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02:34:05 *** cathartes has joined #openttd 03:25:35 *** Wormnest has quit IRC 03:31:55 *** D-HUND has joined #openttd 03:35:18 *** debdog has quit IRC 03:43:52 *** glx has quit IRC 03:53:01 <wiscii> impossible names is a ottd norm 03:57:49 <wiscii> ;-) 04:26:42 *** Gustavo6046 has joined #openttd 04:45:02 <Gustavo6046> if you want it to be cool, just add more dragons to it 06:18:37 *** OsteHovel has joined #openttd 06:48:18 *** OsteHovel has quit IRC 06:49:49 *** OsteHovel has joined #openttd 06:52:39 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 07:15:31 *** cathartes has quit IRC 07:25:49 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 07:33:49 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 08:17:01 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 08:33:29 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 09:43:01 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 09:51:51 *** Gustavo6046 has quit IRC 11:06:29 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 11:13:35 *** toktik is now known as Guest1032 11:13:39 *** toktik has joined #openttd 11:15:27 *** Guest1032 has quit IRC 11:31:34 *** andythenorth_ has joined #openttd 11:37:13 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 12:57:21 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 12:59:21 *** Compu has joined #openttd 14:12:34 *** felix_ is now known as felix 14:30:08 *** tokai|noir has joined #openttd 14:30:08 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai|noir 14:36:58 *** tokai has quit IRC 14:50:40 *** supermop_work has joined #openttd 14:52:03 <supermop_work> yo 14:52:11 <supermop_work> back at office 15:17:03 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 15:20:39 *** glx has joined #openttd 15:20:39 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v glx 15:50:03 *** nielsm has joined #openttd 15:55:45 <supermop_work> what are people's thoughts on buildings not being orthogonal to the tile? 15:56:03 <supermop_work> i feel like its weird if a wall faces the camera directly 16:49:16 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] 2TallTyler opened pull request #9792: Feature: Remember the last-used signal between games https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/9792 16:56:08 *** frosch123 has joined #openttd 16:59:03 <LordAro> what a new and interesting idea in #9792 17:00:22 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] 2TallTyler updated pull request #9792: Feature: Remember the last-used signal between games https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/9792 17:08:30 *** Wormnest has joined #openttd 17:09:48 <andythenorth_> yo 17:10:44 <peter1138> What am I meant to do with a bottle of Prosecco? 17:10:58 <LordAro> pretend you've won a race 17:11:18 <andythenorth_> put it in a pie 17:11:20 <TrueBrain> Time to close that new PR, it adds a setting. Right? :p 17:11:23 <peter1138> Christ that's never going to happen. 17:11:29 <andythenorth_> drink it? 17:11:32 <andythenorth_> whilst complaining? 17:11:34 <andythenorth_> that's what I do 17:11:48 <dale> Drink the whole bottle and submit PRs? 17:11:48 <TrueBrain> You do it without the drinking :D 17:20:38 <peter1138> Maybe bike ride 17:20:45 <LordAro> bit dark 17:20:51 <peter1138> Got lights 17:21:07 <peter1138> Although a bit tired from 4 hours driving 17:23:42 <LordAro> that's a lot 17:29:18 <wiscii> how can somebody not know what to do with a bottle of prosecco ? 17:29:40 <wiscii> if you don't drink then gift it 17:41:41 <andythenorth_> make a sauce for duck 17:42:15 <wiscii> why ruin a duck and a bottle of wine ? 17:43:29 <dale> What if the sauce is for a duck to put on duck food? 17:44:51 <wiscii> what if the duck is a concert pianist .. 17:47:41 <dale> With just a beak and webbed feet? I'm very impressed, I can barely do chopsticks. 17:53:14 <andythenorth_> _dp_ so GSObjectType.NewGRFResolveID() ? 17:53:45 <wiscii> duck needs fingers to pour the sauce ? 