Log for #openttd on 3rd August 2021:
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00:00:16  <hannah777> it worked for an older version which i accidentally installed
00:00:22  <hannah777> with apt-get
00:00:47  <hannah777> then i noticed it was old so i copied over the .deb file i downloaded from the website reinstalled it and added the graphics pack now i get this error
00:01:36  <FLHerne> Oh, > getaddrinfo for hostname "f" <
00:01:40  <FLHerne> is definitely not right
00:01:49  <hannah777> yeah that seems odd :P
00:02:29  <FLHerne> What command are you running exactly?
00:02:32  <FLHerne> and what OS?
00:02:39  <hannah777> openttd -D on ubuntu
00:02:59  <FLHerne> Have you typed -D f instead of -D -f ?
00:03:18  <hannah777> ive not
00:04:07  <FLHerne> Huh, can reproduce here
00:04:13  <FLHerne> that's a bit surprising
00:05:16  <hannah777> at least im not crazy!
00:08:12  <FLHerne> ...and now I can't start openttd because of some weird SDL2/wayland bug yay
00:08:29  <hannah777> :(
00:08:52  <FLHerne> Oh, it's the opposite
00:09:18  <FLHerne> I had SDL_VIDEODRIVER=wayland set, but now I'm not using wayland because I broke it so that was wrong
00:10:19  <hannah777> burn all technology, return to monkey
00:10:24  <hannah777> id be fine playing an older version since that worked, do you know where i can download old clients? i think it was 1.9something for the server that worked
00:11:32  <glx> hmm the weird part is hostname "f", IIRC nothing changed in network area for a long time (except recent nightlies)
00:11:47  <FLHerne> hannah777: What are you using now? 1.11.2?
00:11:55  <hannah777> yes
00:12:25  <hannah777> talking about recent, i found an 11 year old forum post with the same problem
00:12:27  <hannah777> no solution tho
00:12:54  <FLHerne> TrueBrain made some relevant changes recently, but I think those are only in master/nightlies
00:14:28  <FLHerne> hannah777: Can you try the latest nightly from ?
00:15:00  <FLHerne> might have been fixed in passing by
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00:15:48  <DooM> u can always use ip option on dedicated server
00:16:02  <DooM> hostname isnt exactly the best to use dedicated tho
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00:16:09  <FLHerne> If you really want older builds, you can get them from with different number
00:16:57  <FLHerne> If you find out which the latest version that works for you is, that would be useful to know
00:18:30  <FLHerne> but please do try the nightly first ;-)
00:18:35  <hannah777> do i just copy the tar contents into the installation directory?
00:18:52  <hannah777> i installed the other build with the .deb file so not sure how to proceed here
00:18:59  <FLHerne> Just untar it and run ./openttd in the directory
00:19:03  <glx> it's better to use a different folder
00:19:04  <FLHerne> it'll work
00:19:10  <hannah777> ah i see thanks
00:19:19  <FLHerne> Don't try to overwrite system paths, that'll make a mess
00:21:07  <glx> check [server_bind_addresses] section in openttd.cfg
00:21:23  <glx> maybe there's an "f=" in it
00:21:58  <_dp_> that's not the first time I see weird hostnames...
00:23:04  <hannah777> same error for the nightly
00:23:04  <glx> I think any "garbage" after -D may be stored permanently in the config
00:23:13  <_dp_> my guess that is because if you even run -D blahblah it adds to the config
00:23:28  <glx> for nightlies it will be in private.cfg
00:23:44  <glx> and removed from openttd.cfg
00:24:01  <glx> just retry 1.11.2 now
00:24:41  <hannah777> i dont see server_bind_addresses in the config
00:25:13  <hannah777> woah
00:25:17  <glx> yeah, you tried a nightly, some values have been moved
00:25:26  <hannah777> yeah it works now what the heck
00:25:49  <hannah777> aaah
00:26:06  <hannah777> okay so if i run it openttd -Df it wont work again. now lets try running nightly again
00:26:20  <glx> up to 1.11 there was [server_bind_addresses] in openttd.cfg, now it's moved to private.cfg
00:26:23  <hannah777> now i see the thing you mentioned in the config
00:29:00  <hannah777> alright and removing it manually makes it work again
00:29:04  <hannah777> thank you all very much
00:29:05  <hannah777> :)
00:33:14  <FLHerne> _dp_: I don't remember *ever* trying to run a dedicated server on this machine, and yet I have that, oh wait
00:33:29  <FLHerne> I did run -D f when I was testing whether it would produce that output when running -D f
00:33:39  <FLHerne> and then I only ran -D on its own after that
00:33:46  <FLHerne> So yeah
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00:34:01  <FLHerne> Automagically persisting typoes seems like a bad idea
00:34:13  <FLHerne> hannah777: Great, goodnight :-)
00:34:46  <hannah777> oh yeah, bedtime. good night!
