythenorth trying to figure out how the code generator can pre-emptively analyse the results of the code generation 18:55:59 <andythenorth> I think it's just a lot of case(1) and case(n) handling 18:56:33 <FLHerne> andythenorth: Does it matter? NML optimizes them out for you now 18:56:57 <andythenorth> yes, warnings can't pass 18:57:03 <andythenorth> so it matters 18:57:26 <FLHerne> That just means we need more warning settings :p 18:59:20 <FLHerne> -Wno-switch-opt or something 18:59:31 * FLHerne adds one 19:00:03 <andythenorth> ta 19:00:10 <andythenorth> I don't see how it can work though? o_O 19:00:33 <andythenorth> the optimisation generates about 1900 'not referenced' warnings for Horse 19:00:45 <andythenorth> which can't be suppressed, that's a necessary warning 19:02:07 *** Wormnest has quit IRC 19:02:52 <FLHerne> andythenorth: That's an nmlc bug 19:03:07 <andythenorth> ok 19:03:11 <FLHerne> The 'not referenced' warnings are bogus 19:03:26 <andythenorth> I also don't understand how the store_temp case is handled 19:03:31 <andythenorth> https://github.com/OpenTTD/nml/blob/dfb4499a70ef3c84ebde7d1eda10a8173f1e8a9f/nml/expression/storage_op.py#L130 19:03:44 <FLHerne> It decides the switches aren't needed, removes them, and replaces their uses with use of the original value 19:04:26 <FLHerne> But somehow it doesn't remove them enough, because *then* it checks to see if they're used 19:04:55 <FLHerne> And complains because the uses it just replaced don't exist anymore 19:05:28 <andythenorth> the switch in L321 won't be reached afaict https://gist.github.com/andythenorth/89e4d66fd76922b70e3561e8e3e58289#file-gistfile1-txt-L321 19:05:54 <andythenorth> it's detected as a constant 19:06:10 * andythenorth might be wrong, dunno 19:06:47 <TrueBrain> https://github.com/TrueBrain/TrueWiki/issues/89 <- lets see if we can make andythenorth obsolete :P :D <3 19:08:30 <andythenorth> wfm 19:09:08 <TrueBrain> seems I should start working on splitting OpenTTD from TrueWiki 19:09:16 <TrueBrain> just to make it more clear what is where :) 19:09:27 <TrueBrain> not terribly difficult 19:09:36 <andythenorth> I would have said use the conventional breakpoints, and have a bunfight about an XL viewport at 1200px or so 19:09:52 * andythenorth stays out of CSS, I will be glad if I never have to do any ever again 19:10:03 <TrueBrain> I feel the same! :D 19:10:54 <TrueBrain> hmm ... should the CSS and Templates be part of wiki-data, I wonder 19:11:16 <TrueBrain> in .truewiki or something 19:11:31 <TrueBrain> means you don't need to release a new "openttd-truewiki" every "truewiki" release 19:11:34 <TrueBrain> frosch123: what do you think? 19:11:51 <FLHerne> andythenorth: That switch shouldn't be removed, and with iron-horse master I don't think it is 19:13:30 <FLHerne> andythenorth: As the nml code you linked says, STORE_TEMP isn't read-only 19:14:03 <andythenorth> but it's in a chain no? 19:14:18 <andythenorth> breeze_switch_create_effect_default_unreversed is only reached via breeze_switch_create_effect_check_railtype_unreversed 19:14:21 <andythenorth> and breeze_switch_create_effect_check_railtype_unreversed is removed 19:14:38 <andythenorth> I'm not sure that's true yet 19:15:03 <andythenorth> puzzlingly, breeze_switch_create_effect_default_unreversed is not referenced as unreached 19:15:13 <andythenorth> oh is the 'constant' the next switch ID? 19:15:22 <FLHerne> andythenorth: 'removed' means 'replaced by its return value' 19:15:34 <andythenorth> ok so it's a varact2 ID 19:15:45 <FLHerne> andythenorth: So all uses of breeze_switch_create_effect_check_railtype_unreversed should turn into breeze_switch_create_effect_default_unreversed 19:15:56 <andythenorth> not a constant in the sense of global constant 