17:53:47 <_dp_> yep 17:53:58 <andythenorth_> hmm 17:54:25 <andythenorth_> wonder if there's anything to copy from elswhere 17:54:37 <andythenorth_> e.g. neighbouring tile checks 17:56:46 <_dp_> oh, btw, also probably GSIndustryType, not GSIndustry 17:57:41 <andythenorth_> yup 17:57:46 <andythenorth_> dunno if I can patch this or not :P 17:57:49 <andythenorth_> limited brain 17:58:11 <TrueBrain> limited editions are nice 18:15:49 <andythenorth_> true editions 18:15:56 <andythenorth_> did anyone NFT a grf yet? 18:16:24 <frosch123> you can register your grfs on bananas, using a unique grfid 18:18:15 <andythenorth_> git is almost a blockchain 18:20:41 <LordAro> is it not? latest value depends on all the previous values 18:20:52 * LordAro does not know blockchain 18:30:21 <andythenorth_> me neither, but I tried "isn't git just a blockchain" and apparently I won't be going to the moon with that negative attitude 18:31:42 <nielsm> git is missing the critical property of requiring to competitively guess at solutions to math problems to be permitted to add a new revision 18:32:41 <andythenorth_> I was told it was the immutability of history, rather than proof of work that was missing 18:33:05 <andythenorth_> git is trivial to rewrite? 18:33:47 <nielsm> as long as you can get everyone else who wants to use the same history to agree on the rewrite 18:33:50 * andythenorth_ waits for someone to point out blockchains are often trivial to rewrite 18:34:02 <andythenorth_> and get forked due to politics, or theft 18:34:14 <dwfreed> which is no different than forks on crypto blockchains :P 18:34:21 <andythenorth_> DUDE HERESY 18:34:31 <andythenorth_> blockchain is immutable store of value! 18:34:35 <andythenorth_> beyond governments or banks 18:35:02 <andythenorth_> but not beyond those with the root keys 18:35:23 <andythenorth_> definitely crypto bros are much more trustworthy than government or banks 18:35:36 <andythenorth_> when society collapses, you will be able to place your trust in coin 18:36:11 <glx> without electricity ? 18:36:41 <andythenorth_> well the electricity will keep magically arriving 18:36:52 <andythenorth_> nothing to do with society 18:36:58 <andythenorth_> the generators are run by elves 18:37:06 <andythenorth_> and driven by pixie dust 18:37:35 <andythenorth_> ok so GS resolving the grf id 18:37:36 <LordAro> nielsm: i find guessing at the correct programming solutions to be more interesting 18:37:41 * andythenorth_ looks for code to copy 18:38:55 <andythenorth_> hmm not even sure what needs compared with what 18:39:11 <andythenorth_> searching 'grffile' seems a good place to find similar code 18:39:22 * andythenorth_ wonders if Github copilot can extend GS for us 18:41:16 <wiscii> is with 1984 being a warning not an instruction manual .. same goes for crypto-currency 18:41:54 <andythenorth_> GetObjectIDAtOffset is where I am looking now 18:42:21 <andythenorth_> I don't understand how the openttd internal ID for a grf item is found 18:42:26 <andythenorth_> it just position in some list? 18:42:34 <andythenorth_> is * 18:42:38 <glx> yes, index in the pools 18:42:51 <glx> or something 18:43:19 <andythenorth_> so to resolve that with a grfid and id-in-the-grf, walk the pool, comparing? 18:43:26 <andythenorth_> then return the pool index? 18:44:05 <andythenorth_> the intended interface is something like GSObjectType.NewGRFResolveID(grfid, id_in_grf) -> id 18:44:13 <andythenorth_> the term id here is so overloaded 18:44:45 <glx> main issue with id from grf is to be sure it's the correct grf file 18:45:52 <frosch123> andythenorth_: "internal ObjectSpec index" = _object_mngr.GetID(grf_local_id, grf_id); 18:46:01 <frosch123> repeat with similar _mngr objects 18:47:42 <andythenorth_> ok so grf_local_id is the simple term :) 18:47:46 <andythenorth_> helps a lot 18:56:03 <peter1138> Okay, apparently I napped. 18:56:09 <andythenorth_> is that literally paste that line and return index? 18:56:16 <andythenorth_> or do I need to adapt? 18:58:38 <TrueBrain> hmm .. any reason NML doesnt have industry var64 listed? (Distance-to-industry) 18:58:44 <andythenorth_> wondered if I could just do 18:58:45 <andythenorth_> return _object_mngr.GetID(grf_local_id, grf_id); 18:58:54 <andythenorth_> but with some validation for case of item not found 18:59:05 <andythenorth_> TrueBrain I'll look :P 18:59:23 <andythenorth_> is industry_distance not var 64? 18:59:32 <TrueBrain> 67 19:00:37 <TrueBrain> "You may note that this variable can be used instead of variable 64." 