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12:03:39  <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/nml] kaechele opened pull request #228: Fix: define PY_SSIZE_T_CLEAN in _lz77.c
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13:06:18  <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Jeems4727 commented on issue #9459: [Crash]: Game crashed out of nowhere
13:08:51  <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on issue #9459: [Crash]: Game crashed out of nowhere
13:08:54  <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain closed issue #9459: [Crash]: Game crashed out of nowhere
13:09:21  <LordAro> aw, i had a half written response
13:09:26  <LordAro> TB's is better though
13:09:33  <TrueBrain> sorry :P
13:09:36  <LordAro> :p
13:09:39  <TrueBrain> but this ticket already dragged on waaayyyyy too long :)
13:15:29  <LordAro> yup
13:15:41  <glx> only 4GB on windows 10 is quite low
13:16:07  <TrueBrain> having more than one tab in your Chrome browser == asking for problems
13:16:10  <TrueBrain> no matter how much RAM :P
13:16:44  <glx> an active twitch chat in firefox is as worse :)
13:17:17  <TrueBrain> OpenTTD in Firefox with console open is equally worse :P
13:17:21  <TrueBrain> reloading doesn't free the memory
13:17:25  <TrueBrain> you run out of memory REALLY quick :)
13:17:38  <glx> yeah you need to close the tab to clear
13:17:49  <TrueBrain> only happens if you open the console, weirdly enough
13:19:38  <LordAro> dev console or OTTD console?
13:19:43  <LordAro> one would be weirder than the other :p
13:19:52  <TrueBrain> first :)
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13:46:42  <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 opened pull request #9461: Fix 68f2213: Don't use GetPoolSize() for end of pool iterator
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14:13:12  <Samu> i need an ai that crushes my road vehicles to test this
14:14:35  <Samu> I have a bad feeling this won't work
14:17:24  <Samu> but first, going to test 5000 rvs/5000 ships with 250k ops very fast, 4k map, see how much game speed I get
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15:50:36  <andythenorth> solitaire so addictive
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16:22:52  <TrueBrain> poor andythenorth
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16:27:39  <andythenorth> 48 hours of spider
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16:30:14  <TrueBrain> so .... are we going to delete the lobby window?
16:30:24  <TrueBrain> guess one of us should just make a PR doing that, and see if it gets approved or not? :P
16:30:31  <Rubidium> you have been lobbying for it ;)
16:30:54  <TrueBrain> really? RREAAALLLYYYY??!!! :P He went there ...... :P
16:30:55  <TrueBrain> :D
16:32:51  <TrueBrain> but you have to admit, it is a shitty flow :P
16:33:11  <Rubidium> though, can you set servers to disallow spectators? That might make things tricky (or a minimum change)
16:33:32  <TrueBrain> yeah, and I am also not sure just removing it would be good for the flow
16:33:44  <TrueBrain> it might surprise people too much .. as you have to spot tiny buttons to press to join a company
16:37:42  <TrueBrain> for sure the current window doesn't work .. people just blindly press "New Company", no matter what their intentions are .. it creates a connection to the server and closes it after query .. it is slow in showing companies because of that ..
16:37:51  <TrueBrain> and in general I doubt people ever used it for what it is intended
16:38:14  <TrueBrain> just joining the server sounds like a good idea, but indeed we would have to remove spectator limits .. or at least set a higher low-bar :P
16:38:27  <TrueBrain> but when joined, only showing the multiplayer window is weird and frustrating
16:38:40  <TrueBrain> so I have been thinking about stuff like: remember what company you last joined a server on
16:38:45  <TrueBrain> and if still available, rejoin it
16:39:05  <TrueBrain> and replace "Join Game" with "Join Game" and "Spectate Game"
16:39:19  <TrueBrain> (and remove the lobby window)
16:41:04  <TrueBrain> I dunno .. I lack inspiration to "fix" this .. for sure I know people will ask about the double-turn-window now :P
16:42:36  <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick updated pull request #8398: Change: Distribute left over cargo to stations according to the highest remainder
16:43:52  <glx> is a good idea ?
16:44:13  <TrueBrain> who is going to set that to false?
16:45:32  <TrueBrain> (or worded differently: where do you see the use-case for this?)
16:46:08  <glx> I think there are AIs not checking events
16:46:42  <glx> so their event stack just grows uselessly
16:47:02  <TrueBrain> feels like a bug in any AI, if they are not subscribed to Events? It is part of the tutorial :D
16:47:46  <TrueBrain> what is the function to poll events again?
16:48:46  <glx> and
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16:49:44  <glx> ideally it may be possible to detect calls to this function during script compilation, but looks like a not easy task
16:50:05  <TrueBrain> my problem with such settings, it just creates more fuzz for users to take care off
16:50:09  <TrueBrain> it doesn't make things simpler
16:51:24  <LordAro> glx: doesn't fix existing AI though
16:51:28  <LordAro> which is most of the issue
16:51:45  <glx> yeah, that's why autodetect would be better
16:52:06  <LordAro> super hacky though
16:52:08  <TrueBrain> okay, raw values: 451 uploaded AI versions do events, 137 do not .. but many of those are older versions of which never do .. lets see if I can deduplcate ..