19:16:05 <andythenorth> ok that makes sense 19:16:19 <FLHerne> (and then the former gets erroneously marked as unused) 19:17:00 <andythenorth> thanks 19:17:02 <TrueBrain> LordAro: only now looking at PowerToys .. fun fact: https://github.com/microsoft/PowerToys/releases has their releases on AWS :P 19:17:24 <TrueBrain> which I cannot help being ironic 19:17:38 <LordAro> haha 19:19:06 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 19:19:44 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 19:22:47 <frosch123> TrueBrain: css yes, templates no? 19:23:00 <TrueBrain> they contain OpenTTD snippets 19:23:13 <TrueBrain> otherwise I have to make variables out of that, and put a JSON file with those, or something? 19:23:22 <TrueBrain> would be cleaner, now I come to think of it 19:25:50 <TrueBrain> funny .. seems my "Windows" button on my keyboard isn't registered by Windows as such :P 19:27:07 <TrueBrain> oowwwhhh, so that is what that button on my keyboard is for 19:27:08 <TrueBrain> funny 19:27:57 <frosch123> for how long do you have that keyboard? 19:28:06 <TrueBrain> poeh .... close to 10 years now? 19:28:27 <frosch123> i learned that notebooks now have fn-locks 19:28:36 * andythenorth wants that 19:28:49 <andythenorth> I have to fn-lock the stupid emoji bar to play openttd 19:28:56 <TrueBrain> LordAro: PowerToys is cool :D Tnx for mentioning it :) 19:28:56 <andythenorth> but I don't have fn-lock, only fn 19:29:43 <frosch123> and i randomly discovered that my mouse@work had not only a button when pressing the scroll wheel, but also when pushing it left or right 19:29:54 <frosch123> which is super weird, and i have no idea who would use that for anything 19:30:04 <TrueBrain> mine has that too ... NEVER use it 19:30:41 <TrueBrain> I also never press down my scrollwheel .. 19:30:45 <TrueBrain> I don't understand all those extra buttons :P 19:30:56 <LordAro> middle click is extremely useful 19:31:01 <TrueBrain> (says the person with 18 configurable keys on my keyboard ...) 19:31:12 <milek7> ..how do you open links in new tab? 19:31:14 <TrueBrain> what does your middle click do? :) 19:31:21 <TrueBrain> CTRL+click 19:31:22 <TrueBrain> duh 19:31:23 <frosch123> middle click is pan in a lot of applications 19:31:28 <frosch123> middle click is "close tab" 19:31:32 <frosch123> and middle click is paste 19:31:42 <frosch123> middle-click-paste is way better than right-click-paste 19:31:45 <TrueBrain> right click is paste (and copy) 19:31:46 <frosch123> i hate the windows coonsole 19:32:02 <TrueBrain> I do like my extra mouse buttons next to my thumb 19:32:08 <TrueBrain> especially the press-to-talk I have bound there 19:32:13 <TrueBrain> that ... helps a lot in games :D 19:32:13 <LordAro> middle click is paste for the selection clipboard on linux too 19:32:42 <frosch123> i do not know how to remap the thumb buttons on windows 19:32:52 <andythenorth> there's no shorthand for scoping to 'first unit of articulated vehicle'? 19:32:59 <TrueBrain> logitech drivers allow you to 19:33:02 <frosch123> so i hate them since i press them accidentally all the time :p 19:33:03 <andythenorth> I know it was discussed at least once, but I forget the outcome 19:33:03 <TrueBrain> but it is button-4 etc for me 19:33:09 <TrueBrain> which I can bind in applications 19:33:17 <andythenorth> PARENT gets me lead engine 19:33:37 <frosch123> enter stuff in website form, accidentially click the mouse-back button, meh 19:33:42 <TrueBrain> and he is talking about trains again,pfft :P 19:33:57 <andythenorth> nml even :P 19:34:39 <frosch123> andythenorth: the additional scopes were never implemented. but you can use the "position within aticulated vehicle" and "variable of nearby vehicle" 19:35:02 <andythenorth> yes 19:35:07 <andythenorth> I've done it before :) 19:35:25 <andythenorth> thanks 19:35:42 <frosch123> TrueBrain: btw. not sure whether you meant that.. but wiki-data should contain the whole "static" folder, not just "static/css" 19:35:58 <TrueBrain> yup 19:36:07 <TrueBrain> "static" folder and a "settings" YAML 19:36:13 <TrueBrain> static just in the root, you think? 