19:00:38 <TrueBrain> right 19:00:48 <andythenorth_> superseded by 67 19:00:53 <andythenorth_> no case for 64 I am aware of 19:01:44 *** gelignite has joined #openttd 19:05:57 <TrueBrain> I hate 67 and 68 already :P 19:06:08 <TrueBrain> I don't want to add support for that :D Fuck other NewGRFs :P 19:07:05 <frosch123> the are surprisingly similar to what andy wants to do with gs :p 19:08:45 <andythenorth_> I am waiting for the first person to point out I'm trying to make grf in GS 19:08:50 <andythenorth_> which I'm not 19:08:57 <andythenorth_> but this channel has certain predictable patterns 19:09:31 <frosch123> i am waiting for what pynut will look like 19:10:23 <andythenorth_> why wait? https://github.com/andythenorth/firs/tree/gs-is-real/src/gs 19:11:21 <frosch123> poor zuu 19:11:46 <andythenorth_> I should change the readme eh 19:12:07 <andythenorth_> fixed :) 19:13:28 <TrueBrain> hmm .. var71 .. isn't that just 6c/6d in percentage? 19:14:20 <andythenorth_> I think it's there for convenience 19:14:37 <frosch123> TrueBrain: yes 19:14:58 <TrueBrain> good 19:15:28 <frosch123> the PR which added all the 60+x variable for 16 in/out cargos specifically left it out, because it was useless 19:15:38 <frosch123> then people complained it was missing, and added a separare PR 19:15:46 <TrueBrain> and I am not going to implement it again :P 19:16:00 <andythenorth_> stuff and things 19:16:53 <TrueBrain> with RPN it is easy enough to do it yourself 19:16:58 <TrueBrain> saves me from dealing with a 0..255 bla :P 19:17:06 <andythenorth_> I am enjoying this small compact elegant pynut code which 'reads' the value of one grf parameter https://github.com/andythenorth/firs/blob/gs-is-real/src/gs/firs.pynut 19:17:19 <andythenorth_> I mean...we have grfid check and grfversion check for GS 19:17:27 <andythenorth_> but parameters didn't make it so far :) 19:17:54 <andythenorth_> I guess we're in for months of me asking very basic C++ and openttd src questions eh :) 19:18:05 <TrueBrain> why does 60..66 have these offsets? What is the usecase? 19:18:52 <andythenorth_> so you can walk around the layout 19:19:08 <andythenorth_> or outside it 19:19:13 <TrueBrain> ah, like that 19:19:14 <andythenorth_> FIRS uses it for fences for example 19:19:16 <TrueBrain> well, no negative offsets 19:19:24 <TrueBrain> so outside is a bit hard in all sense of the word 19:19:30 <TrueBrain> so how about the town manhattan distance? 19:19:35 <TrueBrain> how is offset important there? 19:19:41 <andythenorth_> oh maybe FIRS doesn't use those 19:19:46 <andythenorth_> those are industry vars 19:19:51 <frosch123> i think some of them were signed 19:19:56 <frosch123> -8..7, -8..7 19:19:58 <TrueBrain> lol, yeah, I just spotted some are frosch123 :P 19:20:02 <TrueBrain> the Town ones are 19:20:03 <andythenorth_> I think FIRS uses https://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/VariationalAction2/Industry_Tiles#Land_info_of_nearby_tiles_.2860.29 19:20:32 <TrueBrain> I just don't see why it matters whether you check one tile vs the other of distance to town? 19:20:35 <TrueBrain> is that really relevant? 19:20:55 <frosch123> maybe you can triangulate the position of the town, if you measure the distance from 3 tiles 19:21:56 <andythenorth_> I'm unclear why these vars are useful 19:21:58 <frosch123> TrueBrain: where is the distance-to-town in 60? 19:22:02 <andythenorth_> not seeing I've ever used them yet? 19:22:14 <frosch123> var60 is mostly for construction check 19:22:24 <frosch123> like those ecs castles 19:22:33 <frosch123> puzzle games etc 19:22:49 <andythenorth_> maybe it lets you change production if center tile is too far from town 19:22:51 <andythenorth_> or something 19:22:59 <TrueBrain> frosch123: var65 19:24:10 <andythenorth_> 65 signed eh 19:24:14 <frosch123> no idea, those vars were added before i joined, so they must be for ECS 19:24:23 <andythenorth_> these don't look like nonsense, but they don't look massively useful 19:24:38 <TrueBrain> I think I will just force it to 0, and await feedback on it :D 19:24:41 <andythenorth_> I could guess some use cases, but eh 19:25:55 <frosch123> oh, it's also possible that at that time just noone had any idea about newgrf 19:26:22 <TrueBrain> if we in this comity can agree it is pointless and "0" is fine too, works for me :P 19:26:27 <frosch123> 2007 added some weird things to newgrf, which already existed elsewhere, just noone knew after patchman elft 19:27:19 <TrueBrain> that happens :) 19:27:32 <andythenorth_> 'can always extend later' is a very powerful tool for progress :P 19:27:35 <andythenorth_> big fan 19:27:51 <TrueBrain> so offsets .. hmm ... 