16:52:56  <TrueBrain> never = newer
16:53:00  <TrueBrain> bah, nasty tpo :P
16:54:04  <glx> (and another one)
16:54:27  <TrueBrain> some are not by accident glx ;)
16:54:35  <TrueBrain> 47 AIs do, 25 do not handle events
16:54:39  <TrueBrain> I think
16:55:19  <glx> also I noticed regression AI checks for events, but there's none before it finishes
16:55:43  <TrueBrain> glx: as alternative, we can trigger a warning in the AI logs when the event-stack gets above a certain amount and we never seen a call to NextEvent
16:58:46  <glx> that's also an option yes
16:59:21  * andythenorth wonders if spider solitaire is always winnable
16:59:37  <TrueBrain> andythenorth: go solve the 3x+1 problem instead
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16:59:42  <glx> I think all games are winnable in theory
16:59:48  <andythenorth> 99.991% of draws are winnable according to [internet]
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17:00:13  <LordAro> and yet i keep getting myself into unwinnable scenarioes
17:00:14  <TrueBrain> so you can always blame the 0.009%, instead of your own poor game-choices :D
17:00:18  <LordAro> i blame you for this, andythenorth
17:00:37  <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick updated pull request #8461: Feature: Permanent rivers
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17:09:42  <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick updated pull request #8609: Fix: Equalise the number of frames needed for road vehicles to traverse different radius curves
17:14:24  <Samu> game speed around 1.00x - 1.10x, with 5000 rvs + 5000 ships + ai with 250k ops very fast on a 4k map
17:14:37  <Samu> i'm pleased
17:14:52  <Samu> now gonna enable aircraft, and i bet it's gonna be ruined
17:44:31  <andythenorth> I blame Wolf01 for spider
17:44:35  <andythenorth> or maybe Eddi|zuHause
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18:09:58  <TrueBrain> just anyone not you? :)
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18:23:43  <frosch123> i vote for removing "max_spectators". "max_clients" is enough
18:24:29  <frosch123> it's super weird, if you are in a company and you can't leave it because there are too many spectators :p
18:41:42  * andythenorth won solitaire
18:44:12  <frosch123> do the card still jump over the screen like they did 30 years ago?
18:50:24  <Timberwolf> more to the pint, do they go impossibly fast bwcause the timing loop is still calibrated for a 386, like they did 20 years ago?
18:50:31  <andythenorth> not in this variant :P
19:04:57  <glx> I vote for always join as spectator with the client list open, number of click to join or create a company will be the same as with lobby window
19:11:16  <Wolf01> [20:41:41] * andythenorth won solitaire <- spider?
19:14:36  <nielsm> agree with glx, joining everyone as spectator by default is better
19:14:57  <nielsm> it will also save many servers for the headache of cleaning empty companies left by players joining to look around
19:14:57  <andythenorth> spider
19:17:48  <TrueBrain> glx: that alone is not enough I think .. maybe a dialog to tell you joined as spectator? Especially to help people getting used to it?
19:18:11  <glx> people read dialogs ?
19:18:47  <TrueBrain> Otherwise the flow is pretty confusing, especially if you have played the game before
19:20:03  <TrueBrain> "Welcome to Nnn! You joined as spectator. Use the client list to either join a company or start a new one."
19:20:24  <TrueBrain> Maybe only show it the first time you join any server? Dunno
19:20:36  <frosch123> can servers configure a MOTD?
19:20:44  <glx> they can
19:20:48  <glx> via script
19:20:52  <frosch123> some servers use chat for that
19:21:02  <frosch123> but we could provide a default message
19:21:16  <frosch123> servers may have custom rules about joining/creating companies
19:21:23  <TrueBrain> Motd dialog? Hmm
19:22:04  <frosch123> motd could be shown in the client list
19:22:06  <TrueBrain> Almost a gamescipt
19:22:09  <frosch123> so it is also readable later
19:22:49  <TrueBrain> We still need to add something to sync servername to clients too, so adding motd would be trivial
19:22:57  <frosch123> i guess difference would be: in-game tooltips about how to join companies would be translated
19:23:01  <frosch123> while motd would probably not
19:23:32  <TrueBrain> Via gamescript it would :p
19:23:35  <frosch123> but multiplayer and translations is always weird
19:23:44  <TrueBrain> But that requires allowing multiple gses
19:25:02  <TrueBrain> I think it is a good idea, at least for now, to do a motd dialog, with a good default.
19:25:26  <TrueBrain> And yeah, it won't be translatable .. but we can't have it all :)
19:25:55  <TrueBrain> And indeed remove max spectators
19:41:21  <nielsm> Timberwolf: here's solitaire from windows nt 3.51 running on my windows 10 machine:
19:41:58  <nielsm> and if anyone needs that version for something, here's a copy:
19:47:20  <frosch123> something is wrong with the mouse position :p
19:49:44  <nielsm> my recording software isn't entirely compatible with per-monitor DPI scaling
20:01:09  <andythenorth> oof 1 hour to win that one
20:01:17  * andythenorth very not doing newgrf :P
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20:42:44  <Timberwolf> nielsm: nippy!
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22:24:11  <glx> oh dead AIs still receive events
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