19:36:20 <TrueBrain> truewiki.yaml + static in / ? 19:36:38 <frosch123> yes, Page, Category, Template, File are unique enough 19:37:41 <TrueBrain> sounds like a plan! Well, not today .. soon :) 19:37:56 <TrueBrain> means all those pesky CSS discussions can be held in other repositories :D 19:40:03 <TrueBrain> funny, now I pay attention to it ... I haven't visited a website yet that is full width 19:40:12 <TrueBrain> all my most frequent visited websites limit the width to ~1000px 19:41:06 <milek7> wikipedia? 19:41:11 <frosch123> tt-forums? 19:41:16 <andythenorth> for conventional websites, endless liquid layouts are poor 19:41:18 <TrueBrain> not on my list of "frequent", sorry :) 19:41:19 <andythenorth> they're a QA nightmare 19:41:28 <TrueBrain> and wikipedia is just awefull to read on a 2k monitor 19:41:36 <andythenorth> and there is an optimum ratio of column width to font size 19:41:43 <andythenorth> due to line length readability 19:41:48 <TrueBrain> yup 19:41:54 <TrueBrain> there are studies about this shit 19:42:00 <TrueBrain> starting in the 1800s somewhere :P 19:42:03 <andythenorth> after adding 2 columns of ads, there's no further use for space 19:42:15 <milek7> well, it is not that browser window can't be resized :P 19:43:28 <TrueBrain> wait, you don't have all windows open fullscreen? 19:43:30 <TrueBrain> that is ... odd 19:45:28 <frosch123> i always wanted to use a tiling window manager 19:45:39 <frosch123> but talking about them seems nicer than using them 19:47:16 *** gelignite has joined #openttd 19:47:25 <TrueBrain> as with many things :P 19:47:57 *** longtomjr has quit IRC 19:53:37 *** jottyfan has quit IRC 19:56:45 *** otetede has quit IRC 20:06:00 <TrueBrain> frosch123: 20:06:02 <TrueBrain> kamnetToday at 9:05 PM 20:06:02 <TrueBrain> If you wanna delete newgrf list by region, feel free to nuke it 20:06:05 <TrueBrain> GO GO GO :P 20:10:41 <frosch123> isn't that already in archive? 20:10:44 <TrueBrain> it is 20:11:57 <frosch123> should i get discord? 20:12:00 <frosch123> or just more spam? 20:14:33 <TrueBrain> I like Discord more than IRC, but that is me 20:14:46 <TrueBrain> And they are a friendly bunch 20:14:52 <TrueBrain> And less active :p 20:14:56 <TrueBrain> There is no andy there 20:15:07 <frosch123> do they do css? 20:15:15 <TrueBrain> They claim they do 20:17:33 <FLHerne> frosch123: Tiling WMs are great on laptops 20:17:42 <andythenorth> I considered joining reddit 20:17:49 <andythenorth> can we move chat to /r/openttd? 20:18:08 <frosch123> reddit is writeonly 20:18:38 <frosch123> but i guess you can use it upload screenshots/images, and link them here 20:18:43 <frosch123> instead of your s3 20:21:26 <andythenorth> there's an idea 20:24:39 <frosch123> maybe you can render horse docs as image, and also host them there 20:25:09 <andythenorth> well I could PDF them 20:25:14 <andythenorth> then rasterise the PDF 20:25:26 <andythenorth> then auto-generate VERY LONG alt texts 20:28:11 <FLHerne> Oh, there's an idea 20:28:29 <FLHerne> TrueBrain: Find a way to encode basesets as valid PNGs, and upload them to Google Photos 20:28:49 <FLHerne> They're less than 15GB :p 20:30:48 <TrueBrain> Hahahaha 20:30:53 <TrueBrain> I like it 20:34:19 <frosch123> "pngcodec" is already taken 20:35:02 <TrueBrain> Pngfuckgooglecodec? 20:35:22 <TrueBrain> Pngwedonotplayfaircodec? 