19:27:57 <TrueBrain> industry:tile_id 1 [] 2 [] 19:28:01 <frosch123> ah, i can't wait until tb arrives at vehicles :) industries will appear so well-designed then 19:28:09 <TrueBrain> or industry:tile_id 0x12 [] 19:28:57 <frosch123> nml has built-ins for that stuff 19:29:15 <frosch123> so industry:tile_id 1 2 _built_in_tileoffset() [] 19:29:38 <TrueBrain> lol, so tempted to use that name now :P 19:29:52 <TrueBrain> but yeah, sounds good 19:30:51 <frosch123> hmm, gcc prefix is __builtin_ though :p 19:32:30 *** andythenorth_ has quit IRC 19:35:57 <frosch123> RPN is weird... builtins appear to be just string-replacements 19:36:44 <frosch123> s/__builtin_tileoffset/0xF & 4 << |/g 19:38:02 <frosch123> hmm, that is only one int4 cast, it needs two 19:38:34 <frosch123> do you have some stack-rotation instructions? 19:38:44 <TrueBrain> no(t yet) :P 19:39:27 <TrueBrain> but I guess I need to allow functions to return values ... I can now, pretty easy now honestly. So I can just create a library of sorts that is always made available :D 19:39:30 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 19:39:44 <TrueBrain> but first ... how do I make this enum available in RPN, without duplicating it all .. hmm 19:41:09 <frosch123> which enum this time? 19:41:33 <TrueBrain> https://github.com/TrueBrain/TrueGRF/blob/main/truegrf-rs/src/grf/actions/variable/industry.rs 19:41:34 <TrueBrain> these 19:42:13 <TrueBrain> I can use Rust magic 19:42:14 <TrueBrain> but .. hmm 19:43:20 <frosch123> ah, okay, i assumed you were copying lists from nml :) i wanted to suggest to parse ottd source instead :p 19:45:31 <TrueBrain> pff, I am not crazy! :D 19:46:16 <TrueBrain> okay, FIRS economy compiles .... :o :o 19:46:32 <TrueBrain> now I need to make some other modifications before it becomes useful .. like, a primary that accepts cargo 19:48:33 <frosch123> the sliders in truegrf do not work for me 19:48:54 <frosch123> they do not store their value when moved, so later revert to the old value 19:49:05 <TrueBrain> they should update the text while sliding 19:49:08 <TrueBrain> that doesn't happen either? 19:49:23 <frosch123> nope, browser too old? 19:49:26 <TrueBrain> any errors on your console? 19:50:15 <frosch123> it's so empty that i am unsure whether i am using it correctly :p 19:50:25 <TrueBrain> :D 19:50:26 <frosch123> usually there is always some error shown :p 19:50:30 <TrueBrain> what OS is that? 19:50:48 <frosch123> firefox 91.5.0esr 19:51:01 <TrueBrain> will check that out in the weekend or something :) 19:51:29 <frosch123> hmm, chromium doesn't work either 19:52:11 <TrueBrain> broken for me too 19:52:21 <TrueBrain> weird ... didn't touch that lately :P 19:52:28 <andythenorth> frosch123 I already gave TrueBrain the vehicle refittability diagram, but he thought it was april fool's 19:53:08 <frosch123> andythenorth: would anyone notice if you used it as cargoflow graph in some economy? 19:53:17 <andythenorth> XIS users might not :) 19:53:35 <andythenorth> it is considerably cleaner than FIRS Extreme was 19:55:52 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 19:56:21 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 20:01:59 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] 2TallTyler commented on issue #9786: [Bug]: Terragenesis Mountainous setting does nothing for Tropic landscape https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/issues/9786 20:02:34 <peter1138> New map gen when? 20:07:35 <andythenorth> yes 20:10:51 <LordAro> sure. 20:11:01 <TrueBrain> does it add new settings? 20:11:20 <LordAro> oh, then no 20:15:34 <TrueBrain> right .. can I now export FIRS economy per industry, is the question .. lets find out! 20:17:30 <andythenorth> o_O 20:18:07 <TrueBrain> can't actually remember what economy part I converted :P 20:18:18 <TrueBrain> I think only primary industries 20:18:25 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] 2TallTyler commented on issue #6544: Put into the AI company when loading savegame https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/issues/6544 20:20:59 <TrueBrain> it compiled :o 20:21:11 <TrueBrain> a Bulk Terminal does 272 tonnes of aluminium on game-start 20:21:13 <TrueBrain> that feels wrong 20:22:44 <andythenorth> it's probably correct though 20:23:04 <TrueBrain> seems so 20:23:06 <TrueBrain> I just don't randomize yet 20:23:10 <TrueBrain> that is the main difference 20:23:35 <TrueBrain> and because secondary industries aren't