20:35:52 <andythenorth> TermsAndConditionsApplyCodec 20:35:52 <frosch123> pngdmcacodec 20:36:00 <TrueBrain> Pnghideasaphotobutiamreallyabasesetcodec? 20:36:22 <frosch123> that may be a unique name 20:36:31 <TrueBrain> :D 20:38:05 <frosch123> FLHerne: can you do that in a way, so it still looks like a cat photo? 20:40:20 <andythenorth> is cat 20:40:40 <andythenorth> this would need some very artful steganography :P 20:42:01 <TrueBrain> With png, funny enough, it is very easy 20:42:06 <TrueBrain> Png has chunks 20:42:24 <TrueBrain> So you can just add random data as an unknown chunk 20:42:39 <TrueBrain> Just ... hopefully their service doesn't strip it :p 20:45:20 <glx> <FLHerne> (and then the former gets erroneously marked as unused) <-- I can probably fix that 20:46:44 <FLHerne> glx: If not, it's on my to-do list (I got sidetracked by RL again) 20:47:56 <TrueBrain> Wuth? What is that concept you call RL? 20:53:20 <frosch123> it's an open world game 20:53:25 <frosch123> mostly a walking simulator 20:53:52 <TrueBrain> Lol 20:55:23 <frosch123> andy plays it a lot. it has weird daily quests like "lunch". tanks are are 20:55:32 <frosch123> +r 20:58:30 <FLHerne> It *was* an open world game 20:58:40 <FLHerne> They added limits recently :-( 20:59:08 <andythenorth> it's mostly a sitting simulator for me 20:59:10 <andythenorth> and napping sim 20:59:16 <TrueBrain> No, not limits. Thet increased the difficulty setting 20:59:19 <andythenorth> they should make bed a savegame point 21:07:40 <Eddi|zuHause> they don't allow save scumming, sadly 21:11:59 <LordAro> FLHerne: no, just open PRs against github's DMCA repo, use that 21:16:34 <andythenorth> I like plain text savegame formats 21:16:43 <andythenorth> they make for the easiest winning of the game 21:17:45 <FLHerne> andythenorth: Eh 21:18:02 <andythenorth> I would like to be able to edit, e.g. daily tasks 21:18:11 <FLHerne> KSP has those, but half my editing attempts lead to the ship exploding ludicrously when reloading 21:18:18 <FLHerne> Oh, for RL 21:18:18 <andythenorth> lunch_complete=False > lunch_complete=True 21:18:29 <andythenorth> Euro Truck Simulator has them, editing money is fine 21:18:36 <andythenorth> editing co-ordinates is a bit dodgy 21:34:52 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 22:45:25 *** Wolf01 has quit IRC 22:52:55 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 22:56:01 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 22:56:50 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 22:59:50 *** iSoSyS has joined #openttd 23:02:22 <milek7> meh 23:02:25 <milek7> there aren't many good VR games 23:02:45 <glx> Alyx is not bad IIRC (just saw streams) 23:03:10 <glx> beat saber seems good too 23:03:48 <milek7> alyx is good, practically only AAA game available 23:04:53 <milek7> beat saber.. doesn't appeal to me 23:06:32 <glx> keep talking and nobody explodes looks fun too, but can't be played solo 23:07:46 <milek7> maybe I should install windows 23:08:00 <milek7> derail valley works like crap on wine 23:10:05 *** iSoSyS has quit IRC 23:19:05 *** frosch123 has quit IRC 23:20:56 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/nml] glx22 opened pull request #170: Codechange: reduce warnings from switches optimisations https://git.io/Jks2Y 23:23:01 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/nml] glx22 updated pull request #170: Codechange: reduce warnings from switches optimisations https://git.io/Jks2Y 23:33:57 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/nml] glx22 updated pull request #170: Codechange: reduce warnings from switches optimisations https://git.io/Jks2Y 23:52:47 *** tokai|noir has joined #openttd 23:52:47 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai|noir 23:59:41 *** tokai has quit IRC