working, you can't make engineering supplies .. so I cannot test if it actually works :D 20:25:03 <TrueBrain> now to figure out why sliders stopped working .. really odd 20:34:17 *** Kitrana1 has joined #openttd 20:40:19 *** Kitrana has quit IRC 20:40:26 <TrueBrain> right, guess this weekend I will convert secondary and tertiary economy from FIRS .. so I can playtest if RPN is actually working :D 20:41:36 <TrueBrain> also really curious if I can now make the Bulk Terminal be placed in the right position .. but that requires callbacks on tiles, not industry .. which is a bit tricky atm :D 20:44:24 <TrueBrain> frosch123: deployed new version, should fix sliders :D 20:46:29 <frosch123> aw, i had hopes i would understand the diff 20:46:44 <TrueBrain> the diff is really easy :P But why it is needed, I do not know :) 20:46:50 <TrueBrain> Svelte binding, that is all :) Svelte is nice :) 20:47:30 <TrueBrain> "random_switch" <- I was not allowed to implement that, right? :D 20:47:36 <frosch123> hmm, the gh deploy action is done, yet truegrf is down for me :/ 20:47:49 <TrueBrain> you are not wrong; that is a white screen 20:47:50 <TrueBrain> grrr 20:47:50 <frosch123> TrueBrain: correct 20:47:59 <frosch123> TrueBrain: you use var 5F instead 20:48:13 <frosch123> for reading 20:48:28 <frosch123> triggers are a separate lesson on their own 20:48:41 <TrueBrain> was looking for https://github.com/andythenorth/firs/blob/master/src/templates/randomise_primary_production_on_build.pynml 20:49:41 <frosch123> well, the thing with random-switch is... it is bad in nfo... but nml makes it worse :p 20:51:10 <frosch123> in this case you would use "var5F & 0xF" which gives you 16 random cases, and then you assign them to match the desired probabilities 20:51:14 <TrueBrain> hmm .. seems that the wrong folder got pushed to GitHub pages .. what is going on there .. hmm .. 20:51:20 <TrueBrain> frosch123: sounds good to me, tnx :D 20:52:45 <TrueBrain> don't you just hate when locally something works that remotely doesn't :P 20:52:54 <frosch123> oh wait, i always get var5F wrong, you need some addition shift by 8 20:53:19 <frosch123> var5F 8 >> 0xF & 20:56:45 * andythenorth did not patch GS yet :P 20:56:47 <andythenorth> played tanks 21:02:51 <TrueBrain> ah .. one of my dependencies broke a certain setting ... lets see if that can be fixed easily :D 21:08:26 *** Gustavo6046 has joined #openttd 21:11:36 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 21:11:51 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 21:15:48 <supermop_work> kind of need to model things in 3d to trace for all these cylindrical building types 21:17:28 <TrueBrain> frosch123: https://truebrain.github.io/TrueGRF/ <- it is back alive! :D 21:17:55 <TrueBrain> I love the changelog ... markdown escaping going wrong :D 21:18:32 <frosch123> yay, sliders 21:18:37 <TrueBrain> \o/ :D 21:18:43 <TrueBrain> right, sleepy time! 21:22:29 <andythenorth> good idea 21:22:32 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 21:25:11 *** frosch123 has quit IRC 21:56:47 *** Montana_ has joined #openttd 22:20:34 *** _aD has joined #openttd 23:01:25 *** Kitrana has joined #openttd 23:07:19 *** Kitrana1 has quit IRC 23:13:22 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 commented on issue #6544: Put into the AI company when loading savegame https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/issues/6544 23:13:46 *** gelignite has quit IRC 23:22:25 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] 2TallTyler opened pull request #9793: Fix #9020: Update station coverage highlight when adding/removing tiles https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/9793 23:29:09 *** Gustavo6046 has quit IRC 23:38:48 *** Montana_ has quit IRC 23:39:25 *** Gustavo6046 has joined #openttd 23:40:47 <Gustavo6046> What if information screens used more icons, with tooltips to explain what they meant? 23:40:54 <Gustavo6046> Then again, icons can be too abstract 23:41:00 <Gustavo6046> I mean like, what would be a running cost icon? 23:41:27 <Gustavo6046> Or a tractive effort icon? 23:41:35 <Gustavo6046> What the heck does tractive effort even mean in practice? 23:52:43 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] 2TallTyler opened pull request #9794: Fix #6544: Don't join AI company when loading network game in singlep… https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/9794